70. Mandy Marquardt︱27x US National Champ on Crushing Records & Creating History with Type 1 Diabetes

Episode Transcript
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Mandy (00:00):
I was supposed to go to this VO2 max testing because I
was supposed to then potentiallytry to make the world's team
for German team for junior trackworlds Like that would have
been amazing.
But no, instead I was in thehospital for two weeks having a
doctor tell me that I wouldnever be able to compete at a
high level in my sport and, yeah, that was a really difficult
time.
Like it brought my dad and Icloser, because I know there's

(00:20):
some times in my career that mydad was really hard on me being
German and you know we laughabout this now but he would just
be like do it or don't do ittechnically like, but in a way
it brought us closer because hewas then more patient with me.
But I'm also in a sense, notpatient at times just because
I'm like I want to do this, Iwant to do that and I want to
make that happen.
So we just took it one step ata time.

(00:41):
I was like, hey, I just want toget back on the bike, see where
it takes me.
And then I was like you knowwhat I'm feeling?
Okay, even though learning howto manage my diabetes was so
hard and I didn't understandthat eating just chocolate or
sweets would just spike my bloodsugar.
And then it was just a lot ofjust learning, even though I
didn't want to be like, oh look,I'm type one, I have to do all

(01:01):
this, you know, like at arestaurant, like take insulin
out and take insulin or check myblood sugar, prick my finger a
ton of times and get all thesemarks on my finger, and like I
just didn't want to be different, but it's what I had to kind of
do.
I just was like it's what I haveto do, I don't have a choice.
And I was like okay, I want toat least do nationals.
And then I competed at Germannationals less than a year later

(01:24):
in that same event and wonbronze, and that to me was like
a shift of like wow, I canactually do this, like with
diabetes, because I was standingin the same exact spot.
And to me that's always like.
One event that means so much tome is the 500 meter time trial
at the sprint event, and that'sthe race that I have the
American record in now and it'slike one of my favorite events
just because it holds so much.

Klara (01:45):
Hello, ladies and gentlemen, and welcome to Grand
Slam Journey podcast, where wediscuss various topics related
to Grand Slam Journey of ourlives sports lessons we have
learned from our athleticendeavors and how we apply them
in the next chapter of our lives.
My today's guest is Mandy .
Mandy is a professional trucksprint cyclist living and racing

(02:11):
with type one diabetes for theUSA Cycling National Team and
Team Novo Nordisk, the world'sfirst all diabetes professional
cycling team.
Her mission and passion is tobe a role model for all to
pursue their dreams and toinspire, educate and empower
everyone affected by diabetes.

(02:33):
Mandy is 27 time US nationalchampion, five time American
record holder, two time PanAmerican Games medalist and
Olympic hopeful.
I'm cheering for her to qualifyfor the 2024 Paris Olympics.
I love so many things about theconversation, including Mandy's

(02:55):
humbleness and the courage withwhich she tells her story.
I hope you enjoyed the lesson.
If you do, please share it withsomeone who you believe may
enjoy it as well.
Don't forget to subscribe soyou don't miss the next episode,
and consider leaving a reviewon YouTube, spotify, apple
podcasts or wherever you listento this episode.

(03:16):
This is your host, KlaraJagosova.
Thank you for tuning in, andnow I bring you Mandy Marquardt.
Mandy, thank you so much foraccepting my invitation and be a
guest on the Grand Slam Journeypodcast to talk about your
Grand Slam Journey of cyclingWelcome, thank you for having me

(03:36):
.
I have been reading about yourlife and what brought you to the
sport and your background andobviously even managing health
conditions such as diabetes,which you have been diagnosed
with early on in life and, beinga former athlete, I believe
managing being an athlete is ajourney on its own, not even

(03:57):
with type one diabetes, whichI've listened to many podcasts
and you talk about even thefocus you have to pay attention
to obviously sleep, recovery,nutrition and all of that above
and obviously, thriving in life,including your school and
academics and Penn State andtraveling now and working to be

(04:17):
at the Olympic Games in Paris in2024.
So there's so many things wecan touch on.
And just for everyone who maynot know you, quick intro your
professional track, sprintcyclist, 27 times US national
champion, six time Americanrecord holder.
I love the Olympic hopeful.

(04:39):
I'm cheering for you.
I'm curious actually how thatis going and next steps for you
on the journey.

Mandy (04:45):
Anything else you want to add for intro for anyone who
may not know, you, I think yousummed it up pretty well and
it's kind of ironic because thisis the Grand Slam podcast and I
actually started playing tennisfirst when I was really young.
I'm excited to dive into that.
But yeah, you covered it andI'm looking forward to this
conversation.

Klara (05:05):
Fantastic, I did hear that.
I heard.
Your idols actually when youwere grown up were Steffi Graff
and Jennifer Capriati, and youplayed some tennis.
I'm curious about all that.

Mandy (05:16):
You listened, like that was.

Klara (05:18):
Maybe I mentioned that once or twice in a podcast, but
yeah you found that I like to dosome background so we can
hopefully dive deeper and thispodcast isn't a repeat of all
the other things that you do.
I know you were born inMankheim, Germany.
Fun fact, my sister studied atMankheim University for a year,
so she was there on an exchangeprogram and when you were six

(05:40):
years old you moved to Floridaand played various different
sports.
But I'm always curious how tomove that cultural background.
Having dad from Germany, momfrom US moving at a young age
between Europe and US and kindof back and forth you in
multiple times.
How has that shaped you,including, obviously, your
selection of sports?

Mandy (06:01):
That is a really great question and I don't think I've
ever been approached with thatangle from your accent.
I just want to ask where areyou from?
I'm from Czech Republic.

Klara (06:09):
So yeah, right next to Germany.

Mandy (06:11):
I might be racing there in Bruno later this year We'll
see, it just depends on the raceschedule.
But yeah, so you know, kind offrom traveling, being in Europe
and being in America, yeah sojust that opportunity experience
at such a young age gave mekind of this perspective of just
people and food and just family, and so I don't really have a

(06:35):
big family growing up in Germany.
I had my grandparents and myparents, but yeah, just that
aspect of being able to haveconversations in the house in
German English was really unique.
Having dinner at home was justevery night, was a cultural
thing for us, and being able tojust travel from one country to
another in Europe was reallyneat and exciting.

(06:55):
So when I went to Florida when Iwas six years old I wasn't as
easy to get to place, but therewas these opportunities in
sports.
A lot of people were reallyactive.
That's kind of why the reasonmy parents, my mom's, from
Florida, so to also be closer toher family, we moved to Florida
and it's just great weather andit was just normal to be out

(07:15):
and be active.
Rather than, you know, inGermany they have seasons, so I
got into swimming and tennis andit kind of went from there.
My direction was just to kindof get me out and be active, was
really like their thing.
It was just to get me out to besocial and, yeah, kind of get
integrated into the Americanculture.

Klara (07:35):
What did you enjoy about tennis?
Because I did hear you on somepodcast that you actually really
liked it and potentially wantedto play it competitively.
How do you?
Got injured, so I'm evencurious how we find our sports
passion and obviously kind offrom that on, what led you to
cycling.

Mandy (07:53):
I wanted to be a professional tennis player.
I think my AOL email was likeMandy Tennis Pro.
I think my dad made it.
But I was playing for fiveyears competitively and I was
playing at the Rick Macy TennisAcademy.
So I was tall, so I was playingagainst a lot of girls that
were a bit older than me and Ithink at that point, at a young
age recovery or back then, thatwasn't really talked about as

(08:14):
much, maybe 15, 20 years ago,recovery and nutrition wasn't as
big as it is now, so I think Iwas just overdoing it.
It's not because of my parentspushing me, it's.
I was always just wanting totrain and be better, and when I
wasn't playing tennis, I wasswimming or I was running.
I was just doing something elseto aid my tennis.

(08:34):
And that was an excitingadventure to get to play and to
travel.
But I had a stress fracture inmy foot and that got me really
upset.
I was like how, why?
I didn't really understand, youknow, at such a young age, like
why am I having this injury?
And I guess it just kind ofmade me sad and I was like, well
, I'm not really enjoying itright now because I'm hurt.

(08:56):
And I had a swinging backgroundand I kind of started to get
better and I was like, hey, dad,can I run with you in the
morning?
Because my dad was a runner andso I'd run with him before
school and I'd see my teachersbefore school, which was really
funny because I'd be like I'llsee you soon in the class.
But from there, yeah, we wererunning five Ks.
And then, with being in Florida,triathlons are just so big and

(09:20):
well known because of the ocean,so I was like I want to do a
triathlon.
I don't know where I saw this.
So my parents were like, well,you do need a bike, you need a
safe place to learn how to ride.
So my dad Googled the velodromeand it was literally 20 minutes
from her home, which isincredible because there's only
one velodrome in Florida andthere's not many active
velodromes now in America asmany as they are in Europe.

(09:43):
I went to the track and thereare some bike rentals and it was
in a park.
So there was a former cyclistand coach and now director of
the park who was so excited tohave me there and show me the
sport, because there was not alot of young kids either.
I was like, okay, there's nobodyreally here, but I just love
like riding my bike.
And I noticed like, okay, thisis actually really challenging

(10:04):
and cool and I'm like riding onthis bank track and it was just
different and unique.
And there was just I could goeasy, I could sprint, I could do
so many things and I was likethis is kind of unique.
And then I did triathlons for afew years and I did my first
national and the juniordiscipline for cycling and so I
was like actually this is prettyfun.
I had success and I was likethat's kind of cool and I just

(10:26):
kind of stuck with it and I didtriathlons here and out for a
bit.
But really cycling was then mypassion.
So kind of grew from like thisinjury to just finding freedom
on a bike where I just felt sorelaxed and excited.
But there was also not a lot ofyoung kids that I was competing
against other than nationally.
But I was just like motivatedbecause I was like I want to

(10:47):
beat that older guy in the groupride and I want to beat this
person that's like 10 yearsolder than me.
I guess I was just always likemotivated to just be better and
just see how far I could go.
I didn't even know, but I wasjust like this is challenging
and I don't know where thedirection of my life could go
from it.
But yeah, I met a lot ofincredible people and that's, I

(11:09):
think, what's helped to thatcommunity, was that community
and cycling was there and itstill is really prevalent.

Klara (11:17):
And I heard you talk about the support system and the
community on several podcastsand would love to dive into it.
But even following on thepassion you beautifully
described, I felt relaxed andexcited.
I guess, just to let you in, oneof the reasons why I love my
podcast and inviting guests onto sharing how they find their

(11:37):
sport and the passion for it.
I find that often it's reallydifficult to describe because
it's this feeling and I think,when you're relaxed but excited,
but kind of this feeling offreedom, I think, the things
that we really enjoy, we justknow the feeling and how it
feels when we enjoy it, but it'sreally hard to kind of explain

(12:01):
for somebody else why you lovedoing it.
So is there anything else,mandy, you would want to add?
Because it seems like you foundsomething that you really
enjoyed.
Obviously you were great at itbecause within a short period of
time you were able to build upto be really great in the nation
and compete at the top level atnationals at the US.

(12:21):
But anything else you wouldwant to add to the feeling or
maybe your own realization?
Maybe you have different wordsto describe it as well, yeah, I
would say like wearing a helmetand glasses.

Mandy (12:32):
Not that I'm like hiding, but I almost felt like this,
like comfort with it.
I guess when I was really youngI felt like this just felt
right.
You know, when I was swimmingit was like a helmet and goggles
.
I guess I've never really donelike team sports other than like
track and field and crosscountry.
I guess that's.
That's not really very teamoriented, but I guess it more so

(12:53):
comes in.
I've always just looked atsports as being individual, even
though there's a big teamaspect to it which I have a
greater appreciation now.
But back then it was just likeit was like me against the clock
or me against like so manypeople that I'm competing
against, and like how can Iimprove?
And like interathlons.
When I was younger I used tolike practice the transitions,

(13:16):
because that's where you couldsave time, and like my mom and I
would like set up a transitionarea at home and I'd practice.
Or like rubber band my shoes soI could like hop on my bike and
then just start riding and justlike the details of it.
I just thought it was cool.
I guess having that like secondlanguage maybe I was never as a
young person so good atcommunicating that just sports

(13:37):
was like an outlet to do that.
I didn't necessarily have tocommunicate to anyone, although
I was getting information.
I just didn't feel like I hadto hold someone else back.
And then their success where itwas just like me and me growing
.

Klara (13:51):
I laughed that you also brunette.
The language I know you stillspeak German, and so growing up
actually led us in to yourchildhood.
Even your dad was obviouslyGerman, so did you speak German
with him and English with yourmom, or what language did you
have in the family growing up so?

Mandy (14:08):
my first language is German and when I came to
America at about six my Englishwas not not good at all and I
went into pre first, which islike not kindergarten and not
first grade.
So I was kind of in the middlethere and I felt really
embarrassed about not knowingEnglish.
And then I started to learnEnglish and I got made fun of

(14:31):
because I had an accent, becauseI sounded different.
And now I wish I had an accentbecause I think it's really
unique.
But I got rid of it because Itried really hard.
So, yeah, I guess I used thataspect of fit again and being
accepted.
So I wish I still had it.
Like I love your accent and Ithink it's just so unique
because it tells the story of,like, who you are and where you

(14:51):
came from.
But I guess when you're youngit just shows you like you kind
of get put in the certainposition of you're not like us,
so you have to conform, but inthe household, I think.
For many years I did still speakGerman, but then because of
going to school they wereincorporating more English and
then as I got older, it's justEnglish.
I was actually recently inGermany and I would switch

(15:12):
between English and German withmy dad when I had to really
speak from the heart.
Sometimes it was really hardfor me to talk in German because
I couldn't find the words.
But if I just just kind of haveconversation with like friends
or somebody on the street.

Klara (15:26):
German's fine, and just to let you in, I wish I had no
accent.
So we always wish to have theother things.
So I'm impressed that you wereso good in paying attention to
English that one cannotrecognize that your first
language was actually German.
So I'm kind of right at thestage where my English is never

(15:46):
perfect and never will be, andI'm forgetting my check too.
So I'm like in the middle ofnowhere now.
But then go back to your cyclingand your journey.
So it seems like, unfortunately, or at that point, your parents
got divorced as well and seemlike your dad went back to
Germany and so you were kind ofput in this position where do I

(16:08):
want to go, it seems like, orwhere do I want to live?
And you actually wanted tofollow the passion cycling in
Europe which my parents gotdivorced, thank God.
Actually.
I think it was to their betterrelationship.
We were grateful for it, all ofus.
I was old, but my sister waskind of at that age, sort of
your age, and I think she wasimpacted by differently than,

(16:31):
let's say, me.
So I think it's really hard fora kid to understand that.
Like when you're in, you knowthe teens.
You're going through your ownkind of teenage stuff and this
is happening bless you,obviously trying to be
competitive athlete, and theneven your diabetes that I want
to kind of dive into.
So it seems like everythingswirls into these few years that

(16:54):
you've gone through so muchchange.
So maybe tell us a little bitabout it.
Have you reflect on those yearsthat seem like was so much that
you had gone through?
But you also talk about it howmuch stronger it made you.

Mandy (17:07):
Yeah, I will definitely say it's.
It's impacted where I am today.
Sometimes I look back at it I'mlike what year and when did
that happen?
Because it's almost like thisblur.
Like 14 to 16, it was like whathappens.
So my parents had split, my dadwent back to Germany and I've
always had a great relationshipand I still do with both of them

(17:28):
and it was, like you said,better that they, you know, went
their separate ways, althoughat that time it was just really
hard for me because, like my dadwas like my training partner,
like he was the one me thatwould go running with me in the
morning or fix my bike or likehelp me with running shoes, and
so my mom was like they're in adifferent role, like making
dinner and just ensuring like Ihad the nutrition, everything

(17:51):
that I needed, and they both,like had different roles.
So, like when my dad left, Ikind of was like not motivated
to do anything.
I kind of stopped sportsactually for a bit of time,
maybe a half a year.
It was kind of weird, but Iremember that time like I just
made more time for likefriendships and I was like
having fun, like skateboardingand stuff and just being a

(18:13):
teenager, but I never wanted to,to make it difficult for my
parents, even though I wanted tobe like reckless, but then I
wasn't because I was just likethat's not me.
But I always kind of looked atlike, okay, sports was like
something I was alwayspassionate about, but I didn't
know how to ignite that passionagain because I didn't have,
like my teammate there eventhough I was always a solo

(18:35):
athlete.
But my mom got me back on myfeet.
Basically, she's like, hey look, there's this triathlon, the
series that you did before, it'shere.
Let's make a plan, let's get anew bike, a triathlon bike,
specifically a triathlon bike.
And so we went shopping for oneand she's like, all right, this
is the date that this event'shappening.
So she just got me ready, likethere was a plan in place and

(18:56):
there was equipment there.
Yeah, she just like helped mewith the transitions and just
she really was passionate abouthelping me get back on my feet.
She was hurting, but she wasalso making sure that I wasn't
hurting and so it was like agood distraction, if I think
about it, like her helping me.
And then I was like thingsstarted to happen again and I
had like some fun and successagain.

(19:18):
I was like you know, it'd bereally, really great.
I went to, I think, visit my dadthe summer before it was like
2007 and I was like I reallyenjoyed the team aspect of one
time.
They had the team there and Ijust wanted to move there and I
didn't really understand thecapacity of what it takes, but I
was just like I want to movethere.
We were seeing like a sportsand family psychologist and I

(19:41):
kind of cornered them and I waslike, can we make this happen?
And yes, it happened, eventhough there's like a lot of
stress involved, because my dadwas like, well, where are you
gonna live, where are you gonnago to school?
And I was like, right, I don'tknow, can you figure that out?
So I lived in like a boardingkind of home.
It's part of the church, butthere was no like religious

(20:02):
affiliation, but it was justlike they had housing available
and so I was living there in thehouse, kind of had my own room,
but like it was a sharedkitchen.
But then on the other side ofthe house there's some young
kids that didn't have manyfamilies, so it's kind of neat
to have dinner with them.
And just my dad was like thisis a good for you to kind of see

(20:23):
this kind of life and see thiskind of experience.
And then I went to AmericanHigh School in Munheim, which is
no longer exists.
Actually.
I went to a German school for alittle bit of time there's just
so many details but I was notvery well accepted there.
The teacher didn't like that Iwas American.
That's like a whole motherstory.
So my.
I just didn't have a goodexperience.

(20:43):
I went to the American HighSchool in Munheim and I was able
to continue my education there,even though my dad had to pay
out of pocket for that and wasvery expensive because we are
not part of the military.
So I got a really greateducation and I started racing
there and racing for the state,because Germany has states.

(21:04):
So I was racing for the stateand then I was racing for a
little bit with like theirnational team.
I'd go on national team campsand then I went and did VO2 max
testing after nationals one yearand that's where my diagnosis
happened and it was like totalshock because I was like I don't
, I don't know, I'm tired, I goto the bathroom, I'm thirsty, a
lot like those are all symptomsand it was quite a difficult

(21:28):
time for sure yeah, just to goback, or so you mentioned you
lift with sort of a boardingtype of setting you had.

Klara (21:36):
So it sounded like you technically lift on your own in
this environment where therewere other kids.
But how old were you when youdid that?

Mandy (21:45):
that's quite a bit I technically lived alone and I
was 15, I would take the trainto school.
I would do my own food shopcooking, although they had some
meals and I could sign up forthem, but I wanted to cook at my
health, like healthy meals.
So yeah, I was prettyindependent at a pretty young
age and my dad lived and ownedthe apartment building, but he

(22:07):
was waiting for somebody to moveon and so then from there he
would renovate it, and thenlater it was my apartment, which
is cool, yeah.
So that's then where I livedafter.
I lived technically alone, butnot alone.

Klara (22:17):
I had a similar situation .
I guess I'm asking because itsounds very familiar.
I left on my own, since I was13, at sort of my own apartment
and I just went between thetennis courts and the apartment.
So there were obviously peoplearound.
But if you want to be great atany sport, really there's kind
of these things that you have todo.
And I never found it weird,because that's kind of what you

(22:38):
got to do to be great and yousort of know your goal,
basically grown up.
When you tell it to somebodyelse, they're like what you did,
like what everybody's kind oflooking at you and you were
talking about it.
I just did because it madesense.
It was like the thing that youneeded to do to be great at
whatever your passion was right.

Mandy (22:56):
It seemed like it was just very much the same for you
yeah, exactly, I've neveractually met someone else with
like similar kind of experienceand, it's true, I didn't even
think twice about it.
Even my parents, they justchecked in with me and I knew
where I had to be and and thatwas my responsibility yeah, how
great.

Klara (23:14):
And I guess the responsible then accountability.
If you have it that early on inyour life, even reflected on my
own journey, it will just kindof go with you and it's equally
not more important as we growthrough life and it's a value
that stays with us and carrieseven to your next chapter,
whatever you decide to do.
Obviously after cycling,hopefully you have many years

(23:36):
still ahead, but it's a greatvalue and a skill that I think I
underestimated earlier on, evenin my kind of post-tentast
career.
Going back to what youmentioned, being diagnosed with
diabetes and again you were 16,if I'm counting correctly and
listen to your podcast correctly, which is again like really
forming years and it's right onthe spectrum really seems like

(24:02):
with any sport.
Really the 15, 16, 17 is whereall kind of the big national
teams are looking at you as youare graduating from the teen
years and transitioning to kindof the women's sport right of 18
and over, and so theperformance is so important to
set yourself up then for kind ofthe next success when you kind

(24:23):
of graduate to the women's side.
I mean that must have beendevastating, and I've kind of
heard you again on the podcast,a doctor telling you you're
never gonna be able to competeat a high level at your sport,
how, where you process, and allof that that was happening
between the 2007 and 2008 whenthis diagnosis was given to you.

(24:44):
And obviously doctors that wekind of were taught to respect
are telling you this news as aapodic talent and something that
you want to see yourselfthriving at for many years ahead
yeah, man, it's, it's hard,like I just even like thinking
about it on, like how did iteven all work out sometimes.

Mandy (25:06):
But it's true, like I moved to Germany to further my
career in cycling and yeah, thisis not the news that I wanted I
placed third at the Germannationals in one event.
Three months later I wassupposed to go to this VO2 max
testing because I was supposedto then potentially try to make
the world's team for, you know,the German team for junior
worlds, junior track worlds likethat would have been amazing.

(25:27):
I've never competed at a juniortrack world championships and
if you look at, like most of thejunior track cyclists, they
have competed at junior worldsbut some of them don't move on
and some of them do.
But it would have been a cooladventure.
But no, instead I was in thehospital for two weeks having a
doctor tell me that I wouldnever be able to compete at a
high level in my sport.
And yeah, that was a reallydifficult time because, like it

(25:49):
brought my dad and I closerbecause I always had a great
relationship with both of them.
But I know there's some timesin my career that my dad was
really hard on me.
You know, being German, and youknow we laugh about this now,
but he would just be like do itor don't do it, technically like
don't waste my time, in a sense.
And I was just like I don'tknow, dad, I'm tired, I don't

(26:11):
know what it is Like.
It was the nationals before Imoved there too, that like I,
just something was wrong.
Obviously my blood sugarprobably was so high because I
was so nervous.
My cortisol level spiked and itmade my stress hormone, so it
made my blood sugar go high.
So it all had this dominoeffect.
But when that all happened andthen I was in the hospital, I
could see my dad like this, likefear in his face, kind of like

(26:34):
of concern, and like almost likehe felt really bad because he
knew I'd never like make excuses.
But in a way it brought uscloser, because he was then more
patient with me.
But I'm also in a sense, notpatient at times because, just
because I'm like I have thislike site set and like I want to
do this and I want to do thatand I want to make that happen,

(26:54):
so we just took it one step at atime I was like, hey, I just
want to get back on the bike,see where it takes me.
And then I was like you knowwhat I'm feeling?
Okay, even though learning howto manage my diabetes was so
hard and I didn't understandthat eating just chocolate or
sweets would just spike my bloodsugar.
And then it was just a lot ofjust learning, even though I
didn't want to be like, oh look,I'm type one, I have to do all

(27:16):
this, you know, like at arestaurant, like take insulin
out and take insulin or check myblood sugar, prick my finger a
ton of times and get all thesemarks on my finger, and like I
just didn't want to be different.
But it's what I had to kind ofdo.
I just was like it's what I haveto do, I don't have a choice.
And I was like, okay, I want toat least do nationals.
And then I competed at Germannationals less than a year later

(27:39):
in that same event and wonbronze.
And to me it was like a shiftof like wow, I can, I can
actually do this, like withdiabetes, because I was standing
in the same exact spot and tome that's always like.
One event that means so much tome is the 500 meter time trial.
It's a sprint event and I wasan endurance rider back then
which is kind of weird.
I'm like, why was I never lookedat as a sprinter, even though,

(28:01):
like, I placed in the sprintevents?
But I don't know, maybe Ididn't have my legs weren't as
big then I don't know, but it'slike I didn't have the physique,
maybe, or something.
And that's the race that I havethe American record in now and
it's like one of my favoriteevents, just because it's just
holds so much.
But yeah, of course, at thatage it's like junior worlds and

(28:21):
then I, you know, making thenational team and then
potentially like, what does itlook like for the Olympics?
And it's a very complicatedprocess, but at that point I was
just like I'll just see whatit's like to get back on my bike
and see if this is like meantfor me.

Klara (28:34):
Thank you for taking us even to that experience because,
reflecting myself and I don'thave diabetes I left playing
with nutrition and I subscribedto my CGM.
I had like the 90 daymonitoring and I swear I think
everyone should have it Like ittells you so much more about
yourself, even as you'rementioning, like stress or
sickness, like I have Applewatch and obviously monitor it,

(28:57):
but CGM tells you so much more.
Oh, I'm like not feeling well,a little bit cold, like my A1C
is elevated, I can see it, andso this is even so much more
important for, obviously,someone who has diabetes and I
love this technology developmentand the trend that has been
advanced in technology to allowus to achieve more goals and be

(29:20):
healthy, whatever it may be foryour life.
But, like 15 years ago, thesethings weren't really that
accessible as you're mentioning,even like nutrition.
When I think about nutrition 15,20 years ago and it would
really matter for me competinglike I wish I had all of this
knowledge that's now kind ofavailable and there's so much
more science and podcasts andeducation around that you

(29:44):
couldn't find Right At thatpoint.
You literally had to go andfind more of like the local
experts, and even that wasdifficult enough.
So, like you said, there was alot of trial and error for you.
But if you have to reflect andkind of compare, when I hear you
on podcasts you get such afancy routine that I would even
love to kind of you let us intoit versus.

(30:05):
You know where you werestarting.
How would you describe that gapand perhaps even the
technological progression thatnow allows you to be so much
more aware of your body and whatit needs?

Mandy (30:17):
Yeah, it's.
I think I would have been likeway back like then if I had all
this technology and and thoseresources and all the doctors
and like team Novinotus backthen, like right away, I'd be
like this is easy, like noproblem, but yeah to be able to
like look back and when I wasdiagnosed and not know anybody
with type 1 diabetes.
Because now, like, when peopleare diagnosed, like some doctors

(30:38):
are like hey, have you heard ofteam Novinotus?
Or like they'll find us, likethrough.
Like social media, likeInstagram, was not a thing back
when I was diagnosed, so itwasn't as easy to connect with
people then.
But, yeah, it was like prickingmy finger and insulin and just
like having to carry all thesedevices all the time.
And now it's like I have myphone and I can see right now

(30:58):
what my blood sugar is, or justlike I recently got my Apple
watch and I can see my bloodsugar right on my screen.
So I'm like that's nice Because, like if I'm out and about a
dinner or like traveling, andI'm like, oh, I kind of feel a
little weird, like what is it?
And I look at it and it'spretty accurate most of the time
.
I still check it to calibrateit occasionally, but, yeah, like

(31:19):
if I had that when I wasdiagnosed, I'd be like this is
easy.
But it's made me more gratefulnow to have these resources,
because when I was diagnosed,there was there was there was a
nutritionist that was workingwith older people.
There's no like type oneathletic specific nutritionist I
had to figure a lot about bymyself and maybe that's why it
took me so much longer to maybeprogress in the sport, because I

(31:39):
didn't have those resources.
Like I came across teamNovinotus in 2010.
And I was like, oh my God,there's other athletes with
diabetes too.
And I'm like what do you do?
Like how do you do it?
Like right, because it's likemaybe I can do it even better.
Like in a way, like what can Ido to be?

Klara (31:56):
better.

Mandy (31:56):
And I was just like learning from them because I
didn't have that the first twoyears.
And then the teams just likeopen that door of like being
able to talk about it.
I remember going to like teamcamp one year, the first year
having to be in a room, likebecause they split us all up,
and it was just kind of likemedia training, because we're
not like doctors to say, okay,this is what you need to do with
your blood sugars and this iswhat you need to say.

(32:18):
But it's more of like how doyou tell your story, like, how
can you shape that?
And I remember just like beingin the room and then like
walking out and crying andcalling me mom.
I'm like I don't know if I cando this, like the first time I
actually really had to talkabout my diagnosis and then it
was just learning that there areother people that you could
help through that, like youngkids, just like sharing your

(32:38):
story.
I'm back on my bike, I'm doingwhat I love, like.
It does take a lot of trial anderror, it does take a lot of
days where I'm like poweringthrough it, but it's worth it.
And, yeah, I mean having thistechnology now, I don't know.
Can I say it's easy, it's a loteasier so reflecting on dad and
even just your lifestyle,nutrition.

Klara (32:57):
I've heard you on some other podcasts that sort of made
sense.
I wouldn't think about it,naturally, but it makes sense,
like these long flights and,obviously, lack of sleep.
Everybody knows, and so manypeople talking about in general,
how sleep is important,managing your levels, but
because of type one diabetes, itactually impacts your A1C so
much more.
And so I just think about youand kind of again I feel like I

(33:22):
know you a bit through listeningto your podcast.
You're so detail oriented andtrying to figure out.
Obviously, if you want to begreat, then in sport you have to
do it.
What is the attention to detail?
How can I improve just this 1%of the time?
Right, because when you're thisgreat, we're trying to get this
.
Splits of seconds especially inyour case because you're a
sprinter like improving.

(33:43):
I think just one 10th for asecond is a big win, probably on
a daily basis and so manythings you've got to do.
So what is your routine, mandy,and what did you find works
best for you?
So I actually came from.

Mandy (33:54):
I want to say it from an endurance background.
I made the transition to tracksprint cycling in 2013, when I
did collegiate cycling too, andI tried my first sprint
tournament, and then it wasthere that I had to relearn my
whole diabetes regimen, because,being a sprinter, things happen
so quickly and I onlytechnically have like one shot,

(34:14):
so it was like my blood sugarhad to be perfect at that moment
.
And then, as I learned, in asprint tournament you have a
qualification and then you havesprint rounds where you're
racing against people and that'slike I can race nine times
within a day, and so that's alot of stress in itself, and
also nutrition.
I would write things down likewhat I was eating, what time,

(34:35):
how much insulin I took, becauseyou would think my blood sugar
would be like low the whole time, but no, it was also high
because I was stressed and itwas hot and I was racing outside
or I just traveled.
So it was just like many yearsof learning how to be a sprinter
with diabetes, and it wasn'tuntil like 2014 that I started
to race internationally and Ithen I was like this is there

(34:57):
fast like this, how am I goingto go from here to like here,
like I'm literally racing myidol from Australia and Amir,
she was literally right next tome.
I was like I can't believe.
Like I'm here racing.
Everybody starts somewhere,right.
So that was for me.
It's like okay, this is thebeginning.
There's just so much I stillpersonally have to learn.
And back then we also didn'thave the resources like we do

(35:19):
now in the program of sprintcycling, like it was really solo
like me and another athlete,and we were just kind of tagging
along with the enduranceathletes to most like world cups
.
So it was very difficult backthen.
Now we have bikes, we have ahub program here, we have a
daily training environment, wehave arrow testing.
We have all these resources nowin the last two years that have

(35:40):
come, because also with theOlympics coming in 2020, just
looking at that, like Isometimes reflect back and like
could I have been moresuccessful, younger if I had all
these resources and all theright doctors and understanding
diabetes?
I kind of look at it and peoplethink like I've been in the
sport for such a long time butat the same time, I kind of
haven't had it that easy.
Like yeah, rio 2016 was nevergoing to happen Because it's

(36:06):
like a two year Olympicqualification.
I literally just startedsprinting in 2013.
And I missed 2020, I was analternate for Tokyo, but I was
part of that qualificationbecause we qualify as a nation.
So we had we could qualify twospots, but we only qualified one
, and so it was between me andanother athlete.
We missed the other spot bylike one country, so not much,

(36:28):
and so it was really hard tokind of look at all of this.
But I've been at the bottombefore and I've had to, like
pick myself up and learn andjust pulling it all together,
like so it's been every year.
I've been just trying to belike a better athlete and a
better athlete with type onediabetes to ultimately reach my
goal.
And now I have three more racescoming up that are part of that
Olympic qualification and I'mgoing to Hong Kong.

(36:49):
I've been there three or fourtimes and then trying to improve
every time when I travel tojust make my diabetes that much
better, like keep my blood sugaras stable as I can with
hydration, electrolytes, eatinga good meal.
It's not just like what you dothe day of and when you travel.
It's like what you do daysprior to competing or travel
I've years of experience is justbeing prepared, but not every

(37:11):
day is the same.
It's like trying to ride up ahill with your bike and trying
to keep like 200 watts.
It's it's, it's not doable,like there's always going to be
fluctuations and that's kind ofhow my blood sugar is.
But I'm doing everything I canwith good sleep I had.
One time was the worstexperience in Hong Kong was
during COVID.
We went there.
They kept us in the airport for24 hours and only give us pasta

(37:34):
and sandwiches and my bloodsugar was so high for like two,
three days I was like this isimpossible, like I am exhausted,
like I haven't really slept.
I slept in a cot where they'vekept COVID patients.
Now we're in the middle of theairport and just trying to get
out because of this COVID window, testing that the team had

(37:55):
missed Something wasmiscommunicated and so they
wouldn't let us leave theairport and it was like the
hardest thing and I was like I'msupposed to race in like two,
three days and that fatigue justfollowed me, like I was like
I'm here, I'm just going to dothe best that I can.
But there's been a lot that hasbeen out of my control.
So I tried to control what Ican.

(38:16):
But yeah, it's always achallenge, even though you want
it to go perfect.
It's never going to be, but aslong as you're just prepared for
that like, it just makes it alittle bit easier.

Klara (38:30):
I can imagine and I've heard you on podcasts also talk
about how much you just focus onthe process and try to take all
emotions out of it, which isthat alone is so hard, even just
you know, reflecting on me,traveling get traveled also for
tennis tournaments around theworld.
I mean that thing alone istiring for anyone.
And not even think about foodand nutrition and how it impacts

(38:53):
your A1C levels, plus even thefood poisoning.
I always had sensitive stomach,so that alone, okay, what can I
eat?
And usually it's like the riceand pasta is like the two things
you think that won't make yousick, especially in Canada if he
countries Funny enough just totell you, maybe listener's story
.
When we played in Egypt, thecoach used to say the one who

(39:17):
don't poop their pants typicallywins, because everybody would
get a diarrhea at some pointfrom just like digestive issues.
So we've always just tried tosee, even in these countries
where we're not used to the food, what do we eat, and so you
just have another level.
I'm just impressed.
Any other stories or things youwant to.

Mandy (39:36):
We went to Indonesia earlier this year.
That was literally like we justtraveled around the world.
We went from Indonesia to racethere, which was terrible food
and just terrible conditions,because like the food was always
cold and like they're inmaggots sometimes in the food
and the way they clean thedishes was cool.
You looked out back and theywere cleaning them out of a

(39:57):
bucket and you're just like wow,you're here, you're trying to
collect Olympic qualifyingpoints and these are the
conditions.
Like it's like oh my God, and Ifound this good ramen place
around the corner.
That's kind of saved me a bit,but most of the team got like
diarrhea on some you're throwingup, but thankfully I only had
some diarrhea, but very little,because I was also eating ramen

(40:22):
from this place that I foundquality ramen.
It was just very hot and I'mlike I just want hot food.
And then from there we weregoing to race in Egypt next, but
there was like some time inbetween.
So we went to my Erica andwe're like also happy to be
there because my Erica had goodfood and they put us in a good
hotel and then we went to Egypt.
It actually wasn't so bad.
I loved all the like BabaGhanoush, even though it was

(40:43):
kind of like oh my God, I haveto be careful because it's cold,
but it was hot and I'm likethat is good enough for me and
then flew back to Pennsylvaniaand back to LA so literally like
went around the world withinlike a month.
But yeah, I had to pack all mydiabetes supplies, keep my
insulin cold.
There's this thing I use as afree okay, it's like these beads

(41:03):
that you put in water and thenthey kind of absorb the water
and stay cool.
So I put my insulin in thatinstead of like asking for a
refrigerator every time, eventhough that's a great perk
because then I can go foodshopping and get like yogurt and
stuff and have like food in myroom.
But I asked the nutritionistslike our team nutritionists if
they can always ask forvegetables without any sauce,

(41:26):
because I noticed like thesodium kind of mess with me too,
because other than the type onediabetes are also have
hypothyroidism and psoriasis, soit could flare up and obviously
, like my immune system isworking harder than and I don't
want it to because I'm trying tobe ready to keep.
So yeah, I definitely try tokeep it very basic.

Klara (41:45):
Yeah.
I can imagine just managing allof that.
Managing food alone for anathlete again is a challenge,
and I always say if I knew howto eat better, I could have been
a better athlete.
This component just add so muchfor complexity and just the
need to focus and pay attention.
But I do want to go back.
You mentioned earlier andsomething that stood out to me

(42:05):
that I find impressive.
I actually don't think you havebeen at the sport for a long
time.
I actually think otherwisebecause I was puzzled how you
were competing for the longesttime in endurance cycling and
that it seems like it wasn'tuntil college when you actually
switched to a sprint athlete.
And so talk about thattransition cost.

(42:26):
To me that seems like acompletely different sport,
almost other than like the onlything seems like you have a bike
, but it seems like the strategyand everything else that goes
into it is like very different.
So it seems like you'relearning a completely different
aspect of the sport.
How was that?
And, to be great, there's somethings around, even biology and

(42:48):
kind of the aspect of it beingaerodynamic and how we will
obviously train for the sport.
So any of the differencesbetween the two that you want to
bring up or describe Mandy asyour transition to.
I find a completely differentside of the cycling.

Mandy (43:02):
Yeah, it's so different.
Like track sprint cycling, likeyou tell people I'm a cyclist.
I've had some people be likeyou don't really look like a
cyclist.
I'm like, what does that mean?
You know, I don't look like aTour de France rider.
I'm not super skinny, I havemuscle mass and so, yeah, like I
don't ride like many, manymiles, I don't ride many, many

(43:25):
hours.
Like the longest road ride I goon occasionally is like two
hours.
I'm training mostly like sixdays a week.
I'm in the gym three to fourdays a week.
I'm on the bike like four tofive days a week on the track,
three to four double sessions aweek.
Like recovery is a big aspectto it.
So I had to learn to likereally we always have this joke

(43:45):
like to be able to bury yourselfand like to do 500 meters.
Like there's an endurance riderthat can do 500 meters but in
like 10 minutes they'll be readyto go again.
Sprinter, they do 500 meters.
We typically take 20 to 30minutes when we do four of them
in a session because we arehitting like maximal, like
threshold.
We're trying to produce as muchlactic acid and so we're able

(44:06):
to produce more lactic acid thanlike your typical endurance
rider and so I had to also kindof learn to do that.
But it kind of came a bit morenatural to me because, just like
my body type, fit more as asprinter and I just like the
sprint races and some of theendurance events that we had.
We had some shorter races, likescratch races are just like 30
laps, with whoever crosses linefirst wins, Whereas like points

(44:28):
races it's like, say, 50 lapsand every 10 laps there's a
sprint that killed me.
I was like I can't keepsprinting like every time and so
I just think physiologically Iwas just going against it for a
long time until a coachidentified my sprint potential
and was like, hey, you want togive us a shot.
So we did some testing on a wallbike and I was able to see my
power and so, like power toweight ratio, that was pretty

(44:49):
good.
And then we did like a 30 secondpower test, which is brutal,
but it's like 30 seconds all outand then my average was pretty
good and so it just took time tolearn like sprint training and
sprint cycling.
I spent more time in the gym.
I then had to learn the tactics.
It was just like one on one onthe track or like the Kieran is
like six riders.

(45:10):
It was very more like tacticalwhere, like endurance is like
you just kind of go for hours oryou go on the track for like 20
, 30 minutes and they'redifferent races.
But the sprint is very tacticaland I like the aspect of it
because it's a little bit of amind game too with, like your
opponent, like on the bike, butthere's a lot of skills that you

(45:31):
have to develop.
So the velgium is 250 metersand it's on wood and it's about
45 degree banking, so it's beingable to ride the track with
looking back if you're leading,and like there's a lot of a
track awareness you have to haveon bike handling and like pedal
technique too.
As you fatigue, can you keeplike staying our dynamic, can

(45:53):
you keep like a smooth pedalstroke, like to continue to put
down power?
And so tracks for cyclingbecame more naturally to me.
But definitely I'm kind ofbummed that it was like later in
my career in a bit, that I wasidentified as a sprinter.
I did 23 in me, my team didthat in 2010.
And I actually identified thatI'm pure sprinter, like that CC

(46:14):
power and I was like if I wouldhave known like my genetics,
like if I thought that I wasmore sprinter oriented, maybe my
parents would have got me intomore of like a power base sport
at a younger age.
Right, but it kind of justconfirmed like, yes, like my
physiology is definitely moresprint and it's just taken years

(46:35):
, with the diabetes and thesprint tactics and the sprint
training and the strength overthe years to build that like,
yeah, I've been in the sport fora long time but at the same
time I look at it, I'm like Ihaven't had the same window of
opportunities as some of thesenewer athletes coming into our
program in the last year or two.
With all this resources and helpI think the coach every day.

(46:55):
Aaron, I'm just like, I'm sohappy like to be here, so like
have these resources at thetowards more the end of my
career now, even though I wishit was more at the beginning,
but at least it's happening thatI'm given still this
opportunity and he rides me.
He's like you're a strong assetand part of this team and even
like my husband too, he alsoraces and we're both like the

(47:18):
older riders on the team butlike we're both the riders on
the team in the team event thatdo like the most amount of laps.
It's we have a team sprint, solike we're considered position
three and we're both the ridersthat technically do three laps.
So we're like the engines onthe on the back of a team sprint

(47:38):
.
But I guess he also came from anendurance background.
Maybe that helped us.
It made me kind of like more ofa longer dragged out sprinter.
I'm working on the explosiveelement to it.
You think sprinter beingexplosive, but there's different
types of sprinters on the track.
Like you have the explosiveones that quick accelerations.
You have the ones that likewant the drag races which I like

(47:59):
, maybe from the endurancebackground.
But yeah, it's.

Klara (48:05):
It's interesting there's different kinds for nurse,
different body types to, if youlook so one thing that even
Comes to my mind and youprobably don't think about it,
but I guess this will alsounveil my you know, not
inclination to cycling.
But when I'm seeing you orsomebody on the sprint track,
like I get terrified because yougo in like what forty, forty,

(48:28):
five miles an hour and I Ialways think like accidents
happen, like did you have tothink about it and overcame it?
Obviously you can go prettyfast in road cycling to
especially kind of down the hill.
You can get some good speed,but this is all out and
obviously it's a kind ofcondense track.
So you have other Cycles, asyou mentioned, probably need to

(48:51):
cut angles and kind of figureout which part of the track is
most aerodynamic and so how youwant to take the curve.
How did you think about thataspect?
And when you worried even aboutfalling or kind of what happens
if you fall, because to me thatsounds really painful at that
speed to fall.

Mandy (49:08):
My worst crash ever was actually on my road bike and I
was not even going.
I was in a group ride inGermany.
It was like literally like thesecond day I moved there right,
the second day I moved there andI was on this group ride and

(49:29):
Closer to the right becausethere's another group coming, my
front wheel went into the holeand I hit like the bottom of my
chin and my two front teeth justlike 15, like when I just moved
there.
So for like weeks though, I hadto like walk around like I

(49:50):
looked like it was like a snaketo.
I was just, and then one waslike was turning like gray.
If it was the root died.
But like I don't know, thedental care was not so great in
Germany, so like I had to waituntil I moved back to America.
It was until two years that Ifinally had teeth like fix, but
not the root, the root fix.

(50:11):
So for a long time I had thislike grayish tooth, front tooth
like this is awesome.
And now I have Can you tellthey're great.
But that was my worst right,because like that was something
that really impacted me for along time, other than that, like
I haven't had any collarbone,knock on wood, I haven't broken

(50:38):
any collarbones yet.
I've maybe had one concussionback in 2011, but at that level
of racing there's a lot of riskand intensity involved and even
in the daily trainingenvironment, safety is always
the priority.
But I would say sometimes I'm amore conservative rider.
I don't maybe shoot the wholelike if I see it, or I don't
make it, which maybe haveprevented me sometimes from

(51:02):
making it to the finals orsomething.
But there's riders who are likethat's their last race, kind of
like ride, and I'm definitelymore of like a conservative in
the sense sprinter, but that'swhy I like the match sprints,
because that to me and cyclingis like the purest form of like
tactics, power and like just acombination of everything.

(51:23):
Where the Kieran is a eventthat is originated in Japan,
it's for betting six ridersBehind the motor brings you up
to speed, motor pulls off threelaps ago.
It's like a literally drag race.
It's like.
It's just like things areshuffling and moving and that,
to me, is like that's more race,though that's like luck.
It's all about positioning to,but with a sprint, my favorite
event, which is you rarely gethurt Ever because it's it's only

(51:46):
you and another person on thetrack, but it can happen.
You like bump wheels or youcome up and they come down, but
I'm Fractured my humorous in theKieran in 2018.
I was sprinting and my elbowlike got bumped up and so my
bars then turned really quicklyand I just fell on my arm and I
fractured my humorous.

(52:06):
But I raised the seven throughtwelve final and I didn't even
know that my arm was likefractured.
So yeah, it has been so bad, butit can be pretty brutal and it
does happen thinking they have.

Klara (52:19):
You even overcome it because you shared your first
time and I think everyone canreflect on their own.
I still have my first bikeaccident when I was biking just
going from the store, and Ithink that's why I don't like
the bike, because I fell likethe bag got tangled in the wheel
and you fall.
The groceries are scattered.
I think it wasn't even bad, butit was just associated with it.
So I don't think I ever gotover it, maybe when I was 1011

(52:42):
years old.
And so here you're, racing andseconds and splits of a second
count and you have to be themindset, probably like any other
sport.
If you think about gettinginjured, it doesn't help you.
But how do you overcome?
Because that's just how ourbrains work.
Have you found anything thatworks for you?
Or how do you work through yourmindset to kind of reset from

(53:05):
the accident like that or kindof scare of an accident like
that for the next race or theupcoming competition?

Mandy (53:12):
For me, it's just racing them more.
The hard part was in like 2020and 2021.
There weren't a lot of races,and so the Kieran.
I wasn't racing it as much, andso when I, when I am racing it
a lot.
I get more confidence with eachone.
So that's why I'm excited aboutthese next three races, because
, even though it's like we haveHong Kong, pan American

(53:33):
Championships here in LA andthen, like, literally the
following week, we have Canada,it's like a month of like three
important races, but it's liketo me that is the best, like
just put them all together.
When there's not kind of spacedout too much, it's hard, like
mentally.
I like when it's all like justlet's just make it happen within
a month and that pressure oflike having to commit and make

(53:55):
it happen when there's just timein between races.
Sometimes you can have moretime to think and it's always
the best.
But yeah, also because I'veseen my husband have some really
serious crashes.
He broke his collarbone and hisscapula, so shoulder and like
both had serious confessions,were literally crash in the
Kieran like right before my race, and I was just like seeing him

(54:19):
, just like not wake up for like40 seconds is really hard and
then him like finally getting up.
But then he got up because hedidn't want to be like lifted,
transported, because he knew Iwas racing and just to know that
I'm going to go to the hospitalafter, like I remember being in
the Kieran and I like the motorpulled off and then I just took

(54:39):
off like I just went and I justI want.
Now I remember just being like Iwon off of adrenaline and off
of just like kind of like I needto get out of here and go to
the hospital.
Yeah, I guess I race you know,physically that's a good race
for me, but like mentallysometimes I have a little bit of
like trauma with it.
but I think just through, likemore racing is always just

(55:03):
helped me, like you think, likeI'm going to talk about you
doing this like, sorry, I thinkthere's a delay, somehow go
ahead no, I was just saying likeyou think like all your list
professional athlete and there'sno fear, but like there is
realistic fear occasionally cuzLike yeah, you crash and your
season could be over, olympicqualifications over.

(55:24):
So like my risk to reward issometimes in it.
I'm trying to qualify theOlympic spot for the United
States in the sprint and thenwhen you make it, you qualify
the sprint spot, you getselected and then At the
Olympics you race sprint and theKieran, so technically it's
like the Pan American games andset a national record.

(55:54):
Our big team focus is more 2028, but there could be a slight
chance that we could qualify for2024.
But individually qualificationis looking a lot better points
wise, but we're still targetingthe next three races
individually and as a team.

Klara (56:08):
Just to go back when you mentioned your husband, jamie,
who's also a track screencyclist, as we talked about the
support systems and how the twoof you coordinate how to share
tips, do you kind of traintogether or advise each other
with mindset or even kind ofoverall, because I was one of

(56:29):
the things you know interviewguests from different sports on
my podcast and you've shared inmany other podcasts as well how
important that is to athletesgrowth having the right people
around you, having the rightEnvironment often even what you
mentioning now that the USAcycling team is really investing

(56:49):
in this spring cycling andgetting you environment set up
in LA, so I would love to evenhear how your obviously campus
going and prep.
But what do you want to shareabout your support system and
even any tips with your husbandthat you do share to kind of
grow together in the sport.

Mandy (57:06):
That's great and it's something that you know I
definitely want to chat aboutbecause it's yeah, it's
happening now and I wouldn't Beable to be in California.
I don't live here, we don'tlive here, but we stay with a
woman on.
Her name is Mary Lou.
I met her through a sportsmassage therapist Because I was
looking for housing maybe fiveyears ago and I was like is

(57:27):
there someone that you know thatI can rent a room from?
Crazy how like things happened.
I remember the year before atnationals I was like wouldn't be
awesome just to be out here, tocome out here to like stay with
someone, and then it all justlike happened.
I just Set it to the universeand to Jamie and it like
happened and we stay with MaryLou and she's amazing.
She's 83 and she's so upbeatand like huge support system for

(57:51):
us because she allows us tostay here.
I shipped out my old car likethree years ago.
A lot of the athletes live here.
We're all the older, olderathletes, so we don't really
have the capacity to like movehere.
We have animals in a home backhome.
But because Jamie had retiredand came back after the program,
kind of pick back up again andwas one nationals and was like

(58:11):
Given an opportunity tobasically be part of it and so
we're like we can't like letthis opportunity pass.
So we have this amazing homehere in California, 20 minutes
away from the track.
I have my old car here, likethe help and resources and
support we've been able to makethis happen on.
He works for the union so he heisn't making a lot of income

(58:32):
right now.
So like a lot of Financialconversations we have like
thankfully have likesponsorships and we're able to
kind of make that happentogether.
But it's definitely difficult.
The men's program is not, isnot targeting the Olympics
because of qualification pointsthey're not there.
But as far as like to have theworld championships in Denmark
and October, which I want to goto because Nova Nordic is there.

(58:55):
But yeah, his career is kind oflike always being re-evaluated
because of like finances andit's it's definitely hard on
both of us, but we're heretogether and a lot of our
conversations after training,you know, is always like how is
that today?
How'd you feel?
Or sometimes the car ride homeis quiet, but there's definitely

(59:16):
a lot of patients involved inthis and I wouldn't want to do
this on my own and to be able todo together so special, even
though, like financially it'sreally hard, but Like being hard
, it would be hard to be awaymonths at a time from each other
.
I think the longest time awaywas two months before when I was
traveling, when he was workingand not math, and so to be able

(59:39):
to do this together and havesomeone to lean on, having
support system, means a lot.
I mean my mom staying at ourhouse in Pennsylvania and
watching our animals.
It's really hard, you miss alot of holidays and yeah, but to
be able to be here and to dotogether and to know like we
have somewhere here that we canstay, we have my car, we're

(01:00:01):
making it work and we're doingit together.

Klara (01:00:02):
This is something we can look back on one day yeah, and
it's great that you actuallyhave that same understanding and
baseline of the sport and sortof know what it takes to put in
the effort to it.
Because even from my tennisbackground back in the day when
I played just came natural todate tennis players because you
got a new the effort that goesin.

(01:00:23):
But when you both travel younever see each other so it's
always a long distancerelationship.
So I was wondering kind of howmuch the two of you how it helps
or not.
So it seems like you'reactually able to train together
and especially in tennis, likethe men said, women's
tournaments aren't at the sameplaces.
So if you both travel, like youliterally just have a phone

(01:00:44):
conversation.
So it seems like at least incycling you have some sort of
common racist where you bothactually are at the same spot,
competing at the same time,instead of traveling separately.
Is that correct?

Mandy (01:00:58):
Yeah, like we went to Indonesia and Egypt and we got
to go to the pyramids with acouple of our teammates and just
be able to experience thattogether and to compete there
together and just like see eachother.
We went to the pan Americangames and competing and being in
the finals and meddling, yeah,it was just so neat to like look
up and see him there, so it wasjust really cool.

Klara (01:01:19):
I was curious right about kind of that and what you
mentioned, how hard it isObviously to make it and be
financially secure.
Everybody who has done anysport knows that no athlete is
choosing their sport for themoney.
There's very few people whoactually make money out of the
sport and tennis, if youactually make it, is one of the

(01:01:40):
better sports where you canactually be financially well off
and somewhat retired.
If you perhaps in the top 15the world for a very long time
but really anywhere beyond that,it's really hard to retire, to
retire in a way that you don'thave to find another kind of
career job after.
And so cycling specifically,even just reflecting on some of

(01:02:01):
my conversation with my formertennis coach who was part of the
Olympic committee and thatdetermines where the Olympics
will be, and he shared hisobservation which is you
probably understand, but manypeople may not like the people
who are going to Olympics.
Ukofh1.
Most sports still, he says, arestill amateurs in a way that

(01:02:27):
you cannot sustain yourselftypically fully on just the
sport.
So there's so many sports wherethe athlete has to do obviously
all the work, putting you knowfour or five, six hours a day,
but still makes some sort ofother job in order to support
the passion which is the sportsand athletics and to be great at
what they do, which is so hard.

(01:02:48):
So it seems like you and Jamieare figuring it out, obviously,
but how are you thinking aboutjust the sponsorship and how are
you taking advantage of it?
I think there's been a littlebit more, fortunately, now
opening up, which I think, withthis social media that gives you
opportunity to speak your voice, really show all the effort and

(01:03:09):
hard work that you've beenputting into the sport.
That's fully transferable toreally any other venture.
But how are you thinking aboutit, mandy, or even thinking
about preparing for what nextchapter may bring?
I wonder if the US cycling teamhas any sort of guidance or
programs that can help you thentransition to potentially the

(01:03:31):
next chapters, whatever you orJamie or really any other
athlete may choose to do afterthat.

Mandy (01:03:37):
Yeah, I do want to say the team USA and USA cycling do
push out a lot of resources, saylike team USA tuition grants
that I've received for school.
That's been really helpful.
So I don't receive a salarythrough USA cycling or any kind
of compensation in that way.
There is a lot of great supportthat we do get with resources
and bikes and our World Cuptravels and stuff.

(01:03:59):
They do provide like greateducational opportunities,
workshops too, which I think arereally helpful.
Like I said, the tuition grantfrom the team USA tuition grant
was really helpful for the lasttwo semesters.
It definitely covered theclasses I took and I'm very
appreciative of that.
I don't have to ask my parentsfor any help there.
So it was nice to be able tohave had that.

(01:04:21):
And as far as like sponsorshipgoes, the way I see them is like
a is a partnership, so not onlyam I promoting them, but like
they're also telling my storyand that we grow together and
make it a difference together inthe community.
So I have a partnership with StLuke's University Health
Network and they're a reallygreat hospital locally in

(01:04:41):
Pennsylvania where I live, andwe've done a lot of pediatric
events, diabetes events.
I threw all the pitch for alocal iron pigs game, just like
more community involvement wasreally big for me and to be out
in the community, and so thatwas just a really great fit.
I've had a partnership withthem for the last few years and
they're definitely one of mybiggest sponsors and I have them

(01:05:03):
on my race kit so I promote mykind of like a race car, I
promote my sponsors on mycycling kit and I have
newsletters and a media report.
So I have a PR manager that Igot a few years back just
because I just thought it wouldbe an important element to
managing my time and havingsomebody to help me kind of keep
track of everything and makesure I'm fulfilling those like
sponsor obligations and justkind of keeping them in the loop

(01:05:24):
.
So I have monthly newsletternow that goes out.
It's just like fun facts andstuff and things that I'm up to,
just to kind of give likesponsors and fans like a more
personal insight to everythingand I kind of talk about like
where we're at right now, likewith Mary Lou and what that
looks like.
So it's kind of differentbecause I don't really tell
people that on social media.
So it is going to be a coollittle blurb on my newsletter.

(01:05:48):
And then I represent Novin'Ordis and Team Novin' Ordis and
so thankfully, I've been able toadvocate for myself there a few
years back for salary.
So, yeah, like a lot, but it'senough for me to get by and like
to buy groceries and to paybills and to at least save a
little bit for emergencies.
I do have an agent Haven'treally secured anything big yet

(01:06:10):
in a sense but he helped me withmy website and my logo because
I want to continue to get backwith any kind of capacity I can
with diabetes.
I'm not able to attend theJuvenile Diabetes Research
Foundation Gala in Florida thatI was invited to, but I'm
contributing to a video.
I recently connected with thisyoung, this mom who her daughter
was recently diagnosed and sothat's why she got involved and

(01:06:32):
saw that I was from Florida.
So I'm creating a video thatthey're going to have at their
gala.
Unfortunately I can't attend,but like little things like that
I just think are so unique andhave created like opportunities
for me to reach more people withthe sport and with diabetes I
hope, to some capacity one dayto continue to be able to do

(01:06:53):
that.
I don't know, I'm not sure what.
I'm not putting any limitations, but we'll see.
We'll see.

Klara (01:07:02):
I don't think you should put a limitation.
Yeah, I can understand and asI've been studying your videos,
I have to say they were verymoving.
The ones you have on yourwebsite specifically.
I love them and you're just sonatural and your passion stands
out.
I always find that, even inconversations and podcasts or in

(01:07:22):
videos, when people are reallytruly passionate about something
, it comes out, and I candefinitely sense it from
everything I've read and seenand I look forward to staying in
touch and following yourjourney.
But if I may have maybe one ortwo more questions, I'm curious
if you could let us in even yourtraining camp now.
I guess two things I knowyou're training now in LA and

(01:07:45):
preparing for these three bigraces that are super important
for you to qualify for the ParisOlympics.
So what does your training looklike?
Kind of average day?
And even I would love to knowif you can take us through your
competition day Because again,as you mentioned even from some
other podcast, like in yourdiscipline, there's no room for

(01:08:07):
error.
So I was wondering what yourroutine looks like and how
you're preparing before you kindof stand on this line and then
you have to go as fast as youcan in the shortest period of
time you can.

Mandy (01:08:20):
Yeah.
So it's crazy because most ofmy events are less than 30 to 45
seconds but I'm literallytraining like I'm not riding the
whole time, but literally like40, 50 hours a week is just all
around recovery, driving, thetraining, training, gym training
, massage therapy, everything tojust help me continue to

(01:08:42):
progress.
So on Mondays it's usually likea single track session.
I'll kind of give you the weeklike just in a way.
In a sense, tuesday, thursday,is gym in the morning at eight
o'clock and we're there about 10and then the track is around
one o'clock.
We start warm up a little bitbefore and then we're there
about until four o'clock andevery session is a different

(01:09:06):
type of workout, whether it'sstanding, starts over, geared
efforts, accelerations ofsmaller gears.
It's all based off of RPM and inthat too we're always getting
told to be more aerodynamic.
Like our coach yells out arrow,I'm like in the middle of the
effort.
You're just like trying to getmore aerodynamic because it does
save.
You're trying to save a tenthand you can get a tenth off of

(01:09:28):
being more aerodynamic.
Or just like your head and bodyposition.
There's a lot there.
It's not a comfortable positionbecause, like we're actually
configuring some aerotesting onThursday we're changing a little
bit my seat or trying adifferent helmet, so I'll be
cool.
I'm excited to see where else Ican save some time.
But Wednesday is usuallyrecovery day and then Friday is
usually a single session butwe're at the track usually from

(01:09:50):
like 10 to three.
We're gone all day and thenSaturday is this gym with a road
ride and we ride along thebeach here.
That's a lot of long days.
At home in Pennsylvania we havea velodrome but it's an outdoor
track, so it's not Olympicsized standard.
But at home I can go home fortwo, three hours and relax, but
here, like we have to, pack ourfood.
Like we could literally get homearound five, make dinner, meal

(01:10:11):
prep for the next day, like justmake more, and we usually sit
down with Mary Lou and havedinner and then we go to bed by
like eight or nine and it's likeall over again.
We wake up at six.
So we're like meal prepping allthe time.
We go to Costco and buy andbulk and like you think, like
you look at our cart and youthink we're like feeding a
family.
It's a lot.
That's our lunch and dinner.
We barely go out to dinner.

(01:10:32):
If we do, it's like maybe onSaturday we have a date night or
something, but most of the timewe're just recovering.
And as far as like racing goes,it's kind of great because the
mechanics take care of our bikesand training I mean like at the
races.
So in training like we do ourown gear changes because it's a
fixed gear bike, but when we goto the races we have mechanics

(01:10:52):
that change our gears and thenwe don't have to cook.
So that's kind of nice to.
I'm like, oh my God, I don'thave to worry about cooking.
But they're really long daysLike.
They're at least like three,four days straight of racing and
it's a lot of like earlymornings, so like late at night
depends on how far you get tothe finals but exhausting days.
I remember my loop was tellingme I was in the red and the

(01:11:14):
orange.
I was like trying not to look atit when I was racing, because I
was only sleeping like fivehours a night because, like, you
get back at like 10 or 11.
And I got to wake up at like6am because racing starts at 9
or 10.
And you got to eat breakfastand be at the competition venue
two hours before.
So it's a lot of like.
Just Half of my bag is usuallyfood because, you know, I never

(01:11:38):
know the circumstances.
Like you had said, you've,you've competed, you've played
in South America.
It is not always great.
So you just got to be overlyprepared and I do pack snacks
with me and Just make sure Ihave a protein shake always on
hand and that I'm like focusedon recovery in between the

(01:12:00):
sprint tournaments to.
I actually had a circumstancewhen my blood sugar was going
really high and chili and Itexted my endocrinologist Like
hey, my blood sugar is going sohigh in between these races I'm
getting these spikes and it'sreally exhausting, like what can
I do?
And I was getting ready for thefinals, like sitting in the
mechanic room because it didn'tmake sense to drive an hour all
the way back to the village andchili.

(01:12:22):
So I was just in the mechanicroom on a blow-up mattress that
they bought for us and and justtrying to cool down and rest for
my next competition and Textingmy endocrinologist all the way
in Pennsylvania and he wasgiving me some good tips and I
made a couple changes Then andtweaked a few things and it
worked out.

(01:12:42):
But yeah, it's always like,okay, how can I make this bit
better?

Klara (01:12:46):
And I was literally like At one of my major I was
wondering, given if you canshare what's your go-to food
like doing these stems, becauseit seems like you're quite
Methodical.
You have everything thoughtthrough, so I'm guessing the
food that you eat probablydoesn't very much, because you
kind of know what do you reactto.
So do you have a go-to foodthat you eat?

(01:13:07):
Our favorite food, I.

Mandy (01:13:10):
Like, like Mexican food, but not spicy.
I just think the combination oflike beans, rice and like the
protein works really well for myblood sugar.
Then between races, just keepingit light because I'm racing
multiple times in a day aprotein shake and then I also
add a Bit of carbohydrates to myprotein shake, but more protein
than carbs.

(01:13:31):
Just sometimes.
It's just hard to eat justbecause of, like, my psoriasis
and anti-inflammatory stuff.
Sometimes I like try not to eattoo much bread, but sourdough
is usually what I go for.
I always say like I listen this, this podcast to you and I
follow glucose goddess and she'sshared some really great tips.
It's like in the order of whatyou eat.
Your food makes a big impact onyour blood glucose too, so it's

(01:13:51):
always vegetables first,protein and starches last.

Klara (01:13:56):
That's really hard because it's like you want to go
right for, like, the potatoesof the french fries, but you got
to start with like a salad orvegetables first, and it has
made such a big difference in myblood glucose, like my blood
sugars because just to share,even from my experience Actually
when I was on the CGM on my90-day trial, that I did what it
pretty much told me, because itkind of takes you through like

(01:14:17):
a different Foods and diets andexactly it's not just what you
eat, but how much of what youeat and when you eat it and how
fast or how slow you eat it.
There's actually a lot ofvariances that I have learned
through my 90 days and what Ihave learned for me.
When I eat my protein first,that's when, even if I eat
something sweet later or carbslater, it kind of keeps my a1c

(01:14:40):
sort of leveled as much aspossible.
So I wonder if you, mentioningeating veggie first, which is
veggie still typically has somecarbs in it.
So I'm wondering if it justreacts differently because your
type one diabetes or maybe it'slike everybody's biology, like
this is the thing why I loveCGMs.
I think everybody should havethem because everyone's biology

(01:15:03):
is just slightly different andso you got to learn about your
own body and what food you reactto best or which one is Is the
ones that kind of least elevateyour Google's levels and sort of
the spikes based on yournutrition and diet program you
create.

Mandy (01:15:20):
Yeah, I think I agree.
I'll think a lot of peoplecould gain a lot of value off
the CGM.
I know typically they're likemedical device, but now they're
definitely used just to helppeople, like with other
conditions, and so I think it'svery helpful to from a Training
aspect and just like learninghow food and your routine

(01:15:41):
affects you.
I will say, though, like thevegetables Aspect is more from
the fiber, like vegetables dohave carbs, but it's more the
fiber and how they digest, so itdigests more slowly and so
that's kind of more the sense,because the vegetables have
fiber and help everything elsedigest slower.

Klara (01:15:58):
Maybe last question, but no least, I want to touch base a
little bit more on your mindsetbecause, again, as you
mentioned, like the sprint is aspring to, you have to be 100%
focused.
There's no room for error.
How are you bearing for therace, or do you have specific
mind routines that you gothrough before or after the Race

(01:16:21):
to be focused or even relax andthen prep for the next race?

Mandy (01:16:27):
I've like I'm a little more on the quieter side
sometimes, just because I'mtrying to recover in between the
efforts and Just think abouthow I can make the next effort
better if I have two effortsleft.
I think of it like this is thegold medal final, because it's
best at three usually.
So I like try to take on mylast two efforts like it's the
gold medal final, because ifthat person wins one and I win

(01:16:48):
one, then we go to three andthat's not fun because then you
have to.
There's only like sometimes 10,15 minutes between the decider
and that's really difficult.
So I try to have this mindsetand training I bring that
intensity and it like with likeracing or like when we do a team
on team training and Teamsprint training and there's
always a technical aspect towhat we do too I'm always kind

(01:17:12):
of thinking and alsocommunicating with my teammates
on ways to make this moreefficient.
It's all about drop-off speed.
It's all about also like there'sso much detail but like the
first rider in a team sprintbrings you up to speed right, so
that person just goes all outthe second rider is definitely a
more like technical position,because they have to get on, but

(01:17:34):
they shouldn't get on rightaway so quickly because they
want to form a gap so then theycan.
When the rider first riderpulls off after a lap, they're
creating that slipstream, sothey cross the line close to
like where that rider pulls offand Then it's like you more than
two like being another ridercome through and then it's like
that affects me because if she'son it and then and then gets

(01:17:57):
off of it.
So in training I'm kind ofcommunicating that with my
teammates too.
I'm feeling this like so a lotof it.
We've created more of likerace-state scenarios to any
training environment.
So to bring that intensity andalso this competitive element.
Our coach says we don't wantcompativness but we want
competitiveness and so likethat's a great element to like

(01:18:20):
training is.
I'm definitely feeling goodpressure for my teammates to
like Want to have a great timethat day or, you know, like be
competitive in that trainingenvironment.
So yeah, like years early on Iwas studying like tactical
positions and like if you're uptrack To gain a height advantage
, there's like places on thetrack that you want to be in

(01:18:42):
certain parts of the race and Ifeel like I've nailed that
pretty well.
But now it's just sometimes thewho am I racing and how does
that change?
Like, how does those technicalelements change?
Depends on the racing, notevery rider.
I'm racing like tennis player.
That person might have astronger backhand than a
forehand.
So it's like every person Irace against, how's the strength

(01:19:03):
and weakness and Knowing that,like I try to play to my
strength or race to my strength,but that's taking years to
develop and years of experiencetoo.
And so, yeah, now it's justbringing more intensity in that
daily training environment tohelp Lower the nerves when I get
to race day Mm-hmm, yeah andanything specific that helps you

(01:19:24):
with that.

Klara (01:19:25):
Mendy, do you have any mind practices or meditation or
specific music you listen to?

Mandy (01:19:30):
Um, yeah, I do listen to Music as I warm up and it's
varied over the years.
It used to be like a little bitof a speed rap and that used to
be like techno pop music andnow it's country music.
What is happening?

(01:19:51):
It's more of like a relaxedwarm-up, I guess.
But, um, yeah, as far as likeroutine, I love yin yoga.
It's restorative yoga.
At home I do that with my mom,every Wednesday.
But here I don't really get todo that.
But yeah, just to kind ofdisconnect and move my body in a
different way, like Pilates oryin yoga, has been really

(01:20:13):
beneficial.
And when, if I take time off,I'm taking time off and I'm not
thinking about my bike and I'mokay.

Klara (01:20:20):
I love it.

Mandy (01:20:21):
I'm off.
I think that's the hard partsome athletes have is to be able
to disconnect.

Klara (01:20:25):
Mm-hmm.
So I think it's something atleast struggle with and we
continue to struggle, even inlife.
I think it work professionswhatever you know drop, you end
up going after.
I think it's super important toknow when to focus and when to
disconnect and step away.
So I think that skill thatyou're working on practicing is
Excellent and it will continueserve you well through anything

(01:20:48):
else you decide to choose after.
Well many.
Thank you so much for your time.
I have Tons of questions Icould still be asking you, but
for the sake of time and you getyou ready for your next day and
training and obviously thecompetition you have upcoming,
we should probably stop there,but I so appreciate you sharing

(01:21:09):
your own journey and acceptingthe invitation.
Anything else you want to sharefor the listeners as you kind
of race through this Olympics,we wish you good luck.
Anything you want to inspirethem in 2024 that you think
people should be doing more ofour less so just continue to do
what you enjoy and it's okay tosay no sometimes.

Mandy (01:21:31):
Right, I've.
Sometimes I've disconnectedmyself from social media, even
though I enjoy it.
I do.
But I find myself justmindlessly scrolling sometimes
and I've actually deleted, likeInstagram or some of the social
media apps and like a few dayslater go by and I'll redownload
it and just kind of check in andsay what's new.
But it's okay to likedisconnect sometimes and don't

(01:21:52):
feel pressure to to kind of haveto be involved.
And I Think that's what's kindof helped me is that I've
deleted Instagram occasionally,here or there.
I do it when I get close toracing too.
I don't like to see it becauseyou know, like a lot of my
competitors are like friends butI just don't really want to See

(01:22:13):
what they're up to and I don'twant it to like affect my
mindset or my like anything soto be able to disconnect and be
okay with it and Is is isdefinitely hard to do because
you don't want to feel likeyou're having FOMO but um, but
it's okay to do sometimes andjust be more present.

(01:22:35):
That's what I've been doingmore in the last like year and a
half.
So love it and subscribe to mynewsletter because I share some
tips and Training and lifeinsights and stuff.
Um, yeah, yes, keep everybodyin the loop.

Klara (01:22:50):
I actually did subscribe, so I look forward to the next
newsletters, as you shared, andI hope many people will as well.
I'll add the link to theepisode notes.
But anyone else?
How can people find you orfollow you?
Obviously we kind of heardabout your Instagram and I'm
sure you have a busy schedule,so not for everybody to buy you,
but is there a best way forfans to reach out or follow your

(01:23:12):
journey?
Yeah, to.

Mandy (01:23:14):
Just, you know, connect with me on Instagram and
Facebook.
I know I said I sometimesdisconnect from those, so if I
don't get to your message Withina couple days, you'll hear from
me though.
But yeah, just to stay up todate with my newsletters
probably the best I I probablywill Feel you in and a little
bit more detail.
I'm open to messages andhearing you know people's

(01:23:35):
stories too, and their diabetesjourney.
It's always great to connectwith others and I'm glad that we
connected because of LinkedIn.
I've been using that a bit morebecause of school and it's
really helpful and I actuallyenjoy scrolling through it.

Klara (01:23:50):
Excellent.
Well, thank you so much again,mending, for even being open to
this conversation.
It's been a pleasure and I'mkeeping all of my finger crossed
and good luck and Just beyourself, and I know you will
degrade with all the hard workYou're putting in and your
routine that you've beenperfecting.

Mandy (01:24:07):
Thank you so much.
This was a great conversationand it's awesome to have that
conversation with a formerathlete.
I still think you're still anathlete, because once an athlete
, always an athlete.

Klara (01:24:16):
I'm trying to keep the athlete title myself.
I've tried to give it up backin the past, but I think of
myself now more as a Businessathlete because I think what you
learn through your sportwhatever sport we choose for
ourselves those skills arealways transferable and will
kind of help you grow in yournext chapter.
So one of the reasons why Istarted this podcast to meet

(01:24:37):
more people like you and getinspired from their own journey.
I love that.
If you enjoyed this episode, Iwant to ask you to please do two
things that would help megreatly.
One, please consider leaving areview on Apple Podcasts,
spotify or any other podcastingplatform that you use to listen
to this episode.
Two, please share this podcastwith a friend who you believe

(01:25:00):
might enjoy it as well.
It is a great way to remindsomeone you care about them by
sharing a conversation theymight be interested in.
Thank you for listening.

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Episode Transcript

Host

Klara Jagosova

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