September 4, 2025 • 33 mins
What 25 years of marriage taught us about faith, family, and leading well—together.
In this special Graced to Lead season finale, I’m joined by my husband, Michael, for his very first appearance on the podcast! Together, we reflect on:
- The leadership lessons we’ve learned in 25 years of marriage
- How we’ve navigated seasons of transition—retirement, new callings, and raising kids in different stages
- Why faith has been the anchor holding our marriage, family, and leadership together
This is a real, honest, and faith-filled conversation about supporting one another, letting go when God says “it’s time,” and staying grounded in family and laughter. Whether you’re leading at home, in business, or in ministry, you’ll find encouragement and practical wisdom here.
Don’t miss this close to Season 2 and get ready for what’s coming next in Season 3!
Please subscribe to our mailing list to stay connected and get updates! Thanks for listening to the Graced to Lead Podcast.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Belinda Gaston (00:01):
Hey, it's Belinda, host of the Grace to
Lead podcast, and listen todayis different.
First of all, it is our seasonfinale for season two of the
Grace to Lead podcast, so thisis the last episode of season
two.
Don't worry, we'll be back withseason three.
And today I have a specialguest on.
I have my husband, michaelGaston, on, and we are talking
(00:23):
about leadership, we're talkingabout marriage and we're talking
(00:48):
about faith.
'm Belinda Gaston, your host,and listen y'all.
This week we have our very ownfirst male guest on the Grace to
Lead podcast, none other thanmy husband, michael Gaston.
Hey, honey.
Michael Gaston (01:08):
Hello everyone.
Belinda Gaston (01:10):
So this is the season finale for season two,
honey, and God told me to putyou on here and you said yes, he
said yes, y'all.
So today you and I are going totalk about leadership and our
marriage, so let me go ahead andintroduce you properly, okay,
(01:30):
so let me introduce you properlyto Michael.
Michael Gaston and I have beenmarried for 25 years.
We have three children, twocollege children and one middle
schooler and we are in the stageof our life right now where we
are transitioning.
I think we've transitioned forthe last few years between.
(01:51):
Michael has a long career in lawenforcement and I've had I
still am working in publichealth as a leader, but also
have in the last few years, youknow, transitioned in creating
Grace to Lead the podcast, theleadership development firm and
the ministry, and so it's been alot of transition.
(02:12):
Also, michael has retired andso he's also restarting a new
career and we'll talk about thata little bit in acting, as well
as his consulting for churchsecurity services.
So I can say we're intransition, but that is who he
is.
So welcome, michael Gaston, tothe show.
Michael Gaston (02:32):
Thank you, Thank you honey.
Belinda Gaston (02:35):
All right, so I have questions, y'all, and if
you are watching us on YouTube,hi welcome.
This is my second video that Iposted on YouTube, if you are
listening.
Thank you for listening to theGrace Elite Podcast, and so
we're going to start with ourfirst question Question number
one.
Question number one.
So let's start with leadership,right Leadership After 25 years
(03:01):
of marriage.
What's one leadership lessonyou've learned about us
navigating life together?
Michael Gaston (03:13):
I would say the main thing I learned about
navigating leadership within afamily context is discussing
everything, talking abouteverything, before you implement
anything.
Without those discussions itcan go sideways and I've proven
(03:36):
without discussing things thatit has and will go sideways.
So whatever's going on in yourmarriage or whatever plans you
have for the marriage or for thefamily, there has to be some
type of discussion.
Whether you disagree or agreeor whatever, it's good to have
(03:57):
those discussions.
So whatever your plans are,they don't go sideways, so
everybody's on the same page.
Belinda Gaston (04:04):
Yeah, I think that's that's really good.
So for me, I think the challengeis especially for women who
lead is like though I was, I'mleading in corporate spaces and
I have a leadership role at thechurch.
At home, you're still the headof our household, and so I know
when we first got married, itwas hard for me to accept some
(04:27):
of the decisions that you made,that kind of thing and I
appreciate the fact that youstarted telling me I don't
necessarily think that I changedyour mind a lot, but you allow
me to offer my ideas and kind oftell me your point of view what
was the hardest part about that?
What's the hardest part aboutthat?
Like, like, what's the hardestpart about communicating?
(04:47):
Cause it's not like when we metand I've now met, like uncle
Mike, so other people in thefamily like it's not like the
men in the family are supercommunicative.
You know it's not like they'reall saying, hey, let's discuss,
and so I imagine you coming intomy life and me coming into your
life, where I like y'all, Ilike to discuss everything, I
want to know how you're feeling,what you do, like all of that,
(05:09):
and that's not really him.
So what's what was the hardestpart about getting adjusted to
that in marriage.
Michael Gaston (05:17):
Oh, like you said, I come from a family of
men that grew up pretty muchsuck it up.
You do a, b and C and don'tdeviate from that, and we didn't
talk about feelings or any ofthat stuff, or even to the point
of whatever the plans are forthe household.
(05:38):
Everybody pretty much had thesame plan and everybody was on
the same page.
So you come into a relationshipwhere you have a significant
other that wants more detailsand things of that nature and
that could be, uh, frustrating,but it helps you.
(06:00):
It helps you that's the wordI'm looking for.
It helps you focus whatever yourplans are, or it helps you
narrow it down or have a what isthe word it's?
You have everything in boxes,organized, organized.
(06:21):
There we go, organized.
So it helps you organize yourplans better.
I mean that stuff is in theBible, so you know you organize
your plans so that everything,when it's implemented, it goes a
lot more smoother.
You're still going to run intolittle hiccups here and there,
but at least you have a plan togo by.
(06:42):
So it makes it made me there,but at least you have a plan to
go by.
So it makes it made me, as aman, think about more of the
details of things and also todiscuss things, because you know
, I don't have all the answers,I don't have all the ideas.
There's certain things Ihaven't experienced where those
questions have to be raised,where it makes me go look for
that thing.
So communication it just helps.
(07:04):
If you don't, if you're not abig talker, it helps you to
communicate anyway.
Belinda Gaston (07:11):
Yeah, I think for me, the biggest lesson was
allowing you to lead honestly.
And I don't know if any of ourlisteners can resonate with this
, but I came from a lineage ofwomen with a couple of
exceptions, but a lineage ofwomen who were divorced, and so
if you're a single mom andyou're raising your kids, you
(07:34):
have to do everything, andbefore that, being in
relationships where you justdidn't have that kind of level
of trust, I had to learn how totrust that, one, you would
consult God before you madedecisions and, two, that you had
the best interest for ourhousehold.
(07:55):
And so I literally had tounlearn.
I don't know if this makessense, but I kind of had to
unlearn the I.
I'm a strong woman and I'mgonna do everything on my own
and allow you to have thatresponsibility.
Does that make sense?
Michael Gaston (08:14):
it sounds weird but no, it makes sense because
on the flip side, you also havemen that were raised in single
parent household and the motherwas the leader of the household.
(08:50):
The men tend to lay back andlet the woman do all the things,
versus no, this is your job,this is your responsibility.
But if you haven't, thankfullybeen from church and men that I
worked in law enforcement, evenbeen from the streets and that
(09:13):
nature, that's what helped me torealize okay, we got everything
flipped and we need to flip itback.
And also in that communicationand leading, you have to learn
how to lead.
Belinda Gaston (09:28):
That's really, that was really good.
So okay, let's talk aboutsupport, because this comes up a
lot.
I have women who lead, whomessage sometimes and say, well,
you're giving great advice, butmy husband doesn't really
support my leadership in theseareas and I understand what
that's like.
But since we've been marriedthe last 25 years I have felt
(09:52):
nothing but support.
I mean even early on, becausewhen we first got married I was
kind of climbing the corporateladder and I was really a
go-getter then Not as much sonow, but then I was and I never
felt like you didn't support mypromotions at work.
I never felt like it was acompetition between the two of
(10:13):
us.
But as you led the house andled in spaces outside the house
for me and I can describe thekind of support I needed from
you and how we, because I thinkthat we did a good job of
(10:33):
support I mean, I hope I don'tknow, but I feel like you at
least did a good job ofsupporting me and I hope I still
did a good job of supportingyou.
But how would you describe thekind of support that you needed
in your own leadership journey?
Michael Gaston (10:49):
Well, definitely off the rip encouragement.
I don't think anybody's goingto be able to do anything
without any type ofencouragement from their
significant other.
So you're in the same householdso you might not get that
encouragement from peopleoutside of the household, but
you as a man, you definitelyexpect that encouragement in the
(11:12):
house, no matter what's goingon outside.
We have encouragement from home, so that's off the rip.
So as far as encouraging eachother, I'm always for anybody,
especially my wife, especiallymy wife, if you're trying to
(11:35):
better yourself, not just foryourself but for the household
in the whole, because that helpsthe household.
That helps out the householdfinancially, that helps out the
household spiritually, thathelps out the household
physically.
So I would say that's why Iencourage.
And if one person in thehousehold not just me, if it was
one of the kids and their stuffalready set up for their
(11:57):
business or whatever, then Iwould say we pour our attention
to that, encourage that kidentrepreneurship in the
household.
If I can give you thesuggestions and I can tell you
like hey, you know, joshua knowshow to do that, let's reach out
(12:20):
to him.
Jada knows how to do that,let's reach out for her to help
you with that.
You know, even Olivia knows howto do this.
Let's all just pull it togetherand that is being a to me being
a leader of the household,being a to me being a leader of
the household.
Belinda Gaston (12:31):
I think that's a family thing and I will say
that y'all, he always like hehas brilliant ideas and he, I
don't think, understands how hisbrilliance, but that's a whole.
I feel like that might be apart two conversation, but but
you brought up something thatmade me think, and so one of the
things that I'm really focusedon right now, as it relates to
(12:51):
support cause we're talkingabout, like support for leaders,
is also helping to birth yourvisions, right, and so me and
the kids talk all the time aboutlike how we can help you,
especially now because we're intransition.
You've retired now, so you'vegot more time to do these things
.
I think that support goes bothways, and so I appreciate the
(13:13):
fact that you supported me andmy climbing up to the corporate
ladder, because it wasn't easywith the young kids and all that
.
And you are so hardworking,like you were always working,
and so you were patient with me,and I think for me it's the
little things.
It's like understanding that mydesire may be to have a spotless
house, but sometimes theremight be dishes in the scene.
(13:34):
Now, once the kids got older,it's like, okay, now y'all do
the dishes.
That's why we had kids, but youknow what I'm saying.
It's like that I feel like wework well together and what I
had to realize as a leader, butalso as a wife, is that it's
never I think our pastor saysthis all the time it's never
50-50.
Marriage is 100-100.
(13:55):
So I'm all in, you're all in,and we have to navigate those.
Michael Gaston (14:00):
We have no expectations.
A lot of people believe if theyput in their 100%, there's
going to be an expectation forreciprocation, and it doesn't go
that way all the time.
So if you're just going to doit, I would say, just do it
without any expectations,because that's where your
disappointments come in andthat's where the enemy uses that
(14:24):
to drive a wedge between youand your wife or your husband.
Is is doing it withoutexpectations and forgiveness
always has to be in theforefront of your mind, because
if you don't have forgivenessand you get rid of your
expectations, you're going tohave the enemy uses that to
(14:47):
cause thoughts in your head.
That's what is a killer to mefrom that.
Belinda Gaston (14:53):
Yeah, I'm glad you said that, because I had
ridiculous expectations when wegot married.
I didn't know what to expectand I feel like we watch TVs and
movies and you're like, oh,it's going to be like this, and
when it's not, it's easy for youto your mind to wander, and I'm
sure you had these momentsbecause we talked about it where
, like, but this is not what Iexpected.
(15:15):
And then we go through seasonstoo, like in the 25 years.
I feel like we've gone throughcycles.
There are times when one of usis feeling one way and the other
person is feeling another, butGod's always allowed us to find
our way back.
So I don't want people to thinkalso that this is I don't know.
Would you say it was easy?
Michael Gaston (15:34):
No, it can be easy, but you have to have God
in your life at ground zero, god, then you know when those
disappointments or thosesurprises or your expectations
are not met.
Without God, you can goanywhere with God At least.
(15:54):
Okay, lord, you can say Lord,what is this?
That's not the person I met.
Belinda Gaston (16:01):
And I'm telling you, boy, there have been some.
You know, as leaders, we wantto make sure that we are walking
in our authentic selves.
We say that, but the reality isyour authentic self changes in
seasons.
Who I was when I was in my 20s,when we got married, versus my
30s, my 40s and now it's likeI'm.
I look at myself sometimes I'mlike, oh, we this.
(16:23):
I went through some seasons,but you, yeah, you had?
Yeah, you had to deal with allof me and my drama and all that.
Michael Gaston (16:33):
No, God knew what he was doing.
My hair fell out in the 80s youknow what you in the hair?
Belinda Gaston (16:37):
I'm just getting you ready.
All right, all right.
So let's talk, because we talkabout God a lot, and this is
gracefully, we do talk about Godin the podcast, and so let's
talk about faith.
Michael Gaston (16:56):
How has faith impacted how you lead our home?
Got rid of all the expectations?
A lot of the TV versus reality,that's a lot.
All the expectations.
Because you have to comparewhat the Word says to what your
(17:17):
reality says, what yourexpectations say.
You always got to compare itagainst the Word of God and you
have to find other godly men orgodly people to bounce those
expectations off of.
To me what faith does in yourrelationship in your marriage in
(17:38):
leadership everything.
It gets rid of all theseexpectations that are not real.
Belinda Gaston (17:47):
So let's talk about transitions.
So retirement for you was a bigtransition.
You know you were leading inthe space for a long time and
then all of a sudden thatchanged.
Now you're kind of finding yourway and doing, and I kind of
feel like you're finding yourpurpose and doing the things you
like, and at the same time wehave two kids that went off to
(18:09):
college and we're kind of thedynamics in our household have
changed a little bit.
And then I started Grace toLead and so that's a big change
because the time I had, freetime I had after my corporate
job has changed.
So we just kind of I feel likewe're all in transition and
we're people of a certain age.
So that's life transition,right, people of a certain age,
(18:31):
so that's life transition right,See that in the stomach.
That's okay, that's love.
Michael Gaston (18:35):
That's love we working on it right, Both of us
Just do the sit-ups.
Belinda Gaston (18:39):
Do our sit-ups.
But I think, if we think abouttransition, how has these kind
of shifts and transitionsaffected, you think, us as a
couple, how we relate to oneanother?
Michael Gaston (18:56):
Well, retiring I'm just going to put that out
there Me retiring from lawenforcement was abrupt and a
surprise to the family.
I'll be honest, my expectationsversus the reality of law
enforcement and my faith at thetime kind of developed stress
(19:19):
beyond reality.
Had I had more faith in God onmy job, maybe the transition
from work into retirementwouldn't have been so abrupt,
because it did impact the family.
So that was a sudden transitionand that's where unification
(19:40):
should have kicked in and allthese other things that I talked
to you guys about.
I didn't do.
That transition was a shock tothe family and everything.
But you know, praise to God, allthat and a leveled out because
that gave me that time that Ineeded to get back in the words,
(20:02):
to get back in communicationwith God, to find out like
what's, what's up, what's nextand things of that nature, like
what's up, what's next andthings of that nature.
So those transitions are still.
We're still feeling therepercussions of those things,
but it's really trusting in Godthat everything is going to work
(20:22):
out like it's supposed to be.
I don't think, even though itwas abrupt, I don't think I was
meant to be in law enforcementas long as I have been, and it's
that part of letting go.
Sometimes you hold on tosomething that God wants you to
let go of and some of us hold ontight when now it's like he's
(20:44):
like okay, jab, jab, hook, I'mgoing to make you let go, but
now it's finding that transitionfrom what I used to do to what
God would have me do now, and Iforgot the question.
Belinda Gaston (21:00):
It's okay.
No, this is good.
This is good.
I told you it's a conversation.
Yeah, it's a conversation.
Michael Gaston (21:05):
I go around the mulberry bush since I retired.
Belinda Gaston (21:07):
Y'all.
He is turning into those peopleon the commercials.
So, if you see him standing outsaying get off my lawn and
talking to people.
Michael Gaston (21:14):
Staring out the window at you.
Belinda Gaston (21:18):
Talking to the else.
Michael Gaston (21:19):
Yeah, we can't let you be that guy, but I do.
Belinda Gaston (21:22):
First, I'm really surprised that you've
been as transparent, but theabrupt change and how you manage
it and how what God has donehas been amazing.
I had the realization the otherday that, like, even though so
what you're saying is, is thatabout the retirement?
That really was abrupt y'all.
Like he literally made thedecision, the paperwork started
(21:43):
and just kind of came home andannounced it and we weren't.
When you, someone like me as aplanner, like I had a plan, I
had outlines, I had this.
We're going to do this first.
We're going to do this secondall of that was out the window
and it was a tough road for usto get over because there was
resentment there was.
It was a lot, but he also, atthe same time you were having
some health challenges with yourheart and so the flip side of
(22:07):
that is, had you stayed, whoknows what would happen with the
stress on your heart?
But recently, like in this time, so if you've been following,
you know that God has put me inthis place where I kind of
stopped and was resting and justlistening to God and I was
thinking about you in retirementthe other day and how like it's
almost like retirement for youwas a rebirth of faith.
(22:29):
I mean you are reading yourword more than I've seen.
I mean you are already abeliever but like the level and
the depth of your study time andyour prayer time and even how
you lead us in prayer is just sodifferent and I believe that we
wouldn't have gotten there ifit wasn't for retirement.
And so I think there are thosebenefits.
(22:50):
And then you also just said thatwhole thing about how we hold
on this stuff, and that is sotrue.
I mean we hold on this stuffthat God is sometimes trying to
make us let go of.
And you're right, if we don'tdecide to let go of it, god was
just like well, I'm going to ripit from you.
Yeah, hook, hook, jab.
Yeah, hook, hook, jab, hook,yeah.
(23:12):
I think some women may say itdifferently.
I don't quite understand thatreference.
But yes, the kickboxing I didtake that kickboxing class.
Yeah, I got it.
I think that's important.
I want to encourage you ifyou're listening I don't know if
you're finding thisconversation helpful One thing I
would like to say as a leader,especially a woman who leaves
who's married.
You know when these kinds ofshifts happen in our lives.
(23:35):
You know you got to feel whatyou feel, but on the other side
of it, sometimes it's better,cause I even feel like trying to
read the questions.
I even feel like you and I spendmore time together, see things
differently, and it's all fromthat one kind of abrupt
experience.
Yeah, I think that's one waywe're going to.
I think I'd like for us to.
(23:56):
Oh sorry, were you going to saysomething?
Michael Gaston (23:58):
I think you know sometimes you can be
comfortable in your discontentabout knowing that you're not
content something like that Wow.
It's a comfortability thatGod's trying to shake everybody
out of.
Belinda Gaston (24:19):
Comfortable in your discontent.
Wow, pretty deep.
I feel like that's a C-linemoment that's what we call it.
You're right, and maybe that'swhat I would have said.
Selah moment that's what wecall it.
You're right, and maybe that'sthe point.
Even in our leadership we canget so comfortable in our
situation and trusting thesituation, like trusting our
(24:41):
jobs or trusting our positions,or even in our households,
trusting that things are goingto be the way they are.
I really didn't anticipate thatour son would be moving on to
campus this year.
I expected him to do what ouroldest did, which is go to
campus one year and then be likeokay, I'm done, I want to stay
home and commute, and so youknow, it's a different dynamic.
Michael Gaston (25:03):
And that's another transition that was kind
of to me sudden and abrupt, butit's something that happens and
it's something that you have toreally lean into God and reach
out to God for help to.
Those type of transitionshappen, and if you don't have it
planned out it can catch yousideways.
Belinda Gaston (25:24):
Yeah, but God is so faithful, like I think, the
25 years we've been married andGod has not abandoned us in any
way, from people dying tofinancial troubles, to us being
upset with one another and kidstuff, like he has never, ever
(25:45):
failed us Just waiting for youto calm down.
Michael Gaston (25:49):
so we can talk to you.
Belinda Gaston (25:52):
That's really it .
I don't like how you directedthat.
You mean me calm down, or youmean the proverbial Everybody
gets angry.
Michael Gaston (26:00):
Nobody wants to say you can get angry at God for
whatever reason, but he's justwaiting for you so he can talk
to you.
Belinda Gaston (26:07):
I feel like that should be on the t-shirt.
Just calm down and let God talk.
Yeah, calm down so I can talk toyou and I will say, in this
relationship I am the tornado,which is crazy, because most of
you know how calm I am.
I'm just not as calm as him,but he doesn't react.
He responds, so he's calm untilhe's not, and then it's like go
(26:28):
time.
So, whereas I process and allthat I guess that's why God put
us together right, we'rebalanced.
I think that we'll end ourconversation, because time went
by really fast.
Michael Gaston (26:38):
And what was the last question?
Did we ever get to the lastquestion?
I?
Belinda Gaston (26:42):
don't think so.
It's okay, you want to get tothe last question.
You'd like the last question.
Michael Gaston (26:52):
I'd like to answer the question, since it's
a conversation.
Belinda Gaston (26:55):
Hold on, hold on .
No, you know you shouldn't talkabout people like that.
No, don't do it.
Don't do it okay here.
What's this one right here?
Michael Gaston (27:02):
yeah, did we get to those?
Belinda Gaston (27:04):
no, but we're out of time we're out of time
we'll have to do a part two,because we talked about faith.
Michael Gaston (27:10):
The last one is faith and family.
Belinda Gaston (27:12):
Yeah, so what's in here?
Okay, so what's one way we tryto keep our family grounded when
life and leadership feel busy?
That's the last question.
Michael Gaston (27:25):
Oh, you have to do your rounds.
You know, it's almost like youknow how the old kings back in
the Bible will walk the kingdomto see how everybody's doing.
And that's how you keep peoplegrounded in the family.
You know, sometimes you go tothe kids and talk with them or,
you know, kick their door openand just do stuff just to make
(27:46):
sure that they're good.
Kick the door open.
Kick the door open, knock oversome pages and stuff.
Sometimes you can gauge whereyour kids are, you know,
depending on how annoyed theyget when you do stuff.
So that, to me, helped keepthem grounded.
And you know, they know youlove them.
Or you wouldn't even go intheir room and stuff like that.
(28:06):
But yeah, you walk your kingdom, you make sure that everything
is good.
You talk to people, you know,even if it's a short
conversation, even if you justgive them a look, and then you
move on.
Belinda Gaston (28:19):
Yeah, I think that's kind of annoying for the
kids.
Michael Gaston (28:21):
Yeah, it is yeah .
Belinda Gaston (28:22):
For me, I would say, is laughter.
I think as a whole our familylaughs a whole lot and that kind
of helps break things.
I mean, even for me sometimes,if I'm focused and I'm kind of
stressed out about whatever'shappening and whatever the
things are, just that brevity oflaughter helps.
(28:43):
It reminds you that thingsaren't so serious.
Like, at the end of the day, isany of this stuff really that
serious?
I don't think in the Biblethere's anything about thou
shall work this particular wayduring these hours with this
checklist.
I don't think that God talkedabout a to do list.
It's really of us kind ofletting go of control.
(29:05):
And so and I think that also I'mthe softer side, so I'm the
heart, I think, of the family.
And so, while you know, youhave your way of monitoring
things, I do heart checks, youknow, with our kids.
I think that works and it's nota competition.
I appreciate it.
It is not a competition.
So I think that's the lastquestion.
(29:28):
Do you have any final thoughtsfor women who lead as it relates
to anything that we'vediscussed?
Like, if you had to say onething to women who lead, from
the husband of someone who leadsbut also who respects your
leadership in the house, whatwould you say?
Michael Gaston (29:50):
your leadership in the House.
What would you say For womenwho lead?
Just recognize that the countrythat you're in, and there's
going to be haters, whether it'sgoing to be men or women,
there's going to be haters.
But keep in the back of yourhead.
(30:13):
If they were supposed to bedoing it or they feel like
they're supposed to be leadingit, you always have to say then
why aren't you?
You don't have to say it totheir face, but keep that in the
back of your, your mind.
When everybody's giving youtheir opinion about how your
business should be run or howyou should be doing things, just
keep it back your head.
All right, I hear you.
Why aren't you doing it?
Because that's what God's goingto ask, and if you know you
(30:38):
don't have an answer, they golook.
Thank you, we'll take youradvice under advisement.
Yeah that's pretty much it.
Belinda Gaston (30:49):
Well, and I think, adding to that, you know
what we talk about all the timeis God called people in certain
places of influence, and whatwe've defined leadership is is
influence.
And so there's some things thatI can say to the people who
respond to my voice that ifMichael tried to say it, that it
(31:11):
wouldn't go over.
Well, and there are people whoyou know Michael is called to.
If I try to talk to thosepeople, I don't, they wouldn't
receive it.
And so I think there's a placewhere all and I think what I've
learned over the years from youis that mutual respect, and you
know there've been times we hadto call each other on like well,
(31:32):
that's not quite respectful.
I really like the way you didthat, but that mutual respect
and communication and just nottaking things so seriously, all
that kind of stuff matters andit's helpful, so I'm grateful.
(31:57):
All right, so that's all we havefor this, our last episode of
season two of the grace to leadpodcast.
I hope that you will come backand listen.
Listen, we're already umpreparing some great
conversations.
I've already startedinterviewing our guests, and so
we have some really great guests.
So thank you so much for yoursupport of the Grace to Lead
podcast.
Honey, thank you for saying yes.
Michael Gaston (32:18):
Thank you for having me.
Belinda Gaston (32:23):
Thank you for being a guest, as always.
I appreciate you.
Please remember to like thepodcast, share the podcast and
if you have topics, remember youcan always reach.
I appreciate you.
Please remember to like thepodcast, share the podcast and
if you have topics, remember youcan always reach out to me.
There is a button on thepodcast page where you can send
me a direct message.
I get those directly to myphone, so please feel free to
continue to do that.
Visit me on the website atBelindaGabsoncom.
(32:45):
The Grace Lee podcastinformation is there and until
we see you again next week,remember you are indeed graced
to lead.
Michael Gaston (33:00):
Bye-bye.
Hey, it's Belinda, host of the Grace to
Lead podcast, and listen todayis different.
First of all, it is our seasonfinale for season two of the
Grace to Lead podcast, so thisis the last episode of season
two.
Don't worry, we'll be back withseason three.
And today I have a specialguest on.
I have my husband, michaelGaston, on, and we are talking
(00:23):
about leadership, we're talkingabout marriage and we're talking
(00:48):
about faith.
'm Belinda Gaston, your host,and listen y'all.
This week we have our very ownfirst male guest on the Grace to
Lead podcast, none other thanmy husband, michael Gaston.
Hey, honey.
Michael Gaston (01:08):
Hello everyone.
Belinda Gaston (01:10):
So this is the season finale for season two,
honey, and God told me to putyou on here and you said yes, he
said yes, y'all.
So today you and I are going totalk about leadership and our
marriage, so let me go ahead andintroduce you properly, okay,
(01:30):
so let me introduce you properlyto Michael.
Michael Gaston and I have beenmarried for 25 years.
We have three children, twocollege children and one middle
schooler and we are in the stageof our life right now where we
are transitioning.
I think we've transitioned forthe last few years between.
(01:51):
Michael has a long career in lawenforcement and I've had I
still am working in publichealth as a leader, but also
have in the last few years, youknow, transitioned in creating
Grace to Lead the podcast, theleadership development firm and
the ministry, and so it's been alot of transition.
(02:12):
Also, michael has retired andso he's also restarting a new
career and we'll talk about thata little bit in acting, as well
as his consulting for churchsecurity services.
So I can say we're intransition, but that is who he
is.
So welcome, michael Gaston, tothe show.
Michael Gaston (02:32):
Thank you, Thank you honey.
Belinda Gaston (02:35):
All right, so I have questions, y'all, and if
you are watching us on YouTube,hi welcome.
This is my second video that Iposted on YouTube, if you are
listening.
Thank you for listening to theGrace Elite Podcast, and so
we're going to start with ourfirst question Question number
one.
Question number one.
So let's start with leadership,right Leadership After 25 years
(03:01):
of marriage.
What's one leadership lessonyou've learned about us
navigating life together?
Michael Gaston (03:13):
I would say the main thing I learned about
navigating leadership within afamily context is discussing
everything, talking abouteverything, before you implement
anything.
Without those discussions itcan go sideways and I've proven
(03:36):
without discussing things thatit has and will go sideways.
So whatever's going on in yourmarriage or whatever plans you
have for the marriage or for thefamily, there has to be some
type of discussion.
Whether you disagree or agreeor whatever, it's good to have
(03:57):
those discussions.
So whatever your plans are,they don't go sideways, so
everybody's on the same page.
Belinda Gaston (04:04):
Yeah, I think that's that's really good.
So for me, I think the challengeis especially for women who
lead is like though I was, I'mleading in corporate spaces and
I have a leadership role at thechurch.
At home, you're still the headof our household, and so I know
when we first got married, itwas hard for me to accept some
(04:27):
of the decisions that you made,that kind of thing and I
appreciate the fact that youstarted telling me I don't
necessarily think that I changedyour mind a lot, but you allow
me to offer my ideas and kind oftell me your point of view what
was the hardest part about that?
What's the hardest part aboutthat?
Like, like, what's the hardestpart about communicating?
(04:47):
Cause it's not like when we metand I've now met, like uncle
Mike, so other people in thefamily like it's not like the
men in the family are supercommunicative.
You know it's not like they'reall saying, hey, let's discuss,
and so I imagine you coming intomy life and me coming into your
life, where I like y'all, Ilike to discuss everything, I
want to know how you're feeling,what you do, like all of that,
(05:09):
and that's not really him.
So what's what was the hardestpart about getting adjusted to
that in marriage.
Michael Gaston (05:17):
Oh, like you said, I come from a family of
men that grew up pretty muchsuck it up.
You do a, b and C and don'tdeviate from that, and we didn't
talk about feelings or any ofthat stuff, or even to the point
of whatever the plans are forthe household.
(05:38):
Everybody pretty much had thesame plan and everybody was on
the same page.
So you come into a relationshipwhere you have a significant
other that wants more detailsand things of that nature and
that could be, uh, frustrating,but it helps you.
(06:00):
It helps you that's the wordI'm looking for.
It helps you focus whatever yourplans are, or it helps you
narrow it down or have a what isthe word it's?
You have everything in boxes,organized, organized.
(06:21):
There we go, organized.
So it helps you organize yourplans better.
I mean that stuff is in theBible, so you know you organize
your plans so that everything,when it's implemented, it goes a
lot more smoother.
You're still going to run intolittle hiccups here and there,
but at least you have a plan togo by.
(06:42):
So it makes it made me there,but at least you have a plan to
go by.
So it makes it made me, as aman, think about more of the
details of things and also todiscuss things, because you know
, I don't have all the answers,I don't have all the ideas.
There's certain things Ihaven't experienced where those
questions have to be raised,where it makes me go look for
that thing.
So communication it just helps.
(07:04):
If you don't, if you're not abig talker, it helps you to
communicate anyway.
Belinda Gaston (07:11):
Yeah, I think for me, the biggest lesson was
allowing you to lead honestly.
And I don't know if any of ourlisteners can resonate with this
, but I came from a lineage ofwomen with a couple of
exceptions, but a lineage ofwomen who were divorced, and so
if you're a single mom andyou're raising your kids, you
(07:34):
have to do everything, andbefore that, being in
relationships where you justdidn't have that kind of level
of trust, I had to learn how totrust that, one, you would
consult God before you madedecisions and, two, that you had
the best interest for ourhousehold.
(07:55):
And so I literally had tounlearn.
I don't know if this makessense, but I kind of had to
unlearn the I.
I'm a strong woman and I'mgonna do everything on my own
and allow you to have thatresponsibility.
Does that make sense?
Michael Gaston (08:14):
it sounds weird but no, it makes sense because
on the flip side, you also havemen that were raised in single
parent household and the motherwas the leader of the household.
(08:50):
The men tend to lay back andlet the woman do all the things,
versus no, this is your job,this is your responsibility.
But if you haven't, thankfullybeen from church and men that I
worked in law enforcement, evenbeen from the streets and that
(09:13):
nature, that's what helped me torealize okay, we got everything
flipped and we need to flip itback.
And also in that communicationand leading, you have to learn
how to lead.
Belinda Gaston (09:28):
That's really, that was really good.
So okay, let's talk aboutsupport, because this comes up a
lot.
I have women who lead, whomessage sometimes and say, well,
you're giving great advice, butmy husband doesn't really
support my leadership in theseareas and I understand what
that's like.
But since we've been marriedthe last 25 years I have felt
(09:52):
nothing but support.
I mean even early on, becausewhen we first got married I was
kind of climbing the corporateladder and I was really a
go-getter then Not as much sonow, but then I was and I never
felt like you didn't support mypromotions at work.
I never felt like it was acompetition between the two of
(10:13):
us.
But as you led the house andled in spaces outside the house
for me and I can describe thekind of support I needed from
you and how we, because I thinkthat we did a good job of
(10:33):
support I mean, I hope I don'tknow, but I feel like you at
least did a good job ofsupporting me and I hope I still
did a good job of supportingyou.
But how would you describe thekind of support that you needed
in your own leadership journey?
Michael Gaston (10:49):
Well, definitely off the rip encouragement.
I don't think anybody's goingto be able to do anything
without any type ofencouragement from their
significant other.
So you're in the same householdso you might not get that
encouragement from peopleoutside of the household, but
you as a man, you definitelyexpect that encouragement in the
(11:12):
house, no matter what's goingon outside.
We have encouragement from home, so that's off the rip.
So as far as encouraging eachother, I'm always for anybody,
especially my wife, especiallymy wife, if you're trying to
(11:35):
better yourself, not just foryourself but for the household
in the whole, because that helpsthe household.
That helps out the householdfinancially, that helps out the
household spiritually, thathelps out the household
physically.
So I would say that's why Iencourage.
And if one person in thehousehold not just me, if it was
one of the kids and their stuffalready set up for their
(11:57):
business or whatever, then Iwould say we pour our attention
to that, encourage that kidentrepreneurship in the
household.
If I can give you thesuggestions and I can tell you
like hey, you know, joshua knowshow to do that, let's reach out
(12:20):
to him.
Jada knows how to do that,let's reach out for her to help
you with that.
You know, even Olivia knows howto do this.
Let's all just pull it togetherand that is being a to me being
a leader of the household,being a to me being a leader of
the household.
Belinda Gaston (12:31):
I think that's a family thing and I will say
that y'all, he always like hehas brilliant ideas and he, I
don't think, understands how hisbrilliance, but that's a whole.
I feel like that might be apart two conversation, but but
you brought up something thatmade me think, and so one of the
things that I'm really focusedon right now, as it relates to
(12:51):
support cause we're talkingabout, like support for leaders,
is also helping to birth yourvisions, right, and so me and
the kids talk all the time aboutlike how we can help you,
especially now because we're intransition.
You've retired now, so you'vegot more time to do these things
.
I think that support goes bothways, and so I appreciate the
(13:13):
fact that you supported me andmy climbing up to the corporate
ladder, because it wasn't easywith the young kids and all that
.
And you are so hardworking,like you were always working,
and so you were patient with me,and I think for me it's the
little things.
It's like understanding that mydesire may be to have a spotless
house, but sometimes theremight be dishes in the scene.
(13:34):
Now, once the kids got older,it's like, okay, now y'all do
the dishes.
That's why we had kids, but youknow what I'm saying.
It's like that I feel like wework well together and what I
had to realize as a leader, butalso as a wife, is that it's
never I think our pastor saysthis all the time it's never
50-50.
Marriage is 100-100.
(13:55):
So I'm all in, you're all in,and we have to navigate those.
Michael Gaston (14:00):
We have no expectations.
A lot of people believe if theyput in their 100%, there's
going to be an expectation forreciprocation, and it doesn't go
that way all the time.
So if you're just going to doit, I would say, just do it
without any expectations,because that's where your
disappointments come in andthat's where the enemy uses that
(14:24):
to drive a wedge between youand your wife or your husband.
Is is doing it withoutexpectations and forgiveness
always has to be in theforefront of your mind, because
if you don't have forgivenessand you get rid of your
expectations, you're going tohave the enemy uses that to
(14:47):
cause thoughts in your head.
That's what is a killer to mefrom that.
Belinda Gaston (14:53):
Yeah, I'm glad you said that, because I had
ridiculous expectations when wegot married.
I didn't know what to expectand I feel like we watch TVs and
movies and you're like, oh,it's going to be like this, and
when it's not, it's easy for youto your mind to wander, and I'm
sure you had these momentsbecause we talked about it where
, like, but this is not what Iexpected.
(15:15):
And then we go through seasonstoo, like in the 25 years.
I feel like we've gone throughcycles.
There are times when one of usis feeling one way and the other
person is feeling another, butGod's always allowed us to find
our way back.
So I don't want people to thinkalso that this is I don't know.
Would you say it was easy?
Michael Gaston (15:34):
No, it can be easy, but you have to have God
in your life at ground zero, god, then you know when those
disappointments or thosesurprises or your expectations
are not met.
Without God, you can goanywhere with God At least.
(15:54):
Okay, lord, you can say Lord,what is this?
That's not the person I met.
Belinda Gaston (16:01):
And I'm telling you, boy, there have been some.
You know, as leaders, we wantto make sure that we are walking
in our authentic selves.
We say that, but the reality isyour authentic self changes in
seasons.
Who I was when I was in my 20s,when we got married, versus my
30s, my 40s and now it's likeI'm.
I look at myself sometimes I'mlike, oh, we this.
(16:23):
I went through some seasons,but you, yeah, you had?
Yeah, you had to deal with allof me and my drama and all that.
Michael Gaston (16:33):
No, God knew what he was doing.
My hair fell out in the 80s youknow what you in the hair?
Belinda Gaston (16:37):
I'm just getting you ready.
All right, all right.
So let's talk, because we talkabout God a lot, and this is
gracefully, we do talk about Godin the podcast, and so let's
talk about faith.
Michael Gaston (16:56):
How has faith impacted how you lead our home?
Got rid of all the expectations?
A lot of the TV versus reality,that's a lot.
All the expectations.
Because you have to comparewhat the Word says to what your
(17:17):
reality says, what yourexpectations say.
You always got to compare itagainst the Word of God and you
have to find other godly men orgodly people to bounce those
expectations off of.
To me what faith does in yourrelationship in your marriage in
(17:38):
leadership everything.
It gets rid of all theseexpectations that are not real.
Belinda Gaston (17:47):
So let's talk about transitions.
So retirement for you was a bigtransition.
You know you were leading inthe space for a long time and
then all of a sudden thatchanged.
Now you're kind of finding yourway and doing, and I kind of
feel like you're finding yourpurpose and doing the things you
like, and at the same time wehave two kids that went off to
(18:09):
college and we're kind of thedynamics in our household have
changed a little bit.
And then I started Grace toLead and so that's a big change
because the time I had, freetime I had after my corporate
job has changed.
So we just kind of I feel likewe're all in transition and
we're people of a certain age.
So that's life transition,right, people of a certain age,
(18:31):
so that's life transition right,See that in the stomach.
That's okay, that's love.
Michael Gaston (18:35):
That's love we working on it right, Both of us
Just do the sit-ups.
Belinda Gaston (18:39):
Do our sit-ups.
But I think, if we think abouttransition, how has these kind
of shifts and transitionsaffected, you think, us as a
couple, how we relate to oneanother?
Michael Gaston (18:56):
Well, retiring I'm just going to put that out
there Me retiring from lawenforcement was abrupt and a
surprise to the family.
I'll be honest, my expectationsversus the reality of law
enforcement and my faith at thetime kind of developed stress
(19:19):
beyond reality.
Had I had more faith in God onmy job, maybe the transition
from work into retirementwouldn't have been so abrupt,
because it did impact the family.
So that was a sudden transitionand that's where unification
(19:40):
should have kicked in and allthese other things that I talked
to you guys about.
I didn't do.
That transition was a shock tothe family and everything.
But you know, praise to God, allthat and a leveled out because
that gave me that time that Ineeded to get back in the words,
(20:02):
to get back in communicationwith God, to find out like
what's, what's up, what's nextand things of that nature, like
what's up, what's next andthings of that nature.
So those transitions are still.
We're still feeling therepercussions of those things,
but it's really trusting in Godthat everything is going to work
(20:22):
out like it's supposed to be.
I don't think, even though itwas abrupt, I don't think I was
meant to be in law enforcementas long as I have been, and it's
that part of letting go.
Sometimes you hold on tosomething that God wants you to
let go of and some of us hold ontight when now it's like he's
(20:44):
like okay, jab, jab, hook, I'mgoing to make you let go, but
now it's finding that transitionfrom what I used to do to what
God would have me do now, and Iforgot the question.
Belinda Gaston (21:00):
It's okay.
No, this is good.
This is good.
I told you it's a conversation.
Yeah, it's a conversation.
Michael Gaston (21:05):
I go around the mulberry bush since I retired.
Belinda Gaston (21:07):
Y'all.
He is turning into those peopleon the commercials.
So, if you see him standing outsaying get off my lawn and
talking to people.
Michael Gaston (21:14):
Staring out the window at you.
Belinda Gaston (21:18):
Talking to the else.
Michael Gaston (21:19):
Yeah, we can't let you be that guy, but I do.
Belinda Gaston (21:22):
First, I'm really surprised that you've
been as transparent, but theabrupt change and how you manage
it and how what God has donehas been amazing.
I had the realization the otherday that, like, even though so
what you're saying is, is thatabout the retirement?
That really was abrupt y'all.
Like he literally made thedecision, the paperwork started
(21:43):
and just kind of came home andannounced it and we weren't.
When you, someone like me as aplanner, like I had a plan, I
had outlines, I had this.
We're going to do this first.
We're going to do this secondall of that was out the window
and it was a tough road for usto get over because there was
resentment there was.
It was a lot, but he also, atthe same time you were having
some health challenges with yourheart and so the flip side of
(22:07):
that is, had you stayed, whoknows what would happen with the
stress on your heart?
But recently, like in this time, so if you've been following,
you know that God has put me inthis place where I kind of
stopped and was resting and justlistening to God and I was
thinking about you in retirementthe other day and how like it's
almost like retirement for youwas a rebirth of faith.
(22:29):
I mean you are reading yourword more than I've seen.
I mean you are already abeliever but like the level and
the depth of your study time andyour prayer time and even how
you lead us in prayer is just sodifferent and I believe that we
wouldn't have gotten there ifit wasn't for retirement.
And so I think there are thosebenefits.
(22:50):
And then you also just said thatwhole thing about how we hold
on this stuff, and that is sotrue.
I mean we hold on this stuffthat God is sometimes trying to
make us let go of.
And you're right, if we don'tdecide to let go of it, god was
just like well, I'm going to ripit from you.
Yeah, hook, hook, jab.
Yeah, hook, hook, jab, hook,yeah.
(23:12):
I think some women may say itdifferently.
I don't quite understand thatreference.
But yes, the kickboxing I didtake that kickboxing class.
Yeah, I got it.
I think that's important.
I want to encourage you ifyou're listening I don't know if
you're finding thisconversation helpful One thing I
would like to say as a leader,especially a woman who leaves
who's married.
You know when these kinds ofshifts happen in our lives.
(23:35):
You know you got to feel whatyou feel, but on the other side
of it, sometimes it's better,cause I even feel like trying to
read the questions.
I even feel like you and I spendmore time together, see things
differently, and it's all fromthat one kind of abrupt
experience.
Yeah, I think that's one waywe're going to.
I think I'd like for us to.
(23:56):
Oh sorry, were you going to saysomething?
Michael Gaston (23:58):
I think you know sometimes you can be
comfortable in your discontentabout knowing that you're not
content something like that Wow.
It's a comfortability thatGod's trying to shake everybody
out of.
Belinda Gaston (24:19):
Comfortable in your discontent.
Wow, pretty deep.
I feel like that's a C-linemoment that's what we call it.
You're right, and maybe that'swhat I would have said.
Selah moment that's what wecall it.
You're right, and maybe that'sthe point.
Even in our leadership we canget so comfortable in our
situation and trusting thesituation, like trusting our
(24:41):
jobs or trusting our positions,or even in our households,
trusting that things are goingto be the way they are.
I really didn't anticipate thatour son would be moving on to
campus this year.
I expected him to do what ouroldest did, which is go to
campus one year and then be likeokay, I'm done, I want to stay
home and commute, and so youknow, it's a different dynamic.
Michael Gaston (25:03):
And that's another transition that was kind
of to me sudden and abrupt, butit's something that happens and
it's something that you have toreally lean into God and reach
out to God for help to.
Those type of transitionshappen, and if you don't have it
planned out it can catch yousideways.
Belinda Gaston (25:24):
Yeah, but God is so faithful, like I think, the
25 years we've been married andGod has not abandoned us in any
way, from people dying tofinancial troubles, to us being
upset with one another and kidstuff, like he has never, ever
(25:45):
failed us Just waiting for youto calm down.
Michael Gaston (25:49):
so we can talk to you.
Belinda Gaston (25:52):
That's really it .
I don't like how you directedthat.
You mean me calm down, or youmean the proverbial Everybody
gets angry.
Michael Gaston (26:00):
Nobody wants to say you can get angry at God for
whatever reason, but he's justwaiting for you so he can talk
to you.
Belinda Gaston (26:07):
I feel like that should be on the t-shirt.
Just calm down and let God talk.
Yeah, calm down so I can talk toyou and I will say, in this
relationship I am the tornado,which is crazy, because most of
you know how calm I am.
I'm just not as calm as him,but he doesn't react.
He responds, so he's calm untilhe's not, and then it's like go
(26:28):
time.
So, whereas I process and allthat I guess that's why God put
us together right, we'rebalanced.
I think that we'll end ourconversation, because time went
by really fast.
Michael Gaston (26:38):
And what was the last question?
Did we ever get to the lastquestion?
I?
Belinda Gaston (26:42):
don't think so.
It's okay, you want to get tothe last question.
You'd like the last question.
Michael Gaston (26:52):
I'd like to answer the question, since it's
a conversation.
Belinda Gaston (26:55):
Hold on, hold on .
No, you know you shouldn't talkabout people like that.
No, don't do it.
Don't do it okay here.
What's this one right here?
Michael Gaston (27:02):
yeah, did we get to those?
Belinda Gaston (27:04):
no, but we're out of time we're out of time
we'll have to do a part two,because we talked about faith.
Michael Gaston (27:10):
The last one is faith and family.
Belinda Gaston (27:12):
Yeah, so what's in here?
Okay, so what's one way we tryto keep our family grounded when
life and leadership feel busy?
That's the last question.
Michael Gaston (27:25):
Oh, you have to do your rounds.
You know, it's almost like youknow how the old kings back in
the Bible will walk the kingdomto see how everybody's doing.
And that's how you keep peoplegrounded in the family.
You know, sometimes you go tothe kids and talk with them or,
you know, kick their door openand just do stuff just to make
(27:46):
sure that they're good.
Kick the door open.
Kick the door open, knock oversome pages and stuff.
Sometimes you can gauge whereyour kids are, you know,
depending on how annoyed theyget when you do stuff.
So that, to me, helped keepthem grounded.
And you know, they know youlove them.
Or you wouldn't even go intheir room and stuff like that.
(28:06):
But yeah, you walk your kingdom, you make sure that everything
is good.
You talk to people, you know,even if it's a short
conversation, even if you justgive them a look, and then you
move on.
Belinda Gaston (28:19):
Yeah, I think that's kind of annoying for the
kids.
Michael Gaston (28:21):
Yeah, it is yeah .
Belinda Gaston (28:22):
For me, I would say, is laughter.
I think as a whole our familylaughs a whole lot and that kind
of helps break things.
I mean, even for me sometimes,if I'm focused and I'm kind of
stressed out about whatever'shappening and whatever the
things are, just that brevity oflaughter helps.
(28:43):
It reminds you that thingsaren't so serious.
Like, at the end of the day, isany of this stuff really that
serious?
I don't think in the Biblethere's anything about thou
shall work this particular wayduring these hours with this
checklist.
I don't think that God talkedabout a to do list.
It's really of us kind ofletting go of control.
(29:05):
And so and I think that also I'mthe softer side, so I'm the
heart, I think, of the family.
And so, while you know, youhave your way of monitoring
things, I do heart checks, youknow, with our kids.
I think that works and it's nota competition.
I appreciate it.
It is not a competition.
So I think that's the lastquestion.
(29:28):
Do you have any final thoughtsfor women who lead as it relates
to anything that we'vediscussed?
Like, if you had to say onething to women who lead, from
the husband of someone who leadsbut also who respects your
leadership in the house, whatwould you say?
Michael Gaston (29:50):
your leadership in the House.
What would you say For womenwho lead?
Just recognize that the countrythat you're in, and there's
going to be haters, whether it'sgoing to be men or women,
there's going to be haters.
But keep in the back of yourhead.
(30:13):
If they were supposed to bedoing it or they feel like
they're supposed to be leadingit, you always have to say then
why aren't you?
You don't have to say it totheir face, but keep that in the
back of your, your mind.
When everybody's giving youtheir opinion about how your
business should be run or howyou should be doing things, just
keep it back your head.
All right, I hear you.
Why aren't you doing it?
Because that's what God's goingto ask, and if you know you
(30:38):
don't have an answer, they golook.
Thank you, we'll take youradvice under advisement.
Yeah that's pretty much it.
Belinda Gaston (30:49):
Well, and I think, adding to that, you know
what we talk about all the timeis God called people in certain
places of influence, and whatwe've defined leadership is is
influence.
And so there's some things thatI can say to the people who
respond to my voice that ifMichael tried to say it, that it
(31:11):
wouldn't go over.
Well, and there are people whoyou know Michael is called to.
If I try to talk to thosepeople, I don't, they wouldn't
receive it.
And so I think there's a placewhere all and I think what I've
learned over the years from youis that mutual respect, and you
know there've been times we hadto call each other on like well,
(31:32):
that's not quite respectful.
I really like the way you didthat, but that mutual respect
and communication and just nottaking things so seriously, all
that kind of stuff matters andit's helpful, so I'm grateful.
(31:57):
All right, so that's all we havefor this, our last episode of
season two of the grace to leadpodcast.
I hope that you will come backand listen.
Listen, we're already umpreparing some great
conversations.
I've already startedinterviewing our guests, and so
we have some really great guests.
So thank you so much for yoursupport of the Grace to Lead
podcast.
Honey, thank you for saying yes.
Michael Gaston (32:18):
Thank you for having me.
Belinda Gaston (32:23):
Thank you for being a guest, as always.
I appreciate you.
Please remember to like thepodcast, share the podcast and
if you have topics, remember youcan always reach.
I appreciate you.
Please remember to like thepodcast, share the podcast and
if you have topics, remember youcan always reach out to me.
There is a button on thepodcast page where you can send
me a direct message.
I get those directly to myphone, so please feel free to
continue to do that.
Visit me on the website atBelindaGabsoncom.
(32:45):
The Grace Lee podcastinformation is there and until
we see you again next week,remember you are indeed graced
to lead.
Michael Gaston (33:00):
Bye-bye.
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