November 30, 2025 • 26 mins
If you like sports, history, and the art of skeptical listening, this one’s for you. Hit play, then tell us your top four team hierarchy, your most convincing theory, and how you separate truth from noise. And don’t miss part two—subscribe, share with a friend, and leave a quick review so others can find the show.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
SPEAKER_03 (02:06):
Let's get started, guys.
SPEAKER_01 (02:07):
Let's get started.
Here we go.
SPEAKER_03 (02:10):
Here we go.
All right.
We're back.
And uh we're here with Luke andChuck.
Yep.
In Luke's garage.
SPEAKER_01 (02:19):
Hanging out.
We're back in the back in thesaddle, baby.
SPEAKER_02 (02:22):
Back in the saddle.
SPEAKER_01 (02:24):
It's good.
You know, I'd like to say that,hey, I missed you guys, but you
know what?
I see you every day, so I don'tmiss you, but I miss this.
SPEAKER_02 (02:32):
This is so being back in your garage is is the
thing.
Like that's that's the that'sthe fun of.
We just spent last what hour orso just kind of hanging out and
catching up and talking aboutstuff that we don't get to talk
about at uh you know our job.
SPEAKER_01 (02:47):
So and it's and it's and it's good.
We're we're sitting here in thegarage and and I've kind of done
some remodeling, but Chuck'swearing his Ohio State shirt in
the middle of the Michiganstuff.
That's out of the show.
SPEAKER_02 (02:57):
Number one, so we made a wager back in the
summertime.
What what do you remember whatthat wager was?
It was was it you had to wear anOhio State sweatshirt?
SPEAKER_01 (03:07):
Yes, we were gonna wear each other's thing for the
next day of school day orwhatever.
So I'm looking forward to seeingyou in uh oh, in some scarlet?
Yeah, scarlet and gray.
SPEAKER_03 (03:18):
Uh you might be wearing is it maze and blue or
what is it?
Maze and blue maze and blue.
SPEAKER_02 (03:23):
I think this is the year.
I am I'm I'm like four years.
SPEAKER_01 (03:28):
Four years in a row now.
SPEAKER_02 (03:29):
Only four years in a row.
I thought it was three years ina row.
Four.
Four years in a row.
SPEAKER_01 (03:33):
Don't be playing the asterisk on stuff.
Don't be doing that.
You know, sound like littlebrother over there for a minute.
Don't be doing that.
They're pretty tough.
SPEAKER_03 (03:45):
Buckeyes?
No, the Wolverines.
Buckeyes are pretty tough.
SPEAKER_01 (03:51):
Everybody's tough.
SPEAKER_02 (03:52):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (03:52):
You know, for the most part.
SPEAKER_02 (03:54):
Yep.
SPEAKER_01 (03:55):
But what have you been up to?
What have you been doing?
What have you been what have youbeen what have you been doing
all this time off?
So we haven't talked since June.
What's going on?
SPEAKER_03 (04:03):
No, it's been it's July.
We did talk in July.
SPEAKER_02 (04:07):
I thought I thought we uh No, it was in July.
SPEAKER_03 (04:10):
Was it?
SPEAKER_00 (04:10):
That's fine.
SPEAKER_03 (04:11):
All right.
Yeah.
And then we talked about eatingin July.
Remember that?
We had football season.
Yeah, I know.
That was a big one.
SPEAKER_02 (04:20):
That was the big thing.
Football season and you know,kind of ramped up in August and
then September, October,obviously.
And that just takes so muchtime.
I was talking to Jen, my wife,and I get twenty five hours
minimum a week back withfootball season being over.
SPEAKER_01 (04:41):
Oh yeah.
100%.
SPEAKER_02 (04:43):
Sometimes it's 30 plus, but it's at least 25 hours
a week that I get it.
SPEAKER_01 (04:48):
As the AD, I get it right here in November.
Two weeks goes back.
SPEAKER_03 (04:52):
Is it two weeks or one?
SPEAKER_01 (04:54):
Yeah.
It's like there's not a wholelot, you know, somewhere in
there, but and and you got allthe plays and all that stuff.
All the stuff going on.
But you know what?
SPEAKER_02 (05:02):
It's concerts, plays, and all that.
With all those hours that we'reworking, it's just there's just
not a left lot of time to kindof do this kind of stuff.
You know, because once you dothe the recording of this
podcast, then you've probablygot you know a couple hours of
editing.
I wouldn't know that.
SPEAKER_01 (05:21):
When we do that, you know, when we do it, our
one-hour recording session turnsinto you know, you know, a
couple, two, three hours, youknow, we just look back, have a
few drinks, and yep.
SPEAKER_03 (05:30):
I wouldn't know about the editing because our
our podcast is edited andproduced by Chuck Kaiser.
None other, none other.
SPEAKER_01 (05:39):
He's other than the OG.
SPEAKER_02 (05:41):
Yeah, what about you guys?
What's been going on in yourworld?
SPEAKER_01 (05:45):
I'm kind of in the same world you are.
Yeah, for sure.
There and doing stuff, butyou've got, you know, it's the
fall is always busy.
We've got a lot of stuffhappening, a lot of stuff going
on.
It's the start of the new schoolyear, so you got all those
things happening, you know, andas administration, you just kind
of go through things and figurethings out and do it.
But lots of driving because uhI'm thankful for extra inning
(06:10):
playoff baseball.
And if you ever would havethought to hear me say that,
that's what got me home fromBoone that night.
Oh, it was the 15-inning Detroitgame, and I listened to it the
entire time.
Yeah, and it was absolutelyamazing to listen to baseball on
the radio like the old days.
SPEAKER_02 (06:27):
Man, I haven't listened to a baseball game on
the radio since the CincinnatiReds beat the Oakland Athletics
in 1990.
SPEAKER_01 (06:34):
Yeah.
It was definitely a long timebecause I because I pulled out
of the thing.
I'm like, I can't just listen toYacht Rock the whole way.
Yeah, I I can't do it.
Like I could, but I didn't wantto.
Yeah.
And um, you know, got off thecaffeine, so I was like, I can't
do that.
Yeah, I gotta have something.
And I'm like, oh, it's the game.
And so I pulled it up on iHeartand went through and found it
and listened to it the wholeway.
(06:54):
Um it took me almost the wholeway.
SPEAKER_03 (06:56):
Fifteen innings, didn't it?
15 innings in at like 1230.
SPEAKER_01 (07:00):
Yeah, something like that.
Because that's about when Ipulled back into the school.
SPEAKER_02 (07:03):
So did you know, John, that Luke was off of uh
caffeine?
SPEAKER_01 (07:09):
Really?
Yeah, I did not know that.
Been about it was about sincethen, so maybe it's been really
four or five weeks, four weeks.
SPEAKER_02 (07:18):
What was the um like what was the reason for that?
SPEAKER_01 (07:21):
Uh you know, a while back it was like the uh sleep
apnea acid reflux kind of deal.
Really?
And the caffeine, I think I juststarted kind of like I never I
think I told you that beforethat I had never drank coffee.
And I started drinking coffee.
Yeah.
And then it was just like I wasgetting, you know, acid reflux
all the time.
I'm like, eh, I'm gonna back offand see.
(07:42):
So that's been it took like aweek, you know, to whatever,
clear my system or whatever.
SPEAKER_02 (07:46):
But did you have any headaches and all that kind of
stuff?
SPEAKER_01 (07:49):
First week.
Yeah, yeah.
Oh yeah.
SPEAKER_03 (07:51):
Um I don't know what I'd do without caffeine.
SPEAKER_01 (07:53):
Still get up and still get up and brew it for
Becky in the morning, you know.
Now in the in the 12 cup uhcoffee maker, now I cut it down
to six.
But it's like uh I just get it,so I get the smell in the
morning, and that's you know,smell is just water, and even
any soda, if I do, it's it'sroot beer or it's something with
no caffeine in it.
SPEAKER_02 (08:13):
So, feel better?
SPEAKER_01 (08:15):
Um it's getting now, you know, it's cleared through
my system.
It's it's okay.
It's tough some mornings, butwe'll get it.
SPEAKER_03 (08:22):
We're good.
I did not know that.
I could not I could not survivewithout my tea.
We understand that.
A lot of ice.
You even brought some today.
I did.
I did.
SPEAKER_02 (08:31):
You take a hike a couple days a couple times a
day, don't you?
SPEAKER_03 (08:34):
Well, you know, it gets my steps in and go across
the street and get a tea andmaybe a yogurt here and there.
SPEAKER_02 (08:43):
What's been going on in your world, John?
SPEAKER_03 (08:45):
Oh, in my world.
You know, uh, gosh, since lasttime, just spent a lot of time
with uh helping kids do thewhat's right, do what's best,
and trying to help them be thebest version of themselves.
Not to be cliche or anything,but no, we would want to do
(09:06):
that.
Never.
Never.
Yeah, that's that's about allI've been doing.
How's your teams doing?
SPEAKER_02 (09:12):
My teams are doing pretty good.
So my fantasy team is so well.
SPEAKER_01 (09:16):
We're not talking about that one.
No, I'm talking about this thishierarchy of your rooting for
teams, those four things.
SPEAKER_03 (09:24):
Okay, so it's you root for Nebraska?
Oh my god.
Really?
SPEAKER_02 (09:28):
Seriously.
Here is my hierarchy.
The uh the Ohio State Buckeyesobviously are numbered.
When did that start?
Started way back.
Go back way back, way back.
Whatever.
So they are number one, haven'tlost the game.
Pretty dominant.
Old Patricia, uh, what's MattPatricia's name?
He's it I'm killing people onthe defense.
(09:50):
So he's throwing some stuff athim that people have never seen
before.
At where?
SPEAKER_01 (09:54):
At the Lions.
Yeah, he did.
I remember those.
SPEAKER_02 (09:56):
They're glad to be rid of him.
Um I heard, I heard you told methat actually.
But I'm glad he's at theBuckeyes because I think I think
he's doing really good.
So that's my number one team.
My number two team, I think, uh,would be um anybody who plays
Michigan.
SPEAKER_01 (10:11):
And uh which I get that.
So right now you're good.
I understand your hierarchyright now.
SPEAKER_03 (10:17):
Yeah we're good.
Okay, this is where the restgoes ahead.
Four teams.
I don't know how you got ahierarchy there.
SPEAKER_02 (10:23):
My number three team would be Iowa.
Like I root for Iowa because Ilive in Iowa, Council Blessed,
Iowa.
I live in Iowa, so I root forIowa University.
Wait for it.
Wait for it.
Why don't you root for IowaState?
Number that's my number fiveteam.
So my number four team would beNebraska.
Oh my gosh, you got five teams?
Yes, my number five team wouldbe Nebraska because.
SPEAKER_03 (10:45):
Or number five is Nebraska or number four.
Number four.
SPEAKER_02 (10:48):
Number four.
Okay.
All right, all right.
So if if Nebraska's playing OhioState, obviously I'm rooting for
Ohio State.
If Nebraska's playing Michigan,I'm rooting for Nebraska.
SPEAKER_01 (10:58):
But if I'm but let me back this up though.
So you just said that you rootfor Iowa because you live in
Iowa.
SPEAKER_02 (11:05):
Right.
SPEAKER_01 (11:05):
But yet Nebraska comes in at number four, even
though Iowa State is number fiveand you live in Iowa.
How does that happen?
SPEAKER_02 (11:13):
Because I'm just not much into Iowa State.
I'm just not.
Like, I mean, I like MattCampbell, but I'm not like
hugely into Iowa State.
SPEAKER_01 (11:24):
I just don't think, and this is where I'm gonna, you
know, this is not sports radio,folks, but I'm gonna tell you
right now it is, is that thereis no way that you can have Iowa
and Nebraska in the samehierarchy of borders.
SPEAKER_02 (11:34):
Yeah, there is like it's a border state, though.
It doesn't matter.
SPEAKER_01 (11:39):
That's like me saying I root for Michigan and
down at number four, it's OhioState.
But that's ridiculous.
SPEAKER_02 (11:45):
I think it's completely different because the
hatred for Michigan uh towardOhio State is way different than
the hatred for Nebraska towardsthe baloney.
SPEAKER_01 (11:56):
How many people here cannot stand the whole thing?
It's on the Friday, it's BlackFriday game.
Yeah, I know, but they can'tstand each other.
And you know what?
Iowa finally has an offense, andthey're gonna so who are you
rooting for in Iowa, Nebraska?
Iowa, Nebraska.
I'm rooting for Iowa becausethat's my number three team.
Because they're three, but yeah,then you get a backlog and say,
well, Nebraska wins, they weremy number four, so I'm still
(12:18):
good.
SPEAKER_02 (12:19):
I don't know.
In that game, I'm rooting forthe boy.
So that's just the way it works.
Then the number five.
SPEAKER_01 (12:28):
This came out, folks, as a Facebook post, and I
and I almost jumped off of my uhthe back of my garage just
because I was like, I need to Ineed to injure myself and make
sure that I'm okay because Icouldn't understand.
Wait, the back of your garage islike two feet off his feet.
Yeah, exactly.
I'm not saying that's that big.
I wasn't like jumping to mydeck.
(12:48):
It wasn't like that.
It was just like I wanted tobruise myself and say, hey, you
know, come on.
Oh my god.
But anyway, yeah, we're gonnawe're excited because we're
gonna go uh um looking at acouple head a couple weeks
ahead, we're going to see uhMichigan play Northwestern.
Okay.
It's at Wrigley Field.
That would be a fun game.
(13:08):
That's why we're going becauseyou know what?
I worked at Northwestern.
I know we've said this.
So, you know, do I still rootfor them?
Not really, like except whenthey were playing Nebraska last
week.
But the idea was they're goingin Wrigley Field.
I'm not a Cubs fan either, butit's it's a state, it's a
historical stadium.
It's cool, and I've never seen afootball game at Wrigley Field,
(13:30):
which they play one every yearin Nebraska or Nebraska.
Northwestern is playing therebecause um their stadium is not
done yet.
So they have that cool stadiumright now that's like the I
think it's the soccer field orthe lacrosse field, and it's
right on Lake Michigan whiletheir stadium is being redone.
SPEAKER_02 (13:49):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (13:50):
And I was thinking about going there, but then I'm
like, oh, they're playingMichigan at Wrigley Field.
We're going.
SPEAKER_02 (13:55):
How long have they been working on Northwestern's
field?
SPEAKER_01 (13:57):
Uh this this will be the so that's gonna be ready
next fall, two years they'vebeen in the okay, yeah.
So the last game I saw RyanField.
SPEAKER_02 (14:04):
Last game I saw where Northwestern was um
playing at Wrigley Field, it wasthe weirdest sideline
experience.
SPEAKER_01 (14:12):
Well, it is because because it goes from home plate
to right field.
Yeah.
So our seats are like on thethird base side, but close to
third base, so you're kind ofclose to the sideline.
But if you're in left field,you're along with the side.
You're way along the way.
You're out there, but it's coolthough.
It's it's just a cool thing.
But the end zone is actually, Ithink, maybe a uh tick shorter
(14:34):
on each side.
Is it because there's only somuch room.
I mean, you can't stackeverything in there, yeah.
But you know, it'll be fun.
So we're going, me and the boysare going.
It'll be it'll be a good time.
When what we can is that's the15th, November 15th, yeah.
Nice.
So it'll be good.
We're we're looking forward toit.
I think it'll be fun, and Ithink that, you know, and you
know, like I said, we're notsports radio, but yeah that
(14:55):
week, that game last week,Nebraska Northwestern.
Yeah, you know, Nebraska pulledit out.
And you know, here's the thing,and I and I don't often say this
on the on our podcast, but I'vebeen relatively successful this
year betting against the spreadbecause Nebraska doesn't cover
very often.
Yeah, so that's been fun becausethere's uh our SRO at the
(15:17):
school, you know, I give them afew.
SPEAKER_02 (15:19):
He's the big Nebraska guy.
SPEAKER_01 (15:20):
But it's it's a good time, it it's fun, and and we're
looking forward to it.
And you know, the NFL has beendoing its thing, and it's always
just the fall is always a bigtime for us.
I mean, we I love the fall, it'smy favorite season.
I haven't been able to get outhunting yet because we don't
have any time.
I don't have any time to do thepodcast, but it's like you know,
we go through and do our thingand it and it's fun, it's good.
So um but we're happy to beback, we're happy to be here and
(15:44):
doing it because you know, weenjoy doing this.
It's not we love that the peoplelisten to us and do our thing,
and we've had some people like,when are you doing your next
one?
Which is cool to hear.
SPEAKER_02 (15:53):
Yeah, I've had a few people reach out to me.
You know, um Ryan Higgins, hereached out to me and said, uh,
hey, are you guys done?
Or are you just like on pause?
I'm like, we're on pause.
SPEAKER_01 (16:02):
Yeah, we're just on pause for a little bit, which is
fine, and we'll pick it up overthe winter and we'll we'll do
our stuff as we go, but it'sit's cool to get back in.
And you know, when we had firstsaid when we spoke in July, I
guess was the last timesomewhere in there, end of June,
early July, it was somewhere inthere.
Um, we had talked about our nextepisode was going to be
something a little bit differentwhere we talked about I don't
(16:26):
want to go full blown and say itwas conspiracy theories, but it
was about like true or false.
Like, is this factual or is thisfiction?
Right, you know, kind of thingsthat you that you talked about,
things that people you know do.
SPEAKER_03 (16:37):
We're all we're all curious, right?
Oh, and we're like, yeah, isthis true?
SPEAKER_02 (16:45):
We live in we live in such an age of um where
information is easily gotten.
Yeah.
And if you're easily createdone, create 100%.
But if you're scrolling TikTokor Facebook or whatever social
media you might be on, there'salways something that comes
across where you're like, isthat true?
(17:06):
You know, and I I think it's funto kind of kind of work in some
of those some of those types ofthings.
SPEAKER_03 (17:12):
So and I think we've got uh oh.
Did you hear that?
What was that noise?
SPEAKER_02 (17:18):
I heard that.
That was pop a top.
That was a pop-up.
SPEAKER_01 (17:21):
I think that I think that the big thing that we look
at is again in our day and agewhere we look at it, is like you
said, things are so easily likeyou get it instantly.
Everybody wants the instantkickback.
Yep.
And I think that when we look atit, just like you said, John,
(17:42):
it's so quickly created as well.
Yeah.
So we have to filter, it's notjust like, well, did you get
that info off of Wikipedia?
You know, like we used to say,even like four or five years
ago.
Right.
And then you say, well, that'snot really real, like they don't
know what they're talking about.
But now it's almost like everyoutlet that we have, yeah.
(18:03):
You have to do your due dil duediligence to make sure that it's
real.
SPEAKER_03 (18:06):
Yeah, Wikipedia might actually be more true than
some of the other stuff, right?
SPEAKER_02 (18:12):
I remember there was a day when Wikipedia was like
one of those things that youdon't trust.
But right, it seems like overthe last maybe 10 years that's
kind of improved, and um peopleappreciate their there you go.
That one sounds a littledifferent.
That does.
SPEAKER_01 (18:29):
But I think that I think that one of the things
like like as an example, wecould start with what's one of
the biggest you know, conspiracytheories that we think of in the
United States that's well what'sone of the biggest conspiracy
theories that you think of?
And it and it could be likelet's just start with one.
Let's just say JFK.
(18:52):
JFK, okay.
You could start with that, andyou can say, how many different
theories have you heard?
Yeah.
There's so many differentthings.
Was he a was he a patzy?
Was he this?
Was it the mob?
Was it right?
SPEAKER_03 (19:07):
Who whoever wasn't too long ago that there was a
Senate hearing or or somethingthat they talked about the JFK
files that got released, yeah,and all that.
I mean, it wasn't very long agothat that happened.
SPEAKER_01 (19:23):
And it's a it's a lot of stuff like that where I
think that when we talk aboutthese things, that if it's
historical, right?
If it's something that happened,you know, in the 60s or even
earlier, yeah, at some pointfiles get released, right?
Information gets released.
And then you almost have to bealmost more cautious because
(19:48):
just like anything else, peopleread something and they comment,
right?
Or they take it a certain way,or they dissect it a certain
way.
So you have to say, Hey, do Ibelieve the way that this guy is
turning this?
You know, much like we have tobe worried sometimes when people
turn the Bible, right?
So kind of the same thing.
Sure.
So you have to really go throughthese things and say it.
(20:11):
So I think we just kind of weretalking about it one day.
We were chatting about stuff,and so we kind of came up with a
few ideas.
We said, Yeah, we shouldprobably just do under.
Do we do we think it's true?
Do we think it's not true?
Do we think it's kind ofmalarky?
You know, what do we think?
SPEAKER_02 (20:26):
So, what's one you want to dive into?
SPEAKER_01 (20:30):
Well, you're here in my garage and you see his
picture on my wall over here.
Yep.
Right?
So I'm just gonna go scratchinghis eye.
And you actually, yeah, he'sscratching his eye with his
middle finger, and it's and it'seven here.
It's it's mine is Jimmy Hoffa,okay?
SPEAKER_02 (20:44):
And I'm just gonna realize it was his middle
finger.
SPEAKER_01 (20:46):
It's great.
Didn't you really in thatpicture, which is one of my
favorite pictures of all time,he's in front of the Congress
and he's flipping off BobbyKennedy.
That's what he's doing, whichwhich makes the picture even
better.
Okay.
SPEAKER_02 (20:58):
So here you're talking about Bobby Kennedy Sr.,
obviously.
Yes.
SPEAKER_01 (21:02):
So you're talking about Oh, yeah.
So you're talking about somebodyat the time who was one of the
most powerful individuals in thecountry, the leader of the
Teamsters, which at the time wasthe largest union in the
country.
SPEAKER_02 (21:16):
Right.
SPEAKER_01 (21:17):
And if the Teamsters went down, nobody got anything.
There was no goods, there was nonothing.
Everything they could shut thecountry down in a day if they
wanted to.
But, you know, he was in deepwith the mob.
Like that's how Vegas got built.
Let's not put things aside,right?
They dipped into the Teamstersretirement fund, they got money.
Vegas is being built up.
(21:37):
I mean, it's the mob and theywere tied together.
Did he know too much?
If you watch the movie TheIrishman, you watch you watch
through it, it's a great movie.
But once they get to about thepoint where they fly out of Ohio
to go in when Ed Sheeran goes,you know, it's kind of like uh I
don't know if that's right.
(21:58):
You know, after that it wasconjecture, and everything after
that is.
But that usually is the way themob works, is that they're not
gonna leave trails.
That's kind of their idea,right?
Okay.
So living up and growing inDetroit, growing up in Detroit,
that was a big thing.
So it was 1975.
The moccasin, for those of youthat care.
(22:19):
That's where the last place hewas seen after that, it's all
conjecture.
They're digging up people'syards.
Right.
This phone number that's here,that's people had that's a
bumper sticker.
And I have it here in the barfor those of you who can't see
it, but that's the bumpersticker that people had.
If you've got a clue, tell uswhere and call us.
And they were digging uppeople's yards.
There was a farm they dug up.
(22:41):
They're not gonna find them.
They're never gonna find them.
And now almost everybody thatwas involved in that story is
dead.
Okay, but to me, that was one ofthose things where is it fact or
fiction?
You look at it, there's great uhinfo on both sides of it.
I think they just hired somedudes in the mafia like they
(23:03):
would, and they got rid of them.
SPEAKER_02 (23:04):
And so you you think that Jimmy Hoffa, his
disappearance is a is a mafiahit.
100%.
So why would the mafia want totake him out?
SPEAKER_01 (23:15):
Because he was going to um he had come back like you
know, you you think about it, hewas he got sentenced to to jail
and he was in federal prison.
Nixon pardoned him.
He comes out with the idea thathe was never gonna be the um the
president of the Teamstersagain, but he had real strong
(23:35):
ideas about what this is andwhat this is, and the mob knew
that he knew stuff that theydidn't want.
Well, he probably didn't wantthey didn't want one out, yeah.
That's what I mean.
So they they thought he wasgonna yap, which is what they do
with everybody.
I mean, if you they think you'regonna be a rat, well, nobody, no
crime.
And there's no way.
SPEAKER_02 (23:53):
Who were the uh who were the big players in the in
the mafia back then?
SPEAKER_01 (23:58):
Well, it was in, you know, it was in the Detroit
area, which which is where ithappened.
It was Tony Giacaloni and allthese guys that were there that
that that you know everybody hadan alibi.
Like it was actually kind offunny because Tony Giacaloni is
a guy that was there that was abig mob guy in in Detroit at the
time.
And he belonged to somethingcalled the Southfield Athletic
(24:18):
Club.
And he was there sometimes, buton that day, he made sure he was
there, and there was at least 40people that said he came up and
said hi to me that day.
Like they know, they know whatthey're doing.
Like they're not, you know.
So that's just the one for methat I grew up with, and I've
always kind of been reallyenamored with.
And so I read a lot of stuff.
I I watch a lot of documentariesabout it, I listen to podcasts
(24:42):
about it.
There's a guy named Bernstein inin Detroit that does a great
podcast about it.
Uh-huh.
And they keep going with it.
Like it's still not solved.
It's it's obviously it's notsolved, right?
But it's it's great stuff.
SPEAKER_02 (24:53):
It seems like the thing with um with Hoffa always
seems to resurface because as Iyou guys know I scroll scroll
TikTok.
Yeah.
And so as I scroll TikTok,occasionally I see things about
Hoffa.
And even recently, within thelast probably 18 months, there's
well, it's because of theanniversary, because it was like
it was it was 50 years.
SPEAKER_01 (25:14):
Yeah, and so there was something that came up where
they dug up somebody's yard orsome piece of ground somewhere,
and it ended up not beinganything but so there was the
the the big story, and I'll justend it with this one for this
part is that um the big threetowers in Detroit, downtown
Detroit, on the river, it'scalled the Renaissance Center,
(25:35):
which was then owned by GeneralMotors.
But at the time it was a hotel,it was this big thing.
Like he went up in the in thethe elevators were on the
outside of the building, it wasglass, it was beautiful, it was
right in the lakefront, right?
Or on the riverfront, right, youknow, facing Windsor.
And um Tony Giacaloni, the headof the Detroit mob at the time
when he was going, they there'sand there's a witness, right?
(25:59):
I don't know how good he is,right?
But he had said that he wasgoing to interview for a job
because they were hiring at theRenaissance Center when they
were building it, and that hewent in there and he got him.
SPEAKER_02 (26:14):
He just caught a fly.
I did.
SPEAKER_01 (26:15):
Luke just caught a flyer.
He caught him, and then thething was that they they saw
they always thought one of thethings was that he's buried in
the concrete under theRenaissance Center.
So when Tony Giacaloni was goingto court, which the courthouse
was down the road, every morningwhen he'd walk by and go, Hey
Jimmy, he'd he'd wave.
Damn.
(26:36):
So that's you know, you're nevergonna find out.
Now the Renaissance Center, Ibelieve, is it at least they're
talking about tearing it down,so people are like, Oh, we need
to tear it down at sea.
But there, yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (26:46):
As you can tell, we were having a good time hanging
out in Luke's garage.
So we got a little bit carriedaway with our conversation.
We had to split this episode upinto two parts.
So be sure to check out parttwo.
Peace out.
Let's get started, guys.
SPEAKER_01 (02:07):
Let's get started.
Here we go.
SPEAKER_03 (02:10):
Here we go.
All right.
We're back.
And uh we're here with Luke andChuck.
Yep.
In Luke's garage.
SPEAKER_01 (02:19):
Hanging out.
We're back in the back in thesaddle, baby.
SPEAKER_02 (02:22):
Back in the saddle.
SPEAKER_01 (02:24):
It's good.
You know, I'd like to say that,hey, I missed you guys, but you
know what?
I see you every day, so I don'tmiss you, but I miss this.
SPEAKER_02 (02:32):
This is so being back in your garage is is the
thing.
Like that's that's the that'sthe fun of.
We just spent last what hour orso just kind of hanging out and
catching up and talking aboutstuff that we don't get to talk
about at uh you know our job.
SPEAKER_01 (02:47):
So and it's and it's and it's good.
We're we're sitting here in thegarage and and I've kind of done
some remodeling, but Chuck'swearing his Ohio State shirt in
the middle of the Michiganstuff.
That's out of the show.
SPEAKER_02 (02:57):
Number one, so we made a wager back in the
summertime.
What what do you remember whatthat wager was?
It was was it you had to wear anOhio State sweatshirt?
SPEAKER_01 (03:07):
Yes, we were gonna wear each other's thing for the
next day of school day orwhatever.
So I'm looking forward to seeingyou in uh oh, in some scarlet?
Yeah, scarlet and gray.
SPEAKER_03 (03:18):
Uh you might be wearing is it maze and blue or
what is it?
Maze and blue maze and blue.
SPEAKER_02 (03:23):
I think this is the year.
I am I'm I'm like four years.
SPEAKER_01 (03:28):
Four years in a row now.
SPEAKER_02 (03:29):
Only four years in a row.
I thought it was three years ina row.
Four.
Four years in a row.
SPEAKER_01 (03:33):
Don't be playing the asterisk on stuff.
Don't be doing that.
You know, sound like littlebrother over there for a minute.
Don't be doing that.
They're pretty tough.
SPEAKER_03 (03:45):
Buckeyes?
No, the Wolverines.
Buckeyes are pretty tough.
SPEAKER_01 (03:51):
Everybody's tough.
SPEAKER_02 (03:52):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (03:52):
You know, for the most part.
SPEAKER_02 (03:54):
Yep.
SPEAKER_01 (03:55):
But what have you been up to?
What have you been doing?
What have you been what have youbeen what have you been doing
all this time off?
So we haven't talked since June.
What's going on?
SPEAKER_03 (04:03):
No, it's been it's July.
We did talk in July.
SPEAKER_02 (04:07):
I thought I thought we uh No, it was in July.
SPEAKER_03 (04:10):
Was it?
SPEAKER_00 (04:10):
That's fine.
SPEAKER_03 (04:11):
All right.
Yeah.
And then we talked about eatingin July.
Remember that?
We had football season.
Yeah, I know.
That was a big one.
SPEAKER_02 (04:20):
That was the big thing.
Football season and you know,kind of ramped up in August and
then September, October,obviously.
And that just takes so muchtime.
I was talking to Jen, my wife,and I get twenty five hours
minimum a week back withfootball season being over.
SPEAKER_01 (04:41):
Oh yeah.
100%.
SPEAKER_02 (04:43):
Sometimes it's 30 plus, but it's at least 25 hours
a week that I get it.
SPEAKER_01 (04:48):
As the AD, I get it right here in November.
Two weeks goes back.
SPEAKER_03 (04:52):
Is it two weeks or one?
SPEAKER_01 (04:54):
Yeah.
It's like there's not a wholelot, you know, somewhere in
there, but and and you got allthe plays and all that stuff.
All the stuff going on.
But you know what?
SPEAKER_02 (05:02):
It's concerts, plays, and all that.
With all those hours that we'reworking, it's just there's just
not a left lot of time to kindof do this kind of stuff.
You know, because once you dothe the recording of this
podcast, then you've probablygot you know a couple hours of
editing.
I wouldn't know that.
SPEAKER_01 (05:21):
When we do that, you know, when we do it, our
one-hour recording session turnsinto you know, you know, a
couple, two, three hours, youknow, we just look back, have a
few drinks, and yep.
SPEAKER_03 (05:30):
I wouldn't know about the editing because our
our podcast is edited andproduced by Chuck Kaiser.
None other, none other.
SPEAKER_01 (05:39):
He's other than the OG.
SPEAKER_02 (05:41):
Yeah, what about you guys?
What's been going on in yourworld?
SPEAKER_01 (05:45):
I'm kind of in the same world you are.
Yeah, for sure.
There and doing stuff, butyou've got, you know, it's the
fall is always busy.
We've got a lot of stuffhappening, a lot of stuff going
on.
It's the start of the new schoolyear, so you got all those
things happening, you know, andas administration, you just kind
of go through things and figurethings out and do it.
But lots of driving because uhI'm thankful for extra inning
(06:10):
playoff baseball.
And if you ever would havethought to hear me say that,
that's what got me home fromBoone that night.
Oh, it was the 15-inning Detroitgame, and I listened to it the
entire time.
Yeah, and it was absolutelyamazing to listen to baseball on
the radio like the old days.
SPEAKER_02 (06:27):
Man, I haven't listened to a baseball game on
the radio since the CincinnatiReds beat the Oakland Athletics
in 1990.
SPEAKER_01 (06:34):
Yeah.
It was definitely a long timebecause I because I pulled out
of the thing.
I'm like, I can't just listen toYacht Rock the whole way.
Yeah, I I can't do it.
Like I could, but I didn't wantto.
Yeah.
And um, you know, got off thecaffeine, so I was like, I can't
do that.
Yeah, I gotta have something.
And I'm like, oh, it's the game.
And so I pulled it up on iHeartand went through and found it
and listened to it the wholeway.
(06:54):
Um it took me almost the wholeway.
SPEAKER_03 (06:56):
Fifteen innings, didn't it?
15 innings in at like 1230.
SPEAKER_01 (07:00):
Yeah, something like that.
Because that's about when Ipulled back into the school.
SPEAKER_02 (07:03):
So did you know, John, that Luke was off of uh
caffeine?
SPEAKER_01 (07:09):
Really?
Yeah, I did not know that.
Been about it was about sincethen, so maybe it's been really
four or five weeks, four weeks.
SPEAKER_02 (07:18):
What was the um like what was the reason for that?
SPEAKER_01 (07:21):
Uh you know, a while back it was like the uh sleep
apnea acid reflux kind of deal.
Really?
And the caffeine, I think I juststarted kind of like I never I
think I told you that beforethat I had never drank coffee.
And I started drinking coffee.
Yeah.
And then it was just like I wasgetting, you know, acid reflux
all the time.
I'm like, eh, I'm gonna back offand see.
(07:42):
So that's been it took like aweek, you know, to whatever,
clear my system or whatever.
SPEAKER_02 (07:46):
But did you have any headaches and all that kind of
stuff?
SPEAKER_01 (07:49):
First week.
Yeah, yeah.
Oh yeah.
SPEAKER_03 (07:51):
Um I don't know what I'd do without caffeine.
SPEAKER_01 (07:53):
Still get up and still get up and brew it for
Becky in the morning, you know.
Now in the in the 12 cup uhcoffee maker, now I cut it down
to six.
But it's like uh I just get it,so I get the smell in the
morning, and that's you know,smell is just water, and even
any soda, if I do, it's it'sroot beer or it's something with
no caffeine in it.
SPEAKER_02 (08:13):
So, feel better?
SPEAKER_01 (08:15):
Um it's getting now, you know, it's cleared through
my system.
It's it's okay.
It's tough some mornings, butwe'll get it.
SPEAKER_03 (08:22):
We're good.
I did not know that.
I could not I could not survivewithout my tea.
We understand that.
A lot of ice.
You even brought some today.
I did.
I did.
SPEAKER_02 (08:31):
You take a hike a couple days a couple times a
day, don't you?
SPEAKER_03 (08:34):
Well, you know, it gets my steps in and go across
the street and get a tea andmaybe a yogurt here and there.
SPEAKER_02 (08:43):
What's been going on in your world, John?
SPEAKER_03 (08:45):
Oh, in my world.
You know, uh, gosh, since lasttime, just spent a lot of time
with uh helping kids do thewhat's right, do what's best,
and trying to help them be thebest version of themselves.
Not to be cliche or anything,but no, we would want to do
(09:06):
that.
Never.
Never.
Yeah, that's that's about allI've been doing.
How's your teams doing?
SPEAKER_02 (09:12):
My teams are doing pretty good.
So my fantasy team is so well.
SPEAKER_01 (09:16):
We're not talking about that one.
No, I'm talking about this thishierarchy of your rooting for
teams, those four things.
SPEAKER_03 (09:24):
Okay, so it's you root for Nebraska?
Oh my god.
Really?
SPEAKER_02 (09:28):
Seriously.
Here is my hierarchy.
The uh the Ohio State Buckeyesobviously are numbered.
When did that start?
Started way back.
Go back way back, way back.
Whatever.
So they are number one, haven'tlost the game.
Pretty dominant.
Old Patricia, uh, what's MattPatricia's name?
He's it I'm killing people onthe defense.
(09:50):
So he's throwing some stuff athim that people have never seen
before.
At where?
SPEAKER_01 (09:54):
At the Lions.
Yeah, he did.
I remember those.
SPEAKER_02 (09:56):
They're glad to be rid of him.
Um I heard, I heard you told methat actually.
But I'm glad he's at theBuckeyes because I think I think
he's doing really good.
So that's my number one team.
My number two team, I think, uh,would be um anybody who plays
Michigan.
SPEAKER_01 (10:11):
And uh which I get that.
So right now you're good.
I understand your hierarchyright now.
SPEAKER_03 (10:17):
Yeah we're good.
Okay, this is where the restgoes ahead.
Four teams.
I don't know how you got ahierarchy there.
SPEAKER_02 (10:23):
My number three team would be Iowa.
Like I root for Iowa because Ilive in Iowa, Council Blessed,
Iowa.
I live in Iowa, so I root forIowa University.
Wait for it.
Wait for it.
Why don't you root for IowaState?
Number that's my number fiveteam.
So my number four team would beNebraska.
Oh my gosh, you got five teams?
Yes, my number five team wouldbe Nebraska because.
SPEAKER_03 (10:45):
Or number five is Nebraska or number four.
Number four.
SPEAKER_02 (10:48):
Number four.
Okay.
All right, all right.
So if if Nebraska's playing OhioState, obviously I'm rooting for
Ohio State.
If Nebraska's playing Michigan,I'm rooting for Nebraska.
SPEAKER_01 (10:58):
But if I'm but let me back this up though.
So you just said that you rootfor Iowa because you live in
Iowa.
SPEAKER_02 (11:05):
Right.
SPEAKER_01 (11:05):
But yet Nebraska comes in at number four, even
though Iowa State is number fiveand you live in Iowa.
How does that happen?
SPEAKER_02 (11:13):
Because I'm just not much into Iowa State.
I'm just not.
Like, I mean, I like MattCampbell, but I'm not like
hugely into Iowa State.
SPEAKER_01 (11:24):
I just don't think, and this is where I'm gonna, you
know, this is not sports radio,folks, but I'm gonna tell you
right now it is, is that thereis no way that you can have Iowa
and Nebraska in the samehierarchy of borders.
SPEAKER_02 (11:34):
Yeah, there is like it's a border state, though.
It doesn't matter.
SPEAKER_01 (11:39):
That's like me saying I root for Michigan and
down at number four, it's OhioState.
But that's ridiculous.
SPEAKER_02 (11:45):
I think it's completely different because the
hatred for Michigan uh towardOhio State is way different than
the hatred for Nebraska towardsthe baloney.
SPEAKER_01 (11:56):
How many people here cannot stand the whole thing?
It's on the Friday, it's BlackFriday game.
Yeah, I know, but they can'tstand each other.
And you know what?
Iowa finally has an offense, andthey're gonna so who are you
rooting for in Iowa, Nebraska?
Iowa, Nebraska.
I'm rooting for Iowa becausethat's my number three team.
Because they're three, but yeah,then you get a backlog and say,
well, Nebraska wins, they weremy number four, so I'm still
(12:18):
good.
SPEAKER_02 (12:19):
I don't know.
In that game, I'm rooting forthe boy.
So that's just the way it works.
Then the number five.
SPEAKER_01 (12:28):
This came out, folks, as a Facebook post, and I
and I almost jumped off of my uhthe back of my garage just
because I was like, I need to Ineed to injure myself and make
sure that I'm okay because Icouldn't understand.
Wait, the back of your garage islike two feet off his feet.
Yeah, exactly.
I'm not saying that's that big.
I wasn't like jumping to mydeck.
(12:48):
It wasn't like that.
It was just like I wanted tobruise myself and say, hey, you
know, come on.
Oh my god.
But anyway, yeah, we're gonnawe're excited because we're
gonna go uh um looking at acouple head a couple weeks
ahead, we're going to see uhMichigan play Northwestern.
Okay.
It's at Wrigley Field.
That would be a fun game.
(13:08):
That's why we're going becauseyou know what?
I worked at Northwestern.
I know we've said this.
So, you know, do I still rootfor them?
Not really, like except whenthey were playing Nebraska last
week.
But the idea was they're goingin Wrigley Field.
I'm not a Cubs fan either, butit's it's a state, it's a
historical stadium.
It's cool, and I've never seen afootball game at Wrigley Field,
(13:30):
which they play one every yearin Nebraska or Nebraska.
Northwestern is playing therebecause um their stadium is not
done yet.
So they have that cool stadiumright now that's like the I
think it's the soccer field orthe lacrosse field, and it's
right on Lake Michigan whiletheir stadium is being redone.
SPEAKER_02 (13:49):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (13:50):
And I was thinking about going there, but then I'm
like, oh, they're playingMichigan at Wrigley Field.
We're going.
SPEAKER_02 (13:55):
How long have they been working on Northwestern's
field?
SPEAKER_01 (13:57):
Uh this this will be the so that's gonna be ready
next fall, two years they'vebeen in the okay, yeah.
So the last game I saw RyanField.
SPEAKER_02 (14:04):
Last game I saw where Northwestern was um
playing at Wrigley Field, it wasthe weirdest sideline
experience.
SPEAKER_01 (14:12):
Well, it is because because it goes from home plate
to right field.
Yeah.
So our seats are like on thethird base side, but close to
third base, so you're kind ofclose to the sideline.
But if you're in left field,you're along with the side.
You're way along the way.
You're out there, but it's coolthough.
It's it's just a cool thing.
But the end zone is actually, Ithink, maybe a uh tick shorter
(14:34):
on each side.
Is it because there's only somuch room.
I mean, you can't stackeverything in there, yeah.
But you know, it'll be fun.
So we're going, me and the boysare going.
It'll be it'll be a good time.
When what we can is that's the15th, November 15th, yeah.
Nice.
So it'll be good.
We're we're looking forward toit.
I think it'll be fun, and Ithink that, you know, and you
know, like I said, we're notsports radio, but yeah that
(14:55):
week, that game last week,Nebraska Northwestern.
Yeah, you know, Nebraska pulledit out.
And you know, here's the thing,and I and I don't often say this
on the on our podcast, but I'vebeen relatively successful this
year betting against the spreadbecause Nebraska doesn't cover
very often.
Yeah, so that's been fun becausethere's uh our SRO at the
(15:17):
school, you know, I give them afew.
SPEAKER_02 (15:19):
He's the big Nebraska guy.
SPEAKER_01 (15:20):
But it's it's a good time, it it's fun, and and we're
looking forward to it.
And you know, the NFL has beendoing its thing, and it's always
just the fall is always a bigtime for us.
I mean, we I love the fall, it'smy favorite season.
I haven't been able to get outhunting yet because we don't
have any time.
I don't have any time to do thepodcast, but it's like you know,
we go through and do our thingand it and it's fun, it's good.
So um but we're happy to beback, we're happy to be here and
(15:44):
doing it because you know, weenjoy doing this.
It's not we love that the peoplelisten to us and do our thing,
and we've had some people like,when are you doing your next
one?
Which is cool to hear.
SPEAKER_02 (15:53):
Yeah, I've had a few people reach out to me.
You know, um Ryan Higgins, hereached out to me and said, uh,
hey, are you guys done?
Or are you just like on pause?
I'm like, we're on pause.
SPEAKER_01 (16:02):
Yeah, we're just on pause for a little bit, which is
fine, and we'll pick it up overthe winter and we'll we'll do
our stuff as we go, but it'sit's cool to get back in.
And you know, when we had firstsaid when we spoke in July, I
guess was the last timesomewhere in there, end of June,
early July, it was somewhere inthere.
Um, we had talked about our nextepisode was going to be
something a little bit differentwhere we talked about I don't
(16:26):
want to go full blown and say itwas conspiracy theories, but it
was about like true or false.
Like, is this factual or is thisfiction?
Right, you know, kind of thingsthat you that you talked about,
things that people you know do.
SPEAKER_03 (16:37):
We're all we're all curious, right?
Oh, and we're like, yeah, isthis true?
SPEAKER_02 (16:45):
We live in we live in such an age of um where
information is easily gotten.
Yeah.
And if you're easily createdone, create 100%.
But if you're scrolling TikTokor Facebook or whatever social
media you might be on, there'salways something that comes
across where you're like, isthat true?
(17:06):
You know, and I I think it's funto kind of kind of work in some
of those some of those types ofthings.
SPEAKER_03 (17:12):
So and I think we've got uh oh.
Did you hear that?
What was that noise?
SPEAKER_02 (17:18):
I heard that.
That was pop a top.
That was a pop-up.
SPEAKER_01 (17:21):
I think that I think that the big thing that we look
at is again in our day and agewhere we look at it, is like you
said, things are so easily likeyou get it instantly.
Everybody wants the instantkickback.
Yep.
And I think that when we look atit, just like you said, John,
(17:42):
it's so quickly created as well.
Yeah.
So we have to filter, it's notjust like, well, did you get
that info off of Wikipedia?
You know, like we used to say,even like four or five years
ago.
Right.
And then you say, well, that'snot really real, like they don't
know what they're talking about.
But now it's almost like everyoutlet that we have, yeah.
(18:03):
You have to do your due dil duediligence to make sure that it's
real.
SPEAKER_03 (18:06):
Yeah, Wikipedia might actually be more true than
some of the other stuff, right?
SPEAKER_02 (18:12):
I remember there was a day when Wikipedia was like
one of those things that youdon't trust.
But right, it seems like overthe last maybe 10 years that's
kind of improved, and um peopleappreciate their there you go.
That one sounds a littledifferent.
That does.
SPEAKER_01 (18:29):
But I think that I think that one of the things
like like as an example, wecould start with what's one of
the biggest you know, conspiracytheories that we think of in the
United States that's well what'sone of the biggest conspiracy
theories that you think of?
And it and it could be likelet's just start with one.
Let's just say JFK.
(18:52):
JFK, okay.
You could start with that, andyou can say, how many different
theories have you heard?
Yeah.
There's so many differentthings.
Was he a was he a patzy?
Was he this?
Was it the mob?
Was it right?
SPEAKER_03 (19:07):
Who whoever wasn't too long ago that there was a
Senate hearing or or somethingthat they talked about the JFK
files that got released, yeah,and all that.
I mean, it wasn't very long agothat that happened.
SPEAKER_01 (19:23):
And it's a it's a lot of stuff like that where I
think that when we talk aboutthese things, that if it's
historical, right?
If it's something that happened,you know, in the 60s or even
earlier, yeah, at some pointfiles get released, right?
Information gets released.
And then you almost have to bealmost more cautious because
(19:48):
just like anything else, peopleread something and they comment,
right?
Or they take it a certain way,or they dissect it a certain
way.
So you have to say, Hey, do Ibelieve the way that this guy is
turning this?
You know, much like we have tobe worried sometimes when people
turn the Bible, right?
So kind of the same thing.
Sure.
So you have to really go throughthese things and say it.
(20:11):
So I think we just kind of weretalking about it one day.
We were chatting about stuff,and so we kind of came up with a
few ideas.
We said, Yeah, we shouldprobably just do under.
Do we do we think it's true?
Do we think it's not true?
Do we think it's kind ofmalarky?
You know, what do we think?
SPEAKER_02 (20:26):
So, what's one you want to dive into?
SPEAKER_01 (20:30):
Well, you're here in my garage and you see his
picture on my wall over here.
Yep.
Right?
So I'm just gonna go scratchinghis eye.
And you actually, yeah, he'sscratching his eye with his
middle finger, and it's and it'seven here.
It's it's mine is Jimmy Hoffa,okay?
SPEAKER_02 (20:44):
And I'm just gonna realize it was his middle
finger.
SPEAKER_01 (20:46):
It's great.
Didn't you really in thatpicture, which is one of my
favorite pictures of all time,he's in front of the Congress
and he's flipping off BobbyKennedy.
That's what he's doing, whichwhich makes the picture even
better.
Okay.
SPEAKER_02 (20:58):
So here you're talking about Bobby Kennedy Sr.,
obviously.
Yes.
SPEAKER_01 (21:02):
So you're talking about Oh, yeah.
So you're talking about somebodyat the time who was one of the
most powerful individuals in thecountry, the leader of the
Teamsters, which at the time wasthe largest union in the
country.
SPEAKER_02 (21:16):
Right.
SPEAKER_01 (21:17):
And if the Teamsters went down, nobody got anything.
There was no goods, there was nonothing.
Everything they could shut thecountry down in a day if they
wanted to.
But, you know, he was in deepwith the mob.
Like that's how Vegas got built.
Let's not put things aside,right?
They dipped into the Teamstersretirement fund, they got money.
Vegas is being built up.
(21:37):
I mean, it's the mob and theywere tied together.
Did he know too much?
If you watch the movie TheIrishman, you watch you watch
through it, it's a great movie.
But once they get to about thepoint where they fly out of Ohio
to go in when Ed Sheeran goes,you know, it's kind of like uh I
don't know if that's right.
(21:58):
You know, after that it wasconjecture, and everything after
that is.
But that usually is the way themob works, is that they're not
gonna leave trails.
That's kind of their idea,right?
Okay.
So living up and growing inDetroit, growing up in Detroit,
that was a big thing.
So it was 1975.
The moccasin, for those of youthat care.
(22:19):
That's where the last place hewas seen after that, it's all
conjecture.
They're digging up people'syards.
Right.
This phone number that's here,that's people had that's a
bumper sticker.
And I have it here in the barfor those of you who can't see
it, but that's the bumpersticker that people had.
If you've got a clue, tell uswhere and call us.
And they were digging uppeople's yards.
There was a farm they dug up.
(22:41):
They're not gonna find them.
They're never gonna find them.
And now almost everybody thatwas involved in that story is
dead.
Okay, but to me, that was one ofthose things where is it fact or
fiction?
You look at it, there's great uhinfo on both sides of it.
I think they just hired somedudes in the mafia like they
(23:03):
would, and they got rid of them.
SPEAKER_02 (23:04):
And so you you think that Jimmy Hoffa, his
disappearance is a is a mafiahit.
100%.
So why would the mafia want totake him out?
SPEAKER_01 (23:15):
Because he was going to um he had come back like you
know, you you think about it, hewas he got sentenced to to jail
and he was in federal prison.
Nixon pardoned him.
He comes out with the idea thathe was never gonna be the um the
president of the Teamstersagain, but he had real strong
(23:35):
ideas about what this is andwhat this is, and the mob knew
that he knew stuff that theydidn't want.
Well, he probably didn't wantthey didn't want one out, yeah.
That's what I mean.
So they they thought he wasgonna yap, which is what they do
with everybody.
I mean, if you they think you'regonna be a rat, well, nobody, no
crime.
And there's no way.
SPEAKER_02 (23:53):
Who were the uh who were the big players in the in
the mafia back then?
SPEAKER_01 (23:58):
Well, it was in, you know, it was in the Detroit
area, which which is where ithappened.
It was Tony Giacaloni and allthese guys that were there that
that that you know everybody hadan alibi.
Like it was actually kind offunny because Tony Giacaloni is
a guy that was there that was abig mob guy in in Detroit at the
time.
And he belonged to somethingcalled the Southfield Athletic
(24:18):
Club.
And he was there sometimes, buton that day, he made sure he was
there, and there was at least 40people that said he came up and
said hi to me that day.
Like they know, they know whatthey're doing.
Like they're not, you know.
So that's just the one for methat I grew up with, and I've
always kind of been reallyenamored with.
And so I read a lot of stuff.
I I watch a lot of documentariesabout it, I listen to podcasts
(24:42):
about it.
There's a guy named Bernstein inin Detroit that does a great
podcast about it.
Uh-huh.
And they keep going with it.
Like it's still not solved.
It's it's obviously it's notsolved, right?
But it's it's great stuff.
SPEAKER_02 (24:53):
It seems like the thing with um with Hoffa always
seems to resurface because as Iyou guys know I scroll scroll
TikTok.
Yeah.
And so as I scroll TikTok,occasionally I see things about
Hoffa.
And even recently, within thelast probably 18 months, there's
well, it's because of theanniversary, because it was like
it was it was 50 years.
SPEAKER_01 (25:14):
Yeah, and so there was something that came up where
they dug up somebody's yard orsome piece of ground somewhere,
and it ended up not beinganything but so there was the
the the big story, and I'll justend it with this one for this
part is that um the big threetowers in Detroit, downtown
Detroit, on the river, it'scalled the Renaissance Center,
(25:35):
which was then owned by GeneralMotors.
But at the time it was a hotel,it was this big thing.
Like he went up in the in thethe elevators were on the
outside of the building, it wasglass, it was beautiful, it was
right in the lakefront, right?
Or on the riverfront, right, youknow, facing Windsor.
And um Tony Giacaloni, the headof the Detroit mob at the time
when he was going, they there'sand there's a witness, right?
(25:59):
I don't know how good he is,right?
But he had said that he wasgoing to interview for a job
because they were hiring at theRenaissance Center when they
were building it, and that hewent in there and he got him.
SPEAKER_02 (26:14):
He just caught a fly.
I did.
SPEAKER_01 (26:15):
Luke just caught a flyer.
He caught him, and then thething was that they they saw
they always thought one of thethings was that he's buried in
the concrete under theRenaissance Center.
So when Tony Giacaloni was goingto court, which the courthouse
was down the road, every morningwhen he'd walk by and go, Hey
Jimmy, he'd he'd wave.
Damn.
(26:36):
So that's you know, you're nevergonna find out.
Now the Renaissance Center, Ibelieve, is it at least they're
talking about tearing it down,so people are like, Oh, we need
to tear it down at sea.
But there, yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (26:46):
As you can tell, we were having a good time hanging
out in Luke's garage.
So we got a little bit carriedaway with our conversation.
We had to split this episode upinto two parts.
So be sure to check out parttwo.
Peace out.
Popular Podcasts
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com
Are You A Charlotte?
In 1997, actress Kristin Davis’ life was forever changed when she took on the role of Charlotte York in Sex and the City. As we watched Carrie, Samantha, Miranda and Charlotte navigate relationships in NYC, the show helped push once unacceptable conversation topics out of the shadows and altered the narrative around women and sex. We all saw ourselves in them as they searched for fulfillment in life, sex and friendships. Now, Kristin Davis wants to connect with you, the fans, and share untold stories and all the behind the scenes. Together, with Kristin and special guests, what will begin with Sex and the City will evolve into talks about themes that are still so relevant today. "Are you a Charlotte?" is much more than just rewatching this beloved show, it brings the past and the present together as we talk with heart, humor and of course some optimism.
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.