Deciphering Migraines: From Triggers to Treatment

Ever wondered why migraines are more common in women? Ever wondered why certain foods trigger migraines? Ever struggled to find a solution that really gets to the root of the problem? We, Dr. Houston Anderson and Dr. Gabe, are here to answer these burning questions. Join our enlightening conversation about migraines, their triggers, treatments, and the significant role diet plays in their management. Let us explain why migraines are more than a mere headache— they are a neurologic condition impacting the trigeminal nerve in the brainstem, affected by genetics and a sensitive nervous system.

Within our discussion, we shed light on how TMJ and C1 alignment factor into migraines, and why it's important to address these issues. Hear us talk about the limitations of commonly used drugs and over-the-counter pain relievers and how they often overlook the core of the problem. We'll also delve into the importance of personal health history in determining the cause of migraines, and why tension headaches and migraines need different approaches.

Ideas for managing migraines through diet and supplements, identifying food triggers, and the importance of balancing sodium and potassium levels for cellular hydration are all on the table. We'll discuss in detail how iron deficiency, particularly in women with carbohydrate-dominant diets, influences migraines. You'll also get practical tips on supplements like artichoke extract and magnesium. As we wrap up, we'll focus on the significance of addressing the root causes of migraines for lasting relief. Make sure you join us next time as we answer your questions from Instagram in our Q&A session!

Looking to connect with Dr. Anderson?
https://linktr.ee/doctorhouston

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:01):
Hey guys, welcome back to the podcast.
I'm Dr Houston Anderson.
I'm here with Dr Gabe.
How are you today, doc?
I'm doing good, man.
How are you Good?
I was thinking about recurringthemes this week and in the
office, and I think that one ofthe recurring themes that I was
thinking about was, simply, Ihad at least like three phone
consults.
They're throughout the world,but there are people that have

(00:21):
read my stuff, listened to apodcast, and then they call me
on the phone.
They pay $250 for 30 minutes.
It's pretty expensive to talkon the phone and I always say
like well, have you done thethings that I recommended?
And the answer is always no.
And so I think, even before westart this podcast, like my
theme for the week is like, hey,if you hear something from me

(00:42):
or Dr Gabe, like we're notspitting out like possibilities
or low probability informationhere, we're trying to throw out
the best stuff.
Yeah, there's always anexception to the rule, but if
you haven't tried our basics yet, you know and I can't give you
medical advice via podcast, butif you haven't tried our basics,
make sure that you do those.
Listen to the podcast, thinkabout what we said that you

(01:04):
haven't done, think about allthe things you're doing that we
say don't work, and then startreforming before you hop on the
phone.
We are always happy to talk,but if I'm just gonna tell you
the same thing I told you on apodcast, you can save yourself a
few bucks.
How about you Doc any themesthis week?

Speaker 2 (01:19):
No, I like that.
You made me actually thinkabout something.
I know my patient population isa bit different from yours but,
like how often one of thebiggest struggles I'm running
into is and, depending on thecase, is how much I will push it
.
But I will send everyone paleohandouts.
But a lot of people think youknow you can just get away with

(01:40):
not eating paleo, especiallyduring the healing phase,
because that's where I'mstrictest and I will go.
These are guidelines.
This is how you should eat.
For now.
I want you to focus because Ifound gluten, focus on gluten,
but keep this in mind.
And then usually I become alittle bit stricter and then it
kind of depends on the case.
Some cases, you know, if it'sreally dire, I'm like you better

(02:02):
be on top of this and eatingwell.
But yeah, I know that's been mylittle bit of a reoccurring
theme lately is people who wantto kind of continue having one
foot in standard American dietand one not.
And it's just kind of aninteresting thing because,
especially the amount of timeswe're dealing with insulin
problems and that's where thecrux of the issue is and it

(02:25):
seems so simple because it is.
It literally is simple andpeople are looking for something
more complex, but when it comesdown to it, you gotta eat more
protein and stop eating so manycars.

Speaker 1 (02:38):
Yeah, I had a patient this week and I don't think she
listens to the podcast but newpatient and she's really sweet.
But I took her off dairy andshe has like a raw milk dairy
like pickup service.
She does for the community andmakes everything raw cheese.
And I was like, oh man, I'm sosorry, but no, the reality is,
it's gonna be such a hugetrigger for so many people, and

(03:00):
that's what we'll talk abouttoday when we get to the
migraine stories.

Speaker 2 (03:03):
So why?

Speaker 1 (03:04):
don't you give me some migraine stats?
What's going on here and maybesomewhere today at least like
share your experience withmigraines.
Maybe we've covered it a littlebit, but if I'm not wrong, we
would call you a migraineur.

Speaker 2 (03:16):
I don't think we actually have.
We talked about my dopamineissue last time, but yeah.
So migraine stats one out ofseven people in the world it's
actually pretty high.
Much more common in women andthat's often due to many
migraines or due to hormoneimbalance, and so that's the
reason why it's three times moreprevalent in women.
There is a little bit of ainheritance I inherited it or

(03:42):
the predisposition from my mom.
It's like a 50% chance that oneparent has migraines.
It's a 75% chance of two havemigraines.
That's both of them, and so,yeah, it's pretty bad.
2% of those cases will bechronic migraines, which means
you're getting a migraine morethan 15 days a month.
That is where I fall.

(04:02):
I fell into the chronicmigraines To the point.
Yeah, and let me just actuallyshare that story since I'm on it
.
So in high school is when Istarted getting migraines.
I remember my mom getting thembeforehand.
I mean, my friends would belike playing video games or
something like.
I remember one time or Iplaying one video game and we're
just being absolutely noisy ascan be and my mom's like

(04:25):
screaming at us because I didn'tunderstand how horrible they
were and she was just liketrying to lay in bed.
She's sound sensitive, lightsensitive, so she's having a
rough time and she says stop itguys.
And then I got my first one inhigh school, and typically they
happen once or twice a month,some weirdly always on Sunday,

(04:47):
and I don't know why, if I wasjust eating weirdly or whatever,
but that was one thing Iremember.
It was always on Sunday.
I get super nauseous and I hadended up throwing up, and
usually throwing up wouldactually relieve it, but I
remember that.
But I also remembered I didn'tknow what to do about it.
I had no medication that Ithought would help.

(05:07):
My mom used to use, I think, arudus before it was off the
market, but I had nothing that Iknew would help.
But I'd only get them once ortwice a month.
But as that progressed you know, missionary in Africa think I
had them a few times there butby then I knew Excedrin would
help and so I had a bottle ofExcedrin.

(05:28):
I didn't get them super common,I just can't remember.
I don't think I ever wrote downhow many times I had them.
And then, as I got home andstarted going to school, nursing
school and all that, theystarted to get worse and worse,
to the point that I went to andthis will kind of lead to the
conventional approach a littlebit.
I went to a medical doctor oncampus at Missouri State and he

(05:50):
told me to take propranolol.
I was hoping to get anothermedication called a tryptin,
which is those things that willstop the migraine early on.
But since Excedrin worked, hesaid, just keep using that.
You may want to consider takingfree a leave instead to see if
that would help.
Otherwise, he put me onpropranolol.
It took the migraines and atthis time I was probably getting

(06:12):
four or five a week down totwice a month, but I was only.
I had a six month prescriptionof propranolol and if anyone
knows what that is, that's abeta blocker.
So technically it helps withblood pressure and they just
found that it would help withmigraines too, and that's likely
because we're gonna get intowhy what migraines are doing in
the brain.
But that took them down to twomonths, but after six months

(06:35):
they started coming back.
My prescription ran out and Iwas tired of taking a
propranolol prescription.
I didn't want to be.
I have a crutch.
At first I kind of liked it,but then I was like I don't want
a crutch for life.
I want to be able to fix this,and so I went to chiropractic
care.
Somebody bought me two rounds ofadjustments.
It seemed to help, but I don'tknow what else was going on at

(06:59):
that time either, because assoon as I went to chiropractic
school, hoping, oh, regularadjustments, sweet.
It made them worse.
I remember and of course we'renot the best adjusters in school
starting off, but still Iremember one time I got an
adjustment, saw stars, whichthat's not actually a good sign.
If you ever get an adjustmentof your neck and you see stars,

(07:20):
that's actually a really badsign.
Just burned a neuron, butanyways, it started a migraine,
and it wasn't until we had thatseminar with Dr Gangemi.
All of us and he figured outmigraines being caused by gluten
, and that ends up being one ofthe main things you're looking
for with migraines is a foodtrigger, A major food trigger,

(07:44):
and we'll get into the triggersin a second.
But that took away my migrainescompletely.
I had other headaches on top ofthem, and so my life is riddled
with several different types ofheadaches, but the migraines
are gone.
So that's how I solved mychronic migraines, due to Dr
Gangemi.
Shout out to him, but it isactually one of the top 10

(08:07):
disabling medical illnesses inthe world.
Like it is totally disabling ifyou actually had a migraine.
We were just talking about howsome people think they have a
migraine and in reality theydon't.
And you can usually tellbecause they're talking to you.
They are actually enjoying yourpresence.
If you have a migraine, you'renot enjoying anyone's presence.

(08:27):
You wanna shut yourself offbecause it hurts that bad and
you're nauseous, all thesethings.
But yeah, that's pretty much, Ithink, the statistics as well
as my story.

Speaker 1 (08:38):
Yeah, so if I go back to like kind of my podcast from
a year ago on this, just ashout out to that so like I'm
trying to take a differentapproach on this podcast from
the one I took last time because, as I say, there's always like
10 different stories that tellyou know the cause of something.
So if you haven't listened tothat podcast before, I do have
my own MyRain podcast, but I didwant to bring Dr Gabon here and

(08:59):
talk to him about it.
But I think that people allhave different stories when it
comes to migraines.
So what we're going to talkabout today are some of like the
really basic things.
So, just to go to some of thebasic, a basic tenant that I
would say is important tounderstand my migraines is they
are neurologically based, right?
So that's the one thing thatsets a migraine apart from, say,

(09:22):
a headache.
They can still have the sametriggers, but what you're
running into is anoverstimulated nervous system
and not even specifically Idon't like the word nervous
system for migraines.
Neurons, nerves, firingthresholds those kind of words
are what I would use more todescribe migraines and
essentially the way your nerveswork in your brain.

(09:42):
Is you either you're all in oryou're not firing at all, and
what happens is you get too muchinto the firing and it gets a
little bit complicated for yourbrain to figure out.
It starts doing compensatorymechanisms for whatever the
trigger was.
And I don't even think we needto talk about too many triggers
today, because I mean there'shundreds of triggers for
migraine sufferers, you know,and that's just because they're

(10:04):
at threshold.
Yeah, they're right at thatthreshold where anything will
set them off, will fire a nerve.
They're so even like if you gointo neurology, it's like really
fun.
Like you could smell something,you could feel a vibration.
Literally the vibration of yourcar could set off a migraine
and then brushing your arm hairtowards the direction that it

(10:25):
lays is calming against it.
So like your kid comes up andlike so my kids do this all the
time and they rub my hair thewrong way in my arms and it
super frustrates me because it'sirritating.
Right, it's a nervous systemirritation.
Luckily I don't get migraines,but if I can convince them to
rub me the other way, I'm like,oh, thank you, I love you too.
Those are fun things.
Like just those littleirritants and yes, of course

(10:48):
it's because like it's at theend of the day and I've had a
good long day, so those are thethings, but there anything can
be a trigger.
So I don't want to like saylike, yeah, we'll talk about a
few specifics as we go, just byhappenstance.
But I don't want to say like,oh, it's the lie, oh, it's this,
oh, yours is unique because x,y or z, they're not as unique as
you think.
They're just nervous systemstimulatory and and I hope that

(11:11):
we didn't lose all our migrainelisteners because of that
because we can be very obsessedwith like nobody understands my
migraines.

Speaker 2 (11:20):
I think you're 100% right there and like I like that
you started off with aneurologic thing, because so
many people don't understandthat it is not just a headache,
it's a neurologic condition,because some people will get a
migraine without the head andthat's actually really important
to notice.
It's just for most people it's.
It's affecting your trigeminalnerve in your brainstem.

(11:41):
That's why it's so ridiculouslypainful.
Your trigeminal nerve.
It provides sensation to mostof your face and your head up
until, like you know, top ofyour head, back your head, that
sort of thing.
But it also descends down intoyour, the top of your, your neck
, and so that in of itself isone of the reasons now your

(12:05):
brain doesn't get has any painreceptors.
You can poke your brain all youwant, you won't feel it, but
your blood vessels in yourmeninges do have pain receptors
and that is what the trigeminalnerve is really going after and
that's where we get into the allthe migraine stuff.
But one of the things I loveabout it is all these weird
symptoms that you do get theyawning, the nausea, all those

(12:25):
things is primarily due to thebleed over effect from the
trigeminal nerve fire and so youget this bleed over effect
where it's firing close to theseother neurons and then those
neurons start to fire.
It's kind of that whole whatwired together or what's what is
it?
What wires together firestogether.

(12:46):
That sort of thing from neuroneurology.
Yeah, yeah, similar to that,but anyways, you get that bleed
over affecting, you get theseweird oras, you get all these
weird symptoms and it's becauseof how this nerve complex is
firing.

Speaker 1 (13:00):
Yeah, I think I just could you mention that way, the
brain so much, and the spillovereffect.
A lot of people say thatmigraines are genetic, right,
and there's definitely, like yousaid, hereditary migraines.
But what essentially what youhave is you have a brain wired
similar to your parents that iscapable of creating these
sensations.
Usually it means that you havea very sensitive nervous system,
and that could be like you canexpect that and almost anything.

(13:23):
It could be that you're astressed out person and so
you're very detail oriented,like OCD almost.
It could be that you're justbrilliant, like really smart,
but you'll notice that yourbrain might function just
slightly different than otherpeople's.
It's similar to your family butmaybe different.
But it could be better or worseas far as that goes.
But you'll find thatessentially, yes, you're
predisposed to having thecapability to have a migraine.

(13:46):
I often tell my patients youknow I can't resonate with a lot
of the brain stuff that theyhave, because that's like
probably my strongest organ, notthat I'm super smart, but that
I don't.
I don't get headaches.
I mean maybe like five in mylife that I can think of which
I'm so lucky, right, and thenI'm not prone to like depression
Right, I'm just not prone to it.

(14:07):
I mean, I've been here a whileon this earth now and I just
don't.
I'm like, oh, it's a great daynow once again.
People hate me for that, I getit, but like if you had my gut
issues that you had to wake upwith every morning, then, like
you know, I got my own issuestoo right.
So more chronic fatigue that wehave to deal with all the time.
It's like we're chasing our ownproblems.

(14:27):
But I would say like my brainor my head is just not wired to
be overly sensitive to thesekind of things.
Maybe even some of the jawissues or maybe my immune system
strong.
So, just because you mentionedit, that trigeminal vascular
complex concept is simply likeyou do want to make sure that
that C one is aligned.
You do want to make sure thatyou don't have any TMJ issues

(14:49):
that are constantly setting offthat nerve and then, once again
now anything sets off a migraine.

Speaker 2 (14:57):
I think that's an important thing.
And then the last thing I wantto mention, just because I'm
always kind of concerned withthis for people, because we're
the root cause guys, we want togo after the root cause and
sometimes I think in our arenawe might forget the means to the
end.
We don't.
I think me and you do a prettygood job to make sure that.
You know people are trying tobe as comfortable as possible.

(15:19):
Give them some things in themeantime, as far as you can,
heal and get over migraines.
Sometimes it's not that quickfor some people because there's
layers that we got to go through, and so I always try to explain
to them when you're getting amigraine.
If it is a true migraine, it'svascular dilation, your blood
vessels are opening up and so,as much as you know, caffeine

(15:42):
can be a problem in people'slives.
It absolutely is a problem.
It is one of.
If it works for you, it is oneof the best things that you can
do if you notice a migrainecoming on, if you do not want to
close yourself off from for twoto 72 hours.
So I usually will tell them,like, get some cough, like
organic coffee or some likeorganic urbimate or something
like that, and stave it off ifyou absolutely have to, because

(16:06):
caffeine's effect in the brainis a vasoconstrictor and that's
why it actually helps out of theectodrine complex, and to me
that's a whole lot better thantaking.

Speaker 1 (16:18):
Yeah, I think you know, without going too far into
the approaches yet, but I thinkyou know one of the problems
with X-Sedarin is it damagesyour gut.
Now we're dealing with adamaged gut while we're trying
to fix things Liver also,especially if you're going for
like the acetaminophen kind ofthing, maybe that works better
for you sometimes.
And even then you know I'll getinto this on some of the root

(16:42):
causes.
But you know vasodilation inthe brain essentially, but you
can have vasoconstriction belowthe brain, below the brain, and
so the vasoconstriction belowmakes you require a vasodilation
above to compensate that youhave enough blood flow to the
brain.
So obviously you don't haveproblems.
So you have like bothconditions going on at once.

(17:04):
And it's why you don't see thatstraight vasodilators or
vasoconstrictors other thancaffeine that have 100% results
all the time.
And it's why caffeine doesn'twork for everyone too, because
sometimes you can't overcomeother things but it's kind of
complicated on that.
But like your beta blocker, forexample, is going to actually
vasodilate in the systemiccirculation, right, it's very

(17:26):
confusing for people, I meanthat's the same with caffeine
too, because it technically is avasodilator in your muscles.

Speaker 2 (17:33):
Correct, because it's trying to get the blood flow
through, because it's fight orflight.
You're adrenaline, it's time togo, yeah.

Speaker 1 (17:42):
And the last thing, on the just signs and symptoms a
lot of people do suffer aftertheir migraines for days, right,
like you said, it can take alittle bit of time to recover.
At a minimum, like as a docwe're looking for, I always say
I'm not looking for yourmigraines to go away.
Today, though I want to say Idon't know if I've ever had a
migraine case that lasted morethan six months, like literally

(18:04):
most are like three months.
Honestly, it kind of depends onwho they are and where they are
in their health, but three tosix months is kind of the window
where most people should be 80to 90% better.
I'm not even going to say 100%,just 89% percent, I think
you're right.

Speaker 2 (18:19):
Especially with the hormone ones making up a good
portion of them, that can take alittle bit of time.

Speaker 1 (18:23):
Yeah, balancing the female hormones specifically.
I think that's pretty common,but I think, if I can get your
quote unquote migraine hangoverto go down from 72 hours to 24
hours, or maybe it's just fourhours, or maybe a 30 minute nap
instead of a six hour nap isenough to make it go away.
That's what I'm looking at.
I'm looking at okay, what canwe get down or can we get?

(18:46):
You know, you've tried caffeineor coffee before and it wasn't
enough to stave off the actualfull migraine.
You feel the prodrome coming,the auras you're seeing.
But now we can even get thecaffeine to work.
Okay, great, now we gave yousome quality of life to start,
while we kind of dig deeper.
And that's the biggest thingthat when I find people that
quit on their natural migrainetreatment, it's because they're

(19:08):
like, well, I tried and itdidn't work, and it's like, well
, you tried like one thing forone week, right, and that's not
the way it works, because thenervous system is, like you said
, right at threshold, right onedge, and we have to slowly but
surely back that off.
In addition, the more often youadd migraines, the more you
develop the neural pathways thatfire more often.
So, like you said, like thefiring together, wiring together

(19:29):
, firing together concept, it'slike a road the more you drive
on it, the more built in thatroad is, and so you actually end
up in habits.
You're having habitualmigraines now, which are just
completely different than theoriginal one that you had, and
we have work to do so let's talkabout conventional.

Speaker 2 (19:44):
Welcome to my life.
Welcome to my life.

Speaker 1 (19:49):
And I think this is a great condition for me to like
explain to people like, look,I've never experienced like a
migraine as far as I know it.
You know I've had a headache ortwo, obviously, but like, and
maybe a bad headache, maybe noteven a bad headache ever, but
I've never had a migraine.
But like, if you listen enoughto patients and if a patient can
say things objectively, I canlearn the stories right.

(20:10):
I can, you know.
I wasn't trained on migrainesin any school class specifically
.
This is what patients havetaught me over the years and I
just listen and listen and wefigure it out.
And that's the cool thing, Iwould say a good doctor listens
to you and figures it out withyou.
They don't have to be thesmartest person that ever
existed, they don't have to be,you know, the only migraine
expert in the world.

(20:31):
They just have to be someone tohear what you said, trust you
and go with you.
So I love that, yeah.

Speaker 2 (20:36):
Yeah, no, I love that too.
And what you were saying theretoo, like, yeah, 100%, like if
we had covered migraines inschool, it was like so many even
in the functional medicineworld.
I don't think that was evertouched on with our training.
And then, in addition to that,the one thing that I remember
that I loved the most was a bookrecommended to me.
It's now outdated, I'm sure,but Oliver Sacks.

(20:58):
He's a pretty famousneurologist out there and they
made a movie about him because Ithink it's what Awakening or
whatever.
Robin Williams plays him, buthe has a book called Migraine.
It's for those who want to nerdup, because it's not for the
layman by any means, but youwill learn at least at that time
the best research that we hadon migraine, and it's pretty

(21:21):
phenomenal.
For I would say.
Still, though, I think we'velearned a little bit since then.

Speaker 1 (21:26):
Yeah, putting it together?
I think yeah, after everyonelistens to podcasts.
I always say something thatthey don't agree with, or they,
some other doctor said different.
And they always ask me likewell, you said this, I made a no
.
I'm going to ask you on ournext visit what did you mean?
And the reality is like there'sa lot of research and I haven't
read that book, but I'm surewhen it's put together, that's
what we want, right?
My job as a doctor is not toteach you the PhD level you know

(21:49):
information on neuroscience.

Speaker 2 (21:51):
My job is to say like how For the nerd person who
wants to learn that, yeah, we'reclinicians, we're not
researchers, we're clinicians.
We're going to look for themost effective, efficient way to
help somebody Like I wastalking to somebody the other
day about herbs and justgenerally yeah, you could learn
everything there is in the world, about every single herb in the
world, but that doesn't tellyou what is actually effective
and efficient for treating apatient.

(22:12):
You're going to read and say,well, this herb like I don't
know Euro or something like thatcan do this, this and this is
like, yeah, but so can this, andit's much more effective at it.

Speaker 1 (22:23):
Yep, I love that, I love that and that's I go crazy
on that.
With artichoke, you know that,just like there's a million
different hormone stuff, but byfar clinically, artichoke is
like my winner, regardless ofwhat the research says, and I
know why, but like to explain itto everyone is complicated, so
I just say trust me on this one.

Speaker 2 (22:40):
This herb works for hormones you know that's one I
mainly use for hormones, unlessI'm looking at a vitamin mineral
issue because of likemethylation or something like
that.

Speaker 1 (22:50):
Doc, why don't you tell me about some of the things
that you ran it so you gotpropanolol there.
You go at the doctor's officethe first time.
You know what are some of theother things you've seen
patients come in with as far asmedications or conventional
approach to treatment.

Speaker 2 (23:06):
So tryptons are pretty common.
Imetrex is like the probablynumber one that somebody will be
on, I think it's generic islike Sumitrypton or something
like that.
Those are the abortives if youcatch them early.
If you don't catch them early,they don't really do their job.
There's injections.
There's several injections now.
There's emgality and a fewothers that people are using and

(23:27):
it's like once a monthinjections.
All kind of work similarly topropanolol, in that they're just
trying to reduce the frequencyand severity of it.
That's usually their goalreduce frequency and severity.
When I went to the doctor andthat was 2008 or 2009 summer
around there they still talkedabout food triggers.

(23:49):
I don't really ever hear thatbeing mentioned from any of my
patients, like given a list offood, possible food triggers.
It's not very common, like Iremember them talking about
chocolate and all thesedifferent things that could do
it, but it's been a long timesince I've heard anyone come in
or state or even hear fromothers that aren't patients

(24:09):
talking about the list of foodtriggers that are possible.
Other than that, then it's yourover the counter pain relievers
and says that's usually what Ihear and a couple of people come
in saying that ibuprofen willknock it out and I'm like
surprised because that never didanything to me.
I'm like, really that actuallyhelped.
Okay, but that means then wecould be looking at a fatty acid

(24:32):
issue, as me and you well know.
So yeah.

Speaker 1 (24:36):
So I mean I think yeah, even with ibuprofen.
The question is, how often areyou going to have to use that?
Are you using that daily?
Are you doing 1600 milligrams aday just to get by?
I mean, eventually you run intoa problem.
Obviously, we know pushing ittoo hard and we run into
leukotriene issues which aresuper painful and inflammatory,
and then both you and I areworking a lot harder on those
because those are a pain in thebutt to get down.

Speaker 2 (24:58):
So we can cause pain by themselves.
And then you're like well, areyou having a migraine or are you
just having a leukotriene issue?

Speaker 1 (25:04):
Right, and they're super painful.
So hence why we have painmanagement and stuff like that,
because we over abuse a lot ofthings in our lives.
So let's go through natural.
Let's say someone comes intoyour office.
What's the history part?
What are you asking them?

Speaker 2 (25:21):
So usually if it's migraines is the thing that they
put down on their intake forms.
That's what they're coming infor.
I'm going to be asking generalhistory questions that we always
ask, like what else is going on?
Do you have any gut issues?
All those things.
But I want to differentiate theheadache.
Is it an actual migraine?
Because some people will comein and I'm like that probably is
more like attention headache,though there is decent amount of

(25:43):
overlap there.
I get attention headaches too.
Like I do understand theoverlap To the point that it's
really difficult because you canget nausea with that.
You can also get, in additionto nausea, you can get the sound
sensitivity and stuff like thatwith a bad tension headache.
But you want to differentiatethat.
Sometimes it'll be an actualcluster headache.

(26:05):
That's a little bit differentfrom a migraine.
But we're going to probablyfrom me and you.
Our standpoint is like well,the root cause is relatively the
same.

Speaker 1 (26:15):
It's just more random .

Speaker 2 (26:16):
It's just kind of more random with a cluster
headache, and so I just I firstwant to differentiate that.
I want to know if this is atrue migraine, what's the
history of it?
Are you getting?
Where's the headache located?
Because sometimes it's likeright here on your temples and
they get a lot of pain there.
There's not necessarily nauseaand vomiting.

(26:38):
Then I'm like well, you got TMJproblems, you're clenching your
teeth or you're doing something.
So that's the main thing.
I want to be able todifferentiate that because it'll
be a different approach to adegree, like as muscle testers,
as a pluriconegiatologist,there's only so far that we can
really lead the testing beforewe realize something's not right
we're going down the wrongavenue.

(27:00):
However, that's usually myapproach right off the bat is I
want a good diet, history,personal health history, and
then what type of headache areyou having?

Speaker 1 (27:09):
I know, after I've been doing this for a few years.
I always tell people honestlylike I love muscle testing and
it's like totally the best wayto get treatment, in my opinion,
obviously, but sometimes Ipretty much feel like I can
diagnose them while they'restill sitting in their chair,
right, you know they're like ohmy gosh, they're all virtual.
Yeah, you know, I get migrainesevery time I eat beef jerky.

(27:30):
You know like, huh, that'sweird.
You know, like you know is it,is it okay?

Speaker 2 (27:34):
And it's organic yeah .

Speaker 1 (27:37):
Well, it could be that, or it could be literally
just the chewing mechanism,right yeah, and then anything
you know.
So they just kind of give theseclues and then you tease out,
okay, is it the processed meatsor is it the chewing mechanism?
And you kind of figure that out.
We test out those two things onthe table and we're down to two
options instead of 52 optionsfor what's causing them.
So that's what.

(27:57):
That's what we're seeing thefunctional medicine doc, or the,
or the well versed doc thatknows migraines, that does
muscle testing Some people callit frequency medicine slightly
different, but kind of the same.
Different ways to address aperson, you know, assess them.
You know, muscle testing to meis not energetic, but there are
energetic forms of muscletesting.

Speaker 2 (28:15):
So yeah, Lots of ways to go through, yeah.

Speaker 1 (28:19):
So we prefer the R way, but it doesn't mean that
the other ones don't work.
It just takes a specialpractitioner and do each type of
tech techniques.
So you just got to know whatyou're going in for and make
sure that you resonate with thatpractitioner, okay.
So what else am I going to lookat?
So I don't.
I think I found probably I meanI probably only had like two,
300 cases, I don't, I don't.
That's a large gap, like Idon't know 200, 250 cases of

(28:42):
migraines in my practice overthe years.
But I would say probably.
I can recall one, maybe twofrom a female of all those that
were not hormone related.
How about you, doc?
Do you find a lot of females,not males?
Yet we'll go to females onlythat have migraines that aren't
hormone related.

Speaker 2 (29:02):
I mean, my male population size is small, like
yours is right, yeah, butnevertheless, yeah, good portion
of them are.
I don't know if I have a numberoff the top of my head where it
well, I know exactly if it'slike estrogen dominance, hormone
imbalance versus a cortisoltrigger type thing, where it's

(29:25):
like food or something related.
I don't know if I have thatpercentage ever broken down.
It's probably similar to yours,I'm sure.

Speaker 1 (29:33):
Yeah, so I mean, so yeah, just for the females
listening to the podcast,obviously, who, like you said,
frequent our office a little bitmore often than their husbands.
So, yeah, I mean we get malemigraines, but I'll just kind of
say this, like we'll get tothis in a second but food
triggers are more common, inmales just, and they play a
bigger role, whereas females canbe like 50, 50, almost like
what's again over generalizationhere, but like half food, half

(29:57):
hormone kind of headache whereif you only avoid the food,
don't address the hormones,you're not gonna get better.
And that would include, likeyou said, the stress hormones,
things like that cortisol,progesterone levels, even
serotonin levels.
Look at serotonin, how much itplays a role in migraines and
the abdominal migraines, yeah,and what I said before, where

(30:18):
you're kind of predisposed tohave a different brain, right,
you have a different wiring,while you're sensitive to
serotonin changes, right.
So there's mood changes thatare more prevalent in those with
migraines, and then you havethe migraines that trigger those
mood changes, which make iteven more complex, right, which
I was wondering with if you hadthis overlap too.

Speaker 2 (30:37):
every once in a while I'll have an overlap where it's
a hormone imbalance and theyalso have the food triggering of
soy, because soy being theestrogen side of things, have
you had that?

Speaker 1 (30:49):
Less commonly, less commonly.

Speaker 2 (30:51):
I also had a couple like that, and it's like
immediate effect, but it'sfascinating because they'll have
the hormone migraines everyperiod.
And then soy was the triggerand it was just kind of
interesting.

Speaker 1 (31:04):
That's super interesting.
I wanna say like right now Idon't think I have a single
vegan in my office.
As far as that goes, as far aspatients go, but once again,
consumption level of soyobviously would matter a lot.

Speaker 2 (31:15):
Yeah, that's what it was with this person.
They weren't vegan or anything,but they were trying to be
healthy.
They just didn't realize soywas like so important.

Speaker 1 (31:22):
Not a superfood.
And then I get a lot of womenthat say like, oh, I don't think
it's hormone imbalance, becauseit happens other than my cycle.
But we also do have to rememberthat there are hormone changes
that occur with ovulation and Isaid this in a previous podcast.
I'm seeing more women that havedouble hormone problems,
meaning ovulation andmenstruation issues like
symptoms.

(31:43):
Ever since COVID started,whatever that immune trigger was
and it doesn't even matter ifyou were vaccinated or not, but
specifically if you were exposedto it.
So any kind of you just caughtthe coronavirus, the new
SARS-CoV-2, you find that thosepeople are starting to have more
menstrual cycle symptoms.
Now, of course, we've heard allthe stories about fertility and

(32:04):
stuff like that associated withthe whole thing.
I'm not getting into that.
I'm just saying for migrainesources, you may be having a
trigger midway through yourcycle and that neurological
trigger isn't like a one-timeevent.
It could be a week from yourmenstrual cycle and a week from
your ovulation timing, so likeif you have two events that last

(32:25):
a week long.
I mean you're like half themonth probabilities for females.

Speaker 2 (32:28):
So and it's consistent too.
That's the other thing.
It's often you know it's twicea month or once a month.
You get a consistent time.
You know what's coming.

Speaker 1 (32:37):
Yeah, okay.
So what else in the office?
What else are you looking fromthe natural approach, anything
you're looking for.

Speaker 2 (32:45):
Gut for sure Gut's gonna be a pretty big one to go
kind of.
In a more general sense, youwanna reduce that threshold, you
wanna get them away from thethreshold, and so that's just
overall.
You gotta get the gut underthing and, like you were saying
with males, like yeah, of course, like food triggers are kind of
a big thing, but I'm thinkingwe gotta make sure blood sugar's
working right, we gotta makesure those cortisol levels like

(33:07):
why are you stressed out?
And then I think we have, likeyou know, like protein
deficiency with the blood sugarissues, like that's a huge one.
I just saw it again yesterdaysomebody eating a lot of carbs
and probably protein deficient.
Another one that was interestingbecause I was just testing and
this wasn't migraine, but it wasjust an interesting connection

(33:29):
and it made me think of it.
She was testing for severaldifferent things that I'm like
these are all on protein.
I wonder if you're juststraight up protein deficient.
And that's what it was.
It was just straight up proteindeficient and it is way more
common than people think it is.
We do not have a steak like ameat and potato diet in America.
We like to say that we have apotato diet with a very tiny

(33:49):
side of meat, and so, in reality, it's like we're protein
deficient and I can get on asoapbox all day about that
because of these issues that wesee on a day-to-day basis.
And so all of this is gonnalead into what we like to
describe as like the glass jar,what you can handle
threshold-wise, and we're alllike stressed out to the max and

(34:11):
we're trying to remove you awayfrom that threshold as quick as
possible, but it might bemultiple things that need to be
looked at.
So that's where I would begoing, mainly because gut is so
big and causing you to be atthreshold.
That's gonna be my first go-to.
I wanna know that.
What was the abdominal migraineissue Cause, it being the second

(34:32):
brain, a lot of people haveabdominal migraines and don't
know it.

Speaker 1 (34:36):
Yeah, yeah, I think we hit most of the major things.
You know.
Just, a lot of people areunderestimating maybe, the way
that cortisol, blood sugar, arecorrelated and how much that
affects your liver, your abilityto detoxify.
So, you know, while I wouldguess I didn't even see any of
these, but I would guess there'slike 100 different books on,

(34:58):
you know, migraines being thefact that you need to detox.
You know, honest truth is thatI think that's a slow way to go
about it, I think, optimizingsome of the other major systems,
and I had a patient yesterdayactually said like hey, you know
, I noticed that you guys kindof go back to the same topics at
the end of how to treat things.
I go 100%.
One of the coolest things aboutwhat Dr Gaben, I do is that we

(35:20):
actually do keep it simple,right, you don't have to know
every chemical that was evermade on earth and you know you
don't have.
I mean, you can go to a cleanproduct and you don't have to
like, say like, oh, but was itmade with bad energy?
And you know, are the people?
You know they have analtruistic purpose where they're
trying to save the world?
No, they can.
It can just be a better productand it's good enough in a lot

(35:42):
of cases we don't have to goextreme, right?
Can you drink RO water?
This was the same person.
Can you drink RO water withoutadding electrolytes?
Sure, why not?
Like you can do it, right,because everything else is
balanced enough, you know.
But yeah, our electrolytes?
Cool, we'll talk about that ina second.
Obviously, one of the old schoolremedies for migraines is

(36:03):
adding salt.
Here's the catch.
It's all about cellularhydration and cellular balance
as far as that goes.
So if you have highextracellular hydration and low
intracellular hydration, you'regonna be more prone to migraines
.
But how do you make that happen?
You can't always make thathappen overnight.

(36:23):
It has to do with your sodiumand potassium balance mostly.
So a good example there is likeif people are overreacting to
chocolate, oftentimes it's notactually the tyromine which we
used to think in the research.
It's actually the fact thatit's high potassium and it's
pulling sodium out.
So you'll see those changes ina lot of the potassium foods.
So now you're the person that'staking seven multis, four

(36:44):
different products and sixdifferent parasite cleanses and
it's like how many of those havea sodium or potassium irritant?
We'll say irritant because itcan go either way, so I think
that those are pretty importantto start balancing.

Speaker 2 (36:55):
As far as electrolytes go, how much are we
drinking caffeine, which isgonna be a diuretic as well, for
?

Speaker 1 (37:02):
sure a general diuretic, so it's gonna pull it
from the blood and from thecells, right.
So now you're just dehydratedthere.
And how do you get rehydrated?
Well, first you have to stopdrinking the caffeine, One of
the big signs.
So I got this on my lastpodcast.
I don't think I answered itbecause my mind wasn't thinking
about it, but you'll find a lotof people that get migraines

(37:24):
with weather changes.
This is cellular hydration.
This is sodium issues.
This is balancing that out.
So I think that that's animportant one there, where
you're seeing change in osmoticpressure or creating different
things.
So those can be a trigger.
But think sodium, potassium,whether you need to add more
sodium.
And some people will say, like,take a bunch of sodium when you

(37:45):
feel the prodrome coming on,the early stuff coming on, I'm
like it can go either way.
I can eat a migraine.

Speaker 2 (37:51):
Yeah, it could make you worse or better, but you
gotta figure yourself out that'sa big thing there and I also
like that you bring that sodium,because one of the other
reasons that we need to beactually a little concerned,
just in general, with sodium islike the low-fat diet.
We've been a low-salt diet forhow long, a long time, and
people they're surprised when Itell them to add insult into

(38:12):
their diet, like the researchfor longevity, for mortality
reasons.
It is.
I think six grams a day is whatthey're saying.
Six grams a day is actuallybetter than you.
It's a lot.
It's better than two grams aday and it's surprising.
Obviously, if your kidneys orsomething like that aren't

(38:33):
working exactly right, you needmore salt than you think you do.
And sometimes we're surprisedme and my wife when we go over
someone's house they're likethis is bland, like you need
some salt on this sucker, likewe salt our food, and I don't
think a crazy amount.
It's not like uber salty oranything, but one of the easiest

(38:53):
ways to know if you have a saltissue and this I mean it's not
foolproof but put some, like youknow, a teaspoon of salt in a
glass of water and tell me ifyou can taste it.
If you can't taste it, youprobably need it.

Speaker 1 (39:08):
Yeah, it should be super salty if you're doing that
Simple at home test.
I like your at home test man.
Okay, food triggers.
I just want to talk about theneurotoxins.
Like, absolutely 100%.
Like if someone comes in andsays they're still doing these
and they have migraines orheadaches or ADD or ADHD or any
brain issue and they've gotaspartame, msg, food dyes or

(39:32):
processed meats in their diet,I'm like you missed the whole
boat, because that's where theresearch lies a lot, that's
where it agrees 100%.
No one's saying that aspartamedoesn't cause brain stuff, right
?
Everyone is saying it does.
I saw a little I don't knowpicture the other day.
Once again, msgs.
Everyone thinks they don't getMSGs, but of course I still have

(39:55):
my patients and I love them todeath.
But like then I go toChick-fil-A in St MacDonald so
it's healthier, but the chickenand the breading has MSG in it,
right?
So what's your Pleasure toserve you, pleasure to serve you
MSGs.
We need to make that commercial.
I mean, it's pretty blessed,right?
So yeah, so you know, savingthe cows, the only other one

(40:20):
that I didn't mention, that wehad written down iron deficiency
.
So a lot of the females, onceagain the women more prone to
migraines than men, but canhappen to men too.
In our carbohydrate dominantdiets is iron deficiency
decreases the oxygen to thebrain.
So what happens?
When your brain doesn't haveoxygen, it has to vasodilate,
one of those main triggers formigraines.
So women are coming in oftensaying like, well, I only eat

(40:42):
white meats, right, I'm eatingchicken and tuna.
And you know they won't eat thered meat because either it
doesn't sit right or they feellike it's less healthy and
they're running out of iron.
I mean, how many women I cantell you that have a history of
anemia?
In my office they tell me thatWell, I'm not anemic now, but I
used to be.
And it's like probably that's asolid in my office.

(41:04):
50% of my women either have itnow or have a history of someone
telling they were anemic atsome time.

Speaker 2 (41:12):
And there's probably a good 50% that are eating
exactly the way you're talkingabout too.
I think it might be more than50% that are coming in not
eating red meat.
Like I love it.
Whenever I finally have a womancome in that is eating red meat
, I'm like hallelujah, pleaseeat that way.

Speaker 1 (41:25):
Yeah, and you find that those people end up being
more robust.
I always say red meat is thebest for stress.
Red meat is the best forphysical stress, mental stress,
emotional stress, like any kindof stress you have, rebuilding
the body.
Red meat is so critical.
If life is perfect and yourhealth is perfect, we could

(41:46):
probably cut back on some redmeat.
I always say but, generallyspeaking, the lives we live in
2023, 2024 coming up here soon,we need a lot of red meat to
exist.
So what else diet goes, doc?
What other recommendations formigraines specifically, I mean?

Speaker 2 (42:03):
I think you hit some of the main ones that I have
seen and struggled withpersonally.
The process means we'll do it.
So like things like look fornitrates.
Anything like that actually hasnitrates in it.
That actually can be a trigger.
The food dies.
If you don't recognize somethingon an ingredient list, you
should be wary of it.
Msg like that can be hidden toa certain degree and I would say

(42:24):
even be aware of the celerypowders.
Not everyone is affected bythat and I can handle like,
let's say, like one of thosechomps, grass, bed sticks and
those things.
I can be probably one or two ina day, but if I eat three or
four I'm not gonna feel verygood the next day.
Is this just too much of theextra things?
Even though it's, you know,natural, they're adding in

(42:46):
celery powder or whatever.
I can't handle too much of that.
Msg is almost always like,depending on the degree that
it's in there, it will mess meup pretty quick and like I
actually had an experience nottoo long ago, I haven't had a
migraine a long, stinking time,but we went over to a friend's
house and it was in somethingthat they put in there and
they're usually pretty goodabout what they're putting in

(43:08):
their food, but it was insomething and, sure enough, the
next day migraine hit.
I was like, wow, I forgot howhorrible this is.
And so that's the main ones.
Anything that is processed andis excitatory, I think we hit
most of them to the degree thatI would be concerned with.

(43:28):
Outside of that, it's justeating a healthy, good diet,
getting your protein in, gettingyour fruit and vegetables, and
also just be aware that it maynot be a trigger, or at least it
might be a slow trigger wouldsay that Eating a bunch of
legumes, eating a bunch of carbsand stuff like that can affect

(43:49):
you negatively.
As good as they are, as much asyou enjoy hummus or whatever,
if you're doing that on aday-to-day basis, it may not be
beneficial to you.
And then the last thingprocessed seed oils, those
things.
So if you got a fatty acidimbalance, you're eating a bunch
of grains and then you're evenif they're organic, non-gmo, and
then they're fried in canolaoil or sunflower oil or

(44:10):
safflower oil, expect to notfeel very good.
And if you already have a fattyacid imbalance and you're prone
to leukotriene issues orprostaglandin problems, expect
to not feel very good.

Speaker 1 (44:22):
Yeah, so the big words.
For those new to those terms, Ithink those are all basic
inflammatory conditions that youcan have, but essentially a lot
of them are caused by junkyoils.
Right, and that would be everyFrench fry, I don't care what
oil they use for it.
Right, that would be-.
A duck fat.
Yeah, duck fat's not a junkyoil, that's an animal based oil.

Speaker 2 (44:45):
And you don't ever find that one, but when you do,
man, it's like candy.

Speaker 1 (44:49):
Oh yeah, I mean, I still tell everyone my favorite
way to eat kale is in duck fat,right.

Speaker 2 (44:54):
Oh gosh yeah.

Speaker 1 (44:56):
That's tasty.
The only other thing that I wassaying.
So I just once again, becausethe theme this week was nobody
listens to me.
No, not that they don't listen,but they're not understanding
what I'm saying.
Like, if you think you're gonnaeliminate migraines and not
eliminate most of thoseprocessed foods, like 99% of
them, you're not gonna get toofar.
The cleaner, more at home youcan make food, the better it's

(45:17):
gonna be.
The other one that I thought ofthat catch a few of my patients
that are eating pretty clean islike steak seasonings.
So they're out there grillingand making food, but they're
just buying run of the mill.
They ran to the supermarket.
They're all steak seasoning orwhatever it is yeah, yeah.
Those all have some kind of MSGor processed kind of chemical

(45:38):
that's gonna set off a migraine.
So yeah, you can make thosepretty simply at home.
You just have to plan ahead, orthat's what mostly.
I'm just gonna salt and peppermy stuff, but you can add your
own chili and cumin and all thatstuff and make your own stuff.
But, just paying attention,that's one that I'm just
thinking about grilling thisafternoon.
So I've got to be careful forthose.

(45:58):
Going back to treatments, I feellike we've been a little bit
I've been lazy about giving youguys more supplements to try.
I feel like people like to trysupplements and I like to try
supplements.
So if I had a second job, itwould be just like trying every
supplement on earth and thendocumenting the changes.
We'll get there one day.
But so artichoke for females.

(46:20):
If you haven't done artichokefor once again, I said three to
six months.
So if you haven't triedartichoke extracts, obviously my
brand's AMG Naturals.
But AMG Naturals artichokeextract for about three months
for a migraine, and you're afemale, you probably should
Because, like I said, it's mostof my female patients with
chronic migraines and sometimesyou can.

(46:41):
I mean, obviously if you're thewoman that can track it to your
cycle 100%.
That would make sense.

Speaker 2 (46:48):
Magnesium side trait obviously is a neurological
relaxer, so that's an importantone we talked about I need to be
talking about some of the othermagnesiums too is I would throw
out there too, because maybecitrate you end up being prone
to diarrhea or something likethat if you take too much.
So because the research shows,especially if it's gonna be
affected with migraines,sometimes you have to get up to
like 700 milligrams, right?

Speaker 1 (47:11):
Yeah, I know people are recommending like a thousand
milligrams acutely, but yeah,my gut wouldn't tolerate that.
But you know, even magnesium isone of those where, honestly,
like if you take itprophylactically every day,
that's one of the few I don'thave a problem with.
You know a little bit ofmagnesium here and there.
But yeah, like my secondfavorite probably form a
magnesium for migraines would bethree and eight.

(47:31):
That's probably my secondoverall.

Speaker 2 (47:34):
Specifically for the brain, because your brain loves
three and eight, so like that'sa good one, glycinate would be
another one I would throw outthere.

Speaker 1 (47:40):
Yeah, so when they're listening yeah, on the
glycinate, I'll just throw outthat.
I see both right.
I see glycinate cura migraineand cause of migraine.
So just know who you are knowwho you are and you know, if
you're someone listening to thispodcast right now and you're
taking a maglycinate and gettingmigraines, consider switching
to one of the others, becauseyou're still having migraines
and you're taking the glycinateform.

(48:01):
So try the three and eight form.
Just once again, lots ofdifferent options there.
There's way more forms ofmagnesium, but those are
probably my three favorite rightthere.

Speaker 2 (48:10):
Yeah, I think that works really well and you can
even try, like I think, bioticsthey have, like the one that I
use, mgzyme.
It will have three differentones in it, so you get, like
Malate, one of the other ones.
So that could be helpful too,having a mixture.
You just want to try, like youwere saying, just try them out.
I like mag Malate.

(48:31):
Yeah, b2 is not one that I havetried, but I know a lot of
people say that riboslavin canhelp.
But yeah, like we've talkedabout, you have to be careful.
It can jack up your gut ifyou're taking riboslavin and a
lot of people just take it andnot really thinking about it and
it can actually contribute tosome gut issues if you're not

(48:51):
careful.

Speaker 1 (48:53):
Yeah, as I mentioned electrolytes, I'm gonna link one
in the show notes, but there'sone called Quintonic or Quintin
electrolytes.
They have an iso isotonic and ahyper tonic.
The hyper tonic can be good,like if you're in a prodrome and
you actually respond to Sodium.
You can drink that really quick, easy to get some salt in that

(49:13):
way.
It's just pretty much a seasalt like actually For this
scenario.
Yes, it's too expensive for meto use on a daily basis, to be
honest.
So you know I might use it forsomeone.
I'll use it for a pot syndrome.
So, like dysautonomia, will useit for that acutely because I'm
trying to get like the absolutemost effective one without cost

(49:36):
, care, care right, like I,whatever it cost, because a
thousand dollars we're gonna getyou better today.
You know that's that case andmost people I'm gonna do like
I'll use sell salt sometimes.
So like tissue salts,homeopathic tissue salts, I'll
use that one and then I'll alsojust do like a.
You can buy the really cheapsodium potassium ones on full

(49:57):
script.
I'll link to that too.
I'll usually do something morelike that, a buffered one like.
So I actually like a pH neutral, magnesium, sodium, potassium
kind of thing.

Speaker 2 (50:07):
Yeah, I like to look at some of those on time.
I've used element and I've usedreal meat element.
Okay, but you have to becareful.
You can't drink it super quickbecause I mean, it's gonna, you
know, feel very good.
Your stomach hurts high.
So, yeah, yeah, cuz, yeah, thesalt content.
Right now I'm using relightwith and uses red mints, but it
has a couple extra things in itand I think that one doesn't sit

(50:28):
well with me either.
I just like that was like in anice little bottle and it was
relatively inexpensive, butright now I don't think it
actually sits well.

Speaker 1 (50:37):
So yeah, I'm always looking for other ones.
Yeah, we, you, we've usedrelight before and at home and
we haven't had a problem with it, once again, not specifically
addressing migraines or, youknow, neurological sensitivity.
Yeah, just just a basic onethere, and you know it is on.
That is one of my manufacturers.
The same manufacturermanufacturers relight actually

(50:58):
makes artichoke.
So I do know their integrityand quality of like
manufacturing.
Though, once again, myrequirements for no fillers, no
binders, high quality herbs isdifferent from I don't know what
relight requires.
I'm not gonna say anythingthere, but I just know that you
know that's.
That's one of the samefactories that's gonna be able
to do a clean product if theychoose, you know, but yeah, so

(51:21):
too.

Speaker 2 (51:21):
So like I actually like that brand for salt.

Speaker 1 (51:24):
So Yep, I like red bins.
I you know you can do yourHimalayan sea salt, but I always
, yeah, I add red bins with it.
I all trade my salts.
Actually is what I do at home.
So biotics research has.

Speaker 2 (51:37):
I was gonna say real quick, you can also just drink
pickle juice.

Speaker 1 (51:41):
So I love pickle juice.
I don't mind drinking it, it'sit really energizes me when I
need sodium.
So I'll do that really quickbecause I almost always have
pickles, because my kids lovepickles, but I'll just drink the
juice.
I don't even like pickles thatmuch.

Speaker 2 (51:55):
This is the the bubby's pickles.
Have you had those?
Yes, they're amazing.

Speaker 1 (52:01):
There's, there's your brand, if you want a good brand
, that's, that's holistic,healthy.
A Few migraines I'll see, youknow, just throwing out a last
supplement here.
A few migraines I'll see, basedupon previous concussion and
and technically I wouldn't evendiagnose them as true migraines,
but they're presenting as such,you know, half the face severe

(52:22):
disabling, slurring of speech,loss of function.
They're kind of migraine like,but they're really more just the
neurological component ratherthan the pain, and, and so I
found that olive leaf is thatgreat antioxidant for that.

Speaker 2 (52:37):
I have.
I have not messed up.

Speaker 1 (52:39):
So it can help with the xanthine.
Correct, that's, that's how.
So just a clinical note there.
Yeah, so for xanthine, which islike vaccine, injuries and Any
head trauma, I've always found areally good success with olive
leaf.
But I would be Interested indoing like high-dose OPCs or
something like that.
I haven't messed around withthat.
They're a little bit moreexpensive so I just haven't like

(53:01):
given someone a whole bottle aday, but I would guess that
those would help with like kindof the previous head trauma, I
think football player or youknow.
Once again, going back to males, not so Hormone maybe, not even
that much food, you know, cantruly be a structural imbalance
contributing to the whole story.

Speaker 2 (53:17):
So that's all I got doc.

Speaker 1 (53:18):
What else?
Do you have anything else youwant to say on migraines before
we end?

Speaker 2 (53:22):
The only other thing, the other supplement that's
popular out there.
I don't do you ever see fever afew actually being effective?

Speaker 1 (53:28):
I've never seen it, yeah from everything I've tried,
I've had a couple people do goto fever, few and butter burr,
but I didn't prescribe them theyand they were slow.
Their slowest can be like 45,you know, 45 days in they start
to see a decrease in migraines.
But my, my take, symptom reliefis what they are their

(53:49):
Inflammation or stimulatoryrelief, not a root cause.
But once again, looking forsome relief while you go for
your root causes can't get inwith me or dr Gabe anytime soon.
Well then, you're gonna have tofigure out what you can.
You know I like those.

Speaker 2 (54:04):
Yeah, so there.

Speaker 1 (54:05):
I'm sure there's other herbs out there.
Um, you know, I feel like theroot cause approach works pretty
well.
So I I haven't had to searchfor, like this magical migraine
cure, because I feel like whenwe address the major things your
foods, your environment, yourinfections and your hormones,
like I feel like everyone getspretty much better from
migraines, keeping them at zero.

(54:28):
That can be a journey becauseyou got to keep your life
perfect.

Speaker 2 (54:31):
But, like I just said , having a migraine not too long
ago, like I usually don't getthem, but you can make a mistake
exactly.

Speaker 1 (54:40):
All right, so that's it for this podcast.
Listen to the next one, guys,we're gonna do the Q&A that we
got submitted from Instagram.
Once again, you can follow bothof us on Instagram and we will
see you on the Q&A podcast.
We'll see you later, doc.
All right.

Speaker 2 (54:52):
Yeah.