Giants Extra Point | Giants vs. Patriots Recap

John Schmeelk, Tiki Barber and Bob Papa break down the Giants' Week 13 loss to the Patriots on Giants Extra Point.

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:06):
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Speaker 2 (00:28):
And what was.

Speaker 1 (00:28):
Probably the worst overall performance of the Giants season, They
fall to the New England Patriots thirty three to fifteen
on Monday Night Football, Get me Thing, Everybody, johnsh Belt,
Tiki Barber with you here on Giants Extra Point. Giants
fall to two and eleven on the season. Patriots improve
to eleven and two. Giants heading into their bye week
next week. Tiki exceptionally well coached the Newland Patriots. Hats

(00:49):
off to Mike Rabel.

Speaker 3 (00:50):
Why do you say that just because you saw it
and as you and I were watching in particularly the
second half of this.

Speaker 2 (00:57):
Game, they dominated, making it look effortless.

Speaker 3 (01:01):
It wasn't like they were actually dominating the New York Giants.
They weren't scoring twenty points in the second half. But
it never felt like the Giants had any kind of
foothold on anything. I know, they had that one drive
where they drove down and scored the touchdown and then
get a two point conversion and it's thirty to fifteen,

(01:22):
but it almost felt like the Patriots were saying fine ghost.

Speaker 2 (01:27):
You never felt they were challenged.

Speaker 3 (01:28):
Go station to station, go first down by first down,
by first down, by first down by first down, get
into the red area.

Speaker 2 (01:35):
Feel good about yourself.

Speaker 3 (01:37):
But you're actually helping us because you're crushing the clock.
And I was talking about to John how how I
watched Mike Vrabel completely master the game clock completely. All right,
we're gonna take an extra minute off the clock here.
We're just gonna go very slow and yeah, I know whatever.

(01:58):
It feels like we're losing here or losing time or
we're losing momentum, but we're doing.

Speaker 2 (02:05):
It for purpose.

Speaker 3 (02:07):
It just it felt like a masterclass on how to
blow out a team without actually fully blowing them out.
And that's a testament to Mike Frable because this is
how he is. It's his mastery of being a head
coach in the NFL. And I mean it's it's a
wonder that he was So it's not a wonder, but
it's I mean, it's not a wonder why he was

(02:27):
so sought after after he got let go by the Tennessee.

Speaker 1 (02:30):
A year without coaching a team is like some type
of travesty, let's be honest.

Speaker 3 (02:34):
I think maybe because of where he was respect wise,
that he had the choice of where he wanted to go,
and he kind of knew that New England is where
he wanted to go to. And Gerard Mayo, who was
kind of in waiting, we didn't I didn't really know
this story until we ch had it earlier in the
show with Scott. With Scott, basically the reason that Bill

(02:58):
Belichick in and the Patriots got at odds was because
of Gerard Mario Mayo.

Speaker 1 (03:03):
And we've learned that Belichick is a little bit sensitive. Well,
he's a control for us, yes, like.

Speaker 3 (03:07):
He wants to be in control of his staff and
who he's projecting forward to be the next head coach.
And when the Patriots kind of selected Gerard Mayo to
be that, Bill got upset about it and ultimately he
became the interim and then the.

Speaker 2 (03:21):
Full head coach. But he wasn't really ready to be
a head coach.

Speaker 3 (03:24):
So this was a great landing spot from Mike vrabel
Andy as a quarterback and now an offensive coordinator that
are going to help take them to I think really
good places.

Speaker 1 (03:33):
So take he Let's just talk about how he got
to the point where the Patriots was able to work
the clock and run this game out as they again
defeat the Giants on Monday Night Football thirty three to fifteen.
And all three phases of the Giants betrayed them in
the big one. And it has to be the special
teams yep, thirty nine yard kickoff to start the game.
You were the ninety four yard kick return for a

(03:54):
touchdown by Marcus Jones.

Speaker 2 (03:56):
Then you had the young Way coup uh chunked.

Speaker 3 (04:01):
I don't I don't even know what I watched it.
I don't think he was I don't think he thought
it was gonna get blocked.

Speaker 2 (04:08):
I think he just jumped it. He literally kicked the ground.

Speaker 1 (04:11):
And then you had the cutter off Chevsky fumble on
the kickoff on the play where he.

Speaker 2 (04:17):
Just cushion because they got knocked out.

Speaker 1 (04:20):
I get, but just four special teams plays that really
shifted how this game went.

Speaker 3 (04:25):
And look, the winning in the NFL is it's obviously
about scoring points. It's obviously about stopping defensive from scoring points.
But it's also about doing that third phase very well.
And by doing it very well, I mean be invisible,
you know, have us not talk about it, make your
extra points, make the field goals that you're supposed to

(04:47):
cover well. On kickoff, don't kick it out of bound,
don't kick it out of bounds. Punt well, pin him down,
don't give him returnable kicks, all that stuff. Just don't
make it a function in the game that causes you
to lose win. The Giants did both in this in
this car they played so terribly it helped the New
England Patriots win and they didn't do enough and on

(05:09):
their side to keep it neutral. And so I don't know.
This is we've talked all year. Offense has struggled to
X Y Z. If you bench Russell Wilson, you start
Jackson Dart, you have fire daves.

Speaker 2 (05:20):
The defense has been terrible.

Speaker 3 (05:22):
They're not aggressive, and Shane Bowen doesn't know what he's doing.
He's too risk averse and conservative and blah blah. I
can't motivate these guys. And now it's like, you get three.

Speaker 2 (05:31):
Quarters of the way through the season. All right, the special.

Speaker 3 (05:33):
Team stinks now. It's just it's one thing after another
with this team. And I'm not putting this on Michael Gobrial,
that special teams coach, because what I am starting to
feel is that this is becoming an effort thing. This
is becoming a want two thing. And I hate that
because I hate throwing players under the bus like that.

Speaker 2 (05:54):
But they just look bad, man, they really did.

Speaker 3 (05:57):
And if you're gonna make a tackle, Timo and Fox,
don't just put your shoulder into.

Speaker 2 (06:03):
The guy hit him right. Make sure you wrap up.

Speaker 3 (06:06):
And tackle guys otherwise you get massive returns like we
saw also in the second half.

Speaker 1 (06:11):
All right, let's take a time out. We'll come back
talk about the defense and the offense, which were not
much better in this game. Giants again fault to the
Patriots thirty three to fifteen. That was tonight's game breakdown,
brought to you locally by Ford. Want performance and capability
at every turn. Get behind the wheel of a new
Ford truck or SUV, Ford Official truck and SUV of
the New York Giants.

Speaker 2 (06:29):
We'll be right back with more after this.

Speaker 4 (06:31):
You're listening to Giants extra Point on the WFAN Giants
Radio Network.

Speaker 1 (06:37):
Backyard Giants extra Point, John Schmelch, Tiki Barber Giants faull
to two and eleven on the season, they lose to
the Patriots thirty three to fifteen. We're waiting Mike Kafkis
press conference, which will be brought to you by Hackensack
Britty in health, keep getting better and Tiki. I think
I guess culprit number two in this game to me
would be the defense. Yeah, you look at the overall

(06:59):
yards they allowed through ninety five yards, that's not a
big deal. But then when you look at the first half,
they gave up two hundred and seventy four yards in
the first half, and then the Patriots only had two
possessions in the second half, I'm sorry, three possessions in
the second half in which they gave thirty five yards,
missed a field goal, thirty six yards and punted and
fifty eight yards and made.

Speaker 2 (07:19):
A field goal.

Speaker 1 (07:20):
But it didn't You didn't even get the sense that
the Patriots are pushing to try to score.

Speaker 2 (07:23):
It was so slow playing it.

Speaker 3 (07:25):
They could have scored forty points in this forty five
points in this game if they had wanted to. Now,
I'll give the Giants a little bit of slack. Playing
on Monday night is It's hard. It's a long week,
it is primetime. You've been waiting around. It's also Thanksgiving
week that you had the practice through and you watched
all the games all all week in, and all of
a sudden, it's your turn and it's just you and

(07:48):
you're you feel that pressure of playing on Monday night
football because you know all the eyes are on you,
and the pomp and circumstance leading up these Monday night
games is a big deal. And sometimes when you're a
young player, Jackson Dard or even Courtel Flott, who got
beat for a touchdown in this game, Abdul Carter, et cetera.
Mike Coffica will answer. I'm sure some of these questions

(08:08):
here he is on the mic.

Speaker 5 (08:12):
So I think it was this Gunner got a concussion
and then Tracy with a hip for injury. Wise, what
can you do to impress upon his own health? Listen,
Jackson's an aggressive football player. You know he's on the
sideline trying to get himself out of bounce takes a hit,

(08:34):
he bounced up. He's a tough kid.

Speaker 6 (08:37):
Like or whatever.

Speaker 5 (08:44):
Yeah, I mean, obviously don't want to take any hits
that are unnecessary, but he was working his way out
of bounce. Yeah, Jackson did it. Did a nice job.
He slid a couple of times for us, you know,
did everything we asked him to do.

Speaker 7 (09:01):
Like, why was.

Speaker 5 (09:04):
That was a coach's decision, My decision just based on
how we how we went during the week. Just that
was that was the decision I wanted to make. No,
it was just my decision to not to not play him.

Speaker 8 (09:18):
There was four that that he was on this part
of all a team event.

Speaker 9 (09:25):
Is that true.

Speaker 5 (09:26):
No, it's it was just strictly my decisions to be
benched in this way. Yeah, no, it's it's unfortunate, but
you know those are that's the way we kind of
work with it this week.

Speaker 10 (09:38):
I imagine that when you mentioned on the first time,
you hope that the message to get fat with this.

Speaker 9 (09:43):
Now two weeks later, it's the same exact thing again.

Speaker 11 (09:47):
Something similar.

Speaker 5 (09:48):
I would just saying we have great communication and he's
one of my favorite players on the team, and that
was one thing that you know, we talked about and
it was my decision to not play this I again,
this is one of the things that I decided to do.

Speaker 6 (10:03):
What do you mean that one of the things you
talk about.

Speaker 5 (10:06):
Well, well, I talked just like I talked with a duel.
I talk with all our players, and you know I
talk with that duel about this week and decided to
not play them for the first two series. It's just
this was just strictly my decision to not play him
this week early in the game, early in the game,
and he listened. When he came back in the game,

(10:27):
you saw the kind of impact he had and the
player that this guy is, and I this is a
this is a kid that I again I back. I
support this kid highly and for any young player that
we have on the roster, whether it's a duel or
any rookie or young player, we're gonna make sure we
take him under our wing and continue to develop these
guys because they're important to us. They're important to me,
and the duels no different, just like Jackson, just like

(10:51):
you know young players like Tracy and and da all
these guys are that are stepping up in big time,
major roles. You know, these are the guys that were
continuing developed, continuing to grow, continue to be pros. And
you know, the standards that we have in our program,
our super are sky high and and everyone's you know,
gonna upheld to him. But that was my decision, my decision.

(11:11):
Only anything else else outside of it, it's going to
be kept in house.

Speaker 12 (11:16):
All the players we're talking to, they're not committing actions that.

Speaker 8 (11:20):
Are made to that means that you talk about how
special is made, what he's doing is taking them off.

Speaker 5 (11:29):
Yeah, and Connor, I just would say this like, that
was my decision to do that, And again it's those
are those are tough decisions to make, but that was
my decision. And again, the kid nothing to do nothing
with him. Everything that we did that we did was
my decision. And obviously I'm sure he's wasn't happy about it,
which I understand, but I thought that was the best

(11:50):
thing for the team, and it was my decision to
move forward with it. And and that's where're at. I
don't regret the decision. I don't.

Speaker 6 (12:01):
Evaluate Jackson situations like this. Is it hard to evaluate?

Speaker 5 (12:13):
Well, I haven't you know, you watch the game. I
have a feel for kind of what happened. I'll go
back and look at the tape and evaluate it fully.
But it's never just one person. We're a team. It's
all three phases, all eleven guys on the field. We
all got to do it together, and we all got
to be better.

Speaker 8 (12:28):
Like your first games, competent games. You know, what do
you think?

Speaker 5 (12:41):
I thought. I thought our guys competed. I thought our
guys competed. There are some plays that we didn't make
that we got to continue to look at and evaluate,
whether from the coaching staff or from the player side
of it, like where we can get better at. And
you know, the the good thing is we have a
bye coming up that we can go and evaluate all
that stuff and really have a great plan coming back
after the bye. But but yeah, today wasn't wasn't our

(13:01):
best effort. It wasn't our best It wasn't our best
game here in a minute, So we'll go back and
look at it and get it cleaned up.

Speaker 6 (13:09):
Break touchdown.

Speaker 13 (13:18):
I don't know what happened with.

Speaker 8 (13:22):
Overall.

Speaker 2 (13:23):
You guys have been sold.

Speaker 14 (13:28):
What happened.

Speaker 5 (13:29):
It wasn't. It just wasn't a great team effort. All
three phases. We got to just everyone's got to step up,
everyone's got to clean up there. They're part of the game.
But it's never just one phase, never just one player,
so we all got to do better job. Well, I
I saw it live. I saw it live. Look at
the ball just kind of slipped a little bit, so
he wasn't sure if it wasn't he gets set, you know,

(13:51):
Jamie tried to reset it, and then by that time
it was kind of you know, he was already kind
of out of his out of his groove on it,
so you know, it was just just uh, you know, tough,
tough bounce right there.

Speaker 15 (14:06):
A little.

Speaker 6 (14:09):
Was there any consideration given there?

Speaker 5 (14:14):
Yeah, no, kind of we went we went tempo on it,
do we you know, I was just trying to down
two scores. We felt like we were just right in
the game. Just wanted to get the drive going. I
think we I had an eye on the time on
where where it would get to to where we really
need to kind of go super fast. But I really
felt like if we can just put together a drive
and go ahead and get points, that would set us
up to be in the game a little bit more.

(14:34):
So You're right, you're kind of teetering on that on
that line in terms of like going super super fast
and just kind of trying to stay within the game
and not get too far away from it. But that's
kind of where my mind was at as I was
calling it. Yeah, that's that, that was kind of where

(14:55):
that spot was at. Do I want to just do
I want to punt it back, kind of back them up,
get a quick through and out, and then give us
a little bit of field position. It was a toss
up for me. I just I just didn't want to.
I wanted to kind of play some field position game
right there and give our defensive opportunities. So you know,
that's one that I'll go back and look at if
I if that's one where I could rip off another
fourth down opportunity, right, But you know, in the heat,

(15:19):
in the heat of the game, that's where I kind
of felt. Well, he was obviously very productive, you know, scrambling,
throwing the football. You know, he did a nice job
with some of the explosive things. So you know we
got to button that stuff up in the back end,
tie it in with the front end, and get everything
a little bit cleaner.

Speaker 8 (15:41):
Just know how much you know becaussive.

Speaker 5 (15:52):
Yeah, we were we were like in go for fourth downs.
I mean, you saw all the times we ran it
on third down. Those were pretty much all go for us.
So you know, we want to be aggressive, want to
stay aggressive, and when the opportunity comes up, well we'll
try and be aggressive. I just at that time, I
just didn't feel like that was the spot for it.
Depending you know, we get it great. If we don't,
now you're basically, you know, making a three score game.

(16:13):
You know where it's now it's a little bit more difficult.
So just trying to play field position and just and
stay with it. Sit again, I thought the operation was cleaned.
I thought the operation was clean. On the headsets, bouncing
back and forth in the headset, so I can hear
a little bit of it. But you know, he was calm,

(16:35):
he was poised. You know, we just all got to
do a better job. We're going to clean up. I
don't I don't, you know. I stand by Charlie. He'll
do a great He'll continue to get better. I stand
by our defensive side, stay by all our coaches. We
got great coaching staff here, and you know these guys,
everyone will step up, the coaching staff, the players, the
surrounding support staff will all step up for us, right,

(16:56):
and that's what we've gotta That's what we gotta think about.
That's what'll be our goal.

Speaker 8 (17:01):
On the last series. Talking about protecting Jackson gets on
the last one.

Speaker 16 (17:06):
Of not putting him out there again.

Speaker 5 (17:09):
Like taking him out of the game. No, I was
I wasn an in front of my mind at all.

Speaker 13 (17:14):
Else.

Speaker 5 (17:16):
Thank you.

Speaker 1 (17:17):
That's the coaches press conference brought to you by Hackensack
and Marine Heals keep getting better. We'll get to the
defense and the second Batiki. I want to get your reaction.
We're hoping to get some clarity as to why Abduqurteros
hold out of.

Speaker 2 (17:27):
The first quarter and we really didn't. No, I think
we have a.

Speaker 3 (17:30):
Little bit of a report. And I understand Mike Kafka.
Kafka trying to protect his player and he doesn't want
that story to take on a life of its own.
But by answering it that way, you you create more
life into it. You make it much more than a
one day type of event that gets handled, talked about
and then put away.

Speaker 2 (17:50):
It becomes a is this a pattern?

Speaker 3 (17:52):
Is this something that and that we're gonna keep hearing
about or is there more depth to this And it's
unfortunate for a garter, but he's going through it and
as a young player, he's figuring out how to be
a professional, and it's not an easy thing to do,
especially when you're on a losing team that hasn't been
playing well and you're underperforming probably even his own expectation,

(18:14):
but certainly fans expectations, I think ownership and Joe Shane's expectations,
the team's expectations, and he's gonna.

Speaker 2 (18:24):
Have to answer for this in some capacity.

Speaker 3 (18:26):
I hope that they have a good plan around this
and how they're going to talk about it, because the
last thing we need is for him to respond like
he did last time and create a firestorm around it,
and so could have done a better job.

Speaker 2 (18:38):
Yeah, talk about.

Speaker 3 (18:40):
The reasons without talking about the reasons is what a
head coach has to do. It is not easy being
a head coach in the NFL, because you become the voice.

Speaker 2 (18:50):
Of every player on the team.

Speaker 3 (18:52):
You become the reason why they're doing well, why they're
doing poorly, or in this case, why they didn't play
for a quarter And it's obviously coach's decision. Clearly it
was his We know that that goes without saying, but
there's gotta be some more depth, I think to that,
because it's starting to become concerning, I think in some ways,
and you don't want it to just linger and be

(19:13):
a talking point over and over over again about Autdill Carter.
All right, let's take a time out.

Speaker 1 (19:18):
We'll come back, break down what else happened on defense,
and take a look at the offense.

Speaker 2 (19:21):
Giants fall to the Patriots thirty three to fifteen.

Speaker 4 (19:24):
You're listening to Giants Extra Point on the Wfan Giants
Radio network.

Speaker 1 (19:30):
Back here on Giants Extra Point. Giants fall to the
Patriots thirty three to fifteen. All right, Tiki, we were
talking about the defense when when Mike Kafka began and
like we were saying, they gave up over two or
to seventy yards in the first def and the Patriots
kind of just slow rolled it in half number two.

Speaker 2 (19:42):
Yeah, they definitely did. They took their foot off the gas.

Speaker 3 (19:45):
And this was veryble knowing his team and knowing what
they're capable of doing, getting first downs, taking time off
the clock, methodically running a four minute offense for basically
thirty minutes in the second half and they knew the
game was was heavily in control and they had they
had the advantage. Now, look, I'll give Charlie Bullen some

(20:06):
credit for what he attempted to do, which is bring
more pressure, make it more confusing for Drake May. But
let's not also forget that Drake May is inching up
to be the favorite for the MVP in the NFL.
And so those all mugs that we saw, those those
double mugs, those simulated blitzes where there's six or seven
guys at the line of scrimmage, that's interesting to see.

(20:28):
That's Vance, Joseph. You see sometimes Vance does it with
the Denver Broncos where one guy or will come, or
a half side will come, or you'll get a zone blitz.
So you'll get three firing off one side and the
backside defensive end dropping into his zone blitz type scheme,
and it gets confusing. The Giants, I think, unfortunately, kept

(20:49):
running the same bail to zone and so when you
do that the same thing over and over and over again,
it gets predictable. Right, you can call the play Josh
McDaniel as a play caller, knowing where the void is
going to be and It's why you kept seeing these
third down situations which are third and four, five, six,
whatever it may have been, and they get an easy

(21:09):
completion because Josh knows where the play is going and
knows where the defense is going, so he can design
the play. And Drake may is very highly processing what's
about to happen to him and so he's not panicked.

Speaker 2 (21:23):
Also, there's no.

Speaker 3 (21:24):
Pressure, and so you're running these these these simulated pressure looks,
but when the ball is snapped, there is no pressure,
and guys are dropping into predictable zones and so it's
easy to find the void, to find the soft spot,
whether that was in the curl, whether that was sitting
over the middle.

Speaker 2 (21:41):
Of the field.

Speaker 3 (21:42):
The voids were self creating in a sense. And so
again it's his first game as a defensive play caller,
Charlie Bullen, and I think, yeah, I give him credit
for at least thinking about doing something different than Shane
Bowen had been doing for the first ten games of
this season.

Speaker 2 (21:59):
But kind of like Shane Bowen, and it was also predictable.

Speaker 3 (22:02):
You knew what was happening, and you just didn't get
enough plays made in the in those moments.

Speaker 1 (22:08):
And look Tiki. Here's the bottom line. And I've said
it on this postgame show. You've said it on Evden
te You've said it on this postgame show, and fans get.

Speaker 2 (22:16):
Mad at us.

Speaker 1 (22:17):
But the bottom line is, you can do simulated pressures.
You can do all that pressures. You could do zero blitzes,
you could do quarters. You can run cover three, you
can run cover two. Here's the bottom line. If nobody
wins up front, he gets to the quarterback and the
guys at the back end can't cover. I don't care
what the defensive coordinator does, it's not going to matter.

Speaker 14 (22:36):
Right.

Speaker 3 (22:37):
Ultimately, that's what we saw tonight. Ultimately, you gotta make plays.
Your players have to make plays, and they just there
weren't enough of them.

Speaker 2 (22:45):
Patriots are a good team.

Speaker 3 (22:47):
This is I couldn't say this was a predictable outcome
because the Giants have played really good teams. I like
the Green Bay Packers, like the Detroit and the.

Speaker 2 (22:54):
Pictures have played close games all year too.

Speaker 3 (22:56):
They've played good teams close. But this felt like and
out coaching, and you felt it. And it's unfortunate that
you had some drops in here. Theo Johnson had one
right before you know, they went up by an extra
another touchdown because of the drop touchdown. Then you had
the miss field goal, and so those things those are
not even miss field goal was just a non field

(23:17):
goal attempt. Those things come back to bite you because
in games where you can't afford and I think the
Giants are at that point in the season where they
can't afford to play mistake prone football, the good.

Speaker 2 (23:30):
Teams are gonna beat you. I mean, that's pretty much
a turnover, right it is.

Speaker 1 (23:33):
So so there were minus two internover ratio because you
have the kickoff fumble, you the young Way coup play,
and then you had a special team touch on give
it up. Yeah, you're not gonna win many games on
your minus two in tonal a ratio. And you give
up a kick return for a touch that's.

Speaker 3 (23:45):
Right, and you don't have the big play in your offense.
You know, it's just it's then we go back to
some of the injuries, and now you got the Tyrone
Tracy injury. Who's the big play threat, and it's they're
trying to make it THEO Johnson, but he's not fully
reliable right now and he's only in his second year.
I know, there's an awareness that comes as you gain
maturity and reps in the NFL, and perhaps as the

(24:09):
seasons go on.

Speaker 2 (24:10):
Theo Johnson involves because he's a big player.

Speaker 3 (24:12):
He's physical, and he's strong, and he's he can high
point and catch balls. But sometimes his awareness on how
to get his body in the right position we hit
this at halftime isn't fully there yet, and they're depending
on him to do that, and as a result, you're
getting some inefficiencies that are preventing you from staying in
some of these games.

Speaker 1 (24:33):
Giants Football is brought to you by Verarizity, the official
five G network on the New York Giants, Verizon America's
fulst reliable network.

Speaker 2 (24:39):
Let's take a time out. We're still winning.

Speaker 1 (24:40):
Jackson's ar at the podium, highlights, audio from the locker room.
Some of the great sound just came in from Paul
Deatino and Pete Hoffman down there. We'll get to all
that and more. Giants again fall to the Broncos in
this game. Thirty three to fifteen will be right back.

Speaker 4 (24:53):
You're listening to Giants Extra Point on the Wfan. Giants
Radio network.

Speaker 3 (24:59):
Is Slayton and you're listening to the Radio home of
Big Blue the Fan, WFAN and WFA in FM, New York.

Speaker 6 (25:10):
Dark.

Speaker 16 (25:10):
Take me's a snap, looks left side, arms and Lap
completes it to Slayton. Slayton keeps Street at twenty to
the tenth to the five into the end zone for
a touchdown.

Speaker 2 (25:19):
A little quick slant to Darius Slayton and Slayton gets
his first touchdown.

Speaker 16 (25:24):
Taps of the season, and the Giants are on the
board here in the second quarter.

Speaker 2 (25:30):
And I mean it's seventeen to seven.

Speaker 1 (25:32):
That was tonight's play of the game, brought to you
locally by Forard one performance and capability at every turn.
Get behind the wheel of a new Ford truck rescuv
Ford official Chuck and SUV of the New York Football Giants.
Welcome to the Giants extra point. John Schmelteeky Barber with
you from our studios in downtown Manhattan. Giants again fall
to the New England Patriots in this game thirty three,

(25:54):
two fifteen. All right, t let's go to the offensive
side of the ball here. He had some i'd say
fluff yardage in the second half of this game. Yeah,
they get the Giants up to two hundred and thirty nine.
They kind of moved the ball very slowly and methodically
in this game. Devin Singletary twelve carries sixty eight yards.
Tywan Tracy, who had a hip injury late in this game,

(26:15):
did not return ten carries thirty six yards.

Speaker 2 (26:17):
Let's hope that's not serious. Yeah, I mean hip injury
and he couldn't put any weight on the leg. You
don't love that. We'll see what that looks like.

Speaker 1 (26:23):
Jackson darts seventeen of twenty four efficient, but only one
hundred and thirty nine yards in this game, Tiki. There
were a lot of checkdowns in this game. The Giants
had just one completion that went for more than twenty yards,
and it was that short eight yard throw to Darius Slayton.
So not one ball that traveled twenty yards in the
air not completed by the Giants in this ga.

Speaker 2 (26:45):
Yeah, they didn't have any downfield throws.

Speaker 3 (26:47):
The one other throw that was downfield was the one
the Theo Johnson immediately before the Darius Layton touchdown.

Speaker 2 (26:55):
It was a third and eight. It was a perfectly
thrown ball to.

Speaker 3 (26:58):
Theo Johnson and he got a helm to helmet hit
by the quarterback Jalen who hit him, Jalen Hawks Hawkins.
Jalen Hawkins helmet to helmet safety hit him, and he
got them the first down. And I liked the play
the first down play right after that from the thirty
yard line where he hit him on a slant, hit
him in the second window. So it took some delayed

(27:19):
timing to get that ball where it needed to be.
And Dare Slaton made a clean catch and then split
the defenders and went and scored a touchdown. So you
give them credit for that play, but there wasn't a
lot else that was you put in quotes explosive in
this game. Again, you give the Giants credit for their
run game because they stick to it even when it's
not necessarily you know, electric it does.

Speaker 2 (27:41):
It was helping them.

Speaker 3 (27:42):
Get first downs and they ran hard Devin Singletary, Tyrone
Tracy as well, But ultimately was it was not nearly
enough of a ball control type situation to get them
back into this game.

Speaker 2 (27:56):
And then after that it just kind of bogged down
for him.

Speaker 3 (27:58):
They get a turnover on downs, and they get a fumble,
a punt, another turnover on downs, and then finally that
late touchdown in the fourth quarter, at the beginning of
the fourth quarter, where you know, they go for two
point conversions, two point conversion and make it a fifteen
point game.

Speaker 2 (28:13):
Two scores.

Speaker 3 (28:14):
But it also felt as if the newly pages just
kind of conceded that if you're gonna take however long
to score a touchdown, I think that that drive was
four or five minutes or so, then they were willing
to concede that in the fourth quarter.

Speaker 2 (28:29):
Up by three scores.

Speaker 1 (28:30):
Yeah, And then the other big play it was a
downfield past attempt tiki and as a play that Bob
and Carl talked a lot about during the broadcast, that
kind of turned this game because the play after this,
it was a third down pass down the left side
that Thel Johnson was kind of an out and up. Yeah,
did a great job of stepping up in the pocket.
I think that was twenty plus yards, maybe it was
like eighteen or so. Looking through his head, it was

(28:51):
a good play and a good a good read by
feel to recognize and he was just running an out route,
a bench route.

Speaker 2 (28:58):
And it wasn't there.

Speaker 3 (28:59):
He looked, didn't see the ball coming, so he turned up,
went upfield, knew the mismatch.

Speaker 2 (29:03):
He had. Oh, so you think that was off schedule. Yeah,
I don't think.

Speaker 3 (29:06):
I don't think that was on schedule. Was off schedule.
He stepped in, stepped up into the pocket, goes to
the to the front corner of the end zone, and
I get Jackson Dart put it exactly where it needed
to be. It's just THEO didn't get his body positioned
right to turn around and get his hands up. We've
seen that a couple of times this year for THEO,
when his body is not perfectly positioned to catch a

(29:27):
ball on his on.

Speaker 2 (29:28):
His back shoulder type throw.

Speaker 3 (29:31):
Getting his body turned and his hands in a catch
position often happens late, and so the ball gets there
just as his hands are getting up and it goes
through his hands. He was upset about it, obviously. He
took his helmet off, punching the ground. Uh, and then
ultimately they missed the field goal. Jackson Dart is now
at the podium.

Speaker 6 (29:52):
The soccer maches.

Speaker 8 (29:53):
Did you see what happened?

Speaker 15 (29:54):
Uh?

Speaker 12 (29:55):
Scrambling out of the pocket trying to get the first
time and got made a good hit.

Speaker 3 (30:01):
It sound Jackson just asking you about the hits and
taking them things like that.

Speaker 12 (30:10):
No, look like I understand the question, but like this
is like this is football, like I'm gonna get hit
if I'm in the pocket or outside the pocket, like
it's I don't like, I feel like I've played this
way my whole entire life. It shouldn't be like any

(30:30):
shock or anybody if you've followed along with my career
and I'm we're not playing like we're not playing soccer
out here, like you're gonna get hit. Things happen, It's
part of the game.

Speaker 17 (30:45):
It seems after that played.

Speaker 18 (30:51):
That kind of maybe.

Speaker 19 (30:53):
Just just kind of.

Speaker 12 (30:58):
I'm not really sure what plays you're talking about specifically,
there was there.

Speaker 7 (31:02):
Was well.

Speaker 20 (31:04):
There times you thought about running and maybe.

Speaker 12 (31:08):
No, no, it didn't hurt, So that didn't play any
thought in my mind.

Speaker 7 (31:14):
Do you think do you think taking that aggressiveness away
from you it takes people away from your game?

Speaker 6 (31:20):
Absolutely?

Speaker 12 (31:23):
Like I said, I I played like this my whole life,
Like I'm turning my high school tape and trying my
college tape like it's not like a shocker to anybody,
Like it's just it's I've played it felt like if
you just watch the game like I did slide, I
did avoid a lot of hits. So it's like you
can get hit.

Speaker 6 (31:39):
It's football when you're playing high school.

Speaker 8 (31:44):
When you're playing in college, the competition is a little
bit different.

Speaker 6 (31:47):
The size, the speed, the physicality a little bit different.

Speaker 2 (31:49):
Or maybe those hits here a.

Speaker 8 (31:51):
Little different than the history would have been taken in
high school.

Speaker 6 (31:53):
You feel at.

Speaker 13 (31:56):
All or what I mean?

Speaker 12 (31:57):
My my body feels good. I got knocked out of
a game against Chicago on a fluke play.

Speaker 2 (32:03):
Like you watch the hit, I.

Speaker 12 (32:05):
Lose control of the ball and I don't brace myself
because I'm trying to recatch the ball. It's not because
of the hit, it's just because I lost the ball.
So I mean, just like any other league, like you
take new steps. There's bigger, faster players. But like, my
body feels good, so you know, I'm gonna play aggressive.

(32:26):
I feel like if I just turn into a complete
pocket passer, that's just not how I want to play
the game. I feel like there's an advantage to me
using my legs. So yeah, on your side, that's where
I want to go. Yeah, he's done a great job.

(32:49):
I'm not into comparisons. Everybody's journey is differently. Everybody's journey
is different, So you know, I've known Drake for years
and he's done a great job. He also went through
a struggle his first year too, so you know, everybody's
journey is different. I'm just trying to do my best
to change this this franchise around a little bit and

(33:13):
uh and do my part. So I just got to
stay diligent in that too much of a m No,
I didn't think so. I mean, I just think we
got down, like we got down big early. Game plans
have to change, like you're just playing catch up the
rest of the game. It's a little bit different when

(33:35):
you know it's a tight game, you can really stick
to a game plan.

Speaker 2 (33:39):
You know.

Speaker 12 (33:39):
I felt like, you know, me trying to extend my
plays in the in the past game and keep my
eyes down the field was more sufficient than me trying
to run and get you know, five yards. So you're
trying to play catch up little bit in those situations,
you know what rate Yeah, I mean I would do

(34:03):
the same for him, and uh, you know that's kind
of the that's a relationship that mean him have you
know you saw the line get in there too, like
we all got each other's backs. It's not it's not
fun losing. It's not fun with this losing streak. It's
it doesn't you know, look super bright from the outside,
but you know, we have each other's backs, and uh,

(34:25):
you know, sometimes it just takes it takes time to
you know, turn things around. And I think that obviously,
you know, we want that now, everybody wants that.

Speaker 13 (34:35):
Now.

Speaker 12 (34:37):
You know, I'm hoping that, you know, we can continue
to to build and uh, you know, find any way
that we can just find a little bit of momentum.

Speaker 21 (34:46):
The like were kind.

Speaker 12 (34:53):
Of right, well, yeah, I mean we got we got
beaten all three phases of the game. So and when
you get down like that, it's not it's not ideal.
And uh, you know, I feel like we had a
little bit of a spark when we were able to

(35:15):
you know, score that Motor had that touchdown, we got
the two point conversion. We're down two scores and you know,
defense got is the ball back and then we didn't
capitalize on it. So, like you said, like we were
just scratching a clawn. So you know, you kind of
have to when you're in that situation, your your game
plan is kind of out out the gate a little bit,
and you're just trying to find any way you can

(35:35):
to to play catch.

Speaker 8 (35:36):
Up, but they also be telling you to protect yourself better.

Speaker 6 (35:45):
What do you what do you.

Speaker 8 (35:46):
Say to that?

Speaker 12 (35:48):
Hmm, I thought I'd a good job tonight. You need
to protect yourself better looking after me?

Speaker 8 (35:59):
Are you looking forward to the time and you're confident
that eventually this will sort itself out, that you will
play with the aggressiveness that you want to. You will
that the coaches will realize that.

Speaker 2 (36:11):
You're doing that but still protecting you know what I mean?

Speaker 8 (36:13):
This has become a a a major talking point around you.

Speaker 13 (36:16):
Now, Yeah, does.

Speaker 8 (36:19):
Quarterbacks growing phase that you have to get through?

Speaker 6 (36:22):
Is it something different.

Speaker 12 (36:27):
Like I'm gonna keep playing aggressive? No, Hopefully everybody can
take a second to watch my tape going back to
high school and realize that this is not a shock
Like I play the game aggressively. I took one hit
that people are talking about. I slid, got out of
the way, have a lot of hits. So I appreciate

(36:49):
people you know, wanting to you know, me to be
healthy and all that stuff, and I want to be
healthy too. But I play this game aggressive, so I'm
not I'm not. Can I just change how I play
the game.

Speaker 6 (37:05):
Do you think that's why you should have stepped out?

Speaker 12 (37:10):
Oh, it's trying to get the first sound.

Speaker 13 (37:12):
Thanks.

Speaker 1 (37:14):
Our player press conference is brought to you by met Life,
the official insurance company of the New York Giants. And
in a game of the Giants lost on National TV
with Jackson nor as first game back, eighty five percent
of the questions or about one hit that he took
in the first quarter that got up from quickly?

Speaker 3 (37:26):
Look, I took many hits like that. It's the ones
that you don't see that don't hurt. That one didn't hurt.
He didn't lean into like there were times this season
where you've seen Jackson Dart lean into contact of the
the worst.

Speaker 2 (37:40):
Car crashes for people that they're a head on collision.

Speaker 3 (37:44):
Think about the San Francisco game where he got drilled
and then a play later they ran a design QB
run QB sweep I think it was, and he leaned
went into the defender with his head, leaned into the
defender with his head And you looked at that and said, man,
you're probably already concussed and then you're taking another shot

(38:05):
willingly that hit and he said this just now it didn't.

Speaker 2 (38:09):
That doesn't hurt, Like he doesn't.

Speaker 3 (38:10):
You don't feel that one Like his body is off
the ground as I think one foot might have still
been on the gown. It looked really bad because he
went down so fast. Like the force coming from the
linebacker Christian Ellis was was was so strong that it
just forced him to the ground. But that play hurts
if he's leaning into Christian Ellis, Like, if he's trying

(38:32):
to equalize that force, then the then the then the
compression point is so strong that it hurts.

Speaker 2 (38:39):
And he got hit on the shoulder pad and landed
on the shoulder. He got hit where you're protected. So
I promise you I've taken that in a million times.

Speaker 1 (38:48):
Stop asking him about it because it didn't hurt, and
you can tell that he was starting to get I mean,
you give Jackson credit.

Speaker 2 (38:53):
He stayed calm, he answered all the questions.

Speaker 3 (38:54):
But what he's getting tired of it because he did
he has done a better did do a better job
in this game of not taking the hits that he
knows are coming. His problem, as I've watched him this season,
is that he knows that the hit is coming, save
for the one where he can cuss against Chicago because
that he.

Speaker 2 (39:12):
Didn't know what was coming.

Speaker 3 (39:12):
The ball was up in the air, he was trying
to find it and he got slammed to the ground. Yeah,
he's had on the ground that wasn't But for the
most part, the hits that I've worried about are when
he knows that they're coming and he and he acts
like a running back or he acts like a big
a big ball carrier and he's not and he's not
that This one didn't hurt, So it's not it's not
one to talk about for sure, but I and I

(39:33):
get I get why he's frustrated by this because he's right,
we're not playing two hand touch.

Speaker 2 (39:38):
We're playing football. He is a football.

Speaker 3 (39:40):
Player, and it's why you you, you ultimately will love
him as a competitor because he's trying to win the games. Now,
with that being said, the unsportsmanlike conduct penalty on THEO
Johnson I thought was a load of crap.

Speaker 2 (39:53):
He didn't do anything.

Speaker 3 (39:54):
He pushed the guy he went in. I don't think
he really pushed him because his hands weren't even available
to him. He he was leaning forward and kind of
just walked into him and he got a flag throwing
on him, which made it third and eighteen and ultimately
a play that they didn't They didn't it couldn't convert, obviously,
but it just I don't know, I think there was
much to being made about that when it wasn't as

(40:16):
bad as some of the other ones that he's voluntarily
put himself into.

Speaker 2 (40:21):
That wasn't one of those. Let's go to Paul Deatino.

Speaker 1 (40:25):
He just left the Giants locker room waiting to get
on the bus to get to the airport to come
home from Foxborough up there in New England. Paul, give
us the mood in the locker room here. We were
just about to play Ku and Abdul Carter. We have
not played any audio yet. We've just played the two
pressers from from Kafka and Dable. What were some of
the highlights from the locker room after the game.

Speaker 13 (40:43):
Well, obviously a lot of the talk from the media
was about Abdul Carter and him missing a team assignment.
You'll hear from Carter, so I won't tell you about
what he said, but he should have clearly took responsibility
and he is being a campbell for it. Ryan Burns
and Dexter Lawrence and addressing the situation, both said he's

(41:04):
a young player, he's hardheaded, he's making mistakes. He has
to learn from them. Dexter Lawrence in particular said enough
of people have already told him what he needs to
do to learn from this and to move on. No
sense in beating it into him. He just needs to
understand and it's about moving forward. Brian Burns also talked

(41:27):
about how he's a young player. He has to understand accountability,
and so those two guys who are two of the
biggest names and biggest voices in the locker room, they
understand that, you know, Carter has made mistakes and unfortunately,
you know, you got to pay for those mistakes, and
he has. Both were more curious about, even though this

(41:49):
has happened twice, how is he going to respond? And
Dexter's only other comment partially an explanation, but not a
reason or not an excuse. He simply said, the schedule
has been changed up a little bit. It's a little
bit different than what it used to be, but that
doesn't mean you know, you can miss something. You still

(42:09):
need to make sure that you're accountable for whatever that's worth.
At least dexter. They try to explain to folks that
things have changed the way the schedule is being handled
and the different times for the things that they've got
to do.

Speaker 3 (42:22):
Yeah, I can understand that, Paul. Obviously, as a young player,
it's on you, like as a professional, it's your job.
You have to be at work at a certain time.
You have to be there in order to do your
job and to prepare to do your job on Sundays.
But this is unfortunately going to start to become a
talking point.

Speaker 2 (42:41):
And I don't know if Mike Mike Kafka handled.

Speaker 3 (42:44):
It correctly by saying as a coach's decision, it's a
coach's decision.

Speaker 2 (42:48):
It's a coach's decision.

Speaker 3 (42:50):
I know that they want to try to keep these
things in house, but it's just not the era that
we live in where you're just going to let it
go because the coach has so.

Speaker 13 (42:58):
Yeah, I certainly end stand that, and you can imagine
it already is a huge talking point. That was a
very very big idel of discussion in the Giants' locker
room today. Now I can tell you this. I did
talk to Tyrone Tracy. He said he was okay. So
in terms of you know, the potential injury that he
suffered doesn't appear like it's an issue. I talked to

(43:21):
THEO Johnson. He took a helmet hit, as you know,
he stayed in the game. He said he was okay.
I was told that Gonnarozhevsky, who did have to come
out because of concussion protocol. I was told that his
helmet was significantly damaged, paint scraped off it and so forth.
It was bad. The hit that he took was vicious,

(43:43):
for sure, but he did walk out of the locker
room on his own power, and so that's certainly a
very good sign. And I guess the only other thing
of significant note is that in talking to the offensive
players about Jackson Dart, they said he was his normal self.
He operated everything in the huddle like he should operate

(44:04):
as at the Liana scrimmage as always, So they didn't
notice any difference in terms of his confidence or wavering
despite the fact that he was making his return after
having to sit out two weeks of the Publo call, all.

Speaker 1 (44:17):
Right, Paul, I know you're on the buss. You guys
gotta get to the airport. We appreciate the time. Have
a safe flight. We'll see you bright early tomorrow at
the trading center.

Speaker 13 (44:24):
Got it, John, Thanks.

Speaker 1 (44:25):
That's Paul Tatino from Foxport. We're gonna hear from all
those guys. Paul Ticino just spoke about him just a
little bit. But for now, I want to take a
quick time out. We'll come back and we'll hear from
young Waiku. We'll hear from Abdul Carter and a couple
other defensive players as well. Giants again fall to the
Patriots on Monday Night Football thirty three to fifteen.

Speaker 4 (44:41):
You're listening to Giants Extra Point on the WFAN Giants
Radio Network.

Speaker 22 (44:47):
This is Devin Singletary and you're listening to Giants football
on the Fan WFAN and WFAN FM, New York.

Speaker 2 (44:59):
Start sprints out in motion to the right. Singletary is
the tailback.

Speaker 16 (45:04):
He takes the snap, pitches it, no fakes the pitch
to Dark, runs it around the right side. He's to
the tenth, to the five and into the end zone
for a touchdown.

Speaker 2 (45:13):
He took a direct snap, faked an.

Speaker 16 (45:15):
End around at Dark, twenty two yard touchdown run.

Speaker 2 (45:20):
Third time in two weeks.

Speaker 1 (45:21):
A trick play for the Giants turns into a touchdown.
That's on a twenty two yard run from Denvin Singletary
to cap a nine play, sixty five yard drive that
took four minutes and fifteen seconds, traveling from the end
of the third quarter to the fourteen to fifty four
mark of quarter number four.

Speaker 2 (45:37):
It was tonight's scoring.

Speaker 1 (45:39):
Drive of the game, brought to you by Citizens. For
every scoring drive this season, Citizens will donate seven hundred
and fifty dollars of the Giants Foundation to support their
work tackling important community issues, improving all over our.

Speaker 2 (45:49):
Health, and empowering our youth.

Speaker 1 (45:51):
A drive earlier in the game was cut short when
young Wayku was not able to attempt a field goal
on a fourth down and he kind of just dug
his foot into the ground and Jamie Gillan tried to
scramble create a play, ended up getting sacked on the
play and the Giants turned over on down.

Speaker 2 (46:07):
Jng Waight, who talked about that play after the game.

Speaker 11 (46:09):
I wasn't able to kick the ball. The ball was
moving when I was driving to it, so I just pulled.

Speaker 14 (46:13):
Up on him.

Speaker 6 (46:13):
You pulled your leg, It gets stucked here.

Speaker 11 (46:15):
No, No, I couldn't as I was driving to it.
The ball was the bottom of the ball was slipping out,
so I just pulled up on it.

Speaker 2 (46:21):
Does that ever happened for uh?

Speaker 11 (46:24):
Unfortunately? I think it was last year or something. The
ball slipped out and actually like hit the ground, So
that was the same visual. But Jamie Jamie did a
good job of like catching it and putting back. But
at that point it was just too late for me
to drive through it.

Speaker 7 (46:39):
Obviously a tough night overall for special teams. They kick
off return, turn touchdown you and it's been good all year.

Speaker 6 (46:45):
What do you what happened to night?

Speaker 11 (46:49):
We just got a fight, man.

Speaker 6 (46:50):
I mean it's NFL.

Speaker 11 (46:50):
People are going to make plays, you know, But we
just gotta go back to work and just try to
improve each the stage week and just you know, put
put before.

Speaker 1 (47:01):
Yeah, and again you had that kick return to start
the game to get the ball just short of midfield.
Marcus Jones had a ninety four yard punp return for
a touchdown.

Speaker 2 (47:08):
You had that snafu.

Speaker 3 (47:10):
Right When they compound like that, they just become more
I don't noticeable when it's more than one example, and
I get.

Speaker 2 (47:18):
What he's saying.

Speaker 3 (47:19):
And the and theky fumble obviously I kind of forgive
that one because Paul Detino was right when he talked
about Gunner Olschewski's helmet. I mean it was destroyed, like
the decal was gone in on the and why it
was was gone.

Speaker 2 (47:32):
It wasn't there, it was gone. The paint was gone.

Speaker 3 (47:35):
So that tells you how hard uh that that he
was drilled on that play. And obviously it is probably
unconscious for a moment, and uh he obviously lost lost
the football. But young way cool was interesting because I've
never seen that play. I'm sure he's it's happened to
him before. But when you see a kicker just kind
of doff his foot into the ground, it looked like
he was stopping because he thought the defender was in

(47:57):
position to block it. But if the ball is moving,
even the slightest little throw off on a snap hold
kick can throw can throw you off as as a kicker,
and as soon as it doesn't look or feel right,
your instinct is to stop, even if it's even if
you should just try to push through it and and
trust your holder, Jamie Gillen, to get the ball back

(48:19):
to where it's supposed to be. It would it have
been a non completed field goal attempt, probably, but just
the way it looked, and then compounding with everything else
that went wrong with special teams, it's just it's it's
hard not to take notice of it.

Speaker 2 (48:34):
And I get it, I get it.

Speaker 1 (48:35):
Trust right, he just got here a few weeks ago.
Hasn't done this with Jamie Gillen for a long This.

Speaker 3 (48:40):
Isn't a two year operation or an entire training camp
operation that he's used to. And so sometimes when a
kicker or when a when a when a snap hole
doesn't quite get right, if a kicker has trust that
his guy is going to get it back down and
and pointing it in the right direction, laces out the
way that it's supposed to be, you just wait half

(49:00):
a tick, half a beat, and then you go through
with your process. But you're right, they're just not fully
there right now with Yung Wayku, and unfortunately it looks
bad and it's it's gonna be one of those kicks.
It's gonna become mimable because it's just it didn't happen right,
and just his foot stuck in the ground, and he
kind of like it looked like his foot got stuck

(49:20):
when you look at him physically, it looks like he's
just stuck after his pitching wadge sticks into the turf
and and nothing ever happens. The ball doesn't ever move,
And then Jamie Gillen tried to pick it up and
run and make a play with it. He probably could
have thrown the ball away, but it would have been
intentional grounding and either way the ball would have been

(49:40):
back at the forty one or forty two yard line
whatever ended up being as opposed to the thirty where
the ball placement was, and so just a bad operation
all the way around.

Speaker 2 (49:49):
From a special teams unit.

Speaker 1 (49:50):
Today, Giants football is brought to you locally by Ford
while performance and capability at every turn. Get behind the
wheel of a new Ford truck or SUV Ford Official
Truck and SUV of the New York Giants.

Speaker 2 (49:59):
Let's take a time out.

Speaker 1 (50:00):
We'll come back here from Abdul Carter and Dexter Lawrence
before we say goodbye.

Speaker 2 (50:03):
To the affiliates on our network. We'll be right back
after this.

Speaker 4 (50:06):
You're listening to Giants Extra Point on the w FAN
Giants Radio network.

Speaker 23 (50:11):
This is Abdua Carter and you're listening to Giants football
on the Fan, w FA N and w FA N
FM New York.

Speaker 1 (50:19):
Back here on Giants extra point John Schmulk Tiki Barber
Giants fall to the Patriots on Monday Night Football thirty
three to fifteen. They are now two and eleven. Abdua
Carter did not play in the first quarter of this game.
Mike Kafka would not elaborate other than it was his decision,
a coach's decision. Here's what Abdul Carter had to say
after the game.

Speaker 23 (50:35):
I mean, I'll let my team down to the first
two drovers. I was out they excore seventeen points.

Speaker 13 (50:41):
I take that.

Speaker 2 (50:41):
I take responsiblity for that.

Speaker 6 (50:42):
I gotta be out there.

Speaker 17 (50:43):
Ye'll be back. Do you fail them?

Speaker 12 (50:46):
Mess have to go through?

Speaker 8 (50:47):
Yeah, this is this is this has not happening for
five coach so.

Speaker 5 (50:56):
Happening since he's given coach.

Speaker 1 (50:59):
Fifty enough doing or its experience.

Speaker 2 (51:01):
No, it's it's not him.

Speaker 20 (51:02):
It's me. It's not him.

Speaker 6 (51:04):
What's the it you get said it? It got through
this time?

Speaker 12 (51:07):
What what's different this time as opposed to the first time?

Speaker 23 (51:10):
The wife after, I wanna say it's something different.

Speaker 6 (51:12):
It's just like I just gotta be better than.

Speaker 2 (51:15):
Something with that.

Speaker 7 (51:16):
What's that feeling when you're sitting on the bench or
just standing on the sidelines watching.

Speaker 6 (51:20):
Me play sick six of my stomach.

Speaker 23 (51:26):
I address your teammates, you know, tell me as it
ain't no, ain't know where it know.

Speaker 6 (51:32):
You know how I feel, You know where I stand.

Speaker 2 (51:34):
Like I said, I looking down there.

Speaker 6 (51:36):
When did you find out if you were gonna play
the first word? I've been moving earlier too. How difficult
I have st least last few weeks been for.

Speaker 23 (51:43):
You hasn't been the best. But like I said, you
keep moving on to keep persevering. I've been through worst things.

Speaker 24 (51:49):
So, like I said, I'd be that off of the
old has the acclamation than the NFL A little bit
more challenging than you're expected.

Speaker 23 (51:57):
I mean, I guess you could say that, but I don't.
I'm not gonna use that as an excuse. Like I said,
I gotta be better. I gotta take part in what
I do where I have to be at simple with that.

Speaker 2 (52:07):
That's Abdul Carter.

Speaker 1 (52:08):
Now let's go to Dexter Lawrence, who talked about the
Abdul Qrter situation in the game.

Speaker 6 (52:12):
It's like this, Oh yeah, the story of the game.

Speaker 7 (52:13):
The story of the season has been the ones that
got away. Does this one hurt hit worse because it
was noncompetitive?

Speaker 22 (52:21):
I think we started so second half we came out
and played better. I think that's what the biggest thing.

Speaker 2 (52:28):
Didn't feel like the game was.

Speaker 22 (52:30):
Over at after No, it wasn't the fourth quarter with
four zeros on the club, so it wasn't.

Speaker 6 (52:35):
It's never over.

Speaker 9 (52:37):
What what do.

Speaker 20 (52:38):
You think the what do you think?

Speaker 6 (52:42):
I thought it was good.

Speaker 22 (52:44):
I mean I'm not like in the headset or any
think so I don't so you know whatever I think
you know here was responding well than adjustin.

Speaker 10 (52:52):
Will then a different feel for you, like anything different
for your guys with him calling very the sham.

Speaker 22 (52:58):
Uh not necessarily. I mean still still seeing defense come
on with the same people.

Speaker 6 (53:07):
So it's just I don't know it. I mean it
just felt it.

Speaker 22 (53:12):
I didn't seen a lot of stuff moving and shaking,
so it all feel the same at at some point.

Speaker 6 (53:19):
How do you feel?

Speaker 7 (53:20):
How did you feel out there and how do you
feel coming out of it after last week?

Speaker 17 (53:23):
Oh?

Speaker 22 (53:23):
I feel I feel good. I feel good. I feel
good going out there. Uh did I'll play enough places
for y'all?

Speaker 2 (53:32):
I don't have the tracker til tomorrow, but I had
to take. Does it affect you then? Does the elbow
like is it something your No?

Speaker 6 (53:40):
I thought I like you, I thought No, I felt
good out there.

Speaker 22 (53:45):
It's it wasn't really the same injury or towards the
same injury as a different part, you know, just of
the elbow or whatever, more the forearm type of thing.
But I felt fun. I feel good.

Speaker 6 (53:59):
You got you obviously you're a team captain.

Speaker 7 (54:01):
You guys have a recurring problem with Abdul Carter missing
some responsibilities and getting batched. What do you need to
see from him?

Speaker 17 (54:10):
Uh?

Speaker 6 (54:10):
Just grow up? Really, you know, just you know, I
think he loves football.

Speaker 22 (54:16):
He takes it serious and his approach to the game
is really good.

Speaker 6 (54:21):
You know, just young stuff that you know that just
can't happen.

Speaker 10 (54:25):
The natural thinking would be like, why didn't he learn
his lesson the first time?

Speaker 6 (54:28):
You know, what do you say to that hardheaded man?
Hard headed?

Speaker 18 (54:33):
Uh?

Speaker 6 (54:35):
Oh, I don't know. It's and and and I mean
to his defense?

Speaker 17 (54:40):
Is it like.

Speaker 22 (54:41):
The the schedule is kind of shaky a little bit,
but you gotta be a pro and note where you
gotta be and what you.

Speaker 6 (54:49):
Gotta be there shaky you mean changing kind of deal.

Speaker 22 (54:53):
Uh, it changed, but it ain't. It's not like changing
every day. It's just it's char So you just gottadjust.

Speaker 6 (55:02):
How frustrating is that for you?

Speaker 10 (55:03):
Though you're frustrated, you know, like you're putting it all
this time, You're putting in all this energy. Maybe it's
not being reciprocated by everybody E that's in here. Obviously
you gotta be disciplined for a second time in three weeks.

Speaker 22 (55:13):
Uh yeah, I mean it's definitely frustrating. But you gotta
stay on him and you gotta help him learn from
these mistakes. You know, we all mean, we all been late,
we all been you know, have moments like that.

Speaker 6 (55:26):
But you just gotta learn from that, specifically about this issue.

Speaker 22 (55:31):
I mean, I think enough people talking to himself. I'm
not gonna beat the drum too much, you know. I
just encourage him and tell him to respond will, And
that's what it's all about.

Speaker 7 (55:41):
Cant Can you appreciate Kafka in his spot trying to
set a mark of accountability.

Speaker 6 (55:47):
Uh, for sure.

Speaker 22 (55:48):
And that's why I just tell him to respond will,
And that's and that's all you can do.

Speaker 6 (55:52):
In a position like.

Speaker 10 (55:53):
That, do you feel the responsibility on your shoulders, like
if you're a captain obviously been here well or do
you just leave that Brian No.

Speaker 6 (56:01):
I mean, like I said, I talked to him. I
talked to him. I just don't. I don't beat the bush.
I mean I don't.

Speaker 22 (56:06):
I don't keep beating the drum over and over, over
and over. He's hearing it from a lot of people.
So I just encourage him and let him know, like
you know, just you gotta be a pro.

Speaker 13 (56:15):
That's it.

Speaker 22 (56:15):
Like I don't talk about the situation or whatever. I
just tell me to respond and be a pro.

Speaker 1 (56:20):
All right, Let's go to the third second leader on
this team, third defensive player, Brian Burns.

Speaker 2 (56:24):
After the game, I'll have him alone the way you.

Speaker 6 (56:26):
Know year, this rookie year.

Speaker 13 (56:28):
So just trying to help you much.

Speaker 6 (56:30):
Second, keep the message just getting through see him. I mean,
I know, the second time in three weeks. Why it
happen makes your kind of think, you know, he needs.

Speaker 10 (56:39):
Sign getting through the way to go battle.

Speaker 13 (56:44):
I think you think.

Speaker 24 (56:47):
I think he's a honest mistake.

Speaker 20 (56:49):
Alright, just what you inspired I usually sit going to
get into after that, I just said.

Speaker 14 (57:00):
A little bit longer than they but.

Speaker 24 (57:02):
Just how quick they got up on us. You know,
like I said, they execute well all all.

Speaker 1 (57:08):
Three bases and better than he did.

Speaker 20 (57:10):
And that's kind of swooping up in my head. How
we can be better get back in the game, right
I I, I know you mentioned they.

Speaker 21 (57:16):
Can get things that he sits got full to Abdul.

Speaker 25 (57:19):
He's not the only rookie on this team, but he.

Speaker 12 (57:23):
Is the only one that's that's been bunched up twice
in the last three weeks.

Speaker 25 (57:26):
So I guess, big Rich break why why do you
think Discat talking us was one of.

Speaker 26 (57:31):
The leaders on the homes So when he.

Speaker 25 (57:32):
Gets to know him and sees him quite often and
certainly what we do, he's.

Speaker 6 (57:35):
Just honest mistake, you know, he's human.

Speaker 24 (57:38):
He makes mistakes, you know, right at the end of
the day, he does have to be a pro and
he does have to you know, take accountability, which he
did for whatever happened. But I'm just trying to help him,
you best he can, and try.

Speaker 6 (57:52):
To help him do this what he can't be bright.
We'll take a couple more.

Speaker 2 (57:55):
You were rookie once, Yeah, did you.

Speaker 8 (57:58):
Have problems adjusting the life rules and the regulations.

Speaker 6 (58:05):
Do you remember back to that? I mean do some
guys do some guys don't.

Speaker 2 (58:09):
It seems like he is.

Speaker 24 (58:10):
I think everybody go through you know, Ricky Paynes when
you just now getting to the league.

Speaker 2 (58:14):
Everybody has different different challenges.

Speaker 6 (58:17):
I had mine.

Speaker 24 (58:18):
You know, he's dealing with his as.

Speaker 20 (58:19):
Long as he takes accountability and you know.

Speaker 17 (58:22):
Take it like a man.

Speaker 14 (58:23):
And I mean, I can't.

Speaker 2 (58:25):
You know, we all make mistakes, all right.

Speaker 1 (58:27):
Take you heard from Abdul Carter and the two leaders
on defense nex To Lawrence and Brian Burns.

Speaker 2 (58:32):
Your thoughts, Yeah, I think.

Speaker 3 (58:33):
They're all saying the right things, most importantly Abdul Carter,
and he didn't want to have excuses made for him.

Speaker 2 (58:39):
He took responsibility for it.

Speaker 3 (58:41):
And even though Mike Africa is trying to defer and
say it's coaches decision, well, we don't know what it's about.
And we knew that Abdul Carter would address it. And
I'm glad that he did instead of you know, waiting
and getting all irate on social media like he did
the last time, he addressed it head on. And you
have to do those things as a young player at
the end of the day, he's a rookie, and rookies

(59:02):
do make dumb, bone headed things sometimes and they become
distractions for a team. The last thing you want to
be is a distraction. You want to be a pro.
You want to be counted on. You want your teammates
to know that every week they can count on you
to be available and to be a baller.

Speaker 2 (59:20):
And I think in time he gets there.

Speaker 3 (59:22):
I know a lot of people are ready to throw
the bus stag on him, but I'm not there yet
with him. I think he's still got a lot of
good football left in him, and he's going to grow
and he's going to learn from these things, not only
as a player, you know, and learning different ways to
attack the quarterback and be disciplined in his rush lanes, etc.
Run fit lanes as well. But it's a grind man.

(59:43):
We talk about this with Jackson Dart and taking the hits.
The same thing applies to all rookies in this league.
It's a different game than what you played in college.
You're not going to dominate unless you're just physically overpowering.
And he's a skilled edge rusher and he's got to
learn to harness that skill the right way. Most important
thing is he's he's got to put in the work
in the in the week, in the work week, and

(01:00:06):
I think he addressed it.

Speaker 2 (01:00:07):
I think Dex addressed it the right way as well.

Speaker 3 (01:00:09):
You have conversations with him, but you're not gonna continue
to burn the bush and beat the drum as he
was trying to say, and make the kid feel bad
because he is standing up for it. He is saying
all the right things and that's really all he can
do at this point. Yeah, Carter sat up there, faced
the music and took responsibility for it absolutely. And the
other part of that I want to talk to you

(01:00:29):
about Tiki Dexter. Lawrence hurt his elbow last week, only
played about fifty percent of the snaps. Early tracking for
PFF had him around seventy four percent of the snaps
YEP this week forty eight of the sixty five Giants
defensive snaps.

Speaker 2 (01:00:41):
So it's great to see that that elbow healed so quickly.

Speaker 3 (01:00:43):
Yeah, well look, and again, you don't know what those
elbows injuries are. I don't remember exactly what it was
last season that it sat him down here.

Speaker 2 (01:00:52):
It was just hyper extended, hyper extended but.

Speaker 3 (01:00:54):
The thing is, you know that I know this at least,
and you should for two as well, covering sports as
long as you havea uh, if you know baseball, you
don't know what those things, those UCL injuries they manifest
his forearm injuries, and you don't know exactly what it
what it is, and he said it was more of
a forearm thing.

Speaker 2 (01:01:11):
And so sometimes it just feels bad.

Speaker 3 (01:01:14):
Sometimes it's seasons long and you're you're constantly in double teams,
you're constantly locking out. There's a couple of good plays
I saw of Dexter h early in this game where
he's locking out and controlling the center and he's he's
creating a two way go for himself, so he's he's
basically covering both gaps to his left end to his right.

(01:01:34):
And so he looked, he looked Okay. Now I didn't
have the impact that I think where we all desire
for Dexter Lawrence, but he looked healthy I think in
this game, and he felt it felt just listening to
him that he's he's in a better place than he
was a couple of weeks ago. Yeah, quiet game for
Dexter does not get credited for a pressure in this game,

(01:01:54):
but again, four games to go and we'll see where
the Giants had from here.

Speaker 2 (01:01:59):
Please take what with us if you're listening on our.

Speaker 1 (01:02:01):
Local flagstipstation WFN in New York City on the surrounding areas.
But right now it's time to say goodbye to our
affiliates across the country on the Giants Radio Network. Our
next broadcast will be in thirteen days on December fourteenth,
when the Giants host the Washington Commanders of at Life Stadium.
Our pregame show we'll begin on the network at noon.
Thanks for being with us today for continuing to cover

(01:02:23):
the Giants all week long. Check out Big Blue Kickoff
Live and the Giants Total Podcast. Both those shows can
be found in the Giants YouTube channel, Giants App and
Giants dot Com. You can also find the archive on
podcast platforms everywhere. Big Blue Kickoff Live is live every
day at twelve thirty.

Speaker 2 (01:02:38):
Thanks you being with us once again.

Speaker 1 (01:02:39):
The final score the Giants fall to the New England
Patriots thirty three to fifteen. They are now two and
eleven heading into the buy. We'll see in thirteen days
on the WFN Giants Radio Network.

Speaker 2 (01:02:52):
Who's still got about half hours.

Speaker 1 (01:02:54):
So here on wfan TIK and I will take your
calls at eight eight eight eight oh eight one zero
one to nine and continue breaking things down when we
return after this.

Speaker 25 (01:03:02):
On the fan, this is Jackson Dart and you're listening
to Giants Football on the fan w FA N and
w f A N FM, New York.

Speaker 2 (01:03:21):
Back here on Giants Extra Point.

Speaker 1 (01:03:22):
We'll take your calls at eighty to eight eight o
eight one zero one nine until chrismicmdele comes your way
when our show concludes. In the meantime, before we get
to your calls, Harvey, we see you. Everyone else, get
on the line, will kill you up THEO. Johnson was
in the locker room after the game.

Speaker 21 (01:03:38):
Field before you hear it, all of a sudden, it
seemed like it was seventeen nothing there in the first quarter.
They struck quickly and in a variety of ways. How
difficult was that to come out of that early hole.

Speaker 18 (01:03:49):
I mean, we definitely didn't start the game we wanted
the way we wanted to. We had a lot of
opportunities to come back, but definitely not the way you
want to start a football game.

Speaker 21 (01:03:57):
This team has done a good job on its first
drive for a lot of the season and getting quick scores.
What was it working right? That was this joint that
that did not allow you to get an early score.

Speaker 18 (01:04:09):
Yeah, I think they had a good plan for us
coming out. I think we just got to do a
better guy of executing the players are called, But I
think they had a good plan for us.

Speaker 21 (01:04:19):
You were one of the players who wound up taking
a helmet hit. It seemed like they were overly aggressive
from the very beginning, almost like they were trying to
prove some kind of point. When stuff is borderline like that,
how does that impact how you're going to play the game?

Speaker 18 (01:04:33):
I mean, every single time you play your helmet on,
you're expecting to play a physical brand of football. That's
how we do things here. So we kind of knew
that going into it. That's kind of what they try
and hang their hat on. I think we needed to
do a better job of combating that.

Speaker 21 (01:04:49):
When you look at Jackson today, it was his first
coming back after being in the protocol for a couple
of weeks. What did you see from him in terms
of his confidence, his demeanor in the huddle, at the
line of screen, how did he look at you?

Speaker 18 (01:05:01):
I mean, he looked like the same confident Uh. You know,
a young kid we've seen all season. I thought he
did a great job today. You just got to keep
building across the board.

Speaker 21 (01:05:12):
Appreciate your time for you.

Speaker 1 (01:05:13):
All right, let's rip through these calls, Teak. Let's go
to Harvey and Dix Hills, who lead us off today.

Speaker 15 (01:05:18):
Harvey, how are you all? It's not easy to make
a call after these games. I'll tell you that right now.
But I once told you one. I think it was
Eddie Eddie Robinson from Grambling said either get a play
or get a player. Either get a better player or
get a player better. And I'm just asking you the
first point, your question, your answer. Have the the giant

(01:05:42):
coaches made the players better or not?

Speaker 20 (01:05:48):
Hey?

Speaker 2 (01:05:48):
Some of them?

Speaker 3 (01:05:48):
Yes, I think we've seen Wanda Robinson become a better player.

Speaker 2 (01:05:53):
Courtel flot quotel Flat has.

Speaker 3 (01:05:54):
Become a better player even though he gave up the
first touchdown of the season today. Uh, Mike McFadden, even
though he hasn't played a lot this season.

Speaker 2 (01:06:03):
You're right, so some of them have.

Speaker 3 (01:06:04):
Actually, I think Brian Burns has become a better player
in his in his two seasons here and So.

Speaker 15 (01:06:11):
That's one of the problems is this is a game
of compliment. Look, you and Colin talk to John talking
about the complimentary football. It's not an individual game. It
is occasionally it's it's a unit game. Whether it's the
defensive backs, it was the linebackers. It's coordinating a unit.
It's like a dance.

Speaker 2 (01:06:29):
Well, no, you're right.

Speaker 3 (01:06:29):
About that, Harvey, because they haven't gotten better together. And
I heard carl talking about this in the in the pregame,
but when they're hit before the game, talking about how
there are individuals that are having outstanding seasons. Right, Brian
Burns is certainly one of them, but it's not everybody,
and and and that's what frustrates you from a from
a from a evaluating the coach standpoint.

Speaker 2 (01:06:51):
But we obviously know that the staff is going to change.

Speaker 15 (01:06:54):
Look, I'm not in the locker room. I don't know
these coaches. I mean, do I know that Charlie Bullen,
the linebacker coach, is going to be a great defasic coordiny.
I don't know that is Coffer gonna be. I don't know.
I mean, you you know them better than I do.
You and John Ticking and my hope is that they do,
is that they have better scouts, better coaches, and they

(01:07:15):
and they put it all together like Grabel does in
La Come on, he's made the players much better there.

Speaker 2 (01:07:21):
Yeah, you mean in New England And obviously was that
way in Tennessee as well. It's it's it's I think.

Speaker 3 (01:07:27):
Part of being a good coach is creating the expectation
that is uncompromising, that is that is a must have
every single week. And I feel like this team is
trying to do that. This coaching staff is trying to
do that. But ultimately it does come down to the
guys executing on the sun on on in this case
on Monday night, but usually on Sunday afternoons, and making

(01:07:48):
those plays and being where you're supposed to be. And
that's not always the case some of it sometimes, is it.
When you're losing, it gets really hard not to try
to do someone else's job. And you hear this the
cliche over and over and over again. He got to
do my one eleventh, got to do my one eleventh.
That is your job and your moment while also helping
the guys around you be better. And that's where the

(01:08:09):
challenge is right now with this Giants team, especially defensively. Yeah,
and look your best players, and a lot of the
Giants resources are spent on some big time defensive players
taking they whether it's the recent free agent editions or
guys that have been here, or draft picks, guys that
they traded for.

Speaker 1 (01:08:24):
Except for Brian Burns has made a ton of plays.
Not enough guys that have made big game changing plays on
the defensive side of the ball. No, you're right, and
look the touchdown to Kyle Williams. And again, I'm gonna
have to go look at it again. I haven't fully
seen the All twenty two, but it feels it feels.

Speaker 2 (01:08:40):
Like it was.

Speaker 3 (01:08:40):
They were inverting into three and so Paulson and Deebo
had the deep third on that Kyle Williams play and
he just he's not fast enough. He's not fast enough
to be a corner. That inverts back to being a
deep safety and Kyle Williams just ran by him. So
because you're from Drake, you're from Drake May's standpoint. That
is a man demand opportunity, even though it's not.

Speaker 2 (01:09:01):
It's a zone.

Speaker 3 (01:09:02):
They're dropping into a zone, and that they had the
All mug. They're dropping into these into these voids. The
safety's coming down filling the flat void. The corner's got
to get back and get into that deep third. And
he's just not athletic enough. He just he gets out run.
And Drake May as I mean, unfortunately, and John asked
me about this.

Speaker 2 (01:09:21):
What I like about Drake May is that he layers and.

Speaker 3 (01:09:24):
Throws with the perfect touch, especially deep balls to his guys.

Speaker 2 (01:09:28):
It's like he's been doing this for five years.

Speaker 17 (01:09:32):
Right.

Speaker 2 (01:09:32):
He puts the ball exactly where it needs to be.

Speaker 3 (01:09:34):
You saw it on the touchdown in the corner over
Courtel Flat as well.

Speaker 2 (01:09:38):
The ball is exactly where it needed to be weighted.

Speaker 3 (01:09:42):
Right before the sideline, just over the outreached arms of
Courtel Flot for a touchdown earlier in this game. And
so they're well coached and they're well drilled on doing
the right things and moments and making those plays in
the moments.

Speaker 2 (01:09:58):
And the Giants got to figure out how to do that.
All right, Let's go to Walt in ocean Port. He's
up next. What what's happening?

Speaker 9 (01:10:03):
Then?

Speaker 2 (01:10:04):
What's up? Walt?

Speaker 17 (01:10:06):
Hey? Uh? What's going on?

Speaker 13 (01:10:07):
To Key.

Speaker 17 (01:10:10):
Yesh? Listen? I love your analysis? Okay, Like from two
to six every day because I listened to you and
you have an awesome radio show. You are a savant, okay,
and you are an awesome running back for the Giants.
And I'm a giant face okay. And but you know

(01:10:32):
where I got into a little difference last night, okay
with c Mac was I didn't see the reason to
play Jackson dark, you know, because you know we're two
and nine or two you know, you know, you know
he's coming out of protocol. Yeah, yeah, and we've seen enough. Okay,

(01:10:57):
do you want to rest on.

Speaker 2 (01:10:58):
The rest of the year, Walter, just in this game? Yea,
what do you want to see? What don't you want
to say?

Speaker 17 (01:11:02):
I don't want to bubble I don't want to bubble
wrap them. But it sounds like but but but well, okay,
well you can school me in that, because you know,
you're an NFL player and you're, you know, a superstar.
You should be in the Hall of Fame. And I
hope Scott you go to the Hall of Fame with
your brother, because you should. But you know, I don't

(01:11:24):
want to bubble wrap them. But I mean, like you know,
Jameis Winston is thirty and thirty, I mean like you're
thirty touchdowns thirty you know.

Speaker 2 (01:11:31):
Five back a couple of years ago, twenty nineteen.

Speaker 17 (01:11:34):
Okay, all right, fine, but you know the Giants just
need wins, okay, And you know at this moment in time,
it's just we just need winning. Okay. I love the coach. Okay,
I love the coach that we have, Taska, And you know,
now we're all around like looking around the universe, you know,
looking for a coach. This guy is good enough. Okay,

(01:11:58):
our defense, Well.

Speaker 3 (01:12:00):
Let me ask you this wall, does it do you
feel like because j Jackson is still learning and he's
had the concussion issues, that that jamis Because I agree
with you, winning is the only thing. Look what it
did for the Jets. I mean, you're you're, I mean,
you're you're paying attention to the Jets, even though you're
not a Jet fan.

Speaker 2 (01:12:17):
Winning a game feels so it feels so damn good.

Speaker 3 (01:12:20):
So I think, what are you asking if Jamis gives
him a better chance of winning right now?

Speaker 17 (01:12:25):
Yes, that's the question.

Speaker 3 (01:12:27):
Yeah, I mean, and that is a fair question, And
the answer might be yes, because there's still so much
that Jackson Dart has to learn about about winning, about
being on time about you know, keeping drives going and
not making mistakes. But I would I would argue that
today that wasn't on Jackson Dart. That was on THEO

(01:12:50):
Johnson making plays. That was on you know, the defense
not giving up you know some of these these these gashers.
That's about the special teams not being an utter liability
this evening against against the Patriots on the road. And
so it's partly Jackson Dart. And maybe Jamis does because
of his experience and his confidence standing tall in the

(01:13:12):
pocket and delivering the ball where it needs to be.
But he's Jackson Dart's got to learn. He's got a
couple of things. He's got to learn. One how to
manage a game, which I think he's he's doing pretty well.
Two staying healthy. But then three, and this is the
most important one. Winning like creating a winning situation. And
I gotta argue, most of the time this season he's

(01:13:32):
been he's done that right this game notwithstanding, because it
felt like it was never a game after the you know,
the middle of the second quarter. But I can't argue
putting him down is gonna make him better, even if
Jamis in the short term gives you a better chance
to win a particular game and take he.

Speaker 1 (01:13:51):
That's the thing young players have to play to get better, right,
And you would much rather have Dart make some of
those rookie mistakes and learn things in games that are
not going to impact your playoff position.

Speaker 2 (01:14:04):
Right, Yeah, you have four games. Let him make mistakes.

Speaker 1 (01:14:07):
Let him learn from his mistakes in these four games,
because you can. It's not gonna hurt you. You're already
done in terms of the standings. You're eliminated from playoffs,
from postseason contention. This is a perfect situation for him
to play.

Speaker 3 (01:14:18):
And learn that a lot. We saw a little bit
with this with Drake May last year. They weren't good
and they were a bad team. And you know, we
had Scott Zolac on before the before the in the
pregame talking about how Drake May learned a lot from
last year. But they went three games, four game, whatever
it was. And you see the experience and the ability

(01:14:39):
to recognize what's happening to you as a player because
you've seen it. Right, It's the one thing to watch
all that stuff on tape and I can sit back
and watch it and say, oh, he should have done this,
or he should have done that. But I'm trying to
think of the of the moments because there would have
to be multiple of them where Jackson Dart looked over match.
I didn't feel that at all in this game, and
I haven't felt it really for much of is his

(01:15:01):
tenure here as a starter in his eight starts other
than the New England or the New Orleans game where.

Speaker 2 (01:15:06):
He had those had a fumble, those couple.

Speaker 3 (01:15:10):
Of interceptions at the end of the game, but I
almost honestly didn't mind those. He's trying to make this game,
make it a comeback win. He has never looked overwhelmed.
He has not looked overwhelmed. The only thing you could
argue is is the health house health side of it.
And that one hit notwithstanding, which I don't even think
was a hard hit. He's not going to feel, you know,
the physicality of that hit. And that was the only

(01:15:34):
thing that was an issue today, and it was got
harped on.

Speaker 2 (01:15:37):
But I don't think it was as big a deal
as it was being made out to be.

Speaker 1 (01:15:39):
All let's take our final time out, we'll come back,
get through the rest of our calls, wrap things up,
and then Chris Bigmodil comes your way on the overnight
right here on the fan and we'll be right back.

Speaker 2 (01:15:48):
Giants fall to the Patriots thirty three to fifteen.

Speaker 5 (01:15:50):
This is Mike Kafka, head coach of the New York Giants,
and you're listening to the radio home of Big Blue
the Fan, WFAN and Wfan FM.

Speaker 1 (01:15:57):
New York Giants TV, presented by Bob's Just Goh Furniture,
is the official connected TV app of the New York Giants,
available for free on Apple TV, rok Who, Amazon Fire TV,
and Inside the Giants Mobile app. Stream game highlights, interviews,
TV shows, and more exclusive video content with Giants TV.
Let's go to Mike and Clifton Parki's up next, Mike,
what's going on?

Speaker 19 (01:16:14):
And Mike, Hey, So I'm watching the game and what
I'm thinking about is the culture on the Giants is
pretty weak. And I'm thinking the Giants represent weak parenting
and the Patriots represents strong parenting. And when you have
strong parents, you have capable children that do a good job.

(01:16:35):
When you're weak parenting, you have children that have boundary issues,
don't who who are saft, don't do a good job.
So the parents are the GM all the way down.
Time to let the weak parents go. We need a
new set of parents to come in. I'm worried about
our rookies and our future rookies. Time to clean everything

(01:16:59):
up here.

Speaker 2 (01:17:00):
Uh yeah, no, I appreciate you, my Cai like this.
There's some truth to that.

Speaker 3 (01:17:04):
I do think that also with young parents, as is
the case with this staff right now. Mike kafka Is
has not been a coach for a really long time,
even though he's got a lot of experience, a lot
of it with the Kent City Chiefs now in his
first stint trying to be the head coach or learning
on the job how to be a head coach, Charlie

(01:17:24):
Bullen being a defensive coordinator. It's just there are there
is a there's a culture that has to be you know,
created and then built and puffed up and blown up
so that it becomes ubiquitous, it becomes everywhere, it exists
in every part of that building. And this team is
still really young, as you know, and I don't want
to make an excuse for them, but there at the

(01:17:45):
beginning of the season, I think the fourth youngest team
in the NFL, and it's probably even younger now because
of some of these young players that have had to
rise to the occasion and and and have to play
right now. But it's also not an excuse. It's still
a professional game. You're still getting paid to do a job,
and if you don't do it well, people lose their

(01:18:07):
jobs head coaches, and ultimately we've moved on from a
lot of the coaches on this staff.

Speaker 2 (01:18:12):
Eventually it's gonna be the players.

Speaker 3 (01:18:13):
I think, you know, going in the bye week, this
is a it's a soul searching moment, and it's a
cliche to say that, but it really is. You're gonna
come out of this bye week, You're gonna hopefully get
some rest. Guys like Tyrone, Tracy and others will try
to get healthy, and they have to finish the season strong.
I'm not saying that they have now winnable games, but
they have an easier schedule on the backside, and those games,

(01:18:35):
while they feel meaningless because they're sitting at two.

Speaker 2 (01:18:38):
And eleven right now, they are also very important.

Speaker 3 (01:18:43):
And at the very least from a player standpoint, you're
trying to figure out, am I are convinced this organization,
Am I going to be here next year, or am
I gonna be on the street looking for something else
to do for a living or somewhere else looking for
to get a job. And that's the importance of the
end of this regular season for the Giants. It's not
meaningful football. You're in December right now. It feels like

(01:19:06):
you have nothing to play for. But the last thing
you need is for guys to want to just check
out and start thinking about their vacation plans because it's
important for their careers even though they're young going forward.

Speaker 20 (01:19:17):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:19:18):
I'm not a believer of this all it carries over
the next year. Every team is different. I don't believe
in that stuff.

Speaker 2 (01:19:23):
But for individual players development, I think it does mean.

Speaker 3 (01:19:26):
I mean it worked for for Dan Campbell and in Detroit. Yeah,
but you know, you don't know if the same head
coach is even gonna be here. Well that's that's that's
the difference, right is it. That was the early stages
of Dan Campbell. It was you could feel you knew
what the culture was, you know, even if you were
laughing at him talking about bite meee caps and stuff,

(01:19:47):
but you felt like these guys, if they if they
care and they're listening to their coach.

Speaker 2 (01:19:52):
They are going to be biting me.

Speaker 1 (01:19:54):
Caps that does not get established all on the final
four games of a loss.

Speaker 3 (01:19:57):
Suits that would gets established at the beginning in the summer,
in the spring. And now you've had a culture change
already because of the head coach being being being dismissed,
and Mike Kafka is learning on the job and learning
some of these decisions that he has to make.

Speaker 2 (01:20:12):
How to discipline players.

Speaker 3 (01:20:13):
We've seen that already with with Abdul carter Uh and
then ultimately how to make the in game decisions. They're
going to put you in position and put them the
players in position to win.

Speaker 2 (01:20:22):
All right, let's go to Robbie and Lennox. He's up next, Robbie, Robbie, Hey, guys.

Speaker 14 (01:20:26):
Thanks for taking my call. Listen, I'm really frustrated. So
let's go through three phases. First, we're going to talk
about Jackson Dart. I agree with everything Tiki said. He
needs to play. Look, there's no vertical game down the field.
There's nobody I can catch anything. Even Slayton can't catch
the ball, and we all know that happen.

Speaker 2 (01:20:41):
Well, I did have a he did have a great
hands catch.

Speaker 14 (01:20:46):
Okay, Jackson looks like fran Tulkington.

Speaker 17 (01:20:48):
I think.

Speaker 14 (01:20:50):
Frid was my first football here, so he did look
like I'm listening. Look, look, I'm all for Jackson playing. Okay,
I love Jackson dark protect yourself better, though, kid, all right,
I love this kid. This kid is gonna be a player,
who's no doubt in my mind. Right, But he needs
he needs he needs coaching and protection. Get rid of
the wall quicker. First of all, Mike Cops has got
to go. First of all, he looks I don't want
to have him give any kind of vulcan neck pinch

(01:21:11):
guys because he looks like mister Spock. Right, I can't
take it. All right, that's the first, right, Let's get
that out of the way.

Speaker 1 (01:21:17):
All right.

Speaker 14 (01:21:17):
Secondly, right, let's talk about let's talk about his stupid
calls here? What is he mister pucellanimous? I thought that
was Brian Dable. Here's king of the pucellanimous role. Here,
it's a half? Was it a happy yard? You got
a twenty point deficit, and you're gonna do this. You're
gonna try to make them jump off signs. And they
kicked the ball back to him. Since the worst defense

(01:21:38):
I've ever seen in my life is a giant fan Tiki.
Even in the seventies, I could be proud to watch
Jack Gregory and Jack Mendenhall and Brian Kelly. Okay, and
those guys at least were pretty good. This defense is
an absolute embarrassment. And it's not even about coordinators anymore,
because right now Brian Dabele Okay, Shane food and they're
having a big cigar and a couple of beers in

(01:21:59):
the hotel and going it's not me, it's the GM,
it's the talent. But it's also effort. And they missed Tis.
Let's be honest. They do miss TIBs Okay on the
right side, Yeah they do. But the fact seven stink.

Speaker 3 (01:22:11):
Now.

Speaker 14 (01:22:12):
Look, I think I think the kid they got from
Miami's pretty good just getting the quote. Yeah, I think
Hollind is pretty talented. Okay, I think he's a good player,
and I think Drew Phillips has a chance to be
an all propri droomates do any mistakes, But come on,
can we please next year go out whoever comes in,
go in and get me a linebacker? Please say Tonio
Pearce is gonna probably come in and play or something
because the last time they had linebacker teak.

Speaker 3 (01:22:34):
Let me ask you this, Robbie, you bring up something interesting.
Hold on, you bring up something interesting, because what can't
happen is guys getting around. I remember having this early,
you know, when we were when we were struggling, we'd
have we'd call it the hot box. You get into that,
you get into the uh, into the sauna, and that's
where you guys would just talk and you couldn't be

(01:22:55):
offended no matter what was said. You couldn't be defended
if you got heated, get out right and so. But
but you needed, you needed that kind of real talk.
And the last thing you need, and you alluded to this, Robbie,
is them starting to say, well, you know, it's the coach.
He's not putting me in the best position to excel,
you know. And it's the play call that wasn't a good.

Speaker 2 (01:23:14):
Call for me.

Speaker 3 (01:23:16):
It's now about finding ways to make even if it
is a bad call.

Speaker 14 (01:23:21):
Confidence ticky to get a happy yard when you're down
by twenty four.

Speaker 19 (01:23:23):
I agree with that.

Speaker 2 (01:23:24):
At that point, nothing had nothing to lose.

Speaker 3 (01:23:28):
Yeah, you're down by twenty you're gonna be and you're
gonna be aggressive. That's your at your mantra. That's what
Mike Kaska has said. And then you and then you
don't do it.

Speaker 14 (01:23:38):
Have a third down, weeight, have a third down three
for a horizontal pass for minus three and you're now
fourth and sixth. How stupid was that one? Yeah, Joe
can never find a kicker. What do we get to
the next year? Bring back the you know, you know,
the ghost of Ralph. Anyway, guys, thanks, I appreciate your Robbie.

Speaker 3 (01:23:57):
The three yard loss on third and three and made
it fourth and that they now had to go for
I think Jackson Dart would will want that one back.

Speaker 2 (01:24:04):
I don't think he looked at it.

Speaker 3 (01:24:06):
I don't think he recognized I forget what this with
the Who the corner was? I think it was Carlton Davis.
I don't think he realized that. Carlton Davis didn't move
on the play. He was lined up in press. He
was his job.

Speaker 2 (01:24:19):
I don't know, if I'm gonna have to re look
at it.

Speaker 3 (01:24:20):
It's probably man is probably a type of man coverage,
and so Carlton Davis had the back or he had
the flat, and so.

Speaker 2 (01:24:28):
He just stayed there.

Speaker 1 (01:24:29):
Yeah, that feels like he was darn almost went to
the college mode where a lane told me that on
this play, I'm throwing to this guy and that's just.

Speaker 2 (01:24:34):
What he did, and that's exactly what he did. And
it was dead.

Speaker 3 (01:24:37):
It was dead from jump and there was a better
option on that play.

Speaker 2 (01:24:41):
I mean, I don't know it because I didn't. I
have to relook at it.

Speaker 3 (01:24:43):
But it was not that it was a difference making
play in the game because they were already down heavy,
but it felt like it crushed momentum and then they
didn't get it on fourth down.

Speaker 1 (01:24:53):
All right, let's go to Jay and woodme or he
will wrap us up today. Jay, what's going on?

Speaker 17 (01:24:57):
Man?

Speaker 9 (01:25:00):
Even during the day, I just want to say that
the game was horrible game. They do all the bad things,
all the small things. They just can't get straight. They
can't kick theo chops with the drop in the end zone.
But the ends justify the means. They deferred to win,
and that's all that matters.

Speaker 1 (01:25:18):
Jay's looking for draft picks, and right now, for the
fans that do keep track of that, the Giants do
have the second overall pick in the draft.

Speaker 3 (01:25:24):
Now, this was Tommy lou Gowers effort. He was efforting
this a couple of weeks ago. I need to find
a new way to say tanking. Giants are not tanking. No,
and so the word I might have been Jay who
came up with this deferred winning.

Speaker 2 (01:25:39):
Deferred winning.

Speaker 3 (01:25:40):
So position yourself to get a better player and defer
the winning which is gonna happen next year.

Speaker 2 (01:25:45):
Here's the problem.

Speaker 1 (01:25:46):
When the Giants go on the by, there are two
other teams are too lost with with only two wins.
So if they both lose next week, the Giants will
be tied with those two teams, and the Giants will
lose the tie breaker to those two teams because they
have a tougher strength of schedule. The Saints one I
remember the other one at the top of my head,
and the Titans have have only one win.

Speaker 2 (01:26:01):
We'll see what happens there. I still think Giants tiki.

Speaker 1 (01:26:04):
The Giants will figure out a way to win one
or two more games year, and I think that's I'd
be very surprised that they were picking second or third in.

Speaker 2 (01:26:10):
This shi agory. And look, you gotta feel good about
your season.

Speaker 3 (01:26:15):
You gotta feel good about the product that you are
working for every single day.

Speaker 2 (01:26:20):
Of the week. To get better at and the only
way to do that is to win.

Speaker 3 (01:26:24):
And we saw this against the earlier in this season
when they won those couple of games against teams they
weren't supposed to beat, and it felt like, man, if
only if only one or two plays had gone our way,
we'd be in the conversation a little bit more. And
the only way to get that feeling back is to
win a football game.

Speaker 2 (01:26:44):
Period. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:26:45):
Look, we have our draft podcast Draft Season on the
Giants app, Giants dot com, Giants YouTube channel.

Speaker 2 (01:26:50):
And this is not a.

Speaker 1 (01:26:50):
Blue chip, top five draft class anyway. It's not like
you're gonna get even an Aiden Hutchinson level type of
There are a couple of good ed rushers in this
Arval Reeze, Rubin Bain.

Speaker 3 (01:27:01):
There are some very good wide receivers in this draft.

Speaker 1 (01:27:04):
Not top five wide receivers, no, but guys I think
who can be impactful Colonel Tate, Jordan Dyson. The Giants
are hopefully going to find somebody in this draft, no
matter where they pick.

Speaker 2 (01:27:15):
You can always find someone in the NFL draft team, right.

Speaker 3 (01:27:17):
But the most important thing is that they got to
find a coach who's going to motivate this team the
right way and get them to play mistake free football.

Speaker 1 (01:27:25):
Make that the culture, all right, take before we say
good by our team, that's gonna take over at one am.

Speaker 2 (01:27:30):
Late bye week Like this, it's a lost season.

Speaker 1 (01:27:32):
What's the mentality now for players heading into this buy
and coming back from it kind of ready to go
through those last time?

Speaker 3 (01:27:37):
I mean, the instinct is to want to just disconnect.
But if this was me, that's the last thing I
could do is disconnect, I'd want to be there. I'd
want to I'd be grinding on tape longer because now
I have time to do it.

Speaker 2 (01:27:50):
I'd be finding.

Speaker 3 (01:27:51):
Self scouting, looking at what can I individually as players
do better? What did I do wrong over these last
few games, especially the tight ones where they had chances
to win? How can I be better or help the
guy next to me be better? Because that's the only
way you're gonna get better is to not just take
accountability for yourself, but also how to make the team

(01:28:11):
around you and your specific position better.

Speaker 2 (01:28:15):
That's the only way to go forward, and.

Speaker 1 (01:28:17):
That's why Tiki's one of the best players in franchise history.
For the New Football Giants, Tikey, enjoy your bye week.

Speaker 2 (01:28:22):
My friend will talk to you in a couple weeks
you as well. My friend for Tiggy Barbara, I'm John Schmelt.

Speaker 1 (01:28:26):
Giants Extra Point was brought to you by Citizens, the
official bank of.

Speaker 2 (01:28:29):
The New York Giants.

Speaker 1 (01:28:29):
Citizens has made ready for Giant fans. London Jewelers your
destination for luxury jewelry and fine time pieces. Hackensack and
Mredian Health keep getting better, Peerless Boilers the world's best
bill boilers and by Moody Deco rist Unlock Opportunity learn
more of Moodies dot Com. Chris mcmoni is coming your
way next. Thank you, Connor Green. Thank you for our
entire crew on the road, Pete Hoffman, Griffin Ward, Chris Magakowski.

(01:28:50):
Of course, thank you to Bob Popacarl Banks and Howard
Cross for taking care of things as well for continuing
covers of the Giants, Giants dot Com, Giants Mobile at
Giants YouTube Channel, bag Boo Kickoff Live coming your way
tomorrow at twelve thirty. Paul Latino, Lance Medal will break
down the game and then Joe Shane will have his
by week press conference.

Speaker 2 (01:29:06):
Tomorrow.

Speaker 1 (01:29:06):
It looks like around one five so I'm not sure
if that's gonna be live on Giants dot com. I
will have full reaction to that as well when that
press conference is concluded. Thank you so much for being
with us today. Thank you will be back in a
couple of weeks when the Giants host the Commanders on
December thirteenth, Sunday at one pm pregame on the fan
at eleven a m for an entire crew. I am

(01:29:28):
John Shrunk. Thanks for being with us. Giants again fall
to the Patriots on Monday Night Football. Then now two
and eleven thirty three to fifteen. Chris mcmonel will coming
your way next right here on the.

Speaker 26 (01:29:38):
Fan a m US defeat, Dead of NS remendagings of

(01:30:18):
mugg of remi