July 23, 2024 • 31 mins
http://forbiddenknowledge.org
In this Bonus episode Nathaniel Heutmaker shares a a recording that he sent to his mother as a gift. It is a sneak peak into other topics that will be brought up on this podcast and the deep significance of symbolism.
What if the ancient symbols that shaped human spirituality still have a profound impact on us today? Unlock the secrets behind the double-headed axe, or Labrys, and its deep-rooted connection to the Earth goddess, predating even the rise of Indo-European culture. We'll uncover how early societies intertwined kingship with the divine feminine, seeking to maintain harmony through ancient rituals. Discover the transformation of symbols like the Labrys and the enduring concepts of Mother Earth and Father Time that have withstood the test of time.
Join us as we trace the rise of patriarchal societies and the decline of matriarchal traditions, influenced by the spread of Indo-European culture. We'll explore the significance of the Earth Goddess cult in Turkey, its ties to Minoan civilization, and the myth of the Minotaur. Learn how patriarchal forces co-opted female power symbols and delve into the often misunderstood practice of tantra, revealing its deeper spiritual meanings. This episode invites you to explore ancient teachings and their relevance in today's spirituality, challenging conventional wisdom and sparking a deeper understanding of our shared human heritage.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
However, if you were a really bad king, you would
just be flat out killed.
So being king was notnecessarily the best position to
be in and whatnot because youhad to do a very good job.
This was not about power if youwere king.
This was about choosing who thepeople believed to be the best
(00:22):
for them in order to appease theearth goddess.
So I wanted to tell you this inperson whenever you got the
(00:55):
gift, but, based upon yourtimeline of not having time to
talk to me until you get back inFebruary, I will have to do
this voice recording instead,which I think in a way, works
out better, because then you canalways refer back to this voice
recording whenever you want tohave more information about the
(01:15):
gift that I'm giving to you.
And so what it is is a pendant.
It's a double-headed axe knownas the Labrys, and it has a lot
of significant meaning, bothcompletely separate from the
Indo-European groups, whichincludes the Vedic tradition as
(01:38):
well as the Nordic tradition,but also is part of that and
goes back way before that.
So I assume you're familiarwith the Venus figurines, mainly
because I think the firstperson I ever heard about them
from was you, and so we willhave to start there in order to
(02:01):
make the story that I'm fittingeverything into make sense.
And the Venus figurines thereare actually older ones than the
ones that have been found thatare between 35 and 40,000 years
old.
Most mainstream scholars do notlike to talk about them because
(02:26):
it completely destroys theirworldview and it goes against
all the evidence of which theyhave anything to do with
whatsoever.
To my knowledge, the oldest onethat has ever been discovered.
That is controversial, but onlycontroversial due to its age,
not because of any techniquesthat were used to date it or any
(02:48):
of these other things with it.
I forget exactly the locationfrom it, but it was somewhere
near the Caucasus region andwhatnot of 800,000 years old.
Even if they don't like thatone, there's another one that
was found in Morocco that was350,000 years old, and both of
(03:10):
these are older than theaccepted time frame for humanity
being as Homo sapiens, one byabout 50,000 years and the other
by about 500,000 years, byabout 50,000 years and the other
by about 500,000 years.
And so this is very telling.
(03:34):
Because even 800,000 years ago,we as a species not necessarily
as Homo sapiens sapiens, but assome earlier version of it, you
know, even had some idea thatthe Earth was a goddess and that
she was the one that gave useverything that we needed and
all that other stuff and thatshe was the most important being
(03:56):
that there was of any sortwhatsoever.
You might be wondering what thishas to do with the
double-headed axe.
I promise we'll get to it, youjust have to bear with me for a
moment.
And so she is still talkedabout to this day.
We call her Mother Earth orMother Nature and whatnot, and
(04:19):
so kernels of story andunderstanding of things that go
back a minimum of 800,000 yearsfrom an archaeological record
standpoint to this day is ratherinsane.
This would make it the oldestknown kernel of story, as well
as viewpoint, if you will,spiritual viewpoint, that there
(04:43):
is point, if you will, spiritualviewpoint that there is period.
And so the great goddess, asshe was referred to, as is the
one that's in charge ofeverything, and she is the
originator of everything andgives birth to everything, and
we all go back to her, no matterhow you look at this and
(05:05):
whatnot, and she's the one thathad power over dominion of
everything.
Fast forward to about 100,000years BC, so 102,000 years ago.
You get the first knowndouble-headed axe, also known as
a labrys, that shows upsomewhere in Greece, and it is a
(05:31):
symbol of the great goddess.
She's the one that wields itspower, and the reason for this
is because it has a multitude ofmeanings.
So, first off, it'sdouble-headed because she's the
one that dictates between lifeand death, so she gets to make
(05:56):
it so one side is life and oneside is death.
On it it kind of seems to forman infinity symbol.
But it also has to do with themoon and the crescent and
timekeeping and all that otherstuff which actually, just to be
(06:17):
clear, all ancient time periodsthat I'm aware of when I've
studied this, the sun wasoriginally a goddess, the moon
was originally a god, and thenonly when patriarchal societies
came in to those regions,wherever it was, did it become
(06:40):
reversed.
Even in certain patriarchalsocieties it never became
reversed.
A perfect example of this isOld Norse society, where the sun
goddess was the one that wasstill there and the moon was
still a man, even up in all theway up through Viking times.
Even so, it has to do with themarking of time and all that
(07:04):
other stuff.
Our ancestors used the moon asthe first marking of time before
they figured out because theycould see the phases of it go
through that that didn'tactually work out correctly and
it was the sun that we needed todo with it and whatnot.
And then they made calendarsbased upon both and they have a
lunar and solar calendar.
That has been going on.
(07:25):
You know, most people use thesolar today, but there's still
aspects of the lunar that we use, even in modern times, having
to do with, you know, certaindates like easter, as an example
in western culture, um, andthen there's southern.
That's the same way for them,and china, india uses it, the.
You know, jews use the calendar.
(07:46):
Anyway.
This is where you get motherearth and father time from,
because he was the one that wasin charge of the time of things
with it in the beginning, forwhere it was, and he's up in the
sky and this is where we getthe sky father idea from.
So that's part of what's thedouble-headed axe represents.
Yeah, it also represents, um,the labia, which is part of the
(08:12):
reason where it has its name,for what it is, and it has
nothing to do with sex forwhat's going on there, although
kind of does in another way.
It has more to do um with theshape of the folds of the labia,
which is partially where thatcomes from, but it also has to
do with the fact that the mothergoddess, is the one that gave
(08:34):
birth to everything, and sowhere birth comes from is from a
woman, of course, and it comesout of her vagina, and this is
where it is, and you get birthto everything else that comes
into this, for what's happening,and so it's a representation of
the cycle of birth as well.
(08:54):
So birth, death, reincarnation,all are tied into her power.
The double-headed axe alsorepresents the two-folded path
that can be taken when you die.
On one side, you would make itso that way you could go through
the reincarnation process againand whatnot, and on the other,
(09:17):
which is the soul.
This is the journey thatbasically all entities, all
souls, took on one side oranother, but on the other side,
you would make it so that way,eventually, you could go and
reach a version of enlightenment, and it makes it so that way.
What happens is that there's awhole world of stuff that's
(09:41):
surrounding this, which I'lltouch on in a moment for how
this plays out.
Four things but at some pointthe great goddess became
supplanted and she's the onethat lost the double-headed axe
and it became a male deity thattook it over, and it became a
(10:04):
male deity that took it over.
We see this in India in theVedic texts, and we see this
inside of the Nordic traditions.
We see this inside of theancient Indo-Iranian traditions
or what's going on Greektraditions, etc.
And it has to do with a groupof people that you probably know
(10:28):
as the proto-indo-europeanpeople, but most people today
either refer to as the kurganpeople or, more frequently now,
with modern scholarship, theyanmaya people.
These people came from aroundthe black and caspian seas we
don't know exactly where,although we're narrowing in more
and more with DNA and otherevidence that's coming from it
and that kind of thing.
They had a Earth Mother and aSky Father and whatnot, and they
(10:52):
came into being in terms oftheir language that we
understand it as today, around8,000, 10,000 years ago, and
then they started to spread outto the rest of the world.
About half of all spokenlanguage, about half of all the
speaking people today, excuse me, use a language from the
(11:13):
Proto-Indo-European group ofsome sort.
So this should show you theirpower and influence, and the
reason why they had this powerand influence has to do with the
fact that they were able to doa few things that they were very
good at, and this led to adiaspora from them and a
complete reshaping of an entireworld forever.
The first thing they were verygood at is horse taming.
(11:37):
They were the first ones, asfar as we can tell, to actually
be able to tame horses and usethem.
If everything else you're doingis on foot and another group of
people is on horseback, then interms of movement, they win.
(11:57):
That's how they were able tooutpace everybody and move out
everybody from one thing toanother.
That's thing number one.
Thing number two is they werevery good warriors.
Now, you don't have to have thebest warriors.
If you have more, you can stillwin.
But if you have warriors onhorseback versus warriors that
are not on horseback or warriorsthat are a mixture of horseback
(12:19):
and not, then you you know thatalready helps out a lot with
you too.
And number three, which isprobably the most important,
other than the horse part, we'vecombined the whole horse part
idea.
That's good for what'shappening.
They were very good at farming.
This is a very key point,because not only were they
(12:39):
allowed to spread everywhere,they were allowed to stay where
they were at and be able tocontinue to grow things.
So if you've got good farming,you've got good horses, you've
got good warriors for what'sgoing on?
Well, of course you're going togo far, you can travel far, you
can maintain your populationonce you get there, because you
(13:00):
can do the farming and whatnotand you can fight any resistance
that you might find on the way.
And so they started to spreadall over and along with them,
their culture started to spreadall over, and then they started
mixing with things.
And so this is why you startgetting the male-dominated thing
(13:25):
that starts coming into being,because the male-dominated side
of things is from their culture.
Beforehand, most cultures wereeither matriarchal, which was
kind of rarer, meaning that thewomen were in charge, or they
were kind of having nobody incharge, meaning neither male nor
(13:50):
female.
They had maybe different genderroles that they took on, but
they were equal in power andthey just played different roles
based upon what their societyneeded.
And, of course, a lot ofsocieties even allowed for, um,
what we would call today genderdifferences that would go
(14:10):
through one side of the otherand whatnot, and play roles in
between, etc.
Although they were rarer, notbecause of the fact that there
was anything wrong with it, butbecause their President Hall
ideology promoting it today.
It was just something that ifyou were that it happened
naturally and if you weren't,then it didn't happen naturally
(14:31):
kind of idea for what's going onNow, you know.
Kind of like a transgender idea, although the people didn't go
through the actual physicalprocess of doing so in any way,
shape or form.
It was more gender roles thathad to do with it, although some
people did because of diseasesand things like that.
Not important for my discussion.
(14:52):
I'm just letting you know thatthis was all over the place and
that has to do with the genderidentity, which will make sense
for what I'm coming back to in amoment.
Um, and so the earth goddesscult.
Don't take that in a negativeway.
The word cult like it is today,it just means people who
believe in the earth goddess andwhatnot.
That's a different scholar usesit differently than how modern
(15:16):
people do, and they were in thearea of Turkey and they had an
area that was there that wasdevoted strictly to her.
These people moved 20 milesaway from where there was water
or anything else in order to dotheir art and to create artwork
(15:38):
associated with her and all thisother stuff at the about the
same time that the yamaya group,the proto-indo-europeans, came
into being.
But they couldn't stay there ifthey wanted to continue to do
stuff with her, and so they leftand they went to a different
area and whatnot, and theyeventually ended up, uh, and
(16:04):
what we know today as crete or,and the minoan civilization,
which is where we get to see allthe double-headed axes show up
there more, and you also get towhere you get, the labyrinth,
and so both of these things aredirectly associated with her.
(16:28):
And there's other labyrinthsthat have been in existence that
are associated with her too.
Another one is in Egypt, as anexample.
Most people just don't talkabout it or know of it.
There's other places that aredone with the labyrinth too,
because it has to do with thesearching for um, one's soul and
whatnot, and to make sure thatyou get into contact with it and
(16:49):
make it so that way you becomeone with it and align with the
overall over soul and becomeenlightened and go to the other
world and grab it and whatnot,which is also what the thread
thread of destiny that's usedwhen he goes in and the hero
(17:11):
goes in and kills the minotaur.
The minotaur is a half man, halfbull, uh, idea.
And you have to slay the bull,representing the assuming,
representing your ego here, andshe is helped by a female figure
that has given the thread forhim to be able to find his way
(17:35):
into the labyrinth, whichrepresents multitude of
different things.
That, since it's red, itrepresents the bloodline, but it
also represents, um, the fluidsthat come out during the
certain time of the month andwhatnot that make that happen,
because it has to do with whenpeople would be at their highest
fertility, since this has to dowith birth.
(17:57):
Again, to a certain extent it'staken from the name that's
going on with it and she's.
The threads also have to dowith the threads of fate that
have been done for a long time,and so this is kind of where
this civilization culminates,with things with it.
Eventually, because of whathappens in menorah, crete, due
(18:18):
to a climate disaster, thevolcanoes and other things with
that, they have to leave thereand they go into other parts of
the world.
But at this point the entiretyof things has become patriarchal
, instead of it being free forwhere they're surrounded by with
it and eventually the cult islost after so many thousands of
(18:45):
years and whatnot.
However, it still survivesdirectly for stuff with it.
So the male powers took it over.
We see this with Thor's axethat he has.
It's double-headed and it hasto do with her power and he
(19:05):
actually comes and it literallyrepresents the life force.
You see this happen in theVedic tradition with Indra.
The Sky Father takes it over,or one of the Sky Father gods
does, and he uses it and he usesit as his command and power
with his thunderbolts andwhatnot.
(19:25):
And this is true of all theproto and I mean of all the
indo-european gods that theytake her power, they take her,
they supplant her and they makethat happen.
Now, I don't know if this istrue in other cultures that are,
that are indo-euroEuropean ofsome sort.
I do know that it happens inother places, such as Egypt, as
(19:46):
an example, but they were neverpart of the Indo-European group.
But I do know, in two placesspecifically, that the goddess
tradition was still very muchalive and that they could not
get rid of it and they had tomake certain concessions to it.
(20:08):
The two major places that thisis the case for is the nordic
world and the vedic world andtheir traditions, and in the
Vedic tradition there's agoddess that's called the great
(20:28):
this and she, all of the goddess.
There's all these othergoddesses that are after her,
but they're all just emanationsand elements of her, and all the
gods even go back to her.
And I bring this up because theDisir, which is Nordic, and the
(20:50):
great Dis or Dasana in theVedic traditions are directly
linked to one another, not justfrom cultural but also
etymological roots and all theseother things that go along with
it.
And so there was a greatgoddess inside of the Nordic
tradition as well, and thismakes it so that way inside of
(21:15):
it that she used to have power.
And the tradition and texts thatsurvive to this day mainly the
Poetic Edda, as it's called itis very clear when you start
reading it that the femalepowers were the ones that were
actually really truly in chargeof things and that the male gods
(21:39):
were not to be trusted to acertain extent and whatnot, but
they still had their own powerfor what was going on, and that
the people who wrote the Edda,they were somebody who was the
last survivors of thisparticular cult, even Stori
Storsson, who was the finalperson to write any poetry
regarding this stuff in the1200s.
(22:03):
He said that there was a cultof Freyja which I don't know if
that's the actual dis itself ornot inside of the Norse one with
it, although it's highlyplausible that it is because her
name means the Lady Sovereignor the Sovereign Lady.
(22:25):
So it could be that that's thecase with it for her, although
there's evidence that therecould be other ones.
Uh, two, it's kind of hard totell because they're all
emanations from each other, butanyway, uh, that it was still
alive even though christianityhad come into power in iceland,
uh, and completely wiped it out.
200 and something years afterthe conversion to Christianity,
(22:50):
they're still being practicedand this book survives because
these people keep it hidden awayfrom authorities for over 400
years.
Now that the new Christianreligion, at least new to
Iceland, is no longer threatened, most people aren't practicing
stuff.
There might be some folkloreand folk traditions that are
(23:11):
still there, but they're mainlyChristian now in terms of their
overall worldview.
Somebody brings the book out,hands it to a priest, who ends
up sending it and shipping itback to the king of Denmark,
because Iceland is under thecontrol of Denmark in this era,
in 1647, when the book isfinally released, and what also
(23:33):
ends up happening is that thebook survives because of this,
and it's the only real sourcethat we have that's of other
than a handful of poems thatsurvived and other sources.
It's the main source thatsurvived, that has all the stuff
inside of it, and it has to dowith the goddess cult.
I bring this up because,interestingly enough, during
(23:57):
that same time period, within acouple years, the water in
Denmark had finally gotten downto a lower level where a temple
to a great goddess to the greatgoddess again, in this case
Nahalena had finally beenrevealed.
And so the timing of it forboth of them coming together
(24:19):
kind of, is interesting forwhat's going on.
And so, if we go back to theVedic tradition, for what's
going on, you know they believein oversoul, for what's
happening and whatnot.
The male tradition of it isBrahman, but in the female
tradition, which is by far theolder tradition not even a
(24:41):
contest for what it is, at leastin terms of its roots it's the
great Dasana and everything thatcomes from her, and she
presides over life, death,rebirth, everything that's going
on with it, and she's the onethat has all the power.
(25:05):
She's the one that has all thepower.
And so why am I giving this toyou?
Well, because obviously, partof it has to do with your own
belief system, your owntraditions that are going on
with it, the Vedic slash Hindutraditions.
Part of it has to do with whatI'm studying now, of course as
(25:31):
well, but it also has to do withyour trip to India and the
funeral rites that you're doingwhile you're there.
With it.
It's a symbol of eternity, it'sa symbol of reincarnation, it's
a symbol of life and death andrebirth.
It's a symbol that has to dowith the power of the earth,
goddess, the original goddessthat everybody believed in at
(25:54):
one point.
Um, because we all go back tomother earth.
This is why, in the text uh,regarding buddha, when he
becomes enlightened and they, hesays the earth is my witness.
He's saying that the motherearth, the being that gave birth
to all of us, is a witness toit.
(26:16):
And part of this one part Ididn't really touch on too much
is part of the sexual aspect ofthings with it, and I'm not
talking about just from abirthing part, I'm talking about
another, actual sexual aspectof it.
This is where the Hyros-Gamosidea comes from.
There's a couple variants of it, but I'm just going to give two
(26:36):
major categories with it here.
It has to do with the Sky Fatherand the Earth Mother coming
together, and so you see this invarious different rituals that
have to do with the king, andthe king has to be selected by
the great goddess, who isrepresented by some sort of
(26:57):
priestess, and there's a ritualthat goes along with that.
And in ancient times, if youwere a king and you failed at
your job as a king, the best youcould hope for is that you
would be removed as king becauseyou originally were elected it
doesn't matter where this istrue everywhere that we have
records for and someone elsewould be put into place for you.
(27:22):
However, if you were a reallybad king, you would just be flat
out killed.
So being king was notnecessarily the best position to
be in and whatnot, because youhad to do a very good job.
But this was not about power.
If you were king, this wasabout choosing who the people
(27:43):
believed to be the best for themin order to appease the earth
goddess.
To make it so.
That way she uh had abundanceand for crops and fertility and
for life in general and whatnot.
And it was believed the kingwas injured because he was in a
(28:04):
relationship with the land andrepresented the land, that the
land would be harmed, and sothey would need to get a new
king to be in charge of thingswith it.
And then the other one has to dowith another version of the
Hieroscamos and it has to dowith the male and female coming
together in order to make it so.
That way you can have the powercome into being for yourself.
(28:30):
And there were these thingscalled bridal chambers that
people would go into and theywould have to go through this
initiation.
And in order to becomeinitiated into these mysteries
with it, you would have to findyour soul again with it, and
this process is described ashaving a sexual union with your
(28:55):
own soul, so to speak.
Now, in certain traditions it'sif you're a woman, it would be
that you're looking for yourhusband.
Still, in other traditions itdoesn't matter.
It's always a woman that you'redoing things for.
But it still has to do with thesoul being found, illumination,
(29:16):
enlightenment, going into theother world and discovering
things with it.
And originally the great god isfor stuff, for what's happening.
So this is how we get a versionof it in terms of seeking it
out.
That seems to kind of this iswhere you get a version of it.
That makes us that way.
It's corrupted and everythingto um where you get tantra.
(29:39):
Now, it doesn't mean that youcan't find stuff through tantra
and whatnot, but they seem tohave misunderstood some of the
uh teachings that was going onto make it so that way.
Uh, it wasn't so much aboutactual physical sexual union,
(30:00):
that it had deeper meaningsbehind it, and there's been
other issues that go along withthat for what's happening, and
so there's stuff that fits thatside of it too.
If you have any questionsregarding this, we can probably
talk about it more when you getback.
But this is the symbolicunderstanding, the meaning, the
(30:21):
history and the power of thegift that I have given you and
whatnot in terms of itsrepresentation.
Anyway, I hope that this hasbeen interesting at least, and
that you understand why I did itand having to do with the
funeral rites and the control ofthings and giving the spiritual
illumination afterwards and allthe other stuff that goes along
(30:41):
with it and the power of thegreat goddess and how she was
supplanted and everything elsealong with that.
Have a safe trip to India, andI will speak to you again in
February.
Thank you.
However, if you were a really bad king, you would
just be flat out killed.
So being king was notnecessarily the best position to
be in and whatnot because youhad to do a very good job.
This was not about power if youwere king.
This was about choosing who thepeople believed to be the best
(00:22):
for them in order to appease theearth goddess.
So I wanted to tell you this inperson whenever you got the
(00:55):
gift, but, based upon yourtimeline of not having time to
talk to me until you get back inFebruary, I will have to do
this voice recording instead,which I think in a way, works
out better, because then you canalways refer back to this voice
recording whenever you want tohave more information about the
(01:15):
gift that I'm giving to you.
And so what it is is a pendant.
It's a double-headed axe knownas the Labrys, and it has a lot
of significant meaning, bothcompletely separate from the
Indo-European groups, whichincludes the Vedic tradition as
(01:38):
well as the Nordic tradition,but also is part of that and
goes back way before that.
So I assume you're familiarwith the Venus figurines, mainly
because I think the firstperson I ever heard about them
from was you, and so we willhave to start there in order to
(02:01):
make the story that I'm fittingeverything into make sense.
And the Venus figurines thereare actually older ones than the
ones that have been found thatare between 35 and 40,000 years
old.
Most mainstream scholars do notlike to talk about them because
(02:26):
it completely destroys theirworldview and it goes against
all the evidence of which theyhave anything to do with
whatsoever.
To my knowledge, the oldest onethat has ever been discovered.
That is controversial, but onlycontroversial due to its age,
not because of any techniquesthat were used to date it or any
(02:48):
of these other things with it.
I forget exactly the locationfrom it, but it was somewhere
near the Caucasus region andwhatnot of 800,000 years old.
Even if they don't like thatone, there's another one that
was found in Morocco that was350,000 years old, and both of
(03:10):
these are older than theaccepted time frame for humanity
being as Homo sapiens, one byabout 50,000 years and the other
by about 500,000 years, byabout 50,000 years and the other
by about 500,000 years.
And so this is very telling.
(03:34):
Because even 800,000 years ago,we as a species not necessarily
as Homo sapiens sapiens, but assome earlier version of it, you
know, even had some idea thatthe Earth was a goddess and that
she was the one that gave useverything that we needed and
all that other stuff and thatshe was the most important being
(03:56):
that there was of any sortwhatsoever.
You might be wondering what thishas to do with the
double-headed axe.
I promise we'll get to it, youjust have to bear with me for a
moment.
And so she is still talkedabout to this day.
We call her Mother Earth orMother Nature and whatnot, and
(04:19):
so kernels of story andunderstanding of things that go
back a minimum of 800,000 yearsfrom an archaeological record
standpoint to this day is ratherinsane.
This would make it the oldestknown kernel of story, as well
as viewpoint, if you will,spiritual viewpoint, that there
(04:43):
is point, if you will, spiritualviewpoint that there is period.
And so the great goddess, asshe was referred to, as is the
one that's in charge ofeverything, and she is the
originator of everything andgives birth to everything, and
we all go back to her, no matterhow you look at this and
(05:05):
whatnot, and she's the one thathad power over dominion of
everything.
Fast forward to about 100,000years BC, so 102,000 years ago.
You get the first knowndouble-headed axe, also known as
a labrys, that shows upsomewhere in Greece, and it is a
(05:31):
symbol of the great goddess.
She's the one that wields itspower, and the reason for this
is because it has a multitude ofmeanings.
So, first off, it'sdouble-headed because she's the
one that dictates between lifeand death, so she gets to make
(05:56):
it so one side is life and oneside is death.
On it it kind of seems to forman infinity symbol.
But it also has to do with themoon and the crescent and
timekeeping and all that otherstuff which actually, just to be
(06:17):
clear, all ancient time periodsthat I'm aware of when I've
studied this, the sun wasoriginally a goddess, the moon
was originally a god, and thenonly when patriarchal societies
came in to those regions,wherever it was, did it become
(06:40):
reversed.
Even in certain patriarchalsocieties it never became
reversed.
A perfect example of this isOld Norse society, where the sun
goddess was the one that wasstill there and the moon was
still a man, even up in all theway up through Viking times.
Even so, it has to do with themarking of time and all that
(07:04):
other stuff.
Our ancestors used the moon asthe first marking of time before
they figured out because theycould see the phases of it go
through that that didn'tactually work out correctly and
it was the sun that we needed todo with it and whatnot.
And then they made calendarsbased upon both and they have a
lunar and solar calendar.
That has been going on.
(07:25):
You know, most people use thesolar today, but there's still
aspects of the lunar that we use, even in modern times, having
to do with, you know, certaindates like easter, as an example
in western culture, um, andthen there's southern.
That's the same way for them,and china, india uses it, the.
You know, jews use the calendar.
(07:46):
Anyway.
This is where you get motherearth and father time from,
because he was the one that wasin charge of the time of things
with it in the beginning, forwhere it was, and he's up in the
sky and this is where we getthe sky father idea from.
So that's part of what's thedouble-headed axe represents.
Yeah, it also represents, um,the labia, which is part of the
(08:12):
reason where it has its name,for what it is, and it has
nothing to do with sex forwhat's going on there, although
kind of does in another way.
It has more to do um with theshape of the folds of the labia,
which is partially where thatcomes from, but it also has to
do with the fact that the mothergoddess, is the one that gave
(08:34):
birth to everything, and sowhere birth comes from is from a
woman, of course, and it comesout of her vagina, and this is
where it is, and you get birthto everything else that comes
into this, for what's happening,and so it's a representation of
the cycle of birth as well.
(08:54):
So birth, death, reincarnation,all are tied into her power.
The double-headed axe alsorepresents the two-folded path
that can be taken when you die.
On one side, you would make itso that way you could go through
the reincarnation process againand whatnot, and on the other,
(09:17):
which is the soul.
This is the journey thatbasically all entities, all
souls, took on one side oranother, but on the other side,
you would make it so that way,eventually, you could go and
reach a version of enlightenment, and it makes it so that way.
What happens is that there's awhole world of stuff that's
(09:41):
surrounding this, which I'lltouch on in a moment for how
this plays out.
Four things but at some pointthe great goddess became
supplanted and she's the onethat lost the double-headed axe
and it became a male deity thattook it over, and it became a
(10:04):
male deity that took it over.
We see this in India in theVedic texts, and we see this
inside of the Nordic traditions.
We see this inside of theancient Indo-Iranian traditions
or what's going on Greektraditions, etc.
And it has to do with a groupof people that you probably know
(10:28):
as the proto-indo-europeanpeople, but most people today
either refer to as the kurganpeople or, more frequently now,
with modern scholarship, theyanmaya people.
These people came from aroundthe black and caspian seas we
don't know exactly where,although we're narrowing in more
and more with DNA and otherevidence that's coming from it
and that kind of thing.
They had a Earth Mother and aSky Father and whatnot, and they
(10:52):
came into being in terms oftheir language that we
understand it as today, around8,000, 10,000 years ago, and
then they started to spread outto the rest of the world.
About half of all spokenlanguage, about half of all the
speaking people today, excuse me, use a language from the
(11:13):
Proto-Indo-European group ofsome sort.
So this should show you theirpower and influence, and the
reason why they had this powerand influence has to do with the
fact that they were able to doa few things that they were very
good at, and this led to adiaspora from them and a
complete reshaping of an entireworld forever.
The first thing they were verygood at is horse taming.
(11:37):
They were the first ones, asfar as we can tell, to actually
be able to tame horses and usethem.
If everything else you're doingis on foot and another group of
people is on horseback, then interms of movement, they win.
(11:57):
That's how they were able tooutpace everybody and move out
everybody from one thing toanother.
That's thing number one.
Thing number two is they werevery good warriors.
Now, you don't have to have thebest warriors.
If you have more, you can stillwin.
But if you have warriors onhorseback versus warriors that
are not on horseback or warriorsthat are a mixture of horseback
(12:19):
and not, then you you know thatalready helps out a lot with
you too.
And number three, which isprobably the most important,
other than the horse part, we'vecombined the whole horse part
idea.
That's good for what'shappening.
They were very good at farming.
This is a very key point,because not only were they
(12:39):
allowed to spread everywhere,they were allowed to stay where
they were at and be able tocontinue to grow things.
So if you've got good farming,you've got good horses, you've
got good warriors for what'sgoing on?
Well, of course you're going togo far, you can travel far, you
can maintain your populationonce you get there, because you
(13:00):
can do the farming and whatnotand you can fight any resistance
that you might find on the way.
And so they started to spreadall over and along with them,
their culture started to spreadall over, and then they started
mixing with things.
And so this is why you startgetting the male-dominated thing
(13:25):
that starts coming into being,because the male-dominated side
of things is from their culture.
Beforehand, most cultures wereeither matriarchal, which was
kind of rarer, meaning that thewomen were in charge, or they
were kind of having nobody incharge, meaning neither male nor
(13:50):
female.
They had maybe different genderroles that they took on, but
they were equal in power andthey just played different roles
based upon what their societyneeded.
And, of course, a lot ofsocieties even allowed for, um,
what we would call today genderdifferences that would go
(14:10):
through one side of the otherand whatnot, and play roles in
between, etc.
Although they were rarer, notbecause of the fact that there
was anything wrong with it, butbecause their President Hall
ideology promoting it today.
It was just something that ifyou were that it happened
naturally and if you weren't,then it didn't happen naturally
(14:31):
kind of idea for what's going onNow, you know.
Kind of like a transgender idea, although the people didn't go
through the actual physicalprocess of doing so in any way,
shape or form.
It was more gender roles thathad to do with it, although some
people did because of diseasesand things like that.
Not important for my discussion.
(14:52):
I'm just letting you know thatthis was all over the place and
that has to do with the genderidentity, which will make sense
for what I'm coming back to in amoment.
Um, and so the earth goddesscult.
Don't take that in a negativeway.
The word cult like it is today,it just means people who
believe in the earth goddess andwhatnot.
That's a different scholar usesit differently than how modern
(15:16):
people do, and they were in thearea of Turkey and they had an
area that was there that wasdevoted strictly to her.
These people moved 20 milesaway from where there was water
or anything else in order to dotheir art and to create artwork
(15:38):
associated with her and all thisother stuff at the about the
same time that the yamaya group,the proto-indo-europeans, came
into being.
But they couldn't stay there ifthey wanted to continue to do
stuff with her, and so they leftand they went to a different
area and whatnot, and theyeventually ended up, uh, and
(16:04):
what we know today as crete or,and the minoan civilization,
which is where we get to see allthe double-headed axes show up
there more, and you also get towhere you get, the labyrinth,
and so both of these things aredirectly associated with her.
(16:28):
And there's other labyrinthsthat have been in existence that
are associated with her too.
Another one is in Egypt, as anexample.
Most people just don't talkabout it or know of it.
There's other places that aredone with the labyrinth too,
because it has to do with thesearching for um, one's soul and
whatnot, and to make sure thatyou get into contact with it and
(16:49):
make it so that way you becomeone with it and align with the
overall over soul and becomeenlightened and go to the other
world and grab it and whatnot,which is also what the thread
thread of destiny that's usedwhen he goes in and the hero
(17:11):
goes in and kills the minotaur.
The minotaur is a half man, halfbull, uh, idea.
And you have to slay the bull,representing the assuming,
representing your ego here, andshe is helped by a female figure
that has given the thread forhim to be able to find his way
(17:35):
into the labyrinth, whichrepresents multitude of
different things.
That, since it's red, itrepresents the bloodline, but it
also represents, um, the fluidsthat come out during the
certain time of the month andwhatnot that make that happen,
because it has to do with whenpeople would be at their highest
fertility, since this has to dowith birth.
(17:57):
Again, to a certain extent it'staken from the name that's
going on with it and she's.
The threads also have to dowith the threads of fate that
have been done for a long time,and so this is kind of where
this civilization culminates,with things with it.
Eventually, because of whathappens in menorah, crete, due
(18:18):
to a climate disaster, thevolcanoes and other things with
that, they have to leave thereand they go into other parts of
the world.
But at this point the entiretyof things has become patriarchal
, instead of it being free forwhere they're surrounded by with
it and eventually the cult islost after so many thousands of
(18:45):
years and whatnot.
However, it still survivesdirectly for stuff with it.
So the male powers took it over.
We see this with Thor's axethat he has.
It's double-headed and it hasto do with her power and he
(19:05):
actually comes and it literallyrepresents the life force.
You see this happen in theVedic tradition with Indra.
The Sky Father takes it over,or one of the Sky Father gods
does, and he uses it and he usesit as his command and power
with his thunderbolts andwhatnot.
(19:25):
And this is true of all theproto and I mean of all the
indo-european gods that theytake her power, they take her,
they supplant her and they makethat happen.
Now, I don't know if this istrue in other cultures that are,
that are indo-euroEuropean ofsome sort.
I do know that it happens inother places, such as Egypt, as
(19:46):
an example, but they were neverpart of the Indo-European group.
But I do know, in two placesspecifically, that the goddess
tradition was still very muchalive and that they could not
get rid of it and they had tomake certain concessions to it.
(20:08):
The two major places that thisis the case for is the nordic
world and the vedic world andtheir traditions, and in the
Vedic tradition there's agoddess that's called the great
(20:28):
this and she, all of the goddess.
There's all these othergoddesses that are after her,
but they're all just emanationsand elements of her, and all the
gods even go back to her.
And I bring this up because theDisir, which is Nordic, and the
(20:50):
great Dis or Dasana in theVedic traditions are directly
linked to one another, not justfrom cultural but also
etymological roots and all theseother things that go along with
it.
And so there was a greatgoddess inside of the Nordic
tradition as well, and thismakes it so that way inside of
(21:15):
it that she used to have power.
And the tradition and texts thatsurvive to this day mainly the
Poetic Edda, as it's called itis very clear when you start
reading it that the femalepowers were the ones that were
actually really truly in chargeof things and that the male gods
(21:39):
were not to be trusted to acertain extent and whatnot, but
they still had their own powerfor what was going on, and that
the people who wrote the Edda,they were somebody who was the
last survivors of thisparticular cult, even Stori
Storsson, who was the finalperson to write any poetry
regarding this stuff in the1200s.
(22:03):
He said that there was a cultof Freyja which I don't know if
that's the actual dis itself ornot inside of the Norse one with
it, although it's highlyplausible that it is because her
name means the Lady Sovereignor the Sovereign Lady.
(22:25):
So it could be that that's thecase with it for her, although
there's evidence that therecould be other ones.
Uh, two, it's kind of hard totell because they're all
emanations from each other, butanyway, uh, that it was still
alive even though christianityhad come into power in iceland,
uh, and completely wiped it out.
200 and something years afterthe conversion to Christianity,
(22:50):
they're still being practicedand this book survives because
these people keep it hidden awayfrom authorities for over 400
years.
Now that the new Christianreligion, at least new to
Iceland, is no longer threatened, most people aren't practicing
stuff.
There might be some folkloreand folk traditions that are
(23:11):
still there, but they're mainlyChristian now in terms of their
overall worldview.
Somebody brings the book out,hands it to a priest, who ends
up sending it and shipping itback to the king of Denmark,
because Iceland is under thecontrol of Denmark in this era,
in 1647, when the book isfinally released, and what also
(23:33):
ends up happening is that thebook survives because of this,
and it's the only real sourcethat we have that's of other
than a handful of poems thatsurvived and other sources.
It's the main source thatsurvived, that has all the stuff
inside of it, and it has to dowith the goddess cult.
I bring this up because,interestingly enough, during
(23:57):
that same time period, within acouple years, the water in
Denmark had finally gotten downto a lower level where a temple
to a great goddess to the greatgoddess again, in this case
Nahalena had finally beenrevealed.
And so the timing of it forboth of them coming together
(24:19):
kind of, is interesting forwhat's going on.
And so, if we go back to theVedic tradition, for what's
going on, you know they believein oversoul, for what's
happening and whatnot.
The male tradition of it isBrahman, but in the female
tradition, which is by far theolder tradition not even a
(24:41):
contest for what it is, at leastin terms of its roots it's the
great Dasana and everything thatcomes from her, and she
presides over life, death,rebirth, everything that's going
on with it, and she's the onethat has all the power.
(25:05):
She's the one that has all thepower.
And so why am I giving this toyou?
Well, because obviously, partof it has to do with your own
belief system, your owntraditions that are going on
with it, the Vedic slash Hindutraditions.
Part of it has to do with whatI'm studying now, of course as
(25:31):
well, but it also has to do withyour trip to India and the
funeral rites that you're doingwhile you're there.
With it.
It's a symbol of eternity, it'sa symbol of reincarnation, it's
a symbol of life and death andrebirth.
It's a symbol that has to dowith the power of the earth,
goddess, the original goddessthat everybody believed in at
(25:54):
one point.
Um, because we all go back tomother earth.
This is why, in the text uh,regarding buddha, when he
becomes enlightened and they, hesays the earth is my witness.
He's saying that the motherearth, the being that gave birth
to all of us, is a witness toit.
(26:16):
And part of this one part Ididn't really touch on too much
is part of the sexual aspect ofthings with it, and I'm not
talking about just from abirthing part, I'm talking about
another, actual sexual aspectof it.
This is where the Hyros-Gamosidea comes from.
There's a couple variants of it, but I'm just going to give two
(26:36):
major categories with it here.
It has to do with the Sky Fatherand the Earth Mother coming
together, and so you see this invarious different rituals that
have to do with the king, andthe king has to be selected by
the great goddess, who isrepresented by some sort of
(26:57):
priestess, and there's a ritualthat goes along with that.
And in ancient times, if youwere a king and you failed at
your job as a king, the best youcould hope for is that you
would be removed as king becauseyou originally were elected it
doesn't matter where this istrue everywhere that we have
records for and someone elsewould be put into place for you.
(27:22):
However, if you were a reallybad king, you would just be flat
out killed.
So being king was notnecessarily the best position to
be in and whatnot, because youhad to do a very good job.
But this was not about power.
If you were king, this wasabout choosing who the people
(27:43):
believed to be the best for themin order to appease the earth
goddess.
To make it so.
That way she uh had abundanceand for crops and fertility and
for life in general and whatnot.
And it was believed the kingwas injured because he was in a
(28:04):
relationship with the land andrepresented the land, that the
land would be harmed, and sothey would need to get a new
king to be in charge of thingswith it.
And then the other one has to dowith another version of the
Hieroscamos and it has to dowith the male and female coming
together in order to make it so.
That way you can have the powercome into being for yourself.
(28:30):
And there were these thingscalled bridal chambers that
people would go into and theywould have to go through this
initiation.
And in order to becomeinitiated into these mysteries
with it, you would have to findyour soul again with it, and
this process is described ashaving a sexual union with your
(28:55):
own soul, so to speak.
Now, in certain traditions it'sif you're a woman, it would be
that you're looking for yourhusband.
Still, in other traditions itdoesn't matter.
It's always a woman that you'redoing things for.
But it still has to do with thesoul being found, illumination,
(29:16):
enlightenment, going into theother world and discovering
things with it.
And originally the great god isfor stuff, for what's happening.
So this is how we get a versionof it in terms of seeking it
out.
That seems to kind of this iswhere you get a version of it.
That makes us that way.
It's corrupted and everythingto um where you get tantra.
(29:39):
Now, it doesn't mean that youcan't find stuff through tantra
and whatnot, but they seem tohave misunderstood some of the
uh teachings that was going onto make it so that way.
Uh, it wasn't so much aboutactual physical sexual union,
(30:00):
that it had deeper meaningsbehind it, and there's been
other issues that go along withthat for what's happening, and
so there's stuff that fits thatside of it too.
If you have any questionsregarding this, we can probably
talk about it more when you getback.
But this is the symbolicunderstanding, the meaning, the
(30:21):
history and the power of thegift that I have given you and
whatnot in terms of itsrepresentation.
Anyway, I hope that this hasbeen interesting at least, and
that you understand why I did itand having to do with the
funeral rites and the control ofthings and giving the spiritual
illumination afterwards and allthe other stuff that goes along
(30:41):
with it and the power of thegreat goddess and how she was
supplanted and everything elsealong with that.
Have a safe trip to India, andI will speak to you again in
February.
Thank you.
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