August 9, 2025 • 30 mins
An incredible journey from creating water holograms for the world's #1 DJ to building a mission-driven franchise! Join Giuseppe Grammatico and Surv Founder Patrick Brown as they discuss:
- The inspiring "Rent Sons" origin story.
- Surv's mission to elevate youth and serve seniors.
- The "to-do list partner" business model.
- A step-by-step playbook for franchising YOUR own business!
- The power of focus and finding your "why."
This episode is packed with inspiration and actionable advice for any aspiring entrepreneur!
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Patrick Brown (00:00):
So I just knocked on every door in my town and
(00:02):
said, Hey, you can rent me andI'll do whatever you want.
That business was called RentSons at the time, and the
tagline was quality service atthe cost and allowance without
the complaining of an actualson.
ask yourself the life you wannalive and build a business around
that.
the way to become rich is to putall your eggs in one basket and
then watch that basket.
(00:24):
Welcome to the Franchise FreedomPodcast, where you can escape
the corporate trap throughfranchise ownership.
Here's your host, Giuseppe gr,the franchise guide.
Giuseppe Grammatico (00:37):
Welcome to the Franchise Freedom Podcast.
I'm your host, Zepi Grammatic,your franchise guide, this show
where we help corporateexecutives experience time and
financial freedom.
Thanks for joining us today.
We have an awesome guest today.
His name is Patrick Brown fromServe.
Patrick.
Welcome to the show.
Patrick Brown (00:52):
Yeah.
Happy to be here.
Thanks for having me.
Giuseppe Grammatico (00:54):
I appreciate you coming on the
show.
we've been working closely thepast month or so, been meaning
to have you on and our guestsyou know, have been just great
talking about franchisefranchise ownership, what it
takes to start a franchise, and,really excited to get your
insight.
So before we dive in today, ifyou could give the audience a
little bit of background on youknow, who Patrick is and how
(01:16):
you, how you came up with serve.
Patrick Brown (01:18):
Yeah, sure.
My name's Pat Brown.
I'm the founder of a companycalled Serve.
I started it in Little Compton,Rhode Island, which is the
smallest town in the smalleststate.
And when I was in college, myfamily went wealthy to poor,
relatively fast.
Parents lost their job, we losttheir house, our parents split
up, I needed a way to pay forschool.
So I just knocked on every doorin my town and said, Hey, you
(01:38):
can rent me and I'll do whateveryou want.
That business was called RentSons at the time, and the
tagline was quality service atthe cost and allowance without
the complaining of an actualson.
that no complaining guaranteeworked did wonders for me.
always made sure I nevercomplained no matter how
Giuseppe Grammatico (01:55):
No plane guarantee.
I like that.
Patrick Brown (01:57):
Yeah.
And so I would generally, as Iwould knock on these doors,
generally the older woman antsthe door, you know, delighted to
have me come do their to-dolist.
Well, there's, we at the garden,clean the garage, put up the
Christmas lights.
You know, I would come over on aweekly or monthly basis.
And I loved it'cause I got topay for school and cash.
I got to build out meaningfulrelationships with people that
became like family to me,especially as my home life was a
(02:19):
little rocky.
I got to learn all theseinterpersonal skills, these
practical skills.
I got to work around my schedulewhen I was gonna college and
also when I wanted to gosurfing.
and they loved it'cause they hada young person come over and do
their to-do list projects andallowed'em to just age at home.
They got to pour into me, theygot to gimme life advice.
They got to have sort of a jackof all trades, a one-stop shop
(02:42):
for their whole home.
And it became like reallymeaningful relationships to many
of my homeowners.
Where now, if.
I put you in my car and we drovearound for a day.
I could tell you a story ofevery homeowner.
We can tell you about theirkids, their families, people
that have passed away.
And I can't tell you what thatdoes for my sense of belonging,
where I live, where I feel likeI've provided a business that's
(03:04):
a lifeline for so many people,that if it went away, it would
actually be really destructiveto the community.
So I think that's what I, Ibuilt there.
And then we repeated it in othermarkets when we started
franchising.
And I just love this, thisbusiness, and I, and I would
love to see people that have thesame heart for their community,
bring it around where to wherethey are so that we can really
(03:26):
see some like national impact inwhat we're doing.
Giuseppe Grammatico (03:30):
Awesome.
and then that leads us to servewhen, so when was serve founded,
talk to us a little bit aboutthat and where you are today as
far as where you're located.
Patrick Brown (03:39):
Yeah, so it's kind of funny story.
I, so I built that business topay for college, which was
called Red Suns.
And then in college I went offand built the nation's largest
water special effects companycalled Aqua.
I like invented a water hologramand it got picked up by the
number one DJ in the world forhis US tour when I was in
college.
So I toured around the countryand interned for myself.
(04:01):
My senior year.
I had to still take Spanish.
I failed Spanish, but I bribedmy Spanish teacher with
backstage passes to my concertand got a c plus.
So I was able to get outtaschool.
Then I kinda hit it big.
I became the water guy from themusic industry and had a show at
Madison Square Garden new Year'sEve with Fish.
(04:21):
and had this moment where I feltlike I was living a very flashy
life, but I didn't feel like Iwas living a very fulfilling
life of what I really was hopingfor.
And so just had this very clearmoment where I looked in the
mirror and go, this is not whatI want.
And I wanna have something thathas like tremendous impact in
whatever I'm spending my day andspending my time on.
So took a step back, spent sometime praying and felt like God
(04:44):
gave me like this desire tobring what I did for college but
build it around the country.
And so that relaunched servereally in sort of 2017 it was
called, still called Red Sonsand built that up.
And then but we were alwaysdoing this tech enabled approach
with the business and justrealized that like.
(05:06):
To do this business well, itactually had to have that
franchise touch where there'slocal owners that really care
about their community, want toinvest in their employees, build
the relationships to thehomeowners, and see all these
relationships come together tobenefit their community.
so in 2020 four, we actuallyjust started franchising.
So we started franchising it andbrought on four franchisees so
(05:29):
far, and they've just beenreally impressed and really
grateful for how well they'vedone.
And now we're in the process ofstarting to scale it out
nationally with these newpartnerships that we've created
recently.
Giuseppe Grammatico (05:41):
I love that.
before we started recording herewe talked with a lot of people,
first time business owners.
We're exploring differentfranchises and, you know, we'll
talk about their role what'smost important to them.
And I never assume anything,right?
Some people may say, well, thebusiness obviously has to make
money.
And yes, you know, we want a, aprofitable business.
But one request that I'm hearingmore and more, and I've been
(06:03):
hearing this probably since,since COVID, is I want, I want a
business to have that, thatmission or, or that gi giving
back to the community.
It's gotta be a feel, feel goodbusiness.
Because yes, you know, the, thebusiness could be profitable,
but I wanna do good for mycommunity.
I wanna leave, I wanna leave alegacy, I wanna leave something
behind.
So, if you wouldn't mind, youknow, because serve is
(06:24):
definitely, you know, in linewith someone looking for that
type of business.
If you could talk to us a littlebit more about the, the mission,
the values maybe, maybe even astory if you can even share that
of, of a, a current franchisee.
Patrick Brown (06:37):
So, yeah, the the mission of the business is to
elevate the next generationthrough meeting the needs of the
community.
You know, the real heart thatwe've had is growing young
people that have worked in thefield and having go out and
serve.
the elderly.
You know, since we've grown,we've expanded that, you know,
we have people of all ages workfor us and we're serving all
types of ages.
But that was like the originalheart of that.
(06:59):
'cause I, when I was when I hadthat time between Aqua and er, I
had a friend die of drugoverdose and a friend die of
suicide.
Giuseppe Grammatico (07:06):
Sorry about that.
Patrick Brown (07:07):
people.
They weren't people that youwould ever expect it And I've
had more and more of friends ofthat has happened to and just
realized that there is like amajor issue with young people,
like a lot of them.
They're, you know, the numberone killer of young people is
suicide.
Many, many of them are verydisconnected from their
generation.
I think only 6% of Gen Z knowanyone outside of their
generation besides theirparents.
(07:29):
And so, you know, I found thatthere was this beautiful thing
that happens when you take youngpeople serving the elderly,
helping with these regulartasks.
You know, having this symbioticrelationship where the elderly's
benefiting even relationallyfrom the kind of companionship
element.
And the young person are beinginspired by helping older
people.
It really, I think, does a lotof good healing young
Giuseppe Grammatico (07:52):
Right.
Patrick Brown (07:52):
You know, getting a tip every day, getting a job
done, being on your phone allday, interacting with all
different types of people,different communication types.
And so to me, I feel like whenI'm wanting to build a business,
like I want something that makesme come alive.
You know, I remember with Aqua.
Ticket we sold, we gave a monthof clean water to someone in
(08:12):
Ghana.
And so the water crisis was whatreally killed me.
'cause that was the number onekiller for I think it was like
one in five.
I can't remember the fact rightnow.
I think it was like one in fivepeople don't make it to the age
of five in a lot of parts ofAfrica because of unclean
drinking water.
so this is, this, this c causeof just really young adult
mental health.
(08:34):
Was what really drove me and gotme really excited.
And then also what it was doingfor seniors that, you know, one
fifth of America is gonna be 65plus by 2030 and one fourth by
2050.
And these at home projects arebarriers to staying at
Giuseppe Grammatico (08:49):
Right.
Patrick Brown (08:50):
being a forced assisted living.
And it's like, how can we dothat to our elderly?
Like we need to have a solutionfor them.
So those two causes rose up andthose just made me like really
come alive and I never.
like bored or regretting doingwhat I'm doing because of, I
think the deep why that liveswith me.
So that would be my advice.
If anyone's thinking aboutstarting a business or looking
(09:11):
for a franchise, like, hey, whatis it that makes you come alive?
And go do that.
Don't, don't just look at youknow, the dollar
Giuseppe Grammatico (09:20):
Right.
Patrick Brown (09:20):
cause I think that's an empty road, you know,
sort of like this.
You know, I'm, I'm a Christian,I'm not, the business isn't
Christian, but I have, you know,a lot of ethos in that.
But you know, there's this versethat says, what is a profit
demand to gain the whole worldand lose his soul?
It's like if you, if you go outand build a business that's just
about money, like sure you gainthe whole world.
But if it's not like ininvigorating your
Giuseppe Grammatico (09:43):
Mm-hmm.
Patrick Brown (09:44):
you've now lost your soul.
And what's the win then at thatpoint?
Giuseppe Grammatico (09:48):
Yeah, it's you know, I, I, I talk about sus
sustainability in the business,right?
PE-people burn out quickly ifthe match isn't there, if there,
there's not this sense ofpurpose.
So, I always talk aboutsustainability, the match.
The purpose in the businessitself.
So it's that is I thinkextremely important and it's,
it's something that people don'tnormally think about, right?
(10:09):
They go in and just, what's thehot business?
How do I get involved?
What kind of money I can make?
And once they dig a little bitdeeper, it's like, wow, there
are other options out there.
There are better matches for me.
I really like that.
on serve.
if you could run us down thebusiness model, the right fit,
you know, essentially you'refranchise avatar and, you know,
what does that business looklike, you know, as far as the
(10:30):
team is this, is this a W2 or 1099 model?
What type of tasks are you ableto, to handle for both seniors
and and busy families?
Patrick Brown (10:39):
It serves a to-do list membership for homeowners.
So we do all the low level tasksaround the house.
Our core four is moving in junk,one category, exterior cleaning,
which includes window washing,power washing, and gutter
cleaning.
Then we have odd jobs, which isa little bit of a catchall that
can be general assistance, likeyou just want help moving a
(11:00):
couch, you want help with this,et cetera.
and then you have.
A to-do list membership forhomeowners and we do all of the
basic odd jobs around the houseto help live fuller lives at
home.
You know, both the busy familythat doesn't have time for it.
And also the senior that'strying to age at age at place.
(11:21):
So we have core four services welike to think, which is moving
and junk removal as onecategory.
That could be moving furnitureon the house, a local move down
the street, getting rid of somejunk decluttering.
That's one bucket.
Next one is yard work.
So that could be like weeding,edging, mulching, pruning this
next bucket.
The third I would say is the oddjobs, which is.
(11:42):
Kinda all of the differentcatchall bucket you know,
general assistance.
Maybe just want a helping hand.
We like have a do with you modelwhere the homeowner can hire you
to help you around the housewith projects.
'cause many homeowners stillwant to get their hands dirty
and just having an extra hand isall they really need.
And then exterior cleaning,which is your power washing,
soft washing window, washing,gutter cleaning.
(12:02):
So that's just anything exteriorto make the house look cleaner.
Giuseppe Grammatico (12:06):
And and are, are, and are these the
people doing the actual work,are these, are they W2?
What, what does that look like?
Does, is the franchise ownerhiring these individuals
directly?
Patrick Brown (12:16):
Yeah, primarily W2.
We start with a really small
Giuseppe Grammatico (12:19):
Hmm.
Patrick Brown (12:19):
You know, it could be as small as you and one
other person.
We like to have a group of twotwo to four, but we would talk
to you about that with thatfranchisee when they onboarded.
And they can add in as theyscale up the model.
They can add in some 10 99.
But we primarily like to keep,you know, W2 trucks, tools
uniforms, like really havingeverything under control and
(12:41):
then not all subbed
Giuseppe Grammatico (12:42):
Gotcha.
And, and, and from the, thefranchisee standpoint, you know,
what is, what is the franchiseeskind of, what are they doing on
a daily basis and what supportare they getting?
Is, is, is it marketing beinghandled at the at the franchisor
level?
You know, what are they doing togenerate leads in business?
Patrick Brown (12:58):
so the community partner franchisee they.
It can ha they really take oneof two roles, the community
manager or the communitybusiness developer, so they can
either run the day-to-dayoperations and get their hands
dirty in the field and, and makesure everything's running
smoothly or they can go out andbe the face of the business.
networking with a lot ofrealtors, interior, interior
(13:19):
designers, property managers,senior care agencies, like
there's many different ways thatwe generate business and they
can really take one of those twoseats and we, like, we recommend
that they hire, that secondposition.
I.
And then Fran, what we providefor as a franchisor, and one
thing that I, we've kinda leftout is we did this deal with a
(13:41):
group called Cornerstone aboutsix months ago, have brought an
incredible infrastructure.
Our sister company's firstflight home care that has 300
franchisees doing.
Incredible volume for perfranchisee unit volume.
They've brought all of ourbackend support so that make
sure that we could reallysupport the franchisees as well.
And we just brought on arecently a brand president of a
(14:04):
man named David Dunsmore thathelped build Home
Giuseppe Grammatico (14:06):
Mm-hmm.
Patrick Brown (14:07):
as like really leading up the charge.
And so.
We're wrapping, you know, ourarms around the franchisee to
really give them the business ina box so that they don't have to
do a lot of thinking they'llhave to do is like follow the
playbook.
So everything you can think frommarketing, from print, digital
all your B2B, your third partylead gen, you know your door to
doors, the sales to cold callsales, recruiting tools.
(14:30):
You know, all the businesspresentations, like anything
that they could ever think theywould ever need, we give from a
marketing perspective, we bringup the technology to help run
the day-to-day operations fromtheir reporting, scheduling,
dispatching, quoting, follow up.
You know, all the nurturingsequences that need to do with
the customer.
all, everything with theirQuickBooks, their financial
(14:51):
tools their projections helpingthem with recommendations with
hr.
You know, it's, it's really likeanything that they could need in
a business.
Like we have it for them, butit's them to go out and execute
and build, you know, build itlocally in their community.
Giuseppe Grammatico (15:05):
Gotcha.
So, so you, you had mentionedwith Cornerstone.
So it sounds, it sounds like, ifyou're a serve franchisee,
you're gonna be, essentially,that's your, that's who you're
gonna be working with the, thepeople at First Lights.
So if they have, if someone, afranchisee at Firstlight is
taking care of a, you know, momor dad.
Er can act, you know, activelygo in there and, and handle the
(15:26):
to-do list if, if I'm not, mis,if, if I understood correctly.
Patrick Brown (15:29):
Yeah,
Giuseppe Grammatico (15:29):
Mm-hmm.
Patrick Brown (15:30):
a nice thing about the sister company.
Every franchisee from Firstlighthas, you know, it's their own
Giuseppe Grammatico (15:35):
Mm-hmm.
Patrick Brown (15:35):
make the strategic introduction and we
like to find ways that they canoverlap so that we can go out
and help the same customers.
And also, you know, Firstlighthas a lot of referral partners,
you know,
Giuseppe Grammatico (15:46):
Right.
Patrick Brown (15:47):
they're, they're getting leads from for their
clients that they can beleveraged as well.
So we try to find ways betweenthe two that they can
symbiotically help each other.
Giuseppe Grammatico (15:57):
Love that.
No, that's, that's awesome.
Yeah.
So, you know, I'm, I'm sure, I'msure with 300 franchisees,
there's probably a franchisee inyour market that you can work
directly with day one.
So.
That's a, that's a huge bonus.
Any, anything and, and whateveryou can share and, and maybe you
can't share at this time, butanything new on the horizon with
with serve any changes, anyadditions, anything you
(16:19):
anticipate going into into theend of the year?
Patrick Brown (16:22):
Yeah, I mean, we've just brought on incredible
talent.
You know, people that have builtHome Depot, rebath Lumber,
liquidators, cer, prop Paintersand Service Master.
And so we've brought on likecenturies of experience to the
table of
Giuseppe Grammatico (16:35):
Hmm.
Patrick Brown (16:36):
team.
And we're, we've raised a lot ofcapital to be able to put
things, things into place tomake sure that the franchisees
are getting the support of aseasoned franchise business, but
they're getting the attention ofa new franchise, emerging
franchise.
So, there's a lot of you know,great.
(16:56):
You know, aspects being rolledout all the time.
You know, we're improving ourCRM.
We're improving new technology.
We're improving our digitalmarketing.
We just rolled out a new microwebsite.
Highly check.
Highly recommend.
Check it out.
W-E-S-U-R v.com.
you can see how each franchiseehas their own like micro site,
so it doesn't look like it'sjust a page on a site that's
(17:16):
like kind of.
Lackluster, but
Giuseppe Grammatico (17:18):
Right.
Patrick Brown (17:19):
feels like their own living portal.
So putting a lot of scaleinfrastructure in place that,
you know, with good security,good backing and good, you know,
marketing.
So the franchisees do reallywell.
Giuseppe Grammatico (17:31):
Awesome.
I appreciate you sharing that.
one thing, you know, we talkedabout in the beginning of the
show, switching gears a littlebit, is you know, we'll have.
Maybe not necessarily thefounders of brands, but you
being the founder of the brand,we, we can, we can have this
discussion.
But you know, there, there arepeople that I speak with and not
an area I specialize in, but wedo work with with other
partners.
(17:51):
You know, advice you would giveto someone that maybe has a
business, a business thatthey've launched that they are,
are thinking of a franchising.
So essentially becoming afranchisor.
Any advice that you would give?
Because this is an area where Ifeel like I'm getting about a
call a week, someone saying, youknow what, I got a great cons
concept.
I wanna franchise.
Where do we start?
(18:11):
How much money do I need?
And we don't have to get tothose specifics, but, you know,
do you, do you recommend it and,and obviously everyone's
situation is different.
Where, where, what kind ofadvice would you give to someone
that's looking to franchisetheir business?
Patrick Brown (18:24):
Yeah.
So it's funny you say thatbecause I had someone reach out
recently asking me to take acall with someone that was
thinking about franchising theirbusiness.
And this is really what I toldthem.
So the first thing you need todo is have unit level
profitability.
Giuseppe Grammatico (18:38):
Hmm.
Patrick Brown (18:38):
to think that if you were to bake your business
down it as a one locationfranchise, like whatever size
territory you wanna sell,whether it's the population,
number of households, et cetera,you need to think that whatever
that net income is, is thatgonna be attractive enough for
someone to quit their job?
make enough there.
So
Giuseppe Grammatico (18:58):
Right.
Patrick Brown (18:58):
that's the first thing, because it's my advisor,
Peter Barkman, that helped buildcer propane.
He says it's the head and theheart, like the heart.
They can, they can really getbehind it and really want it,
but if they can't make enoughmoney, they're never gonna be
able to get their head torationalize making, the impact.
So that's, so that's a big one.
I would also recommend in thatprocess researching FTDs of
(19:19):
comparable businesses that areclose to you.
So.
You know, if you're in thepainting business, perhaps look
concert a prop painter, easypainting whatever it may be,
take their FTDs.
I'd recommend throwing'em inchat, GBT and ask the
differences between their item19, their item six, and their
item seven.
So you can really see what arethe differences the startup
costs, the ongoing cost, andwhat the profitability of a
franchise may be.
(19:41):
The second one is, I wouldrecommend trying to have as low
of startup costs as possible.
So, but enough where they canget an SBA loan.
So.
You know, I'm not gonna saynumbers, but I would, I would
recommend looking up what otherstartup costs are and try to
fall in that
Giuseppe Grammatico (19:56):
Mm-hmm.
Patrick Brown (19:56):
that it's easy for someone to get into, but not
so easy that they're not gonnacare if they bought a franchise.
And I think a target is toreally try to get them in this
model that you're making tocashflow positive as PO as quick
as possible.
I think the third thing is theyshould have a unique concept
that's repeatable, ideally withsome sort of moat where they
can't go and do it on their own.
(20:18):
They need to see your franchisorand say, don't wanna do it
without them, and I'm gonna belike, way more successful.
I do it with them.
And the franchise fee and theroyalty, fully justify the
support that you're gonna get.
And I would recommend there are,there's a book called E-Myth.
I think that's a great franchisebook to read if you're just
starting out.
(20:40):
the fourth is, I think I wouldspend a year or two getting
those financials to the placewhere we need to be.
I know you may be eager to getgoing, but if you don't have
like a strong item 19, which isyour year to date, financials.
It's not going to be compellingenough for someone to really
wanna buy a franchise.
So it may feel slow at thebeginning, but just focus on
getting your business asprofitably as possible.
(21:02):
And I would recommend consultingwith a f franchise consultant
once you do that to build theirF-E-D-F-D-D and operations
manual which is where everythingshould come from.
You know, that should be how yourun your business.
Those 2D occupants are reallycritical.
I would recommend s and bfranchising if you're looking
for someone.
And I worked with Inter Law,they were also incredible at
(21:23):
getting it going, so I highlyrecommend those two firms.
next I would recommend isgetting three to five people
that wanna become your betafranchisees and just work out
the kinks with them.
Give them a good deal.
Since they're in the Founder'sClub, help them be very
successful and just focus allyour energy on.
Getting them to the kinds ofnumbers that you want to show in
(21:44):
your FDD.
After one to two years, I wouldexplore organic paid and broker
channels to help scale up yourfranchise.
I recommend going to the IFA andalso Springboard Conference to
network and learn a lot.
I think other founders and evenvendors can be some of your best
friends in trying to learn.
How to franchise Well,especially in like your size
(22:06):
area, say the one to 50 units,but then also getting advice
from the people in the hundredto 300
Giuseppe Grammatico (22:11):
Right.
Patrick Brown (22:12):
'cause they can tell you some of the horror
stories of that.
You know, one of the classicones I always hear is like,
careful of who your first 10franchisees are.
'cause you're always likewanting to get rid of'em.
I'm very fortunate.
Mine are incredible.
So, but I've heard that as a,that's a horror story that
people say, and the last one Isaid is.
would get three to fivefranchise advisors that have
been in franchising for over 10years.
(22:33):
Ideally a founder and anoperator.
Giuseppe Grammatico (22:36):
Right.
Love that.
Wow.
That's that was very detailed.
So I, I actually.
While we were talking, you know,right before the, our
conversation, I was like, youknow what, maybe, maybe we talk
about this as well because it,it's, it came up recently on a
call.
I, I really appreciate thefeedback, and that was very
thorough because the, the peopledunno where to start.
There was a, I was just watchingit was a, it was a podcast.
(22:58):
We were interviews interviewingthe president of the IFA and
they were saying that, 75% ofpeople that they've interviewed
were interested in starting abusiness.
Of that group of people, seven,another 75%, three quarters of
those people never started thebusiness because they didn't
know where to start.
Which I found, I found prettyamazing in this day and age
(23:18):
where there's so muchinformation out there and may,
and maybe it's because it'sinformation overload, but I kind
of, I kind of liked how you, youhad utilize a, you know, chat
GPT or a Gemini to, to compare,as you mentioned maybe f DDS and
things like that.
And use technology.
You know, you're using it at thefranchisor level.
Why not use it?
In your research.
So I, I think that's that's somegreat advice and I don't know
(23:39):
why I didn't think of that.
You know, I use it for otherthings and creating social
posts, but that was a very goodpoint.
So, I do appreciate that.
Well, I was gonna, I always, Ialways getting towards the end
to ask about a fun fact.
You already, you already sharedthat.
So, wanted to spend a littletime in this topic, but, you
know, and, and we touch on it aswell.
Advice you would give as, as a,as a starting point.
(24:00):
So franchise aside, we're justtalking about just.
Thinking of owning a business,you know, what advice would you
give yourself, or what advicewould you give that corporate
exec that doesn't know where tostart?
Maybe they just, you know, nothappy with their job, they want
some type of change or maybethey're liking their job, but
the hours are so crazy that, youknow, they're missing the, the
kids soccer games and events andthings like that.
(24:22):
What advice would you give asfar as general advice and then
maybe advice on, on kind ofwhere to start?
Patrick Brown (24:29):
Yeah, I would say, you know, ask yourself the
life you wanna live and build abusiness around that.
Giuseppe Grammatico (24:34):
Mm-hmm.
Patrick Brown (24:34):
That's the big one.
And then ask yourself what makesyou come alive?
Like I mentioned earlier, youknow, I built Aqua, that was a
really cool business, but I wasworking 20 hour days.
I was living on a tour busliving in Vegas.
Like it wasn't exactly the lifeI really wanted to
Giuseppe Grammatico (24:47):
Right.
Patrick Brown (24:48):
Like I have a much like better well balanced
life where I'm getting to pourinto young people and talk to
lovely old ladies.
Like it's a wonderful life, youknow?
So that is an important one.
And I think the why part, youknow, like if you.
You know, aren't excited aboutwhat you're doing and you don't
believe in what you're doing.
Like, I don't know about you,but I don't, I can last more
than a week.
You know, I just, I just, I justcompletely give up and don't
(25:11):
care
Giuseppe Grammatico (25:11):
All right.
Patrick Brown (25:12):
I think that's important.
And then the, you know, and thethird, like, does the business
idea you have, like, have thepotential to make any money,
like model it out?
You know, you don't have to becrazy Excel, but just go through
it and have some friends look atit and go, does this sound
realistic?
Is it not?
You know, it might be a littlecrazy, but you know, just make
sure that whatever you'rebuilding actually has like some
opportunity to make real money.
(25:33):
And I think that's the nice partof franchising.
It's like, it's less of aguessing game.
It's like you, you put your feedown, pay royalty, and like get
the entrepreneurship, you know,and the lifestyle, but you don't
have to like.
Risk it all
Giuseppe Grammatico (25:47):
Right.
Patrick Brown (25:47):
on, you know, building your own thing, that it
has a probably higher likelihoodof failure.
And I think, you know, forstarting if you're gonna start
fresh, like what I did is, youknow, I got a notebook I wrote
down, I had my business idea, Ihad everything Oh, that was
inspired and I wrote everythingI think I could, could ever
think of that I would need todo, then I broke it into weeks.
(26:12):
And I, and so I was like, okay,this is a marketing week.
Everything this week is allmarketing.
I'm not gonna do anything butmarketing next week's sales.
All I'm gonna do is sales.
Next what you're gonna do
Giuseppe Grammatico (26:23):
Right.
Patrick Brown (26:23):
you know, and what that does is like the power
of focus allows you to doexponentially more.
And especially when you giveyourself like a tight timeframe,
your body's gonna be able tocomplete way more tasks than if
you don't.
And you gotta jump at somepoint.
You know, and the, honestly, thebest times I've performed my
business is when I had a fireunder my butt, you know, when I
(26:44):
really needed to perform.
Like that's when I was reallysuccessful.
And if you think about all likethe richest people in the world,
all the billionaires, almost allof them dropped out of college
or high school and they like hadto make it
Giuseppe Grammatico (26:55):
Mm-hmm.
Patrick Brown (26:56):
And sometimes like having too much of a
cushion can like be a bad, itcan be your detriment.
It gets you to be lazy.
You don't move as quickly.
So the fire's a good thing.
And like you don't wanna losethat fire'cause you're, that
fire's a good thing.
And like you.
Giuseppe Grammatico (27:10):
I, I, yeah, I, I agree.
I, I know when I started myfirst franchise, I signed the
franchise agreement February2nd.
Of 2007, and we found out wewere ex my wife was expecting
three days later, so that was,that was, that was my fire.
I'm like, man, I, I gotta, wegotta make, we got, we gotta
make this work.
We're on one income now.
You know, I had left my job.
But that's true.
(27:30):
The, the, this idea of focus ishuge and people are like, yeah,
I, I know you have to focus.
And then I talked to newfranchisees and they're, they
got a franchise, they got a sidehustle.
They have 20 things going on,and it's like.
That's, that's fine.
You know, you, you want todiversify, but how do you, how
do you really go a hundredpercent if you have 20, 20
different things you'rebalancing.
(27:51):
So, the power of focus is huge.
And the idea, I talk a lot aboutthe idea of owning the calendar,
putting your, your personalstuff, your rocks on the
calendar, making sure you'refocused and, you know, handling
all the personal stuff.
Like I will never miss a familyevent for work.
Work is always kind of secondright?
I get everything personal on andthen I open up the calendar.
Patrick Brown (28:11):
Yeah.
Giuseppe Grammatico (28:12):
You know, prioritize what's going on in
your life.
But, but, but secondly, focus onone thing at a time and go all
in.
Give give it all you got, getthat business up and running.
You may not need five differentside hustles and businesses if
when you go all in on one.
There, there's some there,there, there's some power there.
You, I've definitely seen somemagic when I left my job and put
aside my, you know, sold my sidebusiness and just focused on my
(28:34):
one franchise.
We grew and it wasn't like 10,20%.
We grew exponentially.
So,
Patrick Brown (28:40):
Yeah.
Giuseppe Grammatico (28:40):
that, that is, that is some great advice.
So I I greatly appreciate that.
Anything else that, that we, wedid not talk about as we, as we
wrap up the the episode,anything we did not talk about
advice or any topic we didn'tthat you'd like to share or
advice?
Patrick Brown (28:54):
Yeah, just maybe a quote I, I love that I was
just touching on what you saidis Andrew Carnegie,
Giuseppe Grammatico (28:59):
Mm-hmm.
Patrick Brown (29:00):
Carnegie, not Carnegie.
Fun, fun fact.
Giuseppe Grammatico (29:02):
Hm
Patrick Brown (29:03):
richest man of all time well, who knows
Giuseppe Grammatico (29:05):
mm-hmm.
Patrick Brown (29:05):
Musk and everybody else.
But said the way to become richis to put all your eggs in one
basket and then watch thatbasket.
He says the
Giuseppe Grammatico (29:13):
And, and, and,
Patrick Brown (29:14):
the most baskets end up breaking the most eggs in
America.
Giuseppe Grammatico (29:17):
and you said, and you said to, to watch
that basket, you said, I'msorry.
Patrick Brown (29:21):
To watch that
Giuseppe Grammatico (29:22):
Gotcha.
Patrick Brown (29:23):
like focus your energy and your talents and all
of your capital and everythingon one area and just make it
work.
You know, don't, don't get too
Giuseppe Grammatico (29:31):
Me.
Patrick Brown (29:31):
Like we, again, like, you know, humans think
they can multitask, but it'sproven that you can't.
So having that focus is gonnapropel much more success than
being too diversified.
Giuseppe Grammatico (29:42):
I love that.
You know, and he has, he is, heis definitely a very, very
successful guy.
So I, I would definitely, thoseare, those are words of wisdom.
I like that quote.
That's something I'm gonna stealand definitely use on a, on a
future episode.
But couldn't, couldn't agreemore.
But pat, I, I really I reallyappreciate your time.
This was fun.
I'm sure we'll we'll continuethis conversation.
Looking forward to, to workingwith you and yeah, we'll we'll
(30:04):
let you know.
Show, show should go live.
Go live here in a few weeks.
Patrick Brown (30:08):
Awesome.
Thanks so much.
Giuseppe Grammatico (30:09):
Thanks again.
I.
So I just knocked on every door in my town and
(00:02):
said, Hey, you can rent me andI'll do whatever you want.
That business was called RentSons at the time, and the
tagline was quality service atthe cost and allowance without
the complaining of an actualson.
ask yourself the life you wannalive and build a business around
that.
the way to become rich is to putall your eggs in one basket and
then watch that basket.
(00:24):
Welcome to the Franchise FreedomPodcast, where you can escape
the corporate trap throughfranchise ownership.
Here's your host, Giuseppe gr,the franchise guide.
Giuseppe Grammatico (00:37):
Welcome to the Franchise Freedom Podcast.
I'm your host, Zepi Grammatic,your franchise guide, this show
where we help corporateexecutives experience time and
financial freedom.
Thanks for joining us today.
We have an awesome guest today.
His name is Patrick Brown fromServe.
Patrick.
Welcome to the show.
Patrick Brown (00:52):
Yeah.
Happy to be here.
Thanks for having me.
Giuseppe Grammatico (00:54):
I appreciate you coming on the
show.
we've been working closely thepast month or so, been meaning
to have you on and our guestsyou know, have been just great
talking about franchisefranchise ownership, what it
takes to start a franchise, and,really excited to get your
insight.
So before we dive in today, ifyou could give the audience a
little bit of background on youknow, who Patrick is and how
(01:16):
you, how you came up with serve.
Patrick Brown (01:18):
Yeah, sure.
My name's Pat Brown.
I'm the founder of a companycalled Serve.
I started it in Little Compton,Rhode Island, which is the
smallest town in the smalleststate.
And when I was in college, myfamily went wealthy to poor,
relatively fast.
Parents lost their job, we losttheir house, our parents split
up, I needed a way to pay forschool.
So I just knocked on every doorin my town and said, Hey, you
(01:38):
can rent me and I'll do whateveryou want.
That business was called RentSons at the time, and the
tagline was quality service atthe cost and allowance without
the complaining of an actualson.
that no complaining guaranteeworked did wonders for me.
always made sure I nevercomplained no matter how
Giuseppe Grammatico (01:55):
No plane guarantee.
I like that.
Patrick Brown (01:57):
Yeah.
And so I would generally, as Iwould knock on these doors,
generally the older woman antsthe door, you know, delighted to
have me come do their to-dolist.
Well, there's, we at the garden,clean the garage, put up the
Christmas lights.
You know, I would come over on aweekly or monthly basis.
And I loved it'cause I got topay for school and cash.
I got to build out meaningfulrelationships with people that
became like family to me,especially as my home life was a
(02:19):
little rocky.
I got to learn all theseinterpersonal skills, these
practical skills.
I got to work around my schedulewhen I was gonna college and
also when I wanted to gosurfing.
and they loved it'cause they hada young person come over and do
their to-do list projects andallowed'em to just age at home.
They got to pour into me, theygot to gimme life advice.
They got to have sort of a jackof all trades, a one-stop shop
(02:42):
for their whole home.
And it became like reallymeaningful relationships to many
of my homeowners.
Where now, if.
I put you in my car and we drovearound for a day.
I could tell you a story ofevery homeowner.
We can tell you about theirkids, their families, people
that have passed away.
And I can't tell you what thatdoes for my sense of belonging,
where I live, where I feel likeI've provided a business that's
(03:04):
a lifeline for so many people,that if it went away, it would
actually be really destructiveto the community.
So I think that's what I, Ibuilt there.
And then we repeated it in othermarkets when we started
franchising.
And I just love this, thisbusiness, and I, and I would
love to see people that have thesame heart for their community,
bring it around where to wherethey are so that we can really
(03:26):
see some like national impact inwhat we're doing.
Giuseppe Grammatico (03:30):
Awesome.
and then that leads us to servewhen, so when was serve founded,
talk to us a little bit aboutthat and where you are today as
far as where you're located.
Patrick Brown (03:39):
Yeah, so it's kind of funny story.
I, so I built that business topay for college, which was
called Red Suns.
And then in college I went offand built the nation's largest
water special effects companycalled Aqua.
I like invented a water hologramand it got picked up by the
number one DJ in the world forhis US tour when I was in
college.
So I toured around the countryand interned for myself.
(04:01):
My senior year.
I had to still take Spanish.
I failed Spanish, but I bribedmy Spanish teacher with
backstage passes to my concertand got a c plus.
So I was able to get outtaschool.
Then I kinda hit it big.
I became the water guy from themusic industry and had a show at
Madison Square Garden new Year'sEve with Fish.
(04:21):
and had this moment where I feltlike I was living a very flashy
life, but I didn't feel like Iwas living a very fulfilling
life of what I really was hopingfor.
And so just had this very clearmoment where I looked in the
mirror and go, this is not whatI want.
And I wanna have something thathas like tremendous impact in
whatever I'm spending my day andspending my time on.
So took a step back, spent sometime praying and felt like God
(04:44):
gave me like this desire tobring what I did for college but
build it around the country.
And so that relaunched servereally in sort of 2017 it was
called, still called Red Sonsand built that up.
And then but we were alwaysdoing this tech enabled approach
with the business and justrealized that like.
(05:06):
To do this business well, itactually had to have that
franchise touch where there'slocal owners that really care
about their community, want toinvest in their employees, build
the relationships to thehomeowners, and see all these
relationships come together tobenefit their community.
so in 2020 four, we actuallyjust started franchising.
So we started franchising it andbrought on four franchisees so
(05:29):
far, and they've just beenreally impressed and really
grateful for how well they'vedone.
And now we're in the process ofstarting to scale it out
nationally with these newpartnerships that we've created
recently.
Giuseppe Grammatico (05:41):
I love that.
before we started recording herewe talked with a lot of people,
first time business owners.
We're exploring differentfranchises and, you know, we'll
talk about their role what'smost important to them.
And I never assume anything,right?
Some people may say, well, thebusiness obviously has to make
money.
And yes, you know, we want a, aprofitable business.
But one request that I'm hearingmore and more, and I've been
(06:03):
hearing this probably since,since COVID, is I want, I want a
business to have that, thatmission or, or that gi giving
back to the community.
It's gotta be a feel, feel goodbusiness.
Because yes, you know, the, thebusiness could be profitable,
but I wanna do good for mycommunity.
I wanna leave, I wanna leave alegacy, I wanna leave something
behind.
So, if you wouldn't mind, youknow, because serve is
(06:24):
definitely, you know, in linewith someone looking for that
type of business.
If you could talk to us a littlebit more about the, the mission,
the values maybe, maybe even astory if you can even share that
of, of a, a current franchisee.
Patrick Brown (06:37):
So, yeah, the the mission of the business is to
elevate the next generationthrough meeting the needs of the
community.
You know, the real heart thatwe've had is growing young
people that have worked in thefield and having go out and
serve.
the elderly.
You know, since we've grown,we've expanded that, you know,
we have people of all ages workfor us and we're serving all
types of ages.
But that was like the originalheart of that.
(06:59):
'cause I, when I was when I hadthat time between Aqua and er, I
had a friend die of drugoverdose and a friend die of
suicide.
Giuseppe Grammatico (07:06):
Sorry about that.
Patrick Brown (07:07):
people.
They weren't people that youwould ever expect it And I've
had more and more of friends ofthat has happened to and just
realized that there is like amajor issue with young people,
like a lot of them.
They're, you know, the numberone killer of young people is
suicide.
Many, many of them are verydisconnected from their
generation.
I think only 6% of Gen Z knowanyone outside of their
generation besides theirparents.
(07:29):
And so, you know, I found thatthere was this beautiful thing
that happens when you take youngpeople serving the elderly,
helping with these regulartasks.
You know, having this symbioticrelationship where the elderly's
benefiting even relationallyfrom the kind of companionship
element.
And the young person are beinginspired by helping older
people.
It really, I think, does a lotof good healing young
Giuseppe Grammatico (07:52):
Right.
Patrick Brown (07:52):
You know, getting a tip every day, getting a job
done, being on your phone allday, interacting with all
different types of people,different communication types.
And so to me, I feel like whenI'm wanting to build a business,
like I want something that makesme come alive.
You know, I remember with Aqua.
Ticket we sold, we gave a monthof clean water to someone in
(08:12):
Ghana.
And so the water crisis was whatreally killed me.
'cause that was the number onekiller for I think it was like
one in five.
I can't remember the fact rightnow.
I think it was like one in fivepeople don't make it to the age
of five in a lot of parts ofAfrica because of unclean
drinking water.
so this is, this, this c causeof just really young adult
mental health.
(08:34):
Was what really drove me and gotme really excited.
And then also what it was doingfor seniors that, you know, one
fifth of America is gonna be 65plus by 2030 and one fourth by
2050.
And these at home projects arebarriers to staying at
Giuseppe Grammatico (08:49):
Right.
Patrick Brown (08:50):
being a forced assisted living.
And it's like, how can we dothat to our elderly?
Like we need to have a solutionfor them.
So those two causes rose up andthose just made me like really
come alive and I never.
like bored or regretting doingwhat I'm doing because of, I
think the deep why that liveswith me.
So that would be my advice.
If anyone's thinking aboutstarting a business or looking
(09:11):
for a franchise, like, hey, whatis it that makes you come alive?
And go do that.
Don't, don't just look at youknow, the dollar
Giuseppe Grammatico (09:20):
Right.
Patrick Brown (09:20):
cause I think that's an empty road, you know,
sort of like this.
You know, I'm, I'm a Christian,I'm not, the business isn't
Christian, but I have, you know,a lot of ethos in that.
But you know, there's this versethat says, what is a profit
demand to gain the whole worldand lose his soul?
It's like if you, if you go outand build a business that's just
about money, like sure you gainthe whole world.
But if it's not like ininvigorating your
Giuseppe Grammatico (09:43):
Mm-hmm.
Patrick Brown (09:44):
you've now lost your soul.
And what's the win then at thatpoint?
Giuseppe Grammatico (09:48):
Yeah, it's you know, I, I, I talk about sus
sustainability in the business,right?
PE-people burn out quickly ifthe match isn't there, if there,
there's not this sense ofpurpose.
So, I always talk aboutsustainability, the match.
The purpose in the businessitself.
So it's that is I thinkextremely important and it's,
it's something that people don'tnormally think about, right?
(10:09):
They go in and just, what's thehot business?
How do I get involved?
What kind of money I can make?
And once they dig a little bitdeeper, it's like, wow, there
are other options out there.
There are better matches for me.
I really like that.
on serve.
if you could run us down thebusiness model, the right fit,
you know, essentially you'refranchise avatar and, you know,
what does that business looklike, you know, as far as the
(10:30):
team is this, is this a W2 or 1099 model?
What type of tasks are you ableto, to handle for both seniors
and and busy families?
Patrick Brown (10:39):
It serves a to-do list membership for homeowners.
So we do all the low level tasksaround the house.
Our core four is moving in junk,one category, exterior cleaning,
which includes window washing,power washing, and gutter
cleaning.
Then we have odd jobs, which isa little bit of a catchall that
can be general assistance, likeyou just want help moving a
(11:00):
couch, you want help with this,et cetera.
and then you have.
A to-do list membership forhomeowners and we do all of the
basic odd jobs around the houseto help live fuller lives at
home.
You know, both the busy familythat doesn't have time for it.
And also the senior that'strying to age at age at place.
(11:21):
So we have core four services welike to think, which is moving
and junk removal as onecategory.
That could be moving furnitureon the house, a local move down
the street, getting rid of somejunk decluttering.
That's one bucket.
Next one is yard work.
So that could be like weeding,edging, mulching, pruning this
next bucket.
The third I would say is the oddjobs, which is.
(11:42):
Kinda all of the differentcatchall bucket you know,
general assistance.
Maybe just want a helping hand.
We like have a do with you modelwhere the homeowner can hire you
to help you around the housewith projects.
'cause many homeowners stillwant to get their hands dirty
and just having an extra hand isall they really need.
And then exterior cleaning,which is your power washing,
soft washing window, washing,gutter cleaning.
(12:02):
So that's just anything exteriorto make the house look cleaner.
Giuseppe Grammatico (12:06):
And and are, are, and are these the
people doing the actual work,are these, are they W2?
What, what does that look like?
Does, is the franchise ownerhiring these individuals
directly?
Patrick Brown (12:16):
Yeah, primarily W2.
We start with a really small
Giuseppe Grammatico (12:19):
Hmm.
Patrick Brown (12:19):
You know, it could be as small as you and one
other person.
We like to have a group of twotwo to four, but we would talk
to you about that with thatfranchisee when they onboarded.
And they can add in as theyscale up the model.
They can add in some 10 99.
But we primarily like to keep,you know, W2 trucks, tools
uniforms, like really havingeverything under control and
(12:41):
then not all subbed
Giuseppe Grammatico (12:42):
Gotcha.
And, and, and from the, thefranchisee standpoint, you know,
what is, what is the franchiseeskind of, what are they doing on
a daily basis and what supportare they getting?
Is, is, is it marketing beinghandled at the at the franchisor
level?
You know, what are they doing togenerate leads in business?
Patrick Brown (12:58):
so the community partner franchisee they.
It can ha they really take oneof two roles, the community
manager or the communitybusiness developer, so they can
either run the day-to-dayoperations and get their hands
dirty in the field and, and makesure everything's running
smoothly or they can go out andbe the face of the business.
networking with a lot ofrealtors, interior, interior
(13:19):
designers, property managers,senior care agencies, like
there's many different ways thatwe generate business and they
can really take one of those twoseats and we, like, we recommend
that they hire, that secondposition.
I.
And then Fran, what we providefor as a franchisor, and one
thing that I, we've kinda leftout is we did this deal with a
(13:41):
group called Cornerstone aboutsix months ago, have brought an
incredible infrastructure.
Our sister company's firstflight home care that has 300
franchisees doing.
Incredible volume for perfranchisee unit volume.
They've brought all of ourbackend support so that make
sure that we could reallysupport the franchisees as well.
And we just brought on arecently a brand president of a
(14:04):
man named David Dunsmore thathelped build Home
Giuseppe Grammatico (14:06):
Mm-hmm.
Patrick Brown (14:07):
as like really leading up the charge.
And so.
We're wrapping, you know, ourarms around the franchisee to
really give them the business ina box so that they don't have to
do a lot of thinking they'llhave to do is like follow the
playbook.
So everything you can think frommarketing, from print, digital
all your B2B, your third partylead gen, you know your door to
doors, the sales to cold callsales, recruiting tools.
(14:30):
You know, all the businesspresentations, like anything
that they could ever think theywould ever need, we give from a
marketing perspective, we bringup the technology to help run
the day-to-day operations fromtheir reporting, scheduling,
dispatching, quoting, follow up.
You know, all the nurturingsequences that need to do with
the customer.
all, everything with theirQuickBooks, their financial
(14:51):
tools their projections helpingthem with recommendations with
hr.
You know, it's, it's really likeanything that they could need in
a business.
Like we have it for them, butit's them to go out and execute
and build, you know, build itlocally in their community.
Giuseppe Grammatico (15:05):
Gotcha.
So, so you, you had mentionedwith Cornerstone.
So it sounds, it sounds like, ifyou're a serve franchisee,
you're gonna be, essentially,that's your, that's who you're
gonna be working with the, thepeople at First Lights.
So if they have, if someone, afranchisee at Firstlight is
taking care of a, you know, momor dad.
Er can act, you know, activelygo in there and, and handle the
(15:26):
to-do list if, if I'm not, mis,if, if I understood correctly.
Patrick Brown (15:29):
Yeah,
Giuseppe Grammatico (15:29):
Mm-hmm.
Patrick Brown (15:30):
a nice thing about the sister company.
Every franchisee from Firstlighthas, you know, it's their own
Giuseppe Grammatico (15:35):
Mm-hmm.
Patrick Brown (15:35):
make the strategic introduction and we
like to find ways that they canoverlap so that we can go out
and help the same customers.
And also, you know, Firstlighthas a lot of referral partners,
you know,
Giuseppe Grammatico (15:46):
Right.
Patrick Brown (15:47):
they're, they're getting leads from for their
clients that they can beleveraged as well.
So we try to find ways betweenthe two that they can
symbiotically help each other.
Giuseppe Grammatico (15:57):
Love that.
No, that's, that's awesome.
Yeah.
So, you know, I'm, I'm sure, I'msure with 300 franchisees,
there's probably a franchisee inyour market that you can work
directly with day one.
So.
That's a, that's a huge bonus.
Any, anything and, and whateveryou can share and, and maybe you
can't share at this time, butanything new on the horizon with
with serve any changes, anyadditions, anything you
(16:19):
anticipate going into into theend of the year?
Patrick Brown (16:22):
Yeah, I mean, we've just brought on incredible
talent.
You know, people that have builtHome Depot, rebath Lumber,
liquidators, cer, prop Paintersand Service Master.
And so we've brought on likecenturies of experience to the
table of
Giuseppe Grammatico (16:35):
Hmm.
Patrick Brown (16:36):
team.
And we're, we've raised a lot ofcapital to be able to put
things, things into place tomake sure that the franchisees
are getting the support of aseasoned franchise business, but
they're getting the attention ofa new franchise, emerging
franchise.
So, there's a lot of you know,great.
(16:56):
You know, aspects being rolledout all the time.
You know, we're improving ourCRM.
We're improving new technology.
We're improving our digitalmarketing.
We just rolled out a new microwebsite.
Highly check.
Highly recommend.
Check it out.
W-E-S-U-R v.com.
you can see how each franchiseehas their own like micro site,
so it doesn't look like it'sjust a page on a site that's
(17:16):
like kind of.
Lackluster, but
Giuseppe Grammatico (17:18):
Right.
Patrick Brown (17:19):
feels like their own living portal.
So putting a lot of scaleinfrastructure in place that,
you know, with good security,good backing and good, you know,
marketing.
So the franchisees do reallywell.
Giuseppe Grammatico (17:31):
Awesome.
I appreciate you sharing that.
one thing, you know, we talkedabout in the beginning of the
show, switching gears a littlebit, is you know, we'll have.
Maybe not necessarily thefounders of brands, but you
being the founder of the brand,we, we can, we can have this
discussion.
But you know, there, there arepeople that I speak with and not
an area I specialize in, but wedo work with with other
partners.
(17:51):
You know, advice you would giveto someone that maybe has a
business, a business thatthey've launched that they are,
are thinking of a franchising.
So essentially becoming afranchisor.
Any advice that you would give?
Because this is an area where Ifeel like I'm getting about a
call a week, someone saying, youknow what, I got a great cons
concept.
I wanna franchise.
Where do we start?
(18:11):
How much money do I need?
And we don't have to get tothose specifics, but, you know,
do you, do you recommend it and,and obviously everyone's
situation is different.
Where, where, what kind ofadvice would you give to someone
that's looking to franchisetheir business?
Patrick Brown (18:24):
Yeah.
So it's funny you say thatbecause I had someone reach out
recently asking me to take acall with someone that was
thinking about franchising theirbusiness.
And this is really what I toldthem.
So the first thing you need todo is have unit level
profitability.
Giuseppe Grammatico (18:38):
Hmm.
Patrick Brown (18:38):
to think that if you were to bake your business
down it as a one locationfranchise, like whatever size
territory you wanna sell,whether it's the population,
number of households, et cetera,you need to think that whatever
that net income is, is thatgonna be attractive enough for
someone to quit their job?
make enough there.
So
Giuseppe Grammatico (18:58):
Right.
Patrick Brown (18:58):
that's the first thing, because it's my advisor,
Peter Barkman, that helped buildcer propane.
He says it's the head and theheart, like the heart.
They can, they can really getbehind it and really want it,
but if they can't make enoughmoney, they're never gonna be
able to get their head torationalize making, the impact.
So that's, so that's a big one.
I would also recommend in thatprocess researching FTDs of
(19:19):
comparable businesses that areclose to you.
So.
You know, if you're in thepainting business, perhaps look
concert a prop painter, easypainting whatever it may be,
take their FTDs.
I'd recommend throwing'em inchat, GBT and ask the
differences between their item19, their item six, and their
item seven.
So you can really see what arethe differences the startup
costs, the ongoing cost, andwhat the profitability of a
franchise may be.
(19:41):
The second one is, I wouldrecommend trying to have as low
of startup costs as possible.
So, but enough where they canget an SBA loan.
So.
You know, I'm not gonna saynumbers, but I would, I would
recommend looking up what otherstartup costs are and try to
fall in that
Giuseppe Grammatico (19:56):
Mm-hmm.
Patrick Brown (19:56):
that it's easy for someone to get into, but not
so easy that they're not gonnacare if they bought a franchise.
And I think a target is toreally try to get them in this
model that you're making tocashflow positive as PO as quick
as possible.
I think the third thing is theyshould have a unique concept
that's repeatable, ideally withsome sort of moat where they
can't go and do it on their own.
(20:18):
They need to see your franchisorand say, don't wanna do it
without them, and I'm gonna belike, way more successful.
I do it with them.
And the franchise fee and theroyalty, fully justify the
support that you're gonna get.
And I would recommend there are,there's a book called E-Myth.
I think that's a great franchisebook to read if you're just
starting out.
(20:40):
the fourth is, I think I wouldspend a year or two getting
those financials to the placewhere we need to be.
I know you may be eager to getgoing, but if you don't have
like a strong item 19, which isyour year to date, financials.
It's not going to be compellingenough for someone to really
wanna buy a franchise.
So it may feel slow at thebeginning, but just focus on
getting your business asprofitably as possible.
(21:02):
And I would recommend consultingwith a f franchise consultant
once you do that to build theirF-E-D-F-D-D and operations
manual which is where everythingshould come from.
You know, that should be how yourun your business.
Those 2D occupants are reallycritical.
I would recommend s and bfranchising if you're looking
for someone.
And I worked with Inter Law,they were also incredible at
(21:23):
getting it going, so I highlyrecommend those two firms.
next I would recommend isgetting three to five people
that wanna become your betafranchisees and just work out
the kinks with them.
Give them a good deal.
Since they're in the Founder'sClub, help them be very
successful and just focus allyour energy on.
Getting them to the kinds ofnumbers that you want to show in
(21:44):
your FDD.
After one to two years, I wouldexplore organic paid and broker
channels to help scale up yourfranchise.
I recommend going to the IFA andalso Springboard Conference to
network and learn a lot.
I think other founders and evenvendors can be some of your best
friends in trying to learn.
How to franchise Well,especially in like your size
(22:06):
area, say the one to 50 units,but then also getting advice
from the people in the hundredto 300
Giuseppe Grammatico (22:11):
Right.
Patrick Brown (22:12):
'cause they can tell you some of the horror
stories of that.
You know, one of the classicones I always hear is like,
careful of who your first 10franchisees are.
'cause you're always likewanting to get rid of'em.
I'm very fortunate.
Mine are incredible.
So, but I've heard that as a,that's a horror story that
people say, and the last one Isaid is.
would get three to fivefranchise advisors that have
been in franchising for over 10years.
(22:33):
Ideally a founder and anoperator.
Giuseppe Grammatico (22:36):
Right.
Love that.
Wow.
That's that was very detailed.
So I, I actually.
While we were talking, you know,right before the, our
conversation, I was like, youknow what, maybe, maybe we talk
about this as well because it,it's, it came up recently on a
call.
I, I really appreciate thefeedback, and that was very
thorough because the, the peopledunno where to start.
There was a, I was just watchingit was a, it was a podcast.
(22:58):
We were interviews interviewingthe president of the IFA and
they were saying that, 75% ofpeople that they've interviewed
were interested in starting abusiness.
Of that group of people, seven,another 75%, three quarters of
those people never started thebusiness because they didn't
know where to start.
Which I found, I found prettyamazing in this day and age
(23:18):
where there's so muchinformation out there and may,
and maybe it's because it'sinformation overload, but I kind
of, I kind of liked how you, youhad utilize a, you know, chat
GPT or a Gemini to, to compare,as you mentioned maybe f DDS and
things like that.
And use technology.
You know, you're using it at thefranchisor level.
Why not use it?
In your research.
So I, I think that's that's somegreat advice and I don't know
(23:39):
why I didn't think of that.
You know, I use it for otherthings and creating social
posts, but that was a very goodpoint.
So, I do appreciate that.
Well, I was gonna, I always, Ialways getting towards the end
to ask about a fun fact.
You already, you already sharedthat.
So, wanted to spend a littletime in this topic, but, you
know, and, and we touch on it aswell.
Advice you would give as, as a,as a starting point.
(24:00):
So franchise aside, we're justtalking about just.
Thinking of owning a business,you know, what advice would you
give yourself, or what advicewould you give that corporate
exec that doesn't know where tostart?
Maybe they just, you know, nothappy with their job, they want
some type of change or maybethey're liking their job, but
the hours are so crazy that, youknow, they're missing the, the
kids soccer games and events andthings like that.
(24:22):
What advice would you give asfar as general advice and then
maybe advice on, on kind ofwhere to start?
Patrick Brown (24:29):
Yeah, I would say, you know, ask yourself the
life you wanna live and build abusiness around that.
Giuseppe Grammatico (24:34):
Mm-hmm.
Patrick Brown (24:34):
That's the big one.
And then ask yourself what makesyou come alive?
Like I mentioned earlier, youknow, I built Aqua, that was a
really cool business, but I wasworking 20 hour days.
I was living on a tour busliving in Vegas.
Like it wasn't exactly the lifeI really wanted to
Giuseppe Grammatico (24:47):
Right.
Patrick Brown (24:48):
Like I have a much like better well balanced
life where I'm getting to pourinto young people and talk to
lovely old ladies.
Like it's a wonderful life, youknow?
So that is an important one.
And I think the why part, youknow, like if you.
You know, aren't excited aboutwhat you're doing and you don't
believe in what you're doing.
Like, I don't know about you,but I don't, I can last more
than a week.
You know, I just, I just, I justcompletely give up and don't
(25:11):
care
Giuseppe Grammatico (25:11):
All right.
Patrick Brown (25:12):
I think that's important.
And then the, you know, and thethird, like, does the business
idea you have, like, have thepotential to make any money,
like model it out?
You know, you don't have to becrazy Excel, but just go through
it and have some friends look atit and go, does this sound
realistic?
Is it not?
You know, it might be a littlecrazy, but you know, just make
sure that whatever you'rebuilding actually has like some
opportunity to make real money.
(25:33):
And I think that's the nice partof franchising.
It's like, it's less of aguessing game.
It's like you, you put your feedown, pay royalty, and like get
the entrepreneurship, you know,and the lifestyle, but you don't
have to like.
Risk it all
Giuseppe Grammatico (25:47):
Right.
Patrick Brown (25:47):
on, you know, building your own thing, that it
has a probably higher likelihoodof failure.
And I think, you know, forstarting if you're gonna start
fresh, like what I did is, youknow, I got a notebook I wrote
down, I had my business idea, Ihad everything Oh, that was
inspired and I wrote everythingI think I could, could ever
think of that I would need todo, then I broke it into weeks.
(26:12):
And I, and so I was like, okay,this is a marketing week.
Everything this week is allmarketing.
I'm not gonna do anything butmarketing next week's sales.
All I'm gonna do is sales.
Next what you're gonna do
Giuseppe Grammatico (26:23):
Right.
Patrick Brown (26:23):
you know, and what that does is like the power
of focus allows you to doexponentially more.
And especially when you giveyourself like a tight timeframe,
your body's gonna be able tocomplete way more tasks than if
you don't.
And you gotta jump at somepoint.
You know, and the, honestly, thebest times I've performed my
business is when I had a fireunder my butt, you know, when I
(26:44):
really needed to perform.
Like that's when I was reallysuccessful.
And if you think about all likethe richest people in the world,
all the billionaires, almost allof them dropped out of college
or high school and they like hadto make it
Giuseppe Grammatico (26:55):
Mm-hmm.
Patrick Brown (26:56):
And sometimes like having too much of a
cushion can like be a bad, itcan be your detriment.
It gets you to be lazy.
You don't move as quickly.
So the fire's a good thing.
And like you don't wanna losethat fire'cause you're, that
fire's a good thing.
And like you.
Giuseppe Grammatico (27:10):
I, I, yeah, I, I agree.
I, I know when I started myfirst franchise, I signed the
franchise agreement February2nd.
Of 2007, and we found out wewere ex my wife was expecting
three days later, so that was,that was, that was my fire.
I'm like, man, I, I gotta, wegotta make, we got, we gotta
make this work.
We're on one income now.
You know, I had left my job.
But that's true.
(27:30):
The, the, this idea of focus ishuge and people are like, yeah,
I, I know you have to focus.
And then I talked to newfranchisees and they're, they
got a franchise, they got a sidehustle.
They have 20 things going on,and it's like.
That's, that's fine.
You know, you, you want todiversify, but how do you, how
do you really go a hundredpercent if you have 20, 20
different things you'rebalancing.
(27:51):
So, the power of focus is huge.
And the idea, I talk a lot aboutthe idea of owning the calendar,
putting your, your personalstuff, your rocks on the
calendar, making sure you'refocused and, you know, handling
all the personal stuff.
Like I will never miss a familyevent for work.
Work is always kind of secondright?
I get everything personal on andthen I open up the calendar.
Patrick Brown (28:11):
Yeah.
Giuseppe Grammatico (28:12):
You know, prioritize what's going on in
your life.
But, but, but secondly, focus onone thing at a time and go all
in.
Give give it all you got, getthat business up and running.
You may not need five differentside hustles and businesses if
when you go all in on one.
There, there's some there,there, there's some power there.
You, I've definitely seen somemagic when I left my job and put
aside my, you know, sold my sidebusiness and just focused on my
(28:34):
one franchise.
We grew and it wasn't like 10,20%.
We grew exponentially.
So,
Patrick Brown (28:40):
Yeah.
Giuseppe Grammatico (28:40):
that, that is, that is some great advice.
So I I greatly appreciate that.
Anything else that, that we, wedid not talk about as we, as we
wrap up the the episode,anything we did not talk about
advice or any topic we didn'tthat you'd like to share or
advice?
Patrick Brown (28:54):
Yeah, just maybe a quote I, I love that I was
just touching on what you saidis Andrew Carnegie,
Giuseppe Grammatico (28:59):
Mm-hmm.
Patrick Brown (29:00):
Carnegie, not Carnegie.
Fun, fun fact.
Giuseppe Grammatico (29:02):
Hm
Patrick Brown (29:03):
richest man of all time well, who knows
Giuseppe Grammatico (29:05):
mm-hmm.
Patrick Brown (29:05):
Musk and everybody else.
But said the way to become richis to put all your eggs in one
basket and then watch thatbasket.
He says the
Giuseppe Grammatico (29:13):
And, and, and,
Patrick Brown (29:14):
the most baskets end up breaking the most eggs in
America.
Giuseppe Grammatico (29:17):
and you said, and you said to, to watch
that basket, you said, I'msorry.
Patrick Brown (29:21):
To watch that
Giuseppe Grammatico (29:22):
Gotcha.
Patrick Brown (29:23):
like focus your energy and your talents and all
of your capital and everythingon one area and just make it
work.
You know, don't, don't get too
Giuseppe Grammatico (29:31):
Me.
Patrick Brown (29:31):
Like we, again, like, you know, humans think
they can multitask, but it'sproven that you can't.
So having that focus is gonnapropel much more success than
being too diversified.
Giuseppe Grammatico (29:42):
I love that.
You know, and he has, he is, heis definitely a very, very
successful guy.
So I, I would definitely, thoseare, those are words of wisdom.
I like that quote.
That's something I'm gonna stealand definitely use on a, on a
future episode.
But couldn't, couldn't agreemore.
But pat, I, I really I reallyappreciate your time.
This was fun.
I'm sure we'll we'll continuethis conversation.
Looking forward to, to workingwith you and yeah, we'll we'll
(30:04):
let you know.
Show, show should go live.
Go live here in a few weeks.
Patrick Brown (30:08):
Awesome.
Thanks so much.
Giuseppe Grammatico (30:09):
Thanks again.
I.
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