June 18, 2025 • 42 mins
What if your body had its own consciousness and even a name? What if the challenges in your life weren't random mishaps, but meaningful guideposts on your hero's journey?
Dive into these profound questions as Cynthia Elliott (Shaman Isis) welcomes Brownell Landrum, a self-described "explorer of metaphysical mysteries" whose spiritual journey has taken her from corporate success to nomadic living guided by what she calls "traffic angels." Their conversation unfolds like a map of consciousness itself, revealing how embracing spiritual perspectives can transform our relationship with life's inevitable challenges.
Brownell shares fascinating research suggesting that people who believe things happen for a reason tend to be happier, regardless of whether it's objectively true. This sense of agency—what psychologist Albert Bandura calls "self-efficacy"—allows us to transform difficulties into opportunities rather than viewing ourselves as victims of random circumstance. As Brownell puts it, "There might be a lesson in it, there might be something that you can use to propel you to the next step."
The discussion takes a fascinating turn when Brownell introduces the Hawaiian Huna philosophy, which views the body as having its own separate consciousness. This approach helps explain phenomena like subconscious sabotage, where our bodies might literally trip us up when we're pushing too hard.
Brownell's newest project, "The Hero's Playbook," invites readers to recognize themselves as the heroes o
Spiritual guru, two-time #1 best-selling author, and higher consciousness advocate Shaman Isis (aka Cynthia L. Elliott) is on a mission to turn the tide of the mental and spiritual health crisis with mindfulness practices, incredible events, powerful content, and motivational storytelling that inspire your heroes journey! Learn more about her books, courses, speaking engagements, book signings, and appearances at ShamanIsis.com.
Ready for a life transformation? Ready to bring your dreams to life? Then you will want Glowup With Shaman Isis: The Collection of inspiring books and courses filled with life lessons and practices that raise your vibration and consciousness.
Ready for a life transformation? Ready to bring your dreams to life? Then you will want Glowup With Shaman Isis: The Collection of inspiring books and courses filled with life lessons and practices that raise your vibration and consciousness.
GlowUp with Shaman Isis: An Edgy Podcast for Transformation and Higher Consciousness
Are you captivated by inspiring personal stories, hero’s journeys, and reflections on spirituality's place in modern life? Tune in to GlowUp with Shaman Isis, the bold and uplifting podcast by spiritual rockstar, 2x #1 best-selling author, and veteran podcaster Cynthia L. Elliott—aka Shaman Isis.
Discover more at ShamanIsis.com or SoulTechFoundation.org.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Hello, hello, hello and welcome to Glow Up with
Shaman Isis.
I'm so delighted to have youhere.
I'm your hostess with themostest Cynthia Elliott, also
known by my spiritual avatar,shaman Isis, and I am so
delighted to have author andBrownell.
I have to first let me justfinish your name, brownell
Landrum.
I'm so glad to have you here,but you have to share your title
(00:21):
with the listeners because Iabsolutely love it.
What was the second part ofyour title with the listeners?
Speaker 2 (00:25):
because I absolutely love it.
What was the second part ofyour title?
Um, you mean, as far as I callmyself an explorer of
metaphysical mysteries, that wasit.
Speaker 1 (00:30):
I was about to say that and I was like, okay, I
gotta ask her to say it, she'lldo it.
I love that.
I.
I think what's so nice aboutthat is that you're
acknowledging the ongoingspiritual journey and the
ongoing evolution, that younever stop learning, you never
stop growing, you never stophealing.
Speaker 2 (00:45):
Absolutely.
And the explorer part, you know.
I mean, I remember when I metsomebody many, many years ago
and he's like you know, it'slike I've got the answer to this
, you know mystery.
And he's like no, Brownell,you're an explorer, You're
always going to be an explorer,and I thought that was probably
(01:05):
one of the most insightfulthings I've ever had told me,
because he was right.
But I might think I have theanswer, but I'm always looking
for more, I'm always looking foranother element to it, and so,
yeah, so that's, that's a goodone way to thing, way to call me
.
Speaker 1 (01:13):
Yeah, no, I like that and I think we get hung up too
much on titles.
You know we really do.
We live in a society thatreally sort of glorifies the
labeling yourself and uh, life'stoo too extraordinary, I think,
to spend it, you know, lookingfor a label um, I can't grow
beyond it, right, because youneed to grow beyond the label,
(01:33):
right, and so that's what we'retrying to look.
Speaker 2 (01:35):
You can't be an explorer if you're gonna.
Speaker 1 (01:38):
Yeah, and I it's interesting that we're talking
about this, as I was thinkingabout this earlier.
A lot of people want you tobecause they doing this
themselves.
They want you to pick a labelso that they can label you and
then understand who you are.
And then, when you try to breakout of that, there are some of
the many people that are theloudest in telling you you know,
don't mess up your life andstay in that box, Cause I want
(02:01):
to stay in mine.
Speaker 2 (02:03):
Right, right, yeah, or I want to at least know where
you are, and in fact I knowwe're going to talk about this
project.
But one of the activities Ihave in this, in this heroes
playbook I'll call it, is tolook at archetypes.
And then there's an activity inthere.
So to go and talk to 12 peopleand ask them what archetype they
think you are, oh, that'sinteresting.
(02:26):
Oh yeah, isn't that deep?
Because everybody is anarchetype in someone else's life
, you know.
Speaker 1 (02:31):
I struggle with the archetype list because there's
like three things there where Ifeel like all of them fit really
well.
I've got over a hundred.
Oh wow, I love it.
This is I'm talking about thelist of I think it's like 15,
but yeah, the typical list.
Speaker 2 (02:45):
No, I've got a hundred, a list of a hundred.
Speaker 1 (02:47):
So and yeah, you know define them however you want,
right, yeah, yeah, well, brunelI.
One of the things that we do onthe show which I think I know
our listeners really like, isthat we have people, guests,
take us through their journey,kind of like where they were at
when, uh, when they decided touh move towards metaphysics or
(03:09):
spirituality, mindfulness,whatever you want to label it.
We have all different types ofguests and kind of like this the
stumbling blocks, the biggestlessons, you know those, those
highlight moments where you hadreal breakthroughs, so can you
share?
Let's start in the beginningwith what.
What was the moment we justbirthed being into metaphysics?
Speaker 2 (03:28):
You know that's a good question.
It's kind of like you said atthe beginning, but I'm kind of
like maybe I go in reverse,because you know, just just to
give you context of where I amnow is I'm literally physically
in Tunisia and I am living anomadic life trying to figure
out where I'm going next and Idon't know the answer to that.
(03:48):
And it's been a reallyinteresting year that I have
felt more guided from above thanI ever have in my life.
So that's kind of like okay,that's the.
You know, if you have a movie,you see the end at the beginning
and then you can fast forwardto say how did I get to this
crazy place?
You know I've been into, youknow I've always been kind of
(04:09):
that explorer type ofpersonality.
I think that you know now I'mgoing to you know date myself,
but it was mid 80s and ShirleyMacLaine was coming out with her
book and her mini series Out ona Limb, and that I mean that
covers a lot of ground, thatbook and that and that story.
(04:30):
And like she covered, you know,the whole idea of
extraterrestrials and you know,beings not from here, and I'm
like okay, and then of course,the whole idea of reincarnation
and channeling and spirituality.
And you know, I think thereincarnation element was the
part that really opened up themost for me.
And then I went to a channelermyself back then and they told
(04:53):
me all kinds of reallyinteresting things about who I
was and what my past was.
And they told me I could dohealing and I never even thought
I could.
And so there's so muchexploration of that and watching
how that changed my life.
And then the next big leap wasMichael Newton's books, which
I'm sure you've probably read,you know, the Journey of Souls
and Destiny of Souls, and whatis it like on the other side and
(05:17):
what do we do when we're nothere.
So all of those kinds of thingskind of took me to another
level, and another level All ofit was introspective.
So it really wasn't until 2006when I wrote my first book,
which is nonfiction and it'scalled Five Reasons why Bad
Things Happen.
So when people say everythinghappens for a reason, I say yeah
(05:40):
, I wrote the book on it and sothat's kind of.
You know, I'll pause because Iwant you to.
I know you'll want to ask, yeahno, no, no.
Speaker 1 (05:48):
I like that you brought that up.
I have to be honest with youabout that phrase.
Everything happens for a reasonis actually my, one, of my, one
of my like because I don't andI love.
I think we should always haveopen conversation.
I don't believe that everythinghappens for a reason.
(06:12):
I believe that if a human beingis present and intelligent and
being guided, that they can turnanything that occurs into a
learning opportunity and a wayto level up.
I think for me, as a child ofthe, I think it's probably has a
lot more to do with my ownhistory, which isn't that the
way it is with all of us Growing?
up in care.
A lot of the things that I sawhappen to children are what
convinced me that everythingdoes not happen for a reason you
cannot, and to tell people thatwhen they've been severely
traumatized, it's a little likereally.
So I'm curious about yourthoughts on that.
Speaker 2 (06:35):
Yeah, I know, I'm really glad you brought it up
because I love looking atdifferent perspectives of it.
Right, and and I do startthere's a couple of anecdotes
about that I do start the bookwith what I call nine basic
assumptions and I say if thesebasic assumptions resonate with
you, then I will explain all thebad things, and I have a list
of maybe 100 bad things and howeach of the five reasons can
(06:58):
explain them.
The other kind of anecdote onit is I'm sure you probably have
heard about the book when BadThings Happ happen to good
people.
Yeah, and I met Rabbi Kushner,who wrote that book, and he read
my book and he came back andsaid, no, he thinks everything's
random.
And what that led me to do ismore research and found some
(07:24):
really solid research thatactually says that people who
believe things happen for areason are happier than those
who don't.
Speaker 1 (07:30):
That makes sense.
It actually makes sense, but Ithink that's kind of like that
ignorance is bliss.
Well, I'm sorry, that's apersonal, obviously.
That's my own opinion.
Speaker 2 (07:39):
Well, no, I mean, it is no, but it is.
In fact, the research comesfrom somebody, a brilliant
psychologist, one of the leadersin in that world, named Albert
Bandura, and he even says, like,even if you're wrong, you're
still happier, right.
So I mean, your, your point isactually a valid one and I again
(07:59):
I don't.
You know, I'm not going to puta stake in the ground, but I but
if you read my book, I thinkyou would see that you just said
there's a lesson in it.
My book doesn't get into thatparticular book doesn't get into
reincarnation.
I got into writing more fictionabout that.
So you know, as far as childrenbeing born a certain way and
that kind of thing, but what itdoes is it helps you look at
(08:24):
kind of.
You alluded to it.
There might be a lesson in it,there might be something that
you can use to propel you to thenext step, and if you can look
at it that way, then you canturn it into an opportunity.
And so you know, and I wrote itwhen I was going through a
really, really difficult timeand I had a business fail.
I went through bankruptcy,foreclosure of, and I had a
business fail.
I went through bankruptcy,foreclosure of my house, a
(08:47):
relationship ended, my dog died.
I mean, like all of thesethings were happening at once
and I just isn't that the way?
Speaker 1 (08:52):
it always is it always seems like it.
Yeah Well, when I talk aboutthis a lot, we have to get to a
place of such emotional painthat we're ready to actually
change our thought habits, andthat that takes serious shadow
work.
And to take on serious shadowwork usually means getting the
shit scared out of you yeah, infact, I explain shadows, too in
my book.
Speaker 2 (09:11):
Um, so for me, it was like the most, it was bliss.
It was bliss because I wasgetting those answers that I was
looking for, and so, um, andthe the big reason why the thing
that all five things have incommon is to get you to change
something, which is is exactlywhat you're saying, right, yeah,
it is to propel you to anotherlevel and another lesson and
(09:32):
another learning.
And you know, I've been throughsome really tough times.
You know, as I said, I've beenaround for a while and they're
not easy, but if you keep amindset of, what can I learn
from this?
How can I?
What needs to change in my life?
What is this trying to get me?
To nudge me to anotherdirection?
Um, I, I, I feel like it can beextremely helpful.
(09:56):
So, um, and not everybody'sgoing to resonate.
you know that's fine yeah.
Speaker 1 (09:59):
And and I I can argue because, because you know
spiritual folks, we like to wecan argue multiple.
Well, some of us can.
If you're Nora Spicy, you knowwhat I'm talking about.
I can argue multiple points ofview and agree with all of them.
I was thinking about when youwere saying that so in my family
the women have repeatedly beenharmed by men.
I mean, it's just literallyrepeated throughout the history
of the women in my family and itstopped with me, I mean,
(10:25):
although I did have my share ofcreepy experiences.
Those creepy experienceshappened and I could see the
pattern in my family.
I knew it when I was young andI think it was the lesson in
seeing the vulnerable beingvulnerable, being in vulnerable
situations.
It was a consistent threadthroughout the history of my
family because the women hadshit taste in men Sorry, but it
(10:47):
was true and it put them in alot of repeatedly dangerous
situations and and things happenfor a reason Like, if I turn
that phrase around, it happenedto me because of a history in my
family and it was a lesson thatI could learn within that
moment when it, when it was timefor me to say the buck stops
here.
I mean I'm I'm trying to thinkof, like how do you, how do I
(11:08):
turn that around where I don'tdisagree with it, but but I can.
I can argue both ways.
Speaker 2 (11:13):
Yeah, yeah, well, and I, I guess I'm, but you know
we're getting deep here, whichI'm I love to do is is do you
believe that and this doesactually is addressed as one of
the and within the basicassumptions that that do you
believe that, before we're born,that we have some choice in
those decisions about who we'reborn to and some key, at least
(11:37):
some key things that we thinkmight happen?
Speaker 1 (11:40):
Yeah, I remember and this was really weird to know
when I was, when I was from thetime I was born, I was like I
had psychic experiences at likea year and a half, which I think
everybody's psychic.
I just I had had enoughweirdness around me that I was
really tapped into it, but,excuse me, I just lost your
question.
What did you ask me?
Speaker 2 (12:01):
Well, I was now.
I was like following you going.
I was like going.
I was like, well, that soundsreally.
I said did you think you wereplanned that that, yes, you made
some decisions about your lifewhen I was.
Speaker 1 (12:12):
Yeah before I came back for this lifetime, which is
something that I had, a.
I struggled to say that outloud and to take it seriously
because it was so hard to even Icouldn't talk to anybody about
it because they were like youmight want to be quiet.
Um, I remember the conversation.
I remember being asked are yousure you want to make it this
hard?
And I said I want to make it mylast lifetime, uh, my last trip
(12:37):
.
And they were like, okay, well,you asked for it.
And I remember thinking, oh,was that a mistake?
And then it was like when Iwake up in this, this baby's
body.
Speaker 2 (12:46):
Yeah, well, you know, in fact I, when you're talking
about children, I actually wrotea children's book, um and um,
and there's a verse in it thatsays we decide on our lessons,
the paths we will take, awardswe might go for and mistakes we
might make.
For life Isn't easy and notalways fun, but easy is boring,
like games, always won.
Speaker 1 (13:05):
Ah, I love that.
Speaker 2 (13:12):
It's like wait a minute, you know that's and
that's where kind of I thinkfree will happens in two places,
right.
One is as we're choosing whatlife we're going to go into, and
then, once we get here, it'skind of like, I think it's like
a roadmap, and we decide do wego right, left, Do we zoom
through the intersection, Do wetake the high road or the low
road?
You know, do we go off road?
Potentially?
So?
So anyway, that's that's tiedinto all of that.
(13:34):
Yeah, it's just.
I mean, you'll have to see ifyou read the book, If, if you go
, oh yeah, okay, now I get whereshe's going, yeah.
Now of course I have to it's nota lecture, you know, but it is
an opportunity to go just tofeel so much better about, um,
you know, about the AlbertBandura who I was mentioning is
(13:54):
like he calls it self-efficacy.
That you have some, you feellike, okay, wait a minute, I do
have some.
Agency is the big word thesedays.
You know, I have some agencyhere in this life.
I'm not just a victim, that's a, that's a in some random world.
You know that there is somesort of, even Einstein, you know
, when asked, he's like therehas to be some infinite
intelligence that created thisstuff.
(14:15):
I mean, this is toowell-designed to be accidental.
This whole world, so, so,anyway, that's that's where I
got into the first book.
Speaker 1 (14:25):
You know, yeah, yeah, no, I, I love that you wrote
that and and I I will read it.
I, I haven't.
It's interesting, I read, Ithink I might.
I used to read voraciously.
I always had two books in mypurse.
I was always reading at leastone, if not three, books at one
time for decades.
Like I counted once I was likewell, it's been at least 3000
books, it may even be 5,000.
(14:46):
Um and then, uh, and then I hadmy spiritual awakening and I
have not read a book all the waythrough since I had it.
I mean, I've written three.
Speaker 2 (14:55):
Well that you, you probably maybe went from student
to teacher.
Speaker 1 (15:00):
you know, like um, unless you were asking about um,
so yeah, yeah, so so the thething is is that I I will read
your book because I think it'sreally important to to to seek
different perspectives,particularly in things that
bother you.
So, like that phrase bothers me, and I think when you see that,
about anything, it is thewisest thing that you can do to
(15:22):
challenge your why you'redigging your heels in on it, and
that that allows you to diginto your own junk.
Speaker 2 (15:29):
Well, and it could easily be you reigning somebody
who used it in a way that was acruel way as opposed to a
supportive way.
You know that would be kind ofmy guess.
Speaker 1 (15:38):
Yeah, that would.
That would fit.
I had my foster motherthroughout high school years was
one of those.
She was one of those like superreligious, super well-respected
, super spiritual, like had thelibrary introduced me to all
sorts of like I love.
I really I have this love haterelationship with with her
because she is one of thefoundational elements to my
spiritual journey.
I was put into her house for areason you know and could go
(16:01):
back to what you say like I or Iturned it into a reason.
I learned so much from her, butat the same time, she was also
she could be incredibly cruelwith comments like that.
So so you wrote your first bookand you were just drawn to
mystical things, was it?
Was there like a moment whenyou like had an aha moment?
Speaker 2 (16:22):
I mean, I think there was well, I'd say, one of the
things that was.
The most profound thinghappened around then is I got a
little bit exposure to the Hunareligion.
I don't know if you're muchfamiliar with Huna I'm not.
I wouldn't put myself as anykind of expert or even student
of Huna but there was one aspectof it that was profound in
terms of changing my life, and Ido talk about it in that
(16:45):
particular book, which is the.
Huna is more like psychology101, and the big thing that
makes it distinctive is thatyour higher self has its own
name.
You have your name and then yourbody has its name hmm, and when
you find out the name of yourbody and there are like three
(17:05):
different entities, they've gotthree different levels of energy
.
The soul chooses your body andbecomes you.
Right, and when I wrote thebook, when I realized the body
is the subconscious, that was abig okay.
Now everything has changed andwith Huna naming your body, and
then you can basically treat herlike a separate entity and you
(17:27):
can say who are you?
And you can kind of imaginewell, what if my soul had chosen
your body or vice versa, howdifferent we would be.
Speaker 1 (17:36):
Yeah, I like that actually a lot.
I think it really fits If youtalk to your spirit guides or
your higher self.
I think that feels like a verynatural process to do.
But I like that because ithelps sort of divorce you from
sort of your attachment to this.
Speaker 2 (17:53):
It does yeah, it does .
It's a separate energy.
And then when you do, you know,like the things that you do,
one of the reasons, um, why badthings happen is subconscious
sabotage, right, and it's whenyour body doesn't want to do
something that you want it to do, right.
So, like one of the things thatI have a story in there is a
(18:13):
friend of mine who was aworkaholic and she was going it
was Labor Day weekend and shewas going to work all weekend.
She goes out to get Thai food,guess what, she trips over the
curb and she's in bed allweekend.
Her body was like I am notfreaking working, okay, you are
not going to make me do that.
And those kinds of things arewhere we can have that body,
(18:33):
part of us, that consciousnessat that body level that's tied
to the earth, that's got allthat genetic memory, all that
kind of um, ancestry, all ofthat stuff's tied to the body,
personality, and.
But when you get to know her andyou're friends with her, you
can say what do you want to dotoday?
And you can also say, hey, ifyou don't mind, we can spend the
next three hours working onthis project or we can finish it
by noon, then I'll let you playthe rest of the day.
(18:56):
They will totally go on, youknow.
So that was a big thing isgetting to know her, because
then all of a sudden, like oneof the big changes in my life
was eating, was conscious, everybite.
I can tell you every bite thatI eat, and people kind of like,
wow, I'm just watching me, butit's like I remember it because
I'm I'm so connected to her allthe time that I know what she
(19:19):
wants and she and I, if she eatssomething naughty, we're
enjoying it together, notsneaking it.
You know like, because youprobably know the experience you
eat something and you forgotyou ate it yeah, yeah,
absolutely.
It's when your body is going oh,I've got an opportunity, I'm
going to go in and do this, soanyway, that was a big thing at
that time.
Um, it wasn't until a number ofyears later that I went through
(19:41):
some, a lot more other thingsbut also thought I'd write
fiction.
And I I never thought I would,and boy did I did.
It open up a lot, and my firstnovels series of novels are a
kind of a love story, so it goesinto past lives and you know,
the first first book is kind oflike your typical kind of love
(20:02):
story, and then the second onegets into their past lives and
starts adding all thosedimensions to it.
And I found something reallypowerful there in that sometimes
fiction opens minds better thannon-fiction oh I.
Speaker 1 (20:15):
I think that's actually what our science
fiction writers do on a subtlelevel.
Our science fiction writers areinforming people of our
potential futures, but they'redoing it in sort of a dramatic,
playful, entertaining way wherepeople can handle it and deal
with it.
But almost everything theywrite comes true or or it gets
prevented.
Speaker 2 (20:34):
Right, right, I mean that's the paradox.
Right, because they can saythis is going to happen, but
then, if you know it's going tohappen, then you can prevent it
and then it doesn't happen.
So, yeah, that was you know.
That led that led to you knowscreenwriting, to this knowledge
that telling stories can reallychange the world.
Speaker 1 (20:52):
Um, oh, yeah, I mean that goes back to folk, the
folklore.
When you think of folklore, Imean if you think about, even
say, like a character like jesuswhich, if you know, if
anybody's read some of my stuff,I believe he was a human being
that achieved christ, achievedthe highest levels of
consciousness, and then told uswhat to do.
You know how to actuallyachieve that and his words got
(21:12):
turned around.
That's for another day.
I did want to go back tosomething you said really quick
about the body.
So you're so I mean I love thatyou shared that the body really
does.
The body will expresssubconscious, a poisoned
subconscious, through making yousick like if you're if you're
(21:32):
not listening to it.
Speaker 2 (21:33):
It's kind of like look, the good.
Analogy is like if you have adog I don't know if you have a
dog or have ever had one or seenpeople with their dogs and
they'll go for a walk with thedog and then the dog runs off
and so often they'll yell at thedog right, come back here.
But if they go, come on, it'smore fun over here.
The dog's like whoa, I'm goingwith you.
(21:53):
I mean, we need to treat ourbodies like that.
Speaker 1 (21:56):
Yeah, yeah, yeah that's not yell at it and get
mad at it.
Speaker 2 (22:00):
But like what?
How can we make this fun?
Because, like, my body loves toexercise and people don't.
People like, oh, my bodydoesn't want to.
Well, it's probably becauseyou're trying to yell at the dog
instead of let's fun over here,kind of thing, and you're, and
you make sure that that's whereyou know where you're in that
connection with the body.
Speaker 1 (22:18):
So I don't think I don't think it helps.
Actually, because we'resurrounded by imagery that gives
the impression that exercise issupposed to be painful and
supposed to be laborious andsupposed to be a duty, and, and
you see, all these influencerpeople who who do these absurd,
ridiculous workouts that youknow 99.9% of the population do
not need to be doing, and itmakes people think it's supposed
(22:40):
to be dreadful.
But you have to find ways toadd fun, um into it.
Uh, yeah, you know, uh, the,the, what the body keeps the
count when we're like.
For me, in my case, I lost 80pounds when I finally started to
pay attention and listen, whenI had my spiritual awakening.
Now, granted, I did fast and Idid begin to finally work out,
(23:02):
but I really believe a lot ofthat weight loss was just me
finally turning within.
Speaker 2 (23:07):
Yeah, in fact, I, I, I, I I've got the this new
project, the heroes playbook,but I started working on one
that was a forgiveness one, andone of the activities in there
is the weight of forgiveness,and if you look at the, you know
that I really think that thereis an angle of this, like we are
literally holding on weight.
That is, that we need torelease so that we can um, and
(23:32):
then we do, and forgiveness is abig one, um, so.
So there's a lot of kind of thepsychological aspect of what's
happening to us physiologically,um for sure, um, and sometimes
it's learning to love your bodyjust as it is and not trying to
change too much either, you know.
So there's you know there's alot of that.
Speaker 1 (23:53):
So you, you have a, so you've been on an incredible
adventure.
You've written a lot ofdifferent types of things,
things you've definitelyexplored so many areas of
metaphysics and now you've got abook that I I mean, I love.
I want to hear about the, the,your latest project, because I
really believe every personneeds to to accept that they're
on a hero's journey.
We all are, like most of theentertainment that we embrace
(24:15):
and admire the most popularentertainment in the world, like
Harry Potter, you know his, hisdark materials, the main
characters on a hero's journey,and that's why we love it so
much.
Although as somebody who grew upin an orphanage, I do find it
interesting that so many ofthose characters grew up in
orphanages, which is a wholeother topic for another
conversation.
Speaker 2 (24:36):
Well, that is part of the archetype of the hero in a
lot of the Joseph Campbell stuff, like you know, or that they
were, you know, somehow orphanedor you know, because I think
part of that is that the mindsetis that they are free, they
don't have parents holding themback from going on their journey
, right, they don't, like youknow, and and you know it
started well, it startedthousands of years ago, but in
(24:58):
terms of really understandingthe heroes Hero of the Thousand
Faces, the Joseph Campbell,looking at mythology and even
Jesus you mentioned, you know,classic hero's journey I mean
you can't get, you know, kind ofmore definitive than that and
and so so, yeah, and I wasthinking I was, so I was working
on that and and I just, youknow it was one of the most fun
(25:20):
I've ever had working onanything, was working on this,
and you know I'm just going toflash it, but it's a whole
series of activities, of allkinds of things that that you
know, that people go through andit takes them through.
I use the Christopher Vogler 12steps instead of the 18 Campbell
steps, but there's a lot ofdifferent kinds of activities
(25:42):
looking at archetypes andlooking at Enneagrams and
looking at, you know basicstorytelling elements and so
it's a kind of a book that youknow it's it's for the hero in
all of us is kind of the messageand that you know you can
either use the book as a selfdevelopment.
You can use it if you're awriter and you were writing a
(26:02):
story and you want to delvedeeper into your characters.
You can use it for memoirwriting, you can.
If you're a coach, you can useit with your coaching clients.
I have a writing coach who'sgot who's going to have all of
his students, you know, buy thebook and he's going to use it in
his classes.
So it's, it was really, reallyfun creating it and you know I'm
(26:27):
just excited because it's brandnew, so it's just getting out
now.
Speaker 1 (26:30):
Um, yeah, I love that , I love that you did a workbook
for that.
I don't, I really don't.
I think of if, if most, thevast majority of people could,
um, really embrace the idea thatthat everything they've been
through is part of this grandadventure of discovering
themselves and going within andlearning how to command their
energy, which is really whatwe're here for to learn to
(26:51):
command our energy, to stay inthe higher levels of vibration.
If we really understood that wedwell in victim mentality and
the survival paradigm andfear-based living.
That's where I spent the vastmajority of my adult life and
it's such a way to live and it'sa choice.
But we're not taught that it's achoice.
We're taught in this worldthrough media and society, uh,
(27:15):
that it you know, once you'revictim, that's what you blame,
and then that becomes who youare and your personality and and
it's, you know, sort of scarsyou for life or whatever, and it
becomes your crutch and it'sjust simply not true.
And when people actually acceptthat they're, that they have
the power over that experienceand that they are a hero and
everyone is, and that we're allsand and on the beach, nobody's
(27:36):
more special than the other,which is I really dislike
celebrity culture because Ithink it reinforces and I worked
in it for a really long timeand I loved all those people I
worked with but I really thinkit reinforces the idea that some
of us are more special thanothers, and I and and so I love
that you wrote this book, so ifsomebody was at any point on
their spiritual journey, this isa great book for them to work
with.
Speaker 2 (27:56):
Yeah, I mean it's, it's there's, if, if you're on a
spiritual journey, you're goingto read it at a lot deeper
level and level and you're goingto see, you know, like there's
just some really simpleactivities.
This I don't know the first one, but like this is the well,
there's a couple.
Well, like one is just get aregular dice, you know six-sided
dice, and you roll the dice andthat's going to give you the
(28:18):
answer to the question you'relooking for and you're like,
okay, that's fun, you knowwhatever, and there's a list of
the six answers.
You know whatever and there's alist of the six answers.
You know that kind of like amagic eight ball.
But the message within that isif you got an answer, that you
don't like.
Speaker 1 (28:36):
now you're onto something Right.
Speaker 2 (28:37):
It helps to find out what you don't want.
And yeah, I get clear on that.
So, like, all of a sudden, yourealize that one thing looks
really lighthearted and simple,right.
And then there's another onethat's like list your greatest
hits, right, and that can beyour for the year or that can be
in a certain arena.
So there's some of them that'slike this seems really light and
(28:58):
airy.
And then all of a sudden you'relike no, it's really really
deep.
Like I was talking to a coachwho wants to use it in all these
big, great, grandiose trainingsand workshops and you know all
these kinds of things and I, oneof the activities is your
blossom, right, right, and it'slooking at what are your flaws.
(29:18):
And she was like at first likeno, no, no, people don't have
flaws.
I'm like no, no, no, if youlook at heroes, we don't like
the heroes that don't have flaws.
We want the heroes that haveflaws.
Then we can relate to them.
So that's the kind of thingthat's fun and light and you can
think, and there are referencesto Star Wars and you know
(29:38):
movies and things like that.
But you know, then you startthinking wait a minute, that's
true.
What kind of heroes do I like,who do I want to emulate?
And you know, most people,would you know, pick an Iron man
over a Captain America,sometimes because they too
perfect is too perfect.
Speaker 1 (29:56):
Right, yeah, yeah, actually, iron man was likable
for, for the, for the flaws, thequirks yeah, exactly, he was
more human.
But super human, obviously, yeah, but sat and sassy and, and you
know you, yeah, I know I lovethat.
You say that and I think I, uh,you point out something that's
really important too is that, um, perfectionism is is a trauma
(30:21):
response, and when we feel theneed to to, to constantly hold
ourselves to such a rigidlyperfect standard, um, it's not
normal.
It's a behavior that we've been, we've learned by our mistakes,
being used against us and, uh,and, as you age it, it can be
really awesome at work, and workwill use it to burn you right
(30:42):
out.
Uh, you'll use it to burnyourself out eventually, and,
and, recognizing that your flaw,your flaws and, frankly and
that is actually bearsmentioning you know, when you're
doing a workbook like this,your flaws, the things, the, the
, the quirks about you, theflaws, the bad, the, the bad
experiences that have been apart of your journey really are
the secret sauce that actuallygive you your unique selling
(31:04):
proposition, the thing that thatactually makes you interesting
and unique in the marketplace.
And when you learn to embracethat instead of run from it
which was my issue for decadesum it gosh boy, does it get
easier?
Speaker 2 (31:15):
It's exhausting.
Speaker 1 (31:17):
It's exhausting, trying to be perfect, so I like
that you have people do that.
When did you is the book out?
Speaker 2 (31:28):
Yes, it is out, it's getting tested.
You know getting kind of doingsome beta testing with some
different people to get somefeedback.
So there'll probably be somevariations that are come along
the road to improve it, but I'mgetting some really amazing
feedback from very high level.
You know coaches, consultants,you know therapists, you know
kind of on all those levels.
And you know, one of my dreamsis that kind of like you're
(31:49):
saying when you're talking aboutyou know what I'd love to see
it get into corporate culture.
Right, I'd love to see it getat a high level and have maybe
an executive coach take theleader through it and then have
a leader take their peoplethrough it, right, and then all
of a sudden, instead of tryingto be perfect, you go okay, yeah
, you know what I messed up onthis.
(32:09):
I didn't make, I didn't do this, you know.
Um, make this right decision orI should have gone at this
other way.
That's that's going to make anorganization more dynamic and
and grow than just trying to bea fear of that.
Speaker 1 (32:22):
Oh, I'm, you know, made up, messed up, yeah, yeah I
know earlier I was hearingabout one of the billionaires
and the way he runs his businessand it's fear-driven and it's
such a stupid, short-sighted wayto run a business.
Uh, the number of times youjust even in my own career, the
number of times I went to youknow the powers that be and said
this brand or company is goingto implode in oh, 18.3 months
(32:47):
you know what I mean.
I had it down to like and I waslike even the reason why is
because of these fundamentalissues that you have and they
couldn't even hear you and youcan't even have those
conversations if people aren'tallowed to be human, because a
lot of the things that peoplesee and are able to express even
, it's that they won't expressthem because they don't want to
be wrong or they won't be seenlike a troublemaker.
(33:07):
And it's such a silly way to runa business where you have to
accept that everybody is humanand if you just show that right
up front, that look, part of usbeing a great team is us
understanding who does what best, who notices certain things and
who, who, uh, the who, whereyour weak spots are, so that we
can help each other.
But it's like you're notallowed to have weak spots.
You know they want to perfectthose too and it's like, but you
(33:29):
know that's actually how a lotof times it's in it's in the
it's in the person, um person'sjourney through that that they
spot some of the issues thatneed to be challenged.
Speaker 2 (33:38):
But yeah, I love that .
Yeah, it makes it really fun,you know.
And then there's like a partabout hero versus anti-hero,
right, and and you know the what, the what are the differences
there?
So there's just it.
There's so many fun things, um,to go through it and um, and I,
I, as I said, I just had somuch fun creating it.
(34:01):
I mean, I just, you know, Ilove my novels.
I came out with some novelslast year that I briefly
mentioned.
That's like this epicreincarnation mystery about a
famous couple from history who'sreincarnated today to fulfill a
prophecy, kind of a DiffingyCode, outlander kind of thing,
and love doing that too.
And this was, you know, adifferent kind of joy.
But I'm, you know, you ask,kind of joy.
But but I, I'm, I'm, you know,I, I, you ask any writer and you
(34:23):
know, as a writer, it'swhatever you're working on right
now is the thing that you lovethe most, right?
Speaker 1 (34:28):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (34:28):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (34:29):
For me it was my second book I I that one really
was very cathartic and fun forme, but obviously always onto
the next thing.
Speaker 2 (34:40):
So what's up next for you?
Well, my latest thing is andI've written it I'm writing it
as a series of short stories andit's the most autobiographical
I've ever gotten, and and it'skind of like when you we started
at the end and then we kind ofcome around to the where I am
now.
I had a writing coach who said,okay, write something.
(35:03):
She calls a reader magnet isthe term.
You probably know what that isin the writing world and it was
like you got to write somethingto be able to offer to people
for free, so that they knowyou're writing, know, learn,
learn about you a little bit.
So I'm writing the story and Iknow you're going to love this,
and and I'm writing the storyand I think I'm going to write
it from the point of view of theupstairs, what I call the
upstairs and I'm writing aboutthis team and all of a sudden
(35:29):
I'm realizing they're telling mewho they are and they are
active in my life, and it's astory about how do you get an
American woman in Colorado tomeet a British man in Tunisia,
and I call it the traffic angels.
Like there's, there's energiesup there, like all those
logistics making sure thisflight gets there and this, you
(35:52):
know, and this team is justhilarious and super fun.
And so I wrote part one, andthen I wrote part two, and then
I just, literally yesterday,finished part three, and so I've
got fans going oh, I can't wait, I can't wait to find out part
three and so.
But it's been wild, becauseI've been in this position, you
know, first time really in mylife that it's been like what do
(36:14):
y'all want?
Okay, I'll just kill, or I'lllisten, or I'll follow, like I'm
.
So I don't know where I'm goingto live next, I just know I'm
here for a little while and thenI'll go somewhere else, and
then I yeah, and they're goingto tell me you know, you're
channeling your, your, you'rechanneling your latest books,
(36:35):
which I think is really cool.
Speaker 1 (36:37):
I love channeling I.
I, I've been doing it for areally long time but in the it
was like my clients would belike, oh, she's gone, she's gone
, she's off in that place andthey're like what, what wise
words like I.
I.
I would never have said to themI'm channeling um, because they
would have been like sorry, uh,but uh, they're like, oh, she's
coming up with an idea, she'sgot an idea.
I'm like, no, I'm actuallychanneling my spirit, guys, uh,
(36:58):
but I think that's, I think thebest artists, the best writers,
the best creators and thecreation process really is a
process of being aligned and inflow, to the point of being able
to channel to what you're doingand it creates such wonderful
you know I think of.
I wonder if the CelestineProphecy do you remember when
(37:18):
that came out?
Speaker 2 (37:19):
Oh, I love that book?
Speaker 1 (37:19):
Yeah, I loved that book.
I didn't love the sequel.
Speaker 2 (37:25):
The third one I kind of did but the.
Sean Law one.
But yeah, I didn't even know.
Speaker 1 (37:31):
There was a third one , but the first one was had a
huge impact.
I was living in Cal.
I think I was living inCalifornia at the time, wasn't
it the early nineties Like?
Speaker 2 (37:39):
it was early nineties .
Yeah, I mean I've beenlistening to James Redfield
speak.
You know that was good for you.
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (37:45):
Yeah, I was super impressed with that book, cause
it was the first time I had readanything, as I, you know, grew
up in a real.
I grew up in a Catholicorphanage and half the time I
was like that isn't even true.
I would get into arguments withmy foster mother Cause she'd
whip out the Bible and quotesomething and then I'd flip a
few pages and quote somethingthat contradicted that.
(38:05):
I was just terrible.
But when I read JamesRedfield's book, I was like, oh
wow, somebody gets it.
What's your?
Yeah, before we go, can youtell me what's your?
What is your favorite book?
Do you have a favorite book?
Tell me what's your.
What is your favorite book?
Do you have a favorite?
Speaker 2 (38:20):
book oh boy, that's a .
That's a very interesting one.
I hadn't really thought aboutthat.
I mean, I guess I, I guess I goback to some of the early
Richard Bach books, likeIllusions and A.
Bridge Across Forever, kind ofthe some that was so formative.
So you know, I mean there'sobviously lots of contemporary
stuff that I love and that Iread all different kinds of
(38:42):
things, but but those are theones that you know really like
that.
Ok, that changed everything.
Speaker 1 (38:50):
Yeah, you know Thomas .
So I think it was Thomas SowellSoulmates.
I think that's the book and theauthor.
That was one of those booksthat James Redfield where I was
like, ok, okay, this istransformative, and you knew
khalil gabran's the prophet.
Yes, yeah, that was a.
That was a powerful book.
Uh, anyway, listen to me, Icould keep talking to you.
(39:10):
Uh, bronnell, it's been so muchfun getting to know you and
getting to know your content.
Let's see the book again.
You guys, she's going to holdup the book for those who
actually see the video this isthe proof one, so it's got
something across it.
Speaker 2 (39:20):
But, um, the hero's playbook is the is the new one,
so please check that out, and mynovels.
And I've got a facebook groupcalled life is a trip
reincarnation stories group, soplease join.
Um, we love stories and, uh,just, you know, just love to
stay in touch with, withlike-minded people yeah,
absolutely, and your and yourwebsite.
Speaker 1 (39:40):
It's Brownell, landrum right.
Speaker 2 (39:42):
Yeah, brownelllandrumcom.
I'm the only Brownell Landrumin the world, so it's pretty
easy to Google me.
Speaker 1 (39:48):
Before we started filming you guys, before I go, I
have to say I was like, okay,what's the deal with the name
Brownell?
And she told me it was themiddle name of your uncle.
Speaker 2 (39:55):
It was my grandfather's middle name, has
grandmother's maiden name and itgoes, goes back to the
Mayflower.
So, um, yeah, it has that ithas that like flavor to it.
Speaker 1 (40:05):
Ah well, thank you so much again, Bronnell, it's been
so much fun to talk to youbefore I go.
You guys hold on, I got to grabmy uh for those of you who see
the video.
Uh, thank you so much forjoining us today.
Uh, if you're not familiar withuh, familiar with my work, I am
a spiritual teacher andthree-time author, shaman Isis,
(40:27):
also known as Cynthia Elliott tomy friends and family, and you
can check out my first book,unleash the Empress, which is my
spiritual practices, memoryMansion, which shares my journey
from Catholic orphanage to PRdiva to finally waking up and
healing my really strangehistory.
If you read the book, you'llknow what I mean.
It's eyebrow raising at somepoints.
Those books also come in myglow up collection, which I
recently launched and is superpopular.
It has my meditations and mynine step course for life
(40:50):
transformation, along with bothbooks and the audio book for
Memory Mansion, which is reallypopular.
So go check those out.
If you're not already subscribedto the podcast, what are you
thinking?
I have amazing guests who talkabout intelligent and
interesting topics.
So be sure and subscribe andcheck out all the other episodes
and you guys have a badass week.
(41:12):
Thanks again for now.
Thank you, bye.
Hello, hello, hello and welcome to Glow Up with
Shaman Isis.
I'm so delighted to have youhere.
I'm your hostess with themostest Cynthia Elliott, also
known by my spiritual avatar,shaman Isis, and I am so
delighted to have author andBrownell.
I have to first let me justfinish your name, brownell
Landrum.
I'm so glad to have you here,but you have to share your title
(00:21):
with the listeners because Iabsolutely love it.
What was the second part ofyour title with the listeners?
Speaker 2 (00:25):
because I absolutely love it.
What was the second part ofyour title?
Um, you mean, as far as I callmyself an explorer of
metaphysical mysteries, that wasit.
Speaker 1 (00:30):
I was about to say that and I was like, okay, I
gotta ask her to say it, she'lldo it.
I love that.
I.
I think what's so nice aboutthat is that you're
acknowledging the ongoingspiritual journey and the
ongoing evolution, that younever stop learning, you never
stop growing, you never stophealing.
Speaker 2 (00:45):
Absolutely.
And the explorer part, you know.
I mean, I remember when I metsomebody many, many years ago
and he's like you know, it'slike I've got the answer to this
, you know mystery.
And he's like no, Brownell,you're an explorer, You're
always going to be an explorer,and I thought that was probably
(01:05):
one of the most insightfulthings I've ever had told me,
because he was right.
But I might think I have theanswer, but I'm always looking
for more, I'm always looking foranother element to it, and so,
yeah, so that's, that's a goodone way to thing, way to call me
.
Speaker 1 (01:13):
Yeah, no, I like that and I think we get hung up too
much on titles.
You know we really do.
We live in a society thatreally sort of glorifies the
labeling yourself and uh, life'stoo too extraordinary, I think,
to spend it, you know, lookingfor a label um, I can't grow
beyond it, right, because youneed to grow beyond the label,
(01:33):
right, and so that's what we'retrying to look.
Speaker 2 (01:35):
You can't be an explorer if you're gonna.
Speaker 1 (01:38):
Yeah, and I it's interesting that we're talking
about this, as I was thinkingabout this earlier.
A lot of people want you tobecause they doing this
themselves.
They want you to pick a labelso that they can label you and
then understand who you are.
And then, when you try to breakout of that, there are some of
the many people that are theloudest in telling you you know,
don't mess up your life andstay in that box, Cause I want
(02:01):
to stay in mine.
Speaker 2 (02:03):
Right, right, yeah, or I want to at least know where
you are, and in fact I knowwe're going to talk about this
project.
But one of the activities Ihave in this, in this heroes
playbook I'll call it, is tolook at archetypes.
And then there's an activity inthere.
So to go and talk to 12 peopleand ask them what archetype they
think you are, oh, that'sinteresting.
(02:26):
Oh yeah, isn't that deep?
Because everybody is anarchetype in someone else's life
, you know.
Speaker 1 (02:31):
I struggle with the archetype list because there's
like three things there where Ifeel like all of them fit really
well.
I've got over a hundred.
Oh wow, I love it.
This is I'm talking about thelist of I think it's like 15,
but yeah, the typical list.
Speaker 2 (02:45):
No, I've got a hundred, a list of a hundred.
Speaker 1 (02:47):
So and yeah, you know define them however you want,
right, yeah, yeah, well, brunelI.
One of the things that we do onthe show which I think I know
our listeners really like, isthat we have people, guests,
take us through their journey,kind of like where they were at
when, uh, when they decided touh move towards metaphysics or
(03:09):
spirituality, mindfulness,whatever you want to label it.
We have all different types ofguests and kind of like this the
stumbling blocks, the biggestlessons, you know those, those
highlight moments where you hadreal breakthroughs, so can you
share?
Let's start in the beginningwith what.
What was the moment we justbirthed being into metaphysics?
Speaker 2 (03:28):
You know that's a good question.
It's kind of like you said atthe beginning, but I'm kind of
like maybe I go in reverse,because you know, just just to
give you context of where I amnow is I'm literally physically
in Tunisia and I am living anomadic life trying to figure
out where I'm going next and Idon't know the answer to that.
(03:48):
And it's been a reallyinteresting year that I have
felt more guided from above thanI ever have in my life.
So that's kind of like okay,that's the.
You know, if you have a movie,you see the end at the beginning
and then you can fast forwardto say how did I get to this
crazy place?
You know I've been into, youknow I've always been kind of
(04:09):
that explorer type ofpersonality.
I think that you know now I'mgoing to you know date myself,
but it was mid 80s and ShirleyMacLaine was coming out with her
book and her mini series Out ona Limb, and that I mean that
covers a lot of ground, thatbook and that and that story.
(04:30):
And like she covered, you know,the whole idea of
extraterrestrials and you know,beings not from here, and I'm
like okay, and then of course,the whole idea of reincarnation
and channeling and spirituality.
And you know, I think thereincarnation element was the
part that really opened up themost for me.
And then I went to a channelermyself back then and they told
(04:53):
me all kinds of reallyinteresting things about who I
was and what my past was.
And they told me I could dohealing and I never even thought
I could.
And so there's so muchexploration of that and watching
how that changed my life.
And then the next big leap wasMichael Newton's books, which
I'm sure you've probably read,you know, the Journey of Souls
and Destiny of Souls, and whatis it like on the other side and
(05:17):
what do we do when we're nothere.
So all of those kinds of thingskind of took me to another
level, and another level All ofit was introspective.
So it really wasn't until 2006when I wrote my first book,
which is nonfiction and it'scalled Five Reasons why Bad
Things Happen.
So when people say everythinghappens for a reason, I say yeah
(05:40):
, I wrote the book on it and sothat's kind of.
You know, I'll pause because Iwant you to.
I know you'll want to ask, yeahno, no, no.
Speaker 1 (05:48):
I like that you brought that up.
I have to be honest with youabout that phrase.
Everything happens for a reasonis actually my, one, of my, one
of my like because I don't andI love.
I think we should always haveopen conversation.
I don't believe that everythinghappens for a reason.
(06:12):
I believe that if a human beingis present and intelligent and
being guided, that they can turnanything that occurs into a
learning opportunity and a wayto level up.
I think for me, as a child ofthe, I think it's probably has a
lot more to do with my ownhistory, which isn't that the
way it is with all of us Growing?
up in care.
A lot of the things that I sawhappen to children are what
convinced me that everythingdoes not happen for a reason you
cannot, and to tell people thatwhen they've been severely
traumatized, it's a little likereally.
So I'm curious about yourthoughts on that.
Speaker 2 (06:35):
Yeah, I know, I'm really glad you brought it up
because I love looking atdifferent perspectives of it.
Right, and and I do startthere's a couple of anecdotes
about that I do start the bookwith what I call nine basic
assumptions and I say if thesebasic assumptions resonate with
you, then I will explain all thebad things, and I have a list
of maybe 100 bad things and howeach of the five reasons can
(06:58):
explain them.
The other kind of anecdote onit is I'm sure you probably have
heard about the book when BadThings Happ happen to good
people.
Yeah, and I met Rabbi Kushner,who wrote that book, and he read
my book and he came back andsaid, no, he thinks everything's
random.
And what that led me to do ismore research and found some
(07:24):
really solid research thatactually says that people who
believe things happen for areason are happier than those
who don't.
Speaker 1 (07:30):
That makes sense.
It actually makes sense, but Ithink that's kind of like that
ignorance is bliss.
Well, I'm sorry, that's apersonal, obviously.
That's my own opinion.
Speaker 2 (07:39):
Well, no, I mean, it is no, but it is.
In fact, the research comesfrom somebody, a brilliant
psychologist, one of the leadersin in that world, named Albert
Bandura, and he even says, like,even if you're wrong, you're
still happier, right.
So I mean, your, your point isactually a valid one and I again
(07:59):
I don't.
You know, I'm not going to puta stake in the ground, but I but
if you read my book, I thinkyou would see that you just said
there's a lesson in it.
My book doesn't get into thatparticular book doesn't get into
reincarnation.
I got into writing more fictionabout that.
So you know, as far as childrenbeing born a certain way and
that kind of thing, but what itdoes is it helps you look at
(08:24):
kind of.
You alluded to it.
There might be a lesson in it,there might be something that
you can use to propel you to thenext step, and if you can look
at it that way, then you canturn it into an opportunity.
And so you know, and I wrote itwhen I was going through a
really, really difficult timeand I had a business fail.
I went through bankruptcy,foreclosure of, and I had a
business fail.
I went through bankruptcy,foreclosure of my house, a
(08:47):
relationship ended, my dog died.
I mean, like all of thesethings were happening at once
and I just isn't that the way?
Speaker 1 (08:52):
it always is it always seems like it.
Yeah Well, when I talk aboutthis a lot, we have to get to a
place of such emotional painthat we're ready to actually
change our thought habits, andthat that takes serious shadow
work.
And to take on serious shadowwork usually means getting the
shit scared out of you yeah, infact, I explain shadows, too in
my book.
Speaker 2 (09:11):
Um, so for me, it was like the most, it was bliss.
It was bliss because I wasgetting those answers that I was
looking for, and so, um, andthe the big reason why the thing
that all five things have incommon is to get you to change
something, which is is exactlywhat you're saying, right, yeah,
it is to propel you to anotherlevel and another lesson and
(09:32):
another learning.
And you know, I've been throughsome really tough times.
You know, as I said, I've beenaround for a while and they're
not easy, but if you keep amindset of, what can I learn
from this?
How can I?
What needs to change in my life?
What is this trying to get me?
To nudge me to anotherdirection?
Um, I, I, I feel like it can beextremely helpful.
(09:56):
So, um, and not everybody'sgoing to resonate.
you know that's fine yeah.
Speaker 1 (09:59):
And and I I can argue because, because you know
spiritual folks, we like to wecan argue multiple.
Well, some of us can.
If you're Nora Spicy, you knowwhat I'm talking about.
I can argue multiple points ofview and agree with all of them.
I was thinking about when youwere saying that so in my family
the women have repeatedly beenharmed by men.
I mean, it's just literallyrepeated throughout the history
of the women in my family and itstopped with me, I mean,
(10:25):
although I did have my share ofcreepy experiences.
Those creepy experienceshappened and I could see the
pattern in my family.
I knew it when I was young andI think it was the lesson in
seeing the vulnerable beingvulnerable, being in vulnerable
situations.
It was a consistent threadthroughout the history of my
family because the women hadshit taste in men Sorry, but it
(10:47):
was true and it put them in alot of repeatedly dangerous
situations and and things happenfor a reason Like, if I turn
that phrase around, it happenedto me because of a history in my
family and it was a lesson thatI could learn within that
moment when it, when it was timefor me to say the buck stops
here.
I mean I'm I'm trying to thinkof, like how do you, how do I
(11:08):
turn that around where I don'tdisagree with it, but but I can.
I can argue both ways.
Speaker 2 (11:13):
Yeah, yeah, well, and I, I guess I'm, but you know
we're getting deep here, whichI'm I love to do is is do you
believe that and this doesactually is addressed as one of
the and within the basicassumptions that that do you
believe that, before we're born,that we have some choice in
those decisions about who we'reborn to and some key, at least
(11:37):
some key things that we thinkmight happen?
Speaker 1 (11:40):
Yeah, I remember and this was really weird to know
when I was, when I was from thetime I was born, I was like I
had psychic experiences at likea year and a half, which I think
everybody's psychic.
I just I had had enoughweirdness around me that I was
really tapped into it, but,excuse me, I just lost your
question.
What did you ask me?
Speaker 2 (12:01):
Well, I was now.
I was like following you going.
I was like going.
I was like, well, that soundsreally.
I said did you think you wereplanned that that, yes, you made
some decisions about your lifewhen I was.
Speaker 1 (12:12):
Yeah before I came back for this lifetime, which is
something that I had, a.
I struggled to say that outloud and to take it seriously
because it was so hard to even Icouldn't talk to anybody about
it because they were like youmight want to be quiet.
Um, I remember the conversation.
I remember being asked are yousure you want to make it this
hard?
And I said I want to make it mylast lifetime, uh, my last trip
(12:37):
.
And they were like, okay, well,you asked for it.
And I remember thinking, oh,was that a mistake?
And then it was like when Iwake up in this, this baby's
body.
Speaker 2 (12:46):
Yeah, well, you know, in fact I, when you're talking
about children, I actually wrotea children's book, um and um,
and there's a verse in it thatsays we decide on our lessons,
the paths we will take, awardswe might go for and mistakes we
might make.
For life Isn't easy and notalways fun, but easy is boring,
like games, always won.
Speaker 1 (13:05):
Ah, I love that.
Speaker 2 (13:12):
It's like wait a minute, you know that's and
that's where kind of I thinkfree will happens in two places,
right.
One is as we're choosing whatlife we're going to go into, and
then, once we get here, it'skind of like, I think it's like
a roadmap, and we decide do wego right, left, Do we zoom
through the intersection, Do wetake the high road or the low
road?
You know, do we go off road?
Potentially?
So?
So anyway, that's that's tiedinto all of that.
(13:34):
Yeah, it's just.
I mean, you'll have to see ifyou read the book, If, if you go
, oh yeah, okay, now I get whereshe's going, yeah.
Now of course I have to it's nota lecture, you know, but it is
an opportunity to go just tofeel so much better about, um,
you know, about the AlbertBandura who I was mentioning is
(13:54):
like he calls it self-efficacy.
That you have some, you feellike, okay, wait a minute, I do
have some.
Agency is the big word thesedays.
You know, I have some agencyhere in this life.
I'm not just a victim, that's a, that's a in some random world.
You know that there is somesort of, even Einstein, you know
, when asked, he's like therehas to be some infinite
intelligence that created thisstuff.
(14:15):
I mean, this is toowell-designed to be accidental.
This whole world, so, so,anyway, that's that's where I
got into the first book.
Speaker 1 (14:25):
You know, yeah, yeah, no, I, I love that you wrote
that and and I I will read it.
I, I haven't.
It's interesting, I read, Ithink I might.
I used to read voraciously.
I always had two books in mypurse.
I was always reading at leastone, if not three, books at one
time for decades.
Like I counted once I was likewell, it's been at least 3000
books, it may even be 5,000.
(14:46):
Um and then, uh, and then I hadmy spiritual awakening and I
have not read a book all the waythrough since I had it.
I mean, I've written three.
Speaker 2 (14:55):
Well that you, you probably maybe went from student
to teacher.
Speaker 1 (15:00):
you know, like um, unless you were asking about um,
so yeah, yeah, so so the thething is is that I I will read
your book because I think it'sreally important to to to seek
different perspectives,particularly in things that
bother you.
So, like that phrase bothers me, and I think when you see that,
about anything, it is thewisest thing that you can do to
(15:22):
challenge your why you'redigging your heels in on it, and
that that allows you to diginto your own junk.
Speaker 2 (15:29):
Well, and it could easily be you reigning somebody
who used it in a way that was acruel way as opposed to a
supportive way.
You know that would be kind ofmy guess.
Speaker 1 (15:38):
Yeah, that would.
That would fit.
I had my foster motherthroughout high school years was
one of those.
She was one of those like superreligious, super well-respected
, super spiritual, like had thelibrary introduced me to all
sorts of like I love.
I really I have this love haterelationship with with her
because she is one of thefoundational elements to my
spiritual journey.
I was put into her house for areason you know and could go
(16:01):
back to what you say like I or Iturned it into a reason.
I learned so much from her, butat the same time, she was also
she could be incredibly cruelwith comments like that.
So so you wrote your first bookand you were just drawn to
mystical things, was it?
Was there like a moment whenyou like had an aha moment?
Speaker 2 (16:22):
I mean, I think there was well, I'd say, one of the
things that was.
The most profound thinghappened around then is I got a
little bit exposure to the Hunareligion.
I don't know if you're muchfamiliar with Huna I'm not.
I wouldn't put myself as anykind of expert or even student
of Huna but there was one aspectof it that was profound in
terms of changing my life, and Ido talk about it in that
(16:45):
particular book, which is the.
Huna is more like psychology101, and the big thing that
makes it distinctive is thatyour higher self has its own
name.
You have your name and then yourbody has its name hmm, and when
you find out the name of yourbody and there are like three
(17:05):
different entities, they've gotthree different levels of energy
.
The soul chooses your body andbecomes you.
Right, and when I wrote thebook, when I realized the body
is the subconscious, that was abig okay.
Now everything has changed andwith Huna naming your body, and
then you can basically treat herlike a separate entity and you
(17:27):
can say who are you?
And you can kind of imaginewell, what if my soul had chosen
your body or vice versa, howdifferent we would be.
Speaker 1 (17:36):
Yeah, I like that actually a lot.
I think it really fits If youtalk to your spirit guides or
your higher self.
I think that feels like a verynatural process to do.
But I like that because ithelps sort of divorce you from
sort of your attachment to this.
Speaker 2 (17:53):
It does yeah, it does .
It's a separate energy.
And then when you do, you know,like the things that you do,
one of the reasons, um, why badthings happen is subconscious
sabotage, right, and it's whenyour body doesn't want to do
something that you want it to do, right.
So, like one of the things thatI have a story in there is a
(18:13):
friend of mine who was aworkaholic and she was going it
was Labor Day weekend and shewas going to work all weekend.
She goes out to get Thai food,guess what, she trips over the
curb and she's in bed allweekend.
Her body was like I am notfreaking working, okay, you are
not going to make me do that.
And those kinds of things arewhere we can have that body,
(18:33):
part of us, that consciousnessat that body level that's tied
to the earth, that's got allthat genetic memory, all that
kind of um, ancestry, all ofthat stuff's tied to the body,
personality, and.
But when you get to know her andyou're friends with her, you
can say what do you want to dotoday?
And you can also say, hey, ifyou don't mind, we can spend the
next three hours working onthis project or we can finish it
by noon, then I'll let you playthe rest of the day.
(18:56):
They will totally go on, youknow.
So that was a big thing isgetting to know her, because
then all of a sudden, like oneof the big changes in my life
was eating, was conscious, everybite.
I can tell you every bite thatI eat, and people kind of like,
wow, I'm just watching me, butit's like I remember it because
I'm I'm so connected to her allthe time that I know what she
(19:19):
wants and she and I, if she eatssomething naughty, we're
enjoying it together, notsneaking it.
You know like, because youprobably know the experience you
eat something and you forgotyou ate it yeah, yeah,
absolutely.
It's when your body is going oh,I've got an opportunity, I'm
going to go in and do this, soanyway, that was a big thing at
that time.
Um, it wasn't until a number ofyears later that I went through
(19:41):
some, a lot more other thingsbut also thought I'd write
fiction.
And I I never thought I would,and boy did I did.
It open up a lot, and my firstnovels series of novels are a
kind of a love story, so it goesinto past lives and you know,
the first first book is kind oflike your typical kind of love
(20:02):
story, and then the second onegets into their past lives and
starts adding all thosedimensions to it.
And I found something reallypowerful there in that sometimes
fiction opens minds better thannon-fiction oh I.
Speaker 1 (20:15):
I think that's actually what our science
fiction writers do on a subtlelevel.
Our science fiction writers areinforming people of our
potential futures, but they'redoing it in sort of a dramatic,
playful, entertaining way wherepeople can handle it and deal
with it.
But almost everything theywrite comes true or or it gets
prevented.
Speaker 2 (20:34):
Right, right, I mean that's the paradox.
Right, because they can saythis is going to happen, but
then, if you know it's going tohappen, then you can prevent it
and then it doesn't happen.
So, yeah, that was you know.
That led that led to you knowscreenwriting, to this knowledge
that telling stories can reallychange the world.
Speaker 1 (20:52):
Um, oh, yeah, I mean that goes back to folk, the
folklore.
When you think of folklore, Imean if you think about, even
say, like a character like jesuswhich, if you know, if
anybody's read some of my stuff,I believe he was a human being
that achieved christ, achievedthe highest levels of
consciousness, and then told uswhat to do.
You know how to actuallyachieve that and his words got
(21:12):
turned around.
That's for another day.
I did want to go back tosomething you said really quick
about the body.
So you're so I mean I love thatyou shared that the body really
does.
The body will expresssubconscious, a poisoned
subconscious, through making yousick like if you're if you're
(21:32):
not listening to it.
Speaker 2 (21:33):
It's kind of like look, the good.
Analogy is like if you have adog I don't know if you have a
dog or have ever had one or seenpeople with their dogs and
they'll go for a walk with thedog and then the dog runs off
and so often they'll yell at thedog right, come back here.
But if they go, come on, it'smore fun over here.
The dog's like whoa, I'm goingwith you.
(21:53):
I mean, we need to treat ourbodies like that.
Speaker 1 (21:56):
Yeah, yeah, yeah that's not yell at it and get
mad at it.
Speaker 2 (22:00):
But like what?
How can we make this fun?
Because, like, my body loves toexercise and people don't.
People like, oh, my bodydoesn't want to.
Well, it's probably becauseyou're trying to yell at the dog
instead of let's fun over here,kind of thing, and you're, and
you make sure that that's whereyou know where you're in that
connection with the body.
Speaker 1 (22:18):
So I don't think I don't think it helps.
Actually, because we'resurrounded by imagery that gives
the impression that exercise issupposed to be painful and
supposed to be laborious andsupposed to be a duty, and, and
you see, all these influencerpeople who who do these absurd,
ridiculous workouts that youknow 99.9% of the population do
not need to be doing, and itmakes people think it's supposed
(22:40):
to be dreadful.
But you have to find ways toadd fun, um into it.
Uh, yeah, you know, uh, the,the, what the body keeps the
count when we're like.
For me, in my case, I lost 80pounds when I finally started to
pay attention and listen, whenI had my spiritual awakening.
Now, granted, I did fast and Idid begin to finally work out,
(23:02):
but I really believe a lot ofthat weight loss was just me
finally turning within.
Speaker 2 (23:07):
Yeah, in fact, I, I, I, I I've got the this new
project, the heroes playbook,but I started working on one
that was a forgiveness one, andone of the activities in there
is the weight of forgiveness,and if you look at the, you know
that I really think that thereis an angle of this, like we are
literally holding on weight.
That is, that we need torelease so that we can um, and
(23:32):
then we do, and forgiveness is abig one, um, so.
So there's a lot of kind of thepsychological aspect of what's
happening to us physiologically,um for sure, um, and sometimes
it's learning to love your bodyjust as it is and not trying to
change too much either, you know.
So there's you know there's alot of that.
Speaker 1 (23:53):
So you, you have a, so you've been on an incredible
adventure.
You've written a lot ofdifferent types of things,
things you've definitelyexplored so many areas of
metaphysics and now you've got abook that I I mean, I love.
I want to hear about the, the,your latest project, because I
really believe every personneeds to to accept that they're
on a hero's journey.
We all are, like most of theentertainment that we embrace
(24:15):
and admire the most popularentertainment in the world, like
Harry Potter, you know his, hisdark materials, the main
characters on a hero's journey,and that's why we love it so
much.
Although as somebody who grew upin an orphanage, I do find it
interesting that so many ofthose characters grew up in
orphanages, which is a wholeother topic for another
conversation.
Speaker 2 (24:36):
Well, that is part of the archetype of the hero in a
lot of the Joseph Campbell stuff, like you know, or that they
were, you know, somehow orphanedor you know, because I think
part of that is that the mindsetis that they are free, they
don't have parents holding themback from going on their journey
, right, they don't, like youknow, and and you know it
started well, it startedthousands of years ago, but in
(24:58):
terms of really understandingthe heroes Hero of the Thousand
Faces, the Joseph Campbell,looking at mythology and even
Jesus you mentioned, you know,classic hero's journey I mean
you can't get, you know, kind ofmore definitive than that and
and so so, yeah, and I wasthinking I was, so I was working
on that and and I just, youknow it was one of the most fun
(25:20):
I've ever had working onanything, was working on this,
and you know I'm just going toflash it, but it's a whole
series of activities, of allkinds of things that that you
know, that people go through andit takes them through.
I use the Christopher Vogler 12steps instead of the 18 Campbell
steps, but there's a lot ofdifferent kinds of activities
(25:42):
looking at archetypes andlooking at Enneagrams and
looking at, you know basicstorytelling elements and so
it's a kind of a book that youknow it's it's for the hero in
all of us is kind of the messageand that you know you can
either use the book as a selfdevelopment.
You can use it if you're awriter and you were writing a
(26:02):
story and you want to delvedeeper into your characters.
You can use it for memoirwriting, you can.
If you're a coach, you can useit with your coaching clients.
I have a writing coach who'sgot who's going to have all of
his students, you know, buy thebook and he's going to use it in
his classes.
So it's, it was really, reallyfun creating it and you know I'm
(26:27):
just excited because it's brandnew, so it's just getting out
now.
Speaker 1 (26:30):
Um, yeah, I love that , I love that you did a workbook
for that.
I don't, I really don't.
I think of if, if most, thevast majority of people could,
um, really embrace the idea thatthat everything they've been
through is part of this grandadventure of discovering
themselves and going within andlearning how to command their
energy, which is really whatwe're here for to learn to
(26:51):
command our energy, to stay inthe higher levels of vibration.
If we really understood that wedwell in victim mentality and
the survival paradigm andfear-based living.
That's where I spent the vastmajority of my adult life and
it's such a way to live and it'sa choice.
But we're not taught that it's achoice.
We're taught in this worldthrough media and society, uh,
(27:15):
that it you know, once you'revictim, that's what you blame,
and then that becomes who youare and your personality and and
it's, you know, sort of scarsyou for life or whatever, and it
becomes your crutch and it'sjust simply not true.
And when people actually acceptthat they're, that they have
the power over that experienceand that they are a hero and
everyone is, and that we're allsand and on the beach, nobody's
(27:36):
more special than the other,which is I really dislike
celebrity culture because Ithink it reinforces and I worked
in it for a really long timeand I loved all those people I
worked with but I really thinkit reinforces the idea that some
of us are more special thanothers, and I and and so I love
that you wrote this book, so ifsomebody was at any point on
their spiritual journey, this isa great book for them to work
with.
Speaker 2 (27:56):
Yeah, I mean it's, it's there's, if, if you're on a
spiritual journey, you're goingto read it at a lot deeper
level and level and you're goingto see, you know, like there's
just some really simpleactivities.
This I don't know the first one, but like this is the well,
there's a couple.
Well, like one is just get aregular dice, you know six-sided
dice, and you roll the dice andthat's going to give you the
(28:18):
answer to the question you'relooking for and you're like,
okay, that's fun, you knowwhatever, and there's a list of
the six answers.
You know whatever and there's alist of the six answers.
You know that kind of like amagic eight ball.
But the message within that isif you got an answer, that you
don't like.
Speaker 1 (28:36):
now you're onto something Right.
Speaker 2 (28:37):
It helps to find out what you don't want.
And yeah, I get clear on that.
So, like, all of a sudden, yourealize that one thing looks
really lighthearted and simple,right.
And then there's another onethat's like list your greatest
hits, right, and that can beyour for the year or that can be
in a certain arena.
So there's some of them that'slike this seems really light and
(28:58):
airy.
And then all of a sudden you'relike no, it's really really
deep.
Like I was talking to a coachwho wants to use it in all these
big, great, grandiose trainingsand workshops and you know all
these kinds of things and I, oneof the activities is your
blossom, right, right, and it'slooking at what are your flaws.
(29:18):
And she was like at first likeno, no, no, people don't have
flaws.
I'm like no, no, no, if youlook at heroes, we don't like
the heroes that don't have flaws.
We want the heroes that haveflaws.
Then we can relate to them.
So that's the kind of thingthat's fun and light and you can
think, and there are referencesto Star Wars and you know
(29:38):
movies and things like that.
But you know, then you startthinking wait a minute, that's
true.
What kind of heroes do I like,who do I want to emulate?
And you know, most people,would you know, pick an Iron man
over a Captain America,sometimes because they too
perfect is too perfect.
Speaker 1 (29:56):
Right, yeah, yeah, actually, iron man was likable
for, for the, for the flaws, thequirks yeah, exactly, he was
more human.
But super human, obviously, yeah, but sat and sassy and, and you
know you, yeah, I know I lovethat.
You say that and I think I, uh,you point out something that's
really important too is that, um, perfectionism is is a trauma
(30:21):
response, and when we feel theneed to to, to constantly hold
ourselves to such a rigidlyperfect standard, um, it's not
normal.
It's a behavior that we've been, we've learned by our mistakes,
being used against us and, uh,and, as you age it, it can be
really awesome at work, and workwill use it to burn you right
(30:42):
out.
Uh, you'll use it to burnyourself out eventually, and,
and, recognizing that your flaw,your flaws and, frankly and
that is actually bearsmentioning you know, when you're
doing a workbook like this,your flaws, the things, the, the
, the quirks about you, theflaws, the bad, the, the bad
experiences that have been apart of your journey really are
the secret sauce that actuallygive you your unique selling
(31:04):
proposition, the thing that thatactually makes you interesting
and unique in the marketplace.
And when you learn to embracethat instead of run from it
which was my issue for decadesum it gosh boy, does it get
easier?
Speaker 2 (31:15):
It's exhausting.
Speaker 1 (31:17):
It's exhausting, trying to be perfect, so I like
that you have people do that.
When did you is the book out?
Speaker 2 (31:28):
Yes, it is out, it's getting tested.
You know getting kind of doingsome beta testing with some
different people to get somefeedback.
So there'll probably be somevariations that are come along
the road to improve it, but I'mgetting some really amazing
feedback from very high level.
You know coaches, consultants,you know therapists, you know
kind of on all those levels.
And you know, one of my dreamsis that kind of like you're
(31:49):
saying when you're talking aboutyou know what I'd love to see
it get into corporate culture.
Right, I'd love to see it getat a high level and have maybe
an executive coach take theleader through it and then have
a leader take their peoplethrough it, right, and then all
of a sudden, instead of tryingto be perfect, you go okay, yeah
, you know what I messed up onthis.
(32:09):
I didn't make, I didn't do this, you know.
Um, make this right decision orI should have gone at this
other way.
That's that's going to make anorganization more dynamic and
and grow than just trying to bea fear of that.
Speaker 1 (32:22):
Oh, I'm, you know, made up, messed up, yeah, yeah I
know earlier I was hearingabout one of the billionaires
and the way he runs his businessand it's fear-driven and it's
such a stupid, short-sighted wayto run a business.
Uh, the number of times youjust even in my own career, the
number of times I went to youknow the powers that be and said
this brand or company is goingto implode in oh, 18.3 months
(32:47):
you know what I mean.
I had it down to like and I waslike even the reason why is
because of these fundamentalissues that you have and they
couldn't even hear you and youcan't even have those
conversations if people aren'tallowed to be human, because a
lot of the things that peoplesee and are able to express even
, it's that they won't expressthem because they don't want to
be wrong or they won't be seenlike a troublemaker.
(33:07):
And it's such a silly way to runa business where you have to
accept that everybody is humanand if you just show that right
up front, that look, part of usbeing a great team is us
understanding who does what best, who notices certain things and
who, who, uh, the who, whereyour weak spots are, so that we
can help each other.
But it's like you're notallowed to have weak spots.
You know they want to perfectthose too and it's like, but you
(33:29):
know that's actually how a lotof times it's in it's in the
it's in the person, um person'sjourney through that that they
spot some of the issues thatneed to be challenged.
Speaker 2 (33:38):
But yeah, I love that .
Yeah, it makes it really fun,you know.
And then there's like a partabout hero versus anti-hero,
right, and and you know the what, the what are the differences
there?
So there's just it.
There's so many fun things, um,to go through it and um, and I,
I, as I said, I just had somuch fun creating it.
(34:01):
I mean, I just, you know, Ilove my novels.
I came out with some novelslast year that I briefly
mentioned.
That's like this epicreincarnation mystery about a
famous couple from history who'sreincarnated today to fulfill a
prophecy, kind of a DiffingyCode, outlander kind of thing,
and love doing that too.
And this was, you know, adifferent kind of joy.
But I'm, you know, you ask,kind of joy.
But but I, I'm, I'm, you know,I, I, you ask any writer and you
(34:23):
know, as a writer, it'swhatever you're working on right
now is the thing that you lovethe most, right?
Speaker 1 (34:28):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (34:28):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (34:29):
For me it was my second book I I that one really
was very cathartic and fun forme, but obviously always onto
the next thing.
Speaker 2 (34:40):
So what's up next for you?
Well, my latest thing is andI've written it I'm writing it
as a series of short stories andit's the most autobiographical
I've ever gotten, and and it'skind of like when you we started
at the end and then we kind ofcome around to the where I am
now.
I had a writing coach who said,okay, write something.
(35:03):
She calls a reader magnet isthe term.
You probably know what that isin the writing world and it was
like you got to write somethingto be able to offer to people
for free, so that they knowyou're writing, know, learn,
learn about you a little bit.
So I'm writing the story and Iknow you're going to love this,
and and I'm writing the storyand I think I'm going to write
it from the point of view of theupstairs, what I call the
upstairs and I'm writing aboutthis team and all of a sudden
(35:29):
I'm realizing they're telling mewho they are and they are
active in my life, and it's astory about how do you get an
American woman in Colorado tomeet a British man in Tunisia,
and I call it the traffic angels.
Like there's, there's energiesup there, like all those
logistics making sure thisflight gets there and this, you
(35:52):
know, and this team is justhilarious and super fun.
And so I wrote part one, andthen I wrote part two, and then
I just, literally yesterday,finished part three, and so I've
got fans going oh, I can't wait, I can't wait to find out part
three and so.
But it's been wild, becauseI've been in this position, you
know, first time really in mylife that it's been like what do
(36:14):
y'all want?
Okay, I'll just kill, or I'lllisten, or I'll follow, like I'm
.
So I don't know where I'm goingto live next, I just know I'm
here for a little while and thenI'll go somewhere else, and
then I yeah, and they're goingto tell me you know, you're
channeling your, your, you'rechanneling your latest books,
(36:35):
which I think is really cool.
Speaker 1 (36:37):
I love channeling I.
I, I've been doing it for areally long time but in the it
was like my clients would belike, oh, she's gone, she's gone
, she's off in that place andthey're like what, what wise
words like I.
I.
I would never have said to themI'm channeling um, because they
would have been like sorry, uh,but uh, they're like, oh, she's
coming up with an idea, she'sgot an idea.
I'm like, no, I'm actuallychanneling my spirit, guys, uh,
(36:58):
but I think that's, I think thebest artists, the best writers,
the best creators and thecreation process really is a
process of being aligned and inflow, to the point of being able
to channel to what you're doingand it creates such wonderful
you know I think of.
I wonder if the CelestineProphecy do you remember when
(37:18):
that came out?
Speaker 2 (37:19):
Oh, I love that book?
Speaker 1 (37:19):
Yeah, I loved that book.
I didn't love the sequel.
Speaker 2 (37:25):
The third one I kind of did but the.
Sean Law one.
But yeah, I didn't even know.
Speaker 1 (37:31):
There was a third one , but the first one was had a
huge impact.
I was living in Cal.
I think I was living inCalifornia at the time, wasn't
it the early nineties Like?
Speaker 2 (37:39):
it was early nineties .
Yeah, I mean I've beenlistening to James Redfield
speak.
You know that was good for you.
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (37:45):
Yeah, I was super impressed with that book, cause
it was the first time I had readanything, as I, you know, grew
up in a real.
I grew up in a Catholicorphanage and half the time I
was like that isn't even true.
I would get into arguments withmy foster mother Cause she'd
whip out the Bible and quotesomething and then I'd flip a
few pages and quote somethingthat contradicted that.
(38:05):
I was just terrible.
But when I read JamesRedfield's book, I was like, oh
wow, somebody gets it.
What's your?
Yeah, before we go, can youtell me what's your?
What is your favorite book?
Do you have a favorite book?
Tell me what's your.
What is your favorite book?
Do you have a favorite?
Speaker 2 (38:20):
book oh boy, that's a .
That's a very interesting one.
I hadn't really thought aboutthat.
I mean, I guess I, I guess I goback to some of the early
Richard Bach books, likeIllusions and A.
Bridge Across Forever, kind ofthe some that was so formative.
So you know, I mean there'sobviously lots of contemporary
stuff that I love and that Iread all different kinds of
(38:42):
things, but but those are theones that you know really like
that.
Ok, that changed everything.
Speaker 1 (38:50):
Yeah, you know Thomas .
So I think it was Thomas SowellSoulmates.
I think that's the book and theauthor.
That was one of those booksthat James Redfield where I was
like, ok, okay, this istransformative, and you knew
khalil gabran's the prophet.
Yes, yeah, that was a.
That was a powerful book.
Uh, anyway, listen to me, Icould keep talking to you.
(39:10):
Uh, bronnell, it's been so muchfun getting to know you and
getting to know your content.
Let's see the book again.
You guys, she's going to holdup the book for those who
actually see the video this isthe proof one, so it's got
something across it.
Speaker 2 (39:20):
But, um, the hero's playbook is the is the new one,
so please check that out, and mynovels.
And I've got a facebook groupcalled life is a trip
reincarnation stories group, soplease join.
Um, we love stories and, uh,just, you know, just love to
stay in touch with, withlike-minded people yeah,
absolutely, and your and yourwebsite.
Speaker 1 (39:40):
It's Brownell, landrum right.
Speaker 2 (39:42):
Yeah, brownelllandrumcom.
I'm the only Brownell Landrumin the world, so it's pretty
easy to Google me.
Speaker 1 (39:48):
Before we started filming you guys, before I go, I
have to say I was like, okay,what's the deal with the name
Brownell?
And she told me it was themiddle name of your uncle.
Speaker 2 (39:55):
It was my grandfather's middle name, has
grandmother's maiden name and itgoes, goes back to the
Mayflower.
So, um, yeah, it has that ithas that like flavor to it.
Speaker 1 (40:05):
Ah well, thank you so much again, Bronnell, it's been
so much fun to talk to youbefore I go.
You guys hold on, I got to grabmy uh for those of you who see
the video.
Uh, thank you so much forjoining us today.
Uh, if you're not familiar withuh, familiar with my work, I am
a spiritual teacher andthree-time author, shaman Isis,
(40:27):
also known as Cynthia Elliott tomy friends and family, and you
can check out my first book,unleash the Empress, which is my
spiritual practices, memoryMansion, which shares my journey
from Catholic orphanage to PRdiva to finally waking up and
healing my really strangehistory.
If you read the book, you'llknow what I mean.
It's eyebrow raising at somepoints.
Those books also come in myglow up collection, which I
recently launched and is superpopular.
It has my meditations and mynine step course for life
(40:50):
transformation, along with bothbooks and the audio book for
Memory Mansion, which is reallypopular.
So go check those out.
If you're not already subscribedto the podcast, what are you
thinking?
I have amazing guests who talkabout intelligent and
interesting topics.
So be sure and subscribe andcheck out all the other episodes
and you guys have a badass week.
(41:12):
Thanks again for now.
Thank you, bye.
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