April 15, 2025 • 24 mins
Have you ever felt pushed beyond your faith limits? Where you didn’t understand your suffering and felt it was too much to bear? If so, Ellen’s story of seeking God in new and profound ways may bring you encouragement and peace.
Ellen's journey was marked by profound grief and loss. Through the untimely death of her first husband and multiple miscarriages, Ellen's faith was always her source of strength. She could find the blessings in the midst of the pain.
When Ellen faced another life-altering illness with her second husband, the ways she had previously connected with God no longer provided comfort and she felt as if she were in a spiritual desert.
In a moment of vulnerability, Ellen cried out to God and experienced a powerful vision of Mary, the Blessed Mother, whose presence brought peace and clarity. She realized her suffering was an opportunity to unite her pain with Mary's own trials, finding solace in the shared experience. This newfound understanding allowed Ellen to embrace her suffering with dignity, knowing she was not alone.
Please join us on Ellen’s inspiring journey of perseverance and growth. When you need it the most, we hope Ellen’s story encourages you to trust in God and take one more step!
Our goal with this episode is to move at least one heart toward God -- is it yours? Let us know! And if you'd like to get involved by becoming a storyteller or donating to the movement, please visit:
Web: godisgoodpodcast.com
Social: www.facebook.com/groups/godisgoodpodcast/
Some of our episodes mention the ACTS Retreat, which is an evangelization retreat from ACTS Missions in San Antonio, TX: www.actsmissions.org.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Carol (00:07):
Welcome to the God Is Good podcast where we share
stories of everyday people whohave reignited their faith in
Jesus and experienced remarkablelife transformations.
My name is Carol O'Brien, andI'm your host for this podcast.
Jeremiah 29 verse 11:"For I knowwell the plans I have in mind
(00:28):
for you, plans for your welfareand not for woe, so as to give
you a future of hope." I feelvery blessed to introduce you to
the newest storyteller to joinour podcast, Ellen.
Ellen and I met a short timeago, but I feel like we've been
friends for years.
She's one of those people whodoesn't ever meet a stranger and
(00:49):
is always willing to jump in andhelp wherever she's needed.
Ellen serves multiple ministriesat church.
And we bonded over serving thehomeless and hungry.
It's a mission that's a passionof both of ours.
Ellen's story is one of hope andgrowth.
Even when we think we can't goon any further, God is ready to
(01:11):
walk one more step with us orfor us.
He asks us to become closer toHim every day, and Ellen is a
beautiful and faith-filledexample of how to do that.
So please join me in welcomingEllen to the podcast.
Hi Ellen.
We're so excited to have youhere.
Ellen (01:30):
Thank you.
It's a pleasure to be here.
Carol (01:32):
So Ellen, if you've heard the podcast, you are probably
aware that I ask all of ourstorytellers about their growing
up periods and their faithfoundation.
Is that something you can sharewith us?
Ellen (01:44):
Oh, I was very blessed.
I was raised in a faith-filledhome.
Now granted it was a very simplefaith.
It was basic.
We went to church every Sunday.
We were involved at Lent andwent to Mass early in the
morning.
We weren't saying the rosarytogether as a family every
night, but we were very aware ofsaying grace.
I was sent to Catholic schoolsall the way through high school.
(02:06):
And then I went on to a Catholiccollege.
So I've always felt verygrateful for my faith.
It has always grounded me.
I always thought it was reallystrong.
It's had its ups and downs, buton the whole, it's always been
there.
Carol (02:20):
So you mentioned your college life-- during that time,
would you say your faith wasvery strong?
Do you feel that you were onfire for Jesus?
Ellen (02:28):
It was Catholic College, All girls school, you know, back
in the day.
So this was late sixties, earlyseventies.
We thought we were really cool.
We were transitioning from beingthat very traditional woman to
being that kind of out thereperson.
So going to Mass every week,even though we had the option to
go to Mass, didn't mean wealways were going there.
(02:49):
So it was always a part of mylife, but I didn't see it as
being as critical as like I donow.
Now it feeds me.
Carol (02:57):
Oh, I love how you described that, that the Mass
feeds you.
That's wonderful.
And it leads us up to a point inyour story where you met your
husband.
Can you tell us about this?
Ellen (03:08):
You'll find out I'm the queen of blind dates.
My first husband was a blinddate.
He went to Notre Dame.
My best friend went to St.
Mary's College, which was thesister school for Notre Dame.
She and her soon-to-be husbandfixed the two of us up.
If I had known what was involvedin marrying John, I probably
would've said no because he wentinto television news and I had
(03:31):
been an incredible homebody.
I went to a college that wasonly 30 minutes away from mom
and dad.
I was locked in at the hip andhere I married this man that we
moved six times in eight years.
That's what you do intelevision.
You start at very small stationsand then move up the ladder.
When we were forced into thesemoves, I was forced to grow.
(03:53):
There's an expression grow whereyou're planted.
I found out that either I wasgonna grow where I was planted
or I was gonna just fall apart.
And so I learned to stretchmyself and reach out to people
that I didn't know, to createconnections, to get involved in
the community, the children,their schools.
(04:13):
We eventually wound up inPhiladelphia, which was great.
But then he got an offer to goand be a consultant for
television news in Cedar Rapids,Iowa.
And we wound up living there for19 years.
That was where we raised ourfamily.
We had a wonderful marriage,very stable.
I could always talk to him.
Carol (04:33):
It sounds like it was really wonderful.
So your husband's career wastaking off and your family was
growing.
What was happening with you atthat point, Ellen?
Ellen (04:43):
The older two children are three years apart and we had
wanted that third child.
Then I went through a series ofmiscarriages.
So there were three miscarriagesin a row.
The first one you kind ofconsiderate just a fluke, and it
was just something that justhappened.
Now the second one.
John traveled an awful lot andit always seemed like if there
was gonna be a family crisis, hemade sure he was out of town.
(05:07):
So I was probably only eight ornine weeks.
It was not very long, but again,started showing symptoms that I
was going to lose this baby.
My parents actually drive thefour and a half hours from
Chicago to come in and help asthe doctor had put me on
immediate bedrest.
The night that I had themiscarriage, my mom and dad were
there.
(05:27):
Neighbors had taken the childrento a pizza parlor to get them
dinner.
And it was a type of place wherethey had those old fashioned
gumball machines and the littleones had gotten into the
gumballs.
Peter was three.
He had gotten a gumball and hestarted to choke.
Everyone-- the ladies were in apanic.
(05:47):
A stranger came, picked up,Peter.
Popped the gumball out of hismouth and disappeared.
They got Peter all sorted andwhen they went to find this
person, they were gone.
I will not believe anythingother than it was an angel.
On the way to the hospital thatnight, my mom and I cried.
(06:07):
I said, God showed me veryclearly that I was not gonna be
able to keep this baby, but thatI would still have Peter.
It just helped so much.
It took so much of that painaway.
So that was a miscarriage numbertwo.
Well, by the time we got to thethird miscarriage...
I again, the pain of themiscarriage.
Just emotionally, every womanthat's ever had a miscarriage
(06:30):
will tell you those babies arevery, very real from the second
you find out that you'repregnant.
I don't think I was angry withGod as much as I was just
disappointed.
And at that point it was like, Idon't wanna ever, ever, ever go
through this pain again.
We're done.
We are done.
We're not gonna do this.
Carol (06:50):
Oh my goodness.
Having gone through multiplemiscarriages myself, I truly
understand the pain that youwent through.
Miscarriages are so hard tounderstand.
But it sounds like your faithwas really strong.
Were you able to find anypositives throughout the
experience?
Ellen (07:06):
After the miscarriages, one of the blessings that we
were given was that we had anopportunity to become foster
parents for newborns.
That was when Catholic Charitiescame to our church and asked was
there anyone that would beinterested in becoming a foster
parent?
And the mom, if she wasconsidering adoption, she didn't
wanna take the baby home withher.
Where's the baby gonna go?
(07:27):
They needed foster homes and Iwas like, this, we can do.
And that began our two years offoster parenting.
We actually had 13 newbornbabies in two years.
Which was a fabulous experience.
We had a 7-year-old and a4-year-old of our own, and then
we had all these babies comingin and out of the house.
So it kept us, kept meincredibly busy, but also very
(07:49):
joyful'cause I had thatnurturing instinct.
So, on baby number nine, I veryunexpectedly got pregnant with
our last baby.
Carol (07:58):
So many changes.
Were you done at that point withall the changes or were there
more still to come?
Ellen (08:04):
So, Iowa, as I said, it was a great time.
And then his company reallychanged.
The ethics changed and Johnwanted out.
Our youngest was about ready tostart high school, so we moved
1000 miles away from CedarRapids, Iowa.
And he took a job as vicepresident for a dot.com, and he
knew that it was a risk, but itwas one that we felt as a family
(08:27):
we needed to take.
So life was good for me.
Very, very busy, but very, verygood.
We could see God's hand in allof it.
Carol (08:35):
So you had moved away from your school and faith
community and moved across thecountry.
What happened when you gotthere?
Ellen (08:43):
We got here in February of 2000.
By September John found out helost his job.
a then we found out in Januarythat he had terminal cancer.
So less than a year after we hadgotten here, we were just on an
incredible roller coaster athousand miles away from
everybody that we knew, all ofour friends, all of our family,
(09:06):
brand new community.
It was complete disaster.
John's very unexpected illness.
And that was the point whereJeremiah 29 11 and I became
great friends.
Every single night, I would praythat over and over and over
again.
There was a plan.
That there was gonna be hopethat God was not gonna leave us.
(09:28):
Somehow or another this wasgonna come out all right.
And, it truly did.
We were given everything wecould have possibly needed.
The community was amazing.
Everyone just rallied around us.
I had nurses that came in.
The hospice people were great.
There were meals showing up fora year from people I didn't
(09:48):
know.
God gave us everything; we hadeverything we needed.
He died on September 6th, theyear of 9/11.
In fact, we were at Notre Damewith his ashes when the towers
fell.
And it was just a very, verytraumatic time.
You're not supposed to die at51.
Carol (10:07):
Oh, I'm so sorry, Ellen.
I can't imagine the trauma thatyou experienced losing your
husband at such a young age.
Ellen (10:14):
But Jeremiah 29 11, I kept going, there's a plan.
I know there is a plan.
Towards the end of John'sillness, he sat me down and he
said,"Ellen, promise me that ifyou can, you will remarry again.
Promise me." And I was like, mynormal joking stuff,"Yeah,
right?
Who the heck's gonna wanna marryme?" And he's like,"No, I am
(10:36):
serious about this.""All right,I promise you that if I have an
opportunity, I will remarry."Well, God had a plan, and five
years later I met thisincredible Texan.
Total opposite of my firsthusband, but totally, equally as
wonderful.
And we knew instantly that thiswas supposed to be a good thing.
Carol (10:58):
So how did you meet him?
Ellen (11:00):
I was teaching at this point.
I had been teaching preschooland I had been blessed to get a
job teaching kindergarten, justthat little baby step up from
preschool.
There was a teacher across thehall and at one point she said,
"Would you like to meet thisman?
He's incredibly wonderful.
He's handsome.
He's funny.
(11:21):
He's very intelligent." She saidhe's just great but he's not the
marrying kind.
He has been single for 26 years.
He had lost his wife to cancer.
Well, I'm not looking to getmarried, but dinner sounds nice.
So it was a blind date.
They fixed us up.
We made an instant connection.
We were totally different, butvery similar.
(11:41):
He was this Texan, veryindustrial background, here I
was a city girl from Chicago.
We were different, but we bothwere very Catholic.
Both of us had had wonderfulfirst marriages.
We scared our children, becausesix months later we were getting
married.
Carol (11:59):
I can imagine your kids were surprised.
Was life easy from there on out?
Ellen (12:05):
Well, things were going along swimmingly.
We were approaching our eighthanniversary.
At that point we had ninegrandchildren.
Art's job was going well.
I was happy with my job.
Everything was really mellow,wonderful.
We were enjoying each other'scompany.
It was a very happy marriage.
It was one of those years wherewe had Valentine's Day over the
(12:26):
weekend and then went straightinto Lent on Wednesday.
Art got sick and they werethinking it was just the flu.
And so for five days, he wasgetting sicker and sicker and
sicker, wound up hospitalized.
They're still saying flu and hisbody is swelling up.
Finally after five days, theyfigured out that it was not flu,
(12:48):
that he actually had a horribleinfection, and that it was
basically everywhere.
He had had four joints replacedover the years.
This was a number of years afterthat surgery.
Those joints for whateverreason, not just one of them,
which is typical, but all ofthem had developed infection
sites and he was one very, very,very sick man.
(13:13):
Took eight hours of surgery justto clean out those sites, and at
that point there was-- it wasnot looking good.
All of his doctors just shooktheir head, had furrowed brows.
Every time we would say, is heout of the woods?
They'd say, not yet.
So this went on for an extendedperiod of time.
(13:36):
Because of the nature of hisillness, he needed to have
someone with him in the hospital24 hours a day.
He was an intensive care totalof 19 days He also was very
delusional.
He could become very anxious andfrantic.
He would try and get up, and hewasn't supposed to.
(13:57):
He needed more care than evenintensive care nurses could give
him.
And so we were all taking turnsjust trying to provide 24 hour
care.
Spiritually, I was fallingapart.
As day after day went on, I wasgetting angrier and angrier.
I.
(14:17):
I'd look at the ceiling and, andI'd literally yell,"I am not
Job! Why, God, are you doingthis to me again?" Jeremiah 29
11, it wasn't cutting it the wayit had before.
It was like I paid my dues.
I already suffered.
I already lost the love of mylife.
(14:39):
"Why?
Why?
God would you do this to meagain?" It was like I had
already, I already put the coinsin that cash register.
I'm supposed to be getting thepayback.
This is supposed to be the goodpart.
You gave me the gift of awonderful second husband.
Why, God would it look likeyou're gonna take it away?
Carol (14:59):
I imagine all of our listeners would agree with me in
saying that it's completelyunderstandable where you would
be questioning and wonderingwhy, God, why this time, what
was happening here?
And I know it all came on soquickly, especially since you'd
already been through an illnesswith a husband.
Ellen (15:15):
It came on fast, but I could see that it was going to
last long.
There was gonna be a lot of painand suffering, not just for him,
but for me.
And I didn't want to do it.
I'd done it.
I was done.
One night I'd had enough, I wasexhausted, emotionally, a wreck.
I was just totally breaking downand I was so angry with God.
(15:40):
God was over here and I was overhere and there was this big
chasm between the two of us.
Carol (15:46):
I think this might be a good time for a brief pause to
ask you quickly about your faithjourney.
Even with everything that youwent through before, you never
felt that God had abandoned you?
And if not, what was sodifferent this time?
Ellen (16:00):
Nope.
Never.
I had always felt like He hadbeen walking with me.
Sometimes I'd be like, why isthis happening?
But very quickly could go,"Oh, Isee part of the plan." It was
like I had seen God take methrough everything.
He was always there.
With John's illness, I feltGod's hand and I saw him all
(16:20):
these places and all thesepeople that had gotten us
through.
But this time I was like, whaton Earth is going on?
Why did you abandon me now?
You gave us all these blessings.
I didn't ask for this man.
You gave him to me.
We have these grandchildren.
We have all our children here.
(16:41):
Everybody's getting along.
We support each other.
And wham, you're gonna take thisall away?
Why would you do this?
I was just mad.
At that point, I couldn't getany more tired.
I couldn't, I couldn't digmyself out.
(17:02):
I was down at the bottom.
Carol (17:04):
At least once in our lives, I think all of us have
been where you were.
Where you just can't take onemore step.
What did you do?
Ellen (17:10):
I went to our parish priest for counseling.
I must have gone through a boxof Kleenex.
One thing he said that reallyresonated with me was he was
like,"Ellen, every sentencethat's coming out of your mouth
starts with I." The whole thingwas about me.
It was my pain, what had beendone to me, what I deserved.
(17:32):
I just hit a brick wall offaith.
And it was definitely an ahamoment.
I had to reevaluate.
And right after that, I waswalking to Palm Sunday Mass in
the hospital.
All of a sudden it was like alight bulb went off and I got
this vision of Mary.
(17:54):
And I was like, what did Marysuffer?
She didn't wanna watch thisperson that she loved so
intensely experience all thatpain, which was exactly what I
was doing with Art.
I was watching his pain.
I was like, Mary had toexperience all this pain, and
she did it just by taking onemore step, one more step.
(18:18):
God's calling me to do that too.
I can't fight the suffering.
I need to walk through thesuffering, and I can't do it
alone.
I have to do it with Him.
I need Mary's support, and I hada very clear vision of not just
her holding me up, but meholding her up in this corridor
(18:41):
as we were walking towards Mass.
I had her elbow and she had me,and we were walking together.
And it was like, Mary, I can dothis if you and your son are
with me.
All of a sudden, I had therealization that I was supposed
to take my pain and my sufferingand unite it with theirs, and
(19:03):
that it was going to be allright.
And that changed everything.
Carol (19:07):
Oh, that's such a beautiful image of you and Mary
carrying each other.
So he did get better.
How long did that take?
Ellen (19:15):
We'd gone from the beginning of Lent to almost the
end of Lent so we're talkingabout over a month.
So at that point, they were ableto say, He's gonna make it." He
did get better, but it was along process.
Multiple hospitalizations,multiple rehab centers, physical
therapy, intravenous IVs at homethat I had to administer.
(19:39):
There was joy.
We got to the good part again,and I was also able to see that,
that I needed to do this.
That God was calling us, both heand I in different ways to tell
the story.
To show that yes, there wassuffering.
Yes, there was pain.
(19:59):
We could take those pains andthat suffering and that there
was hope and that we weresupposed to share that with
other people.
Carol (20:07):
Well, I'm so glad you're here to be able to share that
story with us, and that when youlooked, you were able to see the
plan.
Ellen (20:14):
God really did have a plan.
We've learned the lesson thatit's not worth trying to fight
it.
It's so much easier and so muchmore, if you can say joyful, if
you're able to accept the factthat, yes, I have this pain, but
it's being used for a reason.
Carol (20:33):
I could be wrong, but I don't think God deals in
coincidences.
I think there was a reason thatyou walked this path during
Lent.
Did you celebrate Easter in thehospital?
Ellen (20:44):
They had sent him to rehab; we celebrated Easter in
the visitor lounge of the rehabcenter.
We did get that beautifulEaster, but it was an Easter
where he still was in awheelchair, could not stand on
his own.
He was still one very, very sickman, but we were starting to see
(21:05):
where there was light at the endof the tunnel.
It was close to two years beforehe was really what you would
call recovered.
Well, now, we just celebrated 10years.
He still has the infection.
The infection will always beunderlying but they manage it
with the antibiotics.
He's living a happy, veryfulfilled life where he's still
(21:26):
working.
Life has been beautiful and he'sbeen able to share his story
too.
Carol (21:33):
So there was a point where Jeremiah 29 11 was your
stronghold:"For I know well theplans I have in mind for you,
plans for your welfare and notfor woe, so as to give you a
future of hope." Now, I knowthere was a period where that
scripture wasn't giving you thepeace it had in the past.
(21:54):
Has that changed for you now?
Ellen (21:56):
Hang on just a second.
There's really an extension toit, which I think almost is
exactly where I am now.
Okay.
This is the part that ismeaningful for me now.
"When you call me, when you goto pray to me, I will listen to
you.
When you look for me, you willfind me.
(22:17):
Yes, when you seek me with allyour heart, you will find me
with you, says the Lord, and Iwill change your lot."
Carol (22:24):
Oh, so good.
So God didn't want to change thescripture for you, but just
expand it.
So when you read the fullscripture, and that would be
Jeremiah 29, 11 through 14, Godwas simply asking you to grow.
Ellen (22:40):
I was only focusing on that one little brief part.
But really the second part of myjourney is the second part.
I needed to go to Him.
I needed to seek him.
Before he was always just there,but I guess I went through that
desert where I was like,"whereare you?
Why did you leave?" And I had togo to seek Him and realize that
(23:06):
He never left me.
He was always there, but it wasjust not gonna be the way I
wanted it to be.
But that it was still all right;that that plan was meant to give
me hope.
Carol (23:18):
This is such a beautiful faith journey, Ellen.
And I think the timing of thisis so remarkable.
I just heard an episode ofRosary in a Year with Father
Mark-Mary, and he was sayingreally the same thing.
He said, how many times have wegone to the same old places
where we've always found Jesusbefore and then all of a sudden
(23:39):
we can't hear him anymore?
And what God is really asking usto do is to seek him.
To have a bit more perseverance.
And to take one more step.
I know your story is going totouch at least one heart.
And I hope it's encouraging topeople who feel like they've
given everything that they can.
God is asking you to take onemore step, to keep going,
(24:01):
because he's there.
He's there for you.
Thank you, Ellen, for sharingand being with us today.
Ellen (24:07):
Thank you for having me.
Carol (24:08):
And thank you to all of our listeners for sharing your
time with us.
Please do us a favor and likeand follow our podcast so our
storytellers can reach even morehearts and bring them closer to
Jesus.
And remember, friends, God isgood.
Ellen (24:24):
All the time.
Carol (24:25):
Amen.
Welcome to the God Is Good podcast where we share
stories of everyday people whohave reignited their faith in
Jesus and experienced remarkablelife transformations.
My name is Carol O'Brien, andI'm your host for this podcast.
Jeremiah 29 verse 11:"For I knowwell the plans I have in mind
(00:28):
for you, plans for your welfareand not for woe, so as to give
you a future of hope." I feelvery blessed to introduce you to
the newest storyteller to joinour podcast, Ellen.
Ellen and I met a short timeago, but I feel like we've been
friends for years.
She's one of those people whodoesn't ever meet a stranger and
(00:49):
is always willing to jump in andhelp wherever she's needed.
Ellen serves multiple ministriesat church.
And we bonded over serving thehomeless and hungry.
It's a mission that's a passionof both of ours.
Ellen's story is one of hope andgrowth.
Even when we think we can't goon any further, God is ready to
(01:11):
walk one more step with us orfor us.
He asks us to become closer toHim every day, and Ellen is a
beautiful and faith-filledexample of how to do that.
So please join me in welcomingEllen to the podcast.
Hi Ellen.
We're so excited to have youhere.
Ellen (01:30):
Thank you.
It's a pleasure to be here.
Carol (01:32):
So Ellen, if you've heard the podcast, you are probably
aware that I ask all of ourstorytellers about their growing
up periods and their faithfoundation.
Is that something you can sharewith us?
Ellen (01:44):
Oh, I was very blessed.
I was raised in a faith-filledhome.
Now granted it was a very simplefaith.
It was basic.
We went to church every Sunday.
We were involved at Lent andwent to Mass early in the
morning.
We weren't saying the rosarytogether as a family every
night, but we were very aware ofsaying grace.
I was sent to Catholic schoolsall the way through high school.
(02:06):
And then I went on to a Catholiccollege.
So I've always felt verygrateful for my faith.
It has always grounded me.
I always thought it was reallystrong.
It's had its ups and downs, buton the whole, it's always been
there.
Carol (02:20):
So you mentioned your college life-- during that time,
would you say your faith wasvery strong?
Do you feel that you were onfire for Jesus?
Ellen (02:28):
It was Catholic College, All girls school, you know, back
in the day.
So this was late sixties, earlyseventies.
We thought we were really cool.
We were transitioning from beingthat very traditional woman to
being that kind of out thereperson.
So going to Mass every week,even though we had the option to
go to Mass, didn't mean wealways were going there.
(02:49):
So it was always a part of mylife, but I didn't see it as
being as critical as like I donow.
Now it feeds me.
Carol (02:57):
Oh, I love how you described that, that the Mass
feeds you.
That's wonderful.
And it leads us up to a point inyour story where you met your
husband.
Can you tell us about this?
Ellen (03:08):
You'll find out I'm the queen of blind dates.
My first husband was a blinddate.
He went to Notre Dame.
My best friend went to St.
Mary's College, which was thesister school for Notre Dame.
She and her soon-to-be husbandfixed the two of us up.
If I had known what was involvedin marrying John, I probably
would've said no because he wentinto television news and I had
(03:31):
been an incredible homebody.
I went to a college that wasonly 30 minutes away from mom
and dad.
I was locked in at the hip andhere I married this man that we
moved six times in eight years.
That's what you do intelevision.
You start at very small stationsand then move up the ladder.
When we were forced into thesemoves, I was forced to grow.
(03:53):
There's an expression grow whereyou're planted.
I found out that either I wasgonna grow where I was planted
or I was gonna just fall apart.
And so I learned to stretchmyself and reach out to people
that I didn't know, to createconnections, to get involved in
the community, the children,their schools.
(04:13):
We eventually wound up inPhiladelphia, which was great.
But then he got an offer to goand be a consultant for
television news in Cedar Rapids,Iowa.
And we wound up living there for19 years.
That was where we raised ourfamily.
We had a wonderful marriage,very stable.
I could always talk to him.
Carol (04:33):
It sounds like it was really wonderful.
So your husband's career wastaking off and your family was
growing.
What was happening with you atthat point, Ellen?
Ellen (04:43):
The older two children are three years apart and we had
wanted that third child.
Then I went through a series ofmiscarriages.
So there were three miscarriagesin a row.
The first one you kind ofconsiderate just a fluke, and it
was just something that justhappened.
Now the second one.
John traveled an awful lot andit always seemed like if there
was gonna be a family crisis, hemade sure he was out of town.
(05:07):
So I was probably only eight ornine weeks.
It was not very long, but again,started showing symptoms that I
was going to lose this baby.
My parents actually drive thefour and a half hours from
Chicago to come in and help asthe doctor had put me on
immediate bedrest.
The night that I had themiscarriage, my mom and dad were
there.
(05:27):
Neighbors had taken the childrento a pizza parlor to get them
dinner.
And it was a type of place wherethey had those old fashioned
gumball machines and the littleones had gotten into the
gumballs.
Peter was three.
He had gotten a gumball and hestarted to choke.
Everyone-- the ladies were in apanic.
(05:47):
A stranger came, picked up,Peter.
Popped the gumball out of hismouth and disappeared.
They got Peter all sorted andwhen they went to find this
person, they were gone.
I will not believe anythingother than it was an angel.
On the way to the hospital thatnight, my mom and I cried.
(06:07):
I said, God showed me veryclearly that I was not gonna be
able to keep this baby, but thatI would still have Peter.
It just helped so much.
It took so much of that painaway.
So that was a miscarriage numbertwo.
Well, by the time we got to thethird miscarriage...
I again, the pain of themiscarriage.
Just emotionally, every womanthat's ever had a miscarriage
(06:30):
will tell you those babies arevery, very real from the second
you find out that you'repregnant.
I don't think I was angry withGod as much as I was just
disappointed.
And at that point it was like, Idon't wanna ever, ever, ever go
through this pain again.
We're done.
We are done.
We're not gonna do this.
Carol (06:50):
Oh my goodness.
Having gone through multiplemiscarriages myself, I truly
understand the pain that youwent through.
Miscarriages are so hard tounderstand.
But it sounds like your faithwas really strong.
Were you able to find anypositives throughout the
experience?
Ellen (07:06):
After the miscarriages, one of the blessings that we
were given was that we had anopportunity to become foster
parents for newborns.
That was when Catholic Charitiescame to our church and asked was
there anyone that would beinterested in becoming a foster
parent?
And the mom, if she wasconsidering adoption, she didn't
wanna take the baby home withher.
Where's the baby gonna go?
(07:27):
They needed foster homes and Iwas like, this, we can do.
And that began our two years offoster parenting.
We actually had 13 newbornbabies in two years.
Which was a fabulous experience.
We had a 7-year-old and a4-year-old of our own, and then
we had all these babies comingin and out of the house.
So it kept us, kept meincredibly busy, but also very
(07:49):
joyful'cause I had thatnurturing instinct.
So, on baby number nine, I veryunexpectedly got pregnant with
our last baby.
Carol (07:58):
So many changes.
Were you done at that point withall the changes or were there
more still to come?
Ellen (08:04):
So, Iowa, as I said, it was a great time.
And then his company reallychanged.
The ethics changed and Johnwanted out.
Our youngest was about ready tostart high school, so we moved
1000 miles away from CedarRapids, Iowa.
And he took a job as vicepresident for a dot.com, and he
knew that it was a risk, but itwas one that we felt as a family
(08:27):
we needed to take.
So life was good for me.
Very, very busy, but very, verygood.
We could see God's hand in allof it.
Carol (08:35):
So you had moved away from your school and faith
community and moved across thecountry.
What happened when you gotthere?
Ellen (08:43):
We got here in February of 2000.
By September John found out helost his job.
a then we found out in Januarythat he had terminal cancer.
So less than a year after we hadgotten here, we were just on an
incredible roller coaster athousand miles away from
everybody that we knew, all ofour friends, all of our family,
(09:06):
brand new community.
It was complete disaster.
John's very unexpected illness.
And that was the point whereJeremiah 29 11 and I became
great friends.
Every single night, I would praythat over and over and over
again.
There was a plan.
That there was gonna be hopethat God was not gonna leave us.
(09:28):
Somehow or another this wasgonna come out all right.
And, it truly did.
We were given everything wecould have possibly needed.
The community was amazing.
Everyone just rallied around us.
I had nurses that came in.
The hospice people were great.
There were meals showing up fora year from people I didn't
(09:48):
know.
God gave us everything; we hadeverything we needed.
He died on September 6th, theyear of 9/11.
In fact, we were at Notre Damewith his ashes when the towers
fell.
And it was just a very, verytraumatic time.
You're not supposed to die at51.
Carol (10:07):
Oh, I'm so sorry, Ellen.
I can't imagine the trauma thatyou experienced losing your
husband at such a young age.
Ellen (10:14):
But Jeremiah 29 11, I kept going, there's a plan.
I know there is a plan.
Towards the end of John'sillness, he sat me down and he
said,"Ellen, promise me that ifyou can, you will remarry again.
Promise me." And I was like, mynormal joking stuff,"Yeah,
right?
Who the heck's gonna wanna marryme?" And he's like,"No, I am
(10:36):
serious about this.""All right,I promise you that if I have an
opportunity, I will remarry."Well, God had a plan, and five
years later I met thisincredible Texan.
Total opposite of my firsthusband, but totally, equally as
wonderful.
And we knew instantly that thiswas supposed to be a good thing.
Carol (10:58):
So how did you meet him?
Ellen (11:00):
I was teaching at this point.
I had been teaching preschooland I had been blessed to get a
job teaching kindergarten, justthat little baby step up from
preschool.
There was a teacher across thehall and at one point she said,
"Would you like to meet thisman?
He's incredibly wonderful.
He's handsome.
He's funny.
(11:21):
He's very intelligent." She saidhe's just great but he's not the
marrying kind.
He has been single for 26 years.
He had lost his wife to cancer.
Well, I'm not looking to getmarried, but dinner sounds nice.
So it was a blind date.
They fixed us up.
We made an instant connection.
We were totally different, butvery similar.
(11:41):
He was this Texan, veryindustrial background, here I
was a city girl from Chicago.
We were different, but we bothwere very Catholic.
Both of us had had wonderfulfirst marriages.
We scared our children, becausesix months later we were getting
married.
Carol (11:59):
I can imagine your kids were surprised.
Was life easy from there on out?
Ellen (12:05):
Well, things were going along swimmingly.
We were approaching our eighthanniversary.
At that point we had ninegrandchildren.
Art's job was going well.
I was happy with my job.
Everything was really mellow,wonderful.
We were enjoying each other'scompany.
It was a very happy marriage.
It was one of those years wherewe had Valentine's Day over the
(12:26):
weekend and then went straightinto Lent on Wednesday.
Art got sick and they werethinking it was just the flu.
And so for five days, he wasgetting sicker and sicker and
sicker, wound up hospitalized.
They're still saying flu and hisbody is swelling up.
Finally after five days, theyfigured out that it was not flu,
(12:48):
that he actually had a horribleinfection, and that it was
basically everywhere.
He had had four joints replacedover the years.
This was a number of years afterthat surgery.
Those joints for whateverreason, not just one of them,
which is typical, but all ofthem had developed infection
sites and he was one very, very,very sick man.
(13:13):
Took eight hours of surgery justto clean out those sites, and at
that point there was-- it wasnot looking good.
All of his doctors just shooktheir head, had furrowed brows.
Every time we would say, is heout of the woods?
They'd say, not yet.
So this went on for an extendedperiod of time.
(13:36):
Because of the nature of hisillness, he needed to have
someone with him in the hospital24 hours a day.
He was an intensive care totalof 19 days He also was very
delusional.
He could become very anxious andfrantic.
He would try and get up, and hewasn't supposed to.
(13:57):
He needed more care than evenintensive care nurses could give
him.
And so we were all taking turnsjust trying to provide 24 hour
care.
Spiritually, I was fallingapart.
As day after day went on, I wasgetting angrier and angrier.
I.
(14:17):
I'd look at the ceiling and, andI'd literally yell,"I am not
Job! Why, God, are you doingthis to me again?" Jeremiah 29
11, it wasn't cutting it the wayit had before.
It was like I paid my dues.
I already suffered.
I already lost the love of mylife.
(14:39):
"Why?
Why?
God would you do this to meagain?" It was like I had
already, I already put the coinsin that cash register.
I'm supposed to be getting thepayback.
This is supposed to be the goodpart.
You gave me the gift of awonderful second husband.
Why, God would it look likeyou're gonna take it away?
Carol (14:59):
I imagine all of our listeners would agree with me in
saying that it's completelyunderstandable where you would
be questioning and wonderingwhy, God, why this time, what
was happening here?
And I know it all came on soquickly, especially since you'd
already been through an illnesswith a husband.
Ellen (15:15):
It came on fast, but I could see that it was going to
last long.
There was gonna be a lot of painand suffering, not just for him,
but for me.
And I didn't want to do it.
I'd done it.
I was done.
One night I'd had enough, I wasexhausted, emotionally, a wreck.
I was just totally breaking downand I was so angry with God.
(15:40):
God was over here and I was overhere and there was this big
chasm between the two of us.
Carol (15:46):
I think this might be a good time for a brief pause to
ask you quickly about your faithjourney.
Even with everything that youwent through before, you never
felt that God had abandoned you?
And if not, what was sodifferent this time?
Ellen (16:00):
Nope.
Never.
I had always felt like He hadbeen walking with me.
Sometimes I'd be like, why isthis happening?
But very quickly could go,"Oh, Isee part of the plan." It was
like I had seen God take methrough everything.
He was always there.
With John's illness, I feltGod's hand and I saw him all
(16:20):
these places and all thesepeople that had gotten us
through.
But this time I was like, whaton Earth is going on?
Why did you abandon me now?
You gave us all these blessings.
I didn't ask for this man.
You gave him to me.
We have these grandchildren.
We have all our children here.
(16:41):
Everybody's getting along.
We support each other.
And wham, you're gonna take thisall away?
Why would you do this?
I was just mad.
At that point, I couldn't getany more tired.
I couldn't, I couldn't digmyself out.
(17:02):
I was down at the bottom.
Carol (17:04):
At least once in our lives, I think all of us have
been where you were.
Where you just can't take onemore step.
What did you do?
Ellen (17:10):
I went to our parish priest for counseling.
I must have gone through a boxof Kleenex.
One thing he said that reallyresonated with me was he was
like,"Ellen, every sentencethat's coming out of your mouth
starts with I." The whole thingwas about me.
It was my pain, what had beendone to me, what I deserved.
(17:32):
I just hit a brick wall offaith.
And it was definitely an ahamoment.
I had to reevaluate.
And right after that, I waswalking to Palm Sunday Mass in
the hospital.
All of a sudden it was like alight bulb went off and I got
this vision of Mary.
(17:54):
And I was like, what did Marysuffer?
She didn't wanna watch thisperson that she loved so
intensely experience all thatpain, which was exactly what I
was doing with Art.
I was watching his pain.
I was like, Mary had toexperience all this pain, and
she did it just by taking onemore step, one more step.
(18:18):
God's calling me to do that too.
I can't fight the suffering.
I need to walk through thesuffering, and I can't do it
alone.
I have to do it with Him.
I need Mary's support, and I hada very clear vision of not just
her holding me up, but meholding her up in this corridor
(18:41):
as we were walking towards Mass.
I had her elbow and she had me,and we were walking together.
And it was like, Mary, I can dothis if you and your son are
with me.
All of a sudden, I had therealization that I was supposed
to take my pain and my sufferingand unite it with theirs, and
(19:03):
that it was going to be allright.
And that changed everything.
Carol (19:07):
Oh, that's such a beautiful image of you and Mary
carrying each other.
So he did get better.
How long did that take?
Ellen (19:15):
We'd gone from the beginning of Lent to almost the
end of Lent so we're talkingabout over a month.
So at that point, they were ableto say, He's gonna make it." He
did get better, but it was along process.
Multiple hospitalizations,multiple rehab centers, physical
therapy, intravenous IVs at homethat I had to administer.
(19:39):
There was joy.
We got to the good part again,and I was also able to see that,
that I needed to do this.
That God was calling us, both heand I in different ways to tell
the story.
To show that yes, there wassuffering.
Yes, there was pain.
(19:59):
We could take those pains andthat suffering and that there
was hope and that we weresupposed to share that with
other people.
Carol (20:07):
Well, I'm so glad you're here to be able to share that
story with us, and that when youlooked, you were able to see the
plan.
Ellen (20:14):
God really did have a plan.
We've learned the lesson thatit's not worth trying to fight
it.
It's so much easier and so muchmore, if you can say joyful, if
you're able to accept the factthat, yes, I have this pain, but
it's being used for a reason.
Carol (20:33):
I could be wrong, but I don't think God deals in
coincidences.
I think there was a reason thatyou walked this path during
Lent.
Did you celebrate Easter in thehospital?
Ellen (20:44):
They had sent him to rehab; we celebrated Easter in
the visitor lounge of the rehabcenter.
We did get that beautifulEaster, but it was an Easter
where he still was in awheelchair, could not stand on
his own.
He was still one very, very sickman, but we were starting to see
(21:05):
where there was light at the endof the tunnel.
It was close to two years beforehe was really what you would
call recovered.
Well, now, we just celebrated 10years.
He still has the infection.
The infection will always beunderlying but they manage it
with the antibiotics.
He's living a happy, veryfulfilled life where he's still
(21:26):
working.
Life has been beautiful and he'sbeen able to share his story
too.
Carol (21:33):
So there was a point where Jeremiah 29 11 was your
stronghold:"For I know well theplans I have in mind for you,
plans for your welfare and notfor woe, so as to give you a
future of hope." Now, I knowthere was a period where that
scripture wasn't giving you thepeace it had in the past.
(21:54):
Has that changed for you now?
Ellen (21:56):
Hang on just a second.
There's really an extension toit, which I think almost is
exactly where I am now.
Okay.
This is the part that ismeaningful for me now.
"When you call me, when you goto pray to me, I will listen to
you.
When you look for me, you willfind me.
(22:17):
Yes, when you seek me with allyour heart, you will find me
with you, says the Lord, and Iwill change your lot."
Carol (22:24):
Oh, so good.
So God didn't want to change thescripture for you, but just
expand it.
So when you read the fullscripture, and that would be
Jeremiah 29, 11 through 14, Godwas simply asking you to grow.
Ellen (22:40):
I was only focusing on that one little brief part.
But really the second part of myjourney is the second part.
I needed to go to Him.
I needed to seek him.
Before he was always just there,but I guess I went through that
desert where I was like,"whereare you?
Why did you leave?" And I had togo to seek Him and realize that
(23:06):
He never left me.
He was always there, but it wasjust not gonna be the way I
wanted it to be.
But that it was still all right;that that plan was meant to give
me hope.
Carol (23:18):
This is such a beautiful faith journey, Ellen.
And I think the timing of thisis so remarkable.
I just heard an episode ofRosary in a Year with Father
Mark-Mary, and he was sayingreally the same thing.
He said, how many times have wegone to the same old places
where we've always found Jesusbefore and then all of a sudden
(23:39):
we can't hear him anymore?
And what God is really asking usto do is to seek him.
To have a bit more perseverance.
And to take one more step.
I know your story is going totouch at least one heart.
And I hope it's encouraging topeople who feel like they've
given everything that they can.
God is asking you to take onemore step, to keep going,
(24:01):
because he's there.
He's there for you.
Thank you, Ellen, for sharingand being with us today.
Ellen (24:07):
Thank you for having me.
Carol (24:08):
And thank you to all of our listeners for sharing your
time with us.
Please do us a favor and likeand follow our podcast so our
storytellers can reach even morehearts and bring them closer to
Jesus.
And remember, friends, God isgood.
Ellen (24:24):
All the time.
Carol (24:25):
Amen.
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