December 12, 2025 • 56 mins
Podcast Show Notes: Interview with Erin Rodman & Zac Hug of 12 Dates ’Til Christmas Today on Girls Gone Hallmark, we’re thrilled to welcome two of the creative forces behind Hallmark’s brand-new holiday rom-com series 12 Dates ’Til Christmas: showrunner Erin Rodman and writer/producer Zac Hug. We’re diving deep into how this six-episode series came to life — from adapting Jennie Bayliss’ novel, to shaping the tone, to casting May Whitman, to filming in London and Ireland (with shockingly good weather!), to the sheep that stole the show. If you love behind-the-scenes Hallmark magic, this episode is for you.
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Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:02):
This is a Bramble Jam podcast.
Speaker 2 (00:22):
Welcome to Girls Gone Hallmark, a Hallmark review podcast. I'm
Megan and I'm a longtime Hallmark fan.
Speaker 3 (00:27):
I'm Wendy. I'm a former Hallmark hater.
Speaker 2 (00:30):
Today we are thrilled to be joined by two of
the brilliant minds behind Hallmark's brand new sixth episode holiday
rom com series twelve dates till Christmas. We've got showrunner
Aaron Rodman, whose credits include The Christmas House and The Christmas.
Speaker 3 (00:44):
House to deck those halls, as well as Christmas.
Speaker 2 (00:47):
Class Reunion, and writer and producer Zach Hug known for
some of our favorites like Ghosts of Christmas.
Speaker 3 (00:53):
Always the more the merrier. Thank you so much for
being here.
Speaker 1 (00:57):
Thank you for having us for thrilled to be here.
Speaker 3 (01:00):
We have loved this series, loved it.
Speaker 2 (01:04):
We can't say enough about it, and as Wendy said
in our first review, it's like grab Hallmark by the
shoulders and say like.
Speaker 3 (01:12):
Let's keep doing more of this please kind of love.
Speaker 1 (01:16):
I mean, that's what we always wanted to happen. And here, of.
Speaker 2 (01:20):
Course, well let's talk about how it came to be.
It's adapted from a book by Jenny Baylist. I'd love
to know just the origin story. Did you read the book?
Did someone come to you? How did the series come
to be?
Speaker 4 (01:34):
So a producer sent to the book to me before
it was published. And as you may know, it's very
common in Hollywood for manuscripts of books to go out
around town to producers, to writers, to studios before they're published.
Sometimes they're never published, but the manuscript still gets optioned
or bought to be adapted to a TV series or
a movie. This was Jenny's first book. She was not
(01:57):
yet This is her foray into being a novelist. It
was sent to me as in manuscript form at the time.
I love this producer, but I did not have the
bandwidth to take on the project. And so about a
year later, that producer wound up as an executive at
Hallmark and called me and said, can we take another
crack at this? And so I had loved the book
(02:19):
and loved the concept. I think that the Twelve Dates
of Christmas as a dating service, like a Christmas themed
dating service you could do every year at Christmas, is
like I wish it was real.
Speaker 5 (02:30):
Yeah, sign you up so hard, Like I would have
just so many people.
Speaker 4 (02:37):
So I reached out to Jenny. I had took me
a little time to get to her through social media.
I reached out to her directly and said, hey, there's
interest in this, and here's who I am, and let's
talk and let me let's see if we want to
be partners in my You know, a lot of times
the author is not involved, you know, you just option
the material or deal with reps. But I really thought
(02:59):
there was a benefit to us being partners and finding
something together.
Speaker 1 (03:04):
And I like that. I like collaboration.
Speaker 4 (03:06):
I like taking advantage of all the work she's already
done on this story. I'm building this world, and she
was an absolutely huge part of this process.
Speaker 1 (03:14):
And still is.
Speaker 4 (03:15):
She was in the writer's room, she was on set.
So it's all started back five years ago when before
the book was published. But it's been a nice, long,
beautiful relationship and she's published many books since then.
Speaker 3 (03:27):
Can I ask you a question about the writer's room.
Speaker 2 (03:29):
I saw a screenshow of a zoom. Is your writer's
room virtual or are you actually sitting in the same
space doing it?
Speaker 1 (03:39):
Was virtual? It was virtual for two reasons.
Speaker 4 (03:43):
One is it did allow for all of us to
not have to be in the same space, and Jenny's
in England and I was out on the.
Speaker 1 (03:50):
East Coast for part of the of the writer's room period.
But even when we weren't all in La Ellie, traffic
is real, you know, the city can be a pain.
Speaker 4 (04:00):
People have kids that got to pick up at a
certain time and an hour in traffic, you know. To
all come together in the same room, there's definitely a
benefit of it. And if we'd had a longer writer's
room perhaps that would have been the choice. But it
was truly just easier on all of our lives and
schedules to do it over zoom.
Speaker 2 (04:16):
Yes, I mean, I feel like we've opened up that
window right five years ago. It's like, oh, we can
do so much more work this way and on everyone's schedule.
Speaker 1 (04:25):
Some time in sweatpants pajamas, Yeah, make your lunch and
meet your snat.
Speaker 2 (04:31):
I mean it just you know, you can blow your
background and be in your bedroom and yeah.
Speaker 4 (04:36):
But I think we made a joint decision, like we
talked about it as a group, because you know, you
don't want to sacrifice something valuable in the chemistry of
being in a room together, you know, without thoughtlessly you
want to make sure everybody still feels like we could
do a great job.
Speaker 1 (04:51):
VI A Zoom.
Speaker 2 (04:53):
So both of you have extensive Hallmark resumes, but this
show has a really fresh, sharp tone. We obviously love Hallmark,
It's what we do, but it feels real netflixy in
a really good way. And I'm wondering how like this
whole team of you know, Hallmark familiar creators came to
(05:15):
create such a fresh take on this store.
Speaker 3 (05:18):
And was there.
Speaker 2 (05:19):
Any pushback at all when that was happening. Of course,
it's still like checks all of the boxes, but it's
it's it's different.
Speaker 5 (05:29):
Yeah, you know to me. So I was brought on
by Aaron and they had already worked on I think
the first two episodes were written when I joined up.
But my take when I when I started was like,
this is this is Hallmark how it exists kind of
in my head when I'm writing it. This is kind
of how but which is not to say that like
(05:51):
it changes or becomes something else. I think there was
more time to create it, and I you know, these
movies are made, and they are made. There is not
a formula, but but also there is an expectation and
a brand around the stories that you tell, and I
think audiences expect something from a two hour movie that
(06:12):
in a TV show, you really if you if you
moved that quickly, and if you if you told the
story with that lens on it that the movies exist
in you, you would you would lose something in the
TV show. I think because these stories have to move
so quickly and you have to you gloss over stuff,
you sort of and you know the show you actually
(06:34):
you have all these characters. You have to service all
of them. You have to give them all interesting lives.
I mean, I love that scene where Laura's at home
with her husband, like her husband is this solid dude,
and that you know, you don't have time in a
lot of ways to sort of prove that, like the
confidant has this life that's awesome. And I think here
(06:55):
in six episodes, while you're still limited in time, you've
got you've got more space, more room to breathe a
little bit about everyone's emotional lives, and so I think
that's kind of that's to me is the great joy
of it is that you you get to live in
it a little bit longer, and that feels nice.
Speaker 4 (07:13):
I think that there's a chain of people that explain
why this feels appealing for Hallmark, right for the Hallmark audience,
right for you know that brand, but also perhaps larger
partially because Jenny, the way she writes in her novels,
you know, her Girls Party, and we walked that back
(07:37):
to some degree in developing this story. She writes very grounded,
real women, So they do things in the real world
that we all do when you're single, when you're dating.
And then so we started with what already felt kind
of like a swing, but Hallmark was always very supportive,
really loved the book, really liked what that brought. So
(07:57):
we have their support early on with you know, trying something,
because that the great.
Speaker 1 (08:02):
Thing about working with Hallmark.
Speaker 4 (08:04):
No one knows their audience better than those executives, and they.
Speaker 1 (08:07):
Don't expect you to already know.
Speaker 4 (08:09):
They are able to tell you, like, we try things
and then they say too far, or go farther, or
how about this, So it's a real collaboration. That's the
benefit of those executives to so many in so many
ways is that they aren't going to throw you to
the wolves and say guess what Hallmark wants. They're really
going to help you find that bulls eye and no
one knows better than them.
Speaker 5 (08:29):
Yeah, so your.
Speaker 4 (08:30):
Job is to bring your distinct voice, your level of comedy,
push them sometimes and see what happens. And sometimes it works,
sometimes it doesn't. So there was Jenny, there were our
Hallwark executives, and then I have to give credit to
my kosher runner, Dava Avena, who is you know, a
very seasoned TV writer and the only one of us
on the writing staff not from Hallmark who'd never done
(08:53):
Hallwark before. She's done incredible shows like Firefly, Lane, and
she worked on like mainstream shows on ABC, so she
really was the seasoned TV writer, had run Writer's Rooms before,
had been an EP executive producer.
Speaker 1 (09:07):
So we brought her in to, you know, help.
Speaker 4 (09:11):
She had just had the most experience of the whole process,
and by not having someone who was very familiar with
the genre and writing strong women and writing rom com
you know TV and like series long stories, she didn't
bring any preconceived notions and so we had a real
fresh perspective.
Speaker 1 (09:32):
And that was intentional.
Speaker 5 (09:33):
You know.
Speaker 4 (09:33):
Hallmark had always wanted to work with her and this
was an opportunity to do so I lucked out big time.
Speaker 1 (09:39):
And having a.
Speaker 4 (09:39):
Partner who had all this experience and curiosity about finally
like working in.
Speaker 1 (09:45):
The Hallmark space.
Speaker 4 (09:46):
And so she was our leader in the writer's room,
and she was on set with me, you know, almost
the whole time. And so she, like you know, was
part of that chain as well. So it really is
the fabric we intentionally the fabric of creators for this series.
And then you bring in May, who has not done
you know, has maybe done Hallmark.
Speaker 1 (10:07):
I think she's done on her too, maybe when she
was younger. I don't, honestly don't remember. I don't know.
I should know the answer to that. It's horrible that
I don't.
Speaker 4 (10:13):
But she is different and she has her own perspective,
and she brought a lot to the character.
Speaker 1 (10:18):
So all these things.
Speaker 4 (10:19):
Factored into it, and that is like part of the
magic of this particular project.
Speaker 2 (10:25):
I think, will you bring up May, I think that's
the perfect transition because she is like, having seen this,
I can't imagine anybody else as Kate. But was there
anything for you that shifted Kate's personality or performance once
May was brought on.
Speaker 1 (10:40):
She's so funny. Oh my god.
Speaker 4 (10:43):
I used to joke with her on set about some
pitch line changes and they were better. And this sounds
like you're going to be in the writer's guild by
the end of this production. Because she just has so
much experience, Like no, literally, I don't know that. I mean,
since she was a tiny child, knows how to just
(11:04):
be a you know, a terrific collaborator with everyone, crew, casts, writers, everybody.
Speaker 1 (11:11):
But she is fearless.
Speaker 4 (11:12):
About pitching jokes, she tries things, and she's very funny.
She's a very funny person, a very entertaining person, and
we were so lucky that she brought that to the character.
But yeah, I mean literally, day to day to day,
I could look at almost every scene and tell you
something that she added, what was on the page.
Speaker 5 (11:30):
I think also, though she's in so many ways, if
I were to make a movie of Aaron's life, I
would cast may that like because in the writer's room
we talked a lot, like we would occasionally refer to
Kate as we'd be like when then Aaron goes to sorry,
Kate goes to the thing her voice. I don't think
we meant to do it, but I think that her
voice sort of naturally, you know, I mean, like erin
(11:53):
and I've been friends for fifteen years. And I think
one of the reasons is that like that is that
is the person that I try to write right. When
I'm writing anything right, it's sort of like, give me
a real person, give me this woman who knows herself,
who is fallible but also like really smart and kind
and wants things out of the world. And it's really
(12:14):
funny about it. And so a lot of the story kept.
I think we all kind of just rallied around that character,
and there is a blend, I mean, in the chain
of how this turned out. Like I would I would
also note that Aaron is so much of the voice
of that character and how everyone relates to her. To
Kate is a lot of how people relate I think
(12:37):
to Erin in a lot of ways, and I just
that was one of my favorite pieces of watching this
was like, oh, I'm watching a television show about my
best friend.
Speaker 4 (12:47):
I had flaws for days and for our main character
soon lots of issues.
Speaker 2 (12:54):
So funny you say that, because as we watch a
lot of Hallmark movies, review a lot of Hallmark movies,
we watch a lot of TV too, and we have
always said since we've been doing this is like, we
want messy characters. We want characters who who look like us,
who are doing things, making decisions, making bad mistakes just
like we do. Like that's very relatable TV, and I
(13:16):
freaking love Kate. Can you tell us how May was
brought to you, guys, like when you were writing the
show where you're like, yeah, we want to do it
with me, whitman?
Speaker 3 (13:27):
Or was she presented to you and did you go
when she got cast?
Speaker 4 (13:33):
Literally have never recovered from you that she said yes.
So even now, I still can't believe it. She was
number one on our list. And as you you know,
the casting process is there's a million factors that make
an actor available or not available or just flat out
say no.
Speaker 1 (13:50):
She was number one on our list.
Speaker 4 (13:52):
Hallmark was very interested in, you know, finding a way
to work with her. You know, I was on everyone's radar.
If you're a woman of a certain dame, you're interested
in what she's doing.
Speaker 1 (14:01):
And so she was.
Speaker 4 (14:02):
Number one and she said yes, like within a couple
of days. It was the most simple process ever casting.
I still can't believe she said yes. I still can't
believe Hallmark. I mean, I just can't believe it all worked.
It's like the thing where you're like, she said yes,
and we were all like, okay, nobody move, something is
going to make her change her mind. And then I think,
(14:24):
you know, I yeah.
Speaker 2 (14:27):
What A get what I get? I love seeing her
on Hallmark. I'm a huge fan of hers. So yeah,
when we when it was announced earlier this year that
the series was coming, I was.
Speaker 3 (14:38):
Like, who, Who's coming to Hamemark?
Speaker 1 (14:40):
What?
Speaker 5 (14:41):
It was so pretty cool.
Speaker 1 (14:43):
We couldn't tell anybody for a while. I mean, I
think it was me.
Speaker 4 (14:46):
So we've written all the scripts before, and so by
the time it got to casting, the writer's room was
pretty much finished.
Speaker 1 (14:52):
I think, I can't.
Speaker 4 (14:53):
We were going we had written this show, so we
didn't write with her in mind, and so but her
saying yes hotified.
Speaker 1 (15:01):
The tone of the stories. So like by virtue of
knowing it was.
Speaker 4 (15:04):
Going to be her, I think we all took like
this deep breath of like the way the comedy feels,
the way the heart you know, and the emotion comes through,
all of it is going to be in good hands,
and like she knows what She's going to know what
to do with that tone and preserve it and add
to it, and you know, she delivered it in every
single way. And because she's such a professional, she knows
(15:25):
how to like just show up and the crew was
obsessed with her. She was friends with everybody, like she
just makes us. She knows how to be a number
one on the call sheet, she.
Speaker 1 (15:35):
Just knew how to set. Yeah, it was a dream.
Speaker 5 (15:39):
It was a dream.
Speaker 1 (15:39):
It's still a dream. I still can't believe it, you know.
Speaker 2 (15:42):
Yeah, we have said that this show has a little
bit of a Gilmore Girl's sensibility to it, which for
us is a huge compliment. We love that show, We
love that pace saying is that something that you strive for,
(16:03):
is that something that you recognize?
Speaker 3 (16:05):
Is that our feeling is like, you know, May is like.
Speaker 2 (16:07):
Sixty degrees of separation away from gil margirls with her
friendship from Lauren Graham.
Speaker 3 (16:11):
So like, did she bring that?
Speaker 2 (16:14):
It obviously comes through in the writing because the writing's snappy.
Speaker 4 (16:18):
Yeah, So I think I could be wrong about this
because it's all last week is kind of a blur
the week, you know, the show comes out. I feel
like People Magazine did an article that said that.
Speaker 1 (16:27):
In the title, oh, the show.
Speaker 4 (16:29):
Feels like Gilmore Girl or like May Whitman name checked
Lauren Graham and the tone of something, and I was like,
you know, like this is the most amazing comparison.
Speaker 1 (16:39):
And I think the bottom line is the things we
all love in culture, we just want more of.
Speaker 4 (16:45):
So it was not intentional in the sense that we
sat in the room and said, how did love to make.
Speaker 3 (16:50):
Gil margirls two point out?
Speaker 1 (16:51):
Yeah?
Speaker 4 (16:52):
But did I from the time I started pitching the
show four years ago, did I always say Blaxford, which
is the English village you know, at the heart of
the show is the stars Hollow of England. You know,
think of it as a community in this way where
there's the Reverend characters and there's a community spirit and
a real devotion to this place, and that it'll be
(17:12):
the kind of place you see on screen and which
was real that you could live in.
Speaker 1 (17:15):
And so it was, you know, in on our minds
for sure, but.
Speaker 4 (17:18):
On our minds because we loved the show so much,
loved you know, Gilmore Girls so much, and I wish
there was a ten more seasons sure than you know,
everything I write is chasing a certain emotion that I
felt before as a viewer, and I want to create
a story that elicits that same feeling in myself and others.
So in the spiritual sense, I do think there it's
(17:41):
thrilling to think that people find them in the same universe.
Speaker 2 (17:45):
Well, you talked a little bit about Blaxford, Ireland stands
in for London and much of this movie. What was
it like filming on location in Ireland and did that
kind of shape the obviously it does, but shape the
feel of the movie for you arriving there.
Speaker 3 (18:04):
Yes, I the series, not the movie. I'm sorry, that's okay.
Speaker 1 (18:07):
So the part London was actually London.
Speaker 4 (18:10):
Our first like five days of shooting, three days of
shooting was in London, and then we all moved to
Ireland and the rest is you know, Ireland for England.
I will tell you that we I think I can
speak for you know, everyone I know involved in this
production had the most amazing time in Ireland with the
most talented Irish crew and actors, the most warm welcome
(18:33):
as you know, a giant production that clunked into town
bothered everybody for five months. The talent, the people we
got in each department, you know, the art director and
like the our costumes and our hair and make everybody
was so incredible and so good. We were so lucky
that like a lot of our crew was had worked
on Wednesday, and a lot of our crew worked on Vikings,
(18:55):
and they were people who had done all these big
shows and they hadn't done Christmas.
Speaker 1 (19:00):
Nobody was sick of Christmas.
Speaker 4 (19:02):
Nothing felt like it was all fresh and new, and
so we would have these meetings in the art department
and with the production designer and he's like excited about
doing Christmas, which was so fun.
Speaker 1 (19:12):
Too capitalize on everyone's enthusiasm, But I.
Speaker 4 (19:16):
Would say that the way in which Ireland had the
most impact on the show is that the way we
all felt about each other. It really is so cliched
to say about the crew becomes a family and all
of that, but no kidding, Like our text chain, which
is like one hundred and three people, is still going
and we wrapped in May, so like this is you know,
(19:36):
and it's almost all Irish people and then some Americans
and some English people, but it is like the we
all lament this is over because it was such a
wonderful experience. Everyone was so kind and so had a
good time on set. And I think you can feel that.
I think you can tell you can't always tell when
like production's brutal, and you know, you can't always feel
(19:59):
that in the product. But I believe that the war,
a lot of the warmth and joy you can sense
in this show is because.
Speaker 1 (20:05):
The people were actually feeling those things to the theater school.
Speaker 5 (20:08):
I mean it really to me, Like I was on
set briefly, Like I was there a couple of weeks,
just kind of for in and out, but it really
felt like when people come together to make community theater,
except they all are much better at their jobs and
they've been doing for years and they know how to
want a camera. But also every set that I walked
onto it felt like it came out of my head
(20:30):
but was better. Like the what is it the Escape Room?
I walked in there and there were these someone had
found all of these incredible sculptures that were Christmas villages
that were kind of like a Tim Burton Christmas and
like I just stood there for like an hour, kind
of going through the room and thinking to myself, like
what this is like living in my own head? I'm speaking,
(20:52):
but they were all, yeah, it was the nicest, loveliest people.
They had us over for dinner. We crushed the erin
and I just like this guy and his wife and
their kids, and they're.
Speaker 4 (21:04):
People from the sound department, were like, don't spend Easter
by herself comes, So we didn't.
Speaker 1 (21:10):
It just it never ended.
Speaker 4 (21:12):
There was just this excitement and thrill for everybody. And
I think, like we shot there's this all the scenes
that take place in Nicola. By Nicola, which is the
the saddle Row Design House where Kate works as a
pattern as a textile designer.
Speaker 1 (21:27):
Is a real.
Speaker 4 (21:27):
Irish tailor, Like it's been there for over like one
hundred years forever, and it's it was like he just
led us. He was such a one wonderful man and
had this incredible story about being orphaned when he was
a kid and like being basically raised in the attic
of a tailor and like became a tailor himself and
then had these kids and then adopted. I mean, he
was just like this Irish twinkle in his eye I had,
(21:50):
you know, I'm like, it was just it was too
good to be true. And one of our one of
the production designers, has a daughter who works in fashion,
and so he had her send the clothes she'd made
and we use those in the show as part of
the So there was just this endless amount of like
people just willing to give their things and be a
part of it and contribute, and it all felt so
(22:13):
like yeah, community theater, like just we were all trying
really hard, running in the same direction to make this
great thing and this fun thing.
Speaker 2 (22:20):
The dates are very cool production value wise, the content.
Speaker 3 (22:25):
Is there one that was the hardest to pull off?
Speaker 5 (22:27):
The London Eye, Oh, it doesn't happen.
Speaker 6 (22:36):
I think, well, it's they each had their hardship. Yeah,
I think that you want them to be so dazzling
that they all felt pressurized to be that. So that
and that's not maybe that's not a very fun answer,
but like for every single one, it was like, how
do we knock this out of the park, and then
(22:56):
how to realistically what can we pull off with budget
and yeah, Heather and cast.
Speaker 4 (23:01):
Availability and like what's actually possible? I think Zach said
the escape room they built it out of nothing and
it was so incredible and it was this playground for
the crew, you know, between takes. I almost want to
say that the hardest was the final date, date twelve,
because it had to feel so grand and like worthy
(23:24):
of a finale and finding the right space and having
the right feeling for that was like we all were
sweating to make sure that it would actually feel that
special and transportive.
Speaker 2 (23:36):
Well, speaking of dates, we have to ask about Callum
not knowing the full emotional arc. At what point were
you like, Okay, well we got to thread the needle
here and again we have not seen the whole thing,
so this is not a spoiler. But to us having
seen the first two, it's like, well, is he the
obvious love interest or is this a red herring? Like
how did you walk that line with Callum and with
(24:00):
Richard Richard hartright emerge?
Speaker 5 (24:03):
I know that I will say the writer's room that
was the most fun because because up until the last minute,
I mean, I think you know how the you know
how the book ends, and I won't spoil it here,
but we had a hard time. I chose. I was
on I'm on both teams at different times. Right. I
was on the team of the guy in the escape
(24:23):
room for a minute. I was on there's the guy
who's the guy that I really loved. There was one
there was one date where I was like, he needs
more story and they were like, we do not have
time to tell the story about this poor sweet man
at the SALTI Club. Sorry, but I think that's the
that's the part of it is that if you're going
to send someone on twelve dates, I listen, I'm I'm
(24:44):
all four to twelve. I'll go on twelve, I'll go
on one hundred dates, Like I want to meet people.
I'm interested in the stories they have to tell. And
I think keeping that character on her back foot the
whole time was one of the more for like was
one of the best things to write, because it does
again when you're in a to our movie, Well, at
some point they're going to kiss and then they're going
to be together forever fate to black and I and
(25:05):
the snowfalls and I we didn't have that right, Like,
that doesn't exist in this universe. And I think that
what what a fun thing to write, particularly in a
Christmas story, that it's not just two people linking up.
It's a character who wants things outside of this dating
life for herself and they are the obstacle. And also
(25:30):
the prize. I think that was an incredible what a
gift for a writer to throw together.
Speaker 4 (25:37):
I feel like what we really wanted to make it clear,
and this to feel true to life is you always
have choices that you know there are that this notion
of like fate or like you know, the right one
there there is the feeling of that, but there is
also you can still mess it up.
Speaker 1 (25:57):
You can be able to use something else.
Speaker 4 (26:00):
You know, there are options here, and it may be
that you have a sense because of the genre and
the tropes we work with, who's going to be even
in that case, how and starting with Callum in a relationship,
and starting with Kate and Callum in this deep friendship
(26:20):
creates a question of well.
Speaker 1 (26:23):
How from here to there?
Speaker 4 (26:26):
And the hope is that that journey's entertaining. It feels
true and emotionally resonant, that you know it can happen
this way, and that there's curiosity about it, so you
know you will find out why they aren't together, why
they weren't together, and.
Speaker 1 (26:45):
What stands in the way for the future.
Speaker 4 (26:48):
You'll find out and hopefully that is a rewarding, you know, reveal.
But in the meantime, she's trying on different you know,
feelings and chances and you know I wanted it to
I wanted there's no point putting her through.
Speaker 1 (27:04):
The dating process.
Speaker 4 (27:05):
If she wasn't taking it seriously, she couldn't be dialed
into someone else, so that the twelve dates were just filler.
You know, it had to feel like you know possibilities
and that someone could.
Speaker 1 (27:19):
Turn your head.
Speaker 4 (27:19):
You could think you know what you want, but someone
could turn your head and surprise you. And then what
does that bring up and what does that mean and
what should you explore? What instincts should you follow? So
that is that was the playground.
Speaker 5 (27:30):
Hopefully, well just that it makes her a better artist.
I think that was my favorite part of it was
that we kept coming back to this thing that she
is not out to find someone to date. She is
out to reinvent or reinvigorate the life she's living, and
this is a piece of it, and that those things
do you know, inspiration comes from the emotional life of
(27:51):
a character, and I think watching her discover like that
scene where she's on the roof and she starts sketching,
I think there's something great about showing a character in
their daily life how this affects them, rather than that
is the goal that is the want of the character.
The want of the character is very much grounded in
This is a character who who knows something is missing
(28:11):
in her life. It probably isn't a dude, and it
isn't right that she has. What she has done is
sort of shrunk away from herself, and this is her
throwing herself back into the world.
Speaker 4 (28:20):
And I think that, yeah, there's there's value in the experience. Correct, Yeah,
experience itself, regardless of the outcome, is going.
Speaker 1 (28:26):
To change things.
Speaker 2 (28:27):
I think that comes through so strongly right off the bat,
Like we have the first five dates, right, and Kate's
not excited about this, like she's irritated going into it
that her friends have put her in this position. But
then she commits immediately, like even when she's in the
igloo alone, like she's popping champagne and having a good
time by herself. And then she has that date, the
(28:49):
ice skating date where he cries into her mouth, which,
by the way, we need to know who is responsible
for that line.
Speaker 5 (28:58):
I don't remember, but I think that's Aarin.
Speaker 1 (29:00):
Well doav is that episode one?
Speaker 5 (29:02):
Then?
Speaker 1 (29:02):
Yes, it's me. That actor was so great that we
wrote him into more things throughout the season.
Speaker 2 (29:11):
Well, and that's the nice thing, right, It's like it
doesn't end like these guys. His story carries through and
he reconnects back, you know, to Kate's core group, and
even she has that baking date and you're like, well,
this isn't the guy, but also she's all in, like
she's fully connected with him. They have this great connection
moment talking and I loved the way May did that
(29:34):
where she wasn't like I'm just checking the box so
my friends get off.
Speaker 3 (29:38):
She was there and all in.
Speaker 2 (29:41):
And then she orchestrates to Wingman's that dance, which is
so great, like the fan scene where she blocks the
guy from getting onto the dance.
Speaker 3 (29:48):
It's it's so good. Oh my gosh.
Speaker 1 (29:51):
Yeah, well it's nice hear you say that.
Speaker 4 (29:53):
I think that it was important that we be like,
she's not interested in a relationship, but that is not
the only reason you date.
Speaker 1 (30:03):
So that's just the truth.
Speaker 5 (30:06):
If it wasn't twelve dates, it could have been twelve murders.
Like it's a different show. It's like doves at that point,
but like it's you know, if she is she's reinvigorating
her sense of herself and it just this one happens
to be through dating, And I thought that was a Yeah,
I love my I love.
Speaker 4 (30:22):
That about this, But I agree with you that the
way may played it, she's not someone who's she's a
creative in the world. She's not afraid of experience, it's
afraid of a good time just because she's in a
low moment in life.
Speaker 1 (30:36):
She's not like a wallflower.
Speaker 4 (30:38):
She's not a weirdo who needs someone to drag her
into society. Like she knows how to be in the
world and do stuff, and so she's not that's not
the issue. Yeah, that's not her issue.
Speaker 2 (30:49):
Speaking of relationships, can we talk about mac and Evelyn
and the lovely Jane Seymour I.
Speaker 4 (30:56):
Mean another kind of pinch me moment of asting, of course, sure.
And she was such an enthusiastic participant in this, like
she was so here for the love story, for the
ways in which it was about two people who had
been through a lot in life and were deciding whether
(31:17):
or not to maybe look at each other a certain way,
you know, and and try this again or find a connection,
whether it's romantic or platonic. And they, you know, she
and Nathaniel Parker just knocked it out of the park
as far as great chemistry. They they took it seriously
and they carried with you.
Speaker 1 (31:38):
Know, a lot of intention into making.
Speaker 4 (31:41):
This love story feel just as important in the whole
series as anything.
Speaker 5 (31:47):
She also changed, I mean to me the role writing
Evelyn and watching Jane play Evelyn. There was a very
interesting change in the character from from my experience in
the room because I've famously very protective of Evelyn. I
don't know why. Something about that character. I was like,
nothing bad can happen to her. And then but in
(32:10):
my head she was a little bit you know, drier
and a little bit spark like crankier about things. And
then you put all those words in Jane Seymour's mouth
and they are the most charming, lovely human who knows
themselves right. And I was like, oh, that's how that
works so well? Is you know, you write towards one
(32:31):
thing and then an actress comes in and goes hold
on said a lot of it line for line, and
it still just changed it entirely and made this really
well rounded character who had a lot going on inside
of them.
Speaker 1 (32:43):
So and she has the most beautiful hair.
Speaker 5 (32:46):
The most.
Speaker 2 (32:51):
Okay, before we keep going, we should probably talk about
that little seven day magic mind experiment we did last week.
Oh yeah, that thing that I thought would absolutely do nothing,
and somehow I did something. I tried it because my
afternoons have been rough, like I'll sit down to work
and immediately think Nope, not today. And I tried because
my brain fog has been real. I can start the
(33:14):
day feeling like I'm on top of things, and then
by noon I'm like staring at the screen going like what.
Speaker 3 (33:20):
Was I doing?
Speaker 2 (33:21):
So around day three of the Magic Mind, I remember
thinking like, oh, I'm just doing my thing. I'm not pausing,
going what are you doing, Wendy?
Speaker 3 (33:31):
Do you know what I mean?
Speaker 2 (33:32):
Yeah? The biggest thing for me was that I wasn't
scrambling to find my focus. It's like my attention span
stopped fighting with me. And because it's not coffee level intensity,
I wasn't jittery. I could just sit and do the thing.
I know, you're the kind of girl that's like I
can't drink a coffee in the afternoon. Here's the thing.
Speaker 4 (33:49):
For me.
Speaker 2 (33:49):
It didn't like change my personality or fix my life
in any way, but it did make the week feel
a little bit easier, especially towards the end of the week,
where I'm like done, Yeah, just through the edges, a
little bit less fog, more focus, and if your brain
feels like a little cluttered browser window most days, this
might help.
Speaker 3 (34:10):
So if you are curious, we do have a link.
It's magicmind dot com.
Speaker 2 (34:14):
Slash Girls Gone twenty and the Code Girls Gone twenty
gets you a discount. Try it for seven days and
see if it does anything for you. We were surprised
in a good way. Well, I will tell you.
Speaker 3 (34:30):
I watched episode three.
Speaker 1 (34:32):
Last night, Zach's episode.
Speaker 2 (34:34):
Zach's episode, and when Evelyn and Matt go on their
road trip and we have this whole like scream scene,
I gotta tell you, like, it really made me feel things.
And as I'm watching this, I was like, I don't
even care if these two end up together. I truly
just love their friendship so much and I'm so invested
(34:55):
in whatever happens between them. And I had told Megan
off Mike, yes, it's fun to watch Kate's dates, but
I think I'm closer in age to Mac and Evelyn,
so like I'm rooting for this relationship. But anyway, lovely
lovely stuff between them and episode three, I just love
it so much.
Speaker 5 (35:12):
We're all channeling our own line. I mean Evelyn to meet.
My father died five years ago. My mother is really
she's an adventurer now in a way that she kind
of always was, but it's different. And I think that
that screaming off the cliff was something in the writer's
room that we sort of when we landed on it.
It was very well preserved. It was like where does
it happen? Where in the episode does it happen? How
(35:35):
does it get there?
Speaker 4 (35:36):
All those things and this is you know, really Zach
deserves the credit for that first Like he's the one
that wrote that episode, and that section of the episode
remained pretty much unchanged the whole time because he really
nailed it and found the right amount of sentiment, the
right amount of humor, and something that felt cinematic and
(36:00):
appropriate for like a visual medium, but still felt true
and like like something that could be nice if it
was real, you know, if we really had these places
to express ourselves and these people that forced us to
let things out. I personally absolutely love The Sheep and
I think that being on set with the Sheep in mental.
Speaker 1 (36:19):
Sequence was my favorite, one of my favorite days on set.
Speaker 3 (36:22):
Yeah, that is so funny you said that I was
watching that scene and I was like, how how who corralled.
Speaker 4 (36:30):
Literally this random farmer who had a field next to
where we were shooting, and the.
Speaker 1 (36:35):
Did you have our enterprising location? People went over and
were like would you bring the sheep over?
Speaker 4 (36:39):
And he said sure, and it was him and a dog,
literally a sheep herding dog, and they just came down.
Speaker 1 (36:45):
I have a video. We're all set up for cameras, car.
Speaker 4 (36:49):
The actors and in the distance is this man and
his dog and this flock of sheep.
Speaker 1 (36:53):
Coming down the road.
Speaker 5 (36:54):
It was wild.
Speaker 4 (36:55):
It was as irish as you could possibly imagine. It
was so fun and some of the sheep, you know,
got into the craft services and like into the camp
like it just was a delightful day and you're working
with animals. Is a real crap shoot, but it was
pretty great. But Zak and I were together on set
the day they shot the scream off the cliff and
(37:16):
it was a beautiful day and our actors really went
for it and it was so rewarding to see it,
and that that location itself, that.
Speaker 2 (37:27):
Was yeah, yeah, well it really translated on screen like
I'm glad to hear them.
Speaker 3 (37:33):
Was really moved by it. So nice work. Shooting in Ireland.
Speaker 2 (37:36):
You touch on it briefly, but one of my favorite
places in the world is Ireland. My parents go there
all the time and we come back and we say,
how is the weather. My mom says it was irish, Like,
you know, it's very Did that impact filming days?
Speaker 1 (37:49):
I mean, you were there not have irish weather? We wow,
I know.
Speaker 4 (37:55):
It's another one of those things that makes you feel
like this was imagining.
Speaker 1 (38:00):
So it was dark and cold. We shot.
Speaker 4 (38:03):
You know a lot of times Hallmark movies shoot in summer,
and we shot February through May, so we shot.
Speaker 1 (38:10):
And start in the dark winter into the spring. I
think we had one rain day. That's it. One day
where rain really impacted our schedule.
Speaker 5 (38:19):
Wow.
Speaker 4 (38:20):
A lot of our experiors we had no rain. We
had blue skies to the point where I was like,
this is a problem.
Speaker 1 (38:26):
This is California.
Speaker 5 (38:29):
Those flowers came back at one point and it was like,
we've got flowers on the hillside.
Speaker 4 (38:34):
We shot in the park and the daffodils were coming
in and I was like, I'm just going to take
some scissors and I'm just going to run and they
were like, you cannot do that, And I was like, well,
just everybody look away, I will just we'll just get
rid of the munch. But you know that's it wasn't
when we first learned that we were going to shoot
in Ireland, because there were multiple options of places to
shoot for England and Ireland.
Speaker 1 (38:56):
Was one of them. When we settled on Ireland, my
concern was the rain.
Speaker 4 (39:00):
It was going to be that the weather was going
to somehow impact this, and it really wasn't an issue.
Speaker 2 (39:05):
Switching yours completely, Yeah, thanks Ireland, switching gears completely. The
diversity and representation in this cast is so great. How
much of a hand did you have in that? How
important was that? Because I think we're telling so many
different stories here that it's nice to see so many
(39:26):
different lives represented on screen in a real as you said,
just like natural way, not like this is a very
special episode of television. And look at those same sex
couple having a dance, right, it just happens.
Speaker 4 (39:41):
Well, look this takes place, the story takes place in
London and areas we're.
Speaker 1 (39:46):
Outside of London. It's an incredibly diverse place.
Speaker 4 (39:49):
We were representing the truth of the location truly, and
there is a lot of fun in different perspectives on
the holiday. So you know that part is always intentional too,
is just keeping like in a big city where there's
lots of different cultures and lots of different colors and
lots of different holidays, keeping it all really you know,
(40:11):
true to that in real life. In the show, I
also want to again give Dava credit as she's Latina
and she's almost the only diversity, really uh racial diversity
in our writer's room, and she, you know, came in
very connected to that topic and all of us are too.
We were all really aware that we wanted to keep
(40:33):
that in mind. But when we went through the casting process,
it was something we talked about all the time, was
making sure this felt like true life and real life.
You know, we all live in big cities and this
is what life looks like. So it was it was
simply that, but it was absolutely something that you know
was intentional.
Speaker 2 (40:52):
Well, and every person on the screen is more beautiful
than the next, Like people walk on and like.
Speaker 4 (40:57):
Even I was like like everybody. Also, everyone was so
tall except for May, so it was also so funny.
But yeah, there was a lot of good looking people.
Speaker 5 (41:09):
And what are you gonna do? Everybody you.
Speaker 3 (41:14):
Talked about a lot of fidelity to the script.
Speaker 2 (41:17):
The script was written, May shows up, she slides right in,
puts her own little spin on it. Are there any
improvised moments that made it into the final cut? Anything
that you go, oh, wait, yeah, that's good.
Speaker 4 (41:28):
Many I'm trying to think and we think of episode
one and two, Zach, if you can think of anything.
Speaker 5 (41:33):
I haven't even seen episode three yet, like I'm I'm
I'm seeing it Friday. I'm very excited.
Speaker 4 (41:38):
Oh well, I've just been was in post production for
I've seen it. I could recite the entire series to
you all by memory, and you know, it's funny. I
never got tired of it, which I am also am.
I like a narcissist, couldn't get tired of show.
Speaker 1 (41:52):
But I never came to do that.
Speaker 2 (41:55):
Can you do that jump cut monologue opening by heart?
Because oh my gosh, that's so good.
Speaker 4 (42:00):
It's in a museum, So there are I can think
of a couple of things that you know, may like.
Speaker 1 (42:10):
One of them that comes to mind. I think it's
episode four where Callum agrees to do.
Speaker 4 (42:15):
Something that he said he's not going to do, and
she says, you crumbled like a cookie and I that
was not the line, and I liked it was her.
She tried a bunch of different things like that, and
we love that one.
Speaker 1 (42:26):
And that's like not the most exciting.
Speaker 4 (42:28):
Example, but it's just there were a million moments like
that where she just could give you, like, let me
try five different ways of saying you know the same thing, and.
Speaker 1 (42:38):
Which one was cuter or funnier. And I remember I.
Speaker 4 (42:41):
When she did that, I was like, damn, that was good,
Like I like, I like that choice, and I love
these times when she brings in her own creativity and humor.
Speaker 5 (42:49):
There. There is also that scene in episode four where
they're in the tea house where it's it's Delilah and
Mac and Kate. And I was weirdly on set that
day because I in the shot. I got to sit
behind Mary McDonald because she is, I mean, top tier.
I teach a class about her arc in Battlestar Galactica,
like she is my favorite human. Don't meet your heroes
(43:12):
unless it's Mary McDonald. But there was this moment where
I think Mary and May looked at each other and wait,
wait is it are we doing this? Or are we
doing this? And the director just was like, what's your take,
and they tweeked the scene and like the I think
they flipped like four lines over on themselves and suddenly
(43:32):
everything worked really well. And it was just such a
wild thing to watch two actresses who have been doing
it and know it that hard, like know the process,
work with the director, work with everybody else in the room,
and go so, well, let's just change that to that
great yeah, And then they shot it and we were
all out of there. It was pretty amazing.
Speaker 1 (43:50):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (43:50):
I think the benefit when you have people like May,
people like Mary, people like Jane who've done so much
they have an intuition about these some of these choices,
and it is in those moments I always have the
same feeling, which is like, oh my god, that's great,
and then followed by why.
Speaker 1 (44:07):
Didn't I think of that? But it keeps you humble.
Speaker 4 (44:11):
But it's important to remember this is it isn't just
you write a thing and they say the words.
Speaker 1 (44:16):
It can be a collaboration.
Speaker 4 (44:17):
Everyone finds it together and that is a good thing
and that it should be encouraged. You know, when you
have trusted collaborators like we did, and you know, especially
for a series where you're spending this much time with
the characters. May was invested, and you know, Mary was
invested and Jay was invested in what their careers were
doing for six episodes so that it felt real and
felt like they could bring something special and they all did.
(44:40):
And I appreciate so much that they felt comfortable being
able to do that well.
Speaker 5 (44:45):
They knew how they were thinking five steps ahead of
all of us. They knew or what it would be
like in the editing room, they knew how to how
it would play, what they would need later, and it was.
It was a shocking witness. But that I would say
that that's pretty common. Like I have now worked Cardi
Wong is in two Christmas movies, and when I found
out he was cast in More than Merrier, I rewrote
(45:06):
for him because in Road to Christmas, there's this one
moment where he ad libbed this line where they all
come to the door and she opens it up and
he just went, hi, Mama, And I burst into tears
every time, and everyone talks about that in like reviews
and not scripted, just Cardi being really good and so
of course that's the guy you call right like you
(45:29):
then say, can we get him in this role again
so that we can do this thing. And like I've
tried to get him in every movie now simply because
he did it again and more than merrier. He has
this like he changed a line about where his family
was for Christmas, and like it's ten times touching. It's
ten times better than I would have come up with.
Speaker 4 (45:47):
So it's you know, the first time I ever worked
really closely with an actor in this way was with
Rob Buckley in Christmas House and we you know, that
was his original pitch and we conceived of the story
together and then I wrote the script, but he like
he had such a like we would sit and talk
about the story and the scenes and he would kind
(46:08):
of start to like perform a little. And I felt
like such a dummy because I'd never really been that
aware of how actors take what you've written and start
to make it feel natural and make it feel connected
to a character.
Speaker 5 (46:20):
And all that.
Speaker 4 (46:21):
And sitting and doing some of that and then being
able to edit the script along the way in development.
Speaker 1 (46:26):
With his input, I was like, oh my god, this is.
Speaker 4 (46:29):
Gold to be able to really have that like, oh
my gosh, how great and you find the best line
together because they're finding what performs best for them, and
you're finding, you know, like what sounds best and what's
going to connect to the story later.
Speaker 1 (46:42):
It's just it was terrific and it made me less.
Speaker 4 (46:45):
It made me, you know, very unafraid to do that
in the future with other actors. And on this show,
you know, every time the actor was like, I want
to talk about this scene, I'm like, yes, tell me.
Speaker 1 (46:55):
Tell me what all your thoughts are.
Speaker 5 (46:56):
What do you want?
Speaker 4 (46:57):
You know, let's talk talk it through, because you can't
be a fraid to change something and find the better version.
It has to be okay that what you have on
the page is you know what you know. There's always
up for discussion to some degree. It doesn't mean you
throw it out. Sometimes you talk to the actor and
you keep exactly what's on the page. But it is
not a conversation to be afraid of.
Speaker 2 (47:17):
It's so funny that you say that about You're like, oh,
this is how it works. Because speaking about Christmas House,
the mother in that show, it's Sharon Nyan think.
Speaker 3 (47:25):
I know it.
Speaker 2 (47:26):
I know we just saw her on Find Name Mister
Christmas and she does these four scenes with these four actors,
and I felt that moment, I was like, oh, she
changed her performance to match the energy of the guy
in the room that's acting.
Speaker 3 (47:40):
It's just like it's like.
Speaker 1 (47:42):
More than memorizing lines. Yeah, like we know that, but
then you see it.
Speaker 4 (47:47):
Not that I thought it was easy right exactly, and
you know I yeah, yes.
Speaker 2 (47:54):
But watching someone like Sharon Lawrence take it and just
tweak it ever so slightly, it just had a different
feel every time.
Speaker 3 (47:59):
And in our review I was.
Speaker 2 (48:00):
Like, that was amazing to see it happened. So, yeah,
I think that's very interesting to watch it come to life.
Speaker 4 (48:07):
Well, I want to give a shout out to to
our director for Block one. Imer Conroy is a big
director in Ireland and she's been on the series Blood
of My Blood, which is the spin off of Outlander,
and so she's like used to being in fields and
rain and blood and stuff, and then she came into
our half of our series and the Christmas loveliness. But
(48:31):
she and May connected really early, really quickly, and she
watching the way that she would that emer would share
like directing, like the way she did it, like the
suggestions she'd make. She'd find one one emotional thing to
just speak on simply and let the actor take it
from there. And I felt like it was such an
(48:51):
education for me to understand how you speak to an
actor in that way, because you know, as showrunners, Dom
and I are there, our hands are and everything. We're
like watching everybody all the time, changing the scripts and
changing the budgets and you know, overseeing everything. But we
don't direct, and you know, the relationship between the director
and the actors is sacred, and so watching that and
(49:14):
seeing how that shapes the scenes too was I was
grateful to get to see that firsthand and see it
so successfully. And our second block director Megan Fox, not
that Megan Fox different Megan Fox. She's so great at
finding the joke, finding the way the framing would really
enhance the actors and explaining that to them.
Speaker 1 (49:35):
It was just so such a great part of this.
Speaker 4 (49:38):
But the performances, well, the actors deserve the line's share
of the credit, obviously. I don't want to miss a
chance to credit you know, are great, our great directors.
And it was fun to have a bunch of women
at the top of the help, you know, like female shrerunners.
Speaker 5 (49:51):
And the set is the set is so different when
that happens, and it is a million times better. All
the sets that you're on, the ones that arerun by women,
you're so of like, oh god, thank god. It's just
exhausting otherwise because it's like, is there going to be yelling.
Speaker 3 (50:09):
You breathe, Yeah, relax your job.
Speaker 5 (50:12):
I'm not saying that that's not sure. Boy. In the
long run, you really feel the chance to go to
work for a woman who is a showrunner is Oh God.
If you're out there and you're hope like that is
the key to just making work work.
Speaker 1 (50:30):
Well, I can say, well, I do.
Speaker 4 (50:32):
I want to say that I feel like this genre,
this story meant a lot to me. I mean, I
was really hoping it would be entertaining and funny and
christmassy and cozy and transportive in the way the holiday
is or something like that. But I also wanted to
feel like real women and real people and the real
relationship you know, between all the different characters, the men
(50:53):
as well. And you know, I do think that we
had the benefit of being nuanced women and bringing all
these experiences about love and family and friendship to the story.
That was really it was just try not to be
cliche as often as possible.
Speaker 1 (51:11):
With the rom com you know, trips that we're so
familiar with.
Speaker 5 (51:15):
Yeah, but I mean it's also this is the part
also that I keep finding, having now done rom coms
this long, is that they are Yeah, they are fantasy
in a lot of ways, but it's it's it's so
based in a truth of and like it's very specifically.
You know, the first year I wrote a bunch of
these movies, I wanted to be away from Christmas, and
(51:36):
Aaron turned to me on my way out and was like,
going to You're gonna fall in love while you're on
a trip away for Christmas, because now you've written this
for yourself, And like, no, I didn't, but I did
have the most romantic Christmas on record, Like we watched
Watership Down. There was a fire, it was snowing, and
it was very much but but but the idea that like,
(51:56):
you know, the tropes that you see in these movies,
like of course there's a confident on I have one.
It's Aaron, right, like I'm going to write these characters.
You know the reason that a lot of these stories
are like, well, someone goes home for Christmas. Yeah, you
go home for Christmas. That's the thing that happens every
year that you know, it's extrapolating on actual the emotional
lives of the people who are writing them. And so
(52:18):
I think this particular group of people who were assembled
to create that like at every level, I mean starting
in the writer's room, but then extrapolating it out. I
think everybody felt really comfortable bringing that part of themselves,
the rom com part of their own lives to this story.
Speaker 2 (52:38):
Well, before we go, what are you most excited for
viewers to see in the upcoming episodes.
Speaker 5 (52:44):
There's a thing that happens to the Pear Tree that
I feel like I bullied into the story with Max
Handicrafts that it's one of my favorite things and I'm
dying to see because I wasn't there when it was shot,
but I'm dying to see how it turned out. So
there's a thing.
Speaker 1 (53:01):
I like all the kissing, Yeah, that's not to come.
I'm really excited about.
Speaker 4 (53:08):
And I think that every single time a date like
I you know, gets to come to life on screen,
I'm excited for people to see it and curious if
people think, like I wish I could do that and
go to that and have that. I also love the
sheep endlessly.
Speaker 5 (53:25):
Love thee that car. That car is amazing.
Speaker 1 (53:30):
There was a I can't remember if you were there.
Speaker 4 (53:33):
I got called to the art department one day and
they had a board full of car photos and they're like,
pick a car for Evelyn, and I was like.
Speaker 5 (53:40):
That one fun.
Speaker 1 (53:41):
Yeah, and that was really fun.
Speaker 3 (53:43):
That's so it's so fun to hear, like the inside
base car beautiful.
Speaker 5 (53:50):
In the script, I think it was like a Volkswagen thing.
It was like a boxy like those years. Yeah, I
kept putting it in. They were like, that's an ugly car,
but it's beautiful what they got.
Speaker 4 (54:02):
But I think I think that the conflict increases between
as like the day, you know, as romances develop and
there's more heightened sort of conversations. Those scenes are my
favorite is when May and Richard and Callum I.
Speaker 1 (54:18):
Just mixed the actors we do all the time.
Speaker 4 (54:21):
We get to like take it one step further and
not it's not just flirting and it's not just lovely.
It's actually like digging into the relationships stuff.
Speaker 1 (54:28):
Those scenes. I really love those scenes.
Speaker 5 (54:31):
Plus Delilah Delia, Oh.
Speaker 1 (54:32):
Yeah, Mary mcmary McDonald, Yeah, it's just the.
Speaker 5 (54:35):
Greatest human ever to walk the planet.
Speaker 1 (54:38):
Or any I guess we could just list all the
things we like about it. We're just never going to
stop this episode.
Speaker 2 (54:46):
Well, why don't you tell people where they can follow
your work and keep up with you after this episode.
Speaker 4 (54:52):
I'm simple, I'm just Instagram Aaron nine one seven.
Speaker 1 (54:55):
I'm going to post a lot of pictures of the sheep.
Speaker 5 (54:57):
Go ahead, yah, I'm less Instagram. I you can find
mostly me at zach Hug dot com or story hug
writing dot com, where I do some consulting and such.
Speaker 3 (55:06):
So great, amazing.
Speaker 2 (55:08):
Thank you so much for being here, for sharing your
time and your stories with us. Thank you to our
listeners for listening to this episode of Girls Gone Hallmark,
a Bramble Jam podcast.
Speaker 3 (55:18):
We will be back next time with more Hallmark reviews.
Speaker 1 (55:21):
Goodbye bye Ye.
Speaker 7 (55:30):
All right friends, before we go, just a quick heads up.
You're about to hear some ads. Thee little gems help
us keep the show running and the Hallmark love flowing.
So do with that info what you will grab us neck,
hit the skip button, or maybe just maybe listen in
and discover your new favorite product.
Speaker 1 (55:52):
Bye
This is a Bramble Jam podcast.
Speaker 2 (00:22):
Welcome to Girls Gone Hallmark, a Hallmark review podcast. I'm
Megan and I'm a longtime Hallmark fan.
Speaker 3 (00:27):
I'm Wendy. I'm a former Hallmark hater.
Speaker 2 (00:30):
Today we are thrilled to be joined by two of
the brilliant minds behind Hallmark's brand new sixth episode holiday
rom com series twelve dates till Christmas. We've got showrunner
Aaron Rodman, whose credits include The Christmas House and The Christmas.
Speaker 3 (00:44):
House to deck those halls, as well as Christmas.
Speaker 2 (00:47):
Class Reunion, and writer and producer Zach Hug known for
some of our favorites like Ghosts of Christmas.
Speaker 3 (00:53):
Always the more the merrier. Thank you so much for
being here.
Speaker 1 (00:57):
Thank you for having us for thrilled to be here.
Speaker 3 (01:00):
We have loved this series, loved it.
Speaker 2 (01:04):
We can't say enough about it, and as Wendy said
in our first review, it's like grab Hallmark by the
shoulders and say like.
Speaker 3 (01:12):
Let's keep doing more of this please kind of love.
Speaker 1 (01:16):
I mean, that's what we always wanted to happen. And here, of.
Speaker 2 (01:20):
Course, well let's talk about how it came to be.
It's adapted from a book by Jenny Baylist. I'd love
to know just the origin story. Did you read the book?
Did someone come to you? How did the series come
to be?
Speaker 4 (01:34):
So a producer sent to the book to me before
it was published. And as you may know, it's very
common in Hollywood for manuscripts of books to go out
around town to producers, to writers, to studios before they're published.
Sometimes they're never published, but the manuscript still gets optioned
or bought to be adapted to a TV series or
a movie. This was Jenny's first book. She was not
(01:57):
yet This is her foray into being a novelist. It
was sent to me as in manuscript form at the time.
I love this producer, but I did not have the
bandwidth to take on the project. And so about a
year later, that producer wound up as an executive at
Hallmark and called me and said, can we take another
crack at this? And so I had loved the book
(02:19):
and loved the concept. I think that the Twelve Dates
of Christmas as a dating service, like a Christmas themed
dating service you could do every year at Christmas, is
like I wish it was real.
Speaker 5 (02:30):
Yeah, sign you up so hard, Like I would have
just so many people.
Speaker 4 (02:37):
So I reached out to Jenny. I had took me
a little time to get to her through social media.
I reached out to her directly and said, hey, there's
interest in this, and here's who I am, and let's
talk and let me let's see if we want to
be partners in my You know, a lot of times
the author is not involved, you know, you just option
the material or deal with reps. But I really thought
(02:59):
there was a benefit to us being partners and finding
something together.
Speaker 1 (03:04):
And I like that. I like collaboration.
Speaker 4 (03:06):
I like taking advantage of all the work she's already
done on this story. I'm building this world, and she
was an absolutely huge part of this process.
Speaker 1 (03:14):
And still is.
Speaker 4 (03:15):
She was in the writer's room, she was on set.
So it's all started back five years ago when before
the book was published. But it's been a nice, long,
beautiful relationship and she's published many books since then.
Speaker 3 (03:27):
Can I ask you a question about the writer's room.
Speaker 2 (03:29):
I saw a screenshow of a zoom. Is your writer's
room virtual or are you actually sitting in the same
space doing it?
Speaker 1 (03:39):
Was virtual? It was virtual for two reasons.
Speaker 4 (03:43):
One is it did allow for all of us to
not have to be in the same space, and Jenny's
in England and I was out on the.
Speaker 1 (03:50):
East Coast for part of the of the writer's room period.
But even when we weren't all in La Ellie, traffic
is real, you know, the city can be a pain.
Speaker 4 (04:00):
People have kids that got to pick up at a
certain time and an hour in traffic, you know. To
all come together in the same room, there's definitely a
benefit of it. And if we'd had a longer writer's
room perhaps that would have been the choice. But it
was truly just easier on all of our lives and
schedules to do it over zoom.
Speaker 2 (04:16):
Yes, I mean, I feel like we've opened up that
window right five years ago. It's like, oh, we can
do so much more work this way and on everyone's schedule.
Speaker 1 (04:25):
Some time in sweatpants pajamas, Yeah, make your lunch and
meet your snat.
Speaker 2 (04:31):
I mean it just you know, you can blow your
background and be in your bedroom and yeah.
Speaker 4 (04:36):
But I think we made a joint decision, like we
talked about it as a group, because you know, you
don't want to sacrifice something valuable in the chemistry of
being in a room together, you know, without thoughtlessly you
want to make sure everybody still feels like we could
do a great job.
Speaker 1 (04:51):
VI A Zoom.
Speaker 2 (04:53):
So both of you have extensive Hallmark resumes, but this
show has a really fresh, sharp tone. We obviously love Hallmark,
It's what we do, but it feels real netflixy in
a really good way. And I'm wondering how like this
whole team of you know, Hallmark familiar creators came to
(05:15):
create such a fresh take on this store.
Speaker 3 (05:18):
And was there.
Speaker 2 (05:19):
Any pushback at all when that was happening. Of course,
it's still like checks all of the boxes, but it's
it's it's different.
Speaker 5 (05:29):
Yeah, you know to me. So I was brought on
by Aaron and they had already worked on I think
the first two episodes were written when I joined up.
But my take when I when I started was like,
this is this is Hallmark how it exists kind of
in my head when I'm writing it. This is kind
of how but which is not to say that like
(05:51):
it changes or becomes something else. I think there was
more time to create it, and I you know, these
movies are made, and they are made. There is not
a formula, but but also there is an expectation and
a brand around the stories that you tell, and I
think audiences expect something from a two hour movie that
(06:12):
in a TV show, you really if you if you
moved that quickly, and if you if you told the
story with that lens on it that the movies exist
in you, you would you would lose something in the
TV show. I think because these stories have to move
so quickly and you have to you gloss over stuff,
you sort of and you know the show you actually
(06:34):
you have all these characters. You have to service all
of them. You have to give them all interesting lives.
I mean, I love that scene where Laura's at home
with her husband, like her husband is this solid dude,
and that you know, you don't have time in a
lot of ways to sort of prove that, like the
confidant has this life that's awesome. And I think here
(06:55):
in six episodes, while you're still limited in time, you've
got you've got more space, more room to breathe a
little bit about everyone's emotional lives, and so I think
that's kind of that's to me is the great joy
of it is that you you get to live in
it a little bit longer, and that feels nice.
Speaker 4 (07:13):
I think that there's a chain of people that explain
why this feels appealing for Hallmark, right for the Hallmark audience,
right for you know that brand, but also perhaps larger
partially because Jenny, the way she writes in her novels,
you know, her Girls Party, and we walked that back
(07:37):
to some degree in developing this story. She writes very grounded,
real women, So they do things in the real world
that we all do when you're single, when you're dating.
And then so we started with what already felt kind
of like a swing, but Hallmark was always very supportive,
really loved the book, really liked what that brought. So
(07:57):
we have their support early on with you know, trying something,
because that the great.
Speaker 1 (08:02):
Thing about working with Hallmark.
Speaker 4 (08:04):
No one knows their audience better than those executives, and they.
Speaker 1 (08:07):
Don't expect you to already know.
Speaker 4 (08:09):
They are able to tell you, like, we try things
and then they say too far, or go farther, or
how about this, So it's a real collaboration. That's the
benefit of those executives to so many in so many
ways is that they aren't going to throw you to
the wolves and say guess what Hallmark wants. They're really
going to help you find that bulls eye and no
one knows better than them.
Speaker 5 (08:29):
Yeah, so your.
Speaker 4 (08:30):
Job is to bring your distinct voice, your level of comedy,
push them sometimes and see what happens. And sometimes it works,
sometimes it doesn't. So there was Jenny, there were our
Hallwark executives, and then I have to give credit to
my kosher runner, Dava Avena, who is you know, a
very seasoned TV writer and the only one of us
on the writing staff not from Hallmark who'd never done
(08:53):
Hallwark before. She's done incredible shows like Firefly, Lane, and
she worked on like mainstream shows on ABC, so she
really was the seasoned TV writer, had run Writer's Rooms before,
had been an EP executive producer.
Speaker 1 (09:07):
So we brought her in to, you know, help.
Speaker 4 (09:11):
She had just had the most experience of the whole process,
and by not having someone who was very familiar with
the genre and writing strong women and writing rom com
you know TV and like series long stories, she didn't
bring any preconceived notions and so we had a real
fresh perspective.
Speaker 1 (09:32):
And that was intentional.
Speaker 5 (09:33):
You know.
Speaker 4 (09:33):
Hallmark had always wanted to work with her and this
was an opportunity to do so I lucked out big time.
Speaker 1 (09:39):
And having a.
Speaker 4 (09:39):
Partner who had all this experience and curiosity about finally
like working in.
Speaker 1 (09:45):
The Hallmark space.
Speaker 4 (09:46):
And so she was our leader in the writer's room,
and she was on set with me, you know, almost
the whole time. And so she, like you know, was
part of that chain as well. So it really is
the fabric we intentionally the fabric of creators for this series.
And then you bring in May, who has not done
you know, has maybe done Hallmark.
Speaker 1 (10:07):
I think she's done on her too, maybe when she
was younger. I don't, honestly don't remember. I don't know.
I should know the answer to that. It's horrible that
I don't.
Speaker 4 (10:13):
But she is different and she has her own perspective,
and she brought a lot to the character.
Speaker 1 (10:18):
So all these things.
Speaker 4 (10:19):
Factored into it, and that is like part of the
magic of this particular project.
Speaker 2 (10:25):
I think, will you bring up May, I think that's
the perfect transition because she is like, having seen this,
I can't imagine anybody else as Kate. But was there
anything for you that shifted Kate's personality or performance once
May was brought on.
Speaker 1 (10:40):
She's so funny. Oh my god.
Speaker 4 (10:43):
I used to joke with her on set about some
pitch line changes and they were better. And this sounds
like you're going to be in the writer's guild by
the end of this production. Because she just has so
much experience, Like no, literally, I don't know that. I mean,
since she was a tiny child, knows how to just
(11:04):
be a you know, a terrific collaborator with everyone, crew, casts, writers, everybody.
Speaker 1 (11:11):
But she is fearless.
Speaker 4 (11:12):
About pitching jokes, she tries things, and she's very funny.
She's a very funny person, a very entertaining person, and
we were so lucky that she brought that to the character.
But yeah, I mean literally, day to day to day,
I could look at almost every scene and tell you
something that she added, what was on the page.
Speaker 5 (11:30):
I think also, though she's in so many ways, if
I were to make a movie of Aaron's life, I
would cast may that like because in the writer's room
we talked a lot, like we would occasionally refer to
Kate as we'd be like when then Aaron goes to sorry,
Kate goes to the thing her voice. I don't think
we meant to do it, but I think that her
voice sort of naturally, you know, I mean, like erin
(11:53):
and I've been friends for fifteen years. And I think
one of the reasons is that like that is that
is the person that I try to write right. When
I'm writing anything right, it's sort of like, give me
a real person, give me this woman who knows herself,
who is fallible but also like really smart and kind
and wants things out of the world. And it's really
(12:14):
funny about it. And so a lot of the story kept.
I think we all kind of just rallied around that character,
and there is a blend, I mean, in the chain
of how this turned out. Like I would I would
also note that Aaron is so much of the voice
of that character and how everyone relates to her. To
Kate is a lot of how people relate I think
(12:37):
to Erin in a lot of ways, and I just
that was one of my favorite pieces of watching this
was like, oh, I'm watching a television show about my
best friend.
Speaker 4 (12:47):
I had flaws for days and for our main character
soon lots of issues.
Speaker 2 (12:54):
So funny you say that, because as we watch a
lot of Hallmark movies, review a lot of Hallmark movies,
we watch a lot of TV too, and we have
always said since we've been doing this is like, we
want messy characters. We want characters who who look like us,
who are doing things, making decisions, making bad mistakes just
like we do. Like that's very relatable TV, and I
(13:16):
freaking love Kate. Can you tell us how May was
brought to you, guys, like when you were writing the
show where you're like, yeah, we want to do it
with me, whitman?
Speaker 3 (13:27):
Or was she presented to you and did you go
when she got cast?
Speaker 4 (13:33):
Literally have never recovered from you that she said yes.
So even now, I still can't believe it. She was
number one on our list. And as you you know,
the casting process is there's a million factors that make
an actor available or not available or just flat out
say no.
Speaker 1 (13:50):
She was number one on our list.
Speaker 4 (13:52):
Hallmark was very interested in, you know, finding a way
to work with her. You know, I was on everyone's radar.
If you're a woman of a certain dame, you're interested
in what she's doing.
Speaker 1 (14:01):
And so she was.
Speaker 4 (14:02):
Number one and she said yes, like within a couple
of days. It was the most simple process ever casting.
I still can't believe she said yes. I still can't
believe Hallmark. I mean, I just can't believe it all worked.
It's like the thing where you're like, she said yes,
and we were all like, okay, nobody move, something is
going to make her change her mind. And then I think,
(14:24):
you know, I yeah.
Speaker 2 (14:27):
What A get what I get? I love seeing her
on Hallmark. I'm a huge fan of hers. So yeah,
when we when it was announced earlier this year that
the series was coming, I was.
Speaker 3 (14:38):
Like, who, Who's coming to Hamemark?
Speaker 1 (14:40):
What?
Speaker 5 (14:41):
It was so pretty cool.
Speaker 1 (14:43):
We couldn't tell anybody for a while. I mean, I
think it was me.
Speaker 4 (14:46):
So we've written all the scripts before, and so by
the time it got to casting, the writer's room was
pretty much finished.
Speaker 1 (14:52):
I think, I can't.
Speaker 4 (14:53):
We were going we had written this show, so we
didn't write with her in mind, and so but her
saying yes hotified.
Speaker 1 (15:01):
The tone of the stories. So like by virtue of
knowing it was.
Speaker 4 (15:04):
Going to be her, I think we all took like
this deep breath of like the way the comedy feels,
the way the heart you know, and the emotion comes through,
all of it is going to be in good hands,
and like she knows what She's going to know what
to do with that tone and preserve it and add
to it, and you know, she delivered it in every
single way. And because she's such a professional, she knows
(15:25):
how to like just show up and the crew was
obsessed with her. She was friends with everybody, like she
just makes us. She knows how to be a number
one on the call sheet, she.
Speaker 1 (15:35):
Just knew how to set. Yeah, it was a dream.
Speaker 5 (15:39):
It was a dream.
Speaker 1 (15:39):
It's still a dream. I still can't believe it, you know.
Speaker 2 (15:42):
Yeah, we have said that this show has a little
bit of a Gilmore Girl's sensibility to it, which for
us is a huge compliment. We love that show, We
love that pace saying is that something that you strive for,
(16:03):
is that something that you recognize?
Speaker 3 (16:05):
Is that our feeling is like, you know, May is like.
Speaker 2 (16:07):
Sixty degrees of separation away from gil margirls with her
friendship from Lauren Graham.
Speaker 3 (16:11):
So like, did she bring that?
Speaker 2 (16:14):
It obviously comes through in the writing because the writing's snappy.
Speaker 4 (16:18):
Yeah, So I think I could be wrong about this
because it's all last week is kind of a blur
the week, you know, the show comes out. I feel
like People Magazine did an article that said that.
Speaker 1 (16:27):
In the title, oh, the show.
Speaker 4 (16:29):
Feels like Gilmore Girl or like May Whitman name checked
Lauren Graham and the tone of something, and I was like,
you know, like this is the most amazing comparison.
Speaker 1 (16:39):
And I think the bottom line is the things we
all love in culture, we just want more of.
Speaker 4 (16:45):
So it was not intentional in the sense that we
sat in the room and said, how did love to make.
Speaker 3 (16:50):
Gil margirls two point out?
Speaker 1 (16:51):
Yeah?
Speaker 4 (16:52):
But did I from the time I started pitching the
show four years ago, did I always say Blaxford, which
is the English village you know, at the heart of
the show is the stars Hollow of England. You know,
think of it as a community in this way where
there's the Reverend characters and there's a community spirit and
a real devotion to this place, and that it'll be
(17:12):
the kind of place you see on screen and which
was real that you could live in.
Speaker 1 (17:15):
And so it was, you know, in on our minds
for sure, but.
Speaker 4 (17:18):
On our minds because we loved the show so much,
loved you know, Gilmore Girls so much, and I wish
there was a ten more seasons sure than you know,
everything I write is chasing a certain emotion that I
felt before as a viewer, and I want to create
a story that elicits that same feeling in myself and others.
So in the spiritual sense, I do think there it's
(17:41):
thrilling to think that people find them in the same universe.
Speaker 2 (17:45):
Well, you talked a little bit about Blaxford, Ireland stands
in for London and much of this movie. What was
it like filming on location in Ireland and did that
kind of shape the obviously it does, but shape the
feel of the movie for you arriving there.
Speaker 3 (18:04):
Yes, I the series, not the movie. I'm sorry, that's okay.
Speaker 1 (18:07):
So the part London was actually London.
Speaker 4 (18:10):
Our first like five days of shooting, three days of
shooting was in London, and then we all moved to
Ireland and the rest is you know, Ireland for England.
I will tell you that we I think I can
speak for you know, everyone I know involved in this
production had the most amazing time in Ireland with the
most talented Irish crew and actors, the most warm welcome
(18:33):
as you know, a giant production that clunked into town
bothered everybody for five months. The talent, the people we
got in each department, you know, the art director and
like the our costumes and our hair and make everybody
was so incredible and so good. We were so lucky
that like a lot of our crew was had worked
on Wednesday, and a lot of our crew worked on Vikings,
(18:55):
and they were people who had done all these big
shows and they hadn't done Christmas.
Speaker 1 (19:00):
Nobody was sick of Christmas.
Speaker 4 (19:02):
Nothing felt like it was all fresh and new, and
so we would have these meetings in the art department
and with the production designer and he's like excited about
doing Christmas, which was so fun.
Speaker 1 (19:12):
Too capitalize on everyone's enthusiasm, But I.
Speaker 4 (19:16):
Would say that the way in which Ireland had the
most impact on the show is that the way we
all felt about each other. It really is so cliched
to say about the crew becomes a family and all
of that, but no kidding, Like our text chain, which
is like one hundred and three people, is still going
and we wrapped in May, so like this is you know,
(19:36):
and it's almost all Irish people and then some Americans
and some English people, but it is like the we
all lament this is over because it was such a
wonderful experience. Everyone was so kind and so had a
good time on set. And I think you can feel that.
I think you can tell you can't always tell when
like production's brutal, and you know, you can't always feel
(19:59):
that in the product. But I believe that the war,
a lot of the warmth and joy you can sense
in this show is because.
Speaker 1 (20:05):
The people were actually feeling those things to the theater school.
Speaker 5 (20:08):
I mean it really to me, Like I was on
set briefly, Like I was there a couple of weeks,
just kind of for in and out, but it really
felt like when people come together to make community theater,
except they all are much better at their jobs and
they've been doing for years and they know how to
want a camera. But also every set that I walked
onto it felt like it came out of my head
(20:30):
but was better. Like the what is it the Escape Room?
I walked in there and there were these someone had
found all of these incredible sculptures that were Christmas villages
that were kind of like a Tim Burton Christmas and
like I just stood there for like an hour, kind
of going through the room and thinking to myself, like
what this is like living in my own head? I'm speaking,
(20:52):
but they were all, yeah, it was the nicest, loveliest people.
They had us over for dinner. We crushed the erin
and I just like this guy and his wife and
their kids, and they're.
Speaker 4 (21:04):
People from the sound department, were like, don't spend Easter
by herself comes, So we didn't.
Speaker 1 (21:10):
It just it never ended.
Speaker 4 (21:12):
There was just this excitement and thrill for everybody. And
I think, like we shot there's this all the scenes
that take place in Nicola. By Nicola, which is the
the saddle Row Design House where Kate works as a
pattern as a textile designer.
Speaker 1 (21:27):
Is a real.
Speaker 4 (21:27):
Irish tailor, Like it's been there for over like one
hundred years forever, and it's it was like he just
led us. He was such a one wonderful man and
had this incredible story about being orphaned when he was
a kid and like being basically raised in the attic
of a tailor and like became a tailor himself and
then had these kids and then adopted. I mean, he
was just like this Irish twinkle in his eye I had,
(21:50):
you know, I'm like, it was just it was too
good to be true. And one of our one of
the production designers, has a daughter who works in fashion,
and so he had her send the clothes she'd made
and we use those in the show as part of
the So there was just this endless amount of like
people just willing to give their things and be a
part of it and contribute, and it all felt so
(22:13):
like yeah, community theater, like just we were all trying
really hard, running in the same direction to make this
great thing and this fun thing.
Speaker 2 (22:20):
The dates are very cool production value wise, the content.
Speaker 3 (22:25):
Is there one that was the hardest to pull off?
Speaker 5 (22:27):
The London Eye, Oh, it doesn't happen.
Speaker 6 (22:36):
I think, well, it's they each had their hardship. Yeah,
I think that you want them to be so dazzling
that they all felt pressurized to be that. So that
and that's not maybe that's not a very fun answer,
but like for every single one, it was like, how
do we knock this out of the park, and then
(22:56):
how to realistically what can we pull off with budget
and yeah, Heather and cast.
Speaker 4 (23:01):
Availability and like what's actually possible? I think Zach said
the escape room they built it out of nothing and
it was so incredible and it was this playground for
the crew, you know, between takes. I almost want to
say that the hardest was the final date, date twelve,
because it had to feel so grand and like worthy
(23:24):
of a finale and finding the right space and having
the right feeling for that was like we all were
sweating to make sure that it would actually feel that
special and transportive.
Speaker 2 (23:36):
Well, speaking of dates, we have to ask about Callum
not knowing the full emotional arc. At what point were
you like, Okay, well we got to thread the needle
here and again we have not seen the whole thing,
so this is not a spoiler. But to us having
seen the first two, it's like, well, is he the
obvious love interest or is this a red herring? Like
how did you walk that line with Callum and with
(24:00):
Richard Richard hartright emerge?
Speaker 5 (24:03):
I know that I will say the writer's room that
was the most fun because because up until the last minute,
I mean, I think you know how the you know
how the book ends, and I won't spoil it here,
but we had a hard time. I chose. I was
on I'm on both teams at different times. Right. I
was on the team of the guy in the escape
(24:23):
room for a minute. I was on there's the guy
who's the guy that I really loved. There was one
there was one date where I was like, he needs
more story and they were like, we do not have
time to tell the story about this poor sweet man
at the SALTI Club. Sorry, but I think that's the
that's the part of it is that if you're going
to send someone on twelve dates, I listen, I'm I'm
(24:44):
all four to twelve. I'll go on twelve, I'll go
on one hundred dates, Like I want to meet people.
I'm interested in the stories they have to tell. And
I think keeping that character on her back foot the
whole time was one of the more for like was
one of the best things to write, because it does
again when you're in a to our movie, Well, at
some point they're going to kiss and then they're going
to be together forever fate to black and I and
(25:05):
the snowfalls and I we didn't have that right, Like,
that doesn't exist in this universe. And I think that
what what a fun thing to write, particularly in a
Christmas story, that it's not just two people linking up.
It's a character who wants things outside of this dating
life for herself and they are the obstacle. And also
(25:30):
the prize. I think that was an incredible what a
gift for a writer to throw together.
Speaker 4 (25:37):
I feel like what we really wanted to make it clear,
and this to feel true to life is you always
have choices that you know there are that this notion
of like fate or like you know, the right one
there there is the feeling of that, but there is
also you can still mess it up.
Speaker 1 (25:57):
You can be able to use something else.
Speaker 4 (26:00):
You know, there are options here, and it may be
that you have a sense because of the genre and
the tropes we work with, who's going to be even
in that case, how and starting with Callum in a relationship,
and starting with Kate and Callum in this deep friendship
(26:20):
creates a question of well.
Speaker 1 (26:23):
How from here to there?
Speaker 4 (26:26):
And the hope is that that journey's entertaining. It feels
true and emotionally resonant, that you know it can happen
this way, and that there's curiosity about it, so you
know you will find out why they aren't together, why
they weren't together, and.
Speaker 1 (26:45):
What stands in the way for the future.
Speaker 4 (26:48):
You'll find out and hopefully that is a rewarding, you know, reveal.
But in the meantime, she's trying on different you know,
feelings and chances and you know I wanted it to
I wanted there's no point putting her through.
Speaker 1 (27:04):
The dating process.
Speaker 4 (27:05):
If she wasn't taking it seriously, she couldn't be dialed
into someone else, so that the twelve dates were just filler.
You know, it had to feel like you know possibilities
and that someone could.
Speaker 1 (27:19):
Turn your head.
Speaker 4 (27:19):
You could think you know what you want, but someone
could turn your head and surprise you. And then what
does that bring up and what does that mean and
what should you explore? What instincts should you follow? So
that is that was the playground.
Speaker 5 (27:30):
Hopefully, well just that it makes her a better artist.
I think that was my favorite part of it was
that we kept coming back to this thing that she
is not out to find someone to date. She is
out to reinvent or reinvigorate the life she's living, and
this is a piece of it, and that those things
do you know, inspiration comes from the emotional life of
(27:51):
a character, and I think watching her discover like that
scene where she's on the roof and she starts sketching,
I think there's something great about showing a character in
their daily life how this affects them, rather than that
is the goal that is the want of the character.
The want of the character is very much grounded in
This is a character who who knows something is missing
(28:11):
in her life. It probably isn't a dude, and it
isn't right that she has. What she has done is
sort of shrunk away from herself, and this is her
throwing herself back into the world.
Speaker 4 (28:20):
And I think that, yeah, there's there's value in the experience. Correct, Yeah,
experience itself, regardless of the outcome, is going.
Speaker 1 (28:26):
To change things.
Speaker 2 (28:27):
I think that comes through so strongly right off the bat,
Like we have the first five dates, right, and Kate's
not excited about this, like she's irritated going into it
that her friends have put her in this position. But
then she commits immediately, like even when she's in the
igloo alone, like she's popping champagne and having a good
time by herself. And then she has that date, the
(28:49):
ice skating date where he cries into her mouth, which,
by the way, we need to know who is responsible
for that line.
Speaker 5 (28:58):
I don't remember, but I think that's Aarin.
Speaker 1 (29:00):
Well doav is that episode one?
Speaker 5 (29:02):
Then?
Speaker 1 (29:02):
Yes, it's me. That actor was so great that we
wrote him into more things throughout the season.
Speaker 2 (29:11):
Well, and that's the nice thing, right, It's like it
doesn't end like these guys. His story carries through and
he reconnects back, you know, to Kate's core group, and
even she has that baking date and you're like, well,
this isn't the guy, but also she's all in, like
she's fully connected with him. They have this great connection
moment talking and I loved the way May did that
(29:34):
where she wasn't like I'm just checking the box so
my friends get off.
Speaker 3 (29:38):
She was there and all in.
Speaker 2 (29:41):
And then she orchestrates to Wingman's that dance, which is
so great, like the fan scene where she blocks the
guy from getting onto the dance.
Speaker 3 (29:48):
It's it's so good. Oh my gosh.
Speaker 1 (29:51):
Yeah, well it's nice hear you say that.
Speaker 4 (29:53):
I think that it was important that we be like,
she's not interested in a relationship, but that is not
the only reason you date.
Speaker 1 (30:03):
So that's just the truth.
Speaker 5 (30:06):
If it wasn't twelve dates, it could have been twelve murders.
Like it's a different show. It's like doves at that point,
but like it's you know, if she is she's reinvigorating
her sense of herself and it just this one happens
to be through dating, And I thought that was a Yeah,
I love my I love.
Speaker 4 (30:22):
That about this, But I agree with you that the
way may played it, she's not someone who's she's a
creative in the world. She's not afraid of experience, it's
afraid of a good time just because she's in a
low moment in life.
Speaker 1 (30:36):
She's not like a wallflower.
Speaker 4 (30:38):
She's not a weirdo who needs someone to drag her
into society. Like she knows how to be in the
world and do stuff, and so she's not that's not
the issue. Yeah, that's not her issue.
Speaker 2 (30:49):
Speaking of relationships, can we talk about mac and Evelyn
and the lovely Jane Seymour I.
Speaker 4 (30:56):
Mean another kind of pinch me moment of asting, of course, sure.
And she was such an enthusiastic participant in this, like
she was so here for the love story, for the
ways in which it was about two people who had
been through a lot in life and were deciding whether
(31:17):
or not to maybe look at each other a certain way,
you know, and and try this again or find a connection,
whether it's romantic or platonic. And they, you know, she
and Nathaniel Parker just knocked it out of the park
as far as great chemistry. They they took it seriously
and they carried with you.
Speaker 1 (31:38):
Know, a lot of intention into making.
Speaker 4 (31:41):
This love story feel just as important in the whole
series as anything.
Speaker 5 (31:47):
She also changed, I mean to me the role writing
Evelyn and watching Jane play Evelyn. There was a very
interesting change in the character from from my experience in
the room because I've famously very protective of Evelyn. I
don't know why. Something about that character. I was like,
nothing bad can happen to her. And then but in
(32:10):
my head she was a little bit you know, drier
and a little bit spark like crankier about things. And
then you put all those words in Jane Seymour's mouth
and they are the most charming, lovely human who knows
themselves right. And I was like, oh, that's how that
works so well? Is you know, you write towards one
(32:31):
thing and then an actress comes in and goes hold
on said a lot of it line for line, and
it still just changed it entirely and made this really
well rounded character who had a lot going on inside
of them.
Speaker 1 (32:43):
So and she has the most beautiful hair.
Speaker 5 (32:46):
The most.
Speaker 2 (32:51):
Okay, before we keep going, we should probably talk about
that little seven day magic mind experiment we did last week.
Oh yeah, that thing that I thought would absolutely do nothing,
and somehow I did something. I tried it because my
afternoons have been rough, like I'll sit down to work
and immediately think Nope, not today. And I tried because
my brain fog has been real. I can start the
(33:14):
day feeling like I'm on top of things, and then
by noon I'm like staring at the screen going like what.
Speaker 3 (33:20):
Was I doing?
Speaker 2 (33:21):
So around day three of the Magic Mind, I remember
thinking like, oh, I'm just doing my thing. I'm not pausing,
going what are you doing, Wendy?
Speaker 3 (33:31):
Do you know what I mean?
Speaker 2 (33:32):
Yeah? The biggest thing for me was that I wasn't
scrambling to find my focus. It's like my attention span
stopped fighting with me. And because it's not coffee level intensity,
I wasn't jittery. I could just sit and do the thing.
I know, you're the kind of girl that's like I
can't drink a coffee in the afternoon. Here's the thing.
Speaker 4 (33:49):
For me.
Speaker 2 (33:49):
It didn't like change my personality or fix my life
in any way, but it did make the week feel
a little bit easier, especially towards the end of the week,
where I'm like done, Yeah, just through the edges, a
little bit less fog, more focus, and if your brain
feels like a little cluttered browser window most days, this
might help.
Speaker 3 (34:10):
So if you are curious, we do have a link.
It's magicmind dot com.
Speaker 2 (34:14):
Slash Girls Gone twenty and the Code Girls Gone twenty
gets you a discount. Try it for seven days and
see if it does anything for you. We were surprised
in a good way. Well, I will tell you.
Speaker 3 (34:30):
I watched episode three.
Speaker 1 (34:32):
Last night, Zach's episode.
Speaker 2 (34:34):
Zach's episode, and when Evelyn and Matt go on their
road trip and we have this whole like scream scene,
I gotta tell you, like, it really made me feel things.
And as I'm watching this, I was like, I don't
even care if these two end up together. I truly
just love their friendship so much and I'm so invested
(34:55):
in whatever happens between them. And I had told Megan
off Mike, yes, it's fun to watch Kate's dates, but
I think I'm closer in age to Mac and Evelyn,
so like I'm rooting for this relationship. But anyway, lovely
lovely stuff between them and episode three, I just love
it so much.
Speaker 5 (35:12):
We're all channeling our own line. I mean Evelyn to meet.
My father died five years ago. My mother is really
she's an adventurer now in a way that she kind
of always was, but it's different. And I think that
that screaming off the cliff was something in the writer's
room that we sort of when we landed on it.
It was very well preserved. It was like where does
it happen? Where in the episode does it happen? How
(35:35):
does it get there?
Speaker 4 (35:36):
All those things and this is you know, really Zach
deserves the credit for that first Like he's the one
that wrote that episode, and that section of the episode
remained pretty much unchanged the whole time because he really
nailed it and found the right amount of sentiment, the
right amount of humor, and something that felt cinematic and
(36:00):
appropriate for like a visual medium, but still felt true
and like like something that could be nice if it
was real, you know, if we really had these places
to express ourselves and these people that forced us to
let things out. I personally absolutely love The Sheep and
I think that being on set with the Sheep in mental.
Speaker 1 (36:19):
Sequence was my favorite, one of my favorite days on set.
Speaker 3 (36:22):
Yeah, that is so funny you said that I was
watching that scene and I was like, how how who corralled.
Speaker 4 (36:30):
Literally this random farmer who had a field next to
where we were shooting, and the.
Speaker 1 (36:35):
Did you have our enterprising location? People went over and
were like would you bring the sheep over?
Speaker 4 (36:39):
And he said sure, and it was him and a dog,
literally a sheep herding dog, and they just came down.
Speaker 1 (36:45):
I have a video. We're all set up for cameras, car.
Speaker 4 (36:49):
The actors and in the distance is this man and
his dog and this flock of sheep.
Speaker 1 (36:53):
Coming down the road.
Speaker 5 (36:54):
It was wild.
Speaker 4 (36:55):
It was as irish as you could possibly imagine. It
was so fun and some of the sheep, you know,
got into the craft services and like into the camp
like it just was a delightful day and you're working
with animals. Is a real crap shoot, but it was
pretty great. But Zak and I were together on set
the day they shot the scream off the cliff and
(37:16):
it was a beautiful day and our actors really went
for it and it was so rewarding to see it,
and that that location itself, that.
Speaker 2 (37:27):
Was yeah, yeah, well it really translated on screen like
I'm glad to hear them.
Speaker 3 (37:33):
Was really moved by it. So nice work. Shooting in Ireland.
Speaker 2 (37:36):
You touch on it briefly, but one of my favorite
places in the world is Ireland. My parents go there
all the time and we come back and we say,
how is the weather. My mom says it was irish, Like,
you know, it's very Did that impact filming days?
Speaker 1 (37:49):
I mean, you were there not have irish weather? We wow,
I know.
Speaker 4 (37:55):
It's another one of those things that makes you feel
like this was imagining.
Speaker 1 (38:00):
So it was dark and cold. We shot.
Speaker 4 (38:03):
You know a lot of times Hallmark movies shoot in summer,
and we shot February through May, so we shot.
Speaker 1 (38:10):
And start in the dark winter into the spring. I
think we had one rain day. That's it. One day
where rain really impacted our schedule.
Speaker 5 (38:19):
Wow.
Speaker 4 (38:20):
A lot of our experiors we had no rain. We
had blue skies to the point where I was like,
this is a problem.
Speaker 1 (38:26):
This is California.
Speaker 5 (38:29):
Those flowers came back at one point and it was like,
we've got flowers on the hillside.
Speaker 4 (38:34):
We shot in the park and the daffodils were coming
in and I was like, I'm just going to take
some scissors and I'm just going to run and they
were like, you cannot do that, And I was like, well,
just everybody look away, I will just we'll just get
rid of the munch. But you know that's it wasn't
when we first learned that we were going to shoot
in Ireland, because there were multiple options of places to
shoot for England and Ireland.
Speaker 1 (38:56):
Was one of them. When we settled on Ireland, my
concern was the rain.
Speaker 4 (39:00):
It was going to be that the weather was going
to somehow impact this, and it really wasn't an issue.
Speaker 2 (39:05):
Switching yours completely, Yeah, thanks Ireland, switching gears completely. The
diversity and representation in this cast is so great. How
much of a hand did you have in that? How
important was that? Because I think we're telling so many
different stories here that it's nice to see so many
(39:26):
different lives represented on screen in a real as you said,
just like natural way, not like this is a very
special episode of television. And look at those same sex
couple having a dance, right, it just happens.
Speaker 4 (39:41):
Well, look this takes place, the story takes place in
London and areas we're.
Speaker 1 (39:46):
Outside of London. It's an incredibly diverse place.
Speaker 4 (39:49):
We were representing the truth of the location truly, and
there is a lot of fun in different perspectives on
the holiday. So you know that part is always intentional too,
is just keeping like in a big city where there's
lots of different cultures and lots of different colors and
lots of different holidays, keeping it all really you know,
(40:11):
true to that in real life. In the show, I
also want to again give Dava credit as she's Latina
and she's almost the only diversity, really uh racial diversity
in our writer's room, and she, you know, came in
very connected to that topic and all of us are too.
We were all really aware that we wanted to keep
(40:33):
that in mind. But when we went through the casting process,
it was something we talked about all the time, was
making sure this felt like true life and real life.
You know, we all live in big cities and this
is what life looks like. So it was it was
simply that, but it was absolutely something that you know
was intentional.
Speaker 2 (40:52):
Well, and every person on the screen is more beautiful
than the next, Like people walk on and like.
Speaker 4 (40:57):
Even I was like like everybody. Also, everyone was so
tall except for May, so it was also so funny.
But yeah, there was a lot of good looking people.
Speaker 5 (41:09):
And what are you gonna do? Everybody you.
Speaker 3 (41:14):
Talked about a lot of fidelity to the script.
Speaker 2 (41:17):
The script was written, May shows up, she slides right in,
puts her own little spin on it. Are there any
improvised moments that made it into the final cut? Anything
that you go, oh, wait, yeah, that's good.
Speaker 4 (41:28):
Many I'm trying to think and we think of episode
one and two, Zach, if you can think of anything.
Speaker 5 (41:33):
I haven't even seen episode three yet, like I'm I'm
I'm seeing it Friday. I'm very excited.
Speaker 4 (41:38):
Oh well, I've just been was in post production for
I've seen it. I could recite the entire series to
you all by memory, and you know, it's funny. I
never got tired of it, which I am also am.
I like a narcissist, couldn't get tired of show.
Speaker 1 (41:52):
But I never came to do that.
Speaker 2 (41:55):
Can you do that jump cut monologue opening by heart?
Because oh my gosh, that's so good.
Speaker 4 (42:00):
It's in a museum, So there are I can think
of a couple of things that you know, may like.
Speaker 1 (42:10):
One of them that comes to mind. I think it's
episode four where Callum agrees to do.
Speaker 4 (42:15):
Something that he said he's not going to do, and
she says, you crumbled like a cookie and I that
was not the line, and I liked it was her.
She tried a bunch of different things like that, and
we love that one.
Speaker 1 (42:26):
And that's like not the most exciting.
Speaker 4 (42:28):
Example, but it's just there were a million moments like
that where she just could give you, like, let me
try five different ways of saying you know the same thing, and.
Speaker 1 (42:38):
Which one was cuter or funnier. And I remember I.
Speaker 4 (42:41):
When she did that, I was like, damn, that was good,
Like I like, I like that choice, and I love
these times when she brings in her own creativity and humor.
Speaker 5 (42:49):
There. There is also that scene in episode four where
they're in the tea house where it's it's Delilah and
Mac and Kate. And I was weirdly on set that
day because I in the shot. I got to sit
behind Mary McDonald because she is, I mean, top tier.
I teach a class about her arc in Battlestar Galactica,
like she is my favorite human. Don't meet your heroes
(43:12):
unless it's Mary McDonald. But there was this moment where
I think Mary and May looked at each other and wait,
wait is it are we doing this? Or are we
doing this? And the director just was like, what's your take,
and they tweeked the scene and like the I think
they flipped like four lines over on themselves and suddenly
(43:32):
everything worked really well. And it was just such a
wild thing to watch two actresses who have been doing
it and know it that hard, like know the process,
work with the director, work with everybody else in the room,
and go so, well, let's just change that to that
great yeah, And then they shot it and we were
all out of there. It was pretty amazing.
Speaker 1 (43:50):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (43:50):
I think the benefit when you have people like May,
people like Mary, people like Jane who've done so much
they have an intuition about these some of these choices,
and it is in those moments I always have the
same feeling, which is like, oh my god, that's great,
and then followed by why.
Speaker 1 (44:07):
Didn't I think of that? But it keeps you humble.
Speaker 4 (44:11):
But it's important to remember this is it isn't just
you write a thing and they say the words.
Speaker 1 (44:16):
It can be a collaboration.
Speaker 4 (44:17):
Everyone finds it together and that is a good thing
and that it should be encouraged. You know, when you
have trusted collaborators like we did, and you know, especially
for a series where you're spending this much time with
the characters. May was invested, and you know, Mary was
invested and Jay was invested in what their careers were
doing for six episodes so that it felt real and
felt like they could bring something special and they all did.
(44:40):
And I appreciate so much that they felt comfortable being
able to do that well.
Speaker 5 (44:45):
They knew how they were thinking five steps ahead of
all of us. They knew or what it would be
like in the editing room, they knew how to how
it would play, what they would need later, and it was.
It was a shocking witness. But that I would say
that that's pretty common. Like I have now worked Cardi
Wong is in two Christmas movies, and when I found
out he was cast in More than Merrier, I rewrote
(45:06):
for him because in Road to Christmas, there's this one
moment where he ad libbed this line where they all
come to the door and she opens it up and
he just went, hi, Mama, And I burst into tears
every time, and everyone talks about that in like reviews
and not scripted, just Cardi being really good and so
of course that's the guy you call right like you
(45:29):
then say, can we get him in this role again
so that we can do this thing. And like I've
tried to get him in every movie now simply because
he did it again and more than merrier. He has
this like he changed a line about where his family
was for Christmas, and like it's ten times touching. It's
ten times better than I would have come up with.
Speaker 4 (45:47):
So it's you know, the first time I ever worked
really closely with an actor in this way was with
Rob Buckley in Christmas House and we you know, that
was his original pitch and we conceived of the story
together and then I wrote the script, but he like
he had such a like we would sit and talk
about the story and the scenes and he would kind
(46:08):
of start to like perform a little. And I felt
like such a dummy because I'd never really been that
aware of how actors take what you've written and start
to make it feel natural and make it feel connected
to a character.
Speaker 5 (46:20):
And all that.
Speaker 4 (46:21):
And sitting and doing some of that and then being
able to edit the script along the way in development.
Speaker 1 (46:26):
With his input, I was like, oh my god, this is.
Speaker 4 (46:29):
Gold to be able to really have that like, oh
my gosh, how great and you find the best line
together because they're finding what performs best for them, and
you're finding, you know, like what sounds best and what's
going to connect to the story later.
Speaker 1 (46:42):
It's just it was terrific and it made me less.
Speaker 4 (46:45):
It made me, you know, very unafraid to do that
in the future with other actors. And on this show,
you know, every time the actor was like, I want
to talk about this scene, I'm like, yes, tell me.
Speaker 1 (46:55):
Tell me what all your thoughts are.
Speaker 5 (46:56):
What do you want?
Speaker 4 (46:57):
You know, let's talk talk it through, because you can't
be a fraid to change something and find the better version.
It has to be okay that what you have on
the page is you know what you know. There's always
up for discussion to some degree. It doesn't mean you
throw it out. Sometimes you talk to the actor and
you keep exactly what's on the page. But it is
not a conversation to be afraid of.
Speaker 2 (47:17):
It's so funny that you say that about You're like, oh,
this is how it works. Because speaking about Christmas House,
the mother in that show, it's Sharon Nyan think.
Speaker 3 (47:25):
I know it.
Speaker 2 (47:26):
I know we just saw her on Find Name Mister
Christmas and she does these four scenes with these four actors,
and I felt that moment, I was like, oh, she
changed her performance to match the energy of the guy
in the room that's acting.
Speaker 3 (47:40):
It's just like it's like.
Speaker 1 (47:42):
More than memorizing lines. Yeah, like we know that, but
then you see it.
Speaker 4 (47:47):
Not that I thought it was easy right exactly, and
you know I yeah, yes.
Speaker 2 (47:54):
But watching someone like Sharon Lawrence take it and just
tweak it ever so slightly, it just had a different
feel every time.
Speaker 3 (47:59):
And in our review I was.
Speaker 2 (48:00):
Like, that was amazing to see it happened. So, yeah,
I think that's very interesting to watch it come to life.
Speaker 4 (48:07):
Well, I want to give a shout out to to
our director for Block one. Imer Conroy is a big
director in Ireland and she's been on the series Blood
of My Blood, which is the spin off of Outlander,
and so she's like used to being in fields and
rain and blood and stuff, and then she came into
our half of our series and the Christmas loveliness. But
(48:31):
she and May connected really early, really quickly, and she
watching the way that she would that emer would share
like directing, like the way she did it, like the
suggestions she'd make. She'd find one one emotional thing to
just speak on simply and let the actor take it
from there. And I felt like it was such an
(48:51):
education for me to understand how you speak to an
actor in that way, because you know, as showrunners, Dom
and I are there, our hands are and everything. We're
like watching everybody all the time, changing the scripts and
changing the budgets and you know, overseeing everything. But we
don't direct, and you know, the relationship between the director
and the actors is sacred, and so watching that and
(49:14):
seeing how that shapes the scenes too was I was
grateful to get to see that firsthand and see it
so successfully. And our second block director Megan Fox, not
that Megan Fox different Megan Fox. She's so great at
finding the joke, finding the way the framing would really
enhance the actors and explaining that to them.
Speaker 1 (49:35):
It was just so such a great part of this.
Speaker 4 (49:38):
But the performances, well, the actors deserve the line's share
of the credit, obviously. I don't want to miss a
chance to credit you know, are great, our great directors.
And it was fun to have a bunch of women
at the top of the help, you know, like female shrerunners.
Speaker 5 (49:51):
And the set is the set is so different when
that happens, and it is a million times better. All
the sets that you're on, the ones that arerun by women,
you're so of like, oh god, thank god. It's just
exhausting otherwise because it's like, is there going to be yelling.
Speaker 3 (50:09):
You breathe, Yeah, relax your job.
Speaker 5 (50:12):
I'm not saying that that's not sure. Boy. In the
long run, you really feel the chance to go to
work for a woman who is a showrunner is Oh God.
If you're out there and you're hope like that is
the key to just making work work.
Speaker 1 (50:30):
Well, I can say, well, I do.
Speaker 4 (50:32):
I want to say that I feel like this genre,
this story meant a lot to me. I mean, I
was really hoping it would be entertaining and funny and
christmassy and cozy and transportive in the way the holiday
is or something like that. But I also wanted to
feel like real women and real people and the real
relationship you know, between all the different characters, the men
(50:53):
as well. And you know, I do think that we
had the benefit of being nuanced women and bringing all
these experiences about love and family and friendship to the story.
That was really it was just try not to be
cliche as often as possible.
Speaker 1 (51:11):
With the rom com you know, trips that we're so
familiar with.
Speaker 5 (51:15):
Yeah, but I mean it's also this is the part
also that I keep finding, having now done rom coms
this long, is that they are Yeah, they are fantasy
in a lot of ways, but it's it's it's so
based in a truth of and like it's very specifically.
You know, the first year I wrote a bunch of
these movies, I wanted to be away from Christmas, and
(51:36):
Aaron turned to me on my way out and was like,
going to You're gonna fall in love while you're on
a trip away for Christmas, because now you've written this
for yourself, And like, no, I didn't, but I did
have the most romantic Christmas on record, Like we watched
Watership Down. There was a fire, it was snowing, and
it was very much but but but the idea that like,
(51:56):
you know, the tropes that you see in these movies,
like of course there's a confident on I have one.
It's Aaron, right, like I'm going to write these characters.
You know the reason that a lot of these stories
are like, well, someone goes home for Christmas. Yeah, you
go home for Christmas. That's the thing that happens every
year that you know, it's extrapolating on actual the emotional
lives of the people who are writing them. And so
(52:18):
I think this particular group of people who were assembled
to create that like at every level, I mean starting
in the writer's room, but then extrapolating it out. I
think everybody felt really comfortable bringing that part of themselves,
the rom com part of their own lives to this story.
Speaker 2 (52:38):
Well, before we go, what are you most excited for
viewers to see in the upcoming episodes.
Speaker 5 (52:44):
There's a thing that happens to the Pear Tree that
I feel like I bullied into the story with Max
Handicrafts that it's one of my favorite things and I'm
dying to see because I wasn't there when it was shot,
but I'm dying to see how it turned out. So
there's a thing.
Speaker 1 (53:01):
I like all the kissing, Yeah, that's not to come.
I'm really excited about.
Speaker 4 (53:08):
And I think that every single time a date like
I you know, gets to come to life on screen,
I'm excited for people to see it and curious if
people think, like I wish I could do that and
go to that and have that. I also love the
sheep endlessly.
Speaker 5 (53:25):
Love thee that car. That car is amazing.
Speaker 1 (53:30):
There was a I can't remember if you were there.
Speaker 4 (53:33):
I got called to the art department one day and
they had a board full of car photos and they're like,
pick a car for Evelyn, and I was like.
Speaker 5 (53:40):
That one fun.
Speaker 1 (53:41):
Yeah, and that was really fun.
Speaker 3 (53:43):
That's so it's so fun to hear, like the inside
base car beautiful.
Speaker 5 (53:50):
In the script, I think it was like a Volkswagen thing.
It was like a boxy like those years. Yeah, I
kept putting it in. They were like, that's an ugly car,
but it's beautiful what they got.
Speaker 4 (54:02):
But I think I think that the conflict increases between
as like the day, you know, as romances develop and
there's more heightened sort of conversations. Those scenes are my
favorite is when May and Richard and Callum I.
Speaker 1 (54:18):
Just mixed the actors we do all the time.
Speaker 4 (54:21):
We get to like take it one step further and
not it's not just flirting and it's not just lovely.
It's actually like digging into the relationships stuff.
Speaker 1 (54:28):
Those scenes. I really love those scenes.
Speaker 5 (54:31):
Plus Delilah Delia, Oh.
Speaker 1 (54:32):
Yeah, Mary mcmary McDonald, Yeah, it's just the.
Speaker 5 (54:35):
Greatest human ever to walk the planet.
Speaker 1 (54:38):
Or any I guess we could just list all the
things we like about it. We're just never going to
stop this episode.
Speaker 2 (54:46):
Well, why don't you tell people where they can follow
your work and keep up with you after this episode.
Speaker 4 (54:52):
I'm simple, I'm just Instagram Aaron nine one seven.
Speaker 1 (54:55):
I'm going to post a lot of pictures of the sheep.
Speaker 5 (54:57):
Go ahead, yah, I'm less Instagram. I you can find
mostly me at zach Hug dot com or story hug
writing dot com, where I do some consulting and such.
Speaker 3 (55:06):
So great, amazing.
Speaker 2 (55:08):
Thank you so much for being here, for sharing your
time and your stories with us. Thank you to our
listeners for listening to this episode of Girls Gone Hallmark,
a Bramble Jam podcast.
Speaker 3 (55:18):
We will be back next time with more Hallmark reviews.
Speaker 1 (55:21):
Goodbye bye Ye.
Speaker 7 (55:30):
All right friends, before we go, just a quick heads up.
You're about to hear some ads. Thee little gems help
us keep the show running and the Hallmark love flowing.
So do with that info what you will grab us neck,
hit the skip button, or maybe just maybe listen in
and discover your new favorite product.
Speaker 1 (55:52):
Bye
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