September 30, 2019 • 34 mins
Stacey Butler, owner of For The Love of Roscoe Dog Grooming, talks to Kim and Michelle about professional dog grooming utilizing reward based dog training techniques and gentle handling. Stacey is also a certified Fear Free groomer and talks in detail about the process to earn that certification, how she has incorporated it into her business, and what impact that has had on her clients and their dogs. Stacey's unique one-on-one approach to how she runs her dog grooming salon offers best practices for the grooming industry to make dogs less stressed and fearful about a trip to the groomer. The Fear Free program has been very beneficial to Stacey's business and has allowed her to distinguish herself from the competition in her area.
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Episode Transcript
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Kim (00:00):
Welcome to Good Dog Nation, the weekly video podcast that's
all about having a good dog.
Hosted by Michelle McCarthy,CDBC, CTAC, leading therapy dog
authority, and owner of CanineHomeschooling; and Kim Merritt,
cofounder of GoodDogInABox.com,GoodDogPro.com, and founder of
the URL Doctor.
This episode is brought to youby GoodDogInABox.com,
(00:22):
reward-based dog training anddog bite prevention products for
families with kids and dogs.
And GoodDogPro.com, the onlinecontent subscription and
community for dog professionalswith reward-based dog training
products, curriculums, andonline courses to educate,
motivate, and positively impactthose that work with dogs.
(00:48):
Now let's join Good Dog Nation.
Hello everyone and welcome toGood Dog Nation, the video
podcast that talks about allthings dogs.
I am Kim Merritt, co- founder ofGood Dog In A Box and Good Dog
Pro, and I'm here with myco-host Michelle McCarthy of
(01:09):
Canine Home Schooling.
Michelle (01:11):
Hello!
Kim (01:12):
And we have as our guest today, Stacy Butler.
So in 2016 Stacy left her careerin nursing to follow her dream
of owning and operating her owndog grooming business.
She opened For The Love OfRoscoe dog grooming in September
of 2016, she is an accreditedpet first aid and CPR through
(01:35):
the Canadian Walks and Wagsprogram, and last year she
became fear free certified intheir grooming program.
So welcome Stacy, we're so gladto have you today.
Stacy (01:44):
Thank you!
Kim (01:47):
So why don't you tell us how the whole thing with dog
grooming came up, how you gotinterested in that, and how you
decided to leave nursing to gointo dog grooming.
Stacy (01:59):
Well, basically, I had a few friends that were dog
groomers that I would just helpout when they needed it at
Christmas in their busy season.
But I have a specialNewfoundland dog named Roscoe,
he had both of his hips removed.
So we went through about ayear-and-a-half of surgeries and
rehabilitation, so he doesrequire a lot of grooming, an
(02:24):
excessive amount of grooming.
Kim (02:27):
No, Michelle and I have been.
We were both Newfoundlandowners, we feel your pain.
Stacy (02:33):
Now I was able to do this at home to a certain point, but
then when he got almost too bigto fit in my bathtub, I needed
to look at Plan B.
And that's when I discovered,nothing against any of the
groomers in my area, but Icouldn't find a grooming shop
that I felt comfortable leavinghim at because of his sort of
(02:53):
disability.
The shops were not set up fordogs like him.
So finally, life is short and weall say, we're going to do
everything later, tomorrow, nextweek, when we retire.
And I just said if I'm going tofail, I'd rather have$5 in my
pocket and be happy than$5million and be miserable.
(03:13):
So I just said,"That's it," andI quit my job and I enrolled in
dog grooming school because thatwas my dream.
So I completed the course andopened my own business two days
after I got my certificate fromthe dog grooming school.
In hindsight, I wouldn'trecommend that, but anyways it's
(03:33):
worked out for me.
I always followed the Fear Freemission from day one.
I didn't know it was the FearFree mission., it was just the
Stacy mission.
And then I learned of the FearFree program and then I waited
and waited because I knew thatthe dog grooming certification
was going to be available soon,but it wasn't yet.
(03:53):
And then finally it was done, Iimmediately signed up, and
couldn't be happier to have it.
I wish all groomers in the worldhad this course.
Kim (04:04):
So tell us about it.
I have known Marty Becker, thecreator of Fear Free, for
several years, I've had hisdaughter McKell on with
different webinars and thingswe've done, and it's just, it's
a fabulous program.
It was started for vet clinicsand has kind of migrated now to
(04:26):
dog trainers and now groomers.
So tell us, what does the FearFree program for groomers look
like?
What does that mean to a petowner?
Stacy (04:34):
Well basically the main focus of it, like all the other
fear free programs, is we try todo absolutely everything we can
to reduce the amount of fear,anxiety, and stress to the pet
during the grooming process.
And that is the end goal.
(04:54):
Dogs don't always love theirgrooming and they don't have to
love it, but they also shouldn'tbe ready for a nervous breakdown
because of it.
There's a happy medium there.
I'm not saying that Fluffy hasto count down the days until he
goes to see the groomer, he's soexcited.
But he shouldn't be suffering amild heart attack either by the
(05:15):
end of it.
So it's all about reducing thefear, anxiety, and stress as
much as possible to make itbearable for them with the least
amount of stress.
Kim (05:26):
So give us some examples of how you do that.
Stacy (05:30):
Choice is a big thing, and there are a lot of things
that are right in front of youthat are common sense you may
not always see until they'repointed out to you.
So giving the dog a choice canmake an entire world of
difference during the groomingprocess.
For example, when I take a dogin the back room to the tub,
(05:56):
most dogs walk happily beside meuntil right when they get to
that tub, and then the brakes goon.
Instant fear, all four legssplayed out like I'm dragging
them to their own death.
And at that point many groomers,not again saying anything bad
about them, but they either pullon the grooming loop to force
(06:19):
them into the tub, and if thatdoesn't work, if it's a 10 pound
dog, many of them will justscoop the dog up and place the
dog in the tub.
But they're removing the dog'schoice in those scenarios.
So what I do instead is hangonto the grooming loop, I do not
pull on it at all.
(06:40):
I do hang onto it so that I'mnot allowing the dog to back up
and go away from the tub, butI'm in no way trying to force
the dog to the tub either.
And there are different waysdepending upon the dog, some
dogs are very food motivated andwith a little piece of liver I
can have them do in cartwheelsin that tub.
But some dogs are like,"I willstarve to death before I get in
(07:05):
that tub." Whether you're usingpraise and love or liver or
whatever the thing is that youfind for that particular dog.
Now when that dog moves one inchtowards me in that tub, I act
like I won the lottery.
Positive reinforcement.
If anybody saw me, they'dprobably have me put into the
(07:27):
psychiatric unit.
I dance and I sing and I makesuch a big fuss that this is the
best dog in the world for thatone inch that they moved towards
the tub.
In a few more minutes, theymight move another inch.
Now when all is said and done,it depends on the dog.
Sometimes it's 30 seconds.
My longest was a Newfoundlanddog, and it was one hour and 27
(07:51):
minutes that I sat in the tuband he sat outside of the tub.
Now that's rare.
It doesn't usually take thatlong.
But the funny part of this storyis after one hour and 27
minutes, the dog entered the tuband sat down beside me in the
tub of his own free will.
So that was a huge win becauseyou have to look long term about
(08:17):
this dog grooming.
He's got 10 years left to begroomed.
I would rather take all thisextra time today and have him
readily and happily walk into mytub, then fight with him every
eight weeks and wrestle him intothat tub.
Michelle (08:34):
For the rest of his life.
Stacy (08:36):
Yep.
So when you remove somebody'schoice, even a human, you think
about it for a moment.
If I'm asking you to come into astore with me and you're not
really sure you don't want togo, and I say,"Well that's too
bad whether you want to go ornot." So I grab you by your hair
and your jacket and I drag youinto that store.
Well, you're going to kick andscream and do everything in your
(08:56):
power to get out of that store.
And the dog is no different.
You have to put yourself intheir shoes.
Kim (09:02):
Well, and kudos to you there.
I'm thrilled to hear that.
Because not every groomer wouldtake an hour and 27 minutes out
of their day.
But I totally can understand andI would have to guess that from
(09:22):
that point on, did that dogwillingly go into the tub for
you?
Stacy (09:27):
Every time after that he followed me and did not put the
brakes on when we got to thetub, he walked in.
Now I know it was an hour and 27minutes, but look at how much
time I spent simply by gettingthat dog in the tub every single
time he came to the shop.
So for me it's a bonus.
(09:50):
I know many people who thinktime is money and, without
getting into this too much, butit also depends on your client.
Because the big problem withpracticing Fear Free most of the
time is not the dog, it's thehuman that brings the dog to the
grooming shop.
They need to be on board, and alot of the times they're not.
(10:13):
And at that point, your handsare tied.
Kim (10:16):
So is that because they don't understand what Fear Free
is, or is that because theydon't practice reward-based dog
training at home?
Stacy (10:24):
I find sometimes it's a little bit of everything, but
the two factors that I've seenin my shop are money and time.
As much as I love dogs, I can'twork for free.
So in the beginning to get thedog used to the grooming, it
takes time.
I always tell people, if yourfive-year-old dog is petrified
(10:47):
to have their nails clipped,this didn't happen in one day.
This has been building for fiveyears, building fear in this
dog.
And a lot of people believe thatthey'll bring the dog to my shop
and I will clip the nails andthere will be unicorns floating
through the sky and everybodywill be happy and sometimes it
(11:11):
takes many visits before I canget the nails trimmed.
So that's many visits, they haveto take time out of their busy
lives to bring the dog to theshop, and they do have to pay
every time.
Some clients would rather Ihog-tie the dog, sit on it while
it wails and I just clip thenails.
They just want it done and theydon't care how I do it.
Michelle (11:35):
Can I ask, Stacy, say someone really does have a dog
that's really terrified andyou're working with them, how
much compliance do you get ifyou ask that client to continue
practicing these handlingexercises at home between
groomings?
Do you get compliance withpeople?
Stacy (11:57):
That's a tough one.
I would say yes and no.
Half of them do comply, half ofthem don't.
The problem is even the onesthey want to comply, but they
have such difficulty at homebecause they're Mom to that dog.
And most of the time dogs arelike night and day from your
home to my shop.
(12:19):
They're completely opposite.
When people come in and tell mehow much Fluffy loves their
bath, I'm like,"Oh good God,this is going to be a
nightmare." But if they come inand say they're all worried, and
they're all anxious, and they'rescared of what how dog will act,
and it might bite me because ithates bath, so much.
I'm smiling because I know thisdog is going to be an angel in
(12:41):
my tub.
I can almost bet you$100 onevery dog that they're opposite
from what the client tells meonce they walk out the door.
Yeah.
Kim (12:51):
So are there different exercises and things that you
tell your clients to do inbetween?
Stacy (12:58):
Yes.
If you're talking about nails, Ifind a big mistake is how we
handle the paws.
People touch the paws, you pickup the paws, which is all fine.
I don't normally have a problemwith a dog letting me touch its
paws so much, but you have tokind of get in there and spread
their toes, move the fur backfrom the nail.
(13:22):
It's all those little thingsthat happen during a nail trim,
it's not just simply touchingthe dogs paw.
You have to go a little bitfurther in handling the paw than
simply placing your hand on it,right?
Because to do a safe nail trim,you have to be able to have a
slightly firm grip.
It's one thing to pick up theirpaws and another to have to
(13:44):
apply any pressure to that pawand hold on to it.
And how much is too muchpressure, right?
If it becomes uncomfortable forthe dog, then you're at a whole
new ball game.
It's not just about the nailsanymore.
Michelle (13:56):
So if we're talking about a dog that has a chronic
injury orthopedic problem, we'repulling that paw forward.
You probably need to sometimeseven do a health intake from
people.
Stacy (14:14):
Oh yes, that's another issue too.
A lot of people don't informyou.
I mean, you can ask questions,but a lot of clients aren't
exactly honest and forthcomingwith what they tell you about
the dog.
So when you get an elderly dog,now I'm not talking about any
health problems other than justa senior dog that has some
(14:36):
arthritis.
I experienced this recently, Ilost my Rottweiler, he was
11-and-a-half, and his kneesweren't good.
Now he let anybody in the worldclip his nails his whole life,
but the last 12 months or so,nobody could get near him to cut
his nails.
(14:56):
He would growl.
So I talked with my vet, andagain, it's something that was
so obvious and made sense, but Ihad not thought about.
She said,"The reason he'sreacting this way is you're
picking up his paw to trim thenail.
You're bending the knee, it'shurting and it's uncomfortable.
It's not the nail trim he'sgrowling about.
You're hurting his knee." Wellthen after I cried and felt
(15:20):
horrible, so I continued togroom him and to cut his nails,
and I found a way to cut hisnails without picking up his
paw.
And he never growled at me andwe had no issues.
But something as simple as thatcan make a world of difference.
Kim (15:39):
So for our pet owners, maybe this is new information,
they'd not heard a Fear Freebefore.
They never even thought aboutwhat type of a groomer they're
going to and how they'rehandling their dog.
Are there long term negativeeffects to a dog that has been
(16:03):
to a groomer who, and I don'twant to say mistreated because
it could simply be be handled bya groomer who perhaps just
doesn't even know that they'recausing the dog pain.
Are there long-term effects fromaccidental or unintentional
mishandling?
Stacy (16:22):
Yes, the biggest one that I deal with is, and I'm not
going to state any names, butthere are a few large pet store
chains that offer grooming.
And I have so many clients withpets that have been traumatized
and now have extreme fear fromthe dryers in the grooming
(16:44):
salon..
And it's because at a big chainlike this where you can walk in,
you don't need an appointment,they have multiple groomers and
they have a high turnover rate.
So you can go 20 times and youmight never have the same
groomer.
Continuity of care goes a longway, too.
You need to get to know thatdog, that dog will respond
(17:06):
better to somebody that'shandled it repeatedly than a
perfect stranger, that's commonsense too.
So in these bigger groomingshops, a lot of the times dogs
will be kenneled, stacked on topof each other, and their cage
dried, which basically is a bighose that attaches to the door
(17:27):
of the kennel and it blowsforced air through the kennel.
They will put the dog in thatkennel and then they will walk
away to bathe three more dogs,which will then go in the
kennels to be dried.
I'm not saying that those peopleare bad, everybody does things
differently, I do not cage dry,animals have died being caged
(17:52):
dried that weren't beingwatched.
There was a Newfoundland in theStates that overheated after
being left in there too long andlost its life.
So if a dog is petrified of thenoise of the dryer or the air
going in and you put that dog ina little tiny box and you put
the air on it so it cannot getaway from that air.
(18:14):
First of all, you want to talkabout choice while we just
removed all of that, right.
The dog is in fight or flightmode and it can't flight.
So some dogs will have nocontrol and their bladder and
their bowels will let go.
And that's extreme fear, that'sthe worst of the worst.
If you've got a dog that's soscared it cannot control it's
(18:35):
bladder and it's bowels, that'spretty sad.
Nothing against the groomers,they're not standing there to
watch the signs and the bodylanguage and how the dog's
reacting.
They might peek in,"Oh yeah, thedog looks okay." Well the dog is
sitting there, trembling infear.
And I've gotten a lot of thoseclients, and I don't normally
(18:59):
say anything, but when it's thebig chain like that with the
exact same scenario, after 50clients, you start to notice a
pattern.
Within 50 seconds of clickingthe dryer on, I can tell you
(19:21):
where they took that dog to getgroomed.
So there is definitely a patternand it does make a huge long
term difference and can reallyaffect how the dog goes about.
It's grueling for the rest ofits life.
Kim (19:38):
So with somebody who is looking at getting a new dog,
let's even say puppies, what cana pet parent do with that new
puppy from day one when theybring it home to get it ready to
start coming to the groomer?
Stacy (19:57):
Well, you can't start too young.
First of all, when you get apuppy, you don't have to wait.
Start now.
And I tell them they can dothings at home.
Most importantly, puppies haveno attention span.
You might get three seconds outof them, so people can't sit
(20:20):
there for 15-20 minutes andbrush their puppy, of course the
puppy is going to fight them andthen start mouthing them and run
away and squeal and it's goingto be a nightmare.
Slow and steady wins the race.
Start off by just placing thebrush next to the puppy, let the
puppy sniff it in a couplehours, try again and maybe put
(20:43):
it closer to the puppy or maybetouch the puppy with the brush.
You know, you can't go slowenough.
It's much better to go slowerthan to try to speed things up
and you're going backwards iswhat's going to happen.
And I have meet and greets, Ihave a lot of clients that will
tell me they're getting a newpuppy and the puppy will be,
say, 10 weeks old.
(21:05):
So I usually tell them once theyhave the puppy at home for two
weeks on average that they makean appointment and they bring
the puppy for the first meet andgreet.
It's about 10 minutes if that.
And I do not charge them.
It's free of charge.
They bring the puppy to my shop,I meet the puppy, I play with
the puppy, I rub its belly and Igive it treats and then they go
(21:29):
home.
Nothing is done to the dog, nodryer, nothing scary happens.
It is all positive belly rubsand treats, and they're on their
way.
And then within a week or sothey come for appointment number
two.
Now when they come for thatappointment and they bring that
puppy back to my shop, the onlyassociation that puppy has with
(21:51):
me in that shop is,"That's thereally nice lady that rubbed my
belly and gave me treats!" Sothey're usually pulling their
own or running to the shop tosee me.
Yeah.
So I have many of thoseappointments set up and on the
appointment, number two, they dopay.
I don't give away everything forfree.
(22:14):
They don't get a full groom, butI introduce them to sounds and
tools and a brush and the table,that's about all that's done.
They don't get anything done tothem.
It's to let them familiarizeyourself with the shop.
I judge their reaction tothings, every puppy is
different.
Sometimes I turn the dryer onand the puppy does not even turn
(22:36):
around to see where the noise iscoming from.
It's a process and it's a slowprocess.
Kim (22:44):
So talking about grooming, obviously there are different
types of grooming, differentgrooming needs for different
breeds of dogs.
And my sister, co-founder ofGood Dog In A Box, probably the
best advice she ever gave me andmy family when we were trying to
(23:09):
find a dog 10 years ago when mychildren were little, was to
think about the breed and whatit was originally bred to do.
Some dogs were bred to befighters, some dogs were bred to
be draft dogs, some dogs werebred to hunt and do all these
different things.
Think about what the dog wasbred to do, and then that will
(23:32):
help you to choose the rightdog.
You have to think about whattheir inherent skills are.
As far as training, we ended upwith a Newfoundland and I was
very, very happy.
One of the few breeds where partof the breed standard is their
personality, they're very docileand wonderful.
(23:54):
They were a grooming nightmarethough.
So in the whole process ofpicking a dog and figuring out
what kind of a breed you want,even if it's a dog from a
shelter, what do you say tosomebody looking for a dog as
far as what they want toconsider?
(24:15):
Time, money, effort, the wholegrooming thing.
From the professional point ofview.
Stacy (24:23):
I'm not often speechless.
I don't even know where tostart.
My dream would be that anybodythat wanted a dog would have to
fill out a very detailedquestionnaire, and they would be
given the dog matched for themand they would not be allowed to
see the dog.
Because I believe that one ofthe number one reasons we have
(24:44):
so many dogs dumped at sheltersis because people do not
research the breed they aregetting, and they have no idea
what they're in for.
The Newfoundland for example,thrilled with them, but it's a
(25:07):
full time job, 24-7 outsmartingthem.
And I'm not always successful.
They do require a lot ofgrooming, I spent hours upon
hours upon hours weekly withmaintenance and grooming my
(25:27):
three Newfoundland dogs.
So when you're picking a breedof dog, everything's important.
Like you mentioned about whatthey were bred for, what type of
lifestyle do you live?
If you want to eat potato chipson the couch for your life, you
probably shouldn't get a BorderCollie.
So that being said, when itcomes to the grooming part of it
(25:52):
, and I shudder to say this, I'mgoing to use the doodle as the
example.
I have so many doodle clientswho were not told anything about
their grooming needs, and thenwhen they come to me and they
quite often want their doodle tobe in a three inch long haircut
so they look like a teddy bearthat's stuck its paw in a light
(26:12):
socket, and they don't want tobrush their dog and all, and
they'd like to bring it to agroomer every four to six
months.
And the reality is with adoodle, they're a very curly
(26:37):
coat breed bred with thethickest coat they can find and
they put together and it's sortof this smorgasboard of like,
"Surprise, what type of coat arewe going to get?" Most of it is
all a nightmare.
So their grooming is one of thehighest maintenance groomings
(26:57):
out of all the dogs I groom.
They require daily brushing, andusually it's a four to six week
schedule that they come to mefor a full groom, and my doodle
prices start at$85.
That's for doodle to walk in thedoor and it goes up from there,
(27:20):
and let me tell you, it alwaysgoes up cause they're always
matted.
Michelle (27:43):
How uncomfortable, I'll even say painful, is it for
a dog who has been left five,six, seven months without a
groom, who is completely matteddown to their skin?
(28:05):
How much discomfort is that dogliving?
Stacy (28:07):
I can't imagine, to be honest, Michelle.
I know that a lot of the timepeople aren't educated, and when
I tell them I almost feel bad,but I have to tell them that
they don't understand howpainful it is for the dog when
they're in that condition.
Dogs walk on four feet, unlikeus, so every step the dog takes
(28:29):
they're moving four feet, fourlegs.
If you had a huge knot in yourhair, a massive mat, and I
grabbed it and started haulingyou around the room by it,
that's pretty much what theyfeel like with every step they
take.
It is extremely painful, andthat brings us into one of my
(28:50):
main issues I deal with, andthat's neglect.
And neglect is abuse.
I know that you can call it whatyou want, but when you get an
animal, you know it's yourresponsibility to care for that
animal and make sure it ishealthy and in good physical
shape, it's fed properly, justlike when you have a child.
(29:13):
So when you don't get the doggroomed for a year, we call them
once a year grooms and there arelots of them out there and that
dog is in excruciating pain.
I've seen dogs that stoppeddoing stairs and the owners
think it's because they've gotarthritis or they're getting
old.
They can't move.
It's too painful.
They can't go upstairs becauseof the mats.
It is a serious case in neglect,and here in Canada where I am,
(29:37):
there's nothing anybody doesabout it.
There's nothing I can do aboutit, there's nobody I can call.
So I try to educate the ownersas much as possible and hope and
pray to God that they listen forthe sake of their dog.
Michelle (29:51):
When Kim and I first talked about having you on, we
were so excited because of yourbackground and your experience,
but to really shed light on whatthe grooming experience is like
for the dog.
Because I don't know that wefocus enough attention on that,
that this is happening to thedog.
(30:11):
I think we have to, you know,we're so happy to have you share
this because this is theirexperience, not ours.
We lose sight of that.
Like you said, you know who dowe report these things to when a
dog is going for a year withoutbeing bathed and groomed?
With the skin conditions thatcome from that, and the pain,
and the discomfort, and it'svery disheartening.
(30:32):
And it is education and itshould start with breeders, but
it should also then transfer tothe vet.
Stacy (30:41):
It should be a team effort between every pet
professional dealing with thepet and the owner.
Michelle (30:46):
I can tell you how many students of mine, I'm
reminding them, I'm referringthem to groomers.
They're at this process nowwhere I'll touch a dog and I can
feel that they're matted down totheir skin.
Stacy (30:57):
A lot of people think that if your dog doesn't cry out
in pain, it's not in pain.
Dogs are very resilient.
They can be in severe pain dueto matting walking down your
driveway and they're not goingto scream in pain.
It doesn't mean they're not inpain.
Kim (31:21):
So Stacy, I want you to give us recommendations for our
pet parents out there, sincewe're at the end of the show.
As a pet parent, what do youwant to look for in a groomer?
How do you pick one and whatquestions do you want to ask to
make sure you've got the rightone?
Stacy (31:42):
Well, for starters, now I'm not saying anything, some of
the best groomers in the worldare self-taught.
But as a whole, I woulddefinitely make sure that they
had training and schooling andsome type of certificate that
they went to school.
(32:02):
If it was me and my dog, I wouldwant them to be certified in pet
first aid and CPR.
That's a big one.
Anything can happen to a dog,whether it's at the groomer and
or in your home, the person thatgrooms, your dog should be
trained for any medicalconditions that may arise as
(32:24):
best as they can until they getthem to the vet.
Talk to people.
Now I realize if you're in ahuge city, which I'm not, but
read the reviews, Google thepeople.
It's amazing what you can findout about people through Google.
It's a very simple process, socheck out their credentials and
(32:47):
what people are saying aboutthem.
If you know anybody in the petprofession, whether it's a vet
or a trainer or anybody, askthem if they know of any good
groomers or ones to stay awayfrom, find that stuff out.
And this one is a biggie becausethis is how I am, and you might
(33:09):
laugh, but trust your gut.
So many stories of people thattook their dog to a groomer,
something horrific happened orwas a bad experience, and they
tell me,"You know, I almostdidn't leave him there and I had
this feeling." And for Godsakes, people, if you go
dropping your dog off with astranger and you have this
(33:30):
feeling in your gut for whateverreason, that this is not a
positive, happy experience,don't feel bad that you're going
to take your dog and walk out.
You have an obligation to thisdog.
So even if I'm not saying thegroomer's bad, but for any
reason that you don't feelcomfortable and you don't think
(33:52):
this is a good match for you,just turn around and walk out.
Kim (33:55):
Good advice.
Well, Stacy, thank you so muchfor joining Michelle and I
today.
This has been very valuableinformation for everybody out
there who owns a dog and has tohave it groomed.
I mean, we all have pets thatrequire grooming, and this has
been really great informationfor everyone, so thank you so
(34:15):
much for joining us.
If you'd like to participate inthe rest of today's conversation
for professionals who work withdogs and receive continuing
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listening, visit GoodDogPro.comand subscribe today.
Use coupon PODCAST to get 40%off your first month or annual
(34:39):
subscription.
Welcome to Good Dog Nation, the weekly video podcast that's
all about having a good dog.
Hosted by Michelle McCarthy,CDBC, CTAC, leading therapy dog
authority, and owner of CanineHomeschooling; and Kim Merritt,
cofounder of GoodDogInABox.com,GoodDogPro.com, and founder of
the URL Doctor.
This episode is brought to youby GoodDogInABox.com,
(00:22):
reward-based dog training anddog bite prevention products for
families with kids and dogs.
And GoodDogPro.com, the onlinecontent subscription and
community for dog professionalswith reward-based dog training
products, curriculums, andonline courses to educate,
motivate, and positively impactthose that work with dogs.
(00:48):
Now let's join Good Dog Nation.
Hello everyone and welcome toGood Dog Nation, the video
podcast that talks about allthings dogs.
I am Kim Merritt, co- founder ofGood Dog In A Box and Good Dog
Pro, and I'm here with myco-host Michelle McCarthy of
(01:09):
Canine Home Schooling.
Michelle (01:11):
Hello!
Kim (01:12):
And we have as our guest today, Stacy Butler.
So in 2016 Stacy left her careerin nursing to follow her dream
of owning and operating her owndog grooming business.
She opened For The Love OfRoscoe dog grooming in September
of 2016, she is an accreditedpet first aid and CPR through
(01:35):
the Canadian Walks and Wagsprogram, and last year she
became fear free certified intheir grooming program.
So welcome Stacy, we're so gladto have you today.
Stacy (01:44):
Thank you!
Kim (01:47):
So why don't you tell us how the whole thing with dog
grooming came up, how you gotinterested in that, and how you
decided to leave nursing to gointo dog grooming.
Stacy (01:59):
Well, basically, I had a few friends that were dog
groomers that I would just helpout when they needed it at
Christmas in their busy season.
But I have a specialNewfoundland dog named Roscoe,
he had both of his hips removed.
So we went through about ayear-and-a-half of surgeries and
rehabilitation, so he doesrequire a lot of grooming, an
(02:24):
excessive amount of grooming.
Kim (02:27):
No, Michelle and I have been.
We were both Newfoundlandowners, we feel your pain.
Stacy (02:33):
Now I was able to do this at home to a certain point, but
then when he got almost too bigto fit in my bathtub, I needed
to look at Plan B.
And that's when I discovered,nothing against any of the
groomers in my area, but Icouldn't find a grooming shop
that I felt comfortable leavinghim at because of his sort of
(02:53):
disability.
The shops were not set up fordogs like him.
So finally, life is short and weall say, we're going to do
everything later, tomorrow, nextweek, when we retire.
And I just said if I'm going tofail, I'd rather have$5 in my
pocket and be happy than$5million and be miserable.
(03:13):
So I just said,"That's it," andI quit my job and I enrolled in
dog grooming school because thatwas my dream.
So I completed the course andopened my own business two days
after I got my certificate fromthe dog grooming school.
In hindsight, I wouldn'trecommend that, but anyways it's
(03:33):
worked out for me.
I always followed the Fear Freemission from day one.
I didn't know it was the FearFree mission., it was just the
Stacy mission.
And then I learned of the FearFree program and then I waited
and waited because I knew thatthe dog grooming certification
was going to be available soon,but it wasn't yet.
(03:53):
And then finally it was done, Iimmediately signed up, and
couldn't be happier to have it.
I wish all groomers in the worldhad this course.
Kim (04:04):
So tell us about it.
I have known Marty Becker, thecreator of Fear Free, for
several years, I've had hisdaughter McKell on with
different webinars and thingswe've done, and it's just, it's
a fabulous program.
It was started for vet clinicsand has kind of migrated now to
(04:26):
dog trainers and now groomers.
So tell us, what does the FearFree program for groomers look
like?
What does that mean to a petowner?
Stacy (04:34):
Well basically the main focus of it, like all the other
fear free programs, is we try todo absolutely everything we can
to reduce the amount of fear,anxiety, and stress to the pet
during the grooming process.
And that is the end goal.
(04:54):
Dogs don't always love theirgrooming and they don't have to
love it, but they also shouldn'tbe ready for a nervous breakdown
because of it.
There's a happy medium there.
I'm not saying that Fluffy hasto count down the days until he
goes to see the groomer, he's soexcited.
But he shouldn't be suffering amild heart attack either by the
(05:15):
end of it.
So it's all about reducing thefear, anxiety, and stress as
much as possible to make itbearable for them with the least
amount of stress.
Kim (05:26):
So give us some examples of how you do that.
Stacy (05:30):
Choice is a big thing, and there are a lot of things
that are right in front of youthat are common sense you may
not always see until they'repointed out to you.
So giving the dog a choice canmake an entire world of
difference during the groomingprocess.
For example, when I take a dogin the back room to the tub,
(05:56):
most dogs walk happily beside meuntil right when they get to
that tub, and then the brakes goon.
Instant fear, all four legssplayed out like I'm dragging
them to their own death.
And at that point many groomers,not again saying anything bad
about them, but they either pullon the grooming loop to force
(06:19):
them into the tub, and if thatdoesn't work, if it's a 10 pound
dog, many of them will justscoop the dog up and place the
dog in the tub.
But they're removing the dog'schoice in those scenarios.
So what I do instead is hangonto the grooming loop, I do not
pull on it at all.
(06:40):
I do hang onto it so that I'mnot allowing the dog to back up
and go away from the tub, butI'm in no way trying to force
the dog to the tub either.
And there are different waysdepending upon the dog, some
dogs are very food motivated andwith a little piece of liver I
can have them do in cartwheelsin that tub.
But some dogs are like,"I willstarve to death before I get in
(07:05):
that tub." Whether you're usingpraise and love or liver or
whatever the thing is that youfind for that particular dog.
Now when that dog moves one inchtowards me in that tub, I act
like I won the lottery.
Positive reinforcement.
If anybody saw me, they'dprobably have me put into the
(07:27):
psychiatric unit.
I dance and I sing and I makesuch a big fuss that this is the
best dog in the world for thatone inch that they moved towards
the tub.
In a few more minutes, theymight move another inch.
Now when all is said and done,it depends on the dog.
Sometimes it's 30 seconds.
My longest was a Newfoundlanddog, and it was one hour and 27
(07:51):
minutes that I sat in the tuband he sat outside of the tub.
Now that's rare.
It doesn't usually take thatlong.
But the funny part of this storyis after one hour and 27
minutes, the dog entered the tuband sat down beside me in the
tub of his own free will.
So that was a huge win becauseyou have to look long term about
(08:17):
this dog grooming.
He's got 10 years left to begroomed.
I would rather take all thisextra time today and have him
readily and happily walk into mytub, then fight with him every
eight weeks and wrestle him intothat tub.
Michelle (08:34):
For the rest of his life.
Stacy (08:36):
Yep.
So when you remove somebody'schoice, even a human, you think
about it for a moment.
If I'm asking you to come into astore with me and you're not
really sure you don't want togo, and I say,"Well that's too
bad whether you want to go ornot." So I grab you by your hair
and your jacket and I drag youinto that store.
Well, you're going to kick andscream and do everything in your
(08:56):
power to get out of that store.
And the dog is no different.
You have to put yourself intheir shoes.
Kim (09:02):
Well, and kudos to you there.
I'm thrilled to hear that.
Because not every groomer wouldtake an hour and 27 minutes out
of their day.
But I totally can understand andI would have to guess that from
(09:22):
that point on, did that dogwillingly go into the tub for
you?
Stacy (09:27):
Every time after that he followed me and did not put the
brakes on when we got to thetub, he walked in.
Now I know it was an hour and 27minutes, but look at how much
time I spent simply by gettingthat dog in the tub every single
time he came to the shop.
So for me it's a bonus.
(09:50):
I know many people who thinktime is money and, without
getting into this too much, butit also depends on your client.
Because the big problem withpracticing Fear Free most of the
time is not the dog, it's thehuman that brings the dog to the
grooming shop.
They need to be on board, and alot of the times they're not.
(10:13):
And at that point, your handsare tied.
Kim (10:16):
So is that because they don't understand what Fear Free
is, or is that because theydon't practice reward-based dog
training at home?
Stacy (10:24):
I find sometimes it's a little bit of everything, but
the two factors that I've seenin my shop are money and time.
As much as I love dogs, I can'twork for free.
So in the beginning to get thedog used to the grooming, it
takes time.
I always tell people, if yourfive-year-old dog is petrified
(10:47):
to have their nails clipped,this didn't happen in one day.
This has been building for fiveyears, building fear in this
dog.
And a lot of people believe thatthey'll bring the dog to my shop
and I will clip the nails andthere will be unicorns floating
through the sky and everybodywill be happy and sometimes it
(11:11):
takes many visits before I canget the nails trimmed.
So that's many visits, they haveto take time out of their busy
lives to bring the dog to theshop, and they do have to pay
every time.
Some clients would rather Ihog-tie the dog, sit on it while
it wails and I just clip thenails.
They just want it done and theydon't care how I do it.
Michelle (11:35):
Can I ask, Stacy, say someone really does have a dog
that's really terrified andyou're working with them, how
much compliance do you get ifyou ask that client to continue
practicing these handlingexercises at home between
groomings?
Do you get compliance withpeople?
Stacy (11:57):
That's a tough one.
I would say yes and no.
Half of them do comply, half ofthem don't.
The problem is even the onesthey want to comply, but they
have such difficulty at homebecause they're Mom to that dog.
And most of the time dogs arelike night and day from your
home to my shop.
(12:19):
They're completely opposite.
When people come in and tell mehow much Fluffy loves their
bath, I'm like,"Oh good God,this is going to be a
nightmare." But if they come inand say they're all worried, and
they're all anxious, and they'rescared of what how dog will act,
and it might bite me because ithates bath, so much.
I'm smiling because I know thisdog is going to be an angel in
(12:41):
my tub.
I can almost bet you$100 onevery dog that they're opposite
from what the client tells meonce they walk out the door.
Yeah.
Kim (12:51):
So are there different exercises and things that you
tell your clients to do inbetween?
Stacy (12:58):
Yes.
If you're talking about nails, Ifind a big mistake is how we
handle the paws.
People touch the paws, you pickup the paws, which is all fine.
I don't normally have a problemwith a dog letting me touch its
paws so much, but you have tokind of get in there and spread
their toes, move the fur backfrom the nail.
(13:22):
It's all those little thingsthat happen during a nail trim,
it's not just simply touchingthe dogs paw.
You have to go a little bitfurther in handling the paw than
simply placing your hand on it,right?
Because to do a safe nail trim,you have to be able to have a
slightly firm grip.
It's one thing to pick up theirpaws and another to have to
(13:44):
apply any pressure to that pawand hold on to it.
And how much is too muchpressure, right?
If it becomes uncomfortable forthe dog, then you're at a whole
new ball game.
It's not just about the nailsanymore.
Michelle (13:56):
So if we're talking about a dog that has a chronic
injury orthopedic problem, we'repulling that paw forward.
You probably need to sometimeseven do a health intake from
people.
Stacy (14:14):
Oh yes, that's another issue too.
A lot of people don't informyou.
I mean, you can ask questions,but a lot of clients aren't
exactly honest and forthcomingwith what they tell you about
the dog.
So when you get an elderly dog,now I'm not talking about any
health problems other than justa senior dog that has some
(14:36):
arthritis.
I experienced this recently, Ilost my Rottweiler, he was
11-and-a-half, and his kneesweren't good.
Now he let anybody in the worldclip his nails his whole life,
but the last 12 months or so,nobody could get near him to cut
his nails.
(14:56):
He would growl.
So I talked with my vet, andagain, it's something that was
so obvious and made sense, but Ihad not thought about.
She said,"The reason he'sreacting this way is you're
picking up his paw to trim thenail.
You're bending the knee, it'shurting and it's uncomfortable.
It's not the nail trim he'sgrowling about.
You're hurting his knee." Wellthen after I cried and felt
(15:20):
horrible, so I continued togroom him and to cut his nails,
and I found a way to cut hisnails without picking up his
paw.
And he never growled at me andwe had no issues.
But something as simple as thatcan make a world of difference.
Kim (15:39):
So for our pet owners, maybe this is new information,
they'd not heard a Fear Freebefore.
They never even thought aboutwhat type of a groomer they're
going to and how they'rehandling their dog.
Are there long term negativeeffects to a dog that has been
(16:03):
to a groomer who, and I don'twant to say mistreated because
it could simply be be handled bya groomer who perhaps just
doesn't even know that they'recausing the dog pain.
Are there long-term effects fromaccidental or unintentional
mishandling?
Stacy (16:22):
Yes, the biggest one that I deal with is, and I'm not
going to state any names, butthere are a few large pet store
chains that offer grooming.
And I have so many clients withpets that have been traumatized
and now have extreme fear fromthe dryers in the grooming
(16:44):
salon..
And it's because at a big chainlike this where you can walk in,
you don't need an appointment,they have multiple groomers and
they have a high turnover rate.
So you can go 20 times and youmight never have the same
groomer.
Continuity of care goes a longway, too.
You need to get to know thatdog, that dog will respond
(17:06):
better to somebody that'shandled it repeatedly than a
perfect stranger, that's commonsense too.
So in these bigger groomingshops, a lot of the times dogs
will be kenneled, stacked on topof each other, and their cage
dried, which basically is a bighose that attaches to the door
(17:27):
of the kennel and it blowsforced air through the kennel.
They will put the dog in thatkennel and then they will walk
away to bathe three more dogs,which will then go in the
kennels to be dried.
I'm not saying that those peopleare bad, everybody does things
differently, I do not cage dry,animals have died being caged
(17:52):
dried that weren't beingwatched.
There was a Newfoundland in theStates that overheated after
being left in there too long andlost its life.
So if a dog is petrified of thenoise of the dryer or the air
going in and you put that dog ina little tiny box and you put
the air on it so it cannot getaway from that air.
(18:14):
First of all, you want to talkabout choice while we just
removed all of that, right.
The dog is in fight or flightmode and it can't flight.
So some dogs will have nocontrol and their bladder and
their bowels will let go.
And that's extreme fear, that'sthe worst of the worst.
If you've got a dog that's soscared it cannot control it's
(18:35):
bladder and it's bowels, that'spretty sad.
Nothing against the groomers,they're not standing there to
watch the signs and the bodylanguage and how the dog's
reacting.
They might peek in,"Oh yeah, thedog looks okay." Well the dog is
sitting there, trembling infear.
And I've gotten a lot of thoseclients, and I don't normally
(18:59):
say anything, but when it's thebig chain like that with the
exact same scenario, after 50clients, you start to notice a
pattern.
Within 50 seconds of clickingthe dryer on, I can tell you
(19:21):
where they took that dog to getgroomed.
So there is definitely a patternand it does make a huge long
term difference and can reallyaffect how the dog goes about.
It's grueling for the rest ofits life.
Kim (19:38):
So with somebody who is looking at getting a new dog,
let's even say puppies, what cana pet parent do with that new
puppy from day one when theybring it home to get it ready to
start coming to the groomer?
Stacy (19:57):
Well, you can't start too young.
First of all, when you get apuppy, you don't have to wait.
Start now.
And I tell them they can dothings at home.
Most importantly, puppies haveno attention span.
You might get three seconds outof them, so people can't sit
(20:20):
there for 15-20 minutes andbrush their puppy, of course the
puppy is going to fight them andthen start mouthing them and run
away and squeal and it's goingto be a nightmare.
Slow and steady wins the race.
Start off by just placing thebrush next to the puppy, let the
puppy sniff it in a couplehours, try again and maybe put
(20:43):
it closer to the puppy or maybetouch the puppy with the brush.
You know, you can't go slowenough.
It's much better to go slowerthan to try to speed things up
and you're going backwards iswhat's going to happen.
And I have meet and greets, Ihave a lot of clients that will
tell me they're getting a newpuppy and the puppy will be,
say, 10 weeks old.
(21:05):
So I usually tell them once theyhave the puppy at home for two
weeks on average that they makean appointment and they bring
the puppy for the first meet andgreet.
It's about 10 minutes if that.
And I do not charge them.
It's free of charge.
They bring the puppy to my shop,I meet the puppy, I play with
the puppy, I rub its belly and Igive it treats and then they go
(21:29):
home.
Nothing is done to the dog, nodryer, nothing scary happens.
It is all positive belly rubsand treats, and they're on their
way.
And then within a week or sothey come for appointment number
two.
Now when they come for thatappointment and they bring that
puppy back to my shop, the onlyassociation that puppy has with
(21:51):
me in that shop is,"That's thereally nice lady that rubbed my
belly and gave me treats!" Sothey're usually pulling their
own or running to the shop tosee me.
Yeah.
So I have many of thoseappointments set up and on the
appointment, number two, they dopay.
I don't give away everything forfree.
(22:14):
They don't get a full groom, butI introduce them to sounds and
tools and a brush and the table,that's about all that's done.
They don't get anything done tothem.
It's to let them familiarizeyourself with the shop.
I judge their reaction tothings, every puppy is
different.
Sometimes I turn the dryer onand the puppy does not even turn
(22:36):
around to see where the noise iscoming from.
It's a process and it's a slowprocess.
Kim (22:44):
So talking about grooming, obviously there are different
types of grooming, differentgrooming needs for different
breeds of dogs.
And my sister, co-founder ofGood Dog In A Box, probably the
best advice she ever gave me andmy family when we were trying to
(23:09):
find a dog 10 years ago when mychildren were little, was to
think about the breed and whatit was originally bred to do.
Some dogs were bred to befighters, some dogs were bred to
be draft dogs, some dogs werebred to hunt and do all these
different things.
Think about what the dog wasbred to do, and then that will
(23:32):
help you to choose the rightdog.
You have to think about whattheir inherent skills are.
As far as training, we ended upwith a Newfoundland and I was
very, very happy.
One of the few breeds where partof the breed standard is their
personality, they're very docileand wonderful.
(23:54):
They were a grooming nightmarethough.
So in the whole process ofpicking a dog and figuring out
what kind of a breed you want,even if it's a dog from a
shelter, what do you say tosomebody looking for a dog as
far as what they want toconsider?
(24:15):
Time, money, effort, the wholegrooming thing.
From the professional point ofview.
Stacy (24:23):
I'm not often speechless.
I don't even know where tostart.
My dream would be that anybodythat wanted a dog would have to
fill out a very detailedquestionnaire, and they would be
given the dog matched for themand they would not be allowed to
see the dog.
Because I believe that one ofthe number one reasons we have
(24:44):
so many dogs dumped at sheltersis because people do not
research the breed they aregetting, and they have no idea
what they're in for.
The Newfoundland for example,thrilled with them, but it's a
(25:07):
full time job, 24-7 outsmartingthem.
And I'm not always successful.
They do require a lot ofgrooming, I spent hours upon
hours upon hours weekly withmaintenance and grooming my
(25:27):
three Newfoundland dogs.
So when you're picking a breedof dog, everything's important.
Like you mentioned about whatthey were bred for, what type of
lifestyle do you live?
If you want to eat potato chipson the couch for your life, you
probably shouldn't get a BorderCollie.
So that being said, when itcomes to the grooming part of it
(25:52):
, and I shudder to say this, I'mgoing to use the doodle as the
example.
I have so many doodle clientswho were not told anything about
their grooming needs, and thenwhen they come to me and they
quite often want their doodle tobe in a three inch long haircut
so they look like a teddy bearthat's stuck its paw in a light
(26:12):
socket, and they don't want tobrush their dog and all, and
they'd like to bring it to agroomer every four to six
months.
And the reality is with adoodle, they're a very curly
(26:37):
coat breed bred with thethickest coat they can find and
they put together and it's sortof this smorgasboard of like,
"Surprise, what type of coat arewe going to get?" Most of it is
all a nightmare.
So their grooming is one of thehighest maintenance groomings
(26:57):
out of all the dogs I groom.
They require daily brushing, andusually it's a four to six week
schedule that they come to mefor a full groom, and my doodle
prices start at$85.
That's for doodle to walk in thedoor and it goes up from there,
(27:20):
and let me tell you, it alwaysgoes up cause they're always
matted.
Michelle (27:43):
How uncomfortable, I'll even say painful, is it for
a dog who has been left five,six, seven months without a
groom, who is completely matteddown to their skin?
(28:05):
How much discomfort is that dogliving?
Stacy (28:07):
I can't imagine, to be honest, Michelle.
I know that a lot of the timepeople aren't educated, and when
I tell them I almost feel bad,but I have to tell them that
they don't understand howpainful it is for the dog when
they're in that condition.
Dogs walk on four feet, unlikeus, so every step the dog takes
(28:29):
they're moving four feet, fourlegs.
If you had a huge knot in yourhair, a massive mat, and I
grabbed it and started haulingyou around the room by it,
that's pretty much what theyfeel like with every step they
take.
It is extremely painful, andthat brings us into one of my
(28:50):
main issues I deal with, andthat's neglect.
And neglect is abuse.
I know that you can call it whatyou want, but when you get an
animal, you know it's yourresponsibility to care for that
animal and make sure it ishealthy and in good physical
shape, it's fed properly, justlike when you have a child.
(29:13):
So when you don't get the doggroomed for a year, we call them
once a year grooms and there arelots of them out there and that
dog is in excruciating pain.
I've seen dogs that stoppeddoing stairs and the owners
think it's because they've gotarthritis or they're getting
old.
They can't move.
It's too painful.
They can't go upstairs becauseof the mats.
It is a serious case in neglect,and here in Canada where I am,
(29:37):
there's nothing anybody doesabout it.
There's nothing I can do aboutit, there's nobody I can call.
So I try to educate the ownersas much as possible and hope and
pray to God that they listen forthe sake of their dog.
Michelle (29:51):
When Kim and I first talked about having you on, we
were so excited because of yourbackground and your experience,
but to really shed light on whatthe grooming experience is like
for the dog.
Because I don't know that wefocus enough attention on that,
that this is happening to thedog.
(30:11):
I think we have to, you know,we're so happy to have you share
this because this is theirexperience, not ours.
We lose sight of that.
Like you said, you know who dowe report these things to when a
dog is going for a year withoutbeing bathed and groomed?
With the skin conditions thatcome from that, and the pain,
and the discomfort, and it'svery disheartening.
(30:32):
And it is education and itshould start with breeders, but
it should also then transfer tothe vet.
Stacy (30:41):
It should be a team effort between every pet
professional dealing with thepet and the owner.
Michelle (30:46):
I can tell you how many students of mine, I'm
reminding them, I'm referringthem to groomers.
They're at this process nowwhere I'll touch a dog and I can
feel that they're matted down totheir skin.
Stacy (30:57):
A lot of people think that if your dog doesn't cry out
in pain, it's not in pain.
Dogs are very resilient.
They can be in severe pain dueto matting walking down your
driveway and they're not goingto scream in pain.
It doesn't mean they're not inpain.
Kim (31:21):
So Stacy, I want you to give us recommendations for our
pet parents out there, sincewe're at the end of the show.
As a pet parent, what do youwant to look for in a groomer?
How do you pick one and whatquestions do you want to ask to
make sure you've got the rightone?
Stacy (31:42):
Well, for starters, now I'm not saying anything, some of
the best groomers in the worldare self-taught.
But as a whole, I woulddefinitely make sure that they
had training and schooling andsome type of certificate that
they went to school.
(32:02):
If it was me and my dog, I wouldwant them to be certified in pet
first aid and CPR.
That's a big one.
Anything can happen to a dog,whether it's at the groomer and
or in your home, the person thatgrooms, your dog should be
trained for any medicalconditions that may arise as
(32:24):
best as they can until they getthem to the vet.
Talk to people.
Now I realize if you're in ahuge city, which I'm not, but
read the reviews, Google thepeople.
It's amazing what you can findout about people through Google.
It's a very simple process, socheck out their credentials and
(32:47):
what people are saying aboutthem.
If you know anybody in the petprofession, whether it's a vet
or a trainer or anybody, askthem if they know of any good
groomers or ones to stay awayfrom, find that stuff out.
And this one is a biggie becausethis is how I am, and you might
(33:09):
laugh, but trust your gut.
So many stories of people thattook their dog to a groomer,
something horrific happened orwas a bad experience, and they
tell me,"You know, I almostdidn't leave him there and I had
this feeling." And for Godsakes, people, if you go
dropping your dog off with astranger and you have this
(33:30):
feeling in your gut for whateverreason, that this is not a
positive, happy experience,don't feel bad that you're going
to take your dog and walk out.
You have an obligation to thisdog.
So even if I'm not saying thegroomer's bad, but for any
reason that you don't feelcomfortable and you don't think
(33:52):
this is a good match for you,just turn around and walk out.
Kim (33:55):
Good advice.
Well, Stacy, thank you so muchfor joining Michelle and I
today.
This has been very valuableinformation for everybody out
there who owns a dog and has tohave it groomed.
I mean, we all have pets thatrequire grooming, and this has
been really great informationfor everyone, so thank you so
(34:15):
much for joining us.
If you'd like to participate inthe rest of today's conversation
for professionals who work withdogs and receive continuing
education credits fromparticipating organizations for
listening, visit GoodDogPro.comand subscribe today.
Use coupon PODCAST to get 40%off your first month or annual
(34:39):
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