August 27, 2025 • 36 mins
The daughter of the Moroccan diaspora, Ami Taf Ra, uses music to explore layers of history, spirit and heart. 2025 sees the release of Ami’s The Prophet and the Madman on Brainfeeder. Crafted during the pandemic with producer and beloved musical collaborator and savant artist Kamasi Washington, the record is a metaphysical conversation with the Lebanese writer, philosopher and mystic, Khalil Gibran’s classic and ceaselessly yielding texts. Kamasi Washington is a composer, arranger, bandleader and saxophonist. Collaboration, and a multi-disciplinary perspective, is key to Washington’s process. It’s what keeps him creative. Washington has played with a diverse group of musicians including Wayne Shorter, Herbie Hancock, Horace Tapscott, Lauryn Hill, Nas, Snoop Dogg,[13] George Duke, Chaka Khan and Ami Ta Fra. https://amitafra.com/
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https://www.kamasiwashington.com/bio/
https://www.instagram.com/amitaframusic/
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
Okay, b La Talk fifteen eighty. Okay, you guys there,
I got a studio full of powerful talent this morning.
You're hearing and I want to make sure I'm saying
it right. Fatima Ami Tafra, Is that right? A Ami Tafra.
Speaker 2 (00:20):
You can get a little role in there.
Speaker 1 (00:22):
She's using music to explore layers of history, spirit and heart.
Speaker 3 (00:27):
She is.
Speaker 1 (00:28):
We're sharing her music this morning, Dialects of different land.
She says. Her music carries sentiments of melody and verse
from her myriad homes Cairo, Istamboul, Amsterdam, and La and
she's here in studio with us this morning in support
of her first her debut album. Good morning, Welcome, good morning,
(00:50):
Thank you for having me, Thank you for coming in.
I'm really interested to have the conversation.
Speaker 2 (00:54):
You brought along a friend, Yeah, my husband.
Speaker 1 (00:59):
A very good friend, Kamasi Washington, composer, bandleader and saxophonists.
Speaker 3 (01:03):
Welcome, thank you, thank you.
Speaker 1 (01:05):
Yeah. We were down one yesterday, so we got we
got up one today on the jazz on the jazz
side of things. So you're from Morocco.
Speaker 2 (01:15):
Yes, I was born in Morocco and I lived there
for a few years and also lived in Amsterdam, the Netherlands. Yeah,
my parents are one of the first generation immigrants from
Morocco in Europe in the sixties and seventies, that's when
(01:36):
they moved and the Yeah.
Speaker 1 (01:39):
So when you say you're infusing all these different things
into your music, you're talking about your personal ancestors, but
also your journey as an artist and as a woman.
Speaker 2 (01:50):
Yeah, as an artist and as a woman. I lived
in Amsterdam, but also we're like a nomad living out
of a suitcase, traveling around the world. Yeah, yeah, doing
shows in I just went where music took me, you know,
living on Jordan, Egypt, Europe, different places in Europe.
Speaker 1 (02:13):
So yeah, and Kamasi, you're obviously you're a band leader, composer,
a saxophonist and icon on it's great to have you in.
Tell me about Obviously you guys are married, so that's
a layer. There's a layer to it there. But tell
me about the musical marriage.
Speaker 3 (02:30):
Yeah, you know kind of really started, uh during the pandemic.
You know, we were in lockdown and you know, we
had we had watched all the movies, so we started
we had this idea like we would start like like
reading books together, like like literally like reading them out loud,
like instead of just storytime. Yeah, story time and so
(02:54):
uh we got to Caloglebron's book The Prophet.
Speaker 2 (02:58):
That's quite a storytime.
Speaker 3 (03:00):
Yeah, and it was so fun. It was like it
was fun to kind of do and we were like
kind of trade off, like I would read one of
the chapters, she would read another. The poems say it
and we're like, oh, that was fun. And you know,
then we were I think the first song we wrote together,
I was messing around the piano or something and she
(03:23):
was in the probably in the kitchen, the kitchen, and
she just started singing to it and I was like, oh,
you know, and we just kind of it kind of
just turned into like a song that was written in
two rooms.
Speaker 1 (03:36):
I love that written in two rooms, which were some
of the only places you could go because you.
Speaker 3 (03:41):
Were on lockdown.
Speaker 1 (03:41):
Yeah. Yeah, well I mean any marriage that survives, you know,
lockdown is pretty solid. So it so it happened organically, yeah.
Speaker 3 (03:53):
Very organic.
Speaker 1 (03:54):
Yeah. And The Prophet and the Madman is called.
Speaker 2 (03:59):
Yeah. We we then went I took another book by
Halie Gibran and that was The mad Man, and from
the first page on we looked at each other and
we're like, wow, we think the mad Man is the Prophet.
We gotta do something with it. Then it became, yeah,
(04:19):
this album, you know, the Prophet and the Madman. We
took a few poems out of the two books and
it's kind of it's a conversation between the mad Man
and the Prophet, you know, two voices across across having
a discussion, having a conversation with each other across time.
And yeah, it's.
Speaker 1 (04:40):
It's it's beautiful, it's how do you place it? I mean,
I know that's kind of a weird question, but I'm
I feel like jazz, right, your album is jazz. You're
a jazz musician, but we put so many things under
the umbrella of jazz and you you kind of have
(05:00):
a little avant garde vibe going on, a little poetic
vibe going on. How would you describe it?
Speaker 2 (05:09):
Uh, world jazz, you know, it's it's my identity. Yeah,
world jazz, fusion jazz. There's a lot of like Arabic
sound to a North African Middle Eastern sound, and that's
blend to his sound, you know. So yeah, it's fusion jazz,
world jazz. But it's on the umbrella of jazz.
Speaker 3 (05:30):
So it's hard to contain something like music in a word,
in a singular word, you know, we try to do
that as human beings, to like encompass something like music
in a word. But to me, the music is always
greater than the words. You know, I call it om music.
Speaker 1 (05:50):
Music. I love that. I noticed, well, actually I didn't notice.
My booking producer, she's all in the in the mix
this morning, Asha, Asha Jordan, that you had quote music
is a way into God, the absolute open expression of
everything you You were utilizing that quote, which comes from
my dad, a Mary Baraka. So I thought that was
(06:13):
an interesting connection that it seems like that inspired you
in some way.
Speaker 2 (06:20):
Yeah, that that inspires me, but also just my journey
in general, the people that I've met in my in
my in my life, you know, before I came and
lived here, I lived in Istanbul, Turkey for a few
years during the height of when we had a lot
of terrorist terrorist attacks, and the political climate was this
very still is very very it's turbulence, and just to
(06:47):
see people how they are able to to live and
have hope and have hope for the future even though
they were living that, you know, and that. Yeah, that's
that's that gave me a lot of inspiration. And as
an artist, of course you're gonna like incorporate that into
your into your artistry.
Speaker 1 (07:06):
And yeah, it's funny because I'm always pushing on that
lately since November of last year, that art is one
of the portals. It's one of the places we need
to find strength and courage and inspiration and escape right
now because we you know, we're not having terror attacks
(07:27):
like Istanbul, but it feels like a lot for for
many people in this country right now.
Speaker 3 (07:34):
Yeah, music, art, I said, they're like the they're like
the secret agents of humanity because they can cross lines
that sometimes the artists themselves can't even cross, you know,
because I always say, like, you know, ultimately, you know,
the battle is not really the battle is to ultimately
(07:55):
change people, because they're not gonna disappear.
Speaker 1 (08:00):
You know.
Speaker 3 (08:00):
So the people that we feel like that are pushing
the world and know what direction that we don't want
to go in, it's like, well what do you do
with them? You know? And it's like to me, like
that's where art and music is so powerful because it's like, well, ultimately,
then what you really are saying is you want to do,
is you want to somehow shift them at least, you know,
because what else can you do?
Speaker 1 (08:21):
I mean I do. I believe in redemption and transformation
and a reinvention for all humans. You know, if we
don't have that opportunity, then what do we have?
Speaker 3 (08:31):
What do we have?
Speaker 1 (08:32):
Yeah, we're stuck, We're trapped. And so you know, that's
one of the reasons I do my best too, not
the name call to call out policies rather than you know,
call people called people things, because I feel like as
long as we believe that people can transform and change
and evolve, then there's always hope.
Speaker 3 (08:51):
Yeah, exactly. And we've seen that that's possible. I mean,
we've seen it through history, and we have these little
pockets where we where we do shift things, and it
seems like people we have shifted, you know. And it's
just the thing about it is I think that it's
just about understanding that those shifts are potentially always temporary,
(09:12):
you know. So it's a it's a it's a forever thing.
You know, it's like balancing something. It's like Okay, I
balance it, but it's gonna you know. And so now
I think we had a we had a at a
place of like massive imbalance on the other direction almost
and it's like, well times start writing some songs and
making some paintings and some some some poets. We gotta
(09:35):
we gotta rally the troops because we gotta we gotta
shift some lines, you know.
Speaker 1 (09:39):
Yeah, calling all light workers, let's get busy. Yeah, yeah,
I think it's well said. I'm looking forward to sharing
with the kb L a delegation more of your music
and your collaboration, uh together as we come forward a
tough run. Camasi Washington or in the studio with me
this morning. What a blessing cap talk fifteen eighty Amitra
(10:04):
and Camassi Washington in the studio. Yeah, let it write.
Tell me what we're hearing here?
Speaker 2 (10:12):
You hear love?
Speaker 1 (10:13):
Yeah, I do.
Speaker 2 (10:14):
From the album A Prophet and a Madman And it's
written via Halijah Bron. And there's actually a story. Halijah
Bron he started writing a fellow writer from Egypt in
nineteen from nineteen twelve on, and they fell in love
with each other for twenty years, writing to each other
(10:34):
without ever meeting one another. And there's there's a They
published some of the letters from Halijah bron and throughout
the years that they were writing, and that gives a
little insight behind the writings of the poems of the
Prophet and all the other poems. So it's it's beautiful
(10:55):
you know that someone. Yeah, you don't have to possess
love to be transformed by love, you know, And that's
just so beautiful from.
Speaker 1 (11:06):
Yeah, I feel like I'm listening to a movie. Soundshock,
I hear that if it's not in the movie already
and we'll be in the next ten minute.
Speaker 2 (11:14):
And the music, of course, beautiful arrangement by Kamasi, it's.
Speaker 1 (11:18):
Yeah, arranger, composer, saxophone player. What are what are? What
are we hearing from your perspective here?
Speaker 3 (11:26):
To me, I mean yeah, when I heard when when
we read Love, what I felt from it was like
he what's the right word? When he personified love, he
made it into a person, you know, and I was like, oh, wow,
imagine that, imagine love the person. And so, you know,
(11:47):
to me, when I was thinking about this music, it
was like, you know, you know, remember from like I'm
Gonna Get You sacking. Everybody has that theme music, Like
if love was personified as a person and wrote this
theme music, you know what I mean, And I just
imagine something like that, like some kind of really like
you know, so that was that was kind of how
my wires were and.
Speaker 1 (12:09):
Sung by your love, which is oh yeah they lovely.
Speaker 3 (12:12):
Yeah, And then she took it and at it that
im ti fried just purity, you know. That's how I say.
Her voice is like it's like the purest water, you know,
it's it's uh yeah.
Speaker 1 (12:30):
So when you guys write, do you you hear like
a whole full blown thing in your head or you
build it, you know, you know, instrument by instrument, bar
by bar, or it just plops in down on you
like a spaceship. Like how does that creative process?
Speaker 3 (12:47):
How do think our individual processes and then our kind
of collaborative process are probably a little different, you know.
I mean for me, I definitely am in like a
seed water it let it turn to a tree and
decide when to when the harvest the fruit. Yeah. I
have songs, you know, I've had songs that like lived
and sometimes you know, I'm kind of one of those
(13:09):
kind of organized chaos and people kind drives are crazy.
So I mean when I was younger, I used, there's
a song I have called the rhythm changes. No, no,
it wasn't rhythm changes. It was Journey. Journey lived on
a post it note on the stack of a whole
(13:30):
bunch of music on my piano for years because I
couldn't figure out the rhythm to put on it. And
I like the chords and I like the melody, and
I remember Miles mostly he had heard that song and
every time he came to my house it would drive
him crazy that that was just living right there, I
mean lived there and in my head.
Speaker 1 (13:50):
But so it was it was a sort of an
orphaned song on a post it note.
Speaker 3 (13:55):
And then to me it's like it was solid. It
was like as long as somebody moves my stuff, posting
notice is just as safe as as a hard drive,
you know.
Speaker 2 (14:05):
Okay, But.
Speaker 3 (14:08):
It was just uh, I just I just hadn't. I
was tiring for it. Figure It took me a long
time to figure out, like just the rhythm of it.
So I had it, and I was like I can't
figure out and I was thinking of it the wrong way.
And so anyway, so like that happens with me. So
like I, you know, I have something and then I
grow it, and then I keep growing it. Until I
(14:28):
can until it feels like it's almost like a like
a like it's an adult, and then it's like, all right,
go in the world and live your how do your
existence and how do you?
Speaker 2 (14:39):
Yeah? For me, it's like I record the I hear
the melodies in my head and I just recorded it
and then I listened back to it and see if
I can add something like for speak to us for example,
the word just came came like an epiphany to me
with the melodies together, and I recorded and went to commands.
I was like, COMI listen to this, Okay, do you
think this is this is this is good for the
(15:02):
to work on it, you know, And he was like yeah,
and he made this. Of course he goes big and
he had this whole arrangement of orchestra and we had
like forty five musicians working on the album, you know.
So yeah, he took it just through the next level.
Speaker 1 (15:15):
This is a song you were talking about right life Hella,
that's amazing piece in my hellos Yeah, joys string and
so you knew when it was an adult and you
sent it on its.
Speaker 3 (15:34):
Wife, it was like that that twenty five year old
that's still living in his mother's basement because I had
that song for a long time and then uh, I
tried a bunch of different times and I was like, man,
that's something about this not right, you know. And then
I said, Miles knew it was there. And one day
I think it was Moles. Moles sat down at the drums,
a million drummers, tied, a million drummers, tried to play
(15:55):
and I want to play it right, and he played
that beat and when we played it to that rhythm,
I was like, oh, it was like it was like
it was like it was like that person graduated from
tech school.
Speaker 1 (16:10):
And so now for you, you said that you sometimes
sometimes it can come to you in one whole piece.
Speaker 2 (16:23):
Yeah, it just comes to me. And that that happened
would speak to us. The melodies and the words. It
just just came to me, and I recorded right away
and speak to us, speak to us.
Speaker 1 (16:35):
Now, does that ever happen? A song is knocking on
your door and you're like, go away, I don't that's
not good.
Speaker 2 (16:42):
Yeah, sometimes I record stuff and I listened to what
was I thinking, what is this? You know? I have
like I literally have hundreds of those in my phone,
like and yeah.
Speaker 1 (16:52):
Yeah, but when, but when.
Speaker 2 (16:54):
It's when, you just yeah, like you know, you know,
I know, I know. There was a song on the
album as Ibron. He was playing it in the in
the living room on the piano, and I was somewhere
and walking down the house and I heard the meld.
Speaker 3 (17:10):
I was like, this is it.
Speaker 2 (17:12):
This has to this has to be mine, because I
just had the words for it ready to to to
to be attached to that piece of music, but the
music was not mine because he was working on for
a movie.
Speaker 3 (17:24):
And yeah, I was working on for her film, and
I was doing a whole bunch of different versions of
that uh scene. And so she kind of was like,
I hope that director doesn't want that. I was like,
don't curse it. I'm like trying to get this finished.
(17:44):
And she was like, I hope he doesn't want it
because I want it, you know, and you know it
wasn't the right thing for reason. She was Yes, she
definitely claimed it.
Speaker 1 (17:53):
You know what. I felt mad at that name and
explaiment you do not want this piece? So well, so
are we going to hear it? Are we going to
hear that piece of Batman?
Speaker 2 (18:04):
J bron Bron?
Speaker 1 (18:06):
You got it? Andy? Andy does such a great job.
Speaker 2 (18:15):
I heard that.
Speaker 3 (18:16):
I was like, this is this is so beautiful. It is.
Speaker 4 (18:24):
A father's mad UNTI b masks thieve big big and
(18:44):
the dwell.
Speaker 1 (18:48):
Guilt of.
Speaker 4 (18:53):
He speaks an rasises class and reads two shadows of
and slaves as we feel like go come leave, Father
(19:30):
surveyed me. See I fast so sweet we curtains or
stall read scripted and val.
Speaker 1 (19:55):
That's the prophet and the mad man that's out right now.
I'm me tough for Kamassi Washington. Imi Tafra is here
with me in the studio. Kamasi Washington is here to
tell me what are we hearing?
Speaker 2 (20:14):
What are the words?
Speaker 1 (20:15):
What is the breakdown?
Speaker 2 (20:16):
What we are hearing? Ganawa Ganawa is a tribute to
my beloved Morocco or in North Africa. And Ganwa music
is with the music of the black people of Morocco.
And when I wrote the songs this song, I wrote
it with the spirit of of of of travelers, of immigrants,
(20:38):
of millions of Morocco who immigrated to Europe in the
sixties and seventies, but also many other millions of immigrants
around the world. Here, you know, with a spirit of
an immigrant. I was an immigrant in the Netherlands there
and I'm I'm an immigrant here now. So that's what
the song is about. And it has the GW and
(21:02):
melodine and the verses in the chorus, and you know,
Kamasi brought that jazz with it, so yeah, became our song.
Speaker 1 (21:10):
Well it's and it's not just in the United States,
but around the world. It's a moment where immigrants are
The reality of that is, you know, something that folks
have to have to sort I don't you know. I
think we're very we're not historical when we look at
the concept of immigrants or migration. We're just so narrow
(21:35):
when you look at it in the big world history view,
it's real different.
Speaker 3 (21:40):
Yeah, it's like all around the world, same song. I mean,
tell me about her parents, Like, you know, the the
Netherlands need to work force and so they started to
you know, to hire hire Moroccans to come.
Speaker 2 (21:56):
And you know theabor that they didn't want to do.
Speaker 3 (22:00):
And so that's the same story. And then but you know,
then they look at you like why are you here?
Like only here because you asked me, you know, and
so you know, I think the same thing is happening. Obviously,
here and all around the world that we're like it's
like just people losing sight of humanity beyond just like industry.
(22:23):
You know, it's like all these are human beings and
so when they come they become a part of the culture,
to become a part of the society, and they're not
just you know, that's this thing as an expendable person.
And so the idea of it seems like to me,
the whole idea of like borders and all that, it's
(22:44):
kind of antiquated. It's like we live in such a
global world where like we have such connections with everyone.
It's like these invisible lines are so pointless, you know,
and so it's like they don't really they don't really help.
I don't really see how they're helping at this point.
Speaker 1 (23:02):
And in reality, you know, well, what I say, and
it's an unpopular opinion, but I don't really care, is
that corporations don't respect borders. Only human beings have to
respect borders. So that means they're arbitrary in a sense.
Speaker 3 (23:20):
Oh absolutely obbortrary and pointless. It's like, like, you know,
it's we just we're not there's no reason to separate
each other, Like what's the good reason, you know, other
than like I want to have more than you. You know,
(23:42):
there's no good reason to have that separation, Like, tell
me the good reason.
Speaker 4 (23:46):
You know.
Speaker 3 (23:46):
It's like we're obviously we have to share resources, we
all need each other, we all need everything that's everywhere,
and you know, to say that these people are only
allowed to stay here and these people are allowed to
want to go wherever they want to go, it's just like, well,
give me the good reason for that. M can't. Can't
give me the good reasons for that.
Speaker 1 (24:06):
And of course the music doesn't recognize borders at all.
Speaker 2 (24:11):
No, Yeah, music is basically, yeah, the only kind of
like medium or the art itself you know that doesn't
recognize borders. That brings everybody from around all different kinds
of places around the world.
Speaker 3 (24:27):
To one you know. And yeah, just a universal language.
Speaker 2 (24:31):
It's a universal language.
Speaker 3 (24:32):
Like you said.
Speaker 1 (24:33):
Yeah, and as artists, you're you're dealing with that really
literally because you're actually traveling everywhere and meeting people everywhere.
We started out talking am Tafra And the album is
out now right, Yeah, The Prophet and the Man Man.
You pick it up, We say, go buy the album,
don't just stream it, go to band camp or go
to iTunes, something you buy the vinyl, stop by the
(24:55):
studio right now, you can get it. It's now, you know,
and you've said we started out talking about all these
different influences, your ancestral influences, your band, whatever's your channeling.
We were talking during news, Traffic and Sports about how
the last piece, the Jabron piece, was actually written by
(25:17):
you channeling something that vibed like him, but it was you.
So obviously all of those influences are together in you
and Kamasi Washington. I don't know if it's is it
something about your generation of artists or what it is,
but it seems like the jazz artists, especially the black man,
are like, oh, i'm a I can dabble in hip hop.
(25:38):
I can be over here in R and B. I
know Miles Davis did that, but it seems to me
like what y'all are doing, you know, is more of
an extreme of it. You know, you can be at
a jazz festival one minute and on Kendrick Lamar's album
the next minute.
Speaker 3 (25:52):
I think that was kind of always the case. It
was just happening behind the curtain, and my generation opened
that curtain. And was like, hey, like I was saying,
like the the messaging is like these things are separate,
but they're not really separate, you know that. You know,
like Quincy Jones is as jazz, you know what I mean,
(26:13):
Michael which means Michael Jackson's jazz, you know what I mean.
I'm just saying. I mean, like, like you know, if
you look at James Brown's band, they were mostly people
who consider themselves to be jazz musicians. And so you're
talking about like you know, like Fred Wesley definitely, but
like you know, you know, Pee Wee, like all those
(26:34):
a lot of those guys, say all of them, but
a lot of those guys really consider themself to be
jazz musicians. And so you could we could have easily,
if not came up with the word funk and easily
called James Brown jazz, which would have made funk jazz,
which would have made hip hop jazz, you know what
I mean. And so and then when you you know, ash, So,
(26:55):
when I got graduated high school and I started really
doing a lot of work and stuff like that, so
to notice that like you know, behind the curtain, like
this stuff is mixing, it's all kind of mixing coss poulation,
going like there's all kind of like, you know, Sloops
first band, the first band I played with with Snoop,
(27:15):
most of them, most of us consider ourselves jazz. We
used to play Giant Steps for sound check, you know,
like most of us you're talking about, you know me,
thyn A Cad, you know, Spott, Robert Sea right, Terrace
Martin Uh, you know, people like Isaac Smith and Keon Harrold.
We were all in Sloops bands like that. Man, we
(27:36):
used to get a kick out of like going places,
you know with our you know, like our Snoop uniform,
go to jam sessions and people like like, oh, what
do you guys want to play? And then try to,
you know, call twenty six two or something like like
this the hardest song that you know. But so I
think I think all we really did was just kind
of open the curtain of something that was kind of
(27:57):
already happening, you know.
Speaker 1 (27:59):
And for you, Amita Fat, that was always a natural thing.
Or do you felt you feel more at home in
one one musical space than another.
Speaker 2 (28:10):
So I grew up in Amsterdam and I heard a
lot of like music from the West, but something always
felt missing, like the authenticity of me I am. I
am a Moroccan, I speak Arabic at home, and I
had to like, it just didn't feel natural to be
only hear singing songs from the West. So I one
(28:32):
day I backed my bags. I was eighteen years old,
of my mom. I'm going to Egypt. I want to
know about music in Egypt. I want to meet other
musicians from the Arab world. And that's kind of like
how my Arabic music career started off. And yeah, and
so it became natural. It's like your identity, you know,
it's like true to yourself.
Speaker 1 (28:54):
Yeah, it's in your DNA.
Speaker 2 (28:57):
The blueprint is there, Yes, it is.
Speaker 1 (29:00):
Well, we're gonna keep playing this music and that we're
going to continue this conversation with Kumasi Washington and Ami Tafra,
whose album The Madman and the Prophet, The Prophet and
the mad Man the Prophet first is out right now
listening to k b l A Top fifteen eighty my yes,
(29:22):
Kamasi Washington, Okay, mister Washington, you want to outro this piece?
Tell us where we're hearing. This was the first track, really, yeah, this.
Speaker 3 (29:35):
Is the song when I was playing the chords and
she was in the kitchen, so that that first part,
how do you how do you pronounce it? That what
you're doing on the in the beginning part. Yeah, So
she started singing like that and I was like whoa.
And then she we did the whole journey of hers
kind of hipping me to all that you know, like
people like going Katun and you know, Fayrus and stuff
like that, and it was just so beautiful. It was
(29:57):
it was you know, it's like times we work together, like,
you know, she has like some like something from her
culture that you know, kind of exists in a certain
kind of way that just will remind me of something
that exists, you know, kind of in my culture and
the like. So a lot of times we're just kind
of putting those things right up next to each other.
(30:18):
So when I heard it, I was like, man, I
sound like, you know, sm avant garde, like you know
something that you know, you know, you would hear like
you know, interstellar spaces or something like that. I was like, Oh,
let's let's put those two things together and see what
like with with you know what I mean. So it's
like you know kind of you know, with this you know,
kind of adding a little bit of that like kind
(30:38):
of like human like six eight you know, room but
almost you know what I mean, you know, and just
kind of I love that idea of like just putting
putting like cultures in the room together, like you're putting
people in the room together, and just to see see
what will happen, you know.
Speaker 1 (30:55):
Yeah, networking of entire histories. It Where can we hear you?
I mean, I see I have to go to New
York to the Blue Note.
Speaker 2 (31:08):
I'm going to have my excuse me, my first tour
in the United States. What congratulations, Thank you so much.
I'm so excited. And my first day of the tour
is going to be September twenty second at the Blue Note,
New York.
Speaker 1 (31:22):
Yes, but you're going to be traveling. I see you're
in Cincinnati, Chicago, Saint Louis, Nashville, Atlanta, Baltimore, Philly, Pittsburgh, Boston. Okay, okay, La,
you're gonna have to go to Yosh's in Oakland.
Speaker 3 (31:36):
Yeah, we are.
Speaker 2 (31:37):
I am going to add the dates in LA, but
I have to announce that. Okay, you guys just have
to pay attention.
Speaker 1 (31:42):
Ami Tafra Music, which is a m I t A
f r A Music, Ami taf Music on Instagram. You
probably have a website.
Speaker 2 (31:51):
Yes, website is wwwam dot com.
Speaker 3 (31:56):
You can.
Speaker 2 (31:58):
You can find me on Instagram is at Amita Music.
So that's where it goes when it comes to Instagram.
There's so many platforms I can keep up. I can
really keep up, so, but Instagram is where I'm like
most Yeah, that's the same.
Speaker 1 (32:12):
It's not that I don't care about your website, It's
just I spend way too much time on Instagram. Yeah,
Amita Music. And what are we touring with?
Speaker 2 (32:21):
What kind of a I'm three young cats from la
they're very very town and they're really like twenty one
twenty two and they Yeah, one just graduated from Berkeley College.
But is our cousin nice vertis Miller. So yeah, I'm
bringing a double bass, drunes and keys wow. Yeah, and
(32:46):
some special guests.
Speaker 1 (32:52):
I'm just wondering, Okay, what is it like working with
as together as husband and wife. You gotta have a
special kind of creativity to do that.
Speaker 3 (33:04):
I think it's beautiful. I mean I think that, uh,
you know, it's kind of like a throwback, you know
it used to be. You know, it's like it's the
family business.
Speaker 2 (33:16):
Yeah, literally with the little one. We were just listening
to our old demos the other day, and on every
demo you can hear our daughter like cry.
Speaker 3 (33:25):
Or talk or like.
Speaker 2 (33:28):
The piano, every literally every single demos.
Speaker 1 (33:31):
I mean, I follow you on IG so I see
that she's on the road with you.
Speaker 2 (33:35):
Oh yeah, she's the star, you know, she's definitely she's
part of the of the music band.
Speaker 1 (33:41):
Yeah, let's hope they're able to do that. I mean
I was sharing that, you know, I was backstage everywhere,
heard so much poetry and uh, you know that's an
education in itself. She's gonna pop out with something someday.
You'll be like, what you play the saxophone and you
never told me?
Speaker 3 (33:57):
Oh, she already plays a little She has a little
saxophone he plays and space piano.
Speaker 2 (34:01):
Actually wrote a song on his album Her name is Wow.
Speaker 1 (34:06):
The name Well, uh so that's already, that's already moving
that that train has left the station. And what else?
We only have a minute here, But what else? What
else do we need to know about this album?
Speaker 2 (34:19):
It's a beautiful album, yes, uh yeah, it's it's you know,
when time stops, So you want to reflect on on
things in life, or it can enhance your your your
search and guidance for different teams in life, you know,
like love, friendship, children.
Speaker 3 (34:37):
It's yeah, yeah, and definitely go get the vinyl because
there's we collab with an amazing visual artists Thomas Halsiego
and so there's some really beautiful artwork and you know
it's good for the you know, for the visual aspect
of it.
Speaker 1 (34:52):
We can order it on How where do we get
the vinyl?
Speaker 3 (34:56):
You can get it from my website.
Speaker 1 (35:01):
Yeah, get the vinyl. And you just want to have
an actual thing, definitely, by the thing the artists have
been educating me. When you stream, you own nothing. They
shut down the stream. You have no music. Well you
can go see live music.
Speaker 3 (35:16):
And it sounds better and it sounds better.
Speaker 1 (35:19):
Okay, I believe you. I'm me tell Ron come Asie Washington.
Thank you guys so much for coming in. Great conversation.
Speaker 2 (35:25):
Thank you. Yeah, it's my first podcast, by the way, yay,
who I'm honored.
Speaker 1 (35:31):
I'm honored to be the one. Tavis Smiley is up next.
He's got a great show, as usually have three million
guests and they're all gonna be fire. So you don't
want to miss that. Tap in with me on socials.
I'm at Duprema Radio d I P R I M A,
and then radio I'm everywhere. The station is at KBLA
fifteen eighty everywhere, comment like followed, subscribe like my mama.
(35:54):
The Great Diana Prima used to say, history is now,
like I always say, We're making it together. Until next time.
One Love,
Okay, b La Talk fifteen eighty. Okay, you guys there,
I got a studio full of powerful talent this morning.
You're hearing and I want to make sure I'm saying
it right. Fatima Ami Tafra, Is that right? A Ami Tafra.
Speaker 2 (00:20):
You can get a little role in there.
Speaker 1 (00:22):
She's using music to explore layers of history, spirit and heart.
Speaker 3 (00:27):
She is.
Speaker 1 (00:28):
We're sharing her music this morning, Dialects of different land.
She says. Her music carries sentiments of melody and verse
from her myriad homes Cairo, Istamboul, Amsterdam, and La and
she's here in studio with us this morning in support
of her first her debut album. Good morning, Welcome, good morning,
(00:50):
Thank you for having me, Thank you for coming in.
I'm really interested to have the conversation.
Speaker 2 (00:54):
You brought along a friend, Yeah, my husband.
Speaker 1 (00:59):
A very good friend, Kamasi Washington, composer, bandleader and saxophonists.
Speaker 3 (01:03):
Welcome, thank you, thank you.
Speaker 1 (01:05):
Yeah. We were down one yesterday, so we got we
got up one today on the jazz on the jazz
side of things. So you're from Morocco.
Speaker 2 (01:15):
Yes, I was born in Morocco and I lived there
for a few years and also lived in Amsterdam, the Netherlands. Yeah,
my parents are one of the first generation immigrants from
Morocco in Europe in the sixties and seventies, that's when
(01:36):
they moved and the Yeah.
Speaker 1 (01:39):
So when you say you're infusing all these different things
into your music, you're talking about your personal ancestors, but
also your journey as an artist and as a woman.
Speaker 2 (01:50):
Yeah, as an artist and as a woman. I lived
in Amsterdam, but also we're like a nomad living out
of a suitcase, traveling around the world. Yeah, yeah, doing
shows in I just went where music took me, you know,
living on Jordan, Egypt, Europe, different places in Europe.
Speaker 1 (02:13):
So yeah, and Kamasi, you're obviously you're a band leader, composer,
a saxophonist and icon on it's great to have you in.
Tell me about Obviously you guys are married, so that's
a layer. There's a layer to it there. But tell
me about the musical marriage.
Speaker 3 (02:30):
Yeah, you know kind of really started, uh during the pandemic.
You know, we were in lockdown and you know, we
had we had watched all the movies, so we started
we had this idea like we would start like like
reading books together, like like literally like reading them out loud,
like instead of just storytime. Yeah, story time and so
(02:54):
uh we got to Caloglebron's book The Prophet.
Speaker 2 (02:58):
That's quite a storytime.
Speaker 3 (03:00):
Yeah, and it was so fun. It was like it
was fun to kind of do and we were like
kind of trade off, like I would read one of
the chapters, she would read another. The poems say it
and we're like, oh, that was fun. And you know,
then we were I think the first song we wrote together,
I was messing around the piano or something and she
(03:23):
was in the probably in the kitchen, the kitchen, and
she just started singing to it and I was like, oh,
you know, and we just kind of it kind of
just turned into like a song that was written in
two rooms.
Speaker 1 (03:36):
I love that written in two rooms, which were some
of the only places you could go because you.
Speaker 3 (03:41):
Were on lockdown.
Speaker 1 (03:41):
Yeah. Yeah, well I mean any marriage that survives, you know,
lockdown is pretty solid. So it so it happened organically, yeah.
Speaker 3 (03:53):
Very organic.
Speaker 1 (03:54):
Yeah. And The Prophet and the Madman is called.
Speaker 2 (03:59):
Yeah. We we then went I took another book by
Halie Gibran and that was The mad Man, and from
the first page on we looked at each other and
we're like, wow, we think the mad Man is the Prophet.
We gotta do something with it. Then it became, yeah,
(04:19):
this album, you know, the Prophet and the Madman. We
took a few poems out of the two books and
it's kind of it's a conversation between the mad Man
and the Prophet, you know, two voices across across having
a discussion, having a conversation with each other across time.
And yeah, it's.
Speaker 1 (04:40):
It's it's beautiful, it's how do you place it? I mean,
I know that's kind of a weird question, but I'm
I feel like jazz, right, your album is jazz. You're
a jazz musician, but we put so many things under
the umbrella of jazz and you you kind of have
(05:00):
a little avant garde vibe going on, a little poetic
vibe going on. How would you describe it?
Speaker 2 (05:09):
Uh, world jazz, you know, it's it's my identity. Yeah,
world jazz, fusion jazz. There's a lot of like Arabic
sound to a North African Middle Eastern sound, and that's
blend to his sound, you know. So yeah, it's fusion jazz,
world jazz. But it's on the umbrella of jazz.
Speaker 3 (05:30):
So it's hard to contain something like music in a word,
in a singular word, you know, we try to do
that as human beings, to like encompass something like music
in a word. But to me, the music is always
greater than the words. You know, I call it om music.
Speaker 1 (05:50):
Music. I love that. I noticed, well, actually I didn't notice.
My booking producer, she's all in the in the mix
this morning, Asha, Asha Jordan, that you had quote music
is a way into God, the absolute open expression of
everything you You were utilizing that quote, which comes from
my dad, a Mary Baraka. So I thought that was
(06:13):
an interesting connection that it seems like that inspired you
in some way.
Speaker 2 (06:20):
Yeah, that that inspires me, but also just my journey
in general, the people that I've met in my in
my in my life, you know, before I came and
lived here, I lived in Istanbul, Turkey for a few
years during the height of when we had a lot
of terrorist terrorist attacks, and the political climate was this
very still is very very it's turbulence, and just to
(06:47):
see people how they are able to to live and
have hope and have hope for the future even though
they were living that, you know, and that. Yeah, that's
that's that gave me a lot of inspiration. And as
an artist, of course you're gonna like incorporate that into
your into your artistry.
Speaker 1 (07:06):
And yeah, it's funny because I'm always pushing on that
lately since November of last year, that art is one
of the portals. It's one of the places we need
to find strength and courage and inspiration and escape right
now because we you know, we're not having terror attacks
(07:27):
like Istanbul, but it feels like a lot for for
many people in this country right now.
Speaker 3 (07:34):
Yeah, music, art, I said, they're like the they're like
the secret agents of humanity because they can cross lines
that sometimes the artists themselves can't even cross, you know,
because I always say, like, you know, ultimately, you know,
the battle is not really the battle is to ultimately
(07:55):
change people, because they're not gonna disappear.
Speaker 1 (08:00):
You know.
Speaker 3 (08:00):
So the people that we feel like that are pushing
the world and know what direction that we don't want
to go in, it's like, well what do you do
with them? You know? And it's like to me, like
that's where art and music is so powerful because it's like, well, ultimately,
then what you really are saying is you want to do,
is you want to somehow shift them at least, you know,
because what else can you do?
Speaker 1 (08:21):
I mean I do. I believe in redemption and transformation
and a reinvention for all humans. You know, if we
don't have that opportunity, then what do we have?
Speaker 3 (08:31):
What do we have?
Speaker 1 (08:32):
Yeah, we're stuck, We're trapped. And so you know, that's
one of the reasons I do my best too, not
the name call to call out policies rather than you know,
call people called people things, because I feel like as
long as we believe that people can transform and change
and evolve, then there's always hope.
Speaker 3 (08:51):
Yeah, exactly. And we've seen that that's possible. I mean,
we've seen it through history, and we have these little
pockets where we where we do shift things, and it
seems like people we have shifted, you know. And it's
just the thing about it is I think that it's
just about understanding that those shifts are potentially always temporary,
(09:12):
you know. So it's a it's a it's a forever thing.
You know, it's like balancing something. It's like Okay, I
balance it, but it's gonna you know. And so now
I think we had a we had a at a
place of like massive imbalance on the other direction almost
and it's like, well times start writing some songs and
making some paintings and some some some poets. We gotta
(09:35):
we gotta rally the troops because we gotta we gotta
shift some lines, you know.
Speaker 1 (09:39):
Yeah, calling all light workers, let's get busy. Yeah, yeah,
I think it's well said. I'm looking forward to sharing
with the kb L a delegation more of your music
and your collaboration, uh together as we come forward a
tough run. Camasi Washington or in the studio with me
this morning. What a blessing cap talk fifteen eighty Amitra
(10:04):
and Camassi Washington in the studio. Yeah, let it write.
Tell me what we're hearing here?
Speaker 2 (10:12):
You hear love?
Speaker 1 (10:13):
Yeah, I do.
Speaker 2 (10:14):
From the album A Prophet and a Madman And it's
written via Halijah Bron. And there's actually a story. Halijah
Bron he started writing a fellow writer from Egypt in
nineteen from nineteen twelve on, and they fell in love
with each other for twenty years, writing to each other
(10:34):
without ever meeting one another. And there's there's a They
published some of the letters from Halijah bron and throughout
the years that they were writing, and that gives a
little insight behind the writings of the poems of the
Prophet and all the other poems. So it's it's beautiful
(10:55):
you know that someone. Yeah, you don't have to possess
love to be transformed by love, you know, And that's
just so beautiful from.
Speaker 1 (11:06):
Yeah, I feel like I'm listening to a movie. Soundshock,
I hear that if it's not in the movie already
and we'll be in the next ten minute.
Speaker 2 (11:14):
And the music, of course, beautiful arrangement by Kamasi, it's.
Speaker 1 (11:18):
Yeah, arranger, composer, saxophone player. What are what are? What
are we hearing from your perspective here?
Speaker 3 (11:26):
To me, I mean yeah, when I heard when when
we read Love, what I felt from it was like
he what's the right word? When he personified love, he
made it into a person, you know, and I was like, oh, wow,
imagine that, imagine love the person. And so, you know,
(11:47):
to me, when I was thinking about this music, it
was like, you know, you know, remember from like I'm
Gonna Get You sacking. Everybody has that theme music, Like
if love was personified as a person and wrote this
theme music, you know what I mean, And I just
imagine something like that, like some kind of really like
you know, so that was that was kind of how
my wires were and.
Speaker 1 (12:09):
Sung by your love, which is oh yeah they lovely.
Speaker 3 (12:12):
Yeah, And then she took it and at it that
im ti fried just purity, you know. That's how I say.
Her voice is like it's like the purest water, you know,
it's it's uh yeah.
Speaker 1 (12:30):
So when you guys write, do you you hear like
a whole full blown thing in your head or you
build it, you know, you know, instrument by instrument, bar
by bar, or it just plops in down on you
like a spaceship. Like how does that creative process?
Speaker 3 (12:47):
How do think our individual processes and then our kind
of collaborative process are probably a little different, you know.
I mean for me, I definitely am in like a
seed water it let it turn to a tree and
decide when to when the harvest the fruit. Yeah. I
have songs, you know, I've had songs that like lived
and sometimes you know, I'm kind of one of those
(13:09):
kind of organized chaos and people kind drives are crazy.
So I mean when I was younger, I used, there's
a song I have called the rhythm changes. No, no,
it wasn't rhythm changes. It was Journey. Journey lived on
a post it note on the stack of a whole
(13:30):
bunch of music on my piano for years because I
couldn't figure out the rhythm to put on it. And
I like the chords and I like the melody, and
I remember Miles mostly he had heard that song and
every time he came to my house it would drive
him crazy that that was just living right there, I
mean lived there and in my head.
Speaker 1 (13:50):
But so it was it was a sort of an
orphaned song on a post it note.
Speaker 3 (13:55):
And then to me it's like it was solid. It
was like as long as somebody moves my stuff, posting
notice is just as safe as as a hard drive,
you know.
Speaker 2 (14:05):
Okay, But.
Speaker 3 (14:08):
It was just uh, I just I just hadn't. I
was tiring for it. Figure It took me a long
time to figure out, like just the rhythm of it.
So I had it, and I was like I can't
figure out and I was thinking of it the wrong way.
And so anyway, so like that happens with me. So
like I, you know, I have something and then I
grow it, and then I keep growing it. Until I
(14:28):
can until it feels like it's almost like a like
a like it's an adult, and then it's like, all right,
go in the world and live your how do your
existence and how do you?
Speaker 2 (14:39):
Yeah? For me, it's like I record the I hear
the melodies in my head and I just recorded it
and then I listened back to it and see if
I can add something like for speak to us for example,
the word just came came like an epiphany to me
with the melodies together, and I recorded and went to commands.
I was like, COMI listen to this, Okay, do you
think this is this is this is good for the
(15:02):
to work on it, you know, And he was like yeah,
and he made this. Of course he goes big and
he had this whole arrangement of orchestra and we had
like forty five musicians working on the album, you know.
So yeah, he took it just through the next level.
Speaker 1 (15:15):
This is a song you were talking about right life Hella,
that's amazing piece in my hellos Yeah, joys string and
so you knew when it was an adult and you
sent it on its.
Speaker 3 (15:34):
Wife, it was like that that twenty five year old
that's still living in his mother's basement because I had
that song for a long time and then uh, I
tried a bunch of different times and I was like, man,
that's something about this not right, you know. And then
I said, Miles knew it was there. And one day
I think it was Moles. Moles sat down at the drums,
a million drummers, tied, a million drummers, tried to play
(15:55):
and I want to play it right, and he played
that beat and when we played it to that rhythm,
I was like, oh, it was like it was like
it was like it was like that person graduated from
tech school.
Speaker 1 (16:10):
And so now for you, you said that you sometimes
sometimes it can come to you in one whole piece.
Speaker 2 (16:23):
Yeah, it just comes to me. And that that happened
would speak to us. The melodies and the words. It
just just came to me, and I recorded right away
and speak to us, speak to us.
Speaker 1 (16:35):
Now, does that ever happen? A song is knocking on
your door and you're like, go away, I don't that's
not good.
Speaker 2 (16:42):
Yeah, sometimes I record stuff and I listened to what
was I thinking, what is this? You know? I have
like I literally have hundreds of those in my phone,
like and yeah.
Speaker 1 (16:52):
Yeah, but when, but when.
Speaker 2 (16:54):
It's when, you just yeah, like you know, you know,
I know, I know. There was a song on the
album as Ibron. He was playing it in the in
the living room on the piano, and I was somewhere
and walking down the house and I heard the meld.
Speaker 3 (17:10):
I was like, this is it.
Speaker 2 (17:12):
This has to this has to be mine, because I
just had the words for it ready to to to
to be attached to that piece of music, but the
music was not mine because he was working on for
a movie.
Speaker 3 (17:24):
And yeah, I was working on for her film, and
I was doing a whole bunch of different versions of
that uh scene. And so she kind of was like,
I hope that director doesn't want that. I was like,
don't curse it. I'm like trying to get this finished.
(17:44):
And she was like, I hope he doesn't want it
because I want it, you know, and you know it
wasn't the right thing for reason. She was Yes, she
definitely claimed it.
Speaker 1 (17:53):
You know what. I felt mad at that name and
explaiment you do not want this piece? So well, so
are we going to hear it? Are we going to
hear that piece of Batman?
Speaker 2 (18:04):
J bron Bron?
Speaker 1 (18:06):
You got it? Andy? Andy does such a great job.
Speaker 2 (18:15):
I heard that.
Speaker 3 (18:16):
I was like, this is this is so beautiful. It is.
Speaker 4 (18:24):
A father's mad UNTI b masks thieve big big and
(18:44):
the dwell.
Speaker 1 (18:48):
Guilt of.
Speaker 4 (18:53):
He speaks an rasises class and reads two shadows of
and slaves as we feel like go come leave, Father
(19:30):
surveyed me. See I fast so sweet we curtains or
stall read scripted and val.
Speaker 1 (19:55):
That's the prophet and the mad man that's out right now.
I'm me tough for Kamassi Washington. Imi Tafra is here
with me in the studio. Kamasi Washington is here to
tell me what are we hearing?
Speaker 2 (20:14):
What are the words?
Speaker 1 (20:15):
What is the breakdown?
Speaker 2 (20:16):
What we are hearing? Ganawa Ganawa is a tribute to
my beloved Morocco or in North Africa. And Ganwa music
is with the music of the black people of Morocco.
And when I wrote the songs this song, I wrote
it with the spirit of of of of travelers, of immigrants,
(20:38):
of millions of Morocco who immigrated to Europe in the
sixties and seventies, but also many other millions of immigrants
around the world. Here, you know, with a spirit of
an immigrant. I was an immigrant in the Netherlands there
and I'm I'm an immigrant here now. So that's what
the song is about. And it has the GW and
(21:02):
melodine and the verses in the chorus, and you know,
Kamasi brought that jazz with it, so yeah, became our song.
Speaker 1 (21:10):
Well it's and it's not just in the United States,
but around the world. It's a moment where immigrants are
The reality of that is, you know, something that folks
have to have to sort I don't you know. I
think we're very we're not historical when we look at
the concept of immigrants or migration. We're just so narrow
(21:35):
when you look at it in the big world history view,
it's real different.
Speaker 3 (21:40):
Yeah, it's like all around the world, same song. I mean,
tell me about her parents, Like, you know, the the
Netherlands need to work force and so they started to
you know, to hire hire Moroccans to come.
Speaker 2 (21:56):
And you know theabor that they didn't want to do.
Speaker 3 (22:00):
And so that's the same story. And then but you know,
then they look at you like why are you here?
Like only here because you asked me, you know, and
so you know, I think the same thing is happening. Obviously,
here and all around the world that we're like it's
like just people losing sight of humanity beyond just like industry.
(22:23):
You know, it's like all these are human beings and
so when they come they become a part of the culture,
to become a part of the society, and they're not
just you know, that's this thing as an expendable person.
And so the idea of it seems like to me,
the whole idea of like borders and all that, it's
(22:44):
kind of antiquated. It's like we live in such a
global world where like we have such connections with everyone.
It's like these invisible lines are so pointless, you know,
and so it's like they don't really they don't really help.
I don't really see how they're helping at this point.
Speaker 1 (23:02):
And in reality, you know, well, what I say, and
it's an unpopular opinion, but I don't really care, is
that corporations don't respect borders. Only human beings have to
respect borders. So that means they're arbitrary in a sense.
Speaker 3 (23:20):
Oh absolutely obbortrary and pointless. It's like, like, you know,
it's we just we're not there's no reason to separate
each other, Like what's the good reason, you know, other
than like I want to have more than you. You know,
(23:42):
there's no good reason to have that separation, Like, tell
me the good reason.
Speaker 4 (23:46):
You know.
Speaker 3 (23:46):
It's like we're obviously we have to share resources, we
all need each other, we all need everything that's everywhere,
and you know, to say that these people are only
allowed to stay here and these people are allowed to
want to go wherever they want to go, it's just like, well,
give me the good reason for that. M can't. Can't
give me the good reasons for that.
Speaker 1 (24:06):
And of course the music doesn't recognize borders at all.
Speaker 2 (24:11):
No, Yeah, music is basically, yeah, the only kind of
like medium or the art itself you know that doesn't
recognize borders. That brings everybody from around all different kinds
of places around the world.
Speaker 3 (24:27):
To one you know. And yeah, just a universal language.
Speaker 2 (24:31):
It's a universal language.
Speaker 3 (24:32):
Like you said.
Speaker 1 (24:33):
Yeah, and as artists, you're you're dealing with that really
literally because you're actually traveling everywhere and meeting people everywhere.
We started out talking am Tafra And the album is
out now right, Yeah, The Prophet and the Man Man.
You pick it up, We say, go buy the album,
don't just stream it, go to band camp or go
to iTunes, something you buy the vinyl, stop by the
(24:55):
studio right now, you can get it. It's now, you know,
and you've said we started out talking about all these
different influences, your ancestral influences, your band, whatever's your channeling.
We were talking during news, Traffic and Sports about how
the last piece, the Jabron piece, was actually written by
(25:17):
you channeling something that vibed like him, but it was you.
So obviously all of those influences are together in you
and Kamasi Washington. I don't know if it's is it
something about your generation of artists or what it is,
but it seems like the jazz artists, especially the black man,
are like, oh, i'm a I can dabble in hip hop.
(25:38):
I can be over here in R and B. I
know Miles Davis did that, but it seems to me
like what y'all are doing, you know, is more of
an extreme of it. You know, you can be at
a jazz festival one minute and on Kendrick Lamar's album
the next minute.
Speaker 3 (25:52):
I think that was kind of always the case. It
was just happening behind the curtain, and my generation opened
that curtain. And was like, hey, like I was saying,
like the the messaging is like these things are separate,
but they're not really separate, you know that. You know,
like Quincy Jones is as jazz, you know what I mean,
(26:13):
Michael which means Michael Jackson's jazz, you know what I mean.
I'm just saying. I mean, like, like you know, if
you look at James Brown's band, they were mostly people
who consider themselves to be jazz musicians. And so you're
talking about like you know, like Fred Wesley definitely, but
like you know, you know, Pee Wee, like all those
(26:34):
a lot of those guys, say all of them, but
a lot of those guys really consider themself to be
jazz musicians. And so you could we could have easily,
if not came up with the word funk and easily
called James Brown jazz, which would have made funk jazz,
which would have made hip hop jazz, you know what
I mean. And so and then when you you know, ash, So,
(26:55):
when I got graduated high school and I started really
doing a lot of work and stuff like that, so
to notice that like you know, behind the curtain, like
this stuff is mixing, it's all kind of mixing coss poulation,
going like there's all kind of like, you know, Sloops
first band, the first band I played with with Snoop,
(27:15):
most of them, most of us consider ourselves jazz. We
used to play Giant Steps for sound check, you know,
like most of us you're talking about, you know me,
thyn A Cad, you know, Spott, Robert Sea right, Terrace
Martin Uh, you know, people like Isaac Smith and Keon Harrold.
We were all in Sloops bands like that. Man, we
(27:36):
used to get a kick out of like going places,
you know with our you know, like our Snoop uniform,
go to jam sessions and people like like, oh, what
do you guys want to play? And then try to,
you know, call twenty six two or something like like
this the hardest song that you know. But so I
think I think all we really did was just kind
of open the curtain of something that was kind of
(27:57):
already happening, you know.
Speaker 1 (27:59):
And for you, Amita Fat, that was always a natural thing.
Or do you felt you feel more at home in
one one musical space than another.
Speaker 2 (28:10):
So I grew up in Amsterdam and I heard a
lot of like music from the West, but something always
felt missing, like the authenticity of me I am. I
am a Moroccan, I speak Arabic at home, and I
had to like, it just didn't feel natural to be
only hear singing songs from the West. So I one
(28:32):
day I backed my bags. I was eighteen years old,
of my mom. I'm going to Egypt. I want to
know about music in Egypt. I want to meet other
musicians from the Arab world. And that's kind of like
how my Arabic music career started off. And yeah, and
so it became natural. It's like your identity, you know,
it's like true to yourself.
Speaker 1 (28:54):
Yeah, it's in your DNA.
Speaker 2 (28:57):
The blueprint is there, Yes, it is.
Speaker 1 (29:00):
Well, we're gonna keep playing this music and that we're
going to continue this conversation with Kumasi Washington and Ami Tafra,
whose album The Madman and the Prophet, The Prophet and
the mad Man the Prophet first is out right now
listening to k b l A Top fifteen eighty my yes,
(29:22):
Kamasi Washington, Okay, mister Washington, you want to outro this piece?
Tell us where we're hearing. This was the first track, really, yeah, this.
Speaker 3 (29:35):
Is the song when I was playing the chords and
she was in the kitchen, so that that first part,
how do you how do you pronounce it? That what
you're doing on the in the beginning part. Yeah, So
she started singing like that and I was like whoa.
And then she we did the whole journey of hers
kind of hipping me to all that you know, like
people like going Katun and you know, Fayrus and stuff
like that, and it was just so beautiful. It was
(29:57):
it was you know, it's like times we work together, like,
you know, she has like some like something from her
culture that you know, kind of exists in a certain
kind of way that just will remind me of something
that exists, you know, kind of in my culture and
the like. So a lot of times we're just kind
of putting those things right up next to each other.
(30:18):
So when I heard it, I was like, man, I
sound like, you know, sm avant garde, like you know
something that you know, you know, you would hear like
you know, interstellar spaces or something like that. I was like, Oh,
let's let's put those two things together and see what
like with with you know what I mean. So it's
like you know kind of you know, with this you know,
kind of adding a little bit of that like kind
(30:38):
of like human like six eight you know, room but
almost you know what I mean, you know, and just
kind of I love that idea of like just putting
putting like cultures in the room together, like you're putting
people in the room together, and just to see see
what will happen, you know.
Speaker 1 (30:55):
Yeah, networking of entire histories. It Where can we hear you?
I mean, I see I have to go to New
York to the Blue Note.
Speaker 2 (31:08):
I'm going to have my excuse me, my first tour
in the United States. What congratulations, Thank you so much.
I'm so excited. And my first day of the tour
is going to be September twenty second at the Blue Note,
New York.
Speaker 1 (31:22):
Yes, but you're going to be traveling. I see you're
in Cincinnati, Chicago, Saint Louis, Nashville, Atlanta, Baltimore, Philly, Pittsburgh, Boston. Okay, okay, La,
you're gonna have to go to Yosh's in Oakland.
Speaker 3 (31:36):
Yeah, we are.
Speaker 2 (31:37):
I am going to add the dates in LA, but
I have to announce that. Okay, you guys just have
to pay attention.
Speaker 1 (31:42):
Ami Tafra Music, which is a m I t A
f r A Music, Ami taf Music on Instagram. You
probably have a website.
Speaker 2 (31:51):
Yes, website is wwwam dot com.
Speaker 3 (31:56):
You can.
Speaker 2 (31:58):
You can find me on Instagram is at Amita Music.
So that's where it goes when it comes to Instagram.
There's so many platforms I can keep up. I can
really keep up, so, but Instagram is where I'm like
most Yeah, that's the same.
Speaker 1 (32:12):
It's not that I don't care about your website, It's
just I spend way too much time on Instagram. Yeah,
Amita Music. And what are we touring with?
Speaker 2 (32:21):
What kind of a I'm three young cats from la
they're very very town and they're really like twenty one
twenty two and they Yeah, one just graduated from Berkeley College.
But is our cousin nice vertis Miller. So yeah, I'm
bringing a double bass, drunes and keys wow. Yeah, and
(32:46):
some special guests.
Speaker 1 (32:52):
I'm just wondering, Okay, what is it like working with
as together as husband and wife. You gotta have a
special kind of creativity to do that.
Speaker 3 (33:04):
I think it's beautiful. I mean I think that, uh,
you know, it's kind of like a throwback, you know
it used to be. You know, it's like it's the
family business.
Speaker 2 (33:16):
Yeah, literally with the little one. We were just listening
to our old demos the other day, and on every
demo you can hear our daughter like cry.
Speaker 3 (33:25):
Or talk or like.
Speaker 2 (33:28):
The piano, every literally every single demos.
Speaker 1 (33:31):
I mean, I follow you on IG so I see
that she's on the road with you.
Speaker 2 (33:35):
Oh yeah, she's the star, you know, she's definitely she's
part of the of the music band.
Speaker 1 (33:41):
Yeah, let's hope they're able to do that. I mean
I was sharing that, you know, I was backstage everywhere,
heard so much poetry and uh, you know that's an
education in itself. She's gonna pop out with something someday.
You'll be like, what you play the saxophone and you
never told me?
Speaker 3 (33:57):
Oh, she already plays a little She has a little
saxophone he plays and space piano.
Speaker 2 (34:01):
Actually wrote a song on his album Her name is Wow.
Speaker 1 (34:06):
The name Well, uh so that's already, that's already moving
that that train has left the station. And what else?
We only have a minute here, But what else? What
else do we need to know about this album?
Speaker 2 (34:19):
It's a beautiful album, yes, uh yeah, it's it's you know,
when time stops, So you want to reflect on on
things in life, or it can enhance your your your
search and guidance for different teams in life, you know,
like love, friendship, children.
Speaker 3 (34:37):
It's yeah, yeah, and definitely go get the vinyl because
there's we collab with an amazing visual artists Thomas Halsiego
and so there's some really beautiful artwork and you know
it's good for the you know, for the visual aspect
of it.
Speaker 1 (34:52):
We can order it on How where do we get
the vinyl?
Speaker 3 (34:56):
You can get it from my website.
Speaker 1 (35:01):
Yeah, get the vinyl. And you just want to have
an actual thing, definitely, by the thing the artists have
been educating me. When you stream, you own nothing. They
shut down the stream. You have no music. Well you
can go see live music.
Speaker 3 (35:16):
And it sounds better and it sounds better.
Speaker 1 (35:19):
Okay, I believe you. I'm me tell Ron come Asie Washington.
Thank you guys so much for coming in. Great conversation.
Speaker 2 (35:25):
Thank you. Yeah, it's my first podcast, by the way, yay,
who I'm honored.
Speaker 1 (35:31):
I'm honored to be the one. Tavis Smiley is up next.
He's got a great show, as usually have three million
guests and they're all gonna be fire. So you don't
want to miss that. Tap in with me on socials.
I'm at Duprema Radio d I P R I M A,
and then radio I'm everywhere. The station is at KBLA
fifteen eighty everywhere, comment like followed, subscribe like my mama.
(35:54):
The Great Diana Prima used to say, history is now,
like I always say, We're making it together. Until next time.
One Love,
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