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May 2, 2024 37 mins

How do you set boundaries with difficult people? It's a tough question, but in this episode, Tori and Chanel break it down and talk about how to do it! From the recommendation of Chanel's therapist, the girls discuss insights from a chapter in the book: Set Boundaries, Find Peace by Nedra Glover Tawwab. They reflect on what constitutes a difficult person, what a boundary is, and what fair boundaries look like. The girls also answer questions like are all boundaries good boundaries? 
From people-pleasing to the importance of open communication and self-reflection in setting and maintaining boundaries, this episode is packed with useful tips and perspectives. Tori and Chanel also share personal experiences and examples of setting boundaries, such as asking a friend to take down an unflattering photo on social media. We remember the early days of Facebook! They also discuss common reasons why people may not respect boundaries, such as not stating needs or expectations clearly. Overall, the conversation emphasizes the importance of setting and maintaining boundaries for personal growth and healthy relationships.

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Episode Transcript

Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Tori (00:20):
Hi friends, hello and welcome back to Glad we Talk
podcast.
I'm Tori, I'm Chanel.
Chanel, you sent me an articlethis week, or a chapter from a
book from your therapist, andit's very interesting yeah.

Chanel (00:36):
I had a session like two weeks ago and I was talking to
my therapist about a difficultperson in my life that it's kind
of like hard to set boundarieswith them.
She was, you know, obviouslydoing her therapist thing,
giving me advice, but for myhomework she was like I want to
send you this chapter from abook.
It's by Nedra Glover Tawwab andit's a book on boundaries, and

(00:59):
the chapter that she sent me isspecifically about setting
boundaries with difficult people.
So I read it and I just thoughtit was really good.
I took a lot away from it and Iwanted to share it with you
because I know we both have likeissues setting boundaries with
people in general then, letalone if the person's difficult.
So we just thought it would beinteresting to talk about today
and like what constitutes adifficult person when you're

(01:21):
setting a boundary, what aboundary is?
What are fair boundaries?

Tori (01:24):
Yeah, this is a really good topic and I was excited
when you sent me this because,it's true, we all struggle with
difficult people, whether it'sin our personal or professional
life, and I think we whether wethink of someone right now when
you're talking about difficultpeople and how it is to set
boundaries or maybe we'veexperienced it in the past I
think this will resonate with alot of our friends, so I think
we're just going to hop into ittoday.

Chanel (01:46):
Yeah, no, no fluff today , we're just getting into it.

Tori (01:49):
No, no fluff just pure advice from Chanel's therapist,
from us.

Chanel (01:56):
Hi, we're doing fine.
How are you?
How are you?
Great, moving on.

Tori (02:01):
That was outstanding items .
Great job, Chanel.
So in the article you sent me,I keep calling it an article In
this chapter from the book thatyou just referenced.

Chanel (02:09):
I'm sorry, I'm sorry the amount of times you've called
it an article and I'm like it'snot a standalone article.

Tori (02:16):
It's because I don't read books.
Yeah, in this chapter, theexample that we were given of a
hard person to set boundarieswith was this son and his father
, and his father would call himwhen he was drunk, and the son
didn't like this.
I don't know if it was adrinking problem Unclear, I
can't remember that part but theson didn't like it, and so he

(02:38):
decided to work with histherapist on setting this
boundary.
So this is just like oneexample of a difficult person.
But I think, like you saidearlier, there's so many
different difficult people like,especially in your situation,
like the person you're dealingwith.
Probably it might not bedrinking, but it could be
something else.

Chanel (02:56):
Yeah, and I think we all have kind of learned what a
boundary is at this point.
Like we know, a boundary islike setting.
We're going to talk a littlebit more about like what we
think a fair boundary is later.
But for all intents andpurposes, boundary is something
that you set for yourself tomake you you yourself feel more
comfortable and you know yourown limits.
And it's something that you setfor yourself with other people

(03:17):
to make sure that they'rerespecting you in the way that
you want to be respected andtreated.
So in the book she talks about,like you said, setting
boundaries with difficult peopleand she gives some examples of
what it can be like when someoneis difficult, when you're
trying to set a boundary.

Tori (03:31):
This can be really difficult when you're setting a
boundary with someone thatdoesn't either recognize the
need for this boundary or whatthey're doing wrong.
I think that could be reallyhard, and it gets into these
points that you're going to talkabout in a second, about what
that could be like in theprocess of navigating this new
boundary with a difficult person.

Chanel (03:52):
Right.
So she says like a few examplesof being difficult when you try
to set a boundary, someone whopushes back, they basically like
ignore that you even mentioneda boundary and continue doing
what you want.
She talks about people who testyour limits.
So they'll try and like sneakor manipulate or get one past
you and do it in a way that youmight not notice.

Tori (04:12):
Like they'll pretend like you never set the boundary, like
they'll just ignore it.

Chanel (04:16):
That one is the pushback one and then the testing, the
limit one is kind of like I'mgoing to do this but you're not
going to know I'm doing this.
I'm going to do this, but you'renot going to know I'm doing
this, I'm going to be likereally sneaky and manipulative
about it.
Oh, they're going toconsciously try to work around
and circumvent this boundary,yeah, and they kind of take
advantage of you in a way.
Oh, I see the difference here,yeah.

(04:36):
And then another one she saysis like they rationalize and
question you, like theychallenge the reason for your
boundary and its validity, andthat one I feel like a lot of
people can do if you're notsomeone who sets boundaries.
Often they kind of takeadvantage of you like oh well,
you've never set a boundary inthe past, why are you all of a
sudden setting a boundary?
You can set a boundary wheneveryou want.

Tori (04:59):
Right, just because there was an instance of bad behavior
before and you let it go,doesn't mean you have to
continue to let it happen, liketheir bad behavior isn't the
means and like you, accepting itonce or twice doesn't mean like
that's the pattern that shouldcontinue exactly, and maybe you
talk to your therapist and nowyou wanted to stop.

Chanel (05:16):
So, yeah, exactly.
Um.
Another example she gives islike defensiveness.
So if you try and set aboundary and they challenge what
you said or your character ormake excuses about how their
behavior is okay, um, so theyjust get really defensive and
they're like, well, I don't seehow this is a problem or, um, I
don't see like what I'm doing iswrong.
Like they just get reallydefensive and kind of like

(05:38):
attack you for setting up yourboundary.

Tori (05:40):
Basically, this is the one that makes the most sense for
me and I think the one that I'vemost commonly experienced is
like when you address something,it's like it feels critical and
yeah, I mean you kind of arecalling them out for their
what's not working for you, butthey get defensive and they're
like, well, what's wrong with me, like this, and they can kind
of gaslight you and intothinking like it's okay, like I

(06:02):
think the defense is the primarything that we all experience.

Chanel (06:07):
Yeah, I feel like gaslighting could fall under
this one, because it's kind oflike making you feel like you're
wrong for calling them out.
They get really defensive.
They're like well, I don't seehow what you feel is more
important, you know, they justlike make excuses for their
behavior and just pretend thateverything's okay, when really
it's not as we're going throughthis list.

Tori (06:28):
I'm thinking of you people specifically.

Chanel (06:31):
And like no one that listens to the podcast guys like
all friends, listening it's notabout you guys.

Tori (06:36):
So just rest assured.
But like I'm thinking aboutlike past people and wow, it's
bringing up some feelings.

Chanel (06:43):
This is a little triggering, yeah.
And then the last way that shesays someone can be difficult is
the silent treatment.
So they'll stop talking to youbecause they didn't like what
you said.
And a lot of people she wrotedo this in hopes that you take
back your boundary.
Because imagine, you set thisboundary, someone's giving you
the silent treatment.
They're not talking to you.

(07:04):
You're like I feel really bad.
I said it Now, I ruined ourfriendship, I ruined our
relationship, I ruined whateveryou had going on, and then you
feel bad all of a sudden.
That's another form ofgaslighting.
All of a sudden you feel badnow for setting a boundary for
yourself, because now they'remad at you and they're giving
you the silent treatment, givingyou the same treatment, and

(07:27):
something I read later in thischapter.
Was that you?

Tori (07:28):
shouldn't apologize while you're setting this boundary and
like you know, if someone'sdefensive and like you're
starting to feel guilty, like oh, should I have done this?
And you feel like you'rehurting their feelings, like
it's important not to apologizewhen you're setting this
boundary because that kind ofjust values the boundary you're
setting and showing that youcare and listen.
I think this is really toughbecause you and I both, I think

(07:49):
we say, oh, I'm sorry, justaccidentally you know what I
mean.
It's like, oh sorry, I'mbreathing, like it's just
something that, like a lot ofwomen do, they apologize for
taking up space, and I think notapologizing is so key in
setting boundaries, likestanding your ground and not
being like oh I'm so sorry, butlike hey, I gotta like call this

(08:11):
out.

Chanel (08:12):
You have to be like really confident and firm yeah,
and a lot of what she says inthe chapter is like making sure
that you stand by your boundaryonce you set it.
A big part of it is like notgoing back.
If you set a boundary andyou're letting it slide, then
they're going to think it's okaysometimes.
So it's really hard to assertthe boundary when you're letting

(08:32):
it slide sometimes and notother times.
So, yeah, you have to standfirm in it.
She also gives like statementsthat you can use, which I found
to be a little for me like alittle weird, because she says
to you like I want and I needstatements, I need you to stop
calling me when you're drunk.
And another one she says is Iexpect, like I expect you to

(08:55):
stop calling me when you'redrunk.
And that one I was struggledwith.
I was like I can't picturemyself saying I expect.
I feel like it's so unnatural,like I don't know, like I don't
know for you if you felt thatway, kind of reading through it,
but like I don't set boundariesoften because of my people
pleasing tendencies.
So I just felt like when I wasreading through it I was like I

(09:15):
feel like this would be sounnatural, and I told my
therapist that as well.
I was like reading through this.
It just felt like somethingthat I wouldn't feel totally
comfortable doing.

Tori (09:25):
Yeah, it's funny that you just said people pleasing, and
you know, as I was thinkingabout this word, I, or this
phrase, I expect because I thinkit could be hard to be honest,
like you can't presume thatsomeone's expectations are your
expectations, like, and it's,you know, I guess it has to be
very and this is kind of whatwe're talking.
Know, I guess it has to be veryand this is kind of what we're

(09:46):
talking about.
The boundary has to be likevalid, like there has to be a
real reason for this boundary,and then we're going to talk
about what we at least thinkmakes grounds for a boundary.
Like it's not fair, I think, tosay like well, I'd expect you
to just know what I was on mymind, like that's not.
I think you know what I mean,because we're mind reading and

(10:06):
stuff like that.
Like, or you know, sometimeswhen that guilt feeling comes up
and you know, mom, I'm notsaying this to you, but when
you're a parent has anexpectation of you and you don't
meet that expectation, andmaybe it's right or wrong, but
you don't know, and it could bethat the expectation isn't fair,

(10:28):
that's being set and you'reexpecting, so I don't know.
Net, net is.
I feel weird about that one,just like you do.

Chanel (10:34):
Yeah, agreed, I feel like it could be a really big
gray area because people cankind of use it to their
advantage rather than reallyusing it for a valid boundary,
like in the book she says, oneof the statements she uses for I
expect is I expect you toreturn my car with a full tank
of gas.
Like that, I feel like it's agood.
It's a good I expect is Iexpect you to return my car with
a full tank of gas.
Like that, I feel like is agood.

(10:54):
It's a good I expect maybebecause if you're going, to lend
your car to someone.
Yeah, I expect you to return itwith a full tank of gas, but,
like you said, I expect you toread my mind, or I expected you
to know.
That that was going to upset meis a really hard statement to
use with a boundary, becauseyou're putting these
expectations on someone thatmaybe they can't fulfill.

Tori (11:14):
Yeah, the gas is a really good tangible example.
You know I can see that youdon't want to be stranded.
So, like this is and it'ssomething easy, like hey, if, if
you're gonna, if you're goingto lend me 20 bucks, I expect to
be returned.
I think that's that to berepaid.
I think that's fair.
But like I would have expectedyou to know better, it's kind of

(11:36):
like, well, what if it was anaccident?
Like exactly.
It depends on age and everythingyou know like.
I don't know if Mitch came hometoday and I said I would have
expected flowers.

Chanel (11:46):
I think it would be not fair, I expected you to come
home with flowers.
He's like oh sorry, I need youto come home with flowers.
And he's like oh sorry, I needyou to come home with flowers.

Tori (11:58):
I think this is fair today and it's, um, I think I need.
It gives you a position to showwhat your needs are and it
helps explain the boundary more.
You know like, for example, Ineed space If, If you just need
time to process something,that's a need, you need space.
You're communicating that.
You're not saying I would haveexpected space, Like that's

(12:19):
making someone guess that youneeded space, you know.

Chanel (12:23):
Yeah, I think that's why she gives the three statements,
because it's like I guess,depending on the situation,
which one feels the mostrelevant to use.
Like if you were to say toMitch, like I need you to bring
me home flowers on days that I'mupset, maybe that's like a good
way to say it versus like Iexpect you to bring home flowers
on days that I'm upset, I dofeel like that, I expect, is a

(12:47):
little bit more not demanding,but a little bit more clear cut
and I think it has to be like avery tangible, like valid reason
for using that statement.
So that is fair to both parties.

Tori (13:00):
Yeah, I agree 100%.
The other thing that you saidwas the people pleasers that I
wanted to touch on.
I think a lot of thought andtime, and maybe therapy or just
processing, goes into settingboundaries.
Especially if you're a peoplepleaser, especially if you're
more empathetic, a sensitiveperson, someone that's not
really outspoken, maybe a littlebit more timid or shy, this can

(13:23):
be really difficult for you.
I know I felt that way,especially with my anxiety and
just like not wanting to upsetpeople.
I always want to do the rightthings and often think about
myself second and what otherpeople would want first.
So I could see this beingreally difficult for people that
haven't practiced it, and somaybe these tools really help
her and especially like you.

(13:43):
Like it's almost like buildingthat confidence to be able to
say I need this.

Chanel (13:50):
Yeah, because I think, if you think about it, there are
people who are probably reallygood at setting boundaries, like
.
I know people in my life whoare very clear cut and who set
boundaries and who, if we'retrying to make plans, they're
like I'm sorry, I can't, andthey don't give explanation.
They're just like I'm sorry, Ican't, and that's such a good
boundary to have.
Like there's no need to explainyourself.
Like if you can't do something,you can't do something.

(14:11):
If you're not available, you'renot available.
You're putting yourself firstand it's really hard to do.
I feel like there are people whoare really good at it and there
are people who struggle with ita little bit.
And I think she gives someexamples in the book of like if
you do set a boundary, how areways that you can like make sure
you stay firm and reinstate it?
So one of the ways that which weboth talked about is just like

(14:32):
assertively, restate it, like ifit happens again just the same
thing, you use the samestatements, you use, you know
you say the same thing again andjust make sure that you stand
firm, like we were saying.
Another one she says is likecorrect it in real time, don't
let the opportunity pass andthen mention it later, say it in
the moment, which I thought wasinteresting, and I mentioned
that to my therapist and sheactually had a kind of a

(14:55):
different take Cause she waslike.
She was like well, I do agreewith everything that Joe was
saying in the book.
She was like sometimes peopleare really emotional in the
moment and if it's a boundarythat you're trying to set that
makes you emotional sometimes inthe moment, you may say it to
someone in a way that you don'tmean, so like you can be like
meaner or more rude about it.
She was like sometimes I justadvise maybe taking a second

(15:17):
before you say something.

Tori (15:19):
Yeah, I think you have to really be able to read the
situation and the scenario, like, if you're the one setting the
boundary, most of it's on you,right, you're going to feel
anxious about it because thisperson probably doesn't see it
coming.
So you're probably going towant to do it at the right time.
And I could definitely say, ifit's in a heated argument,

(15:42):
someone getting really defensiveand it just blowing up and not
really happening, you know it'sjust the stakes are higher than
I could see where you reallyhave to make make sure you're
doing at the right time.

Chanel (15:54):
Yeah, and then another thing she was saying as well as
like people are entitled totheir response, so that you, so
you have to accept that youcan't expect everyone to, just
because you set a boundary,agree with you Like they're
entitled to their own feelingsas well, right, you, you almost
have to.

Tori (16:10):
you have to prepare yourself, and I think she says
this as well.
You have to prepare yourselfwith whatever the outcome is
going to be, because it mightnot be what you think.
It's not going to all be honkydory sometimes and maybe
sometimes it goes better thanyou expected, you know.
But you, you really have tomanage your expectations and how
this outcome comes when you'resetting the boundary and you
have to be kind of like preparedfor fallout or you know,

(16:34):
whatever comes, with that?

Chanel (16:36):
Yeah, I think so too, and like you have to understand
that, like you're, differentpeople, like they're not gonna
maybe understand your boundaryright away, especially if you're
not used to setting them.
So you have to give a periodfor both people to get like used
to this.
I'm sure, like for you knowyourself if you're not used to
setting boundaries, and then theother person if they're not

(16:57):
used to this dynamic in yourrelationship.

Tori (17:00):
Yeah, the other thing is like I, we've talked about this
before in our friendship episodewhen we had friendship breakups
, like sometimes people just setso many boundaries you know, so
it's like I think thisacclimation period makes sense
when, like you're, the boundaryhas been set and people are
working on it Right.

(17:20):
But sometimes people are justsetting boundaries left and
right and it's almost a hard totell what is a fair boundary.

Chanel (17:27):
I completely agree and I think I mean listen, it's great
, everyone's going to therapy,right?
I think it's.
It's awesome that everyone'slike not everyone, but most
people are like self-aware andthat they're like I should get
therapy, I should talk to atherapist.
But I think in that a lot ofpeople are maybe telling their
side of the stories to theirtherapists, right, and then

(17:49):
their therapist is like okay,well, you're right, and this is
what you need to do and you needto set a boundary about this.
And then I feel like somewhereit gets lost.
So I think a lot of timeseither number one, people are
reading like articles or booksand misinterpreting things,
right, and they're like I, thisis my boundary now, and it's
like that's not a real boundary.
And then two like I thinksometimes people go into therapy

(18:10):
and they're just like tellingtheir sides of the story and
they're just getting validityfrom their therapist and it
might be very one-sided.

Tori (18:17):
I think that's a really good point you make because,
again, one-sided stories,there's always two sides and
like I feel like sometimespeople neglect the parts that
make them look bad to theirtherapist if you're not 100%
open.
Like%.
I feel, like I'm very honestwith my therapist, I really try
to just put everything out thereprobably TMI, even for a

(18:38):
therapist.
I'm just like I want you toevaluate the full situation.
But, like you said, some peopleare just looking for validation
and I don't know if a therapistcan see through that or not.

Chanel (18:50):
I guess it depends on the therapist.
Yeah, wow.
But but I also think it's likeare you like having like a life
bulb?
You're like Hmm.

Tori (19:01):
I, I am.
It's just like I hope peopleare self-aware, Can't work on
these problems, and just it'slike not getting to the core
problem, which really upsets me.
Like if you're in therapy,that's step one, that's great,
but you have to be willing to dothe work and do the
self-reflection it takes and notjust say I need to set better

(19:22):
boundaries, but also what areyou doing to help the situation?
You know, like we we, you and Ihad a difficult conversation
yesterday.
We just had a typical ToriChanel fight, a little rift,
nothing major, but we weretalking through it in such a
thoughtful way that I was likewow, we both have really done

(19:42):
the work.
You know, we we've reflected onthis.
We see where we went wrong,where we could do better, and
we're opening to open tolistening to each other.
And that's what comes when youhave two people that are really
dedicated on becoming betterpeople and evolving.
And did we set boundariesyesterday?

Chanel (19:58):
No, no, it wasn't like that, it was just like hearing
each other out.
But I think you're right, beingopen to listening to each other
is like the most important part.
Like, even when there weredifficult things that are like
hard to hear, we still like heareach other out and we still
give each other the space torespond.
And then we still respondthoughtfully and we talk to each
other with respect, first ofall.
And when you were saying thething about like um, telling

(20:21):
your therapist everything, liketmi, I'm like I, I try and do
that too because I want her tosee, I want her to see
everything so that I get themost out of it.
Like I remember telling hersomething and I I was like yeah,
and then, you know, honestly, Iwas pretty passive, aggressive
in that moment, like I don'twant to be like that.
And she was like, well, I'm,I'm glad that you know, you
noticed that about yourself.

(20:41):
And I'm like, no, yeah, I do.
I'm pretty self-aware.
And I remember another time,like my old therapist, I was
telling her a story that I toldit was like that meme.
That's like when you googlesymptoms of toxic man and you
find out you're the toxic one.
I was like I love that.
I was like telling her aboutsomething with me and Martin and
I was like, yeah, so like whenI get ready and like I'm like
blah blah, she's like well, howdo you think that feels for him?

(21:04):
I'm like, all right, you knowwhat you got me there.
Yeah, so it's just funnybecause, like I really what I
like to your point, like I wasbeing honest and like because of
that I got the feedback that Ireally needed.
And I think that's what maybesome people I'm not saying
everyone, just some people mightbe lacking is, is that like
honesty piece of like makingthemselves look bad sometimes in

(21:25):
order?
to move forward and set correctboundaries that make sense and
that are fair to your firstpoint.

Tori (21:31):
Yeah, wow, this was a light bulb moment for me, for
sure.

Chanel (21:36):
I know Cause?
We definitely know.

Tori (21:38):
Yeah, I'm really, I'm really glad we just talked that
part, that part out.
It really like wow.

Chanel (21:44):
Um, so, like in your opinion, what is like a fair
boundary, like?
What do you think is likesomething that makes sense to
you?

Tori (21:52):
What do you think is something that makes sense to
you?
Yeah, okay, I think, and I knowyou and I kind of are on the
same path, but I think the fairboundary is when something is
affecting a person's well-being,their safety, their time, their
availability, their mentalhealth, their privacy, kindness,
empathy, anything like thatreally is when you need to think

(22:15):
about boundaries, because thatthat that affects the whole
being.
It's like those really corethings to who you are and that
kind of sacred space.
I think that's where boundariesshould be set if necessary.
What about, like?
I know you feel similar, butlike, do you have anything to
add to that?

Chanel (22:34):
I think that's good.
Like your sacred space um, Ilike all the words you used
because it's like like safety,like taking advantage of your
empathy, like that kind of goesinto the manipulation part that
she was talking about withpeople.
Like manipulating you, likeanything that takes advantage of
like who you are as a person iskind of a fair boundary to set,

(22:54):
because I know that there arepeople who like set bad.
I mean, I don't want to saylike anyone's boundaries are bad
, but there are boundariessometimes that you're just like,
is that really a boundary?
Like, are you sure?
Like, are you being a littleunfair, are you being a little
defensive, or is that actually aboundary?
And maybe you're the personbeing difficult when another

(23:16):
person's trying to set aboundary.
Like I think we have to be alittle bit aware of the
boundaries that we're settingand make sure they kind of like
hit on these pillars of like isthis affecting my well being?
Like, I wish there was like alist of questions to ask
yourself when setting a boundary, you know maybe there is that
would be good there might be.
Is this affecting my mentalhealth?
Is this affecting my privacy?

(23:37):
My space Like a list ofquestions before you move
forward with setting theboundary to make sure that it's
fair to everybody.

Tori (23:45):
Yeah, and I think, like you're saying, like, assess the
situation and sometimes, if youhave to cross a boundary to you
know, and is that boundary beingcrossed because it's necessary,
because it's affecting someoneelse's safety, wellbeing, health
, um, you know, I, I think anexample this is a complete dire

(24:06):
like this is the most clearexample for me is that, say,
someone is like a predator,right, and they're like, well,
it's my privacy, so youshouldn't be able to check my.
I mean, these are why we havelaws and everything, but you
can't come onto my property,blah, blah, blah.
Then, like, if you see, if youknow this is happening, you have

(24:27):
to cross that privacy boundarybecause children and women and
people's well-being are at stake.
So I think those are okay times, like legally, you know, these
are the instances and they'rethe really drastic instances,
but there are people that willdefend those boundaries and it's
, you know, it's crazy, but theydo it.

Chanel (24:52):
Yeah, yeah, that's.
That's a good example.
Very dark, but I agree with you.
It has to be like in a case oflike, like even in therapy
they're always like if you tellme you're gonna harm yourself or
someone else, then I have to,unfortunately, like cross our
boundary that we have of privacyand tell someone right, so it's
the same thing right right.

Tori (25:11):
it comes down to the well-being of an individual, I
think these boundaries so youand I also had a little bit of a
hard time actually figuring outlike what would be a relatable
and real boundary for us, andyou came up with a really good
example, oh, yeah, well, I waslike we were just joking around,
but I was like if I asked myfriend to take down a bad photo

(25:36):
of me on their Instagram or likeremember back in the day in
college and people used to liketag you in photos on.

Chanel (25:42):
Facebook.

Tori (25:44):
Facebook was the wild wild west.

Chanel (25:46):
Yeah, Like, can you untag me from this horrible
picture that you took of meRight?
Like for me that's a boundary.
Like I don't want myselflooking horrid and like a
gremlin on the internet.
Like can you please take thisdown?
This is like a public space.
If my friends, like my friends,always were like, oh my gosh,
no, you're being dramatic.
But yes, of course, Like theywould either crop me out or they

(26:14):
would take it down, or theywould untag me, whatever it was.

Tori (26:16):
But imagine someone was like no, it's my, it's my
facebook I'm gonna leave thisphoto of you up because I think
that I look nice.
Yeah, what, yeah, like it couldbe.

Chanel (26:20):
So you think that's a little crazy I agree.

Tori (26:23):
I think, like you know, if it's, if it's you in the
picture and you don't want itthere, get rid of it.
If you're a friend, you shouldsay, ok, I will take that down
gladly.
But there are people that willdefend it, like you're saying.

Chanel (26:40):
They'll be like it's my social media.

Tori (26:43):
Yeah, so I think a compromise if this person's like
creating a boundary.
I guess one thing too, like,hey, can you ask me what are?

Chanel (26:59):
I would like for you to ask me before you post pictures
of me, right, that's how youwould set that boundary?
Oh yeah, no, you're right, wewould all review the photos
together in college and thenwe'd be like I that one, I hate
that one.
Please don't post that one.
This is the one that we alllook good in because, if you
think about it, when you'relooking at a photo right of a
group of girls, who do you lookat?
You look at yourself yourself.
You're not looking at anybodyelse and, of course, like we're

(27:22):
our own harshest critic, sowe're going to see the photo of
ourselves and be like, hate that, but like your friend's not
going to think you look ugly.
So you really have to set theboundary.
You really have to be the oneto speak up and say I don't like
this photo of me.
Can you please take it down?

Tori (27:34):
yeah, yeah, and next time, next steps.
Can you ask me before postinglike you know something.
Next steps I would haveexpected you to know.

Chanel (27:43):
I look terrible in that photo right, I expect it's
probably like not the way to gohere.
It's so dramatic.

Tori (27:51):
It's like I would have expected.
I love it.

Chanel (27:53):
It's the drama yeah, no, it's really.
I need you to take down thatgremlin photo of me before I
pass out and go into hiding.
Thank you.
I want you to get rid of thatphoto.
Yeah, hey, it works.
You know what?

Tori (28:06):
I mean, yeah, it really does.
Oh, that photo, yeah, hey, itworks you know, what I mean it
really does.
Oh, that brings me back to likethe Facebook days.

Chanel (28:14):
Yeah.

Tori (28:15):
I've definitely been that friend when it was like high
school when we were on Facebookthat like felt defensive.
When someone asked me like, afriend would say I don't look
good in that picture, can youtake it down?
Because like I like the pictureand like, so I know how that

(28:36):
feels.
Like I can empathize withsomeone that like has been asked
and like a boundary has beenset up.
But as an adult I understand itmore.

Chanel (28:39):
You know, I think as you mature you understand things a
little bit different so you'resaying you were the one who
looked good in the picture andposted the photo of the bad
friend and had to take it down?

Tori (28:50):
yeah, but I didn't know, she looked bad you know, like
right I didn't right, I didn'tknow.
But then they came back to meand said hey, I don't really
like this picture of me, do youmind taking it down?
And I felt bad because I lookedgood, like we're saying you
know, you look good.
Yeah, and I didn't think shelooked bad.
But there she was asking me totake it down and you know, this

(29:10):
was high school.
Now I don't care Like I,literally I'm the last person.
Like, if there's a picture ofme that looks bad, but if it's
not compromising, you know whatI mean.
Like for us it was always likedon't post pictures of alcohol,
Don't post because your job.

Chanel (29:23):
You know, I think it's funny that you have to like
sacrifice yourself.
I think it's funny that youhave to like sacrifice yourself
like you're you looking goodbecause your friend doesn't like
it.
Anyway, so just to wrap this upa little bit, from Nedra's book
and the chapter that we read, Ithink I wanted to kind of
mention like common reasons thatpeople don't respect boundaries

(29:43):
, and it could be externalfactors or it could be something
you did.
So I kind of wanted to talkabout these a little bit.
So some of them are like youaren't upholding your boundaries
, so, like we said, like you'reletting things slide.
You didn't speak in a firm tone,so maybe you said it jokingly
or you said it like in a waythat's like not serious and you
were just like, oh, I would justappreciate it if you did this.
You know, like too casual maybe.

(30:04):
Um, you didn't state a need orexpectation.
I mean, like we said, itdepends on the situation whether
you can say it's an expectationor not.
Um, your boundaries areflexible women.
If they're serious, the nextthey aren't.
Um, you assume people willself-correct even if you don't
tell them what you need or wantthat's kind of of like that's

(30:26):
mind reading.
Yep, yeah, you're right, causeyou're just like.
You should just know thatyou're.
What you're doing is bad, andthis is kind of a way that my
therapist said I was beingpassive aggressive, and the book
says it as well.
Someone does something youdon't like and you, you kind of,
are upset at them, but youdon't give them the reason why.
Obviously that's passiveaggressive, um, but that's

(30:46):
obviously not a way to deal withsomething and the person isn't
going to know that.
That's why you're upset at them, unless you talk to them.

Tori (30:53):
Yeah, I see passive aggressiveness as being a fear
or a cop out to actually doingthe work of setting a boundary.
You know like it's a waste oftime.
That's my issue.

Chanel (31:06):
It's a waste of time and energy, and this is what I'm
working through in therapy, andthis is yeah, this is what we're
talking about and then justsome other ones yeah, right, I'm
, she's self-aware yeah thankyou for being honest with us
you're so welcome, always, yeah,and then you believe that
stating your boundary onceshould be enough.

(31:27):
You apologize for havingboundaries and you issue
consequences and don't stick tothem, which we talked about.

Tori (31:35):
Listen, I think a lot of boundaries is like with Brody
training him Repetition,repetition.
Maybe some positivereinforcement, you know like,
hey, buddy, good job respectingthat boundary you want to treat.

Chanel (31:51):
I like that.
I mean, don't be like pets.
If only everyone treated peoplewith kindness.
No, I, I, I do understand whatyou're saying, though Like in a
like, not like weird way,because sometimes positive
reinforcement can just be like acompliment to someone who's

(32:11):
doing something good and likedoing behavior that you like,
versus always being negative youknow, I agree.

Tori (32:17):
I mean there are things like that I said I needed from
Mitch, or that I wanted and thatI came to expect from him.
I think, actually, I think it'slike need, want, expect, like,
because it's maybe the expect islike based on the boundary and
like repeating it.
You know what I mean.

Chanel (32:34):
Like based on like we've already talked about this need.

Tori (32:38):
Yeah, you know, like I expressed this need, I expressed
what I wanted, and I would haveexpected you, after 123 times,
to remember that.

Chanel (32:49):
I like that.
That's the reinforcement,that's like the you're
reinstating your boundaries oryou just need gas in your car,
but yes, or that, yeah, it'slike I need this, I want this,
and then, if you know, you'vestated it a few times, you can't
keep saying I need, I want.
It's like, at this point, I doexpect it can't keep saying I

(33:10):
need.
I want it's like at this point,I do expect it.
Yeah, no, I totally, totallyagree with that.
I'm with you.
Yeah, um, and I just don'tapologize for having boundaries.
No, we're just gonna end onthat.

Tori (33:19):
I did a TikTok on it one time, like I, when I stayed over
your apartment and I wasapologizing, and I was like I'm
sorry, I, I'm sorry you have toset up the futon for me or
whatever the sleep, the airmattress.
And you're like, why are youapologizing?
And I was like I'm sorry, I'msorry you have to set up the
futon for me or whatever, thesleep, the air mattress.
And you're like, why are youapologizing?
I'm like I just feel like aninconvenience.
You're like, I asked you tostay here.
Of course, we're gonna give youa place to sleep yeah, that was

(33:41):
crazy.

Chanel (33:42):
I do remember that I was like that's not something to
apologize for, though yeah,that's a whole other topic yeah
it, it is.
But I think it's good for peoplewho are notorious apologizers
to hear, like when you'resetting your boundary, don't
ever feel sorry for it.
Like this is something that youneed to stand firm in.
You need to be like, confidentin.
You have to say seriously, sothat people take you serious,

(34:05):
and if you're dealing with adifficult person, it's even more
important to reinforce thosethings yeah, I think the key is
the difficult people.

Tori (34:12):
This is really tough.
This is tough work and it canbe tough when you're close with
someone too.
It could be friends, family butyour friends and family you
know they're gonna love you,hopefully, and you'll be able to
work on it.
It's the difficult peoplethat's like scary man.

Chanel (34:27):
Sometimes your family and friends are the difficult
people true, chanel, I reallyappreciate you bringing this
article.
No, it's the no okay, myboundary is you need to stop
calling this an article.
It's a chapter of a book.

Tori (34:46):
All right, I'm gonna respect that boundary.
I hear you, Chanel.
I'm really appreciative thatyou brought this chapter of this
book to us for the podcasttoday.

Chanel (34:59):
Yeah, thank you to my therapist, thank you to Nedra.
I need to find the full name ofthe book.
It's called Set Boundaries,find Peace by Nedra
Glover-Tawwab, and this is justone chapter, like I said, in the
whole book.
So if you are someone who needshelp with setting boundaries, I
definitely have heard that thisbook is amazing and it really

(35:19):
helps you learn how to setboundaries and keep them, just
like this chapter did.
So hopefully you guys tooksomething away from this today,
because I know Tori and I did.

Tori (35:30):
Yes, for sure.
And if you have set boundariesand want to talk about it and
give us examples, let us know.
We love hearing follow up toour topics.

Chanel (35:40):
Yeah, slide in those DMs .

Tori (35:44):
Yep, and you can do that on TikTok and Instagram at Glad
we Talk Podcast, and you canemail us these stories or text
us.
But you can email us atgladwethotkpodcast at gmailcom.

Chanel (35:56):
And don't forget to rate and review us on Apple, spotify
or wherever you listen topodcasts.

Tori (36:01):
No, I need to set a boundary.
I need to go eat something.

Chanel (36:07):
Oh my God, that's so late.

Tori (36:09):
I'm over explaining.
I need to go eat something.
Oh my God, that's so late.

Chanel (36:13):
I'm over explaining.
I need to go Chanel.
I'm going to go now.
I'm going to go Chanel.
I want to go now.

Tori (36:20):
Chanel, I would have expected you to know I was going
to go now.

Chanel (36:25):
These are going to be our new phrases.
Not that we're trying to likemake fun of the boundaries, but
we love them.

Tori (36:32):
A little bit of laughter, yeah, yeah, exactly glad we
talked guys, glad we talked,glad we talked.

Chanel (36:56):
This delay is awful go ahead, okay, go glad we talked
guys okay, one, two, three, I'mgonna go woo.

Tori (37:06):
Yes, I don't like that ending.
Let's not, we're not gonna endwith a yes, okay.
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