New York Giants Draft Preview

John Schmeelk, Paul Dottino and Tony Pauline preview the 2025 NFL Draft.

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
Giants Draft Preview Live presented by Tommy's Tavern in Tap
twenty twenty.

Speaker 2 (00:05):
Four NFL Draft is now underway.

Speaker 3 (00:08):
The New York.

Speaker 4 (00:09):
Giants select Plague, Neighbors, Wide Receiver, hell Us.

Speaker 1 (00:14):
Series, Tommy's Tavern and taff the Perfect Spot for every occasion.
Now here's John Schmoke.

Speaker 3 (00:22):
Good evening, everybody, Happy Eve to be twenty twenty five
NFL Draft Welcome. I am John Smelt joined by Paul
Tatina with you for the next two hours to talk
Giants and to talk NFL Draft. We'll take a lot
of your calls. At eight eight eight, eight oh eight,
one zero one to nine. We're gonna hear some of
the snippets from Joe Shane's press conference late last week.

(00:43):
Tony Pauline, our resident draft expert from sports Keito, will
join us in our number two to take your calls
to talk everything Giants and again NFL Draft. You think
our sponsor Tommy's Tavern and Tap your perfect spot for
every occasion for taking us along the way for the
next two hours. Today, Paul, We've done a lot of analysis,
a lot of pontificating, a lot of over thinking about

(01:05):
this draft of the past three months since we were
I was all the way back at the Shrine game
and the Senior both end of January. You back to
the combine when we were in Indianapolis together, and finally
we're gonna find that was actually gonna happen tomorrow night.

Speaker 1 (01:16):
Indeed we will.

Speaker 5 (01:17):
John.

Speaker 6 (01:17):
It seems like yesterday we were checking in at the
airport trying to get all those oversized heavy baggage, the
pieces of luggage through the security system.

Speaker 1 (01:26):
To get them on the plane. I don't know.

Speaker 6 (01:29):
Sometimes I think the time drags. Other times it seems
to go buy in a heartbeat, But I know this,
over the next four to five days, we are not
going to sleep very much.

Speaker 3 (01:38):
Yeah, and I think it's gonna be a pretty wild
draft as well. Once you get past the elite blue
Chippers at the top, which there aren't as many this
year as you have had in past years. These draft
boards from team to team are going to be very different,
you know, in theory, starting as early at four and
going into the mid first round, and then from the
mid to late first round all the way to the

(01:59):
start around three, where guys are gonna be all over
these boards. So I think you're gonna have a lot
of surprises. Not sure how much training action we're gonna have,
but we'll talk about all that and more. Let's start
the New York Football Giants. They select third overall Paul
in this year's draft, and it's been a while since
we've seen a mock draft from any of these analysts

(02:20):
out there predicting the Giants will take a quarterback at three.
I would never rule it out. When you don't have
a young franchise quarterback for the future, you're always on
the lookout for one, So I would never rule it out.
But right now, if the analysts are correct, it looks
like if cam Ward and Travis Hunter are both off
the board, and it certainly looks like that's what it's

(02:41):
going to be to the Titans at one and then
the Browns or Travis Hunter two, that the Giants will
be looking at again, either that quarterback we talked about
or Abdul Carter, who seems to be the consensus other
blue chip player in this class besides Ashton Genty. And
we're not gonna be talking about a running back here
at the third overall pick.

Speaker 6 (02:57):
No, certainly not. If you're the Giants. You think about
Abdula Carter. There's no doubt he's an immediate impact guy
with his tremendous pass rushability. Now, there's no doubt that
the medical situation at the Combine that popped up, and
we were just floored when they said, oh, he's got
a stress for a stress reaction and by the way,

(03:18):
he's not coming out to talk to the media.

Speaker 3 (03:19):
Correct. And by the way, he also had a shoulder
injury coming out of last season his wife.

Speaker 6 (03:24):
Which was minor and not unecessarily something that we thought
was going to be in his shoe.

Speaker 3 (03:28):
Yeah, he ended up playing in the college football players
at the injury.

Speaker 5 (03:30):
Correct.

Speaker 6 (03:31):
So you know, we hear this thing at the Combine
and we were all waiting to talk to him.

Speaker 3 (03:35):
I mean, John, we were just we couldn't wait. They
were like, please please.

Speaker 6 (03:38):
Wear no says he's not going to be coming out. Well,
I understood that agent Drew Rosenhaus has got to protect
his guy. He didn't want him saying anything crazy, and
so he was not made available to the media. So
then about a week and a half ago and Joe
Shane had already told everybody at the presser and you'll
hear from him in just a bit that he visited
the Giants and the Giant went through a whole diagnostic

(04:01):
with him, and Joe did say that I don't think
the foot thing would prevent him from being taken. And
that's about all we have because Joe said he wasn't
going to talk to the medical folks, including VP of
Medical Services Ronnie Barnes, until the next day to get
deeper into.

Speaker 3 (04:20):
The profile of the player.

Speaker 6 (04:22):
So we are still kind of in limbo as to
how we feel about that as outsiders to the front office.
But if you're to believe Drew Rosenhaus, he said after
the medical rechecks in Indianapolis about a week and a
half ago, that the foot has progressed well and he
doesn't think it's going to be a problem for training

(04:42):
camp for the season. We don't have anything else to
go on, so not being upstairs, we have to go
by that. And if that's true, then a blue chair
player is going to be on the board at three
for the Giants. You would think that they're going to
take him.

Speaker 3 (04:57):
That plays a premium position, that's pressure and if you
have an edge rusher like an Abdul Carter, you go
back down the line. Here folks, whether you're talking about
Chase Young a few years ago, who's career unfortunately got
derailed by injury. You go back to Nick Bosa, you
go back to Miles Garrett, you go back to Aiden Hutchinson.
If you have a player with this type of traits
and production bio. By the way, twelve sacks in his

(05:19):
final year of Penn State, the first year he actually
played edge full time. Before this past year he was
an off ball linebacker inside. He used him on blitzes
a lot. He did have eleven total sacks in his
first two seasons at Penn State, but not as a
full time edge defender, so you would think there's still
some room to grow there. He's about two hundred and
fifty pounds. He's got elite burst and bend at the

(05:41):
top of his rush. The comparison a lot of people
make is Micah Parsons because of Penn State and where's
the number. But I heard Daniel Jeremiah make this comparison.
I spoke to a couple people on the Johnstontle podcast.
They've made this comparison. They compare him to Von Miller
with his upfield burst and his ability to dip and
bend that edge and bend that corner at the top

(06:01):
of the rush. And if you can get a player
like that, even with the Brian Burns and a Cavon
Tibbadau already at edge, you cannot pass on a player
like that. Given the rest of this class, there just
aren't many other players, if the consensus is to be believed,
do not fall in that potential elite category.

Speaker 6 (06:18):
Two things about that comment, John. Number One, elite pass
rush skills like what von Miller had, they don't come
along every day, never mind high or low in the draft.
You don't get one of those in every draft, and.

Speaker 3 (06:31):
They don't become available in free agency either well, because
teams keep them correct.

Speaker 6 (06:35):
The other thing is, and I talked to a scout yesterday,
an independent guy, not related at all to the New
York Giants, and he said to me, I want you
to answer me a question, when is the last time
you remember a third, fourth, or fifth round edge rusher
who made a dramatic impact in the NFL. And You've

(06:56):
often said to me, John, that you can't find sleeper quarterbacks.

Speaker 3 (06:59):
So we've had that debate quite often. But he said
to me, he turned it around. It was probably Daniel Hunter,
who was a third round pick. He's probably the last one.

Speaker 6 (07:06):
And that's where I came up with. Yeah, and I said,
Daniel Hunter, he said, okay, keep going, and I had
no answer for him.

Speaker 3 (07:15):
Sure, and he said, do you know why, Paul, Because
if you're gonna be good at that position, you have
to be elite as an athlete.

Speaker 6 (07:21):
And it's obvious because people could see.

Speaker 3 (07:23):
Me Trey Hendricks, and I guess you can make the
argument too. He was not a high peck and he
turned out to be a double digit zach and that
would be the other guy would consider in that conversation.

Speaker 6 (07:31):
Think like the Giants right straighthand in you manure was
second round picks. Okay, and and you know that's that's
something that I had not actually considered it at all,
But when he brought that to my attention yesterday, it
made it all the more obvious to me that if
you got that blue chip guy like that, it's just

(07:51):
it's just too much of a rare commodity. You've got
to grab him.

Speaker 3 (07:54):
All right, Let's now take a look at the Giants
draft needs presented by Sloman's. The difference is human. So Paul,
after I duel Carter at three, or maybe they de's
not not to go Carder. Let's see what the Giants
needs might dictate some of their targets for the rest
of this twenty twenty five NFL Draft. And I think
important to note folks, you draft players, you don't draft positions.

(08:14):
That's a role that I have every year. You can
say we need this position, Well, if that position the
value doesn't meet where you're picking, you don't pick that
position just because you need it. You pick the best
player available, not the best player at the position you
want available. With that said, I think we've talked about
interior defensive line. The Giants rush defense has not been
the best the past two years despite the change of

(08:36):
defensive coordinator. I think they want to improve that. They
did bring in Lead Better in the offseason to be
a backup nose tackle to Dexter Lawrence. But I think
any a young player at that defensive tackle spot would
not be a bad idea, whether it's a plugger, a
bigger guy, or guy that can get upfield to rush
the passer. And the other spot I would mention is
on the offensive line, where you have two guys in

(08:56):
Greg Van Roten and Jermaine Luminar are both entering the
final year of their contracts. On the right side of
your line. Van Rodan's a little bit older Evan Neil.
Depending if the Giants pick up that fifth year option,
which we'll know shortly, he could be on the last
year of his contract. And you always want to build
with youth on the offensive line. They didn't draft them
last year, and I think adding to that group would

(09:17):
make sense this year at tackle or guard, by the way,
depending on which one is available in which round to
the right value.

Speaker 6 (09:23):
Yes, I think we concur about the first two priorities
for the Giants going in. I think it's also obvious
that they could use some depth in the.

Speaker 1 (09:31):
Running back room.

Speaker 6 (09:32):
Depending upon how you feel, do you want a power
guy or do you want more of a quick sky
We differ on that, but we would both like to
add somebody to the room. And then, quite honestly, with
the number of injuries the Giants have had in the
secondary over the years, it would not be a bad idea.
If they feel as though they've got a corner who
can compete and who can push and who has some

(09:53):
really good upside, it probably wouldn't be a bad idea
to try to grab one of those two.

Speaker 3 (09:58):
And I think you always lean into the streng of
the draft class as well. You mentioned running back. That's
such a deep running back class, and we'll get into
the draft class when Tony joins us a little bit
more in our number two tight end another area where
it's pretty deep in this draft classes, even wide receiver.
On Day two, in early day three, you're gonna have
a lot of players, even though it's not necessarily thick
with blue Chippers at the top. Those are the giants.

(10:18):
Draft needs brought to you by Sloman's Call or visit
Slowman's dot com to schedule a free estimate on a
new central AC system Slowman's. The difference is human. So, Paul,
we're gonna get into the quarterbacks situation in the next segment.
Fans don't worry. We're not skipping it. We understand it's
a big issue. I want to give it its own
segment so we can focus on it. We'll hear from

(10:40):
Joe Shane on the decision and all of that, so
we will do that. But we talked about the needs, Paul,
who are some of the players in rounds too? Because
I really think things get interesting. The Giants have a
second round pick at thirty four, they select the first
pick in round number three at sixty five. Then they
have another third round pick at ninety nine. Then they
pick it one oh five in round one four. That's

(11:00):
really the meat of this draft, right. Who are some
of the players. You don't have to give me one name,
just names at some of the positions of need. We
talked about that fans should maybe familiarize themselves based on
where the consensus has them ranked and where that value
could meet needs for the Giants in some of these rounds.

Speaker 6 (11:17):
Well, we're gonna discard the quarterback conversation for the moment, correct,
So let's just talk about the two primary needs that
we discussed a few minutes ago or seconds ago, if
you will, the defensive line and the offensive line. Now,
there are so many good defensive linemen, specifically good defensive
tackles that could go anywhere between the late first round

(11:39):
and all the way into the third, maybe even the
early fourth. So the slew of guys that we could
talk about here, it may take forever. So I'll just
give you a couple of real quick flash names.

Speaker 7 (11:50):
Yep.

Speaker 6 (11:50):
Some of the higher rank guys. And I'm sure you're
going to agree with this because we've talked about a
lot of these guys over the past couple of months.
There's Harmon, Grant, No Williams, Alexander, these guys. If any
of those guys fell to the Giants at thirty four
at the top of the second round, I don't think
we would have a problem picking any.

Speaker 7 (12:11):
One of them.

Speaker 6 (12:11):
Absolutely not, Okay, offensive Line, if any of these guys
fell to the Giants at thirty four, I think we
would agree.

Speaker 3 (12:19):
Booker, Jackson, Connolly or Simmons. Yep, I think those guys
would all be in the conversation.

Speaker 6 (12:24):
Right, Okay. So then I said, all right, well what
about sixty five? If you go to the third round,
who were some of the guys who might be there?
Defensive tackle wise, Collins, Sanders, Farmer and Turner were all
guys that I thought might possibly be in that neighborhood.
And I'd be happy with any of those guys.

Speaker 3 (12:42):
Yep, I like that too. Offensive Line, Frasier, Mum, Robinson
and Hamilton were all guys I thought could be somewhere
in the third round. Now, Robinson and Hamilton defensive tackles
not offensive line.

Speaker 6 (12:57):
Oh yes, yes, I'm sorry, I can't read. Yeah, the
two defensive tackles that go with the first group, all
of those guys, if any of those guys are in
the third round, I think you could make a case
that the value is there.

Speaker 3 (13:10):
Yeah. And again, there's a lot of players at defensive tackle.
It's one of the deeper defensive tackle drafts. We'll get
more into all these positions when Tony joins us in
the second hour, and of course when you give us
a call and we talked Giants football with you at
eight eight eight eight oh eight one zero one nine
an NFL draft as well. Any drafted Giant questions you
guys have, get on the horn, we'll talk about it
with you right here on Giants' Draft Preview. Lin let's

(13:34):
say go kick time out. We'll come back. We'll hear
what Joe Shane said at a press conference last week
about the need and search for the giants future long
term franchise quarterback. That and a whole lot more when
we return right here on Draft Preview Live presented by
Tommy's Tavern and Tackle. Going back to Giants Draft Preview

(14:01):
Live right here on the Fan, presented by Tommy's Tavern
and tap schmelt Fatino with you. We'll get to your
calls pretty soon at eighth eight one zero, one to nine.
Joe Shane did address the media last week when a
listen to some of what he said, brought to you
by quick Check, official sub of the New York Football Giants,
and we talked about the Giants selecting third overall and

(14:21):
maybe some of their picks later in the draft and
their needs and segment number one. We talked about some
of the bloot chip guys at three, such as Abdul Carter,
some of the other players that they could pick even
at three other than Carter. And one of those guys
we talked about was potentially a quarterback. So Joe Shane
was asked at his press conference multiple times last week
about the quarterback position. I spliced a bunch of his

(14:43):
answers together. Here's how the Giants are going to approach
the quarterback position in this year's draft.

Speaker 8 (14:48):
Where we are you'd like to have, you know, a
young franchise quarterback. I think every general manager would be.
You know, everybody wants that, you know so, but the
value has to be right or doesn't matter. I mean
you get that one wrong. You just got to get that.
So when in position to get the right one at
the right time, that's when you pull the trigger. If
the value matches up with what we have on a player,
and there's an opportunity to take any position, we'll do it,

(15:09):
but not going to force it if it's not the
right value. If the board lines up when we're on
the clock and that's the position that we want to
go with, we'll go with it, but not conn be
back into a corner on that. You know, I don't
think that's mandatory or something that we're in our feet
of the fire and we have to do.

Speaker 3 (15:25):
And I think that is where the Giants stand when
it comes to the quarterback position. And Paul, that was
the reason they brought in Russell Wilson. They brought in
Jamis Winston during free agency so they would have someone
in the building, that two guys in the building that
you would feel confident starting in week one if you
don't end up getting a quarterback in the draft, because

(15:45):
at that time you didn't know what the Times are
doing at number one. If that pick was up for sale,
your evaluation of the quarterbacks wasn't done yet. Either you
hadn't done all these private visits stuff with the quarterbacks,
so you had to prepare as though, who knows if
we're going to be able to land one. And that's
why they brought those two guys in so they had
someone in place rate to start this year if you

(16:06):
cannot get a quarterback in the draft. And Joe Shane
has talked about trying to head into the draft without
having any holes, so exceedingly obvious that you have to
do something at a position, and the way the Giants
are acting and the way Joe Shane's speaking about it,
they've done that at the quarterback spot first and foremost.

Speaker 6 (16:21):
Well past general managers such as Joe Jong and known
of your course, who used to say, you don't want
a draft hungry, And really that's what Joe was trying
to do when he added a couple of veteran qbs.
And you know what I think is very funny. Sometimes
people don't listen or misinterpret what is being said. But
Joe Shane just laid it out for you exactly what

(16:42):
he is thinking. And he did a few months ago
to John after the season was over, he said to everybody,
the Giants have one quarterback under contract, right, Tommy DeVito.
He made that very clear. And what did he say,
We're going to be looking for a veteran. He did
say that the team is going to take multiple shots

(17:02):
at the quarterback position. Well, guess what, they got a
veteran in Russell Wilson. They took multiple shots by signing
a second veteran in Jameis Winston. And what else happened?
Joe Shane also said, we're going to try to win
and be as competitive as we possibly can this year. Well,
that's what Bringing in a Russell Wilson, who is a

(17:23):
two time Super Bowl participant, a guy who's got a
Lombardi Trophy, a guy who's been to almost ten Pro
Bowls during his career, that's what you do when you're
trying to be competitive. You bring in a guy with
this type of resume. So everything that Joe has told
people has come to pass. You just have to listen

(17:44):
to him.

Speaker 3 (17:45):
But you should also listen to the first part of
the cut that we played, which is that every team
wants a young, future franchise quarterback on their roster and
until you have one, you're always looking for one. So
the Giants will be looking for one in this year's draft.
Clar whether that's at three overall, which again, whenever you
don't have one, it's always on the table, or you

(18:05):
could be talking about a selection at thirty four. Joe
also talked about in the press conference about how you
can find guys that can be long term backup quarterbacks
a little bit later in the draft, maybe in Day three,
but talking about a potential starter, that eventual starter that
could be your future franchise guy. You're talking either at
number three or more than likely picking at thirty four,
sticking at picking that's the Giants second round pick, or

(18:26):
potentially trading back into the back of the first round
to get a player there. There are players picking between
selections twenty and thirty two that don't have a couple
of Day two picks. Teams like the Vikings, teams like
the Rams, teams like the Commanders. So those are some
teams to keep an eye on, and there are a
group of quarterbacks that can The consensus seems to have

(18:49):
in that group. After cam Ward, who again all indications
are he's going to go go to the Titans at
number one, you have shd or Sanders out of Colorado.
You have Jackson Dart out of Ole Miss, you have
Tyler Shook out of Louisville, and you have Jyalen Merrill Alabama,
for very different prospects that have all taken very different
roads to where they are right now, that have their

(19:10):
own unique strength, own unique weaknesses. And I think different teams,
based on what offenses they run, their coaches, how they scout,
are going to like different guys. I don't think there's
any guarantee, even though the consensus was a couple months
ago at least among media folks that Sharer Standers was
definitely the second one that's going to get taken. Based

(19:32):
on a lot of the insiders and the reports that
I've heard the last couple of days, I don't think
that's a guarantee. I still think it's likely, but I
don't think it's a guarantee. So I do think depending
on what team you are and what you value out
of the quarterback position, you might like any of those
four guys better than the other.

Speaker 6 (19:47):
Well, John, when we went to the combine the Indianapolis
and we talked to just slew of people, and we're
talking about people who are in management at one time,
people who are coaches at one time, people who are
draft guru and experts. We went through the entire spectrum,
and what did we hear from all of these people?
Pretty much? Oh yeah, camp Ward is probably the number

(20:09):
one guy on mostly all the boards. But after that,
it was like a rainbow in terms of the preference
of who might be number two. Wart seemed to shoot
out of a cannon up to the top of the list,
and all of a sudden, it was like everybody else
is floating kind of in the bottom. And Juel Sanders

(20:30):
gets a lot of hype because of who he is.
I understand that, and he had.

Speaker 3 (20:33):
A very good college career that he did, oh he did.

Speaker 6 (20:36):
But it was like, well, he's the purple in the rainbow,
and Darts the yellow in the rainbow, and Shuck is
the orange in the rainbow, and you know, pick the color,
and depending upon the coaching staff, the system, the traits,
everybody seemed to have this kind of I don't want
to say, you know, demolition derby, but it was a

(20:58):
demolition derby of as as to who should be the
consensus number two.

Speaker 3 (21:03):
Yeah. I think we've seen that continue over the past
two as well. So then I think is interesting when
you talk about the Giants at thirty four, how they
approach trying to find your next guy, and Joe Shane
talked about it and what we played back about trying
to find a guy that matches the value of where
you're picking. And I do not think the Giants are
going to force it. I think a big pivot point
of this draft will talk about this Tony Paul Lean

(21:24):
in our second hour, what the Steelers do at twenty one,
whether or not they pick a quarterback, whether or not
the Saints pick a quarterback at nine. According to most
of the people out there, that seems unlikely. The Steelers
more likely at twenty one. You know, they're still waiting
on Aaron Rodgers. Who knows what's going to happen there.
We just don't know what his decision process is going
to be. I don't think anyone does, no, so what

(21:45):
they do there could then dictate how many of those
quarterbacks are left heading into the twenties, Which then if
the Giants, if they like one of these guys, and
I think you only make a move to trade up
if you really believe one of these guys has a
chance to be become a really good future starter to
trade up in front of Cleveland to get that guy.

(22:06):
And maybe there's just one guy they like from the group,
in which case you have to move up. But if
you're okay with two of the guys, are you okay
with letting the Browns select in front of you at
thirty three and then selecting one at thirty four. This
is the type of strategy that Joe Shane and his
group have been working on in their war room over
the past couple of weeks. Depending on how the draft goes,

(22:26):
how they approached to pick at thirty four, would they
trade up, are they comfortable sitting there at thirty four,
or do they punt on the position completely around two
and just decide, look, we're gonna stick with what we have.
Maybe we pick a guy on round three or day
three and we attack it that way. It all depends
on how they have these quarterbacks evaluated, which I say
this all the time for people like this on the

(22:48):
outside looking at it's very difficult to evaluate quarterbacks without
getting the time in a room with them, getting them
on the board, getting them in front of video, doing
the private workouts. I thart the Curt Warner last year
and he says John, I can't tell about a quarterbacks
processing or decision making by watching him on tape. I
can't do it. I don't know what the coach is
teaching him. I don't know what they're telling him to do.
I don't know what what's expected of him in that

(23:09):
college offense. So if the Hall of Fame, Super Bowl, NBT,
Kurt Water can't figure it out, we can't figure it
out at it. We can do our best. We can
figure it out, but nobody knows. So I don't know
how the Giants have these guys evaluated. Nobody does this
for Joe Shane and his crew, and that'll dictate how
aggressive the Giants would be trying to get one or
deciding not to pick one that early at all.

Speaker 6 (23:29):
I think maybe an easy analogy that might be really
really simple for people to understand. You asked me a
few minutes ago about maybe in the second round, if
you didn't go quarterback, what would you think about one
of the other positions? And I rattled off about six
defensive tackles, right, Yeah, And that's because guess what, there
seems to be a consensus amongst most football people we

(23:52):
talked to and draft guruz that if you get any
one of those six defensive tackles, you're gonna be fine.
You're gonna get really good value for the slot. That's
exactly the opposite of the way it is.

Speaker 3 (24:05):
With the quarterbacks, because everyone gets pushed up the board.

Speaker 6 (24:08):
Everyone gets pushed up the board with the quarterbacks, and everybody,
outside of what we seem to think about Ward, has
a different opinion about each of the guys. It's entirely
possible that the Giants like one guy on the second tier,
two guys on the second tier, three guys on the
second tier. Maybe they like more, maybe they like none

(24:30):
of them.

Speaker 3 (24:31):
And by the way, that second tier might not be
the Giants second tier. Maybe they like Will Howard, maybe
they like Riley Leonard, Maybe they like Quinn Yours, Carl mccorr.
No one knows.

Speaker 6 (24:39):
Nobody knows, And so that's what makes this position so difficult,
because while we know there's gonna be a cluster of
running backs in the third and fourth rounds, you'd be
happy with getting almost any of them. The defensive tackles,
some of the offensive line is a decent cluster of
those guys, maybe on the second, second round, third round,

(25:01):
the quarterbacks. There doesn't seem to be a consensus over
a cluster of guys, and that's what makes that's what
makes it so hard, because if you've only got a
specific target, then that's the guy you're going to be
willing to spend draft capital to go get right.

Speaker 3 (25:18):
And we went over this on Big Blue Kickoff Live,
which is our live show on giants dot com every
day at twelve thirty during the week. Some quarterback draft
history here I want to go through. It's brought to
you by Bob's Discount Furniture, official furniture and official Mattress
partner of the New York Giants. So I've had one
of our stat services breakdown for us of all the
quarterbacks drafted since two thousand and their level of success

(25:40):
in the league to see what the difference was. And
I had them separated by rounds and day of the draft,
and my threshold for success was did you get to
the second round of the playoffs with your team. I
hate using wins and losses as a quarterbacks that but
what am I gonna use QBR? I'd much rather use
this as a guy that can lead you deep into

(26:00):
the playoffs. So breaking it down and I have a
million numbers year, but I'm gonna keep it simple, just
to one that's important for quarterbacks selected in round two
and round three. Since the year two thousand, only fourteen
percent of them got their team to the second round
of the playoffs. So you're looking at around fifteen percent.
You're looking at around the one and eightish type of chance,

(26:24):
give or take between one eighth and one seventh on
one of every seven to get your team to the
second round of the playoffs. Now, there are some good
players in there. Russell Wilson's in there, for example, But
you know Drew Brees if you go back further, he's
in that group two. But your chances of finding someone
in that day too is a little bit lower. But

(26:45):
it's easy to make the argument, and I've made it
before that it's worth the position is so valuable, it's
worth having another bite of the apple, another throw at
the dark board to try to have that quarterback in
the building to develop into that future starter. Just to
give you the number for first round quarterbacks, the numbers

(27:06):
that are out forty three percent, and that's the difference,
so it's almost three it's about three times lower. If
you pick them on day two versus in the first round,
and if you're talking in the top five, you're looking
at around forty percent at that number. So the chances
if you find they won't go significantly down the later
you pick them. But fifteen percent not nothing, And you

(27:26):
can find good quarterbacks there. I promise you one of
those quarterbacks from that second group is probably not promise
is strong. There's a good chance one of those quarterbacks
from that second group is going to become a good
football player. The trick is fined in the right one. Now,
maybe it's gonna be more than one. I don't know
the answer to that. No one does. We don't have
Christal loss exactly. So you have a shot, but the
percent chances it's a little bit lower the longer you

(27:48):
wait to find the quarterback. If you look at rounds
four and later, you're looking at four point two percent
chance of getting your team to the second round of
the playoffs. So it gets lower and lower as you go.
Just want to throw those numbers at you, so fans
kind of have a feel for what it's like as
you draft quarterbacks later and later in the draft, and
the chance they have of being successful. For you. All right,

(28:09):
let's take a quick time out. We're gonna open up
the phones where take your calls in. Our next segment
will be all You with Paul and I talking draft
and Giants football at eight eight eight eight oh eight,
one zero one nine. We'll be right back with more
on Giants Draft Preview Live presented by Tommy's Tavern AND's
Half on the Fan in New York. Right after this,

(28:36):
we're back to Giants Draft Preview Live presented by Tommy's
Tavern and'saf right here on the Fan in New York.
John sh Milch, Paul Datino with you. We're taking your
calls at eight eight eight eight oh eight, one zero
one nine. Guys, if you're into the draft, it still
about twenty four hours. We got a bunch of great
episodes up on the Giants Little podcast. You can find
them the Giants Podcast, Network Feed, the Giants App, Giants
dot Com, Slash podcast using the great interviews. Phil Simms

(28:59):
just went ill that we talked to him about all
the quarterbacks coming out in the draft. We did Chris
Sims his son last week, great conversation with him. Todd
McShay is up on there. Last week, Bruce Feldman, Nate Tice,
former NFL scout Brian brought us just a bunch of
great interviews, So make sure you go check it out
on the Giants Little Podcast on the Giants Podcast network feed.
All right, let's get to your calls here at eight

(29:20):
eight eight, eight oh eight, one zero one nine, we're
gonna lead things off with John and Cedar. Grove wants
to talk about the Giants pick. At three, John, what's up?

Speaker 4 (29:28):
Hell?

Speaker 2 (29:30):
Thanks?

Speaker 9 (29:30):
So, I got a question about the Giants pick. I
have a lot of friends that are Giants fans. I'm
actually a Raider fan, but the Giants fans I said
they should go for Shador. I think he's like a
generational talent, very accurate passer, and he's pretty comparable to
some of these guys that you know, like Daniels or
Pennis that ended up starting on their team. My critique

(29:53):
of you guys was you said you couldn't get an
edge rudger, edge rusher in the later rounds my team,
who happens to be the Terrible Raiders.

Speaker 6 (30:01):
I know who you're gonna I know who you're gonna
throw out. You're gonna throw at Crosby. Yeah, I know, yeah,
I know the scouts. The scouts comment was you don't
find them in later rounds. Name one, as John said,
I came up with Daniel Hunter myself and then I
stopped because it's rare. It's very, very difficult to find
a legitimate, bonafide impact pass rusher once you start getting

(30:24):
into the fourth fifth.

Speaker 3 (30:25):
You are right, though, Crosby is he came from a
smaller school.

Speaker 7 (30:29):
He was.

Speaker 3 (30:29):
He was a guy that had to develop. There was
some off the field stuff with him too, that teams
that questions about, which is one of the reasons that
he dropped a little bit later. But you're right, A
good call. That's a name I did not think of
Paul brought up. It didn't pop out of the top
of my head. Excellent point, John.

Speaker 6 (30:41):
If you went far between though, that's for sure.

Speaker 3 (30:43):
Shape the call man. Hey, look, John, to your point.
If the giants have done their scouting, and I'll get
it out of the way now, don't use the term generational.
You will have me go on a round. You cannot
have generational talents in the draft every year. By definition
they are not. Then generational generations are ten to fifteen
years long. So I don't care what player you're talking about,
Let's not use the generation.

Speaker 6 (31:03):
Yeah, he want taking.

Speaker 3 (31:06):
Blue chip, blue chip is fine. I'm hot tier, future
Pro Bowl or future All Pro. That's all fine. Not
use generational, please, But if the Giants believe that one
of the quarterbacks in this draft class such a shoot
or say there's are any of the other guys for
that matter, are that type of blue chip player that's
going to be a guy that's going to be an

(31:27):
All Pro, is going to be a Pro Bowl and
can be in that class of quarterbacks that can get
you deep into the playoffs, they should absolutely pick them
at three. And that should be the pick at three.
And we don't know, maybe they do have a guy
grated that high. We don't know the answer to that question.
When I was talking about Abdul Carter before and Hunter
and cam Ward, we were more referencing the consensus that's

(31:48):
out there. Sure, so that's where we were going with that.
But if the Giants do have that evaluation on one
of these quarterbacks, they should asolutely pick them at three.

Speaker 6 (31:55):
Brian Jabole the other day was on a zoom call
with the New York Giants feed reporters in the media,
and they tried to pick and pride him a little
bit right about what was going on, and they said, well,
what if there's a difference of opinion, And Brian said,
we've got great communication between all the personnel people, between
him and GM Joe Shane ownership, everybody communicates very well

(32:17):
all the time. And that should not be a surprise
because every single day when we see these folks, they
were constantly talking to each other. So what Brian said
was you listen, you rationalize what was said, You come
to an agreement, and you have a consensusp Well, if
you're all in on a player, you take the player.
If you're not all in on a player and the

(32:40):
parties inside the room can't come to a consensus, then
chances are you don't go for the player.

Speaker 3 (32:46):
And by the way, you can find pass rushers that
can play in the National Football League later in.

Speaker 1 (32:51):
The DAAR we're talking impact.

Speaker 3 (32:52):
We're not even just impact. You were talking Michael Parson's
Von Miller level pass rushers. Those are difficult significant impact. Yes,
so those guys are very difficult to find. Later, look
are their exceptions to the rule, Yes, But the fact
that we've come up with like three in the last
ten years tells you that there aren't a ton of
these guys. And again, they don't become available in free agency.
The only reason the Giants got Brian Burns is because

(33:12):
they had to trade for him. It was money and
the pick. So these guys just don't become available. And again,
if the Giants believe he's that type of player, maybe
they'll pick them. Maybe they won't, maybe they think another
player is great to hire for them. We don't know
what their grading process looks like. So well, if the
wait and see Bruce and Flushing is up next on
the fan, Bruce, what's going on?

Speaker 2 (33:32):
Hey, guys? I hope and pray that the Giants picked
Carter for these reasons. Number one, if the medical people
clay him, he brings an impact like a Michaeh Poffins,
it gives a team my identity. Sand is as good
as he is, there are question marks, and especially if

(33:56):
we're going to reports by Todd McShay, would but Davill
is not high on sand is why would you graft
a kid like Sands when the coach is not high am?
And the follow up question is if if Shane once
says I'm the general manager I want to quarterback. If
the coach says I don't think he's that good, is

(34:18):
now the tie bracer.

Speaker 3 (34:20):
No, Bruce, look, I think good call, and I'm happy
you brought up that report. One, be careful. If there's
one thing I know by Brian Dabele, coming from the
Bill Belichick school of football, he does not generally leak
information to people. So I'm not saying it's not his way.
We at Todd Vick Shaw Onder show, so I love Toddy.
He does a really good job. But reports are reports.

(34:41):
He's probably he's not getting that verbatim from the source.
And I'd listened to the whole spot. He said he
did not get that directly from Brian Dables, So just
keep that in mind when you hear these reports. But
to your larger point, Joe Shane is not going to
force a quarterback on the head coach who also is
in charge of the offense. Whether he calls plays this
year or not, we'll find out he's not going to
force a quarterback on his offensive.

Speaker 2 (35:02):
Mind.

Speaker 3 (35:02):
The head coach is that you have to coach this
guy no matter what. That's the Paul's point. Before they're
going to come to a consensus on this, Bruce. So
to your point, no, Joe Shay might want a quarterback.
If Brian Dables says no, I'm not taking him, they're
going to come together and they're going to come to
a consensus on a player that everybody wants, and that's
the guy they're going to draft.

Speaker 6 (35:21):
I might add to your point about Abdul Carter. If
you're in that frame of mind that you really like him,
do keep this in mind. They can take him and
there's a place for him on this team where he
can play in conjunction with Burns and Tibideau. I've heard
too many people say, well, where are you going to
put him?

Speaker 1 (35:38):
He's an edge rusher.

Speaker 6 (35:39):
You have two edge rushers, you have Thhibideaux, and you
have Burns. Not necessarily, that's not the way it's going
to go. If you take that player at three, you
will find a place to get him on the field
for enough snaps so that he can do your football
team a lot of good. And it's my opinion that
because of his versatility quick he played some off ball
lineback or at Penn State, you will be able to

(36:02):
maneuver him around for a number of plays when all
three of those guys will be on the field at
the same time.

Speaker 3 (36:07):
Well, I'm gonna keep this simple, Paul, I'm just gonna
do basic mathematics. What percentage of the plays do you
want Thibodau and Burns to play? What's seventy Well, even
if you go seventy five a piece, fine, so that's
right right off the bat, fifty percent of the snaps
bring for abdual Carter, No, that's right off the bat,
fifty percent, no doubt. Then you get in the pass situation,
you can get all three guys on the field. That'll
pop you up another twenty percent, and that'll get him

(36:30):
up to seventy. So getting time for three pass rushers
on the field at the same time, that's easy. Talking
about a fourth guy then it gets challenging, correct, But
for three guys, that's not a problem.

Speaker 6 (36:42):
Can I go one more step further and say your
efficiency might even be beat.

Speaker 3 (36:46):
These guys won't be win at.

Speaker 6 (36:47):
Again, you can take some of those snaps away.

Speaker 3 (36:49):
Look at how many Look at the percentage of plays
all those Eagles pass rushers play. They rotate them in
and out all the time, so they're fresh at the
end of the game. With jafensive line. I might be
dragging a little bit. Tommy's Tavern, Tap and bud Lighter
offering a draft special for Giants fans all throughout draft
weekend when the Giants are on the clock, fans can
get one dollar bud Light drafts at participating Tommy's Tavern

(37:09):
and Tap locations in Clifton and Edgewater must be twenty
one and up. Maybe the Giants can stand the clock
a little bit longer if the fans will have a
chance to get in there. There you go, eight oh eight,
one zero one nine. Let's go to Anthony and Bridgewater. Anthony,
what's going on? Man?

Speaker 10 (37:27):
Hey, guys, thanks for taking my call, sir.

Speaker 4 (37:29):
Yeah, listen, I'm so nervous about this draft. I don't
trust Shane at all. He has shown me that I
can't trust him at all for this. Yeah, I haven't
shown He has shown that he can't do anything with quarterbacks.
Let's be quite honest. Last year he blowed super quarterbacks
in the drafts and didn't get it. I think he's
gonna blow it because I think I think Standards is

(37:50):
gonna be an impact quarterback. He's not gonna take him.
I think the one of major reasons he's not taken
him is because he's inna win now mode, because he
knows if he doesn't win, he's gonna lose his job.
So Carter is the safe pick. I think if he
had a good year, or if he knew he was
coming back from more than last next year, he won't
take Carter. So like to me, I think the biggest

(38:10):
fault is Mara. I think these two guys should not
have been back, and I think any one, any sane
guy would be getting a quarterback. The Giants have not
drafted a quarterback well, honestly, get them in. At least
have some guts to try to get Daniel Jones, even
though it's a bad pick. At least he has when
they needed a quarterback. The Giants passed every year out
quarterbacks and they haven't had him on since Eli. It's

(38:33):
insane to me that the Giants have a top pick
in the draft and they're not going to get a quarterback.

Speaker 6 (38:39):
Hold on half a second, Hold on, just half a second.

Speaker 3 (38:41):
Thank you, Athon, I appreciate it.

Speaker 6 (38:43):
I appreciate the frustration.

Speaker 3 (38:45):
I get it.

Speaker 6 (38:46):
Nobody's happy with how things have gone around here in
the last several years. I totally understand that.

Speaker 3 (38:52):
And yes, by the way, they need a quarterback. If
you watch hard knots. Last year, they tried the trade
off and get the quarterback that they thought was good
enough to pick in that spot.

Speaker 6 (38:58):
And that's the point.

Speaker 3 (39:00):
Okay.

Speaker 6 (39:01):
They re signed a guy who got them to the
playoffs because they understood how valuable it was to have
somebody who did a good job, so they re signed
him and gave him an extension in Daniel Jones. Then
last year they investigated the possibility of moving up because
they thought there might be another quarterback that they also
really felt very good at.

Speaker 3 (39:21):
One or two or three.

Speaker 6 (39:22):
Okay, So I think you're misguided. Okay, if you want
to go by the logic that this administration has not
valued the quarterback position correctly and tried to do something
about it now, that would be number one.

Speaker 3 (39:37):
And I do want to go back to his point
on the two quarterbacks last year. Michael Pennock's played like
two games at the end of the year. We don't
know if he's good yet, the jury still out. We
know he had talent, but we don't know what he
is yet. And as good of the year as Bonnix
did have his workie, and he had a very good year.
He also had maybe the best or second best offensive
line in football in front of him, and some pretty
good weapons around them, a wide receiver. And you don't

(39:59):
judge a quiquarterback on their first year. So I don't
think we know what those guys are yet to make
the evaluation that the Giants missed on some future star
quarterback last year, we just don't have the answer to
that question yet.

Speaker 6 (40:11):
Now, the other point that you made, and really you
kind of put yourself into quicksand on your own when
you said they have to take a quarterback at number
three and it has to be Sanders, Well, if you
don't believe in the player, no matter who it is,
if you don't believe in the player and simply force

(40:31):
it because he plays a certain position, especially one that's
as important as the quarterback, then you have basically done
yourself a tremendous disservice.

Speaker 3 (40:42):
Whenever you start your point by saying you have to
do something.

Speaker 6 (40:45):
That's not the way front offices were.

Speaker 3 (40:47):
That's not the way anything in the NFL works unless
you want to fail. And you made the point that
they would make this decision because they're trying to save
their jobs. Well, I think the more common argument is
that you try to get the future franchise quarterback. He
looks good in with the team and on the offense,
and that's the best chance. And that's been the argument
other people have made. I don't buy any of this,
to be honest with you, So I think there are

(41:08):
two ways to argue that. I guess, but Joe Shane
has said he's not operating like we have to do
this and this and this and this in order to
be back next year. He's gonna do the right thing
for the long term health of the franchise. That's the
right thing to do. That's how he's operating. That's what
the Giant's gonna operate. That's how Brian Dabe's gonna operate.
And that's how they're thinking about this. It's not in
some all we got to maximize our wins now and

(41:30):
sacrifice the future. That's not how they're approaching things.

Speaker 6 (41:34):
No draft decisions should ever be quote banned a tour,
and it should ever and it should not be about
this year either. I'm with you, John.

Speaker 3 (41:41):
You draft for the future. You draft for the next
five years, the next eight years that first weeky contract,
You're not making decisions about now and today, and that's
not how Joe Shane's gonna operate in this year's draft either.
All right, we have one more hour of Giants Draft
Preview Live presented by Tommy's Tavern and tapp coming your way.
Our draft expert from Sports Kida, Tony Pauline, will be

(42:02):
joining us when we return for our second hour of programming.
We'll be right back with more. Thanks for being with us.

Speaker 5 (42:10):
Well we see you at three declark.

Speaker 3 (42:24):
We are back with Giants Draft Preview Live, prezenta by
Tommy's Tavern and Tap your perfect spot for every occasion.
Welcome back everybody, John Schmell, Paul Datino with you. Join
now by our resident draft expert, my co host on
our wildly popular draft season podcast from Sports Kida, Tony Pauline. Tony,
how are you man?

Speaker 1 (42:45):
I'm great. It's great to be here now. I know
where you where you do the show from here in
this little, quaint little studio.

Speaker 3 (42:50):
Yes we are. We are jammed in here a bit
of a tomato can, but we are rocking and rolling here.
So Tony, you have your ear to the payment you've
been talking to people around the league about what's going
on in the draft process. What are the top storylines
you're tracking a night before the draft.

Speaker 1 (43:05):
Well, obviously the first one is Shador Sanders. Where does
he end up? I mean, I think we've all overrated
Shador Sanders in large park because who his dad is.
I mean, Shador Sanders is a nice prospect, He's not
a great quarterback prospect. Everyone thought, you know, in January,
maybe he's a top five pick, maybe three to the Giants.
But as we learned at the Shrine Bowl when you
and I were there, all of a sudden, cam Ward's

(43:26):
the top player in the draft. And then as I
learned at the Combine, Shadoor Sanders is falling. So Shador
Sanders really probably was, it was overrated, and now looks
like he's gonna go or for what I'm hearing, could
go to Pittsburgh at twenty one. Tyler Warren, the tight
end from Penn State, you know, a nice prospect, but
not a game breaking Rock Towers type of guy. Yet

(43:46):
he could go top ten, Jets at seven, Saints at nine,
you know, the the Chicago Bears at ten. And then
there's Shimer Stewart I mean, the Olympic type athlete just
blew the doors open at the combine. But it's got
one and a half sacks last season, four and a
half sacks his career Texas.

Speaker 3 (44:04):
A and M has to be one and a half
sacks every year.

Speaker 1 (44:06):
I mean, basically, he's a better athlete than he is
a football player. Where does a guy like that go?
And then of course there's always you know, the injured players,
guys that have red flags. I'm hearing some not so
good things about Jihad Campbell and his shoulders. We'll see
what happens. I mean, if Johad Campbell starts to fall
into the twenties, you know that the concerns that's being
spread around about his injury is true. And Will Johnson

(44:29):
as well. I mean Will Johnson was a guy we thought,
we talked about early on, could be a top ten player,
the cornerback for Michigan. I didn't play all that well,
had some injuries. There's some more injury concerns. If Will
Johnson starts to fall into the twenties, we know that
those injury concerns are legitimate.

Speaker 3 (44:45):
And just to be clear, you have shoud Or Saners
as a first round player on your board. You like
him as a player, so I don't want the fans
to come after you be like, well, totally hate jud
or standers. He doesn't. He has them as a first
round player, and coming in.

Speaker 1 (44:56):
The season he was my number one quarterback. But when
I watched the film, he just didn't improve and progress
the way I thought he should have.

Speaker 6 (45:04):
Tony. Before we get to some specific players, I want
to ask you a general question as we approach the draft,
it's now just about twenty four hours away. Is there
anything that has done a complete one point eighty where,
oh my goodness, out of nowhere. As we're getting closer
and closer and closer.

Speaker 3 (45:21):
I remember when Baker Mayfield wound up suddenly coming out
of the blue to become the Cleveland Brown's top draft choice.
Is there anything that's really shocking you at this point
late in the game.

Speaker 1 (45:32):
I don't think anything like that is going to impact
the top ten. I mean, it's kind of shocking to
me to see armand Membos rise, you know, really from
mid to lay first round into the top six, into
the top seven. Matthew Golden, I don't think that any
of us thought in December he could be the first
receiver selected in the draft, and it looks like that

(45:55):
may happen, but I don't see. You know, there's nothing
that I jet that's gonna happen in the top ten
that's really gonna blow anybody away.

Speaker 3 (46:03):
All Right. Who are some of the guys that might
be rising in this draft class that maybe a microL
top ten, but a few months ago people were not
talking about them as top ten.

Speaker 1 (46:11):
I just mentioned one. Arman Nembo, the offensive right tackle
from Missouri. He's a three year starter. He is a big,
nasty lineman. Some people thought guard. He goes to the
Senior Bowl, arms of thirty four and a half inches,
six foot four. Okay, he's got the tackle measurables. You
watch the film, had a great combine, and I know
the combine is shorts and a T shirt, but you're
looking at a three hundred and twenty pound athlete on

(46:32):
the film three and thirty pounds, moves like a sprinter.
So he's a guy could go forward to New England,
could go six to the Raiders. I think if he's
there at seven, the Jets jump all over them. Matthew Golden,
who I also mentioned, speed, excellent route running skills really
looks like the whole package of Marion Hampton. You know,
we thought the number two back, maybe an early second

(46:53):
round pick. He could go to Washington. He goes early
as the Denver Broncos, the number twenty twenty selection. I
don't think that we thought about this. You know, four
months ago, Josh Connelly right now was the hot name.
Josh Connelly, the offensive lineman from Oregon, can play tackle
or guard. He's the guy that everyone thought early second round,
late first rounds. Probably gonna go somewhere in the middle

(47:15):
of round round one, and then some later round guys.
Carson Sweessinger, the linebacker off ball linebacker from UCLA, could
slide the late part of round one. Josh Farmer, Florida
State is getting a lot of play. Noel Williams, the
cornerback from Cal had a lot of ball production, really
elevated his game, ran faster than people thought, was a

(47:35):
better athlete than people thought.

Speaker 3 (47:36):
He was fun to watch it the Shrine Bowl and
we were down there together. Transferred to Cal. You're thinking
late round pick. No Williams probably gonna land in day two.
He's about six to three, is a big, tall, long
guy too.

Speaker 1 (47:46):
He had a lot of ball production. It's not an
opportunistic guy.

Speaker 6 (47:49):
All right, let's flip it around. Who were the guys
who seemed to be sliding according to the scuttle butt
around the league.

Speaker 3 (47:55):
You already mentioned Shad or so why don't we move
past them?

Speaker 1 (47:57):
Luther Burden, the receiver from Missouri. I mean, come into
the season, Luther Burden was greted as the number one
prospect by NFL scouts, not the number one receiver, the
number one prospect. If the draft was held in September
of twenty twenty four, Luthor Burden's one of the first
players selected. I doubt he goes in the first round, though,
you're looking early second round. As of Ray Thomas, the big,

(48:18):
tall cornerback from Florida State, played well at the Senior Bowl.
We saw him runs a four to five eight during
Pro Day, so you know, he doesn't have that speed.
You know, a guy like that probably doesn't go top
forty five. And then Cameron Williams, the big offensive tackle
from Texas. Early on in the season, he looked like
a potential first round pick. He got hurt, he played poorly.

(48:39):
You know, he's three, he's massive, six eight three hundred
and twenty pounds. You know, maybe he goes second round,
maybe he goes third round. There's some people think that
he's gonna fall out of the top one hundred that
are spoken with.

Speaker 3 (48:51):
All Right, I want to touch a couple of topics here.
The consensus seems to be that it's cam Ward one,
Travis Hunter two. If you learned anything in the last
day or so we recorded draft season yesterday, that might
change your mind in that respect.

Speaker 6 (49:04):
No.

Speaker 1 (49:04):
I mean, there was some talk about Cleveland maybe going
with ab little quarter number three, but I think they're
pretty set on Travis Hunters.

Speaker 3 (49:10):
Okay, now I want to focus it on the Giants.
We've talked about them at number three, the possibility of
Abdul quarter, but again, they could have someone else great
at high They could go in a different direction there,
maybe a quarterback you just released. What as long as
there's no trades in Tony I saw him doing some
hal Mary's out there to make sure there are no
trades in the next twenty four hours. Is those are
no trades? That's your final three round MOK, which people
can find over at sports Keita. What do you have

(49:31):
the Giants doing at pick thirty four Daniel Jeremiah And
the reason I asked this he just released his final
mock draft and in his he is the Giants trading
up to eighteen to select Jackson Dart ahead of Shador Sanders,
who still goes to the Steelers at twenty one?

Speaker 6 (49:44):
Did he have a price on that?

Speaker 3 (49:46):
All I have is a graphic from the social media,
so I do not have the info on that, Tony.
What are you hearing about what the Giants might do
a pick thirty four?

Speaker 1 (49:53):
What I'm hearing, what I've heard through the process is
maybe Tyler Shock yeh, the quarterback from Louisville, started his
career at Oregon, was great as a redshirt freshman, basically
had four non existent years at Texas Tech, where he
didn't play well. He had injury, had a great year
at Louisville, turned on some people at the senior ball,

(50:13):
was good at the combine. A lot of people great size,
six four and a half forty pounds can make all
the throws. A lot of people think that after cam Ward,
he's the most NFL ready quarterback. But there's a lot
missing there, which is a concern to me. Which Tyler Schuck,
are you getting the Tyler shuck from twenty twenty four
or the Tyler shuck from twenty twenty one to twenty

(50:34):
twenty three. In my mock draft, I had the Giants
taking Donovan Jackson, the offensive lineman from Ohio State, in
the second round. I really wanted to put a quarterback there,
but I said, you know, Giants have had issues with
their offensive line. You built from the lines of scrimmage.
Donovan Jackson was projected as the first round pick in
twenty twenty three, played poorly, returned in twenty twenty four,

(50:57):
had an outstanding season, first at guard and and then
at left tackle when they had to kick him out
because the injury is there. So you know, he is
a guard, but he's a player that's on the rise.
He is a polished offensive lineman that I think if
the Giants take him in the second round, he's a
Week one starter and he's gonna improve that offensive line
right off the back.

Speaker 6 (51:16):
Let me ask you about another quarterback who's been attached
to the Giants, and a lot of the news reports
Jackson Dart has been gaining a lot more momentum in
recent weeks than he had some time ago. What are
you hearing about him, and why do you suppose the
momentum has picked up.

Speaker 1 (51:31):
Well, I've heard exactly what you said. In fact, a
couple hours before we did the show, I heard exactly that.
I heard him attach to the Giants. That's the guy
that the Giants like now. Jackson Dart was always a
very good quarterback. I don't have him projected as a
first round prospect, but as we know, quarterbacks are always overdrafted.
He's got good size, He's an accurate quarterback. You know,

(51:53):
I'm concerned. I know some people aren't coming out of
that Mississippi system, which rarely uses the tight end. When
you watch him on film, he makes good decisions, but
at times he's slow moving his head from the primary target,
which is worthsome to me. I mean, I like Jackson Dart,
but if you're drafting him, it's to be your starter
in twenty twenty six, maybe the end of twenty twenty

(52:15):
five if things don't go well.

Speaker 3 (52:16):
Which by the way, the Giants aren't set up for
that with Russell Wilson to the building, but have.

Speaker 1 (52:19):
Time exactly, But you know, do they want to get
players on the field week one that are gonna help
them or are they willing to wait, you know, to
draft the Jackson dart plus you know, moving up to eighteen,
you're gonna have to give away a good amount of
draft capital, potentially a number one pick in twenty twenty six.

Speaker 3 (52:37):
Oh you think it's that much.

Speaker 1 (52:39):
It's a half a round that you're moving up, right, Yeah,
a half round, Dad is So you know, do you
want to give away all that draft capital and you
know you don't know what the situation is gonna be
in twenty twenty six. That's a lot for me.

Speaker 6 (52:54):
Let me ask you this your head, Let me just so.

Speaker 1 (52:56):
Let me else says it's eighteen to Seattle.

Speaker 2 (52:58):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (52:59):
I don't think Seattle wants a trade out of the
first round. They want to move down and take grays
Abel later on. But if they move out of the
first round, they're not getting Grays.

Speaker 3 (53:07):
They could get Donovan Jackson.

Speaker 1 (53:08):
They could I think they had the hearts.

Speaker 6 (53:13):
Do you have a sleeper quarterback who may not be
first or second round, but another guy third or.

Speaker 3 (53:20):
Fourth round who may be able to do the trick?

Speaker 1 (53:23):
I mean, I think Kyle McCord of Syracuse has all
the physical skills, but he needs a lot of coaching.
I mean I followed him during when he took over
for CJ. Strat at Ohio State. Then he moves to Syracuse.
His problem at Ohio State was he never took his
head off the primary target. He would lock onto the
target and throw the ball. He did a better job

(53:43):
of it this year at Syracuse. He he was the
best deep ball thrower at the combine. He was throwing
the prettiest passes down the field. Now he's headed in
the right direction. I love his resiliency, not only the
way he rebounded Syracuse this year, but even at Syracuse
in the middle of the year he had a five
interception games against Pittsburgh did and then they won the
rest of the games the remainder of the season. I

(54:05):
talked to him at length at the shrine ball when
we were there, and I asked him about, you know,
what was it like sitting there and watching your old school,
Ohio State win the national championship. And he was very
honest with me. We talked about sometimes how Ohio State
was over coached. They put the handcuffs on him, but
when they let him and they let the team play,
the team would win. I like him, but he's going

(54:25):
to need a real good quarterback coach.

Speaker 3 (54:28):
And who'd you have the Giants and the mock draft
in your around three selections? Tony Joshua Farmer of Florida State,
a guy who showed flashes throughout his career, decided to
enter the draft. Was dominant at the senior ball against
some good offensive lineman. He's a relatively good athlete. I
think he would be a real good fit in the
Giants system, you know, in sort of that.

Speaker 1 (54:49):
Three man line. He's strong, he's athletic, he can hold
the point, and he calls to make plays.

Speaker 3 (54:56):
And then who's your and who's your second one? After
Joshua Farmer? You have two third round picks Giants.

Speaker 1 (55:02):
Yeah, well sorry, I'll tell you. I think it was.
Was it a safety? What number pick?

Speaker 2 (55:08):
Was it?

Speaker 3 (55:09):
Ninety nine?

Speaker 1 (55:10):
Ninety nine? I had them taking Darian Porter.

Speaker 3 (55:14):
Oh.

Speaker 1 (55:15):
I like Iowa State now, uh, sort of like Colin
McCord in the sense that he's a great athlete. He's
got great size, he has tremendous upside, but he's going
to need uh time to develop his game. I think
he's a bigger corner the Giants like what was he
six six three two.

Speaker 3 (55:32):
Pounds testing at the combat was immaculate, a four to three.

Speaker 1 (55:35):
At the combine.

Speaker 3 (55:35):
And I'm a wide receiver too, and also his the
jilty numbers and jumps were great too.

Speaker 1 (55:39):
Showed flashes, but is far from the polished product. You know,
he's a guy that's gonna do That's why he's a
third round pick.

Speaker 3 (55:45):
Correct. All right, it's time for Tony Pauline's Top ten
prospects on the Board, sponsored by Slowman's. The difference is human, Tony,
give us your top ten in your twenty twenty five grades.

Speaker 1 (55:54):
Hands down. Obdual Carter, no doubt about it. You know,
paul and I go back and you go in the
eighties and in the nineties, there was a time before
the league became quarterback crazy. Everybody wanted that impact defensive player.
That's what Abdual quarter is. Travis Hunter, who I've always,
as you know, had rated as a receiver and maybe
he's a two way player. I think the Browns draft
him as a receiver, maybe use him to die packages.

(56:17):
Ashton Genty, who is one of the cleanest, safest players
in the draft, doesn't have great size, as good sized,
incredible instincts, incredible vision, can run, can pound it out
on the inside, can turn the corner tackle a real
good pass catcher out of the backfield. Jalen Walker is
my number four out of Georgia. A little bit on

(56:37):
the sides that six foot one doesn't have that great
growth potential, But like Abdull, Carter can rush the passer
and can also play off the ball in space. I mean,
I've seen him twenty twenty five yards downfield in pursuit.
Then I have Will Campbell and Armah Membo, neck and neck.
Will Campbell to tackle out of LSU, Arma Membo to
tackle out of Missouri. Campbell is more than your pure

(57:01):
left tackle. And I always give the nod to left tackles.
I'm a left tackle guy. You have a quarterback, you
better be able to protect them.

Speaker 6 (57:08):
Tony, you would not shift him to guard.

Speaker 1 (57:10):
No, no, no, unless you can't play tackle, you know.
And here's the thing is they and I mentioned this
on Twitter, they had his arm length at thirty two
and five ace inches and the combine, but the combine
arm lengths were shorter for everybody.

Speaker 3 (57:23):
They short at everybody. Okay.

Speaker 1 (57:25):
Warma Membo was thirty fourth the Senior Bowl, thirty two,
thirty three and a half at the combine. Will Campbell
was thirty thirty two and five as at the combine
thirty three even at his pro day. And if you
go back at guys who were measured the combine and
then measured the shrine the senior even at pro day,
those numbers on their arm length was anywhere from an

(57:46):
eighth of an inch to five as in.

Speaker 3 (57:47):
Slo And just to know, these weren't LSU people measuring
his arms at the pro day. It is an NFL
scout measuring in his arms of the protect So exactly
someone had a bad tape measure at Indianapolis. Someone to
check on that.

Speaker 1 (58:00):
I think Arman member has incredible upside. I love his game.
I know the Jets have talked with him through the
week to basically check some boxes with him. Then Mason
Graham of Michigan doesn't have great upside, but he's very polished,
you know, like Ashton Genty, he doesn't have a he
doesn't have much downside. You know what you're getting with him.
Mckel Williams the defensive and from Georgia. Kelvin Banks the

(58:25):
offensive lineman from Texas who can play left tackle, can
play guard. I think he could go a little bit
earlier than people think. And then finally, number ten, cam
Ward the quarterback from Miami, Florida, who is going to
be the first pick of the draft tomorrow night.

Speaker 3 (58:38):
Those are Tony paul Lean's Top ten prospects, sponsored by
Sloman's Color Visit Sloman's dot com to schedule a free
estimate on a new central air conditioning system Slowman's. The
difference is human and just for fun. T mac Teterol McMillan,
Will Johnson the quarterback out of Michigan, Matthew Golden wide receiver, Texas,
Walter Nolan defensive tackle, Ole Miss Colston Lovelan titled Michigan

(59:00):
and Manwarie the safety out of South Carolina, Tyler Warren
tight end Penn State, James Pierce junior outside linebacker, Tennessee,
Kenneth Grant defensive tackle, Michigan, Shure Standards quarterback, Colorado. The
rest of Tony's first round grades on his big board.
All right, let's take a time out right here on
Giants Draft Preview Live presented by Tommy's Tavern and Tap.

(59:20):
We'll come back. Tony sticks with us and we will
take your calls. At eight eight eight eight o eight
one zero one nine when will return Right after this,
we're back on Giants Draft Review Live, presented by Tommy's
taverna tap right here on the fan. We'll open up

(59:41):
the phones again at eight eight eight eight oh eight
one zero one nine eight eight eight eight oh eight
one zero one nine point you to quickly for Tony
before we got to the call.

Speaker 6 (59:48):
Well as you're the first hour, Tony, John and I
discussed the potential needs for the Giants going into the
draft by position. We talked about defensive line, we talked
about offensive line, running back. It possible even corner at
each of those positions. In your opinion, how deep can
they go into the rounds to find guys who could
really help them out a.

Speaker 1 (01:00:09):
Lot of questions at cornerback, So you're gonna have to
get a cornerback no later than day two. It's the
exact opposite with running back. I mean, you could probably
wait until the fourth, fifth round and you get a
good running back. It's just a type of running back
you want. Do you want the downhill between the tackles,
pounder or do you want the guy that turns around,
turns a corner. That's me. I like the interior offensive

(01:00:30):
line class, so I think you can go third, fourth round,
and even the fifth round of what we've talked about
John and I on our show is you know, you
got a lot of college tackles who project to guard,
So if you're looking for an interior offensive line, you
could probably wait until day three. Same thing with defensive tackle, no.

Speaker 3 (01:00:48):
Question about it. All right, let's get to the calls
and say what's up to Pat and Suffern? Pat? What's
going on? Then?

Speaker 7 (01:00:55):
Hey, how's it going, guys? We're good, great show. Hey.
I also just want to give a little shout out
Connor doing a great job.

Speaker 3 (01:01:01):
Connor is the man. We love Connor.

Speaker 7 (01:01:04):
I just one thing that really baffles me. And I
was listening to you guys before, and you're talking about,
like who really dropped from last year? Quinn yours, and
I just want to I just want to make a
case for him. I give me technically lead out Archie Manning,
who lets everybody in the league he's talking about, is
there some way they could create overer picks the year
he comes in and I mean I saw him, I've

(01:01:26):
seen him make some great throws. He's like, I get
to go what second round?

Speaker 3 (01:01:31):
Tony. I know you were a big quin Yours guy
heading to this year. I'm actually a quin Yours fan too.
I think you can get a chance to be a
good player. What do you think I have.

Speaker 1 (01:01:37):
Him going late second round. Now, let's let's break that
down a little bit. I think Quinn Yours is a
guy that was overrated at certain points. I mean, I
think you's on this radio station talking to Giants tank
and take quin you weres in the top ten picks.
He was never that type of quarterback. Scouts consistently saw
him as a third round prospect. I think he is
a late second early third round prospect. I agree with

(01:01:59):
the call. I think he's being undervalued now like he
was overvalued in October when people were saying you're the
top ten pick. Now he seems to be the forgotten guy.
You know, he's a good vertical passer. He needs some
work on his footwork, which will only improve his downfield accuracy.
He's a good underneath the pass as well. He's done
a lot of winning on the college level. I mean,

(01:02:21):
what that Texas team to back to back semifinal games
in the college football playoffs. I think he's undervalued. I
have him as a late second rounder. I think the
worst third round. If he happens to land in day
Day three, I mean, it's an absolute steal. All right,
let's go to CJ and Brooklyn. He's up next, CJ.

Speaker 10 (01:02:38):
Hey, guys, how's the going good man?

Speaker 1 (01:02:41):
Yeah?

Speaker 10 (01:02:42):
Yeah, So I think, honestly, there's only four quarterbacks going
in the first round this year. I think everybody's falling
for the old smoking mirrors, devaluing a quarterbacks in the
process leading up to the draft. But you know whatever,
even come draft day, teams all of a sudden get

(01:03:02):
nervous and they just start reaching and jumping for quarterbacks.
And you saw it last year. The first three guys
went off the board right in the first four picks
or so, and then right after the Giants picked their guy,
then the next guy goes and before you know, there's
only two guys left and you're not even out of
the top fifteen picks. So this is gonna happen again

(01:03:24):
in a certain way. I think it's gonna be cam Ward.
He's gonna go first, obviously. Then you're gonna have a
team that you know, here's whispers and if it's not
New Orleans, the second pick, you know, or second quarterback
taking at nine. I think if somebody's gonna trade up,
and before you know it, the Steelers are twenty one,
will probably have to trade up because there's no way

(01:03:44):
they can sit back for like ten more picks to
wait for a quarterback and the top three quarterbacks to
drop to them. I just think every everybody's falls words.
Every year, these quarterbacks get overvalued just because of the
need and supply and demand obviously, and it just happens
every year. I'm just gonna sit back and wait. But
i think four quarterbacks are going this year. What do
you think, CJ.

Speaker 3 (01:04:04):
I didn't realize I emailed you my rundown because you
just segued perfectly into our next segment. It's now time
for our round table discussion sponsored by Slowman's. Thanks for
the call, CJ. The difference is human. My first factor
fiction question was there will be at least three quarterbacks
taken in the first rout of the draft, So Tony,
I'm gonna give these to you, Factor fiction. There will

(01:04:25):
be at least three quarterbacks taken in the first round
of the draft.

Speaker 2 (01:04:27):
CJ.

Speaker 3 (01:04:28):
Thank you for co hosting and producer me I appreciate it.

Speaker 1 (01:04:30):
Man, I'm gonna say a maximum of three. I disagree
with the caller about four. You can't compare this year
to last year because last year you had some really
good special quarterbacks at the top of the draft. I
think it's gonna be three with Ward with Sanders, and
then a team that trades back into the end of
round one to maybe take a Jackson Dart. I don't

(01:04:50):
think it's gonna be Jalen Milroe. I think if there's
a fourth quarterback, it could be a Tyler. Shocked, but
I'm gonna stick with three.

Speaker 3 (01:04:56):
Who are the teams that you think, besides the Giants
we talked about them earlier, that you think could trade
back into the end of the first round.

Speaker 1 (01:05:02):
Browns have a history of that and they need a
quarterback for the future. Would the Raiders trade back into
the end of the first round to pick up a quarterback?
I know they got Geno Smith there, but they need
a player for the future. You know the Saints as well.
Couldn't they trade I'd be shocked if they take a
quarterback at not I'd be really shocked.

Speaker 7 (01:05:20):
You know.

Speaker 1 (01:05:20):
Could they make a move back up? But again, how
much draft capital you talk about the Giants moving eighteen.
How much draft capital do you want to give away
to move up to get one of these guys?

Speaker 3 (01:05:30):
All right, let's go to statement number two, and I
think I would go fact on that as well. I
think there will be I think there will be three exactly,
So will I okay? Statement number two? They will be
more edge players taken in the first round than any
other position, tony fact or fiction fact?

Speaker 1 (01:05:46):
I have seven edge rushers. Wow, the next would be
six offensive linemen. Offensive lineman, not tackles, guards, et cetera.
Together because the Calvin Banks and the Josh Connor Leeves
or even Gray's Abels are tackles that project to guard.
So six offensive line but seven edge rushers pass rushers?
Who are you?

Speaker 3 (01:06:04):
Edge rushers?

Speaker 2 (01:06:05):
Can?

Speaker 11 (01:06:05):
Do?

Speaker 3 (01:06:05):
You have the seven handy? Who you have going in
the first round at cariocity?

Speaker 1 (01:06:08):
Abdul Parter, yep, Jalen Walker if you want to, if
you want to consider him, he's in the great edge rusher,
He's in the group. Michel Michel Williams out of Georgia.
I think James Pearce is going first round. I think
Michael Green is going first round. I think both of
the Texas A and M kids, Shamar Stewart and Nick
Scalerton are gonna go in the first round. Scourton I

(01:06:29):
think slides into the late part. Those last two picks,
either Kansas City or Philadelphia.

Speaker 3 (01:06:33):
And they're just surprising for me. And there could be
an eighth in Donovan Azaraku. I know some people have
him in there, some people don't, but I think that
could be the eighth if you get to that number.

Speaker 1 (01:06:42):
If it's up to you, he's going in the first round.

Speaker 6 (01:06:45):
I know.

Speaker 3 (01:06:45):
I'm sure, Hey, what, don't put that on me. I'm
just going by what people out there are saying. Okay,
on that BC guy for a while, how many sacks
did you have last year? He had a sixteen and
a half. That's pretty good. I agree, And I'm also
sucker tube as I talked to him at the Senior
Bowl for about eight minutes. That guy's gonna be like
running some financial company on Wall Street in twenty years.

Speaker 2 (01:07:08):
He is.

Speaker 3 (01:07:08):
He might be justin talk like he's that smart of
a guy, Like he's really really well put together. All right,
statement number three, by the way, I'll be backed on that, Okay,
I'm gonna go back on that as I figured you were. Yep,
running back is the best position in the draft top
to bottom. Tony factor fiction.

Speaker 1 (01:07:24):
Absolutely, I mean like we said, I mean it's strong
at the top with Ashton Genty. You got good great back,
good backs or at least starters on day two. You
look at day three, I mean la Quin Allen of Syracuse,
Jarquez Hunter of Auburn, Vershort Smith one of your favorites
from SMU love. These guys are all potential productive rotational backs.

(01:07:45):
Later on, Phil MafA, you want a short yardage back,
you want a gold lineback. Phil MafA of Clemson. Raheem Sanders.
You're talking late or second part of day three. Another
short yardage goal line back. Kyle Menagy from right down
the road here Rutgers, one of my favorite guys. Guy
who's been a tremendous ball carry at Rutgers. Not a
great tester, but a real good running back. I'm gonna

(01:08:08):
count to you, Tony uh oh. Here's what I'm gonna say.
I'm gonna take John's question and define it as guys
who will make fifty three man rosters. I think the
defensive line is going to have more naked players in
the NFL. We're not talking stars, not talking stats, but
more guys who make rosters than the running backs will well.

(01:08:29):
Number one, you have four off four defensive.

Speaker 6 (01:08:30):
Line absolutely one or two runnings, which helps the odds.

Speaker 1 (01:08:34):
And the thing is this is defensive line is a
priority position on draft day, whether it be defensive tackle
or whether it be edge rushers. So historically you're gonna
have a lot more defensive line and selected over the
course of the seven rounds than the running backs, which
would you know, I could understand it, but here's a good.
It's a good. I like the position.

Speaker 3 (01:08:55):
I could see as many as twelve to thirteen running
backs from this group, not full time twenty carrier, game starter,
but being part of a committee in a starting backfield.
Tony mentioned a bunch of them. I'll just go through
my list, Ashton Genty, o'marion Hampton, Caleb Johnson, Quin Shawn Jenkins,
Cam Scatibo, Traveon Henderson. A lot of people think might
end up sticking into the back of the first round.

(01:09:15):
That's the latest news that's out there on him. Dylan Samson.
I love him at a Tennessee. Damian Martinez, Tony's guy
out of Miami. Paul likes him too.

Speaker 6 (01:09:22):
R J.

Speaker 3 (01:09:23):
Harvey my guy out of UCF who's just super fast
and quick, big play waiting to happen. Devin Neil out
of Kansas, who's you know, he's not gonna value watching nobody.
He's a really good quality back. I like DJ Giddens.
I think he's a good running back. Jordan James out
of Oregon. He reminds me a lot of the running
back that came head of Oregon last year who was
a good player. Bachelle Toton. If he figures out the
fumbling issues, that guy's a big play waiting to happen.

(01:09:45):
And then my guy Burshard Smith to Tony mentioned at SMU,
and that's not even count a guy like Trevor Atien,
who is a starter for Georgia this year, is one
of the best teams in the nation. So there are
a lot of really good running backs that will go
as deep as round four or five.

Speaker 6 (01:09:57):
I love you said Maa as a sleeper later on,
and I kind of had him in the seventh round
as a guy who'd be a great sleeper and a steal.
But I told John the other day on Big Blue
Kickoff Live, our daytime show Shameless Plug twelve thirty pm,
one hour every weekday, Monday to Friday on Giants dot Com.
Tony the Muldozer, I love Coleel Mullings out of Michigan.

(01:10:18):
Only a one year starter.

Speaker 3 (01:10:19):
But the mondowser is that yours?

Speaker 1 (01:10:22):
No, that's what they call.

Speaker 3 (01:10:23):
Is that what they think?

Speaker 1 (01:10:24):
I don't know that.

Speaker 6 (01:10:24):
It's just technical because that's the way he plays.

Speaker 1 (01:10:27):
Beat Ohio State this year.

Speaker 6 (01:10:31):
He's a bruiser and.

Speaker 1 (01:10:31):
He is well liked within the scouting community. Not the
greatest tester, I mean, runs in the high four five,
four sixes, but again, you know, if you're looking for
a day three back that's a short yardage back, goal
line ball carrier, you know, to be your fifth back
on your roster.

Speaker 3 (01:10:47):
He will pound it.

Speaker 1 (01:10:48):
He's the guy. He's definitely one of those guys you
look at.

Speaker 3 (01:10:51):
That was our roundtable discussion sponsored by Sloman's Caller. Visit
Slowman's dot com to schedule a free estimate on a
new central AC system Sloman's. The Difference is human Quick
time out right here on Giants Draft Preview Live presented
by Tommy's Tavern and Tap. We'll come back and we
will take your call. So get on the line, folks.
We got about another fifteen minutes of programming. Get on

(01:11:12):
the line, give us a call. We'll talk draft with you,
and we'll get Tony's prediction for what the Giants are
gonna do in the twenty twenty five NFL Draft. Stick
with us, We'll be right back. All right, We're back

(01:11:32):
here for our final segment on Giants Draft Preview Live,
presented by Tommy's Tavern and Tap, John Svelt, Paul Dettino,
and Tony Pauline, our draft expert with you for the
next twelve minutes or so until the top of the
hour when Keith McPherson joins and takes over at nine pm.
So you guys want to get in, you can get
on the calls at eight eight eight eight eight one

(01:11:53):
zero one to nine. We'll get in some calls if
we can. But I think this is a good time
to talk about some of those potential trade options for
the Giants. Mention that Daniel Jeremiah mock draft Tony, he
has been trading up to eighteen with the Seahawks. Why
did you kind of raise your eyebrows at that particular
target and where do you think could be targets at
the end of the first round that would make sense
for the Giants, or another quarterback needed. Team trying to

(01:12:14):
move up, where would they go.

Speaker 1 (01:12:16):
I don't think the Seattle Seahawks would move that far down.
I know he's a little bit higher on Gray Zabel
than I have him. I do know the Seahawks like Zabel.
I think that's their selection. As far as trade down
or teams that would want to trade down. From what
I'm hearing, all three NFC teams, not NFC East teams,
start with Green Bay at twenty three. They are definitely
looking to move down. If a top pass rusher is

(01:12:39):
staring them in the face, maybe they go with that direction.
Maybe they look with that receiver. That'll be an opportunity
if in fact the Giants want to move up to
get a quarterback. The team that selects next, the Minnesota Vikings,
they need a qurnerback, but they're short on picks. They
would like to move down. They only have four picks
in this year's draft. That's to get some extra selections.
And you know, just I heard you talking earlier, why

(01:13:01):
do these teams want to move down? Because what's happening
is once you get outside the top twenty, you're basically
drafting second round players because there's only a limited number
of players that have true first round grades. I know
of one team that only has twelve players with first
round grades. So really, when you get from pick twenty
to pick sixty, it's all second round grades.

Speaker 6 (01:13:22):
And specifically Tody Minnesota picking a twenty four. They don't
have a second round pick, so they would love to
get something in that second day, and.

Speaker 1 (01:13:31):
The Washington Commanders are twenty nine. They don't have a
third round pick. They are looking to trade down, and
again trade down unless some great player that that's high
on the board happens to fall til their laps and
is staring in the face. I think the Commanders would also,
I know they want to trade down. Would they trade
with the Giants, I don't know, but they like to
trade down. They don't have a third round pick. They

(01:13:52):
want a third round pick so they can get an
extra receiver in that frame. From what I'm.

Speaker 3 (01:13:56):
Told, stop by Tommy's Tavern and tapping Edgewater and Clifton
tomorrow to watch Round one of the draft with a
Giants legend. Carl Banks will be at Tommy's Tavern and
Tappan Edgewater and OJ Anderson will be in Clifton from
seven thirty to nine. Go check it out. All right,
let's go to the phonesdot anyway one zero one nine
and we're gonna go next to Gary and Waterbury. Gary.

(01:14:19):
What's going on?

Speaker 11 (01:14:21):
Oh?

Speaker 2 (01:14:22):
Not much.

Speaker 11 (01:14:23):
I am excited about the Giraffe because I don't know
what the Giants are gonna do, and I'm not sure
that they know either at this point. But I hope
they hold the third pick and just get the best
available player.

Speaker 3 (01:14:40):
Gary. I'm gonna be honest, Yeah, and look, and I
think that's what they're going to do. The Giants are
gonna pick the guy that's the highest graded player on
their board. They're not gonna reach for somebody there and
appreciate the call Gary, good stuff. I'm not upstairs. I
don't know what's going on. They keep that draft room
locked up tighter than Fort Knox, but I would be very,

(01:15:02):
very surprised if at eight forty seven pm on the
Wednesday night before the draft, they don't have a pretty
darn good feel based on what's probably gonna happen at
one or two as to what they're gonna do. At
number three. Obviously, you don't etch anything in stone, you
don't write anything down in pen, you don't call the
league office and turn in the card extra early that
he is inevitable. Phone call comes in, you get extra

(01:15:24):
information and something might change. But Tony, you know, and
Paul how this works these teams at this point, they've
been through weeks of draft meetings. It's not like Joe
Shade's going home. It's two guys that I like, I'm
gonna sleep on. I'm gonna come back and make my decision.

Speaker 6 (01:15:36):
Lushine just told us last week that he's had phone calls,
yes exactly, moving up and moving down. So they have
a feel for at least what might potentially be possible.

Speaker 1 (01:15:47):
They know who they're gonna take. The question is who
wants to move up and are they willing to pay
the price that the Giants want. We see this all
the time. A couple of years ago, the Eagles wanting
to move up on the cheap to get Jalen Carter.
You're gonna hear all kinds of talk tomorrow about this
team wants to move up. Last year, the Colts wanting
to move up to get Rock Bowers, the Rams wanting

(01:16:07):
to move up to get rock Powers. You're gonna hear that,
and they will entertain those calls. It's just that does
a team wants to move up, are they going to
pay the Giants price in order for them to move down?
That's the only decision.

Speaker 3 (01:16:20):
And they're usually a quarterback tax, right if you're trading
up to draft the quarterback. But I do wonder if
this year, even though a team probably maybe they would
be I don't know, trading up for a quarterback if
the consensus evaluation of these players is to be believed,
the drop off from the Hunter and Carter group to

(01:16:41):
the next group Tony is so steep that I think
there would be maybe not a full quarterback tax, but
maybe a tiny little tax on it for a team
to move up to get the Giants to drop down
a couple spots. Again, if the Giants have a graded
like the consensus evaluators do last.

Speaker 1 (01:16:56):
Year, teams were gonna have to basically open the vall
to move up and get one of those quarterbacks in
the top three. That's why you didn't see any trades.
I don't think it's going at the price is going
to be all that steep. This year if a team
wants to move up.

Speaker 6 (01:17:11):
Now, let me address this with your Tony, because while
we're talking about possible trades, guys moving up, guys moving
down on the board, try to figure out what kind
of price that they're going to command. Everybody out there
wants to be a general manager and they want to
predict or craft a trade that their team should make.
So they go online and they find the old Jimmy

(01:17:32):
Johnson trade value chart, of which I have a copy
right here. Okay, I always keep it with me anyway.

Speaker 3 (01:17:37):
Paul's actually typed out on a typewriter up for the
people that want to get envision at home of what
Paul's holding in his hands hieroglyphics.

Speaker 11 (01:17:43):
Well, there you go.

Speaker 6 (01:17:44):
So my question to you is this. I'm told that
some teams still have this chart and still will look
at it. I'm told that other teams have completely different
charts that they go by, which are based on finances
and tracks and economic slots.

Speaker 3 (01:18:01):
A lot of the new charts, the differential and prices
aren't quite as steep from pick to pick. It's more
packed together. Spielberger for who used to work rather at Spielberger.
He used to be on our shows that he helped
develop that chart with some people in that another Trumper.
Most teams have custom charts they've developed in their analytics.

Speaker 6 (01:18:17):
That's my question to you is how many people, how
many people around the league and your opinion, still use
these types of charts and how useful are they If
everybody's got their own different chart, what are we doing.

Speaker 1 (01:18:30):
It's a guideline. It's not something that set in stone.
You know, if a team wants to move down and
they really don't care for the players that are available,
when they're called to the clock, they say, okay, this
is what we should get, and if they're offered less,
they'll still move down if they really don't if there's
no player available to them at that point, at that
when they're called to the clock, when they're on the clock,

(01:18:52):
you know, if they're gonna get some extra selections. It's
a guideline. It's not written in stone. It's not the Bible.
If we could put that way all.

Speaker 3 (01:18:59):
Right, now, it's time to play Predict the Pick presented
by Duncan. Go to giants dot com slash Predict the
Pick for your chance to win free Duncan coffee for
a year and an autographed item by the twenty twenty
five Giants first draft pick. So, Tony wanna go to
you first, Why don't you predict the pick? And by
the way, I'm gonna put the asterisks here, folks. We're
gonna talk about these picks and these players. Obviously, every

(01:19:21):
NFL team, including the Giants, well, maybe not more than Tony,
but at least more than Paw and I have a
lot more information about these guys than we do, Tony,
so locked in. They probably more than twenty two. But
so keep in mind that while we talk about these
players a certain way, the Giants and other teams might
know more than we do, whether it's medicals or anything else,
and they might have a different opinion on these guys.
So Tony, go ahead, predict your pick for the Giants. Yeah,

(01:19:42):
predicta pick at number three.

Speaker 1 (01:19:44):
Yeah, abdul clutter. I mean, they get the best player
in the draft with a third pick of the draft.
It's great value. He's much more than an ad rusher.
We're assuming that the medicals are fine on him and
he's going to be healthy early on. You know, people
are gonna broad and it's it's been my problem. They
brought rushing where they stereotypins as an edgeresher. Go back
and watch the twenty three film when he played in

(01:20:05):
space and he was great in pursuit and he showed
the ability to cover, and that's why he's so explosive.
I thought that, really Penn State did the service to
him this year lining up out of a three point stance.
He basically do everything. And as I said earlier, you
know Paul and I go back and in the eighties
in the nineties, everybody coveted the impact defensive player in

(01:20:27):
the draft. That's exactly what Abdua Carter is.

Speaker 6 (01:20:29):
You know, John, to enhance this defense, to make it
a dominant force again like the Giants championship teams of
the past that Tony just referred to. This is a
guy who could easily be a major component in that direction.
And as we talked about before Tony came out into
the program, there's no reason why he can't play in
conjunction with Thibodeaux and Burns on the field at the

(01:20:51):
same time. So yes, I'm with you on this one, Tony.
I think Carter would.

Speaker 3 (01:20:56):
Be the guy I leave the window open for a
quarterback just because teams are always looking for one when
they don't have one, and if they believe in one,
I will never rule that out as a possibility. And
if they believe one, they should certainly pick one in
that spot. But if cam Warden and Travis Hunter are
off the board and by all on dcations, they are
going to be I'm with you, guys, I agree. I
just think he's a really, really good player. He rushes

(01:21:18):
the passer well, double digit sacks last year. He has
rare physical traits. I wish we could have seen him
test at the combine Tony, because I think his testing
numbers have been great. You know Bruce Feldman on his
Freaks List. We have him on draft season all the time,
by the way, guys, search a draft season on your
favorite podcast platform. And his numbers that he tested over
the summer were off the charts. And we talked to

(01:21:39):
Bruce on the Johnson podcast at a couple weeks ago
and he said Penn State is actually one of the
schools that generally give him some of the most accurate numbers.
When you get to actual combine testing, the Penn State
numbers tend to match more than other teams. So he's
a freak athlete, and again you can add to a
pass rush. You see how teams build through the defensive
one and the defensive front. You add a run stuff

(01:22:00):
for a little bit later on in the draft, you
stop to run a little bit better, you get teams
into more third and lungs. You unleash that pass rush,
and that can really be a difference maker for defense.

Speaker 6 (01:22:09):
And John, I'll tell you something else about Carter as
he matures and fills out, and I think you'll agree
with this. Tony, he will get stronger and more powerful,
and he will add more elements to his game.

Speaker 1 (01:22:18):
Only makes sense. I mean he's an underclassman. You can
say that about armand Menbo and Jaylen Walker, guys like that.
It makes sense. Just as you physically mature, as you
get older, you get better and that component of your
game improves.

Speaker 3 (01:22:32):
All right, Before we say goodbye, we got about the
midtle left. Each of you throw out a couple of
names of a guy that you really like in this
draft that maybe we even talked about. That you want
to feature Tony. Why don't you go first, Kat McMillan.
I think he's a dominant receiver. I know he's made
some really dumb comments in the lead up to the draft.
By the way, though those comments were from like two
years ago, we should be clear about that. People dug
those up from when he was a freshman.

Speaker 1 (01:22:52):
Just for the record, I just think he is an
outstanding game controlling receiver. I agree he's great, and I'm
gonna go with the guy in the third round like
a lot that no one is paying attention to, Ty
Felton of Maryland. Tall, excellent rangy guy, terrific downfield receiver,
ran in the four threes at the Combine, and he
plays like a vertical receiver. So I like both of

(01:23:13):
those guys.

Speaker 3 (01:23:13):
Ball give me a couple guys.

Speaker 6 (01:23:14):
You know, I love the hammers in the backfield. So
I'm gonna go with Camp Scataboo out of Arizona State,
who is just an absolute sledgehammer. He is a force.
He black and blues people on the other side of
the ball. And I really love Oli Gordon also or
coming out of Oklahoma State, as another guy who runs angry.
That's one of my favorite things when I look at

(01:23:36):
tape of a guy is if he runs angry.

Speaker 3 (01:23:39):
Right, Kyle brant Well, I didn't take that from him.

Speaker 1 (01:23:43):
He took it from me. Oh, I'm sure that's the
only thing about those running backs is they're smart. They're smart. Yeah,
they look for the contact, but they're smart players. They
see the field, find them a great vision, and find
the running lanes.

Speaker 3 (01:23:55):
All right, I'm gonna give you two defensive tackles that
are like Tyler Williams. So I just think it's a
really safe player. He's gonna stop the run and be
an anchor for you in the middle of your defense.
Just a really good player. Love him. You want to
wait a little bit later for a plugger. Look at CJ.
West out of Indiana. He's not his big as Ti
Leek Williams, but man, and he tested well for a
man his size too. He is just solid as a

(01:24:16):
rock and he's got some bursts to his game. I
think he can develop a little bit as a pass rusher.
Was really good Ken State, Indiana. We saw him at
the shri and ball. No one could move him off
the line of scrimmage. No, he was absolutely dominant. And
then I got to shout out my guy R. J.
Harvey at a UCF. Just a big play waiting to happen.
He's quick, he's athletic, he can catch the ball out
of the backfield. One receiver I likely uh Jayalen Knowle

(01:24:37):
out of Iowa State would not be surprising me if
he ends up being the second best wide receiver in
this draft class. I'm much higher him than Tony is,
and that's okay.

Speaker 6 (01:24:45):
I think we loved him at the combo.

Speaker 3 (01:24:47):
I think he's fantastic, really good player. So those are
some names althro out there, and I got to show
my love out for Tyler Shuck, who I thought his
tape was is a lot of fun this year. I
know he's gonna be, you know, like forty five years
old when the draft happens.

Speaker 6 (01:24:57):
A couple.

Speaker 3 (01:24:59):
O Joe, he's twenty five, he's gonna be twenty six.
I just thought he was really fun to watch and
talking to him too it at the Senior boat.

Speaker 6 (01:25:05):
Just a really out of central casting.

Speaker 3 (01:25:07):
Really fun kid to watch on tape. So but I
think all these quarterbacks we talked about all have talent,
all have ability, whether it's Shad or Sanders, Tyler Schulk,
Jackson Dark Jalen Milroe, all different but good in different ways,
and they all could be good options for the Giants
if they decide to go to the route up the quarterback, Tony.
It was always fun having you my friend, appreciate it.
Thanks for having me here, PAULI always fun. Paul and
I will be live doing coverage of the draft for

(01:25:28):
the Giants. Will React live on Giants dot Com and
the Giants App after each pick on Thursday and Friday night,
and you can check out the Giants social media for
the rest of our schedule. But a lot coming your
way playing Big Blue Kickoff Live next two days twelve thirty.
A bunch of Giant hotle podcasts going up. Make sure
you check all that out Giants dot Com, Slash Podcast,
the Giants App, or just search on your favorite podcast

(01:25:49):
platform for Giants Huddle, Draft Season or Big Blop Kickoff Live.
We thanks to our partners over at Wfan for letting
us do these two hours tonight. We had a lot
of fun. Thanks for the callers, Connor Green, thanks for
making us look as good as you possibly can. You
the man. That's all we have for Giants Draft Preview
Live presented by Tommy's Tavern and Tap your perfect spot
for every occasion, and I should mention we'll be back

(01:26:11):
on Sunday morning. To recap the draft right here on
the fan from eight to ten am. Tony will be
back with us again as well. Make sure you join
us then. For our entire crew, I'm John Schmelk. Enjoy
the draft everybody. We'll talk to you soon.