November 12, 2025 • 41 mins
Ever wondered how a traditional painter transitions into a trailblazer in digital art? Join us as we chat with Krista Kim, an internationally renowned digital artist, who recounts her incredible journey from the serene Roenji Temple Garden in Kyoto to pioneering digital Zen experiences. Krista reveals the paradigm shift she observed in 2012 that led her to abandon traditional mediums in favor of exploring light and color through digital art. Learn how her work, infused with meditative and healing qualities, is dedicated to serving humanity and future generations.
We'll also discuss the vital role creativity plays in embracing emerging technologies, especially AI. Krista shares her thoughts on the shortcomings of current educational systems that stifle innovation by funneling students into conventional corporate roles. She champions the transformative potential of AI in accelerating learning and enhancing artistic expression. We examine how industries, notably architecture and engineering, can innovate through collaboration with creative minds, comparing the innovation strategies of tech giants like Meta and Apple.
Finally, discover the revolutionary potential of the Metaverse, NFTs, AI, and blockchain identity in fostering human well-being and secure personal identities. Krista's Mars House, a virtual Zen space born during the COVID-19 lockdowns, exemplifies the healing possibilities of digital environments. We explore the future of personal avatars connected to the blockchain, preserving our legacy for future generations and drawing wisdom from past generations to shape a better future. Join us for an inspiring conversation that bridges art, technology, and human connection.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:19):
Hi everyone.
Welcome to the Future Constructpodcast.
I am your host, Amy Peck, andthis is the new series that
we're doing with our Futuristseries, and our guest today is
Krista Kim, who is pretty muchremarkable in every way.
She's a celebratedinternational digital artist.
(00:41):
She is founder of the TechismMovement, creator of Mars House
and co-founder of Xero Studio.
Welcome, Krista.
Speaker 2 (00:50):
Thank you, Amy.
And Amy is an advisor to XeroStudio as well, might I mention?
Speaker 1 (00:55):
Indeed, indeed, indeed, and the reason being
that when I first met you, I wasabsolutely blown away by just
the breadth with which you sortof approach not only your art
but just life and humanity.
(01:15):
And that's really what we wantto tackle with this Futurism
series, and it's not just beingaspirational, it's really about
how do we fundamentally usetechnology to change outcomes,
change our lives, solve some ofthe challenges that we're facing
.
And so, before we kind of diveinto the really nitty-gritty,
(01:40):
I'd love for you to just kind oftalk a little bit about your
history how did you come to be adigital artist?
And then we'll get into all ofyour accomplishments.
Speaker 2 (01:51):
Well, digital art I started in 2012.
I was painting.
Basically, I was practicingabstract painting.
Basically, I was practicingabstract painting.
I was very much influenced byJapanese abstract painting,
modern style painting usingtraditional pigments, a
technique that I learned inTokyo when I lived in Japan
(02:13):
between 2005 to 2008.
But when I landed in Singaporein 2010, I really started
painting in acrylics and oils,and it was in 2012 when I
decided to leave paintingaltogether and pursue digital,
because I was enrolled in theMasters of Fine Art program at
La Salle College of the Arts andwhen I was thinking about you
(02:36):
know how much I was using thisthing and not writing even.
I wasn't even writing notesanymore.
I was note-taking in my phone.
That's when I knew there was amajor paradigm shift in the
world where everything's goingto become digital.
So what's the point in creatingart that is based on, you know,
the medium of painting, when Ishould really be exploring light
(02:58):
and color, as you can see in inmy background?
That's you know digital, thatyou can see the screen, cause
I'm really fascinated by thephysiological effects of looking
at a screen.
It's all light and stuff.
You know messages and that'sshining into your retina.
But how can I use that as anart medium to create a sublime
experience?
And that was my thesis for forart school.
Speaker 1 (03:21):
Well, I, you know, I didn't know that you had lived
in Japan.
We were there at the same time,so we're going to have to talk
about that I used to live nearNishiyazabu Crossing.
Speaker 2 (03:31):
I was in Akasaka Ichome beside Okura Hotel.
Speaker 1 (03:34):
Oh, wow, so we must be.
I'm sure we'll talk about that.
Lexington Queen, you know thewhole.
Yeah, we'll have to chatoffline about that.
Very cool, so you know,actually.
So even just watching yourbackground, it is incredibly
soothing and that seems to beone of the through lines, I
(04:02):
think, in the art that I've seenof your work.
There's just something very andI forget the quote that's on
your website about the like,something about creating a sort
of a Zen experience, but it isyeah.
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (04:14):
You got it.
Speaker 1 (04:15):
So you know how does all of this mesh with your
vision for the future.
Speaker 2 (04:22):
Yeah, oh my gosh.
Thank you.
It's a great question.
You know, my artistic epiphanycame in Japan.
Actually is a very formativeperiod of my life as a human
being, as an artist, and it wasin Kyoto.
Kyoto, for me, was so impactful, it actually was the place
where I had my aha moment as anartist.
It was at the Roenji TempleGarden.
I don't know if you've beenthere, but it's one of the most
(04:44):
sacred Zen gardens in Japan, andwhen you go there, you sit in
front of the garden and yourealize that your mind becomes
automatically immersed in a Zenexperience.
And then I thought, oh my gosh,after an hour or two of
meditating in the space I didn'twant to leave right, I
(05:09):
discovered that it was the Zenmonks, over a thousand years ago
, who created this immersiveexperience out of a garden.
And that's when I discoveredthat art can create a meditative
experience in the viewer, andtherefore it is a service to
humanity, to future generations.
Experience in the viewer, andtherefore it is a service to
humanity, to future generations,to the future of civilization
(05:29):
itself.
I was so inspired by thatconcept that when I started to
really delve into what kind ofartist I wanted to be, during my
master's degree program.
That's when I realized I wantedto create a digital Zen
experience, that I want toreally pursue the sublime, the
healing, the same Zen beautifulexperience that I had at the Zen
garden in the digital realm.
So this is, in fact, isn't agood example of a digital garden
(05:51):
, a Zen garden, if you will.
That's the digitalreinterpretation of what I had
experienced in Kyoto.
And so, and when you fastforward, though, when you're
when, when now, whatever mediumI'm doing very interdisciplinary
, whether it's the metaverse orwhatever medium I I I encounter
(06:11):
or I want to work with, that isthe fundamental core of
everything that I do.
So that's it's it's about, it'sa blessing that I was there at
the same time as you.
Speaker 1 (06:22):
I love that.
I love that.
Hold on, I have to.
I'm going to pause.
I just inhaled some sort offloating dust situation.
Let me drink this, okay, good,good, yeah, let's take a quick
sip.
We're going to cut away to youanyway during that whole
situation.
That is so funny that we werethere at the same time.
(06:45):
That's amazing, okay six volumesyes, yes, all right, so let me
do this for jamil and so, butthere's a, there's a, there's a
real.
So there's the Zen quality, butthere's I mean, I guess let me
speak to the experience I havewhen I, when I have experienced
(07:08):
your artwork there's anarchitectural component, like
the NFTs that you shared witheveryone, which I treasure over
over the holidays.
There's the Zen zen component,but there's an, there's an
intellect and there's a.
You know, there's a vision thatis more uh, I don't even know
(07:30):
how, what the quite, quite theword is.
I think we think of zen garden,we think, oh, it's just all
kind of flowery and meditative,but there's like this very
powerful intellectual, visceralvision that is powering all of
this and I think it's why it'sso touching for people.
And again, I you know, do youfind that the time now is really
(07:57):
ripe for this convergence of,and it's, mental wellness?
Right, art and mental wellnessnow, I think are inextricably
aligned, and then this vision ofusing art and technology to
solve problems, I think also areconnected.
Speaker 2 (08:13):
I love that question, amy, and thank you so much for
the compliment.
I really do approach mypractice as a philosophy and you
know my background is inpolitical science.
That's what I studied atuniversity, so I learned a lot
from reading.
You know political philosophy.
(08:33):
You know and also like how isit that these ideas that were
shared, you know pen on paperthe pen is mightier than the
sword.
How did these ideas shift theworld and the way people think
and therefore change the world,like democracy itself, voltaire,
diderot, the French Revolutionthat actually led to the
(08:55):
formation of America, anddemocracy, and so all of these
sort of like incredible seismicshifts throughout history, I
learned a lot from, and so, whenI approached my art and I
looked at the current state ofthe world with, especially with
the technological disruption,you know where social media back
then in 2012, when I was reallythinking about this, you know
(09:19):
it really became the dominantnew communication medium and you
know the medium is the messageright?
I'm very much a student ofMarshall McLuhan, who I'm a big
fan of.
I really love his workUnderstanding Media.
The Medium is a Message.
I just feel.
I felt like, hey, if we'removing on from TV media,
electronic media, into theinternet age, into the
(09:41):
information age and now into theage of acceleration and AI and
blockchain.
What are those changes andparadigm shifts going to bring
to our society and how can Iimpart, you know, a vision for
the future of humanity in thisnew paradigm?
So I really wanted tocontribute in a way that really
(10:06):
keeps humanity at the core andthe ethos of a philosophy of how
we pursue the advancement oftechnology, and that's why I
wrote the Tech is a Manifesto in2014, because I saw the silo of
art, the silo of technology.
You know completely differentworlds and yet these two worlds
(10:27):
are pushing culture forward, andit was so.
It was very schizophrenic,right?
So I felt that there needs to bea bridge, that artists have to
get out of the classical, youknow, paradigm of creating art.
You know the way that we'retaught in school and I went
through the school system, so Iknow that there was this
(10:50):
hesitancy to pursue the new.
You know, as a medium, that alot of people weren't interested
in digital art at all.
In fact, it was still it stillis very outlier to this day and
so I felt that art was notreally communicating the
zeitgeist and I felt thatartists need to do that.
Artists need to ring an alarmif there are any human rights
(11:11):
issues that are being violated.
Artists need to create the techthat is humane, to collaborate,
co-create, have a dialogue withthe tech world, have a dialogue
(11:37):
with businessmen and have aseat at the table really to be
valuable in terms of our inputin making the tech human, making
it humane, so we're notalienating people with the
technology.
Speaker 1 (12:01):
So there, and it's funny, I'm so transfixed by your
background because it just isevocative of this idea of like
volumetric thinking right andtaking, connecting disparate
ideas and being fluid and beingpresent.
And we talk so much about STEM,stem, stem.
You mentioned education, stem.
So I fundamentally do notbelieve it's STEM education.
I think it's STEAM.
And if we forget that, art ontwo paths?
(12:26):
One is that we are, as humans,able to create something from
nothing, which, yes, we cantrain AI to do that, but there
is an organic element to the waythat humans do it that is
fundamentally different.
And then the second piece isthat kind of, you know,
practical element of being ableto see around the corners and
(12:50):
exercising the artistic part ofour minds, I think, allows us to
do that and yet, ironically,through the school system, those
are the programs that are underfire.
How do we move past that andconvince the world that this is
important?
Speaker 2 (13:07):
AI is so fascinating.
And what I love about you, amy,is that you truly are a
visionary yourself.
I mean, you are very creativeand I love how you're truly
right at the bleeding edge andyou get it and you're fearless,
creative.
And I love how you're trulyright at the bleeding edge and
you get it and you're fearless.
And I believe that fearlessnesscomes from, yes, the creativity
of your mind, that you know howto create something new out of
nothing.
(13:28):
So you're not looking at a newtechnology as something that is
scary, that brings instabilityand you know people don't like
instability, but you and I arethe types of people that like
disruption, that welcome it andcan create beauty out of it.
Right, the better systems outof it.
(13:48):
And that's the thing.
Most people in the world are notcreative.
Most people in the world arefed through a school system that
does not support a creativemind, but rather supports you to
be an employee for a company,to listen and integrate into a
hierarchical corporate system,which is fine.
(14:08):
It's been working for a longtime, but these are very
disruptive times times, and Ithink the school system is where
it has to start, where we areactually teaching children to be
unique and expressive andcreative, and harness AI and
learn how to be promptingengineers, learn how to tap into
(14:29):
their natural talents andpassions, and how can you use AI
to really showcase that, tomake that a powerful production
medium of what you want to see,right?
I just think that AI is sointeresting and it is so
(14:52):
exciting, but I'm definitely forit because I can see how
incredible ideas can spreadfaster and that how production
can be faster and, if anything,it's going to eliminate the need
for, you know, decorativepieces created by people.
(15:15):
I think that anyone can createbeautiful things now with AI.
But if you really want to be anartist, as we have spoken about
before, it's about thephilosophy and the ideas and
where you come from, and ifthat's unique and if people
resonate with that, then youhave an audience and then you
have art right that lives on forthe rest of humanity and into
(15:39):
the future.
Ai is very, very exciting andwe should not disparage AI.
We should not tell our kids tobe fearful of it.
In fact, I'm telling my kidshey, man, as soon as I learned
about ChachiPT on my kids,here's ChachiPT4.
Learn how to use it, be smarter, study better, learn more
(16:04):
faster, get more done and, hey,you have more free time to
pursue and think about what youlove to do, right?
I mean, what better manner isthere for kids to learn than to
use it as a tool to acceleratewho they are, how they learn,
how they form Right?
Speaker 1 (16:22):
It's so true, and I think you know we also can't
actually identify the influenceswe have, you know.
So artists are ingesting theworld as well, just in the same
way that we're feeding AI dataand inputs and inputs.
(16:50):
We do that as well.
I'm all for.
You know, we can solve thedigital asset management piece
and you know what was theprovenance of this.
You know this and that piece ofart.
But I agree with you, I thinkartists are.
They take the tools that wedemocratize and they elevate
them.
I mean, everyone now is aphotographer.
They have advanced filters,they have the best cameras in
the world and they can takeamazing photographs, but there
(17:13):
are still photographers outthere taking amazing and really
pushing the boundaries of whatphotography is.
And if you see an amazingphotograph that tells a story
that touches you, is that, youknow, somehow different from
this new realm of art?
No, it still touches you fromwithin and I think this is this
(17:34):
is leading me into, you know, myquestion, which, which I think
will be more relative to our,you know, more relevant to our
existing audiences.
We have a lot of business,people and AEC architecture
engineering and and what am I?
People and AEC architectureengineering and what am I doing?
Aec let's do that one again.
And our audience is veryfocused on business and the AEC
(17:56):
industry architecture,engineering and construction and
I'm sure they're listeningsaying what does this have to do
with me?
And I think the way also youtalk about business is that you
have, you know, you're using artin in an application, right
You're?
You're moving into this webthree realm, you're moving into
(18:16):
this 3d realm.
What are some of the ways thatyou know people and companies
can start to think aboutinnovation?
Because it's artists that arethe key to unlocking this.
I believe.
Speaker 2 (18:27):
Yeah, I totally agree with you.
I think that the creativityaspect is key and collaboration
is definitely going to be anincredible bonus and it's going
to add strength to your brand,strength to your products.
If you look at how Facebookchanged to meta and how they
approached the metaverse withoutcollaborating in a meaningful
(18:51):
way with the creative community,like they basically were using,
applying the same you knowbusiness model of trying to
acquire IP and you know, andreally controlling it when
really it should be aboutcollaboration, so that that's
how you can really create themost interesting and meaningful
(19:12):
new work and new ideas.
I think that if only they hadcollaborated more and if they
did a better job inunderstanding that culture, then
they would have been much moresuccessful in creating beautiful
, compelling spaces.
Because I think that in acompany right now, there's so
much focus on, like, marketingand strategy and let's get the
(19:33):
product out there, productdevelopment what about the
actual human connection and thebeauty of your products and the
beauty of what your services are?
I mean, there's something therethat art can actually impart
and I completely agree with youand I think meta is a very good
example of that versus Apple.
I mean the way that Appleapproaches their design ethos
(19:55):
and everything is like an artist, and that's why I really like
look at Apple.
I'm like really fascinated andamazed.
But you know what's reallyinteresting about Apple, too.
When I spoke with James Higa,who was the number two of
products under Steve Jobs, wespoke about the Roengi Temple
Garden, right, and you knowwe're he's actually I adore this
(20:16):
man, and and when we spokeabout it, you know I'm working.
I'm basically working on myMacBook Pro, or I love my
MacBook.
I use Mac all the time and Idon't know why I have this
amazing fascination with theproducts.
Everybody loves their Mac.
It's like a cult, right.
And when I talked about Roe andG Temple Garden, you know what
he told me.
He said oh, my goodness, like Iwould go to Roe and G Temple
(20:40):
Garden on many occasions, andyou know Steve has been there as
well and we would actuallydiscuss how can we impart this
experience in Apple products.
Speaker 1 (20:52):
I love that.
Speaker 2 (20:53):
Right.
So that's an artist mind, andif you can apply that to
anything, any company, anyindustry, it will totally
transform that product intosomething that's beloved.
Speaker 1 (21:06):
Yeah, I think you're right and I think you know I
hadn't really drawn thatconnection and that makes total
sense.
And the challenge I have withcompanies is that is and you
touched on it it's everything isthis economics first, and we
are at the precipice of reallybeing able to unlock completely
different economic models,different ways of engaging.
(21:35):
The jobs of the future, I think, are all going to have some
art-related basis orcraftsmanship or mindset, and if
we can start to weave theseartistic endeavors and these
creative endeavors intoeverything we do If you look at
healthcare or sort ofpost-pandemic, we saw how much
the digital landscape was both ahindrance and a help, and so
(21:57):
how do we take those learningsand move forward?
But that can be, I believe canbe really infused into sort of
the products and services of thefuture.
But I'd love to also talk aboutjust some of the other work
that you're doing and Mars Houseand what you're doing with Zero
Studio.
You're doing so manyfascinating I mean so many
amazing projects.
Speaker 2 (22:17):
Thank you.
Well, you know, first of all,you know everything I'm doing
with Metaverse.
I really want the Metaverse andthese powerful technologies,
which are only going to get moreand more accelerated, more and
more powerful and more and moreubiquitous.
I want these technologies to,first and foremost, serve
humanity and make us healthy,healthier, right and be good for
(22:40):
us, because I think Web 2.0 hasreally proven, because of our
mental health crisis that we'reactually experiencing globally,
social media has a lot to dowith that, and I witnessed this
and I knew that in 2014, that ifI'm experiencing these you know
yicky feelings, fomo andanxiety, and you know this
(23:01):
narcissism on social mediaplatforms then you know it's,
that's universal, and billionsof people around the world are
feeling that too, and there willbe a crisis and, lo and behold,
here we are.
So how can we make a change?
How can the new technology thatwe're introducing into the
world actually make us betterand solve those problems that
(23:22):
were created from web two,including loneliness, which is a
huge epidemic, and I mean it'suniversal.
Let's start from square one.
Let's create spaces of healingand bring people together, and I
think those are two things thatwe need desperately right now.
(23:42):
So, mars House I created duringthe height of the COVID crisis,
and it was in response to thelockdowns, and it was me and my
two kids under lockdown.
I mean, that lasted for a yearand a half.
Right, it was insane, wasn't it?
And I really wanted to create aspace that was zen of the 21st
century, a house that integratesmy gradient, meditative artwork
(24:05):
into the architecture.
And that's what Mars Housebecame, and so I was so proud of
this project.
It was such a passion projectof mine, and I never used Unreal
Engine 4 before.
It was my first introductioninto creating 3D spatial spaces
architecture, but I was reallyinspired to do it, and so I
(24:32):
designed the house, designed thefurniture, installed my work,
and it was such an incredibleexperience.
Then I parked it because what Ireally?
I didn't know what it was goingto be, what it would become.
I didn't know that it wouldbecome an NFT until December of
2020, when I discovered Bitcoinand Ethereum and I was doing
some research on blockchain arton the blockchain, and then NFTs
popped up.
And I was doing some researchon blockchain art on the
blockchain, and then NFTs poppedup and I was like whoa and I
went down that rabbit hole.
And then I ended up signing upfor super rare and I was
(24:55):
accepted artist in February, andthat was the time when they
were just onboarding artistsbecause they had upgraded their
platform platform.
And then in March, after amonth of studying the NFT market
, studying NFTs and art ingeneral, I thought, wow, these
(25:16):
platforms are very early and Iknew that the potential of NFTs
and going into the future wouldbe that they would be 3D digital
assets powered by AI.
Knew that, I don't know how Iknew that, but I just knew that
that was the future and that wasalso the future for a 3D
spatialized metaverse, that theywould be the building blocks
building economies and economiesof experiences and creative
(25:41):
economies on top of a virtualspace.
So I thought, oh my gosh, Iactually have a house that I can
offer for sale as an NFT.
And I was like, oh my God, Ijust have to do this, I have to
mint the Mars house.
And I was ready to ask theworld the question whether or
not the world is ready for a 3Ddigital asset of real estate,
(26:03):
which is also presented as anartwork on SuperRare real estate
, and as the, which is alsopresented as an artwork on super
rare.
And that was March 14th that Iminted the piece.
And, um lo and behold, aoi, areal visionary collector,
collected the piece.
He actually came in and swoopedall of my entire catalog that
was available and uh, we had aphone call and he's uh, um, uh,
based in Asia, and um.
(26:24):
So we had a call and he's likeyou know, chris, I just wanted
to know, I want to double check,if this is really a house for
the metaverse the way that youintended.
Am I getting the 3D files andeverything I'm like?
Yes, this is a house that youcan actually install in a
metaverse platform of yourchoice and it's yours to, you
know, enjoy in virtual realityhowever way you wish.
(26:46):
Right?
And that was a revolutionarysort of like moment when he said
, okay, I'll buy it.
And then it was, you know,amazing.
It just the world justresponded very, let's just say,
I was on Squawk Box thefollowing week.
Speaker 1 (27:04):
Oh, no, no, yes, I saw that.
I saw that on your website.
It's like now, everyone'spaying attention.
There's like, oh, there's moneyhere.
And it's like, oh, man, are youjust missing?
You're just missing the point.
Speaker 2 (27:21):
Exactly.
And then, of course, you know,everybody was like, hey, krista,
when you you going to sell morehouses?
Or people come to me like, oh,I had all kinds of propositions
to sell more houses, get behindvirtual real estate development
projects, at that early stage,without even a proper metaverse
world built, everything waswalled gardens.
(27:42):
You've got CryptoVox CentralLand Sandbox was walled gardens.
You've got CryptoVox CentralLand Sandbox.
Yeah, okay, but those aregaming platforms and I did not
consider that the true metaverse, the open metaverse, is what I
was imagining in my mind, whereeveryone will basically be able
to access an open metaverse.
Different realms haveinteroperable assets, not like
(28:04):
your home.
Like you know, your home is ina video game.
That that's not what I wantedand I didn't want to create this
um, you know this, this falsebubble, right?
I didn't believe in in, uh, inin the state of the market for
real estate in the metaverse.
Yet because, uh, we, we need tobuild out, um, out a greater
(28:25):
foundation, engineering, rightbehind it, the architecture, so
that we can all be there atscale right, offering services,
creating experiences and,through that, creating value on
top of these spaces, right, likethe Mars House, for example.
So I was really, reallycautious and I knew that I had
(28:52):
to take my time on this, andthat's when I was inspired to
create the studio, because Ithought, okay, so instead of
like selling all these houses,right, what I should be doing is
creating experiences that addvalue, so that people understand
the value being in themetaverse and we could build a
metaverse together through theseexperiences.
And for me, I believe that youknow, as a mom, right, I've got
(29:14):
two teenagers and I think, well,what do I want for my kids?
I want them to be smarter, Iwant education and I also want
them to be healthier.
I want mental health offeringsin the metaverse, and I think
that's what would attractmothers, women, society into the
metaverse and the mainstream enmasse as a mainstream, you know
(29:37):
, selling point, and that's whatI wanted to focus on.
So you build a more robustreason and experience economy,
which therefore supports theassets.
Speaker 1 (29:49):
Yeah, that makes sense and you know this is your
of course.
You know we know we are inviolent agreement on all of
these things, because it's again, it's how do we?
You know the interoperability,you know that's a problem,
hopefully we will solve, butit's the economy of scarcity
(30:09):
that we're trying to replicatein this virtual realm.
That doesn't make any sense andthat's why I agree with you
that virtual real estate, itwill have its place.
There will be a reason for youto be in, you know, certain
quadrant with a certain group,and but to me it's around
community and it's not aroundthe financial wherewithal just
to be in.
That you know, because again,you mentioned hierarchical
(30:32):
structure.
That's what we're like.
Why would we build that again?
Speaker 2 (30:37):
You know what you know.
It's so cool.
I actually learned a lot aboutthis from Kyoto.
Yeah, you know, kyoto is beauty, of all of their beautiful
ancient buildings and Zengardens over all of these
(31:00):
millennia, you know, and it'sthe beauty of the space that
brings people back, and it'sthis X factor that brings you
back, and that's what I think isthe only thing that's going to
be a sticky point for themetaverse as well.
So, yes, we are in totalagreement there Create beautiful
experiences and people willwant to come back, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1 (31:23):
And then you know the NFT craze and crypto, because
they're going through.
There's not only hype cycle,there's been so much kind of you
know criminal activity thatit's really sullying the
elegance of the blockchain andreally what we can accomplish.
And this idea that we have to,like, wrestle cryptocurrency to
(31:46):
the ground and make it behavelike fiat currency Again.
What is, you know, an exchangeof?
just a transparent exchange ofvalue, right and value can come
in any form right, it can be art, it can be experience, it can
be data, it can becryptocurrency.
But what are the mechanics ofthis new economy?
(32:08):
And with microtransactions now,which have been, you know, sort
of the bane of the regulatoryexistence, and trying to figure
out you know how to, how tocontrol it?
But but out of that, you know,could, can we collectively
divine a better economy, onewhere, you know, people in the
remotest areas of the world canactually participate in a global
(32:31):
economy?
And you know what?
What is the vision to to kindof allow that to happen?
Speaker 2 (32:38):
oh yeah, totally, and I, you know, I, I for one, am
all about foundational.
You know the foundations rightuh, when you're building
something that will last, and I,I think that, especially when
we're looking right now at the,the age where ai, metaverse and
blockchain will converge, right,they're not siloed and I think
(32:58):
a lot of people discuss thesetechnologies as if they're
separate, but they're reallygoing to converge in a major way
, what we have to do, andespecially when you're touching
upon and I think it's aboutdigital identity, right, and
being able to be recognized inthe blockchain for what you
contribute to an economy, acreator's economy, and be
remunerated for the blockchain,we need to really focus on the
(33:22):
digital identity part, don't we?
I mean, that's the foundationalstructure we need right now,
and I actually think that we'regoing to move toward a
blockchain system that's poweredand facilitated through AI.
You know that will allow us toconnect our true identity, our
one identity.
(33:42):
That is, you know, proof of whowe are.
That is our passport, that'sour everything birth certificate
, marriage certificateeverything is connected to that
true identity of who we are, andI think that, if it's immutable
in the blockchain, it'saccessible for everybody in the
world to do because it's cheapto mint, and I think that this
(34:03):
accessible technology will alsobe for everyone.
It's actually technology and Iknow about through our common
friend, teddy Bahagbia, calledTenbeo, friend Teddy Pahagbia,
called Tenbeo.
It's a very exciting technologythat basically attaches your
(34:25):
unique heartbeat algorithm tothe blockchain, which identifies
you as a unique individual inthe world.
All of your bio data is fedinto the blockchain.
It is a wallet, it's a vault,if you will.
This vault in the blockchainalso facilitates the storage of
your own data, so we can allself-custody our data and then,
of course, self-custody of allof our assets and then, of
course, our IP.
(34:45):
So, as an artist and for anyonewho basically is participating
in the world economy in thefuture economy in the future, I
think it's very important thatit is clearly authenticated what
we create and how we contributeto, whatever projects we
participate in and we're fairlyremunerated for that.
And those microtransactions are.
(35:08):
I mean, that's all AI andblockchain that will allow that
to happen.
That's a scalable model thatanyone can participate in there
and I think that's going to bethe way forward.
Speaker 1 (35:20):
Yeah, yeah, I agree with you.
I think it's going to take sometime and I think we also have to
agree, you know, kind ofcollectively as individuals, to
do the work to actually start tomanage our own data and manage
our identities.
But to your point, you know, itkind of becomes a database query
where, as long as, becausewe're going to present in
multiple different types ofpersonas, we might have one
(35:45):
digital persona in oneenvironment, a different one for
a game, a different one for acollaboration setting and a
different one for business, butthat at a core they're all tied
to that same vault or wallet ordate, you know personal database
, and there will just be a sortof a you know KYC mechanism and
know your customer mechanism,which already exists, to allow
(36:07):
you to prove that you are whoyou say you are, that you're not
an AI, because that's going tostart to matter soon, and that
you're not an imposter, becausethat's going to matter, and you
know you're not some sort ofnefarious being and it's a
little hard to imagine how toget there.
But this is where I also thinkthat artists are so valuable,
(36:27):
because you're able to drawpeople in in a way that is
soothing and meaningful andhuman, in in a way that is
soothing and meaningful andhuman, and then that's where we
can start to educate and justbring people along like bit by
bit by bit.
Speaker 2 (36:43):
So I hope this is exactly Thank you, and and, and.
So basically, the what I wouldlove to do in my you know how
Xero would like to strategizeand bringing people in is to use
this technology for mentalhealth and wellness.
So I mean AI technology andmetaverse.
What we want to do is we wantto create the digital
(37:07):
intelligent avatar of DeepakChopra and other great icons and
teachers that can really impartone-on-one information in a
human conversation style, likewhat we're having right now with
the AI.
If you need guidance onsomething, I would love to sit
(37:27):
with Deepak.
Wouldn't you love to sit withDeepak and just ask him
questions if you're goingthrough something or if you need
some advice?
I mean, that's the kind ofscalable service that Metaverse
as a service can provide, ifit's open, it's interoperable
and that you know you canactually communicate with his,
(37:48):
his intelligent avatar.
And then you think about how artlike this can also be.
You know, with science, aigenerated generative art that
can scientifically soothe yourmind or give you energy.
You know, have differenteffects on the brain and they're
(38:11):
all sort of like.
You know, all the biomarkersare, all the data is there and
it's also stored in theblockchain, so the art responds
to you, it's customized, andthen, of course, you have all
kinds of incredible wellnessservices that can be distributed
to you.
You know, through knowing youand your AI agents can
(38:33):
facilitate whatever informationyou need, what you want, curated
for you, bringing the righthelp, bringing you know, and I
think the future is bright, ifonly we can use a technology
that's you know, beyondeconomics first, that it's
humanity first, but it can be awinning combination, right first
(38:54):
, but it can be a winningcombination, right?
Speaker 1 (38:56):
Yeah, yeah, it's so, so true.
So without?
I know you already live in thefuture, but I'm going to ask you
the question that I askeveryone at the end, which is
normally 20, 25 years in thefuture, but let's go a hundred
years in the future, cause Iknow that you can easily step
into 25 years from now in yourimagination.
So, 100 years from now, you canbring with you any gadget, any
(39:21):
service, just just anytechnology that makes you
personally happy or makes youjust better in some way.
What would it be and what wouldit do?
Speaker 2 (39:35):
in some way.
What would it be and what wouldit do?
Wow, so I would.
I would love the um.
I basically I would love tohave my own avatar, um,
connected to the blockchain, asI had mentioned, with my
heartbeat that recordseverything I've done, and I'd
love for after I, after I die, Iwould love for that avatar to
live on.
(39:55):
For you know, my future great,great, great grandkids to know
me and I can actually haveconversations with them and
share stories with them, andeven just anyone really is that
we can talk about what everyonetalk about, whether it's my art
or what.
I think that that would beincredible to be able to live
forever and just leave a legacyfor future generations to learn
(40:18):
from, because I find that wehave so much ADD and such short
tension spans.
I think that people wouldreally benefit from wisdom right
, and gaining that wisdom, and Ithink this would be a really
valuable kind of new thing thatwe can do, and we should do one
of you too, amy, like we shouldjust be living in the metaverse,
you know.
Speaker 1 (40:36):
Let's do it, I'll upload.
I'll upload tomorrow.
No, I love that and I thinkit's a way.
It's a way it's, you know, it'sa way forward, by kind of
reaching back into the future,but in a really, you know, kind
of positive and compelling humanway, because it's someone you
know was part of your family,like they're in your DNA, and
they get to kind of live on alittle bit through you and then
(40:57):
you get to make better decisionsthrough the knowledge that they
impart, and I think I'm withyou there.
Let's do it, let's make ithappen.
Yeah, Wonderful project.
Well, it has been amazinggetting to chat with you.
Thank you so much for joiningus today amazing getting to chat
with you.
Speaker 2 (41:17):
Thank you so much for joining us today.
Thank you, my dear friend.
You also inspire me.
You're so eloquent andbeautiful and my fellow futurist
, always a pleasure.
Hi everyone.
Welcome to the Future Constructpodcast.
I am your host, Amy Peck, andthis is the new series that
we're doing with our Futuristseries, and our guest today is
Krista Kim, who is pretty muchremarkable in every way.
She's a celebratedinternational digital artist.
(00:41):
She is founder of the TechismMovement, creator of Mars House
and co-founder of Xero Studio.
Welcome, Krista.
Speaker 2 (00:50):
Thank you, Amy.
And Amy is an advisor to XeroStudio as well, might I mention?
Speaker 1 (00:55):
Indeed, indeed, indeed, and the reason being
that when I first met you, I wasabsolutely blown away by just
the breadth with which you sortof approach not only your art
but just life and humanity.
(01:15):
And that's really what we wantto tackle with this Futurism
series, and it's not just beingaspirational, it's really about
how do we fundamentally usetechnology to change outcomes,
change our lives, solve some ofthe challenges that we're facing
.
And so, before we kind of diveinto the really nitty-gritty,
(01:40):
I'd love for you to just kind oftalk a little bit about your
history how did you come to be adigital artist?
And then we'll get into all ofyour accomplishments.
Speaker 2 (01:51):
Well, digital art I started in 2012.
I was painting.
Basically, I was practicingabstract painting.
Basically, I was practicingabstract painting.
I was very much influenced byJapanese abstract painting,
modern style painting usingtraditional pigments, a
technique that I learned inTokyo when I lived in Japan
(02:13):
between 2005 to 2008.
But when I landed in Singaporein 2010, I really started
painting in acrylics and oils,and it was in 2012 when I
decided to leave paintingaltogether and pursue digital,
because I was enrolled in theMasters of Fine Art program at
La Salle College of the Arts andwhen I was thinking about you
(02:36):
know how much I was using thisthing and not writing even.
I wasn't even writing notesanymore.
I was note-taking in my phone.
That's when I knew there was amajor paradigm shift in the
world where everything's goingto become digital.
So what's the point in creatingart that is based on, you know,
the medium of painting, when Ishould really be exploring light
(02:58):
and color, as you can see in inmy background?
That's you know digital, thatyou can see the screen, cause
I'm really fascinated by thephysiological effects of looking
at a screen.
It's all light and stuff.
You know messages and that'sshining into your retina.
But how can I use that as anart medium to create a sublime
experience?
And that was my thesis for forart school.
Speaker 1 (03:21):
Well, I, you know, I didn't know that you had lived
in Japan.
We were there at the same time,so we're going to have to talk
about that I used to live nearNishiyazabu Crossing.
Speaker 2 (03:31):
I was in Akasaka Ichome beside Okura Hotel.
Speaker 1 (03:34):
Oh, wow, so we must be.
I'm sure we'll talk about that.
Lexington Queen, you know thewhole.
Yeah, we'll have to chatoffline about that.
Very cool, so you know,actually.
So even just watching yourbackground, it is incredibly
soothing and that seems to beone of the through lines, I
(04:02):
think, in the art that I've seenof your work.
There's just something very andI forget the quote that's on
your website about the like,something about creating a sort
of a Zen experience, but it isyeah.
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (04:14):
You got it.
Speaker 1 (04:15):
So you know how does all of this mesh with your
vision for the future.
Speaker 2 (04:22):
Yeah, oh my gosh.
Thank you.
It's a great question.
You know, my artistic epiphanycame in Japan.
Actually is a very formativeperiod of my life as a human
being, as an artist, and it wasin Kyoto.
Kyoto, for me, was so impactful, it actually was the place
where I had my aha moment as anartist.
It was at the Roenji TempleGarden.
I don't know if you've beenthere, but it's one of the most
(04:44):
sacred Zen gardens in Japan, andwhen you go there, you sit in
front of the garden and yourealize that your mind becomes
automatically immersed in a Zenexperience.
And then I thought, oh my gosh,after an hour or two of
meditating in the space I didn'twant to leave right, I
(05:09):
discovered that it was the Zenmonks, over a thousand years ago
, who created this immersiveexperience out of a garden.
And that's when I discoveredthat art can create a meditative
experience in the viewer, andtherefore it is a service to
humanity, to future generations.
Experience in the viewer, andtherefore it is a service to
humanity, to future generations,to the future of civilization
(05:29):
itself.
I was so inspired by thatconcept that when I started to
really delve into what kind ofartist I wanted to be, during my
master's degree program.
That's when I realized I wantedto create a digital Zen
experience, that I want toreally pursue the sublime, the
healing, the same Zen beautifulexperience that I had at the Zen
garden in the digital realm.
So this is, in fact, isn't agood example of a digital garden
(05:51):
, a Zen garden, if you will.
That's the digitalreinterpretation of what I had
experienced in Kyoto.
And so, and when you fastforward, though, when you're
when, when now, whatever mediumI'm doing very interdisciplinary
, whether it's the metaverse orwhatever medium I I I encounter
(06:11):
or I want to work with, that isthe fundamental core of
everything that I do.
So that's it's it's about, it'sa blessing that I was there at
the same time as you.
Speaker 1 (06:22):
I love that.
I love that.
Hold on, I have to.
I'm going to pause.
I just inhaled some sort offloating dust situation.
Let me drink this, okay, good,good, yeah, let's take a quick
sip.
We're going to cut away to youanyway during that whole
situation.
That is so funny that we werethere at the same time.
(06:45):
That's amazing, okay six volumesyes, yes, all right, so let me
do this for jamil and so, butthere's a, there's a, there's a
real.
So there's the Zen quality, butthere's I mean, I guess let me
speak to the experience I havewhen I, when I have experienced
(07:08):
your artwork there's anarchitectural component, like
the NFTs that you shared witheveryone, which I treasure over
over the holidays.
There's the Zen zen component,but there's an, there's an
intellect and there's a.
You know, there's a vision thatis more uh, I don't even know
(07:30):
how, what the quite, quite theword is.
I think we think of zen garden,we think, oh, it's just all
kind of flowery and meditative,but there's like this very
powerful intellectual, visceralvision that is powering all of
this and I think it's why it'sso touching for people.
And again, I you know, do youfind that the time now is really
(07:57):
ripe for this convergence of,and it's, mental wellness?
Right, art and mental wellnessnow, I think are inextricably
aligned, and then this vision ofusing art and technology to
solve problems, I think also areconnected.
Speaker 2 (08:13):
I love that question, amy, and thank you so much for
the compliment.
I really do approach mypractice as a philosophy and you
know my background is inpolitical science.
That's what I studied atuniversity, so I learned a lot
from reading.
You know political philosophy.
(08:33):
You know and also like how isit that these ideas that were
shared, you know pen on paperthe pen is mightier than the
sword.
How did these ideas shift theworld and the way people think
and therefore change the world,like democracy itself, voltaire,
diderot, the French Revolutionthat actually led to the
(08:55):
formation of America, anddemocracy, and so all of these
sort of like incredible seismicshifts throughout history, I
learned a lot from, and so, whenI approached my art and I
looked at the current state ofthe world with, especially with
the technological disruption,you know where social media back
then in 2012, when I was reallythinking about this, you know
(09:19):
it really became the dominantnew communication medium and you
know the medium is the messageright?
I'm very much a student ofMarshall McLuhan, who I'm a big
fan of.
I really love his workUnderstanding Media.
The Medium is a Message.
I just feel.
I felt like, hey, if we'removing on from TV media,
electronic media, into theinternet age, into the
(09:41):
information age and now into theage of acceleration and AI and
blockchain.
What are those changes andparadigm shifts going to bring
to our society and how can Iimpart, you know, a vision for
the future of humanity in thisnew paradigm?
So I really wanted tocontribute in a way that really
(10:06):
keeps humanity at the core andthe ethos of a philosophy of how
we pursue the advancement oftechnology, and that's why I
wrote the Tech is a Manifesto in2014, because I saw the silo of
art, the silo of technology.
You know completely differentworlds and yet these two worlds
(10:27):
are pushing culture forward, andit was so.
It was very schizophrenic,right?
So I felt that there needs to bea bridge, that artists have to
get out of the classical, youknow, paradigm of creating art.
You know the way that we'retaught in school and I went
through the school system, so Iknow that there was this
(10:50):
hesitancy to pursue the new.
You know, as a medium, that alot of people weren't interested
in digital art at all.
In fact, it was still it stillis very outlier to this day and
so I felt that art was notreally communicating the
zeitgeist and I felt thatartists need to do that.
Artists need to ring an alarmif there are any human rights
(11:11):
issues that are being violated.
Artists need to create the techthat is humane, to collaborate,
co-create, have a dialogue withthe tech world, have a dialogue
(11:37):
with businessmen and have aseat at the table really to be
valuable in terms of our inputin making the tech human, making
it humane, so we're notalienating people with the
technology.
Speaker 1 (12:01):
So there, and it's funny, I'm so transfixed by your
background because it just isevocative of this idea of like
volumetric thinking right andtaking, connecting disparate
ideas and being fluid and beingpresent.
And we talk so much about STEM,stem, stem.
You mentioned education, stem.
So I fundamentally do notbelieve it's STEM education.
I think it's STEAM.
And if we forget that, art ontwo paths?
(12:26):
One is that we are, as humans,able to create something from
nothing, which, yes, we cantrain AI to do that, but there
is an organic element to the waythat humans do it that is
fundamentally different.
And then the second piece isthat kind of, you know,
practical element of being ableto see around the corners and
(12:50):
exercising the artistic part ofour minds, I think, allows us to
do that and yet, ironically,through the school system, those
are the programs that are underfire.
How do we move past that andconvince the world that this is
important?
Speaker 2 (13:07):
AI is so fascinating.
And what I love about you, amy,is that you truly are a
visionary yourself.
I mean, you are very creativeand I love how you're truly
right at the bleeding edge andyou get it and you're fearless,
creative.
And I love how you're trulyright at the bleeding edge and
you get it and you're fearless.
And I believe that fearlessnesscomes from, yes, the creativity
of your mind, that you know howto create something new out of
nothing.
(13:28):
So you're not looking at a newtechnology as something that is
scary, that brings instabilityand you know people don't like
instability, but you and I arethe types of people that like
disruption, that welcome it andcan create beauty out of it.
Right, the better systems outof it.
(13:48):
And that's the thing.
Most people in the world are notcreative.
Most people in the world arefed through a school system that
does not support a creativemind, but rather supports you to
be an employee for a company,to listen and integrate into a
hierarchical corporate system,which is fine.
(14:08):
It's been working for a longtime, but these are very
disruptive times times, and Ithink the school system is where
it has to start, where we areactually teaching children to be
unique and expressive andcreative, and harness AI and
learn how to be promptingengineers, learn how to tap into
(14:29):
their natural talents andpassions, and how can you use AI
to really showcase that, tomake that a powerful production
medium of what you want to see,right?
I just think that AI is sointeresting and it is so
(14:52):
exciting, but I'm definitely forit because I can see how
incredible ideas can spreadfaster and that how production
can be faster and, if anything,it's going to eliminate the need
for, you know, decorativepieces created by people.
(15:15):
I think that anyone can createbeautiful things now with AI.
But if you really want to be anartist, as we have spoken about
before, it's about thephilosophy and the ideas and
where you come from, and ifthat's unique and if people
resonate with that, then youhave an audience and then you
have art right that lives on forthe rest of humanity and into
(15:39):
the future.
Ai is very, very exciting andwe should not disparage AI.
We should not tell our kids tobe fearful of it.
In fact, I'm telling my kidshey, man, as soon as I learned
about ChachiPT on my kids,here's ChachiPT4.
Learn how to use it, be smarter, study better, learn more
(16:04):
faster, get more done and, hey,you have more free time to
pursue and think about what youlove to do, right?
I mean, what better manner isthere for kids to learn than to
use it as a tool to acceleratewho they are, how they learn,
how they form Right?
Speaker 1 (16:22):
It's so true, and I think you know we also can't
actually identify the influenceswe have, you know.
So artists are ingesting theworld as well, just in the same
way that we're feeding AI dataand inputs and inputs.
(16:50):
We do that as well.
I'm all for.
You know, we can solve thedigital asset management piece
and you know what was theprovenance of this.
You know this and that piece ofart.
But I agree with you, I thinkartists are.
They take the tools that wedemocratize and they elevate
them.
I mean, everyone now is aphotographer.
They have advanced filters,they have the best cameras in
the world and they can takeamazing photographs, but there
(17:13):
are still photographers outthere taking amazing and really
pushing the boundaries of whatphotography is.
And if you see an amazingphotograph that tells a story
that touches you, is that, youknow, somehow different from
this new realm of art?
No, it still touches you fromwithin and I think this is this
(17:34):
is leading me into, you know, myquestion, which, which I think
will be more relative to our,you know, more relevant to our
existing audiences.
We have a lot of business,people and AEC architecture
engineering and and what am I?
People and AEC architectureengineering and what am I doing?
Aec let's do that one again.
And our audience is veryfocused on business and the AEC
(17:56):
industry architecture,engineering and construction and
I'm sure they're listeningsaying what does this have to do
with me?
And I think the way also youtalk about business is that you
have, you know, you're using artin in an application, right
You're?
You're moving into this webthree realm, you're moving into
(18:16):
this 3d realm.
What are some of the ways thatyou know people and companies
can start to think aboutinnovation?
Because it's artists that arethe key to unlocking this.
I believe.
Speaker 2 (18:27):
Yeah, I totally agree with you.
I think that the creativityaspect is key and collaboration
is definitely going to be anincredible bonus and it's going
to add strength to your brand,strength to your products.
If you look at how Facebookchanged to meta and how they
approached the metaverse withoutcollaborating in a meaningful
(18:51):
way with the creative community,like they basically were using,
applying the same you knowbusiness model of trying to
acquire IP and you know, andreally controlling it when
really it should be aboutcollaboration, so that that's
how you can really create themost interesting and meaningful
(19:12):
new work and new ideas.
I think that if only they hadcollaborated more and if they
did a better job inunderstanding that culture, then
they would have been much moresuccessful in creating beautiful
, compelling spaces.
Because I think that in acompany right now, there's so
much focus on, like, marketingand strategy and let's get the
(19:33):
product out there, productdevelopment what about the
actual human connection and thebeauty of your products and the
beauty of what your services are?
I mean, there's something therethat art can actually impart
and I completely agree with youand I think meta is a very good
example of that versus Apple.
I mean the way that Appleapproaches their design ethos
(19:55):
and everything is like an artist, and that's why I really like
look at Apple.
I'm like really fascinated andamazed.
But you know what's reallyinteresting about Apple, too.
When I spoke with James Higa,who was the number two of
products under Steve Jobs, wespoke about the Roengi Temple
Garden, right, and you knowwe're he's actually I adore this
(20:16):
man, and and when we spokeabout it, you know I'm working.
I'm basically working on myMacBook Pro, or I love my
MacBook.
I use Mac all the time and Idon't know why I have this
amazing fascination with theproducts.
Everybody loves their Mac.
It's like a cult, right.
And when I talked about Roe andG Temple Garden, you know what
he told me.
He said oh, my goodness, like Iwould go to Roe and G Temple
(20:40):
Garden on many occasions, andyou know Steve has been there as
well and we would actuallydiscuss how can we impart this
experience in Apple products.
Speaker 1 (20:52):
I love that.
Speaker 2 (20:53):
Right.
So that's an artist mind, andif you can apply that to
anything, any company, anyindustry, it will totally
transform that product intosomething that's beloved.
Speaker 1 (21:06):
Yeah, I think you're right and I think you know I
hadn't really drawn thatconnection and that makes total
sense.
And the challenge I have withcompanies is that is and you
touched on it it's everything isthis economics first, and we
are at the precipice of reallybeing able to unlock completely
different economic models,different ways of engaging.
(21:35):
The jobs of the future, I think, are all going to have some
art-related basis orcraftsmanship or mindset, and if
we can start to weave theseartistic endeavors and these
creative endeavors intoeverything we do If you look at
healthcare or sort ofpost-pandemic, we saw how much
the digital landscape was both ahindrance and a help, and so
(21:57):
how do we take those learningsand move forward?
But that can be, I believe canbe really infused into sort of
the products and services of thefuture.
But I'd love to also talk aboutjust some of the other work
that you're doing and Mars Houseand what you're doing with Zero
Studio.
You're doing so manyfascinating I mean so many
amazing projects.
Speaker 2 (22:17):
Thank you.
Well, you know, first of all,you know everything I'm doing
with Metaverse.
I really want the Metaverse andthese powerful technologies,
which are only going to get moreand more accelerated, more and
more powerful and more and moreubiquitous.
I want these technologies to,first and foremost, serve
humanity and make us healthy,healthier, right and be good for
(22:40):
us, because I think Web 2.0 hasreally proven, because of our
mental health crisis that we'reactually experiencing globally,
social media has a lot to dowith that, and I witnessed this
and I knew that in 2014, that ifI'm experiencing these you know
yicky feelings, fomo andanxiety, and you know this
(23:01):
narcissism on social mediaplatforms then you know it's,
that's universal, and billionsof people around the world are
feeling that too, and there willbe a crisis and, lo and behold,
here we are.
So how can we make a change?
How can the new technology thatwe're introducing into the
world actually make us betterand solve those problems that
(23:22):
were created from web two,including loneliness, which is a
huge epidemic, and I mean it'suniversal.
Let's start from square one.
Let's create spaces of healingand bring people together, and I
think those are two things thatwe need desperately right now.
(23:42):
So, mars House I created duringthe height of the COVID crisis,
and it was in response to thelockdowns, and it was me and my
two kids under lockdown.
I mean, that lasted for a yearand a half.
Right, it was insane, wasn't it?
And I really wanted to create aspace that was zen of the 21st
century, a house that integratesmy gradient, meditative artwork
(24:05):
into the architecture.
And that's what Mars Housebecame, and so I was so proud of
this project.
It was such a passion projectof mine, and I never used Unreal
Engine 4 before.
It was my first introductioninto creating 3D spatial spaces
architecture, but I was reallyinspired to do it, and so I
(24:32):
designed the house, designed thefurniture, installed my work,
and it was such an incredibleexperience.
Then I parked it because what Ireally?
I didn't know what it was goingto be, what it would become.
I didn't know that it wouldbecome an NFT until December of
2020, when I discovered Bitcoinand Ethereum and I was doing
some research on blockchain arton the blockchain, and then NFTs
popped up.
And I was doing some researchon blockchain art on the
blockchain, and then NFTs poppedup and I was like whoa and I
went down that rabbit hole.
And then I ended up signing upfor super rare and I was
(24:55):
accepted artist in February, andthat was the time when they
were just onboarding artistsbecause they had upgraded their
platform platform.
And then in March, after amonth of studying the NFT market
, studying NFTs and art ingeneral, I thought, wow, these
(25:16):
platforms are very early and Iknew that the potential of NFTs
and going into the future wouldbe that they would be 3D digital
assets powered by AI.
Knew that, I don't know how Iknew that, but I just knew that
that was the future and that wasalso the future for a 3D
spatialized metaverse, that theywould be the building blocks
building economies and economiesof experiences and creative
(25:41):
economies on top of a virtualspace.
So I thought, oh my gosh, Iactually have a house that I can
offer for sale as an NFT.
And I was like, oh my God, Ijust have to do this, I have to
mint the Mars house.
And I was ready to ask theworld the question whether or
not the world is ready for a 3Ddigital asset of real estate,
(26:03):
which is also presented as anartwork on SuperRare real estate
, and as the, which is alsopresented as an artwork on super
rare.
And that was March 14th that Iminted the piece.
And, um lo and behold, aoi, areal visionary collector,
collected the piece.
He actually came in and swoopedall of my entire catalog that
was available and uh, we had aphone call and he's uh, um, uh,
based in Asia, and um.
(26:24):
So we had a call and he's likeyou know, chris, I just wanted
to know, I want to double check,if this is really a house for
the metaverse the way that youintended.
Am I getting the 3D files andeverything I'm like?
Yes, this is a house that youcan actually install in a
metaverse platform of yourchoice and it's yours to, you
know, enjoy in virtual realityhowever way you wish.
(26:46):
Right?
And that was a revolutionarysort of like moment when he said
, okay, I'll buy it.
And then it was, you know,amazing.
It just the world justresponded very, let's just say,
I was on Squawk Box thefollowing week.
Speaker 1 (27:04):
Oh, no, no, yes, I saw that.
I saw that on your website.
It's like now, everyone'spaying attention.
There's like, oh, there's moneyhere.
And it's like, oh, man, are youjust missing?
You're just missing the point.
Speaker 2 (27:21):
Exactly.
And then, of course, you know,everybody was like, hey, krista,
when you you going to sell morehouses?
Or people come to me like, oh,I had all kinds of propositions
to sell more houses, get behindvirtual real estate development
projects, at that early stage,without even a proper metaverse
world built, everything waswalled gardens.
(27:42):
You've got CryptoVox CentralLand Sandbox was walled gardens.
You've got CryptoVox CentralLand Sandbox.
Yeah, okay, but those aregaming platforms and I did not
consider that the true metaverse, the open metaverse, is what I
was imagining in my mind, whereeveryone will basically be able
to access an open metaverse.
Different realms haveinteroperable assets, not like
(28:04):
your home.
Like you know, your home is ina video game.
That that's not what I wantedand I didn't want to create this
um, you know this, this falsebubble, right?
I didn't believe in in, uh, inin the state of the market for
real estate in the metaverse.
Yet because, uh, we, we need tobuild out, um, out a greater
(28:25):
foundation, engineering, rightbehind it, the architecture, so
that we can all be there atscale right, offering services,
creating experiences and,through that, creating value on
top of these spaces, right, likethe Mars House, for example.
So I was really, reallycautious and I knew that I had
(28:52):
to take my time on this, andthat's when I was inspired to
create the studio, because Ithought, okay, so instead of
like selling all these houses,right, what I should be doing is
creating experiences that addvalue, so that people understand
the value being in themetaverse and we could build a
metaverse together through theseexperiences.
And for me, I believe that youknow, as a mom, right, I've got
(29:14):
two teenagers and I think, well,what do I want for my kids?
I want them to be smarter, Iwant education and I also want
them to be healthier.
I want mental health offeringsin the metaverse, and I think
that's what would attractmothers, women, society into the
metaverse and the mainstream enmasse as a mainstream, you know
(29:37):
, selling point, and that's whatI wanted to focus on.
So you build a more robustreason and experience economy,
which therefore supports theassets.
Speaker 1 (29:49):
Yeah, that makes sense and you know this is your
of course.
You know we know we are inviolent agreement on all of
these things, because it's again, it's how do we?
You know the interoperability,you know that's a problem,
hopefully we will solve, butit's the economy of scarcity
(30:09):
that we're trying to replicatein this virtual realm.
That doesn't make any sense andthat's why I agree with you
that virtual real estate, itwill have its place.
There will be a reason for youto be in, you know, certain
quadrant with a certain group,and but to me it's around
community and it's not aroundthe financial wherewithal just
to be in.
That you know, because again,you mentioned hierarchical
(30:32):
structure.
That's what we're like.
Why would we build that again?
Speaker 2 (30:37):
You know what you know.
It's so cool.
I actually learned a lot aboutthis from Kyoto.
Yeah, you know, kyoto is beauty, of all of their beautiful
ancient buildings and Zengardens over all of these
(31:00):
millennia, you know, and it'sthe beauty of the space that
brings people back, and it'sthis X factor that brings you
back, and that's what I think isthe only thing that's going to
be a sticky point for themetaverse as well.
So, yes, we are in totalagreement there Create beautiful
experiences and people willwant to come back, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1 (31:23):
And then you know the NFT craze and crypto, because
they're going through.
There's not only hype cycle,there's been so much kind of you
know criminal activity thatit's really sullying the
elegance of the blockchain andreally what we can accomplish.
And this idea that we have to,like, wrestle cryptocurrency to
(31:46):
the ground and make it behavelike fiat currency Again.
What is, you know, an exchangeof?
just a transparent exchange ofvalue, right and value can come
in any form right, it can be art, it can be experience, it can
be data, it can becryptocurrency.
But what are the mechanics ofthis new economy?
(32:08):
And with microtransactions now,which have been, you know, sort
of the bane of the regulatoryexistence, and trying to figure
out you know how to, how tocontrol it?
But but out of that, you know,could, can we collectively
divine a better economy, onewhere, you know, people in the
remotest areas of the world canactually participate in a global
(32:31):
economy?
And you know what?
What is the vision to to kindof allow that to happen?
Speaker 2 (32:38):
oh yeah, totally, and I, you know, I, I for one, am
all about foundational.
You know the foundations rightuh, when you're building
something that will last, and I,I think that, especially when
we're looking right now at the,the age where ai, metaverse and
blockchain will converge, right,they're not siloed and I think
(32:58):
a lot of people discuss thesetechnologies as if they're
separate, but they're reallygoing to converge in a major way
, what we have to do, andespecially when you're touching
upon and I think it's aboutdigital identity, right, and
being able to be recognized inthe blockchain for what you
contribute to an economy, acreator's economy, and be
remunerated for the blockchain,we need to really focus on the
(33:22):
digital identity part, don't we?
I mean, that's the foundationalstructure we need right now,
and I actually think that we'regoing to move toward a
blockchain system that's poweredand facilitated through AI.
You know that will allow us toconnect our true identity, our
one identity.
(33:42):
That is, you know, proof of whowe are.
That is our passport, that'sour everything birth certificate
, marriage certificateeverything is connected to that
true identity of who we are, andI think that, if it's immutable
in the blockchain, it'saccessible for everybody in the
world to do because it's cheapto mint, and I think that this
(34:03):
accessible technology will alsobe for everyone.
It's actually technology and Iknow about through our common
friend, teddy Bahagbia, calledTenbeo, friend Teddy Pahagbia,
called Tenbeo.
It's a very exciting technologythat basically attaches your
(34:25):
unique heartbeat algorithm tothe blockchain, which identifies
you as a unique individual inthe world.
All of your bio data is fedinto the blockchain.
It is a wallet, it's a vault,if you will.
This vault in the blockchainalso facilitates the storage of
your own data, so we can allself-custody our data and then,
of course, self-custody of allof our assets and then, of
course, our IP.
(34:45):
So, as an artist and for anyonewho basically is participating
in the world economy in thefuture economy in the future, I
think it's very important thatit is clearly authenticated what
we create and how we contributeto, whatever projects we
participate in and we're fairlyremunerated for that.
And those microtransactions are.
(35:08):
I mean, that's all AI andblockchain that will allow that
to happen.
That's a scalable model thatanyone can participate in there
and I think that's going to bethe way forward.
Speaker 1 (35:20):
Yeah, yeah, I agree with you.
I think it's going to take sometime and I think we also have to
agree, you know, kind ofcollectively as individuals, to
do the work to actually start tomanage our own data and manage
our identities.
But to your point, you know, itkind of becomes a database query
where, as long as, becausewe're going to present in
multiple different types ofpersonas, we might have one
(35:45):
digital persona in oneenvironment, a different one for
a game, a different one for acollaboration setting and a
different one for business, butthat at a core they're all tied
to that same vault or wallet ordate, you know personal database
, and there will just be a sortof a you know KYC mechanism and
know your customer mechanism,which already exists, to allow
(36:07):
you to prove that you are whoyou say you are, that you're not
an AI, because that's going tostart to matter soon, and that
you're not an imposter, becausethat's going to matter, and you
know you're not some sort ofnefarious being and it's a
little hard to imagine how toget there.
But this is where I also thinkthat artists are so valuable,
(36:27):
because you're able to drawpeople in in a way that is
soothing and meaningful andhuman, in in a way that is
soothing and meaningful andhuman, and then that's where we
can start to educate and justbring people along like bit by
bit by bit.
Speaker 2 (36:43):
So I hope this is exactly Thank you, and and, and.
So basically, the what I wouldlove to do in my you know how
Xero would like to strategizeand bringing people in is to use
this technology for mentalhealth and wellness.
So I mean AI technology andmetaverse.
What we want to do is we wantto create the digital
(37:07):
intelligent avatar of DeepakChopra and other great icons and
teachers that can really impartone-on-one information in a
human conversation style, likewhat we're having right now with
the AI.
If you need guidance onsomething, I would love to sit
(37:27):
with Deepak.
Wouldn't you love to sit withDeepak and just ask him
questions if you're goingthrough something or if you need
some advice?
I mean, that's the kind ofscalable service that Metaverse
as a service can provide, ifit's open, it's interoperable
and that you know you canactually communicate with his,
(37:48):
his intelligent avatar.
And then you think about how artlike this can also be.
You know, with science, aigenerated generative art that
can scientifically soothe yourmind or give you energy.
You know, have differenteffects on the brain and they're
(38:11):
all sort of like.
You know, all the biomarkersare, all the data is there and
it's also stored in theblockchain, so the art responds
to you, it's customized, andthen, of course, you have all
kinds of incredible wellnessservices that can be distributed
to you.
You know, through knowing youand your AI agents can
(38:33):
facilitate whatever informationyou need, what you want, curated
for you, bringing the righthelp, bringing you know, and I
think the future is bright, ifonly we can use a technology
that's you know, beyondeconomics first, that it's
humanity first, but it can be awinning combination, right first
(38:54):
, but it can be a winningcombination, right?
Speaker 1 (38:56):
Yeah, yeah, it's so, so true.
So without?
I know you already live in thefuture, but I'm going to ask you
the question that I askeveryone at the end, which is
normally 20, 25 years in thefuture, but let's go a hundred
years in the future, cause Iknow that you can easily step
into 25 years from now in yourimagination.
So, 100 years from now, you canbring with you any gadget, any
(39:21):
service, just just anytechnology that makes you
personally happy or makes youjust better in some way.
What would it be and what wouldit do?
Speaker 2 (39:35):
in some way.
What would it be and what wouldit do?
Wow, so I would.
I would love the um.
I basically I would love tohave my own avatar, um,
connected to the blockchain, asI had mentioned, with my
heartbeat that recordseverything I've done, and I'd
love for after I, after I die, Iwould love for that avatar to
live on.
(39:55):
For you know, my future great,great, great grandkids to know
me and I can actually haveconversations with them and
share stories with them, andeven just anyone really is that
we can talk about what everyonetalk about, whether it's my art
or what.
I think that that would beincredible to be able to live
forever and just leave a legacyfor future generations to learn
(40:18):
from, because I find that wehave so much ADD and such short
tension spans.
I think that people wouldreally benefit from wisdom right
, and gaining that wisdom, and Ithink this would be a really
valuable kind of new thing thatwe can do, and we should do one
of you too, amy, like we shouldjust be living in the metaverse,
you know.
Speaker 1 (40:36):
Let's do it, I'll upload.
I'll upload tomorrow.
No, I love that and I thinkit's a way.
It's a way it's, you know, it'sa way forward, by kind of
reaching back into the future,but in a really, you know, kind
of positive and compelling humanway, because it's someone you
know was part of your family,like they're in your DNA, and
they get to kind of live on alittle bit through you and then
(40:57):
you get to make better decisionsthrough the knowledge that they
impart, and I think I'm withyou there.
Let's do it, let's make ithappen.
Yeah, Wonderful project.
Well, it has been amazinggetting to chat with you.
Thank you so much for joiningus today amazing getting to chat
with you.
Speaker 2 (41:17):
Thank you so much for joining us today.
Thank you, my dear friend.
You also inspire me.
You're so eloquent andbeautiful and my fellow futurist
, always a pleasure.
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