December 21, 2022 • 30 mins
Franchise Friday - Episode 210 Roger Ewart from America’s Swimming Pools
Experience in emerging to multi-brand International Franchise Operations, Support, Training and Development. Brick and mortar specialty retail to home service concepts.
America's Swimming Pool Company (ASP) is America's leading home-based Pool Service Franchise. I am directly responsible for the development of the brand nationally. Franchise Development Strategy, Broker Relations and Candidate Cultivation are the main functions of my duties. For the parent organization, Authority Brands, I mentor new Franchise Development team members and advise leadership on the multi-brand franchisor's strategy and tactics.
ASP - America’s Swimming Pool Company was founded in 2002 by Stewart C. Vernon in Macon, Georgia. He started ASP out of a desire to provide high-quality, honest pool services at an affordable price. Over the last two decades, ASP has met this goal (and then some) through our incredible franchisees. We’ve earned the trust of customers and have established locations across the nation. Our customers love our service because we make their pools look beautiful, last longer, and stay cleaner giving them more time to enjoy life poolside. Today, our brand is servicing pools throughout more than 400 American cities.
At ASP, our mission is to find honest, hard-working people who want to own their own business, ensuring they follow the standards that have made hundreds of business owners successful nationwide. After all, success for our locations begins with our quality as a brand. We provide our franchise owners with reliable support and offer the best resources in the industry. As a result, our locations are always ready to show customers why ASP is the most trusted pool service company in the country, and we can empower franchisees to fulfill their dreams of becoming successful business owners!
Since opening our doors in 2002, we haven’t settled with being anything but the best pool cleaning, repair, and renovation company in the nation. We’re dedicated and passionate about our work, and this translates to happy customers! Our quality service has helped our business expand out of Macon, Georgia. Since starting to franchise in 2005, we’ve gained over 100 franchisees that serve over 400 cities!
Franchise Friday, where you can watch or listen as we explore franchising, entrepreneurship, and small business ownership, speaking with the franchise industry thought leaders and subject matter experts that shape the Future Of Franchising. #FranchiseFriday – For more about our podcast, visit our website: https://futureoffranchising.com/ Produced by Franchise Source Brands International and The Entrepreneur’s Source.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Unknown (00:14):
everyone welcome back to another franchise Friday
podcast. I am Melissa Pang hereat the entrepreneur source. And
I am joined today by Roger Ewartfrom America's swimming pools.
Welcome, Roger.
Thanks for this, I appreciateyou having me on. I really
appreciate it. This is, this isa lot of fun.
(00:34):
I'm very excited for ourconversation today, you are a
wealth of knowledge, alwaysproviding value, and just
overall great to work with. Sothank you. Before we jump into
general, you know, before wejump into talking more about
franchising, and America'sswimming pools, and all of those
(00:55):
good things, can you give us alittle bit of background on
where you were before yourcurrent role? And you've had a
lot of different roles in a lotof different industries. But
what are maybe some of thethings you've done that have
really led you to where you aretoday and really allow you to
(01:15):
bring a lot of value to yourcurrent, your current role.
All right. Well, that's that's,that's a that's a long story. So
I'll keep it as brief aspossible. Thanks for the
question. So I'll just startabout 11 years ago, when I was
in corporate America, as adirector of operations for a
company, I kind of saw theTitanic getting ready to sink. I
(01:40):
was that guy who had a littlebit of foresight, I had saved up
some money, my 401k decided tocash it out and start a
business. That business, whichis in sunny Florida, broke even
on month two never looked backsince that was 11 years ago
today. But in in that same timeperiod, I entered franchising. I
(02:01):
kind of fell in love with thefranchise model although that
was not franchised. I developedand created that business from
scratch ground up and launchedit everything from marketing,
you name it, website developmentand physical build out of the
actual retail store. You know,because I just happen to have
those skills and I enjoyedworking in those capacities. And
then also, all the buying etcpricing, materials, vendors, you
(02:24):
name it, and got that up andlaunched and running. And it's
just doing great ticking alongto this day. In entering
franchising. About 11 years ago,I was brought in as a director
of support, because I've donesome business owner coaching at
about 300 owners that I'vecoached in the previous career
that I was in as a director ofoperations training. And so I
(02:47):
use those skills to help bringin new franchisees and to train
them and get them up to speedfranchise University, onboarding
and coaching them to successfinancials, you name it. The
whole schmeer of directordirecting staff support team as
well as supporting franchiseesdirectly then went into promoted
(03:07):
into a business development roleas well as strategic partners.
So help them negotiate all thevendor resources rebates and so
forth for the franchisor as wellas developed a future future
business for the franchiseesmoving on offered a role that
was a vice president ofoperations over France 800
(03:28):
franchises in 32 countries thatwas probably the most
responsibility I've ever had andit was a lot a lot of great
lessons there. Some hard onesbut mostly all good and I've
really learned what to and whatnot to do in franchising My.
(04:50):
identify what's so special aboutyour brand. It's not just about
your systems. It's not going tobe just about the fact that
you've got more whitespace Sendthe other person. It's about
your operations team. It's aboutyour support, your training, and
all these other things that youhave implemented along the way
that really create flawlessexecution for your franchisees,
(05:12):
right. So if you're, and I'll gothrough a little bit of the,
what I see as trending infranchising in a bit, but how
you build up that franchise andhow you compare yourself to
other franchise ors, which is adirect comparison model. If
you're working with a TTS coach,which are absolutely wonderful
to work with. Obviously, they'reperhaps showing multiple brands
(05:32):
and hopefully not in the samevertical as yours. But that may
happen and you have to have somedifferentiators. So identify
your differentiators right away,your strength will come from
that in the financialperformance of your actual
franchise owners, period,everybody wants to make money.
If you can't prove that thesepeople can make money, you've
got a pretty tough road pavedahead of you. So you've got to
figure that component out, youhave corporate stores, if you're
(05:53):
just starting out is a fledglingfranchise system just getting
into franchising, you're gonnahave to prove those corporate
sort of profitability back outanything that would be owner
related and include any feesthat franchisee would have to
pay. So their profitability is anet truth of what you're going
to produce. So, long story shorton that one, so going, I'll go
(06:15):
more into depth on that later.
What makes what I do at ESPAmerica, swimming pool company,
unique in this industry. I thinkit's my approach on the process.
I am obviously recently at heartand ops guys, I don't approach
franchise development the sameway salesperson would but have
the sales skills, obviously. SoI look at things and I was that
(06:36):
guy who, when I had a lot offranchises, you know, I was
handed from the developmentteam, people who are not as a
director of support, etc,operations ended people who are
not fully educated or arewoefully unprepared to actually
launch their franchise. And thatwas kind of disenchanting, of,
you know, getting those peoplefrom the sales team, off the
logistics, real estate, whateverthey may be doing. It was
(06:59):
frustrating for the team and thefranchisees struggled, my team
struggled, and the salespersongot their commission. Well, that
didn't sit well with me. So Idecided when I was going to get
back into development, I'm goingto do it right, or I'm not going
to do it at all. So incrediblywell prepared, my candidates
will end up being they arecoming up with full business
(07:19):
plans, pro formas, the wholegamut. And I set them up the
challenge, many, many challengesalong the path, I think one of
the hallmarks of what I'm doingdifferently, and my ops team
will say it out loud to anyone,they appreciate everything I'm
doing to fully prepare becausethey're launching so much
stronger and faster. And youknow, somebody said at one
(07:40):
point, I don't know that it'sscalable, you can't really keep
that going. And I said, Well,you know, I'm a quarter
Scottish, so you don't tell aScotsman you can't do something
or he'll prove you wrong everytime. And the Italian comes out,
and he's really passionate. So,you know, I looked at that and
said, This is a great challenge.
So two years running now, we'veseen double digit unit economic
(08:01):
growth. Using my plan of thatfull preparation. The operations
team, of course, loves mebecause they're getting a
franchisee who's really ready togo. And they're saving them a
lot of time and a lot ofheartache and in trouble. And
honestly, that's a great feelingto me. So that's what I call
responsible franchising. We'lltalk more about that later as
well. With ASP in particular,this brand is an essential
(08:25):
services brand, so it won't beshut down. Number one, if
anything ever happens, again,like has happened in the last
few years of our lives, which ishorrible gutter, we'll see it
again, don't want to participatein that again, as anyone
wouldn't want to. And also it'srecession resistant. The
attorneys say we can't sayrecession proof. And that's
true. Okay, it's recessionresistant. And so we went
(08:46):
through the last economicdownturn at Oh 809. And our
franchisees were not horriblyaffected, adversely affected by
that on a financial basis. Sowith that, it brings me great
competence in order to say hey,you're, you're presenting
something that's really aterrific insulated brand, the
most that I can possibly presentto you. So it's a central
(09:07):
service brand that will continueto feed your, your, your
clients, if you're a DTS coachlistening to this, or if you're
a franchisor. I think about yourmodel and how effective it will
be to you know, if you'reworking a franchise, you have
this partner who's invested aton of money in your business,
or they're going to survive adownturn, right. And that's your
(09:30):
responsibility as a franchisorto ensure that they're going to
see it through. So ASP is theleading pool franchise
maintenance, cleaning repairservice, renovation and
construction franchise in ourspace. We've got approximately
389 units established with over140 owners at this point, I see
(09:51):
it as having about 200 more,maybe 250 more units to go and
then I'm going to take the brandinternationals, the goal so
we're looking forward to doingthat. And that's, that's coming
sooner than later. You know thatthe unique thing about this
brand, it's on two and a halfacres, you know 13 pools indoor
(10:12):
training is a massive facilitywith a ton of trainers, people
support for people marketing atthe brand level alone, not even
speaking about authority brandspower with their, you know, very
powerful marketing machine thatthey have, which is our parent
company. And it owns 12 brands,which are all home service
brands, by the way. So ourfranchisees can also look into
(10:34):
partnering with our other localfranchise companies that we own,
and, and trade those customersback and forth. So I think
that's a another thing thatmakes us stand out from the
crowd. Systems, of course, youknow, we have our own
proprietary software, we don'tuse a third party. So we control
completely what the softwaredoes, there's no third party
that's selling the same exactplatform are being used by our
(10:56):
competitors. So that's not a oneto one. And so, you know, carve
out your uniqueness, I think iswhat the story is here. So, I
think that helps define a bitmore about ASP and why it's,
it's unique. And I also want toreflect upon what I love so much
about working with TDs, and, andso forth. And number one,
(11:18):
Melissa, number two, Jackie,number three of the coaches.
And, Melissa, you can you can,you know, buy me a glass of wine
next time we see it, but nokidding, I just think you folks
are terrific, I love theapproach of the coaches, the
educational approach are, youknow, you really want to educate
them thoroughly. And as an opsguy that kind of speaks to my
(11:39):
heart, because you really, trulywant to serve the best interest
of the client, which ultimatelywill serve the best interests of
the franchisor. So with thatbeing said, you know, when I see
for franchising, coming forward,obviously, the direction of
franchising in general, I liketo talk about, first of all, the
(12:01):
lifecycle of what I'm seeing atrend in the last 1015 years. So
what's changed in franchisingover the last 10 years,
4000 5000 more franchiseconcepts, that's the big thing
that's changed, right? We'vealso seen, you know, franchise
sales organizations, we've seenprivate equity insert themselves
into franchising referralnetworks, such as t e s, coming
(12:24):
in, and so forth. And so, youknow, as that relates to,
really, when we're talking aboutthe lifecycle of a franchisor,
let's just pretend for a second,you're a company that wants to
franchise and you're afledgling, as I would call it,
you're literally just out of theegg. And you've got maybe a few
corporate units, maybe a coupleof franchise units, and you're
(12:46):
really getting on to okay, Iwant to get serious about this
and then you turn into a microemerging, you may be scooped up
by a, a private equity firm ornot affirm themselves, but multi
brand franchisor, who is lookingto help develop develop you,
more than likely you'll probablyin the emerging area, if that
should happen.
(13:06):
Some pros and cons there,obviously founder, so I'll speak
to you about that, obviously,you're gonna give up piece of
your equity or your equityposition, and most likely have a
buyout, right, and so you'll getabout half of your money, and
then half later when you hityour goal, and about two years
or so. So keep those things inmind when you're negotiating
those kinds of terms andconditions with any any multi
(13:27):
brand franchisor, who's lookingto acquire you, obviously, you
know, and as you grow throughthat emerging area, you then
start to mature and I see thatas about 50 to 60 units. And
you're you're not depending uponany franchise fees any longer
for hand to mouth to keep yourfranchise system going, you
ultimately shouldn't be lookingat needing franchise fees,
(13:51):
really, other than for buildingthe business, and so forth and
getting more people moreoperational past about 40 units.
And that's my sole opinion. Byway, everybody has a different
opinion on that. When you get toabout 100 units, that's when you
become unsure. In my mind. Mostfranchises don't make it past 20
units. So if you can get past 20units, you're on the right
(14:13):
track. If you're struggling, youcan't get past a 20 unit point,
that's when you need to reachout to these multiband
franchisors to see if there'ssomebody who may be interested
in partnering with you if you'vekind of run out of gas, if you
will. And you need thatexpertise in that help to get to
the next level, whether it beoperational, you know, the sales
systems, they've got systems ingeneral, vendor relation,
(14:35):
negotiation power, becausethat's a big thing that
authority brands offers is thatability to have 12 brands 1000.
You know, franchises under ourbelts, we can negotiate terms on
things that most people can'tand the single small franchise.
And then past that point, Ithink about two to 300 years in
what's called in my mind alegacy business in a franchise.
(14:58):
That's when you're kind of thebee's knees and business and
you're like what's next. Andthat's when you can look at
going to multi International,whatever you want to do, you
know, Master licensed partnersand in foreign countries etc,
which can be very tricky. And Iknow enough about that if Amy
wants more details reach out tome privately, I'll share the
good bad the ugly there. AndArea Development, which there's
(15:22):
also pros and cons behind thosethings. So I hope that helps to
to paint a little bit of thewhat I see in franchising in the
trends. And you know, as far asthe future what I see, you know,
135 10 years down the road, Iactually see potential PE held
(15:43):
brands possibly going backprivate, and or perhaps going
public. Interestingly enough,why is that? I think it's a
trend right now. And I think Ithink that there's going to be
some breaking off of that, Ithink that other interest groups
are going to start seeing thatconglomerates don't always work,
(16:05):
to the best interests of thewhole, right. And that sometimes
more focused energies for thatone company to develop maybe
best, its pros and cons behindit. Because you know, the larger
an organization gets the hairierthings get no matter what
organization you're talkingabout, whether it's IBM or GE or
any of these big companies, andpeople just get lost in the mix,
(16:26):
right? When there are 1000s ofpeople. So there's that
component, whereas a founderlistening to this who's just
started, his franchise justemerged, and he's got up to two
300 units, or whatever he or shemay do. They feel like, you
know, where did this thing comefrom? And why what did we lose
along the path? What do we haveto sacrifice or acquiesce on or
(16:47):
give up in order to get to thatnext level? And oh, boy, do I
want these components back. Anda lot of people have that. And
it could just be an exit of afounder at that point, say,
okay, adios, you guys have thisand take my baby and go go
married off to somebody else atthis point. Right? That does
happen. There's all differentpaths. Questions.
(17:09):
So I have, again, like I said,at the beginning, you are a
wealth of knowledge. And I wouldlove to pick your brain about
all of these topics, a fewthings that I wanted to touch
on. You mentioned responsiblefranchising, which I think
should become a trending phrase.
Because in that vein of youknow, we're talking private
(17:33):
equity and different groups, andthere's a lot of different paths
that I franchise can take afranchise zoar can take to grow,
but which one is going to beright for the brand? And also
within that franchise? How areyou taking the responsibility to
grow the right way, because atthe end of the day, it's not
(17:56):
just a franchise and a company,you're bringing in individuals
who are putting oftentimes lifesavings on the line, and you're
asking them to invest in yourbrand. What are you doing to
again, responsibly grow, so theygrow with you? And that's where
you see the success storiescome, but where can you how can
(18:18):
you have more of that so on ifyou want to say anything more
about that responsiblefranchising piece, but I want to
mention to just the fact that wework so well together our two
networks is you take that thefirst call that you have with
the candidate is education,you're prepping that like it's
not like the relationship as afranchisee starts when they get
(18:39):
passed off to the operationalteam. It starts with the sales
team, the development team, andthen I would take that a step
further and say thatrelationship starts with our
coaches. They're starting tonurture them figure out their
why their pain points, theirmotivators, where they are,
where they want to go to, andthen they bring them to you you
continue you know, so it's thiswhole it's not just these starts
(18:59):
and stops and transactionalthings.
I understand you're spot onMelissa, them and people need to
listen to that more likefrankly, and I'll just reinforce
everything you said with maybe alittle different color added
color to it if you if you'reokay with that. Perfect. So,
(19:22):
again speaking to franchisorsman develop your franchises
responsibly. I coined thatphrase here at authority brands
and you want to go and repeat itfeel free. I don't care. I mean,
I'm proud to have to havebrought that to any any
franchise that I've been with.
You know, and my, my, my goldenrule or quote that I'll give you
(19:42):
is don't ever Chase $1 Or aperson chase the right thing,
and the people and money willcome to you. That's my advice.
So education is the key. Okay.
Couple different levels I'mgoing to talk about at the
franchisor level and at thecandidate level All, you know, I
do a heck of a lot ofpreparation on the candidate
(20:04):
level from the development teamdemand from your development
team that this goes on. It's notcomplex, get them into the ops
people's roles, make them gothrough what the day in the life
of an ops person at thefranchisor level is like and
send them out into the field andwork with the franchisee make
them understand a day in thelife so they can truly bring
people along to your ops teamthat are going to be the right
(20:26):
fit, number one, number two,they're gonna be really fully
prepared and have complete buyin there's no meat your team of
the day will be decision day notmeet your team date for giggles.
Right. And and you know, then onthe franchisors side, in the
light of education is key hereand Melissa franchisors, go get
(20:47):
your CFP, if you're a FranchiseExecutive, I am not being paid
by IFA to say that I'm tellingyou right now it was a life
changer for me in my career, payfor it through your company and
pay for it for your people, inanyone in a management role in
your company, you're gonna see agreat transformation make that
investment in your people.
That's my advice.
(21:08):
I love that I am disclaimer onthis. You're hearing it here, I
still don't have my CFP and Ihave like completed it
partially, and I need to dothat. So thank you, Roger, I'm
now gonna go finish that up. Buteducation being key. And I like
that you split it into the twoparts. It's not just candidate
(21:29):
education. It's also franchisoreducation. So going back to ops
and development ops and sales,oftentimes developers are just
work in silos. It's like, Hello,yes. All like all the time,
probably in our own company. Youknow, you're saying sales team
is saying this. And ops team issaying this. And caught in the
(21:51):
middle are often the candidatesor the clients or whoever it is
confused. And so that's anexcellent point. Right there.
And then also on the franchisorside with education, I would add
to that in light of what we'retalking about the future of
franchising, how brands aregoing to be growing, where
that's going. Take time as afranchisor, to educate yourself
(22:15):
on the different ways to developyour brand, again, the right
way. Every brand is different.
It's not you can't just look atone franchise that's taken off,
and, you know, sold 300 units inone year and say whatever they
did, I'm going to do that. YouYou just don't know everything
else that's going on in there.
(22:37):
And I don't want to speak anymore to that. But educate
yourself.
No, it's it's very poignant. AndI can tell you right now, you
know, you hit on a key note withme, which was ops versus sales.
Remember, I've been both guys.
Yep. Okay, so isn't that fun?
Right? You're not going to finda freak of nature like that. You
(22:59):
are Steve both right, which iswhy I'm encouraging everybody to
go do both roles. Right? Or makeyour teams play nice together.
So there's a very importantpoint here. And by the way, have
your operations people try tosell a franchise right? Okay,
good luck with that right? Noweverybody in operations sells
for a living why they have toconvince them somebody to do
(23:19):
something that they typicallynaturally wouldn't want to do ie
a franchise following a plan anddoing this meticulously, right?
So they're really all are all inin influencer roles I call not
sales, but influencer roles. Sothe reason for young franchisors
in which you're failing todevelop, if you are failing to
develop is the that you don'thave an understanding of how to
(23:42):
make that dot Connect. Right?
You're not forcing your teammembers to play along nicely.
Without somebody complaining sobadly that they want the other
person gone. Whatever else No,you kids will play in the
sandbox together, we're going tobuild the same Castle gathering
this is what's gonna look like.
And so it's, it's you have tolook at them like, like,
children in not a child sense.
But in that the you're grooming,you're mentoring, you're guiding
(24:03):
you're coaching, you're trainingyour people and I think if you
start there with your people,that will lead right down to the
people that TTS bring to you asthey enter your system. And that
seamless transition from and offfrom ops or from sales or
development ops will occur.
You're gonna be much happierfranchisor
(24:26):
I hope everyone was taking notesbecause just in this like, what
20 minutes I feel you've droppedsome some gold nuggets here. And
what was the other thing Iwanted to say? I lost it. Hold
on. Hold on while I bring itback. It's gone. Oh, man, um,
(24:56):
but when? Okay, so I'll just Toreiterate this as well, and
again, why you, Roger, andAmerica swimming pools and the
entrepreneurs have worked sowell together is when you were
talking about uniquedifferentiators and what sets
you apart in your industry infranchising, you didn't talk
(25:20):
about features and benefits youdidn't talk about, well, we use
this type of equipment, we usethis type of uniform and this
type of vehicle, and all thesethings. That's important. But
those are the details. It'sabout those the differentiators
were your support your training,how are you helping your
(25:42):
franchisee? All these are thingswe have something that we say L
we income, lifestyle, wealthequity, what are your brand
differentiators around income,lifestyle, wealth, equity is
just another way of looking atit. But what are your
differentiators around thosefour key components? Because
that's what we talk to theclients about what are your
goals? So if a franchise canthen say, these are my
(26:05):
differentiators, this is how Ican help you meet your goals
around these four things, thenit really does like, match up.
Right? Andwhat are we doing here? Long
term, right? That's, that's thebig reason we're doing this.
They're investing in this to geta return. They don't just want
to be your franchisee for thenext 150 years. Right? That's
not realistic. We're doing 10year agreements, typically here
(26:25):
on average, and, you know, andtwo things. I don't want to
forget to talk about processes,clear processes. That was very
important, right? So somethingI'm a checklist kind of guy,
right? Dad was navy. So I grewup with checklists on the
fridge. I joked with you aboutthat earlier before this, and
you know, every boy had a choreand you did it here, you checked
(26:46):
it off here and you got dessertif you've finished right? Every
day. So I present everycandidate with a checklist
that's like super clear, they'reeducated adults, and not gonna
insult their intelligence theyself grade as they go, right.
But it's a great indicator, ifyou don't have that, that you're
probably not very organized inthe first impression you're
giving from your yourdevelopment person is not a
(27:08):
great organization. So how doesthat translate into the future
of your franchise? So have clearprocesses that you lay out? I
think that's a key component.
Excellent. Again, I'm going towrap this up, but so many good,
just pieces of information for afranchisor I think in any stage
and I know we only touched on,you know, the different stages
(27:31):
of fledgling to micro merging toemerging and of course, we can
get more into detail people canreach out to you. Individually,
I have to have my two finalquestions for you. One, where
can people find you? And to whatwould you recommend what's like
a book or podcast or even justif you want to finish off with a
(27:52):
quote for the people you havethrowing?
See? You want to?
I don't? Not sure if you haveum, I think one of the best
books I am a CFP, as you know,and I give back to franchising
in that I actually help overseethe CFP courses now the testing
and I think one of the best onesthat I that I had taken was
(28:15):
actually I think I had the bookright but
for those who aren't watchingRoger has a massive bookshelf
behind him. SUPing finest. He'sgoing to find the book this life
changing book that we will allbe ordering off Amazon
(28:36):
Greg Nathan, great guy, awesomeAustralia accent he was a rather
bitter franchisee that turnedinto a franchisor great guy.
Profitable partnerships. I thinkthat's a good one for all
franchisors to read a little bitleaning toward the franchisee
perspective, but that's okay.
Right. You got to you got to,you know, see all sides of it. I
(28:58):
think that's a really valuableone. I've got so many books up
there. I don't know where towhere to begin with it. As far
as franchising is concerned. Ithink that's one of the better
ones that I think everyfranchisor should read. In
their, their path to it. Thatwas a book What else was what
was the other question? I'msorry.
The other one was just where canwe where can people find you?
(29:22):
website.
They can look me up on LinkedIn.
I have two profiles. The onewith a million connections is
the one that's my real one. Ijust have one that is for folks
that want to abuse me onLinkedIn. So if you're
Roger, go if you want to seewhat he's actually done and and
follow along with hisaccomplishments go to the the
(29:44):
million follower one.
Yeah. And if you do want to senda connection request, please put
a note in there. Don't just sendthe request. If I don't know who
you are, please just send me asimple note saw you on the
podcast with Melissa love toconnect and I'm happy to talk
with you anytime.
Yeah, Roger Stone I answered myconnect request. So good luck
out there, everyone. I knowthat's not true. I'm just
(30:08):
kidding. You're anabsolute joy to work with
Melissa. You really are. Ireally am your relationship.
Thank you for having me.
Thank you so much. Roger.
America's swimming pools islucky to have you. Thank you so
much for joining me today. Allright.
everyone welcome back to another franchise Friday
podcast. I am Melissa Pang hereat the entrepreneur source. And
I am joined today by Roger Ewartfrom America's swimming pools.
Welcome, Roger.
Thanks for this, I appreciateyou having me on. I really
appreciate it. This is, this isa lot of fun.
(00:34):
I'm very excited for ourconversation today, you are a
wealth of knowledge, alwaysproviding value, and just
overall great to work with. Sothank you. Before we jump into
general, you know, before wejump into talking more about
franchising, and America'sswimming pools, and all of those
(00:55):
good things, can you give us alittle bit of background on
where you were before yourcurrent role? And you've had a
lot of different roles in a lotof different industries. But
what are maybe some of thethings you've done that have
really led you to where you aretoday and really allow you to
(01:15):
bring a lot of value to yourcurrent, your current role.
All right. Well, that's that's,that's a that's a long story. So
I'll keep it as brief aspossible. Thanks for the
question. So I'll just startabout 11 years ago, when I was
in corporate America, as adirector of operations for a
company, I kind of saw theTitanic getting ready to sink. I
(01:40):
was that guy who had a littlebit of foresight, I had saved up
some money, my 401k decided tocash it out and start a
business. That business, whichis in sunny Florida, broke even
on month two never looked backsince that was 11 years ago
today. But in in that same timeperiod, I entered franchising. I
(02:01):
kind of fell in love with thefranchise model although that
was not franchised. I developedand created that business from
scratch ground up and launchedit everything from marketing,
you name it, website developmentand physical build out of the
actual retail store. You know,because I just happen to have
those skills and I enjoyedworking in those capacities. And
then also, all the buying etcpricing, materials, vendors, you
(02:24):
name it, and got that up andlaunched and running. And it's
just doing great ticking alongto this day. In entering
franchising. About 11 years ago,I was brought in as a director
of support, because I've donesome business owner coaching at
about 300 owners that I'vecoached in the previous career
that I was in as a director ofoperations training. And so I
(02:47):
use those skills to help bringin new franchisees and to train
them and get them up to speedfranchise University, onboarding
and coaching them to successfinancials, you name it. The
whole schmeer of directordirecting staff support team as
well as supporting franchiseesdirectly then went into promoted
(03:07):
into a business development roleas well as strategic partners.
So help them negotiate all thevendor resources rebates and so
forth for the franchisor as wellas developed a future future
business for the franchiseesmoving on offered a role that
was a vice president ofoperations over France 800
(03:28):
franchises in 32 countries thatwas probably the most
responsibility I've ever had andit was a lot a lot of great
lessons there. Some hard onesbut mostly all good and I've
really learned what to and whatnot to do in franchising My.
(04:50):
identify what's so special aboutyour brand. It's not just about
your systems. It's not going tobe just about the fact that
you've got more whitespace Sendthe other person. It's about
your operations team. It's aboutyour support, your training, and
all these other things that youhave implemented along the way
that really create flawlessexecution for your franchisees,
(05:12):
right. So if you're, and I'll gothrough a little bit of the,
what I see as trending infranchising in a bit, but how
you build up that franchise andhow you compare yourself to
other franchise ors, which is adirect comparison model. If
you're working with a TTS coach,which are absolutely wonderful
to work with. Obviously, they'reperhaps showing multiple brands
(05:32):
and hopefully not in the samevertical as yours. But that may
happen and you have to have somedifferentiators. So identify
your differentiators right away,your strength will come from
that in the financialperformance of your actual
franchise owners, period,everybody wants to make money.
If you can't prove that thesepeople can make money, you've
got a pretty tough road pavedahead of you. So you've got to
figure that component out, youhave corporate stores, if you're
(05:53):
just starting out is a fledglingfranchise system just getting
into franchising, you're gonnahave to prove those corporate
sort of profitability back outanything that would be owner
related and include any feesthat franchisee would have to
pay. So their profitability is anet truth of what you're going
to produce. So, long story shorton that one, so going, I'll go
(06:15):
more into depth on that later.
What makes what I do at ESPAmerica, swimming pool company,
unique in this industry. I thinkit's my approach on the process.
I am obviously recently at heartand ops guys, I don't approach
franchise development the sameway salesperson would but have
the sales skills, obviously. SoI look at things and I was that
(06:36):
guy who, when I had a lot offranchises, you know, I was
handed from the developmentteam, people who are not as a
director of support, etc,operations ended people who are
not fully educated or arewoefully unprepared to actually
launch their franchise. And thatwas kind of disenchanting, of,
you know, getting those peoplefrom the sales team, off the
logistics, real estate, whateverthey may be doing. It was
(06:59):
frustrating for the team and thefranchisees struggled, my team
struggled, and the salespersongot their commission. Well, that
didn't sit well with me. So Idecided when I was going to get
back into development, I'm goingto do it right, or I'm not going
to do it at all. So incrediblywell prepared, my candidates
will end up being they arecoming up with full business
(07:19):
plans, pro formas, the wholegamut. And I set them up the
challenge, many, many challengesalong the path, I think one of
the hallmarks of what I'm doingdifferently, and my ops team
will say it out loud to anyone,they appreciate everything I'm
doing to fully prepare becausethey're launching so much
stronger and faster. And youknow, somebody said at one
(07:40):
point, I don't know that it'sscalable, you can't really keep
that going. And I said, Well,you know, I'm a quarter
Scottish, so you don't tell aScotsman you can't do something
or he'll prove you wrong everytime. And the Italian comes out,
and he's really passionate. So,you know, I looked at that and
said, This is a great challenge.
So two years running now, we'veseen double digit unit economic
(08:01):
growth. Using my plan of thatfull preparation. The operations
team, of course, loves mebecause they're getting a
franchisee who's really ready togo. And they're saving them a
lot of time and a lot ofheartache and in trouble. And
honestly, that's a great feelingto me. So that's what I call
responsible franchising. We'lltalk more about that later as
well. With ASP in particular,this brand is an essential
(08:25):
services brand, so it won't beshut down. Number one, if
anything ever happens, again,like has happened in the last
few years of our lives, which ishorrible gutter, we'll see it
again, don't want to participatein that again, as anyone
wouldn't want to. And also it'srecession resistant. The
attorneys say we can't sayrecession proof. And that's
true. Okay, it's recessionresistant. And so we went
(08:46):
through the last economicdownturn at Oh 809. And our
franchisees were not horriblyaffected, adversely affected by
that on a financial basis. Sowith that, it brings me great
competence in order to say hey,you're, you're presenting
something that's really aterrific insulated brand, the
most that I can possibly presentto you. So it's a central
(09:07):
service brand that will continueto feed your, your, your
clients, if you're a DTS coachlistening to this, or if you're
a franchisor. I think about yourmodel and how effective it will
be to you know, if you'reworking a franchise, you have
this partner who's invested aton of money in your business,
or they're going to survive adownturn, right. And that's your
(09:30):
responsibility as a franchisorto ensure that they're going to
see it through. So ASP is theleading pool franchise
maintenance, cleaning repairservice, renovation and
construction franchise in ourspace. We've got approximately
389 units established with over140 owners at this point, I see
(09:51):
it as having about 200 more,maybe 250 more units to go and
then I'm going to take the brandinternationals, the goal so
we're looking forward to doingthat. And that's, that's coming
sooner than later. You know thatthe unique thing about this
brand, it's on two and a halfacres, you know 13 pools indoor
(10:12):
training is a massive facilitywith a ton of trainers, people
support for people marketing atthe brand level alone, not even
speaking about authority brandspower with their, you know, very
powerful marketing machine thatthey have, which is our parent
company. And it owns 12 brands,which are all home service
brands, by the way. So ourfranchisees can also look into
(10:34):
partnering with our other localfranchise companies that we own,
and, and trade those customersback and forth. So I think
that's a another thing thatmakes us stand out from the
crowd. Systems, of course, youknow, we have our own
proprietary software, we don'tuse a third party. So we control
completely what the softwaredoes, there's no third party
that's selling the same exactplatform are being used by our
(10:56):
competitors. So that's not a oneto one. And so, you know, carve
out your uniqueness, I think iswhat the story is here. So, I
think that helps define a bitmore about ASP and why it's,
it's unique. And I also want toreflect upon what I love so much
about working with TDs, and, andso forth. And number one,
(11:18):
Melissa, number two, Jackie,number three of the coaches.
And, Melissa, you can you can,you know, buy me a glass of wine
next time we see it, but nokidding, I just think you folks
are terrific, I love theapproach of the coaches, the
educational approach are, youknow, you really want to educate
them thoroughly. And as an opsguy that kind of speaks to my
(11:39):
heart, because you really, trulywant to serve the best interest
of the client, which ultimatelywill serve the best interests of
the franchisor. So with thatbeing said, you know, when I see
for franchising, coming forward,obviously, the direction of
franchising in general, I liketo talk about, first of all, the
(12:01):
lifecycle of what I'm seeing atrend in the last 1015 years. So
what's changed in franchisingover the last 10 years,
4000 5000 more franchiseconcepts, that's the big thing
that's changed, right? We'vealso seen, you know, franchise
sales organizations, we've seenprivate equity insert themselves
into franchising referralnetworks, such as t e s, coming
(12:24):
in, and so forth. And so, youknow, as that relates to,
really, when we're talking aboutthe lifecycle of a franchisor,
let's just pretend for a second,you're a company that wants to
franchise and you're afledgling, as I would call it,
you're literally just out of theegg. And you've got maybe a few
corporate units, maybe a coupleof franchise units, and you're
(12:46):
really getting on to okay, Iwant to get serious about this
and then you turn into a microemerging, you may be scooped up
by a, a private equity firm ornot affirm themselves, but multi
brand franchisor, who is lookingto help develop develop you,
more than likely you'll probablyin the emerging area, if that
should happen.
(13:06):
Some pros and cons there,obviously founder, so I'll speak
to you about that, obviously,you're gonna give up piece of
your equity or your equityposition, and most likely have a
buyout, right, and so you'll getabout half of your money, and
then half later when you hityour goal, and about two years
or so. So keep those things inmind when you're negotiating
those kinds of terms andconditions with any any multi
(13:27):
brand franchisor, who's lookingto acquire you, obviously, you
know, and as you grow throughthat emerging area, you then
start to mature and I see thatas about 50 to 60 units. And
you're you're not depending uponany franchise fees any longer
for hand to mouth to keep yourfranchise system going, you
ultimately shouldn't be lookingat needing franchise fees,
(13:51):
really, other than for buildingthe business, and so forth and
getting more people moreoperational past about 40 units.
And that's my sole opinion. Byway, everybody has a different
opinion on that. When you get toabout 100 units, that's when you
become unsure. In my mind. Mostfranchises don't make it past 20
units. So if you can get past 20units, you're on the right
(14:13):
track. If you're struggling, youcan't get past a 20 unit point,
that's when you need to reachout to these multiband
franchisors to see if there'ssomebody who may be interested
in partnering with you if you'vekind of run out of gas, if you
will. And you need thatexpertise in that help to get to
the next level, whether it beoperational, you know, the sales
systems, they've got systems ingeneral, vendor relation,
(14:35):
negotiation power, becausethat's a big thing that
authority brands offers is thatability to have 12 brands 1000.
You know, franchises under ourbelts, we can negotiate terms on
things that most people can'tand the single small franchise.
And then past that point, Ithink about two to 300 years in
what's called in my mind alegacy business in a franchise.
(14:58):
That's when you're kind of thebee's knees and business and
you're like what's next. Andthat's when you can look at
going to multi International,whatever you want to do, you
know, Master licensed partnersand in foreign countries etc,
which can be very tricky. And Iknow enough about that if Amy
wants more details reach out tome privately, I'll share the
good bad the ugly there. AndArea Development, which there's
(15:22):
also pros and cons behind thosethings. So I hope that helps to
to paint a little bit of thewhat I see in franchising in the
trends. And you know, as far asthe future what I see, you know,
135 10 years down the road, Iactually see potential PE held
(15:43):
brands possibly going backprivate, and or perhaps going
public. Interestingly enough,why is that? I think it's a
trend right now. And I think Ithink that there's going to be
some breaking off of that, Ithink that other interest groups
are going to start seeing thatconglomerates don't always work,
(16:05):
to the best interests of thewhole, right. And that sometimes
more focused energies for thatone company to develop maybe
best, its pros and cons behindit. Because you know, the larger
an organization gets the hairierthings get no matter what
organization you're talkingabout, whether it's IBM or GE or
any of these big companies, andpeople just get lost in the mix,
(16:26):
right? When there are 1000s ofpeople. So there's that
component, whereas a founderlistening to this who's just
started, his franchise justemerged, and he's got up to two
300 units, or whatever he or shemay do. They feel like, you
know, where did this thing comefrom? And why what did we lose
along the path? What do we haveto sacrifice or acquiesce on or
(16:47):
give up in order to get to thatnext level? And oh, boy, do I
want these components back. Anda lot of people have that. And
it could just be an exit of afounder at that point, say,
okay, adios, you guys have thisand take my baby and go go
married off to somebody else atthis point. Right? That does
happen. There's all differentpaths. Questions.
(17:09):
So I have, again, like I said,at the beginning, you are a
wealth of knowledge. And I wouldlove to pick your brain about
all of these topics, a fewthings that I wanted to touch
on. You mentioned responsiblefranchising, which I think
should become a trending phrase.
Because in that vein of youknow, we're talking private
(17:33):
equity and different groups, andthere's a lot of different paths
that I franchise can take afranchise zoar can take to grow,
but which one is going to beright for the brand? And also
within that franchise? How areyou taking the responsibility to
grow the right way, because atthe end of the day, it's not
(17:56):
just a franchise and a company,you're bringing in individuals
who are putting oftentimes lifesavings on the line, and you're
asking them to invest in yourbrand. What are you doing to
again, responsibly grow, so theygrow with you? And that's where
you see the success storiescome, but where can you how can
(18:18):
you have more of that so on ifyou want to say anything more
about that responsiblefranchising piece, but I want to
mention to just the fact that wework so well together our two
networks is you take that thefirst call that you have with
the candidate is education,you're prepping that like it's
not like the relationship as afranchisee starts when they get
(18:39):
passed off to the operationalteam. It starts with the sales
team, the development team, andthen I would take that a step
further and say thatrelationship starts with our
coaches. They're starting tonurture them figure out their
why their pain points, theirmotivators, where they are,
where they want to go to, andthen they bring them to you you
continue you know, so it's thiswhole it's not just these starts
(18:59):
and stops and transactionalthings.
I understand you're spot onMelissa, them and people need to
listen to that more likefrankly, and I'll just reinforce
everything you said with maybe alittle different color added
color to it if you if you'reokay with that. Perfect. So,
(19:22):
again speaking to franchisorsman develop your franchises
responsibly. I coined thatphrase here at authority brands
and you want to go and repeat itfeel free. I don't care. I mean,
I'm proud to have to havebrought that to any any
franchise that I've been with.
You know, and my, my, my goldenrule or quote that I'll give you
(19:42):
is don't ever Chase $1 Or aperson chase the right thing,
and the people and money willcome to you. That's my advice.
So education is the key. Okay.
Couple different levels I'mgoing to talk about at the
franchisor level and at thecandidate level All, you know, I
do a heck of a lot ofpreparation on the candidate
(20:04):
level from the development teamdemand from your development
team that this goes on. It's notcomplex, get them into the ops
people's roles, make them gothrough what the day in the life
of an ops person at thefranchisor level is like and
send them out into the field andwork with the franchisee make
them understand a day in thelife so they can truly bring
people along to your ops teamthat are going to be the right
(20:26):
fit, number one, number two,they're gonna be really fully
prepared and have complete buyin there's no meat your team of
the day will be decision day notmeet your team date for giggles.
Right. And and you know, then onthe franchisors side, in the
light of education is key hereand Melissa franchisors, go get
(20:47):
your CFP, if you're a FranchiseExecutive, I am not being paid
by IFA to say that I'm tellingyou right now it was a life
changer for me in my career, payfor it through your company and
pay for it for your people, inanyone in a management role in
your company, you're gonna see agreat transformation make that
investment in your people.
That's my advice.
(21:08):
I love that I am disclaimer onthis. You're hearing it here, I
still don't have my CFP and Ihave like completed it
partially, and I need to dothat. So thank you, Roger, I'm
now gonna go finish that up. Buteducation being key. And I like
that you split it into the twoparts. It's not just candidate
(21:29):
education. It's also franchisoreducation. So going back to ops
and development ops and sales,oftentimes developers are just
work in silos. It's like, Hello,yes. All like all the time,
probably in our own company. Youknow, you're saying sales team
is saying this. And ops team issaying this. And caught in the
(21:51):
middle are often the candidatesor the clients or whoever it is
confused. And so that's anexcellent point. Right there.
And then also on the franchisorside with education, I would add
to that in light of what we'retalking about the future of
franchising, how brands aregoing to be growing, where
that's going. Take time as afranchisor, to educate yourself
(22:15):
on the different ways to developyour brand, again, the right
way. Every brand is different.
It's not you can't just look atone franchise that's taken off,
and, you know, sold 300 units inone year and say whatever they
did, I'm going to do that. YouYou just don't know everything
else that's going on in there.
(22:37):
And I don't want to speak anymore to that. But educate
yourself.
No, it's it's very poignant. AndI can tell you right now, you
know, you hit on a key note withme, which was ops versus sales.
Remember, I've been both guys.
Yep. Okay, so isn't that fun?
Right? You're not going to finda freak of nature like that. You
(22:59):
are Steve both right, which iswhy I'm encouraging everybody to
go do both roles. Right? Or makeyour teams play nice together.
So there's a very importantpoint here. And by the way, have
your operations people try tosell a franchise right? Okay,
good luck with that right? Noweverybody in operations sells
for a living why they have toconvince them somebody to do
(23:19):
something that they typicallynaturally wouldn't want to do ie
a franchise following a plan anddoing this meticulously, right?
So they're really all are all inin influencer roles I call not
sales, but influencer roles. Sothe reason for young franchisors
in which you're failing todevelop, if you are failing to
develop is the that you don'thave an understanding of how to
(23:42):
make that dot Connect. Right?
You're not forcing your teammembers to play along nicely.
Without somebody complaining sobadly that they want the other
person gone. Whatever else No,you kids will play in the
sandbox together, we're going tobuild the same Castle gathering
this is what's gonna look like.
And so it's, it's you have tolook at them like, like,
children in not a child sense.
But in that the you're grooming,you're mentoring, you're guiding
(24:03):
you're coaching, you're trainingyour people and I think if you
start there with your people,that will lead right down to the
people that TTS bring to you asthey enter your system. And that
seamless transition from and offfrom ops or from sales or
development ops will occur.
You're gonna be much happierfranchisor
(24:26):
I hope everyone was taking notesbecause just in this like, what
20 minutes I feel you've droppedsome some gold nuggets here. And
what was the other thing Iwanted to say? I lost it. Hold
on. Hold on while I bring itback. It's gone. Oh, man, um,
(24:56):
but when? Okay, so I'll just Toreiterate this as well, and
again, why you, Roger, andAmerica swimming pools and the
entrepreneurs have worked sowell together is when you were
talking about uniquedifferentiators and what sets
you apart in your industry infranchising, you didn't talk
(25:20):
about features and benefits youdidn't talk about, well, we use
this type of equipment, we usethis type of uniform and this
type of vehicle, and all thesethings. That's important. But
those are the details. It'sabout those the differentiators
were your support your training,how are you helping your
(25:42):
franchisee? All these are thingswe have something that we say L
we income, lifestyle, wealthequity, what are your brand
differentiators around income,lifestyle, wealth, equity is
just another way of looking atit. But what are your
differentiators around thosefour key components? Because
that's what we talk to theclients about what are your
goals? So if a franchise canthen say, these are my
(26:05):
differentiators, this is how Ican help you meet your goals
around these four things, thenit really does like, match up.
Right? Andwhat are we doing here? Long
term, right? That's, that's thebig reason we're doing this.
They're investing in this to geta return. They don't just want
to be your franchisee for thenext 150 years. Right? That's
not realistic. We're doing 10year agreements, typically here
(26:25):
on average, and, you know, andtwo things. I don't want to
forget to talk about processes,clear processes. That was very
important, right? So somethingI'm a checklist kind of guy,
right? Dad was navy. So I grewup with checklists on the
fridge. I joked with you aboutthat earlier before this, and
you know, every boy had a choreand you did it here, you checked
(26:46):
it off here and you got dessertif you've finished right? Every
day. So I present everycandidate with a checklist
that's like super clear, they'reeducated adults, and not gonna
insult their intelligence theyself grade as they go, right.
But it's a great indicator, ifyou don't have that, that you're
probably not very organized inthe first impression you're
giving from your yourdevelopment person is not a
(27:08):
great organization. So how doesthat translate into the future
of your franchise? So have clearprocesses that you lay out? I
think that's a key component.
Excellent. Again, I'm going towrap this up, but so many good,
just pieces of information for afranchisor I think in any stage
and I know we only touched on,you know, the different stages
(27:31):
of fledgling to micro merging toemerging and of course, we can
get more into detail people canreach out to you. Individually,
I have to have my two finalquestions for you. One, where
can people find you? And to whatwould you recommend what's like
a book or podcast or even justif you want to finish off with a
(27:52):
quote for the people you havethrowing?
See? You want to?
I don't? Not sure if you haveum, I think one of the best
books I am a CFP, as you know,and I give back to franchising
in that I actually help overseethe CFP courses now the testing
and I think one of the best onesthat I that I had taken was
(28:15):
actually I think I had the bookright but
for those who aren't watchingRoger has a massive bookshelf
behind him. SUPing finest. He'sgoing to find the book this life
changing book that we will allbe ordering off Amazon
(28:36):
Greg Nathan, great guy, awesomeAustralia accent he was a rather
bitter franchisee that turnedinto a franchisor great guy.
Profitable partnerships. I thinkthat's a good one for all
franchisors to read a little bitleaning toward the franchisee
perspective, but that's okay.
Right. You got to you got to,you know, see all sides of it. I
(28:58):
think that's a really valuableone. I've got so many books up
there. I don't know where towhere to begin with it. As far
as franchising is concerned. Ithink that's one of the better
ones that I think everyfranchisor should read. In
their, their path to it. Thatwas a book What else was what
was the other question? I'msorry.
The other one was just where canwe where can people find you?
(29:22):
website.
They can look me up on LinkedIn.
I have two profiles. The onewith a million connections is
the one that's my real one. Ijust have one that is for folks
that want to abuse me onLinkedIn. So if you're
Roger, go if you want to seewhat he's actually done and and
follow along with hisaccomplishments go to the the
(29:44):
million follower one.
Yeah. And if you do want to senda connection request, please put
a note in there. Don't just sendthe request. If I don't know who
you are, please just send me asimple note saw you on the
podcast with Melissa love toconnect and I'm happy to talk
with you anytime.
Yeah, Roger Stone I answered myconnect request. So good luck
out there, everyone. I knowthat's not true. I'm just
(30:08):
kidding. You're anabsolute joy to work with
Melissa. You really are. Ireally am your relationship.
Thank you for having me.
Thank you so much. Roger.
America's swimming pools islucky to have you. Thank you so
much for joining me today. Allright.
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