Episode Transcript
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Joy Blue (00:10):
Welcome to Here We Are, the podcast where we
celebrate the beauty of being anerd by learning about nerdy
things from fellow nerds.
I'm your host, Joy Blue.
Today's guest is a Michelintrained chef who specializes in
following her curiosity towardsall things culinary: savory,
sweet, massive, hot, andeverything in between.
(00:36):
We're going to talk about somany fun food things.
I could keep going, but whywould I?
Without further ado here is chefHalee Raff to tell us all about
her career with foods.
Halee Raff (00:50):
My name is Halee Raff and I am the chef of Hard
Bittenn in Chicago.
We are three years old and wemake gourmet pop-tarts, cakes,
catering, private chef,wholesale bakery.
We also do the cheesecakes forGolden Girls and the Barbie doll
pop-up cake pops.
We're all over the place.
Joy Blue (01:10):
That's amazing.
I have so many questions justabout those individual items.
I think you're known a lot forthe Pop-Tarts, is that correct?
Halee Raff (01:21):
Yes, the Pop-Tarts are what make the money so I can
continue doing all the other funstuff that I like doing.
Joy Blue (01:28):
That's amazing.
Halee Raff (01:29):
the bills.
Joy Blue (01:30):
Yep.
Yep.
And you make those and then sellthem through retailers.
Right.
That's so cool.
I need to find a place to getthem.
I'm starting to tell all myfriends about you, and they're
like, excuse me, where do we getthem?
Halee Raff (01:44):
We deliver.
Joy Blue (01:45):
oh this is very exciting.
We will have a side discussionabout this very shortly.
Halee Raff (01:49):
Yeah.
Joy Blue (01:50):
Okay.
So somehow you got the ideaabout Pop-Tarts.
How long has that been around?
Halee Raff (01:56):
So when I started Hard Bittenn in the early
pandemic, after I got laid offof my job, I was making pasta
and selling it.
And I got really burnt outreally quickly of doing it cuz
it got really busy and I was uptill 5:00 AM every day making
pasta.
It was, it got to be too muchand I just started experimenting
to see what else I can do andsell to kind of hope that I can
(02:17):
continue the momentum.
And people would continue buyingfrom me.
I didn't wanna fade away.
I wanted people to just be like,yeah, we can order from Halee we
can get this.
And I came out with like my ownline of pastries, which included
the Pop-Tarts, cakes, cinnamonrolls, and they all just blew
up.
I have a really good resumebecause I've worked in fine
(02:38):
dining Michelin restaurants fora majority of my career.
So people were like, oh, wow.
A Michelin trained chef iscooking and doing all these
pastries.
Let's get it, let's try it.
And it just kind of kept growingand going from there.
And the Pop-Tarts are just whatblew up the mouths.
Joy Blue (02:54):
Wow.
Halee Raff (02:55):
it's, it was super intense.
And the reason I started makingPop-Tarts is because I saw a
baker in like Texas who madePop-Tarts and hers were nice.
I just saw on Instagram, it was,I wasn't following this person.
And I was like, oh, the poptarts look cool, but I can make
them better.
And I was like, no one inChicago's doing them.
So I was like, I will try it.
And it just, it worked and itblew up.
(03:17):
And we were two, when I say we,I mean we, cuz now I have a
team, but for a year and a halfit was just me.
I was two weeks out in order andit was, it was tiring.
It was really cool.
Joy Blue (03:30):
Wow.
It all started with Pop-Tarts,Pop-Tarts is your foundation.
They're still your foundation.
I'm assuming there's a lot ofthings that you've tried and you
kind of threw it against thewall.
Some of them stuck, some of themdidn't.
Outside of the Pop-Tarts, whathas been one of your favorite
things that has stuck?
Halee Raff (03:48):
I would say the cakes.
I've never done cakes before,like baking and decorating.
And in the beginning it was verysloppy and it was not great.
And I had some wonderfulcustomers who were just like,
oh.
We don't care if we wannasupport Haley and we'll buy her
cakes, even though they were notwhat they look like, right,
right now.
But I learned how to do itproperly and I figured out my
(04:11):
own way of decorating and my ownstyle of cakes.
And now it makes up a majorityof our business as well.
Joy Blue (04:19):
That's amazing.
Halee Raff (04:20):
Pop-Tarts, but something I just kind of tried.
I was like, I'll just give it ashot.
How hard could it be?
And the cakes blew up on theirown.
And now we're just, we're doinglike anywhere between eight to
15 cakes a week, which is a lotfor us, especially, cause I'm
the only one who does the cakes,
Joy Blue (04:36):
Yeah.
Halee Raff (04:37):
so that's a lot for me and I deliver everything.
So, I, it's, if I have more thanlike 12, I get a little stressed
out.
Joy Blue (04:44):
For sure.
What I love about what I'mhearing you say is that you've
just been continually followingyour curiosity.
So like, yeah, you lost your jobduring Covid, A lot of us did.
And then you creatively pivotedusing what you had.
And what it sounds like is yourcreativity is still alive and
very well, and you've done agood job of, of not moving into
(05:07):
burnout.
What's that been like for you?
Halee Raff (05:10):
I appreciate that.
Thank you for all of the reallynice things that you said.
So I.
I experienced a bit of a burnouta little bit ago, I would say
the end of last summer.
And it's because ever since Istarted Hard Bittenn, it's been
just nonstop.
I am too afraid to just stop orto take a break because I want
(05:32):
to always be there for yourorders and for the people who
wanna place their orders and.
I really wanted Hard Bittenn tobecome something.
I wanted to become something.
And my history of working inkitchens, like where I come
from, you don't take breaks, youdon't have days off.
You work 15 hour days straight,which I loved it then, and I
(05:52):
still sometimes miss it.
But it's different when you workfor yourself because I can't
just go take a break.
I can't go take a vacation.
I can't call out of work today.
Like people depend on me and Ilike the responsibility.
It's just, it's just somethingthat I had to just keep going.
It's like a dark tunnel and thenyou see the bright end, you just
(06:15):
have to kind of keep going.
At this point, things are goingtoo well through pause for a
little while.
I'm, I'm not one of thosepeople.
I don't let people down.
Joy Blue (06:23):
Yeah.
Halee Raff (06:24):
So we continued.
Joy Blue (06:27):
That is on one hand, a very motivating place to be, and
on the other hand, it'sextremely exhausting.
Halee Raff (06:33):
It's okay.
Because I would much rather beworking for myself than working
for other people and be stressedabout my business, and I would
rather be stressed about becauseof how busy we are than not.
So, we continue.
Joy Blue (06:47):
That's beautiful.
So you have your, your good oldstaples.
You've learned a lot.
What is on the horizon?
What are you excited abouttrying next?
Where's your creativity takingyou?
Halee Raff (07:00):
That is a very loaded question, because I get
asked that a lot.
And I am a bit secretive aboutwhat my next steps will be
because I don't like peopleknowing what I'm doing.
I want, I'm one of those peoplethat just likes to move forward
without other people knowing.
I don't post about, I don't postabout the good or bad, I just
(07:21):
post, I just talk about themedium.
And then one day I'll be hereand then in two months I'll be
up here because something,something I like to move
quietly.
I believe that we will beextending Hard Bittenn a bit.
But I really do miss kitchens.
Joy Blue (07:40):
Huh.
Halee Raff (07:40):
I don't miss the environment.
I don't miss the people.
I don't miss really anythingexcept the food and the kitchen,
like service of actually thecooking for people in the heat.
I might wanna be in a restaurantagain and I'm, but I, again,
don't see myself working foranother person, so I don't know
if I wanna be the chef.
I don't know what I wanna do.
I started Hard Bittenn with theidea that this was not going to
(08:03):
be like, permanent.
There's a reason I didn't open arestaurant, and it's because I
didn't want the overhead.
I didn't want theresponsibility, and I didn't
wanna be tied to it.
So what if I decide like I don'twanna.
I don't wanna do this anymore.
I wanna be able to just kind ofclose up and not do it anymore.
So that is the position that I'min and that is what I want.
(08:23):
I am someone who likes to thinkon my feet.
I don't like planning very much.
I don't like structure.
So I wanna, if, if in two monthsI'm like, I don't really wanna
do this anymore.
I don't know what I wanna do, ormaybe I'm gonna move it to
another state, or who knows?
But I like having the optionthat this is just completely
mine and I get to do whatever Iwant with it.
(08:46):
So to answer your question, Idon't fully know what I wanna
do.
I do miss fine dining.
But working for yourself is sucha cooler, better environment for
me.
Joy Blue (08:59):
Yep.
Halee Raff (09:00):
So I don't really see myself going back to it.
I think I just miss theintensity of it a bit.
Joy Blue (09:06):
That makes sense.
Halee Raff (09:07):
I just like doing whatever I want every day
Joy Blue (09:10):
That's
Halee Raff (09:10):
and I get to decline orders.
I get to do more orders, someweekends I have off because I
don't have any events like Iwanna be able to do whatever I
want,
Joy Blue (09:18):
Yep.
Halee Raff (09:19):
and I would prefer this than working 80 hour weeks.
Joy Blue (09:23):
Yeah.
You value independence.
Halee Raff (09:25):
So I don't know.
I don't know where I'm gonna be.
I don't know what I'm gonna do.
Hard Bittenn is not supposed tobe the most permanent thing
ever.
But that's why we celebrate eachyear that we're still here.
Now that we just reached threeyears great.
That's amazing.
Hopefully another year, maybeanother year after that.
Maybe not.
Maybe we'll only do it a fewmore months.
whatever I want.
Joy Blue (09:44):
That's amazing because I feel like it's pretty rare for
people who start businesses towalk forward with open hands
because there is so much atstake.
And so there's something that Ilove in your tone of I.
I'm gonna follow the curiositytill it's not fun anymore.
I have so many questions.
I saw on Instagram that one ofthe things you like to do is
(10:05):
ginormous spreads on tables forevents.
Halee Raff (10:08):
Mm-hmm.
Joy Blue (10:08):
Where did that start?
How do you even plan that?
How far in advance do you needto plan that?
How it's magical.
How?
Halee Raff (10:18):
Thank you.
Those are our grazing tables,and it's, like platters, meat,
cheese, vegetable platters outnicely.
The reason that they started isbecause I saw other people doing
them, and I thought that I knowhow to do that, and I'll do it
too.
Right.
I know I, it's not thatdifficult.
Sourcing everything, I think isthe hardest part.
(10:38):
Getting all the correct meats,cheeses, vegetables, fruit.
You're not just gonna haveapples, bananas, and oranges.
You want the really nice fruitand things that you can't just
get at, your local Jewel.
Like I sourcing everything Ithink is the hardest, but
Grazing tables are probably oneof our easiest things that we
do, because there's not anycooking involved.
(11:00):
There's not a lot of productionother than just cutting things
and being organized.
Yeah, they're a lot of fun andthey look beautiful, and they're
just, they're so much differentthan doing platters I saw other
people doing it and I said, whycan't I do it?
So I started doing it.
I get to do whatever I want.
Joy Blue (11:16):
which is lovely
Halee Raff (11:19):
Thank you.
Joy Blue (11:19):
cuz you have a very powerful curiosity
Halee Raff (11:23):
Mm-hmm.
Joy Blue (11:23):
How do you even start planning something like that?
Like I am not a fancy meatsperson.
My wife loves making charcuterieboards and all of that, but
what's the process in your headwhen you're thinking about what
goes with what?
Halee Raff (11:44):
I just do whatever I want.
Joy Blue (11:46):
That's amazing.
Halee Raff (11:47):
honestly, I see it and I'm like, that sounds good.
That'll do.
Yeah, I, I, I, you shouldbelieve me that grazing tables
are, are like easy items becauseI don't have to make anything.
It's not like I make the cheeseor the meats.
And if I had to make the meats,that would take forever and that
would suck.
it's really not too difficultfor me.
(12:08):
I have been making platters likemy entire career in restaurants
and stuff, so it's not hard forme.
And also, there's so muchinspiration online that I can
pull up like a grazing tablefrom some girl and so-and-so
that she did and be like, oh,that looks great.
I'm gonna copy that.
Joy Blue (12:25):
That's so cool.
And here we are, we're back tothe open hands of what I love
experiencing about you is notonly are you open-handed towards
yourself, but you're alsoopen-handed toward others.
Halee Raff (12:35):
Yeah.
Joy Blue (12:36):
a big deal too.
Halee Raff (12:38):
Thank you.
Yeah, there's a lot of peoplewho don't really like the things
I'm doing or the food that wedo, and that's okay.
Eat it or don't
Joy Blue (12:45):
And that's up to you.
You're, you enable people tohave agency.
Halee Raff (12:49):
I don't care.
It's not, I'm not gonna losesleep over it.
You can get your cake from me,you can get it from someone
else.
There are a lot other things tobe worrying about,
Joy Blue (12:57):
Hmm.
Halee Raff (12:58):
and if you're not happy with something that I have
done for you, whether it's acake, whether it's Pop-Tarts,
whether it's a dinner, I hopethat, people have expressed, of
course, we were upset.
The cake wasn't this, or thiswasn't this.
I will always make it right.
I will always try and make itright.
I'm not like you're stuck withit.
If the cake is not what youthought it would be, I will take
(13:20):
it back and I will redo it foryou.
It is not that difficult, and ifyou're not happy, if something's
wrong, I'll just refund theorder.
I want you to be happy and Ithink that you were to actually
reach out to like majority of mycustomers, you would find that
that is my, like I will workwith you one-on-one until you
are happy.
Let me take the cake back.
Let me take the whatever backand I will fix it.
(13:42):
I'm so sorry.
But if you don't like my food,don't order for me.
Again.
I don't,
Joy Blue (13:47):
Yeah.
Halee Raff (13:48):
I don't care.
Joy Blue (13:49):
that just sounds like amazing boundaries though, on
top of great customer service.
Halee Raff (13:54):
It's, it's very one-sided with me.
If you wanna refund, great.
If you don't wanna refund, I'llmake it better.
And if you don't want that, thenI can you just not order from
you then if you're not happy.
I don't, not that it's not thatdeep.
I, there are so, there arebigger things in the world to be
worrying about.
Joy Blue (14:12):
Yeah.
Okay.
Thinking about your culinarycareer, across all of it, what
has been a moment or a meal or arevelation or something that
you've had that you are reallyproud of?
Halee Raff (14:29):
Okay.
That there's a lot of answers tothat, but I think the one that's
sticking out to me is because ofthe example that I set in my
kitchen.
My cooks have learned from me bywatching me
Joy Blue (14:49):
Mm-hmm.
Halee Raff (14:50):
and.
Respecting their work and thefood.
We respect the food.
This is stuff going intopeople's bodies.
And we care about what we do.
I show up every day.
I clean, I'm here, and to see mycooks, like, I don't need to
yell at them and say, Hey, thisis wrong.
Why is this wrong?
(15:11):
They just do it because I setthat example.
And one of my cooks says to methe other day, he says, we were
talking about respect for food.
Like why I respect the food andwhy we all need to respect the
food.
And he's like, yeah.
He's like, you know, on my firstday here when I was just
interviewing here, I saw youwash dishes.
That is like the coolest thingever.
What boss starts a business andjust happens to be here every
(15:34):
day and is washing the disheslike he never complains about
washing dishes.
Joy Blue (15:38):
Yep
Halee Raff (15:38):
so I was really proud of that.
Joy Blue (15:41):
that's beautiful.
Halee Raff (15:42):
Thanks.
Thanks.
Joy Blue (15:44):
Leading By example is, is really a big deal.
Halee Raff (15:47):
Mm-hmm.
Joy Blue (15:48):
Like some of the places I've been most amazed is
when I walk in and there is verylittle power distance.
Like, Yes, you run the companyand also.
You're a part of the every day.
Cuz I think we so oftenexperience the leader as quite a
few levels separated and unawarefrom what the normal people are
(16:10):
doing.
And so that actually brings myheart a lot of joy to hear that
like you're creating anenvironment where everybody is
on the same team.
That's beautiful.
That's rare.
I love that.
Halee Raff (16:24):
Thank you.
Thank you.
I appreciate that.
I, if I respect the food,they'll respect the food and you
will be able to see the love andthe respect that we show in our
food just by eating a pop tartand saying, wow, this was made
by someone who gave a shit.
When my cooks begin working forme when we're interviewing, even
people who don't work for me, Ialways tell the same thing.
(16:45):
If you are having a bad day, ifyou are sad, if you're mad about
what's going on with you andyour boyfriend and you got into
a fight with your mom, it'llshow in the food that something
is wrong.
And I would, I would prefer younot be here at all.
I know that life doesn't stopand we all have things going on,
but you need to learn to be ableto just kind of set it aside for
(17:05):
a little while and put yourheart and your work into what
you're doing, whether you're ahandyman, whether you're making
food, whether you, do nails.
It all comes from love.
And again, if you are sad orgoing through something in the
world, it'll show in the food.
And I can always come in andlook at it something and be
like, you okay today?
So
Joy Blue (17:25):
Wow.
Halee Raff (17:25):
we respect each other.
We respect the food, we respectour kitchen.
We clean every day.
And I hope that it is areflection on what I make and
show to the world and say, look,I made this cake.
It doesn't look like much toyou, but to me, I, There was a
lot of love that went.
Joy Blue (17:40):
Yeah.
Wow.
That put words to some feelingsI had that didn't, I didn't know
had words.
Thank you so much for sharingthat.
Halee Raff (17:50):
You're welcome.
Joy Blue (17:51):
What's something you think people should know
something more about in terms ofcooking, in terms of your job,
in terms of, you name it.
Halee Raff (18:01):
I hate when people say, follow your dreams.
Do what you, what you wanna do.
And I, I really only mean thatin the terms of more of like
maybe just the cooking world,cuz I don't really know much
about other worlds,
Joy Blue (18:15):
Sure.
Halee Raff (18:16):
other jobs.
This isn't something where youcan just wake up one day and be
like, I'm gonna open a business.
I'm gonna run a kitchen, I'mgonna open a restaurant.
It like, I have thisconversation with other people
in the industry like, don't dothis.
It's really hard.
It's not for weak people, andyou are gonna be working 24
(18:36):
hours a day.
Even when you're asleep, you'regonna be working because you're
gonna hear an email and be like,oh my God, I gotta respond to
it, because it's probablyimportant.
And it is.
All of your customers areimportant and you wanna make
them feel important.
It's expensive.
And it's not like we need morebakeries and more cake
decorators and more cookies.
Like the, this stuff is reallyhard.
Joy Blue (18:58):
Yeah.
Really take time to consider.
Halee Raff (19:00):
You really need to consider it.
I'm, I'm very cynical.
I'm a pessimist.
My business is called HardBittenn.
It's another word for cynical.
Joy Blue (19:07):
Mm-hmm.
Halee Raff (19:09):
Like I, I think that I'm just more realistic.
And in the beginning when Istarted this, I think that's the
reason why people gravitatedtowards Hard Bittenn is because
I was more realistic aboutthings about the world and what
was going on.
Everything sucks.
We're in a pandemic like, Thingsreally suck.
Instead of me sayingeverything's great, everything
will be fine, everything will beover with, and we'll be able to
(19:29):
go back to normal.
No, everything sucks.
You should eat my food though.
Joy Blue (19:33):
Yeah.
That's the one thing everybodyneeds.
That's the place of, connectionis around food, is around a
table.
I've come back to that point inso many of my interviews where
we end up talking about whathappens at the kitchen table,
what happens when you do ingestfood that is made with love and
it is made with care.
Halee Raff (19:53):
Mm-hmm.
Joy Blue (19:54):
has a very powerful outcome,
Halee Raff (19:57):
Mm-hmm.
Joy Blue (19:58):
and I love that you get to be a part of that.
Halee Raff (20:00):
Thank you.
Thanks.
Joy Blue (20:02):
Thank you so much for your time.
This has been absolutelyfantastic.
Halee Raff (20:08):
Thank you for having me.
Joy Blue (20:10):
So here we are! What a fun journey that was! Halee's
story outlines so many aspectsof curiosity that I personally
want to embody.
Like the ability to stay openwith projects and experiments,
caring about what I createenough that I want to bring my
best self always, and continuingto search for inspiration and
(20:34):
seeing where the path leads.
Halee thank you so much for yourtime, your care for food, and
your continued contribution ofgoodness into the world.
If you've got a flavor of nerdyou want me to celebrate, I
would love to hear all about it.
So go ahead and email me atherewearethepodcast@gmail.com
and tell me everything.
(20:55):
I love taking time to sit andmake space for nerd to be
celebrated.
If you really liked this podcastand want to financially support
what I'm doing, head on over topatreon.com, search for Here We
Are The Podcast and sign up forone of the many beautifully
written support tiers.
So until next time, don't forgetthat curiosity wins and the
(21:16):
world needs more nerds.
Bye
Welcome to Here We Are, the podcast where we
celebrate the beauty of being anerd by learning about nerdy
things from fellow nerds.
I'm your host, Joy Blue.
Today's guest is a Michelintrained chef who specializes in
following her curiosity towardsall things culinary: savory,
sweet, massive, hot, andeverything in between.
(00:36):
We're going to talk about somany fun food things.
I could keep going, but whywould I?
Without further ado here is chefHalee Raff to tell us all about
her career with foods.
Halee Raff (00:50):
My name is Halee Raff and I am the chef of Hard
Bittenn in Chicago.
We are three years old and wemake gourmet pop-tarts, cakes,
catering, private chef,wholesale bakery.
We also do the cheesecakes forGolden Girls and the Barbie doll
pop-up cake pops.
We're all over the place.
Joy Blue (01:10):
That's amazing.
I have so many questions justabout those individual items.
I think you're known a lot forthe Pop-Tarts, is that correct?
Halee Raff (01:21):
Yes, the Pop-Tarts are what make the money so I can
continue doing all the other funstuff that I like doing.
Joy Blue (01:28):
That's amazing.
Halee Raff (01:29):
the bills.
Joy Blue (01:30):
Yep.
Yep.
And you make those and then sellthem through retailers.
Right.
That's so cool.
I need to find a place to getthem.
I'm starting to tell all myfriends about you, and they're
like, excuse me, where do we getthem?
Halee Raff (01:44):
We deliver.
Joy Blue (01:45):
oh this is very exciting.
We will have a side discussionabout this very shortly.
Halee Raff (01:49):
Yeah.
Joy Blue (01:50):
Okay.
So somehow you got the ideaabout Pop-Tarts.
How long has that been around?
Halee Raff (01:56):
So when I started Hard Bittenn in the early
pandemic, after I got laid offof my job, I was making pasta
and selling it.
And I got really burnt outreally quickly of doing it cuz
it got really busy and I was uptill 5:00 AM every day making
pasta.
It was, it got to be too muchand I just started experimenting
to see what else I can do andsell to kind of hope that I can
(02:17):
continue the momentum.
And people would continue buyingfrom me.
I didn't wanna fade away.
I wanted people to just be like,yeah, we can order from Halee we
can get this.
And I came out with like my ownline of pastries, which included
the Pop-Tarts, cakes, cinnamonrolls, and they all just blew
up.
I have a really good resumebecause I've worked in fine
(02:38):
dining Michelin restaurants fora majority of my career.
So people were like, oh, wow.
A Michelin trained chef iscooking and doing all these
pastries.
Let's get it, let's try it.
And it just kind of kept growingand going from there.
And the Pop-Tarts are just whatblew up the mouths.
Joy Blue (02:54):
Wow.
Halee Raff (02:55):
it's, it was super intense.
And the reason I started makingPop-Tarts is because I saw a
baker in like Texas who madePop-Tarts and hers were nice.
I just saw on Instagram, it was,I wasn't following this person.
And I was like, oh, the poptarts look cool, but I can make
them better.
And I was like, no one inChicago's doing them.
So I was like, I will try it.
And it just, it worked and itblew up.
(03:17):
And we were two, when I say we,I mean we, cuz now I have a
team, but for a year and a halfit was just me.
I was two weeks out in order andit was, it was tiring.
It was really cool.
Joy Blue (03:30):
Wow.
It all started with Pop-Tarts,Pop-Tarts is your foundation.
They're still your foundation.
I'm assuming there's a lot ofthings that you've tried and you
kind of threw it against thewall.
Some of them stuck, some of themdidn't.
Outside of the Pop-Tarts, whathas been one of your favorite
things that has stuck?
Halee Raff (03:48):
I would say the cakes.
I've never done cakes before,like baking and decorating.
And in the beginning it was verysloppy and it was not great.
And I had some wonderfulcustomers who were just like,
oh.
We don't care if we wannasupport Haley and we'll buy her
cakes, even though they were notwhat they look like, right,
right now.
But I learned how to do itproperly and I figured out my
(04:11):
own way of decorating and my ownstyle of cakes.
And now it makes up a majorityof our business as well.
Joy Blue (04:19):
That's amazing.
Halee Raff (04:20):
Pop-Tarts, but something I just kind of tried.
I was like, I'll just give it ashot.
How hard could it be?
And the cakes blew up on theirown.
And now we're just, we're doinglike anywhere between eight to
15 cakes a week, which is a lotfor us, especially, cause I'm
the only one who does the cakes,
Joy Blue (04:36):
Yeah.
Halee Raff (04:37):
so that's a lot for me and I deliver everything.
So, I, it's, if I have more thanlike 12, I get a little stressed
out.
Joy Blue (04:44):
For sure.
What I love about what I'mhearing you say is that you've
just been continually followingyour curiosity.
So like, yeah, you lost your jobduring Covid, A lot of us did.
And then you creatively pivotedusing what you had.
And what it sounds like is yourcreativity is still alive and
very well, and you've done agood job of, of not moving into
(05:07):
burnout.
What's that been like for you?
Halee Raff (05:10):
I appreciate that.
Thank you for all of the reallynice things that you said.
So I.
I experienced a bit of a burnouta little bit ago, I would say
the end of last summer.
And it's because ever since Istarted Hard Bittenn, it's been
just nonstop.
I am too afraid to just stop orto take a break because I want
(05:32):
to always be there for yourorders and for the people who
wanna place their orders and.
I really wanted Hard Bittenn tobecome something.
I wanted to become something.
And my history of working inkitchens, like where I come
from, you don't take breaks, youdon't have days off.
You work 15 hour days straight,which I loved it then, and I
(05:52):
still sometimes miss it.
But it's different when you workfor yourself because I can't
just go take a break.
I can't go take a vacation.
I can't call out of work today.
Like people depend on me and Ilike the responsibility.
It's just, it's just somethingthat I had to just keep going.
It's like a dark tunnel and thenyou see the bright end, you just
(06:15):
have to kind of keep going.
At this point, things are goingtoo well through pause for a
little while.
I'm, I'm not one of thosepeople.
I don't let people down.
Joy Blue (06:23):
Yeah.
Halee Raff (06:24):
So we continued.
Joy Blue (06:27):
That is on one hand, a very motivating place to be, and
on the other hand, it'sextremely exhausting.
Halee Raff (06:33):
It's okay.
Because I would much rather beworking for myself than working
for other people and be stressedabout my business, and I would
rather be stressed about becauseof how busy we are than not.
So, we continue.
Joy Blue (06:47):
That's beautiful.
So you have your, your good oldstaples.
You've learned a lot.
What is on the horizon?
What are you excited abouttrying next?
Where's your creativity takingyou?
Halee Raff (07:00):
That is a very loaded question, because I get
asked that a lot.
And I am a bit secretive aboutwhat my next steps will be
because I don't like peopleknowing what I'm doing.
I want, I'm one of those peoplethat just likes to move forward
without other people knowing.
I don't post about, I don't postabout the good or bad, I just
(07:21):
post, I just talk about themedium.
And then one day I'll be hereand then in two months I'll be
up here because something,something I like to move
quietly.
I believe that we will beextending Hard Bittenn a bit.
But I really do miss kitchens.
Joy Blue (07:40):
Huh.
Halee Raff (07:40):
I don't miss the environment.
I don't miss the people.
I don't miss really anythingexcept the food and the kitchen,
like service of actually thecooking for people in the heat.
I might wanna be in a restaurantagain and I'm, but I, again,
don't see myself working foranother person, so I don't know
if I wanna be the chef.
I don't know what I wanna do.
I started Hard Bittenn with theidea that this was not going to
(08:03):
be like, permanent.
There's a reason I didn't open arestaurant, and it's because I
didn't want the overhead.
I didn't want theresponsibility, and I didn't
wanna be tied to it.
So what if I decide like I don'twanna.
I don't wanna do this anymore.
I wanna be able to just kind ofclose up and not do it anymore.
So that is the position that I'min and that is what I want.
(08:23):
I am someone who likes to thinkon my feet.
I don't like planning very much.
I don't like structure.
So I wanna, if, if in two monthsI'm like, I don't really wanna
do this anymore.
I don't know what I wanna do, ormaybe I'm gonna move it to
another state, or who knows?
But I like having the optionthat this is just completely
mine and I get to do whatever Iwant with it.
(08:46):
So to answer your question, Idon't fully know what I wanna
do.
I do miss fine dining.
But working for yourself is sucha cooler, better environment for
me.
Joy Blue (08:59):
Yep.
Halee Raff (09:00):
So I don't really see myself going back to it.
I think I just miss theintensity of it a bit.
Joy Blue (09:06):
That makes sense.
Halee Raff (09:07):
I just like doing whatever I want every day
Joy Blue (09:10):
That's
Halee Raff (09:10):
and I get to decline orders.
I get to do more orders, someweekends I have off because I
don't have any events like Iwanna be able to do whatever I
want,
Joy Blue (09:18):
Yep.
Halee Raff (09:19):
and I would prefer this than working 80 hour weeks.
Joy Blue (09:23):
Yeah.
You value independence.
Halee Raff (09:25):
So I don't know.
I don't know where I'm gonna be.
I don't know what I'm gonna do.
Hard Bittenn is not supposed tobe the most permanent thing
ever.
But that's why we celebrate eachyear that we're still here.
Now that we just reached threeyears great.
That's amazing.
Hopefully another year, maybeanother year after that.
Maybe not.
Maybe we'll only do it a fewmore months.
whatever I want.
Joy Blue (09:44):
That's amazing because I feel like it's pretty rare for
people who start businesses towalk forward with open hands
because there is so much atstake.
And so there's something that Ilove in your tone of I.
I'm gonna follow the curiositytill it's not fun anymore.
I have so many questions.
I saw on Instagram that one ofthe things you like to do is
(10:05):
ginormous spreads on tables forevents.
Halee Raff (10:08):
Mm-hmm.
Joy Blue (10:08):
Where did that start?
How do you even plan that?
How far in advance do you needto plan that?
How it's magical.
How?
Halee Raff (10:18):
Thank you.
Those are our grazing tables,and it's, like platters, meat,
cheese, vegetable platters outnicely.
The reason that they started isbecause I saw other people doing
them, and I thought that I knowhow to do that, and I'll do it
too.
Right.
I know I, it's not thatdifficult.
Sourcing everything, I think isthe hardest part.
(10:38):
Getting all the correct meats,cheeses, vegetables, fruit.
You're not just gonna haveapples, bananas, and oranges.
You want the really nice fruitand things that you can't just
get at, your local Jewel.
Like I sourcing everything Ithink is the hardest, but
Grazing tables are probably oneof our easiest things that we
do, because there's not anycooking involved.
(11:00):
There's not a lot of productionother than just cutting things
and being organized.
Yeah, they're a lot of fun andthey look beautiful, and they're
just, they're so much differentthan doing platters I saw other
people doing it and I said, whycan't I do it?
So I started doing it.
I get to do whatever I want.
Joy Blue (11:16):
which is lovely
Halee Raff (11:19):
Thank you.
Joy Blue (11:19):
cuz you have a very powerful curiosity
Halee Raff (11:23):
Mm-hmm.
Joy Blue (11:23):
How do you even start planning something like that?
Like I am not a fancy meatsperson.
My wife loves making charcuterieboards and all of that, but
what's the process in your headwhen you're thinking about what
goes with what?
Halee Raff (11:44):
I just do whatever I want.
Joy Blue (11:46):
That's amazing.
Halee Raff (11:47):
honestly, I see it and I'm like, that sounds good.
That'll do.
Yeah, I, I, I, you shouldbelieve me that grazing tables
are, are like easy items becauseI don't have to make anything.
It's not like I make the cheeseor the meats.
And if I had to make the meats,that would take forever and that
would suck.
it's really not too difficultfor me.
(12:08):
I have been making platters likemy entire career in restaurants
and stuff, so it's not hard forme.
And also, there's so muchinspiration online that I can
pull up like a grazing tablefrom some girl and so-and-so
that she did and be like, oh,that looks great.
I'm gonna copy that.
Joy Blue (12:25):
That's so cool.
And here we are, we're back tothe open hands of what I love
experiencing about you is notonly are you open-handed towards
yourself, but you're alsoopen-handed toward others.
Halee Raff (12:35):
Yeah.
Joy Blue (12:36):
a big deal too.
Halee Raff (12:38):
Thank you.
Yeah, there's a lot of peoplewho don't really like the things
I'm doing or the food that wedo, and that's okay.
Eat it or don't
Joy Blue (12:45):
And that's up to you.
You're, you enable people tohave agency.
Halee Raff (12:49):
I don't care.
It's not, I'm not gonna losesleep over it.
You can get your cake from me,you can get it from someone
else.
There are a lot other things tobe worrying about,
Joy Blue (12:57):
Hmm.
Halee Raff (12:58):
and if you're not happy with something that I have
done for you, whether it's acake, whether it's Pop-Tarts,
whether it's a dinner, I hopethat, people have expressed, of
course, we were upset.
The cake wasn't this, or thiswasn't this.
I will always make it right.
I will always try and make itright.
I'm not like you're stuck withit.
If the cake is not what youthought it would be, I will take
(13:20):
it back and I will redo it foryou.
It is not that difficult, and ifyou're not happy, if something's
wrong, I'll just refund theorder.
I want you to be happy and Ithink that you were to actually
reach out to like majority of mycustomers, you would find that
that is my, like I will workwith you one-on-one until you
are happy.
Let me take the cake back.
Let me take the whatever backand I will fix it.
(13:42):
I'm so sorry.
But if you don't like my food,don't order for me.
Again.
I don't,
Joy Blue (13:47):
Yeah.
Halee Raff (13:48):
I don't care.
Joy Blue (13:49):
that just sounds like amazing boundaries though, on
top of great customer service.
Halee Raff (13:54):
It's, it's very one-sided with me.
If you wanna refund, great.
If you don't wanna refund, I'llmake it better.
And if you don't want that, thenI can you just not order from
you then if you're not happy.
I don't, not that it's not thatdeep.
I, there are so, there arebigger things in the world to be
worrying about.
Joy Blue (14:12):
Yeah.
Okay.
Thinking about your culinarycareer, across all of it, what
has been a moment or a meal or arevelation or something that
you've had that you are reallyproud of?
Halee Raff (14:29):
Okay.
That there's a lot of answers tothat, but I think the one that's
sticking out to me is because ofthe example that I set in my
kitchen.
My cooks have learned from me bywatching me
Joy Blue (14:49):
Mm-hmm.
Halee Raff (14:50):
and.
Respecting their work and thefood.
We respect the food.
This is stuff going intopeople's bodies.
And we care about what we do.
I show up every day.
I clean, I'm here, and to see mycooks, like, I don't need to
yell at them and say, Hey, thisis wrong.
Why is this wrong?
(15:11):
They just do it because I setthat example.
And one of my cooks says to methe other day, he says, we were
talking about respect for food.
Like why I respect the food andwhy we all need to respect the
food.
And he's like, yeah.
He's like, you know, on my firstday here when I was just
interviewing here, I saw youwash dishes.
That is like the coolest thingever.
What boss starts a business andjust happens to be here every
(15:34):
day and is washing the disheslike he never complains about
washing dishes.
Joy Blue (15:38):
Yep
Halee Raff (15:38):
so I was really proud of that.
Joy Blue (15:41):
that's beautiful.
Halee Raff (15:42):
Thanks.
Thanks.
Joy Blue (15:44):
Leading By example is, is really a big deal.
Halee Raff (15:47):
Mm-hmm.
Joy Blue (15:48):
Like some of the places I've been most amazed is
when I walk in and there is verylittle power distance.
Like, Yes, you run the companyand also.
You're a part of the every day.
Cuz I think we so oftenexperience the leader as quite a
few levels separated and unawarefrom what the normal people are
(16:10):
doing.
And so that actually brings myheart a lot of joy to hear that
like you're creating anenvironment where everybody is
on the same team.
That's beautiful.
That's rare.
I love that.
Halee Raff (16:24):
Thank you.
Thank you.
I appreciate that.
I, if I respect the food,they'll respect the food and you
will be able to see the love andthe respect that we show in our
food just by eating a pop tartand saying, wow, this was made
by someone who gave a shit.
When my cooks begin working forme when we're interviewing, even
people who don't work for me, Ialways tell the same thing.
(16:45):
If you are having a bad day, ifyou are sad, if you're mad about
what's going on with you andyour boyfriend and you got into
a fight with your mom, it'llshow in the food that something
is wrong.
And I would, I would prefer younot be here at all.
I know that life doesn't stopand we all have things going on,
but you need to learn to be ableto just kind of set it aside for
(17:05):
a little while and put yourheart and your work into what
you're doing, whether you're ahandyman, whether you're making
food, whether you, do nails.
It all comes from love.
And again, if you are sad orgoing through something in the
world, it'll show in the food.
And I can always come in andlook at it something and be
like, you okay today?
So
Joy Blue (17:25):
Wow.
Halee Raff (17:25):
we respect each other.
We respect the food, we respectour kitchen.
We clean every day.
And I hope that it is areflection on what I make and
show to the world and say, look,I made this cake.
It doesn't look like much toyou, but to me, I, There was a
lot of love that went.
Joy Blue (17:40):
Yeah.
Wow.
That put words to some feelingsI had that didn't, I didn't know
had words.
Thank you so much for sharingthat.
Halee Raff (17:50):
You're welcome.
Joy Blue (17:51):
What's something you think people should know
something more about in terms ofcooking, in terms of your job,
in terms of, you name it.
Halee Raff (18:01):
I hate when people say, follow your dreams.
Do what you, what you wanna do.
And I, I really only mean thatin the terms of more of like
maybe just the cooking world,cuz I don't really know much
about other worlds,
Joy Blue (18:15):
Sure.
Halee Raff (18:16):
other jobs.
This isn't something where youcan just wake up one day and be
like, I'm gonna open a business.
I'm gonna run a kitchen, I'mgonna open a restaurant.
It like, I have thisconversation with other people
in the industry like, don't dothis.
It's really hard.
It's not for weak people, andyou are gonna be working 24
(18:36):
hours a day.
Even when you're asleep, you'regonna be working because you're
gonna hear an email and be like,oh my God, I gotta respond to
it, because it's probablyimportant.
And it is.
All of your customers areimportant and you wanna make
them feel important.
It's expensive.
And it's not like we need morebakeries and more cake
decorators and more cookies.
Like the, this stuff is reallyhard.
Joy Blue (18:58):
Yeah.
Really take time to consider.
Halee Raff (19:00):
You really need to consider it.
I'm, I'm very cynical.
I'm a pessimist.
My business is called HardBittenn.
It's another word for cynical.
Joy Blue (19:07):
Mm-hmm.
Halee Raff (19:09):
Like I, I think that I'm just more realistic.
And in the beginning when Istarted this, I think that's the
reason why people gravitatedtowards Hard Bittenn is because
I was more realistic aboutthings about the world and what
was going on.
Everything sucks.
We're in a pandemic like, Thingsreally suck.
Instead of me sayingeverything's great, everything
will be fine, everything will beover with, and we'll be able to
(19:29):
go back to normal.
No, everything sucks.
You should eat my food though.
Joy Blue (19:33):
Yeah.
That's the one thing everybodyneeds.
That's the place of, connectionis around food, is around a
table.
I've come back to that point inso many of my interviews where
we end up talking about whathappens at the kitchen table,
what happens when you do ingestfood that is made with love and
it is made with care.
Halee Raff (19:53):
Mm-hmm.
Joy Blue (19:54):
has a very powerful outcome,
Halee Raff (19:57):
Mm-hmm.
Joy Blue (19:58):
and I love that you get to be a part of that.
Halee Raff (20:00):
Thank you.
Thanks.
Joy Blue (20:02):
Thank you so much for your time.
This has been absolutelyfantastic.
Halee Raff (20:08):
Thank you for having me.
Joy Blue (20:10):
So here we are! What a fun journey that was! Halee's
story outlines so many aspectsof curiosity that I personally
want to embody.
Like the ability to stay openwith projects and experiments,
caring about what I createenough that I want to bring my
best self always, and continuingto search for inspiration and
(20:34):
seeing where the path leads.
Halee thank you so much for yourtime, your care for food, and
your continued contribution ofgoodness into the world.
If you've got a flavor of nerdyou want me to celebrate, I
would love to hear all about it.
So go ahead and email me atherewearethepodcast@gmail.com
and tell me everything.
(20:55):
I love taking time to sit andmake space for nerd to be
celebrated.
If you really liked this podcastand want to financially support
what I'm doing, head on over topatreon.com, search for Here We
Are The Podcast and sign up forone of the many beautifully
written support tiers.
So until next time, don't forgetthat curiosity wins and the
(21:16):
world needs more nerds.
Bye
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