June 22, 2025 • 43 mins
Heart of Herbs Alumni, Cindy Collins, never imagined her kitchen experiments would transform into a multi-million dollar herbal business serving over 70,000 customers worldwide. Yet that's exactly what happened with Euphoric Herbals, now operating two beautiful brick-and-mortar apothecaries and shipping to 61 countries.
As a certified herbalist, former lactation counselor, and birth doula, Cindy brought a unique perspective to product development. Her culinary background proved surprisingly valuable, enabling her to approach herbal formulations in a similar manner to recipes. "I thought about herbal formulations as recipes, and I was like, oh, I could totally make that," she explained. This approach demystifies herbalism, showing how transferable skills can lead to success in unexpected ways.
What stands out in Cindy's journey is her thoughtful approach to physical spaces. Rejecting the dark, cluttered "head shop" aesthetic common in many herb stores, she designed bright, accessible apothecaries that customers of all mobility levels could comfortably explore. This deliberate design philosophy has paid off—some customers drive four hours to visit her locations. The stores serve as "beta test labs" where she gathers invaluable feedback directly from customers, constantly refining her offerings.
Beyond selling products, Cindy has expanded into education, offering workshops on starting apothecary businesses and scaling handmade products. Her $97 workshop shares insights from opening two locations, covering everything from location scouting to permits and launch timelines. For those hesitant to begin without perfection, her advice is refreshingly practical: "Put your ugly out there and do it and know it's going to improve." This permission to start imperfectly might be the most valuable lesson for aspiring herbalists and entrepreneurs who feel stuck waiting for ideal conditions.
Ready to explore herbalism as a business or hobby? Visit Euphoric Herbals online or in-person to experience Cindy's thoughtful approach to herbal wellness firsthand.
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Episode Transcript
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(00:09):
Hi everyone, this is Demetria Clark with the Heart of Verbs
Herbal school podcast. And today we are talking to
Cindy Collins and Cindy is she'sjust doing all kinds of great
stuff. So I'm not going to try to come
up with the words to describe all that this Dynamo is doing.
I'm going to let her share with you what she's doing and what
(00:33):
her journey is. And Cindy has taken.
Oh my gosh, like she runs euphoric herbals.
And if you just even look at herpackaging, it's so beautiful.
It's so it's so inspiring just from the packaging, which says
to me that there was so much thought put into everything.
So, you know, the formulas are just going to be just as
(00:56):
wonderful. Good morning, Cindy, thank you
so much for being here. Good.
Morning. Thank you so much for having me
on here. I really appreciate it.
Oh, well, thank you. Yeah.
Well, I'll tell you about, Yep, I'll tell you just a little bit
about a little bit about myself and a little bit about my
journey. I am a certified herbalist and
(01:16):
I'm a former lactation counselorand also a former Boris doula.
And that kind of was a bit of mybeginning journey and it's
always been a bit of inspirationfor my product development.
I started my business as a hobbyout of my kitchen in 2010,
selling on Etsy and just making a bit of everything from herbal
(01:39):
products. And I made beaded jewelry and I
made baby hats. Whatever inspired me or I wanted
to create, I sold it on Etsy with not a clue where this was
going to go, you know, as a stayat home mom, 2-3 boys, you know,
And since then I've decided to focus on one thing because I had
three businesses at one time raising three children and I
just thought, what the hell am Idoing?
(02:00):
I can't do all this thing, all these things, it's just
impossible. But eventually decided on just
what my one thing was going to be, that I could have the
greatest impact doing that was the most important thing to me.
So I eventually let go of being a photographer.
I eventually let go of being a birth doula and decided to focus
on herbalism in the products that I was creating in the
marketplace and the value where they were having.
(02:22):
So since then, I've been doing this, I would say full time
since 2015, but it really started for me as a hobby in
2010. But 2015 I realized the
potential of what I was buildingand that I really needed to
focus on just that thing. But since then I've opened my
first herbal apothecary locationin 2018, the first one in
(02:42):
Delaware and then I opened another one in fall of 22 and
Maryland, Indianapolis, DC area and sell online now to ship to
every state and 61 countries which is bananas to think.
That's awesome. Oh so where can people find your
apothecaries? Like what town and everything so
(03:02):
or at the website so people can get that right at the beginning
too. Yep.
So our website iseuphoricherbals.com.
And I know it's a little bit hard to spell sometimes and hard
to say. I never imagined when I was
creating this what it was going to become, or else I might have
thought about something different.
Euphoria, a name. But I wanted people to
experience happiness and euphoria in their healing and
(03:24):
Wellness journey. So it's EUPHORIC herbals with an
s@theend.com and my apothecary brick and mortars are located in
in Milford, DE, which is centralDelaware.
And then we also have one near Annapolis.
It's technically Edgewater. So we kind of serve all of
Delaware with our Delaware apothecary location.
(03:45):
And then our Annapolis one is right between like Baltimore and
DC area. So we kind of pull from that
area. Wow, 2 great locations.
I mean they're so central there's got to be a a good
amount of foot traffic. But I've got to tell people I've
seen some pictures of your apothecary.
I have I I am eventually gonna, I'm swing by at some point.
(04:08):
And they're so beautiful. It's so inviting.
Like, what was your was that idea of euphoria?
Was that really like what you were thinking when you were
designing the space? Did you work with a designer?
Is this all just like pulled outof your head in one section
after another? Like how did you come up with
such beautiful spaces? Yeah, So it was really, I didn't
(04:30):
work with the designer. It was just all of me.
But I think I kind of gleaned from my photography and brand
branding experience as a photographer thinking about how
does this look, how does this feel?
And from traveling over the years before I opened my first
brick and mortar, I would travelto any place that sold herbs or
teas or anything holistic, and Iwould drive to neighboring
states around Delaware. And what I often found is that
(04:53):
sometimes they were too dark, they were too cluttered.
It was hard to find things or itkind of felt like a hedge.
And I was like, if someone is starting on their health and
Wellness journey, they're not going to feel comfortable
walking into something that feels like a head shop to me or
like a smoke shop. Like they're not going to feel
comfortable that. So I wanted to make sure it was
bright, it had modern and clean and the colors were warm.
(05:17):
And so I wanted to make sure we do have people that will walk in
and they'll go, Oh my gosh, it feels amazing in here.
And I think that's a combinationof a lot of things, obviously,
besides the good energy and intention that we're putting in
and the amazing team of people that I have working at these
locations. You know, I think it's the
color, I think it's the aesthetic.
I think how things are merchandised and laid out.
Of course it's the smell of all the things that smells so great
(05:40):
from, you know, soaps and essential oils and herbs and
teas, you know, So I think it's all of those things that make
for an inviting space where people can feel comfortable,
regardless if it's their their new to holistic killing or if
they've been on this journey fora while.
Oh, I cannot even agree more. Like I through the years, I've
(06:00):
probably been into a few 100 different apothecaries in the
United States and worldwide. And one of the things I noticed
about a lot of them in Europe isthat they did have that clean,
open airy feeling, which in the US you don't get.
And I didn't want to go into a head shop looking place to buy
my herbs because I kind of felt like, how long have they been
(06:20):
here? Are they moldy and musty?
Like, And when you're in a spacethat's really clean and really
inviting, it's, it's got to be like, Oh, I know exactly what I
want. I can see the quality.
There's no dust, there's no cobwebs.
I mean, like I, I'm just really applaud you for like taking that
step and making like what looks like just like incredibly
looking spaces. Yeah, thank you.
(06:42):
Thank you so much. It's definitely been a journey
from each time I got a hold of the physical space and trying to
transform it into that has been,especially with two different
spaces. I have learned so much opening 2
brick and mortar stores, you know, and they're a little bit
different, you know, like 1 is twice the size of the other to
allow for events. The other one, the first one
that I opened is half the size. It's about 1000 square feet,
(07:04):
which might seem like a lot, butreally it's not.
When you get groups of people inthere, it gets really cluttered
very fast. So I knew with opening my second
one that I needed to allow for hosting events, that there could
be more mobility and more space as people to move around in
there, Especially if they had stroller strollers or
wheelchairs or kids. That they weren't going to bump
(07:25):
into one another and then allow for me to open eventually the
the Smoothie Teen Kaboocha bar like we have in the Delaware
one. Oh, I love that.
I love that you're thinking about ways for all of your
customers to have a good experience if they've got a
stroller, if they're in a wheelchair, a Walker, there's
all different kinds of mobility things and sometimes herbal
(07:46):
spaces are not easy for them to get into.
And so I just love that because to me, I would have loved that
when my kids were little and I had like one on my back when I'm
stroller like I wouldn't have toworry about knocking everyone
off as I walked through the space.
What a cool, what a cool way to present and think about space.
So I've got to tell you, I just think everyone who's thinking
(08:09):
about opening an apothecary needs to go and visit you and
see like, OK, this is a good wayto do this.
This is, you know, and to take then to then take their
attention to their community and, and do whatever.
Or maybe one day you'll franchise.
Maybe you'll be like the first herbal apothecary franchise in
the United States or something. I've actually gone through the
(08:30):
franchise development process and I've gone through that to
franchise my apothecary right now.
What I've realized going throughthat I did that before I opened
my second brick and mortar, which was, which was fine, but I
felt like if I opened my second brick and mortar before I gone
through the franchise development process, it would
have allowed me to learn some lessons along the way, you know,
and in preparation for the franchise development.
(08:52):
So it's something that I definitely do want to do because
there's only so much of me and Ido have people since we do shit
everywhere, people are always looking for more locations that
we have. And I'm only one person.
I can only do so much and I can only do so much.
Well, you know, so it's something that I, that I plan to
do in the future when I am able to free up more of me because
(09:12):
once I'm, you know, that's a whole other business
franchising. It's I just have to be their
biggest cheerleader and their coach, and right now I'm leading
a team of people. And so right now, there's not
enough of me yet to do that for somebody else.
Yeah. No, I mean, I love it.
I just think it would be like such a cool model.
I mean, we have different kinds of supplement stores and stuff
that's just not the same market.And then a lot of people think
(09:34):
that there's a lot of intersectionality and a lot of
connection in those markets, butin a lot of ways there really
isn't. And so like, you know, it, it is
a needed, it is a needed thing in our world, thing in our
world. Look at me.
I am over here with all the goodbig, all the big words.
So what was your what was your inspiration to go into
(09:54):
herbalism? So I think for me originally, it
was during my first pregnancy in2004, 2005, you know, and I was
wanting to pay attention to whatI was putting in and on my body
as this human being that I was growing.
I thought this is really important work.
I really should think about that.
And that's kind of how it started was just I was making
(10:15):
things for myself. I have a culinary background as
a chef, so it was so easy for meto formulate.
I thought about herbal formulations as recipes and I
was like, oh, I could totally make that.
And then after my first son was born, you know, I was making dye
appointments in cranes and things of that nature.
And then I later worked in lactation and hospitals for a
couple of years on the postmortem floor.
(10:36):
And then I later became a birth ruler.
So a lot of the products that I was making were originally
inspired for me. And then it was my family and it
was my friends, and then it was my doula clients.
And I continued to grow and expand from there.
And what I love having about a brick and mortar herbal
apothecary, it's, it's almost like my own to test lab, if you
will. It's where I can have these
great experiences and interactions with customers
(10:57):
about what they're looking for, what they like, what they don't
like. I'm constantly seeking that
feedback from them all the time and how I can continually
improve, you know, not only the products that we make, because
we make about 30 different products and, but also the
products that I carry, you know,that we have at the apothecary
about what they're looking for. And then also sometimes guiding
(11:18):
them, you know, products that they may think that they want,
but also educating them that maybe you actually don't really
want that product, you might want something else.
So it was just originally for meand then it continued to grow
from there in ways that I I never anticipated.
Yeah, no, I mean, watching, watching your career develop
over the years has been so inspiring, but not just that.
(11:38):
I mean, you touched on somethingI think is really important, and
I always say this to people whenthey call, I'm like, hey, are
you a good cook? And if they're like, yeah, I'm
like, you're going to be great at formulation, you know, when
they're worried about it. And it's cool that you brought
that up because like the culinary world and the herbal
world have been separate for so long, but they're really not.
(11:59):
We've been using food and herbs and healing since the beginning
of time. And they really are organically
like part of the same world. And so I love that you brought
that up and that you shared thatthat you would have that
experience because I think it really, I think it really helps
people think about herbalism a little bit differently.
Like, oh, OK, maybe this is accessible to me.
(12:19):
I don't have to be like this master science herbal brain.
I can say I know how to, I know how to work with ingredients and
food. And I think that's really
beautiful. So thank you for sharing that.
When you first started off on Etsy, obviously, did you think
it was going to be here or were you hoping it would be here one
(12:41):
day? Or were you just kind of like,
I'm going to do this so I can fund my passions, right?
Well, I think it was when I first started on Etsy, it was
like, well, I'm creating these things.
And I had a dual account and shewas like, oh, maybe you should
sell your products on Etsy because I would go to, I mean,
I've done all kinds of events and I still do events where I
did farmers markets and I did a lot of farmers markets.
(13:03):
I did craft shows. If there's anything holistic in
my state, which there's not a lot in Delaware, it's not a very
progressive state that was hard to find, but anything I could
find where I could sell my products at, I was there and I
would even bring my baby on top.So it didn't matter.
Like I was there trying to get my products out into my
community. And I love to look back and I
keep pictures of how my productsstarted because I was printing
(13:24):
all my labels on my printer withAvery labels and I was, I was
using scrapbooking materials to cut labels.
I put my phone number on there. I upcycled baby food jars.
I did that for a long time whereI would ask friends if you have
baby foods, save your baby food jars because I would like to use
those jars for to making herbal sabs in exchange, I'll give you
an herbal SAP in between, you know, forgive me that.
(13:46):
So I would always do that with friends.
And so that way I was just trying to be sustainable, keep
costs down and, you know, and bemindful about the waste.
And so I never imagined eventually I did outgrow Etsy
because Etsy became really challenging for me as far as
what I could and could put on there, what I couldn't, couldn't
say. And that's still important.
I understand even more now the importance of that doing this
(14:08):
for so long about the language we use and the products and
descriptions, what is on the product and try not to allude to
curing, diagnosing, treating a disease of any kind.
But I realized at some point, like it's just not necessary for
me to be on Etsy. So I eventually did go off Etsy.
I went on to another marketplaceand then I eventually moved on
to big commerce and then I movedon to Shopify.
I think it was 2015. I moved on to Shopify and and
(14:32):
decided to do my own website which is just.
It's a never ending project. It's a lot of work.
You do have a really beautiful website though.
I mean, you do have, I mean likeit's really, it's not only a
beautiful website, which I thinkis important, it's really
useful. So you have resources on there
for parents and customers, whichI think a lot of places miss out
(14:56):
on that way of connecting with people on a different level.
So I do think that's really cool.
And your product reviews, I mean, I mean, I almost need to
start breastfeeding again just to give.
Yeah, no, my husband just had a he just fainted it.
He's out in the field with the animals.
He just fainted. He just heard that he's like,
(15:17):
oh, no more. But I mean, it's so great that
that you were able to really keep this and keep your vision
and keep what was important to you.
And I think that's a good lessonfor a lot of herbal businesses
is to keep what's important to you as the herbalist.
And I mean with the apothecary, do you find that you are
(15:39):
offering a lot of guidance to people when they come in?
Tremendous amount of guidance tothem because so, so.
Definitely be educated. Yeah, I think that.
So I did. Do a virtual workshop on like
starting your own apothecary business because I have a lot of
questions about that and people come to the store.
We have people that travel to usfrom neighboring states.
(16:00):
So we have some people that havedriven as far as like 4 hours
one way, which blows my mind that people are willing to make
that trip. It's incredibly humbling and so
I think it's super important. When someone is going to start
an herbal apothecary, they absolutely do need basic
education. You need to know more than your
customers. And there's some customers who
are going to come in here are going to know more than you.
(16:20):
And that's amazing because it's a great collective learning
experience and, and be open to that, not be intimidated with
that. Somebody is going to come in and
they've been an herbalist for 30years or they're, they're a
nurse and they're an herbalist or whatever type of functional
practitioner that they are. They're going to know more than
you. And that's a great opportunity
to learn from them. So I think it's fantastic.
But you have to have basic herbal knowledge because
(16:42):
somebody comes in and they're looking at this wall of herbs
behind me and it's got hundreds of herbs and they go, is this
tea? And you're like, well, yes and
no, you know, and so, and being able to educate them on how to
use the herbs, what form is best, what concentration is
best? If it's not a, a dried root, you
know, maybe it's an oil, dependson what it is.
So knowing how to guide and navigate someone in their health
(17:05):
journey, what form they should be using herbal remedies is, is
so important, you know, and, andbeing able to caution them if
they're taking any medications or there might be
contraindications or adverse reactions.
Because as we know that herbs are natural, but they are not
all safe for everybody. And make sure you're
communicating that clearly to your customer.
(17:26):
So that way they leave feeling informed, empowered in the
decisions that they're making. And so they're going to come
back again because you build that rapport and trust.
It's really important. Oh yeah, no, I can't agree more.
I think it's wonderful that people are, you know, interested
in the workshop that you, the virtual workshop that you did.
So are you going to be doing that again?
Is this something like it's going to be a regular feature
(17:47):
and people can go to your website and find out more about
it? Because I think that is really
needed. Yeah.
So in the workshop I will be doing it again and then it will
be available for anybody to watch on demand at any time
soon. So that will be happening later
this year. But it's so important.
I've had so many questions over the years when people would come
in or they go, I'd love to open a workshop, I'd love to open a
place like this one day or this is my dream when I retire.
(18:10):
I hear that often. And there's room for growth and
there's room for abundance for everybody.
And you can only serve so many people in your community.
And so I really wanted people tofeel if there's something they
wanted to do that to do it in their community, wherever that
is, whether it's in the same state that I'm in or if they're
traveling from another state. So in the Herbal Apothecary
(18:31):
business workshop, I kind of talk about the four foundational
things that I think people really need to know before they
go down this process. Having done it twice, I learned
even more the second time, you know, from talking about
location scouting, what things to ask when looking for
commercial location, choosing the best location, and then also
(18:51):
talking about insurance, permitsand licenses.
And every state has different variations and nuances in every
state. Some say that you can't use the
word apothecary because people might think you're a pharmacy or
they might think you're a dispensary.
So knowing the language that youcan and can't use in your
business name is important. And then we talk about startup
cost and talk about ongoing costs.
(19:14):
And then there's another an education.
And we talk a little bit about like education, what research
you need to do before you open your brick and mortar.
So it's really the information that I wish I had had before I
opened my brick and mortar. So that way somebody at least
feels they have some place to start and how to launch.
And I put together like a launchchecklist starting back like 12
(19:36):
to 18 months before you actuallyopen because.
Everything. I love that.
They need to know what things may be doing when, when they
need to filing for permits, whenthey offer licenses, you know,
And so that way they're. Kind of insurance to look into
like when we, we have a, a business mentorship thing,
right? And it's the same kind of thing.
It's like, you know, it's not just about getting T-shirts
(19:59):
printed. You need to make sure your
building's accessible. Are you going to have available
bathrooms? How is the lighting?
You know, like what kind of insurance?
So I love that you put that all together.
I think that's amazing. And I definitely look people, if
you're going to do something like this, you need to check
this out because and how much isthe cost of that?
(20:20):
The live workshop is $97.00. Get it?
That's it. Oh my gosh, if if someone is
interested in this and they don't invest in 97 dollars, then
I don't know what to tell you because that's an incredible
deal. And I talked about the different
apothecary business model types,because I think there's so many
types as well in the pros and cons of each of them.
(20:40):
And for something for them to think through from whether
you're just doing consulting or whether you're doing retail,
whether you're doing retail and events or whether you're doing
retail and food and beverage service, all the pros and cons
of each of those that you have to think through for in advance.
Because otherwise you'd get started on this journey.
And you're like, oh, you know what?
Actually, I don't think I want to do that or I want to change
(21:00):
my mind. You can always pivot.
We can always change your mind. But before you get too far into
it, it's good to consider the pros and cons of every business
model. Which one's best for you based
on your skill set and your experience and your education?
Oh yeah, I love that. And I think The thing is, is
that people have to be kind to themselves because usually, you
know what we always like, we find that people, people change.
(21:24):
They start off and they're like,all I want to do is be a
consulting herbalist. That's all I want to do, right?
And then like a few months laterthey're like, Oh, I don't want
to do that. I want to do this instead.
Or, and to be kind with yourselfas you go through the journey
and figure it out. You may be like, Hey, I want to
start with the tea room and all we do is is blend a blah, blah,
blah, right? And then you're like, no, I want
to have a more full, fully functioning apothecary.
(21:46):
And then other people, like, I just really want to sell tea
cups only, you know, and it's OK.
And so to be kind to yourself, did you have moments where
you're like, I should have been kinder to myself during this
process? Yes.
So I realized that after I opened my second apothecary,
probably about about a year intoit, realizing that I made things
(22:08):
way harder on myself than necessary because I'm kind of
like a go, go harder, go home type of person and I'm all in.
And I realized that I probably made it a lot more challenging
for myself than I should have. I mean, I could, I would have
opened when opening my second location, I opened in a
different state. So that's just challenging unto
itself. And then more than an hour away
from the other one. And then I have to go over a
(22:29):
bridge, right? So just logistically that made
it challenging. So I could have opened another
location in another town in the capital of Delaware closer to me
because I already had a customerbase throughout the entire
state. So that would have been kinder
to myself if I had just been like, OK, we don't need to go so
far to have an impact. I could go 30 minutes, you know,
(22:50):
it doesn't have to be preferred to have an impact.
So that was one a huge lesson for me going, oh, I probably
made things way harder for myself and way more expensive
for myself opening in another location.
But obviously it's been great character building experience
and it's allowed me to learn allof these things, which I'm like,
I got to put this in a workshop for somebody else, so that way
(23:13):
when they're thinking about opening their own brick and
mortar apothecary, things that they might want to consider.
With the connection we have in the world nowadays, there's
definitely no reason not to invest in someone else's
knowledge to help you get to thenext level, you know?
(23:33):
So something like this, I think is amazing.
I'm so glad that you offer this.There's so many things with
setting up a business. And since this is like a
specific kind of business, I mean, people are really going to
have the opportunity to get yourexperience really, really
narrowed in on something. You see me over here with my
hands, I'm going crazy. No, but I mean, like, you know,
(23:53):
they're really going to be you're you're going to help
them. You can help them pinpoint
exactly where they need to go. And I think that's something
that when people start business,they don't realize that they
need to do. They just want to be all things,
all herb all day long, all that,you know, and that's really
hard. You know, that's really, really,
really hard. And having a resource like what
(24:15):
you're offering, I would have loved that back in like 1996.
Yeah, yeah. Well, and I think it's important
for people to give them to understand they don't have to be
all things to all people. So just because you're serving
customers and clients and they think you should offer this
product or this service, you don't have to, right?
You know, I've had people ask about consultations and that's a
totally different skill set. And that's something why I
(24:38):
wasn't entirely sure. And I opened my brick and
mortar. Did I want to do that, right?
I didn't need a decision about that.
But as I got further into it andI was like, you know, that
doesn't light me up. Like I'm not playing in my
strengths. I felt my strengths are running
this business. So I eventually did bring
someone onto my team who's a certified herbalist, certified
nutritionist. And so she's worked in my brick
and mortar and now she's available for virtual
(25:00):
consultations. So I said, you know what, I
don't want to do it. I'm going to have somebody else
on my team who can do it and bring them into my sphere,
somebody that I know and trust and that I've thoroughly vetted
that they can do a good job, youknow, under my brand, under my
business. And so now somebody else I can
refer them out when they are looking for an herb list for a
consultation. Oh, I love that.
(25:22):
Pay the experts, you know, pay someone who's in love with the
job to do the job right. I think that's really, I think
that's really great that you share that.
But I also think it's really brave because I think sometimes,
especially in herbalism, there can be at times very much a
scarcity mentality. And so people feel like they
have to be everything to every customer and client.
(25:42):
And it's like, that's one way tojust ring the rag out.
I mean, you're just going to be,you're not going to last long if
you if you want to live like that.
It's really, really, really unsustainable.
So I love that you're queuing onthis like sustainability aspect.
So it can be a lifelong career. So thank you. 100 percent, 100%
(26:03):
and I think that's just being honest with yourself and
awareness of going can I do thisand can I do it well and be
proud of what I what it is that I'm creating, Whether it's a
product or a service, you don't have to make and do everything
that somebody says that you should do.
You know, we have enough ideas of our own that we have to say
yes and no to and we just have to be very conscious of going
what what can I do within, you know, my ability and my skills
(26:25):
and my scope that's going to do a good service to my customers.
Yeah, no, I, I can't agree with that more.
So Speaking of customers and Speaking of products, what are
what is your favorite product that you sell?
Not necessarily your bestseller?Like what is the one that you're
like, this is my baby? I know, but while we are most
(26:47):
known for our lactation supplements because that really
helped us expand it and we have over 70,000 customers that we
have served, which is mind blowing.
You never thought that from Etsy, you know, in every 61
countries, but I feel like one of our best sellers to me is the
menstrual melody tea because of the reviews are just life
changing for people. And it's incredibly humbling to
(27:08):
read about someone's experience where they would be debilitated
during their menstrual cycle. They couldn't go to bed, they
were popping Motrin left and right and they were miserable.
And so and that they found that this tea really gave them life
back, back to themselves during that season of the month where
they could actually cope and they didn't have to not go to
work. They didn't have to go and get
(27:29):
their children help with their hormone balancing and help with
their quality of life. So I feel like that is one of
our best products as far as the tea goes.
As far as topical savs, we make a couple different savs.
I feel like to me that is the awesome sav.
I've had people, it's been used in ways that I never imagined.
So I love getting customers feedback from it.
I made originally as a diaper ointment for yeast rashes.
(27:50):
One of my children were little and I've had people use it for
hand, foot and mouth disease. I've had people use it for
ringworm. I've had people use it for on
their pets where nothing the vetprescribed would get rid of it.
So the reviews, I mean I've got like 6000 reviews on our
website, which is amazing. So reading these reviews and how
people use these products is I read every single review that
(28:12):
comes in because I want to know what's working and what's not
working and where we can improveupon.
So I love the feedback from the customers that we serve online
and in store on a regular basis.Oh I love that.
I think it is interesting how customers will use your products
in ways you've never intended. I I have a story.
(28:34):
It was 2003. We were selling some shampoos at
a food Co-op and so we had our phone number on it.
This is back in the day, right? Avery labels baby and and the I
get this voicemail and I wish I'd saved it.
Then the guy's like. Dude.
I can't tell you how much I freaking love the shampoo.
(28:54):
Oh, feels so awesome. My whole head's tingling.
I love it, you know? And he's going on and on and
he's like, but it doesn't taste good though.
My husband listened to it with me and it was like Oh my gosh.
And I was like, OK, now I need feedback.
Edit the label not for human. Oh my goodness.
(29:14):
Yes, yes, what a learning. But it's like the the reviews
are, I mean, the reviews are good even when they're not good.
You can find a way to make things better and use it for
inspiration. So I think it's really good that
you point that out. Like we're always trying to be
better. We're always trying to take
things to the next level for ourcustomers.
And I really love that you infuse that into your work
(29:37):
because you can see that when you go to your website and you
check things out, you can see that you guys are listening.
And so I think that that's really important for businesses
to think about like how can I bebetter?
Is there is there any upcoming events or anything that you
wanna share with our listeners that you're doing?
(29:59):
Are you gonna be starting classes or workshops soon?
Anything like that? Yeah, so we have at our Maryland
store, we do events every singlemonth, some that we teach and
some I bring in people from the community to teach just because
we have, when you're running a retail store, you can only do so
much. And also it's important to bring
in experts from the community who were going to be no more in
(30:19):
their area. And again, just minding your
scope I think is super important.
So at the Apothecary, I teach innatural remedies for beginners.
This is a great basic one. This is in person.
I've done this online because again, since I serve customers
everywhere, just the basics, understand so they feel
comfortable when they walk in tounderstand there's been herbs,
capsules, teas, essential oils and how to use them and which
(30:40):
ones are the best to use for most everyday common ailments.
So that's something that I teachat the store and I've also done
virtually. So I'll be doing that again for
my customers. And then so in our Maryland
store, so we have a make and take Firesider workshop.
I have somebody else that works at the store and she teaches A
detox her home class. And so that's all about what are
(31:01):
the toxins that are lurking in your home and the toxin burden
that's building from, yes, your plugins, your air fresheners,
your laundry detergent, your pots, your hands.
But what are some ways you can identify where these are hiding
in your home and make healthy switches and your cleaners?
So I let her teach that because she does a great job at that and
that is all on her. And then I have people that come
(31:23):
in to teach. I have another herbalist in the
area and she's going to be teaching a class on spiritual
herbalism. It's a three-part series class
and that's in person. And so she's an ancestral
herbalist. And so I'm super excited for her
to teach about spiritual herbalism because that is not my
wheelhouse. I would not even know where to
begin on that. And so I'm so excited to feature
her. And then we have somebody come
(31:44):
in and teach a class on yoga andbreath work.
So those are some of the classesthat we do regularly and then
we'll do more. And then online, I will be
relaunching another online course, How to Grow Your
Handmade Products. So that's something I feel super
passionate about because becauseof my skills I had learned when
I started making these products as just a hobby, I never
(32:05):
imagined that I would have to teach other people how to do
them, that I would figure out how to skill them, that I would,
you know, skill them away. That whether I'm making an in
house. So I have a warehouse and I have
a team of people that work there.
When I say team, it's two or three people.
It's not a massive team. We're still a small team, but
how do you grow your handmade products so that way you can
build them so that way if you need to teach other people how
(32:27):
to do that, how do you figure out the cost of these products?
How do you figure out how to price them?
How do you figure out the psychology of pricing?
How do you know how to sell them?
Online marketplaces, your own website, social media event.
So this is another course that'scalled Handmade Business Mastery
for Beginners. Yeah.
So I want to teach people how togrow and scale their handmade
(32:47):
business because I mean, I've learned that over, I mean, I've
developed products that have been able to accumulate more
than 70,000 customers and grow my business to more than more
than $5,000,000 in revenue through direct to consumer not
selling on Amazon and with some wholesale partners, you know,
and just my products alone, you know.
(33:08):
So that's something I want to teach people if it, if that's
what they want to do, grow theirhandmade products, if they're
trying, whether that's jewelry or whether that's hat making or
soap or whatever it is that they're creating, they want to
grow and scale it. I'd love to be able to coach
them through that. Oh, that's awesome.
Oh, I'm so excited. I'm so excited.
You were like the perfect personto do that.
(33:28):
You know, I think that, and I, and I'm sure you talk about this
in that class, but like one of the problems is when herbalists
are starting out, they're like, I'll sell more if I price it at
$2.00 and it cost me $1.79 to make.
And it's like, and I'm always telling students, no, don't, you
know, don't do that, Don't do that.
And I love that, that you're, you know, you're going to have a
(33:51):
resource for people so we can say go to go, go check out.
It's specifically about this thing that you're trying to do
because I think sometimes peoplethink one class should teach
them everything in the whole wide world about, you know,
things. And it just doesn't work that
way. There's too much detail and
information. So that sounds like a really
detailed class. Yeah, yeah.
(34:13):
And I'm breaking it up into three different parts because
there's so much from like if I put everything I've learned into
one single class, like 1 area from like shipping. 9,000,000
pages. It would be so much and we have
shipped, I've learned, we do ourown fulfillment at our own
warehouse. And so I've created so many
systems within a warehouse from a manufacturing schedule, you
(34:36):
know, from shipping systems and to build those systems and how
to teach others how to do what you've created.
So it's one thing when you're one person doing everything.
And I've been there and done that and I still do probably way
too much of my business, but it's, it's really important when
you're growing your, how many products that you kind of have a
plan on how to grow and where togrow.
So how do you bring sales in in person and online?
(34:59):
I still do community events, I still do advertising because
it's so even though I have grownmy business in such a way
online, I can't take for grantedjust just because of that, that
I assume that people know about my brand.
They don't. So I still get out into my town
where my apothecary locations are.
I still set up as a vendor with a lot of our products feature
that we make in manufacture, butalso just brand awareness for
(35:21):
the apothecary and the other things that we offer.
Even if we don't make them, I want to make sure I know that we
are resourced in the community so people get to learn about us.
Oh, I love that. And I think it's important to
remember, even though everythingis everything's online,
everything's online, right? That doesn't mean that the
impact that you can make in yourcommunity as being a valued
(35:43):
business in your community doesn't exist.
You know, it's like, it's so important for herbal businesses
to have everyone in town know who they are because it really
helps give validity not to the only just the field, but but to
the education and the practices.And, you know, yes, this person
is offering a viable business that benefits our community
(36:05):
because you're paying taxes. You're, you know, you're help
keeping the lights on in the city by all your hard work.
And it makes the community have ownership.
You know, they want you to be successful and they want you to,
you know, be considered a contributor.
And I think it's good that you do that and you go out and let
people know, hey, we're here, you know, we participate because
(36:29):
it isn't just like truck drivingcompanies that participate, you
know, it's all of us out there, you know.
So I love that you are doing that and and being visible that
way. Yeah, absolutely.
Yeah. And I still say a lot of say yes
to a lot of different events, you know, and I think that's
important that people want to get to meet the owner.
They want to get to meet the formulator.
(36:49):
Whether you have a brick and mortar apothecary or whether
you're just a handmade business,people are you need to get out
in their community because people need to connect with you
and who you are and why you makewhat you do and the impact that
you're going to have. You can, you don't want to hide
behind the screen all the time. You need to connect with your
customers and your potential customers.
That's really important. Oh, I love that.
(37:10):
Well, thank you so much. I'm so I'm just so glad we were
able to get this all sorted and scheduled because I think that
what you're bringing into the herbal world is very inspiring
for new students. I think it's inspiring for
herbalists that are, you know, oh, I'm, I'm thinking of
retiring and I'd love to open. A lot of our students are in the
retirement age and they like want to start a business one day
(37:33):
for their second act. And, and I think it's great that
that you are going to have theseresources available for people
who want to do that and look at things in a different way.
So that's super exciting. I'm so glad you were able to
take the time and, you know, talk with us today.
It's just been so great. Is there any like leaving
(37:54):
thoughts or words or wisdom thatyou would love to share with our
listeners? I I think it's important.
I love the quote. Do what?
Do what you can with what you have.
Right. So sometimes I think we're so
scared to put our products or services, whatever out in the
world because it's the first edition, it's the first version
of it and like, oh, I know it could be so much more, right.
(38:15):
So put your ugly out there and do it and know it's going to
improve. You know, if you'd, I mean, you
could, you can find products, pictures of the products that I
created when I first started andI have revised them multiple
times over and over and over andjust keep working at it.
I think that's really important.Don't give up on it just because
it doesn't look the way that youthink it's going to or it
(38:37):
doesn't present the way that you're wanting to.
I mean, I'm watching these courses.
This is a whole new type of or remove my business, if you will.
And there's a lot for me to learn.
And I'm like, I'm just starting.So I'm giving myself grace in
that. I'm just starting.
I'm just learning this. This is a different way I can
serve my customers and my clients, but it's going to get
better and just be stick to it and just continue to improve
(38:58):
over time and that you're not going to master it in three
months or three years. This is just part of the
journey. Yeah, I mean, we're, we, we've
rewritten all of our manuals probably about 15 times.
So I get that. You always have to like, you
know, I, I talk funny, so I write funny, you know, like I
just, I don't know, I lived in like too many places to have a
(39:21):
regional dialect or thought process.
And so, yeah, like I have to learn and, and rephrase things
and go through and my materials over and over again.
And you know, you have to do that with products too.
I mean, your materials are your products, but I mean like, so I
love that you're saying put the,you know, you don't have to
strive for for production, not perfection.
(39:41):
Get it out there, then fix it, you know, always, always be
better. And I love that you shared that
because I think it's important for students to like hear that
and be like, OK, it does not have to be perfect.
It you know my little printed Avery label is a good place to
start. Right, right.
And don't be afraid of the feedback that you're going to
get at first. I think when you first start, it
really wounds you when you get that feedback that there's your
(40:04):
product missed the mark or it didn't get the results or
somebody had a problem with yourproduct.
I think don't take that personally that it's
constructive criticism for for you to use to be able to
improve. So I think just kind of
developing that thicker skin andjust knowing it's going to be OK
if it misses the mark the first time or the second time, there's
room for improvement. And that.
(40:25):
Yeah, yeah. I mean, and you can definitely,
you know, you can learn. It's just that's all herbalism
is, is a constant path of learning, changing and growing
as things alter in our fields, right.
So why wouldn't it be with product development and customer
interactions? And, you know, so I think it's
good that you point that out and, and, and highlight that how
important that is to your business, because you're right,
(40:47):
there are people who probably would hear bad feedback or maybe
not even bad, just like something and, and just stop.
And then their greatness, they'll never be able to share
it because, you know, because we're all wounded, right?
We're all wounded individuals, right?
And no one gets out of here alive.
But I mean, like, you know, so Ithink it's, that's a good thing
(41:09):
to like remind people of. So thank you for reminding us of
that. Yeah, absolutely.
Thank you so much for being on today and thank you for sharing
so much valuable information. I just really appreciate it.
Thank you. Well.
Thank you for the invitation andthe work that you're also doing
to bring, you know, to be a catalyst for it, to bring other
(41:31):
people to life and to realize their potential and to kind of
step into this industry and thisfield.
Because it's really, it's such agreat beginning because it was a
beginning for me when I took theheart of herbs.
And when I think it was with my second son, I think I took it, I
feel like it's like 2007 maybe I, that was the first course I
(41:51):
took. And so it was a catalyst for me.
And it was just, for me, it was just personal education and
enrichment. I never knew when I took that,
that it was going to turn into something beyond just my
personal education because I wasjust devouring all the books and
I knew I needed some type of course to kind of guide me.
And so it was such foundation for me.
And I said, once I started, I was like, oh, I'm going to be on
this journey for a while. I realized this is something I
(42:13):
do not attain. I'm a natural.
I do not attain herbalism. This is a lifelong journey and I
have to be OK with the growth and that's that's what I still
continue to do to this day when I'm driving back and forth to my
apothecary locations on my hour and 10 minute drive.
I'm listening to podcast all thetime, learning and growing
(42:35):
non-stop. Oh, yeah, it is an I take
classes all the time, like even ones about taking care of goats,
even though I don't have goats because my clients have goats
and they want to be able to use herbs with their goat.
I mean, like, I'm serious. Like the Extension Service never
gets enough of me. But I mean, like, you know, So I
think it's good that you shared that.
(42:56):
Yeah, it's a it is a process. It is a lifelong commitment.
No one's gonna, no one knows everything.
And if they tell you they do, run.
Run. Absolutely.
Absolutely. That's a herbal relationship red
flag, Yeah. Absolutely, absolutely.
So I appreciate that work, the work that you're doing, it's
(43:18):
definitely it was a catalyst forme to get started on my journey.
Oh, well, thank you. That's really nice of you to
share. So thank you so much for being
here. And I cannot wait for people to
hear this because I think they're just going to be so
inspired by your journey and realize that there are ways of
(43:39):
doing things where you can honoryour commitment to your
community and your family and yourself and still have a
sustainable and equitable business.
So thank you so much for doing what you do.
Yeah. Thank you.
Thank you. Bye.
Bye.
Hi everyone, this is Demetria Clark with the Heart of Verbs
Herbal school podcast. And today we are talking to
Cindy Collins and Cindy is she'sjust doing all kinds of great
stuff. So I'm not going to try to come
up with the words to describe all that this Dynamo is doing.
I'm going to let her share with you what she's doing and what
(00:33):
her journey is. And Cindy has taken.
Oh my gosh, like she runs euphoric herbals.
And if you just even look at herpackaging, it's so beautiful.
It's so it's so inspiring just from the packaging, which says
to me that there was so much thought put into everything.
So, you know, the formulas are just going to be just as
(00:56):
wonderful. Good morning, Cindy, thank you
so much for being here. Good.
Morning. Thank you so much for having me
on here. I really appreciate it.
Oh, well, thank you. Yeah.
Well, I'll tell you about, Yep, I'll tell you just a little bit
about a little bit about myself and a little bit about my
journey. I am a certified herbalist and
(01:16):
I'm a former lactation counselorand also a former Boris doula.
And that kind of was a bit of mybeginning journey and it's
always been a bit of inspirationfor my product development.
I started my business as a hobbyout of my kitchen in 2010,
selling on Etsy and just making a bit of everything from herbal
(01:39):
products. And I made beaded jewelry and I
made baby hats. Whatever inspired me or I wanted
to create, I sold it on Etsy with not a clue where this was
going to go, you know, as a stayat home mom, 2-3 boys, you know,
And since then I've decided to focus on one thing because I had
three businesses at one time raising three children and I
just thought, what the hell am Idoing?
(02:00):
I can't do all this thing, all these things, it's just
impossible. But eventually decided on just
what my one thing was going to be, that I could have the
greatest impact doing that was the most important thing to me.
So I eventually let go of being a photographer.
I eventually let go of being a birth doula and decided to focus
on herbalism in the products that I was creating in the
marketplace and the value where they were having.
(02:22):
So since then, I've been doing this, I would say full time
since 2015, but it really started for me as a hobby in
2010. But 2015 I realized the
potential of what I was buildingand that I really needed to
focus on just that thing. But since then I've opened my
first herbal apothecary locationin 2018, the first one in
(02:42):
Delaware and then I opened another one in fall of 22 and
Maryland, Indianapolis, DC area and sell online now to ship to
every state and 61 countries which is bananas to think.
That's awesome. Oh so where can people find your
apothecaries? Like what town and everything so
(03:02):
or at the website so people can get that right at the beginning
too. Yep.
So our website iseuphoricherbals.com.
And I know it's a little bit hard to spell sometimes and hard
to say. I never imagined when I was
creating this what it was going to become, or else I might have
thought about something different.
Euphoria, a name. But I wanted people to
experience happiness and euphoria in their healing and
(03:24):
Wellness journey. So it's EUPHORIC herbals with an
s@theend.com and my apothecary brick and mortars are located in
in Milford, DE, which is centralDelaware.
And then we also have one near Annapolis.
It's technically Edgewater. So we kind of serve all of
Delaware with our Delaware apothecary location.
(03:45):
And then our Annapolis one is right between like Baltimore and
DC area. So we kind of pull from that
area. Wow, 2 great locations.
I mean they're so central there's got to be a a good
amount of foot traffic. But I've got to tell people I've
seen some pictures of your apothecary.
I have I I am eventually gonna, I'm swing by at some point.
(04:08):
And they're so beautiful. It's so inviting.
Like, what was your was that idea of euphoria?
Was that really like what you were thinking when you were
designing the space? Did you work with a designer?
Is this all just like pulled outof your head in one section
after another? Like how did you come up with
such beautiful spaces? Yeah, So it was really, I didn't
(04:30):
work with the designer. It was just all of me.
But I think I kind of gleaned from my photography and brand
branding experience as a photographer thinking about how
does this look, how does this feel?
And from traveling over the years before I opened my first
brick and mortar, I would travelto any place that sold herbs or
teas or anything holistic, and Iwould drive to neighboring
states around Delaware. And what I often found is that
(04:53):
sometimes they were too dark, they were too cluttered.
It was hard to find things or itkind of felt like a hedge.
And I was like, if someone is starting on their health and
Wellness journey, they're not going to feel comfortable
walking into something that feels like a head shop to me or
like a smoke shop. Like they're not going to feel
comfortable that. So I wanted to make sure it was
bright, it had modern and clean and the colors were warm.
(05:17):
And so I wanted to make sure we do have people that will walk in
and they'll go, Oh my gosh, it feels amazing in here.
And I think that's a combinationof a lot of things, obviously,
besides the good energy and intention that we're putting in
and the amazing team of people that I have working at these
locations. You know, I think it's the
color, I think it's the aesthetic.
I think how things are merchandised and laid out.
Of course it's the smell of all the things that smells so great
(05:40):
from, you know, soaps and essential oils and herbs and
teas, you know, So I think it's all of those things that make
for an inviting space where people can feel comfortable,
regardless if it's their their new to holistic killing or if
they've been on this journey fora while.
Oh, I cannot even agree more. Like I through the years, I've
(06:00):
probably been into a few 100 different apothecaries in the
United States and worldwide. And one of the things I noticed
about a lot of them in Europe isthat they did have that clean,
open airy feeling, which in the US you don't get.
And I didn't want to go into a head shop looking place to buy
my herbs because I kind of felt like, how long have they been
(06:20):
here? Are they moldy and musty?
Like, And when you're in a spacethat's really clean and really
inviting, it's, it's got to be like, Oh, I know exactly what I
want. I can see the quality.
There's no dust, there's no cobwebs.
I mean, like I, I'm just really applaud you for like taking that
step and making like what looks like just like incredibly
looking spaces. Yeah, thank you.
(06:42):
Thank you so much. It's definitely been a journey
from each time I got a hold of the physical space and trying to
transform it into that has been,especially with two different
spaces. I have learned so much opening 2
brick and mortar stores, you know, and they're a little bit
different, you know, like 1 is twice the size of the other to
allow for events. The other one, the first one
that I opened is half the size. It's about 1000 square feet,
(07:04):
which might seem like a lot, butreally it's not.
When you get groups of people inthere, it gets really cluttered
very fast. So I knew with opening my second
one that I needed to allow for hosting events, that there could
be more mobility and more space as people to move around in
there, Especially if they had stroller strollers or
wheelchairs or kids. That they weren't going to bump
(07:25):
into one another and then allow for me to open eventually the
the Smoothie Teen Kaboocha bar like we have in the Delaware
one. Oh, I love that.
I love that you're thinking about ways for all of your
customers to have a good experience if they've got a
stroller, if they're in a wheelchair, a Walker, there's
all different kinds of mobility things and sometimes herbal
(07:46):
spaces are not easy for them to get into.
And so I just love that because to me, I would have loved that
when my kids were little and I had like one on my back when I'm
stroller like I wouldn't have toworry about knocking everyone
off as I walked through the space.
What a cool, what a cool way to present and think about space.
So I've got to tell you, I just think everyone who's thinking
(08:09):
about opening an apothecary needs to go and visit you and
see like, OK, this is a good wayto do this.
This is, you know, and to take then to then take their
attention to their community and, and do whatever.
Or maybe one day you'll franchise.
Maybe you'll be like the first herbal apothecary franchise in
the United States or something. I've actually gone through the
(08:30):
franchise development process and I've gone through that to
franchise my apothecary right now.
What I've realized going throughthat I did that before I opened
my second brick and mortar, which was, which was fine, but I
felt like if I opened my second brick and mortar before I gone
through the franchise development process, it would
have allowed me to learn some lessons along the way, you know,
and in preparation for the franchise development.
(08:52):
So it's something that I definitely do want to do because
there's only so much of me and Ido have people since we do shit
everywhere, people are always looking for more locations that
we have. And I'm only one person.
I can only do so much and I can only do so much.
Well, you know, so it's something that I, that I plan to
do in the future when I am able to free up more of me because
(09:12):
once I'm, you know, that's a whole other business
franchising. It's I just have to be their
biggest cheerleader and their coach, and right now I'm leading
a team of people. And so right now, there's not
enough of me yet to do that for somebody else.
Yeah. No, I mean, I love it.
I just think it would be like such a cool model.
I mean, we have different kinds of supplement stores and stuff
that's just not the same market.And then a lot of people think
(09:34):
that there's a lot of intersectionality and a lot of
connection in those markets, butin a lot of ways there really
isn't. And so like, you know, it, it is
a needed, it is a needed thing in our world, thing in our
world. Look at me.
I am over here with all the goodbig, all the big words.
So what was your what was your inspiration to go into
(09:54):
herbalism? So I think for me originally, it
was during my first pregnancy in2004, 2005, you know, and I was
wanting to pay attention to whatI was putting in and on my body
as this human being that I was growing.
I thought this is really important work.
I really should think about that.
And that's kind of how it started was just I was making
(10:15):
things for myself. I have a culinary background as
a chef, so it was so easy for meto formulate.
I thought about herbal formulations as recipes and I
was like, oh, I could totally make that.
And then after my first son was born, you know, I was making dye
appointments in cranes and things of that nature.
And then I later worked in lactation and hospitals for a
couple of years on the postmortem floor.
(10:36):
And then I later became a birth ruler.
So a lot of the products that I was making were originally
inspired for me. And then it was my family and it
was my friends, and then it was my doula clients.
And I continued to grow and expand from there.
And what I love having about a brick and mortar herbal
apothecary, it's, it's almost like my own to test lab, if you
will. It's where I can have these
great experiences and interactions with customers
(10:57):
about what they're looking for, what they like, what they don't
like. I'm constantly seeking that
feedback from them all the time and how I can continually
improve, you know, not only the products that we make, because
we make about 30 different products and, but also the
products that I carry, you know,that we have at the apothecary
about what they're looking for. And then also sometimes guiding
(11:18):
them, you know, products that they may think that they want,
but also educating them that maybe you actually don't really
want that product, you might want something else.
So it was just originally for meand then it continued to grow
from there in ways that I I never anticipated.
Yeah, no, I mean, watching, watching your career develop
over the years has been so inspiring, but not just that.
(11:38):
I mean, you touched on somethingI think is really important, and
I always say this to people whenthey call, I'm like, hey, are
you a good cook? And if they're like, yeah, I'm
like, you're going to be great at formulation, you know, when
they're worried about it. And it's cool that you brought
that up because like the culinary world and the herbal
world have been separate for so long, but they're really not.
(11:59):
We've been using food and herbs and healing since the beginning
of time. And they really are organically
like part of the same world. And so I love that you brought
that up and that you shared thatthat you would have that
experience because I think it really, I think it really helps
people think about herbalism a little bit differently.
Like, oh, OK, maybe this is accessible to me.
(12:19):
I don't have to be like this master science herbal brain.
I can say I know how to, I know how to work with ingredients and
food. And I think that's really
beautiful. So thank you for sharing that.
When you first started off on Etsy, obviously, did you think
it was going to be here or were you hoping it would be here one
(12:41):
day? Or were you just kind of like,
I'm going to do this so I can fund my passions, right?
Well, I think it was when I first started on Etsy, it was
like, well, I'm creating these things.
And I had a dual account and shewas like, oh, maybe you should
sell your products on Etsy because I would go to, I mean,
I've done all kinds of events and I still do events where I
did farmers markets and I did a lot of farmers markets.
(13:03):
I did craft shows. If there's anything holistic in
my state, which there's not a lot in Delaware, it's not a very
progressive state that was hard to find, but anything I could
find where I could sell my products at, I was there and I
would even bring my baby on top.So it didn't matter.
Like I was there trying to get my products out into my
community. And I love to look back and I
keep pictures of how my productsstarted because I was printing
(13:24):
all my labels on my printer withAvery labels and I was, I was
using scrapbooking materials to cut labels.
I put my phone number on there. I upcycled baby food jars.
I did that for a long time whereI would ask friends if you have
baby foods, save your baby food jars because I would like to use
those jars for to making herbal sabs in exchange, I'll give you
an herbal SAP in between, you know, forgive me that.
(13:46):
So I would always do that with friends.
And so that way I was just trying to be sustainable, keep
costs down and, you know, and bemindful about the waste.
And so I never imagined eventually I did outgrow Etsy
because Etsy became really challenging for me as far as
what I could and could put on there, what I couldn't, couldn't
say. And that's still important.
I understand even more now the importance of that doing this
(14:08):
for so long about the language we use and the products and
descriptions, what is on the product and try not to allude to
curing, diagnosing, treating a disease of any kind.
But I realized at some point, like it's just not necessary for
me to be on Etsy. So I eventually did go off Etsy.
I went on to another marketplaceand then I eventually moved on
to big commerce and then I movedon to Shopify.
I think it was 2015. I moved on to Shopify and and
(14:32):
decided to do my own website which is just.
It's a never ending project. It's a lot of work.
You do have a really beautiful website though.
I mean, you do have, I mean likeit's really, it's not only a
beautiful website, which I thinkis important, it's really
useful. So you have resources on there
for parents and customers, whichI think a lot of places miss out
(14:56):
on that way of connecting with people on a different level.
So I do think that's really cool.
And your product reviews, I mean, I mean, I almost need to
start breastfeeding again just to give.
Yeah, no, my husband just had a he just fainted it.
He's out in the field with the animals.
He just fainted. He just heard that he's like,
(15:17):
oh, no more. But I mean, it's so great that
that you were able to really keep this and keep your vision
and keep what was important to you.
And I think that's a good lessonfor a lot of herbal businesses
is to keep what's important to you as the herbalist.
And I mean with the apothecary, do you find that you are
(15:39):
offering a lot of guidance to people when they come in?
Tremendous amount of guidance tothem because so, so.
Definitely be educated. Yeah, I think that.
So I did. Do a virtual workshop on like
starting your own apothecary business because I have a lot of
questions about that and people come to the store.
We have people that travel to usfrom neighboring states.
(16:00):
So we have some people that havedriven as far as like 4 hours
one way, which blows my mind that people are willing to make
that trip. It's incredibly humbling and so
I think it's super important. When someone is going to start
an herbal apothecary, they absolutely do need basic
education. You need to know more than your
customers. And there's some customers who
are going to come in here are going to know more than you.
(16:20):
And that's amazing because it's a great collective learning
experience and, and be open to that, not be intimidated with
that. Somebody is going to come in and
they've been an herbalist for 30years or they're, they're a
nurse and they're an herbalist or whatever type of functional
practitioner that they are. They're going to know more than
you. And that's a great opportunity
to learn from them. So I think it's fantastic.
But you have to have basic herbal knowledge because
(16:42):
somebody comes in and they're looking at this wall of herbs
behind me and it's got hundreds of herbs and they go, is this
tea? And you're like, well, yes and
no, you know, and so, and being able to educate them on how to
use the herbs, what form is best, what concentration is
best? If it's not a, a dried root, you
know, maybe it's an oil, dependson what it is.
So knowing how to guide and navigate someone in their health
(17:05):
journey, what form they should be using herbal remedies is, is
so important, you know, and, andbeing able to caution them if
they're taking any medications or there might be
contraindications or adverse reactions.
Because as we know that herbs are natural, but they are not
all safe for everybody. And make sure you're
communicating that clearly to your customer.
(17:26):
So that way they leave feeling informed, empowered in the
decisions that they're making. And so they're going to come
back again because you build that rapport and trust.
It's really important. Oh yeah, no, I can't agree more.
I think it's wonderful that people are, you know, interested
in the workshop that you, the virtual workshop that you did.
So are you going to be doing that again?
Is this something like it's going to be a regular feature
(17:47):
and people can go to your website and find out more about
it? Because I think that is really
needed. Yeah.
So in the workshop I will be doing it again and then it will
be available for anybody to watch on demand at any time
soon. So that will be happening later
this year. But it's so important.
I've had so many questions over the years when people would come
in or they go, I'd love to open a workshop, I'd love to open a
place like this one day or this is my dream when I retire.
(18:10):
I hear that often. And there's room for growth and
there's room for abundance for everybody.
And you can only serve so many people in your community.
And so I really wanted people tofeel if there's something they
wanted to do that to do it in their community, wherever that
is, whether it's in the same state that I'm in or if they're
traveling from another state. So in the Herbal Apothecary
(18:31):
business workshop, I kind of talk about the four foundational
things that I think people really need to know before they
go down this process. Having done it twice, I learned
even more the second time, you know, from talking about
location scouting, what things to ask when looking for
commercial location, choosing the best location, and then also
(18:51):
talking about insurance, permitsand licenses.
And every state has different variations and nuances in every
state. Some say that you can't use the
word apothecary because people might think you're a pharmacy or
they might think you're a dispensary.
So knowing the language that youcan and can't use in your
business name is important. And then we talk about startup
cost and talk about ongoing costs.
(19:14):
And then there's another an education.
And we talk a little bit about like education, what research
you need to do before you open your brick and mortar.
So it's really the information that I wish I had had before I
opened my brick and mortar. So that way somebody at least
feels they have some place to start and how to launch.
And I put together like a launchchecklist starting back like 12
(19:36):
to 18 months before you actuallyopen because.
Everything. I love that.
They need to know what things may be doing when, when they
need to filing for permits, whenthey offer licenses, you know,
And so that way they're. Kind of insurance to look into
like when we, we have a, a business mentorship thing,
right? And it's the same kind of thing.
It's like, you know, it's not just about getting T-shirts
(19:59):
printed. You need to make sure your
building's accessible. Are you going to have available
bathrooms? How is the lighting?
You know, like what kind of insurance?
So I love that you put that all together.
I think that's amazing. And I definitely look people, if
you're going to do something like this, you need to check
this out because and how much isthe cost of that?
(20:20):
The live workshop is $97.00. Get it?
That's it. Oh my gosh, if if someone is
interested in this and they don't invest in 97 dollars, then
I don't know what to tell you because that's an incredible
deal. And I talked about the different
apothecary business model types,because I think there's so many
types as well in the pros and cons of each of them.
(20:40):
And for something for them to think through from whether
you're just doing consulting or whether you're doing retail,
whether you're doing retail and events or whether you're doing
retail and food and beverage service, all the pros and cons
of each of those that you have to think through for in advance.
Because otherwise you'd get started on this journey.
And you're like, oh, you know what?
Actually, I don't think I want to do that or I want to change
(21:00):
my mind. You can always pivot.
We can always change your mind. But before you get too far into
it, it's good to consider the pros and cons of every business
model. Which one's best for you based
on your skill set and your experience and your education?
Oh yeah, I love that. And I think The thing is, is
that people have to be kind to themselves because usually, you
know what we always like, we find that people, people change.
(21:24):
They start off and they're like,all I want to do is be a
consulting herbalist. That's all I want to do, right?
And then like a few months laterthey're like, Oh, I don't want
to do that. I want to do this instead.
Or, and to be kind with yourselfas you go through the journey
and figure it out. You may be like, Hey, I want to
start with the tea room and all we do is is blend a blah, blah,
blah, right? And then you're like, no, I want
to have a more full, fully functioning apothecary.
(21:46):
And then other people, like, I just really want to sell tea
cups only, you know, and it's OK.
And so to be kind to yourself, did you have moments where
you're like, I should have been kinder to myself during this
process? Yes.
So I realized that after I opened my second apothecary,
probably about about a year intoit, realizing that I made things
(22:08):
way harder on myself than necessary because I'm kind of
like a go, go harder, go home type of person and I'm all in.
And I realized that I probably made it a lot more challenging
for myself than I should have. I mean, I could, I would have
opened when opening my second location, I opened in a
different state. So that's just challenging unto
itself. And then more than an hour away
from the other one. And then I have to go over a
(22:29):
bridge, right? So just logistically that made
it challenging. So I could have opened another
location in another town in the capital of Delaware closer to me
because I already had a customerbase throughout the entire
state. So that would have been kinder
to myself if I had just been like, OK, we don't need to go so
far to have an impact. I could go 30 minutes, you know,
(22:50):
it doesn't have to be preferred to have an impact.
So that was one a huge lesson for me going, oh, I probably
made things way harder for myself and way more expensive
for myself opening in another location.
But obviously it's been great character building experience
and it's allowed me to learn allof these things, which I'm like,
I got to put this in a workshop for somebody else, so that way
(23:13):
when they're thinking about opening their own brick and
mortar apothecary, things that they might want to consider.
With the connection we have in the world nowadays, there's
definitely no reason not to invest in someone else's
knowledge to help you get to thenext level, you know?
(23:33):
So something like this, I think is amazing.
I'm so glad that you offer this.There's so many things with
setting up a business. And since this is like a
specific kind of business, I mean, people are really going to
have the opportunity to get yourexperience really, really
narrowed in on something. You see me over here with my
hands, I'm going crazy. No, but I mean, like, you know,
(23:53):
they're really going to be you're you're going to help
them. You can help them pinpoint
exactly where they need to go. And I think that's something
that when people start business,they don't realize that they
need to do. They just want to be all things,
all herb all day long, all that,you know, and that's really
hard. You know, that's really, really,
really hard. And having a resource like what
(24:15):
you're offering, I would have loved that back in like 1996.
Yeah, yeah. Well, and I think it's important
for people to give them to understand they don't have to be
all things to all people. So just because you're serving
customers and clients and they think you should offer this
product or this service, you don't have to, right?
You know, I've had people ask about consultations and that's a
totally different skill set. And that's something why I
(24:38):
wasn't entirely sure. And I opened my brick and
mortar. Did I want to do that, right?
I didn't need a decision about that.
But as I got further into it andI was like, you know, that
doesn't light me up. Like I'm not playing in my
strengths. I felt my strengths are running
this business. So I eventually did bring
someone onto my team who's a certified herbalist, certified
nutritionist. And so she's worked in my brick
and mortar and now she's available for virtual
(25:00):
consultations. So I said, you know what, I
don't want to do it. I'm going to have somebody else
on my team who can do it and bring them into my sphere,
somebody that I know and trust and that I've thoroughly vetted
that they can do a good job, youknow, under my brand, under my
business. And so now somebody else I can
refer them out when they are looking for an herb list for a
consultation. Oh, I love that.
(25:22):
Pay the experts, you know, pay someone who's in love with the
job to do the job right. I think that's really, I think
that's really great that you share that.
But I also think it's really brave because I think sometimes,
especially in herbalism, there can be at times very much a
scarcity mentality. And so people feel like they
have to be everything to every customer and client.
(25:42):
And it's like, that's one way tojust ring the rag out.
I mean, you're just going to be,you're not going to last long if
you if you want to live like that.
It's really, really, really unsustainable.
So I love that you're queuing onthis like sustainability aspect.
So it can be a lifelong career. So thank you. 100 percent, 100%
(26:03):
and I think that's just being honest with yourself and
awareness of going can I do thisand can I do it well and be
proud of what I what it is that I'm creating, Whether it's a
product or a service, you don't have to make and do everything
that somebody says that you should do.
You know, we have enough ideas of our own that we have to say
yes and no to and we just have to be very conscious of going
what what can I do within, you know, my ability and my skills
(26:25):
and my scope that's going to do a good service to my customers.
Yeah, no, I, I can't agree with that more.
So Speaking of customers and Speaking of products, what are
what is your favorite product that you sell?
Not necessarily your bestseller?Like what is the one that you're
like, this is my baby? I know, but while we are most
(26:47):
known for our lactation supplements because that really
helped us expand it and we have over 70,000 customers that we
have served, which is mind blowing.
You never thought that from Etsy, you know, in every 61
countries, but I feel like one of our best sellers to me is the
menstrual melody tea because of the reviews are just life
changing for people. And it's incredibly humbling to
(27:08):
read about someone's experience where they would be debilitated
during their menstrual cycle. They couldn't go to bed, they
were popping Motrin left and right and they were miserable.
And so and that they found that this tea really gave them life
back, back to themselves during that season of the month where
they could actually cope and they didn't have to not go to
work. They didn't have to go and get
(27:29):
their children help with their hormone balancing and help with
their quality of life. So I feel like that is one of
our best products as far as the tea goes.
As far as topical savs, we make a couple different savs.
I feel like to me that is the awesome sav.
I've had people, it's been used in ways that I never imagined.
So I love getting customers feedback from it.
I made originally as a diaper ointment for yeast rashes.
(27:50):
One of my children were little and I've had people use it for
hand, foot and mouth disease. I've had people use it for
ringworm. I've had people use it for on
their pets where nothing the vetprescribed would get rid of it.
So the reviews, I mean I've got like 6000 reviews on our
website, which is amazing. So reading these reviews and how
people use these products is I read every single review that
(28:12):
comes in because I want to know what's working and what's not
working and where we can improveupon.
So I love the feedback from the customers that we serve online
and in store on a regular basis.Oh I love that.
I think it is interesting how customers will use your products
in ways you've never intended. I I have a story.
(28:34):
It was 2003. We were selling some shampoos at
a food Co-op and so we had our phone number on it.
This is back in the day, right? Avery labels baby and and the I
get this voicemail and I wish I'd saved it.
Then the guy's like. Dude.
I can't tell you how much I freaking love the shampoo.
(28:54):
Oh, feels so awesome. My whole head's tingling.
I love it, you know? And he's going on and on and
he's like, but it doesn't taste good though.
My husband listened to it with me and it was like Oh my gosh.
And I was like, OK, now I need feedback.
Edit the label not for human. Oh my goodness.
(29:14):
Yes, yes, what a learning. But it's like the the reviews
are, I mean, the reviews are good even when they're not good.
You can find a way to make things better and use it for
inspiration. So I think it's really good that
you point that out. Like we're always trying to be
better. We're always trying to take
things to the next level for ourcustomers.
And I really love that you infuse that into your work
(29:37):
because you can see that when you go to your website and you
check things out, you can see that you guys are listening.
And so I think that that's really important for businesses
to think about like how can I bebetter?
Is there is there any upcoming events or anything that you
wanna share with our listeners that you're doing?
(29:59):
Are you gonna be starting classes or workshops soon?
Anything like that? Yeah, so we have at our Maryland
store, we do events every singlemonth, some that we teach and
some I bring in people from the community to teach just because
we have, when you're running a retail store, you can only do so
much. And also it's important to bring
in experts from the community who were going to be no more in
(30:19):
their area. And again, just minding your
scope I think is super important.
So at the Apothecary, I teach innatural remedies for beginners.
This is a great basic one. This is in person.
I've done this online because again, since I serve customers
everywhere, just the basics, understand so they feel
comfortable when they walk in tounderstand there's been herbs,
capsules, teas, essential oils and how to use them and which
(30:40):
ones are the best to use for most everyday common ailments.
So that's something that I teachat the store and I've also done
virtually. So I'll be doing that again for
my customers. And then so in our Maryland
store, so we have a make and take Firesider workshop.
I have somebody else that works at the store and she teaches A
detox her home class. And so that's all about what are
(31:01):
the toxins that are lurking in your home and the toxin burden
that's building from, yes, your plugins, your air fresheners,
your laundry detergent, your pots, your hands.
But what are some ways you can identify where these are hiding
in your home and make healthy switches and your cleaners?
So I let her teach that because she does a great job at that and
that is all on her. And then I have people that come
(31:23):
in to teach. I have another herbalist in the
area and she's going to be teaching a class on spiritual
herbalism. It's a three-part series class
and that's in person. And so she's an ancestral
herbalist. And so I'm super excited for her
to teach about spiritual herbalism because that is not my
wheelhouse. I would not even know where to
begin on that. And so I'm so excited to feature
her. And then we have somebody come
(31:44):
in and teach a class on yoga andbreath work.
So those are some of the classesthat we do regularly and then
we'll do more. And then online, I will be
relaunching another online course, How to Grow Your
Handmade Products. So that's something I feel super
passionate about because becauseof my skills I had learned when
I started making these products as just a hobby, I never
(32:05):
imagined that I would have to teach other people how to do
them, that I would figure out how to skill them, that I would,
you know, skill them away. That whether I'm making an in
house. So I have a warehouse and I have
a team of people that work there.
When I say team, it's two or three people.
It's not a massive team. We're still a small team, but
how do you grow your handmade products so that way you can
build them so that way if you need to teach other people how
(32:27):
to do that, how do you figure out the cost of these products?
How do you figure out how to price them?
How do you figure out the psychology of pricing?
How do you know how to sell them?
Online marketplaces, your own website, social media event.
So this is another course that'scalled Handmade Business Mastery
for Beginners. Yeah.
So I want to teach people how togrow and scale their handmade
(32:47):
business because I mean, I've learned that over, I mean, I've
developed products that have been able to accumulate more
than 70,000 customers and grow my business to more than more
than $5,000,000 in revenue through direct to consumer not
selling on Amazon and with some wholesale partners, you know,
and just my products alone, you know.
(33:08):
So that's something I want to teach people if it, if that's
what they want to do, grow theirhandmade products, if they're
trying, whether that's jewelry or whether that's hat making or
soap or whatever it is that they're creating, they want to
grow and scale it. I'd love to be able to coach
them through that. Oh, that's awesome.
Oh, I'm so excited. I'm so excited.
You were like the perfect personto do that.
(33:28):
You know, I think that, and I, and I'm sure you talk about this
in that class, but like one of the problems is when herbalists
are starting out, they're like, I'll sell more if I price it at
$2.00 and it cost me $1.79 to make.
And it's like, and I'm always telling students, no, don't, you
know, don't do that, Don't do that.
And I love that, that you're, you know, you're going to have a
(33:51):
resource for people so we can say go to go, go check out.
It's specifically about this thing that you're trying to do
because I think sometimes peoplethink one class should teach
them everything in the whole wide world about, you know,
things. And it just doesn't work that
way. There's too much detail and
information. So that sounds like a really
detailed class. Yeah, yeah.
(34:13):
And I'm breaking it up into three different parts because
there's so much from like if I put everything I've learned into
one single class, like 1 area from like shipping. 9,000,000
pages. It would be so much and we have
shipped, I've learned, we do ourown fulfillment at our own
warehouse. And so I've created so many
systems within a warehouse from a manufacturing schedule, you
(34:36):
know, from shipping systems and to build those systems and how
to teach others how to do what you've created.
So it's one thing when you're one person doing everything.
And I've been there and done that and I still do probably way
too much of my business, but it's, it's really important when
you're growing your, how many products that you kind of have a
plan on how to grow and where togrow.
So how do you bring sales in in person and online?
(34:59):
I still do community events, I still do advertising because
it's so even though I have grownmy business in such a way
online, I can't take for grantedjust just because of that, that
I assume that people know about my brand.
They don't. So I still get out into my town
where my apothecary locations are.
I still set up as a vendor with a lot of our products feature
that we make in manufacture, butalso just brand awareness for
(35:21):
the apothecary and the other things that we offer.
Even if we don't make them, I want to make sure I know that we
are resourced in the community so people get to learn about us.
Oh, I love that. And I think it's important to
remember, even though everythingis everything's online,
everything's online, right? That doesn't mean that the
impact that you can make in yourcommunity as being a valued
(35:43):
business in your community doesn't exist.
You know, it's like, it's so important for herbal businesses
to have everyone in town know who they are because it really
helps give validity not to the only just the field, but but to
the education and the practices.And, you know, yes, this person
is offering a viable business that benefits our community
(36:05):
because you're paying taxes. You're, you know, you're help
keeping the lights on in the city by all your hard work.
And it makes the community have ownership.
You know, they want you to be successful and they want you to,
you know, be considered a contributor.
And I think it's good that you do that and you go out and let
people know, hey, we're here, you know, we participate because
(36:29):
it isn't just like truck drivingcompanies that participate, you
know, it's all of us out there, you know.
So I love that you are doing that and and being visible that
way. Yeah, absolutely.
Yeah. And I still say a lot of say yes
to a lot of different events, you know, and I think that's
important that people want to get to meet the owner.
They want to get to meet the formulator.
(36:49):
Whether you have a brick and mortar apothecary or whether
you're just a handmade business,people are you need to get out
in their community because people need to connect with you
and who you are and why you makewhat you do and the impact that
you're going to have. You can, you don't want to hide
behind the screen all the time. You need to connect with your
customers and your potential customers.
That's really important. Oh, I love that.
(37:10):
Well, thank you so much. I'm so I'm just so glad we were
able to get this all sorted and scheduled because I think that
what you're bringing into the herbal world is very inspiring
for new students. I think it's inspiring for
herbalists that are, you know, oh, I'm, I'm thinking of
retiring and I'd love to open. A lot of our students are in the
retirement age and they like want to start a business one day
(37:33):
for their second act. And, and I think it's great that
that you are going to have theseresources available for people
who want to do that and look at things in a different way.
So that's super exciting. I'm so glad you were able to
take the time and, you know, talk with us today.
It's just been so great. Is there any like leaving
(37:54):
thoughts or words or wisdom thatyou would love to share with our
listeners? I I think it's important.
I love the quote. Do what?
Do what you can with what you have.
Right. So sometimes I think we're so
scared to put our products or services, whatever out in the
world because it's the first edition, it's the first version
of it and like, oh, I know it could be so much more, right.
(38:15):
So put your ugly out there and do it and know it's going to
improve. You know, if you'd, I mean, you
could, you can find products, pictures of the products that I
created when I first started andI have revised them multiple
times over and over and over andjust keep working at it.
I think that's really important.Don't give up on it just because
it doesn't look the way that youthink it's going to or it
(38:37):
doesn't present the way that you're wanting to.
I mean, I'm watching these courses.
This is a whole new type of or remove my business, if you will.
And there's a lot for me to learn.
And I'm like, I'm just starting.So I'm giving myself grace in
that. I'm just starting.
I'm just learning this. This is a different way I can
serve my customers and my clients, but it's going to get
better and just be stick to it and just continue to improve
(38:58):
over time and that you're not going to master it in three
months or three years. This is just part of the
journey. Yeah, I mean, we're, we, we've
rewritten all of our manuals probably about 15 times.
So I get that. You always have to like, you
know, I, I talk funny, so I write funny, you know, like I
just, I don't know, I lived in like too many places to have a
(39:21):
regional dialect or thought process.
And so, yeah, like I have to learn and, and rephrase things
and go through and my materials over and over again.
And you know, you have to do that with products too.
I mean, your materials are your products, but I mean like, so I
love that you're saying put the,you know, you don't have to
strive for for production, not perfection.
(39:41):
Get it out there, then fix it, you know, always, always be
better. And I love that you shared that
because I think it's important for students to like hear that
and be like, OK, it does not have to be perfect.
It you know my little printed Avery label is a good place to
start. Right, right.
And don't be afraid of the feedback that you're going to
get at first. I think when you first start, it
really wounds you when you get that feedback that there's your
(40:04):
product missed the mark or it didn't get the results or
somebody had a problem with yourproduct.
I think don't take that personally that it's
constructive criticism for for you to use to be able to
improve. So I think just kind of
developing that thicker skin andjust knowing it's going to be OK
if it misses the mark the first time or the second time, there's
room for improvement. And that.
(40:25):
Yeah, yeah. I mean, and you can definitely,
you know, you can learn. It's just that's all herbalism
is, is a constant path of learning, changing and growing
as things alter in our fields, right.
So why wouldn't it be with product development and customer
interactions? And, you know, so I think it's
good that you point that out and, and, and highlight that how
important that is to your business, because you're right,
(40:47):
there are people who probably would hear bad feedback or maybe
not even bad, just like something and, and just stop.
And then their greatness, they'll never be able to share
it because, you know, because we're all wounded, right?
We're all wounded individuals, right?
And no one gets out of here alive.
But I mean, like, you know, so Ithink it's, that's a good thing
(41:09):
to like remind people of. So thank you for reminding us of
that. Yeah, absolutely.
Thank you so much for being on today and thank you for sharing
so much valuable information. I just really appreciate it.
Thank you. Well.
Thank you for the invitation andthe work that you're also doing
to bring, you know, to be a catalyst for it, to bring other
(41:31):
people to life and to realize their potential and to kind of
step into this industry and thisfield.
Because it's really, it's such agreat beginning because it was a
beginning for me when I took theheart of herbs.
And when I think it was with my second son, I think I took it, I
feel like it's like 2007 maybe I, that was the first course I
(41:51):
took. And so it was a catalyst for me.
And it was just, for me, it was just personal education and
enrichment. I never knew when I took that,
that it was going to turn into something beyond just my
personal education because I wasjust devouring all the books and
I knew I needed some type of course to kind of guide me.
And so it was such foundation for me.
And I said, once I started, I was like, oh, I'm going to be on
this journey for a while. I realized this is something I
(42:13):
do not attain. I'm a natural.
I do not attain herbalism. This is a lifelong journey and I
have to be OK with the growth and that's that's what I still
continue to do to this day when I'm driving back and forth to my
apothecary locations on my hour and 10 minute drive.
I'm listening to podcast all thetime, learning and growing
(42:35):
non-stop. Oh, yeah, it is an I take
classes all the time, like even ones about taking care of goats,
even though I don't have goats because my clients have goats
and they want to be able to use herbs with their goat.
I mean, like, I'm serious. Like the Extension Service never
gets enough of me. But I mean, like, you know, So I
think it's good that you shared that.
(42:56):
Yeah, it's a it is a process. It is a lifelong commitment.
No one's gonna, no one knows everything.
And if they tell you they do, run.
Run. Absolutely.
Absolutely. That's a herbal relationship red
flag, Yeah. Absolutely, absolutely.
So I appreciate that work, the work that you're doing, it's
(43:18):
definitely it was a catalyst forme to get started on my journey.
Oh, well, thank you. That's really nice of you to
share. So thank you so much for being
here. And I cannot wait for people to
hear this because I think they're just going to be so
inspired by your journey and realize that there are ways of
(43:39):
doing things where you can honoryour commitment to your
community and your family and yourself and still have a
sustainable and equitable business.
So thank you so much for doing what you do.
Yeah. Thank you.
Thank you. Bye.
Bye.
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