February 8, 2025 • 47 mins
What if the path to healing from trauma and betrayal was more achievable than you thought? Join us as we explore the profound journey of Michelle Vrabel, an inspiring author who shares her story of overcoming childhood abuse and trauma through faith. Michelle's book, "Butterfly Stitches," serves as a poignant metaphor for her physical and spiritual recovery. Her account encourages listeners to take an active role in their healing journeys, starting from the first moment a wound is inflicted. Michelle's unwavering faith and resilience offer hope and guidance for those seeking to heal from their past.
Michelle opens up about the emotional scars left by infidelity and emotional abuse, which are often more challenging to heal than physical wounds. Her journey reveals unexpected paths to healing through community engagement and storytelling. By sharing her own experiences, Michelle highlights the power of emotional resilience and finding solace in faith. This episode underscores the importance of breaking generational patterns and establishing healthier relationships, emphasizing the transformative guidance of the Holy Spirit. Michelle's candid narrative serves as a testament to the strength found in supportive networks and personal determination.
Finally, we explore the role of faith in healing every aspect of our well-being—mental, emotional, spiritual, and physical. Michelle shares her insights on the divine assistance offered by the Holy Spirit and invites listeners to deepen their spiritual connection through prayer and an understanding of the Trinity. Her personal journey reveals the wisdom gained from studying the Holy Spirit and the enriching impact it has had on her life. We also discuss the principles of the Gracefield Community, inspired by the early Church of Acts, and how they aim to foster a supportive and spiritually guided network for those in need.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
My name is Nicole Cater, your host, founder and
servant leader of GracevilleCommunity.
I want to thank you for tuningin to Graceville Community
Podcast.
This is a safe space, a placein which we just share stories
of how God has touchedindividuals' lives all across
the world and how they are nowimpacting the kingdom of God.
(00:21):
Thank you for tuning in.
Blessings to you.
Hello Graceville communityfollowers, we are so excited for
you to connect with us ontoday's podcast.
As always, I am just overlyblessed by the individuals that
lend themselves to our podcastto share their stories and how
(00:44):
they're impacting community.
And so today is like everyother in the sense that we have
an amazing guest joining ustoday.
I've had a chance to read andunderstand more about her, her
heart, her vision, her story,and I'm so excited for her to
share with you guys today.
(01:05):
So I will read just a littlebit about our guests.
Today we have Michelle Vrabel.
Michelle is an expert beancounter by day, in addition to
her work as bookkeeper.
Her superpowers and sidehustles include pastry chef and
(01:26):
author in training, which Iwould love to try that pastry
chef stuff out.
She has been told she has sass,which she deploys regularly.
She has, with exponential joy,finished her first book,
butterfly Stitches, and isworking on the sequel.
According to her king, sheapparently has several other
(01:48):
books in her.
At 61, she has launched apodcast and is having the time
of her life.
She is an enthusiastic traveler, foodie, smart aleck and lover
of her king, jesus.
Michelle lives in Mesa, arizona, with her daughter, who is
lovingly known as Peanut.
Michelle would love to engagewith you through any and all
(02:11):
media, as she is also availablefor speaking engagements and
retreats.
So, gracefield community, goahead and join me in welcoming
Michelle.
Hey, michelle.
Speaker 2 (02:31):
Thank you, how fun.
I guess I haven't heard my bioread out loud in a while and I
guess I am kind of a smart aleckhuh Love it.
I mean, hey, well, it's allpart of the life we're living
and I just look at it becauseI'm 62.
Now I was 61 when I started mypodcast.
That you know.
I don't know if the Lord'sgoing to give me three more
years, three more days, 30 moreyears, and if he is, then I want
(02:58):
to take every minute and justlike absorb it, because there is
a lot of time I wasn't a goodsteward of when I was younger
and so that has a lot to do withmy story and my journey, and so
I enjoy every bit of this wildride he's given me.
I liken it to being on a rollercoaster, in a tornado.
You know it's exhilarating, butit's terrifying, but it's.
Speaker 1 (03:19):
Oh, I am right there with you.
I say all the time this faithwalk is definitely like the
roller coaster.
I say all the time this faithwalk is definitely like the
roller coaster.
I like to use the scenario tolike you know those, um, you go
to the fair and they have thatboat that like swings you.
I don't know what's happened,but ever since I've had kids,
it's like everything in mystomach seems to drop and it
feels entirely different now.
(03:40):
But I'm like that's how lifeseems to be.
It's like, yeah, okay, god youever get.
Oh, okay, absolutely, I love it, okay.
Well, I'm so excited to dive in.
I would love for our listenersto just hear more about your
(04:00):
story and your personal journey.
So I first just want to ask,like butterfly stitches, tell us
about that.
Like, where does that name evencome from?
How does it connect with youpersonally?
Share your story to the worldtoday.
Speaker 2 (04:13):
Okay, I absolutely believe that.
Every bit of my book, the storyof course I call it my story,
his story, our story, because itis my journey with my king.
I believe he gave me the visionfor the title, the cover, which
I have been told is a boldchoice.
(04:35):
It's around here somewhere Icould hold it up, but anyway.
And the title, and it'sinteresting, it comes from a
couple of directions.
First of all, I don't know ifyour listeners know this and I
don't want to insult anyone'sintelligence, but a butterfly
stitch is an actual medicaldevice.
It's a bandage and they put iton wounds or cuts that aren't
(04:57):
deep enough for actual stitches,so it'll hold a wound together.
Now the problem with that is isthat it's going to take a
little bit longer and you haveto participate, you have to keep
it clean, you have to changethe butterfly stitch.
So all of that's a beautifulmetaphor that goes with my book
and its subtitle theMetamorphosis of Healing.
(05:19):
Because with our King Jesus, Ibelieve healing is a process.
Because with our King Jesus, Ibelieve healing is a process and
I believe it begins at themoment of the wound.
My story is a two-part memoir.
I was beaten as a child I wassexually molested.
I have had abuse in every areamentally, emotionally,
(05:40):
spiritually and physically sinceI was little and I believe from
one of the very first beatingsI got worst ones when I was two
years old that every bit of myhealing the Holy Spirit was
there Not to intercede becausewe all understand that free will
is running rampant in thisparticular world but to show me
(06:03):
I was created to start healingthe moment a wound happens.
So when our physical bodyresponds like if we're cut, you
know it starts coagulating and ascab starts forming so we don't
bleed out Then mentally we'rekind of going all right, what's
going on here?
This doesn't make sense.
Like if a little kid touches ahot stove, they know, okay, I'm
(06:26):
not going to touch that again.
So we have that mentaldiscernment to begin that
healing process too, to kind oftake every experience we
encounter and evaluate it forwhether or not we understand the
good or the bad of it andwhether we want that to happen
again or not.
Now does that stop it fromhappening again.
Not necessarily, but at leastit helps us start to evaluate
(06:47):
and hopefully, at some juncturein our life as we grow, try to
avoid those when we have theopportunity to make that
decision, as opposed to havingit thrust upon us.
So butterfly stitches requireour engagement.
We have to be involved in thatprocess.
Our King Jesus is right here,the Holy Spirit's right here.
We are going to heal, but it'sa process and we need to keep
(07:11):
the wound clean, put on the newbandages and stop going back to
what caused the wound in thefirst place when we have the
ability to.
So that's how that name cameabout.
It also has a very humorousbackstory.
When I was getting married, I,the song butterfly, kisses.
You know that song, butterflykisses.
Speaker 1 (07:34):
Okay, I might ask you to sing it to remind.
Speaker 2 (07:36):
Oh my, we don't really want that, but it's a
song that was written by aChristian artist and he's
singing.
It's a dad singing about hislittle girl growing up and then
him having to give her away atthe end of the song at her
wedding.
And butterfly kisses are likelittle kisses that you put on
your little baby's forehead orsomething like that, and so that
(07:58):
song was all the rage andeverybody was playing it at
their wedding.
Well, I didn't have a goodfather, I didn't have someone to
give me away like that at mywedding.
So I'm hearing this song in mycar, I mean literally within a
couple of weeks of my wedding,and I am a smart aleck, and so I
rewrote in my mind the lyricsto Butterfly Kisses as butterfly
(08:20):
stitches, and so it just kindof all comes together.
I love double meaning things and, uh, that's why that title is
that way.
That's why on the cover, um, ifyou'll notice, I have a
butterfly stitch bandage overone eye.
Um, my niece did does you know?
Uh, that type of makeup for youknow, like movies or contests
(08:42):
or whatever, and so she helpedme look like I did, which was
wounded, and some people haveasked about that too Like were
you beaten up as an adult?
Because the picture is me as anadult.
But no, what I'm expressing isthat even though those wounds
are healing, it doesn't mean wedon't carry them into adulthood.
(09:04):
You know, and some people carryand hang on to them a little
too tight into adulthood.
And don't let that healingprocess start.
And that's my prayer with mybook is that people can
understand.
I don't want them to walk awayfeeling sorry for me or with me
because I was a victim.
I'm not a victim.
(09:25):
I don't sit in that.
So I want them to see that inthe telling, in the looking back
, the Holy Spirit was there andthe Holy Spirit began that
healing with us.
Now we kind of take over thereins sometimes and reopen
wounds on our own, but thereality is the healing is there
and we can see it if we'rewilling to do our part, do the
(09:48):
work.
Speaker 1 (09:49):
Right, yes, I absolutely love that.
I mean I myself have my own, aswe all do, right, we all have
our own background.
We all have our various areasthat we experienced trauma.
You know, I joke with mychildren.
I'm like I am saving yourcollege fund and I'm also saving
your counseling fund.
Your therapy, I know that I'mnot getting this perfect, so
(10:14):
there are going to be somethings that you are probably
going to want to talk tosomebody about.
Speaker 2 (10:18):
We'll get a bulk rate for you by in advance.
Yes, yes, that's awesome.
Speaker 1 (10:26):
That's just the reality, and I understand
exactly.
What you're saying is that youknow we have these wounds and I
think the first step is alwaysto recognize that, like there
are wounds here, it's okay toacknowledge I've been wounded
and to sit with God.
I mean, one of the questionsthat I often ask is like God,
where were you?
Where were you in that moment?
(10:49):
And let's talk that out right.
I love that we have a heavenlyfather and a Holy spirit that's
a comforter right that can sitwith us and allow us to have
those conversations, to give itall to him, and so I'm so
excited for what you offer inthis book.
I do have to ask the moment youdecided to write this book,
(11:09):
what was the catalyst Like?
What caused you to say I'mgoing to release this, Not me.
Speaker 2 (11:15):
Right, not me, I was.
It was a while ago.
Now I say I say 10 years, butthat was five years ago, so it's
probably been about 15 years.
I was in the middle of a Biblestudy in Isaiah I was still
married at the time and the Lordjust said we were dipping into
Esther and going back and forth,and some of the things that
were being said were bringing meto tears and I was trying to
(11:37):
figure out what was going onthere.
And the Lord I believe that Ihear him audibly.
I have people like poo, poothat even believers and I'm like
okay, maybe if you were sittingin the room with me you
wouldn't be hearing him.
But I'm telling you that I hearhim audibly, not every time he
answers me.
Sometimes it's different ways,but there are times when and I
(12:02):
think some of it is becausewe've dispensed with subtlety
I'm just, you know, I'm the kidthat needs to get hit over the
head with a brick, you know, geta clunked on the head.
My girlfriend and I call itgetting a slap in the face.
You know, we just, we just need, you know, that little extra.
So anyway, I audibly, you know,heard him say now it's time,
(12:24):
it's time to tell your story.
And when he did that originallyI thought okay, this is just
for me, so I can live with that.
I didn't panic, I didn't freakout.
I thought this is just for me,although I do feel, like a lot
of people who've come up to mesince telling my story, that you
initially are a little afraidto write it down because, wait,
(12:45):
what if somebody else sees it?
You know, if this is just forme, how do I do this and keep it
just for me?
You know, I didn't have alaptop that I was going to put
on.
Literally, I started writing byhand and then eventually moved
to a laptop.
Speaker 1 (12:59):
But I didn't ask for this.
Speaker 2 (13:02):
My daughter's going to Arizona State University to
be a writer and she, I think,has a novel already in the works
and she has a book of poetry.
All that, Not me, not what Iwanted not some lifelong dream,
no, so, anyway, I go a couple ofyears where I'm just kind of
like, you know, just getting itout there, not editing it, just
(13:23):
writing stuff down, just kind oflike, you know, just getting it
out there, not editing it, justwriting stuff down.
And then my marriage wentthrough some.
The stuff I was going throughgot more intense, it got crazy
and I kind of it kind of got puton the back burner, which is
not what the Lord wanted for me,but he isn't, wasn't surprised
by what was happening in my life.
And, um, we come to the end ofmy marriage and now I'm really'm
(13:44):
really.
The wounds of my childhood havebeen ripped back open.
I'm raw.
I'm laying out, literallylaying on the floor of my living
room before the Lord, because Ithought the infidelity was bad
enough, but who my ex becameduring the divorce was very
upsetting.
I was unrecognizable and I justhad to, you know, be where he
(14:08):
wanted me to be in, thatprostrate and, let you know,
letting go, letting go ofthinking that I was in control,
that I was protecting myself,that I was protecting my
daughter by staying and, youknow, going through all this
stuff.
So, you know, I I believe thatthat that calling initially, now
(14:28):
I can affirm he has now saidokay, here we are, now this is
going to work together, not onlyfor you but for others.
So buckle up buttercup Time totime to really get it out there.
And so I joined some writergroups and got a writing coach,
(14:50):
or wrote coaches and uh, moved,moved, the moved the football
down the field.
Speaker 1 (14:57):
I love it.
You know, one of the things,too, is so true.
I mean, even for me, with thispodcast and all the things that
we do, I mean, gracevillecommunity as a whole was never
anything that I wanted to do,right, and so I think that it's
so.
I guess we will say kind andgracious of our Lord to really,
(15:18):
though, push us in the sense ofbecause it does take us even
through the healing process ofanother step of healing, because
it does take us even throughthe healing process of another
step of healing, when we canshare our story, when we can
land into someone else and thenhear from them like how much it
has impacted them.
If you know, gracevillecommunity didn't make a dime.
It's the stories that conformit right, it's the testimonies
(15:39):
that come from it.
That is really what is, youknow, the true reward behind it,
and so I'm right there with youand get where it's like.
This is not what I necessarilysigned up to do.
Speaker 2 (15:53):
Like not even a little bit.
Speaker 1 (15:55):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (15:58):
Yep, and the same with when my coaches told me you
need to do a podcast becauseit's an extension of your story
and then you can also bring inothers and extend that healing
process.
And I was like what, what I'mnot doing, joe Rogan?
And they're like well, ofcourse you're not.
They're like we know, don't besilly, you've got your community
(16:24):
, just talk to them.
Speaker 1 (16:26):
Oh yeah, you know, one of the things that you said
that I can personally speak toand want to just talk about
briefly is the trauma thatactually occurs after infidelity
, right, and so my husband and Iwe do a Graceville marriages,
we do a lot of marriagecounseling, biblical counseling.
We have marriage groups ofmarriage counseling, biblical
counseling.
We have marriage groups, onlinemarriage community, all kinds
(16:48):
of things.
And so, coming from that, oneof the things that I learned
throughout our experience and Isee with couples all the time is
there's this misconception thatemotional abuse is is not as
great as a physical abuse, whenthe reality is that emotional
abuse is often much harder toheal from, because it's not,
(17:12):
like, you know, if we and thisis not to discredit any physical
abuse, right absolutely.
I understand exactly whereyou're going yes, when we have a
physical punch, like, okay, Ican put the ice on it, but even
in the physical abuse, there'semotional abuse behind it, Like
why did this occur?
How did we get here?
And that's the part that takesthe healing process.
And so, like you said, evenwith infidelity there's the
(17:35):
emotional abuse, the betrayalthat comes from it.
You know, in a study they showthat people that experience
emotional abuse throughinfidelity say that it's worse
than actually the loss of achild and being.
I have experienced both.
I would attest to it.
Is it very much so is.
(17:55):
And so I just want to hear fromyou real quick.
Like I know, in the book youdiscuss the impact of, like
physical and emotional abuse.
But how did you navigate suchan intense experience at such a
young age?
Speaker 2 (18:07):
Well, and and I couldn't agree more, um, I've
said um and I go through.
My book is written in seasons,three different seasons which
are timelines of my life, and sothe sequel finishes off work up
to now with, with my divorceand with my daughter and those
kinds of things.
But yes, I've said before outloud that the actual physical
(18:32):
act of him committing adulterywith someone else did not hurt
me physically as much as theemotional thought that he had
given himself to another person,that someone else took that
priority, took that place afterwe had said those vows.
So then, and those emotionalscars, physical scars, um, heal.
(18:55):
Like you said, the pain stopsand over time I don't remember.
I mean I remember, but I don'tremember.
I can't call to mind the painin my face when I was two years
old and my father, open arm,slapped me dozens of times to
the point where my facehemorrhaged.
I don't, I can't summon that up, but can I summon up how I felt
(19:18):
the fact that my daddy did thatto me?
Absolutely Now, I did not dragthat forward and think about it
often, any of those components,because back then I'd had no
counselors, no doctors, nobodycame in and checked on me.
So a lot of the kind of reviewof what I went through was with
(19:40):
the Holy Spirit.
I believe we receive him atsalvation, but it doesn't mean
he wasn't there beforehand, itdoesn't mean he's not our
comforter from the before we'reknit together in our mother's
womb.
So I think the emotional andmental scars are are the most
(20:00):
difficult to get healed.
They really are.
It's not that I don't believemy Lord can do it and that my
Holy, the Holy spirit can, butwith those are the little wounds
you go back to when you're likeout on a date after you've been
divorced and like little hairsmay come up and it might be
yellow flags and you're temptedbecause of your emotional scars
(20:23):
to just run to a red flag andthe situation when that could be
a very genuine human in frontof you.
So those are the healingprocesses that bring you back to
relationship with Jesus aboutdiscernment and how to let those
emotional wounds heal.
But I couldn't agree more.
(20:43):
Those, those are probably thetoughest.
Speaker 1 (20:45):
Yes, absolutely.
And you know, I think aboutscripture telling us to renew
our mind daily Right and even inthe component of, like you,
allowing the Holy spirit to giveus that discernment, because we
can.
I think our bodies are builtright.
Flight what is it Flight?
Speaker 2 (21:01):
or flight.
Speaker 1 (21:03):
Our bodies are built to respond one way or another,
and it is only through the powerof the Holy Spirit allowing us
to discern where we are in thatmoment, right Discern maybe
those that we're interactingwith and then really sitting
with him on.
Hey, is this a space that iscoming from past trauma, Even
(21:23):
though it may have been healed?
our bodies will tend tonaturally respond right.
Hey, let's take a quick breakto tell you about Grace-Filled
Community.
Grace-filled Community is anorganization that focuses on the
primary principles of theChurch of Acts, centered around
(21:46):
building communities that impactthe kingdom of God.
We do this through three coreextensions.
One, graceville Church Network,where we empower churches and
nonprofits for God's success andgrowth.
Success and growth we offertailored growth strategies
(22:07):
rooted in biblical principlesthat will help you expand your
reach and impact yourcommunities.
Just like the early church, wefocus not on attendance and
numbers, but on discipleship,providing leadership teachings
and trainings to today'sministry leaders.
Our second extension is Projectof the Grace Field, where we
provide biblical counseling,mentorship, workshops and events
(22:30):
that are dedicated toencouraging individuals to live
a life filled with grace andpurpose, rooted in the
understanding that all havefallen short and are a working
project.
Let us help the individuals inyour community grow as they walk
with God and experience thefullness of his love.
(22:51):
Our third extension is thegrace-filled business.
Grace-filled business is hereto help small, faith-based
business owners develop theirbusiness in a way that honors
God, that brings increase andallows them to pour back into
his kingdom, through marketplaceministry and financing his
kingdom.
We do this through our 15 yearsof experience of virtual
(23:14):
administrative work, digitalmarketing, business development
and consulting.
Welcome back, welcome back, youknow.
(23:38):
I would say.
What we do also see is thatwhen we have these childhood
traumas and we are not properlytaught like you stated, there
was to this, referring thefamily to this at that time,
when we don't have the space andthe safe space to properly heal
from it, we find that itcarries in to adulthood, like
you stated.
And so my question to you isyou know, was there a specific
(24:00):
time in your early years thatyou realized that you had to
break a cycle of abuse Like whendid that occur for you?
How did you get there, nothaving resources at the time?
Speaker 2 (24:11):
You know that's so fascinating and somebody asked
me that a couple of weeks ago ona podcast a mental health
professional.
I'm like this is the first time, but it is so why I believe so
much and so deeply that the HolySpirit has been working my
healing.
The thing of the matter is isthat around 23, probably, I went
(24:37):
on a 10 year stint of where Iwas going to be in control of
who loved me and who who wasgoing to be let in, because I
thought me controlling it wasgoing to be better and I had
made a couple of decisions Ididn't want to talk to the Lord
about.
But in talking about whatyou're saying about my childhood
and breaking that generationalsin because my father was beaten
(24:58):
by his father and it was agenerational sin that he chose
not to break a generational sinthat he chose not to break I
honestly believe at 14 years old, when I had the discernment and
could only could be a God thing.
Sitting in our car, he wasdriving us back home from a
visitation weekend and I justcouldn't do it anymore.
(25:18):
Every time we went with him, hewould take us, my brothers and
I, and jump us off at this housewith all these kids and we
loved those kids.
Actually that was a fun place,but they would leave with the
parents, come back staggeringdrunk and our ride home was just
I don't even know the rightword for it.
(25:40):
It was terrifying and it justgot to be to the point where I
was like you know what, as muchas I love these kids and stuff,
I'm not related to them.
I can be home with my mom andmy grandparents instead of being
dumped somewhere else.
Um, if, if, he supposedly caresabout us this much, so I I
finally said to him you know I Ican't do this anymore.
(26:02):
And the thing was he popped thetrunk, didn't even get out and
get my suitcase out.
Want to hug me, want to talk meout of it?
Pop the trunk, let us get out.
We're on our way.
So I never thought of thatHonestly again, the rest I mean
the rest of my life, until itcame time to write this book.
(26:22):
My, I can tell you, myex-husband does not know
everything that I've written inthis book.
My brothers didn't knoweverything that has been written
, and they wrote the forewordfor the book for me, because we
were in the trenches when wewere little together.
Um, but none of us haverepeated this cycle.
All of us broke thegenerational sin, and, and and,
(26:46):
and I don't even remember sayingit out loud that this was going
to be a conscious effort.
I really don't.
I have an only child, adaughter, and I remember the
first time I had to spank her,because I do believe that spank.
I know the difference between aspanking and a beating.
I've had both, yes, and thefirst time I had to swallow, I
believe in spanking spoil.
Speaker 1 (27:03):
Spare the rod, spoil the child.
I'm like we're not sparing rodsaround here.
Speaker 2 (27:07):
The first time I had to swat her on the bottom a
couple of times I I sat her downand I prayed with her and I
told her why this was happening.
And and then I did it and she'scrying and I go out and close
the door and I go in the livingroom and my husband was sitting
there because, I mean, I knowthe difference and he did, he
just reinforced.
He did reinforce for me.
He's like you did not hurt her,you did not, you're not, he
(27:30):
didn't even really hurt her, youkind of gathered her attention,
whatever.
So it was.
It was a um Holy spirit drivendecisions in my life not to let
that be a part of any part, notanywhere in my universe.
We didn't even have to be setout loud, it didn't have to be a
(27:51):
conscious decision, there wasnot going to be beating, because
that isn't what people who loveone another do.
And if I, if I brought anythingforward and and, like I said,
that 10 year period and I wasmaking bad decisions, it was
because every male in particularfrom the time I was born up
until that point, that said theylove me or that should have
(28:15):
loved me, didn't?
They lied and they did things,devastating things, and so I
decided that I was going to likeI.
My answer to it wasn't todiscern and see if somebody
meant it when they said theylove me.
If somebody said they love me,I'm done dating you.
Next, I'm done dating you, andI somehow in my little pea brain
(28:42):
, thought this was a great wayto go.
Needless to say, some mentalscars and emotional scars were
taking a lot longer.
Speaker 1 (28:58):
I mean that makes absolute, absolute sense.
I know it sounds like we'relaughing, but I can see how that
happens, right the momentsomebody says I love you like oh
, pause, put on the last time.
Speaker 2 (29:09):
Last time somebody said that they were a liar.
Speaker 1 (29:12):
Yes, yes, on fire right and you know it's
interesting.
The thought that just came to mewas that that reminds me very
much of how the enemy will comeat us Right, will give us a
false pretense on what's reallyhappening, like a false pretense
or what God really gave us orwhat God really said, and try
(29:32):
and switch the narrative.
Imagine, like those gentlementhat maybe said, hey, I love you
, and you're like, oh, no, I'mout Versus.
There may be one that camealong and would have never said
I love you and maybe gave anddid the things that was
(29:53):
expressing red flags andexpressing signs, but it was
like, okay, because you didn'thit this point that I've created
this guard for what?
I'm trying to control things.
I'm not seeing it in thataspect.
I think that's so true of how,why it's important that we do
walk through healing with theHoly spirit.
Yes, because, especially inthis day and age I mean we have
social media, we have Google, wehave the news media.
(30:18):
You know, in addition to it isa society that's very much about
okay, self-driven you caneasily become deceived,
absolutely, in the sense of whatyou're looking like and are you
protecting yourself?
or have you really let the HolySpirit heal you to where you
(30:38):
trust God?
Because it really is a trustwalk to even enter back into
those spaces, right?
I?
Speaker 2 (30:44):
did.
I was doing a Bible study whenI first started coming back to
the Lord and I talk more aboutthat in the second book.
The Holy Spirit was drawing meback.
But it was funny.
I was doing this Bible study, Ibelieve it was called In my
Father's House and it wastalking about how we can
sometimes, how our, ourrelationship is with our earthly
(31:04):
father treat our heavenlyfather.
And I was sitting therestubborn as a mule.
Nope, never happened, I wouldnever do that.
I would never treat God likethat.
And the whole time I was stiffarming God.
I wasn't denying him Iacknowledge fully, you know, my
salvation, all of that but I wasstiff arming him.
I was because everyone had saidI love you and everyone lied
(31:26):
and didn't mean it and, um, Istill hadn't learned the lesson
that me being in charge of ofall of that was not a good thing
.
I mean I, I.
I look back and I remember acouple of the young men who had
tried to, you know, court me, ifyou will and they were really
decent, kind people who had agood job and, you know, were
(31:50):
loving.
They didn't beat me, theydidn't, you know, they didn't
write on me, they didn't lie tome and yet I dissed them and
ended up with the cheaters andthe liars for the rest of my
life.
I was like what is wrong withyou?
How come it took you that longto figure this out?
(32:12):
I'm just grateful that my, myJesus, didn't give up on me.
That he didn't give up on me,but he did give up on us, you
know, yes, I'm right there withyou.
Speaker 1 (32:20):
Oh, so grateful, so grateful, I mean.
Speaker 2 (32:24):
I would have.
Speaker 1 (32:27):
Yes, good thing I'm not gone so many times.
I'm like Lord, you still loveme Like please tell me why.
(32:47):
Oh, yes, you know, I think too.
I often refer to that and Ithink that when you see how
people are responsive to ourHeavenly Father, I do tend to
ask, like, what's yourrelationship with your father?
Right, and it could go positiveand negative in some sense
right.
I grew up in a home where mydad had me late and about the
age of 11 and 12, my parentsdivorced and my dad did his best
(33:13):
almost in the sense, probablycaring from guilt to provide for
anything I asked for and sowhen I got married, my husband
grew up in theopposite.
Yeah, like he was in theopposite, where they had to lack
.
And so when it came to thingslike I mean, and it would be
(33:34):
good causes, I was just supergenerous and I would be like, oh
, I'm getting to this, I'm gonnaget to this.
Or I would just like, hey,we're gonna'm getting to this,
I'm gonna get to this.
Or I would just like, hey,we're going to get this.
And he's like, how are youpaying for it?
I don't know, god will provide.
And there was this aspect.
He's like how can you're likeis this faith?
Like, how can your faith be sostrong?
And it got to a point where,thankfully, once again, the Holy
(33:55):
spirit opened my spiritual eyesto recognize that that wasn't
my challenge with God, because Ididn't grow up having that
challenge with my heavenlyfather, but I had other
challenges.
I had a challenge that, eventhough my father was actively
present in my life, he had leftthe home, and so I had a
challenge of trusting that Lord.
When I make a mistake, are yougoing to leave?
(34:15):
And so there's some ways whereit can come positive, like, yeah
, walk in faith.
I'm like, yeah, god's going toleave and so there's some ways
where it can come positive, like, yeah, walk in faith.
I'm like, yeah, god's going toprovide, but there are other
side.
I'm like, oh, I made a mistake.
And I go through this boutwhere, like I don't even feel
comfortable talking to you, lord, because I don't feel worthy to
have relationship with you,because I don't want to mess it
up.
Speaker 2 (34:34):
Or, yeah, you know, I have a girlfriend who, who
shared that with me and it wasso wild, she's like 40 and had
never told anyone not herhusband, not her parents that
that is how she felt about hisdeparture.
And I thought, oh, how sad isthat I, that she felt, and again
(34:56):
, I just hadn't thought of it mywhole life.
I was just operating, you know,and so you know she probably
could have just looked rightacross the table and been like
pat my hand.
No, no, don't worry, you'reright in here.
Speaker 1 (35:11):
Yeah, Look, we all look.
Yes, yes, I love that.
Well, I um, oh man, I feel liketime flies by so fast.
Like what time goes by whenyou're having fun, Like you know
, one of the things I do want totalk about before we go is just
faith and spirituality.
I know that I believe faithplays a huge role in our healing
(35:36):
.
I know that even evidence hasshown that when individuals have
faith that they're holding onto that, their healing process
is faster than one that does nothave hope or faith.
And so I always say, like Idon't know how people do this
life without like God, becauseso many times I'm like that's
the only thing that I'm holdingon to, right In the chaos of
(35:58):
this world.
And so I just want to ask you,like how has your relationship
with God evolved throughout theyears of this healing process?
Speaker 2 (36:08):
That is an excellent question and I truly believe and
that's why I wrote my book fromseasons of time, but also in
sections of emotional, spiritual, mental and physical, because I
don't think you can extractthem from each other.
I think, if you do, I've donethe research, I'm a science geek
about health and healing andcellular healing.
(36:29):
And the top five toxins in theworld right now, number one is
anxiety, and anxiety affects youmentally, emotionally,
spiritually and physically,because if you are anxious, you
are not trusting.
If you are overly anxious, yourbody is physically reacting to
that and there can be goodanxiety, like a first date or a
(36:51):
first kiss.
You know those things.
Your body doesn't know thedifference.
So you've got to you know.
Know how to self-regulate withyour like emotions and mentally
and breathe, how not to eatthings or do things that amp up
or do something to make mattersworse, like some people will
drink or whatever.
And I'm not getting into thebiblical debate about drinking,
(37:12):
I'm just saying it does impactyour hormones and chemicals, but
spiritually, yes, your hormonesand chemicals, um, but
spiritually, yes, absolutely,because he's our creator, so
he's made every system of ourbody.
Have a backup, have a backup,have a backup.
We would have to try to diequickly of natural causes, of of
(37:38):
like depleting things ordeficiencies, because our bodies
are just designed to just keepmaking up for that loss.
So I do believe that I couldn'thave the peace to sit back and
be quick to listen and slow tospeak if it weren't for the Holy
Spirit, if it weren't for myrelationship with Jesus, because
the loneliness is staggeringbut I'm not alone.
(38:02):
It's just that, that humancontact, that that is something
that I struggle with still, likeemotionally but spiritually,
knowing that I spend my morningsnow, I did a deep dive on the
Holy spirit and so in themorning it, depending on what
conversation I'm wanting to have, I'm either talking to the Holy
(38:22):
Spirit or I'm talking to myKing Jesus or I'm talking to my
Abba Father.
And this study I started on theHoly Spirit.
It was so funny they startedoff with, first of all, the Holy
Spirit isn't an it, it's a he,he's a part of Godhead and so
and and that's just been, eventhough that was something I knew
and I acknowledged and I neverreferred to him as an it it's
(38:45):
been a game changer for myconversations in the morning and
just understanding that hispart in creation, his part in
delivering the power that raisedChrist from the dead, his part
in delivering wisdom andknowledge and courage to us.
If we didn't have that, you'rehealing.
You're right, healing of anykind is just gone, and so I have
(39:11):
enjoyed thoroughly, I've gone.
This study is taking me throughevery single scripture in the
Bible that uses the, the Holyspirit, in it, and it has been
eyeopening because I've readthrough the Bible multiple times
.
But it's funny how, when you'rereading through for time, I got
(39:32):
it done in six months, um, butthat you, uh, um you.
When you slow down and you takea good look at what you're
looking at like an inductivestudy of the Holy spirit, if you
will it.
It just takes healing to anexponential level.
Speaker 1 (39:52):
Yeah, yeah, oh, man, such good conversation.
You know, as we talk about theHoly spirit, I find it I
shouldn't say funny, but I findthings humorous and I recognize
I'm like God is a humorous God.
I mean, we're creating his imageand I have humor, so clearly
he's humorous as well.
But when I, often when I pray,especially publicly and in my
(40:17):
prayers I did, I too did a studyabout the different persons of
God the father, christ and theHoly spirit.
And so I remember doing thatstudy and I remember just
hearing, like how come you don'tacknowledge the Holy spirit
when you talk to me?
He would like to talk to and Ilike, oh, okay, and so in my
(40:42):
prayer time I, I do, Iacknowledge like heavenly father
, I acknowledge Christ and hissacrifice and his you know,
aspect of interceding and beingthere on my behalf.
I acknowledge the holy spiritfor guiding me and being my
comforter, and discernment andso forth.
And so I love it that when Ipray publicly and sometimes you
(41:02):
see people like I literally seethem, or you hear the gas and
like who is she praying to?
I'm like it's, it's the same inone, yet three persons.
It's okay, guys.
Speaker 2 (41:14):
And they're very specific, while they don't
divert from the character of God.
It is very different.
The Holy Spirit, if you see inscripture, if you are being
imparted power, if you are beingimparted wisdom or
understanding, it says by theHoly Spirit.
And so why not?
(41:34):
You know, it's not that I'mwanting to circumvent God or
Jesus, but like I've asked himrecently, you know I've said I
get it.
The human race is barely using10 percent of our brain.
Holy spirit, could you and Iget together and maybe tap a
little bit of them?
right because I could really usesome of that look.
Speaker 1 (41:58):
I'm about to add that to my conversation with him.
Speaker 2 (42:03):
Can we just dip over here a little bit?
Yeah, yes, I'd like Jordan,kind of kind of smart.
When I watch him sometimes onhis podcast, I mean he'll say
something and I'm like, oh myGod, that's exactly what I think
about God or or about someconcept.
But I would have, I, I, thosewords would have never crossed
(42:23):
my lips.
I'm like, where did that comefrom?
And I I've joked that I wouldlove to get him on my podcast,
but then I feel like all itwould do is ultimately show how
stupid I am.
Speaker 1 (42:33):
I'd be like, oh, my God.
Well, you know, hey, I, I feellike I host this podcast.
I learn so much because evenwhen you were explaining, like
the butterfly stitches, I'm like, oh, that makes sense, you're
not insulting me, I needed toknow that Learn something new
every day.
Speaker 2 (42:53):
That's what I think.
Speaker 1 (42:55):
Yeah, yes, no, you're so.
Right though I think about Acts1 and 8, and it literally says
right, but you will receivepower when the holy spirit comes
on you and you will be mywitnesses in Jerusalem and in
all Judea and Samaria and allthe ends of the earth.
But when I think about that,you know, I think there there's
a caveat there, right, like thefirst part of that says you'll
(43:16):
receive power when the holyspirit comes upon you and then
you'll be my witnesses.
So I think even the aspect oflike, we can't properly be a
witness if we don't allow theHoly Spirit to come and be the
power that drives us even in ourhealing.
Because if we think about it,like what we're witnessing, what
(43:38):
our witness is the sharing ofour testimony, right, it's by
the blood of our testimony, it'sby the lamb, it's by the
testimony that we witnessed, andso we wouldn't be able to do
that if we didn't have the powerof the Holy spirit to walk us
through those healing processesso that we can be a witness for
him into all the earth.
Right.
Speaker 2 (43:57):
You can't export what you haven't imported.
Speaker 1 (44:00):
Yes, I love that.
Yes, oh, yes, absolutely.
Okay, I'm going to tell youright now this is probably going
to be a clip.
I love that you can't exportwhat you have not imported.
Absolutely, absolutely.
Oh my goodness.
Well, I just want to say,michelle, thank you again so
much.
I have truly, truly enjoyed ourtime.
(44:24):
I feel like there's so muchmore that we could talk about,
from generational trauma and somuch, but, as we already knew
when we started, we're liketime's going to go by so fast
and so I'm willing to come backagain when the second book comes
out.
I would love that.
Yes, absolutely.
I would love that.
We are, as always, going toprovide in the show notes for
(44:44):
you listeners how you can stayconnected to Michelle, how you
can get her book, but I alsowant her to tell you here, Okay.
Speaker 2 (44:52):
Yes, it's available on Amazon and Barnes and Noble.
The name of the book isButterfly Stitches the
Metamorphosis of Healing and onmy website, which is easier to
remember, it's michellebrablecom.
There is a link for both Amazonand Barnes Noble and also my
podcast on there, which Iexpound on some other items from
the book as well.
Speaker 1 (45:12):
Awesome, I love it.
Michelle, I'm excited to hop onAmazon and get my own copy, and
thank you again for joining usat Graceville community.
I look forward to having youback.
I'm holding you to that.
Okay, absolutely, I'm on board.
Sign me up, yes, yes, I love it.
Well, graceville listeners, asalways, we thank you for tuning
(45:32):
in and our hope and prayer isthat this episode has impacted
you in a positive way in thelight in which you see our
Father, jesus Christ, and ourHoly Spirit.
Thank you so much for tuning intoday.
Blessings to you all.
Thank you for tuning in totoday's episode of Graceville
(45:52):
Community Podcast.
We would like to invite you tovisit gracefieldcommunitycom.
Gracefield Community is allabout doing church the way
Church of Acts did, using fivemain principles that we see in
the Book of Acts.
Sharing resources, as believerspooled their possessions and
(46:22):
resources to support those inneed, as we see in Acts 2.44.
Through hospitality the earlyChristians practiced hospitality
by opening their homes toothers, as we see in Acts 2 and
46.
By financial aid the church inAntioch sent financial aid to
believers in Judea during a timeof famine, as described in Acts
11 and 29.
(46:43):
Prayer and encouragement theysupported each other through
prayer and encouragement, as wesee in Acts 4 and 24.
And finally, spiritual guidance.
The apostles and eldersprovided spiritual guidance and
teaching to help strengthen andbuild the community, as we see
(47:04):
in Acts 1530.
I would like to encourage you.
If any of those areas are areasin which you are in need or can
contribute, please reach out toGraceville Community.
We are working together acrossthe world with ministries and
individuals alike to help bringback the Church of Acts.
My name is Nicole Cater, your host, founder and
servant leader of GracevilleCommunity.
I want to thank you for tuningin to Graceville Community
Podcast.
This is a safe space, a placein which we just share stories
of how God has touchedindividuals' lives all across
the world and how they are nowimpacting the kingdom of God.
(00:21):
Thank you for tuning in.
Blessings to you.
Hello Graceville communityfollowers, we are so excited for
you to connect with us ontoday's podcast.
As always, I am just overlyblessed by the individuals that
lend themselves to our podcastto share their stories and how
(00:44):
they're impacting community.
And so today is like everyother in the sense that we have
an amazing guest joining ustoday.
I've had a chance to read andunderstand more about her, her
heart, her vision, her story,and I'm so excited for her to
share with you guys today.
(01:05):
So I will read just a littlebit about our guests.
Today we have Michelle Vrabel.
Michelle is an expert beancounter by day, in addition to
her work as bookkeeper.
Her superpowers and sidehustles include pastry chef and
(01:26):
author in training, which Iwould love to try that pastry
chef stuff out.
She has been told she has sass,which she deploys regularly.
She has, with exponential joy,finished her first book,
butterfly Stitches, and isworking on the sequel.
According to her king, sheapparently has several other
(01:48):
books in her.
At 61, she has launched apodcast and is having the time
of her life.
She is an enthusiastic traveler, foodie, smart aleck and lover
of her king, jesus.
Michelle lives in Mesa, arizona, with her daughter, who is
lovingly known as Peanut.
Michelle would love to engagewith you through any and all
(02:11):
media, as she is also availablefor speaking engagements and
retreats.
So, gracefield community, goahead and join me in welcoming
Michelle.
Hey, michelle.
Speaker 2 (02:31):
Thank you, how fun.
I guess I haven't heard my bioread out loud in a while and I
guess I am kind of a smart aleckhuh Love it.
I mean, hey, well, it's allpart of the life we're living
and I just look at it becauseI'm 62.
Now I was 61 when I started mypodcast.
That you know.
I don't know if the Lord'sgoing to give me three more
years, three more days, 30 moreyears, and if he is, then I want
(02:58):
to take every minute and justlike absorb it, because there is
a lot of time I wasn't a goodsteward of when I was younger
and so that has a lot to do withmy story and my journey, and so
I enjoy every bit of this wildride he's given me.
I liken it to being on a rollercoaster, in a tornado.
You know it's exhilarating, butit's terrifying, but it's.
Speaker 1 (03:19):
Oh, I am right there with you.
I say all the time this faithwalk is definitely like the
roller coaster.
I say all the time this faithwalk is definitely like the
roller coaster.
I like to use the scenario tolike you know those, um, you go
to the fair and they have thatboat that like swings you.
I don't know what's happened,but ever since I've had kids,
it's like everything in mystomach seems to drop and it
feels entirely different now.
(03:40):
But I'm like that's how lifeseems to be.
It's like, yeah, okay, god youever get.
Oh, okay, absolutely, I love it, okay.
Well, I'm so excited to dive in.
I would love for our listenersto just hear more about your
(04:00):
story and your personal journey.
So I first just want to ask,like butterfly stitches, tell us
about that.
Like, where does that name evencome from?
How does it connect with youpersonally?
Share your story to the worldtoday.
Speaker 2 (04:13):
Okay, I absolutely believe that.
Every bit of my book, the storyof course I call it my story,
his story, our story, because itis my journey with my king.
I believe he gave me the visionfor the title, the cover, which
I have been told is a boldchoice.
(04:35):
It's around here somewhere Icould hold it up, but anyway.
And the title, and it'sinteresting, it comes from a
couple of directions.
First of all, I don't know ifyour listeners know this and I
don't want to insult anyone'sintelligence, but a butterfly
stitch is an actual medicaldevice.
It's a bandage and they put iton wounds or cuts that aren't
(04:57):
deep enough for actual stitches,so it'll hold a wound together.
Now the problem with that is isthat it's going to take a
little bit longer and you haveto participate, you have to keep
it clean, you have to changethe butterfly stitch.
So all of that's a beautifulmetaphor that goes with my book
and its subtitle theMetamorphosis of Healing.
(05:19):
Because with our King Jesus, Ibelieve healing is a process.
Because with our King Jesus, Ibelieve healing is a process and
I believe it begins at themoment of the wound.
My story is a two-part memoir.
I was beaten as a child I wassexually molested.
I have had abuse in every areamentally, emotionally,
(05:40):
spiritually and physically sinceI was little and I believe from
one of the very first beatingsI got worst ones when I was two
years old that every bit of myhealing the Holy Spirit was
there Not to intercede becausewe all understand that free will
is running rampant in thisparticular world but to show me
(06:03):
I was created to start healingthe moment a wound happens.
So when our physical bodyresponds like if we're cut, you
know it starts coagulating and ascab starts forming so we don't
bleed out Then mentally we'rekind of going all right, what's
going on here?
This doesn't make sense.
Like if a little kid touches ahot stove, they know, okay, I'm
(06:26):
not going to touch that again.
So we have that mentaldiscernment to begin that
healing process too, to kind oftake every experience we
encounter and evaluate it forwhether or not we understand the
good or the bad of it andwhether we want that to happen
again or not.
Now does that stop it fromhappening again.
Not necessarily, but at leastit helps us start to evaluate
(06:47):
and hopefully, at some juncturein our life as we grow, try to
avoid those when we have theopportunity to make that
decision, as opposed to havingit thrust upon us.
So butterfly stitches requireour engagement.
We have to be involved in thatprocess.
Our King Jesus is right here,the Holy Spirit's right here.
We are going to heal, but it'sa process and we need to keep
(07:11):
the wound clean, put on the newbandages and stop going back to
what caused the wound in thefirst place when we have the
ability to.
So that's how that name cameabout.
It also has a very humorousbackstory.
When I was getting married, I,the song butterfly, kisses.
You know that song, butterflykisses.
Speaker 1 (07:34):
Okay, I might ask you to sing it to remind.
Speaker 2 (07:36):
Oh my, we don't really want that, but it's a
song that was written by aChristian artist and he's
singing.
It's a dad singing about hislittle girl growing up and then
him having to give her away atthe end of the song at her
wedding.
And butterfly kisses are likelittle kisses that you put on
your little baby's forehead orsomething like that, and so that
(07:58):
song was all the rage andeverybody was playing it at
their wedding.
Well, I didn't have a goodfather, I didn't have someone to
give me away like that at mywedding.
So I'm hearing this song in mycar, I mean literally within a
couple of weeks of my wedding,and I am a smart aleck, and so I
rewrote in my mind the lyricsto Butterfly Kisses as butterfly
(08:20):
stitches, and so it just kindof all comes together.
I love double meaning things and, uh, that's why that title is
that way.
That's why on the cover, um, ifyou'll notice, I have a
butterfly stitch bandage overone eye.
Um, my niece did does you know?
Uh, that type of makeup for youknow, like movies or contests
(08:42):
or whatever, and so she helpedme look like I did, which was
wounded, and some people haveasked about that too Like were
you beaten up as an adult?
Because the picture is me as anadult.
But no, what I'm expressing isthat even though those wounds
are healing, it doesn't mean wedon't carry them into adulthood.
(09:04):
You know, and some people carryand hang on to them a little
too tight into adulthood.
And don't let that healingprocess start.
And that's my prayer with mybook is that people can
understand.
I don't want them to walk awayfeeling sorry for me or with me
because I was a victim.
I'm not a victim.
(09:25):
I don't sit in that.
So I want them to see that inthe telling, in the looking back
, the Holy Spirit was there andthe Holy Spirit began that
healing with us.
Now we kind of take over thereins sometimes and reopen
wounds on our own, but thereality is the healing is there
and we can see it if we'rewilling to do our part, do the
(09:48):
work.
Speaker 1 (09:49):
Right, yes, I absolutely love that.
I mean I myself have my own, aswe all do, right, we all have
our own background.
We all have our various areasthat we experienced trauma.
You know, I joke with mychildren.
I'm like I am saving yourcollege fund and I'm also saving
your counseling fund.
Your therapy, I know that I'mnot getting this perfect, so
(10:14):
there are going to be somethings that you are probably
going to want to talk tosomebody about.
Speaker 2 (10:18):
We'll get a bulk rate for you by in advance.
Yes, yes, that's awesome.
Speaker 1 (10:26):
That's just the reality, and I understand
exactly.
What you're saying is that youknow we have these wounds and I
think the first step is alwaysto recognize that, like there
are wounds here, it's okay toacknowledge I've been wounded
and to sit with God.
I mean, one of the questionsthat I often ask is like God,
where were you?
Where were you in that moment?
(10:49):
And let's talk that out right.
I love that we have a heavenlyfather and a Holy spirit that's
a comforter right that can sitwith us and allow us to have
those conversations, to give itall to him, and so I'm so
excited for what you offer inthis book.
I do have to ask the moment youdecided to write this book,
(11:09):
what was the catalyst Like?
What caused you to say I'mgoing to release this, Not me.
Speaker 2 (11:15):
Right, not me, I was.
It was a while ago.
Now I say I say 10 years, butthat was five years ago, so it's
probably been about 15 years.
I was in the middle of a Biblestudy in Isaiah I was still
married at the time and the Lordjust said we were dipping into
Esther and going back and forth,and some of the things that
were being said were bringing meto tears and I was trying to
(11:37):
figure out what was going onthere.
And the Lord I believe that Ihear him audibly.
I have people like poo, poothat even believers and I'm like
okay, maybe if you were sittingin the room with me you
wouldn't be hearing him.
But I'm telling you that I hearhim audibly, not every time he
answers me.
Sometimes it's different ways,but there are times when and I
(12:02):
think some of it is becausewe've dispensed with subtlety
I'm just, you know, I'm the kidthat needs to get hit over the
head with a brick, you know, geta clunked on the head.
My girlfriend and I call itgetting a slap in the face.
You know, we just, we just need, you know, that little extra.
So anyway, I audibly, you know,heard him say now it's time,
(12:24):
it's time to tell your story.
And when he did that originallyI thought okay, this is just
for me, so I can live with that.
I didn't panic, I didn't freakout.
I thought this is just for me,although I do feel, like a lot
of people who've come up to mesince telling my story, that you
initially are a little afraidto write it down because, wait,
(12:45):
what if somebody else sees it?
You know, if this is just forme, how do I do this and keep it
just for me?
You know, I didn't have alaptop that I was going to put
on.
Literally, I started writing byhand and then eventually moved
to a laptop.
Speaker 1 (12:59):
But I didn't ask for this.
Speaker 2 (13:02):
My daughter's going to Arizona State University to
be a writer and she, I think,has a novel already in the works
and she has a book of poetry.
All that, Not me, not what Iwanted not some lifelong dream,
no, so, anyway, I go a couple ofyears where I'm just kind of
like, you know, just getting itout there, not editing it, just
(13:23):
writing stuff down, just kind oflike, you know, just getting it
out there, not editing it, justwriting stuff down.
And then my marriage wentthrough some.
The stuff I was going throughgot more intense, it got crazy
and I kind of it kind of got puton the back burner, which is
not what the Lord wanted for me,but he isn't, wasn't surprised
by what was happening in my life.
And, um, we come to the end ofmy marriage and now I'm really'm
(13:44):
really.
The wounds of my childhood havebeen ripped back open.
I'm raw.
I'm laying out, literallylaying on the floor of my living
room before the Lord, because Ithought the infidelity was bad
enough, but who my ex becameduring the divorce was very
upsetting.
I was unrecognizable and I justhad to, you know, be where he
(14:08):
wanted me to be in, thatprostrate and, let you know,
letting go, letting go ofthinking that I was in control,
that I was protecting myself,that I was protecting my
daughter by staying and, youknow, going through all this
stuff.
So, you know, I I believe thatthat that calling initially, now
(14:28):
I can affirm he has now saidokay, here we are, now this is
going to work together, not onlyfor you but for others.
So buckle up buttercup Time totime to really get it out there.
And so I joined some writergroups and got a writing coach,
(14:50):
or wrote coaches and uh, moved,moved, the moved the football
down the field.
Speaker 1 (14:57):
I love it.
You know, one of the things,too, is so true.
I mean, even for me, with thispodcast and all the things that
we do, I mean, gracevillecommunity as a whole was never
anything that I wanted to do,right, and so I think that it's
so.
I guess we will say kind andgracious of our Lord to really,
(15:18):
though, push us in the sense ofbecause it does take us even
through the healing process ofanother step of healing, because
it does take us even throughthe healing process of another
step of healing, when we canshare our story, when we can
land into someone else and thenhear from them like how much it
has impacted them.
If you know, gracevillecommunity didn't make a dime.
It's the stories that conformit right, it's the testimonies
(15:39):
that come from it.
That is really what is, youknow, the true reward behind it,
and so I'm right there with youand get where it's like.
This is not what I necessarilysigned up to do.
Speaker 2 (15:53):
Like not even a little bit.
Speaker 1 (15:55):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (15:58):
Yep, and the same with when my coaches told me you
need to do a podcast becauseit's an extension of your story
and then you can also bring inothers and extend that healing
process.
And I was like what, what I'mnot doing, joe Rogan?
And they're like well, ofcourse you're not.
They're like we know, don't besilly, you've got your community
(16:24):
, just talk to them.
Speaker 1 (16:26):
Oh yeah, you know, one of the things that you said
that I can personally speak toand want to just talk about
briefly is the trauma thatactually occurs after infidelity
, right, and so my husband and Iwe do a Graceville marriages,
we do a lot of marriagecounseling, biblical counseling.
We have marriage groups ofmarriage counseling, biblical
counseling.
We have marriage groups, onlinemarriage community, all kinds
(16:48):
of things.
And so, coming from that, oneof the things that I learned
throughout our experience and Isee with couples all the time is
there's this misconception thatemotional abuse is is not as
great as a physical abuse, whenthe reality is that emotional
abuse is often much harder toheal from, because it's not,
(17:12):
like, you know, if we and thisis not to discredit any physical
abuse, right absolutely.
I understand exactly whereyou're going yes, when we have a
physical punch, like, okay, Ican put the ice on it, but even
in the physical abuse, there'semotional abuse behind it, Like
why did this occur?
How did we get here?
And that's the part that takesthe healing process.
And so, like you said, evenwith infidelity there's the
(17:35):
emotional abuse, the betrayalthat comes from it.
You know, in a study they showthat people that experience
emotional abuse throughinfidelity say that it's worse
than actually the loss of achild and being.
I have experienced both.
I would attest to it.
Is it very much so is.
(17:55):
And so I just want to hear fromyou real quick.
Like I know, in the book youdiscuss the impact of, like
physical and emotional abuse.
But how did you navigate suchan intense experience at such a
young age?
Speaker 2 (18:07):
Well, and and I couldn't agree more, um, I've
said um and I go through.
My book is written in seasons,three different seasons which
are timelines of my life, and sothe sequel finishes off work up
to now with, with my divorceand with my daughter and those
kinds of things.
But yes, I've said before outloud that the actual physical
(18:32):
act of him committing adulterywith someone else did not hurt
me physically as much as theemotional thought that he had
given himself to another person,that someone else took that
priority, took that place afterwe had said those vows.
So then, and those emotionalscars, physical scars, um, heal.
(18:55):
Like you said, the pain stopsand over time I don't remember.
I mean I remember, but I don'tremember.
I can't call to mind the painin my face when I was two years
old and my father, open arm,slapped me dozens of times to
the point where my facehemorrhaged.
I don't, I can't summon that up, but can I summon up how I felt
(19:18):
the fact that my daddy did thatto me?
Absolutely Now, I did not dragthat forward and think about it
often, any of those components,because back then I'd had no
counselors, no doctors, nobodycame in and checked on me.
So a lot of the kind of reviewof what I went through was with
(19:40):
the Holy Spirit.
I believe we receive him atsalvation, but it doesn't mean
he wasn't there beforehand, itdoesn't mean he's not our
comforter from the before we'reknit together in our mother's
womb.
So I think the emotional andmental scars are are the most
(20:00):
difficult to get healed.
They really are.
It's not that I don't believemy Lord can do it and that my
Holy, the Holy spirit can, butwith those are the little wounds
you go back to when you're likeout on a date after you've been
divorced and like little hairsmay come up and it might be
yellow flags and you're temptedbecause of your emotional scars
(20:23):
to just run to a red flag andthe situation when that could be
a very genuine human in frontof you.
So those are the healingprocesses that bring you back to
relationship with Jesus aboutdiscernment and how to let those
emotional wounds heal.
But I couldn't agree more.
(20:43):
Those, those are probably thetoughest.
Speaker 1 (20:45):
Yes, absolutely.
And you know, I think aboutscripture telling us to renew
our mind daily Right and even inthe component of, like you,
allowing the Holy spirit to giveus that discernment, because we
can.
I think our bodies are builtright.
Flight what is it Flight?
Speaker 2 (21:01):
or flight.
Speaker 1 (21:03):
Our bodies are built to respond one way or another,
and it is only through the powerof the Holy Spirit allowing us
to discern where we are in thatmoment, right Discern maybe
those that we're interactingwith and then really sitting
with him on.
Hey, is this a space that iscoming from past trauma, Even
(21:23):
though it may have been healed?
our bodies will tend tonaturally respond right.
Hey, let's take a quick breakto tell you about Grace-Filled
Community.
Grace-filled Community is anorganization that focuses on the
primary principles of theChurch of Acts, centered around
(21:46):
building communities that impactthe kingdom of God.
We do this through three coreextensions.
One, graceville Church Network,where we empower churches and
nonprofits for God's success andgrowth.
Success and growth we offertailored growth strategies
(22:07):
rooted in biblical principlesthat will help you expand your
reach and impact yourcommunities.
Just like the early church, wefocus not on attendance and
numbers, but on discipleship,providing leadership teachings
and trainings to today'sministry leaders.
Our second extension is Projectof the Grace Field, where we
provide biblical counseling,mentorship, workshops and events
(22:30):
that are dedicated toencouraging individuals to live
a life filled with grace andpurpose, rooted in the
understanding that all havefallen short and are a working
project.
Let us help the individuals inyour community grow as they walk
with God and experience thefullness of his love.
(22:51):
Our third extension is thegrace-filled business.
Grace-filled business is hereto help small, faith-based
business owners develop theirbusiness in a way that honors
God, that brings increase andallows them to pour back into
his kingdom, through marketplaceministry and financing his
kingdom.
We do this through our 15 yearsof experience of virtual
(23:14):
administrative work, digitalmarketing, business development
and consulting.
Welcome back, welcome back, youknow.
(23:38):
I would say.
What we do also see is thatwhen we have these childhood
traumas and we are not properlytaught like you stated, there
was to this, referring thefamily to this at that time,
when we don't have the space andthe safe space to properly heal
from it, we find that itcarries in to adulthood, like
you stated.
And so my question to you isyou know, was there a specific
(24:00):
time in your early years thatyou realized that you had to
break a cycle of abuse Like whendid that occur for you?
How did you get there, nothaving resources at the time?
Speaker 2 (24:11):
You know that's so fascinating and somebody asked
me that a couple of weeks ago ona podcast a mental health
professional.
I'm like this is the first time, but it is so why I believe so
much and so deeply that the HolySpirit has been working my
healing.
The thing of the matter is isthat around 23, probably, I went
(24:37):
on a 10 year stint of where Iwas going to be in control of
who loved me and who who wasgoing to be let in, because I
thought me controlling it wasgoing to be better and I had
made a couple of decisions Ididn't want to talk to the Lord
about.
But in talking about whatyou're saying about my childhood
and breaking that generationalsin because my father was beaten
(24:58):
by his father and it was agenerational sin that he chose
not to break a generational sinthat he chose not to break I
honestly believe at 14 years old, when I had the discernment and
could only could be a God thing.
Sitting in our car, he wasdriving us back home from a
visitation weekend and I justcouldn't do it anymore.
(25:18):
Every time we went with him, hewould take us, my brothers and
I, and jump us off at this housewith all these kids and we
loved those kids.
Actually that was a fun place,but they would leave with the
parents, come back staggeringdrunk and our ride home was just
I don't even know the rightword for it.
(25:40):
It was terrifying and it justgot to be to the point where I
was like you know what, as muchas I love these kids and stuff,
I'm not related to them.
I can be home with my mom andmy grandparents instead of being
dumped somewhere else.
Um, if, if, he supposedly caresabout us this much, so I I
finally said to him you know I Ican't do this anymore.
(26:02):
And the thing was he popped thetrunk, didn't even get out and
get my suitcase out.
Want to hug me, want to talk meout of it?
Pop the trunk, let us get out.
We're on our way.
So I never thought of thatHonestly again, the rest I mean
the rest of my life, until itcame time to write this book.
(26:22):
My, I can tell you, myex-husband does not know
everything that I've written inthis book.
My brothers didn't knoweverything that has been written
, and they wrote the forewordfor the book for me, because we
were in the trenches when wewere little together.
Um, but none of us haverepeated this cycle.
All of us broke thegenerational sin, and, and and,
(26:46):
and I don't even remember sayingit out loud that this was going
to be a conscious effort.
I really don't.
I have an only child, adaughter, and I remember the
first time I had to spank her,because I do believe that spank.
I know the difference between aspanking and a beating.
I've had both, yes, and thefirst time I had to swallow, I
believe in spanking spoil.
Speaker 1 (27:03):
Spare the rod, spoil the child.
I'm like we're not sparing rodsaround here.
Speaker 2 (27:07):
The first time I had to swat her on the bottom a
couple of times I I sat her downand I prayed with her and I
told her why this was happening.
And and then I did it and she'scrying and I go out and close
the door and I go in the livingroom and my husband was sitting
there because, I mean, I knowthe difference and he did, he
just reinforced.
He did reinforce for me.
He's like you did not hurt her,you did not, you're not, he
(27:30):
didn't even really hurt her, youkind of gathered her attention,
whatever.
So it was.
It was a um Holy spirit drivendecisions in my life not to let
that be a part of any part, notanywhere in my universe.
We didn't even have to be setout loud, it didn't have to be a
(27:51):
conscious decision, there wasnot going to be beating, because
that isn't what people who loveone another do.
And if I, if I brought anythingforward and and, like I said,
that 10 year period and I wasmaking bad decisions, it was
because every male in particularfrom the time I was born up
until that point, that said theylove me or that should have
(28:15):
loved me, didn't?
They lied and they did things,devastating things, and so I
decided that I was going to likeI.
My answer to it wasn't todiscern and see if somebody
meant it when they said theylove me.
If somebody said they love me,I'm done dating you.
Next, I'm done dating you, andI somehow in my little pea brain
(28:42):
, thought this was a great wayto go.
Needless to say, some mentalscars and emotional scars were
taking a lot longer.
Speaker 1 (28:58):
I mean that makes absolute, absolute sense.
I know it sounds like we'relaughing, but I can see how that
happens, right the momentsomebody says I love you like oh
, pause, put on the last time.
Speaker 2 (29:09):
Last time somebody said that they were a liar.
Speaker 1 (29:12):
Yes, yes, on fire right and you know it's
interesting.
The thought that just came to mewas that that reminds me very
much of how the enemy will comeat us Right, will give us a
false pretense on what's reallyhappening, like a false pretense
or what God really gave us orwhat God really said, and try
(29:32):
and switch the narrative.
Imagine, like those gentlementhat maybe said, hey, I love you
, and you're like, oh, no, I'mout Versus.
There may be one that camealong and would have never said
I love you and maybe gave anddid the things that was
(29:53):
expressing red flags andexpressing signs, but it was
like, okay, because you didn'thit this point that I've created
this guard for what?
I'm trying to control things.
I'm not seeing it in thataspect.
I think that's so true of how,why it's important that we do
walk through healing with theHoly spirit.
Yes, because, especially inthis day and age I mean we have
social media, we have Google, wehave the news media.
(30:18):
You know, in addition to it isa society that's very much about
okay, self-driven you caneasily become deceived,
absolutely, in the sense of whatyou're looking like and are you
protecting yourself?
or have you really let the HolySpirit heal you to where you
(30:38):
trust God?
Because it really is a trustwalk to even enter back into
those spaces, right?
I?
Speaker 2 (30:44):
did.
I was doing a Bible study whenI first started coming back to
the Lord and I talk more aboutthat in the second book.
The Holy Spirit was drawing meback.
But it was funny.
I was doing this Bible study, Ibelieve it was called In my
Father's House and it wastalking about how we can
sometimes, how our, ourrelationship is with our earthly
(31:04):
father treat our heavenlyfather.
And I was sitting therestubborn as a mule.
Nope, never happened, I wouldnever do that.
I would never treat God likethat.
And the whole time I was stiffarming God.
I wasn't denying him Iacknowledge fully, you know, my
salvation, all of that but I wasstiff arming him.
I was because everyone had saidI love you and everyone lied
(31:26):
and didn't mean it and, um, Istill hadn't learned the lesson
that me being in charge of ofall of that was not a good thing
.
I mean I, I.
I look back and I remember acouple of the young men who had
tried to, you know, court me, ifyou will and they were really
decent, kind people who had agood job and, you know, were
(31:50):
loving.
They didn't beat me, theydidn't, you know, they didn't
write on me, they didn't lie tome and yet I dissed them and
ended up with the cheaters andthe liars for the rest of my
life.
I was like what is wrong withyou?
How come it took you that longto figure this out?
(32:12):
I'm just grateful that my, myJesus, didn't give up on me.
That he didn't give up on me,but he did give up on us, you
know, yes, I'm right there withyou.
Speaker 1 (32:20):
Oh, so grateful, so grateful, I mean.
Speaker 2 (32:24):
I would have.
Speaker 1 (32:27):
Yes, good thing I'm not gone so many times.
I'm like Lord, you still loveme Like please tell me why.
(32:47):
Oh, yes, you know, I think too.
I often refer to that and Ithink that when you see how
people are responsive to ourHeavenly Father, I do tend to
ask, like, what's yourrelationship with your father?
Right, and it could go positiveand negative in some sense
right.
I grew up in a home where mydad had me late and about the
age of 11 and 12, my parentsdivorced and my dad did his best
(33:13):
almost in the sense, probablycaring from guilt to provide for
anything I asked for and sowhen I got married, my husband
grew up in theopposite.
Yeah, like he was in theopposite, where they had to lack
.
And so when it came to thingslike I mean, and it would be
(33:34):
good causes, I was just supergenerous and I would be like, oh
, I'm getting to this, I'm gonnaget to this.
Or I would just like, hey,we're gonna'm getting to this,
I'm gonna get to this.
Or I would just like, hey,we're going to get this.
And he's like, how are youpaying for it?
I don't know, god will provide.
And there was this aspect.
He's like how can you're likeis this faith?
Like, how can your faith be sostrong?
And it got to a point where,thankfully, once again, the Holy
(33:55):
spirit opened my spiritual eyesto recognize that that wasn't
my challenge with God, because Ididn't grow up having that
challenge with my heavenlyfather, but I had other
challenges.
I had a challenge that, eventhough my father was actively
present in my life, he had leftthe home, and so I had a
challenge of trusting that Lord.
When I make a mistake, are yougoing to leave?
(34:15):
And so there's some ways whereit can come positive, like, yeah
, walk in faith.
I'm like, yeah, god's going toleave and so there's some ways
where it can come positive, like, yeah, walk in faith.
I'm like, yeah, god's going toprovide, but there are other
side.
I'm like, oh, I made a mistake.
And I go through this boutwhere, like I don't even feel
comfortable talking to you, lord, because I don't feel worthy to
have relationship with you,because I don't want to mess it
up.
Speaker 2 (34:34):
Or, yeah, you know, I have a girlfriend who, who
shared that with me and it wasso wild, she's like 40 and had
never told anyone not herhusband, not her parents that
that is how she felt about hisdeparture.
And I thought, oh, how sad isthat I, that she felt, and again
(34:56):
, I just hadn't thought of it mywhole life.
I was just operating, you know,and so you know she probably
could have just looked rightacross the table and been like
pat my hand.
No, no, don't worry, you'reright in here.
Speaker 1 (35:11):
Yeah, Look, we all look.
Yes, yes, I love that.
Well, I um, oh man, I feel liketime flies by so fast.
Like what time goes by whenyou're having fun, Like you know
, one of the things I do want totalk about before we go is just
faith and spirituality.
I know that I believe faithplays a huge role in our healing
(35:36):
.
I know that even evidence hasshown that when individuals have
faith that they're holding onto that, their healing process
is faster than one that does nothave hope or faith.
And so I always say, like Idon't know how people do this
life without like God, becauseso many times I'm like that's
the only thing that I'm holdingon to, right In the chaos of
(35:58):
this world.
And so I just want to ask you,like how has your relationship
with God evolved throughout theyears of this healing process?
Speaker 2 (36:08):
That is an excellent question and I truly believe and
that's why I wrote my book fromseasons of time, but also in
sections of emotional, spiritual, mental and physical, because I
don't think you can extractthem from each other.
I think, if you do, I've donethe research, I'm a science geek
about health and healing andcellular healing.
(36:29):
And the top five toxins in theworld right now, number one is
anxiety, and anxiety affects youmentally, emotionally,
spiritually and physically,because if you are anxious, you
are not trusting.
If you are overly anxious, yourbody is physically reacting to
that and there can be goodanxiety, like a first date or a
(36:51):
first kiss.
You know those things.
Your body doesn't know thedifference.
So you've got to you know.
Know how to self-regulate withyour like emotions and mentally
and breathe, how not to eatthings or do things that amp up
or do something to make mattersworse, like some people will
drink or whatever.
And I'm not getting into thebiblical debate about drinking,
(37:12):
I'm just saying it does impactyour hormones and chemicals, but
spiritually, yes, your hormonesand chemicals, um, but
spiritually, yes, absolutely,because he's our creator, so
he's made every system of ourbody.
Have a backup, have a backup,have a backup.
We would have to try to diequickly of natural causes, of of
(37:38):
like depleting things ordeficiencies, because our bodies
are just designed to just keepmaking up for that loss.
So I do believe that I couldn'thave the peace to sit back and
be quick to listen and slow tospeak if it weren't for the Holy
Spirit, if it weren't for myrelationship with Jesus, because
the loneliness is staggeringbut I'm not alone.
(38:02):
It's just that, that humancontact, that that is something
that I struggle with still, likeemotionally but spiritually,
knowing that I spend my morningsnow, I did a deep dive on the
Holy spirit and so in themorning it, depending on what
conversation I'm wanting to have, I'm either talking to the Holy
(38:22):
Spirit or I'm talking to myKing Jesus or I'm talking to my
Abba Father.
And this study I started on theHoly Spirit.
It was so funny they startedoff with, first of all, the Holy
Spirit isn't an it, it's a he,he's a part of Godhead and so
and and that's just been, eventhough that was something I knew
and I acknowledged and I neverreferred to him as an it it's
(38:45):
been a game changer for myconversations in the morning and
just understanding that hispart in creation, his part in
delivering the power that raisedChrist from the dead, his part
in delivering wisdom andknowledge and courage to us.
If we didn't have that, you'rehealing.
You're right, healing of anykind is just gone, and so I have
(39:11):
enjoyed thoroughly, I've gone.
This study is taking me throughevery single scripture in the
Bible that uses the, the Holyspirit, in it, and it has been
eyeopening because I've readthrough the Bible multiple times
.
But it's funny how, when you'rereading through for time, I got
(39:32):
it done in six months, um, butthat you, uh, um you.
When you slow down and you takea good look at what you're
looking at like an inductivestudy of the Holy spirit, if you
will it.
It just takes healing to anexponential level.
Speaker 1 (39:52):
Yeah, yeah, oh, man, such good conversation.
You know, as we talk about theHoly spirit, I find it I
shouldn't say funny, but I findthings humorous and I recognize
I'm like God is a humorous God.
I mean, we're creating his imageand I have humor, so clearly
he's humorous as well.
But when I, often when I pray,especially publicly and in my
(40:17):
prayers I did, I too did a studyabout the different persons of
God the father, christ and theHoly spirit.
And so I remember doing thatstudy and I remember just
hearing, like how come you don'tacknowledge the Holy spirit
when you talk to me?
He would like to talk to and Ilike, oh, okay, and so in my
(40:42):
prayer time I, I do, Iacknowledge like heavenly father
, I acknowledge Christ and hissacrifice and his you know,
aspect of interceding and beingthere on my behalf.
I acknowledge the holy spiritfor guiding me and being my
comforter, and discernment andso forth.
And so I love it that when Ipray publicly and sometimes you
(41:02):
see people like I literally seethem, or you hear the gas and
like who is she praying to?
I'm like it's, it's the same inone, yet three persons.
It's okay, guys.
Speaker 2 (41:14):
And they're very specific, while they don't
divert from the character of God.
It is very different.
The Holy Spirit, if you see inscripture, if you are being
imparted power, if you are beingimparted wisdom or
understanding, it says by theHoly Spirit.
And so why not?
(41:34):
You know, it's not that I'mwanting to circumvent God or
Jesus, but like I've asked himrecently, you know I've said I
get it.
The human race is barely using10 percent of our brain.
Holy spirit, could you and Iget together and maybe tap a
little bit of them?
right because I could really usesome of that look.
Speaker 1 (41:58):
I'm about to add that to my conversation with him.
Speaker 2 (42:03):
Can we just dip over here a little bit?
Yeah, yes, I'd like Jordan,kind of kind of smart.
When I watch him sometimes onhis podcast, I mean he'll say
something and I'm like, oh myGod, that's exactly what I think
about God or or about someconcept.
But I would have, I, I, thosewords would have never crossed
(42:23):
my lips.
I'm like, where did that comefrom?
And I I've joked that I wouldlove to get him on my podcast,
but then I feel like all itwould do is ultimately show how
stupid I am.
Speaker 1 (42:33):
I'd be like, oh, my God.
Well, you know, hey, I, I feellike I host this podcast.
I learn so much because evenwhen you were explaining, like
the butterfly stitches, I'm like, oh, that makes sense, you're
not insulting me, I needed toknow that Learn something new
every day.
Speaker 2 (42:53):
That's what I think.
Speaker 1 (42:55):
Yeah, yes, no, you're so.
Right though I think about Acts1 and 8, and it literally says
right, but you will receivepower when the holy spirit comes
on you and you will be mywitnesses in Jerusalem and in
all Judea and Samaria and allthe ends of the earth.
But when I think about that,you know, I think there there's
a caveat there, right, like thefirst part of that says you'll
(43:16):
receive power when the holyspirit comes upon you and then
you'll be my witnesses.
So I think even the aspect oflike, we can't properly be a
witness if we don't allow theHoly Spirit to come and be the
power that drives us even in ourhealing.
Because if we think about it,like what we're witnessing, what
(43:38):
our witness is the sharing ofour testimony, right, it's by
the blood of our testimony, it'sby the lamb, it's by the
testimony that we witnessed, andso we wouldn't be able to do
that if we didn't have the powerof the Holy spirit to walk us
through those healing processesso that we can be a witness for
him into all the earth.
Right.
Speaker 2 (43:57):
You can't export what you haven't imported.
Speaker 1 (44:00):
Yes, I love that.
Yes, oh, yes, absolutely.
Okay, I'm going to tell youright now this is probably going
to be a clip.
I love that you can't exportwhat you have not imported.
Absolutely, absolutely.
Oh my goodness.
Well, I just want to say,michelle, thank you again so
much.
I have truly, truly enjoyed ourtime.
(44:24):
I feel like there's so muchmore that we could talk about,
from generational trauma and somuch, but, as we already knew
when we started, we're liketime's going to go by so fast
and so I'm willing to come backagain when the second book comes
out.
I would love that.
Yes, absolutely.
I would love that.
We are, as always, going toprovide in the show notes for
(44:44):
you listeners how you can stayconnected to Michelle, how you
can get her book, but I alsowant her to tell you here, Okay.
Speaker 2 (44:52):
Yes, it's available on Amazon and Barnes and Noble.
The name of the book isButterfly Stitches the
Metamorphosis of Healing and onmy website, which is easier to
remember, it's michellebrablecom.
There is a link for both Amazonand Barnes Noble and also my
podcast on there, which Iexpound on some other items from
the book as well.
Speaker 1 (45:12):
Awesome, I love it.
Michelle, I'm excited to hop onAmazon and get my own copy, and
thank you again for joining usat Graceville community.
I look forward to having youback.
I'm holding you to that.
Okay, absolutely, I'm on board.
Sign me up, yes, yes, I love it.
Well, graceville listeners, asalways, we thank you for tuning
(45:32):
in and our hope and prayer isthat this episode has impacted
you in a positive way in thelight in which you see our
Father, jesus Christ, and ourHoly Spirit.
Thank you so much for tuning intoday.
Blessings to you all.
Thank you for tuning in totoday's episode of Graceville
(45:52):
Community Podcast.
We would like to invite you tovisit gracefieldcommunitycom.
Gracefield Community is allabout doing church the way
Church of Acts did, using fivemain principles that we see in
the Book of Acts.
Sharing resources, as believerspooled their possessions and
(46:22):
resources to support those inneed, as we see in Acts 2.44.
Through hospitality the earlyChristians practiced hospitality
by opening their homes toothers, as we see in Acts 2 and
46.
By financial aid the church inAntioch sent financial aid to
believers in Judea during a timeof famine, as described in Acts
11 and 29.
(46:43):
Prayer and encouragement theysupported each other through
prayer and encouragement, as wesee in Acts 4 and 24.
And finally, spiritual guidance.
The apostles and eldersprovided spiritual guidance and
teaching to help strengthen andbuild the community, as we see
(47:04):
in Acts 1530.
I would like to encourage you.
If any of those areas are areasin which you are in need or can
contribute, please reach out toGraceville Community.
We are working together acrossthe world with ministries and
individuals alike to help bringback the Church of Acts.
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