September 16, 2025 • 29 mins
Why do we do hard things?
In this episode, I break down why discomfort matters and what it does for us in everyday life. Hard is relative—what challenges me may not challenge you, but both deserve respect. We’ll explore how hard things build patience, shape confidence, and inspire those around us. I share stories from my own life—battling fatigue, pushing through burnout, qualifying for Boston—and how those experiences prove that adversity is the most honest teacher.
You’ll hear about:
- Why confidence comes from keeping promises to yourself
- How training in discomfort helps with patience, presence, and resilience
- Why grace and progression matter more than perfection
- How your hard things ripple out to inspire others
- A simple “Discomfort Toolkit” you can use this week
Hard things forge your character. Not in theory, but in practice. And the challenge for you: over the next 7 days, stop fearing the hard. Don’t focus on the effort—focus on the outcome.
Keep Getting After It.
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I hope today’s episode sparked something within you to pursue your dreams and unlock your true potential. If you found value in it, consider sharing it with someone who might need that same push.
Getting After It is for those who. want to silence their self-doubt. Refuse to be owned by comfort. Understand their limits are man-made and breakable. We live in a time of constant comparison. Social media drowns us in highlight reels and overnight success stories. But what most people don’t see is the grit behind it all. The reps. The quiet mornings. The sacrifices. The failures.
You are just getting started. Keep Getting After It.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Welcome back to the getting after a podcast.
My friends, happy to have youhere today.
It always means a lot to methat you come and listen to what
I have to say.
I'm hoping some of the things Isay help out and allow you to
make some changes in your life,to to get you one step closer to
your goals, because that'sthat's ultimately what our our
end goal is here is justcontinuous improvement and the
(00:24):
face of diversity and everythingelse like that.
So, with that in mind, today'stopic is going to be very
focused on why we do hard things.
That's something I feel likemany of us talk about is hey,
you know what it's important todo hard things, but until we
actually explore why it'simportant to do hard things, I
think it just becomes somethingthat is easier said than done,
(00:49):
um, and it becomes almost like a, a mantra, in a sense,
something that you would put ona t-shirt.
You know, do hard things, butwhy do we do them?
Um, I have been experimentingwith hard things over the past
few years and I think I havesome answers for you, and the
first and foremost is that hardthings matter because they teach
(01:11):
you.
They're great teachers.
That's something I've beenreminded, this week my body has
been feeling wrecked.
I've been changing my hormonesup with some new medicines.
I've been constantly fatigued,and even the simple stuff that I
do feels heavy.
Now, at the gym, my workoutsaren't what they were the week
before.
(01:31):
At work, sometimes I'm fightingto keep my eyes open, like I'll
have to stand up, walk aroundand then sit back down and keep
on going.
So it's been difficult for me.
It isn't easy.
But here's the thing is, Idon't want to be defined by how
I feel.
I want to be defined by how Irespond, because there's a lot
of things that happen to us inour lives that aren't going to
(01:53):
be ideal and they're not goingto be comfortable.
They're not going to be easy.
You should want to be someonewho, when presented a challenge,
looks at it as an opportunityto test yourself, to see if you
can push yourself a little bitfurther, to get through it, to
maintain a positive attitude andbecome better on the other side
.
And it's, like I said, easiersaid than done.
(02:15):
But it takes practice, and thatpractice, um leads to growth,
um.
So doing hard things will lookdifferent depending on the
season of life.
That's one thing I've.
I've learned as well is that wewill go through seasons and
hard will be, relative um towhat it could have been in the
(02:36):
past or whatever it might be.
But right now my heart islighter.
Workouts and just showing up atmy desk when I'm running an
ultra marathon, it's testingmental fortitude over those long
miles.
One day, as a parent, my heartmight look like what the bare
minimum feels like right now,but in that moment it could be
(02:57):
my best.
Like it's hard to say, you know.
And one of the Stoics, seneca.
He says we suffer more often inour imagination than in reality
.
And when you do something hard,you face reality.
You discover what you can carrytoday and you realize that
adversity, though uncomfortable,might be the most honest
(03:18):
teacher you'll ever have.
That's been my experience.
The reason I doultramarathonsons.
It's not because I want to runsome crazy distance.
It's not because I want to, youknow, show people that I can
run ultra marathons.
None of that stuff, really.
Why I run ultra marathons isbecause I am taught during those
(03:39):
times, because everything in mybody, everything in my mind, is
telling me to stop.
But I know that I can pushthrough and it's just a mental
barrier I have to get through.
I have to tell myself, hey, I'mstrong enough to get through
this.
And usually in the end you knowthat run is going to test me
throughout the entire race.
I'm going to be tripping, I'llbe stumbling around, I'll be
(04:02):
exhausted, my body will startaching, it's gonna be hard to
get food down, but all thesethings that are hard about an
ultra marathon, staying on yourfeet for multiple hours um, they
all teach you about yourself.
And for me, I want to learn hey, what is my limit?
What?
Where am I going to?
(04:23):
Um, find that we're going tofind that gap in my limits where
I finally reach that.
And, hey, I have to be honestwith myself and I have to be
humble and say, hey, this was it, this is as much as I could do.
I haven't found that yet and Iplan on doing that, I plan on
trying to find that end.
(04:44):
But I want to start by talkingabout what hard really means.
First and foremost, hard isrelative.
What is difficult for you mightnot be difficult for someone
else, and vice versa.
For me, right now, one of thehardest things isn't running
miles or lifting weights, it'strying to stay present.
There's a lot happening in mylife right now and when my head
(05:05):
gets pulled into five differentdirections, being here in this
moment becomes a challenge ofits own.
That's a hard that I've had todeal with recently, and I see it
in people I coach and thefriends around me too.
We tend to think hard has to beextreme.
You know, think ultra marathons, marathons in general, heavy
(05:27):
lifts, new habits but sometimesthe hardest thing is patience.
You're dieting for a week andthe scale doesn't budge.
You're two weeks into amarathon plan and it feels
impossible.
You're trying to build a habitbut nothing sticks the way you
want it to.
Do you quit or do you keepgoing?
And all those things?
(05:47):
You know they're going to bedifficult.
Like if you're dieting, that'sobviously going to be hard.
You're in a caloric restriction.
If you're trying to build somekind of habit, that's going to
be requiring new behaviors andnew, new trials.
And if you're running a marathon, that prep takes weeks, not
days, and so patience is is oneantidote that gets you through
hard things, and it's aattribute that I've tried
(06:10):
refining over the years.
I've tried really putting myhead down and figuring out how I
can be patient in as many waysas possible but really hard
things asks that question everyday.
Do you quit or do you keepgoing?
And the answer is always thesame for me, and it's
consistency over results.
(06:31):
Consistency is built onthousands of small actions that
no one applauds, that no onesees, no one's cheering you on
for, and you don't get thefinish line on day one.
You earn it slowly, brick bybrick.
It's tough, but I've alsolearned that sometimes we
(06:51):
mistake hard for too much.
I've hit burnout before, notjust once, but plenty of times,
like it's happened many times inmy life.
The key isn't quitting or isn'tto quit, but to scale, like,
look at what's causing the moststress and cut, cut it back.
That takes honesty and almostevery time it takes humility.
(07:12):
And so I'm not trying to justdissuade you from going out and
trying hard things, and if yougo and do it and you feel like
it's too much, I don't want youto give up.
What I want you to do is take astep back and say, okay, this
is obviously too much for meright now.
It takes that humility piece.
Where can I scale back?
(07:33):
What can I do to make it alittle bit more, a little bit
more sustainable for where I'mat right now, and it's just a
question that you know you'llhave to determine from your own.
But that's what hard is, andwhatever's standing in your way,
that's your path.
And one of my favorite quotesfrom Marcus Aurelius.
He says the impediment toaction advances action.
(07:56):
This is what I want you toremember, this part right here
what stands in the way becomesthe way.
What stands in the way, whatchallenges in your way.
Once you decide that that'swhat you're going to go after,
that is the way that you need togo.
You need to fight thatchallenge head on.
You need to push yourself, youneed to be the best version of
you that you can be as you gothrough this challenge, these
(08:19):
difficulties, and when you dothat, you'll build a lot of
confidence in yourself, andthat's what I want to talk about
.
Next is the confidence thatcomes from doing hard things,
but also the confidence thatcomes from keeping promises to
yourself, mainly becauseconfidence is not built in front
(08:40):
of a crowd like.
The reason why Michael Jordanwas so loved and so appraised
was because of all the work thathe did behind the scenes.
So when game day came, he wasready to go, and that's such a
good example for what I'm tryingto get out here is confidence
is not built in front of thecrowd.
Michael Jordan was MichaelJordan because he knew that he
(09:01):
would make the game, winningshots, because he practiced
nonstop.
And uh, it's built by thepromises that you make to
yourself and then keep.
For me, one of those promiseshas always been to be honest
with myself and with others, andnot just when it's convenient
but when it's hard.
Being honest when it's hard isvery difficult to do and I'm
(09:22):
sure there's been times whereyou've had conversations with
other people where you had to behonest with them and you felt
that little.
You know the nervous jittersgoing into that thing, but I'm
sure the truth wasn'tcomfortable for you to get
across, but I'm sure it wasreceived and hopefully it paid
(09:43):
off.
But that'll allow more peopleto trust you and, more
importantly, you start trustingyourself.
And I love the quote fromJordan Peterson.
I don't remember exactly how hesays it, let me.
Let me try and do a quicksearch right here.
I wish I had a Jamie, you know,but basically, here it is.
(10:11):
Jordan Peterson encouragespeople to not lie to themselves
as a form of radicalself-honesty, and this is kind
of interesting.
I found a couple things here.
But why you should not lie toyourself.
This is a list from Google.
I kind of like this, but itcorrodes your identity and
character.
Lying to yourself, even insmall ways, weakens your
integrity and can transform youinto someone you despise.
Oof, you definitely don't wantto be that.
(10:34):
Two distorts reality.
Habitual lies create a falsereality like a map that leads to
nowhere, causing you to becomedisoriented and lost in life.
I can also see that being trueBecomes a habitual delusion.
The more you lie, the more youinhabit that falsehood, making
the truth difficult to see andleading to despair.
It's kind of interesting.
So what I would say to that isjust be brave, be honest with
(10:55):
yourself.
And I've gained a lot ofconfidence from being honest
with myself and with otherpeople, because one I know that
people trust me, because when Isay I'm going to do something, I
(11:16):
usually get it done.
When I say I was going to, ifsomeone needs me there, I'll go.
Whatever it is like, stay trueto your word.
That's all you have.
Your word is your bond andstart being.
Your word is your bond andstart being.
Start being true to that.
But one thing um, it's kind ofinteresting, it's.
It's on a different topic here,but I I know the other side too
(11:41):
.
So not lying to yourself,that's very important.
But I have in the past lied tomyself.
I know that side too.
For years I thought it was aquitter and I'd give up when
things got hard.
And every time I quit I chippedaway at my own trust.
The way I repaired that wasn'tby suddenly becoming perfect.
(12:01):
These changes do not happenovernight, and that's why
consistency is something I harpon so much, because I've seen
the benefits of my life and Iknow what it can do for you too.
But the reason I was able togain that trust back was by
finishing the things I said Iwas going to start, even if I
was slow, even if it wasn't mybest, even if the outcome wasn't
what I wanted.
(12:22):
But just finishing provedsomething to myself.
It told me hey, you can keepgoing and you don't have to quit
.
And I love going back to havingDJ take two on the podcast.
That's one thing that.
Check it out, I got a hammer.
That's one thing that he reallymade adamant was.
(12:43):
He said your pace, your race,and he told a story about that.
But basically no, it's yourrace, your pace.
I'm sorry I flipped those, butyour race, your pace, meaning
this is your race, this is yourthing, this is your challenge.
So your pace it's going to beunique too.
And you shouldn't be sad ifyou're not hitting your goals
when you, when you expected themto.
(13:04):
Just don't quit, just stay inthe fight and readjust if you
don't make it.
When, when?
If you have a goal set for,let's say, december 1st, and
that's when you want to havewhatever goal, it is done by.
But December 1st comes andyou're halfway done, readjust.
Just don't throw in the towelBecause, who knows, you could be
50% done and you just wasted50% of work.
(13:27):
Like, don't allow yourself toquit if there's an opportunity
to continue.
And now my non-negotiable is tobe brutally honest with myself.
It's to cut the excuses, it'sto admit when I fall short, but
still keep moving forward.
Because here's the truth thatI've come to understand is that
(13:49):
confidence isn't a feeling, it'sevidence.
And it goes back to that AlexHormozy quote that I absolutely
love it's you do not.
You do not gainself-affirmation from shouting
no, that's it.
Okay, let me back up.
You don't gain confidence fromshouting affirmations in the
mirror.
You gain confidence frombuilding an undeniable stack of
proof that you are who you sayyou are, and so confidence is
(14:13):
not a feeling.
It is evidence, evidence thatyou've kept promises that you've
made.
And every small promise kept isa brick, and over time those
bricks become a foundation youcan stand on no matter what
comes next.
I want to talk about somethingelse that's very interesting.
When we discuss doing hardthings and why we do them and
(14:34):
this is more the everydaypayoffs that you can see from
doing hard things Becausetraining hard for forces you to
be patient those grueling,difficult workouts where every
part of you wants to stop that'swhere you learn how to endure,
and endurance is really justpatience with discomfort.
In those moments, you alwayshave a choice you give up or you
(14:56):
keep going.
If you choose to keep going,then you're choosing patience,
and that practice carries over.
Really in everyday life, whenthings don't go the way that I
expect at work or at home, I'mnot rattled like I used to be.
I can sit with it, and traininghas taught me that, as odd as
that might seem, but it's thatenduring aspect of training that
(15:21):
I can now apply to other areasof my life.
I can't pin um pinpoint like anexact moment, but I know
training makes me less reactive.
There's this pause, a small gapthat opens up, where I have
time to think Instead ofsnapping or rushing.
I take a breath, I think beforeI act.
I owe that gap to the time I'vespent in discomfort.
(15:44):
The only way that I've beenable to handle the things that
come my way in life and at workand everything, is because I am
in the face of discomfort everyday, doing something difficult
that requires a lot of energyand effort.
Choosing patience when it wouldhave been easier to quit also
(16:09):
gets me through that difficulttimes.
Even simple habits carry some ofthe weight, and for me, being
present is one of the hardest.
Like.
It demands attention, itdemands you to listen, it
demands you to notice the peopleand the moments right in front
of you, and if you miss themthey're gone.
And training in presence isjust like training in the gym.
It's a rep, hard in its own way, but it pays off more than
(16:32):
almost anything else.
That's what my experience hasbeen, bringing back a little bit
of stoicism for you.
Epictetus.
He says that no great thing iscreated suddenly.
No great thing is createdsuddenly.
That's true for marathons, it'strue for muscles, but it's also
true for patience, presence andthe way you live every single
(16:55):
day.
So think about that If you'retrying to make some changes in
your life.
No great thing is createdsuddenly.
It's going to take time, it'sgoing to take effort and it's
going to take patience.
You're in control.
You're in control Along thejourney of doing hard things.
(17:19):
There needs to be a emphasis onboth grace but also progression,
and I've always been someonewho does not open up very well
about his emotions.
Like some people find itnatural to share what they're
feeling, and for me it's almostlike a brain freeze.
I just don't know how to.
I don't know how to dictate itand tell you exactly how I'm
feeling.
My words get stuck.
I've improved over time, buteven now it still feels like I'm
(17:41):
climbing uphill.
Every time I need to express myemotions or tell Allie how I'm
feeling, because if you'remarried, your spouse needs to
know how you're feeling, and forme that's been hard to get
across the line a little bit,and that's my heart, but it
deserves respect just as much asthe miles I put on the road or
on the trails.
Like that is effort, but so islearning to open up.
(18:05):
And that's the thing is, yourheart doesn't have to look like
mine, and in fact it shouldn't.
What feels overwhelming to youmight be effortless for someone
else, and that's okay.
I want you to remember thatcomparison will rob you of your
progress.
Comparison is the thief of joy,and once we start comparing
ourselves to other people, wedon't know what their situations
(18:28):
are.
We only see their highlights.
That becomes a mental, a mentalgame for yourself, really, and
you have to learn how to bestrong in those moments.
You have to Learn that, hey,this person's hard might not be
mine, but that's okay.
Um, just do not compareyourself to others along your
(18:48):
own personal journey.
This is your journey.
There's no one else to compareto.
You can look to people forinspiration, and I think that's
a good way to use comparison.
Or like, hey, I love what thatguy's life looks like.
I want to try and emulate thatin my own.
That's fine, that's a good formof progression or of comparison
.
But if you're sitting therethinking man, nick Bear just
(19:11):
runs the fastest miles, I'llnever be anything like him.
He's way above me.
You'll fall into a dark, darkplace Like don't allow yourself
to get that to that point,because there are times when the
goals feel so heavy and inthose moments grace keeps you
consistent.
It has for me Because, again,quitting should not be an option
(19:33):
, but scaling back is that is anoption.
Pulling back is not a weakness.
In fact, sometimes I think itshows that you're wise, you have
wisdom, and it's a strength.
It gives you perspective, andwhat feels impossible today
might be manageable tomorrow,and what stops you now doesn't
(19:53):
have to stop you later.
So my rule for scaling ispretty simple.
It's just always step outsideyour comfort zone.
Push when you can slow downwhen you need to and readjust
when the moment calls for it,but never stop stepping forward.
Never stop that motion.
Keep that momentum going.
(20:15):
Grace doesn't weaken discipline.
I recorded an episode aboutthis, I think about three
episodes ago.
But grace does not weakendiscipline.
In fact, I think it strengthensit, because grace is what
allows you to keep showing uplong after perfection would have
made you quit.
Grace is what allows you tokeep showing up long after
perfection would have made youquit.
We're not perfect.
We're all human beings.
Human beings are flawed, and soyou cannot expect yourself to
(20:37):
be perfect in every sense of theword, especially when you're
training, especially when you'reworking towards goals.
That's not fair to you, it'snot fair to the people that
you're around, because you mightbe a pretty angry man or woman,
but never stop stepping forward.
That grace will not weaken yourdiscipline.
It'll allow it to be moreconsistent and more sustainable.
(21:01):
Something else that'sinteresting about doing hard
things is that hard thingsaren't just about us.
They ripple outward in a sense,and my brother is living proof.
He's a man I've looked up to myentire life, drew, and he told
me that my example helped himmake a change, and two and a
half years ago he was notrunning and in fact swore it off
(21:22):
.
He said I would never run again.
And now he's logging 40 plusmile weeks, he's training for
ultra marathons, and to hear himsay that my effort sparked
something in him, that was oneof the greatest honors of my
life.
Because you don't know the smallthings that or you don't know
the things that you do whichcould inspire someone else, and
that's the power of doing hardthings.
(21:43):
People watch and sometimes,when you're not even knowing it,
your struggle gives thempermission to begin, because
they see that you're out thereworking hard and they say, hey,
maybe maybe I can do that too,and you were where they were
once.
So I would say keep pushing.
And when I think about myfuture kids or my nieces and
(22:05):
nephews, that's what I hope theylearn from me that they're
capable of greatness.
That's a common theme in thispodcast is that you are capable
of doing great things and thatadversity isn't something to run
from, it's something to facehead on, even when that is scary
, that fear will knock.
But you don't have to back down.
You can do great things If youhold your head high, you set a
(22:28):
vision for yourself, you make aplan, you adjust when you need
to and, above all, you stayconsistent.
That's where real growthhappens.
And when it comes to encouragingothers, the key is love.
Like if it comes from a placeof love, it's not shameful.
Like, if you have someone inyour life who you'd love to
start seeing working out, do itfrom a place of love.
Say, hey, listen, I care aboutyou, I want you to be around for
(22:50):
a long time.
Maybe you could start walking.
Like just trying to encouragethem that way.
Just try and tell them that thereason you push someone to take
on something hard is becauseyou care about them.
Show them that care, invitethem to walk with you, and not
by making them feel small, butby showing them that they're
capable of doing more.
(23:13):
And there's this great quotefrom Albert Schweitzer, and he
says Example is not the mainthing in influencing others.
It is the only thing.
Example is the only thing thatwill influence others.
And as I think about my futurefamily, as I think about my wife
, I think about my other familymembers, my friends.
(23:35):
I want to set a good example tothem, because I want them to
understand that doing hardthings can change your life for
the better.
It's only by doing them thatyou'll understand that.
It's only by putting yourselfin uncomfortable situations, by
walking out of your comfort zoneand looking adversity in the
face and saying you know, I knowyou're there, but I'm not
(23:58):
worried about you.
That is what will keep yougoing, that's what will inspire
other people.
And so we've talked a lot aboutthe why.
But how do you actually practicedoing hard things without
actually burning out?
And here's a simple framework.
You can call it a toolkit fordiscomfort First you want to
start where you are.
Don can call it a toolkit fordiscomfort.
First, you want to start whereyou are.
(24:19):
Don't overdo it in thebeginning.
That's where people faceburnout almost immediately.
That's the fastest way to do it.
Pick something hard, but makeit your version, and maybe
that's running a mile, maybethat's showing up to the gym
twice a week, maybe it's havingone honest, hard conversation.
Start small, but start Getmoving.
(24:40):
Get going.
Number two is scale with time.
Think of it as a ladder V1 toV4.
These are your prototypes.
You don't climb all the rungsat once.
You move step by step and alittle more stress each time, a
little more weight, a littlemore honesty, a little more
honesty, a little more patience.
And that's how you grow withoutbreaking.
You just continue to push thatdiscomfort and you continue to
(25:04):
master these challenges that youset for yourself and then set
your sights on another one.
Step three is use your fallback.
Life gets chaotic.
You won't always have hours tofocus and for me, when things
feel overwhelming, I take 10 or20 minutes and I lie down, I
cover my eyes with something andI just breathe Calm first, then
(25:27):
clarity, and when I get back upI'm steady, I know I can handle
what's in front of me, and sofind something that allows you
to kind of decompress, and forme, it's that little moment
where I have 10 to 20 minutes ofjust laying there, thinking to
be alone with my thoughts, toturn my phone off and just sit
there and think about what'sgoing on in my life.
Step four is reflect, which isequally as important as all the
(25:51):
other ones, and for me,journaling has been my anchor.
It's where I get to processwhat's working, what isn't, and
how I'm growing.
And for me, journaling has beenmy anchor.
It's where I get a processwhat's working, what isn't, and
how I'm growing.
And, honestly, prayer because Ibring God into it daily.
I know I'm not carrying theweight alone.
When things go wrong, he getsme through.
Reflection is what transformsdoing hard things into becoming
(26:14):
someone stronger.
And for me, I include God inevery day because there's
strength that comes from theAlmighty and there's strength
that comes from praying and justmeditating, thinking about what
you're worried about, thinkingabout what is top of mind for
you and just figuring out how totake one more step forward.
(26:44):
The man who moves a mountainbegins by carrying small stones
a quote from Confucius.
And that's what this toolkit isSmall stones, carrying them
daily and over time, themountain will move.
You'll see that you really will.
Hard things forge yourcharacter, and not in theory,
not in imagination, but in thereality of effort.
(27:04):
So I wanted to come up withsome kind of challenge for the
next seven days.
I want you to really try andimplement this into your life,
and it's learn to not fear hardthings.
Don't obsess over all the work.
Put your eyes on the outcome.
Let the discomfort come andwalk through it anyway, because
(27:28):
the hard things you choose todaywill shape who you become
tomorrow.
I've seen that so many times inmy life and I know that you can
see that in your own Because,honestly, it takes a lot of work
and it takes a lot of patience.
It takes many times to sit therewith your thoughts and to not
(27:49):
allow them to dictate if you'regoing to give up or not.
Instead, you need to learn howto figure out how to live with
discomfort, how to push it justa little bit further and to not
let it control your life.
And once you figure out that,you'll have a lot of power,
because hard things will teachyou how to become better, it'll
refine you, it'll refine yourcharacter and it'll inspire
(28:11):
others to take some chances onthemselves.
The reason why David Goggins isso inspirational is because he
does things that no sane personwould do, and the fact that he's
out there doing that muchallows some people to say, well,
if he's doing that, I canprobably do five miles.
He just ran a 200-mile race.
I can probably do five.
(28:31):
It's things like that.
That's the example that youcould set for someone else, and
it's through that consistency.
It's things like that.
That's the example that youcould set for someone else, and
it's through that consistency,it's through that discomfort,
and in the end you'll becomebetter.
I've seen that in my own lifemany times over.
Every time I go after somethingdifficult and I get through it,
I always remember there's somany lessons to learn, and I
(28:54):
have podcast episodes aboutpretty much after every race
I've done.
I have one for my Bostonmarathon qualifier, I have one
for my ultra marathon, I haveone for team Tim and all those
races.
Um, they teach you things aboutyourself that are hard to
explain, uh, but I tried my bestin those podcasts episodes.
So if you're interested at all,um, you can check those ones
out too.
But that's really it, guys, it'shard.
(29:16):
Things take patience.
It takes practice andeventually you'll become someone
who is forged in adversity, whounderstands discomfort, who is
friends with discomfort, whoknows how to have that
conversation.
And life will become better.
I can guarantee it.
But you have to start.
Start small, but start.
I appreciate you guys forlistening to this episode.
(29:38):
If it helped at all, pleaseleave a like, a comment or rate
the show on Apple Podcasts orSpotify.
It always helps and until nextepisode, everybody keep getting
up for it.
Thanks, guys.
Welcome back to the getting after a podcast.
My friends, happy to have youhere today.
It always means a lot to methat you come and listen to what
I have to say.
I'm hoping some of the things Isay help out and allow you to
make some changes in your life,to to get you one step closer to
your goals, because that'sthat's ultimately what our our
end goal is here is justcontinuous improvement and the
(00:24):
face of diversity and everythingelse like that.
So, with that in mind, today'stopic is going to be very
focused on why we do hard things.
That's something I feel likemany of us talk about is hey,
you know what it's important todo hard things, but until we
actually explore why it'simportant to do hard things, I
think it just becomes somethingthat is easier said than done,
(00:49):
um, and it becomes almost like a, a mantra, in a sense,
something that you would put ona t-shirt.
You know, do hard things, butwhy do we do them?
Um, I have been experimentingwith hard things over the past
few years and I think I havesome answers for you, and the
first and foremost is that hardthings matter because they teach
(01:11):
you.
They're great teachers.
That's something I've beenreminded, this week my body has
been feeling wrecked.
I've been changing my hormonesup with some new medicines.
I've been constantly fatigued,and even the simple stuff that I
do feels heavy.
Now, at the gym, my workoutsaren't what they were the week
before.
(01:31):
At work, sometimes I'm fightingto keep my eyes open, like I'll
have to stand up, walk aroundand then sit back down and keep
on going.
So it's been difficult for me.
It isn't easy.
But here's the thing is, Idon't want to be defined by how
I feel.
I want to be defined by how Irespond, because there's a lot
of things that happen to us inour lives that aren't going to
(01:53):
be ideal and they're not goingto be comfortable.
They're not going to be easy.
You should want to be someonewho, when presented a challenge,
looks at it as an opportunityto test yourself, to see if you
can push yourself a little bitfurther, to get through it, to
maintain a positive attitude andbecome better on the other side
.
And it's, like I said, easiersaid than done.
(02:15):
But it takes practice, and thatpractice, um leads to growth,
um.
So doing hard things will lookdifferent depending on the
season of life.
That's one thing I've.
I've learned as well is that wewill go through seasons and
hard will be, relative um towhat it could have been in the
(02:36):
past or whatever it might be.
But right now my heart islighter.
Workouts and just showing up atmy desk when I'm running an
ultra marathon, it's testingmental fortitude over those long
miles.
One day, as a parent, my heartmight look like what the bare
minimum feels like right now,but in that moment it could be
(02:57):
my best.
Like it's hard to say, you know.
And one of the Stoics, seneca.
He says we suffer more often inour imagination than in reality
.
And when you do something hard,you face reality.
You discover what you can carrytoday and you realize that
adversity, though uncomfortable,might be the most honest
(03:18):
teacher you'll ever have.
That's been my experience.
The reason I doultramarathonsons.
It's not because I want to runsome crazy distance.
It's not because I want to, youknow, show people that I can
run ultra marathons.
None of that stuff, really.
Why I run ultra marathons isbecause I am taught during those
(03:39):
times, because everything in mybody, everything in my mind, is
telling me to stop.
But I know that I can pushthrough and it's just a mental
barrier I have to get through.
I have to tell myself, hey, I'mstrong enough to get through
this.
And usually in the end you knowthat run is going to test me
throughout the entire race.
I'm going to be tripping, I'llbe stumbling around, I'll be
(04:02):
exhausted, my body will startaching, it's gonna be hard to
get food down, but all thesethings that are hard about an
ultra marathon, staying on yourfeet for multiple hours um, they
all teach you about yourself.
And for me, I want to learn hey, what is my limit?
What?
Where am I going to?
(04:23):
Um, find that we're going tofind that gap in my limits where
I finally reach that.
And, hey, I have to be honestwith myself and I have to be
humble and say, hey, this was it, this is as much as I could do.
I haven't found that yet and Iplan on doing that, I plan on
trying to find that end.
(04:44):
But I want to start by talkingabout what hard really means.
First and foremost, hard isrelative.
What is difficult for you mightnot be difficult for someone
else, and vice versa.
For me, right now, one of thehardest things isn't running
miles or lifting weights, it'strying to stay present.
There's a lot happening in mylife right now and when my head
(05:05):
gets pulled into five differentdirections, being here in this
moment becomes a challenge ofits own.
That's a hard that I've had todeal with recently, and I see it
in people I coach and thefriends around me too.
We tend to think hard has to beextreme.
You know, think ultra marathons, marathons in general, heavy
(05:27):
lifts, new habits but sometimesthe hardest thing is patience.
You're dieting for a week andthe scale doesn't budge.
You're two weeks into amarathon plan and it feels
impossible.
You're trying to build a habitbut nothing sticks the way you
want it to.
Do you quit or do you keepgoing?
And all those things?
(05:47):
You know they're going to bedifficult.
Like if you're dieting, that'sobviously going to be hard.
You're in a caloric restriction.
If you're trying to build somekind of habit, that's going to
be requiring new behaviors andnew, new trials.
And if you're running a marathon, that prep takes weeks, not
days, and so patience is is oneantidote that gets you through
hard things, and it's aattribute that I've tried
(06:10):
refining over the years.
I've tried really putting myhead down and figuring out how I
can be patient in as many waysas possible but really hard
things asks that question everyday.
Do you quit or do you keepgoing?
And the answer is always thesame for me, and it's
consistency over results.
(06:31):
Consistency is built onthousands of small actions that
no one applauds, that no onesees, no one's cheering you on
for, and you don't get thefinish line on day one.
You earn it slowly, brick bybrick.
It's tough, but I've alsolearned that sometimes we
(06:51):
mistake hard for too much.
I've hit burnout before, notjust once, but plenty of times,
like it's happened many times inmy life.
The key isn't quitting or isn'tto quit, but to scale, like,
look at what's causing the moststress and cut, cut it back.
That takes honesty and almostevery time it takes humility.
(07:12):
And so I'm not trying to justdissuade you from going out and
trying hard things, and if yougo and do it and you feel like
it's too much, I don't want youto give up.
What I want you to do is take astep back and say, okay, this
is obviously too much for meright now.
It takes that humility piece.
Where can I scale back?
(07:33):
What can I do to make it alittle bit more, a little bit
more sustainable for where I'mat right now, and it's just a
question that you know you'llhave to determine from your own.
But that's what hard is, andwhatever's standing in your way,
that's your path.
And one of my favorite quotesfrom Marcus Aurelius.
He says the impediment toaction advances action.
(07:56):
This is what I want you toremember, this part right here
what stands in the way becomesthe way.
What stands in the way, whatchallenges in your way.
Once you decide that that'swhat you're going to go after,
that is the way that you need togo.
You need to fight thatchallenge head on.
You need to push yourself, youneed to be the best version of
you that you can be as you gothrough this challenge, these
(08:19):
difficulties, and when you dothat, you'll build a lot of
confidence in yourself, andthat's what I want to talk about
.
Next is the confidence thatcomes from doing hard things,
but also the confidence thatcomes from keeping promises to
yourself, mainly becauseconfidence is not built in front
(08:40):
of a crowd like.
The reason why Michael Jordanwas so loved and so appraised
was because of all the work thathe did behind the scenes.
So when game day came, he wasready to go, and that's such a
good example for what I'm tryingto get out here is confidence
is not built in front of thecrowd.
Michael Jordan was MichaelJordan because he knew that he
(09:01):
would make the game, winningshots, because he practiced
nonstop.
And uh, it's built by thepromises that you make to
yourself and then keep.
For me, one of those promiseshas always been to be honest
with myself and with others, andnot just when it's convenient
but when it's hard.
Being honest when it's hard isvery difficult to do and I'm
(09:22):
sure there's been times whereyou've had conversations with
other people where you had to behonest with them and you felt
that little.
You know the nervous jittersgoing into that thing, but I'm
sure the truth wasn'tcomfortable for you to get
across, but I'm sure it wasreceived and hopefully it paid
(09:43):
off.
But that'll allow more peopleto trust you and, more
importantly, you start trustingyourself.
And I love the quote fromJordan Peterson.
I don't remember exactly how hesays it, let me.
Let me try and do a quicksearch right here.
I wish I had a Jamie, you know,but basically, here it is.
(10:11):
Jordan Peterson encouragespeople to not lie to themselves
as a form of radicalself-honesty, and this is kind
of interesting.
I found a couple things here.
But why you should not lie toyourself.
This is a list from Google.
I kind of like this, but itcorrodes your identity and
character.
Lying to yourself, even insmall ways, weakens your
integrity and can transform youinto someone you despise.
Oof, you definitely don't wantto be that.
(10:34):
Two distorts reality.
Habitual lies create a falsereality like a map that leads to
nowhere, causing you to becomedisoriented and lost in life.
I can also see that being trueBecomes a habitual delusion.
The more you lie, the more youinhabit that falsehood, making
the truth difficult to see andleading to despair.
It's kind of interesting.
So what I would say to that isjust be brave, be honest with
(10:55):
yourself.
And I've gained a lot ofconfidence from being honest
with myself and with otherpeople, because one I know that
people trust me, because when Isay I'm going to do something, I
(11:16):
usually get it done.
When I say I was going to, ifsomeone needs me there, I'll go.
Whatever it is like, stay trueto your word.
That's all you have.
Your word is your bond andstart being.
Your word is your bond andstart being.
Start being true to that.
But one thing um, it's kind ofinteresting, it's.
It's on a different topic here,but I I know the other side too
(11:41):
.
So not lying to yourself,that's very important.
But I have in the past lied tomyself.
I know that side too.
For years I thought it was aquitter and I'd give up when
things got hard.
And every time I quit I chippedaway at my own trust.
The way I repaired that wasn'tby suddenly becoming perfect.
(12:01):
These changes do not happenovernight, and that's why
consistency is something I harpon so much, because I've seen
the benefits of my life and Iknow what it can do for you too.
But the reason I was able togain that trust back was by
finishing the things I said Iwas going to start, even if I
was slow, even if it wasn't mybest, even if the outcome wasn't
what I wanted.
(12:22):
But just finishing provedsomething to myself.
It told me hey, you can keepgoing and you don't have to quit
.
And I love going back to havingDJ take two on the podcast.
That's one thing that.
Check it out, I got a hammer.
That's one thing that he reallymade adamant was.
(12:43):
He said your pace, your race,and he told a story about that.
But basically no, it's yourrace, your pace.
I'm sorry I flipped those, butyour race, your pace, meaning
this is your race, this is yourthing, this is your challenge.
So your pace it's going to beunique too.
And you shouldn't be sad ifyou're not hitting your goals
when you, when you expected themto.
(13:04):
Just don't quit, just stay inthe fight and readjust if you
don't make it.
When, when?
If you have a goal set for,let's say, december 1st, and
that's when you want to havewhatever goal, it is done by.
But December 1st comes andyou're halfway done, readjust.
Just don't throw in the towelBecause, who knows, you could be
50% done and you just wasted50% of work.
(13:27):
Like, don't allow yourself toquit if there's an opportunity
to continue.
And now my non-negotiable is tobe brutally honest with myself.
It's to cut the excuses, it'sto admit when I fall short, but
still keep moving forward.
Because here's the truth thatI've come to understand is that
(13:49):
confidence isn't a feeling, it'sevidence.
And it goes back to that AlexHormozy quote that I absolutely
love it's you do not.
You do not gainself-affirmation from shouting
no, that's it.
Okay, let me back up.
You don't gain confidence fromshouting affirmations in the
mirror.
You gain confidence frombuilding an undeniable stack of
proof that you are who you sayyou are, and so confidence is
(14:13):
not a feeling.
It is evidence, evidence thatyou've kept promises that you've
made.
And every small promise kept isa brick, and over time those
bricks become a foundation youcan stand on no matter what
comes next.
I want to talk about somethingelse that's very interesting.
When we discuss doing hardthings and why we do them and
(14:34):
this is more the everydaypayoffs that you can see from
doing hard things Becausetraining hard for forces you to
be patient those grueling,difficult workouts where every
part of you wants to stop that'swhere you learn how to endure,
and endurance is really justpatience with discomfort.
In those moments, you alwayshave a choice you give up or you
(14:56):
keep going.
If you choose to keep going,then you're choosing patience,
and that practice carries over.
Really in everyday life, whenthings don't go the way that I
expect at work or at home, I'mnot rattled like I used to be.
I can sit with it, and traininghas taught me that, as odd as
that might seem, but it's thatenduring aspect of training that
(15:21):
I can now apply to other areasof my life.
I can't pin um pinpoint like anexact moment, but I know
training makes me less reactive.
There's this pause, a small gapthat opens up, where I have
time to think Instead ofsnapping or rushing.
I take a breath, I think beforeI act.
I owe that gap to the time I'vespent in discomfort.
(15:44):
The only way that I've beenable to handle the things that
come my way in life and at workand everything, is because I am
in the face of discomfort everyday, doing something difficult
that requires a lot of energyand effort.
Choosing patience when it wouldhave been easier to quit also
(16:09):
gets me through that difficulttimes.
Even simple habits carry some ofthe weight, and for me, being
present is one of the hardest.
Like.
It demands attention, itdemands you to listen, it
demands you to notice the peopleand the moments right in front
of you, and if you miss themthey're gone.
And training in presence isjust like training in the gym.
It's a rep, hard in its own way, but it pays off more than
(16:32):
almost anything else.
That's what my experience hasbeen, bringing back a little bit
of stoicism for you.
Epictetus.
He says that no great thing iscreated suddenly.
No great thing is createdsuddenly.
That's true for marathons, it'strue for muscles, but it's also
true for patience, presence andthe way you live every single
(16:55):
day.
So think about that If you'retrying to make some changes in
your life.
No great thing is createdsuddenly.
It's going to take time, it'sgoing to take effort and it's
going to take patience.
You're in control.
You're in control Along thejourney of doing hard things.
(17:19):
There needs to be a emphasis onboth grace but also progression,
and I've always been someonewho does not open up very well
about his emotions.
Like some people find itnatural to share what they're
feeling, and for me it's almostlike a brain freeze.
I just don't know how to.
I don't know how to dictate itand tell you exactly how I'm
feeling.
My words get stuck.
I've improved over time, buteven now it still feels like I'm
(17:41):
climbing uphill.
Every time I need to express myemotions or tell Allie how I'm
feeling, because if you'remarried, your spouse needs to
know how you're feeling, and forme that's been hard to get
across the line a little bit,and that's my heart, but it
deserves respect just as much asthe miles I put on the road or
on the trails.
Like that is effort, but so islearning to open up.
(18:05):
And that's the thing is, yourheart doesn't have to look like
mine, and in fact it shouldn't.
What feels overwhelming to youmight be effortless for someone
else, and that's okay.
I want you to remember thatcomparison will rob you of your
progress.
Comparison is the thief of joy,and once we start comparing
ourselves to other people, wedon't know what their situations
(18:28):
are.
We only see their highlights.
That becomes a mental, a mentalgame for yourself, really, and
you have to learn how to bestrong in those moments.
You have to Learn that, hey,this person's hard might not be
mine, but that's okay.
Um, just do not compareyourself to others along your
(18:48):
own personal journey.
This is your journey.
There's no one else to compareto.
You can look to people forinspiration, and I think that's
a good way to use comparison.
Or like, hey, I love what thatguy's life looks like.
I want to try and emulate thatin my own.
That's fine, that's a good formof progression or of comparison
.
But if you're sitting therethinking man, nick Bear just
(19:11):
runs the fastest miles, I'llnever be anything like him.
He's way above me.
You'll fall into a dark, darkplace Like don't allow yourself
to get that to that point,because there are times when the
goals feel so heavy and inthose moments grace keeps you
consistent.
It has for me Because, again,quitting should not be an option
(19:33):
, but scaling back is that is anoption.
Pulling back is not a weakness.
In fact, sometimes I think itshows that you're wise, you have
wisdom, and it's a strength.
It gives you perspective, andwhat feels impossible today
might be manageable tomorrow,and what stops you now doesn't
(19:53):
have to stop you later.
So my rule for scaling ispretty simple.
It's just always step outsideyour comfort zone.
Push when you can slow downwhen you need to and readjust
when the moment calls for it,but never stop stepping forward.
Never stop that motion.
Keep that momentum going.
(20:15):
Grace doesn't weaken discipline.
I recorded an episode aboutthis, I think about three
episodes ago.
But grace does not weakendiscipline.
In fact, I think it strengthensit, because grace is what
allows you to keep showing uplong after perfection would have
made you quit.
Grace is what allows you tokeep showing up long after
perfection would have made youquit.
We're not perfect.
We're all human beings.
Human beings are flawed, and soyou cannot expect yourself to
(20:37):
be perfect in every sense of theword, especially when you're
training, especially when you'reworking towards goals.
That's not fair to you, it'snot fair to the people that
you're around, because you mightbe a pretty angry man or woman,
but never stop stepping forward.
That grace will not weaken yourdiscipline.
It'll allow it to be moreconsistent and more sustainable.
(21:01):
Something else that'sinteresting about doing hard
things is that hard thingsaren't just about us.
They ripple outward in a sense,and my brother is living proof.
He's a man I've looked up to myentire life, drew, and he told
me that my example helped himmake a change, and two and a
half years ago he was notrunning and in fact swore it off
(21:22):
.
He said I would never run again.
And now he's logging 40 plusmile weeks, he's training for
ultra marathons, and to hear himsay that my effort sparked
something in him, that was oneof the greatest honors of my
life.
Because you don't know the smallthings that or you don't know
the things that you do whichcould inspire someone else, and
that's the power of doing hardthings.
(21:43):
People watch and sometimes,when you're not even knowing it,
your struggle gives thempermission to begin, because
they see that you're out thereworking hard and they say, hey,
maybe maybe I can do that too,and you were where they were
once.
So I would say keep pushing.
And when I think about myfuture kids or my nieces and
(22:05):
nephews, that's what I hope theylearn from me that they're
capable of greatness.
That's a common theme in thispodcast is that you are capable
of doing great things and thatadversity isn't something to run
from, it's something to facehead on, even when that is scary
, that fear will knock.
But you don't have to back down.
You can do great things If youhold your head high, you set a
(22:28):
vision for yourself, you make aplan, you adjust when you need
to and, above all, you stayconsistent.
That's where real growthhappens.
And when it comes to encouragingothers, the key is love.
Like if it comes from a placeof love, it's not shameful.
Like, if you have someone inyour life who you'd love to
start seeing working out, do itfrom a place of love.
Say, hey, listen, I care aboutyou, I want you to be around for
(22:50):
a long time.
Maybe you could start walking.
Like just trying to encouragethem that way.
Just try and tell them that thereason you push someone to take
on something hard is becauseyou care about them.
Show them that care, invitethem to walk with you, and not
by making them feel small, butby showing them that they're
capable of doing more.
(23:13):
And there's this great quotefrom Albert Schweitzer, and he
says Example is not the mainthing in influencing others.
It is the only thing.
Example is the only thing thatwill influence others.
And as I think about my futurefamily, as I think about my wife
, I think about my other familymembers, my friends.
(23:35):
I want to set a good example tothem, because I want them to
understand that doing hardthings can change your life for
the better.
It's only by doing them thatyou'll understand that.
It's only by putting yourselfin uncomfortable situations, by
walking out of your comfort zoneand looking adversity in the
face and saying you know, I knowyou're there, but I'm not
(23:58):
worried about you.
That is what will keep yougoing, that's what will inspire
other people.
And so we've talked a lot aboutthe why.
But how do you actually practicedoing hard things without
actually burning out?
And here's a simple framework.
You can call it a toolkit fordiscomfort First you want to
start where you are.
Don can call it a toolkit fordiscomfort.
First, you want to start whereyou are.
(24:19):
Don't overdo it in thebeginning.
That's where people faceburnout almost immediately.
That's the fastest way to do it.
Pick something hard, but makeit your version, and maybe
that's running a mile, maybethat's showing up to the gym
twice a week, maybe it's havingone honest, hard conversation.
Start small, but start Getmoving.
(24:40):
Get going.
Number two is scale with time.
Think of it as a ladder V1 toV4.
These are your prototypes.
You don't climb all the rungsat once.
You move step by step and alittle more stress each time, a
little more weight, a littlemore honesty, a little more
honesty, a little more patience.
And that's how you grow withoutbreaking.
You just continue to push thatdiscomfort and you continue to
(25:04):
master these challenges that youset for yourself and then set
your sights on another one.
Step three is use your fallback.
Life gets chaotic.
You won't always have hours tofocus and for me, when things
feel overwhelming, I take 10 or20 minutes and I lie down, I
cover my eyes with something andI just breathe Calm first, then
(25:27):
clarity, and when I get back upI'm steady, I know I can handle
what's in front of me, and sofind something that allows you
to kind of decompress, and forme, it's that little moment
where I have 10 to 20 minutes ofjust laying there, thinking to
be alone with my thoughts, toturn my phone off and just sit
there and think about what'sgoing on in my life.
Step four is reflect, which isequally as important as all the
(25:51):
other ones, and for me,journaling has been my anchor.
It's where I get to processwhat's working, what isn't, and
how I'm growing.
And for me, journaling has beenmy anchor.
It's where I get a processwhat's working, what isn't, and
how I'm growing.
And, honestly, prayer because Ibring God into it daily.
I know I'm not carrying theweight alone.
When things go wrong, he getsme through.
Reflection is what transformsdoing hard things into becoming
(26:14):
someone stronger.
And for me, I include God inevery day because there's
strength that comes from theAlmighty and there's strength
that comes from praying and justmeditating, thinking about what
you're worried about, thinkingabout what is top of mind for
you and just figuring out how totake one more step forward.
(26:44):
The man who moves a mountainbegins by carrying small stones
a quote from Confucius.
And that's what this toolkit isSmall stones, carrying them
daily and over time, themountain will move.
You'll see that you really will.
Hard things forge yourcharacter, and not in theory,
not in imagination, but in thereality of effort.
(27:04):
So I wanted to come up withsome kind of challenge for the
next seven days.
I want you to really try andimplement this into your life,
and it's learn to not fear hardthings.
Don't obsess over all the work.
Put your eyes on the outcome.
Let the discomfort come andwalk through it anyway, because
(27:28):
the hard things you choose todaywill shape who you become
tomorrow.
I've seen that so many times inmy life and I know that you can
see that in your own Because,honestly, it takes a lot of work
and it takes a lot of patience.
It takes many times to sit therewith your thoughts and to not
(27:49):
allow them to dictate if you'regoing to give up or not.
Instead, you need to learn howto figure out how to live with
discomfort, how to push it justa little bit further and to not
let it control your life.
And once you figure out that,you'll have a lot of power,
because hard things will teachyou how to become better, it'll
refine you, it'll refine yourcharacter and it'll inspire
(28:11):
others to take some chances onthemselves.
The reason why David Goggins isso inspirational is because he
does things that no sane personwould do, and the fact that he's
out there doing that muchallows some people to say, well,
if he's doing that, I canprobably do five miles.
He just ran a 200-mile race.
I can probably do five.
(28:31):
It's things like that.
That's the example that youcould set for someone else, and
it's through that consistency.
It's things like that.
That's the example that youcould set for someone else, and
it's through that consistency,it's through that discomfort,
and in the end you'll becomebetter.
I've seen that in my own lifemany times over.
Every time I go after somethingdifficult and I get through it,
I always remember there's somany lessons to learn, and I
(28:54):
have podcast episodes aboutpretty much after every race
I've done.
I have one for my Bostonmarathon qualifier, I have one
for my ultra marathon, I haveone for team Tim and all those
races.
Um, they teach you things aboutyourself that are hard to
explain, uh, but I tried my bestin those podcasts episodes.
So if you're interested at all,um, you can check those ones
out too.
But that's really it, guys, it'shard.
(29:16):
Things take patience.
It takes practice andeventually you'll become someone
who is forged in adversity, whounderstands discomfort, who is
friends with discomfort, whoknows how to have that
conversation.
And life will become better.
I can guarantee it.
But you have to start.
Start small, but start.
I appreciate you guys forlistening to this episode.
(29:38):
If it helped at all, pleaseleave a like, a comment or rate
the show on Apple Podcasts orSpotify.
It always helps and until nextepisode, everybody keep getting
up for it.
Thanks, guys.
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