#221 - Hong Kong's Pastry Chef Queen Who Is Also a Yoga Instructor

Karys Plaxe is a long time HK resident, and recently wrapped up her time as Black Sheep Restaurant Group's head pastry chef. Karys’ career before HK ranged from working in MICHELIN-starred pastry programs to overseeing top-level international bakeries where she honed her creative finesse. Apart from being the driving force behind Hong Kong's most famous cake shop, Butter, Karys has also spent the last few years cultivating her passion for yoga. She now hosts all-levels yoga classes, and is taking some time to decelerate and prepare for her next career steps.

We chat with Karys about our many issues with Vission Bakery, her work at Dominique Ansel Bakery at the height of the 'cronut' hype, and her recent decision to leave Butter Cake Shop.

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Follow Karys Plaxe on Instagram: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://www.instagram.com/karys.loves.kale⁠⁠⁠

Follow Karys Plaxe's yoga page on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/yogatogether.hk/

Follow Mohammed on Instagram: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://www.instagram.com/theothermohammed⁠⁠⁠

Follow Vivek on Instagram: ⁠https://www.instagram.com/funnyvivek

Episode Transcript

(00:01):
So I reiterate here, the bill isdead.
The story of this great city is about the years before this
night. Hey everybody, it's a new

(00:22):
episode of Hong Kong and we are going nuts with the guests.
This is what, two or three weeksin a row, Vivek?
That's right. We're having guest, guests,
guests and more guests. And more guests, yes.
So yeah, we were back full circle.
We started with only guests and then during COVID we decided
they were just going to talk thetwo to each other exactly
because we are not legally allowed to talk to anyone else.

(00:43):
Exactly. We're not legally to be our
guest, Yes. Yeah.
And then now we're back on the guest guest train and we have a
very special guest. But before we get our guest,
Vivek, how are you doing man? I'm pretty good, man.
I mean, the good thing is actually I did a show at the
hospital yesterday. What?
Yeah. I was actually at the Hong Kong
Eye Hospital doing a show duringlunchtime.
Wait a second, Eye Hospital? Is that like Eye Hospital, Like

(01:05):
Apple Eye Hospital? One thinks that, but it's EYE.
Oh, like the actual eye? Hospital, yeah.
OK, so The funny thing is they actually have a floor that is an
eye bank. EYE Bank I.
Am so confused. I know, I know, I was like, what
the hell is this place, right? But the ironic thing is during
the whole throwing it out there,man, I know what I'm talking

(01:26):
about. The, the, the best part is that
the whole performance, pretty much all the staff there, yeah,
wearing glasses. I was like, I think you're on
the wrong side of the table. You should be the patient, not
the not the worker here there. Is a lot of people like in a
certain like like eye doctor, for example, that they're like
they have bad eyesight. I have seen three different or
how do you say that orthodontistis like the guy with the fixing

(01:49):
the teeth? Yeah, but not just a regular
dentist like the one who. The braces guy.
And yeah, the braces guy and theteeth are just completely
fucked. Yeah, three different people.
Like, I don't. There was a friend, he probably
knows who he is, but he's a heavy smoker.
Yeah, never. Yeah, eventually is one of the
humility things like I'm so busyserving, I have no time to serve
myself actually is. Super successful.

(02:12):
Is in Hong Kong. That's my wife.
He's like teaching and he's likea really high, high level, high
level professor. Whatever.
Bad teeth bad. Man, I think it's one of those
things where he, like, he went through the hell of it and
you're like, you know, I want togive back to society now, right?
Sure things, yeah. How did you do the IE test I, I?

(02:32):
I I show basically. So in other words, it was just
like I knew some people that areconnected to the hospital
authority in Hong Kong and they were like, hey, you know, we
would you be interested in doingcomedy show for the medical
staff? I'm like, yeah, let's do it.
Yeah. So they organized everything.
I go there, I do the show. It's hilarious because like you
have some people there, there, you know, medical staff, right?
They're like here we're at Electric Theatre.
Yeah, Electric Hall. They're also sitting looking at

(02:52):
me. They're like, OK, what are we
gonna learn today? And I'm here in the company.
Hey, I got help, Dad. I'm doing that right?
And you can see it takes a little while for them to break.
They're like, this is not right,this.
Guy is sick, is there any other entertainment for you?
No, no opening act, just you. It's a classic, like, let's just
get some staff to like, OK, I got home today.
We're very happy to have a special guest with us who will

(03:12):
try to bring us some laughter. Please welcome Avi.
Yeah, yes, yeah, yeah. Called class.
Called class. Yeah, yeah.
And I'm like, and like everyone's been like, they're
like, oh, hold on. They knew it's a comedy show,
but they would like, they're notused to it.
Clearly the staff is not going to comedy nights, right?
So it was fun for me. I did that.
And then after that, I had to gostraight to a school in a
Victoria Shanghai Academy in Wang Zhong Kong.

(03:34):
It's like an International School.
And I was performing for 2/2 teachers, part of their mental
well-being week. They had me as one.
Yeah. You know, for them to have a
little laugh, right. So they finally we're in this
black box, OK. That we were told to go to the
black box. And unfortunately, maybe the
teachers don't go there very often.
Nobody knew where it was, right?Yeah.
You own them. Campus, they don't know where
the venue is, they. Were confused because their

(03:55):
emails said 10th floor appearance on the 9th floor, but
because you get out of the 9th floor, they're having exams.
You got to go down to the 8th floor to go through the tunnel
to get to the 9th floor. And I show up and I'm like wow.
I mean I guess you're so focusedon your job that you don't care
about the black box. You're like, I'm with the the
chance papers. That's about it.
Yeah. So that was my day.
Did they? Happen to?
Did they happen to eat any cake by any chance on that?

(04:17):
Well, I, I feel like they probably did and that's why they
got lost with all that, you know, sugar in their body.
I'm dazed, you know, I'm sugar crashing right now.
I have no idea what's going. On, yeah.
So that's what we call in the business a Segway.
Yeah, exactly. OK, So today's guest we have
actually Karis. I'd like to introduce yourself
because I think you wear too many hats as they say, like you

(04:39):
do a lot of stuff that are maybenot even related.
I don't know which one you like to identify at.
Yes. Sure.
What is your career? Pronouns.
That's what he's asking. Yes.
Career. My career.
Karis Plaques diving right in, very happy to have you.
Hi, guys. Thank you so much.
Happy to be here. Yeah, my name's Karis Plaques.
In terms of career hats, my mostcomfortable and longest term

(05:01):
career hat has been pastry chef.In an ironic twist, you
mentioned orthodontists with terrible teeth.
Yes, I'm a pastry chef who doesn't like to eat sweets.
Oh. Sorry, sorry.
So you're you're the Steve Jobs that invented the iPad but
doesn't let his kids use it? Exactly.
Yeah, exactly. I'm like cake, but not for me.
Yeah, yeah. Good enough?
So I've been a cake lady here inHong Kong for seven years.

(05:23):
Yeah. And it's been, it's been a
really beautiful path. I've done fine.
I've done so sort of like Frenchex Cantonese cuisine and then I.
Wait wait wait wait wait. French ex Cantonese as in like
French but just broke up with Cantonese cuisine?
What? What?
Yeah, slash Cantonese you mean. French slash Cantonese so like
French ex like. A like a.

(05:43):
Fujuk Tong soy milfoi. Like, wow.
Like actual like fusion fusion. Fusion.
I worked at a restaurant called Vea VEA with Vicky Chang.
He now has Wing and he's made like amazing strides with that.
Like he's well known for it. So let me guess, it's French
fine dining with the Cantonese attitude of like, eat that food
now? Honestly, like part of it was

(06:04):
it's like French fine dining butwith the Cantonese attitude of
like, I'm gonna scroll on my phone and not eat the food at.
All, Yeah. All right.
OK, Yeah. Yeah, he makes amazing food, but
dining serving there was interesting because so many
guests are there just like for the photos.
Of the photos, Oh yeah. But I think wing his like next
concept has gotten again, reallywarm feedback because it's like
really soulful and people are super enjoying it.

(06:26):
I've all good things to say about Vicki and Vay and all the
things, but I worked there for afew years and then I moved to
Black Sheep. Yeah.
So I've worked for Black Sheep for the last six years, as of
last week. And now six years, six years,
yeah, 5, five and a half. Six years, give or take, it
feels. Like 60 pre COVID or COVID time
issue? Right at the time of COVID, like
I joined and I was like, I've never seen any of my Cook's

(06:46):
faces before. Yeah.
And so it was like the unveilingand you're.
Like I don't know any put the masks back on.
Yeah, you're like, I don't know.Maybe that's the best.
So I joined them in a really interesting time, and we went
from basically the pastry kitchen served, I don't know, 15
restaurants. Yeah.
All by, like, WhatsApp group. It was super disorganized to
this, like, giant pastry, like Empire.

(07:08):
Proud to say so. I would not be surprised.
When I was young and we think like all these people, you know,
they got the stuff together. You work there, you're like,
what the hell? How do you work?
Yeah, yeah, yeah, absolutely. Well, it seems like the play.
Are you making all of this pastry just at the actual
location of butter? Yeah, so the location of Butter
that you see on Staunton St., we're making everything for all
the restaurants. It's really like it's an amazing
production space, super vibrant.No, for for for one restaurant,

(07:33):
it's great for 3540 restaurants,it's pretty crazy.
So yeah, it's a full tilt space.But the the team that I have
working with me is really was really talented.
They are really talented. And we expanded from 15 ish
restaurants to more than 30 restaurants during the time that
I was there, so. During the process now you do
pastries and everything and doesit bother you when people eat

(07:55):
bad pastry and they complimentedand say it's good pastry?
I know where this is going. Oh.
I'm so I'm so curious to hear what, what you're leading into
here. I mean, I think, I think people
as a whole have bad taste in a lot of things, including myself.
I have terrible taste in certainthings.
That's OK. Yeah.
I don't want to be judged. So people have terrible taste in
pastry, but they love what they love.

(08:16):
Yeah. Get after it.
But yeah, actually, yeah, like, and our word, like we talk about
the Vivekan eyes, like when people are like, when there is a
stand up comedian who are like us, us comedians who are like,
what the fuck, man? Yeah.
You're like, that's not funny atall, this.
Is not funny at all like what wecall hacky.
That's like, you know, easy jokeand people are just like eating
it up. Like I went on public many
times. I say I do not like the style of

(08:37):
like a Mr. Uncle Roger, Uncle Roger at all.
I don't find him funny at all. I find the whole things like,
OK, it's good for like a 3 minute video.
You can't have a whole career out of this.
This is insane. But also I am here and he's
doing fucking arenas. Yeah.
So am I to judge? But like, I have friends who are
like, not like, not in the business, like normal civilians.
And they think it's great they. Send it to me all the time.

(08:59):
They're like, can you bring it to Hong Kong?
Is this guy super funny? I'm like, I want to kill myself.
Yeah, you're like, you're like, no, absolutely not.
But yes. But again, everyone should have
their guilty pleasures and like if someone likes something that
I think is kind of trash. Yeah, but what point do you feel
like as a pastry chef yourself, that you have a certain
responsibility as service to society to teach people like
you're ruining your life by eating from this particular

(09:21):
place, like. Ruining your life.
But actually you take taste. More seriously than I do.
I love it. You're like.
No, I mean, like, it's very rarethat something affects me to a
point where I literally look at them be like, I cannot be in the
same space as people who are enjoying this, you know?
Funny enough, you are in the same space of the place you are
referring to. I'm telling as in like.

(09:42):
You're in the same block you can.
OK, yeah, I'm in a 5 minute distance from.
Yes, yeah. Can you get?
Shade Rattle. Yeah, yeah, no.
Entire episodes trashing that place and he is gonna mention.
Let me tell you something, I'm not the type of guy to trash.
I'm not one of those. Are you talking?
I'm always very like, you know, come on, we can get it done.
I'm very the typical like you can do it if you want to give

(10:03):
your heart and everything. But when something bothers me to
that point where I trash it. Dude, that must have.
It's done. It's done dragging.
Yeah, exactly what are you dragging?
There's a place near in StauntonSt. side this bakery.
Unfortunately somebody managed to register it and the Hong Kong
Business Registration Departmentapproved of their license.
It's called vision. Oh, of course we know visual.

(10:25):
I like how you pronounce it. You're giving it fancy.
I'm trying to make it. I'm giving it the benefit of the
doubt. I gave everything.
I gave it chances. I bought stuff there multiple
times. It sucked every single time.
It's messy food. It's messy food is terrible.
It's. Trash, by the way, episode 205,
the whole thing is there is a 49minute episode pretty much
trashing visual. Yeah, so.

(10:46):
How did I miss this? I was downloading things and
listening to you guys on like myflights back and forth and
somehow I skipped this vision. Yeah.
Is that is that how you say vision?
No, I mean I would, I would justsay vision, but I think I think.
You're giving more, right? I'm trying.
I'm trying so hard to see. I literally bought stuff with.
Them you don't want them to succeed anymore.
It's OK. It's OK.
Let's just call a spade. A spade.

(11:07):
Honestly, I think they one up tome.
Like, as much as I don't want them to succeed, they are
successfully not succeeding by sucking.
You get it? Yeah, they're.
That's what I mean. Like OK, so let's say.
Yeah. Is there acknowledgement just
like I was saying about like a bad comedian that like, is there
acknowledgement from your side? Or are you gonna?
Within the business that you're like?
I'm not gonna like shovel too deep into it because again,

(11:28):
they've got a line. They're like, they're doing
their thing. But I just see it as messy food.
Like when you see something and you're like, that's impractical
to eat, I'm gonna try and bite into that croissant and it's
gonna get all over my shirt. Like you have to realize that's
not like at some level that's just not good food.
Yeah, should be able to be eaten, you know?
So on the. Floor as much as their food.
Technically it crumbles and theyrealize because their food is
not worth eating so they're doing you a service but let them

(11:49):
crumble everywhere. You're like, dude, I can't
believe you bought our shit so. Let me help you for a little
third of it to be like your top in the box on the napkin on the
floor. Yeah, you're welcome for letting
me waste my food. Particularly how you how what
how do you fuck up by making it to that messy like in the in the
I? Think I think so.
I think what's happening is people in this day and age, so

(12:12):
it's basically like a baseline requirement that all humans are
foodies. Now everyone has to have an
opinion about where is the best and where is this.
And that means that all food establishments have to make
complicated and often messy foodwhere you're like, this isn't
just a croissant, it's a matcha mocha brownie explosion.
You're like fuck off with that. Like can I just chocolate?
Can I just have something delicious like?

(12:33):
Just have a regular croissant. That is good.
Sorry to, like, plug it, but like, can you just have a slice
of red velvet cake? Go around the corner, have a
nice, beautiful slice of red velvet cake?
Yeah, it's great. And it's not gonna get on your
other place. Like you're gonna eat something
that's true food. And so I think people are trying
so hard to one up themselves that they create like,
catastrophes. Yeah, yeah.
Unfortunately. But how does it become so flaky?

(12:56):
Like why? Why does?
Like, God, this is not the podcast that you want to have me
on. How does it become so flaky?
Is such a unintended layered, a layered question?
No. So making croissants is a really
fascinating process. I won't bore anyone with it, but
actually making it flaky means giving it less folds, which
makes like less time and less technique.

(13:18):
And then the flakes are bigger and then everything's messy, but
it's actually just made less carefully, right?
Again, I could. I could wax poetic.
About this, but yeah, yes, that's it.
That's yes. It's all reined it in all.
Yeah, yeah. So basically it's a lack of
ability, skill, time, effort andeverything that caused this to
be the way it is. I love it.
And we'll just segue here for like a 32nd, Yeah, you being
like a vision of shit. Vision that's something like

(13:43):
this is the thing. When he told me that you're
getting on, I was like, I'm gonna try to pull myself away
from getting into that topic andI survived like 6 minutes into
it. We're just started.
I need, yeah, but that was amazing.
I just need a true professional who knows what they're talking.
Not me. See, I am the consumer, just
like any consumer to comedy show, right?
Consumers are the professionals,in a way.
In a way, fair enough. What matters?

(14:03):
That's it. Consumes.
They're the ones who are consuming.
You may know your stuff, but they're the ones who are buying,
right? As much as you may trash.
Let's say Uncle Roger he is as most yes, he's selling stadiums
and you're selling like your bathroom.
Right. Yeah, exactly.
So it is what it is, but my curiosity is like the
phenomenal. See, comedy is very subjective
because your ten sense of humor and everything.
But like for example, you don't lick the floor because the

(14:25):
flavor of the floor is nothing appetizing.
It's understood. You get it.
Like no one's going like dude, Ihave a fetish for floor.
Like maybe you've got like 5 people, right?
You don't have a line of people.We're like, dude, I'm into floor
licking, right? It's true.
I mean, maybe you're finding a new community now by shout out
to all the floor. They're like, we hate flavor, we

(14:46):
hate the. Good.
I mean you would probably know this even because you live
closer to it. Like the last few months even I
passed by there was never reallya line anymore.
So I think people are catching on to it to be fair.
Also, the line at Big House is very.
Reduced to light. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
So I'm not sure if this is just like a Hong Kong economy tanking
or the flavors change. What do you think if you are in,

(15:08):
since you are in the business, Yeah.
In the business, I mean, luckilyI've been away from the city for
a month, so I haven't seen the shift in the lines.
But I think that, you know, I think Hong Kong is very much a
trend city. I mean, we all know that, right?
Like once everyone's tried vision a few times, like I
think, I think the lines start to reduce.
Everyone finds the thing like it's, it's such a revolving

(15:29):
wheel. But I think what's key is like
is maintaining consistency and having product that's like there
for you all the time, not this like ever evolving wheel of like
crazy new shit. Yeah.
So I told a few listeners that our some of our regulars that
you are coming on and pretty much everybody asked me the same
exact question that I'm sure youare aware of.

(15:50):
People are talking about the conspiracy of blasting your like
exhaust fan on the street and they're like, is this deliberate
because it pulls people in like zombies?
OK, so and. They're saying it's I've heard
this, this exact word from two different people.
They're like, tell them this is evil.
Evil, evil, you know it's. Like, not in a bad reason.

(16:10):
Like, yeah, it's like. Ebenezers, man on the bridge.
Same deal, right? Yeah, same thing what they're
doing. So they're like, this is, Yeah.
No, I wish, I wish I could say that it was like this amazing
marketing scheme, but honestly, when we, when I first started,
it was just the little corner shop and like, that's just the
exhaust. We just have to get the heat out
of that bakery like but you can pull.
It up. I think it's it's actually.

(16:31):
I don't know. Just happened the way it is.
You know physics. You know happens to.
Be I feel like as fans go, they usually go, yeah, point of.
I think maybe we were trying notto like pipe that straight into
the apartments above us, so instead we just put that out
into like Club 7. Do people still call?
That club 7-11, yeah, yeah, thatcorners up, yeah, I think.
So, but yeah, a lot of a lot of drunk people need to smell

(16:54):
carrot cake. I think it's just good for them.
But a lot of like people on the way to work need to smell carrot
cake. Yes, but smell it.
But then you stop serving to actual like like humans at like
what, 8:00 PM? PM exactly, I know.
And you guys are in there at like 12.
We're in there all the time. They're in there all the time
and all the last thing smell. And yeah, I really imagine
people like banging on the window like zombies.

(17:15):
Okay, okay, okay, so true story,true story.
Before the bakery got bigger because we were one shop and
then we became three shops before the bakery got bigger.
I was in there at night. I'm working by myself.
My shift started at 1:00 AM and I was there like setting up pies
and doing my thing and this guy comes in and I was like Lord the
door. Wasn't locked.
The door isn't locked. But yeah, you don't expect it's.
Also like a fire hazard cuz it was only one door.

(17:37):
It's like I locked the door. Anything you can't run out?
Yeah. But also, it's Hong Kong, why do
I need to have the door locked? Yeah, yeah, exactly.
Yeah, yeah. And.
This guy, like, helps himself into the bakery.
And I was there alone and there's like no other exit.
And I was like, I'm like, I'm trapped.
I'm like Heller, Heller, Heller.Wait, what?
Do you mean help himself? He's actually walking stuff.
He's like. He's like walked in and he's
like I need and I was like no, no, no.
Like he's like coming towards meand I was like actually kind of

(17:59):
scared. I'm tough but I'm actually not.
I'm like I seem tough but I'm really like squishy and like
very scared. I have seen you do hand stands
like it's not. But I mean when it's.
All way by the way. Yeah, she do.
Well, she's going on her hands. But like, get out of here.
I'm just carrying. Like a spider man thing.
Like he's drunk. Like he's seen.
Her at yoga, like you're like, she's so flexible.

(18:21):
Like what? Like I'm.
I'm tough, but yeah. No, use the logic.
OK, let's say this guy bars. I need cake.
And she's like, watch me get on my hand.
And he's like the rules upside down.
I have to walk away. Like, what do you think is gonna
happen, man? Maybe.
She would just like get him withher Zen.
Yeah, just we just got to take adeep breath, yeah.
And leave and exhale. Exactly the fuck exhale out of

(18:42):
my store. Yeah, yeah, exactly.
So yeah, he walks. In he walks in and he's like,
he's there. He's like kind of pounding on
the table. And I'm like, what do I do?
I like do I give the mouse a cookie?
Cookie drunk, right he. Was really drunk.
And then he like sits down. It was like a whole scene.
It was fine. Ultimately it was fine.
Luckily there are beautiful teammembers within the team of the
restaurant group that you can call and they come and like help

(19:02):
you. Wait at 2:00 in the morning?
Yeah. What?
Yeah, that means like. 2:00 in the morning, but like I.
Because we have so many restaurants.
Yeah. So you're just like, you're like
A and I won't say names, but like, yeah, please.
And then they just, like show upand they're like big and
intimidated. And then the guy is like out.
And I was like, thank you. Back to my baking.
She met her husband. Yeah, exactly.

(19:23):
You wandered into my. Bakery, I'll give you way more
than gig buddy. Give my pastry.
Let me just say it's not flaking.
Oh man. Oh man, I went there.
I went there off the rails very quickly.
Here we go. Wait, wait, wait.
Dude, this is so cool. So now people know that should

(19:45):
they decide to attack, let's say, a black sheep or generally
a restaurant in that area at 2:00 in the morning, thinking
like, I'm the man, I'm going to go get some Kirk.
Yeah. You just have to, like, dial a
certain number and like, is there a certain code of like,
like, you know, like how comedians you tell the security
or if I say, oh, you know, get this guy a glass of water.
Yeah, That means reject this. Problem.
That's the thing. A lot of them because they want
to get this guy out, they're like, I think you need a glass

(20:06):
of water, Sir. And.
Then they sneak over and they. Come up to yeah.
Yeah. Sorry.
Yeah. Come with me, Sir.
You get a glass of water and they eject them from the show.
Yeah, no, there's team members who are there for some of our
events. Where people tend to get real
shitface, yeah, yeah, that are there just to make sure that our
team is taken care. Of there's no, there's no code

(20:28):
word or code, say you don't be like, hey, I need a bit more of
a car. I guess the shit out of this man
plays. Yeah, break some kneecaps.
Oh man, I need an ornament. I have.
I need an ornament gentleman whoI think one of the guys you're
referring to, he's like a brown guy.
Like, oh, he's a tall turban guy.
No, not the tall turban guy who also was a topic on this podcast

(20:49):
before because a lot of women find him quite attractive.
There you go, you are totally agree.
Yeah. But no, there is another guy who
is like wearing a suit a lot of the times he's like brown.
I don't know what's his name is.There's a few, there's a few
guys. There's a guy walking around,
yeah. It's just a nice thing to feel
really supportive. But I mean break a fight, slash

(21:10):
like try like it was actually atBurger Circus and it was during
COVID and like just like right outside and some drunk idiot
trying to go at the like he was trying to break up a fight and
he just went for him and the guytossed him like a child.
Yeah, it was like it. Was so funny that.
Is so cool. Yeah.
He's like woof. Yeah.
Yeah. It was.
It was almost. He just wanted to like that

(21:32):
cartoon. Yeah.
He just looks. He just looks irritated.
Yeah, yeah. No more of that.
Yeah. And then he just like did like a
James Bond, like fixing his suitthing.
Yeah, yeah. Walking, yeah.
Yeah, it looked very comical. Yeah, so, OK, so let's
visualize. I really need to visualize this
whole thing. OK, so you you picked up your
phone and you were like, I need a a bit more of icing sugar and

(21:52):
the guys like I got it. That's code for something else
anyway, hey? All German guys just say so. 3
minutes later. 3 minutes, 5 minutes, 5 minutes, right.
More like 3 than 5 but yeah, shows up and the door just
slides open and the guys like all slumped and then the guy is
just like. To join these 5 minutes, what's
the What's the protocol for you?Do you entertain this person and

(22:14):
keep? I don't have time for that.
I'm making pies, my friend. Yeah, I told you this.
Yeah. You're making.
Yeah. Yeah, I know.
Yeah. I mean, I have no idea what the
process is to me. According to some bakeries, it's
just like, no. No, I'm like in the weeds.
I'm in the weeds because. This guy's in there.
This guy's just sitting there. I'm like, my heart's like, yeah,
so I'm trying not to be stressed, but I'm also trying to
be cool, 'cause. I'm the boss and I'm like, yeah,

(22:35):
I'm like, I shouldn't. Freak out, I've already called,
someone will be here. This guy doesn't scare me,
'cause logically he shouldn't, right?
Yeah, I shouldn't be good. Yeah, I mean, you also have
stuff to give him. Like you can just give him,
obviously. Yeah, just throw cookies at him.
Throw the. Crumbs at him, you know what I
mean? Like the little cut off that.
You'll need like when they say like when you have a shop and
you're getting robbed, just givethem what they.
Want them what they want, I mean.
He's obviously not there to likechat, no.

(22:56):
And once that was the thing, I was like, I shouldn't be scared.
So I had no reason to be scared.And I just kept on.
I kept on. The word is fonsage.
I was fonsaging my pies. It means what is fonsage vision.
Yeah, Fonsage. It just means to put the the
dough inside of the pie tin and make it look nice, like make the
little crinkly edges. So I'm like funsaging and and
staring him down, being like he won't move.

(23:17):
He won't, you know, like a stareoff with like a bug in your
bathroom. You're like, if I look at it
enough, it won't, it won't come near me.
Yeah, do the the the cowboy stare at it, Yeah.
Let's backtrack. How do you get into being a
funsage expert? I think.
Yeah. It's your new title I love.
It I love it. I got into being a pastry chef
from a pretty young age. I was in high school and I was

(23:39):
planning to go into neuroscience.
I was gonna be really smart. I was a nerd.
I ate lunch by myself in the library every day, which
logically led me to pastry. Yeah, of course.
Yeah, I was working part time ina bakery and I really loved it.
Were you working as in that bakery part time?
Were you like neurosciencing them?
No, I wasn't even neurosciencingthem when I was 15.
I had no idea what I was doing. Yeah.

(24:00):
I was just trying to make some money, like, support my mom's
whatever. Yeah, yeah, Yeah.
And so I was, like, making tartsand cakes and learning how to
decorate things. I was learning how to come up
with, like, flavors of Creme brulee.
And I loved it. Yeah.
And my brother was like, don't get into food.
It's no fun. It's no good.
You'll never make money. Is he an F&B?
Of course not. No.
My whole family are engineers. Everyone was like be smart and I

(24:21):
was like rad I'll. Do it, Yeah.
And so I was like, I'll go into neuroscience.
And then my mom, she's like the black sheep of the family.
It was like. Hey.
She was like, but you love baking.
And I was like, yeah, but that'snot a real job.
I was like, I'm gonna go to realcollege.
But she's amazing. She was like, follow your
passion. If you're interested in this and
you think that there's like, a future for you that would make

(24:44):
you happier, like, give it a try.
And at that point, I was in all these, like, nerdy study groups,
Yeah. And I was, like, baking stuff
every week. And I was so excited.
To Baker, that would bring stuffand.
Every week I was like, this weekis marble cheesecake and
everyone was like Oh my God. That must have made you so
popular. I was the only way I could make
friends. Yeah.
I was like the only person I knew in high school who had a
tattoo and, like, baked stuff. And I was like.

(25:06):
But, but otherwise, I was such anerd.
I was like such a juxtaposition.People were like, is she cool or
not? And I was like, I don't know,
I'm just gonna keep confusing you.
Yeah, but so I applied to the Culinary Institute of America,
which is the closest thing to like a real college for pastry
chefs cuz you can get a degree in baking and pastry arts
management. Wow.
Wait, what? Yeah, What's pastry Arts
management? Baking and pastry.

(25:27):
Not just pastry, but baking and pastry arts management.
You can have an associate's or even a bachelor's degree.
Yeah. And what like so when you have
that, are you able like do you learn how to create new like
completely new inventions? Yeah, yeah, yeah.
So you have all sorts of different modules.
You learn about culinary math. You learn about, like, yield
testing. You learn about menu design,
team management, basic psychology, art and design.

(25:49):
Yeah. Question, is this in the menu
design session? Do they teach you?
How do you choose when it is chef recommendation and when
it's not? I don't recall.
Is there criteria? Is that something you must have
hit these tick these boxes before It's a chef
recommendation. Good question.
I don't recall there being like a specific, like, sort of
calibration. Yeah.
What becomes a chef's recommendation?

(26:10):
Yeah. But we definitely talk about
like how to highlight certain things, where things should go
on a menu, like menu psychology.Yeah, yeah, pretty big.
Three items over there and you got the small ones.
The small. Ones like how you scatter the
prices and things like this. Yeah, you.
Give us give us a bit of a crashcourse on menu, like if yeah on
on menu. Well, so I mean, the basic
thing, I think about it more from a chef's perspective than a

(26:31):
design perspective because luckily I don't have to design a
lot of menus. But from a chef's perspective,
you have to have your like best selling items that make some
sense food cost wise. And then you have to have things
that you just like know are gonna waste money, but people
love them. You know what I mean?
The pistachio Raspberry tart of it all, Like that's gonna cost
way too much to be profitable, but it brings value to the
brand. And then you've got to have a

(26:52):
few slam dunks that are just like really easy labor, low food
cost, and even if they don't sell as much, they kind.
Of fill out your French fries for example, in a regular
restaurant like something like. That.
Yeah, Exactly, Exactly. Yeah.
It's not going to take much labor.
It doesn't cost much, it doesn'tbring you much revenue, but it
helps to bring like a more balanced experience.
So you've got to kind of play the synthesizer of these.
So do. They teach you like for example,
let's say you know your product sucks.

(27:13):
OK, And do they teach you like OK, if you have it on a display,
the best way to hide that product and continue sucking is
you write the name of the product on a display to kind of
hide the food with from with theword.
Big display, big font. That wasn't something that I was
taught at the the at America's premier culinary college.
But I'm sure maybe, maybe now kids are being taught this.
It's been this little while since I've been in.

(27:34):
College. Some hacky college that was
like, oh, you spell vision with two s s, you know.
Trick them and so you get. Them.
This is the spelling I've never seen.
This must be good, this. Is Nancy.
That you were here because the topic of the vision trashing
episode was mostly me trying theegg tart inside the cookie.
The cookie thing. Did you hear of that before?

(27:55):
Before you know, I told you knowOr did you try it?
I've seen it, I know about it and look OK, so after not to
like dive back into me, but likewe after college, I worked at a
very well known bakery in New York and we were known for an
item called a cronut, which is acroissant and a don't work for.
Dominic Ansel. I was his first head pastry
chef. What?
Wait, so you're the reason people were like selling it in

(28:18):
like the black market? I I.
Can't say that I came up with it.
I started shortly after the cronut started so it's not it's
not mine. I would never claim it.
Shout out to Anna, she's amazing.
She made it. But I worked for Dominic Gansel,
I helped to expand his brand andopened his 2nd and 3rd and 4th
and 5th shops. But I was that is not something.
New. I mean, I didn't do it.
I I my research is talking to you.

(28:38):
I did not look up anything before beyond talking to you,
but that's amazing. Yeah.
So working for Dominique. Was very cool.
It was it was funny to like workin the place that originally I
never tried that thing by. The way like, because it was
here for like a year or whatever, yeah, it's gone and
then it's gone. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Was it? Was it?
Worth the hype? Loaded question.

(29:00):
Guys, OK, so the cronut was never my favorite pastry, but
when you talk about these fusionpastries, when you're like, it
was an egg tart inside of a cookie, yes.
I think in a way, Dominique kindof started this like he was he
was a visionary in that sense. He was like, I'm gonna make a
croissant slash doughnut. It's gonna be the same thing.
I'm gonna make a magic souffle. I'm gonna make a cookie shot.
I'm gonna make these different things.
Very fusion. And it was very fun to work with

(29:23):
and for him and to learn to innovate these things.
But now as a pastry chef, if there's something that I and
tiring, yeah, it's people being like, it's a waffle, but a
pudding, a pud waffle and like, what's happening?
Yeah. So when it comes to an egg tart
cookie, honestly, anytime I see these things, I'm just like,
that's a red light. Like nae nae, that's clearly
like a gimmick. That they're like, oh, well, how
do I get the two of them to buy the same thing twice?

(29:44):
Yeah, exactly. Yeah, you're like, I think.
It's also because. Obviously right around the
corner is Big House that is famous for the egg tart.
Yeah. So I think you want to be like,
well, while you're waiting, if the line is too long, we have an
egg tart. But it's with A twist.
Yeah. Yeah, it's.
Like jail time worthy, which this thing is so bad.
No, Yeah. Yeah, I was like.

(30:04):
I like, it's hard. Like I'm not a foodie and it's
hard for me to like eat something.
I'm like, oh, I am upset. Like I'm actually very angry
eating this thing. And that was one of the few
times. I mean, I'll give you an
example. Honestly, it's so bad.
Let me explain to you how bad itis.
Like you know, like how a lot ofcharities they will take, let's
say pastry bakeries and everything.
When they can't sell the items, they'll donate it to charities

(30:25):
for people to take it. I do a lot of charity work and
work a lot of charities. I have never heard anyone say,
oh, we're going to collect the leftover pastries from Bizon.
They're like, I think we have a heart.
We would never. We would not give.
This to homeless people, Yeah, we're like, dude.
How would you? That's me.
Haven't they suffered? Enough.
Yeah, exactly. You know, so a lot.
Of that and that keeps like I think the reinforcement this may

(30:45):
be confirmation bias, but so farit's just purely confirmation.
It's not confirmation bias. This is just.
Yeah, just saying what it is. Yeah, exactly.
So having. You also approved, like, not
reapproved. But I also agree with the idea
of, like, having the egg tart inthe cookie.
Yes. You know, it sounds really cool.
It's funny. Ha, ha, ha, ha.
But come on, people. We're better than this.
Yeah, unfortunately. They're not even better.
Than that wait, do you have? Do you have?
Any like funny stories working for the the crouton?

(31:09):
What is it called Cronut? The cronut did you have like
friends? Who was like, you know, asking
you like at midnight, like, hey,can you sneak us some like so,
OK. The small funny stories, things
like I would try and go to work and people be like, no, you
can't cut me and I'm like I haveto I.
Am making it. Yeah, this is another time.
It's so funny. I didn't realize this, how how
often I've had security personnel.
We had security for that line. So security would help to make

(31:32):
sure that I could get into the shop because people would be
queuing up from like 2:00 AM literally.
Yeah, that's insane. That's just.
Like for a whatever item, Yeah, it's not that.
It's like. If it's like the.
Best burger in the world. It's it's, if it's anything,
it's still yeah. Worth a four hour queue.
You're like, no, we also have New York.
It's it's like. Fucking freezing.
It's cool. Yeah, during certain.
Times it's like it's absolutely frigid outside and people are

(31:54):
doing it. People would pay other people to
wait in line for them. Professional line we had we had
a couple of guys that were just like there every morning.
Yeah, you again. Yeah.
But in terms of like funny stories, something interesting
that I learned is that we actually, this is kind of sad.
Maybe in maybe not sad, but we couldn't throw away any of our
cronuts. If the cronuts were not usable

(32:14):
to our standard, we had to RIP them up because people would go
through our trash. They would go through our trash.
And like, want to resell the cronuts or like try them or like
take photos of them. And so like if you had a cronut
pastry that was not acceptable. You had to like RIP it to shreds
and like put it in the bin with other stuff, which was like so
silly. You're like, my Lord, fair
enough, I mean, but that also. Happens with let's say like toy

(32:35):
figures, right? Like there are companies that
design like these proper figuresand everything that if you buy
it and let's say there's something problem with it, you
take a photo of it and they replace it.
But you have to show them a shattered piece of it, like a
photo of it's all shattered before they send you a
replacement. Wow.
Yeah, cuz they're like. Collectibles.
Oh yeah. Yeah.
What? Do you collect?
A lot of those like Joker. Figures and stuff like that.
So if you look at that, there's a whole bunch of these figures.

(32:56):
Oh yeah, we forgot to tell. You that Vivek is actually
mentally 12 years old. OK, sorry that we should have
opened I've got a lava. Lamp in here.
Like in all tracks. I mean after.
Talking about visual soccer egg,I think I have 12 years old.
They suck. They suck.
I don't like them. OK, so.
Coming back to, but are you whenyou are working there and are

(33:17):
you being told like, hey, can you make these like items or are
you more like given freedom to create new lots of freedom?
Lots of freedom. It's been a really cool
adventure. Like Black Sheep is always
opening new restaurant concepts and they always need new
desserts. And so there's a lot of freedom
for myself and the team to to make new things.
There's not a lot of boundaries so long as it fits the concept.

(33:38):
But the cool thing is, what is your most proud like?
Invention. Oh God.
That's so difficult to say. Butter that is like currently.
In in in I mean. I mean, I haven't, like, I
haven't made new stuff in a while.
I'm like, I'm checked out. I'm unemployed now.
Yeah. I think my, I would say my
proudest sort of like recipe or achievement at, at butter was
the red velvet cake or maybe theapple pie.

(33:59):
It's a tie. It's a toss up because the, the
apple pie is A twist on my mom'srecipe.
Love my mom, but she doesn't know how to bake anything.
So the fact that I could, like, take her recipe, tweak it a
little bit, add some beauty and like, make it a, a legitimate
thing that people love. And it's the only place you can
really get apple pie in Hong Kong.
Yeah, and the red velvet cake, just because it's kind of a
funny story. So I was like, I need to make a

(34:21):
red velvet cake. But prior to working at Butter,
I wasn't a cake lady. I was in fine dining.
I was at Dominique Ansel in French pastry.
Like, I actually don't have, like, a good, like, deck of cake
recipes. So I was like, scrapping and
scrimping and trying. And I was like, I'm going to
make this red velvet cake. But it was like, kind of not
good. And I was complaining to my
husband. I was like, it's not good.
It's not good. He's also a pastry chef.

(34:41):
Whoa, wait, hold on. Whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa,
whoa, whoa, whoa. This is hold on a second
diabetes. Yeah, number.
Of people who are getting heart attacks, yeah, from just this
couple. Does yeah, the.
Plaques is you. Welcome.
OK, so he's a pastry chef, but he.
Doesn't do cakes, he is a pastrychef as.
Well, I met him at Dominique Ansel.
It was his first job. I was his boss.

(35:01):
Whoa. Shit, you're like you are.
Gonna get on your knees boy. Give me that ring.
Like make pretzels. Yeah, wow.
Go, go. Game So I met my husband.
Doing work things. I moved to Hong Kong.
He chased me out here, La La la.But I was trying to make this.
Yeah, there's a whole 3 martini conversation about that.
Yeah, I was married before. It's a whole.

(35:22):
It's fun, Yeah. Yeah, we can get into.
It on the Patreon, Yeah, Patreondot.
Com slash hoho pod if you want to know more about her private
life, her private life and how her.
Husband stole her from her otherhusband.
Yeah, yeah. There you go.
Whoa. Oh yeah.
Jesus. Oh, my.
Good. It is flake.
Yeah, very flake. Lot of layers.
Lots of layers. Let me just wait.

(35:45):
So wait. So.
To wrap it up, the red velvet cake, I was like, I was like
crying. I was like this red velvet cake.
My recipe sucks. I don't know how to make cake.
I'm a bad cake lady. And I'm doing this for like a
week and a half. And then he's like, do you have
my recipe? And I was like, hello, hello.
Like we, I've been. Why didn't you start with this?
Yeah, because he, unlike me, he knew he wanted to be a pastry
chef from the time he was very small.
Yeah. And so like he has like a tried
and true red velvet cake recipe and he just like held back on me

(36:07):
for like 2 weeks of my trials and tribulations because he.
Wanted to not interfere with, I think you know.
As much as he's like the best man ever, he's like also a man.
And so he was like, oh, I just didn't think about it.
And I'm like, seriously? Seriously though, you you were.
Doing stuff and I was like, and he's just like, he's like, I
don't know, I just. You, I knew you'd figure it out
and I'm like, but I wasn't figuring it out.

(36:28):
And you had the answer. You have the answer.
You could have just. Given me a good.
Speech as to to. Quote UN quote identifying as
male people. If you were in that situation,
would you? What would be your true excuse?
Not the one you tell her, but the true excuse of why you
didn't give it to her. It's probably because I was
thinking of like football on set, football results.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I.
Think I'm thinking probably how many?

(36:48):
Times like how many games are left for Liverpool to win the
title and like the new signing for Man City and like how it's
going to affect our lineup next season.
Like that's because that's. What I'm thinking of?
About 80% of the time. So my God, I.
Had no idea that was what's likein the backtrack.
Yeah. Yeah, you said.
Red Bell screensaver is. Usually the the EPL like this
mental screensaver. I don't know.

(37:11):
For me, it would be a little bitof that typical male alpha ego
thing of like if I just give it to her, she might make it really
big and it's my recipe. And then I have to be like, you
know, this recipe you inspired by?
I'm not inspired by. It was my recipe.
Yeah, it means it is inspired by.
Him, but like I also made it better.
That's what I mean. So like you would make it nice.
My point is that he'll give you the.
Recipe. Whatever you will make it
better. That better is the tipping point

(37:31):
of what made it huge. And technically he was inspired
by him. But nobody's reading the the
little asterisk that says inspired by this guy.
Well, actually, it's true. His shop?
Is gonna be called better and itsays 0.
That's pretty good. Yeah, they.
All feel better. Butter.
Yeah. I can't believe it's butter.
Oh yeah, yeah. Better, right.
Or yeah. So that might have been the
whole thing. And after a week, he's like,
he's just like, he's holding out.

(37:52):
Yeah, yeah. He's like, she's not giving up.
I gotta do this. Typically can't listen to her
wine. Yeah.
I want to do the husband thing. I'm.
Like let me, let me fix it for you.
Let me call my mom. So I never mentioned this here.
How we met is that I came to your yoga class and I was like,
well, it's like, probably like ayear ago now.
Like, it's been a while. Yeah.
And you know I. Recognize you from from butter

(38:15):
because I bought stuff from there before.
We never really actually talked.I just bought stuff or whatever.
And then we eventually started like making friends and talking.
But funny enough, Jared was there the whole time and I
didn't. The husband, husband.
Jared, so he's at at every. Your class, like even when I
would go like once a week, he's always there.
And I didn't know who you are. Like, I knew you guys knew each
other, but I didn't know he's the husband.
I actually thought he's just a very dedicated yoga student.

(38:36):
Yeah, who is like, I'm like thatvery dedicated.
Yeah, like I just made a. Mental note of like first of all
that guy is definitely jobless because.
He's always there. He's.
Always there. And also he's really good at
yoga. I'm like, maybe he's like, like
doing a, like a, like an instructor thing or whatever.
Yeah, we're like a connector. But I never and.
He's also has a lot of tattoos. You have a lot of tattoos and I

(38:57):
never connected that you guys are an item.
Yeah, until like you told me, like very recently.
You know why you didn't connect it?
Because 80% of your fucking brain, it's like you're on.
Screensaver mode. It's so obvious, it's like.
I do tattoo. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
You have a lot of like very similar.
Tattoos as well, Like tattoos from similar artists or similar
artists? Yeah.
Well, yeah, like one of my. Tattoos is of a is like a

(39:18):
prominent graffiti artist in Hong Kong.
And so I got a picture of one oftheir graffitis tattooed on me
that I thought was very cool. And then they actually the the
artist graffitied over there. Your own graffiti with a new
graffiti. Yeah.
And he got that. And so like we have some like
kind of cool before the act. Ohh.
We have some kind of cool. Do you?
Have one of those. Tattoos where like when you when
you stick together. No, no.

(39:39):
You should have one of the you guys.
Maybe, maybe, maybe. One day, but not not yet.
You don't have one was. Like I'm with stupid, you know?
Yeah, he's like. Ha ha, it's.
Me because that. Would be the dream.
Like, you have the chat too. And that's the true test of
sagging skin. Like, you know, if you don't get
spit, who stays? Yeah, spit.
Yeah. Nicer, Yeah.
Wait, does he feel? Betrayed that you left like the

(40:00):
the butter like the pastry chef in industry in a way.
No, he's my biggest like. Honestly, in life, he's my
biggest cheerleader, He's my biggest champion.
Like nobody wants to hear like my mushy, like I love my husband
so much, but like all of that plus plus, yeah, that's kind of
gross. So boring.
Yeah, don't do that. I won't do that when you're
making your. Pastry, let's say, you know,
like how you have that turntablefor to do the cakes and all that

(40:21):
stuff. Has he ever, has he ever just
just while you're doing spinningthe table and trying to do the
pastry and doing the icing and everything, has he ever done the
ghost movement where Patrick's played?
Because Oh yeah. I don't know, maybe now that I'm
like not employed as a patient like that was like more.
Hot now being like baby shut me.Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Funny. Yeah, you can like hopefully

(40:42):
now. Is a good test.
If he doesn't make him listen tothis episode, I will and I will.
If he does. And then he's like, that's a
good idea. Then you'd be like, I, you did
listen to the episode. I see what he did at home.
Again, I don't think he would want to.
Listen to the Patreon because we're going to go hard on on the
stealing husband's situation. Meaning why?
Yeah, that's good. There's some funny stuff, but.

(41:02):
And also like for who don't knowanything, I mentioned yoga
randomly and people will be like, what the fuck?
We thought she's a pastry chef. What's going on with the yoga
thing? Because that's yeah, came out of
nowhere. You are a yoga instructor as
well. Certified.
I'm a certified yoga. Instructor.
So when I first moved to Hong Kong, one of my best friends
introduced me to yoga. I had taken a few classes here
and there, but I got involved atthe studio and started

(41:24):
practicing daily. And it's honestly, it's been the
best sort of foil or counterbalance to chef life.
Yeah, is making time to slow down, to breathe, to move
mindfully. And I never thought that I would
want to teach yoga, but I knew that I wanted to learn more.
So last year I took a 200 hour, which is like the base level.
Yeah. Yeah.
Yeah, and. Actually the, the company that I

(41:46):
work for, for hospitality was like, could you teach some yoga
classes like to our community? And I was like, oh, I don't know
how to teach. I'm nervous.
I can't do that, but I did. And it opened up these like
floodgates of like, oh, I actually love sharing this
practice in this way. So I'm teaching.
I've been teaching yoga once a week, once to twice to thrice a
week actually for the last year plus.

(42:07):
Yeah. And it's become this nice little
group, this this kind of nice little community of F&B people,
but also non F&B people. Yeah.
So I'm looking to explore that more as I become unemployed,
which I am now. Yeah.
So yeah, I'm gonna be teaching more and more.
I'm taking my 300 hours certification at the moment
which is just the next level, so300 hours on top of.
The 200 so total 500 hours, so I'll have a 500 hour.

(42:29):
RIT cert Yeah. So does that mean?
Every class you're teaching is added to the hours some.
Certification programs allow your teaching or even just
taking classes to count towards your certification.
But the studio that I'm taking my certification at is really
quite strict and serious. So the 500 hours are all actual,
like lecture and learning time. Yeah, so in addition to that,

(42:51):
I'm also taking classes, I'm teaching, I'm doing all these
other things, but it's 500 hoursof learning about anatomy and
yoga, history, philosophy, mantras, pranayama, asana,
practice, like all of it. So what are the biggest like?
Misconceptions about yoga instructors.
I think the biggest. Misconceptions are that you have
to be flexible to teach yoga. And I think the biggest, maybe

(43:13):
that's not a misconception, but the biggest kind of gap that I
see in modern yoga is that people focus just on movements
and hand stands and being able to do tricks.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, it looks. Good on Instagram, but yeah,
there's nothing behind you. My heart.
My heart hurts. Yeah, I know.
Like I don't. I won't forget to have my mic
closed. My heart hurts.
Yeah. Exactly with the like the.

(43:33):
Instagram yoga but like I try and make sure that any class
that I teach incorporates at least a little bit of meditation
and breath work because so many places just skip over they're
like settle in yeah OK now downward facing dog let's move
let's flow, let's sweat, let's burn and I'm like no we got to
breathe yeah bibs, bibs the whole thing we got to start with
yeah yeah you do a lot of. Like, yeah, like smaller breaks

(43:53):
in the middle of I guess Osters movements with a lot of breath
work, which which is actually I think the one that I come to
Ying Yang usually is 75 minutes.And I imagine it's because of
that. Like, you want to allow certain
like, time for breath work, right?
You need to have time for breath.
Work, you need to have time to slow down.
Like traditionally classes were always 90 minutes or even

(44:15):
longer. So the fact that everyone's
trying to package yoga into thislike 45 minute, like lunch break
yoga, yeah, it's great. It's still movement, it's still
beautiful, absolutely. But for me, the biggest, again,
maybe not miss conception, but this gap in modern yoga is not
making time for the foundation, which is mind and body
connection, which comes from meditation and breath.

(44:37):
So yeah, that's my my yoga soundbite.
But I'm really enjoying to teachyoga.
Would you? Would you do it full?
Time I. Would like to do it full time.
I know that like that's a bit ofa challenging thing to make
financially soluble. I mean, you have your own.
Studio or no if Visio doesn't run out of.
Business stopping you from doingthat right that's so I'm I'm.
Really just open minded right now about what my like future

(44:58):
prospects are. So I'm going to teach.
I have some opportunities to teach so would you do like one
on ones? Yeah, of course.
One on ones, one on twos, whatever.
Is like you're happy that anyoneis willing to genuinely learn.
Yeah, right. Of course.
OK, OK. Of course.
So small. Format classes can be really
effective because you can tailormore to what people's goals are,
whether that's more physical strength and like what the
mental or more. Like or help?

(45:20):
Me check. Out if I'm messing it up without
realizing all these years, Yeah,of course.
Or like group classes that are more for kind of community
building, which is what we're doing now.
So the classes are usually 5 to 8 people, 5 to 10 people.
And it's nice cuz you see some regulars, you make some friends,
you move together. It's great.
Yeah. Or like bigger stuff, corporate
stuff, like I'm really open. I'm happy to teach in different
formats. As a chef, you're always kind of

(45:40):
a teacher. Yeah.
So I've found teaching to actually be quite natural.
Yeah. I'm not saying I'm great at it.
Yeah, yeah, yeah. But it comes naturally to me to
speak and not be nervous in front of people.
Yeah. And to give guidance and
directions. So it's been really fun to share
something that makes people feelso good.
I can tell you there's a really.Simple idea.
It's actually on par to the egg tart cookie idea in a way, but

(46:03):
it's a bit better. It's called bacon.
Breathe, right? Because while you're bacon.
Is a lot of time awaiting. So while you're waiting for it
to bake, do the breathing. Yeah, you go in, you mix a.
Cake. You put it in the oven and you
come and do that. And you're learning 60 minutes
later. Yeah, yeah.
And then my God at the. End What you do is then you have
a little room where people put on goggles and they have

(46:24):
baseball bats, where they bash microwaves, they bash those
instant cake mixes. And that's when they like.
I will no longer be impatient. Bake and break and breathe.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, all the. Bees, Baby bees.
Yes, all the bees, you know whatI mean?
Yeah. It's all that kind of thing.
Yeah. So there's a lot of I can, I can
guarantee if you had something like that, people who are
probably like in the financial industry, like I need to break
something. I wasn't.

(46:45):
I wasn't. Expecting the breakdown as the
curveball, it's yeah, it's also.Like, you were very creative.
Yeah. You need to like go out there
and break shit and be like, whatam I doing with my life, man?
It's not what life? Well, it's a lot of like.
I mean, all of these things individually exist.
There is like the break room or whatever.
Like I've heard about these. Yeah, yeah.
I would love to. Go.
Someone write in. How?

(47:05):
Where do we go? Yeah, yeah.
How do we go? And can you get us, the three of
us in for free, one right down here?
Is it just like that? That trash receptacle part, no,
it's. Like I just keep giving money.
To the guys over there, they letme throw stuff you.
See, no, that place basically you have to bring your own
baseball bat. Yeah, it's called.
It's called vision. That's right.

(47:26):
You go and beat the shit out of all this stuff there.
Nice. What do you do?
I'm eating a fucking dough. OK.
That's I think. What normal people call a crime.
So it's not. That's when you start helping
prisoners, yes, do bake and breathe and break.
Yes, in prison. I mean, just like the field day.

(47:48):
Out exactly. I'll go.
To the prank room. Wait, hey.
Selfishly. While we have you, I would like
to learn a quick like recipe to make like some fun desserts at
home. Oh my God, a quick recipe.
To make fun desserts at home. Yes.
You know what I do? Yes.
Well, you don't like? Desserts but you.
Spoiled it. I was gonna.
Say, do you know what I do? I take one part Corkscrew and

(48:08):
one part wine bottle. Yeah.
And there we go. Wow, we.
Go bottle. Bake.
You know, like. Yeah.
Is there like a brownie rest? Like something really easy that
me and the listeners can make? I mean, I wish I could.
Give you something but to be honest we even tried to do just
like a simple take it home and bake it thing like it was like a
tray bake. It was already ready, like a
Raspberry crumble, and, like, nobody bought it.

(48:29):
I think Hong Kong is the laziestcity in the world.
Yeah, I do. Sorry.
Sorry. Love you.
Yeah. When it comes to baking, I don't
think anyone wants to make anything.
Yeah, because everyone's thinking like.
Hold on a second. Let me understand this.
So you're gonna provide me with the ingredients which I can get
myself? Yeah.
You tell me what to do. I'm like, that's not the point
here. The point is you do it.
I enjoy it. I no like.
Honestly, even if you tell people how to make things, no
one wants to make anything at home.

(48:49):
It costs so much more to make something at home than to make
it than to just buy it. Yeah, but if you do want to make
something, I mean make some chocolate chip cookies, Simple.
OK, well. Butter.
Brown sugar. Sugar, some eggs, little baking
powder, some flour, chocolate chips.
Like, you know, just write that.Yeah, done.
Done. Done, done, done, done paddle.
Paddle. Would you?
Would you? Put all of your original recipes

(49:11):
in into a book of sorts to for for us to learn for us dummies.
There's a possibility. There's a possibility I would be
interested to possibly create a little bit of a recipe book
slash life story situation at some point Yeah, but I think
more centered around kind of theadventures of chefing and less

(49:31):
around specific recipes cuz I I wonder how many people do the
fine art of baking at home. Yeah, yeah, and on.
Top of that they must have. So if you're doing recipe book
wise, you're competing on that level.
It's all right, we get we, there's tons, you know, I think
there's so much. About kind of the story of the
interesting, like, experience ofbeing a chef.
Yeah. I've had the chance to move to
many different countries, live in a lot of different places,

(49:53):
work for a lot of interesting people.
Yeah. I think if I were to ever
publish anything, it would be kind of a fusion of recipes, art
and also story. Yeah.
That's all. Have you?
Read Kitchen Confidential of course.
I think you have. To read Kitchen Confidential To
be a chef. Do you?
Do you? Obviously, like his story,
whatever, like there is a level of like, I guess sexiness to

(50:16):
like the messiness of the kitchen and stuff.
Can you relate to that as well? Even if you're a pastry chef?
Not. Oh my God, yeah.
When I was. So I when I was 2020 to 20, me
too. I worked in New York City in a
fine dining French restaurant. We were through Michelin star.
We were 7th best in the world. Like we had 200 covers a night.
It was a very busy happening place.
It was at the top of its game and it was everything that you

(50:38):
think of as like the kind of crazy kitchen being like you
show up 3 hours before you clockin, you stay 4 hours after you
clock out. You work hard, you party hard.
Like I most not most nights, butI would say a few nights a month
at least. I didn't even have enough time
to go home. So I'd like sleep in Central
Park like it was wow. Oh yeah, it was crazy.
And you're like getting paid well in a good.

(50:59):
Restaurant, you're getting paid shitty.
Because you work in a good restaurant.
Oh, that's how it is. Because you want the name on
your right next. To nothing.
OK. And.
Then you go out with all your like, your comis and other chefs
and you get completely just like, and then you sleep in the
park and you wake up and you like dust yourself off and do it
again. And you work super hard and you
get yelled at. Like I had a chef who would like

(51:19):
time our bathroom breaks. You'd be like, chef, I need to
leave the lion to pee. And he'd be like, OK, 2 1/2
minutes. He'd be like, ah, this isn't
sanitary, but you'd just like, yeah, you'd just run.
Yeah, I saw there was a night service somebody went down on,
like, this Peach dish, They didn't have enough Peaches.
And it's, we're in, like, the Upper East Side.
And he's like, go get more Peaches.
And you're like, there's literally nowhere open.
It's 9:30 at night. But like, this poor guy Vincent,

(51:41):
like, leaves the line to, like, run to try and find white
doughnut Peaches at 9:30 at night.
They have to be specific. Kind of Peaches, of course they
do. This is Michelin.
Baby, Yeah, yeah, the little doughnut sheet and you needed
to. Poach them in lemon.
Verbena like on the station like.
So yeah, you deal with the craziness of one last thing
though, with all the craziness. It's led me to ask one question.
If you were to cook scallops, God and you.

(52:03):
Were to serve it. To the front, whatever they call
it. Sure, And that chef finds it
raw. Why does the chef have to slap
the scallops and then tell you it's raw?
And then put it on TV. What's the necessity of that?
I mean, everyone likes. Outrageous shit.
No, I would never cook scallops.Mostly 'cause I'm a vegetarian.

(52:24):
Sorry. Oh, I'm like, oh, raw scallops.
Gross. Yeah, yeah.
I mean, I think everyone wants to make a big splashy show.
It's raw. Let me do it. close the show.
I thought maybe it's one of those those.
Etiquette things with, with chefs, like you can't just say
it's raw, man, just try again. Oh, of course I I.
Literally, I was like, I was on the service line and there was
this giant chocolate sculpture and it was kept on this tall

(52:44):
shelf because my shelf was tall.And he's like, get it down.
And I was like, I can't reach. And he's like, get it down and
I'm like, I can't reach. And I like as I'm getting it
down, it like fumbles out of my hands and I break this like
massive chocolate. Sculpture.
He's like, why did you break? It and I'm like because I.
Told you I told you I was about to.
Break it like I said it and I called it and he's like, go make
another one. And I'm like right now.
Yeah. And I and I had to like ran
downstairs and I like, cried andI cried and I like made

(53:05):
chocolate and I like made a thing.
It was. It's a vibe.
Yeah. Oh, my God.
Yeah. OK, Yeah, yeah.
OK. That sounds.
We had the Fabio's a common friend of ours on the podcast
like years ago. And actually it wasn't me, it
was Andy the host before me. And yeah, he's still like, he's
actually a big Liverpool fan. So yeah, sometimes when I'm
thinking of Liverpool that I'm also thinking in the back.

(53:26):
He he works. On the screensaver section of
your mind, so. Fabio, shout out.
He's executive chef for Falconi.22 restaurants now, Yeah.
Yeah, many restaurants, yeah. Many.
Restaurants Karis, thank you so much for joining us.
This is wonderful. This is so fun.
Yeah. Super fun, thanks.
Guys so how do people find you for yoga needs and the general

(53:48):
online present present suite? Find me online.
On Instagram at Karis loves kale.
As in, like the vegetable, Karisloves kale.
One word karis dot loves dot KLKRY notes.
Yeah, sure. And then yoga together dot HK.
So Yoga Together is my yoga pageand you can find practice times
and opportunities for us all to meet up and breathe and move.

(54:11):
Amazing. Thank you so much.
We're about to do the Patreon where we do a little bit more
gossip and yes, All right, OK, we're going.
There. All right, see you guys on.
The Patreon, thanks for joining us everyone Come to a live show.
We have a bunch of stuff coming up before this gets too long.
Just you'll find everything. The show notes.
Thank you and see you next week.Bye Ciao.