February 5, 2025 • 20 mins
Faith and public policy are at a crossroads, making waves in national headlines. This intersection is deeply political, with Christians divided on all sides of the issue. As followers of Christ, it’s essential to remember that while Jesus’ message is undeniably political, it is never partisan.
In this episode, Bishop Wright sits down with Rebecca Linder Blachly, the Director of the Office of Government Relations for The Episcopal Church. Together, they explore the nation’s most pressing issues and the critical role the Church plays in advocating for humane immigration policies amidst political tension. Rebecca, whose journey took her from studying philosophy to navigating the corridors of the Pentagon, offers her unique perspective on how to maintain hope and stability, all while nurturing existing ministries. Listen in for the full conversation.
Since 2016, Rebecca Blachly has served as The Director of The Office of Government Relations for The Episcopal Church. Prior to this role, she was the Senior Policy Advisor for Africa in the Office of Religion and Global Affairs at the U.S. Department of State. Her previous positions include Acting Chief of the Strategic Communication Division at U.S. Africa Command in Stuttgart, Germany, Special Assistant to the Principal Deputy Under Secretary of Defense for Policy, and Research Associate in the Post-Conflict Reconstruction Project at the Center for Strategic and International Studies. She has conducted fieldwork and research throughout Africa and the Middle East and she has published on civil-military relations and information sharing in complex environments. Ms. Blachly received her B.A. in philosophy from Williams College and her M.Div. from Harvard University, and she is a Term Member at the Council on Foreign Relations.
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Episode Transcript
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Rebecca Linder Blachly (00:00):
We are called to different things right
, Different ministries, and weare not called to fix everything
that we can't.
So I just feel that if each ofus can open our hearts to what
that calling is, which againwill be so different for some
people it's advocacy, for somepeople it's direct ministry
(00:20):
there's so many differentcallings and know that our help
comes from the Lord that canhelp us through what can be some
really challenging times.
Bishop Wright (00:40):
Hi everyone, and welcome to this special edition
of For People.
Today, our guest is RebeccaLinder Blachly.
She's the director of theOffice of Government Relations
for the Episcopal Church.
Rebecca hi.
Rebecca Linder Blachly (00:54):
Hi, so good to be with you today.
Bishop Wright (00:56):
And welcome.
Welcome and thanks for beingwith us.
Her BA is from Williams and shehas an MDiv from Harvard.
Prior to taking this role asDirector of the Office of
Government Relations for theEpiscopal Church, she was a
Senior Policy Advisor for Africain the Office of Religion and
Global Affairs at the USDepartment of State.
(01:18):
Her previous positions includeActing Chief of Strategic
Communication Division at USAfrica.
Include acting chief ofstrategic communication division
at US Africa command inStuttgart, germany.
Special assistant to theprincipal deputy under secretary
of defense for policy andresearch associate in the
post-conflict reconstruction Wow, that's a lot of experience,
(01:39):
yeah, so well.
First of all, let's start withyou.
How did you get into this work?
You've got an MDiv, which meansyou're interested in God and
interested in the ways in whichwe talk about God and live for
God, and you've got this publicpolicy background.
Take me to that intersection.
Rebecca Linder Blachly (01:58):
Yeah, for some it's surprising, but to
me it always felt natural.
There were two things that Iwas interested in and felt
called to, so studied philosophyas an undergrad and dance as
well, and found myself workingat the Pentagon a few years
after that, after spending a fewyears in a think tank, and I
(02:19):
was surprised and interested toreally think the work was so
meaningful and I thought it wasa really powerful way to help
the hurting world.
I was working on peacekeeping,disaster response, humanitarian
assistance, went to divinityschool and was kind of
discerning what way forward,what the way forward would be,
(02:40):
and then was able to actuallywork on the intersection of
those two things at the StateDepartment for a short time.
It's no longer there, but therewas an Office of Religion and
Global Affairs where the StateDepartment was trying to do a
better job of understanding themany roles that religious
communities play, so notseparate, you know there was no
constitutional question aboutseparation of church and state,
(03:04):
about separation of church andstate.
But it was more, that the StateDepartment was realizing that
religious communities, as youknow, have health ministries and
education networks and so manyministries that understanding
those dynamics on climate changeand anti-corruption work and,
of course, education, health,all these things that are so
critical for foreign policygoals better understanding
(03:25):
religious communities could help.
So I was, you know, happily inthat role and then had the
opportunity to come on over tothe Episcopal Church and lead
the advocacy efforts.
Bishop Wright (03:35):
So I wanted to have you on because here, at the
very beginning of PresidentTrump's second term of President
Trump's second term, we'rethinking a lot about immigration
, refugees, deportationpractices and policies and, of
(03:58):
course, in our church here inAtlanta and really in middle
North Georgia, a lot of ourmembers are men and women and
young people of you know who areHispanic, and there's a great
wave of fear that's sweepingover over this community, as
well as uncertainty, and peoplewho love them and care a lot
about them are wondering howbest to help, and I know you've
(04:22):
been taking a lot of calls andspending a lot of time in
interviews and meetings, etcetera, and so where do you
start in this conversation?
What should the church be doingright now, as many of her
members are fearful?
Rebecca Linder Blachly (04:39):
I think the church should keep doing
what we've been doing, which iskeep having the ministries that
we carry out, continuing them,realizing there may be a greater
need, and that's forundocumented populations or
those who currently haveauthorization to be in the
United States but who may havethat revoked.
That's one of the things we'rereally concerned about.
(04:59):
But also for US citizens, wemay see social safety net
provisions really scale backdramatically.
So I think the first is just toknow that the work is the same.
It may need to be more but, asyou point out, the fear is
present and is just, I think,part of maybe part of the goal.
(05:23):
Think part of, maybe part ofthe goal.
I mean I can't speak for theintent, but it certainly seems
like that's certainly the effect.
Again, whether or not it's theintent, I guess I can't say, but
to have communities feel afraidand, I think, to continue to do
the best we can to be rooted inour own faith and to then,
practically speaking, help thoseof us in our communities who
(05:47):
have a fear of deportation or,again, fear about a legal status
with resources.
And so there's Know your Rightstrainings that help educate
everyone in our churches aboutwhat our rights are, and there's
family preparedness plans forpeople who may be at risk of
deportation, having something inplace so that the kids have a
(06:08):
place to go and people know whatbank accounts they've got or
what to do with pets I mean, whoknows?
But just some practical stepsto just be prepared.
And then I would just say thatwe can advocate, we can reach
out to our members of Congressand tell them that we support
humane immigration policies andthat we want to care for our
(06:29):
neighbors.
Bishop Wright (06:31):
Yeah, yeah, you know I'm thinking a lot about
this right now.
I'm thinking about you know,the people in our 120 worshiping
communities.
And I'm thinking about you knowmy own vows that I made when I
was ordained bishop and I justreread those in light of
everything that's happening inour country.
(06:52):
And you know, in preparationfor this phone call and I was
really struck again by a promisethat I made and it says will
you be merciful to all showcompassion to the poor and
stranger and defend those whohave no help?
And I said, in front of God andeverybody else, a pastor is the
(07:26):
care of folks, the care ofsouls, the enlargement of
compassion, first and foremost,and not very much about people's
status, immigration status,citizenship status.
(07:50):
I think the gospel helps me tothread that needle.
I pray and will advocate forthe implementation of any
policies that we have toimplement, that they be done
with care for the dignity ofevery human being.
But I think the church has asacred role here and that is to
(08:11):
care for people and to bearwitness that all are made in the
image of God.
Have I got that right?
I mean, I know you spend sometime with the presiding bishop
and others who are thinkingabout these things.
What would you say in responseto that?
Rebecca Linder Blachly (08:27):
I mean yes, a thousand times yes.
Our call is to care for thosein our midst and to show
Christ's love and be agents ofChrist's love.
Our job is not to formulatecomplex immigration policy.
Let's say that we can advocatefor values that should undergird
it.
Our church has taken policypositions that my colleagues and
(08:50):
I advocate for, certainly, butreally, at the root of all of
that is the dignity of everyhuman being.
At the root of all of it isthat we, as church, serve all.
Bishop Wright (09:24):
We met, that is, the representatives of the
entire Episcopal Church.
We met in Louisville, Kentucky,in June and, as you well know,
that body worships together,prays together and passes
resolutions, which are basicallythe mind of the church, if you
will, who we say we are, and wepassed some resolutions.
(09:49):
I think that touch on thisissue primarily.
Which one of those resolutionsor which number of resolutions
are you thinking about as youtry to support us, who are
supporting congregations?
Rebecca Linder Blachly (10:06):
Well, there certainly were some
resolutions passed In Louisville.
There was one called Migrationwith Dignity, looking at how we
as a church respond to migration.
But I would just say as wellthat we've, as a church, have
more than 650 public policyresolutions that our office has
called to carry out, so there isno shortage.
We have more than 50 focused onimmigration alone, and so
(10:32):
there's a lot our church hassaid over the decades in various
different political contextsand in different times.
But, as I said, the valuesunderlying them are the same.
And then there's times when thechurch speaks to the current
political moment and what'sneeded in that.
But right now we've for decadesand decades advocated for
(10:53):
comprehensive immigration reform, recognizing the right of
sovereign states to have asecure border while at the same
time, the legal right forimmigrants to claim asylum, At
the same time, the legal rightfor immigrants to claim asylum.
And of course, we are one ofthe 10 federally funded refugee
resettlement agencies throughthe tremendous work of Episcopal
Migration Ministries.
So we know it's a part of ourchurch, both in terms of the
(11:17):
resolutions that we've spoken onthrough for decades and then
again the ministries, both atthe congregational level up
through the church structures.
Bishop Wright (11:28):
You know this is really important.
This is an important pointyou're making here, and that is
that we have been shouldered tothe wheel of this work for some
time.
And so you know, I know thatsome people and I think
legitimately they wonder, youknow, if the church isn't
engaged in partisan politicswhen it stands up and sort of
(11:51):
affirms the right of, you know,to dignity for everyone.
They're wondering if what we'resaying and what we're doing
isn't sort of specific to thispresident, isn't anti-President
Trump.
And you're saying we've been atthis work for some time.
Rebecca Linder Blach (12:08):
Absolutely , and we have engaged with all
the administrations of bothparties members of.
Congress of both parties andreally try to find common ground
whenever it's possible.
Actually, there's a resolutionso the church has said that we
should work in a bipartisan waywhenever possible.
Actually there's a resolutionso the church has said that we
should work in a bipartisan waywhenever possible.
Of the Episcopal members ofCongress, it's 50-50 Republicans
(12:30):
and Democrats.
We know that there's politicaldiversity in our pews, certainly
, so we really are not lookingat our work as coming from a
partisan place but instead as,again, the values that we as a
religious community can offer.
And that's something we hearfrom members of Congress that
there are many lobbyists who areworking for industry,
(12:52):
advocating for interest and taxcuts for the industry that
they're working for, but whereare the people who are speaking
up for the most vulnerable?
It's religious communities andnon-profits, secular and secular
nonprofits as well.
You know, certainly we workwith ecumenical, inter-religious
secular groups all the time,but there's a lot that religious
communities can do because wehave the ministries, know the
(13:14):
people and can say we need tomake sure that there's a voice
in Washington for the peoplerelying on food assistance or
supplemental you know,supplemental nutritional
assistance, or need housing helpor need support when they're
encountering domestic violence,and just make sure that those
are priorities too, right, andnot just not just the things
(13:39):
that you know the corporatelobbyists are paying to advocate
for, and that's really how Isee us.
Bishop Wright (13:45):
Sure, let me take you to the granular level here.
You know I've gotten calls,emails and text messages and
people are wondering about.
You know what is this idea ofsanctuary?
Is that real, is it sentimental?
You've heard that questionbefore.
I mean we should have sanctuaryhearts for everyone, of course,
(14:09):
but they're asking aboutproperty.
How do we participate with lawenforcement and when do we
resist nonviolently andrespectfully?
Rebecca Linder Blachly (14:26):
So the sanctuary question, I think, is
a hard one because the word isso meaningful to us as
Christians and our church hascommitted ourselves to the
spirit of the sanctuary movement.
But what that means is sodifferent based on different
contexts so it can be confusing.
So I usually urge diocesecongregations, if asked, to
(14:48):
emphasize welcome rather thanusing a word that has a
different meaning in differentcontexts.
So sanctuary city can mean thatthe local law enforcement
doesn't cooperate with federallaw enforcement, but then for
the churches it doesn't have atechnical meaning but it can
mean sheltering someone.
So I think other words are morehelpful because of the
(15:09):
ambiguity of that term.
Bishop Wright (15:11):
Yeah, Well, the verbiage is one thing, but what
about?
Do we have an official policyin the Episcopal church about
property, for instance?
Do we hold our properties asprivate property and therefore
can limit access?
Rebecca Linder Blachly (15:26):
What I've heard in briefings that
I've been doing over the pastfew weeks with our chief legal
officers to really be in touchwith legal counsel within, you
know, depending on thejurisdiction.
But you know we have know yourrights trainings that talk about
what to do if there's a raidand whether something happens in
the sanctuary or in publicspace and open space and private
(15:49):
space.
You know you don't need to letsomeone into private space
unless there's a specificwarrant that you can ask to see.
But again, I don't want to stepout of my lane here too much.
But there's certainly resourcesthat can speak to what to do if
law enforcement comes invarious settings.
But there's not a universalchurch policy that sort of is
(16:09):
across the board for thesesettings because it depends on
the context, both the localityand the context of you know
who's there at any given time.
Bishop Wright (16:20):
No, I appreciate that and I know it's complex,
you know.
So for us here in middle andnorth Georgia, I mean, we're
distributed over 75 and a halfcounties and it's just not
uniform right.
It's sort of a moving targetand it kind of depends.
And so people are sort ofasking me what is the broad
(16:43):
statement I can issue that'sgoing to be elastic enough for
everything and everyone.
And it's really difficult.
And I've talked to otherbishops and we all sort of agree
that because it's socomplicated we feel ineffectual.
Rebecca Linder Blachly (17:01):
Yeah, I think.
I mean it's such a challengingmoment for just so many around
the church, and I think that thethings we can do are just
continue our ministries and notask about people's immigration
status.
That's a really good one.
We don't need to know that, andthat can protect people in a
sense too, because then we'renot knowingly involved in
(17:22):
anything, but again, knowing,like offering trainings, sharing
resources for familypreparedness plans that can help
people who are feeling at riskto know what they have in place
and then to know that the churchwill be there for them and
their family.
The federal government haspretty broad authority on some
immigration questions, that'strue, and so we want to seek a
(17:47):
transformative policy agendaaround our immigration policy.
But in this moment, I think wewant to make sure to protect
those in our communities as bestwe can and serve those in our
communities as best we can.
Bishop Wright (17:58):
I appreciate that answer.
I really do, because it isevolving.
The issue is evolving, rapidlyevolving, in fact, and it's
being applied different placesin different ways and it's sort
of hard to know.
And yet we want to make surethat the message is clear that
we love our brothers and sisters, that we are siblings entirely
(18:19):
under God and that when theyhurt, we hurt.
You know, one of the thingsthat I've heard that some people
are going to do is, you know,develop sort of banks of lawyers
to be able to assist, providesome resources, some know-how to
people those of us who possesstwo languages can really really
(18:40):
be helpful right now et cetera,et cetera.
But all of it is to justdeliver as much care and
compassion as we can.
So let me ask you this lastlyYou've worked at a great and
large scale in faraway placesand now you're here at home
working through all of thiscomplexity.
(19:00):
You're a person of faith, sowhat image or word from
Scripture is helping you to holdsteady at this hour so that you
can help us?
Rebecca Linder Blachly (19:13):
I was just reading through the Psalms
and came to 121.
I lift up my eyes to the hills.
From where's my help to come?
My help comes from the Lord,the maker of heaven and earth.
We are called to differentthings right, Different
ministries, and we are notcalled to fix everything that we
(19:34):
can't.
So I just feel that if each ofus can open our hearts to what
that calling is, which againwill be so different for some
people it's advocacy, for somepeople it's direct ministry you
know there's so many differentcallings and know that our help
comes from the Lord that canhelp us through what can be some
really challenging times, andknow that we're called to try
(19:58):
right.
I don't know that we're calledto have to succeed, that our
judgment depends on that, butreally, instead, just with good
faith, good effort, wisdom, dothe work we each feel called to
do.
Bishop Wright (20:11):
Yeah, it's a, and not give into despair.
Rebecca Linder Blachly (20:14):
Yeah, yeah.
Bishop Wright (20:16):
That's, that's that's what that Bible verse
tells me, that that hope is hereand on the way simultaneously.
Rebecca Linder Blachly (20:23):
Amen.
Bishop Wright (20:25):
Rebecca, thank you so much.
Rebecca Linder Blachly (20:27):
Thanks so much, Bishop Rob.
It's really a pleasure.
We are called to different things right
, Different ministries, and weare not called to fix everything
that we can't.
So I just feel that if each ofus can open our hearts to what
that calling is, which againwill be so different for some
people it's advocacy, for somepeople it's direct ministry
(00:20):
there's so many differentcallings and know that our help
comes from the Lord that canhelp us through what can be some
really challenging times.
Bishop Wright (00:40):
Hi everyone, and welcome to this special edition
of For People.
Today, our guest is RebeccaLinder Blachly.
She's the director of theOffice of Government Relations
for the Episcopal Church.
Rebecca hi.
Rebecca Linder Blachly (00:54):
Hi, so good to be with you today.
Bishop Wright (00:56):
And welcome.
Welcome and thanks for beingwith us.
Her BA is from Williams and shehas an MDiv from Harvard.
Prior to taking this role asDirector of the Office of
Government Relations for theEpiscopal Church, she was a
Senior Policy Advisor for Africain the Office of Religion and
Global Affairs at the USDepartment of State.
(01:18):
Her previous positions includeActing Chief of Strategic
Communication Division at USAfrica.
Include acting chief ofstrategic communication division
at US Africa command inStuttgart, germany.
Special assistant to theprincipal deputy under secretary
of defense for policy andresearch associate in the
post-conflict reconstruction Wow, that's a lot of experience,
(01:39):
yeah, so well.
First of all, let's start withyou.
How did you get into this work?
You've got an MDiv, which meansyou're interested in God and
interested in the ways in whichwe talk about God and live for
God, and you've got this publicpolicy background.
Take me to that intersection.
Rebecca Linder Blachly (01:58):
Yeah, for some it's surprising, but to
me it always felt natural.
There were two things that Iwas interested in and felt
called to, so studied philosophyas an undergrad and dance as
well, and found myself workingat the Pentagon a few years
after that, after spending a fewyears in a think tank, and I
(02:19):
was surprised and interested toreally think the work was so
meaningful and I thought it wasa really powerful way to help
the hurting world.
I was working on peacekeeping,disaster response, humanitarian
assistance, went to divinityschool and was kind of
discerning what way forward,what the way forward would be,
(02:40):
and then was able to actuallywork on the intersection of
those two things at the StateDepartment for a short time.
It's no longer there, but therewas an Office of Religion and
Global Affairs where the StateDepartment was trying to do a
better job of understanding themany roles that religious
communities play, so notseparate, you know there was no
constitutional question aboutseparation of church and state,
(03:04):
about separation of church andstate.
But it was more, that the StateDepartment was realizing that
religious communities, as youknow, have health ministries and
education networks and so manyministries that understanding
those dynamics on climate changeand anti-corruption work and,
of course, education, health,all these things that are so
critical for foreign policygoals better understanding
(03:25):
religious communities could help.
So I was, you know, happily inthat role and then had the
opportunity to come on over tothe Episcopal Church and lead
the advocacy efforts.
Bishop Wright (03:35):
So I wanted to have you on because here, at the
very beginning of PresidentTrump's second term of President
Trump's second term, we'rethinking a lot about immigration
, refugees, deportationpractices and policies and, of
(03:58):
course, in our church here inAtlanta and really in middle
North Georgia, a lot of ourmembers are men and women and
young people of you know who areHispanic, and there's a great
wave of fear that's sweepingover over this community, as
well as uncertainty, and peoplewho love them and care a lot
about them are wondering howbest to help, and I know you've
(04:22):
been taking a lot of calls andspending a lot of time in
interviews and meetings, etcetera, and so where do you
start in this conversation?
What should the church be doingright now, as many of her
members are fearful?
Rebecca Linder Blachly (04:39):
I think the church should keep doing
what we've been doing, which iskeep having the ministries that
we carry out, continuing them,realizing there may be a greater
need, and that's forundocumented populations or
those who currently haveauthorization to be in the
United States but who may havethat revoked.
That's one of the things we'rereally concerned about.
(04:59):
But also for US citizens, wemay see social safety net
provisions really scale backdramatically.
So I think the first is just toknow that the work is the same.
It may need to be more but, asyou point out, the fear is
present and is just, I think,part of maybe part of the goal.
(05:23):
Think part of, maybe part ofthe goal.
I mean I can't speak for theintent, but it certainly seems
like that's certainly the effect.
Again, whether or not it's theintent, I guess I can't say, but
to have communities feel afraidand, I think, to continue to do
the best we can to be rooted inour own faith and to then,
practically speaking, help thoseof us in our communities who
(05:47):
have a fear of deportation or,again, fear about a legal status
with resources.
And so there's Know your Rightstrainings that help educate
everyone in our churches aboutwhat our rights are, and there's
family preparedness plans forpeople who may be at risk of
deportation, having something inplace so that the kids have a
(06:08):
place to go and people know whatbank accounts they've got or
what to do with pets I mean, whoknows?
But just some practical stepsto just be prepared.
And then I would just say thatwe can advocate, we can reach
out to our members of Congressand tell them that we support
humane immigration policies andthat we want to care for our
(06:29):
neighbors.
Bishop Wright (06:31):
Yeah, yeah, you know I'm thinking a lot about
this right now.
I'm thinking about you know,the people in our 120 worshiping
communities.
And I'm thinking about you knowmy own vows that I made when I
was ordained bishop and I justreread those in light of
everything that's happening inour country.
(06:52):
And you know, in preparationfor this phone call and I was
really struck again by a promisethat I made and it says will
you be merciful to all showcompassion to the poor and
stranger and defend those whohave no help?
And I said, in front of God andeverybody else, a pastor is the
(07:26):
care of folks, the care ofsouls, the enlargement of
compassion, first and foremost,and not very much about people's
status, immigration status,citizenship status.
(07:50):
I think the gospel helps me tothread that needle.
I pray and will advocate forthe implementation of any
policies that we have toimplement, that they be done
with care for the dignity ofevery human being.
But I think the church has asacred role here and that is to
(08:11):
care for people and to bearwitness that all are made in the
image of God.
Have I got that right?
I mean, I know you spend sometime with the presiding bishop
and others who are thinkingabout these things.
What would you say in responseto that?
Rebecca Linder Blachly (08:27):
I mean yes, a thousand times yes.
Our call is to care for thosein our midst and to show
Christ's love and be agents ofChrist's love.
Our job is not to formulatecomplex immigration policy.
Let's say that we can advocatefor values that should undergird
it.
Our church has taken policypositions that my colleagues and
(08:50):
I advocate for, certainly, butreally, at the root of all of
that is the dignity of everyhuman being.
At the root of all of it isthat we, as church, serve all.
Bishop Wright (09:24):
We met, that is, the representatives of the
entire Episcopal Church.
We met in Louisville, Kentucky,in June and, as you well know,
that body worships together,prays together and passes
resolutions, which are basicallythe mind of the church, if you
will, who we say we are, and wepassed some resolutions.
(09:49):
I think that touch on thisissue primarily.
Which one of those resolutionsor which number of resolutions
are you thinking about as youtry to support us, who are
supporting congregations?
Rebecca Linder Blachly (10:06):
Well, there certainly were some
resolutions passed In Louisville.
There was one called Migrationwith Dignity, looking at how we
as a church respond to migration.
But I would just say as wellthat we've, as a church, have
more than 650 public policyresolutions that our office has
called to carry out, so there isno shortage.
We have more than 50 focused onimmigration alone, and so
(10:32):
there's a lot our church hassaid over the decades in various
different political contextsand in different times.
But, as I said, the valuesunderlying them are the same.
And then there's times when thechurch speaks to the current
political moment and what'sneeded in that.
But right now we've for decadesand decades advocated for
(10:53):
comprehensive immigration reform, recognizing the right of
sovereign states to have asecure border while at the same
time, the legal right forimmigrants to claim asylum, At
the same time, the legal rightfor immigrants to claim asylum.
And of course, we are one ofthe 10 federally funded refugee
resettlement agencies throughthe tremendous work of Episcopal
Migration Ministries.
So we know it's a part of ourchurch, both in terms of the
(11:17):
resolutions that we've spoken onthrough for decades and then
again the ministries, both atthe congregational level up
through the church structures.
Bishop Wright (11:28):
You know this is really important.
This is an important pointyou're making here, and that is
that we have been shouldered tothe wheel of this work for some
time.
And so you know, I know thatsome people and I think
legitimately they wonder, youknow, if the church isn't
engaged in partisan politicswhen it stands up and sort of
(11:51):
affirms the right of, you know,to dignity for everyone.
They're wondering if what we'resaying and what we're doing
isn't sort of specific to thispresident, isn't anti-President
Trump.
And you're saying we've been atthis work for some time.
Rebecca Linder Blach (12:08):
Absolutely , and we have engaged with all
the administrations of bothparties members of.
Congress of both parties andreally try to find common ground
whenever it's possible.
Actually, there's a resolutionso the church has said that we
should work in a bipartisan waywhenever possible.
Actually there's a resolutionso the church has said that we
should work in a bipartisan waywhenever possible.
Of the Episcopal members ofCongress, it's 50-50 Republicans
(12:30):
and Democrats.
We know that there's politicaldiversity in our pews, certainly
, so we really are not lookingat our work as coming from a
partisan place but instead as,again, the values that we as a
religious community can offer.
And that's something we hearfrom members of Congress that
there are many lobbyists who areworking for industry,
(12:52):
advocating for interest and taxcuts for the industry that
they're working for, but whereare the people who are speaking
up for the most vulnerable?
It's religious communities andnon-profits, secular and secular
nonprofits as well.
You know, certainly we workwith ecumenical, inter-religious
secular groups all the time,but there's a lot that religious
communities can do because wehave the ministries, know the
(13:14):
people and can say we need tomake sure that there's a voice
in Washington for the peoplerelying on food assistance or
supplemental you know,supplemental nutritional
assistance, or need housing helpor need support when they're
encountering domestic violence,and just make sure that those
are priorities too, right, andnot just not just the things
(13:39):
that you know the corporatelobbyists are paying to advocate
for, and that's really how Isee us.
Bishop Wright (13:45):
Sure, let me take you to the granular level here.
You know I've gotten calls,emails and text messages and
people are wondering about.
You know what is this idea ofsanctuary?
Is that real, is it sentimental?
You've heard that questionbefore.
I mean we should have sanctuaryhearts for everyone, of course,
(14:09):
but they're asking aboutproperty.
How do we participate with lawenforcement and when do we
resist nonviolently andrespectfully?
Rebecca Linder Blachly (14:26):
So the sanctuary question, I think, is
a hard one because the word isso meaningful to us as
Christians and our church hascommitted ourselves to the
spirit of the sanctuary movement.
But what that means is sodifferent based on different
contexts so it can be confusing.
So I usually urge diocesecongregations, if asked, to
(14:48):
emphasize welcome rather thanusing a word that has a
different meaning in differentcontexts.
So sanctuary city can mean thatthe local law enforcement
doesn't cooperate with federallaw enforcement, but then for
the churches it doesn't have atechnical meaning but it can
mean sheltering someone.
So I think other words are morehelpful because of the
(15:09):
ambiguity of that term.
Bishop Wright (15:11):
Yeah, Well, the verbiage is one thing, but what
about?
Do we have an official policyin the Episcopal church about
property, for instance?
Do we hold our properties asprivate property and therefore
can limit access?
Rebecca Linder Blachly (15:26):
What I've heard in briefings that
I've been doing over the pastfew weeks with our chief legal
officers to really be in touchwith legal counsel within, you
know, depending on thejurisdiction.
But you know we have know yourrights trainings that talk about
what to do if there's a raidand whether something happens in
the sanctuary or in publicspace and open space and private
(15:49):
space.
You know you don't need to letsomeone into private space
unless there's a specificwarrant that you can ask to see.
But again, I don't want to stepout of my lane here too much.
But there's certainly resourcesthat can speak to what to do if
law enforcement comes invarious settings.
But there's not a universalchurch policy that sort of is
(16:09):
across the board for thesesettings because it depends on
the context, both the localityand the context of you know
who's there at any given time.
Bishop Wright (16:20):
No, I appreciate that and I know it's complex,
you know.
So for us here in middle andnorth Georgia, I mean, we're
distributed over 75 and a halfcounties and it's just not
uniform right.
It's sort of a moving targetand it kind of depends.
And so people are sort ofasking me what is the broad
(16:43):
statement I can issue that'sgoing to be elastic enough for
everything and everyone.
And it's really difficult.
And I've talked to otherbishops and we all sort of agree
that because it's socomplicated we feel ineffectual.
Rebecca Linder Blachly (17:01):
Yeah, I think.
I mean it's such a challengingmoment for just so many around
the church, and I think that thethings we can do are just
continue our ministries and notask about people's immigration
status.
That's a really good one.
We don't need to know that, andthat can protect people in a
sense too, because then we'renot knowingly involved in
(17:22):
anything, but again, knowing,like offering trainings, sharing
resources for familypreparedness plans that can help
people who are feeling at riskto know what they have in place
and then to know that the churchwill be there for them and
their family.
The federal government haspretty broad authority on some
immigration questions, that'strue, and so we want to seek a
(17:47):
transformative policy agendaaround our immigration policy.
But in this moment, I think wewant to make sure to protect
those in our communities as bestwe can and serve those in our
communities as best we can.
Bishop Wright (17:58):
I appreciate that answer.
I really do, because it isevolving.
The issue is evolving, rapidlyevolving, in fact, and it's
being applied different placesin different ways and it's sort
of hard to know.
And yet we want to make surethat the message is clear that
we love our brothers and sisters, that we are siblings entirely
(18:19):
under God and that when theyhurt, we hurt.
You know, one of the thingsthat I've heard that some people
are going to do is, you know,develop sort of banks of lawyers
to be able to assist, providesome resources, some know-how to
people those of us who possesstwo languages can really really
(18:40):
be helpful right now et cetera,et cetera.
But all of it is to justdeliver as much care and
compassion as we can.
So let me ask you this lastlyYou've worked at a great and
large scale in faraway placesand now you're here at home
working through all of thiscomplexity.
(19:00):
You're a person of faith, sowhat image or word from
Scripture is helping you to holdsteady at this hour so that you
can help us?
Rebecca Linder Blachly (19:13):
I was just reading through the Psalms
and came to 121.
I lift up my eyes to the hills.
From where's my help to come?
My help comes from the Lord,the maker of heaven and earth.
We are called to differentthings right, Different
ministries, and we are notcalled to fix everything that we
(19:34):
can't.
So I just feel that if each ofus can open our hearts to what
that calling is, which againwill be so different for some
people it's advocacy, for somepeople it's direct ministry you
know there's so many differentcallings and know that our help
comes from the Lord that canhelp us through what can be some
really challenging times, andknow that we're called to try
(19:58):
right.
I don't know that we're calledto have to succeed, that our
judgment depends on that, butreally, instead, just with good
faith, good effort, wisdom, dothe work we each feel called to
do.
Bishop Wright (20:11):
Yeah, it's a, and not give into despair.
Rebecca Linder Blachly (20:14):
Yeah, yeah.
Bishop Wright (20:16):
That's, that's that's what that Bible verse
tells me, that that hope is hereand on the way simultaneously.
Rebecca Linder Blachly (20:23):
Amen.
Bishop Wright (20:25):
Rebecca, thank you so much.
Rebecca Linder Blachly (20:27):
Thanks so much, Bishop Rob.
It's really a pleasure.
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