April 2, 2025 • 33 mins
In this engaging episode of 'Get the Lax Scoop,' hosts Big Dawg and Jaybird delve into the inspiring journey of Jules Heningberg, a two-time All-American and Rutgers graduate. From his early struggles at Columbia High School to becoming the first All-American at Seton Hall Prep, Jules shares how his competitive spirit and dedication led to a successful collegiate and professional lacrosse career. The discussion highlights key influences, including Jules' father and brother, the challenges of navigating the complex landscape of high school and club lacrosse, and the importance of hard work and skill development over innate talent. Listeners are treated to anecdotes about the intense sibling rivalry and the roles various coaches played in shaping Jules' path. The episode closes with a teaser for more on Jules' impactful lacrosse career at Rutgers.
00:00 Introduction to Get the Lax Scoop
00:23 Meet the Hosts: Big Dawg and Jaybird
02:13 Special Guest: Jules Henningburg
05:03 Jules' Early Lacrosse Journey
10:05 High School and Club Lacrosse Experience
15:20 Playing with Family: Brotherly Competition
17:53 High School Lacrosse Rivalry
20:47 The Myth of Natural Talent
23:35 Seton Hall Prep Journey
24:13 Overcoming Adversity at Columbia High
29:26 Triumph at Seton Hall
32:21 Conclusion and Reflections
NEW BOOK!
Inside the Recruiting Game: Insights From College Lacrosse Coaches
-Available on Amazon.com as an Ebook and paperback
Links to training videos:
Master The 5 Best Dodges From the Wing!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k_7LDOcQQ6Q&t=88s
Blazing Shots... on the Run!
https://youtu.be/XiptPlM63oQ
Check us out...
On YouTube @jaymcmahonlax23
On Instagram @jaymcmahonlax23
On Facebook @: facebook.com/jmcmahonlax23. Page name: Jay McMahon Lacrosse
Jules Heningburg: https://thelaxlab.com/
Check out!... Coach Tintle's Lacrosse Barn:
https://g.co/kgs/eXedCXf
SuccessHotline with Dr. Rob Gilbert on Ironclad & Apple Podcasts
Brian Cain Daily Dominator on Apple Podcasts
Lacrosse Charities Mentioned in S2 E36:
https://www.4thefuturefoundation.org/
https://www.harlemlacrosse.org/
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
It's time for Get the LackScoop, a podcast bringing you
all the people and stuff youshould know in the game of
lacrosse.
We take lack seriously, butourselves, not so much.
Join host Big Dog and Jaybirdand the biggest names in the
game brought to you by JayMcMahon lacrosse.
That's JML skills, mindset, andlacks IQ training.
(00:23):
Ron Doglish, the big dog, was acollegiate football and lacrosse
player at Brown.
He was also an assistantlacrosse coach and the executive
director of the SportsFoundation.
And Jay McMahon, the Jaybird, athree time All American
midfielder at Brown.
He was the captain of the U.
S.
Junior National Team and is thefounder of JML.
(00:43):
And Joining us in the studio,Steve Grisolfi, who's collegiate
lacrosse career statisticsequals one goal against
Dartmouth brought to you by JayMcMahon lacrosse.
That's JML skills, mindset, andlacks IQ training, helping the
next generation of lacrosseplayers get to the next level
Well, Jay, here we are again.
Another episode of Get the LackScoop.
(01:06):
Absolutely.
It's trying desperately to actlike spring.
The lacrosse is definitely,definitely heating up, no doubt.
I see.
In the division one, the, Ithink the TURPs and the heels
are beginning to separatethemselves, if I might say.
I would agree.
Can't deny that our next guestis silent right now.
(01:27):
We haven't announced him yet,dog.
Don't try to ask him and ruinthe surprise.
Jay, do you think this is myfirst goddamn episode?
Jesus.
I wonder, Ron, I always wonder.
Unbelievable.
Jay.
Jay, yes.
It's your job to introduce theguest.
I have not blown anything.
Do your job, Jay.
Introduce our guest.
(01:48):
Our next guest is a graduate ofRutgers University where he was
a two time all American attackman, two time captain, and all
big 10 selection, as well as theschool's second, all time
leading scorer.
He completed his high schooleducation at Seton Hall Prep,
where he was the school's firstever All American, and led his
team to winning the ES EssexCounty Championship.
(02:11):
After Rutgers, he went on to theprofessional ranks where he was
the seventh overall pick in the2018 draft, and has been a four
time all-star selection while inthe professional ranks.
He currently plays with aCarolina Chaos.
He's also the founder of threeorganizations, the LAX Lab,
which is a skills trainingprogram Mission primed, an
(02:32):
initiative geared towardspreparing lacrosse players to
excel in lacrosse and life whileat college, as well as the Black
Lacrosse Alliance, which worksto build a pathway for players
and coaches to navigate racialbarriers and provide inclusive
diversity in the sport we alllove.
Please give a warm welcome tothe one the only Jules Hen
(02:54):
welcome.
Yeah, Jules, I appreciate that.
It's, it's funny to hear likepeople talk about you know, kind
of what you've done.
I feel like I'm, I'm getting oldnow, just like getting old.
You're just a kid, but yeah,you've done a lot.
Jay, Jules, busy guy's.
Resume college.
Lacrosse, resume.
Looks just like mine, Jay.
Oh yeah.
I mean, you know, two time allAmerican captain, he looks kind
(03:15):
of speedy.
I'm sure his game and my gameare very similar.
Just like you, just like you RonJules couldn't be farther from
the truth.
Ron, did you play Jules, take aguess, please.
Defense, I, I put him in thegoal right now, right?
You, you, you could say goalie.
I'm not gonna do that to youthough.
Like that.
I gotta throw that at you,right?
(03:36):
That this early on the podcast,you know, oh, Jay, I like it.
Jules is testy.
He is coming in hot, I say, andfor those of you who have never
actually.
Watched us on video.
I am larger than the averageguy.
So I think Jules just called mea fat guy who might've been
standing in the goal.
I think you're a fat guy whocould take up a lot of the goal.
(03:57):
I think that's what I just gotfrom the guests that I just met.
Jay.
Well, blaze Beard, his teammate.
I wouldn't do that to you.
I, I would say that you were,you were a defender and, and
maybe, you know at some time youtried goal.
I don't know.
But I, I wouldn't put that onyou that I would put that on.
Yeah.
I'm sure Jay put you up to thatleading into the podcast.
Oh yeah.
That's right.
(04:17):
But Jules, hey, as we getstarted, you know, we love to
ask every one of our guests youknow, as we were just talking
before we came on air, you know,how much.
We each love the game.
Right, and Jay and I still dothis because we just love
talking to people in the game oflacrosse, and clearly you are so
committed to the game in all thedifferent ways you're giving
back.
(04:38):
But where did it start, Jules?
Where did you first develop thispassion and love for the game?
Yeah, it started in Maplewood,New Jersey back when I was seven
years old.
It honestly, I didn't wanna playlacrosse when I was growing up.
I was, I was playing basketballand my sister was playing, and
my dad would keep saying to me,Hey, like, there's this game
lacrosse, like, you know, youreally should try it out.
(05:01):
And I was like, no, like that,that's not for me.
Like I'm, I'm gonna playbasketball and that's gonna be
my thing.
And then I just remember forsome reason, like it, it became
not an option.
Like we had to go, me and mybrother had to go to, to
practice one day.
And I just remember going and Iwas so bad and I remember
leaving being like, damn, like,I don't know how to cradle.
I don't know how to throw, Idon't know, to catch like, I'm
(05:22):
not going back.
Me and my brother were bothcrying about practice and then
it's like my dad said to us,Hey, if you sign up for
something, I, I signed you upfor this.
You're going back, like there'sno quitting in the middle of the
season.
So we ended up going back and,and very quickly it turned from,
I wasn't very good to, okay,like I gotta figure out how to
cradle.
Do I use my top hand or mybottom hand?
(05:43):
You know, I'm gonna figure thisout.
Like, I started to, to competewith myself a little bit'cause
there was a lot of kids outthere.
Honestly, at the time I, lookingback on, this is silly to think,
but I was starting in secondgrade and there were kids that
were out there who had startedin kindergarten and so they were
already three years ahead of meand doing stuff that I was like,
man, like that can do that.
(06:03):
Like, all right, I need tofigure this out.
So it became competitive for me,which was you know, it, it was
exciting.
Like I, I was, I was playingbasketball for a long time and
this was something new.
And that, that drove me.
It got my competitive juicesgoing.
And the town that we were in,Maplewood that I grew up in
Maplewood and Montclair are thetwo oldest club programs.
When I say club they ended up,it initially was club, but then
(06:26):
it became high school programs,but they called'em clubs back in
the day.
I'm not gonna say any of youguys, but back in the day.
And they basically had, I wasvery fortunate.
Like we had dads that played in,in the club and at the high
school who moved back to thetown and, and they were coaching
us and they were just taking thegame so seriously.
And were just, were talkingabout the Native American roots
(06:47):
and they were talking about, youknow, legends that had played on
in, in the program that hadpassed away.
You know, we have their numberon their sleeve.
I could talk more about that.
And I'm just over here soakingall in and being like, wow,
Maplewood Lacrosse Club isunbelievable.
I can't believe I get to havethis coach who played at, you
know Colgate or, you know,Wooster College, wherever these
guys are playing.
(07:08):
And, and I was like, wow, I'm sograteful for the opportunity.
And I kind of just bought intothat.
And then that, that, you know,led me on to to a lot of
different things, which, whichI'm fortunate for in my lacrosse
career.
So, Jules, you talked about yourdad pushing you.
Was was he particularlyconnected to the game?
Had he played, what was, what doyou think really ha inspired him
(07:29):
to push you and your brotherinto the game?
Honestly, so when you're young,you know, you guys have probably
experienced this with, with,maybe your parents and, and
maybe your dad, I don't know.
But my dad would, wouldfabricate some things about his.
And so he would talk about, oh,I played lacrosse back in high
school and, you know, I was thescrub on the team, this and
(07:50):
that.
And, and come to find out, I'mlike, you never actually like
played on the team.
I think you were just adjacentto some guys who were very good,
who went on to play at someamazing programs.
Like the, the teams in theseventies and the eighties and
the nineties in Columbia.
They were producing guys gonnaMaryland, Rutgers, Loyola Navy,
like there was, you know, somenice high level talent.
And so he was playing, he was atschool with them.
(08:13):
And so he would hang out withthem and he would, he would see,
you know, the game and enjoy thegame.
But he was a basketball player.
So for him it was, he hadlifelong friends that I had
played lacrosse and he was stillconnected to, and they were
always just telling him about,you know, about this game.
And, you know, he would calllike the ticket, like, this is
your ticket.
Go, go, go run with this gameand, and see how far you can
take it.
Like.
(08:34):
Basketball.
I played basketball at a highlevel.
It's really hard, you know,unless you're gonna be six four
Jules and, and Dunking whenyou're 13, 14, you're gonna have
to be Steph Curry.
You're gonna have, you're gonnahave to be an outlier to make
it.
But if you play lacrosse, youknow, there's just so much
creativity.
There's so much opportunity for,for your skillset to blossom.
(08:54):
And again, like, I didn't knowthat at the time, but when I got
to eighth grade, I started torealize, like, I love
basketball.
I was very good at it, but someof my friends had just shot up
in size.
And I, I was still kind of alate bloomer and I was like,
like, I don't know, maybe Ishould just keep going with this
lacrosse thing.
I'm, I'm, I'm really good atthat too.
And, and that was kind of just Ithink the, the matriculation of
it and, and how it started with,you know, with him kind of
(09:16):
pushing me a little bit.
And it was always him being aguy that made it seem like he
played, but I pushed him tostuff.
I'm like, dude, you never reallyplayed well.
It seemed like, it seemed likeyou saw the opportunity though,
huh?
That's great.
Yeah, clearly.
Definitely seemed like thosestories worked out.
I mean, we'll, we'll eventuallylet Jay ask a question, Jules,
but I'm a much betterinterviewer, so we'll we'll just
(09:38):
keep going here.
You just mentioned a littlewhile ago, Ron, the club team in
your town was actually like thehigh school team, but we al
always like,'cause therecruiting thing has just
changed so much over the years.
Mm-hmm.
We're wondering when you startedto play in that high school age
group, were you playing club,was that a thing for you and
your player development and yourrecruiting process?
(10:01):
So tell us how you, how yourhigh school and club career
evolved.
Yeah.
I think honestly I rememberbeing in class in seventh grade
and the summer kind of gettingclose to the summertime and, and
thinking I knew how good I wasrelative to my, like, classmates
right at my school or on my recprogram.
(10:22):
And I had an idea of it alsorelative to, to some of the
other towns that we'd play inthe state of New Jersey.
I remember being in class andhaving a friend talk about going
to Trilogy Camp and me beinglike, oh, like I don't know
about, I don't know about thecamp.
Like how would you know about acamp?
And I don't know about a camp.
I, I know how good I am relativeto you.
That was, I should be going tothat camp.
(10:44):
You should be staying home.
Exactly.
See that Ron, like, get home.
And I'm like, dad, like, what isthis trilogy camp that my
buddy's going to?
And he is like, to be honestbuddy, I don't know what the
trilogy clamp is.
Send it to me and I send it tohim.
He's like, you know, whateveramount of money he is like,
yeah, you're not gonna trilogycamp.
And I was like, oh man.
Like if I don't go to this camp,then, you know, maybe I'm not on
the right path.
Whatever I come this, you know,tossed it to the side.
(11:07):
And at that time I was, I wasjust playing pickup lacrosse in
this league in the summertimethat you, you would go with your
rec program and you would playdifferent towns like through the
summer.
'cause the club lacrosse had aholding, but there were still
like these leagues that you, youcould play in.
I would just play lacrosse onlike Wednesday nights for four
hours and like straight, whetherit was on our team, and then we
(11:29):
would maybe play two games andthen I would stay and play for
other teams that needed extraguys.
And I remember the followingsummer where again, I was like,
Hey dad.
You know, some of my friends,some of the guys that I'm
playing against that again, I'm,I know how good I am relative to
them.
They all seem to be doing thisclub thing.
Like it's, I kind of need to, todo this.
(11:50):
And so he, he bit the bullet, helet me try out for this team
called Trilogy which Ryan Boylestarted in New Jersey.
Mm-hmm.
They don't participate in, inthe club scene anymore, but
they, they run a, a bunch ofcamps and showcases and things
and tournaments still.
And I played on that team andthat team was kind of the team.
They had these baby bluehelmets.
Like every, you know, if you sawthat, you were like, that kid's
(12:10):
pretty nice.
Yeah, and I, so I started toplay that, but the team kind of
was like gutted a little bitgoing into ninth grade.
So I got on it like at the lasttime before it was kind of just
falling apart.
And so I just felt like I didn'thave a great experience with it.
And my, my dad felt the sameway.
And so the following year he'slike, okay, well now your
(12:31):
brother has to play club too.
So I kind of pushed it where Iwas like, I gotta play.
And now my dad's like, oh, wellI gotta start thinking about if
you're gonna get recruited, Iguess you gotta play club.
So the following year he, he gotus on this team with this guy by
the name of Andrew Deco.
I don't know if you guys arefamiliar with Andrew.
I've heard the name, but Idon't, I haven't met him.
But yeah, played at Rutgershuge, phenomenal talent at
(12:52):
Rutgers.
Graduated from there, I think hewas like an eighties, nineties
guy and he had had a club team,you know, and, and so I was
like, okay, like I guess I'llplay on this team where my
brother, my dad got us both fromthe team, kind of a two for one
deal.
Figuring out ways to make itwork financially.
And I played on that team, nowI'm playing up two grade levels
(13:12):
with this club team.
And then that year, I'm goinginto my sophomore year now'cause
it was like kind of that ninthgrade summer and I'm, I'm
remember I'm sitting now mysophomore year after playing for
the Deigo program in class andlike inside lacrosse is
dropping, all these guys aregetting recruited and like
committed.
And I was just like, wait, howis this possible?
(13:34):
I don't, I don't even, I haven'teven talked to a college coach
yet.
I don't, again, I'm seeing likemy co like I call'em colleagues
now, my friends, teammates,other on other programs
committing to schools.
And I'm like, I'm like, I knowhow good I am relative to you.
How are you already going to aschool?
And I haven't even talked to acoach, let alone gone on a visit
(13:54):
and you're already committinglike, this doesn't make a ton of
sense to me.
So now at that point I startedto recalibrate.
Okay, maybe I was playingagainst kids two years older.
I wasn't standing out enough.
Maybe I was at the wrongtournaments.
Now what do I need to do?
And then finally I go, okay, letme, let me really dial this in
and take some, some ownership ofwhat's going on here.
It's not gonna be my dad or thiskid or what team he plays where
(14:18):
it's like, what do I want to do?
And so I found this team calledLeading Edge, which is pretty
prominent club in New Jersey.
And yeah, I went to the tryoutand I ended up getting on the
team going into my juniorsummer, which means I had to
take someone's spot that hadalready, they already would, did
two summers where they weregetting looked at by, right?
Yeah.
At that point, college coachesand I got on there and you know,
(14:40):
the, that was, the rest washistory after that for as far as
recruiting goes.
But it was all kind of like.
Me just figuring it out alongthe way and having to, yeah.
To be like, all right, like, letme, let me just try to lock in a
little bit more if this is what,you know, I kind of want to do.
That's cool.
Nice stuff.
Yeah.
And we love, you know, talkingabout the relationships, you
were talking about, you know,your dad and then your brother
(15:00):
Dylan, and then, you know,taking a look, your high school
at Columbia, you went there to10th grade and then mm-hmm.
As you, as we were saying, youwent to Seton Hall after that.
But looking at the stat sheet,you know, you had, they have all
the stats on there for ColumbiaHigh School, like every year.
So I could see, like when you'rein 10th grade, I.
You had like a few more pointsthan your brother Dylan, but he
(15:21):
did have a few more goals.
So, but I was thinking that musthave been so cool to play with
your brother.
I have a younger brother, but hekind of was like a maybe a year
behind where he wasn't as good.
He wasn't gonna play in the samemidfield as me.
I was a midfielder.
But tell us about that.
That must have been awesome tobe playing and at, at this
stage, you're really gettingcompetitive with it playing with
your older brother there atColumbia High School and looked
(15:44):
like you guys had a good littleseason there.
So tell us about that.
Yeah, JI mean, you know, youkind of hit the nail on the
head.
The opportunity to, to play withyour brothers is definitely a
special one.
I, I think you, you might takeit for granted when you're, when
you're young you know, our dadwas definitely pushing us around
it and looking back on that,like that, that's such a special
experience.
But in, in the time, me and himbutted heads a ton, honestly,
(16:06):
really.
I think it started in thebackyard.
We had this like dirt court withlike tree roots grown out of it.
And my dad put up a basketballhoop.
And you could raise it higher orlower.
So we started pretty young, likeyou could put it lower and we
would just go at, go at it afterout there.
And he's got a completelydifferent build than me.
Like I'm slim.
He's, I'm six two, he's 5 8, 59.
(16:27):
But like stocky, more like aMatt Rambo type.
Yeah.
I'm skin and bones.
He's solid.
I'm more shifty, you know, we'replaying against each other.
It was always competitive andeventually I figured out like
how I could beat him.
Right.
And become like, all right, Ican't have my, my younger
brother beating me.
So, right.
Like, okay, I'm gonna, I'm gonnafoul the outta you.
(16:48):
So starts dropping the hammer.
Exactly.
Like I'm shaking past you.
I go for a layup and I'm justgetting like, jumped the ball.
I would, I would never have donesuch a thing, Jay, that's I, I,
oh yeah, right.
Ron.
Ron was the oldest of, he seemslike Dylan and I've had a
similar strategy.
Yeah.
Oh man.
Dylan's not here to defendhimself.
He just had a baby.
(17:08):
He was gonna be on the podcastto let everybody know, but, but
that's great.
No.
And I got, I gotta give him hisflowers though.
Like, we'll get a statement fromhim perhaps, and he'll admit
that like I, because we have agreat relationship now, and
that, that's why I want, youknow, wanted to get him on here.
He's a, he's a brilliantlacrosse mine.
He is the offensive coordinatorat Lawrenceville.
Yeah.
National championship program.
Yeah.
(17:28):
That's awesome.
When you, in high school, like Iwas more of a gifted lacrosse
player from like, the overallsense, because I worked really
hard and I was, you know, I wasshifty, but he was actually more
naturally talented than I was.
He just didn't like put in asmuch work as a player because,
you know, I just, I loved to, Iloved to work hard.
(17:50):
Like I, that was my thing when Iwas young.
Mm-hmm.
I knew I was good, but I didn'tever feel like I was the best,
but I was competitive, so I waslike, what's it gonna take for
me to, to become my best and,and beat these other guys that
are playing on the club orthey're, they're getting this
ranking or whatever.
He was, I'm always justnaturally talented and, and
bigger.
So he would just show up andhe'd be like, it's game time.
Like I'm, I'm right.
(18:11):
Get it.
And so in, when we would look atthe course of a season when I
was younger, I would be the moreproductive player.
But when mm-hmm.
To you wanted to give him theball'cause you're like, he's
just gonna go get us a goal.
He's a gamer.
He's a gamer.
Yeah.
I wasn't a gamer growing up.
I was more strategic, high iq.
Like, I'm gonna make everyonebetter.
(18:32):
And I had to develop a gamerkind of sense for, for me.
And you know, it's, it's funny'cause my dad was like, if you
could combine you two, you'd belike the best lacrosse player
ever.
It was like just, you know,figuring out things.
And he's taken more of the, thework ethic approach now as a
coach for Right film.
You know, what he does for hisguys and, and just that side of
(18:53):
things.
But he has always loved thegame.
So, you know, it's kind ofcoming together for him full
circle as a coach where.
I talk lacrosse with a decentamount of people, but like
there's only a handful of peoplethat I will actually trust,
wholeheartedly, trust theiropinion about the sport with.
And, and he's one of those guysand he wasn't always that way,
(19:14):
but he's worked himself to justunderstanding the game at such a
high level to where now I canthrow something at him and he's
gonna be able to give me solidadvice about it.
And, and so we, we bond overthat and it, we have a a solid
relationship now in that, inthat aspect.
That's great.
Despite all those hard fouls,you've, you've gotten over it,
despite the hard fouls, thecontrollers being broken and,
(19:34):
and you know, like just throwingme through a window.
Like I, a lot of stories, Imean, Jules, it doesn't sound
like you harbor any ill will.
'cause if I could summarize whatyou just said about Dylan.
Well, basically I was a betterathlete than him, and I was
smarter.
He is worked harder.
And now I kind of e listen whathe has to say about the game.
I mean, is that, have you heardthis a pretty good summary from
your brothers out there, Jules?
(19:54):
I mean, yeah.
That, that, that's a, that's apretty good summary.
And I, I would just, I wasalways like, yo, like I'm, I'm a
good player.
I'm like, dude, why don't youjust come work with me?
Like, yeah, you, you would be,you would actually be the goat
if you came and worked with me,but you want to go do this, go
do that.
It's like, all right, I'll justwork in silence.
And then we show up, shockerthat I'm, you know, the, the
better player.
And he would, he would literallyat the time be like.
(20:15):
Like, screw you, this and that.
But now he's like, no, Julesjust, he literally just worked
hard.
He didn't do anything special.
Like talented.
MacBook Pro Microphone (20:22):
Ladies and gentlemen, this is a great
time to talk about one of thebiggest myths in all of sports.
The idea that some players arejust born with talent while
others aren't the truth.
No one is born knowing how tocradle shoot dodge, or throw a
perfect pass.
Everything you see an athlete dowith a lacrosse stick.
(20:43):
They had to learn.
Think about the greatestathletes of all time.
Let's look at basketball.
Steph Curry didn't come out ofthe womb draining threes.
LeBron James wasn't born with aperfect slam dunk or jump shot.
These guys put in countlesshours of work.
If they were just naturallytalented, why would they need to
practice so much?
Why?
Because skill beats talent.
(21:05):
When talent doesn't work hard,I.
Remember that skill beatstalent.
When talent doesn't work hard,lacrosse is no different.
If you want to be great, it'snot about whether you were born
with it in quotes.
It's about how much time you'rewilling to put in your skills,
your lacrosse, iq, your mindset.
Those are all things you candevelop.
(21:25):
The difference between a goodplayer and a great player.
It's not talent.
It's who's willing to do thework, who's willing to get on
the wall, work on their weekend,break down film, and sharpen
their mind.
So if you ever thought, I'm notjust as talented as that guy,
stop it right there.
So if you ever thought, I'm notjust as talented as that guy,
(21:47):
stop right there.
Talent is just potential.
Skill is what you create througheffort and the best part, skill
has no limits.
You can get better, you canclose the gap.
You just have to be willing toput in the work.
So the question isn't, do I havetalent?
The question is, how much areyou willing to earn your skill?
(22:10):
Think about that one, folks.
Now, we'll, return to ourinterview and you'll find that
interview in progress.
I did.
Didn't work.
Say all that.
Yeah.
And, and you know, if I did, Iwould've been a better player.
So I, I appreciate him for, youknow, kind of us having those
conversations and dialogues asyou get older.
'cause when you're young, yeah,we're just in the trenches
together and, you know theseason and everything.
(22:32):
But definitely being reallycompetitive too.
Well, I get you Jules.
'cause I was a worker and it'shard to convince people like dog
who's a big talker and loves thegame and everything, who just
shows up, you know, it's likeimpossible.
So I, I get it.
Oh yeah.
Jay, I'm a grinder.
I'm a natural athlete who showedup.
I never, I thought I was anatural athlete, but I did work
hard, Ron.
I You did.
So gotta give that.
I will.
I will give you that.
(22:53):
Jay, you were a grinder.
Jay Grinder.
You were a grinder.
I'm a grinder.
I'm not sure how we got thatback to you, Jay, but George,
you'll notice.
Well, I'm just encouraging ourguests that Jay will bring it
back to him.
Quite often.
That's all right.
It's, you know, I'll let youhave it.
Hey thank you Jules.
So, you know, moving on, you,you then go to Seton Hall Prep
(23:14):
and I will give Jay props.
He does some tremendous researchfor our shows and to learn that
you were the first worker rungrinder, you were the first high
school all American.
That's kind of a cool thing, youknow, to be the first All
American ever at your highschool, and then you lead'em to
a county championship.
So first of all, why'd you moveon to Seton Hall Prep?
(23:37):
And then how did your careergrow?
And really, I'm sure it's inthose years where now you're
putting yourself in position tobe, you know, a Division one big
10 lacrosse player.
Yeah.
Honestly, the, so when we weregrowing up, the, the rec
program, right, which was theclub program originally
Maplewood.
(23:57):
They were selling, they wereselling me a dream.
Like honestly, they're greatsalesmen.
All the coaches there and, andthe, the development that they
were looking to have with us toget to the high school.
And so I bought into that.
I was like, I'm gonna go to theColumbia High School.
I'm gonna be one of the greatthat have been there.
I'm gonna break all the records.
Like that was I, and I thought abunch of my teammates were all
(24:18):
like, yeah, like, we're gonna goto Columbia, it's gonna be
great.
And eighth grade comes and allthe, my team just like leaves to
go to other schools, basicallylike all the good kids.
Hmm.
So in my mind I'm like, wow,like we just spent all this time
together growing up playing rec,we had an amazing experience.
And then eighth grade kind ofstarts to dip.
May maybe some guys don't go topuberty, some guys aren't
(24:38):
working as hard, which I thinkthat's what you see in eighth
grade.
And then ninth grade came andeveryone was gone.
But during that time, I would, Iwould play I would play up.
So I, in the summer times and inmaybe in the tournaments that we
would go to with each other.
I would be playing with theolder kids and I would, I would
be doing well and like Iwouldn't just be doing well.
(25:00):
I'd be like one of the best guysout there.
So there was always a sense ofwhen I got to Columbia that I
was gonna be a freshman onvarsity and, and make a big
impact.
And then the coach that wasthere originally, he moved on to
another school.
So they got a new coach and hekind of was a little bit more
old school.
And I, I think his rule, I knowhis rule is freshmen cannot play
(25:20):
varsity, which is, I'm a coachnow.
It's a ridiculous rule.
And I would never yeah, havethat in place.
But like, I get it, likeeveryone kind of has their own
approach.
And if it works, it works.
But we weren't good.
So like if we, if we're not agood program, like you need to
put the best players in theposition possible to help your
team succeed.
And so when I started hearingfrom my brother and some of the
(25:43):
upperclassmen, they're like,Jules, like you're not gonna be
able to play varsity.
I'm looking at these guys likethey got 10 heads.
'cause I'm like.
Let's go out to the field rightnow and let's see.
Right.
Let's see who's best player heis.
Like, I'll take you.
I'm only another guy out therethat I know who's more talented
than me.
And, and that's it.
And so I was like, I'm justgonna go to the coach's office
and I'm gonna ask him like, Idon't know why this is this kind
(26:04):
of weird gray area when we'vebeen playing together for three
or four years.
Like, I, and this doesn't makesense.
So I go in there and I asked himand, and he was like, yep, you
know, freshmen can't playvarsity.
And I was like, I'm not askingto play.
I'm asking for a tryout.
I'm asking for you to evaluatemy skillset based on where,
where I'm at right now,according to the, the rest of
the group.
(26:24):
And he was like, nah, it's justnot gonna happen.
And I was crushed, you know,like,'cause that was my, my
dream for a long time.
And I, I also thought, if youdon't play varsity as a freshman
at Columbia, like how am I evergonna play at the next level was
also my mindset.
And I kind of, you know, I tookthat in stride and I flipped
this switch and I was like,okay, I'm playing freshman
lacrosse for a team that, youknow, with 90% of kids that have
(26:46):
never played lacrosse before.
Because all my rest of myteammates left and I made the
most of the experience.
I got to play jv, we won the JVchampionship, you know, like MVP
of the JV championship,whatever.
And so that gave me, you know,some, some sense of like
confidence, belief in myself.
I see what I can do, even thoughmaybe the coach doesn't see it.
Even if he does, he doesn'tcare.
(27:07):
He is got rules, whatever.
But the next year comes and hestarts to like, honestly pick on
me and bully me.
Which again, crazy thing to doas a coach now is, is someone
working with young men andwomen.
He would just be saying thingsthat were just completely off,
off base.
And I would just kind of have totake it on the chin.
(27:28):
And I, you know, eventually my,I wouldn't talk about it'cause I
was just like, whatever.
But my brother would, wouldbring it home to my dad and then
my dad would catch wind of it.
And then my dad, you know, like.
He's a big guy.
He's not, he's not scaredanyone.
He goes up to the coach and heis like, yeah, you got something
to say about my son.
Like, I'm happy for you to tellme about it and let's talk about
(27:48):
it.
He didn't like that.
He was definitely afraid of, ofthat conversation.
And so my brother and I werethere, my brother graduates.
I'm like, I'm not staying here.
Like, there's no way I'm stayingat this school.
Right.
And then that's, that's whatbrought me to Scene Hall.
And ironically one of the kids Ihad left the program, he, once
people started to catch windthat like, what was going on?
(28:09):
Like this coach was doing this,and then they were like, Jules
is leaving.
Everyone's like, that's crazythat this is going on, but like,
gotta get him to C Hall.
Don't let him go to, you know,there's like a bunch of
parochial schools.
And so I had a friend and he, hewas vouching for me.
And then that coach was thecoach of, that we're based in
counties in New Jersey.
So they'd have these countytryouts and the coach of our
(28:33):
county tri, like tryout was the,the seed hall varsity head
coach.
So I go there and then like hesees me, gets to meet me in
person, you know, I'm the best,best player on that county team.
And so that it became like a nobrainer that he was like, I
don't understand what's going onhere, but come one, come all
happy to Right.
Pick you on.
Yeah.
And so I, you know, I'm forevergrateful for, for him to do that
(28:55):
to, you know, to see in me likea, another coach could have been
like, oh, you're a problem.
You're this, you're that.
But, but he took me at facevalue from the tryout, from the
in, you know, the conversationsthat we had and then you know,
had a, a crazy experience at, atc Hall, like I got there.
And they, they weren't very goodat that point, right?
When you first got there?
(29:15):
No, it's, so the, the weirdthing was they had some
tradition at the school and notas much as I thought there was
more tradition.
'cause it had some programs inthe past.
Coach Deco was coached them to astate championship in 2004.
So I knew there was sometradition.
I knew they had division oneplayers.
But when I got there, like wehad won in the off season in the
(29:38):
winter tournament and you know,I, I was a part of that.
I was, you know, guys started tolearn about me, what am I
bringing to the table?
I'm building relationships withthese guys.
Then the season starts and wejust, we are two and eight
because I have to sit out forthe first 10 games of the season
'cause of transfer.
Oh really?
Yeah.
Transfer rule.
(29:59):
Yeah.
And, and so I'm sitting thereand I'm like, I can't believe I
just transferred to this schooland I had a better record at
Columbia with a bunch of kidswho just we're just playing
lacrosse.
You know, granted, like,honestly, the schedules weren't
that much different either.
And, but we had talent.
So I was like, okay, again, Igotta figure out what, what can
I do to make an impact, apositive impact.
(30:21):
I gotta make the most of this.
And then I started playing andlike, honestly, they just needed
someone to, to reel it in alittle bit and be the
quarterback.
And I, that speaks to like howimportant that.
That role really is, and theyjust happen to not really have
that on the team.
Mm-hmm.
And so it kind of just workedout with some synergy there that
I came in, I slotted in, youknow, first game we win and
(30:43):
like, everyone's like, wow.
Like that felt so muchdifferent.
And then all of a sudden we, wego on this 10 game winning
streak.
We, we beat Del Barr in theirranked number one in the country
by inside lacrosse.
Wow.
Won the county championship.
We lost in the finals to DonBosco.
Incredible.
Don Bosco.
Oh man.
Yeah.
But it was kind of a Cinderellastory thing where we went from
two and eight to 11 and nine,like didn't lose until the state
(31:05):
championship.
And Wow.
The following year the coach islike, Hey, like you're a captain
now.
Which like, you know, I was atransfer.
No one knew who I was.
I didn't play.
And then all of a sudden I'm acaptain.
So it's again, speaks to likehim as a, just as a coach, as a
man for giving me thatopportunity.
I would not be here if he didn'tdo that.
And that was, that was just howit worked out.
So really.
(31:25):
It always felt like I had a lotof belief in myself.
But my circumstances justweren't really the best for me
and for all intents andpurposes.
But I didn't ever let that like,define my experience.
Like I was always like, what canI do to control and do the best
I can?
Whether it was on the freshmanteam, whether it's on sophomore
where the coach doesn't evenwant me to be there, I'm on an a
(31:46):
team that's two and eight.
Like I was always just kind oftrying to write my own story and
eventually, you know, the storystarted to to work out for me.
That's great.
Good stuff.
And, and a little bit of thatresearch that came up that you
weren't a ranked recruit.
I guess the way things were doneat that stage, Ron and I, there
was wasn't much of a ranking.
People might have had somerumors, but there was, there was
(32:07):
nothing published.
But then you go into their r torts, Jay would've had himself
high in the rankings.
Oh yeah.
Just so you know.
He would've, the rumor wa therumor was I was very high in
ranking actually.
That's great.
That's, that's all he wanted tosay, Jules.
That's why you brought thatwhole thing up as long as you
earned it, Jay, you know,that's, that's what I respect.
Exactly, Jules.
Lots of hard work.
(32:28):
But you know, there you are atSeton Hall, you become a leader
there.
And then same thing at Rutgers,you're a two time captain, so by
the time you're a junior, you'reone of the leaders on the team.
And then by the time you're asenior, you're one of the best
attacker in the whole country.
So just awesome stuff there.
So tell us, tell us about thatjourney there at Rutgers with
the Scarlet Knights.
MacBook Pro Microphone-2 (32:49):
Uh, yes.
What a journey it was.
To hear all about it.
That is how Jules Denberg,metaphorically speaking, wrote a
powerful steed, dressed as ascarlet night onto victory.
Tune in next week, my friends.
Until we meet again.
Here's to hoping you find thetwine.
(33:11):
We're signing off here at theget the lax scoop.
Thanks again so much.
We will see you the next time.
It's time for Get the LackScoop, a podcast bringing you
all the people and stuff youshould know in the game of
lacrosse.
We take lack seriously, butourselves, not so much.
Join host Big Dog and Jaybirdand the biggest names in the
game brought to you by JayMcMahon lacrosse.
That's JML skills, mindset, andlacks IQ training.
(00:23):
Ron Doglish, the big dog, was acollegiate football and lacrosse
player at Brown.
He was also an assistantlacrosse coach and the executive
director of the SportsFoundation.
And Jay McMahon, the Jaybird, athree time All American
midfielder at Brown.
He was the captain of the U.
S.
Junior National Team and is thefounder of JML.
(00:43):
And Joining us in the studio,Steve Grisolfi, who's collegiate
lacrosse career statisticsequals one goal against
Dartmouth brought to you by JayMcMahon lacrosse.
That's JML skills, mindset, andlacks IQ training, helping the
next generation of lacrosseplayers get to the next level
Well, Jay, here we are again.
Another episode of Get the LackScoop.
(01:06):
Absolutely.
It's trying desperately to actlike spring.
The lacrosse is definitely,definitely heating up, no doubt.
I see.
In the division one, the, Ithink the TURPs and the heels
are beginning to separatethemselves, if I might say.
I would agree.
Can't deny that our next guestis silent right now.
(01:27):
We haven't announced him yet,dog.
Don't try to ask him and ruinthe surprise.
Jay, do you think this is myfirst goddamn episode?
Jesus.
I wonder, Ron, I always wonder.
Unbelievable.
Jay.
Jay, yes.
It's your job to introduce theguest.
I have not blown anything.
Do your job, Jay.
Introduce our guest.
(01:48):
Our next guest is a graduate ofRutgers University where he was
a two time all American attackman, two time captain, and all
big 10 selection, as well as theschool's second, all time
leading scorer.
He completed his high schooleducation at Seton Hall Prep,
where he was the school's firstever All American, and led his
team to winning the ES EssexCounty Championship.
(02:11):
After Rutgers, he went on to theprofessional ranks where he was
the seventh overall pick in the2018 draft, and has been a four
time all-star selection while inthe professional ranks.
He currently plays with aCarolina Chaos.
He's also the founder of threeorganizations, the LAX Lab,
which is a skills trainingprogram Mission primed, an
(02:32):
initiative geared towardspreparing lacrosse players to
excel in lacrosse and life whileat college, as well as the Black
Lacrosse Alliance, which worksto build a pathway for players
and coaches to navigate racialbarriers and provide inclusive
diversity in the sport we alllove.
Please give a warm welcome tothe one the only Jules Hen
(02:54):
welcome.
Yeah, Jules, I appreciate that.
It's, it's funny to hear likepeople talk about you know, kind
of what you've done.
I feel like I'm, I'm getting oldnow, just like getting old.
You're just a kid, but yeah,you've done a lot.
Jay, Jules, busy guy's.
Resume college.
Lacrosse, resume.
Looks just like mine, Jay.
Oh yeah.
I mean, you know, two time allAmerican captain, he looks kind
(03:15):
of speedy.
I'm sure his game and my gameare very similar.
Just like you, just like you RonJules couldn't be farther from
the truth.
Ron, did you play Jules, take aguess, please.
Defense, I, I put him in thegoal right now, right?
You, you, you could say goalie.
I'm not gonna do that to youthough.
Like that.
I gotta throw that at you,right?
(03:36):
That this early on the podcast,you know, oh, Jay, I like it.
Jules is testy.
He is coming in hot, I say, andfor those of you who have never
actually.
Watched us on video.
I am larger than the averageguy.
So I think Jules just called mea fat guy who might've been
standing in the goal.
I think you're a fat guy whocould take up a lot of the goal.
(03:57):
I think that's what I just gotfrom the guests that I just met.
Jay.
Well, blaze Beard, his teammate.
I wouldn't do that to you.
I, I would say that you were,you were a defender and, and
maybe, you know at some time youtried goal.
I don't know.
But I, I wouldn't put that onyou that I would put that on.
Yeah.
I'm sure Jay put you up to thatleading into the podcast.
Oh yeah.
That's right.
(04:17):
But Jules, hey, as we getstarted, you know, we love to
ask every one of our guests youknow, as we were just talking
before we came on air, you know,how much.
We each love the game.
Right, and Jay and I still dothis because we just love
talking to people in the game oflacrosse, and clearly you are so
committed to the game in all thedifferent ways you're giving
back.
(04:38):
But where did it start, Jules?
Where did you first develop thispassion and love for the game?
Yeah, it started in Maplewood,New Jersey back when I was seven
years old.
It honestly, I didn't wanna playlacrosse when I was growing up.
I was, I was playing basketballand my sister was playing, and
my dad would keep saying to me,Hey, like, there's this game
lacrosse, like, you know, youreally should try it out.
(05:01):
And I was like, no, like that,that's not for me.
Like I'm, I'm gonna playbasketball and that's gonna be
my thing.
And then I just remember forsome reason, like it, it became
not an option.
Like we had to go, me and mybrother had to go to, to
practice one day.
And I just remember going and Iwas so bad and I remember
leaving being like, damn, like,I don't know how to cradle.
I don't know how to throw, Idon't know, to catch like, I'm
(05:22):
not going back.
Me and my brother were bothcrying about practice and then
it's like my dad said to us,Hey, if you sign up for
something, I, I signed you upfor this.
You're going back, like there'sno quitting in the middle of the
season.
So we ended up going back and,and very quickly it turned from,
I wasn't very good to, okay,like I gotta figure out how to
cradle.
Do I use my top hand or mybottom hand?
(05:43):
You know, I'm gonna figure thisout.
Like, I started to, to competewith myself a little bit'cause
there was a lot of kids outthere.
Honestly, at the time I, lookingback on, this is silly to think,
but I was starting in secondgrade and there were kids that
were out there who had startedin kindergarten and so they were
already three years ahead of meand doing stuff that I was like,
man, like that can do that.
(06:03):
Like, all right, I need tofigure this out.
So it became competitive for me,which was you know, it, it was
exciting.
Like I, I was, I was playingbasketball for a long time and
this was something new.
And that, that drove me.
It got my competitive juicesgoing.
And the town that we were in,Maplewood that I grew up in
Maplewood and Montclair are thetwo oldest club programs.
When I say club they ended up,it initially was club, but then
(06:26):
it became high school programs,but they called'em clubs back in
the day.
I'm not gonna say any of youguys, but back in the day.
And they basically had, I wasvery fortunate.
Like we had dads that played in,in the club and at the high
school who moved back to thetown and, and they were coaching
us and they were just taking thegame so seriously.
And were just, were talkingabout the Native American roots
(06:47):
and they were talking about, youknow, legends that had played on
in, in the program that hadpassed away.
You know, we have their numberon their sleeve.
I could talk more about that.
And I'm just over here soakingall in and being like, wow,
Maplewood Lacrosse Club isunbelievable.
I can't believe I get to havethis coach who played at, you
know Colgate or, you know,Wooster College, wherever these
guys are playing.
(07:08):
And, and I was like, wow, I'm sograteful for the opportunity.
And I kind of just bought intothat.
And then that, that, you know,led me on to to a lot of
different things, which, whichI'm fortunate for in my lacrosse
career.
So, Jules, you talked about yourdad pushing you.
Was was he particularlyconnected to the game?
Had he played, what was, what doyou think really ha inspired him
(07:29):
to push you and your brotherinto the game?
Honestly, so when you're young,you know, you guys have probably
experienced this with, with,maybe your parents and, and
maybe your dad, I don't know.
But my dad would, wouldfabricate some things about his.
And so he would talk about, oh,I played lacrosse back in high
school and, you know, I was thescrub on the team, this and
(07:50):
that.
And, and come to find out, I'mlike, you never actually like
played on the team.
I think you were just adjacentto some guys who were very good,
who went on to play at someamazing programs.
Like the, the teams in theseventies and the eighties and
the nineties in Columbia.
They were producing guys gonnaMaryland, Rutgers, Loyola Navy,
like there was, you know, somenice high level talent.
And so he was playing, he was atschool with them.
(08:13):
And so he would hang out withthem and he would, he would see,
you know, the game and enjoy thegame.
But he was a basketball player.
So for him it was, he hadlifelong friends that I had
played lacrosse and he was stillconnected to, and they were
always just telling him about,you know, about this game.
And, you know, he would calllike the ticket, like, this is
your ticket.
Go, go, go run with this gameand, and see how far you can
take it.
Like.
(08:34):
Basketball.
I played basketball at a highlevel.
It's really hard, you know,unless you're gonna be six four
Jules and, and Dunking whenyou're 13, 14, you're gonna have
to be Steph Curry.
You're gonna have, you're gonnahave to be an outlier to make
it.
But if you play lacrosse, youknow, there's just so much
creativity.
There's so much opportunity for,for your skillset to blossom.
(08:54):
And again, like, I didn't knowthat at the time, but when I got
to eighth grade, I started torealize, like, I love
basketball.
I was very good at it, but someof my friends had just shot up
in size.
And I, I was still kind of alate bloomer and I was like,
like, I don't know, maybe Ishould just keep going with this
lacrosse thing.
I'm, I'm, I'm really good atthat too.
And, and that was kind of just Ithink the, the matriculation of
it and, and how it started with,you know, with him kind of
(09:16):
pushing me a little bit.
And it was always him being aguy that made it seem like he
played, but I pushed him tostuff.
I'm like, dude, you never reallyplayed well.
It seemed like, it seemed likeyou saw the opportunity though,
huh?
That's great.
Yeah, clearly.
Definitely seemed like thosestories worked out.
I mean, we'll, we'll eventuallylet Jay ask a question, Jules,
but I'm a much betterinterviewer, so we'll we'll just
(09:38):
keep going here.
You just mentioned a littlewhile ago, Ron, the club team in
your town was actually like thehigh school team, but we al
always like,'cause therecruiting thing has just
changed so much over the years.
Mm-hmm.
We're wondering when you startedto play in that high school age
group, were you playing club,was that a thing for you and
your player development and yourrecruiting process?
(10:01):
So tell us how you, how yourhigh school and club career
evolved.
Yeah.
I think honestly I rememberbeing in class in seventh grade
and the summer kind of gettingclose to the summertime and, and
thinking I knew how good I wasrelative to my, like, classmates
right at my school or on my recprogram.
(10:22):
And I had an idea of it alsorelative to, to some of the
other towns that we'd play inthe state of New Jersey.
I remember being in class andhaving a friend talk about going
to Trilogy Camp and me beinglike, oh, like I don't know
about, I don't know about thecamp.
Like how would you know about acamp?
And I don't know about a camp.
I, I know how good I am relativeto you.
That was, I should be going tothat camp.
(10:44):
You should be staying home.
Exactly.
See that Ron, like, get home.
And I'm like, dad, like, what isthis trilogy camp that my
buddy's going to?
And he is like, to be honestbuddy, I don't know what the
trilogy clamp is.
Send it to me and I send it tohim.
He's like, you know, whateveramount of money he is like,
yeah, you're not gonna trilogycamp.
And I was like, oh man.
Like if I don't go to this camp,then, you know, maybe I'm not on
the right path.
Whatever I come this, you know,tossed it to the side.
(11:07):
And at that time I was, I wasjust playing pickup lacrosse in
this league in the summertimethat you, you would go with your
rec program and you would playdifferent towns like through the
summer.
'cause the club lacrosse had aholding, but there were still
like these leagues that you, youcould play in.
I would just play lacrosse onlike Wednesday nights for four
hours and like straight, whetherit was on our team, and then we
(11:29):
would maybe play two games andthen I would stay and play for
other teams that needed extraguys.
And I remember the followingsummer where again, I was like,
Hey dad.
You know, some of my friends,some of the guys that I'm
playing against that again, I'm,I know how good I am relative to
them.
They all seem to be doing thisclub thing.
Like it's, I kind of need to, todo this.
(11:50):
And so he, he bit the bullet, helet me try out for this team
called Trilogy which Ryan Boylestarted in New Jersey.
Mm-hmm.
They don't participate in, inthe club scene anymore, but
they, they run a, a bunch ofcamps and showcases and things
and tournaments still.
And I played on that team andthat team was kind of the team.
They had these baby bluehelmets.
Like every, you know, if you sawthat, you were like, that kid's
(12:10):
pretty nice.
Yeah, and I, so I started toplay that, but the team kind of
was like gutted a little bitgoing into ninth grade.
So I got on it like at the lasttime before it was kind of just
falling apart.
And so I just felt like I didn'thave a great experience with it.
And my, my dad felt the sameway.
And so the following year he'slike, okay, well now your
(12:31):
brother has to play club too.
So I kind of pushed it where Iwas like, I gotta play.
And now my dad's like, oh, wellI gotta start thinking about if
you're gonna get recruited, Iguess you gotta play club.
So the following year he, he gotus on this team with this guy by
the name of Andrew Deco.
I don't know if you guys arefamiliar with Andrew.
I've heard the name, but Idon't, I haven't met him.
But yeah, played at Rutgershuge, phenomenal talent at
(12:52):
Rutgers.
Graduated from there, I think hewas like an eighties, nineties
guy and he had had a club team,you know, and, and so I was
like, okay, like I guess I'llplay on this team where my
brother, my dad got us both fromthe team, kind of a two for one
deal.
Figuring out ways to make itwork financially.
And I played on that team, nowI'm playing up two grade levels
(13:12):
with this club team.
And then that year, I'm goinginto my sophomore year now'cause
it was like kind of that ninthgrade summer and I'm, I'm
remember I'm sitting now mysophomore year after playing for
the Deigo program in class andlike inside lacrosse is
dropping, all these guys aregetting recruited and like
committed.
And I was just like, wait, howis this possible?
(13:34):
I don't, I don't even, I haven'teven talked to a college coach
yet.
I don't, again, I'm seeing likemy co like I call'em colleagues
now, my friends, teammates,other on other programs
committing to schools.
And I'm like, I'm like, I knowhow good I am relative to you.
How are you already going to aschool?
And I haven't even talked to acoach, let alone gone on a visit
(13:54):
and you're already committinglike, this doesn't make a ton of
sense to me.
So now at that point I startedto recalibrate.
Okay, maybe I was playingagainst kids two years older.
I wasn't standing out enough.
Maybe I was at the wrongtournaments.
Now what do I need to do?
And then finally I go, okay, letme, let me really dial this in
and take some, some ownership ofwhat's going on here.
It's not gonna be my dad or thiskid or what team he plays where
(14:18):
it's like, what do I want to do?
And so I found this team calledLeading Edge, which is pretty
prominent club in New Jersey.
And yeah, I went to the tryoutand I ended up getting on the
team going into my juniorsummer, which means I had to
take someone's spot that hadalready, they already would, did
two summers where they weregetting looked at by, right?
Yeah.
At that point, college coachesand I got on there and you know,
(14:40):
the, that was, the rest washistory after that for as far as
recruiting goes.
But it was all kind of like.
Me just figuring it out alongthe way and having to, yeah.
To be like, all right, like, letme, let me just try to lock in a
little bit more if this is what,you know, I kind of want to do.
That's cool.
Nice stuff.
Yeah.
And we love, you know, talkingabout the relationships, you
were talking about, you know,your dad and then your brother
(15:00):
Dylan, and then, you know,taking a look, your high school
at Columbia, you went there to10th grade and then mm-hmm.
As you, as we were saying, youwent to Seton Hall after that.
But looking at the stat sheet,you know, you had, they have all
the stats on there for ColumbiaHigh School, like every year.
So I could see, like when you'rein 10th grade, I.
You had like a few more pointsthan your brother Dylan, but he
(15:21):
did have a few more goals.
So, but I was thinking that musthave been so cool to play with
your brother.
I have a younger brother, but hekind of was like a maybe a year
behind where he wasn't as good.
He wasn't gonna play in the samemidfield as me.
I was a midfielder.
But tell us about that.
That must have been awesome tobe playing and at, at this
stage, you're really gettingcompetitive with it playing with
your older brother there atColumbia High School and looked
(15:44):
like you guys had a good littleseason there.
So tell us about that.
Yeah, JI mean, you know, youkind of hit the nail on the
head.
The opportunity to, to play withyour brothers is definitely a
special one.
I, I think you, you might takeit for granted when you're, when
you're young you know, our dadwas definitely pushing us around
it and looking back on that,like that, that's such a special
experience.
But in, in the time, me and himbutted heads a ton, honestly,
(16:06):
really.
I think it started in thebackyard.
We had this like dirt court withlike tree roots grown out of it.
And my dad put up a basketballhoop.
And you could raise it higher orlower.
So we started pretty young, likeyou could put it lower and we
would just go at, go at it afterout there.
And he's got a completelydifferent build than me.
Like I'm slim.
He's, I'm six two, he's 5 8, 59.
(16:27):
But like stocky, more like aMatt Rambo type.
Yeah.
I'm skin and bones.
He's solid.
I'm more shifty, you know, we'replaying against each other.
It was always competitive andeventually I figured out like
how I could beat him.
Right.
And become like, all right, Ican't have my, my younger
brother beating me.
So, right.
Like, okay, I'm gonna, I'm gonnafoul the outta you.
(16:48):
So starts dropping the hammer.
Exactly.
Like I'm shaking past you.
I go for a layup and I'm justgetting like, jumped the ball.
I would, I would never have donesuch a thing, Jay, that's I, I,
oh yeah, right.
Ron.
Ron was the oldest of, he seemslike Dylan and I've had a
similar strategy.
Yeah.
Oh man.
Dylan's not here to defendhimself.
He just had a baby.
(17:08):
He was gonna be on the podcastto let everybody know, but, but
that's great.
No.
And I got, I gotta give him hisflowers though.
Like, we'll get a statement fromhim perhaps, and he'll admit
that like I, because we have agreat relationship now, and
that, that's why I want, youknow, wanted to get him on here.
He's a, he's a brilliantlacrosse mine.
He is the offensive coordinatorat Lawrenceville.
Yeah.
National championship program.
Yeah.
(17:28):
That's awesome.
When you, in high school, like Iwas more of a gifted lacrosse
player from like, the overallsense, because I worked really
hard and I was, you know, I wasshifty, but he was actually more
naturally talented than I was.
He just didn't like put in asmuch work as a player because,
you know, I just, I loved to, Iloved to work hard.
(17:50):
Like I, that was my thing when Iwas young.
Mm-hmm.
I knew I was good, but I didn'tever feel like I was the best,
but I was competitive, so I waslike, what's it gonna take for
me to, to become my best and,and beat these other guys that
are playing on the club orthey're, they're getting this
ranking or whatever.
He was, I'm always justnaturally talented and, and
bigger.
So he would just show up andhe'd be like, it's game time.
Like I'm, I'm right.
(18:11):
Get it.
And so in, when we would look atthe course of a season when I
was younger, I would be the moreproductive player.
But when mm-hmm.
To you wanted to give him theball'cause you're like, he's
just gonna go get us a goal.
He's a gamer.
He's a gamer.
Yeah.
I wasn't a gamer growing up.
I was more strategic, high iq.
Like, I'm gonna make everyonebetter.
(18:32):
And I had to develop a gamerkind of sense for, for me.
And you know, it's, it's funny'cause my dad was like, if you
could combine you two, you'd belike the best lacrosse player
ever.
It was like just, you know,figuring out things.
And he's taken more of the, thework ethic approach now as a
coach for Right film.
You know, what he does for hisguys and, and just that side of
(18:53):
things.
But he has always loved thegame.
So, you know, it's kind ofcoming together for him full
circle as a coach where.
I talk lacrosse with a decentamount of people, but like
there's only a handful of peoplethat I will actually trust,
wholeheartedly, trust theiropinion about the sport with.
And, and he's one of those guysand he wasn't always that way,
(19:14):
but he's worked himself to justunderstanding the game at such a
high level to where now I canthrow something at him and he's
gonna be able to give me solidadvice about it.
And, and so we, we bond overthat and it, we have a a solid
relationship now in that, inthat aspect.
That's great.
Despite all those hard fouls,you've, you've gotten over it,
despite the hard fouls, thecontrollers being broken and,
(19:34):
and you know, like just throwingme through a window.
Like I, a lot of stories, Imean, Jules, it doesn't sound
like you harbor any ill will.
'cause if I could summarize whatyou just said about Dylan.
Well, basically I was a betterathlete than him, and I was
smarter.
He is worked harder.
And now I kind of e listen whathe has to say about the game.
I mean, is that, have you heardthis a pretty good summary from
your brothers out there, Jules?
(19:54):
I mean, yeah.
That, that, that's a, that's apretty good summary.
And I, I would just, I wasalways like, yo, like I'm, I'm a
good player.
I'm like, dude, why don't youjust come work with me?
Like, yeah, you, you would be,you would actually be the goat
if you came and worked with me,but you want to go do this, go
do that.
It's like, all right, I'll justwork in silence.
And then we show up, shockerthat I'm, you know, the, the
better player.
And he would, he would literallyat the time be like.
(20:15):
Like, screw you, this and that.
But now he's like, no, Julesjust, he literally just worked
hard.
He didn't do anything special.
Like talented.
MacBook Pro Microphone (20:22):
Ladies and gentlemen, this is a great
time to talk about one of thebiggest myths in all of sports.
The idea that some players arejust born with talent while
others aren't the truth.
No one is born knowing how tocradle shoot dodge, or throw a
perfect pass.
Everything you see an athlete dowith a lacrosse stick.
(20:43):
They had to learn.
Think about the greatestathletes of all time.
Let's look at basketball.
Steph Curry didn't come out ofthe womb draining threes.
LeBron James wasn't born with aperfect slam dunk or jump shot.
These guys put in countlesshours of work.
If they were just naturallytalented, why would they need to
practice so much?
Why?
Because skill beats talent.
(21:05):
When talent doesn't work hard,I.
Remember that skill beatstalent.
When talent doesn't work hard,lacrosse is no different.
If you want to be great, it'snot about whether you were born
with it in quotes.
It's about how much time you'rewilling to put in your skills,
your lacrosse, iq, your mindset.
Those are all things you candevelop.
(21:25):
The difference between a goodplayer and a great player.
It's not talent.
It's who's willing to do thework, who's willing to get on
the wall, work on their weekend,break down film, and sharpen
their mind.
So if you ever thought, I'm notjust as talented as that guy,
stop it right there.
So if you ever thought, I'm notjust as talented as that guy,
(21:47):
stop right there.
Talent is just potential.
Skill is what you create througheffort and the best part, skill
has no limits.
You can get better, you canclose the gap.
You just have to be willing toput in the work.
So the question isn't, do I havetalent?
The question is, how much areyou willing to earn your skill?
(22:10):
Think about that one, folks.
Now, we'll, return to ourinterview and you'll find that
interview in progress.
I did.
Didn't work.
Say all that.
Yeah.
And, and you know, if I did, Iwould've been a better player.
So I, I appreciate him for, youknow, kind of us having those
conversations and dialogues asyou get older.
'cause when you're young, yeah,we're just in the trenches
together and, you know theseason and everything.
(22:32):
But definitely being reallycompetitive too.
Well, I get you Jules.
'cause I was a worker and it'shard to convince people like dog
who's a big talker and loves thegame and everything, who just
shows up, you know, it's likeimpossible.
So I, I get it.
Oh yeah.
Jay, I'm a grinder.
I'm a natural athlete who showedup.
I never, I thought I was anatural athlete, but I did work
hard, Ron.
I You did.
So gotta give that.
I will.
I will give you that.
(22:53):
Jay, you were a grinder.
Jay Grinder.
You were a grinder.
I'm a grinder.
I'm not sure how we got thatback to you, Jay, but George,
you'll notice.
Well, I'm just encouraging ourguests that Jay will bring it
back to him.
Quite often.
That's all right.
It's, you know, I'll let youhave it.
Hey thank you Jules.
So, you know, moving on, you,you then go to Seton Hall Prep
(23:14):
and I will give Jay props.
He does some tremendous researchfor our shows and to learn that
you were the first worker rungrinder, you were the first high
school all American.
That's kind of a cool thing, youknow, to be the first All
American ever at your highschool, and then you lead'em to
a county championship.
So first of all, why'd you moveon to Seton Hall Prep?
(23:37):
And then how did your careergrow?
And really, I'm sure it's inthose years where now you're
putting yourself in position tobe, you know, a Division one big
10 lacrosse player.
Yeah.
Honestly, the, so when we weregrowing up, the, the rec
program, right, which was theclub program originally
Maplewood.
(23:57):
They were selling, they wereselling me a dream.
Like honestly, they're greatsalesmen.
All the coaches there and, andthe, the development that they
were looking to have with us toget to the high school.
And so I bought into that.
I was like, I'm gonna go to theColumbia High School.
I'm gonna be one of the greatthat have been there.
I'm gonna break all the records.
Like that was I, and I thought abunch of my teammates were all
(24:18):
like, yeah, like, we're gonna goto Columbia, it's gonna be
great.
And eighth grade comes and allthe, my team just like leaves to
go to other schools, basicallylike all the good kids.
Hmm.
So in my mind I'm like, wow,like we just spent all this time
together growing up playing rec,we had an amazing experience.
And then eighth grade kind ofstarts to dip.
May maybe some guys don't go topuberty, some guys aren't
(24:38):
working as hard, which I thinkthat's what you see in eighth
grade.
And then ninth grade came andeveryone was gone.
But during that time, I would, Iwould play I would play up.
So I, in the summer times and inmaybe in the tournaments that we
would go to with each other.
I would be playing with theolder kids and I would, I would
be doing well and like Iwouldn't just be doing well.
(25:00):
I'd be like one of the best guysout there.
So there was always a sense ofwhen I got to Columbia that I
was gonna be a freshman onvarsity and, and make a big
impact.
And then the coach that wasthere originally, he moved on to
another school.
So they got a new coach and hekind of was a little bit more
old school.
And I, I think his rule, I knowhis rule is freshmen cannot play
(25:20):
varsity, which is, I'm a coachnow.
It's a ridiculous rule.
And I would never yeah, havethat in place.
But like, I get it, likeeveryone kind of has their own
approach.
And if it works, it works.
But we weren't good.
So like if we, if we're not agood program, like you need to
put the best players in theposition possible to help your
team succeed.
And so when I started hearingfrom my brother and some of the
(25:43):
upperclassmen, they're like,Jules, like you're not gonna be
able to play varsity.
I'm looking at these guys likethey got 10 heads.
'cause I'm like.
Let's go out to the field rightnow and let's see.
Right.
Let's see who's best player heis.
Like, I'll take you.
I'm only another guy out therethat I know who's more talented
than me.
And, and that's it.
And so I was like, I'm justgonna go to the coach's office
and I'm gonna ask him like, Idon't know why this is this kind
(26:04):
of weird gray area when we'vebeen playing together for three
or four years.
Like, I, and this doesn't makesense.
So I go in there and I asked himand, and he was like, yep, you
know, freshmen can't playvarsity.
And I was like, I'm not askingto play.
I'm asking for a tryout.
I'm asking for you to evaluatemy skillset based on where,
where I'm at right now,according to the, the rest of
the group.
(26:24):
And he was like, nah, it's justnot gonna happen.
And I was crushed, you know,like,'cause that was my, my
dream for a long time.
And I, I also thought, if youdon't play varsity as a freshman
at Columbia, like how am I evergonna play at the next level was
also my mindset.
And I kind of, you know, I tookthat in stride and I flipped
this switch and I was like,okay, I'm playing freshman
lacrosse for a team that, youknow, with 90% of kids that have
(26:46):
never played lacrosse before.
Because all my rest of myteammates left and I made the
most of the experience.
I got to play jv, we won the JVchampionship, you know, like MVP
of the JV championship,whatever.
And so that gave me, you know,some, some sense of like
confidence, belief in myself.
I see what I can do, even thoughmaybe the coach doesn't see it.
Even if he does, he doesn'tcare.
(27:07):
He is got rules, whatever.
But the next year comes and hestarts to like, honestly pick on
me and bully me.
Which again, crazy thing to doas a coach now is, is someone
working with young men andwomen.
He would just be saying thingsthat were just completely off,
off base.
And I would just kind of have totake it on the chin.
(27:28):
And I, you know, eventually my,I wouldn't talk about it'cause I
was just like, whatever.
But my brother would, wouldbring it home to my dad and then
my dad would catch wind of it.
And then my dad, you know, like.
He's a big guy.
He's not, he's not scaredanyone.
He goes up to the coach and heis like, yeah, you got something
to say about my son.
Like, I'm happy for you to tellme about it and let's talk about
(27:48):
it.
He didn't like that.
He was definitely afraid of, ofthat conversation.
And so my brother and I werethere, my brother graduates.
I'm like, I'm not staying here.
Like, there's no way I'm stayingat this school.
Right.
And then that's, that's whatbrought me to Scene Hall.
And ironically one of the kids Ihad left the program, he, once
people started to catch windthat like, what was going on?
(28:09):
Like this coach was doing this,and then they were like, Jules
is leaving.
Everyone's like, that's crazythat this is going on, but like,
gotta get him to C Hall.
Don't let him go to, you know,there's like a bunch of
parochial schools.
And so I had a friend and he, hewas vouching for me.
And then that coach was thecoach of, that we're based in
counties in New Jersey.
So they'd have these countytryouts and the coach of our
(28:33):
county tri, like tryout was the,the seed hall varsity head
coach.
So I go there and then like hesees me, gets to meet me in
person, you know, I'm the best,best player on that county team.
And so that it became like a nobrainer that he was like, I
don't understand what's going onhere, but come one, come all
happy to Right.
Pick you on.
Yeah.
And so I, you know, I'm forevergrateful for, for him to do that
(28:55):
to, you know, to see in me likea, another coach could have been
like, oh, you're a problem.
You're this, you're that.
But, but he took me at facevalue from the tryout, from the
in, you know, the conversationsthat we had and then you know,
had a, a crazy experience at, atc Hall, like I got there.
And they, they weren't very goodat that point, right?
When you first got there?
(29:15):
No, it's, so the, the weirdthing was they had some
tradition at the school and notas much as I thought there was
more tradition.
'cause it had some programs inthe past.
Coach Deco was coached them to astate championship in 2004.
So I knew there was sometradition.
I knew they had division oneplayers.
But when I got there, like wehad won in the off season in the
(29:38):
winter tournament and you know,I, I was a part of that.
I was, you know, guys started tolearn about me, what am I
bringing to the table?
I'm building relationships withthese guys.
Then the season starts and wejust, we are two and eight
because I have to sit out forthe first 10 games of the season
'cause of transfer.
Oh really?
Yeah.
Transfer rule.
(29:59):
Yeah.
And, and so I'm sitting thereand I'm like, I can't believe I
just transferred to this schooland I had a better record at
Columbia with a bunch of kidswho just we're just playing
lacrosse.
You know, granted, like,honestly, the schedules weren't
that much different either.
And, but we had talent.
So I was like, okay, again, Igotta figure out what, what can
I do to make an impact, apositive impact.
(30:21):
I gotta make the most of this.
And then I started playing andlike, honestly, they just needed
someone to, to reel it in alittle bit and be the
quarterback.
And I, that speaks to like howimportant that.
That role really is, and theyjust happen to not really have
that on the team.
Mm-hmm.
And so it kind of just workedout with some synergy there that
I came in, I slotted in, youknow, first game we win and
(30:43):
like, everyone's like, wow.
Like that felt so muchdifferent.
And then all of a sudden we, wego on this 10 game winning
streak.
We, we beat Del Barr in theirranked number one in the country
by inside lacrosse.
Wow.
Won the county championship.
We lost in the finals to DonBosco.
Incredible.
Don Bosco.
Oh man.
Yeah.
But it was kind of a Cinderellastory thing where we went from
two and eight to 11 and nine,like didn't lose until the state
(31:05):
championship.
And Wow.
The following year the coach islike, Hey, like you're a captain
now.
Which like, you know, I was atransfer.
No one knew who I was.
I didn't play.
And then all of a sudden I'm acaptain.
So it's again, speaks to likehim as a, just as a coach, as a
man for giving me thatopportunity.
I would not be here if he didn'tdo that.
And that was, that was just howit worked out.
So really.
(31:25):
It always felt like I had a lotof belief in myself.
But my circumstances justweren't really the best for me
and for all intents andpurposes.
But I didn't ever let that like,define my experience.
Like I was always like, what canI do to control and do the best
I can?
Whether it was on the freshmanteam, whether it's on sophomore
where the coach doesn't evenwant me to be there, I'm on an a
(31:46):
team that's two and eight.
Like I was always just kind oftrying to write my own story and
eventually, you know, the storystarted to to work out for me.
That's great.
Good stuff.
And, and a little bit of thatresearch that came up that you
weren't a ranked recruit.
I guess the way things were doneat that stage, Ron and I, there
was wasn't much of a ranking.
People might have had somerumors, but there was, there was
(32:07):
nothing published.
But then you go into their r torts, Jay would've had himself
high in the rankings.
Oh yeah.
Just so you know.
He would've, the rumor wa therumor was I was very high in
ranking actually.
That's great.
That's, that's all he wanted tosay, Jules.
That's why you brought thatwhole thing up as long as you
earned it, Jay, you know,that's, that's what I respect.
Exactly, Jules.
Lots of hard work.
(32:28):
But you know, there you are atSeton Hall, you become a leader
there.
And then same thing at Rutgers,you're a two time captain, so by
the time you're a junior, you'reone of the leaders on the team.
And then by the time you're asenior, you're one of the best
attacker in the whole country.
So just awesome stuff there.
So tell us, tell us about thatjourney there at Rutgers with
the Scarlet Knights.
MacBook Pro Microphone-2 (32:49):
Uh, yes.
What a journey it was.
To hear all about it.
That is how Jules Denberg,metaphorically speaking, wrote a
powerful steed, dressed as ascarlet night onto victory.
Tune in next week, my friends.
Until we meet again.
Here's to hoping you find thetwine.
(33:11):
We're signing off here at theget the lax scoop.
Thanks again so much.
We will see you the next time.
Popular Podcasts
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com
Amy Robach & T.J. Holmes present: Aubrey O’Day, Covering the Diddy Trial
Introducing… Aubrey O’Day Diddy’s former protege, television personality, platinum selling music artist, Danity Kane alum Aubrey O’Day joins veteran journalists Amy Robach and TJ Holmes to provide a unique perspective on the trial that has captivated the attention of the nation. Join them throughout the trial as they discuss, debate, and dissect every detail, every aspect of the proceedings. Aubrey will offer her opinions and expertise, as only she is qualified to do given her first-hand knowledge. From her days on Making the Band, as she emerged as the breakout star, the truth of the situation would be the opposite of the glitz and glamour. Listen throughout every minute of the trial, for this exclusive coverage. Amy Robach and TJ Holmes present Aubrey O’Day, Covering the Diddy Trial, an iHeartRadio podcast.
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.