May 23, 2025 • 20 mins
Amy Hom, CEO of Barcelona Wine Bar and a powerhouse leader in hospitality, joins Zack to share how she’s created strong cultures and top-tier guest experiences across some of the industry’s most iconic brands. From reducing turnover to building future leaders, Amy brings practical wisdom and contagious energy.
Zack and Amy discuss:
- How culture drives results and retention
- Why team energy is the foundation of guest experience
- How to spot which “B players” can level up
- Why feedback is the ultimate success filter
- The operational must-haves she looks for at every brand
- How gratitude and mindset fuel leadership
Thanks, Amy!
Links:
https://www.linkedin.com/in/amyhom17/
https://www.linkedin.com/company/barcelona-wine-bar/
https://www.instagram.com/barcelonawinebar/
https://barcelonawinebar.com/
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Welcome to another edition of Give an Ovation, the
restaurant guest experiencepodcast.
I'm your host, zach Oates, andeach week I chat with industry
experts to uncover theirstrategies and tactics you can
use to create a five-star guestexperience.
This podcast is powered byOvation, the feedback and
operations platform built formulti-unit restaurants.
It gives you all the insightsyou need, with none of the
(00:21):
annoying surveys for your guests.
Learn more at OvationUpcom.
And today is an honor because Ihave the distinguished Amy Hom
with us and if you don't knowher, that means you probably are
new in the restaurant industry.
So let me introduce you.
She's the COO of Barcelona WineBar.
She's board member on the GleanNetwork ResQ Lunchbox, former
(00:45):
COO of Bluestone Lane.
She was with Reef, sweetgreen,red Robin, wolfgang Puck, cpk.
I mean, amy, you have done itall and it's an honor to have
you here.
Speaker 2 (00:52):
Well, you're aging me , Zach.
Speaker 1 (00:54):
Oh, and she did three months at each of those brands.
Speaker 2 (00:59):
Sometimes it feels like that, but they were a
little longer than that.
Speaker 1 (01:02):
Yeah well, amy, you've had such a distinguished
career in this industry and soit's an honor.
For those of you who might notbe seeing our little clip, we
are wearing matching hats and,truly, amy, you deserve an
ovation because you've beendoing so many incredible things.
But we'll get to that in aminute.
First, I want to hear about you.
Have been deep in theoperations of restaurants, and
(01:26):
when you think about restaurantoperations, what are some things
when you go into a brand andyou're looking at low-hanging
fruit that you can get in andsay let's fix that.
What are some of the commonthings that you see that most
restaurants need to improve whenit comes to their operations?
Speaker 2 (01:42):
First off, we need to give an ovation for Zach, who's
been doing an extraordinary job, built this amazing platform.
I'm a big fan, so nice job, andI hope you get ovation
sometimes too.
Speaker 1 (01:52):
Oh well, thank you, amy.
Speaker 2 (01:53):
I'm just bummed, I didn't get a t-shirt, but that's
okay.
That's okay, I'll talk to yourpeople.
Speaker 1 (01:59):
And, all right, let's come to the booth.
We'll have a bunch of that.
All right, come to the booth.
Speaker 2 (02:01):
We'll have a bunch of that array.
Come to the booth.
That is where I picked up thislovely hat.
So some things you go into arestaurant and look for.
I don't think it's anydifferent than any other guest
Hospitality.
Are there smiling faces?
The team having fun is the mostimportant to me.
Clean, safe environment for theteam and for the food and the
vibe.
Everybody wants to be hangingout in a cool place with a cool
(02:30):
vibe, so but if the team's nothaving fun, I don't want to be
in there.
Speaker 1 (02:32):
So you got to have a really great climate and culture
for the team to be working in.
So I get that in theory, butyou have made a career out of
that and I think the teams thatyou've built and how people talk
about you as a leader isexceptional.
You have actually a great quoteon your LinkedIn oh, I just had
it pulled up because I lovethat.
But your backdrop of yourLinkedIn you talk about.
If your actions create a legacythat inspire others to dream
(02:53):
more, learn more, do more andbecome more, then you are an
excellent leader.
That's a Dolly Parton quote.
Love me some, dolly.
She's someone who works likenine to nine, not nine to five.
How do you do that inpracticality?
Because I think there's no onewho would disagree with you, but
the people who agree with you alot of them are still terrible
bosses.
So, like how do you create thatenvironment?
Speaker 2 (03:14):
I agree with.
There's some folks out therethat are not great for culture,
but culture creates greatresults, and so if you want to
create a climate of developmentwhere people you're literally
zoned in on that person, whatthey want to learn, what they
want to work on, you're givingthem that time, you're writing
it down, you're putting yourphone away and making it
intentional.
That's important.
We do heart checks.
(03:34):
A lot of people heard that.
I know Stacey Cain and some ofthe other folks in the industry
are now doing them with thefranchisees, which is awesome
and hilarious.
But question of the day is tolearn about people.
You can't get on a call andjust Zoom, like you and I were
chatting before this call.
It's like you're getting toknow each other.
You're still vibing, but yougot to make sure the teams are
doing okay.
More people are living alonethan ever these days.
(03:55):
Mental health is an issue, andthat's a lot of our team members
.
We're still the second largestemployer in the country when it
comes to restaurants, right pastunder the government there.
Well, that may have changed.
We might be the number one now.
Small dig there, but there's aneed for connection.
(04:15):
There's a need for connectionfor our teams and there's a need
for connection with the gueststhat walk into our restaurant
and if we can make, create anenvironment that leaves them
better than how they walked inor how we found them team
members, guests, vendors,everyone then you've got this
culture that people want tobelong to.
But you have to care.
And is it extra time?
Sure is.
Is it extra energy?
(04:36):
100%.
But you get back what you putin, and so we really strive to
do that and it's important.
And we just saw, and so wereally strive to do that, and
it's important, and we just sawwe were just doing our numbers
we just saw a 30% reduction inturnover.
That's training dollars, that'sall these things, since we've
all been on board doing thesethings of development planning
(04:56):
in 30, 60, 90s and having themread the first 90 days when they
join.
All these components, skillbuilding, practice sessions, all
these things tie into that.
One big thing, which isprobably one of the largest
costs behind labor and COGS, isthat retention and turnover
piece.
So it all comes down to do youwant to go to work when you wake
up in the morning?
I know you love what you dobecause it exudes when you walk
(05:18):
through, when I'm around you,like you just have this positive
ball of energy that everybodywants to be around Zach.
If they could be Zach when theygrow up they'd love to be.
Speaker 1 (05:28):
Well, maybe when you get to be my age, amy, I'll give
you some of the secrets.
Speaker 2 (05:32):
Your age, oh my gosh, anyway.
So it is what kind of energyyou bring into the business, and
so you might be having a badday, but you're leading troops
and nobody cares.
So you have to care more aboutthem than you do about yourself.
Speaker 1 (05:43):
Yeah, let's get a little deeper, because I think
this is so great and I thinkthat, as a leader, you're
someone who I've always seentalk about, someone who lights
up a room.
You go in and you have suchpositive, fun energy.
I remember the first time thatwe actually met, we were at a
dinner and sitting next to eachother and I was just cracking up
.
You just make everyone aroundyou happy, but even the great
(06:07):
Amy Hom has a bad day every nowand again.
As a leader, what's some advicethat you have to still bring it
, still bring the positivity andthat great energy, even when
you're not feeling it.
Speaker 2 (06:19):
I don't not feel it and I'll tell you why.
When you look at and this maysound so dramatic and it
probably is to some peoplelistening, but I'm very grateful
my arms and legs work rightnow- and I'm happy I get to wake
up in a bed.
And it depends on if you don'tdo gratitude or think about
those things.
You can go down a rabbit holepretty quick because there's a
lot of stuff in the world that'sjust crazy and can bring you
(06:42):
down, and there's so much goodin the world that we're still
living in.
And so I grew up in a crazyarea in St Louis and I'm very
fortunate to live out inCalifornia Not that there's
anything wrong with St Louis,but where I grew up and a lot of
the people that know me from mychildhood agree not a great
place where we all grew up.
But now I'm living a dream thatI never thought that I could be
(07:04):
Now.
Did I get here and push myself?
Yes, I'm a learner.
I'm big on strength finders.
I'm big on development.
Somebody asked me today what'sone thing you're trying to focus
on this year, and it's alwaysseeking knowledge.
So if there's something I canlearn from someone, I will leech
myself onto that person, figureit out and, like spend time.
But you have to invest in whatyou want to do in life.
You've invested in your companyand building it and all of that
(07:24):
.
You've invested in your companyand building it and all of that
, and we're all trying to do thesame thing in our own way.
But things don't just happen toyou.
You have to actually go, chasethem and make them happen.
Speaker 1 (07:33):
So are you a woo Amy?
Speaker 2 (07:35):
I'm not a woo.
Speaker 1 (07:37):
No way.
Speaker 2 (07:38):
No, I'm still a realist.
I'm still a realist.
My number one is futuristic.
So I'm very much a visionary.
I can look at something or walkinto a restaurant and say, oh,
this could be this if we didthis strategy to get there and
we built this business this waywith the right people.
But I'm pretty far away from awoo.
I'm easy on people, tough onstandards.
(07:59):
If I have to fire you becauseyou can't figure it out and get
results or take feedback, thenyou can't play in the sandbox.
So that's definitely not thewoo side, that's the opposite
side of it.
But the relator and some ofthose other people pieces I have
.
But I also think there's a linein the sand on getting results
and making sure that the peoplethat are working with you are
driving them and having funalong the way.
(08:21):
But they should feel likethey're part of an A team and
you can't keep the as everybodyknows.
You can't keep the C and Dplayers because your A team
becomes less of that can't keepthe as everybody knows.
You can't keep the C and Dplayers because your A team
becomes less of that.
Speaker 1 (08:30):
So so what do you recommend?
Let's say that you've got someB players and what are some
signs of if they can make thatjump to being A players?
Because I think D and C playersthat's one thing right.
It's like we know that peoplethat aren't performing can't
keep it.
Speaker 2 (08:44):
Not a good fit for the business.
Speaker 1 (08:45):
But there are some B players where they're like, ah,
if they just did this, theywould be an A player.
How much do you put into thoseB players and how do you coach
them and how do you know if it'sjust not going to work
long-term, if they'll never bean A player?
Speaker 2 (09:00):
Very simple they can either take feedback and adjust,
or they can't.
Speaker 1 (09:04):
Interesting.
Speaker 2 (09:06):
So if I'm working with somebody in a role and they
want to get promoted and you'regiving them feedback on how to
get better and they don't writeit down and they don't follow up
with you and they're not comingto you with, hey, these are
things I'm working on, which, ofcourse, we have that in the
conversation, they don't getanywhere.
And I worked for a CEO once andI was getting in the car.
This was a large, publiclytraded company and I said why
(09:26):
are there some people you spendtime with versus others, and who
gets promoted versus not?
And he goes the people that cantake feedback.
And that's something I learnedfrom the famous Steve Carley who
turned around to play a localin Red Robin and that stuck with
me and he is absolutely 100percent right.
Speaker 1 (09:42):
Wow, that is powerful .
That is like knowledge bomb ofthe decade, because I think
that's such a great benchmark.
Can they adapt, can they adjust, even if your feedback might
not be totally right I think, asleaders, we're not going to be
right all the time, we're oftenwrong and can they go in that
(10:05):
direction and take that feedbackand at least say, yeah, that's
really good feedback as opposedto I know what I'm doing.
That's really interesting.
Speaker 2 (10:14):
And a lot of people can't take it and whether
they're a business owner and avendor's giving feedback like,
hey, this way.
And they're like, no, this ishow my product is, this is how
it works.
It's like, no, we need you tobend.
I think you do that really well.
You listen to what's going onand when I was talking about our
business, you're like this iswhat I could do, this is how we
can flex the model that'simportant for vendor
relationship and being ovationand being on the number one.
(10:37):
And then you go to otherproducts and they don't listen
and you hit a wall.
Or I get on the phone and thesalesperson will say I won't
even talk to the sales folks toomuch anymore.
I'll say I want to talk to theengineers because I'll find out
that the thing they were askingfor is 20 ranks down on the
engineer roadmap and they're notbeing honest.
And I said just give me theengineer's number Only because
(10:58):
of some of the advisory workI've done, I can see how both
sides of this work.
So I'm like I love you, butyou're not who I need to talk to
right now.
So you have to be firm and fair.
But I think taking feedback, atthe end of the day, is the
biggest thing.
People get stuck in their rolesand where they're at.
If they cannot adjust, they'renot adaptable and they can't
take the feedback.
Speaker 1 (11:16):
I mean, I was not expecting to get on and get a
masterclass on, you know,dealing with employees and team
members.
Speaker 2 (11:22):
I am not a girl that gives a masterclass.
Speaker 1 (11:24):
This is so spot on, because what we're talking about
is the root of the guestexperience, and, as we've said
numerous times on this podcast,the employee experience can
never exceed the guestexperience, and so I love that
we're starting with the lasttouch, which is the employees,
and you could do all of themarketing, all of the branding,
all of the decor, but if theperson delivering the food
(11:47):
doesn't have that joy, then it'snot going to be hospitality,
and, as Will Guterres talksabout, service is giving the
right food at the right time,the right temperature.
Hospitality is how the guestfeels about it, and I think that
this is what we're nailing.
But talk to me, though, aboutthe guest experience.
What are some things that youwould recommend restaurants do
(12:07):
to improve their guestexperience, other than I think
that you've nailed it on thehead of the employee experience?
What else about the guestexperience, though?
Speaker 2 (12:16):
The guest experience is all about our team, or a team
, reading the guest right.
Some people want to beconnected to and talk to.
Some people don't want to talkto anybody, they just want to
come in for a bite to eatinstead of the bar and have a
beer or a soda.
And then it's about making surethat the team is equipped with
the skill set to handle anysituation right.
(12:37):
So it's a lot of coaching.
It's a lot of pre-shiftscommunication.
What I have watched happen overthe years I am talking out both
sides of my head here is wagerates rose.
Everyone's struggling,especially in states like
California, illinois, where it'sreally tough to do business.
You see New York.
You see labor cuts right.
You go down to Texas.
(12:58):
You get better hospitalitybecause they have more staff on,
because the minimum wage canafford it.
So, as you're thinking throughhow do you do more with less,
you have to make sure that yourA players are trained right,
because now you don't have theluxury of having a C or D player
serve your guests because youcan only have so many people on
with the budgeting and trying tomake some money in the business
(13:20):
.
So it's important to constantlytrain.
I do think restaurants have gonesideways a little bit.
They paused, where there's moremom and pops than ever, but
they're not developing theirteams.
My son recently went to work ata pizza place.
I said, hey, how's the training?
They cut the training short.
How's the development going?
There's no development.
They throw him in All of asudden.
(13:40):
He turns 18, and now he's ashift manager.
And I just started laughing,because that is what's happening
with a lot of businesses.
If you want to pause and youwant to take a little bit of the
money that you might bespending somewhere else and
reroute it back into your peopleand invest in the teams, your
business will thrive longer andthe teams will be more, more
invested and they'll actuallywant to help you make money and
(14:01):
be successful.
But right now, instead of youbuilding slow to go fast,
everyone's going fast and thengoing faster and falling, and so
you see some of these conceptsstruggling a little bit or going
out of business and hats off tothem.
People are giving everythingthey've got right now the sweats
, tears and fuss, but those onesthat do have a little bit of
(14:22):
the money on the side.
You should be investing in thepeople and I think those are the
ones that thrive and will standout and hang for the long haul
through all of this.
Speaker 1 (14:30):
And I would say before you put dollars in
marketing, put dollars in yourpeople, put dollars in training,
Do not bring anybody in unlessyou are a raving fan yourself of
that location or that business.
Speaker 2 (14:42):
Absolutely not, and we've paused marketing.
We only approve certainlocations that are ready for it,
because we're not going tobring people in until we're
really running properly and thenI'll say, okay, turn on the
faucet, send some influencers inor whatnot, but don't send
anybody in right now.
We're missing a GM, or we'remissing a couple of key
components on some of ourmetrics that are important to us
(15:02):
.
Until we nail those, then theycan't get the extra push.
Speaker 1 (15:06):
Wow, that's powerful.
I mean, the theory is good, butit's cool that you're actually
doing that.
I mean we just signed up abrand.
They have a thousand locations,they're growing, they're doing
great.
Thank you.
But what was so cool was theycreated an entire internal doc
all about Ovation, telling theirentire company here's why we're
doing it, here's what we'redoing, here's exactly how every
(15:28):
little thing works about it.
And I went through that, I sentit to my team and I'm like
let's do this.
This is great.
We obviously have our trainingmaterials and stuff, but they
put together this entire programall about Ovation, have our
training materials and stuff,but they put together this
entire program all about Ovation.
And I was so impressed and itjust goes to show like they are
really investing in the guestexperience and they're investing
(15:49):
in their team and they'remaking sure that when they bring
on a vendor, it's not likegreat, the end is not the
signature, that is the beginning, and a lot of times it's a
partnership.
Exactly, but I feel like whathappens sometimes is the
signature comes in and thencertain restaurant brands
they'll be like, okay, great,now just do your thing, and I'm
like okay, but like we need topartner on this.
(16:10):
We're a tool and we need to beused, and so I would just
encourage everyone to thinkabout the vendors that they're
using and how can they get theirteams more engaged and how can
it make their team's liveseasier.
And I think most tools aredesigned to do that, but if you
don't use them correctly,they'll do the opposite.
Speaker 2 (16:30):
Well, if you don't deliver the message, explain the
how and the why, especiallywith the generation that is in
the workforce right now then youlose them.
And so the old schoolrestaurant leadership I think
was directive Now it's aboutparticipative and affiliative
leadership styles.
And how do you bring them along?
That's what's so critical isand nine times out of 10, they
have better answers than we,than I do, and so I'm like what
(16:50):
do you guys want to do here?
Here's the goal, here's thegoalpost.
How are we going to get there?
And each person leading ourmarket might have a different
way.
They need to align.
So we're all walking inlockstep.
But that's where you have to goslow to build properly.
And that's what that company isdoing right.
They're building slow.
They're making sure everybodyunderstands the program.
They're getting the buy-in.
That's the most important.
(17:11):
They get the buy-in.
Then they can go really fastwith the program and start
executing at a high rate.
I think that's great.
They're doing that.
Speaker 1 (17:18):
Amy, who deserves an ovation in the restaurant
industry, who is someone that weshould be following.
Speaker 2 (17:23):
I think you need to follow Stephen Mercer at
Mendocino Farms.
So Mendocino Farms is, ofcourse, in a growth state.
They've got some greatleadership over there, but
Stephen Mercer, who is one oftheir VPs, is a complete badass.
He has the west side of thestates.
I worked with him in a pastlife and is this leader that
everybody wants to follow.
Positive energy explains thewhy.
(17:46):
Has great, great listeningskills, very active listener and
people want to work for him.
So I'd give him a big ovation.
I think he deserves one.
He's had a long road and he'spretty resilient and he's got a
lot of grit, so very proud ofwhere he's at.
Speaker 1 (18:00):
Awesome.
Well, definitely a huge fan ofMendocino Farms and they've done
some amazing things.
But, amy, how do people findand follow you?
And Barcelona Wine Bar.
Speaker 2 (18:10):
Well, I'm on LinkedIn just like everybody else.
Speaker 1 (18:14):
But I do have to say you do post occasionally.
If you follow Amy, follow hercomments.
Her and Jim Mises, I think, aretwo people in the industry who
just leave the best comments onposts, because anyone could post
a thoughtful post.
But you, amy, you postthoughtful comments and so I
need to shout that out becausethat's something that so few
(18:35):
people do and you rock at it,but okay.
Speaker 2 (18:37):
Well, you got to think about it.
If you have an opportunity tofill somebody's bucket, why
wouldn't you?
So if it's somebody's birthdayor anniversary or just special
day, they have a specialaccomplishment.
Again, it's easy on people,tough on standards, and if they
deserve it, then we need topause for a minute, because life
is too short and our job is tofill each other's buckets at the
end of the day.
So we try to do that, we alltry to do that as best we can.
(18:59):
Life gets busy, but you shouldnever be too busy to give
somebody a little love.
Speaker 1 (19:03):
Love that and Barcelona Wine Bar.
Is it all the handles?
Barcelona Wine Bar.
Speaker 2 (19:08):
Yeah, barcelona Wine Bar.
We also have Corsica.
We have a second brand.
We're opening our secondlocation, reston Virginia, soon,
so that's going to be right bythe Reston Barcelona Wine Bar
right around the corner there.
So, yeah, we'll have our twobrands up and going and thriving
.
So, looking at some LOIs togrow and super excited If you've
not been in one.
Even if you don't drink, wehave great non-alcoholic
(19:30):
cocktails, mocktails, wine butwe have amazing chefs in every
location that create tapas andchange the menu every day.
So it's pretty cool.
Speaker 1 (19:37):
Super cool.
Well, amy, for teaching us thebarometer of how employees take
feedback and for just being alight in this industry.
Today's ovation goes to youbecause you deserve an ovation,
as it says on our hats.
Speaker 2 (19:49):
Love it.
Thank you so much.
You did too, Zach.
You give everybody ovationsback to you.
Speaker 1 (19:55):
Well, thank you for joining us on Give an Ovation,
Amy.
Speaker 2 (19:58):
Thanks, Zach.
Speaker 1 (19:59):
Thanks for joining us today.
If you liked this episode,leave us a review on Apple
Podcasts or your favorite placeto listen.
We're all about feedback here.
Again, this episode wassponsored by Ovation, a
two-question, sms-basedactionable guest feedback
platform built for multi-unitrestaurants.
If you'd like to learn how wecan help you measure and create
a better guest experience, visitus at OvationUpcom.
Welcome to another edition of Give an Ovation, the
restaurant guest experiencepodcast.
I'm your host, zach Oates, andeach week I chat with industry
experts to uncover theirstrategies and tactics you can
use to create a five-star guestexperience.
This podcast is powered byOvation, the feedback and
operations platform built formulti-unit restaurants.
It gives you all the insightsyou need, with none of the
(00:21):
annoying surveys for your guests.
Learn more at OvationUpcom.
And today is an honor because Ihave the distinguished Amy Hom
with us and if you don't knowher, that means you probably are
new in the restaurant industry.
So let me introduce you.
She's the COO of Barcelona WineBar.
She's board member on the GleanNetwork ResQ Lunchbox, former
(00:45):
COO of Bluestone Lane.
She was with Reef, sweetgreen,red Robin, wolfgang Puck, cpk.
I mean, amy, you have done itall and it's an honor to have
you here.
Speaker 2 (00:52):
Well, you're aging me , Zach.
Speaker 1 (00:54):
Oh, and she did three months at each of those brands.
Speaker 2 (00:59):
Sometimes it feels like that, but they were a
little longer than that.
Speaker 1 (01:02):
Yeah well, amy, you've had such a distinguished
career in this industry and soit's an honor.
For those of you who might notbe seeing our little clip, we
are wearing matching hats and,truly, amy, you deserve an
ovation because you've beendoing so many incredible things.
But we'll get to that in aminute.
First, I want to hear about you.
Have been deep in theoperations of restaurants, and
(01:26):
when you think about restaurantoperations, what are some things
when you go into a brand andyou're looking at low-hanging
fruit that you can get in andsay let's fix that.
What are some of the commonthings that you see that most
restaurants need to improve whenit comes to their operations?
Speaker 2 (01:42):
First off, we need to give an ovation for Zach, who's
been doing an extraordinary job, built this amazing platform.
I'm a big fan, so nice job, andI hope you get ovation
sometimes too.
Speaker 1 (01:52):
Oh well, thank you, amy.
Speaker 2 (01:53):
I'm just bummed, I didn't get a t-shirt, but that's
okay.
That's okay, I'll talk to yourpeople.
Speaker 1 (01:59):
And, all right, let's come to the booth.
We'll have a bunch of that.
All right, come to the booth.
Speaker 2 (02:01):
We'll have a bunch of that array.
Come to the booth.
That is where I picked up thislovely hat.
So some things you go into arestaurant and look for.
I don't think it's anydifferent than any other guest
Hospitality.
Are there smiling faces?
The team having fun is the mostimportant to me.
Clean, safe environment for theteam and for the food and the
vibe.
Everybody wants to be hangingout in a cool place with a cool
(02:30):
vibe, so but if the team's nothaving fun, I don't want to be
in there.
Speaker 1 (02:32):
So you got to have a really great climate and culture
for the team to be working in.
So I get that in theory, butyou have made a career out of
that and I think the teams thatyou've built and how people talk
about you as a leader isexceptional.
You have actually a great quoteon your LinkedIn oh, I just had
it pulled up because I lovethat.
But your backdrop of yourLinkedIn you talk about.
If your actions create a legacythat inspire others to dream
(02:53):
more, learn more, do more andbecome more, then you are an
excellent leader.
That's a Dolly Parton quote.
Love me some, dolly.
She's someone who works likenine to nine, not nine to five.
How do you do that inpracticality?
Because I think there's no onewho would disagree with you, but
the people who agree with you alot of them are still terrible
bosses.
So, like how do you create thatenvironment?
Speaker 2 (03:14):
I agree with.
There's some folks out therethat are not great for culture,
but culture creates greatresults, and so if you want to
create a climate of developmentwhere people you're literally
zoned in on that person, whatthey want to learn, what they
want to work on, you're givingthem that time, you're writing
it down, you're putting yourphone away and making it
intentional.
That's important.
We do heart checks.
(03:34):
A lot of people heard that.
I know Stacey Cain and some ofthe other folks in the industry
are now doing them with thefranchisees, which is awesome
and hilarious.
But question of the day is tolearn about people.
You can't get on a call andjust Zoom, like you and I were
chatting before this call.
It's like you're getting toknow each other.
You're still vibing, but yougot to make sure the teams are
doing okay.
More people are living alonethan ever these days.
(03:55):
Mental health is an issue, andthat's a lot of our team members
.
We're still the second largestemployer in the country when it
comes to restaurants, right pastunder the government there.
Well, that may have changed.
We might be the number one now.
Small dig there, but there's aneed for connection.
(04:15):
There's a need for connectionfor our teams and there's a need
for connection with the gueststhat walk into our restaurant
and if we can make, create anenvironment that leaves them
better than how they walked inor how we found them team
members, guests, vendors,everyone then you've got this
culture that people want tobelong to.
But you have to care.
And is it extra time?
Sure is.
Is it extra energy?
(04:36):
100%.
But you get back what you putin, and so we really strive to
do that and it's important.
And we just saw, and so wereally strive to do that, and
it's important, and we just sawwe were just doing our numbers
we just saw a 30% reduction inturnover.
That's training dollars, that'sall these things, since we've
all been on board doing thesethings of development planning
(04:56):
in 30, 60, 90s and having themread the first 90 days when they
join.
All these components, skillbuilding, practice sessions, all
these things tie into that.
One big thing, which isprobably one of the largest
costs behind labor and COGS, isthat retention and turnover
piece.
So it all comes down to do youwant to go to work when you wake
up in the morning?
I know you love what you dobecause it exudes when you walk
(05:18):
through, when I'm around you,like you just have this positive
ball of energy that everybodywants to be around Zach.
If they could be Zach when theygrow up they'd love to be.
Speaker 1 (05:28):
Well, maybe when you get to be my age, amy, I'll give
you some of the secrets.
Speaker 2 (05:32):
Your age, oh my gosh, anyway.
So it is what kind of energyyou bring into the business, and
so you might be having a badday, but you're leading troops
and nobody cares.
So you have to care more aboutthem than you do about yourself.
Speaker 1 (05:43):
Yeah, let's get a little deeper, because I think
this is so great and I thinkthat, as a leader, you're
someone who I've always seentalk about, someone who lights
up a room.
You go in and you have suchpositive, fun energy.
I remember the first time thatwe actually met, we were at a
dinner and sitting next to eachother and I was just cracking up
.
You just make everyone aroundyou happy, but even the great
(06:07):
Amy Hom has a bad day every nowand again.
As a leader, what's some advicethat you have to still bring it
, still bring the positivity andthat great energy, even when
you're not feeling it.
Speaker 2 (06:19):
I don't not feel it and I'll tell you why.
When you look at and this maysound so dramatic and it
probably is to some peoplelistening, but I'm very grateful
my arms and legs work rightnow- and I'm happy I get to wake
up in a bed.
And it depends on if you don'tdo gratitude or think about
those things.
You can go down a rabbit holepretty quick because there's a
lot of stuff in the world that'sjust crazy and can bring you
(06:42):
down, and there's so much goodin the world that we're still
living in.
And so I grew up in a crazyarea in St Louis and I'm very
fortunate to live out inCalifornia Not that there's
anything wrong with St Louis,but where I grew up and a lot of
the people that know me from mychildhood agree not a great
place where we all grew up.
But now I'm living a dream thatI never thought that I could be
(07:04):
Now.
Did I get here and push myself?
Yes, I'm a learner.
I'm big on strength finders.
I'm big on development.
Somebody asked me today what'sone thing you're trying to focus
on this year, and it's alwaysseeking knowledge.
So if there's something I canlearn from someone, I will leech
myself onto that person, figureit out and, like spend time.
But you have to invest in whatyou want to do in life.
You've invested in your companyand building it and all of that
(07:24):
.
You've invested in your companyand building it and all of that
, and we're all trying to do thesame thing in our own way.
But things don't just happen toyou.
You have to actually go, chasethem and make them happen.
Speaker 1 (07:33):
So are you a woo Amy?
Speaker 2 (07:35):
I'm not a woo.
Speaker 1 (07:37):
No way.
Speaker 2 (07:38):
No, I'm still a realist.
I'm still a realist.
My number one is futuristic.
So I'm very much a visionary.
I can look at something or walkinto a restaurant and say, oh,
this could be this if we didthis strategy to get there and
we built this business this waywith the right people.
But I'm pretty far away from awoo.
I'm easy on people, tough onstandards.
(07:59):
If I have to fire you becauseyou can't figure it out and get
results or take feedback, thenyou can't play in the sandbox.
So that's definitely not thewoo side, that's the opposite
side of it.
But the relator and some ofthose other people pieces I have
.
But I also think there's a linein the sand on getting results
and making sure that the peoplethat are working with you are
driving them and having funalong the way.
(08:21):
But they should feel likethey're part of an A team and
you can't keep the as everybodyknows.
You can't keep the C and Dplayers because your A team
becomes less of that can't keepthe as everybody knows.
You can't keep the C and Dplayers because your A team
becomes less of that.
Speaker 1 (08:30):
So so what do you recommend?
Let's say that you've got someB players and what are some
signs of if they can make thatjump to being A players?
Because I think D and C playersthat's one thing right.
It's like we know that peoplethat aren't performing can't
keep it.
Speaker 2 (08:44):
Not a good fit for the business.
Speaker 1 (08:45):
But there are some B players where they're like, ah,
if they just did this, theywould be an A player.
How much do you put into thoseB players and how do you coach
them and how do you know if it'sjust not going to work
long-term, if they'll never bean A player?
Speaker 2 (09:00):
Very simple they can either take feedback and adjust,
or they can't.
Speaker 1 (09:04):
Interesting.
Speaker 2 (09:06):
So if I'm working with somebody in a role and they
want to get promoted and you'regiving them feedback on how to
get better and they don't writeit down and they don't follow up
with you and they're not comingto you with, hey, these are
things I'm working on, which, ofcourse, we have that in the
conversation, they don't getanywhere.
And I worked for a CEO once andI was getting in the car.
This was a large, publiclytraded company and I said why
(09:26):
are there some people you spendtime with versus others, and who
gets promoted versus not?
And he goes the people that cantake feedback.
And that's something I learnedfrom the famous Steve Carley who
turned around to play a localin Red Robin and that stuck with
me and he is absolutely 100percent right.
Speaker 1 (09:42):
Wow, that is powerful .
That is like knowledge bomb ofthe decade, because I think
that's such a great benchmark.
Can they adapt, can they adjust, even if your feedback might
not be totally right I think, asleaders, we're not going to be
right all the time, we're oftenwrong and can they go in that
(10:05):
direction and take that feedbackand at least say, yeah, that's
really good feedback as opposedto I know what I'm doing.
That's really interesting.
Speaker 2 (10:14):
And a lot of people can't take it and whether
they're a business owner and avendor's giving feedback like,
hey, this way.
And they're like, no, this ishow my product is, this is how
it works.
It's like, no, we need you tobend.
I think you do that really well.
You listen to what's going onand when I was talking about our
business, you're like this iswhat I could do, this is how we
can flex the model that'simportant for vendor
relationship and being ovationand being on the number one.
(10:37):
And then you go to otherproducts and they don't listen
and you hit a wall.
Or I get on the phone and thesalesperson will say I won't
even talk to the sales folks toomuch anymore.
I'll say I want to talk to theengineers because I'll find out
that the thing they were askingfor is 20 ranks down on the
engineer roadmap and they're notbeing honest.
And I said just give me theengineer's number Only because
(10:58):
of some of the advisory workI've done, I can see how both
sides of this work.
So I'm like I love you, butyou're not who I need to talk to
right now.
So you have to be firm and fair.
But I think taking feedback, atthe end of the day, is the
biggest thing.
People get stuck in their rolesand where they're at.
If they cannot adjust, they'renot adaptable and they can't
take the feedback.
Speaker 1 (11:16):
I mean, I was not expecting to get on and get a
masterclass on, you know,dealing with employees and team
members.
Speaker 2 (11:22):
I am not a girl that gives a masterclass.
Speaker 1 (11:24):
This is so spot on, because what we're talking about
is the root of the guestexperience, and, as we've said
numerous times on this podcast,the employee experience can
never exceed the guestexperience, and so I love that
we're starting with the lasttouch, which is the employees,
and you could do all of themarketing, all of the branding,
all of the decor, but if theperson delivering the food
(11:47):
doesn't have that joy, then it'snot going to be hospitality,
and, as Will Guterres talksabout, service is giving the
right food at the right time,the right temperature.
Hospitality is how the guestfeels about it, and I think that
this is what we're nailing.
But talk to me, though, aboutthe guest experience.
What are some things that youwould recommend restaurants do
(12:07):
to improve their guestexperience, other than I think
that you've nailed it on thehead of the employee experience?
What else about the guestexperience, though?
Speaker 2 (12:16):
The guest experience is all about our team, or a team
, reading the guest right.
Some people want to beconnected to and talk to.
Some people don't want to talkto anybody, they just want to
come in for a bite to eatinstead of the bar and have a
beer or a soda.
And then it's about making surethat the team is equipped with
the skill set to handle anysituation right.
(12:37):
So it's a lot of coaching.
It's a lot of pre-shiftscommunication.
What I have watched happen overthe years I am talking out both
sides of my head here is wagerates rose.
Everyone's struggling,especially in states like
California, illinois, where it'sreally tough to do business.
You see New York.
You see labor cuts right.
You go down to Texas.
(12:58):
You get better hospitalitybecause they have more staff on,
because the minimum wage canafford it.
So, as you're thinking throughhow do you do more with less,
you have to make sure that yourA players are trained right,
because now you don't have theluxury of having a C or D player
serve your guests because youcan only have so many people on
with the budgeting and trying tomake some money in the business
(13:20):
.
So it's important to constantlytrain.
I do think restaurants have gonesideways a little bit.
They paused, where there's moremom and pops than ever, but
they're not developing theirteams.
My son recently went to work ata pizza place.
I said, hey, how's the training?
They cut the training short.
How's the development going?
There's no development.
They throw him in All of asudden.
(13:40):
He turns 18, and now he's ashift manager.
And I just started laughing,because that is what's happening
with a lot of businesses.
If you want to pause and youwant to take a little bit of the
money that you might bespending somewhere else and
reroute it back into your peopleand invest in the teams, your
business will thrive longer andthe teams will be more, more
invested and they'll actuallywant to help you make money and
(14:01):
be successful.
But right now, instead of youbuilding slow to go fast,
everyone's going fast and thengoing faster and falling, and so
you see some of these conceptsstruggling a little bit or going
out of business and hats off tothem.
People are giving everythingthey've got right now the sweats
, tears and fuss, but those onesthat do have a little bit of
(14:22):
the money on the side.
You should be investing in thepeople and I think those are the
ones that thrive and will standout and hang for the long haul
through all of this.
Speaker 1 (14:30):
And I would say before you put dollars in
marketing, put dollars in yourpeople, put dollars in training,
Do not bring anybody in unlessyou are a raving fan yourself of
that location or that business.
Speaker 2 (14:42):
Absolutely not, and we've paused marketing.
We only approve certainlocations that are ready for it,
because we're not going tobring people in until we're
really running properly and thenI'll say, okay, turn on the
faucet, send some influencers inor whatnot, but don't send
anybody in right now.
We're missing a GM, or we'remissing a couple of key
components on some of ourmetrics that are important to us
(15:02):
.
Until we nail those, then theycan't get the extra push.
Speaker 1 (15:06):
Wow, that's powerful.
I mean, the theory is good, butit's cool that you're actually
doing that.
I mean we just signed up abrand.
They have a thousand locations,they're growing, they're doing
great.
Thank you.
But what was so cool was theycreated an entire internal doc
all about Ovation, telling theirentire company here's why we're
doing it, here's what we'redoing, here's exactly how every
(15:28):
little thing works about it.
And I went through that, I sentit to my team and I'm like
let's do this.
This is great.
We obviously have our trainingmaterials and stuff, but they
put together this entire programall about Ovation, have our
training materials and stuff,but they put together this
entire program all about Ovation.
And I was so impressed and itjust goes to show like they are
really investing in the guestexperience and they're investing
(15:49):
in their team and they'remaking sure that when they bring
on a vendor, it's not likegreat, the end is not the
signature, that is the beginning, and a lot of times it's a
partnership.
Exactly, but I feel like whathappens sometimes is the
signature comes in and thencertain restaurant brands
they'll be like, okay, great,now just do your thing, and I'm
like okay, but like we need topartner on this.
(16:10):
We're a tool and we need to beused, and so I would just
encourage everyone to thinkabout the vendors that they're
using and how can they get theirteams more engaged and how can
it make their team's liveseasier.
And I think most tools aredesigned to do that, but if you
don't use them correctly,they'll do the opposite.
Speaker 2 (16:30):
Well, if you don't deliver the message, explain the
how and the why, especiallywith the generation that is in
the workforce right now then youlose them.
And so the old schoolrestaurant leadership I think
was directive Now it's aboutparticipative and affiliative
leadership styles.
And how do you bring them along?
That's what's so critical isand nine times out of 10, they
have better answers than we,than I do, and so I'm like what
(16:50):
do you guys want to do here?
Here's the goal, here's thegoalpost.
How are we going to get there?
And each person leading ourmarket might have a different
way.
They need to align.
So we're all walking inlockstep.
But that's where you have to goslow to build properly.
And that's what that company isdoing right.
They're building slow.
They're making sure everybodyunderstands the program.
They're getting the buy-in.
That's the most important.
(17:11):
They get the buy-in.
Then they can go really fastwith the program and start
executing at a high rate.
I think that's great.
They're doing that.
Speaker 1 (17:18):
Amy, who deserves an ovation in the restaurant
industry, who is someone that weshould be following.
Speaker 2 (17:23):
I think you need to follow Stephen Mercer at
Mendocino Farms.
So Mendocino Farms is, ofcourse, in a growth state.
They've got some greatleadership over there, but
Stephen Mercer, who is one oftheir VPs, is a complete badass.
He has the west side of thestates.
I worked with him in a pastlife and is this leader that
everybody wants to follow.
Positive energy explains thewhy.
(17:46):
Has great, great listeningskills, very active listener and
people want to work for him.
So I'd give him a big ovation.
I think he deserves one.
He's had a long road and he'spretty resilient and he's got a
lot of grit, so very proud ofwhere he's at.
Speaker 1 (18:00):
Awesome.
Well, definitely a huge fan ofMendocino Farms and they've done
some amazing things.
But, amy, how do people findand follow you?
And Barcelona Wine Bar.
Speaker 2 (18:10):
Well, I'm on LinkedIn just like everybody else.
Speaker 1 (18:14):
But I do have to say you do post occasionally.
If you follow Amy, follow hercomments.
Her and Jim Mises, I think, aretwo people in the industry who
just leave the best comments onposts, because anyone could post
a thoughtful post.
But you, amy, you postthoughtful comments and so I
need to shout that out becausethat's something that so few
(18:35):
people do and you rock at it,but okay.
Speaker 2 (18:37):
Well, you got to think about it.
If you have an opportunity tofill somebody's bucket, why
wouldn't you?
So if it's somebody's birthdayor anniversary or just special
day, they have a specialaccomplishment.
Again, it's easy on people,tough on standards, and if they
deserve it, then we need topause for a minute, because life
is too short and our job is tofill each other's buckets at the
end of the day.
So we try to do that, we alltry to do that as best we can.
(18:59):
Life gets busy, but you shouldnever be too busy to give
somebody a little love.
Speaker 1 (19:03):
Love that and Barcelona Wine Bar.
Is it all the handles?
Barcelona Wine Bar.
Speaker 2 (19:08):
Yeah, barcelona Wine Bar.
We also have Corsica.
We have a second brand.
We're opening our secondlocation, reston Virginia, soon,
so that's going to be right bythe Reston Barcelona Wine Bar
right around the corner there.
So, yeah, we'll have our twobrands up and going and thriving
.
So, looking at some LOIs togrow and super excited If you've
not been in one.
Even if you don't drink, wehave great non-alcoholic
(19:30):
cocktails, mocktails, wine butwe have amazing chefs in every
location that create tapas andchange the menu every day.
So it's pretty cool.
Speaker 1 (19:37):
Super cool.
Well, amy, for teaching us thebarometer of how employees take
feedback and for just being alight in this industry.
Today's ovation goes to youbecause you deserve an ovation,
as it says on our hats.
Speaker 2 (19:49):
Love it.
Thank you so much.
You did too, Zach.
You give everybody ovationsback to you.
Speaker 1 (19:55):
Well, thank you for joining us on Give an Ovation,
Amy.
Speaker 2 (19:58):
Thanks, Zach.
Speaker 1 (19:59):
Thanks for joining us today.
If you liked this episode,leave us a review on Apple
Podcasts or your favorite placeto listen.
We're all about feedback here.
Again, this episode wassponsored by Ovation, a
two-question, sms-basedactionable guest feedback
platform built for multi-unitrestaurants.
If you'd like to learn how wecan help you measure and create
a better guest experience, visitus at OvationUpcom.
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