What Are You Reading? feat. Heather Aimee O'Neill (The Irish Goodbye)

Episode Transcript
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(00:04):
Gaze reading where the greatsdrop by trendy authors.
Tell us all the who, what, andwhy.
Anyone can listen.
Comes we're spoiler free Readingfrom politic stars to book club
picks where the curious mindscan get their picks.
So you say you're not gay.

(00:24):
Well that's okay.
There's something for everyone.
Gays rating.
Hello and welcome to Gay'sReading and this episode of,
what Are You Reading?
I'm your host, Jason Blitman,and today I talked to the

(00:45):
delightful Heather Aimee O'Neillabout what she's been reading
and learned a little bit abouther new book, the Irish Goodbye,
which I loved.
And it is this month's read withJenna Book Club Pick.
Follow us on social media atgay's reading on Instagram,
like, and subscribe wherever youget your podcast so you know
when a new episode drops.
Yeah.
without further ado, here is myconversation with Heather, Amy

(01:08):
O'Neill.
I.

Heather Aimee O'Neill (01:09):
I'm in my childhood bedroom right now
because I came, I actually camehome to my parents' house.
To watch the Today Show for mybook

Jason Blitman (01:21):
Yes.

announced for to

Oh my God.

But it turned out that my father, who
just had back surgery, needed tostay in the city in the hospital
for an extra night.
So my parents couldn't be here,but they got to watch it on the
TV in the hospital, and I got towatch it with my sisters and my
wife here

Oh, that's so cute.

Hence the the backdrop.

The pink walls.

bedroom, not my apartment in Bed-Stuy,
Brooklyn.

You don't have No, no justification needed.
Um, I was worried you were gonnasay you watched it all by
yourself.

I don't know if anybody else has this
experience, but at my parents'house, like their tv, it's not
like you just click it and youturn it on.
You like click it and there'slike a million.
Steps to get from on to whereyou wanna watch your show and
like you would think the TodayShow, this is gonna be like the
easiest thing to find.

(02:16):
It wasn't, we were there, sothey have a TV in this little
seating area by the kitchen.
We were trying to do it there.
And then in the in the backroom, like in the Living Den
area, we were like, running backand forth, we're like on our
phones and we couldn't figure itout until I think it was
announced at some sometimebetween eight 30 and eight 40
and we like finally got it on 828.

Oh my God.

it was, yeah, it was,

right.
It's like power on turn on thesoundbar, turn on the, this
change the channel to thisthing.
Uh, Yeah.
And it's like multiple remotesprobably.

Totally.
We joke that my mom like, hasset things up so that, we just
can't exist without her, becauseshe knows the secrets to it all.
And when she's not around, it'slike,

clever.
Does she ever say like, goneyou're, you're not gonna know
what to do?

no.

appreciate me now?

She's almost 80, she's 78, so she
wouldn't want me to say she'salmost 80, but she's, yeah,
she's a real firecracker.
She's got like a ton of energyand she would've had that
figured out in a, you know, in a

Of course she would have, it was probably
being recorded anyway, right?
Like she'd set it up the nightbefore.
So funny.
Well, I'm so happy to meet

I'm so happy to meet you.
I love your podcast.
I listen to it all the time.
When I sold my book and we were,I was talking to the marketing
team at Holt.
I was like, I wanna be on hispodcast.
He's so much fun.
I love, like, well, I love thatyou have a theater background.
We have a mutual friend Jill,um, which I think We just found

(03:54):
that out, right?

We did just find that out,

And my older son, we just dropped him
off at Emerson for, he's afreshman there studying theater.
And I love that you're like alate late reader, that you've
discovered books a little bitlater in life and have now you
devote so much of your time tospreading the word and
especially spreading it from a,queer perspective which we need

(04:17):
more of.

Well, I appreciate that so much.
I, um, asked your publicity teamto get a copy of your audio book
because I, my a DD is can be offthe charts when I have a million
things on my mind.
So I love reading and listeningsimultaneously.
It helps.
Keep me on track.
So I wrote to them on Friday,like end of day basically, and

(04:44):
later that afternoon I was like,let me just start reading.
By the time Monday rolled aroundand listen, they got back to me
very swiftly, first thing Mondaywith the audiobook link.
I had already finished it.

Oh my gosh.
Wow.

I was like, I devoured the book.
Um, I loved it and I'm soexcited for people to read it
and I can't wait to talk aboutit.
Um, but before we dive in,because this is one of my
special bonus episodes, what areyou reading?
Heather?
Amy O'Neill.
I have to know, what are youreading and are you reading

Yeah, that's a great question.
I'm a teacher and an editor anda writer.
And I do s so much of my readingis in the editing and teaching
work that I do that my, mysisters are so much they're such
better readers than, they'veread every book out there.
I do a lot of, like reversereading, you know, like I, I

(05:46):
don't know, over the past

What do you mean?

like I'm reading the Razor's Edge right
now, and I just, I love, I thinkit's just with all of the
craziness of the past few years,there's something really about
being immersed in another timeperiod, another language,
another world.
And just to see oh yeah, thesepeople lived through really
difficult things and found a wayforward, and there's something

(06:12):
comforting about that.
But so I'm about two chaptersaway from finishing the Razor's
Edge.
I don't know if you've read itor any

have not.

w Summerset Mo.
He's fantastic.
It's a really it's a beautifulbook.
And so yeah, so I'm about two.
Two chapters away from finishingthat.
I I'm always reading, or notalways, but I try to be reading
oftentimes a book with myyounger son who's 13 and we're

(06:41):
currently reading The Curious,the, what is it, the the curious
incident of the dog atnighttime.

yeah.

if you've read that, but

You know, it's funny, I haven't read the book,
but I saw the play.

I didn't know it was a play.

So it was adapted into a play.
by, uh, the National Theater inLondon.
They commissioned it and it wasthis gorgeous production and I
think there are like clipsonline in places, so you should
definitely check that out.

That's really interesting.
I, yeah, just being immersed inthe point of view of this young
boy who, said has all of thisbrilliance and then struggles in
these very unique ways.
I just it's a really beautifulbook and it's a great book to be
reading with a eighth grader.
I just got his list of booksthat he'll be reading this year,
and I'm excited to.

(07:31):
Expand, like he's readingOrwell's 1984 and Fahrenheit 4
51 and lots of books that willthat I think are very important
to be reading right now.
So I'm excited about that.
And I, i, my, my wife reads tome a lot.

That's so cute.

I know.
It's actually like one of themost lovely things.
I just recommend that everybodyfind someone to read to them.
'cause it's such a, it's such arelaxing it's a real gift.
And she's currently reading me,Sharon Salzberg's Faith.
I don't know if you're familiarwith Sharon.
She's a she's a meditationteacher.
And so the book is it's groundedon her journey with faith with

(08:17):
within the context of Buddhism.
And like her upbringing, her,she had a really difficult
childhood and how this pathreally had helped her in so many
ways.
But I think it's, I don'tconsider myself a Buddhist.
I, but, but the lessons are justso universal, and it's a very
it's a very grounding, calmingthing to read right now, which,

(08:39):
again I guess that's the themehere, like looking for things to
take me out of the and noise

Oh well, of the world, but also you're, you're
on this publishing journey.
You know, I was talking to anauthor yesterday and I was
shocked by how much he wasreading while on book tour, and
I was most people I know arejust sort of.
so in the weeds of where they'regoing and meetings and traveling
and not, they don't have thepatience, uh, to pick up a book.

Yeah.
I would imagine I definitely,again, I am I'm always reading
like multiple books at once I'm.
I'm rereading Dublin right now.
I don't know if you've readJames Joyce's Dublins.

It's so weird that you said that because when
is this episode coming out?
Just before this episode comesout, I'm talking to someone
about how, I've never read JamesJoyce.

Oh, okay.
So start with Dublins.
And in fact the audio bookversion is really lovely too.
I haven't read it in probably.
Like eight years because I, thelast time I read it, I taught
it.
And it's definitely a collectionof stories to, it's I think
there's 15 stories in it andit's there's, it's not just

(09:58):
about one character, but there'sdefinitely like an arc to the
stories.
It's, It's kind of a journey of.
Of growing up or not growing upA lot, a lot about the
characters are about like theirexperience of paralysis in
Dublin during this time, I'malways so amazed at stories
that, that hold up sobeautifully, despite the

(10:20):
difference in and time and.

I mean, It'll be interesting like you talking
about what your 13-year-old hason his reading list for eighth
grade in 2025 was what I wasreading.

Yeah.

however many you know.
Right.
So, so not only does it seem to,well we haven't, or you will I'm
sure, reread some of thesethings.
I haven't read them in so long,but the fact that they're still
being taught, I think, sayssomething about

I totally agree.
Like my older son who I wastelling you about, who's an
actor and studying theater, he,during COVID, when he was in
middle school, I tried to gethim to read The Outsiders and
because I recommended it, he waslike, absolutely not.
And then when the musical cameout.
Became absolutely obsessed.

(11:12):
He probably knows every singleword in that musical.
And, but that too, I mean thatlike story of masculinity and
brotherhood and friendship andcommunity and, and family, all
of these things as likebattlegrounds, but also as like
places of, of salvation andloyalty.

(11:34):
And these stories just continueto, I think, be relevant for,
for very real reasons.

Yeah.
Well, And it's interesting thatyou bring up the outsiders
because my first thought whenthinking about books that I read
as a young person that reallymoved me school, that I was like
required to read, uh, was ToKill a Mockingbird.
And, you know, but, and the theinteresting parallels between,
uh, outsiders and To Kill aMockingbird is that Essie Hinton

(12:04):
who wrote.
Outsiders and, um, what's herface?
Who wrote to Kill Mockingbird?
Harper Lee, who wrote To KillMockingbird.
It's for all intents andpurposes, the only book they
wrote.

Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.

I say that because the Harper Lee's other
books were published withouther.

Yes.
Yes.
And I'd almost think it wasjust.

Yeah, right.
Exactly.
But so there's something sofascinating about it to today
where, you know, authors aregetting two book deals and there
there's an of what's next.
Right?
Whereas these quite young womenwrote these books that had
tremendous impacts Thezeitgeist, um, adapted into

(12:46):
films, adapted into plays andmusicals, and still stand up,
um, today.
So it's very interesting.
I.

It is.
And I like.
All of, I think those stories,so many of the stories that
we're talking about are storiesthat this, I'm just thinking
about this now, but like storiesthat allow for so much nuance in
the moral message that they'retrying to convey.

(13:15):
They're not preachy.
They're not didactic.
They really show, they reallyshow the message through the
characters and through thestruggles.
And it's not telling us what tothink or to feel or how to act,
but showing us the consequencesof what happens if we don't, if
we don't do that in a way thatallows for compromise and

(13:38):
compassion and, so it's that.
I feel like that is somethingthat allows those books to, to,
endure.

I also wonder, because I, one of my husband's
favorite books is East of Eden.
By John Steinbeck, And, um, Iread it recently and it was a
lot.
It was like, it was, everysentence was sort of a meal and
which is, which is beautiful.
However, I'm just sort of like,just just tell me the story.

(14:12):
But in Ro upon reflection andjust thinking about when it was
written.
There was nothing else to do,

Yes, this is very true.

you know, So there's something to be said
about like, you're taking timeto really read and consume this
content, and you could spend 10pages reading about a valley,

Yeah, it's true.

because you're not, you're not itching to watch
TV or you're not itching to getto the next book or whatever.
So I do also wonder, you know.
when the outsiders in TacoMockingbird were published, was
it a time where, you know, itwasn't a more, is more sort of
environment.
There weren't hundreds of thingson TV that you were watching.

(14:58):
It wasn't.
New movies coming out, of moviescoming out every week, you so it
was there was sort of an easeand everyone was sort of picking
them up

Yeah, I was gonna say there was that,
like even, like when I grew upMo most of the TV shows that we
watch, it was like, we all watchthose.
It wasn't, now everyone canconsume their own cultural and
media diet and so there, thereisn't that kind of connection or
that.
Universality to the experiencethat we're having, but even if
we're processing it differently,I, you were talking before about

(15:31):
reading a book and alsolistening to it, and another
book that I reread this year,but I also in part listened to
it was Anna Carina, Leo Toto,and I reread it because I hadn't
read it in decades.
And I included it in my novel,like the character of Maggie is

(15:51):
reading the book.
And I was like, I feel like ifI'm gonna reference this, I need
to remember it.
And also when I read it, I waslike, I don't, it didn't it was
like for a class.
And I, it didn't really with me.
And there was something aboutreading it this time and I do
think the.
Like every sentence is a mealkind of experience was like I

(16:15):
wanted that because I, again,going back that like I wanted a
slowing down.
I wanted some something to feelindulgent.
But Maggie Gien Hall's readingof it is brilliant.
Like one of the most extremetruly it's my favorite audio
book I've ever listened to.
And IC she just.

(16:37):
She could describe the characterof Levin, like mowing the hay on
the fields for like pages andpages, or be in his head as he
is intellectualizing the purposeof life.
And it just, she's, yeah, shejust, it's wonderful.
So that's a great book to, to,have that dual

that is very good to know one of the best
audiobook experiences of my lifewas Michelle Williams reading
Britney Spears's memoir.

I haven't listened to it, but I can
imagine that would be reallycool.

She is giving this epic performance.
It's like, oh my.
But Right.
It's so good.
'cause it's like freaking Oscarwinner, Michelle Williams.
Winner nominee winner.
She is,

She's up there.

she's a very performer.

Yeah.

Um, and yeah, there's something about just a
really good performer.
That makes such a hugedifference.
So that's really fun to knowabout

I agree.
I've had some people ask me if Iwas going to read the Irish
goodbye on audio, and I waslike, absolutely not.
Like I, that is like a skill andan art in and of itself.
And the woman who did it,kristen, it did such a beautiful
job, and I'm so grateful, andshe can she can pull off the
mother's Irish accent and, alsoshift into the different points

(17:57):
of view and perspectives.
But it really is, it is aperformance, it's not just like
reading on the page.

Well, I mean, Even you saying that your wife
will read to you.
I'm just like, that to me is soexhausting.
I, if I read a page out loud,I'm like, I'm tired, I'm witted,
I'm bored.
lost my own thread.
Um, So it's impressive that yourwife can do it and always
impressive when, uh, an audiobook narrator does it so easily,

(18:26):
lead.

Yeah.
It's I feel so grateful that sheenjoys it because I I benefit
from it so much.
It's a lovely experience.

Do you have a hard time focusing?

No I, it's interesting.
I grew up with a readingdisability and it took me many
years to learn how to read anddyslexia runs in my family like
my whole extended family.
Which is interesting becauseevery, we're all big readers,
but a lot of, there, there'sbeen a lot of like reading

(19:00):
difficulties, early, earlychildhood reading difficulties.
And I think that, for me, Ithink there's something ironic
about having spent my earlychildhood struggling to do this
thing that seemed to come soeasily to everybody else.
And then once I got it, it waslike, okay, now.
It was smooth sailing.
But um, be I, I remember thatstruggle, I remember not getting

(19:27):
it and just being so frustratedand so to have devoted my entire
life as an adult to like onlyreading and writing.
That's all I do.
I think it's just become thisskill that, for better or worse
is a superpower, but, it's yeah,so I can listen and follow along
and,

Do you remember what that book was?
That sort of was thetransformative moment for you
where you were like, I did it.
I, I conquered the disability ornot conquered, but like, it, it
it embraced and was able tosucceed in spite of

I think so I left Catholic school in the
fourth grade'cause I was notreading and went to public
school and it was in publicschool that I finally got help.
And then, I could read but Ialways, I always loved to be
read too, and.
But it was really in publicschool that I, at that age that
I began to read on my own and Idevoured shell Silverstein's

(20:28):
where the sidewalk ends.
That was like a, every night Iwould read poems from that, from
that book.
And then, at like around thattime, I also discovered
Babysitter's Club.
And I don't even know if thatseries still exists.
There was a character whoactually had a reading or like a
learning difference.

(20:49):
I think her name was Claudia,maybe.
And that there was like anassociation there.
But I, so I it was definitelypoetry though, for sure.
Um, that,

Has poetry stuck around for you?

yeah.
I, for sure I, when I went tocollege.
I was an English major.
I went to Boston University andI had a teacher there, Eric
McHenry, who was my first poetryteacher, and we became friends
and he just like completelyopened my mind to.
Like narrative poetry, whichwasn't something like prior to

(21:23):
that when I was in high school,I I loved Charles Wakowski and
the sort of like anti-hero kindof stuff, but he, yeah, he
really exposed me to so manyincredible poets at that time,
like Philip Levine and MarilynHacker, and.

hmm.

William Stafford and and I was like, oh
I want to be a poet.
That's what I want to do.
And he always, he was veryencouraging and he, but I think
when I graduated he was like,I'm, I am so sorry that I am I
helped you lead you on thispath.
'cause being a writer reallysucks.
It's really hard.
But so I ended up going tograduate school for.

(21:59):
For fiction, I got my MFA infiction.
But after that I published twocollections of poetry.
And it wasn't until, yeah, so Istopped, I, not that I stopped
writing poetry, but that hasn'tbeen my focus for the past, like
decade or so.
But yeah, I love, I love poetry.

I love that I, uh, wa was not a poetry person.
I'm still not really a poetryperson.
I was pitched a book, um, lastyear by an author named Lindsay
Rush.
She is on Instagram as MaryOliver's drunk cousin.

Stop it.

And it was pitched to me as poetry for the
millennial woman, and I waslike, send it to me.
I need this.
I read it.
It was one of my favorite bookslast

I.

Yeah.
I on the show.
She is, she's so funny.
The, The poems are so clever andmoving and they're, so, it's a
nice gateway for people who, uh,feel like they're not a poetry
person.

Yeah.
So I think, poetry can seemreally like obscure and
unreachable.
But then, like poets like MaryOliver, if you start your day
every day with a Mary Oliverpoem, like you're gonna be in
better shape than if you'rescrolling on your phone.
She's just, she's extraordinary.
So I'll definitely, I'll have tocheck Her out.
The, what did you.

Her name is Lindsay Rush, um, And her handle
is Mary Oliver's drunk cousin.
So funny.
Um.
So you talked about this at thevery beginning to the, on the
day of recording, it wasannounced that your book, the
Irish Goodbye, is a read withJenna book.
Love Pick.
Congratulations.

(23:41):
But today we could talk aboutit, so I'm so excited.
All right.
What is your elevator pitch forthe Irish goodbye?

It's funny with the elevator pitch
thing, I, so I, as I mentioned,I, I teach and I teach a
manuscript generator classthrough the Sackett Street
Writers Workshop, and I alwaysdo this exercise with the
writers that I'm working with.
What's your pitch?
And it I can feel a little bitlike, you know what's the
analogy?
Like the shoe salesman whodoesn't have shoes.

(24:10):
Like when someone asks me for mypitch, because it's oh yeah.
But I will go with, I actually,I thought that, Jenna's review
of it was really spot on, andwhen I listened to it, I was
like, oh, I should borrow fromthat.
But my pitch is that it's astory about three sisters
returning to their childhoodhome on the North Fork of Long

(24:34):
Island and for Thanksgiving.
And when the oldest sisterinvites a guest from their past
the family is forced to confronta tragedy that has haunted them
for years.

Succinct and perfect.
I'm so excited for people toread it.
As I said, I devoured it inessentially a day and a half.
I couldn't put it down.
I fell in love with this familyand I was on their journey so
hardcore and, um, wasn't readyfor how emotional it was gonna
be, and there's a lot happening.
I'm, and I'm so excited for youand the book.

(25:07):
Was there anything else that youwanted to share?

I guess maybe one thing I would wanna
share is that, as a kid growingup on Long Island in the
nineties and gay and not ableto.
I was deeply closeted.
I, there was like, no, I didn'tthink there was like really any
option.
Books were such a safe place forme.

(25:32):
I like, when I was in highschool, I discovered Michelle T
and Jeanette Winterson and then,later on Sarah Waters and that
I, so I, reading has always beena place for me to go to, to Find
myself when I couldn't seemyself in my anywhere.
Really like to be honest at thatpoint.

(25:54):
So I'm really grateful thatyou're, you're showcasing queer
writers and stories and I thinkit's really important.

Well, I appreciate you saying that.
Um, And so are you,

Thank you.

so we're in this together.

for sure.

Everyone, go get your copy of The Irish Goodbye,
the read with Jenna book Cluband Heather Amy O'Neill.
Thank you so much for being here

Thank you so much for having me.
I look forward to meeting yousometime in person.

I know you too.

right.

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What Are You Reading? feat. Heather Aimee O'Neill (The Irish Goodbye)

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