From Mormon Roots to Christian Transformation: Matt Crowther's Inspiring Faith Journey

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Welcome to the Feeling Faith Podcast.
I'm here with my guest, mattCrowther.
Matt, super blessed to have youin today.
I'm excited to hear your storyand testimony.
We met a few months back,actually, at the Aspire Tour
event.
Yeah, there were some reallygood speakers.

(00:20):
Dan Fleshman and Andrew Corgoand his team uh put together an
awesome.
I think what magic johnson wasthere, yeah, yeah, and uh, tim
grover tim grover that'sactually where we met.
We were both talking to timgrover, right there, right and
then we, we linked up um, andyou'd kind of just approach me
like, hey, bro, I feel likewe're supposed to talk right

(00:45):
it's like really spirit led andso we got to talk in and you
ended up actually being fromtemecula.
This event was down in la, yeahand um.

Speaker 2 (00:54):
Yeah, the lord, just kind of put it on your heart to
uh, to talk to you, to talk,yeah, yeah, well, and and there
was some other similarities thatI didn't even know that just
kind of have come up over thepast couple months of getting to
know each other.
And then you know, with thispodcast that you're running it's

(01:15):
right up the alley ofeverything that I'm doing right
now, and so I feel like it wasall kind of a divine encounter
that happened exactly when itneeded to happen.

Speaker 1 (01:27):
Yeah, absolutely, absolutely Super cool.
Well, we're blessed to have youhere, excited to hear your
story.
The Feeling Faith podcast isall about personal testimonies
for Christ right, and so we wantto hear your story.
Let's go all the way back tothe beginning.
Where'd you grow up?
What was life like?
Did you have siblings?

(01:47):
Did you have mom and dad in thehouse?
Let's start all the way at thebeginning.
I love that.

Speaker 2 (01:52):
So you know, I grew up in Colorado, born and raised
from Colorado Springs, and Ihave a great family, two amazing
parents, and I actually havefour brothers and sisters, so
I'm the middle child, I'm thethird of five kids, so I have

(02:14):
two older sisters and twoyounger brothers.
All right.
And yeah, so I was raised in aMormon home and my parents were
very, very devout and taught mea lot about faith, taught me a
lot about commitment, and Ireally had a lot of pretty

(02:38):
amazing experiences as a kid.
You know, one of the thingsthat was so interesting was, you
know, my parents were very,very supportive of our talents,
our gifts, our passions.
And so me, from a young age, Istarted to play music, you know,

(03:01):
started playing piano, I think,probably when I was seven or
eight, before I was 10 years old, started playing the piano and
then got into the guitar when Iwas 12.
And the guitar kind of becamemy life, to be honest.

Speaker 1 (03:19):
So your parents anointed those hands.
They did.
They did.

Speaker 2 (03:23):
And with music it really was my outlet.
So in high school I played somesports.
I played a little bit ofbasketball, did some wrestling.
I was also on the diving teamand would do those crazy triple
front flips and stuff like that.

Speaker 1 (03:43):
Okay, You're going to have to teach me how to do some
of those, bro.
Oh, I haven't done them forever, but yeah, wait so real quick.
Did you grow up in the church,in the?

Speaker 2 (03:53):
Mormon church.
I grew up in the Mormon churchand then I went on a Mormon
mission when I was 19, which Ican for sure share about.

Speaker 1 (04:02):
So all this time it was in Colorado.

Speaker 2 (04:04):
All that time was in colorado.

Speaker 1 (04:06):
Yep and uh you know your influence, your sphere,
your friend, all your friends,like everybody essentially came
through yeah, well, yes and no.

Speaker 2 (04:16):
So, um, you know, I went to a high school in
colorado that only had a handfulof mormon people.
Uh, it was primarily christianand so I I grew up with a
handful of Mormon people.
It was primarily Christian andso I grew up with a lot of
conversations with very devoutChristians and was always very
open-minded.
You know, I actually went to anumber of different churches

(04:36):
when I was in high school justto kind of test it out.
I wouldn't say regularly, butlike I would stop by one or two
different churches in, you know,two, three months span, just to
kind of see what that was about.
And I felt called to serve amission, which I did, and so I

(05:00):
did my two year mission.
Actually it was in Ukraine, soit was a pretty interesting
place to live for two years Atleast.

Speaker 1 (05:10):
it was back in that time and not right now.

Speaker 2 (05:12):
Well, well, yeah but I actually saw a lot of the uh,
the strife and the conflict.

Speaker 1 (05:18):
Um, I lived, so how old were you at that time?

Speaker 2 (05:20):
19, 19.
Okay, so that was graduated highschool 2007, 2009, I was in
ukraine and, um, basically, yeah, I lived in the
russian-speaking part of ukrainethat is now, like under russian
rule, it's called the donbass,uh, in in, you know, donetsk and

(05:42):
hov, mariupol, a bunch of thosecities on the very eastern
border of Ukraine and Russia,like right next to Russia.
So I learned Russian, stillfluent in Russian, and I've just
kept that up over the years andyou know, my kids are actually
named after Russian names, asyaand Mila, just because it's a

(06:06):
very, it was a very biginfluence in my life and so,
yeah, when I was there, I had alot of pretty wild experiences.
You know preaching and how didthey accept?

Speaker 1 (06:21):
the Mormon faith over there.
How did they accept the Mormonfaith over there?

Speaker 2 (06:25):
Not a lot.
You know generally.
You know Russians or Ukrainians.
You know where I was.
It was very predominantlyRussian, and so that's partly
why this whole war that hashappened Pretty much the Donbass
like, went to Russia, becausethey're just a little bit more

(06:45):
aligned with a lot of those.
You know, I would say, socialbackgrounds, but you know
they're mainly what's calledPravoslavny, which is Russian
Orthodox, and over there, youknow they didn't really accept

(07:08):
Christianity or Mormonism.
You know what we were talkingabout.

Speaker 1 (07:13):
Yeah, what was their main religion over there?

Speaker 2 (07:15):
Russian Orthodox, russian Orthodox, but a lot of
people that are Russian Orthodoxwould probably be more agnostic
or even atheist or just kind ofyou know, going through the
motions but not really so therewasn't a big influence of
Mormonism over there at all.

Speaker 1 (07:33):
No, hardly at all you guys were really Really the few
Coming, yeah, and you went withjust one other person.

Speaker 2 (07:42):
A handful of other people, it's kind of structured
like you, structured like you'vegot.
In one mission you've probablygot 100 or 150 missionaries,
maybe even more, maybe like 200.
But then you're paired off ingroups of two.
Were you riding?

Speaker 1 (08:00):
bikes and wearing white.

Speaker 2 (08:03):
I did wear like a white shirt with a name tag yes.
And sometimes on a bike, butusually we actually mostly got
around through, like the youknow, buses and subways and
stuff like that.
But yeah, no, it was a veryinteresting time.
I think back to it all the timebecause my time in Ukraine

(08:24):
really opened up my mind to therest of the world and it created
this love of travel.
So, you know, after I got back,I ended up going on this
massive trip to Europe andtraveled through 18 countries in
Europe in about three, fourmonths.
You got the travel bug.
I got the travel bug when Ilived out there, and so then I

(08:47):
got into sales because I figuredout that I was decent at it and
also that I could make goodmoney Going door to door Right.

Speaker 1 (08:57):
I had already learned how to do it.
Oh yeah, for sure, You're a proat that point.

Speaker 2 (09:01):
Well, and that's why there's like a lot of people
that are Mormon that go intodoor-to-door sales because we
have all this training whenwe're on a mission for two years
, right, and so out there, itwas one of those things that,
like it, became a very big youknow, I would say part of my

(09:21):
life that that time that I wasin ukraine and I even went to
college, uh, studying russian,you know, was getting a minor in
russian and was studying musicactually, and uh, and then, you
know, finished a couple years ofschool and decided to go
straight into salesprofessionally.
And uh, and what year was that?

(09:43):
That was was in 2010, 2010.
Okay, yeah, so 2010,.
I got into sales and then, uh,did Cutco I actually sold Cutco
knives and everyone knows aboutCutco.
And I learned a lot.
I learned a lot in my umexperience selling Cutco knives
and you know, became uh a goodsales rep through that and then

(10:06):
found solar in Colorado and havebeen doing solar for 11 years
now at a top 1% level.

Speaker 1 (10:13):
So when you left Ukraine you came back to
Colorado to kind of your homebase Yep Family friends.
Yeah, I moved to Denver.

Speaker 2 (10:22):
So I lived, you know, an hour hour and a half away
from where my, where I grew up,in Colorado Springs.
But but yeah, no I, I got intosolar and that kind of happened
just at the right time.
I then ended up, ended upmoving all over the country
selling solar and lived in fivestates selling solar over the

(10:46):
next, like you know, seven,seven years before I settled in
California, which now I've beenhere for almost seven years.

Speaker 1 (10:54):
So what brought you from California over or from
Colorado over to California?

Speaker 2 (11:00):
Oh well, that was a whole journey.
You know, I moved, took a jobin New York and sold solar in
New York for over three yearsand did really well in New York.
I actually love New York.
I lived on Long Island.
A part of me has a really fondmemory of living on the East

(11:22):
Coast Right memory of living onthe east coast right.
But then I always kind of felta little bit more aligned with
the west coast.
And so then I, you know, movedto texas, sold solar there, then
arizona and then california,and I was going to move to
hawaii to keep selling solar.
But, um, the hawaii thingdidn't end up working out that.
That was seven years ago, right?

Speaker 1 (11:43):
uh, how did your parents feel?
Like what was your familythinking?
You're moving all around thecountry like you're still doing
door-to-door.
You've now been yeah doing thisfor a long time.
Yeah, you know.

Speaker 2 (11:55):
I think that my family was understanding because
they know how adventurous I am.
You, you know I was always likea bit of an adrenaline junkie.
You know I would jump offcliffs in, you know, Lake Powell
and like do these wild 50, 80foot cliffs with my brothers,

(12:16):
and so I've always been a bit ofa adrenaline junkie.
And you know my moving around.
You know I've actually spent alot of money unpacking all this
for why I lived the way that Idid, which was pretty chaotic.
Actually, you know moves prettygenerally different companies,

(12:40):
just changing things up.
I I had this, this massive needfor variety, and, um, I think
that it was maybe just this ideaof you know, the grass is
greener on the other side.
And now I live by a, um, youknow a concept or or, I guess, a
theme, that the grass isgreener where you water it.

(13:04):
And really I've been working on, instead of trying to look for
variety in different places orin different opportunities or
whatever, to really water thegrass where I'm at and nurture
the parts of my life that areimportant, and so that's been a
big life shift over the pastseveral years was switching from

(13:29):
, you know, moving and changingcompanies pretty often which was
like every year or every, youknow, two years to really like
planning my feet and and andreally focusing on how can?
How can I water the grass whereI'm at?

Speaker 1 (13:46):
Yeah, no, that's great and it's.
It's important too, especiallyfor, you know, people that don't
have that stability on aconsistent basis, um, to be
moving on a on a regular and notreally have the relationships
and, you know, being able to getyourself rooted in a community
and around people oh yeah, no,no, it was a little crazy and

(14:09):
you know, I've got two kids withmy ex wife and that was.

Speaker 2 (14:16):
That was definitely a long story, but so what?

Speaker 1 (14:18):
what year did you?

Speaker 2 (14:20):
that was when you came to California, or you were
that was a couple of years afterI came to California Okay, so
you're in California, met her,and then, well, we met in
Colorado, so yeah, we weremarried for eight years and had
two beautiful kids together, andwe still have a great
relationship and a greatco-parenting relationship to

(14:41):
this day that's good.
I think that with I guess Icould back up a little bit.
So I'm selling solar inCalifornia doing really well,
made good money that year.
This was 2018.
2019, I was kind of on ajourney of self-discovery and

(15:01):
you have kids at this time?

Speaker 1 (15:03):
yeah okay, yeah, two kids.
How old were they?

Speaker 2 (15:07):
um four and and a brand new newborn.

Speaker 1 (15:11):
A newborn, so yeah, 2019 four-year-old, you got a
newborn, okay, and that's whereI'm at right now, actually, so
oh awesome got a four-year-oldand well, she's one years now um
2019.
Four-year-old one one-year-old.
You're married, just moved tocalifornia a couple years ago.

Speaker 2 (15:28):
Yeah at this 2017 moved to california okay and had
done really well for two yearsand um was leading a team and
just life was good, yeah, but Iwas feeling like something was
missing to be honest and if I'mbeing completely honest, at that

(15:48):
time I was living a little bitof a double life as well.
Well, and I worked through thatwith therapists and with some
life coaches, coaches and, and Ithink it it it stems back to
that need for variety that I had.

(16:09):
That, you know, created a lotof um, a lot of things that
weren't aligned with with livinga Christian life.
And you know, I I'm open aboutit because it was a big part of
my journey.
You know, at that part of myjourney, yep, you know, at that
point I was kind of half in,half out of the Mormon church.

Speaker 1 (16:29):
Were you guys going to church at that time?
Yeah, when you had moved here.
Okay, yeah, we were going tochurch.

Speaker 2 (16:35):
And we were.
You know, we were living thestandards as best as we could,
but I just felt like there wassomething that I was missing.
Right, we could, but I justfelt like there was something
that I was missing.
And, you know, I think part ofit might've been a little bit of
the, you know, the double lifethat I was living, which was

(16:55):
detaching me from my wife atthat time.
Right, and we ended up havingdiscussions about it, talking
through things.
We did try to work throughthings.
So when you say double, life.

Speaker 1 (17:08):
What do you mean by that?

Speaker 2 (17:10):
Oh, I just I had, I would say, a bit of an addiction
to you know variety indifferent ways on like a sexual
nature.
So I had some sexual addictionsthat started to become a little
bit more intense and you knowit stemmed from pornography and

(17:33):
then kind of led into otherthings.
But you know, and I neveractually was, like you know,
cheating on my wife with anotherperson, like that, I never
crossed that line, yeah, butthere were lines that I crossed
emotionally in your heart in myheart talks a lot about that.

Speaker 1 (17:51):
Oh yeah, and the importance of it and pornography
is big and it's somethingmajority of men struggle with at
some point.
Um, I know I I'd struggled withit for many years.
I had a lot of friends andfamily, like um especially.
We grew up in a day and in ageneration and age where it was
just easily accessible oh yeahyeah, um, and even you know I

(18:13):
come across pornography in myparents room and stuff like that
and like that's just not.
That's obviously not ideal foryou know, young 12, 13, 14 year
old boy Like.
That's not the best move.

Speaker 2 (18:28):
Yeah, and that was me at 12, 13 as well, and you know
, in the Mormon church there's alot of shame around it.
That really messed with me andit made it feel even worse,
which I think the rebelliousside of me wanted even more,
because I couldn't have it.
Yeah.
And because there was such likea barrier and a wall around it,

(18:48):
and so it turned into thisthing that I just had a lot of
other interests that weren't inmy marriage.

Speaker 1 (18:57):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (18:57):
That I would entertain in certain ways and,
like I said, I never crossed aline of actually meeting someone
or whatever.
Certain ways, and, like I said,I never crossed a line of
actually meeting someone orwhatever, but it was to a point
where I just I wasn't whole andsomething was missing.
On my healing journey, I havediscovered that wholeness

(19:19):
through Jesus Christ and youknow, uh, it was a full-on
journey of years, years andyears.
Well, you know, um, withtalking through things that was
back in 2019, 2020, with my wifeat that time and then really
coming to the conclusion that we, we should separate and and

(19:43):
that we would be okay withraising the family, and I always
wanted to put the kids first inthat situation.
So, anyone who's either goingthrough separation or divorce,
or especially if you're in themiddle of it, just remember that
your kids are the mostimportant part of that entire
equation and, luckily, me and myex-wife have done many, many

(20:08):
sacrifices for those kids tomake it as smooth and as easy as
possible, and if you know theyever listened to this, I'm sure
they would tell you that.
You know, I did my best, myex-wife did her best and we
really didn't have a lot ofchaos or drama or anything like
that.
That's great.
We really kept it very calm,specifically for the children.

Speaker 1 (20:31):
Yeah, that's super important.
My parents actually wentthrough a divorce a couple years
ago and we're older, we'regrown up right, so it didn't
affect us as much.
But it was not.
It wasn't good, it wasn't clean, it was bad, it was a mess
actually.

Speaker 2 (20:47):
Well, most are.
Yeah, I would say I.
I heard a statistic that about70 percent of divorces are are
messy.
Yeah, you know, most 30 percentof clean or amicable or calm
divorces are the rarity and it'ssad because it doesn't have to
be that way, like it reallydoesn't, and it doesn't but

(21:07):
people are a lot of pride.

Speaker 4 (21:09):
Yeah, it's pride away , ego pride ego hurt guilt.

Speaker 2 (21:13):
People don't know how to deal with pain healthily.
Yeah, you know, um, they, theyreally don't.
Most people don't know how todeal with their pain with,
especially if there's trauma.
Um, they really don't.
Most people don't know how todeal with their pain, especially
if there's trauma.
They really don't know how towork through that.
And that's why, like you knowso, after I went through that

(21:36):
separation, I ended up meetingan amazing woman who is now my
wife and we had a pretty chaoticrelationship and, you know, had
to do a lot of work to workthrough things which was mainly
me healing, and I knew that Iwasn't whole at that moment when
I went through that separation,but, at the same time, I didn't

(22:00):
know what to do about it.
Yeah.
And it became this process ofJesus calling me to him and
really like showing me his loveand his grace through the church
that I go to now, which isCalvary, and through a number of

(22:23):
little love letters that hesent to me, that he showed me a
lot of them through my wife, youknow.
So what?

Speaker 1 (22:33):
was that original turning point Like?
When were you like?
You know what?
I don't have a relationshipwith God.
I've been.
I grew up in the Mormon church.
I've been living this life.
I went on a mission for twoyears and committed my time and
energy and effort to the Mormonchurch, went through a divorce

(22:53):
right.
Like you've been through a lotand a big journey at this point.
What was that turning point?
Or when did you realize, like Idon't even have a relationship
with God.
I don't truly know God.

Speaker 2 (23:08):
Well, and I don't know if I would say it that way.
So this is what I will sayabout people in the LDS church.
They have a very strong faithand they do have a relationship
like a personal relationshipwith God a relationship like a
personal relationship with God,but it goes through a lot of
chains, I would say, of you knowjust all of the different

(23:35):
guidelines and rules and all ofthat.
I feel like that is, in myopinion, what has been the main
differentiator between myChristian faith today and my
Mormon faith from five, seven,10 years ago.
And I lived, I think, a goodlife.
I have a lot of friends who areMormon, that are amazing people
that I'm still very close with,and I respect every religion,

(24:00):
every religion.
One of the things that I havereally been taught in my walk
with Jesus is how much he lovedpeople that were unlovable, amen
.
How much he taught people thatwere lost.
Yeah, you know like he dinedwith sinners and prostitutes and

(24:22):
at that time it was likeliterally a sin.
You know, coming from theJewish faith, and you know I
watched the Chosen and I lovethat show and I actually saw it
after I was saved, which was avery interesting take on it
compared to if I had watched it,you know, a couple years ago,

(24:43):
when it had come out.
I watched it just recently andit was one of these moments
where I just saw Jesus in adifferent light because of His
love for all people.
And even it's like in that showthey have this whole part with,

(25:04):
like the Jews and the Gentilesthat are both there, and the
Pharisees are like, whoa, what'sgoing on?
Like there's Jewish people,there's Gentiles here, like
there's people from all over,like you know, and they're
wanting to basically like writeup Jesus and send it to the
Sanhedrin and like it's thiswhole thing, sanhedrin, and like

(25:28):
it's this, this whole thing,and it's.
And he just has this beautifullove, this abundant love about
him, where he's like, hey, I,I'm, I'm bringing something
that's new and I'm bringing ahigher law, and that law is love
.
It's love God and love yourneighbors, god and love your
neighbors.
And that is where, for me, inmy heart, I have grown and
healed was learning how to lovemyself.

(25:57):
And so I think that the biggestpart of my journey from you know
, switching a faith, which was avery, let's say, committed
faith, right, like people thatare LDS that are practicing,
that are going to the temple.
It takes a lot of commitment tolive that life.
It does, and I love thatcommitment actually, and I wish

(26:17):
that more people would live withthat type of devout commitment
in their life.
I agree.
And so that's why I thinkMormons are incredible people.
But at this stage of my life,in my walk with Jesus, I learned
about his love and his grace ata whole new level.
Yeah, a new depth of that.

Speaker 1 (26:39):
Yeah, and really the biggest difference is the
relationship right, and I see ita lot, the Mormon faith.
It's very religious.
Yes, you're checking boxes.

Speaker 2 (26:50):
Yes, very, very religious, I would say.
I'm more spiritual and lessreligious right.
This second.

Speaker 1 (26:56):
Yeah, you have a true relationship.
You really know the nature ofGod, you know Jesus.

Speaker 2 (27:03):
I had to figure that out.
Yeah, but through the Mormonchurch, like you don't get that
because of all the works that gointo it, there's a lot of
distractions and there's a lotof distractions with all of the,
the works that you know in theBible it talks about works
versus faith and you know thatwas like even when I was a

(27:28):
missionary and even when I wasin high school that was
something I always struggled tounderstand.
It's like, okay, how does Iguess you need them, but maybe
not?
Like it was just very confusingfor me and now I know that
truly what that scripture meansis that we are on a journey and

(27:50):
our faith is our guide.
And Jesus Christ on the cross,when he died for us, he gave us
that free gift.
And that free gift we canaccept that outside of ourself
as a sinner, as someone whoneeds salvation desperately, we
can accept his gift of grace andhis gift of love because of

(28:13):
what he did on the cross for us.

Speaker 1 (28:15):
Yes, amen, that's the truth and I want to talk.
I want to really kind of divedeeper into this conversation
and this topic of Mormon incomparison with Christianity,
because there are, I know, a lotof Mormons that have converted
to Christianity.
They really found a true,genuine relationship with Jesus.

(28:35):
There's a lot of differencesreally.
Number one the Mormons are bigon the Book of Mormonon, right,
um, almost more so, actuallytruly more so than even the
bible itself.
Right, they hold strong andhold true really to the book of
mormon more than they do theactual word of god which there's

(28:58):
.
The bible is very clear on notdoing that, right, um.
But also the work side ofthings, um, there's a lot of
legalism, right, and kind of thethe religious system.
Let's talk about that.
What, from your perspective?
you grew up in the church, likeyou know, obviously way more
than I do yeah I have somefamily and friends that you know

(29:21):
are in the mormon church andand of that faith.

Speaker 2 (29:23):
But I want to talk like what do you see the biggest
difference between both ofthose faiths?
Yeah, that's a great questionand thank you for for framing it
that way.
You know it's, it's one ofthose things.
It's like religion.
There's so many religions outthere, right, and I'm fascinated
by it.
I took some comparativereligion classes in college and

(29:46):
high school and I was veryintrigued just by.
You know, there's a billionMuslims out there, right, and
there's people that are Catholicand Jewish, and at this point
there's hundreds and hundreds ofchurches, thousands, probably,
maybe even tens of thousands ofchurches in the world, probably.

(30:07):
But you know there's thousandsof churches.
And you know the thing that wasso interesting, you know, when
you're raised in the LDS church,it's very strict, right.
Like, even on a Sunday, Icouldn't play with friends.
I couldn't even, you know and alot of this I still agree with

(30:29):
but you know we couldn't watchTV.
The only thing that we couldwatch was like a church movie or
a Disney movie and you know,like a lot of my friends, they
would play on Sundays and I waspretty much just at home and was
, uh, keeping the Sabbath day,holy right Is um, you know kind

(30:50):
of how, how we, how we had it inour family and and I don't
disagree with that I just thinkthat, um, the strictness it
creates a little bit of tensionwith how you live your life.
Because it's so strict andthere's so many rules and I
don't disagree with pretty muchall the rules I think that it is

(31:14):
a good way to live your lifewhen it comes to, you know,
don't drink alcohol, like youknow, no sex before marriage,
like, keep yourself clean, youknow.
All of that stuff I think isvery positive.
I just think that there's somuch more love that is in the

(31:36):
Christian church, and when wesay Christian church, you know
there's hundreds of Christianchurches, right.
And so when you think aboutreligion as a whole, like as
this big, big idea of all thesedifferent religions, what I felt
was Jesus calling for me andcalling me, sometimes even by

(31:57):
name, and helping me tounderstand like I'm here.
I just need you to open up yourheart to me, and it's not about
all the little things, it'sabout accepting me into your
heart and walking with me all ofyour days.

(32:17):
And for me that resonated thebest.
And there might be people thatlisten to this that are Buddhist
or Muslim or Jewish or whatever, and I think that you know, and
I heard a phrase which was notfrom a Christian but it's kind
of stuck with me, and it was aquote that Einstein said, and he

(32:40):
said all religion is branchesof the same tree.
No-transcript us to where we'regoing, to where we're supposed

(33:08):
to go.
He can kind of help us withavoiding road blocks and
avoiding the speed bumps andavoiding the potholes along the
journey, because there areplenty, and that road is not
straight and that road is notfree, you know, free of
obstacles, right, and all of usare on this.

(33:28):
It's a narrow road.
It's a narrow road.

Speaker 1 (33:30):
It is, the Bible talks about it, yeah.

Speaker 2 (33:32):
Yeah, and we are on this path and we are on this
journey and it's not going tohappen exactly the way that we
think it will, because we don'tknow the future, we don't know
the plan, and what I think isthat God has a bigger plan that
is beyond our comprehension, andhe understands how all of it

(33:54):
fits together.
Like, really, the world is inchaos when you think about all
the different religions andcountries, and you know
governments and all of thisstuff, but somehow it still
works, and you know it's becauseGod is the one who's in charge
of all of it and he understandsit.
And so, for me, I know, throughwhat I've been through, that

(34:18):
God has called me by name andthat he has saved me and that
day, if you want, we can go intoit a little bit.
It was a pretty, let's say,intense experience for me.

Speaker 1 (34:34):
I want to pause you before we jump into that,
because there's a few pointsthat you referenced that I want
to touch on.
First off, you talked a lotabout the religions.
Satan is the great imitator.
Oh, yeah, right, and so he hasimitated the word and he has
created all these falsereligions.

(34:55):
And I'm not the one to judge.
I can't say whether this personis going to heaven or this
person's not.
It doesn't matter what religionor what faith you live by like.
The only thing that matterstruly is jesus and your
relationship with with jesuschrist.
But what I also know is thebible tells us that judgment is

(35:16):
based on your knowledge and yourunderstanding, and so if you
had never had the opportunity tolearn about God, where does
that judgment scale lead right?
Where is that weight balance on?
I've never heard about Jesus.
I don't even know who Jesus is.

Speaker 2 (35:34):
Right, Someone who lives in India and you know, or
whatever.

Speaker 1 (35:37):
Never, never heard the gospel, right.
And so God, he's a righteousGod, right, he's a loving God.
Obviously, he created us onpurpose, for a purpose, with a
purpose, and part of that beinghe wanted a relationship with us
.
And that's where you have thesereligious systems, and you made
a great point.
There's all these churches andthere's really only one church.

(35:58):
That's the truth.
But there's all thesecongregations, right, we are the
church, the body of Christ isthe church.
So there's all thesecongregations, there's thousands
of congregations and thousandsof different faiths and branches
of faith, but at the end of theday, there's only one truth.
There's only one God right.

Speaker 2 (36:17):
Absolutely, and that's.

Speaker 1 (36:18):
Jesus and he died on the cross for our sins.
I just want to bring that upbecause it's really important
for people, especially ourviewers, to understand like God
died for you, like and he has aplan and a purpose and he wants
to have a relationship with you.
You don't have to check theseboxes, you don't have to not not

(36:38):
drink alcohol, not do drugs,not have sex before marriage to
come to him.
If you do all of that stuff,it's okay.
He's going to accept youbecause of love, because of
faith, because of grace, and hehas grace and his grace is
enough.
And so it doesn't matter whatyour sins are, it doesn't matter
what your struggles or trialsor tribulations that you face,

(36:59):
because we're all sinners, weall fall short of the glory of
God and Jesus paid the perfectprice.
Jesus on the cross died for usand covers all of the sins of
the world.
If you just accept that right,it's a free gift of life and the
life is the restoration andyour spiritual right To be
restored with God, because andpeople look at hell, I know I'm

(37:20):
going on a tangent here- but, Ireally have to talk about it.
People look at hell and you know, know, in the Bible it talks
about like there'll be fire andbrimstone and gnashing of teeth
and all this, and so the waythat I see hell, it's just
eternal separation from God.
And what is God?
God is love.
God is light.
Just those two alone, right?

(37:42):
That's enough.
I could stop right there.
God is love and God is light.
So if hell is eternalseparation from God, that means
I'm not going to be within thegrace and love of God and I'm
not going to be in light, so I'mgoing to be in outer darkness
with no love.
That's a scary place to be.
That sounds like hell in and ofitself, right?

(38:03):
So I just wanted to share thatbecause you're right, there are
so many different religions outthere, but it's important that
we understand, like, why theBible is truth and why Jesus did
what he did.

Speaker 2 (38:16):
Yeah, and you know, I'll add.
The thing that's so interestingis, you know, the way that my
mind works is I have a very bigpicture way of thinking of
things, and that's why I go andthink about the whole world and
all the different religions andhow it all kind of works, even
though there's so many different.

(38:37):
You know, moving pieces in thatequation, that guess what God he
understands and he is incontrol and he wants that
personal relationship with you,which, which is so amazing, Like
and and that's, and that'sreally the uh, the beauty of
Christianity is like he died forus so that we could return to

(38:59):
him and, um, you know, I thinkthat, without, like, picking
apart just all the differencesbetween my previous faith and my
faith today, I think that loveand respect is so important and
it's like you know, my parentsare devout, devout LDS, uh,

(39:21):
followers, Mormon, uh, and, andI love them for how they raised
me and I have no, you know, illwill or or, uh, bad feelings
about the childhood that I hador the life that I that I was,
uh, was, was, I would say, given, but just over those decades of

(39:48):
living and learning from them,and I still am very close to
both my parents, even thoughI've left the Mormon church and
I am now on a different path,you know, and so Praise God for
that.

Speaker 4 (40:02):
Yeah, and that's been hard right.

Speaker 2 (40:04):
Like you know, two of my brothers are, you know,
christian and then two of mysisters are still Mormon and you
work through those things inlife and in families and what I
can say is that for me, theamount of love and hope and

(40:27):
light that has come into my lifesince I was saved is hard to
fully express.

Speaker 1 (40:34):
Yeah, I guarantee they're looking at your life and
what you're doing and the faiththat you have and the change
that they're seeing, and they'reseeing the power in that Right
and there's that song like thereis power in the name of Jesus,
right.
Like there is power in the nameof Jesus.

(40:56):
There's power in your testimony,right, and that's what that's
really what all this is about.
That's why we're here right now, yeah, is to share our personal
testimonies and what Jesus hasdone in our life, right, because
there's power in that.
And so I love that you're goingthrough this journey and also
that your family is getting tosee what a true, genuine
relationship without thereligion, right, but

(41:19):
relationship, justrelationship-focused can do in
somebody's life, and that'samazing that the Lord's kind of
using you as that vessel andyou're going to impact many
people's lives thousands,hundreds, thousands of people's
lives, and I do want to share mytestimony and how I was saved.
Yeah, let's get to it.

Speaker 2 (41:39):
Because it was.
You know, I'll give a littlebit of a disclaimer.
It was unexpected and, like Isaid, it was Jesus calling for
me for many, many years.
And, like I said, this story,this is what happened to me.

(42:01):
You know, my wife, this is whathappened to me, my wife Janet,
the love of my life.
I just got married to her fromour pastor, who married us in
November.

Speaker 1 (42:12):
Congratulations so six months ago.
Yeah, honeymoon phase still.

Speaker 2 (42:15):
It's still in the honeymoon phase, yeah, but I
will tell you it's going to liveforever.

Speaker 1 (42:18):
The honeymoon phase is never going to end.

Speaker 2 (42:21):
She's the best thing that ever happened to me.
I, you know, I I have, uh, Ihave love and respect for my ex
wife, um and, and we spent overeight years together and and I
always especially for mychildren, like I always will, uh
, really remember all of thoseyears and look at those times

(42:44):
with fondness because of who itmade me.
But so my journey was a littlebit more than what I expected.
You know, I was on this growthjourney and I was, you know, was
making a lot of money doingsolar and basically I was

(43:06):
investing a lot of money into myown personal growth.
So I was investing money.
I went to Tony Robbins'conference, which I'm a huge fan
of what he does.

Speaker 1 (43:15):
Unleash the power within.
Yeah, I went to it.
Did you walk on pulse?
I did.
I did it multiple times.
Yeah, it's the best experienceEverybody should go.

Speaker 2 (43:28):
Yeah, you really should, and you know so.
I invested into growth.
I was in this mastermindcommunity as well it's called
Abundant, and they're kind ofdoing other things now but you
know so I was involved with thatand I went to a number of
different immersions and eventsand really started diving deeper
into, like, who am I?
And as I was doing that andfiguring out my identity, my

(43:53):
values, the things that I standfor, I really started getting to
this point of like, oh wow, Ithink that I'm living a little
bit out of alignment with who Iam.
And that was that double lifethat I was living in secret,
that God knew all about and hetried to help me and he tried to

(44:17):
save me from my sins, but I wastoo stubborn and too prideful
to really um accept his help,and so all of this kind of was
was getting more and more on thesurface.
And so I I, you know met Janetand um.

(44:39):
Basically, at that time I wasstill Mormon and still trying to
work, work through that um, butat the same time it it didn't
really feel um authentic to meanymore, and you know so I
started going to her church atcalvary and um, as I'm going to

(45:02):
that church, I just feelsomething different.
I feel some of the things thatwere missing and I was still
very hesitant and resistant.
So I'm still Mormon going tothis Calvary church because I
feel more comfortable there thanthe Mormon church at that point
because me and Janet wereliving together and you know,

(45:24):
kind of there was a lot ofthere's a lot of rules, right,
and I was working through adifficult phase of my life.
And so we're at Calvary thiswas years ago and Janet was like
crying next to me, listening toworship, and I kind of asked
her like what's wrong?

(45:44):
And she said I'll tell youlater.
And it wasn't for a while thatshe told me, I think maybe even
a year or something like that,because I had my own conversion
that I needed to go through andI had my own process of coming
to Jesus that I needed to gothrough and I had my own process
of coming to Jesus that Ineeded to go through.

(46:06):
And eventually she did tell methat on that day she had a
vision of seeing me on stageperforming in the worship band.
Wow.
And at that moment it wasimpossible.
I was still Mormon, I was stillvery devout in my own way, how
I needed to be at that moment,and so she had this powerful

(46:27):
vision that she shared with melater, which is actually kind of
in process right now.
I'm already singing withworship band and starting to do
that and already working on someof my own worship music, which
I'm working on an album rightnow like an acoustic worship
album so rad and so you knowthere's so much that's there

(46:51):
that you know.
Janet really felt like you knowI should be a worship pastor
because I've been playing guitarsince I was 12 years old which
is.
You know, I'm 35.
So that's 23 years that I'vebeen playing guitar and singing
and performing and writing music.
And so right now I'm like kindof getting into that and I'm

(47:13):
actually going to be leadingworship at a Christian
conference, like a businessconference, but they want to
bring some worship in, and sothat's happening a month from
now Congratulations conference.
Uh, like a business conference,but they, they want to bring
some worship in, and so I loveit, that's happening a month
from now yeah, congratulationsand so the vision is, is coming
into focus and, um, you know,I'm, I'm.
I get fired up talking aboutthat because I just love music

(47:36):
so much, and especiallychristian worship music.
It just like after I was saved,I couldn't stop listening to it
.
I was like on repeat every day.
That's the jam and I learnedall of those songs, I memorized
all of them because those wordshad meaning for me at a new
level.
And so, like even you know,great Are you, lord, is one of

(48:00):
my favorite songs, even you knowGreat Are you.
Lord is one of my favorite songsand, like I, just I want to
praise him in everything that Ido, in every conversation, in
all of the interactions that Ihave.
I want to praise and glorifyJesus through me as an
instrument.

Speaker 1 (48:17):
Yeah, and so Can you give us a little vocals?
Give us a couple, bro.
Just one little line, let'shear it.
All right, let me let me think.

Speaker 2 (48:27):
Like any song, I'll sing one of one of my favorites
that I've been working on.

Speaker 4 (48:33):
You call me out upon the water, the great unknown,
where feet may fail.
And there you find me in thesomething.

(49:08):
Keep my eyes above the waveswhen oceans in your embrace, for
I am yours and you are minepraise the lord.

Speaker 1 (49:28):
That's dude.
You got a beautiful voice.
Thank you, I love it heck, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 2 (49:32):
So you put me on the spot.
I had to, bro the viewerswanted it they wanted it right.

Speaker 1 (49:36):
What can?

Speaker 2 (49:37):
I say I would have I would have been more prepared
and more ready.
But, um, you know, I've been,I've been working on some of
these songs with this worshipalbum and it's starting to come
together and you know, I'vewritten probably about 50 or 60
songs, maybe even 100 in my life.
10 are very good.
Where I have, you know, alittle album that I put together

(49:58):
, but nothing professional, andI feel like the first
professional album I do is gonnabe a worship album which will
be coming into the world in thenext year.

Speaker 1 (50:07):
That's awesome.

Speaker 2 (50:09):
And so Super exciting , yeah, you know.
So, getting back to my story,I'll try to kind of give the
condensed version.
So I'm, you know, in this newphase of life, the last year, me
and my wife, we went throughtherapy, we fixed things that we

(50:29):
needed to.
I went through a healingjourney and, you know, we ended
up getting engaged about a yearago and you know so I knew that
I wanted to marry that woman and, janet, if you're listening, I
love you more than anything, sograteful to be with you and that
you're my wife.

Speaker 1 (50:50):
Um, wives somebody told me that your wife is your
superpower.
And ever since I was told thatI'm like you're so right, that's
my superpower right there, yeah.

Speaker 2 (51:00):
Yeah, yeah, absolutely.
I believe fully in true yeah,yeah, yeah, Absolutely.
I believe fully in that yeah.
And so we're working througheverything getting ready for the
wedding, and this was last yearNovember.
November 11th 2023 is when Igot married in San Diego.

Speaker 1 (51:15):
And so you're still going to Calvary at this time,
yeah.

Speaker 2 (51:18):
Yeah, I started going to Calvary full-time almost
three years ago two and a halfto three years ago and so at
that point I really felt likethis is the church I want to go
to, this is my people and Ireally related with, especially
the worship pastor.
He actually played at ourwedding.

(51:38):
So we had a pastor from Calvarymarry us and then the worship
pastor led worship during ourwedding.
So it was a very coolexperience and a very Christian
wedding that was filled withpraise and worship and a really,
really beautiful ceremonyChristian ceremony and so

(52:02):
basically, we are going, youknow, we're in the wedding phase
and then, after that, somestuff started getting a little
funky with my job and, withoutgoing too deep into it, it just
became very apparent that it wastime for me to to start doing

(52:24):
other things and and I'm stilldoing solar, and I'm still going
to keep doing solar, justbecause I've been doing that for
11 years and I I feel like I'mnot quite ready for that.
No, but that at that momentwith uh, with that team, it, it,
it was very difficult for meand, uh, it actually led to, you
know, me becoming suicidal.

(52:46):
Wow.
Yeah, and this was, this wasless than six months ago.
So so this is the story, um,and I was.
You know, my job is soimportant to me and and it means
so much to me and and it meansso much to me that at that
moment of seeing it kind offalling out of reach, pretty

(53:07):
much like it was, it was almostlike I felt like the ground was
crumbling all around me.
I was like, okay, what am Isupposed to do with this?
Where am I supposed to go?
And my identity was so tied towork, achievement this job, and
I made good money last year.
Yeah.

(53:27):
But I felt like it was not timeyet and the fact that it was
happening when it was justreally was hard for me.
And so I started having and I'mnot suicidal, but I started
having some of these thoughtsand I actually talked to another
Christian brother of mine, timJohnson.

(53:48):
Shout out to Tim.
Shout out Tim very inspired, andso he and I have had a lot of
deep conversations the pastthree, four months, and so I had

(54:12):
conversations with him aboutthis and he explained something
similar where he started havingthese dark thoughts, and the
only way I can describe it is itwas like these thoughts were
just, they might have been thereor quiet, but they got
overwhelmingly loud and it wasthese very dark thoughts of just
kill yourself.
You know, the world doesn'tneed you.

(54:34):
Um, your daughters will be finewithout you like really dark
shit that I didn't expect andall of that with, like, my
career falling apart and just abunch of that stuff that was so
important to me just happeningright when it did, which was

(54:54):
like a couple months after thewedding this was in January and
then there was a couple otherlayers of it that just made me
feel trapped, made me feelworthless and made me feel
without purpose, and I forgot mypurpose at that moment, and so
I was.
I was planning on killingmyself.

(55:16):
It was about a week of buildupthat led up to December 31st, or
, sorry, january 31st, january31st.
So so the week before that inin January, I was going through
this motion and going throughthis like feeling of you know,

(55:38):
really starting to believe thelies, and I know for a fact that
that was Satan, no, who wastrying to confuse me, trying to
destroy me.
Yeah, literally, take me out.
You know he was trying toremove me from the equation,
because I know that there aresome big things that God has in
store that I'm supposed to helpwith in this world.

(55:59):
Amen.
And at that moment I couldn'teven see beyond that and I got
to such a dark and, you know,I'm open to share this but, like
a lot of my family doesn't evenknow this whole story.
This is, you know, a verypersonal experience that I just
I'm not proud of, but maybe mesharing it can help people that

(56:23):
are in it.
Yes, exactly because I I wasnot a suicidal person, but I
became suicidal for those coupleweeks that was leading up to it
and the voices and the thoughtsbecame so loud it was just
deafening.
I just wanted to end it, yeah,to get rid of those voices were.

(56:44):
You know, and I am a huge fan ofCS Lewis, I read a lot of his
books and he wrote a book calledthe Screwtape Letters.
Yeah, it's all about this, yeah, and about the generals and the
different layers of followersof you know, darkness and these
demons that that's really try todestroy you.

(57:04):
Yep, in one way or another,spiritually or physically, you
know they'll.
They'll destroy you throughalcoholism, through numbing
yourself to get you to the pointwhere you can't even make a
rational thought.
Yep, um, for me it was astraight up spiritual attack
where I was in the middle ofthis battle a full on battle for

(57:28):
my life.

Speaker 1 (57:29):
Well, everyone read the Screwtape Letters.
If you haven't, it's a greatone.

Speaker 2 (57:33):
Yeah, it is, and I'll also mention one other book
called Outwitting the Devil.

Speaker 1 (57:38):
Napoleon Hill.
Napoleon Hill, amazing, famousbook of all time Everyone has to
read that outwitting the devil.

Speaker 2 (57:44):
It teaches all about um good and evil, light and
darkness.
You know it's?
It's a, it's incredible book.
It's an inspired book by bynapoleon hill it really like
reading that book.

Speaker 1 (57:57):
Really I was.
I'm convinced, I'm stillconvinced, that he interviewed
the devil.

Speaker 4 (58:02):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (58:03):
I am truly convinced.
Yeah, I am too.

Speaker 2 (58:06):
I consider Napoleon Hill almost to the level of a
prophet, with his level ofinsight and knowledge and light.
He has so much light in all ofhis works and I'm a huge reader.
Actually, this is off topic,but I'm writing a book that will
be also published next year andI'm almost done with it.
But Napoleon Hill, he inspiredme with a lot of what I'm doing

(58:30):
with my book and so, anyways,the battle is real.
Spiritual warfare is a realthing.
It's in the Bible.
Jesus casted out demons.
We know it, we saw it again andagain.
There are stories in the Bible,in the New Testament, again and

(58:52):
again and again, of evilspirits that were casted out
through the power of Jesus.

Speaker 1 (58:54):
And I want to point something out for everybody too.
You'd gone through Tony Robbins.
You've been investing inpersonal development, tony
Robbins.
One of one of my favorite toolsthat that he had he had shared
and given me was when you havebad thoughts or evil thoughts,
or negative thoughts, you actlike there's a cloud floating
right and you immediatelypinpoint that thought and you

(59:16):
say whose thought is that?
That is a dumb thought?
And you throw it out of yourmind.
Right, and you actually do this.
Who's thought of that?
That's a dumb thought?
You throw it out and then youimmediately replace it with
self-fulfilling positivethoughts.
Right, and I'm sure you learnedthat and unleashed the power
within.

Speaker 2 (59:32):
And I was trying to do that, but I was so deep in it
that I couldn't even get out ofthe cloud.

Speaker 1 (59:40):
Yeah, and that's why I wanted wanted to refer back to
it, because I'm knowing thatyou've gone through the personal
development, health, growth,understanding, mindset, the
psychology of the mind, how themind works, um to be spiritually
attacked.
It doesn't matter what.

Speaker 2 (59:56):
The only tool you have is jesus exactly, and and I
wasn't relying on him until Iwas saved and I'm getting to
this part of the story, and soso basically, one thing I want
to also add about thoughts is weknow that you know Satan and
his followers.
They, they can, they caninfluence our thoughts.

(01:00:17):
They can't control them.
They can put them in your headand you can decide like, even
even like a lustful thought,that that just comes into your
head randomly.
It's like you don't have to gowith that, you don't have to
focus on that and don't have togo layers deeper on that.
But but sometimes people willjust be a slave to their own
thoughts where they just, theyjust let their thoughts run.

(01:00:39):
The show thoughts where theyjust they just let their
thoughts run.
The show has, which keeps themdrifting in life without purpose
.
Yes, because, because you haveto control your thoughts, you
have to if, if anything fromthis podcast you learn, you have
to learn how to control yourthoughts and how to replace
negative thoughts with positivethoughts amen evil thoughts with
holy thoughts yeah, 100 and andso anyways, I'm and that's life

(01:01:02):
.

Speaker 1 (01:01:02):
That's life.
I want to dive a little bitdeeper into that, because people
don't talk about this and no,no.

Speaker 2 (01:01:09):
Right, and this is hard shit to talk about.
By the way, the only reason I'mable to talk about it is
because I've done a lot of workon vulnerability and sharing and
being open and and truly livingmy authentic self as opposed to
just.
I don't have to worry aboutwhat people will think about
what I say.
I don't have to worry abouttheir perception of me because I

(01:01:33):
have done enough legwork andespecially on the Christian side
, with my relationship withJesus that I can be very
comfortable being exactly who Iam.
Yeah, exactly, and even ifsomeone doesn't like it, or if
it offends someone like I'm,just, I'm gonna be exactly who
I'm meant to be and focus ondoing that with love, light,

(01:01:56):
faith, hope, charity, all of thepositive emotions that I can
put into this.
Amen, that's truth.
Well, back to the positiveemotions that I can put into
this.
Amen, that's truth.

Speaker 1 (01:02:03):
Well, back to the thoughts thing, a lot of people
and that's where you knowdepression stems from suicide.
All of that stems from thethoughts and from whether it's
you know the enemy attacking youor you know a demon attacking
you and, on a spiritual level,attacking your mind.
You know a demon attacking youand, on a spiritual level,

(01:02:25):
attacking your minds, um, orit's just you allowing certain
things or other influences evenmusic, oh yeah, music, movies
and tv and anything thatinfluence your head, you allow
into your mind, is so powerful,and so it's extremely important
that you protect and guard yourheart and you guard your mind
from certain things, andespecially negative and evil

(01:02:47):
things.
And if you do have thesethoughts, if you have bad
thoughts or negative thoughts, Ijust want to encourage
everybody to talk about it.
It's okay to talk about it.
We all have these crazy thoughts, like.
We all get these randomthoughts that pop into our mind.
They're crazy, they're radical,right, you're sharing some
right now, um, and it just somany people have gone through

(01:03:12):
this and they think that they'rethe only ones.
And that's what breaks my heartis they think that they're
crazy.
But they're not crazy, they'rejust human, right, and so it's
really important to talk aboutthose things, because everybody
goes through it.
I go through it, you go throughit, you go through it, you, you
, you, you, we all experiencethat Read the Bible, you know,
replace those thoughts withGod's word.

Speaker 2 (01:03:35):
And you know, like that's one thing that I did a
lot of is I started replacingthose thoughts with worship
songs and I would just gothrough these songs in my head
again and again and I would diedeep into the lyrics and I would
use those lyrics as my armorand but this was after I was
saved yeah, so we're not thereyet.

Speaker 1 (01:03:55):
All right, let's jump back to it.

Speaker 2 (01:03:56):
I am, I'm in the middle of it.
Um, I have a timer on my uh, onmy phone, for for when I'm
gonna kill myself well this onjanuary 31st and, like people,
and you're engaged at this pointoh married, married okay
november okay, you got marriednovember, two months after your

(01:04:18):
marriage.

Speaker 1 (01:04:18):
This was like four months ago well.

Speaker 2 (01:04:21):
So I and and people that know me, they probably
won't even believe this becauseI'm such a positive guy yeah,
and I really am like I have avery positive life mission and
viewpoint and like I'm, I'm, I'ma happy guy generally, but I

(01:04:42):
was in the middle of a battleand the work thing was setting
me over the edge and um, and Ijust felt like there was, I just
needed to end my life.
And you know, there's alsofinancial stuff, financial
pressures, all that stuff likethat.
Life, life, life stuff.

(01:05:03):
Yeah Right, but, but all ofthat it was so heavy.
The problem was that I waslistening to the wrong voice and
or I don't know, you listen tothe story and you tell me what
you think, because I don't knowif I could have gotten here
without going through what Iwent through, and so I have to
learn the hard way.
Unfortunately, that's that'show I'm wired.

Speaker 1 (01:05:25):
Some do some, some learn from others.

Speaker 2 (01:05:28):
I have learned the hard way many times.

Speaker 1 (01:05:30):
You're the older brother.

Speaker 2 (01:05:31):
So it makes sense, right?
And so, anyways, it's themiddle of the afternoon on that
Wednesday.
I didn't have my kids thatnight.
I desperately wanted to seethem that day, but it just
wasn't on that day that I hadthem.
And um, and I was in the middleof it and um, something snapped

(01:05:52):
me out after the clock gotunder an hour, like for my
countdown, and something snappedme out of it.
And something snapped me out ofit.
I was able to just like, no,I'm not going to do that.
And I told my wife thatafternoon.
I told her, babe, I'm not okay.
You know I am having very darkthoughts and I almost took my

(01:06:14):
life today and she was like no,you didn't.
And I said I really did LikeI'm not okay, right, this second
.
And she was upset and you knowshe's Cuban, so she can't hold
things in.
She is very expressive andemotional and started screaming

(01:06:41):
at me and just was mad that Iwould even do that.
But I was so deep in it that Icouldn't even see the light out
of where I was at.
And so, anyways, that night Irandomly had a session with our
therapist.
On the schedule I was like,okay, we're doing that, uh,
because I I kind of have thesessions when I just randomly,

(01:07:02):
when I need them.
And it was just on thatschedule that exact day, which I
don't know if that isn'tdivinely, you know, orchestrated
Cause we hadn't seen him forfor months, just cause we were
so busy with the wedding andhoneymoon and all that stuff.
Yeah, I go to bed that nightafter that session.
The session helped.

(01:07:22):
We talked through things and Iwas able to to kind of come to a
place of feeling good and um.
So that night I go to bed andI'm having just crazy dreams,
dark, demonic dreams like from ahorror movie and, um you know,

(01:07:48):
I'm being chased and killed bythis demon in my dream.
Wow.
And, uh, you know, the secondtime that I woke up, it was
choking me and I couldn't evenbreathe physically, like like
this attack, like was, was sointense that I that I literally
felt afraid for my life, wow,and um, in the dream, like, and

(01:08:10):
I still can imagine it andpicture it, just just like I am
seeing right now with my eyes.
You know, I was in this houseand I was hiding from this dark,
black demon that was literallyhis entire purpose was just to
kill me, and you know so, therewas multiple times that I that I

(01:08:30):
woke up, but the second time Iwas being choked in the dream
and I couldn't breathephysically for probably 30
seconds.
And I woke up and I was like,what is happening right now?
I was sweating, I was just, Iwas in it, uh, middle of the
night.
And the third time I'm, I'm,you know, in this house and I'm

(01:08:52):
hiding and, uh, and I look underthe bed and this thing crawls
on me and goes inside of, insidemy mouth, like, like, like a
black well wind or, you know,cloud or whatever.
And as that's happening, Iaudibly and this is, as god is
my witness, this is exactly howit happened I audibly say get

(01:09:17):
out.
And as that's happening, uh, Iwake up, janet, she's laying
next to me in my bed and shetouches my arm and she says that
it was like I had just taken ashower and laid down, wow, and
the bed was soaked.
And she touched my arm andshe's like what is happening?

(01:09:38):
And I say, babe, I'm underattack, I need you to pray for
me.
And I say, babe, I'm underattack, I need you to pray for
me.
And she starts praying for meand she puts her hand on my head

(01:09:59):
and she says, in the name ofJesus Christ, any evil spirits I
command.
Like, in the middle of it, Idon't even know what's happening
to my body, I'm shaking, I amjust experiencing this insane
thing.
And she goes and gets her crossfrom the wall.
She calls this her miraclecross.
It was her dad's cross.

(01:10:19):
Her dad passed away about eightyears ago.
Dad's cross.
Her dad passed away about eightyears ago and he was a warrior,
literally.
He lived in Cuba, wasimprisoned for trying to kill
Fidel Castro.
He was in prison for 18 years,and this happened to me as she
put that cross on my chest.

(01:10:39):
I'm holding it and she ispraying for me with her hand on
my head and I am actually notthere.
Once that cross was on my chest, it was almost like I got a
glimpse into her father's lifefor a minute, and I saw him in

(01:11:06):
prison.
I saw him starved, beingtortured, I saw his life, I saw
his faith and his love for hisdaughter and I felt all of that
with that cross on my chest.
I kid you not.
Wow.
And his name is Victor.
You know he passed away yearsago but he, you know he has a

(01:11:30):
picture on my wife's side of herbed.
So I I I know what he lookslike, I've seen many pictures
with him and I'm holding thiscross and I'm praying with all
of my heart to Jesus and at thatpoint I felt like I was being
torn apart like that, I wasphysically being attacked.
And I'm praying to this crosson my chest and Janet is praying

(01:11:55):
and I look over to the left ofme in the bedroom and I see an
angel to the left of me in thebedroom and I see an angel and
it's it's her dad and he was inthat room with us and he had a
hat like a general's hat on, and, um, he was an angel of light.

(01:12:19):
He was light, like lighting upthe whole room, and he gave me a
smile and a nod and he took outa sword and he started going
after those demons in that room.
Wow.
And I saw it with my eyes.
Wow and as that was happening,I prayed to Jesus and I said

(01:12:41):
Jesus, I'm so sorry for my sins,I'm so sorry for all the
mistakes I have made.
If you save me today, I promiseI will devote the rest of my
life to you.
All glory be to your name, amen.
And when I said that, thedarkness left.

Speaker 1 (01:13:00):
That's amazing.

Speaker 4 (01:13:02):
Yeah, wow, and this cross.

Speaker 1 (01:13:05):
This happened on january 31st.

Speaker 2 (01:13:07):
That all that same day, february 1st, that morning
it was, it was three, eight, itwas like three am into the
morning.
Wow, yeah on february 1st, wow.
And then I went and bought thiscross later that week and it's,
it's my connection to myguardian angel.
And you know, the story getseven a little bit more wild

(01:13:29):
where you know Janet had calledher mom, who's in Florida that
day.

Speaker 1 (01:13:36):
What was going on through your wife's mind at this
point, and did you share thatwith her at that time?

Speaker 2 (01:13:41):
like I just saw, um dad or I'm sure you're in shock,
you're experiencing trauma like, so one thing that I've learned
about and I've talked to acouple of my christian brothers
about this story only a couple,because it's a very private
story, but I'm I'm fine to shareit because I think God wants me

(01:14:02):
to share this story because ofhow powerful the witness was and
you know, seeing that angel andexperiencing that.
So, Janet, she, you know, hadher hand on my head and she
prayed for me and she deliveredme and that is a spiritual gift,

(01:14:24):
the gift of deliverance, andyou know it's in the Bible again
and again and she has differentgifts that we've been kind of
learning about and reading aboutin the Bible.
But that moment of whathappened and how God used her as
an instrument to save me, youknow, and I literally felt like

(01:14:49):
I was at the gates of hell,literally at that moment, where
I was just being torn apartuntil that angel came in and
fought that battle for me.
And you know, I've seen acouple different religious or
church, you know, I would sayperformances Awaken Church is a

(01:15:18):
church that I have a few friendsat and I love that church and I
go to their performances.
Church that I have a fewfriends at, and and I love that
church and I go to theirperformances and I've been to
the last two that they've done,and and they did one around
Christmas which I saw this rightbefore this happened.
So in December I went to it wascalled uh, I think it's called
Twisted, is I?

(01:15:39):
I have to look it, look it upfor sure, but it's.
It's the story of, likeEbenezer Scrooge, told in a
Christian way.
So it's like a Christmasmusical, but it's like the fight
over his soul and they havethis really powerful visual in
that musical where you see theangels and the demons both

(01:16:04):
fighting over his soul and andyou see it like on the stage.
It's a very visual like whoaI'm, I'm seeing this right now
and so I saw that before.
I saw it in person in my ownlife in in my own life, in in my
own bedroom, yeah, and, like I,I think it's a little

(01:16:26):
supernatural.
It's maybe a littleunbelievable for people, but
that's what happened to me andjesus saved me, literally saved
me from the depths of hell, andI didn't understand what it
meant to be saved before thatday, and now, as I've talked to

(01:16:47):
people about their experience ofbeing saved, a lot of them are
actually kind of similar wherethey were at rock bottom, they
were at the you know, the placeof giving up yeah and jesus
saved them right when theyneeded him.

Speaker 1 (01:17:06):
Right on time.
Right on time, so let's go back.
You said that your wife hadcalled her mom the next day.

Speaker 2 (01:17:12):
Yeah, so she had called her after we had that
therapy appointment and I wasnot okay.
Right.
And like that was maybe one ofthe worst days of my life Before
it was the best day of my lifeand she had called her mom and

(01:17:32):
said you know, mom, matt reallyis not okay.
He really needs us to pray forhim.
And she prayed to God and toher husband who had passed and
said Victor, you always wanted ason, please go protect our son.

(01:17:55):
And it was that night that hecame to me, wow, and I think
that he wanted me to see him sothat I could know that the
angels are around me andprotecting me.

Speaker 1 (01:18:11):
Amen.
We're not fighting againstflesh and bones, but powers and
principalities, and the Bible isvery clear about that.
Right, yeah, it's a spiritualwarfare and it's happening all
around us.
They're probably out here rightnow fighting.
We can clear about that, right,yeah, it's a spiritual warfare
and it's happening all around us.
They're probably out here rightnow fighting.
We can't see them, right?
Oh yeah, and you're blessed tobe previewed to actually seeing

(01:18:32):
with your own eyes, right, andI'm sure that instilled so much
additional faith in you.
That is undeniable.

Speaker 2 (01:18:40):
Oh well, and it gets even deeper in you.
That is undeniable.
Oh well, and it gets evendeeper, you know.
So I, I go and visit, um, my,my mother-in-law.
I go and visit janet's mom, uh,in florida.
This was over easter and, uh, wewere in florida for a while and
in um, you know, in florida wewere talking a little bit about

(01:19:02):
it and, like she know, she knewa little bit about it and like
she knew a little bit about thestory.
But she hadn't heard me tell thestory and I told her that.
And when I told her that partof the story with the sword,
janet's mom says, you know thathe had a sword in his car, right
, that he carried, he kept withhim in his car A full-on sword,

(01:19:26):
and like the fact that I sawthat and I didn't even know
about that until after it, justit just was so much more like
knowledge behind what hadhappened.
And you know, I believe inangels, I believe in spirits, I
believe that our ancestors arearound us in one way or another.

(01:19:49):
I believe that there arespirits, both good and bad, on
this earth that are both guidingand distracting us, both
leading us to God and tryingwith all of their might to drag
us to the pits of hell and meexperiencing the spiritual
warfare in this way to have thismoment happen.

(01:20:14):
And you know I actually I gotthis tattoo a couple days after
I was saved.
I can do all things throughChrist, who gives me strength.
I love it.
And I got that tattoo after Iwas saved to anchor what had
just happened to me and it's notquite done.
I'm going to put some star oryou know like kind of like sun

(01:20:36):
beams, like lights, you know,around it, and then I'm going to
do a little bit more with that.

Speaker 1 (01:20:42):
Throw a little sword in there A little sword and a
cross yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:20:46):
So I just you know this is a very special cross to
me and you know I got one forboth me and my wife.
So we bought our crosses on thesame day and I never thought
that I would wear a cross.
I'm not going to lie, becausein the Mormon church they don't
wear crosses, you know.

(01:21:07):
They think more of the livingChrist and it's funny.
I talked to my worship pastorabout this After I bought this
cross.
I was playing music with himand he looked at it and he said,
hey, can I see that?
I said sure.
And so he looks at it and hesaid, hey, can I see that?
I said sure.
And so he looks at it and hesays, yeah, do you see how it's
open in the back?
And I was like, what does thatmean?

(01:21:29):
And he says it's open becauseJesus is risen.
And you know.
So I kind of have the best ofwhat I grew up with and also my
new Christian faith, where, youknow, Mormons believe in the
living Christ and that's whythey don't, you know, have
crosses in their home or whatnot, because they believe that he
was risen, that he leads thechurch.

(01:21:50):
And with this, you know, withan open cross.
It's the cross that he died on,but it's open because he was
risen and it's open because itno longer has Jesus on it, Like
he overcame the cross when hedied for our sins.

Speaker 1 (01:22:13):
Amen, I wear a cross too.
It's a constant reminder.
It's not something that I wouldsay like I idolize, but it is
no, it's a reminder it is aconsistent reminder, um, and I
can truly say that there's beenmany times where I just grab it
right here and that that's,that's enough you know, and I

(01:22:34):
just, you know, I just begin topray.
So, um, I love that, I love, Ilove the story, and that's
really where it all happened.
It happened on the cross, itdid, and so, having that
consistent reminder, however youwant, right, some people like
it, some don't, it doesn'treally matter at the end of the
day, Like I said, I had a verystrong opinion about crosses

(01:22:55):
before I was saved when I wasbecoming Christian and going
through all of you know thesteps of learning this new faith
and really embracing the Bibleat a different level.

Speaker 2 (01:23:11):
And as that was happening, I still was like
Janet thought that I was weirdwith the cross.
She was like, why don't youlike the cross?
Like I don't understand it.
And I was like like it's notthat, it's just different from
how I was raised.
But her cross, you know, hermiracle cross, that was her
dad's.
Um, when, when that was on mychest, I I literally had an

(01:23:34):
experience and and there's powerin that, and and I do believe
that certain objects have power,and I saw his faith.
I you know he would have been myfather-in-law if he wouldn't
have passed away years ago.
He's still your father-in-law.
He's still my father-in-law,and he's still showing me that
he's here.
Yeah, and you know that he'sprotecting me and my wife and

(01:23:58):
our family.
Yeah, and you know, I'mactually writing a worship song
right now.
It's called Army of Angels andit's all about how we each have
an army of angels that is thereto protect and support us and
even if it's unseen, even if wedon't know about those angels

(01:24:20):
there.

Speaker 1 (01:24:20):
we do have support don't know about those angels
there.
We do have support and God willnot abandon us.
He is there for us, amen.
And it's like there's so muchwe don't know, like our little
minds can't comprehend.
But to have an angel there andto have a familiar face too at
that level and I don't know whatthe capabilities of angels are

(01:24:40):
Like none of do we have like alittle glimpse of God that we
probably won't ever fullyunderstand but God knows how it
all works together, and so hecan be the one who's in charge
of all of it.

Speaker 2 (01:24:57):
And God has helpers he really does, and some of
these are people.

Speaker 1 (01:25:01):
The Bible talks all about it and they.
They come in different ways,shapes and forms um, just like
you said, people sometimespeople, sometimes it's spirits
or angels.
Yeah, yeah, 100.
Yeah, that's amazing.
That is a.
That's a very powerfultestimony right there it was.

Speaker 2 (01:25:19):
It was, uh life-changing and and so since
then, everything that I do is isfor the glory of God.
I love it so now.

Speaker 1 (01:25:27):
Now what?
Now you have an experience atthis level.
Um, you're on fire for the Lord.
I saw that.
I mean I must've met you justmaybe a couple months after,
after that experience.

Speaker 2 (01:25:39):
Yeah, it was probably .

Speaker 1 (01:25:41):
I think in March that we met.

Speaker 2 (01:25:42):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:25:42):
I love it.
So you're on fire for the Lord.
Now.
Now what, matt?
What's next?
Yeah, you know.

Speaker 2 (01:25:50):
I, I think that God has some big plans and I'm just
wanting to to listen to hisguidance and what he wants for
my life, and I do believe that,you know, part of what I'm
supposed to do is share mytestimony, and also through

(01:26:12):
music, and so I'm very excitedto be leading worship at this
event and then I'm going to be,you know, working with my
worship pastor as well.
To fit that into the schedule.
I'm still in the process withmy church, but I think that down
the road, I've got a vision of.

(01:26:32):
One of the things that I'mdoing is I'm working with a
group investment group thatbuilds retreat centers, mainly
like leadership retreats, but wewill have a lot of faith-based
retreats that we're working withas well, and I see that being a
lot of.
Where I put my energy in thenext 10 to 20 years is on

(01:26:54):
building these sanctuaries innature where people can
reconnect to themselves, whilethey reconnect to God and to, uh
, you know, to God's beauty andin nature, and so we've already
got a couple of these retreatcenters, and one of them will be
in Costa Rica.
Um, and so you know, I, I hadthis, this whole vision of, uh,

(01:27:17):
you know, leading this was likea couple months ago, but I it
was like a couple months ago,but it was like a vision of
leading a big worship group inCosta Rica, like Telos, costa
Rica, and leading worship andpraising and singing and playing
guitar, very open to, to god'splan right now.

(01:27:40):
Even the last 90 days has beenvery different from my plan,
which I am starting to surrendermy plans to god help and uh and
say god, just guide me.
You know, um, I know that youhave all power and that you are.
You are merciful as well as allknowing, and I'm going to trust

(01:28:03):
you.
You know, it's just like in theBible trust not on your own or
lean not under, lean not ontoyour own understanding, but
trust in the Lord.

Speaker 1 (01:28:13):
And all your ways acknowledge him.
Yep A hundred percent, andthat's it.

Speaker 2 (01:28:17):
What I'm really trying to do is live by that
scripture and truly trust himand acknowledge him and
everything that I do, andglorify his name and his glory
with, uh, with everything thatthat is happening right now in
my life.

Speaker 1 (01:28:31):
Yeah, no, that's great.
We, uh, me, me and my wife, my,my daughters too Um, we always
sing.
I will be content in everycircumstance.
Gyra, you are enough, andthat's just a constant reminder.
And you talked about havingscripture, right, um, or having
worship songs that you reallylike turn to and lean to.

(01:28:52):
Um, we're big on that, like I'm.
I'm so big on just leaning intogod because, at the end of the
day, like we're just stewards,none of this is ours, right,
like this isn't realized, not mycompany, there's.
None of this equipment is mine,not, these aren't even my pants

(01:29:12):
.
Like, I've just been blessedwith the ability to.
It's a gift.
I'm here to steward what I'vebeen given.
But a pastor gave me a greatmessage years ago and the whole
theme of it is life's like agame of Monopoly.
It all goes back in the box andso we don't get to take

(01:29:33):
anything with us and we're justhere to steward the gifts that
God has given us, whether it'srelationships or our children,
or companies and businesses, ora church, or whatever your gifts
are that the Lord has given youto steward.
It's just stewardship.
And so, having that stewardshipmentality, which I love, that

(01:29:53):
you have that stewardshipmentality and you're really just
entrusting with God.

Speaker 2 (01:29:57):
Yeah, Well, and it's like I've had a lot and I've had
a little and I've hadeverything in between and,
honestly, at this point I could,you know, sell all my
possessions, my cars and, youknow, guitars.
I don't want to sell it.

Speaker 1 (01:30:15):
So you got to live out the Job story.
We'll do it.

Speaker 2 (01:30:19):
I can get rid of everything and and be totally
just fine at this point.
Point because I feel like God heneeded to break me down through
what happened with releasing myattachment to money and career,
job and making money and becomeobsessed about it.
And you know, God says that hedoesn't want us to be worshiping
any idols and you know, I thinkthat I was so obsessed with

(01:30:41):
money and achieving and then,once I got to that level of

(01:31:04):
achievement, I was like, oh, I'mnot even filled.
Yeah, exactly, I want to share.
Um, this is kind of similar tothe monopoly analogy.
But one of my friends, uh, sam,he, he explained this uh to me
at at, at a time where you knowit's like we're all just

(01:31:25):
building our sandcastle, okay,and so you know, you're on the
beach and you can build a littletiny sandcastle, that's just
kind of like a little tiny thingand that's fine.
And some people will build likea huge sandcastle and they got
like all the shovels and all thefoxes and you know, and and and
that's fine.
God wants us to be abundant.

(01:31:45):
I truly believe that and a lotof the stories and parables in
the Bible support that.
The parable of the talents,like he wants us to multiply our
gifts and to multiply our money, our wealth, our influence,
everything.
God is a God of abundance andthere's more than enough for

(01:32:07):
everyone.
And so, like, having anabundant mindset I think is so
important, yeah, so like for me,with my sandcastle, like I'm
going to build it as cool and asbig as I want, but it's not
about that, because at the endof the day, the beach and the
waves, they wash it all away andour life is, is our sandcastle

(01:32:29):
Right?
And?
And you might have to buildmultiple sandcastles again and
again, some big, some small, butit doesn't really matter
because at the end of the day,you know this life is not about
the things and the material, andyou know whatever it is like.
And for me, like, I even have acouple very, very nice cars,
and you know it's not about thatanymore for me like, for me, I

(01:32:53):
want to glorify god amen and umso.
So you asked what's next.
So I do have a book that isgoing to be coming out.
Uh, I am 80 plus percent donewith it.
Let's go.
Need to finish the manuscript,but there's about.

Speaker 1 (01:33:06):
What's the book about ?

Speaker 2 (01:33:08):
Oh, the book is all about dreams and how to create
your dream life, you know, andand really how to turn your
dreams into reality.
You know, I had this big dreamin my life to travel to 100
countries.
Big dream in my life to travelto 100 countries.
I've already been to 46countries Nice, 47.
Now Halfway there, halfwaythere 47 countries at 35 years

(01:33:29):
old.
But that was like that was alsoa little bit of an obsession of
mine.
So I'm learning how to dialthings back into like having a
more abundant, aligned life,yeah, where it's not so much
about me or about achievement orwhatever, but it can be more
about a bigger picture.
And so this book is all about,like how to turn your dreams

(01:33:53):
into reality.
Um, and, you know, there's alot of Christian uh stories and
ideas and thoughts in there aswell that I think will really
resonate with people, and thatworship album.
I'm going to be working on that.
Let's go.
I'll keep you posted as that iscoming into the world.

Speaker 1 (01:34:11):
I'm super excited to hear that, and the truth is, god
wants to partner with us in ourdreams and our goals.
Right, god wants to partnerwith us, and I think people
mistake that.
They think that we can't havethese goals and dreams and these
large visions of what we wantin life.
God's a creator and he createdus to be creators.

Speaker 2 (01:34:33):
Right, and the world is is abundant with resources
and the creations that we canmake.
You just have to create itfirst in your mind before it
comes into reality, and you knowso.
So I think that people willlike the book.
Um, I'm still in the process ofit, but I thought that I would

(01:34:54):
be publishing it this year, butI'm committed to next year
publishing.
I think that that's going to bebetter on the timing side.
Awesome.
But yeah, you know.
So there's a lot of fun stuffcoming, but I'm super stoked
that we were able to have thisconversation.

Speaker 1 (01:35:09):
Yeah, no, I appreciate you.

Speaker 2 (01:35:11):
To share about this experience that really made a
huge impact on my life.

Speaker 1 (01:35:16):
Yeah, no, thank you for coming in and sharing.
I know the viewers aredefinitely going to be highly
encouraged by your story,hopefully.

Speaker 2 (01:35:26):
My goal is to be giving a message of hope and
healing and you know, just like,at this point, I feel more
aligned with Jesus than I everhave.
That's amazing.
And for people that are stilltrying to have a relationship
with Jesus, just start, you know, just start.

(01:35:46):
Just start reading his word,just start praying and and
asking for guidance and askingfor you know, his, his hand in
your life, cause he is the wayand and he will help you with
the way of your life and whereyou're headed.

Speaker 1 (01:36:03):
Amen.
I am the way, the truth and thelife.
Nobody comes to the Fatherexcept through me, and so it's
important that we know that, andmy favorite verse is 1
Corinthians 13, 13.
And now these three remainfaith, hope and love, the
greatest of these being love,and that's what it's all about.
Like you said at the beginningof the podcast, you know it's
all about love, so appreciateyou sharing your story.

(01:36:24):
Is there any last words thatyou want to you want to share?
I?

Speaker 2 (01:36:28):
feel very, very happy with how.
I was a little nervous becausemy story was, as you could see,
a pretty impactful, you knowkind of intense experience.
As you could see, a prettyimpactful, you know kind of
intense experience but I'mreally, really happy that I was

(01:36:49):
able to share it and I thinkit's going to give a lot of
people hope and that anyone thatwants to reach out to me feel
free.
You know I'm very open tohearing from people and where
can we find?
you.
You can find me on Facebook orInstagram, you know.
On Facebook, just Matt Crowther.
On Instagram, yeah.
If on Facebook, just MattCrowther.
On Instagram, yeah, if you justsearch for Matt Crowther,
you'll see a picture of me andmy wife and then you know I'm

(01:37:10):
really a coach.
Right now I'm doing a lot oflife coaching and just still
doing a lot with solar.
But really like, if people feellike they resonate with any of
this, feel free to reach out andwe could talk about coaching.
But you know, I've I've hadthree life coaches the past
seven years.
That have all been a huge partof my life, uh, and and so

(01:37:33):
that's partly why I got intocoaching and started doing a
little bit more with thiscoaching business that me and my
wife started.

Speaker 1 (01:37:40):
I love it.
Yeah, no, coaching is huge.
Having good mentors, andespecially on a spiritual level,
is game changing.
So right on, matt.
Thank you so much for sharingyour story.
Thank you, guys for tuning inthe Fueling Faith podcast.
Make sure to tune in on thenext episode.

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