Disaster preparedness is sort of an oxymoron. Disaster is the kind of indiscriminate calamity that only ever finds us ill-equipped to manage. And if you are truly prepared, you’ve probably averted disaster.
There’s a big difference between the impact of disaster on physical, material life—and its outsized impact on mental, emotional, and spiritual life.
Personal disasters like a terminal illness, natural disasters like the recent fires that razed southern Californian communities, the impact of endless, senseless wars … these all cause a pain and physical damage that can be mitigated or rebuilt. But the worst of these cases threaten to destroy the very meaning of our lives.
No wonder disaster takes such a psychological and spiritual toll. There’s an urgent need to find or even make meaning from it. To somehow explain it, justify why God would allow it, and tell a grand story that makes sense from the senseless.
These are difficult questions, and my guests today both have personal experience with disaster. Dr. Pam King is the Peter L. Benson Professor of Applied Developmental Science at Fuller School of Psychology, and the Executive Director the Thrive Center. She’s an ordained Presbyterian minister, and she hosts a podcast on psychology and spirituality called With & For. Dr. Jamie Aten is a disaster psychologist and disaster ministry expert, helping others navigate mass, humanitarian, and personal disasters with scientific and spiritual insights. He is the Founder and Executive Director of the Humanitarian Disaster Institute Wheaton College, where he holds the Blanchard Chair of Humanitarian & Disaster Leadership. He is author of *A Walking Disaster: What Surviving Katrina and Cancer Taught Me about Faith and Resilience.*
In this conversation, Pam King and Jamie Aten join Evan Rosa to discuss:
- Each of their personal encounters with disasters—both fire and cancer
- The psychological study of disaster
- The personal impact of disaster on mental, emotional, and spiritual health
- The difference between resilience and fortitude
- And the theological and practical considerations for how to live through disastrous events.
About Pam King
Pam King is Executive Director the Thrive Center and is Peter L. Benson Professor of Applied Developmental Science at Fuller School of Psychology & Marriage and Family Therapy. She hosts the With & For podcast, and you can follow her @drpamking.
About Jamie Aten
Jamie D. Aten is a disaster psychologist and disaster ministry expert. He helps others navigate mass, humanitarian, and personal disasters with scientific and spiritual insights. He is the Founder and Executive Director of the Humanitarian Disaster Institute and Disaster Ministry Conference and holds the Blanchard Chair of Humanitarian & Disaster Leadership at Wheaton College. And he’s the author of *A Walking Disaster: What Surviving Katrina and Cancer Taught Me about Faith and Resilience.*
Show Notes
- Humanitarian Disaster Institute
- Spiritual First Aid
- Jamie Aten’s A Walking Disaster: What Surviving Katrina and Cancer Taught Me about Faith and Resilience
- The Thrive Center at Fuller Seminary
- Pam King’s personal experience fighting fires in the Eaton Fire in January 2025
- 5,000 homes destroyed
- 55 schools and houses of worship are gone
- “Neighborhoods are annihilated …”
- Jamie Aten offers an overview of the impact of disasters on humanity, and the human response
- 1985: 400% increase in natural disasters globally
- Japan 2011 Tōhoku earthquake and tsunami
- Haiti 2010 earthquake
- Physical, emotional, spiritual
- Infrastructural impacts that set up disasters
- USAID support
- Jamie Aten’s experience during Hurricane Katrina
- Personal disasters
- Jamie Aten’s experience with colon cancer
- “Evacuation Impossible”
- Impact of disaster on personal sense of thriving
- Thriving vs surviving
- Understanding trauma
- Collective traumatic events
- The historically Black multigenerational community in Altadena
- What constitutes thriving?
- Thriving as adaptive growth: with and for others
- Self-care is not just me-care, but we-care.
- Trauma brain and the cognitive impacts of dis
Popular Podcasts
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Special Summer Offer: Exclusively on Apple Podcasts, try our Dateline Premium subscription completely free for one month! With Dateline Premium, you get every episode ad-free plus exclusive bonus content.
The Breakfast Club
The World's Most Dangerous Morning Show, The Breakfast Club, With DJ Envy, Jess Hilarious, And Charlamagne Tha God!
Crime Junkie
Does hearing about a true crime case always leave you scouring the internet for the truth behind the story? Dive into your next mystery with Crime Junkie. Every Monday, join your host Ashley Flowers as she unravels all the details of infamous and underreported true crime cases with her best friend Brit Prawat. From cold cases to missing persons and heroes in our community who seek justice, Crime Junkie is your destination for theories and stories you won’t hear anywhere else. Whether you're a seasoned true crime enthusiast or new to the genre, you'll find yourself on the edge of your seat awaiting a new episode every Monday. If you can never get enough true crime... Congratulations, you’ve found your people. Follow to join a community of Crime Junkies! Crime Junkie is presented by audiochuck Media Company.