May 7, 2025 • 17 mins
Oliver Barwin, CEO of Bushfire Kitchen, joins Zack Oates live to share how he transitioned from Wall Street to hospitality, building a fast-casual brand focused on healthy food, hospitality, and smart growth. Oliver explains how technology upgrades, streamlined operations, and a better-for-you menu helped Bushfire Kitchen scale during challenging times. He dives into how loyalty to the guest experience shaped their tech decisions and why being proactive in guest recovery is a must. His journey proves that a finance background can be a surprising advantage in hospitality when paired with heart.
Zack and Oliver discuss:
- How Oliver went from investment banking to running restaurants
- Why Bushfire Kitchen rebuilt its entire tech stack from scratch
- The importance of clean operations and guest experience
- How smart quoting and texting improve off-premise satisfaction
- Using feedback tools to track and enhance table touches
- Tactics for creating lasting guest relationships in a competitive market
Learn how Oliver’s approach to scaling Bushfire Kitchen combines heart, hustle, and hospitality.
Thanks, Oliver!
Links:
https://www.linkedin.com/in/oliverbarwin/
https://www.instagram.com/bushfirekitchen/
https://www.bushfirekitchen.com/
https://www.linkedin.com/company/bushfire-kitchen/
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Welcome to a live version of Give an Ovation.
We are here in 3D.
This is not a Zoom virtualbackground.
I'm here with Oliver Barwin,ceo of Bushfire Kitchen.
How are you Good?
Thanks for having me Superexcited to talk.
Tell me about the start of allthis.
How did you get intohospitality?
Speaker 2 (00:19):
Yeah, so my prior life, prior to Rationals, was
actually in New York.
I'm working investment bankingon Wall Street.
Our family has been in theconsumer space for my entire
life.
So back in 2020, I decided tomake the switch to take over the
business.
My father was running at thetime and we really took the
opportunity to take thisbusiness to the next level, so
(00:41):
brought in institutional capitalto kind of help us expedite
that growth and you know, undermy leadership we essentially
would end up well tripling, butin the next 12 months from where
we started and then sky's thelimit beyond that and tell me
about the name.
Speaker 1 (00:55):
Where'd the name come from?
Speaker 2 (00:56):
bushfire kitchen.
You know our family'soriginally australian, oh really
, yeah, so some of the bushfiremenu was developed, you know,
based on some of the conceptsthat we really loved in
Australia growing up.
Yeah, and you know bushfire wasactually an Australian name for
brushfire, so that's why a lotof people get those two mixed up
with us.
(01:16):
And, yeah, it was kind of agenesis to our Australian roots
and some of the menu wasinfluenced by that kind of
culture.
Speaker 1 (01:23):
So what was it that made you go from the finance,
banking side to food?
I mean, like it seems likethose are two just polar
opposites.
One is just give mespreadsheets, give me the
numbers.
The other one is like let's youknow, it's people, it's
connection, it's all about thehospitality.
How do you make that switch?
Speaker 2 (01:40):
Yeah, so you know.
Unfortunately, my father wassick at the time, so he was kind
of the point where they neededsomeone to step in.
I joined february 2020, whichis a very interesting time.
No, join the industry.
So it was the week prior to ourgovernor shutting down
restaurants in california.
Oh, that was my entourage, soit was really unique time to
join.
Speaker 1 (02:01):
So march 1st of 2020.
Were you just like oh, what didI do?
Speaker 2 (02:05):
oh, yeah, it was, you know, but ultimately our you
know our belief, both family andbusinesses family comes first.
Yeah, that's part of ourmission, our statement, our
values.
So we practiced that, so wekind of have to made it happen.
Really, you know, covet,obviously everyone, those first
six to 12 months was reallyrocky and scary, but ultimately,
(02:26):
with crisis brings opportunityand that's what we took.
I found that opportunity tore-look at our business from a
fresh pair of eyes and reallymake change and be able to drive
the business forward and reachnew heights.
Speaker 1 (02:38):
So you get through COVID, which sometime happened
over the next three years.
Right, you get through COVID.
And what was it that got you tosay, yeah, let's go into growth
mode now.
Let's like, keep going.
Speaker 2 (02:51):
So our brand you know we've been successful just
through good food and word ofmouth, no marketing.
It was just clean the basicsfood, hospitality.
If you had those two thingsright, you could have something
special.
So I really believe in thebrand.
I think we were always out ofthe times in terms of kind of
our menu, culinary forwardapproach and really providing a
(03:12):
better for you product.
So that's what it started withand then ultimately coming with
a fresh pair of eyes and reallylooking at the systems, the tech
stack, the infrastructure tosupport that growth was really
important and that's what webuilt.
We pretty much started thewhole tech.
When I joined, we rippedeverything out and started from
scratch.
Speaker 1 (03:30):
How has the technology changed from when you
started to?
Speaker 2 (03:34):
now 100%.
When I joined, we don't have asingle thing left.
No, so it was a full rebuildand we built it with the vision
to be able to scale, even thoughat the time it was only three
or four units.
When I initially joined, we hadmuch bigger plan for the future
when it was about building atech stack that was integrated
(03:56):
systems could talk to oneanother, like hit scale.
That's what we did.
So ovations one of obviouslyour key partners.
We use toast for pos, onlineordering, 3 3PD integrations,
email marketing, so it's been ahuge player for us.
And then we use a programcalled Chubby, which is a data
warehouse analytic tool whichessentially allows us to kind of
take all of our data and put itto one place, recut it and make
(04:19):
sense of it and provide notonly from finance side but also
our operators in real-timeinsights into their performance,
not only on a P&L but alsooperational KPIs, guest feedback
, kind of full view view lens ofthe business when you look at
your tech vendors.
Speaker 1 (04:35):
What was the hardest thing to replace and what was
the easiest thing to do?
Speaker 2 (04:39):
POS is tough switching costs we rolled out.
There were no KDSs when Ijoined.
That was something that wereally felt was important to the
brand.
What were they doing?
Old school tickets?
No, yeah, like you know, we'llpage long expo tickets all
kitchen printers yeah but yeah,it was old school with pens.
so yeah, we were on clover atthe time, which I remember we'd.
(04:59):
I'd get probably five calls aday with some issue, some tech
issue, no way, and we justrealized it's time to rip it all
out, start from scratch.
You put in KDS.
We just had a hole-in-onesolution that can integrate with
a bunch of other great softwareproviders and have everything
in one place.
Speaker 3 (05:18):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (05:18):
And that was just key for us and it made.
Once we got that it was a lotof work to get it rolled out.
Once we got that it was a lotof work to get it rolled out,
but once it's going, so thepaying was worth it.
It runs smooth.
You know now I don't get asingle call.
Speaker 1 (05:28):
Okay, that's awesome.
What were some of the easierthings to get going?
Speaker 2 (05:32):
Give you guys credit.
Ovation was an easy one.
Prior to that, we were usingjust Toast's, I guess, feedback
solution, which is really simple, just thumbs up, thumbs down
but really wasn't giving usactual insights into our
performance.
I was a big believer in text.
First.
We looked at a lot of the othersolutions that are mostly email
driven and in the new age wefelt like texting was the place
(05:54):
we wanted to be aligned with andwe felt like open rates and the
amount of feedback you getthrough that is significantly
better than email.
So that was a big part of itand the rollout, you know, was
seamless and we still.
We use it today in every one ofour stores and we integrate all
of that data.
We get back with our datawarehouse Chubby to be able to
get you know real time insightsinto what's going on.
Speaker 1 (06:15):
That is amazing that you're actually like using that
data and aggregating that data,because I think a lot of times
we love to partner with people,we have an API.
We want people to pull thatdata into other sources.
A lot of people just don't dothat.
Or a lot of people, like wepull in a lot of data, some
other vendors don't want toshare that data, and so Our
(06:36):
philosophy is it's not our data,it's not me sharing that data
with someone else.
This is your data, it's yourguess, and I think that that's
an important factor to make surethat when you're working with
vendors understand what is theirdata philosophy and how do they
connect with you.
But all of this at the end,like the data is great, the
finance is great, but, like, atthe end of the day, it's about
(06:57):
the guest experience, right?
So I'd love to understand whatdo you think are some of the
most important aspects of guestexperience nowadays?
Speaker 2 (07:04):
Yeah.
So I think there's multifacets.
The restaurant industry haschanged so much with on-premise,
off-premise.
It really depends what you'relooking at.
But I think the start is justthe guest experience, right.
Yeah, walking in, the littlethings, it's what do you see?
Is the restaurant clean?
Do I walk in?
Do they welcome me?
It's the little things.
Do I get table touched?
Do they check on me?
So it's really the culturallittle things that it takes time
(07:25):
to build and create a welcomingatmosphere, to give a reason to
come back.
You can have the best food inthe world, but if you don't have
the service and hospitalityit's for nothing.
Yeah, so that's really beenimportant to us and Ovation
allows us to kind of measuresome of that.
So, for example, ovation, we'reable to tag all of our review
source to a source, right.
(07:45):
So table tents, for example.
So every one of our restaurants, every single table, has a QR
code to scan, leave feedback andthen we can tie that back to
the source.
So what we do with our GMs iswe actually give them goals.
So let's get 20 table tentsreviews a week to really push
them to table touch and reallyinteract with the guests and
kind of try to gather feedbackand gather information and kind
(08:08):
of ensure that our actions alignwith what we're kind of seeing
on the back end.
Speaker 1 (08:13):
Interesting.
So do your GMs like have ascript, Like will they go up and
actually like say oh, hey, yeah, I mean we table touching is
part of the industry, right.
Speaker 2 (08:22):
So we want to make sure that everything's right and
kind of treat the guestsperfectly and make sure they
have a great experience.
And then, if they do have agreat experience, it's just
saying that.
One extra question, you know,if you have a second, could you
take a time to get like yourcard and leave us a review?
Yeah, and mostly guests thatare good experience, they're
more than happy to do that.
And and obviously we've seen areally nice increase in our
(08:42):
public reviews.
So Yelp and Google Scores sincewe went on elevation we've seen
those go up Because obviouslythose five-star ones we're
directing straight to there andit's made a huge impact to the
business.
Beyond just in-store hospitality, it's all about creating an
easy, seamless experience forthe guests.
So we look at throughput.
It's you know once you walk inthe door, how quick because
we're fast cows, right.
(09:03):
So how quickly can I order, sitdown and get my food?
So and that starts with thegeneral menu the restaurant
design making sure that our sodamachine is after where you pay,
so that there's no bottlenecksso we look at the whole guest
experience as they walk into thedoor is really important to us.
And then also from an onlineperspective, having really great
(09:23):
online ordering solution iscritical, and we think Toast
does a really good job of that.
And then, beyond that, we'reusing what's called SmartQuote
in Toast, which is essentiallyan AI-powered order coach tool
which essentially takes intoaccount the kitchen's capacity
and how busy they are at thetime of that order to provide a
more accurate order ready timefor the guest, and that's
something we measure in terms ofour percent kitchen's capacity
and how busy they are at thetime of that order to provide a
more accurate order ready timefor the guest, and that's
something we measure in terms ofour percent.
(09:45):
On time relates.
Speaker 1 (09:46):
Yeah, because that's one of the things is, a lot of
times, as we kind of look at theback end system and as we're
looking at who is responding andwhat's the feedback, one of the
big things that we hear isservice was slow.
And people will often push backand they'll be like, well, our
service wasn't slow and I'm like, okay, but your guests thought
(10:07):
that it was, and so we try tounderstand why did they think it
is?
And as we dive into that data,one of the most common
complaints about order was slowis because the order wasn't
ready when someone went to gopick it up.
And if I go to the store and Iorder ahead and I get there at
the order ready time and thefood hasn't even started to get
(10:28):
cooked, I'm like, why did Iorder ahead?
I could have just showed up andjust ordered with everybody
else, but instead I took thetime to order ahead and it
creates a really negative guestexperience.
And so we always recommend being, especially if you have
something like what do you callit?
What was the toast feature?
Smart quote, smart quote,that's awesome.
If you don't have that, give alittle extra buffer, right?
(10:51):
Because especially if youronline ordering system allows
you to say during, like thelunch or dinner rush, give
yourself a little more time,because that creates such a
negative experience and veryconsistently will get you
negative reviews.
Speaker 2 (11:06):
We also we're using KDS in all of our restaurants,
so we also text the guests whentheir order is actually ready
with instructions on where to go, and then we also sometimes put
an ovation link to leavefeedback.
So they have it all in oneplace.
Order's ready, now they go.
How was it?
Here's the link Leave us somefeedback.
Speaker 1 (11:23):
I love that you send that link with it, because then
if they get their food andthere's something wrong right
there, they forgot to do it.
Because we try to basicallymimic a table touch which is 20,
25 minutes and then say, hey,how was everything?
But if there's somethingmissing, they want to tell
somebody about it, right then.
And so I think that's reallycool.
I like that.
Any tactics that you've seen tobe really effective to improve
(11:44):
the guest experience.
Speaker 2 (11:45):
Yeah, I mean, I think a lot of it is, yeah, as I said
, like systems, throughput,speed of service, communication
to the guests and just reallysetting up a great experience
from start to finish of theorder and then you know, then,
what we do is we're reallyfocused on when we get something
wrong.
We can't be 100%, no one can be100%.
(12:06):
When we get something wrong, wemake sure to make it right and
quickly.
So we actually measure, throughOvation, our response time to
guest complaints and make surethat we resolve everything
within ideally 12 hours.
Speaker 1 (12:17):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (12:17):
And giving them promos gift cards or promo codes
to be able to come back and tryus again and give us another
chance.
Because once those guests, ifthey don't have a good
experience, the likelihood ofthem coming back is very, very
low.
Yeah, but if they give you thatopportunity or that feedback,
you have to take it.
Speaker 1 (12:32):
And I think that that apology is something that's so
powerful because data shows thata guest who had a negative
experience in proper servicerecovery is actually worth 24
times more than your averageguest, and so to have that
ability to create raving fansfrom mistakes is huge, because
you could do the same thingright.
For example, there's a pizzaplace by me and I went there for
(12:55):
years and one day I went inthere and the ranch dressing or
the creamy Italian dressing,which I really liked, was so
runny.
It was just kind of like gross.
It was like really watery.
I literally didn't go back therefor two years.
I've been going there for sevenyears and they had nailed it
every time, but what happenedwas I didn't have a way to share
with anyone.
To me it was like, well, maybethey changed the recipe.
(13:17):
I didn't talk to anyone therebecause I was in a meeting in a
rush and it wasn't like I wasoffended or mad, it was just
that when I thought about thatrestaurant, I thought about,
like that runny dressing, andthen I was like, well, maybe
I'll try something else.
A lot of other places haveopened up.
So it took me two years to getaround to getting that
restaurant back in my rotationbecause of one tiny little
(13:38):
mistake.
And guess what happened when Iwent back there two years later?
It must've just been an off day, because the dressing was
exactly how it was before.
But I think that, like havingthat low effort way of a guest
just to reach out and had theybeen able to say, we're so sorry
, we had a new person making itthat's not what we're trying to
(13:59):
do.
I would have never had a breakfrom that restaurant and they
would have had my business foranother two years.
Now, luckily, they're great,they're awesome.
I'm back with them.
I go there a couple of times ayear.
But yeah, like that is soimportant to make sure that
you're not only hearing what'sgoing on, that you're staying
that consistent, but that youapologize when things don't go
(14:20):
right.
Speaker 2 (14:21):
And our guests.
They've said it.
They couldn't believe thatsomeone actually reached out to
make it right.
That's a foreign concept to alot of guests.
They're not used to restaurantsreally texting them and going
above and beyond to get to thebottom of what the issue was and
making sure it's resolved andthey feel good about it, which
is great, though, because thebar is set really low in the
hospitality industry.
Speaker 1 (14:41):
Ironically, right, because you think it's
hospitality, but at the end ofthe day, when you have 120%
employee turnover and 80%manager turnover, it's just hard
to get people that really buyin in the moment.
Right, and so the tech is thereto not to replace them, but to
enhance what they, and that'show we look at it.
Speaker 2 (15:00):
Yeah, giving our operators the tools, the
research and the data to be ableto do their jobs, and then have
the insights to understandwhere are we doing well or do we
do better?
Okay, and then have theinsights to understand where are
we doing well?
Where do we?
Speaker 1 (15:11):
do better.
Okay, let's say you arestarting a new restaurant today.
Right, brand new Bushfire justgot sold for a billion dollars,
and what do you do next?
What do you feel like is theconcept that would do well in
today's environment?
Speaker 2 (15:26):
We are big believers in better for your products.
You see, there's an overallpush to make america healthy and
I think there's also thissituation we're in with the
economy that you know there islower consumer confidence and
relations high and people wantvalue offerings.
So I think you know we'd I'dprobably potentially look at,
you know, a healthy kind of fast, casual concept at a lower
(15:47):
price point.
That's really smaller menu,easy to execute, easy to scale,
but still providing the sameflavor, quality and healthy food
to communities kind of acrossthe nation.
That's really what.
But similar to bushfire, we'vebeen able to be successful in
very different demographicsmarkets and we can be successful
(16:08):
in the coastal California aswell as Inland Empire, which is
not many brands that have beenable to do both.
So we're really about any brandI do in the future would be
about being able to have a broadreach.
We have something for everyoneand really be able to provide a
very value offering to theguests.
They feel like they're gettingbang for their buck.
Eat healthy, quick, easy.
(16:29):
Okay, you know a lot of peoplein the industry.
Who is someone?
Yeah, so they feel like thatthey're getting bang for their
buck.
Speaker 1 (16:32):
Eat healthy, quick, easy.
Okay, you know a lot of peoplein the industry.
Who is someone that deserves anovation, who's someone that we
all should be following.
Speaker 2 (16:38):
I think, jim Bayless.
He spoke today at ourconference.
I think he's a great, greatoperator, great investor.
Speaker 1 (16:43):
Speaking of a billion .
He is no longer with SizzlingPlatter, but he's the one who
helped grow them to the pointthat they were able to sell for
a billion dollars, which,anytime you create something
that sells for something with aB in it, that's impressive.
Speaker 2 (16:56):
Yeah, and he's been a great mentor to me, was very
involved in Bushfire and ourgrowth and, yeah, I have a lot
of respect for Jim.
I think a lot of people couldlearn a lot of things from him.
Speaker 1 (17:06):
Yeah, jim Bayless man 100% great shout out.
Jim Bayless man 100% greatshout out.
And how do people find andfollow you and Bushfire
Instagram is the best way.
Speaker 2 (17:13):
We're at Bushfire Kitchen, our website
bushfirekitchencom, and then,you know, for business and
growth news, we're on LinkedIn.
That's the best way.
Keep on top of us.
Speaker 1 (17:21):
Awesome Well for giving us a little bit of the
down under up north today'sovation goes us today.
Speaker 3 (17:29):
If you liked this episode, leave us a review on
Apple Podcasts or your favoriteplace to listen.
We're all about feedback here.
Again, this episode wassponsored by Ovation, a
two-question, sms-basedactionable guest feedback
platform built for multi-unitrestaurants.
If you'd like to learn how wecan help you measure and create
a better guest experience, visitus at OvationUpcom.
Welcome to a live version of Give an Ovation.
We are here in 3D.
This is not a Zoom virtualbackground.
I'm here with Oliver Barwin,ceo of Bushfire Kitchen.
How are you Good?
Thanks for having me Superexcited to talk.
Tell me about the start of allthis.
How did you get intohospitality?
Speaker 2 (00:19):
Yeah, so my prior life, prior to Rationals, was
actually in New York.
I'm working investment bankingon Wall Street.
Our family has been in theconsumer space for my entire
life.
So back in 2020, I decided tomake the switch to take over the
business.
My father was running at thetime and we really took the
opportunity to take thisbusiness to the next level, so
(00:41):
brought in institutional capitalto kind of help us expedite
that growth and you know, undermy leadership we essentially
would end up well tripling, butin the next 12 months from where
we started and then sky's thelimit beyond that and tell me
about the name.
Speaker 1 (00:55):
Where'd the name come from?
Speaker 2 (00:56):
bushfire kitchen.
You know our family'soriginally australian, oh really
, yeah, so some of the bushfiremenu was developed, you know,
based on some of the conceptsthat we really loved in
Australia growing up.
Yeah, and you know bushfire wasactually an Australian name for
brushfire, so that's why a lotof people get those two mixed up
with us.
(01:16):
And, yeah, it was kind of agenesis to our Australian roots
and some of the menu wasinfluenced by that kind of
culture.
Speaker 1 (01:23):
So what was it that made you go from the finance,
banking side to food?
I mean, like it seems likethose are two just polar
opposites.
One is just give mespreadsheets, give me the
numbers.
The other one is like let's youknow, it's people, it's
connection, it's all about thehospitality.
How do you make that switch?
Speaker 2 (01:40):
Yeah, so you know.
Unfortunately, my father wassick at the time, so he was kind
of the point where they neededsomeone to step in.
I joined february 2020, whichis a very interesting time.
No, join the industry.
So it was the week prior to ourgovernor shutting down
restaurants in california.
Oh, that was my entourage, soit was really unique time to
join.
Speaker 1 (02:01):
So march 1st of 2020.
Were you just like oh, what didI do?
Speaker 2 (02:05):
oh, yeah, it was, you know, but ultimately our you
know our belief, both family andbusinesses family comes first.
Yeah, that's part of ourmission, our statement, our
values.
So we practiced that, so wekind of have to made it happen.
Really, you know, covet,obviously everyone, those first
six to 12 months was reallyrocky and scary, but ultimately,
(02:26):
with crisis brings opportunityand that's what we took.
I found that opportunity tore-look at our business from a
fresh pair of eyes and reallymake change and be able to drive
the business forward and reachnew heights.
Speaker 1 (02:38):
So you get through COVID, which sometime happened
over the next three years.
Right, you get through COVID.
And what was it that got you tosay, yeah, let's go into growth
mode now.
Let's like, keep going.
Speaker 2 (02:51):
So our brand you know we've been successful just
through good food and word ofmouth, no marketing.
It was just clean the basicsfood, hospitality.
If you had those two thingsright, you could have something
special.
So I really believe in thebrand.
I think we were always out ofthe times in terms of kind of
our menu, culinary forwardapproach and really providing a
(03:12):
better for you product.
So that's what it started withand then ultimately coming with
a fresh pair of eyes and reallylooking at the systems, the tech
stack, the infrastructure tosupport that growth was really
important and that's what webuilt.
We pretty much started thewhole tech.
When I joined, we rippedeverything out and started from
scratch.
Speaker 1 (03:30):
How has the technology changed from when you
started to?
Speaker 2 (03:34):
now 100%.
When I joined, we don't have asingle thing left.
No, so it was a full rebuildand we built it with the vision
to be able to scale, even thoughat the time it was only three
or four units.
When I initially joined, we hadmuch bigger plan for the future
when it was about building atech stack that was integrated
(03:56):
systems could talk to oneanother, like hit scale.
That's what we did.
So ovations one of obviouslyour key partners.
We use toast for pos, onlineordering, 3 3PD integrations,
email marketing, so it's been ahuge player for us.
And then we use a programcalled Chubby, which is a data
warehouse analytic tool whichessentially allows us to kind of
take all of our data and put itto one place, recut it and make
(04:19):
sense of it and provide notonly from finance side but also
our operators in real-timeinsights into their performance,
not only on a P&L but alsooperational KPIs, guest feedback
, kind of full view view lens ofthe business when you look at
your tech vendors.
Speaker 1 (04:35):
What was the hardest thing to replace and what was
the easiest thing to do?
Speaker 2 (04:39):
POS is tough switching costs we rolled out.
There were no KDSs when Ijoined.
That was something that wereally felt was important to the
brand.
What were they doing?
Old school tickets?
No, yeah, like you know, we'llpage long expo tickets all
kitchen printers yeah but yeah,it was old school with pens.
so yeah, we were on clover atthe time, which I remember we'd.
(04:59):
I'd get probably five calls aday with some issue, some tech
issue, no way, and we justrealized it's time to rip it all
out, start from scratch.
You put in KDS.
We just had a hole-in-onesolution that can integrate with
a bunch of other great softwareproviders and have everything
in one place.
Speaker 3 (05:18):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (05:18):
And that was just key for us and it made.
Once we got that it was a lotof work to get it rolled out.
Once we got that it was a lotof work to get it rolled out,
but once it's going, so thepaying was worth it.
It runs smooth.
You know now I don't get asingle call.
Speaker 1 (05:28):
Okay, that's awesome.
What were some of the easierthings to get going?
Speaker 2 (05:32):
Give you guys credit.
Ovation was an easy one.
Prior to that, we were usingjust Toast's, I guess, feedback
solution, which is really simple, just thumbs up, thumbs down
but really wasn't giving usactual insights into our
performance.
I was a big believer in text.
First.
We looked at a lot of the othersolutions that are mostly email
driven and in the new age wefelt like texting was the place
(05:54):
we wanted to be aligned with andwe felt like open rates and the
amount of feedback you getthrough that is significantly
better than email.
So that was a big part of itand the rollout, you know, was
seamless and we still.
We use it today in every one ofour stores and we integrate all
of that data.
We get back with our datawarehouse Chubby to be able to
get you know real time insightsinto what's going on.
Speaker 1 (06:15):
That is amazing that you're actually like using that
data and aggregating that data,because I think a lot of times
we love to partner with people,we have an API.
We want people to pull thatdata into other sources.
A lot of people just don't dothat.
Or a lot of people, like wepull in a lot of data, some
other vendors don't want toshare that data, and so Our
(06:36):
philosophy is it's not our data,it's not me sharing that data
with someone else.
This is your data, it's yourguess, and I think that that's
an important factor to make surethat when you're working with
vendors understand what is theirdata philosophy and how do they
connect with you.
But all of this at the end,like the data is great, the
finance is great, but, like, atthe end of the day, it's about
(06:57):
the guest experience, right?
So I'd love to understand whatdo you think are some of the
most important aspects of guestexperience nowadays?
Speaker 2 (07:04):
Yeah.
So I think there's multifacets.
The restaurant industry haschanged so much with on-premise,
off-premise.
It really depends what you'relooking at.
But I think the start is justthe guest experience, right.
Yeah, walking in, the littlethings, it's what do you see?
Is the restaurant clean?
Do I walk in?
Do they welcome me?
It's the little things.
Do I get table touched?
Do they check on me?
So it's really the culturallittle things that it takes time
(07:25):
to build and create a welcomingatmosphere, to give a reason to
come back.
You can have the best food inthe world, but if you don't have
the service and hospitalityit's for nothing.
Yeah, so that's really beenimportant to us and Ovation
allows us to kind of measuresome of that.
So, for example, ovation, we'reable to tag all of our review
source to a source, right.
(07:45):
So table tents, for example.
So every one of our restaurants, every single table, has a QR
code to scan, leave feedback andthen we can tie that back to
the source.
So what we do with our GMs iswe actually give them goals.
So let's get 20 table tentsreviews a week to really push
them to table touch and reallyinteract with the guests and
kind of try to gather feedbackand gather information and kind
(08:08):
of ensure that our actions alignwith what we're kind of seeing
on the back end.
Speaker 1 (08:13):
Interesting.
So do your GMs like have ascript, Like will they go up and
actually like say oh, hey, yeah, I mean we table touching is
part of the industry, right.
Speaker 2 (08:22):
So we want to make sure that everything's right and
kind of treat the guestsperfectly and make sure they
have a great experience.
And then, if they do have agreat experience, it's just
saying that.
One extra question, you know,if you have a second, could you
take a time to get like yourcard and leave us a review?
Yeah, and mostly guests thatare good experience, they're
more than happy to do that.
And and obviously we've seen areally nice increase in our
(08:42):
public reviews.
So Yelp and Google Scores sincewe went on elevation we've seen
those go up Because obviouslythose five-star ones we're
directing straight to there andit's made a huge impact to the
business.
Beyond just in-store hospitality, it's all about creating an
easy, seamless experience forthe guests.
So we look at throughput.
It's you know once you walk inthe door, how quick because
we're fast cows, right.
(09:03):
So how quickly can I order, sitdown and get my food?
So and that starts with thegeneral menu the restaurant
design making sure that our sodamachine is after where you pay,
so that there's no bottlenecksso we look at the whole guest
experience as they walk into thedoor is really important to us.
And then also from an onlineperspective, having really great
(09:23):
online ordering solution iscritical, and we think Toast
does a really good job of that.
And then, beyond that, we'reusing what's called SmartQuote
in Toast, which is essentiallyan AI-powered order coach tool
which essentially takes intoaccount the kitchen's capacity
and how busy they are at thetime of that order to provide a
more accurate order ready timefor the guest, and that's
something we measure in terms ofour percent kitchen's capacity
and how busy they are at thetime of that order to provide a
more accurate order ready timefor the guest, and that's
something we measure in terms ofour percent.
(09:45):
On time relates.
Speaker 1 (09:46):
Yeah, because that's one of the things is, a lot of
times, as we kind of look at theback end system and as we're
looking at who is responding andwhat's the feedback, one of the
big things that we hear isservice was slow.
And people will often push backand they'll be like, well, our
service wasn't slow and I'm like, okay, but your guests thought
(10:07):
that it was, and so we try tounderstand why did they think it
is?
And as we dive into that data,one of the most common
complaints about order was slowis because the order wasn't
ready when someone went to gopick it up.
And if I go to the store and Iorder ahead and I get there at
the order ready time and thefood hasn't even started to get
(10:28):
cooked, I'm like, why did Iorder ahead?
I could have just showed up andjust ordered with everybody
else, but instead I took thetime to order ahead and it
creates a really negative guestexperience.
And so we always recommend being, especially if you have
something like what do you callit?
What was the toast feature?
Smart quote, smart quote,that's awesome.
If you don't have that, give alittle extra buffer, right?
(10:51):
Because especially if youronline ordering system allows
you to say during, like thelunch or dinner rush, give
yourself a little more time,because that creates such a
negative experience and veryconsistently will get you
negative reviews.
Speaker 2 (11:06):
We also we're using KDS in all of our restaurants,
so we also text the guests whentheir order is actually ready
with instructions on where to go, and then we also sometimes put
an ovation link to leavefeedback.
So they have it all in oneplace.
Order's ready, now they go.
How was it?
Here's the link Leave us somefeedback.
Speaker 1 (11:23):
I love that you send that link with it, because then
if they get their food andthere's something wrong right
there, they forgot to do it.
Because we try to basicallymimic a table touch which is 20,
25 minutes and then say, hey,how was everything?
But if there's somethingmissing, they want to tell
somebody about it, right then.
And so I think that's reallycool.
I like that.
Any tactics that you've seen tobe really effective to improve
(11:44):
the guest experience.
Speaker 2 (11:45):
Yeah, I mean, I think a lot of it is, yeah, as I said
, like systems, throughput,speed of service, communication
to the guests and just reallysetting up a great experience
from start to finish of theorder and then you know, then,
what we do is we're reallyfocused on when we get something
wrong.
We can't be 100%, no one can be100%.
(12:06):
When we get something wrong, wemake sure to make it right and
quickly.
So we actually measure, throughOvation, our response time to
guest complaints and make surethat we resolve everything
within ideally 12 hours.
Speaker 1 (12:17):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (12:17):
And giving them promos gift cards or promo codes
to be able to come back and tryus again and give us another
chance.
Because once those guests, ifthey don't have a good
experience, the likelihood ofthem coming back is very, very
low.
Yeah, but if they give you thatopportunity or that feedback,
you have to take it.
Speaker 1 (12:32):
And I think that that apology is something that's so
powerful because data shows thata guest who had a negative
experience in proper servicerecovery is actually worth 24
times more than your averageguest, and so to have that
ability to create raving fansfrom mistakes is huge, because
you could do the same thingright.
For example, there's a pizzaplace by me and I went there for
(12:55):
years and one day I went inthere and the ranch dressing or
the creamy Italian dressing,which I really liked, was so
runny.
It was just kind of like gross.
It was like really watery.
I literally didn't go back therefor two years.
I've been going there for sevenyears and they had nailed it
every time, but what happenedwas I didn't have a way to share
with anyone.
To me it was like, well, maybethey changed the recipe.
(13:17):
I didn't talk to anyone therebecause I was in a meeting in a
rush and it wasn't like I wasoffended or mad, it was just
that when I thought about thatrestaurant, I thought about,
like that runny dressing, andthen I was like, well, maybe
I'll try something else.
A lot of other places haveopened up.
So it took me two years to getaround to getting that
restaurant back in my rotationbecause of one tiny little
(13:38):
mistake.
And guess what happened when Iwent back there two years later?
It must've just been an off day, because the dressing was
exactly how it was before.
But I think that, like havingthat low effort way of a guest
just to reach out and had theybeen able to say, we're so sorry
, we had a new person making itthat's not what we're trying to
(13:59):
do.
I would have never had a breakfrom that restaurant and they
would have had my business foranother two years.
Now, luckily, they're great,they're awesome.
I'm back with them.
I go there a couple of times ayear.
But yeah, like that is soimportant to make sure that
you're not only hearing what'sgoing on, that you're staying
that consistent, but that youapologize when things don't go
(14:20):
right.
Speaker 2 (14:21):
And our guests.
They've said it.
They couldn't believe thatsomeone actually reached out to
make it right.
That's a foreign concept to alot of guests.
They're not used to restaurantsreally texting them and going
above and beyond to get to thebottom of what the issue was and
making sure it's resolved andthey feel good about it, which
is great, though, because thebar is set really low in the
hospitality industry.
Speaker 1 (14:41):
Ironically, right, because you think it's
hospitality, but at the end ofthe day, when you have 120%
employee turnover and 80%manager turnover, it's just hard
to get people that really buyin in the moment.
Right, and so the tech is thereto not to replace them, but to
enhance what they, and that'show we look at it.
Speaker 2 (15:00):
Yeah, giving our operators the tools, the
research and the data to be ableto do their jobs, and then have
the insights to understandwhere are we doing well or do we
do better?
Okay, and then have theinsights to understand where are
we doing well?
Where do we?
Speaker 1 (15:11):
do better.
Okay, let's say you arestarting a new restaurant today.
Right, brand new Bushfire justgot sold for a billion dollars,
and what do you do next?
What do you feel like is theconcept that would do well in
today's environment?
Speaker 2 (15:26):
We are big believers in better for your products.
You see, there's an overallpush to make america healthy and
I think there's also thissituation we're in with the
economy that you know there islower consumer confidence and
relations high and people wantvalue offerings.
So I think you know we'd I'dprobably potentially look at,
you know, a healthy kind of fast, casual concept at a lower
(15:47):
price point.
That's really smaller menu,easy to execute, easy to scale,
but still providing the sameflavor, quality and healthy food
to communities kind of acrossthe nation.
That's really what.
But similar to bushfire, we'vebeen able to be successful in
very different demographicsmarkets and we can be successful
(16:08):
in the coastal California aswell as Inland Empire, which is
not many brands that have beenable to do both.
So we're really about any brandI do in the future would be
about being able to have a broadreach.
We have something for everyoneand really be able to provide a
very value offering to theguests.
They feel like they're gettingbang for their buck.
Eat healthy, quick, easy.
(16:29):
Okay, you know a lot of peoplein the industry.
Who is someone?
Yeah, so they feel like thatthey're getting bang for their
buck.
Speaker 1 (16:32):
Eat healthy, quick, easy.
Okay, you know a lot of peoplein the industry.
Who is someone that deserves anovation, who's someone that we
all should be following.
Speaker 2 (16:38):
I think, jim Bayless.
He spoke today at ourconference.
I think he's a great, greatoperator, great investor.
Speaker 1 (16:43):
Speaking of a billion .
He is no longer with SizzlingPlatter, but he's the one who
helped grow them to the pointthat they were able to sell for
a billion dollars, which,anytime you create something
that sells for something with aB in it, that's impressive.
Speaker 2 (16:56):
Yeah, and he's been a great mentor to me, was very
involved in Bushfire and ourgrowth and, yeah, I have a lot
of respect for Jim.
I think a lot of people couldlearn a lot of things from him.
Speaker 1 (17:06):
Yeah, jim Bayless man 100% great shout out.
Jim Bayless man 100% greatshout out.
And how do people find andfollow you and Bushfire
Instagram is the best way.
Speaker 2 (17:13):
We're at Bushfire Kitchen, our website
bushfirekitchencom, and then,you know, for business and
growth news, we're on LinkedIn.
That's the best way.
Keep on top of us.
Speaker 1 (17:21):
Awesome Well for giving us a little bit of the
down under up north today'sovation goes us today.
Speaker 3 (17:29):
If you liked this episode, leave us a review on
Apple Podcasts or your favoriteplace to listen.
We're all about feedback here.
Again, this episode wassponsored by Ovation, a
two-question, sms-basedactionable guest feedback
platform built for multi-unitrestaurants.
If you'd like to learn how wecan help you measure and create
a better guest experience, visitus at OvationUpcom.
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