November 13, 2024 • 13 mins
Our exclusive podcast chat with the writers of 'Power of Two' Sarah Megginson & Lisa Messenger. After 18 rounds of IVF and years of trying, Lisa Messengers dream of motherhood came true thanks to the selfless act of her friend, Sarah Megginson, who became her surrogate. Their new book shares this incredible journey of the arrival of baby Hugo.
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Lisa and Sarah. Good morning, good.
Speaker 2 (00:02):
Morning, good money.
Speaker 3 (00:04):
Well, congratulations on a few things. A few babies in
the studio. We've got baby Hugo here, the baby you
created together, and we have got your book Baby Here,
The Power two.
Speaker 4 (00:14):
So you've been everywhere.
Speaker 1 (00:16):
We're so proud.
Speaker 3 (00:16):
Well, we'll say, Lisa, we're only just meeting you, but
we're very proud of Sarah and everything she's done, not
only for you, but just career wise as well.
Speaker 4 (00:24):
Thank you.
Speaker 5 (00:24):
What was harder to give birth to the book or
the baby?
Speaker 6 (00:27):
Oh my gosh, the baby was much quicker. He was
out in three hours. The book has been a much bigger,
longer experience, but both had their ups and downs.
Speaker 4 (00:36):
I would say, yes.
Speaker 3 (00:38):
So for those that don't know, you were a surrogate
for Lisa and now you've created this baby and book together. Yes,
and the book is all about the surrogacy journey.
Speaker 4 (00:47):
It is. And you can tell he's very interested in
sharing this story.
Speaker 2 (00:52):
Again. Yes, a big chatter. Oh mama, do we have
to talk about this one again?
Speaker 1 (00:58):
Yes?
Speaker 6 (00:58):
And we we We found the experience obviously so profound,
and both Lisa and I are writers, so we kind
of journaled a lot and we the way we experience
our world is through writing. So we kind of got
to the end of it and realized that this was
such a big experience and that there's so little information
out there about sarrogacy, and it just felt very natural
(01:19):
to try and share the experience with people and let
them know the real nuts and bolts of what's involved
in sarrogacy. But it's also a really beautiful story about
friendship and.
Speaker 4 (01:31):
Hope and not giving up.
Speaker 6 (01:32):
And you know, Lisa's journey was pretty long before this,
her fertility journey, so there's a whole bunch in it.
Speaker 4 (01:39):
For a lot of different people.
Speaker 1 (01:40):
Well that's the thing with sarrogassi in Australia.
Speaker 3 (01:42):
You only come to it if you either are perhaps
same sex, or there's fertility issues. So a pretty normal,
healthy woman doesn't go, I want somebody else to carry
my baby. That doesn't happen here, does it.
Speaker 2 (01:55):
They might like to think it would. I mean, it's
certainly the greatest outsource, but no, I mean for me,
it was as I'm holding this little man in my arms.
It was eight years of trying and sixteen rounds of
IVF and various lotions and potions and standing on my
head and doing all sorts of things to try and conceive,
and ultimately this goddess offered up her tummy and this
(02:19):
little man came out of it.
Speaker 5 (02:20):
Could you recommend it at all to someone else to
do this? I think it's a hard question to answer,
because you know what You've gone through, all of it,
like the good bits, which is this, but the journey itself.
So could you honestly recommend to someone that they could
(02:43):
do it or should do it?
Speaker 4 (02:44):
I think if you know yourself.
Speaker 6 (02:46):
I knew myself that I would be okay to go
through the whole experience and to not become connected to
the baby in a way that felt maternal. I knew
in myself I would be able to do that.
Speaker 4 (02:57):
I thought, I knew you kind of never know until
you do it.
Speaker 6 (03:00):
And then when I did it, thankfully, everything happened with
him the way I expected, and I felt really protective
of him as an auntie. But I never felt connected
as in a maternal way. So I think there could be,
you know, gray areas for people if they still want
children themselves, if they haven't finished their family, if they've
got really little kids and they're still in the trenches
(03:21):
of parenting that could create some gray areas, but for me,
I thought it was extraordinary and I would recommend it
because now we have HUGO.
Speaker 3 (03:28):
Let's go back to the very beginning. That first moment
where you offered your woomb to Lisa.
Speaker 2 (03:35):
Well, that was twenty and eighteen, but we'd actually known
each other since twenty eleven, and Sarah had worked for
me editing lots of my books, and we'd become great
friends over the years. We had lots of things happen
in parallel, like our father's passing away within three months
of each other to the day, so we knew each
other pretty well. And it was in twenty eighteen and
(03:56):
we were having a coffee or a lunch on a
rooftop in Surrey Hills. Sarah just knew that I was
a few rounds into IVF and said, if you're ever
looking for someone, i'd be interested. And I think we
all come at things when we're ready, and I just
was like, oh my gosh, she was this goddess that's amazing.
But I just wasn't ready. I needed to get to
a place where I was resolute in not being able
(04:18):
to carry my own baby and that was actually four
years later, twenty twenty two.
Speaker 3 (04:24):
Wow, it's an interesting I'm halfway through the book and
because I've lived it as well, because we work with Christo,
Sarah's wife, so we were a part of like, oh
my god, she's offered up her womb to someone.
Speaker 1 (04:34):
But what we were a part of his journey.
Speaker 3 (04:38):
Yeah, And that's not so much in the book, because
you both very cleverly wrote about.
Speaker 1 (04:43):
Your own journeys.
Speaker 3 (04:44):
But our part of it was Christo going about what's
this going to mean for me? And how's this going
to work out for us? And I need paternity leave?
But do I need paternity leave? Because I'm not a
cake taking home a baby, but I've got a care
for my wife.
Speaker 4 (04:57):
And hot Tomato was amazing.
Speaker 6 (04:58):
They gave him a couple of weeks, yeah, maybe, which
was extraordinary. There were lots of moments like that where
other people and other organizations and just support around us
really showed up for us.
Speaker 4 (05:09):
Yes, And it's also a really.
Speaker 6 (05:11):
Good point, like this was not just a decision I made,
It was a decision for our whole family.
Speaker 4 (05:15):
He is, you know, pretty disruptive to be pregnant and.
Speaker 6 (05:18):
Go through IVF and all of that, So it was
something the whole family went on that journey.
Speaker 4 (05:22):
And I think when we first did surgery, the sorry
not surgery, what do you call it? Therapy? Yes, the
therapist said.
Speaker 1 (05:28):
Which was like surgery, excavating use all.
Speaker 6 (05:33):
It was pretty intense, but he said that he usually
usually the families that go through this, they find it
to be an expansive journey. And I really held on
to that word because there were really tough times, especially
as I got heavily pregnant, and I could no longer,
you know, go to my son's soccer games, or just
show up for my kids the way that I normally
wanted to. I kept reminding myself, this is for the
(05:54):
greater good of everyone, and I can't show up for
them right now, but they are seeing modeling for them
what happens when you give back and when you help
your community. So it's all working towards the greater good,
even if I can't see it right in this moment.
Speaker 5 (06:08):
Yes, it's more long term than short terms.
Speaker 4 (06:10):
Yeah, yeah, planning seeds.
Speaker 3 (06:12):
One part of the book that shocked me though, was
that you, Lisa, had the opportunity to have a surrogate
in America at almost the same time and then NFL
through And the reason I want you to share it.
Speaker 1 (06:26):
I know we need people.
Speaker 3 (06:27):
To read the book, but there's a lot of people
who consider surrogacy overseas and you had a terrible experience.
Speaker 2 (06:33):
We did, and I think, just leaning into that and
also jumping off from what say has been saying, part
of the reason we've written the book is to help
with so many different things the complexities of IVF for
a start, and it's so expensive. I mean, I was
fortunate that we were able to do sixteen and ultimately
eighteen rounds, and we're in a position to pay for it,
(06:54):
but I think a lot of that could be deregulated
and there could be a lot more government support. The
US is a whole different ballgame, and really we've written
an entire horrendous chapter about my experience there, but ultimately
that would have cost around four hundred and fifty thousand
dollars and it's too confusing and complex to get into here.
And I do know some people have, you know, wonderful
(07:16):
experiences over there that was certainly not the case for us.
And I think, you know, there are so many things
we could talk about here, but I hope that in
us sharing the book it will help things like what
hot Tomato did for Christo and what Sarah's work ultimately
did for her, and just changing people's perceptions and regulatory
(07:36):
and red tape and bureaucracy surrounding you know, IVF, infertility
and surrogacy.
Speaker 1 (07:43):
What is some of that.
Speaker 6 (07:45):
Well, one thing, for instance, is Medicare rebates. When I
was having my IVF, Lisa and Stephen weren't eligible for
the same Medicare rebates they would be when Lisa's doing
it herself because it's not her going through the experience,
so that if they did for me, was much more expensive.
Just small, small, but significant things like that. And also
(08:06):
I was Hugo's legal parent until he was thirteen months old,
which we were really lucky didn't cause any issues, but
if he had had a medical issue, I would have
had to be the one taking him to hospital because
I was legally his parent.
Speaker 2 (08:18):
And next week you go sixteen months old and we
still don't have a legal birth certificate or a legal
Medicare card for him under our name. We've got the
parentage order now, which happened at thirteen months, but we're
still having to get paperwork. In fact, after this, I've
got to go to another JP to get more paperwork signed,
(08:41):
and that becomes problematic in terms of enrolling him in daycare.
So every single time something happens like this, even though
every single cell in my entire body unquestionably is his mother,
it is this little jarring reminder every time they're like, oh,
but his birth certificate has other people's names on it,
or we go to get him vaccinated or go to
(09:01):
the doctor and they're like, oh, what, but he doesn't
have a Medicare cut.
Speaker 1 (09:04):
So we are still, wow.
Speaker 2 (09:06):
Sixteen months later, dealing with this, and it's like daily
reminders a little bit, and I think, you know, we
could really kind of get with the program. Sarah, and
I had to go to the Supreme Court when via
Zoom when he was thirteen months old, and I had
to explain to a gray head judge from another century.
You know why he was questioning me, but had you
(09:30):
really tried hard enough to have a baby on you?
And I'm like, my child is thirteen months old. If
I don't answer this to your satisfaction, where's.
Speaker 1 (09:39):
The baby gonna go?
Speaker 2 (09:41):
Like I do think and I get it to a.
Speaker 1 (09:43):
Degree in that situation, there's.
Speaker 2 (09:47):
Only one hundred and twenty so I guess he's in
Australia a year, so I think that antiquated. There's a
lot of catching up to do. And hopefully Sarah and
I threw all our kind of advocacy and talking our
heads off about it will help move the needles so
so it becomes easier for people, you know, in the future.
Speaker 4 (10:04):
I had infertility issues.
Speaker 3 (10:06):
We researched surrogacy in San Diego and we chose there
because the mother would be me.
Speaker 4 (10:13):
So the birth certificate their their laws over there are that, yes,
and so was the father of Hugo.
Speaker 6 (10:19):
Yes, it's just blows sorry, wow, just because he was
my husband, he was listed as the father and I
didn't understand that. I was like, why I couldn't at
least if I'm the gestational mother, why can't his actual father,
Stephen be on the birth certificate from day dot?
Speaker 4 (10:34):
That just would have created well christa a bit more.
Speaker 2 (10:36):
Christo is still to this day, sixteen months and we
still do not have a very certificate.
Speaker 1 (10:42):
Wow, he'd loved being a father of four.
Speaker 3 (10:46):
I just feel the trauma I have still from my
IVF experience and infertility.
Speaker 1 (10:52):
To know that then that is continually.
Speaker 3 (10:54):
Perpetuated for you after the baby is here. With all
of these things you have to question make me furious
for you, Well.
Speaker 2 (11:02):
Yes, thank you. Sarah and I talk about this a lot.
I think a very good compartmentalizing and desensitizing And for me, it's.
Speaker 4 (11:11):
A story now.
Speaker 2 (11:13):
And I've had to do that because for eight years
I just lived absolute, pure hell. And now I try
and stay in the light and focus on the good.
And every day I look at this little munchkin and
just go, oh my god, could my heart explode anymore?
And so I think I've trained myself in mindset, and
I've been writing books about this, thank God, for years
(11:34):
to kind of, you know, flip my mindset and try
and find the silver lightings. And Sarah and I, I mean,
were actually the perfect duo because so often I was like, oh,
there isn't I get how you're looking at a silver lighting,
but I just situation.
Speaker 4 (11:47):
She's like, it's actually fine. I'm like, no, it's actually not.
Speaker 1 (11:50):
That's fine for you as well. You do all your
woo were happiness. I'm furious here in stew Well, Yeah.
Speaker 2 (11:56):
I think I can't keep being furious was actually my
whole life. I've been this optimistic, you know, Pollyanna, like,
let's find the good, and I actually started becoming very
jaded and resentful and angry, and i just started losing myself.
And so I'm trying to brother, I'm trying to lean.
(12:17):
I'm so cute. He's like up my skirt as we're speaking.
Speaker 1 (12:24):
You have to call.
Speaker 2 (12:29):
It was that kind of a show that we've got there,
trying to break it up a bit.
Speaker 1 (12:37):
Very gracious, letting the girls to stay in the light light,
very gracious because he just looks at the girl and
falls pregnant. He's not four kids.
Speaker 3 (12:48):
Well I've taken away about.
Speaker 1 (12:56):
Well does she have a spare?
Speaker 2 (12:59):
You should say that we have four more emperors and
we're looking for another time because this one has done
its job.
Speaker 1 (13:05):
Look at the time.
Speaker 3 (13:08):
It's an extraordinary story. And do stay positive. I mean,
it is the only way to do it. The Power
of Two is in bookstores now. We're so proud of
Sarah Meganson and Lisa Meissinger. Thank you for coming in
and joining us, and congratulations on your baby.
Speaker 4 (13:25):
Thank you.
Speaker 7 (13:27):
All right, ladies, hold it there. We're going to continue
the story about you. All right, ladies, hold it there,
we're going to continue finding out more about your ski.
All right, ladies, hold it right there. We're going to
continue this conversation up next. We want to find out
more details on your surrogacy and how it played out,
in particular, what went wrong when you went to America,
(13:47):
and much much more as we keep talking about your book.
It's Gaily and Emily Jada Hot Tomato
Lisa and Sarah. Good morning, good.
Speaker 2 (00:02):
Morning, good money.
Speaker 3 (00:04):
Well, congratulations on a few things. A few babies in
the studio. We've got baby Hugo here, the baby you
created together, and we have got your book Baby Here,
The Power two.
Speaker 4 (00:14):
So you've been everywhere.
Speaker 1 (00:16):
We're so proud.
Speaker 3 (00:16):
Well, we'll say, Lisa, we're only just meeting you, but
we're very proud of Sarah and everything she's done, not
only for you, but just career wise as well.
Speaker 4 (00:24):
Thank you.
Speaker 5 (00:24):
What was harder to give birth to the book or
the baby?
Speaker 6 (00:27):
Oh my gosh, the baby was much quicker. He was
out in three hours. The book has been a much bigger,
longer experience, but both had their ups and downs.
Speaker 4 (00:36):
I would say, yes.
Speaker 3 (00:38):
So for those that don't know, you were a surrogate
for Lisa and now you've created this baby and book together. Yes,
and the book is all about the surrogacy journey.
Speaker 4 (00:47):
It is. And you can tell he's very interested in
sharing this story.
Speaker 2 (00:52):
Again. Yes, a big chatter. Oh mama, do we have
to talk about this one again?
Speaker 1 (00:58):
Yes?
Speaker 6 (00:58):
And we we We found the experience obviously so profound,
and both Lisa and I are writers, so we kind
of journaled a lot and we the way we experience
our world is through writing. So we kind of got
to the end of it and realized that this was
such a big experience and that there's so little information
out there about sarrogacy, and it just felt very natural
(01:19):
to try and share the experience with people and let
them know the real nuts and bolts of what's involved
in sarrogacy. But it's also a really beautiful story about
friendship and.
Speaker 4 (01:31):
Hope and not giving up.
Speaker 6 (01:32):
And you know, Lisa's journey was pretty long before this,
her fertility journey, so there's a whole bunch in it.
Speaker 4 (01:39):
For a lot of different people.
Speaker 1 (01:40):
Well that's the thing with sarrogassi in Australia.
Speaker 3 (01:42):
You only come to it if you either are perhaps
same sex, or there's fertility issues. So a pretty normal,
healthy woman doesn't go, I want somebody else to carry
my baby. That doesn't happen here, does it.
Speaker 2 (01:55):
They might like to think it would. I mean, it's
certainly the greatest outsource, but no, I mean for me,
it was as I'm holding this little man in my arms.
It was eight years of trying and sixteen rounds of
IVF and various lotions and potions and standing on my
head and doing all sorts of things to try and conceive,
and ultimately this goddess offered up her tummy and this
(02:19):
little man came out of it.
Speaker 5 (02:20):
Could you recommend it at all to someone else to
do this? I think it's a hard question to answer,
because you know what You've gone through, all of it,
like the good bits, which is this, but the journey itself.
So could you honestly recommend to someone that they could
(02:43):
do it or should do it?
Speaker 4 (02:44):
I think if you know yourself.
Speaker 6 (02:46):
I knew myself that I would be okay to go
through the whole experience and to not become connected to
the baby in a way that felt maternal. I knew
in myself I would be able to do that.
Speaker 4 (02:57):
I thought, I knew you kind of never know until
you do it.
Speaker 6 (03:00):
And then when I did it, thankfully, everything happened with
him the way I expected, and I felt really protective
of him as an auntie. But I never felt connected
as in a maternal way. So I think there could be,
you know, gray areas for people if they still want
children themselves, if they haven't finished their family, if they've
got really little kids and they're still in the trenches
(03:21):
of parenting that could create some gray areas, but for me,
I thought it was extraordinary and I would recommend it
because now we have HUGO.
Speaker 3 (03:28):
Let's go back to the very beginning. That first moment
where you offered your woomb to Lisa.
Speaker 2 (03:35):
Well, that was twenty and eighteen, but we'd actually known
each other since twenty eleven, and Sarah had worked for
me editing lots of my books, and we'd become great
friends over the years. We had lots of things happen
in parallel, like our father's passing away within three months
of each other to the day, so we knew each
other pretty well. And it was in twenty eighteen and
(03:56):
we were having a coffee or a lunch on a
rooftop in Surrey Hills. Sarah just knew that I was
a few rounds into IVF and said, if you're ever
looking for someone, i'd be interested. And I think we
all come at things when we're ready, and I just
was like, oh my gosh, she was this goddess that's amazing.
But I just wasn't ready. I needed to get to
a place where I was resolute in not being able
(04:18):
to carry my own baby and that was actually four
years later, twenty twenty two.
Speaker 3 (04:24):
Wow, it's an interesting I'm halfway through the book and
because I've lived it as well, because we work with Christo,
Sarah's wife, so we were a part of like, oh
my god, she's offered up her womb to someone.
Speaker 1 (04:34):
But what we were a part of his journey.
Speaker 3 (04:38):
Yeah, And that's not so much in the book, because
you both very cleverly wrote about.
Speaker 1 (04:43):
Your own journeys.
Speaker 3 (04:44):
But our part of it was Christo going about what's
this going to mean for me? And how's this going
to work out for us? And I need paternity leave?
But do I need paternity leave? Because I'm not a
cake taking home a baby, but I've got a care
for my wife.
Speaker 4 (04:57):
And hot Tomato was amazing.
Speaker 6 (04:58):
They gave him a couple of weeks, yeah, maybe, which
was extraordinary. There were lots of moments like that where
other people and other organizations and just support around us
really showed up for us.
Speaker 4 (05:09):
Yes, And it's also a really.
Speaker 6 (05:11):
Good point, like this was not just a decision I made,
It was a decision for our whole family.
Speaker 4 (05:15):
He is, you know, pretty disruptive to be pregnant and.
Speaker 6 (05:18):
Go through IVF and all of that, So it was
something the whole family went on that journey.
Speaker 4 (05:22):
And I think when we first did surgery, the sorry
not surgery, what do you call it? Therapy? Yes, the
therapist said.
Speaker 1 (05:28):
Which was like surgery, excavating use all.
Speaker 6 (05:33):
It was pretty intense, but he said that he usually
usually the families that go through this, they find it
to be an expansive journey. And I really held on
to that word because there were really tough times, especially
as I got heavily pregnant, and I could no longer,
you know, go to my son's soccer games, or just
show up for my kids the way that I normally
wanted to. I kept reminding myself, this is for the
(05:54):
greater good of everyone, and I can't show up for
them right now, but they are seeing modeling for them
what happens when you give back and when you help
your community. So it's all working towards the greater good,
even if I can't see it right in this moment.
Speaker 5 (06:08):
Yes, it's more long term than short terms.
Speaker 4 (06:10):
Yeah, yeah, planning seeds.
Speaker 3 (06:12):
One part of the book that shocked me though, was
that you, Lisa, had the opportunity to have a surrogate
in America at almost the same time and then NFL
through And the reason I want you to share it.
Speaker 1 (06:26):
I know we need people.
Speaker 3 (06:27):
To read the book, but there's a lot of people
who consider surrogacy overseas and you had a terrible experience.
Speaker 2 (06:33):
We did, and I think, just leaning into that and
also jumping off from what say has been saying, part
of the reason we've written the book is to help
with so many different things the complexities of IVF for
a start, and it's so expensive. I mean, I was
fortunate that we were able to do sixteen and ultimately
eighteen rounds, and we're in a position to pay for it,
(06:54):
but I think a lot of that could be deregulated
and there could be a lot more government support. The
US is a whole different ballgame, and really we've written
an entire horrendous chapter about my experience there, but ultimately
that would have cost around four hundred and fifty thousand
dollars and it's too confusing and complex to get into here.
And I do know some people have, you know, wonderful
(07:16):
experiences over there that was certainly not the case for us.
And I think, you know, there are so many things
we could talk about here, but I hope that in
us sharing the book it will help things like what
hot Tomato did for Christo and what Sarah's work ultimately
did for her, and just changing people's perceptions and regulatory
(07:36):
and red tape and bureaucracy surrounding you know, IVF, infertility
and surrogacy.
Speaker 1 (07:43):
What is some of that.
Speaker 6 (07:45):
Well, one thing, for instance, is Medicare rebates. When I
was having my IVF, Lisa and Stephen weren't eligible for
the same Medicare rebates they would be when Lisa's doing
it herself because it's not her going through the experience,
so that if they did for me, was much more expensive.
Just small, small, but significant things like that. And also
(08:06):
I was Hugo's legal parent until he was thirteen months old,
which we were really lucky didn't cause any issues, but
if he had had a medical issue, I would have
had to be the one taking him to hospital because
I was legally his parent.
Speaker 2 (08:18):
And next week you go sixteen months old and we
still don't have a legal birth certificate or a legal
Medicare card for him under our name. We've got the
parentage order now, which happened at thirteen months, but we're
still having to get paperwork. In fact, after this, I've
got to go to another JP to get more paperwork signed,
(08:41):
and that becomes problematic in terms of enrolling him in daycare.
So every single time something happens like this, even though
every single cell in my entire body unquestionably is his mother,
it is this little jarring reminder every time they're like, oh,
but his birth certificate has other people's names on it,
or we go to get him vaccinated or go to
(09:01):
the doctor and they're like, oh, what, but he doesn't
have a Medicare cut.
Speaker 1 (09:04):
So we are still, wow.
Speaker 2 (09:06):
Sixteen months later, dealing with this, and it's like daily
reminders a little bit, and I think, you know, we
could really kind of get with the program. Sarah, and
I had to go to the Supreme Court when via
Zoom when he was thirteen months old, and I had
to explain to a gray head judge from another century.
You know why he was questioning me, but had you
(09:30):
really tried hard enough to have a baby on you?
And I'm like, my child is thirteen months old. If
I don't answer this to your satisfaction, where's.
Speaker 1 (09:39):
The baby gonna go?
Speaker 2 (09:41):
Like I do think and I get it to a.
Speaker 1 (09:43):
Degree in that situation, there's.
Speaker 2 (09:47):
Only one hundred and twenty so I guess he's in
Australia a year, so I think that antiquated. There's a
lot of catching up to do. And hopefully Sarah and
I threw all our kind of advocacy and talking our
heads off about it will help move the needles so
so it becomes easier for people, you know, in the future.
Speaker 4 (10:04):
I had infertility issues.
Speaker 3 (10:06):
We researched surrogacy in San Diego and we chose there
because the mother would be me.
Speaker 4 (10:13):
So the birth certificate their their laws over there are that, yes,
and so was the father of Hugo.
Speaker 6 (10:19):
Yes, it's just blows sorry, wow, just because he was
my husband, he was listed as the father and I
didn't understand that. I was like, why I couldn't at
least if I'm the gestational mother, why can't his actual father,
Stephen be on the birth certificate from day dot?
Speaker 4 (10:34):
That just would have created well christa a bit more.
Speaker 2 (10:36):
Christo is still to this day, sixteen months and we
still do not have a very certificate.
Speaker 1 (10:42):
Wow, he'd loved being a father of four.
Speaker 3 (10:46):
I just feel the trauma I have still from my
IVF experience and infertility.
Speaker 1 (10:52):
To know that then that is continually.
Speaker 3 (10:54):
Perpetuated for you after the baby is here. With all
of these things you have to question make me furious
for you, Well.
Speaker 2 (11:02):
Yes, thank you. Sarah and I talk about this a lot.
I think a very good compartmentalizing and desensitizing And for me, it's.
Speaker 4 (11:11):
A story now.
Speaker 2 (11:13):
And I've had to do that because for eight years
I just lived absolute, pure hell. And now I try
and stay in the light and focus on the good.
And every day I look at this little munchkin and
just go, oh my god, could my heart explode anymore?
And so I think I've trained myself in mindset, and
I've been writing books about this, thank God, for years
(11:34):
to kind of, you know, flip my mindset and try
and find the silver lightings. And Sarah and I, I mean,
were actually the perfect duo because so often I was like, oh,
there isn't I get how you're looking at a silver lighting,
but I just situation.
Speaker 4 (11:47):
She's like, it's actually fine. I'm like, no, it's actually not.
Speaker 1 (11:50):
That's fine for you as well. You do all your
woo were happiness. I'm furious here in stew Well, Yeah.
Speaker 2 (11:56):
I think I can't keep being furious was actually my
whole life. I've been this optimistic, you know, Pollyanna, like,
let's find the good, and I actually started becoming very
jaded and resentful and angry, and i just started losing myself.
And so I'm trying to brother, I'm trying to lean.
(12:17):
I'm so cute. He's like up my skirt as we're speaking.
Speaker 1 (12:24):
You have to call.
Speaker 2 (12:29):
It was that kind of a show that we've got there,
trying to break it up a bit.
Speaker 1 (12:37):
Very gracious, letting the girls to stay in the light light,
very gracious because he just looks at the girl and
falls pregnant. He's not four kids.
Speaker 3 (12:48):
Well I've taken away about.
Speaker 1 (12:56):
Well does she have a spare?
Speaker 2 (12:59):
You should say that we have four more emperors and
we're looking for another time because this one has done
its job.
Speaker 1 (13:05):
Look at the time.
Speaker 3 (13:08):
It's an extraordinary story. And do stay positive. I mean,
it is the only way to do it. The Power
of Two is in bookstores now. We're so proud of
Sarah Meganson and Lisa Meissinger. Thank you for coming in
and joining us, and congratulations on your baby.
Speaker 4 (13:25):
Thank you.
Speaker 7 (13:27):
All right, ladies, hold it there. We're going to continue
the story about you. All right, ladies, hold it there,
we're going to continue finding out more about your ski.
All right, ladies, hold it right there. We're going to
continue this conversation up next. We want to find out
more details on your surrogacy and how it played out,
in particular, what went wrong when you went to America,
(13:47):
and much much more as we keep talking about your book.
It's Gaily and Emily Jada Hot Tomato
Popular Podcasts
Boysober
Have you ever wondered what life might be like if you stopped worrying about being wanted, and focused on understanding what you actually want? That was the question Hope Woodard asked herself after a string of situationships inspired her to take a break from sex and dating. She went "boysober," a personal concept that sparked a global movement among women looking to prioritize themselves over men. Now, Hope is looking to expand the ways we explore our relationship to relationships. Taking a bold, unfiltered look into modern love, romance, and self-discovery, Boysober will dive into messy stories about dating, sex, love, friendship, and breaking generational patterns—all with humor, vulnerability, and a fresh perspective.
On Purpose with Jay Shetty
I’m Jay Shetty host of On Purpose the worlds #1 Mental Health podcast and I’m so grateful you found us. I started this podcast 5 years ago to invite you into conversations and workshops that are designed to help make you happier, healthier and more healed. I believe that when you (yes you) feel seen, heard and understood you’re able to deal with relationship struggles, work challenges and life’s ups and downs with more ease and grace. I interview experts, celebrities, thought leaders and athletes so that we can grow our mindset, build better habits and uncover a side of them we’ve never seen before. New episodes every Monday and Friday. Your support means the world to me and I don’t take it for granted — click the follow button and leave a review to help us spread the love with On Purpose. I can’t wait for you to listen to your first or 500th episode!
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com