Step into the world of fashion marketing with Ernest Moore, of Moore Marketing & PR, a seasoned pro who’s worked with top PR agencies and retail giants like Macy’s and Saks. In this must-hear episode, Ernest unpacks the biggest marketing mistakes emerging designers make—and how to get real results without wasting time or money. 💸✨
With honest advice and real-world stories, Ernest challenges designers to think smart, embrace feedback, and build relationships that actually move the needle. If you’re serious about growing your brand, don’t miss this one. 🎧
💡 Key Takeaways: 🔹 Marketing vs. PR: Paid visibility vs. earned attention—know the difference.
🔹 The Gifting Trap: Why careless gifting kills budgets—and what to do instead.
🔹 Perfectionism Paralysis: Launch, learn, and improve—don’t wait for “perfect.”
🎧 Listen now! #HandbagDesigner101 #FashionMarketing #EmergingDesigners #BrandBuilding #StartupTips #PRvsMarketing
Our Guest: Ernest Moore brings insider expertise from major retailers and PR agencies, helping designers market smarter and avoid the costly traps that stall so many brands.
Host Emily Blumenthal is a handbag industry expert, author of Handbag Designer 101, and founder of The Handbag Awards. Known as the “Handbag Fairy Godmother,” Emily also teaches entrepreneurship at the Fashion Institute of Technology. She is dedicated to celebrating creativity, craftsmanship, and the art of building iconic handbag brands.
Find Handbag Designer 101 Merch, HBD101 Masterclass, one-on-one sessions, and opportunities to book Emily Blumenthal as a speaker at emilyblumenthal.com.Â
Buy Emily’s Books: “Handbag Designer 101” & “Savvy Suzanna’s Amazing Adventures in Handbags”
Youtube: / Handbagdesigner101-ihda | Instagram:/ Handbagdesigner
TikTok: / Handbagdesigner | Twitter: / Handbagdesigner
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
That's why I say you have to think more than just
what does the media want, whatdoes the traditional consumer
want?
And also, it's a lot.
It's a lot that you have totake into, of course.
But businesses, I think there'sa lot that can be done without
spending a single dime up front.
That's going to give you somuch insight.
But do you have the time?
(00:21):
That's the reality of it.
You know it's a luxury, it's aluxury to have the time.
That's the reality of it.
You know it's a luxury, it's aluxury to have the time.
Speaker 2 (00:26):
Hi and welcome to Handbag Designer 101, the
podcast with your host, emilyBlumenthal, handbag industry
expert and the handbag fairygodmother.
Each week, we uncover thestories behind the handbags we
love, from the iconic brands andtop designers to the creativity
, craftsmanship and culture thatdefine the handbag world.
Whether you're a designer,collector or simply passionate
(00:48):
about handbags, this is yourfront row seat to it all.
Welcome, ernest Moore.
Of Ernest Moore, pr or MPR.
I want to correct myself.
Speaker 1 (01:04):
Moore, so M-O-R-E, M-P-R.
Speaker 2 (01:08):
Gotcha, it's a play on your last name, m-o-o-r-e.
Correct, correct?
Ernest Moore, we'll get more ofyou.
Welcome to Handbag Designer 101, the podcast.
Thank you so much for joiningus today.
Speaker 1 (01:20):
Of course.
Thank you so much for having me.
Speaker 2 (01:22):
This is exciting and, as we were talking about, as it
seems to be the conversationthat I'm having like every week,
we met on Substack, which thesexy new podcast, sexy new
platform for nice people.
Speaker 1 (01:36):
Quite literally.
I immediately, probably met youwithin the first week of using
Substack quite literally, butbecause I'm just so engaged with
actual business content andpeople showcasing information
that is real today being used,not a hypothesis, not a theory,
so it's spectacular.
I'm so glad we've met.
Speaker 2 (01:56):
I know.
So why don't you share a littlebit about what your company is
and what you do, and then we'lljust dive right into the meat
and potatoes, as you said.
Speaker 1 (02:06):
Listen, I'm such an East Coaster I say my meat and
potatoes.
So we are marketing and publicrelations, which is interesting,
I say.
I used to work for the numberone public relations agency in
North America, so I was veryfortunate to have that
experience.
Speaker 2 (02:22):
That's a good job.
Speaker 1 (02:23):
I decided to go on my own after all of that
experience from the publicrelations agency.
But, more so, what reallyreally benefited was working and
being a part of the marketingand events team for national
retailers like Macy's and SaksFifth Avenue.
I feel like that education andalso having to be attached to
(02:47):
the actual consumers, the actualusers of the product, is what
has been able to translate somuch, so well into our marketing
and PR strategies.
Speaker 2 (02:55):
So, if you could because I teach this a lot
there's a vast differencebetween marketing and PR,
especially from a budgetperspective, from an execution
perspective.
How would you define one versusthe other in terms of strategy?
What does one mean versus theother?
Speaker 1 (03:15):
Well, I guess, for me personally, I would attribute
marketing to there's a strategyof paid opportunities that you
can seek, specificallytraditional or social media and
digital.
So traditional, in the sense ofdirect mail, advertising, such,
you know back then essentially,but it's still going on and,
(03:38):
might I say, multimillion dollarproducing still to this day
because our clients still do it.
Dollar producing still to thisday because our clients still do
it.
That's one aspect.
Marketing is just, I feel, likea more paid opportunity, to
lack of better words, to forcepeople to look at you, whereas
public relations is creatingattention, in my opinion, in
(03:58):
different, various forms,whether with media, social media
, influencers, community,community leaders even could be
considered that as well to beable to get attention and the
aspect or in the angle that youwant it, to be able to build
your business appropriately.
Speaker 2 (04:14):
So that's an interesting take and you know,
what I do with my students is Ialways say advertising is a
dirty word.
Why?
Because most brands start outwith no budget and I think
that's okay and I say that, yes,there's a customer acquisition
cost.
Yes, there's a cost if you'regoing to do promoted posts.
I think so many people whenthey do them.
(04:35):
There is no strategy behind it,although, hypothetically
speaking, for Instagram, youhave to pick your audience and
the city and the country andwhat their interests are.
That is, I guess, as granularas you can get to someone who is
no expert or has not done anystrategy.
But the reason why we always saythat advertising is a dirty
word, because you have to gointo this being clever and out
(04:58):
of the box as a thinker in orderto garner somebody's attention,
because nowadays it's almostimpossible.
People wanna try and dosomething clever to go viral.
But are you going viral foryour audience?
Is it strategic?
Is it really reaching thepeople that you need it to, to
cross over?
Because the only thing we wannaknow is what's the why and will
(05:19):
it lead to sales?
Speaker 1 (05:21):
So it's funny that you mentioned all this.
It makes me think ofimmediately, right off the bat.
I also think that, as you say,advertising is a dirty word.
Sometimes PR can be a dirtyword.
Oh yeah, I say that all thetime because the same paid
strategies that we are I say we,many consumers, many people
(05:46):
these days that are so exhaustedby social media constantly
being sold, it's the exact samething that is falling into or
has fallen into PR.
So it's very delicate when Isay marketing and PR.
For me, the world always fallsin the same umbrella.
Is the reality.
And, additionally, it doesn'tnecessarily matter about budget
(06:08):
for us, because if your productcan garner enough attention in a
earned capacity meaning unpaidand it is done strategically
with bringing other partiestogether from different
audiences or different places tobe able to seek other consumers
(06:29):
, you can really take things upa level with no budget,
essentially, as long as you putin the work as a business owner
and developing your product oryour brand appropriately.
Right Example I can buy achapstick, a glorified chapstick
from Chanel.
Why did I buy that?
I probably bought it because,without me knowing, I saw all
(06:52):
the cool kids one day with theirlittle Chanel chapstick and I
didn't even realize it.
That was called me beinginfluenced, that wasn't me being
sold, and I think that PR whatwe focus on more so than
anything, is we love toinfluence rather than sell,
because if it is done well,it'll be bought essentially.
(07:15):
So, yes, I think PR can also bedirty as well, fyi.
Speaker 2 (07:20):
You know, I had someone recently speak to my
class who was a marketer and shesaid at this point, deferring
to influencers is borderlinelazy at this point, because the
sell-through is that much morediluted than what it
historically was.
New iteration of creators hasto happen in order to employ
(07:44):
them, to try and successfullyfeature, sell, market your
product without it being, atthis point, like, okay, how much
is it really going to move theneedle?
Speaker 1 (07:55):
Right, and that at the end of the day.
So example, not just example,but a very tangible, real moment
in my career was we.
I was working at the number onePR agency and this was the
exact moment where I said we arenot focusing on results.
I was sitting there, we wereplanning this huge event for
National Margarita Day.
(08:16):
We had the national, we had atequila company that was our
client and that we put togetherfor National Margarita Day huge
exposure opportunity, fantasticopportunity, to say the least.
To the unknown, I will say thatbecause everyone thinks that
having something like that isgoing to immediately guard our
attention.
(08:36):
But how much did you have topay for it?
First, that was I don't know ifI'm allowed to say how much,
but it was in the $30,000 to$40,000 to $50,000 range,
without an event, okay.
And then you have to do anevent that builds it up.
Another person is not going tobe able to do that.
Someone without a budget isjust not going to be able to do
that whatsoever, right?
(08:56):
So that person you know for afact literally just sat there
and paid to play for the wholething and they have zero sales
now.
Speaker 2 (09:05):
Right.
Speaker 1 (09:06):
Right, zero, zero.
And we worked with them.
Granted, what I did wasfabulous, but anyhow, literally,
and I still work with them onmy own to this day, which is
spectacular.
They were at my own party.
They just met Michael Korsbecause of us.
Literally, they want to workwith us because the transparency
, the to the point, and thenalso we're able to communicate.
(09:29):
A lot of times, a lot of people,especially in our field of
marketing, public relations andmedia, are very aware of a lot
more than people will ever beaware of.
We know trends, because thatinsight, those data, that number
that you cannot fight okay,when a peak of engagement or a
peak of product sales ordifferent things like that come
(09:51):
in, we can't fight that.
Those are numbers that aretangible.
That's something that we canfollow.
I call it like a map.
Literally, a map rolls outright in front of you and it
tells you what's going to be hotin two months or three months
or six months.
So it's a little interestingand that's why I think that you
have to be so creative and justthink more than what people are
(10:13):
being provided, what we think weknow, and have to go back to
the basic roots, always have togo back to the basic roots.
Speaker 2 (10:19):
In reality, so if you were working with an
independent designer and youwere thoughtful enough to say,
ok, I'll meet you for a coffee,and I don't believe.
I believe everybody can be kindand generous with their time,
but I don't believe in charityto the point of people brain
sucking your 20 years ofexperience for free.
(10:40):
I'm just saying for the sake ofpeople who are fortunate enough
to have you here and listen toyour experience.
(11:05):
If you were to meet someone whohas a decent let's just say,
handbag brand for the sake ofconversation, it's been's a
bigger issue, because thechances of getting media
attention or anything if it'snot priced correctly, if you
haven't done your competitiveanalysis, if you don't know who
your customer is, if you don'tknow what they eat, what they
wear, what they drive, wherethey live, the kind of home they
have, if they have a car, whatthey have in their bag, how many
times they buy a bag, whattheir favorite color is, what
(11:27):
they're more prone to, all ofthose things obviously play into
all that.
Which, again, a lot of peopledon't do that homework because
doing that homework is free andthen not doing it will end up
costing you more.
But let's just say you metsomeone who knew enough to do
their due diligence.
What would be the first thingsyou would say get on.
(11:48):
This is what you can do on yourown.
You don't need me for this.
Speaker 1 (11:59):
Oh, immediately, right off the bat.
Everyone has the opportunity togift and introduce their brand
on their own.
That is the reality, even inpublic relations or marketing.
The reality is either you'repaying someone to be introduced
to your brand or you'reintroducing yourself.
Every single human being and Ijokingly say even monkeys can do
it can gift and introducethemselves or their product or
(12:21):
their brand to any person, placeor thing on this planet,
because it's just possible.
We have the availability.
You don't have to spend adollar to direct message someone
in reality.
Okay, now, as business ownersnot every business owner or
executive or their teams evenhave that time and we understand
(12:44):
that but if you have your duediligence and you have something
that you know that hasexcellent, great potential and
that you want to see how it'sengaged or seen, or if you want
to see like initial feedbacks oranything like that, anyone
could be reached out to at anypoint.
There's many people that are,unfortunately, intimidated by a
(13:05):
lot of other people.
It's such a wasted energy andit's just, it's not their fault,
it's not the other person'sfault, it is the moment in time
and the mentality that they'rein.
That's just the reality of it.
I was there and what's crazy isI was raised, born and raised
in an environment where we arenot insecure in any way, shape
(13:28):
or form.
To be very honest with you,what we wanted was what.
I'm not speaking in amaterialistic way, I'm meaning
if we had the confidence we were.
We were raised very confident,to say the least.
Many people are so intimidatedthat even just sending a three
sentence message is too much forthem, type of thing.
(13:48):
So we, you know, that's what Ithink is.
The very first step is, I think, introducing their brand or
their product in a not buy mecapacity.
I think that's where they'regoing to be getting more
(14:11):
attention, more feedback, moreengagement just from the jump,
without even spending a dollarin that capacity.
Speaker 2 (14:14):
Of course, they've already spent the dollars
because they did their duediligence and their time.
Speaker 1 (14:15):
Right, right, right.
But you know that is the veryfirst one.
On one foundation I would sayreach out, speak out and be you
and your product.
Don't just make it a product,because I think it can make a
product.
Speaker 2 (14:28):
I love that because I got to tell you the amount of
designers with whom I haveworked who don't wear their
product.
It's crazy, it's nuts, nuts.
Like you've spent a minimum of$10,000 on your product
marketing, even building,research, production,
(14:55):
manufacturing and you're stillwearing your Louis or you're
still wearing your Gucci orChanel because it's not perfect.
And I've had so many people dothat when I've met them and then
they take it out of a box andthey take it out of a dust bag.
I'm like what the hell's wrongwith you?
Why?
aren't you wearing that bag.
And they said, well, it's notperfect yet.
And I said, well, nobody knowsthat.
Who knows that?
Speaker 1 (15:14):
like no one's looking at you to begin with, so if
they also look at you, they getwith the mentality of saying you
know what, I want this to be asuccess, I need need to know the
good, the bad, the ugly, 100%.
It's not perfect, yeah, and youknow that.
First off, what have you doneto help that situation or not?
(15:36):
I know that sounds ridiculous.
Speaker 2 (15:38):
I always like to know .
Speaker 1 (15:40):
Literally.
We were on a call on aconsultation, quite literally
earlier and we always jokinglysay if your baby's ugly, I am
telling you your baby is ugly,Before the public burns your
house down and does so much morethan say a couple of mean
things, yeah, you get what I'msaying.
(16:01):
So, 100%, having an audience of20 million people around the
world say we hate your product,versus me, ernest, who quite
literally has the proof frombeing on the buying team at Saks
Fifth Avenue and with Macy'sand all this stuff.
These are numbers.
Again, you can't lie withnumbers.
It's right in front of you.
(16:22):
You can attempt to think ofwhat you want to accomplish with
what you have, but there's amap in front of you.
It's been done.
My family's major inmanufacturing as well.
I'm six generations in acompany that manufactures
corrugated boxing so literally,packaging company that
(16:42):
manufactures corrugated boxing,so literally, packaging
packaging.
Okay, so when I tell you I'm sofamiliar from when a product
goes from this little no labelnothing no idea to what one
person will bring us and saythis is a good idea and we say
this is not a good idea.
That's not a cheap box, becausethe second that someone unzips
(17:03):
that tape or undoes that tape inthat shipping package, the
eyeballs are 15 seconds and ittakes.
You've lost them immediately.
And if they have to do too muchwork, do not send an editor or
anyone that's important,including an influencer,
anything from Ikea that theyhave to put together and take
three hours, including your ownproduct.
(17:24):
You know what I mean.
So, yeah, we view things morethan just PR, more than just
getting attention.
We literally say listen,there's so much stuff that you
can do, that everyone else canalso do and everyone else
already has.
Speaker 2 (17:43):
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Yep, yep, no.
I couldn't agree more with thatin terms of doing everything
you can before you startoutsourcing.
And before you outsource, youhave to know how it works.
You need to know who theplayers are, you need to know
how to write, respond, send athank you, because if you're
(19:32):
going to outsource, you'repaying someone.
So now you're paying for theiroverhead, you're paying for
their rent, for their gumballs,their tissues, their bathroom
key.
You shouldn't be paying forthat if you don't know how to
market, sell your product, oryou don't know the weaknesses as
to where you should fix itbefore it gets to somebody to
rep you in that capacity.
Speaker 1 (19:50):
Absolutely, and then, unfortunately, because of not
doing the due diligence.
Speaker 2 (19:54):
And then it gets to you and then you're like your
baby's ugly.
Speaker 1 (19:57):
Correct, right.
You should have known it wasn'tor they bring it to someone who
doesn't tell them that theirbaby's ugly and literally,
internally, it rips theirbusiness from the inside out.
Because now this product isbeing sent to all of the public,
all of the media, all of theeditors, everyone who is of an
influence, and those safetybarriers were moved because you
(20:22):
just wanted to proceedregardless, you didn't want to
do anything else.
And now that person, that othermarketing agency, that PR agent
, that agency, whoever is justpromoting your product, taking
the overhead, you know,stripping your business,
sometimes seven to, we know ofdeals and contracts going into
(20:45):
the 125,000 every three months,type of ordeals just in PR.
And literally that stilldoesn't create sales, correct,
you know.
So that's why I say you have tothink more than just what does
the media want, what does thetraditional consumer want?
And also, it's a lot.
It's a lot that you have totake into, of course, but
(21:08):
businesses, I think there's alot that can be done without
spending a single dime up front.
That's going to give you somuch insight.
But do you have the time?
That's the reality of it.
You know it's a luxury.
It's a luxury to have the time.
Speaker 2 (21:22):
So, after you've gifted it, said back what should
be the next course of action.
Okay, I've done my homework.
I've gifted it to a coupleeditors who I think this would
fit in with their look.
I've gifted it to someone whomight be celebrity adjacent.
What would be something elsethat you would say Okay, this is
, don't come to me until you'vedone all this, because I'm going
(21:44):
to charge you to do the exactsame thing that you could do
without me, which I always sayfirst like have you done all
this?
Because don't come to me,because I'm going to charge you
for it.
So do it and come back to me.
So what is another thing thatyou could suggest?
Speaker 1 (22:01):
another thing that you could suggest.
I mean the thing flat out iswhen you give your product to
the wrong editor or influencerwhether the person's at an
agency or you are the businessowner sending a direct message
either person can send it to thewrong person.
Okay, because they just did notdo the right job and they just
think any attention is going toget attention.
(22:22):
My next process after giftingwould be to find out what's the
feedback.
I need to hear from them, whatthey're going to tell my clients
or our team.
What is wrong with the productor did they just love it?
What is wrong with the productor did they just love it?
(22:44):
Literally, I think that we havebeen so separated from actually
finding out people's insightand interest and find out what
they love and what they don'tlove.
Example we have a fragranceclient that you know.
Fragrance brands and beautybrands send gifts 24-7, all day
long, to everyone.
That's the reality of it.
Imagine sending a product to aneditor who's allergic to
(23:07):
fragrances.
Speaker 2 (23:08):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (23:09):
Okay, I have the prime example of one of our
editors in Miami from Ocean'sRide magazine Love her to death.
You know she's allergic tofragrances.
I have another editor inAtlanta from Atlanta magazine.
She's allergic to fragrances.
I have another editor inAtlanta from Atlanta Magazine.
She's allergic to fragrances.
Can you imagine if I or ifanyone just sent that product?
(23:30):
And quite literally, it happensevery single day.
It happens every single day andyou have just lost every ounce
of opportunity every single day.
And you have just lost everyounce of opportunity.
Yeah, not because you werebeing malice or malicious or so
angled.
You were just, you were sofocused on one direction that
you weren't allowing what theywant.
(23:51):
You have to listen to whatpeople want because they will
tell you, just like the datathat we have on consumers and
trends that are coming up, orhere we have that the numbers
don't lie.
When I look at monitoringsystems, from social media,
metrics and keywords and allthis jazz, it tells us what's
hot, what's not.
(24:11):
There's just no going around it.
So it's difficult when I hearit time and time again when
people gift products and spend.
I hear it time and time againwhen people gift products and
spend.
You know some products can be$300 a piece, like a handbag.
$300 a piece times $2,000 plusthe time, plus the staff, plus
(24:35):
everything else, everything else.
Your product gifting went fromfree to $30,000 in a four month
time span without you realizingit, not including the cost of
shipping stuff or anything likethat, only because it just
wasn't strategized and it wasn'tdone appropriately.
Speaker 2 (24:55):
I mean, I personally have done that, where I had a
meeting with a major editor andthis was years ago but I got a
meeting through a friend of afriend and my it was like I
thought it was just, you know, aSanta Claus in the summer of
everything I was bringing.
And I finally got this meeting.
(25:26):
And you know, you're never asimportant as you think you are
when you're in somebody else'sdomain.
Let's be honest.
You're in someone else's officetime, whatever.
And the fact that I brought acoffee has historically always
been very well received.
Like I always tell people, ifyou're going to talk to a buyer,
if you're going to a boutique,always bring a coffee because
it's their time and you shouldpay them for it in some shape or
(25:49):
form so it does not look likeit's transactional, because
you're talking to me, here's acoffee.
Well, here's the deal.
This lovely editor does notdrink coffee and apparently
everybody knew that but me.
So the fact that this gestureand a normal person would say,
hey, you know I don't drink it,whatever.
But this particular person hewas very much like I don't drink
(26:13):
coffee and the fact that Ibrought that did so much more
harm than good.
He asked an assistant to takeit, get it out of his face, and
then said, sure, you can have it.
And then she had a sip.
She was like this isn't for meand threw it out Again.
Bitchy, disgusting, but it iswhat it is, but it is what it is
.
Speaker 1 (26:33):
Should I?
Speaker 2 (26:33):
have asked do they drink coffee?
Probably, but I assumedeverybody does.
And guess what Everybody doesnot Like I should have brought a
lemonade before I brought acoffee, because who doesn't like
lemonade?
Speaker 1 (26:48):
But then maybe they're off sugar?
Who knows Diabetic?
You know, in reality, there'sjust so many different variables
.
What is the one thing that,time and time again, has always
been stated you don't know untilyou ask.
And I think that for so manypeople, they don't ask, they
(27:10):
don't want the other person'sopinion or perspective, because
they put so much work, they putso much effort, even though
there's no due diligence, but intheir heart and their minds
they think it is the hardestwork that they've ever done and
this is going to work.
That is not always the case.
The case is you have to come inwith your information, your
homework.
If you go to high school, ifyou go to college, if you go to
(27:36):
a job of any sorts in anycapacity, you have to do things
their way.
Speaker 2 (27:43):
It's like this is preaching to the choir.
I can't even say that enough.
No, you have to do yourhomework and whenever anybody
has hired me, I have learnedover the years because I always
give my clients homework becauseit's not my job to do it you
have to come back to me withwhat you want me to sell and if
you're not clear, I'm going togive it to you for you to come
(28:05):
back and present it to me howyou think this should be sold.
So we're on the same page.
So when people have said,because I won't look at
anybody's handbag anymore justbecause because that's a free
brain suck, this is 20 years ofmy life for me to eyeball
something and say this, that,this, that, so I say very
upfront would you?
You're paying me.
We've agreed to that.
Are you paying me for me totell you what you want to hear,
(28:31):
or are you paying me for me totell you what you need to know?
Because we need to be on thesame page, because if you want
your ego stroked, I'll do it I'mreally good at it.
But if you want to understand,like cold, hard facts, scared
straight, like what, do we needto work on?
This is why you have me.
I believe that's the bestchoice.
I cannot be the one to decidethat for you and that's why you
know, after three months,there's such an attrition rate,
(28:52):
because everybody's shocked thatyou are not a miracle worker
for saying like I've just paidyou X, how come you didn't get
me Y?
And I said, well, I had tospend two and a half months
getting you ready to get you outthere.
Because you didn't listen to me.
You didn't update your website,you didn't update your product,
you didn't update yourpackaging.
This is a mess.
I can't write a press release.
(29:14):
I can't even send anyinformation out until everything
of yours is cohesive.
But this is, I mean honestly.
It's true to form that a goodclient is one that's done their
homework and is ready andunderstands the landscape to a
degree.
So when you say to them, haveyou gifted these people?
(29:35):
If not, who do you think weshould be gifting?
Speaker 1 (29:37):
Let's start from there if not, who do you think
we should be gifting?
Let's start from there.
Absolutely no.
At the end of the day, it makesthings so much easier in the
transition from going fromunknown to known.
If you have done everything inyour power prior to seeking
anything else or seeking otherpeople to execute everything in
(30:03):
your power to be able toaccomplish it and then go there,
it's going to benefit you inevery way, shape or form.
Now I also will say if you arehonest enough in yourself as a
business owner or anentrepreneur to know that you do
not have the interest inlearning all the fussy dust or
have the time or the knowledgeor anything, it's okay to not
(30:27):
know things, it's completelyfine, and that's when the
professional absolutely comes in.
It's okay to know when youdon't know, and it's okay to
know when you do know.
Again, anyone can use Instagram.
Anyone can use social media.
Any human has emailed since the90s.
The 80s the 2000s, the wholenine yards.
(30:49):
It's just, it's the reality.
Speaker 2 (30:52):
And what are you doing with it, correct?
Speaker 1 (30:55):
You know, we work with brands and have worked with
brands that have gone from zeroto 20 million, zero to 30
million, zero to $100 millionvaluations.
We are currently working withone that is potentially reaching
up to the $400 millionvaluation, which is insane, to
(31:15):
say the least.
And it was only because andit's funny that we're talking
about this at the moment, onlybecause and it's funny that
we're talking about this at themoment she knew that she did not
know.
She knew that she did not knowand so she was responsible
enough to say hey, listen, Ineed to outsource.
Because I need to outsource, Ineed that resource, I need that
knowledge, but it has to be thecorrect knowledge.
(31:38):
But it has to be the correctknowledge If it's not the proper
audience.
Example if I am speaking to aRolls Royce vehicle, okay, and
that audience?
Why would I go to New Beautymagazine about lipsticks?
Speaker 2 (31:55):
Right, not the same audience.
Speaker 1 (31:58):
It's a little tough.
It's a little.
You know about Amazon's topselling products for $20 and
under.
That is not my person.
You know within that audienceof Rolls Royce.
It's just not you know andthere's no going around it.
So either you know or you don'tknow and you have to do your
every single ounce of work, giftfrom that moment of gifting,
(32:20):
see what people's insight is,see what their interests were If
it was a blind gift and let'ssay you necessarily didn't do
all the digging that you wantedto do.
Do the digging with the personthat you're reaching out to Find
out what do you think that onequestion.
Find out what do you thinkExactly that one question.
The one question is one of theeasiest questions on this entire
(32:46):
planet.
Yeah, and then say what do youthink?
Don't tell me what I want tohear, just because I feel like
it.
To be able to have that littlesense of confidence and little
self of.
I think that's self-love morethan anything To be able to take
.
I'm very, very I well, I meanask people, I don't know, but I
(33:06):
believe I'm very good at takingcriticism.
I have always been.
I grew up a competitive sportsplayer in tennis.
I had an.
I have an identical twinbrother.
We were the exact same power,so are you shared an egg.
I have no clue about all that,but I know I was inside my
mother.
I do know that.
Yes, yes, this is one of thosemoments where I will admit I
(33:31):
don't know, and so that'samazing Having the exact same
power, strength, having theexact same everything.
It was like we immediately wereborn, getting attention without
even asking for it.
I know that sounds ridiculous.
Going to the grocery store, Iremember being probably four or
(33:52):
three, if god knows, and tv newsproducers in south florida
would come up to mom and dad allthe time and say we would love
to have your twins on our TVshow, not because we were nice,
not because we were sweet, notbecause we were cute, not
because of this or that, justbecause to fill that one little
black and white checkmark box.
(34:14):
That is not engaging enough.
That is not anything.
You know.
We have to produce so much morethan just a pretty product.
We have to produce so much morethan just a pretty product.
We have to do so much more thanjust giving people product to
expect them to make you a $100million brand.
That is not going to happen.
The way that it's going tohappen is by you utilizing
strategies either that you knowor that someone else knows.
(34:37):
That's just the reality of it.
Speaker 2 (34:40):
Ernest, every time I have someone on and I get so
obsessed and excited like weneed to continue this.
This was so good.
I love a branding chat.
I will always chat with you.
Speaker 1 (34:49):
Literally, I mean it Because at the end of the day,
again, there's no gatekeeping.
I am I'll repeat it till theday I die.
My family has beenmanufacturing corrugated boxes
for six generations.
Okay, you put your product toship to consumers, probably
through one of my family'sthings from six generations ago.
(35:13):
It's already been done.
This is nothing new.
That's why that's.
It's nothing other than thepoint of it's nothing new.
Speaker 2 (35:20):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, this has been done.
Speaker 1 (35:23):
Literally.
Louis Vuitton has been goingfor how long, mm hmm, chanel has
been going for how long.
Speaker 2 (35:30):
I mean, I can actually tell you, I can
actually tell you, and I bet youcould.
Speaker 1 (35:37):
In reality it's.
There's nothing new.
The consumer and the peoplewill tell us what they want.
Speaker 2 (35:46):
Ironically, Louis Vuitton has always been a luxe
customer.
I mean, when they started, itwas with luggage cases.
And they were able to usurp amarket from a British trunk
company because they realizedthey could do it better.
From a British trunk companybecause they realized they could
do it better.
So if you know who yourcustomer is and you stay crystal
clear at it, you know that theycan afford to do that.
(36:07):
From when the market droppedfor the first time, of coming up
with a bag that was meant forchampagne while the rest of the
people were on lines for breadCorrect, you got to know your
customer Then also, you have toknow your competitors especially
today.
You know, I want to dig intothis one.
Speaker 1 (36:25):
You know having your competitor analysis and seeing
what your market share would beor could not be.
I need you to understand, justbecause a market is that XYZ
trillion dollar cap, oh my God.
Multi-billion dollar component.
Are you really going to putyour effort to be the next
(36:47):
McDonald's?
The next McDonald's?
It's just reality.
Are you reinventing Frenchfries, my dear, I know.
Speaker 2 (36:56):
I know, that's just the reality of it.
Speaker 1 (36:58):
You know, everyone wants to.
John Cena is now a beautyinfluencer.
Did you see?
Speaker 2 (37:03):
Oh, I saw that.
I saw that Listen, I like nohair.
Speaker 1 (37:07):
I love me some John Cena, and only not because of
the media.
I met him at a pancake houseliterally an IHOP and he was the
coolest person.
Not because he's a this or that.
There's no reason.
I get the point and I get theunderstanding.
They want men and in theathletic world to be able to be
(37:28):
attached to the beauty world.
I get it.
We have been seeing thisstarting to creep up, especially
since the hype of athletesreally getting these like
fashion deals and beauty dealsand whatnot, but that's just why
does John?
Cena need a Neutrogena.
Speaker 2 (37:46):
Unless he's an ambassador.
I know, well there's that.
But since the term metrosexualcame about, on Sex and the City,
honestly it's been done.
It just has to be done in a waylike any other product, like do
it strategically?
Like when Nova took their carto Mexico to launch and didn't
think that their name wouldn'twork.
The car wouldn't sell becausein Spanish Nova means it doesn't
(38:09):
go.
You got to do your homework.
Oh my God, that's spectacular.
I know there's so much.
Thank you so much for joiningus.
How can we find you?
Follow you, Because we're goingto be back with you for sure.
Perfect.
Speaker 1 (38:20):
But the best way is, honestly, through Instagram.
My name is Ernest E-R-N-E-S-T.
Every day, because I'm just thesame person every single day
this hot mess of a box.
But I think it's a great timewhen you see me on Instagram and
you'll know for a fact I'm theexact same human being.
Speaker 2 (38:38):
Which is I love that.
Oh my God, Ernest, it's been anabsolute delight.
Thank you so much.
Thank you, Emily.
Thanks for listening.
Don't forget to rate and reviewand follow us on every single
platform at Handbag Designer.
Thanks so much.
See you next time.
That's why I say you have to think more than just
what does the media want, whatdoes the traditional consumer
want?
And also, it's a lot.
It's a lot that you have totake into, of course.
But businesses, I think there'sa lot that can be done without
spending a single dime up front.
That's going to give you somuch insight.
But do you have the time?
(00:21):
That's the reality of it.
You know it's a luxury, it's aluxury to have the time.
That's the reality of it.
You know it's a luxury, it's aluxury to have the time.
Speaker 2 (00:26):
Hi and welcome to Handbag Designer 101, the
podcast with your host, emilyBlumenthal, handbag industry
expert and the handbag fairygodmother.
Each week, we uncover thestories behind the handbags we
love, from the iconic brands andtop designers to the creativity
, craftsmanship and culture thatdefine the handbag world.
Whether you're a designer,collector or simply passionate
(00:48):
about handbags, this is yourfront row seat to it all.
Welcome, ernest Moore.
Of Ernest Moore, pr or MPR.
I want to correct myself.
Speaker 1 (01:04):
Moore, so M-O-R-E, M-P-R.
Speaker 2 (01:08):
Gotcha, it's a play on your last name, m-o-o-r-e.
Correct, correct?
Ernest Moore, we'll get more ofyou.
Welcome to Handbag Designer 101, the podcast.
Thank you so much for joiningus today.
Speaker 1 (01:20):
Of course.
Thank you so much for having me.
Speaker 2 (01:22):
This is exciting and, as we were talking about, as it
seems to be the conversationthat I'm having like every week,
we met on Substack, which thesexy new podcast, sexy new
platform for nice people.
Speaker 1 (01:36):
Quite literally.
I immediately, probably met youwithin the first week of using
Substack quite literally, butbecause I'm just so engaged with
actual business content andpeople showcasing information
that is real today being used,not a hypothesis, not a theory,
so it's spectacular.
I'm so glad we've met.
Speaker 2 (01:56):
I know.
So why don't you share a littlebit about what your company is
and what you do, and then we'lljust dive right into the meat
and potatoes, as you said.
Speaker 1 (02:06):
Listen, I'm such an East Coaster I say my meat and
potatoes.
So we are marketing and publicrelations, which is interesting,
I say.
I used to work for the numberone public relations agency in
North America, so I was veryfortunate to have that
experience.
Speaker 2 (02:22):
That's a good job.
Speaker 1 (02:23):
I decided to go on my own after all of that
experience from the publicrelations agency.
But, more so, what reallyreally benefited was working and
being a part of the marketingand events team for national
retailers like Macy's and SaksFifth Avenue.
I feel like that education andalso having to be attached to
(02:47):
the actual consumers, the actualusers of the product, is what
has been able to translate somuch, so well into our marketing
and PR strategies.
Speaker 2 (02:55):
So, if you could because I teach this a lot
there's a vast differencebetween marketing and PR,
especially from a budgetperspective, from an execution
perspective.
How would you define one versusthe other in terms of strategy?
What does one mean versus theother?
Speaker 1 (03:15):
Well, I guess, for me personally, I would attribute
marketing to there's a strategyof paid opportunities that you
can seek, specificallytraditional or social media and
digital.
So traditional, in the sense ofdirect mail, advertising, such,
you know back then essentially,but it's still going on and,
(03:38):
might I say, multimillion dollarproducing still to this day
because our clients still do it.
Dollar producing still to thisday because our clients still do
it.
That's one aspect.
Marketing is just, I feel, likea more paid opportunity, to
lack of better words, to forcepeople to look at you, whereas
public relations is creatingattention, in my opinion, in
(03:58):
different, various forms,whether with media, social media
, influencers, community,community leaders even could be
considered that as well to beable to get attention and the
aspect or in the angle that youwant it, to be able to build
your business appropriately.
Speaker 2 (04:14):
So that's an interesting take and you know,
what I do with my students is Ialways say advertising is a
dirty word.
Why?
Because most brands start outwith no budget and I think
that's okay and I say that, yes,there's a customer acquisition
cost.
Yes, there's a cost if you'regoing to do promoted posts.
I think so many people whenthey do them.
(04:35):
There is no strategy behind it,although, hypothetically
speaking, for Instagram, youhave to pick your audience and
the city and the country andwhat their interests are.
That is, I guess, as granularas you can get to someone who is
no expert or has not done anystrategy.
But the reason why we always saythat advertising is a dirty
word, because you have to gointo this being clever and out
(04:58):
of the box as a thinker in orderto garner somebody's attention,
because nowadays it's almostimpossible.
People wanna try and dosomething clever to go viral.
But are you going viral foryour audience?
Is it strategic?
Is it really reaching thepeople that you need it to, to
cross over?
Because the only thing we wannaknow is what's the why and will
(05:19):
it lead to sales?
Speaker 1 (05:21):
So it's funny that you mentioned all this.
It makes me think ofimmediately, right off the bat.
I also think that, as you say,advertising is a dirty word.
Sometimes PR can be a dirtyword.
Oh yeah, I say that all thetime because the same paid
strategies that we are I say we,many consumers, many people
(05:46):
these days that are so exhaustedby social media constantly
being sold, it's the exact samething that is falling into or
has fallen into PR.
So it's very delicate when Isay marketing and PR.
For me, the world always fallsin the same umbrella.
Is the reality.
And, additionally, it doesn'tnecessarily matter about budget
(06:08):
for us, because if your productcan garner enough attention in a
earned capacity meaning unpaidand it is done strategically
with bringing other partiestogether from different
audiences or different places tobe able to seek other consumers
(06:29):
, you can really take things upa level with no budget,
essentially, as long as you putin the work as a business owner
and developing your product oryour brand appropriately.
Right Example I can buy achapstick, a glorified chapstick
from Chanel.
Why did I buy that?
I probably bought it because,without me knowing, I saw all
(06:52):
the cool kids one day with theirlittle Chanel chapstick and I
didn't even realize it.
That was called me beinginfluenced, that wasn't me being
sold, and I think that PR whatwe focus on more so than
anything, is we love toinfluence rather than sell,
because if it is done well,it'll be bought essentially.
(07:15):
So, yes, I think PR can also bedirty as well, fyi.
Speaker 2 (07:20):
You know, I had someone recently speak to my
class who was a marketer and shesaid at this point, deferring
to influencers is borderlinelazy at this point, because the
sell-through is that much morediluted than what it
historically was.
New iteration of creators hasto happen in order to employ
(07:44):
them, to try and successfullyfeature, sell, market your
product without it being, atthis point, like, okay, how much
is it really going to move theneedle?
Speaker 1 (07:55):
Right, and that at the end of the day.
So example, not just example,but a very tangible, real moment
in my career was we.
I was working at the number onePR agency and this was the
exact moment where I said we arenot focusing on results.
I was sitting there, we wereplanning this huge event for
National Margarita Day.
(08:16):
We had the national, we had atequila company that was our
client and that we put togetherfor National Margarita Day huge
exposure opportunity, fantasticopportunity, to say the least.
To the unknown, I will say thatbecause everyone thinks that
having something like that isgoing to immediately guard our
attention.
(08:36):
But how much did you have topay for it?
First, that was I don't know ifI'm allowed to say how much,
but it was in the $30,000 to$40,000 to $50,000 range,
without an event, okay.
And then you have to do anevent that builds it up.
Another person is not going tobe able to do that.
Someone without a budget isjust not going to be able to do
that whatsoever, right?
(08:56):
So that person you know for afact literally just sat there
and paid to play for the wholething and they have zero sales
now.
Speaker 2 (09:05):
Right.
Speaker 1 (09:06):
Right, zero, zero.
And we worked with them.
Granted, what I did wasfabulous, but anyhow, literally,
and I still work with them onmy own to this day, which is
spectacular.
They were at my own party.
They just met Michael Korsbecause of us.
Literally, they want to workwith us because the transparency
, the to the point, and thenalso we're able to communicate.
(09:29):
A lot of times, a lot of people,especially in our field of
marketing, public relations andmedia, are very aware of a lot
more than people will ever beaware of.
We know trends, because thatinsight, those data, that number
that you cannot fight okay,when a peak of engagement or a
peak of product sales ordifferent things like that come
(09:51):
in, we can't fight that.
Those are numbers that aretangible.
That's something that we canfollow.
I call it like a map.
Literally, a map rolls outright in front of you and it
tells you what's going to be hotin two months or three months
or six months.
So it's a little interestingand that's why I think that you
have to be so creative and justthink more than what people are
(10:13):
being provided, what we think weknow, and have to go back to
the basic roots, always have togo back to the basic roots.
Speaker 2 (10:19):
In reality, so if you were working with an
independent designer and youwere thoughtful enough to say,
ok, I'll meet you for a coffee,and I don't believe.
I believe everybody can be kindand generous with their time,
but I don't believe in charityto the point of people brain
sucking your 20 years ofexperience for free.
(10:40):
I'm just saying for the sake ofpeople who are fortunate enough
to have you here and listen toyour experience.
(11:05):
If you were to meet someone whohas a decent let's just say,
handbag brand for the sake ofconversation, it's been's a
bigger issue, because thechances of getting media
attention or anything if it'snot priced correctly, if you
haven't done your competitiveanalysis, if you don't know who
your customer is, if you don'tknow what they eat, what they
wear, what they drive, wherethey live, the kind of home they
have, if they have a car, whatthey have in their bag, how many
times they buy a bag, whattheir favorite color is, what
(11:27):
they're more prone to, all ofthose things obviously play into
all that.
Which, again, a lot of peopledon't do that homework because
doing that homework is free andthen not doing it will end up
costing you more.
But let's just say you metsomeone who knew enough to do
their due diligence.
What would be the first thingsyou would say get on.
(11:48):
This is what you can do on yourown.
You don't need me for this.
Speaker 1 (11:59):
Oh, immediately, right off the bat.
Everyone has the opportunity togift and introduce their brand
on their own.
That is the reality, even inpublic relations or marketing.
The reality is either you'repaying someone to be introduced
to your brand or you'reintroducing yourself.
Every single human being and Ijokingly say even monkeys can do
it can gift and introducethemselves or their product or
(12:21):
their brand to any person, placeor thing on this planet,
because it's just possible.
We have the availability.
You don't have to spend adollar to direct message someone
in reality.
Okay, now, as business ownersnot every business owner or
executive or their teams evenhave that time and we understand
(12:44):
that but if you have your duediligence and you have something
that you know that hasexcellent, great potential and
that you want to see how it'sengaged or seen, or if you want
to see like initial feedbacks oranything like that, anyone
could be reached out to at anypoint.
There's many people that are,unfortunately, intimidated by a
(13:05):
lot of other people.
It's such a wasted energy andit's just, it's not their fault,
it's not the other person'sfault, it is the moment in time
and the mentality that they'rein.
That's just the reality of it.
I was there and what's crazy isI was raised, born and raised
in an environment where we arenot insecure in any way, shape
(13:28):
or form.
To be very honest with you,what we wanted was what.
I'm not speaking in amaterialistic way, I'm meaning
if we had the confidence we were.
We were raised very confident,to say the least.
Many people are so intimidatedthat even just sending a three
sentence message is too much forthem, type of thing.
(13:48):
So we, you know, that's what Ithink is.
The very first step is, I think, introducing their brand or
their product in a not buy mecapacity.
I think that's where they'regoing to be getting more
(14:11):
attention, more feedback, moreengagement just from the jump,
without even spending a dollarin that capacity.
Speaker 2 (14:14):
Of course, they've already spent the dollars
because they did their duediligence and their time.
Speaker 1 (14:15):
Right, right, right.
But you know that is the veryfirst one.
On one foundation I would sayreach out, speak out and be you
and your product.
Don't just make it a product,because I think it can make a
product.
Speaker 2 (14:28):
I love that because I got to tell you the amount of
designers with whom I haveworked who don't wear their
product.
It's crazy, it's nuts, nuts.
Like you've spent a minimum of$10,000 on your product
marketing, even building,research, production,
(14:55):
manufacturing and you're stillwearing your Louis or you're
still wearing your Gucci orChanel because it's not perfect.
And I've had so many people dothat when I've met them and then
they take it out of a box andthey take it out of a dust bag.
I'm like what the hell's wrongwith you?
Why?
aren't you wearing that bag.
And they said, well, it's notperfect yet.
And I said, well, nobody knowsthat.
Who knows that?
Speaker 1 (15:14):
like no one's looking at you to begin with, so if
they also look at you, they getwith the mentality of saying you
know what, I want this to be asuccess, I need need to know the
good, the bad, the ugly, 100%.
It's not perfect, yeah, and youknow that.
First off, what have you doneto help that situation or not?
(15:36):
I know that sounds ridiculous.
Speaker 2 (15:38):
I always like to know .
Speaker 1 (15:40):
Literally.
We were on a call on aconsultation, quite literally
earlier and we always jokinglysay if your baby's ugly, I am
telling you your baby is ugly,Before the public burns your
house down and does so much morethan say a couple of mean
things, yeah, you get what I'msaying.
(16:01):
So, 100%, having an audience of20 million people around the
world say we hate your product,versus me, ernest, who quite
literally has the proof frombeing on the buying team at Saks
Fifth Avenue and with Macy'sand all this stuff.
These are numbers.
Again, you can't lie withnumbers.
It's right in front of you.
(16:22):
You can attempt to think ofwhat you want to accomplish with
what you have, but there's amap in front of you.
It's been done.
My family's major inmanufacturing as well.
I'm six generations in acompany that manufactures
corrugated boxing so literally,packaging company that
(16:42):
manufactures corrugated boxing,so literally, packaging
packaging.
Okay, so when I tell you I'm sofamiliar from when a product
goes from this little no labelnothing no idea to what one
person will bring us and saythis is a good idea and we say
this is not a good idea.
That's not a cheap box, becausethe second that someone unzips
(17:03):
that tape or undoes that tape inthat shipping package, the
eyeballs are 15 seconds and ittakes.
You've lost them immediately.
And if they have to do too muchwork, do not send an editor or
anyone that's important,including an influencer,
anything from Ikea that theyhave to put together and take
three hours, including your ownproduct.
(17:24):
You know what I mean.
So, yeah, we view things morethan just PR, more than just
getting attention.
We literally say listen,there's so much stuff that you
can do, that everyone else canalso do and everyone else
already has.
Speaker 2 (17:43):
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Yep, yep, no.
I couldn't agree more with thatin terms of doing everything
you can before you startoutsourcing.
And before you outsource, youhave to know how it works.
You need to know who theplayers are, you need to know
how to write, respond, send athank you, because if you're
(19:32):
going to outsource, you'repaying someone.
So now you're paying for theiroverhead, you're paying for
their rent, for their gumballs,their tissues, their bathroom
key.
You shouldn't be paying forthat if you don't know how to
market, sell your product, oryou don't know the weaknesses as
to where you should fix itbefore it gets to somebody to
rep you in that capacity.
Speaker 1 (19:50):
Absolutely, and then, unfortunately, because of not
doing the due diligence.
Speaker 2 (19:54):
And then it gets to you and then you're like your
baby's ugly.
Speaker 1 (19:57):
Correct, right.
You should have known it wasn'tor they bring it to someone who
doesn't tell them that theirbaby's ugly and literally,
internally, it rips theirbusiness from the inside out.
Because now this product isbeing sent to all of the public,
all of the media, all of theeditors, everyone who is of an
influence, and those safetybarriers were moved because you
(20:22):
just wanted to proceedregardless, you didn't want to
do anything else.
And now that person, that othermarketing agency, that PR agent
, that agency, whoever is justpromoting your product, taking
the overhead, you know,stripping your business,
sometimes seven to, we know ofdeals and contracts going into
(20:45):
the 125,000 every three months,type of ordeals just in PR.
And literally that stilldoesn't create sales, correct,
you know.
So that's why I say you have tothink more than just what does
the media want, what does thetraditional consumer want?
And also, it's a lot.
It's a lot that you have totake into, of course, but
(21:08):
businesses, I think there's alot that can be done without
spending a single dime up front.
That's going to give you somuch insight.
But do you have the time?
That's the reality of it.
You know it's a luxury.
It's a luxury to have the time.
Speaker 2 (21:22):
So, after you've gifted it, said back what should
be the next course of action.
Okay, I've done my homework.
I've gifted it to a coupleeditors who I think this would
fit in with their look.
I've gifted it to someone whomight be celebrity adjacent.
What would be something elsethat you would say Okay, this is
, don't come to me until you'vedone all this, because I'm going
(21:44):
to charge you to do the exactsame thing that you could do
without me, which I always sayfirst like have you done all
this?
Because don't come to me,because I'm going to charge you
for it.
So do it and come back to me.
So what is another thing thatyou could suggest?
Speaker 1 (22:01):
another thing that you could suggest.
I mean the thing flat out iswhen you give your product to
the wrong editor or influencerwhether the person's at an
agency or you are the businessowner sending a direct message
either person can send it to thewrong person.
Okay, because they just did notdo the right job and they just
think any attention is going toget attention.
(22:22):
My next process after giftingwould be to find out what's the
feedback.
I need to hear from them, whatthey're going to tell my clients
or our team.
What is wrong with the productor did they just love it?
What is wrong with the productor did they just love it?
(22:44):
Literally, I think that we havebeen so separated from actually
finding out people's insightand interest and find out what
they love and what they don'tlove.
Example we have a fragranceclient that you know.
Fragrance brands and beautybrands send gifts 24-7, all day
long, to everyone.
That's the reality of it.
Imagine sending a product to aneditor who's allergic to
(23:07):
fragrances.
Speaker 2 (23:08):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (23:09):
Okay, I have the prime example of one of our
editors in Miami from Ocean'sRide magazine Love her to death.
You know she's allergic tofragrances.
I have another editor inAtlanta from Atlanta magazine.
She's allergic to fragrances.
I have another editor inAtlanta from Atlanta Magazine.
She's allergic to fragrances.
Can you imagine if I or ifanyone just sent that product?
(23:30):
And quite literally, it happensevery single day.
It happens every single day andyou have just lost every ounce
of opportunity every single day.
And you have just lost everyounce of opportunity.
Yeah, not because you werebeing malice or malicious or so
angled.
You were just, you were sofocused on one direction that
you weren't allowing what theywant.
(23:51):
You have to listen to whatpeople want because they will
tell you, just like the datathat we have on consumers and
trends that are coming up, orhere we have that the numbers
don't lie.
When I look at monitoringsystems, from social media,
metrics and keywords and allthis jazz, it tells us what's
hot, what's not.
(24:11):
There's just no going around it.
So it's difficult when I hearit time and time again when
people gift products and spend.
I hear it time and time againwhen people gift products and
spend.
You know some products can be$300 a piece, like a handbag.
$300 a piece times $2,000 plusthe time, plus the staff, plus
(24:35):
everything else, everything else.
Your product gifting went fromfree to $30,000 in a four month
time span without you realizingit, not including the cost of
shipping stuff or anything likethat, only because it just
wasn't strategized and it wasn'tdone appropriately.
Speaker 2 (24:55):
I mean, I personally have done that, where I had a
meeting with a major editor andthis was years ago but I got a
meeting through a friend of afriend and my it was like I
thought it was just, you know, aSanta Claus in the summer of
everything I was bringing.
And I finally got this meeting.
(25:26):
And you know, you're never asimportant as you think you are
when you're in somebody else'sdomain.
Let's be honest.
You're in someone else's officetime, whatever.
And the fact that I brought acoffee has historically always
been very well received.
Like I always tell people, ifyou're going to talk to a buyer,
if you're going to a boutique,always bring a coffee because
it's their time and you shouldpay them for it in some shape or
(25:49):
form so it does not look likeit's transactional, because
you're talking to me, here's acoffee.
Well, here's the deal.
This lovely editor does notdrink coffee and apparently
everybody knew that but me.
So the fact that this gestureand a normal person would say,
hey, you know I don't drink it,whatever.
But this particular person hewas very much like I don't drink
(26:13):
coffee and the fact that Ibrought that did so much more
harm than good.
He asked an assistant to takeit, get it out of his face, and
then said, sure, you can have it.
And then she had a sip.
She was like this isn't for meand threw it out Again.
Bitchy, disgusting, but it iswhat it is, but it is what it is
.
Speaker 1 (26:33):
Should I?
Speaker 2 (26:33):
have asked do they drink coffee?
Probably, but I assumedeverybody does.
And guess what Everybody doesnot Like I should have brought a
lemonade before I brought acoffee, because who doesn't like
lemonade?
Speaker 1 (26:48):
But then maybe they're off sugar?
Who knows Diabetic?
You know, in reality, there'sjust so many different variables
.
What is the one thing that,time and time again, has always
been stated you don't know untilyou ask.
And I think that for so manypeople, they don't ask, they
(27:10):
don't want the other person'sopinion or perspective, because
they put so much work, they putso much effort, even though
there's no due diligence, but intheir heart and their minds
they think it is the hardestwork that they've ever done and
this is going to work.
That is not always the case.
The case is you have to come inwith your information, your
homework.
If you go to high school, ifyou go to college, if you go to
(27:36):
a job of any sorts in anycapacity, you have to do things
their way.
Speaker 2 (27:43):
It's like this is preaching to the choir.
I can't even say that enough.
No, you have to do yourhomework and whenever anybody
has hired me, I have learnedover the years because I always
give my clients homework becauseit's not my job to do it you
have to come back to me withwhat you want me to sell and if
you're not clear, I'm going togive it to you for you to come
(28:05):
back and present it to me howyou think this should be sold.
So we're on the same page.
So when people have said,because I won't look at
anybody's handbag anymore justbecause because that's a free
brain suck, this is 20 years ofmy life for me to eyeball
something and say this, that,this, that, so I say very
upfront would you?
You're paying me.
We've agreed to that.
Are you paying me for me totell you what you want to hear,
(28:31):
or are you paying me for me totell you what you need to know?
Because we need to be on thesame page, because if you want
your ego stroked, I'll do it I'mreally good at it.
But if you want to understand,like cold, hard facts, scared
straight, like what, do we needto work on?
This is why you have me.
I believe that's the bestchoice.
I cannot be the one to decidethat for you and that's why you
know, after three months,there's such an attrition rate,
(28:52):
because everybody's shocked thatyou are not a miracle worker
for saying like I've just paidyou X, how come you didn't get
me Y?
And I said, well, I had tospend two and a half months
getting you ready to get you outthere.
Because you didn't listen to me.
You didn't update your website,you didn't update your product,
you didn't update yourpackaging.
This is a mess.
I can't write a press release.
(29:14):
I can't even send anyinformation out until everything
of yours is cohesive.
But this is, I mean honestly.
It's true to form that a goodclient is one that's done their
homework and is ready andunderstands the landscape to a
degree.
So when you say to them, haveyou gifted these people?
(29:35):
If not, who do you think weshould be gifting?
Speaker 1 (29:37):
Let's start from there if not, who do you think
we should be gifting?
Let's start from there.
Absolutely no.
At the end of the day, it makesthings so much easier in the
transition from going fromunknown to known.
If you have done everything inyour power prior to seeking
anything else or seeking otherpeople to execute everything in
(30:03):
your power to be able toaccomplish it and then go there,
it's going to benefit you inevery way, shape or form.
Now I also will say if you arehonest enough in yourself as a
business owner or anentrepreneur to know that you do
not have the interest inlearning all the fussy dust or
have the time or the knowledgeor anything, it's okay to not
(30:27):
know things, it's completelyfine, and that's when the
professional absolutely comes in.
It's okay to know when youdon't know, and it's okay to
know when you do know.
Again, anyone can use Instagram.
Anyone can use social media.
Any human has emailed since the90s.
The 80s the 2000s, the wholenine yards.
(30:49):
It's just, it's the reality.
Speaker 2 (30:52):
And what are you doing with it, correct?
Speaker 1 (30:55):
You know, we work with brands and have worked with
brands that have gone from zeroto 20 million, zero to 30
million, zero to $100 millionvaluations.
We are currently working withone that is potentially reaching
up to the $400 millionvaluation, which is insane, to
(31:15):
say the least.
And it was only because andit's funny that we're talking
about this at the moment, onlybecause and it's funny that
we're talking about this at themoment she knew that she did not
know.
She knew that she did not knowand so she was responsible
enough to say hey, listen, Ineed to outsource.
Because I need to outsource, Ineed that resource, I need that
knowledge, but it has to be thecorrect knowledge.
(31:38):
But it has to be the correctknowledge If it's not the proper
audience.
Example if I am speaking to aRolls Royce vehicle, okay, and
that audience?
Why would I go to New Beautymagazine about lipsticks?
Speaker 2 (31:55):
Right, not the same audience.
Speaker 1 (31:58):
It's a little tough.
It's a little.
You know about Amazon's topselling products for $20 and
under.
That is not my person.
You know within that audienceof Rolls Royce.
It's just not you know andthere's no going around it.
So either you know or you don'tknow and you have to do your
every single ounce of work, giftfrom that moment of gifting,
(32:20):
see what people's insight is,see what their interests were If
it was a blind gift and let'ssay you necessarily didn't do
all the digging that you wantedto do.
Do the digging with the personthat you're reaching out to Find
out what do you think that onequestion.
Find out what do you thinkExactly that one question.
The one question is one of theeasiest questions on this entire
(32:46):
planet.
Yeah, and then say what do youthink?
Don't tell me what I want tohear, just because I feel like
it.
To be able to have that littlesense of confidence and little
self of.
I think that's self-love morethan anything To be able to take
.
I'm very, very I well, I meanask people, I don't know, but I
(33:06):
believe I'm very good at takingcriticism.
I have always been.
I grew up a competitive sportsplayer in tennis.
I had an.
I have an identical twinbrother.
We were the exact same power,so are you shared an egg.
I have no clue about all that,but I know I was inside my
mother.
I do know that.
Yes, yes, this is one of thosemoments where I will admit I
(33:31):
don't know, and so that'samazing Having the exact same
power, strength, having theexact same everything.
It was like we immediately wereborn, getting attention without
even asking for it.
I know that sounds ridiculous.
Going to the grocery store, Iremember being probably four or
(33:52):
three, if god knows, and tv newsproducers in south florida
would come up to mom and dad allthe time and say we would love
to have your twins on our TVshow, not because we were nice,
not because we were sweet, notbecause we were cute, not
because of this or that, justbecause to fill that one little
black and white checkmark box.
(34:14):
That is not engaging enough.
That is not anything.
You know.
We have to produce so much morethan just a pretty product.
We have to produce so much morethan just a pretty product.
We have to do so much more thanjust giving people product to
expect them to make you a $100million brand.
That is not going to happen.
The way that it's going tohappen is by you utilizing
strategies either that you knowor that someone else knows.
(34:37):
That's just the reality of it.
Speaker 2 (34:40):
Ernest, every time I have someone on and I get so
obsessed and excited like weneed to continue this.
This was so good.
I love a branding chat.
I will always chat with you.
Speaker 1 (34:49):
Literally, I mean it Because at the end of the day,
again, there's no gatekeeping.
I am I'll repeat it till theday I die.
My family has beenmanufacturing corrugated boxes
for six generations.
Okay, you put your product toship to consumers, probably
through one of my family'sthings from six generations ago.
(35:13):
It's already been done.
This is nothing new.
That's why that's.
It's nothing other than thepoint of it's nothing new.
Speaker 2 (35:20):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, this has been done.
Speaker 1 (35:23):
Literally.
Louis Vuitton has been goingfor how long, mm hmm, chanel has
been going for how long.
Speaker 2 (35:30):
I mean, I can actually tell you, I can
actually tell you, and I bet youcould.
Speaker 1 (35:37):
In reality it's.
There's nothing new.
The consumer and the peoplewill tell us what they want.
Speaker 2 (35:46):
Ironically, Louis Vuitton has always been a luxe
customer.
I mean, when they started, itwas with luggage cases.
And they were able to usurp amarket from a British trunk
company because they realizedthey could do it better.
From a British trunk companybecause they realized they could
do it better.
So if you know who yourcustomer is and you stay crystal
clear at it, you know that theycan afford to do that.
(36:07):
From when the market droppedfor the first time, of coming up
with a bag that was meant forchampagne while the rest of the
people were on lines for breadCorrect, you got to know your
customer Then also, you have toknow your competitors especially
today.
You know, I want to dig intothis one.
Speaker 1 (36:25):
You know having your competitor analysis and seeing
what your market share would beor could not be.
I need you to understand, justbecause a market is that XYZ
trillion dollar cap, oh my God.
Multi-billion dollar component.
Are you really going to putyour effort to be the next
(36:47):
McDonald's?
The next McDonald's?
It's just reality.
Are you reinventing Frenchfries, my dear, I know.
Speaker 2 (36:56):
I know, that's just the reality of it.
Speaker 1 (36:58):
You know, everyone wants to.
John Cena is now a beautyinfluencer.
Did you see?
Speaker 2 (37:03):
Oh, I saw that.
I saw that Listen, I like nohair.
Speaker 1 (37:07):
I love me some John Cena, and only not because of
the media.
I met him at a pancake houseliterally an IHOP and he was the
coolest person.
Not because he's a this or that.
There's no reason.
I get the point and I get theunderstanding.
They want men and in theathletic world to be able to be
(37:28):
attached to the beauty world.
I get it.
We have been seeing thisstarting to creep up, especially
since the hype of athletesreally getting these like
fashion deals and beauty dealsand whatnot, but that's just why
does John?
Cena need a Neutrogena.
Speaker 2 (37:46):
Unless he's an ambassador.
I know, well there's that.
But since the term metrosexualcame about, on Sex and the City,
honestly it's been done.
It just has to be done in a waylike any other product, like do
it strategically?
Like when Nova took their carto Mexico to launch and didn't
think that their name wouldn'twork.
The car wouldn't sell becausein Spanish Nova means it doesn't
(38:09):
go.
You got to do your homework.
Oh my God, that's spectacular.
I know there's so much.
Thank you so much for joiningus.
How can we find you?
Follow you, Because we're goingto be back with you for sure.
Perfect.
Speaker 1 (38:20):
But the best way is, honestly, through Instagram.
My name is Ernest E-R-N-E-S-T.
Every day, because I'm just thesame person every single day
this hot mess of a box.
But I think it's a great timewhen you see me on Instagram and
you'll know for a fact I'm theexact same human being.
Speaker 2 (38:38):
Which is I love that.
Oh my God, Ernest, it's been anabsolute delight.
Thank you so much.
Thank you, Emily.
Thanks for listening.
Don't forget to rate and reviewand follow us on every single
platform at Handbag Designer.
Thanks so much.
See you next time.
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