June 25, 2025 • 32 mins
If you’ve ever struggled to slow down, to feel proud, or to say “I’m enough,” this episode is a must-listen.We often see the hustle. The 3am alarms. The shredded physique. The front covers and product launches. But what we rarely see is the cost behind the curtain. In this raw and revealing episode, Heart On My Sleeve Clinical Director Michaela Overman sits down with celebrity trainer and gym owner Jono Castano to explore the emotional weight that success can carry.
From growing up in a small Colombian town and navigating childhood bullying in Australia, to battling imposter syndrome at the peak of his career - Jono opens up like never before. He shares the silent toll of loneliness, the inner critic shaped by childhood wounds, and how the pressure to always be “on” led him to a breaking point.
This conversation is about what happens when achievement stops feeling like enough. It’s about learning to connect with your inner world, rebuilding after heartbreak, and finally believing you are worthy—not for what you’ve done, but for who you are.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
All right, run it. I wonder what you mean when you
use the word I use the word I I I kick a break.
We have an aversion to. Ourselves and to what's
happening. Inside us.
(00:22):
Inside us. I've been very interested in
this for a long, long time. Something settles.
Hi guys, and welcome back to theHeart of My Sleeve podcast.
I am your host today Michaela Overman, psychologist and lead
(00:43):
Clinical Director of the charity.
And today I am joined by Jono Castano, the gym owner of Acero
Gyms, which is a really amazing gym here in Sydney.
And today he's here to share, I guess, a slightly different side
of himself that he maybe wouldn't.
But thank you so much for joining us today.
(01:03):
Thanks for having me. I think, you know, you said
share, share something that people don't know about and I
think that's super important. And I think that's the reason
why I do personally love to kindof jump on podcast because you
know, what you see on social media and what you see, you
know, you know, where wherever you may say that person is, is
not, you know, what that person is about.
You know, I think for me personally, people always just
(01:24):
jump straight away to why John is doing this, John is doing
that, but they have no idea in terms of like the effect of what
long hours of work can do what, you know, relationship break
UPS, everything, you know? So I think for me, you know,
jumping on this is going to be good.
I reckon it's going to be great.Yeah, and it's, it's so true,
especially when you do have a really big social media
(01:46):
following and social media presence and people speak about
it all the time, about what we show on social media can be
really different. But you do show quite often.
I mean, I've followed you for a while now how much you grind and
the 3:00 AM starts and you know,the crazy amount of PT sessions
you do and, and I can imagine the toll that, that, that that
(02:06):
takes. But I guess I would, I would
kind of like to start by asking you a little bit different to
just tell me a bit about yourself.
But what? What is something that you think
that people wouldn't know about Jono?
I'd probably say what people wouldn't know is, you know, how
like, sometimes, you know, when I'm, when I'm sitting still,
(02:28):
sometimes I actually feel like, you know, I've got that
impossible syndrome. And I feel like everything that
I've kind of do every single daydoesn't really kind of, I don't
deserve it. I feel like I feel like that a
lot. And what that tends to suffer is
I tend to achieve something and then I don't even appreciate it,
you know, like I'm even my partner and I were talking about
and she's like, you know, I'm launching my, my fragrance with
(02:49):
Chemist Warehouse. And then I, I tell her and she's
like, she's more excited and excited than I am.
And I'm like, and then I'm like,she's like, I'd like, why don't
you like smile? Why don't you want to do like,
why are you like super happy? And I'm like, I don't know, I
just, I'm trying to attach like an emotion to it and I can't, I,
I just, I don't know why I can't.
And it's something I'm trying towork on.
It's, you know, when I feel emotion, I try to like, do like
(03:11):
a write down what I'm feeling. But it's just, yeah, it's just I
feel like people don't like, know that about me.
There's almost like a disconnectbetween what you're experiencing
factually and what you're experiencing emotionally.
Your brains kind of separating the two.
Yeah, I'd say so. Yeah, yeah.
Separating the two like there's just like everything like I do
(03:34):
like I achieve, like, you know, if it's a front cover or it's
like an amazing, like a massive job.
I just, you know, I'm like, I just can't put.
It in What's next? Yeah, what's next?
And I don't know if it's becauseI keep there's so many things on
the horizon that don't like. I feel like maybe just because
I'm doing so much, there's no like, there's no like, I can't
put it a feeling to. Yeah, yeah.
And I think that that is something that is in 2025
(03:57):
actually pretty common for a lotof people to kind of go, it's so
go, go, go loud. The world is so loud, you know,
social media and doing that and running gyms and, and doing all
the things that you do being a parent.
It's it's really, really busy. But more often than not, when
(04:18):
you really disconnect from your emotions, it's coming from some
reason that's a little bit deeper than just being 2025.
So I'd love to understand a little bit about where did you
grow up and how do you think howyou grew up kind of shaped the
person that you are today? So I guess like for me
personally, I grew up in a smalltown in Colombia.
(04:39):
It's a it's a place called Lavidhinia, which you know, when
you talk to people, they have noidea where that is.
Even Colombians. It's a very small town and, and
a lot of the town, the main job is sugar canes are kind of kind
of sugar canes. And it's a very like low, low
salary place. And it's kind of like if they,
if you're not a late sportsman, if you're not like a musician,
(05:00):
if you're not doing any of those, there's no way out.
So my dad actually took the recent migrate here in 98, which
I'm so grateful for that he tookthe opportunity.
But you know, life there is very, very, very tough.
Like I cannot explain how tough it is.
And every time that I go back there, it brings me back down to
reality and it makes me that them doing that and coming back
(05:22):
here, that's when I feel super grateful.
That's why I constantly post a lot of like my hometown, even
through my social media. It's actually not for people.
It's actually for myself to remind me.
And a lot of quotes even, like Ijust post stuff up and that's
just to remind me, not even anyone else.
So when I watch that, then I must share.
OK, I've, I did, you know, I need to go back into that to
feel grateful. But yeah, that's kind of a
(05:45):
little bit like to cut it short,that's like my little spill and
like where I grew up from. But how old were you?
I was a seven years old. Yeah, seven years old when I
came over and. Wow, it was a yeah, like from
what I remember anyway, it was, it was extremely tough because,
you know, obviously not understand, like not knowing
English was like like a like a massive thing back then.
I just too, I remember even getting bullied at school
(06:07):
because I was one of those kids of not knowing obviously
English. And you know, and then I grew up
in mascot and then I was a sporty kid.
I used to play a lot of soccer and then my parents moved out
West because that's kind of where all the sports schools
schools are, which I managed to do.
But yeah, a lot of that, like, you know, my whole life, you
know, was that kind of remembering that stage of it,
(06:30):
like just getting bullied and need some.
Yeah, It's quite. Yeah.
I think maybe maybe that's got abit of a, I don't know.
I don't know. Yeah, well, I mean, you, you go
from living the kind of life like you did, which in itself
has so many layers for a young 7year old kid.
Like I'm imagining. I mean, my stepdaughter's seven.
I'm imagining her having to moveto a totally different country,
(06:53):
not understanding the language, vastly different cultural
experiences. Your parents probably
experiencing fear and anxiety and worry of are we going to be
OK here? And that coming on to you, you
know, that's, that's a really big thing for a 7 year old to go
through. And then you Chuck on top of
that being bullied at school, That's heartbreaking to imagine.
(07:14):
Yeah, it was. Yeah.
You know, it's still still thinking about itself in these
days because it kind of I feel like even that's just even kind
of like fueled me to once again just, you know, do so much
better and always go above and beyond and just prove people
wrong, you know? Yeah.
(07:34):
What do you think it makes you want to do for yourself, though?
I mean, a lot of that is like proving other people wrong that
someone who is bullied, it's like almost like, well, fuck
you, look, look what I can do. And coming from such a small
town, it's the same thing there.Like, look what I've achieved,
Right. But what about, like, for your
(07:55):
own heart and soul? Like, I guess I wonder how does
it. I mean, now I know you have a
little one year old, right? She's yeah, yeah.
Even just, you know, touching a chair like, you know, I think
like a lot of it even now, like the stuff that I do now is
obviously like driven towards her future and stuff like that.
But then once again, you just mentioned, you know, what about
for myself. And I think I'm like that type
(08:17):
of person in my life where I'm always doing stuff for other
people, but then always neglect,you know, putting aside time
aside for myself, you know, and,you know, even like my partner
now, she gets surprised on how much like, like stuff I actually
do and like for her. And like, how I kind of want to
like, you know, it's like a book, a dinner, if it's like
book, something like simple thatshe's mentioned.
(08:38):
And like, she's never met someone like that.
And I'm not sure if it's a good thing or it's a bad thing.
But yeah, I kind of neglect myself a lot putting time for
myself and I the only times thatI probably in my life where I'm
like, you know what, I've kind of been able to relax and feel
good about it. Everything is probably like when
I've been to Mudgie, when I've gone away, like on a very quiet
(09:00):
trip where I can just kind of hear the sound of the, the water
and like just so simple things and off my phone completely.
I feel like that's kind of whereI found myself.
And that's why this year I've actually, it's quite like, I've
actually decided to plan a lot more trips this year in terms of
like more the Outback and get toknow Australia more.
And I've actually like really enjoyed doing that.
So I've actually planned something every single month and
(09:22):
this just to take 3-4 days off work and put time aside for
myself. And yeah.
Yeah, which would be a really foreign feeling for you.
Yeah, it is. Because I, I, I've just, I used
to stress out about taking days off work and I'd get, I'd take
1-2 days off work and I'd be like, fuck, I'm not doing it.
And, and it's kind of goes back to, I guess my, my mum and dad,
(09:45):
just like my dad really kind of always just being you're not
good enough, you're not doing enough, you're not good enough.
And then that's kind of just installed in my head.
Yeah, yeah. And then I've just, yeah, like,
you know, I've kind of even there's this times of even like
with my ex wife Amy, when I still recall like even like days
where she like be angry. She's like, you're such a waste
of time. And that kind of just repeats in
(10:05):
my mind a lot. And I think like just those
little things just really push me.
Yeah to yeah. Yeah, I mean, your dad used
those actual words with you. It wasn't a, it wasn't even just
a feeling you got from him. It was words that he used with
you. And how our parents talk to us
is how our inner critic forms. Like that voice doesn't just
(10:26):
exist. It comes from how our parents
speak to us and how they speak to themselves.
So I mean, it'd be really, really hard to shut that down
when that's what's been instilled in you is you're not
good enough, you're not achieving enough.
I mean, it's no wonder that now you have that experience of,
like, cool, I've launched A fragrance, cool, my gym's hugely
(10:48):
successful, Cool, my social media following is skyrocketing.
Cool, I'm achieving all this shit.
What's next? I got to do more because I'm not
enough who I am as a person. That's so hard.
Yeah. It's, it's, it's quite tough.
And I think like we spoke about,you know, and, you know, people
think it's all amazing things, but at the end of the day,
sometimes, you know, achieving more and achieving bigger
(11:10):
things, it's not always like a good feeling, you know?
It's always like, you know, yeah.
Yeah, you know, it's, I don't know you right, But I'm, I'm
really, really proud hearing yousay these things because it's it
is extremely hard to say that kind of stuff when I mean, look
(11:32):
at the size of this guy, right? Muscley and big.
And like the presence that you have on social media is big and
the energy is like, you can do anything you put your mind to.
Like, like I said, I've been following you for a while and
and the message that you send toother people is believe in
yourself. You can fucking do it.
You can achieve it. You have greatness within you go
(11:54):
after it, but you don't ever speak to yourself like that.
I would never. You know, that's something that
I think is really powerful. Yeah, for sure.
And it goes, it goes back to as well, like I was saying, like
sometimes I just say stuff on social media to even remind
myself when I when I rehear thatstory, it's like that person's
(12:16):
talking to me. So that's the reason why
sometimes I just kind of put outthere what I want to hear from
someone else to myself because no one else out there saying it
to me. It's not getting from my dad
getting it from anyone else because now, like I feel like
sometimes just me against the world, you know, you know,
sometimes I feel a lot super lonely.
And there's been times in my life where, you know, like I
(12:36):
have been super, super lonely. And it's it's I was in a toxic
part talk about it and I was in a toxic place at one stage when
I obviously was gone through everything with my breakups and
stuff. And, you know, I did turn to
obviously, you know, drugs and alcohol at one stage early on,
which I became that. And I talk about that, you know,
openly because, you know, we getinto into those phases.
(12:59):
But yeah, there was a time whereI was very, very lonely.
But, you know, I think I me opening up and talking about
because no one knew that I was going through such a tough time
because I get into work and I'm feeling good.
I'm feeling proud. And then no one knew.
So that when I started to talk about it, I started to be and
people started kind of check up on me.
That's when I, you know, I was like, you know why I can
(13:20):
actually do this? And I overcame it and I feel
good. Yeah, feel great.
And, and and training was a massive part of that as well.
Yeah, so so sharing with. People sharing with people was
the best, was probably the best.This is what I'm doing.
And a lot of people, you know, they get scared to be like, you
know why I've gone through through like a tough time about,
you know, talking about drugs and talking about alcohol.
A lot of people turned turned tothat because, you know, it felt
(13:43):
like when I was doing that, I, Ididn't think about the outside
world at that time. And no one really knew.
So. Yeah.
Yeah, and who is in your supportnetwork?
Who? My support network.
I, I, I spoke to obviously Amy, which Amy's a massive, yeah,
part of my life. And then how is?
That how is that a support when I mean, I have plenty of
examples in in my work of couples who are far better for
(14:07):
each other and friends for each other when they're not together.
But when she was married to you.Yeah, she spoke.
To that in a critic and. Yeah, I think yeah, she was my
critic that when we were obviously in a relationship, but
now obviously that when we're not, she became that figure of
being my best friend. She's probably, you know,
there's not many people out there that she check up with me
and and those times when I was going through that should be
(14:28):
like a UK, you know, should check up on me every single day.
And she continues to do that still as well.
So, you know, I think if I hadn't opened up, I don't know,
don't know, things would have been extremely tough or who
knows where I would have been, you know?
Yeah, how, How did it show up for you when you're experiencing
a tough time? How does it look for John?
(14:49):
I mean, turning to alcohol, turning to drugs?
How? How did it?
I think it was just a lot of pressure as well to, to do
everything that I've been doing,you know, from, you know,
delivering an X amount of sessions to running to like, you
know, the business that we have to, to be in a positive role
model to so many individuals. I think all that pressure really
kind of got to me and you know, it was and even the breakup on
(15:12):
top everything was just a lot too.
It was just too much for me personally in my own, for
myself. It was just too much as an
individual to take every all that pressure on.
And then, yeah, I think that down slope really kind of, it
lasted for like, you know, a fewmonths and then, you know, just
trying to put on a brave face ontop of that.
But then it started to really affect my business.
(15:33):
It started to affect a lot of people around me.
And I lost people as well because of that.
So I'm, I'm, I'm grateful that Ican talk about it because, yeah,
not many people open up and actually want to spread that
message. You know, you can't do better.
You can't be better with support.
And with the breakup that you are reflecting on, do you mean
the one with Amy or? Do you mean the one with Simone?
(15:55):
I would say the one with Amy, the one with Simi.
I was very is very different. It was kind of, you know, I went
through like such a losing my partner for 16 years.
And I guess, you know, the the thing we've seen was the breakup
was, you know, I wasn't for me. What I hope probably hurt the
most was I wasn't going to be inmy daughter's life every single
day. And I knew that all those
(16:15):
special moments, I wasn't going to be there.
And I think that's probably whatwhat that affected me the most.
And we've me and seem, I think it's kind of, you know, like it
was just one of those things that just, it just happened.
And you know, I wish you things were very different, but they
were not. And then we kind of, you know,
I'm, I'm, I'm in a great place now.
I've got an amazing partner now.So, you know, and, and I think
(16:37):
with life, just things are just meant to happen.
And then what we got from that relationship was a beautiful
daughter that I'll always be there.
Yeah. And we, you know, that's the way
that I think about it. Yeah, yeah.
And I, I think turning to drugs and alcohol as a way of escaping
the reality of what you're goingthrough is something that a lot
of people would do. What are some of the, for lack
(16:58):
of better words, symptoms that you're experiencing that you
wanted to escape from? I think for me, the symptoms,
what I wanted to escape from during that time was probably,
it'd probably get to like, say, for example, like, you know,
when I felt super, super lonely,that's when I, that's when I'll
do it. That's when I'll, you know, I'll
(17:19):
be like, I'm feeling lonely. I'm just going to go out, I'm
going to have a drink and then I'm just going to, you know, get
on it or whatever. And then that kind of escaped me
for that time. And then all there'll be times
where I just want to make myselffall asleep.
I'd be like, fuck, I just want to go to sleep because I don't
want to be 345 hours awake. Yeah, because I feel too lonely.
So I just want to start my day and start work again.
(17:41):
Yeah, just ignore. It just ignore the day yeah,
when I should be you know, like I should be maximising go for a
walk and, you know, do some exciting holes and things which
I'm doing these days now, you know, I'm like it's just like
what? Like I was missing out on so
much, but it just, it was part of my learning experience and I
needed to experience that in order to be the person I am now.
(18:01):
Yeah, yeah. And before that break up with
Amy and that experience, what did your mental health look like
as a child with the, I guess theschooling that you experienced?
Was it throughout? School, yeah, it was throughout
school and there we, I'll tell you.
So from the seven all the way through, I reckon.
Oh yeah, there was certain situation that happened, you
(18:24):
know what I mean? I remember even one time there
was a guy, like, there was some people waiting for me after
school to stab me, like, you know what I mean?
This was in Year 8. And like experiencing all that,
all that stuff and constant bullying throughout Year 7 all
the way through to Year 12. So I think, yeah, that that kind
of was. Yeah.
(18:44):
That was a terrible time. Terrible.
Yeah. And all the way from such a
young, young age, did you feel at any point you had a support
network? I'll probably say no, I'll say
no. I didn't have a support network
because only my mum and dad, I guess, you know, but they can
(19:05):
only do so much because I'm at school as well.
And like they don't know what happens from, you know, 9 till
to 3:00 PM, you know. But yeah, I'd say I didn't have
one. And as well, like being being a
sporty kid, being in a sporting environment, we don't in those
times like, you know, we don't, no one was opening up.
We don't talk about that stuff. It'd always just be trained,
leave training, go home, train, leave training, and then that's
(19:26):
it. Yeah.
So reflecting on that now, do you think that played a part in
the tough stage that you faced later on with?
Amy Yeah, I'll tell you, it's all very related.
You know, that Like that feelinglonely and that feeling
obviously like, you know, like, I guess, you know, being being
bullied by or not aiming to bully me, you know what I mean?
(19:48):
But just saying like keywords oflike, you know, at that time
that I felt like were heartbreaking because you know,
the person that you love is saying that you're not good
enough and you know, like you're, you're breaking down
like because you're not, you're not achieving these things that
you've set out to do rather thanjust, I guess, you know, just
trying to be a supportive personrather than trying to but.
(20:10):
You know, I do mention this to her quite often, you know, and,
and obviously she'll be listening to this, I think.
Yeah, I think, yeah. But things are great.
Like, you know, she's definitelya much, much, much more
supportive person now as a best friend.
Yeah, Yeah. I guess I feel like listening to
this, a lot of the external things in your life have shifted
(20:33):
in terms of the support network that you have and and the people
that you can turn to. But it sounds like the the
internal one is definitely starting to shift.
Yeah, but it sounds like he's still.
Yes, still probably. Your own biggest.
Bully, right, yeah, 100%. I'd definitely say I am my
biggest and I'm my worst criticsbecause once again, I feel like,
(20:54):
you know, I feel like I do suffer.
Yeah, a lot of pain, like a lot of still, I still suffer a lot
of pain from, you know, and it's, it could be from like you
said, like from my childhood andjust kind of following through
to high school to, to everythingto now everything that's
happening with my love, what's happening with my life to, you
know, still continue to, to experience that.
(21:15):
But I think you know the best way that I is just trying to
accept things and just try to write down your emotions and
just, I think, yeah, that's helping me a lot lately.
So what does self? Care look like now I think self
care, Yeah, well, it's quite funny.
I think what I should say, it's funny stuff.
(21:35):
Funny at all. I feel like, you know, even with
my like what I've really valued about my current pioneers, you
know, the every single day we dolike a debrief about our day and
like how we're feeling in our emotions.
And I think that that's kind of that's helped me so much.
And, you know, and we've been dating now just over four months
and from the get go, it's kind of like, you know, she's, that's
kind of something that she lovesto do and it's really worked
(21:58):
really well. And I've seen such a positive
impact from that. Just debriefing your emotions
and debriefing your days every single day, like a dinner table,
no phones, no nothing. It's just be just, you know, she
cooked dinner and then we'll talk about it.
Yeah, yeah. So actually slowing down enough.
To acknowledge. What is happening in my inner
world right now? Because you spend.
So much time. Yeah, what?
(22:19):
What's happening in your outer world and making sure there's
enough metals on the wall, so tospeak.
You're not spending any time reflecting on what's happening
in my own life and my own feelings and my own body.
And I also feel like, you know, someone's there listening and
wanting the best for me and supporting me, you know, which
is something I probably never really.
(22:39):
It's very fun, yeah. Do you feel like you don't have
to answer this either because it's a personal relationship
question, But do you feel like you ever gone through stages in
that four months where you've rejected it and you've rejected
thinking that there might be something wrong with the
relationship or wrong with it because it's so foreign?
No, no, not at all. I've kind of embraced how, how
(23:00):
foreign it is. And I, I tell her, you know what
I always tell EMS like, how likehow amazing this, all this new
stuff is to me because it it like in previous times with the
relationship with Amy, it'd be like, like you'd get home, but
then there would, would just be talking about work you'd never
be about like, how like, how areyou feeling?
How's your, you know, how's your, you know, Yeah, exactly.
(23:20):
Like you just did whatever X amount of sessions.
Like, how are you feeling? Are you exhausted?
Are you mentally exhausted? Like what are you feeling in
your head? Like what's going on?
And that kind of never happened.So to experience this now, it's
just been just a whole lot of positivity.
Yeah, yeah. And such a different shift to
what it. Was different shift of big time
(23:41):
yeah and yeah. And I feel like, you know, some
old time would come into my lifelike that is I've never had
someone like that before. And I tell her all the time,
yeah, whether she believes me ornot, just, you know, And I hope
she does, but she'll be listening.
Anyway, yeah, yeah, in your lowest point, what would a
normal day look like for you? Oh, it'd be my.
(24:01):
It'd be just kind of, you know, just walk through the walk
through the doors at work and then just knock out my 12:14
sessions, which at. Like 4. 30 at 4:30 in the
morning and then and then finishwork and then go put on a brave
face, a happy, happy face at an event.
Yeah. Or a photo or whatever it is
like a whatever I was doing backthen.
Anyway, it was a photo shoot or whatever.
(24:22):
It was a potty. Potty, another potty, whatever,
you know, you probably get like a like a fake kind of me, like,
you know, and not opening up andbeing like very like like I
wouldn't be stealing from the heart.
I always be my answers were verykind of calculated.
You know, you get the calculatedJohno.
I feel like because I was just, you know, there, he just felt
like I was just ticking along, ticking along and wasn't
(24:42):
connecting with any emotion. And, and people I've known,
people sometimes notice that people they don't whatever, but
in my life, I always feel like people always create.
They just say the best things. It's just like you're doing so
well, you know, you're doing great, you're good, you know,
you're great at what you do, youlook good, whatever it is, but
it's never like, it's never likea hard critic, you know, So
that's something that's happenedas well.
(25:04):
So. You'd leave, yeah, whatever the
event is in the afternoon or night, and then either go out,
start drinking, getting on. It or.
Go. Home.
And do the same thing until you fell.
Asleep or they'll be taught. Yeah, I guess I could, yeah,
Correct exactly what you said there.
Or it'd be like, you know, I would actually book something in
to, to, to, to, to drinking and on it because it'd be like, oh,
(25:26):
that would be in my mind. I'd be like, oh, that feeling of
escape and feeling of, of that sensation would be would be what
I was creating every single weekbecause my Monday to Friday was
just there was nothing there. Yeah, yeah.
And you were living alone at this stage.
Yeah. What was this?
What it mean at the stage where so I broke out of them and then
I moved in with one of my with my friends.
(25:46):
And then after I broke out with Simi, I continued to live in
Bondi. But in those both phases I've
I've I've felt learning. Yeah, which for a lot of people
is a strange sensation when you're probably never actually
alone. Like you have people around you.
All the time, all the time. But inside it, it's so lonely.
(26:10):
Yeah, yeah. And that's true what you just
said that. Yeah.
Or no way. That's got me thinking.
Yeah, you're so right. Yeah.
You know, I've always had, but I've always had people around
me. But inside I've just feel
lonely. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
That's a good one. How does that feel like when you
say that? Yeah, it hurts.
Yeah, it's not good. Yeah.
(26:32):
Yeah, it's not good. It's really hard, Yeah.
It's a. Good one, and.
It's like, I think a really valuable thing to take away from
today's conversation is not to make yourself healing into a
project and not to make it another thing that you've got to
(26:57):
grind after, you know, because in some ways my personality is
similar in that I just want to keep achieving and, you know,
got to go, go, go. And probably just before I had
my son, I realised that I was even making my healing journey A
to do list. Like I was even making that like
(27:18):
a look how far I've come, you know, And it's it's a trap that
people who are always like got to be better, got to achieve
more that we can fall into. And I think it's something just
to be mindful of is it's like, you know, actually if I did
nothing, just being me, that is an achievement.
And just learning to just say that that's OK rather than
(27:42):
everything you said you want to do is freaking awesome.
Phone free time, getaways, you know, having someone you open up
to, connecting your emotions, writing them down, that's
amazing. All these things I would
recommend to clients to do, but just making sure that you don't
make this another thing that Jono has to strive for and Jono
has to achieve. Jono is good enough just being
(28:02):
Jono. And I think that that is a
really beautiful thing for you to truly, truly believe and feel
that just the way you are is good enough.
Not once you've done all the stuff that you say you want to
do this year. You know what I mean?
How do you how do you feel hearing that?
Like, you know, it feels, feels positive.
It feels like, you know, like just words that I need to be
(28:26):
like, not need to be heard. That I've, that I've been
wanting to hear, you know, wanting to be like hearing these
type of words. But yeah, it feels, I feel, it's
hard to describe the feeling to me.
Yeah. Yeah, well, like the last thing
I would love to hear from you isif if that kid was here.
Yeah, yeah. How do you think?
(28:48):
I mean, what, what, what would you really want to say to him
right now, do you think? If I was in, I'd probably say,
you know, it's going to be, it'sgoing to be a whirlwind of a, of
a journey. But at the end of the day,
you're going to be fine. And everything you've always
wanted to to do, not just yourself, like career wise to
(29:09):
everything that you've always wanted to do to build like a,
like a positive community. You know, a strong family is, is
always going to be, is going to be there and you are going to
have everything you've always wanted to to do.
And that doesn't mean that just means being able to be family
because at the end of the day, you know, I want to want to be
family. I want, that's exactly what I
(29:29):
wanted. I want my daughter to have
everything that I didn't have. And and I know that that little
boy when I was seven, yeah, he'sgoing to do all that.
Yeah, yeah. I think he also, he really
deserves to hear that. He's good enough and he really
deserves to hear that. Yeah, everything's going to be
(29:50):
OK for sure, absolutely. But he deserves to hear.
You're an amazing human and you are loved for just the person
that you are and you are good enough just the way that you
are. And I really hope that you can
start to believe that for him. And you know, you can maybe walk
out of here today metaphoricallytake his hand.
(30:13):
Come on, mate, I've got you. You didn't get the treatment
that you deserved. Maybe your parents, I don't know
them. They could have been wonderful
parents. Parents do the best they can,
right? But sometimes the best that they
can isn't good enough. And I think that it's, it's
important to kind of go, I've got you now, mate.
And I'm, I am going to give you the love that you didn't get.
(30:35):
And I am going to give you the treatment that you didn't get.
And it just happens that you nowhave an amazing partner to do it
with you, but that you are goingto take his hand and, and you
are going to start giving him the love that he deserves to get
and those feelings that he deserves to get.
Thank. You thanks Sir.
I think you should be extremely proud of yourself.
(30:57):
Sharing stories is profoundly powerful.
It's why Mitch created Hard on My Sleeve.
Him hearing somebody else's mental health story literally
stopped him from committing suicide and saved his life.
So he started hard on my sleeve and now it's whole purpose is
way hard on your sleeve and it'shard for people to do that.
(31:19):
And you did it today. You freaking owned it.
And that's amazing. I think not just for you, but
for everybody hearing this, you know, acknowledging what you've
been through and what you continue to go through, I think
is it's so strong and it resembles so much power more
(31:39):
than any other accolade that canhang on a wall.
So thank you so much for joiningus today.
Thanks. For having me Thank you.
Thanks. So I was good.
It was really good. I've so glad that I came today
as well, You know, and anyone out there who is listening, I
hope my story kind of inspires you to to talk and speak up or
even, you know, reach out to me or reach out to yourself.
(32:01):
Happy to tell you my story even a little bit deeper if you need.
Yeah. Well, I would love that.
We'll have to come back for Part2.
Thank you so much for today and I will see you all in the next
episode. Emotions have a natural tendency
to dissipate unless they get reinforced.
And so if there's more thoughts,more stories, more intentions
(32:21):
that come along, so the act of how am I leaving it alone is an
act of not act, adding more stories, adding fuel to it.
So it might not go away in 2 minutes, but it then begins to
relax and dissipate. And so rather than being the
person who has to fix it, we've become the person who makes
space for the heart, the mind, to relax and settle away itself.
All right, run it. I wonder what you mean when you
use the word I use the word I I I kick a break.
We have an aversion to. Ourselves and to what's
happening. Inside us.
(00:22):
Inside us. I've been very interested in
this for a long, long time. Something settles.
Hi guys, and welcome back to theHeart of My Sleeve podcast.
I am your host today Michaela Overman, psychologist and lead
(00:43):
Clinical Director of the charity.
And today I am joined by Jono Castano, the gym owner of Acero
Gyms, which is a really amazing gym here in Sydney.
And today he's here to share, I guess, a slightly different side
of himself that he maybe wouldn't.
But thank you so much for joining us today.
(01:03):
Thanks for having me. I think, you know, you said
share, share something that people don't know about and I
think that's super important. And I think that's the reason
why I do personally love to kindof jump on podcast because you
know, what you see on social media and what you see, you
know, you know, where wherever you may say that person is, is
not, you know, what that person is about.
You know, I think for me personally, people always just
(01:24):
jump straight away to why John is doing this, John is doing
that, but they have no idea in terms of like the effect of what
long hours of work can do what, you know, relationship break
UPS, everything, you know? So I think for me, you know,
jumping on this is going to be good.
I reckon it's going to be great.Yeah, and it's, it's so true,
especially when you do have a really big social media
(01:46):
following and social media presence and people speak about
it all the time, about what we show on social media can be
really different. But you do show quite often.
I mean, I've followed you for a while now how much you grind and
the 3:00 AM starts and you know,the crazy amount of PT sessions
you do and, and I can imagine the toll that, that, that that
(02:06):
takes. But I guess I would, I would
kind of like to start by asking you a little bit different to
just tell me a bit about yourself.
But what? What is something that you think
that people wouldn't know about Jono?
I'd probably say what people wouldn't know is, you know, how
like, sometimes, you know, when I'm, when I'm sitting still,
(02:28):
sometimes I actually feel like, you know, I've got that
impossible syndrome. And I feel like everything that
I've kind of do every single daydoesn't really kind of, I don't
deserve it. I feel like I feel like that a
lot. And what that tends to suffer is
I tend to achieve something and then I don't even appreciate it,
you know, like I'm even my partner and I were talking about
and she's like, you know, I'm launching my, my fragrance with
(02:49):
Chemist Warehouse. And then I, I tell her and she's
like, she's more excited and excited than I am.
And I'm like, and then I'm like,she's like, I'd like, why don't
you like smile? Why don't you want to do like,
why are you like super happy? And I'm like, I don't know, I
just, I'm trying to attach like an emotion to it and I can't, I,
I just, I don't know why I can't.
And it's something I'm trying towork on.
It's, you know, when I feel emotion, I try to like, do like
(03:11):
a write down what I'm feeling. But it's just, yeah, it's just I
feel like people don't like, know that about me.
There's almost like a disconnectbetween what you're experiencing
factually and what you're experiencing emotionally.
Your brains kind of separating the two.
Yeah, I'd say so. Yeah, yeah.
Separating the two like there's just like everything like I do
(03:34):
like I achieve, like, you know, if it's a front cover or it's
like an amazing, like a massive job.
I just, you know, I'm like, I just can't put.
It in What's next? Yeah, what's next?
And I don't know if it's becauseI keep there's so many things on
the horizon that don't like. I feel like maybe just because
I'm doing so much, there's no like, there's no like, I can't
put it a feeling to. Yeah, yeah.
And I think that that is something that is in 2025
(03:57):
actually pretty common for a lotof people to kind of go, it's so
go, go, go loud. The world is so loud, you know,
social media and doing that and running gyms and, and doing all
the things that you do being a parent.
It's it's really, really busy. But more often than not, when
(04:18):
you really disconnect from your emotions, it's coming from some
reason that's a little bit deeper than just being 2025.
So I'd love to understand a little bit about where did you
grow up and how do you think howyou grew up kind of shaped the
person that you are today? So I guess like for me
personally, I grew up in a smalltown in Colombia.
(04:39):
It's a it's a place called Lavidhinia, which you know, when
you talk to people, they have noidea where that is.
Even Colombians. It's a very small town and, and
a lot of the town, the main job is sugar canes are kind of kind
of sugar canes. And it's a very like low, low
salary place. And it's kind of like if they,
if you're not a late sportsman, if you're not like a musician,
(05:00):
if you're not doing any of those, there's no way out.
So my dad actually took the recent migrate here in 98, which
I'm so grateful for that he tookthe opportunity.
But you know, life there is very, very, very tough.
Like I cannot explain how tough it is.
And every time that I go back there, it brings me back down to
reality and it makes me that them doing that and coming back
(05:22):
here, that's when I feel super grateful.
That's why I constantly post a lot of like my hometown, even
through my social media. It's actually not for people.
It's actually for myself to remind me.
And a lot of quotes even, like Ijust post stuff up and that's
just to remind me, not even anyone else.
So when I watch that, then I must share.
OK, I've, I did, you know, I need to go back into that to
feel grateful. But yeah, that's kind of a
(05:45):
little bit like to cut it short,that's like my little spill and
like where I grew up from. But how old were you?
I was a seven years old. Yeah, seven years old when I
came over and. Wow, it was a yeah, like from
what I remember anyway, it was, it was extremely tough because,
you know, obviously not understand, like not knowing
English was like like a like a massive thing back then.
I just too, I remember even getting bullied at school
(06:07):
because I was one of those kids of not knowing obviously
English. And you know, and then I grew up
in mascot and then I was a sporty kid.
I used to play a lot of soccer and then my parents moved out
West because that's kind of where all the sports schools
schools are, which I managed to do.
But yeah, a lot of that, like, you know, my whole life, you
know, was that kind of remembering that stage of it,
(06:30):
like just getting bullied and need some.
Yeah, It's quite. Yeah.
I think maybe maybe that's got abit of a, I don't know.
I don't know. Yeah, well, I mean, you, you go
from living the kind of life like you did, which in itself
has so many layers for a young 7year old kid.
Like I'm imagining. I mean, my stepdaughter's seven.
I'm imagining her having to moveto a totally different country,
(06:53):
not understanding the language, vastly different cultural
experiences. Your parents probably
experiencing fear and anxiety and worry of are we going to be
OK here? And that coming on to you, you
know, that's, that's a really big thing for a 7 year old to go
through. And then you Chuck on top of
that being bullied at school, That's heartbreaking to imagine.
(07:14):
Yeah, it was. Yeah.
You know, it's still still thinking about itself in these
days because it kind of I feel like even that's just even kind
of like fueled me to once again just, you know, do so much
better and always go above and beyond and just prove people
wrong, you know? Yeah.
(07:34):
What do you think it makes you want to do for yourself, though?
I mean, a lot of that is like proving other people wrong that
someone who is bullied, it's like almost like, well, fuck
you, look, look what I can do. And coming from such a small
town, it's the same thing there.Like, look what I've achieved,
Right. But what about, like, for your
(07:55):
own heart and soul? Like, I guess I wonder how does
it. I mean, now I know you have a
little one year old, right? She's yeah, yeah.
Even just, you know, touching a chair like, you know, I think
like a lot of it even now, like the stuff that I do now is
obviously like driven towards her future and stuff like that.
But then once again, you just mentioned, you know, what about
for myself. And I think I'm like that type
(08:17):
of person in my life where I'm always doing stuff for other
people, but then always neglect,you know, putting aside time
aside for myself, you know, and,you know, even like my partner
now, she gets surprised on how much like, like stuff I actually
do and like for her. And like, how I kind of want to
like, you know, it's like a book, a dinner, if it's like
book, something like simple thatshe's mentioned.
(08:38):
And like, she's never met someone like that.
And I'm not sure if it's a good thing or it's a bad thing.
But yeah, I kind of neglect myself a lot putting time for
myself and I the only times thatI probably in my life where I'm
like, you know what, I've kind of been able to relax and feel
good about it. Everything is probably like when
I've been to Mudgie, when I've gone away, like on a very quiet
(09:00):
trip where I can just kind of hear the sound of the, the water
and like just so simple things and off my phone completely.
I feel like that's kind of whereI found myself.
And that's why this year I've actually, it's quite like, I've
actually decided to plan a lot more trips this year in terms of
like more the Outback and get toknow Australia more.
And I've actually like really enjoyed doing that.
So I've actually planned something every single month and
(09:22):
this just to take 3-4 days off work and put time aside for
myself. And yeah.
Yeah, which would be a really foreign feeling for you.
Yeah, it is. Because I, I, I've just, I used
to stress out about taking days off work and I'd get, I'd take
1-2 days off work and I'd be like, fuck, I'm not doing it.
And, and it's kind of goes back to, I guess my, my mum and dad,
(09:45):
just like my dad really kind of always just being you're not
good enough, you're not doing enough, you're not good enough.
And then that's kind of just installed in my head.
Yeah, yeah. And then I've just, yeah, like,
you know, I've kind of even there's this times of even like
with my ex wife Amy, when I still recall like even like days
where she like be angry. She's like, you're such a waste
of time. And that kind of just repeats in
(10:05):
my mind a lot. And I think like just those
little things just really push me.
Yeah to yeah. Yeah, I mean, your dad used
those actual words with you. It wasn't a, it wasn't even just
a feeling you got from him. It was words that he used with
you. And how our parents talk to us
is how our inner critic forms. Like that voice doesn't just
(10:26):
exist. It comes from how our parents
speak to us and how they speak to themselves.
So I mean, it'd be really, really hard to shut that down
when that's what's been instilled in you is you're not
good enough, you're not achieving enough.
I mean, it's no wonder that now you have that experience of,
like, cool, I've launched A fragrance, cool, my gym's hugely
(10:48):
successful, Cool, my social media following is skyrocketing.
Cool, I'm achieving all this shit.
What's next? I got to do more because I'm not
enough who I am as a person. That's so hard.
Yeah. It's, it's, it's quite tough.
And I think like we spoke about,you know, and, you know, people
think it's all amazing things, but at the end of the day,
sometimes, you know, achieving more and achieving bigger
(11:10):
things, it's not always like a good feeling, you know?
It's always like, you know, yeah.
Yeah, you know, it's, I don't know you right, But I'm, I'm
really, really proud hearing yousay these things because it's it
is extremely hard to say that kind of stuff when I mean, look
(11:32):
at the size of this guy, right? Muscley and big.
And like the presence that you have on social media is big and
the energy is like, you can do anything you put your mind to.
Like, like I said, I've been following you for a while and
and the message that you send toother people is believe in
yourself. You can fucking do it.
You can achieve it. You have greatness within you go
(11:54):
after it, but you don't ever speak to yourself like that.
I would never. You know, that's something that
I think is really powerful. Yeah, for sure.
And it goes, it goes back to as well, like I was saying, like
sometimes I just say stuff on social media to even remind
myself when I when I rehear thatstory, it's like that person's
(12:16):
talking to me. So that's the reason why
sometimes I just kind of put outthere what I want to hear from
someone else to myself because no one else out there saying it
to me. It's not getting from my dad
getting it from anyone else because now, like I feel like
sometimes just me against the world, you know, you know,
sometimes I feel a lot super lonely.
And there's been times in my life where, you know, like I
(12:36):
have been super, super lonely. And it's it's I was in a toxic
part talk about it and I was in a toxic place at one stage when
I obviously was gone through everything with my breakups and
stuff. And, you know, I did turn to
obviously, you know, drugs and alcohol at one stage early on,
which I became that. And I talk about that, you know,
openly because, you know, we getinto into those phases.
(12:59):
But yeah, there was a time whereI was very, very lonely.
But, you know, I think I me opening up and talking about
because no one knew that I was going through such a tough time
because I get into work and I'm feeling good.
I'm feeling proud. And then no one knew.
So that when I started to talk about it, I started to be and
people started kind of check up on me.
That's when I, you know, I was like, you know why I can
(13:20):
actually do this? And I overcame it and I feel
good. Yeah, feel great.
And, and and training was a massive part of that as well.
Yeah, so so sharing with. People sharing with people was
the best, was probably the best.This is what I'm doing.
And a lot of people, you know, they get scared to be like, you
know why I've gone through through like a tough time about,
you know, talking about drugs and talking about alcohol.
A lot of people turned turned tothat because, you know, it felt
(13:43):
like when I was doing that, I, Ididn't think about the outside
world at that time. And no one really knew.
So. Yeah.
Yeah, and who is in your supportnetwork?
Who? My support network.
I, I, I spoke to obviously Amy, which Amy's a massive, yeah,
part of my life. And then how is?
That how is that a support when I mean, I have plenty of
examples in in my work of couples who are far better for
(14:07):
each other and friends for each other when they're not together.
But when she was married to you.Yeah, she spoke.
To that in a critic and. Yeah, I think yeah, she was my
critic that when we were obviously in a relationship, but
now obviously that when we're not, she became that figure of
being my best friend. She's probably, you know,
there's not many people out there that she check up with me
and and those times when I was going through that should be
(14:28):
like a UK, you know, should check up on me every single day.
And she continues to do that still as well.
So, you know, I think if I hadn't opened up, I don't know,
don't know, things would have been extremely tough or who
knows where I would have been, you know?
Yeah, how, How did it show up for you when you're experiencing
a tough time? How does it look for John?
(14:49):
I mean, turning to alcohol, turning to drugs?
How? How did it?
I think it was just a lot of pressure as well to, to do
everything that I've been doing,you know, from, you know,
delivering an X amount of sessions to running to like, you
know, the business that we have to, to be in a positive role
model to so many individuals. I think all that pressure really
kind of got to me and you know, it was and even the breakup on
(15:12):
top everything was just a lot too.
It was just too much for me personally in my own, for
myself. It was just too much as an
individual to take every all that pressure on.
And then, yeah, I think that down slope really kind of, it
lasted for like, you know, a fewmonths and then, you know, just
trying to put on a brave face ontop of that.
But then it started to really affect my business.
(15:33):
It started to affect a lot of people around me.
And I lost people as well because of that.
So I'm, I'm, I'm grateful that Ican talk about it because, yeah,
not many people open up and actually want to spread that
message. You know, you can't do better.
You can't be better with support.
And with the breakup that you are reflecting on, do you mean
the one with Amy or? Do you mean the one with Simone?
(15:55):
I would say the one with Amy, the one with Simi.
I was very is very different. It was kind of, you know, I went
through like such a losing my partner for 16 years.
And I guess, you know, the the thing we've seen was the breakup
was, you know, I wasn't for me. What I hope probably hurt the
most was I wasn't going to be inmy daughter's life every single
day. And I knew that all those
(16:15):
special moments, I wasn't going to be there.
And I think that's probably whatwhat that affected me the most.
And we've me and seem, I think it's kind of, you know, like it
was just one of those things that just, it just happened.
And you know, I wish you things were very different, but they
were not. And then we kind of, you know,
I'm, I'm, I'm in a great place now.
I've got an amazing partner now.So, you know, and, and I think
(16:37):
with life, just things are just meant to happen.
And then what we got from that relationship was a beautiful
daughter that I'll always be there.
Yeah. And we, you know, that's the way
that I think about it. Yeah, yeah.
And I, I think turning to drugs and alcohol as a way of escaping
the reality of what you're goingthrough is something that a lot
of people would do. What are some of the, for lack
(16:58):
of better words, symptoms that you're experiencing that you
wanted to escape from? I think for me, the symptoms,
what I wanted to escape from during that time was probably,
it'd probably get to like, say, for example, like, you know,
when I felt super, super lonely,that's when I, that's when I'll
do it. That's when I'll, you know, I'll
(17:19):
be like, I'm feeling lonely. I'm just going to go out, I'm
going to have a drink and then I'm just going to, you know, get
on it or whatever. And then that kind of escaped me
for that time. And then all there'll be times
where I just want to make myselffall asleep.
I'd be like, fuck, I just want to go to sleep because I don't
want to be 345 hours awake. Yeah, because I feel too lonely.
So I just want to start my day and start work again.
(17:41):
Yeah, just ignore. It just ignore the day yeah,
when I should be you know, like I should be maximising go for a
walk and, you know, do some exciting holes and things which
I'm doing these days now, you know, I'm like it's just like
what? Like I was missing out on so
much, but it just, it was part of my learning experience and I
needed to experience that in order to be the person I am now.
(18:01):
Yeah, yeah. And before that break up with
Amy and that experience, what did your mental health look like
as a child with the, I guess theschooling that you experienced?
Was it throughout? School, yeah, it was throughout
school and there we, I'll tell you.
So from the seven all the way through, I reckon.
Oh yeah, there was certain situation that happened, you
(18:24):
know what I mean? I remember even one time there
was a guy, like, there was some people waiting for me after
school to stab me, like, you know what I mean?
This was in Year 8. And like experiencing all that,
all that stuff and constant bullying throughout Year 7 all
the way through to Year 12. So I think, yeah, that that kind
of was. Yeah.
(18:44):
That was a terrible time. Terrible.
Yeah. And all the way from such a
young, young age, did you feel at any point you had a support
network? I'll probably say no, I'll say
no. I didn't have a support network
because only my mum and dad, I guess, you know, but they can
(19:05):
only do so much because I'm at school as well.
And like they don't know what happens from, you know, 9 till
to 3:00 PM, you know. But yeah, I'd say I didn't have
one. And as well, like being being a
sporty kid, being in a sporting environment, we don't in those
times like, you know, we don't, no one was opening up.
We don't talk about that stuff. It'd always just be trained,
leave training, go home, train, leave training, and then that's
(19:26):
it. Yeah.
So reflecting on that now, do you think that played a part in
the tough stage that you faced later on with?
Amy Yeah, I'll tell you, it's all very related.
You know, that Like that feelinglonely and that feeling
obviously like, you know, like, I guess, you know, being being
bullied by or not aiming to bully me, you know what I mean?
(19:48):
But just saying like keywords oflike, you know, at that time
that I felt like were heartbreaking because you know,
the person that you love is saying that you're not good
enough and you know, like you're, you're breaking down
like because you're not, you're not achieving these things that
you've set out to do rather thanjust, I guess, you know, just
trying to be a supportive personrather than trying to but.
(20:10):
You know, I do mention this to her quite often, you know, and,
and obviously she'll be listening to this, I think.
Yeah, I think, yeah. But things are great.
Like, you know, she's definitelya much, much, much more
supportive person now as a best friend.
Yeah, Yeah. I guess I feel like listening to
this, a lot of the external things in your life have shifted
(20:33):
in terms of the support network that you have and and the people
that you can turn to. But it sounds like the the
internal one is definitely starting to shift.
Yeah, but it sounds like he's still.
Yes, still probably. Your own biggest.
Bully, right, yeah, 100%. I'd definitely say I am my
biggest and I'm my worst criticsbecause once again, I feel like,
(20:54):
you know, I feel like I do suffer.
Yeah, a lot of pain, like a lot of still, I still suffer a lot
of pain from, you know, and it's, it could be from like you
said, like from my childhood andjust kind of following through
to high school to, to everythingto now everything that's
happening with my love, what's happening with my life to, you
know, still continue to, to experience that.
(21:15):
But I think you know the best way that I is just trying to
accept things and just try to write down your emotions and
just, I think, yeah, that's helping me a lot lately.
So what does self? Care look like now I think self
care, Yeah, well, it's quite funny.
I think what I should say, it's funny stuff.
(21:35):
Funny at all. I feel like, you know, even with
my like what I've really valued about my current pioneers, you
know, the every single day we dolike a debrief about our day and
like how we're feeling in our emotions.
And I think that that's kind of that's helped me so much.
And, you know, and we've been dating now just over four months
and from the get go, it's kind of like, you know, she's, that's
kind of something that she lovesto do and it's really worked
(21:58):
really well. And I've seen such a positive
impact from that. Just debriefing your emotions
and debriefing your days every single day, like a dinner table,
no phones, no nothing. It's just be just, you know, she
cooked dinner and then we'll talk about it.
Yeah, yeah. So actually slowing down enough.
To acknowledge. What is happening in my inner
world right now? Because you spend.
So much time. Yeah, what?
(22:19):
What's happening in your outer world and making sure there's
enough metals on the wall, so tospeak.
You're not spending any time reflecting on what's happening
in my own life and my own feelings and my own body.
And I also feel like, you know, someone's there listening and
wanting the best for me and supporting me, you know, which
is something I probably never really.
(22:39):
It's very fun, yeah. Do you feel like you don't have
to answer this either because it's a personal relationship
question, But do you feel like you ever gone through stages in
that four months where you've rejected it and you've rejected
thinking that there might be something wrong with the
relationship or wrong with it because it's so foreign?
No, no, not at all. I've kind of embraced how, how
(23:00):
foreign it is. And I, I tell her, you know what
I always tell EMS like, how likehow amazing this, all this new
stuff is to me because it it like in previous times with the
relationship with Amy, it'd be like, like you'd get home, but
then there would, would just be talking about work you'd never
be about like, how like, how areyou feeling?
How's your, you know, how's your, you know, Yeah, exactly.
(23:20):
Like you just did whatever X amount of sessions.
Like, how are you feeling? Are you exhausted?
Are you mentally exhausted? Like what are you feeling in
your head? Like what's going on?
And that kind of never happened.So to experience this now, it's
just been just a whole lot of positivity.
Yeah, yeah. And such a different shift to
what it. Was different shift of big time
(23:41):
yeah and yeah. And I feel like, you know, some
old time would come into my lifelike that is I've never had
someone like that before. And I tell her all the time,
yeah, whether she believes me ornot, just, you know, And I hope
she does, but she'll be listening.
Anyway, yeah, yeah, in your lowest point, what would a
normal day look like for you? Oh, it'd be my.
(24:01):
It'd be just kind of, you know, just walk through the walk
through the doors at work and then just knock out my 12:14
sessions, which at. Like 4. 30 at 4:30 in the
morning and then and then finishwork and then go put on a brave
face, a happy, happy face at an event.
Yeah. Or a photo or whatever it is
like a whatever I was doing backthen.
Anyway, it was a photo shoot or whatever.
(24:22):
It was a potty. Potty, another potty, whatever,
you know, you probably get like a like a fake kind of me, like,
you know, and not opening up andbeing like very like like I
wouldn't be stealing from the heart.
I always be my answers were verykind of calculated.
You know, you get the calculatedJohno.
I feel like because I was just, you know, there, he just felt
like I was just ticking along, ticking along and wasn't
(24:42):
connecting with any emotion. And, and people I've known,
people sometimes notice that people they don't whatever, but
in my life, I always feel like people always create.
They just say the best things. It's just like you're doing so
well, you know, you're doing great, you're good, you know,
you're great at what you do, youlook good, whatever it is, but
it's never like, it's never likea hard critic, you know, So
that's something that's happenedas well.
(25:04):
So. You'd leave, yeah, whatever the
event is in the afternoon or night, and then either go out,
start drinking, getting on. It or.
Go. Home.
And do the same thing until you fell.
Asleep or they'll be taught. Yeah, I guess I could, yeah,
Correct exactly what you said there.
Or it'd be like, you know, I would actually book something in
to, to, to, to, to drinking and on it because it'd be like, oh,
(25:26):
that would be in my mind. I'd be like, oh, that feeling of
escape and feeling of, of that sensation would be would be what
I was creating every single weekbecause my Monday to Friday was
just there was nothing there. Yeah, yeah.
And you were living alone at this stage.
Yeah. What was this?
What it mean at the stage where so I broke out of them and then
I moved in with one of my with my friends.
(25:46):
And then after I broke out with Simi, I continued to live in
Bondi. But in those both phases I've
I've I've felt learning. Yeah, which for a lot of people
is a strange sensation when you're probably never actually
alone. Like you have people around you.
All the time, all the time. But inside it, it's so lonely.
(26:10):
Yeah, yeah. And that's true what you just
said that. Yeah.
Or no way. That's got me thinking.
Yeah, you're so right. Yeah.
You know, I've always had, but I've always had people around
me. But inside I've just feel
lonely. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
That's a good one. How does that feel like when you
say that? Yeah, it hurts.
Yeah, it's not good. Yeah.
(26:32):
Yeah, it's not good. It's really hard, Yeah.
It's a. Good one, and.
It's like, I think a really valuable thing to take away from
today's conversation is not to make yourself healing into a
project and not to make it another thing that you've got to
(26:57):
grind after, you know, because in some ways my personality is
similar in that I just want to keep achieving and, you know,
got to go, go, go. And probably just before I had
my son, I realised that I was even making my healing journey A
to do list. Like I was even making that like
(27:18):
a look how far I've come, you know, And it's it's a trap that
people who are always like got to be better, got to achieve
more that we can fall into. And I think it's something just
to be mindful of is it's like, you know, actually if I did
nothing, just being me, that is an achievement.
And just learning to just say that that's OK rather than
(27:42):
everything you said you want to do is freaking awesome.
Phone free time, getaways, you know, having someone you open up
to, connecting your emotions, writing them down, that's
amazing. All these things I would
recommend to clients to do, but just making sure that you don't
make this another thing that Jono has to strive for and Jono
has to achieve. Jono is good enough just being
(28:02):
Jono. And I think that that is a
really beautiful thing for you to truly, truly believe and feel
that just the way you are is good enough.
Not once you've done all the stuff that you say you want to
do this year. You know what I mean?
How do you how do you feel hearing that?
Like, you know, it feels, feels positive.
It feels like, you know, like just words that I need to be
(28:26):
like, not need to be heard. That I've, that I've been
wanting to hear, you know, wanting to be like hearing these
type of words. But yeah, it feels, I feel, it's
hard to describe the feeling to me.
Yeah. Yeah, well, like the last thing
I would love to hear from you isif if that kid was here.
Yeah, yeah. How do you think?
(28:48):
I mean, what, what, what would you really want to say to him
right now, do you think? If I was in, I'd probably say,
you know, it's going to be, it'sgoing to be a whirlwind of a, of
a journey. But at the end of the day,
you're going to be fine. And everything you've always
wanted to to do, not just yourself, like career wise to
(29:09):
everything that you've always wanted to do to build like a,
like a positive community. You know, a strong family is, is
always going to be, is going to be there and you are going to
have everything you've always wanted to to do.
And that doesn't mean that just means being able to be family
because at the end of the day, you know, I want to want to be
family. I want, that's exactly what I
(29:29):
wanted. I want my daughter to have
everything that I didn't have. And and I know that that little
boy when I was seven, yeah, he'sgoing to do all that.
Yeah, yeah. I think he also, he really
deserves to hear that. He's good enough and he really
deserves to hear that. Yeah, everything's going to be
(29:50):
OK for sure, absolutely. But he deserves to hear.
You're an amazing human and you are loved for just the person
that you are and you are good enough just the way that you
are. And I really hope that you can
start to believe that for him. And you know, you can maybe walk
out of here today metaphoricallytake his hand.
(30:13):
Come on, mate, I've got you. You didn't get the treatment
that you deserved. Maybe your parents, I don't know
them. They could have been wonderful
parents. Parents do the best they can,
right? But sometimes the best that they
can isn't good enough. And I think that it's, it's
important to kind of go, I've got you now, mate.
And I'm, I am going to give you the love that you didn't get.
(30:35):
And I am going to give you the treatment that you didn't get.
And it just happens that you nowhave an amazing partner to do it
with you, but that you are goingto take his hand and, and you
are going to start giving him the love that he deserves to get
and those feelings that he deserves to get.
Thank. You thanks Sir.
I think you should be extremely proud of yourself.
(30:57):
Sharing stories is profoundly powerful.
It's why Mitch created Hard on My Sleeve.
Him hearing somebody else's mental health story literally
stopped him from committing suicide and saved his life.
So he started hard on my sleeve and now it's whole purpose is
way hard on your sleeve and it'shard for people to do that.
(31:19):
And you did it today. You freaking owned it.
And that's amazing. I think not just for you, but
for everybody hearing this, you know, acknowledging what you've
been through and what you continue to go through, I think
is it's so strong and it resembles so much power more
(31:39):
than any other accolade that canhang on a wall.
So thank you so much for joiningus today.
Thanks. For having me Thank you.
Thanks. So I was good.
It was really good. I've so glad that I came today
as well, You know, and anyone out there who is listening, I
hope my story kind of inspires you to to talk and speak up or
even, you know, reach out to me or reach out to yourself.
(32:01):
Happy to tell you my story even a little bit deeper if you need.
Yeah. Well, I would love that.
We'll have to come back for Part2.
Thank you so much for today and I will see you all in the next
episode. Emotions have a natural tendency
to dissipate unless they get reinforced.
And so if there's more thoughts,more stories, more intentions
(32:21):
that come along, so the act of how am I leaving it alone is an
act of not act, adding more stories, adding fuel to it.
So it might not go away in 2 minutes, but it then begins to
relax and dissipate. And so rather than being the
person who has to fix it, we've become the person who makes
space for the heart, the mind, to relax and settle away itself.
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