The Medical Side of Major League Baseball: Dr. Pat DeMeo's Journey

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What happens when the players break? Dr. Pat DeMeo takes us into the sacred space of the Pittsburgh Pirates' trainer's room at LECOM Park to reveal the hidden world of Major League Baseball medicine.

Growing up as a Yankees fan in 1960s New York, DeMeo never imagined he'd one day become the Pirates' medical director and head of orthopedic surgery at Allegheny Health Network. With remarkable candor, he shares the unexpected path that led him to this rare position – one of only 30 MLB medical directors in the world – and the steep learning curve he faced during his first years with the organization.

Behind every pitcher's devastating injury or miraculous comeback lies an intricate dance between medical science and the business of baseball. Dr. DeMeo pulls back the curtain on how these decisions unfold, revealing the seasonal rhythm that dictates his work from spring training physicals to draft preparations and trade deadline medical evaluations. His philosophy remains steadfast through it all: "I don't represent management. I represent the player."

The conversation takes a dramatic turn when DeMeo recounts saving a man's life on the field during spring training, performing CPR and using a defibrillator while players watched on bended knee. He describes Jung Ho Kang's catastrophic 2015 knee injury as "the worst baseball injury I've ever seen – worse than anything in football" and details the innovative surgical approach that allowed Kang to return to play when the odds seemed impossible.

From AJ Burnett's transformative impact on team chemistry to the emotional challenges of forming bonds with players who might be "here today, gone tomorrow," Dr. DeMeo provides a deeply human perspective on medicine at the highest level of sports. His stories reveal not just the physical demands of baseball, but the mental fortitude required from both players and the medical professionals who care for them.

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:05):
We talk about a special edition of Hold my
Cutter.
This is a first inside thetrainer's room at Lee Com.
The former, I guess this is theMcKechnie Field Clubhouse at
Lee Com, because we're in thetrainer's room, the doctor tells
us we can't smoke any Rockies.
At least here We'll go outsideand do it.
It's Hold my Cutter.
We do have baseballs all overthe place.
But the great Dr Pat DeMeo iswith us who, uh, heads the

(00:28):
orthopedic surgery department atallegheny health network.
A long-time medical directorfor the pirates, going back to
like 2002, his stories areunbelievable.
Uh, this is where it allhappens, doc.
Yes, many is where we wish somethings didn't happen yeah.

Speaker 3 (00:46):
We're bringing good juju Right.

Speaker 1 (00:48):
Well, I want to talk to Pat DeMeo about your story.
We love talking, pat, about howpeople have gotten to where
Hold my Cutter is about baseball, the Pirates sports, pittsburgh
, and how people got to wherethey are today.
Your story, when you thinkabout being a medical director,
a guy that's in charge of allthe stuff, all the medicine,

(01:11):
essentially the medical stuffwith the Pittsburgh Pirates, a
major league sports franchise,when you're growing up and your
accent is still very evident inNew York, you couldn't have
dreamed about being this.

Speaker 2 (01:25):
No, no, I mean, obviously I was.
You know, growing up in the 60s.
You know there wasn't a littleboy in America didn't want to be
a baseball player, right, andso you know it was America's
pastime, it was the biggestthing ever, and we all played
Little League.
You know Pony League and a lotof other stuff, and you know so.
To even think someday I wouldbe able to mingle with Major

(01:49):
League Baseball players.

Speaker 1 (01:52):
I would never even think of that.
Yankees Mets obviously.

Speaker 2 (01:53):
Yankees.
Well, I grew up so my dad wasan old New York Giant fan and he
pretty much stayed a Giant fan.
So it's really the Willie Mayssdays and then those guys on the
willie mccovey's and whatnot,and then I grew up I don't know,
I mean I just, you know, when Iwas little the yankees were
pretty bad, right, they were inlast place all the time, but I

(02:15):
was just a yankee fan, I thinkmainly because of mickey mantel,
okay, right, and uh, you know,I caught the tail end of his
career, um, and so, uh, and Ijust I maybe just because of all
the tradition and history thatwas there with the team.
So, yeah, we used to watch theYankee games on WPXI.

Speaker 1 (02:35):
Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 2 (02:36):
In New York, Channel 11.
And then, as my careerprogressed, I think people asked
me how did I get to where I'mat?
There was really no plan.
It wasn't like.
I said, hey, I have thisdiabolical plan and I'm going to
plan this.
Once I decided to go to medicalschool I wasn't really sure what

(02:58):
kind of doctor I would be.
Until I had enough exposure andexperience I knew I wanted to
be a surgeon.
And then I narrowed it down toorthopedics.
Enough exposure and experienceand knew I wanted to be a
surgeon.
And then I narrowed it down toorthopedics and once I got into
orthopedics I decided that youknow, sports medicine was my
passion and you know.
And then one thing led toanother and I think I was very,
very fortunate in my career tohave some really big mentors,

(03:18):
and especially at the ClevelandClinic my mentor was Dr John
Bergfeld and he was one of themost respected sports
manifestations in the countryand that kind of was the
springboard to kind of like thebox you check to say, okay, are
you, can you do a professionalteam?
Right?
Because, because you had that?

Speaker 1 (03:36):
did he make you aware that was a possibility?

Speaker 2 (03:38):
you just knew that you get into that program.
How?

Speaker 1 (03:40):
do.
How do you get a break tobecome this for a sports
franchise, by the way.
What happens?

Speaker 2 (03:46):
Well, I think you have to have your boxes checked
right, you have to have all yourcredentials in line, which
obviously I did and then therehas to be some faith to it.
Right, you have to be in theright place at the right time
and there has to be a need.
And there's only 30 majorleague teams, right, how do you
get to be a player?
You know there has to be.
You know how many great playersdid you come up with in high
school, college minor leaguebaseball that you think, man,

(04:09):
this guy's going to be a greatmajor leaguer.
But there was never that window.
Right, they just they got shutout because there wasn't the
opportunity.
The same thing with us.
Right, it was just that windowfor me.
I was in the right place at theright time.
Kevin McClatchy believed in meand you know he stuck with me.
And you know David, you knowCam Bonifay and then David were,

(04:29):
you know, really instrumentalearly in my career.
And I will tell you this youknow you don't learn how to be a
major league baseball teamdoctor in medical school or
residency, right, because thisis a very insular world right,
there's only so many majorleague baseball players.

Speaker 1 (04:44):
No way to practice this.

Speaker 2 (04:45):
Right.
And so you know, having neverhaven't played the game at this
level Right, for me those firstfour or five years was very big
learning curve, and learning notjust the medical side of the
game, but the game of the game,the game within the game, and
what these guys are feeling,what the stress is like.
You know the pressure thatthey're under constantly.

(05:07):
I mean those are things thatyou know people on the outside
don't see, and so you have tolearn how to understand what
they're going through,understand what their problems
are.
It's not just oh, does yourshoulder hurt, or your elbow
hurt, or what's the MRI show.
There's a lot of stuff thatgoes into it and the baseball
side of it.
Browning, I didn't knowbaseball like you guys know it.

Speaker 1 (05:26):
You played in high school.

Speaker 2 (05:27):
I played.

Speaker 1 (05:28):
Okay, yeah, I know.

Speaker 2 (05:29):
I know I wasn't even going to go to the next level,
right, but that's not whatprofessional baseball is, it's a
whole different app.
Yeah, yeah, a whole differentapp.
And so, learning that part ofit, having David Littlefield and
Brian Graham those guys teachme the game and understanding
and you know, there's kind oflike a rhythm to the season,
right, and understanding thatbecause, okay, that's a great

(05:53):
point Red.

Speaker 1 (05:53):
Steve Blass always talked about that.
The three phases like springtraining.
The excitement of getting tothe ballpark for spring training
, you know, and then theexcitement of playing, but then
in the middle there's this lullthe down and then it revs back
up at the very end, and therhythm for us is well right now.

Speaker 2 (06:09):
Everything's ramped up between training.
We're going to get physicalsdone, so Major League Camp's
going to break tomorrow.
That's great, but you know what?
I've got the minor leaguescoming in.

Speaker 1 (06:16):
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 2 (06:29):
So now I have to be two places time, yeah, right,
and answering phone calls allday long right between both
places.
But in the minor leagues it's alot of work.
There's a lot of players, right, you know, and then a lot of
coaches too, yeah right, um andso uh.
And then once spring trainingkind of gets settled and the
minor leagues are playing theirgames, things kind of calm down
a little bit and then it's kindof okay.
Now they're setting rostersright and you know how
thatle-down effect goesthroughout the entire
organization.
You know, and you know who arethey who's going to be the 27th
guy?
Who's going to be the 26th guy?

(06:49):
Who's going to be the 25th guy?
You know?
Who's going to be the 12thpitcher, right?
All those things that are beingdecided in the next few weeks,
that last week.
Sometimes, you know, they'll askquestions of me.
You know, do I think thisperson can play or pitch
back-to-back games?
Do I think you know, like howmany games do you think he can,
you know, play?
You know, do you think thisperson's going to play 90 games,

(07:10):
100 games?
You know, what do you think?
And those are just guesstimates, right, but at the end of the
day you kind of get used to itover the years, understanding
what it all entails.
I don't think I could answerthose questions in my first two
years.

Speaker 1 (07:20):
Right, you have to build that up.

Speaker 3 (07:22):
Yeah, you got to get that Even what they were really
asking your first two years.

Speaker 2 (07:26):
Not really.

Speaker 3 (07:28):
Yeah, Sure Cause.
I mean they don't speak yourlanguage, you don't speak their
language.
But they made it fresh out ofit.

Speaker 2 (07:33):
Littlefield.
Yeah, littlefield really cut.
He understood, and heunderstood how to.
How to?
You know, I used to sit withthem during the games and listen
to them, and then I, and that'show I hear the language.

Speaker 1 (07:47):
Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 2 (07:48):
And so then the season starts, Right.
So this excitement of openingday and like kind of April and
May, you kind of glide a littlebit.
But then all of a sudden youstart thinking, OK, here comes
the June draft and you know Ihave to go through a lot of work
for that, Right.
So there's going through allthose medical records, which is
easier now than it might havebeen, you know, a generation ago

(08:08):
, because the electronic medicalrecord.
But back then if you everwalked into my office at PNC you
just see five feet worth ofpaper.
Right, I would go into allthose charts and I would come up
.
I came up with a grading schemethat I would give that's still
in use today, that I wouldexplain that now, well, like a
perfect score would mean thatyou had no injuries, uh say, the

(08:31):
next category would be that youhad, say, maybe a non-baseball
specific injury.
So anybody that's playing asport, you know if you hurt your
knee, hurt your ankle, either,whether it was surgery or not.
But it's not baseball specific,it's just kind of a general
orthopedic athletic injury.
But then you start to get tobaseball specific injuries the
shoulder, the elbow, okay, andthen that's a different grading

(08:51):
scheme and so you've got toknock people down for that a
little bit.
But at the same time, if they'dcome back from that and
demonstrated that they can besuccessful, you don't want to
penalize them either.
Right, and I penalize themeither right.
Um, and I think over you know,the last generation, I mean, if
you teams are now drafting guyswho haven't had their surgery
yet, but they know they need it,yeah, which I mean a decade ago

(09:13):
that would have never happened,right?
So I think that goes to.

Speaker 3 (09:15):
We did that with hunter barco, right, yeah yeah,
explain that now so hunter barcois at florida.
He is maybe a huge still in thedraft it's looking better and
better each and every year, buthe's at Florida, probably going
to be a top ten pick, but nobodytakes him, nobody kind of puts
their hand on him.
We did, we get him in and weget to do that rehab and I think
that's a huge benefit,absolutely, and it's a bet on

(09:38):
our medical staff and we have agreat medical staff.

Speaker 1 (09:40):
You can draft guys now who've had surgeries, maybe
Tommy John Even before they'reTommy John.

Speaker 2 (09:44):
They're drafting guys that say, let's say you're an
elite college pitcher and youget hurt in May, right, and you
need Tommy John surgery.
Well, if they had you pegged asa first-rounder, they're going
to take you still thinking thatyou know, they may drop you a
little bit.
But there's a 90% chance you'regoing to make it back from that
surgery, right?
So so that didn't exist at thatKVK.
I mean, the numbers have justwe've continued to get better

(10:05):
and better at the surgical side,that is crazy to think that you
would stay completely away froma Tommy John guy and now, heck
with it.

Speaker 1 (10:13):
we'll rehab him.
We know what we're doing.
There's a track record there.

Speaker 2 (10:16):
And then, right after the June draft comes, what
Trading deadline.
That's another crazy period,because for every one thing the
media may hear about, there's ahundred things that we're doing.
Right, you're?

Speaker 1 (10:28):
constantly researching guys' medical
records.

Speaker 2 (10:31):
You're constantly.

Speaker 1 (10:32):
So are you constantly passing medical records to
different teams and you'regiving some players?
You're getting some players,but it's much easier now because
it's electronic.

Speaker 3 (10:42):
You have the portal now.
What did you do back in the day?
Did you have to mail it, scanit?

Speaker 2 (10:47):
Telephone calls it's like one paper, two papers, it's
nuts, I'm not going to say.
There have never been timeswhere we have been duped by
other teams by withholdingmedical information, which is
much harder to do now because ofelectronic records.

Speaker 3 (11:04):
They give us the access as players.

Speaker 2 (11:06):
now we got some players, like a guy by the name
of Freddy Sanchez.

Speaker 1 (11:11):
Oh yeah, there was some shenanigans that would take
place.
You end up with Freddy Sanchezbecause of that.

Speaker 2 (11:17):
They had to undo the trade they didn't divulge to us,
but you know, they gave us aNational, nationally batting
championship.
Turned out to be great for thePirates Right.

Speaker 1 (11:26):
Exactly, actually it turned out probably better
because if you look at the otherplayers involved and it's out
there, it's a public thing,right, right.
But if you look at the playersthat would have been involved,
the Pirates turned out waybetter trade for the Pirates.
It did it did.

Speaker 2 (11:39):
And so then that trading deadline happens and
then it's kind of OK.
Then that training deadlinehappens, and then it's kind of
okay.
Then the season kind of justkind of goes on autopilot for a
little bit, except with justinjuries.
And then, as you know, as youstart to get into late August
and the September call up,things start to get hectic again
.
And then you're trying to geteverybody, you know, in
September to make sure that, asthe season's ending, you're

(12:01):
making sure you're, you're,you're dotting all your I's and
crossing your T's and guys aregoing to get the correct
diagnostic procedures they needbefore they go home and things
like that, because you don'twant to have those loose ends.
And then you know, when peoplego home, you know what it's like
in the offseason it gets crazy.
You've got to get away fromthis game and they decompress.
And I think that's really,really important because you

(12:22):
know, I don't think the publicreally understands, I don't
think I could really evenappreciate it, even though I see
it.
You know 162 games.
It's unbelievable, I mean forgetabout the physical toll, the
mental toll.
Right, how do you get yourselfmentally prepared?

Speaker 1 (12:36):
162 games a year Right, but not including spring
training Right.
And then we forget about these30, right.

Speaker 3 (12:42):
Right, yeah, we don't talk about these 30.

Speaker 1 (12:44):
So you know, you played all the sports.
Explain that from a doctor's,orthopedic guy's standpoint
about the difference betweenbaseball and these other sports,
because there's a mentalitysometimes in Western PA they
call it a football town andthese guys aren't tough enough.
It's not hockey, but talk aboutthat grind.
I would say this to anybody.

Speaker 2 (13:05):
You can walk into the Steelers locker room.
You can walk into the Piratelocker room, athlete's an
athlete yeah, that's a good call.
I mean these guys are prettybig.

Speaker 1 (13:12):
They're not wearing pads.
Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 2 (13:13):
But they're not tiny little guys, they're built to
rotate Right, which is different.
And I think in baseball you'regoing to see more attritional
type injuries.
So the wear and tear ofthrowing thousands of baseball
over the course of the year, thewear and tear on your back
rotating your hips from therotation of the swing, thousands

(13:37):
and thousands of swings duringthe course of the season.
So, yeah, I think that it'smuch different types of injuries
, but it's not that acute thinglike, oh, he blew his knee out,
and every once in a while you dosee that, right, but it's it's
rare.
I mean, you see, you know, um,you know o'neill cruz break an
ankle, or uh uh, jung ho, jungho gong.

(13:59):
Yeah, the knee.
Yeah, polanco that burgerpolanco but I'll tell you what
jung ho's was the worst baseballinjury I've ever seen in my
life what worse than the kendallinjury?

Speaker 1 (14:08):
yeah, yeah, no, wait a second the kendall injury.

Speaker 2 (14:11):
Of course, we saw ankle dislocation but he didn't
break anything okay.
So it's just soft tissue, um,and, and you know, obviously it
was open so you had to worryabout infection, but he did
really well with that right andit really wasn't a whole lot to
fix Right.
The injury to John was thatI've never seen and that's worse
than football.

(14:32):
The injury I've seen Get out.
Now his entire cartilage wasdisplaced about a centimeter and
a half.
What I think about?
Like if somebody took a pistonand just drove it through his
knee.
And so we had to.
Not only we had to reconstructthe ligaments, but we had to
tunnel up underneath the kneeand push that cartilage back up
from the bottom.
Where did it go it?
Just it drove into like a diepunch, what it's?

(14:54):
Just like this.
I'll show you the x-rays, um.
So I've never seen anythinglike that and you know I will
tell you what's amazing.
And first of all, you knowyou're only as good as the
weakest member of your team inanything that you do in life,
whether it's sports or what I doas the chairman of the
department.
I have a great team.
I have great partners, greatcolleagues.

(15:15):
You know if I pick up thatphone they're going to be there
at a moment's notice and they'regoing to give me their A game.
So I had my.
You know my colleagues likeGreg Altman come in and help me
with that surgery, and you knowit was, but honestly, did I
think he was going to come backfrom that.
I'd put I had to put itprobably 80, 20,.
No way he's ever coming backfrom professional sports.

(15:36):
So that's a testament to himtoo, though right, I mean, at
the end of the day you could dothe best surgery in the world,
but somebody has to have themental makeup.

Speaker 3 (15:43):
You got to get through that rehab.
You've got to get through thatrehab Right.
And they've got to say, hey, Ican do this Right.

Speaker 2 (15:47):
So I give the kid a lot of credit, I mean, for what
he went through.
That was pretty tough and then,like the day, like Ryan Boldel
song got hit in the eye withthat.

Speaker 1 (15:57):
Oh, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 2 (15:58):
I mean I was like, oh my God, I'm an orthopedic, what
do I know about eyes?
I'm like holy man, I've neverseen anything like this.
But thank God he gets to the ERat AGH two blocks away.
The ophthalmologicaltraumatological surgeon was in
the OR one floor below, met himup in the ER as he arrived.

(16:19):
Oh my gosh.
And so you know to have thatlevel of support from your
colleagues, not just in theDepartment of Orthopedics, but
from the entire enterprise.
You know you pick up the phone,they're going to be there for
you.
That really matters.

Speaker 1 (16:33):
I didn't realize that that injury of Jung Ho-Gung's
was so late in the season,september 18, 2015, against the
Cubs PMC Park.
Slide takeout slide by ChrisCoghlan of the Chicago Cubs.
Pirate fans will remember andthey'll hold a grudge forever,
I'm sure the manager of theChicago Cubs I can't believe
that statement.
Joe Maddon kind of kiddinglysaid something about plantar

(16:55):
fasciitis.
That was disingenuous, yeah.

Speaker 2 (16:58):
Wow yeah, the guy had a traumatic knee injury.
That was obvious to everybodyin the stadium and you're going
to call it plantar fasciitis.

Speaker 1 (17:07):
Yeah, wow.

Speaker 2 (17:08):
So so Very unprofessional.

Speaker 3 (17:10):
Yeah, you can.
You can fight your opponent.

Speaker 2 (17:13):
Yes.

Speaker 1 (17:13):
Yeah, Wow, so that that happens in September he's
done for the.
Who knows what impact that hasthe rest of the way on the
pirates.
They ended up going topost-season one game playoff and
lose it.
But then you mentioned RyanVogel song game playoff and lose
it, but then you mentioned ryanvogel song.

Speaker 2 (17:32):
The pitchers at the plate gets hit in the eye.
Um go back to the uh july 4th.
Can I tell you, no, please,heck, yeah, please, yeah, aj, aj
right, this is aj bernett yeah,and you know, he's just the
character.
I love it.
Yeah, yeah, okay, uh, but Ididn't know him that well and
his first day, first springtraining.
He's bunning and then he gets anorbital fracture.
Right, I'll never forget, yeah.
So now we're on the planetogether going home Not planned.

(17:52):
You're escorting him back.
I'm not really escorting him,I'm going back because I have to
operate myself and so I justfinished the major league
physicals and I was going homefor a week and then I was going
to come back on minor leaguephysicals.
And so AJ was on the planebecause he had to have surgery
and our surgeon was randy baby,same one that took care of brian

(18:13):
, and so randy the next morning,you know, I'm in the or and I'm
operating in the same space asrandy, right?
So I have two rooms runninghere.
Maybe he has one room here, andso, you know, during the survey
I check in and say how's itgoing.
So he said it's going great,it's going to be no problem,
we'll fix it up, no big deal.
So now I'm in the recovery room.

(18:33):
That's unbelievable.

Speaker 1 (18:34):
Like during the surgery no big deal, that's so
good, but wait, wait, that's sogood Side baseball stuff.

Speaker 2 (18:39):
It's really better.
And his wife is sitting next tohim and he's got the patch on
his eye and I just went up tohim and I said hey, aj, I just
want to let you know everythingwent perfect, you did great.
And he opens his good eye andhe looks at me and says don't
you have some shoulder surgeries.

Speaker 3 (18:59):
So AJ, that's.
So great.
So AJ, that is so great, go dosome surgery.
Yeah, go get yourself done, getout of oh my gosh so great.

Speaker 2 (19:06):
Yeah, and you know I mean I have so many favorites
over the years I can't it's hardto distinguish them.
But I mean guys that you knowreally respect.
You know Kevin Young's, jasonKendall's, brian Giles, guys
that play hard.

Speaker 1 (19:18):
You know guys that you know they just Now you this
is maybe a silly question, maybenot, but you develop
relationships more so throughinjuries, correct?

Speaker 2 (19:31):
Yes and no.
I mean I will tell you this andyou would appreciate this as a
physician.
I mean you don't really becomea physician unless you actually
are empathetic and care aboutyour patient 100%.
And you do a great job of that.
But if you don't, you're introuble.
Yeah, the hardest thing for meto learn in professional
baseball was the here today,gone tomorrow.
Right, because now you, webecome friends, we book, I know

(19:55):
your wife's name, I know yourkid's name, you know.
I mean I may not socialize withyou, but I mean I know you well
enough to know you personallyand have a relationship with you
.
But and then part of the gameis you're here today, gone
tomorrow.
And I guess if you're in thegame, you understand that
mentality because you've done ityour whole life to get here and
so you accept it.
But for us as physicians it wasvery hard for me to get used to

(20:19):
that.
Right, and they just go move onto other organizations or other
clubs where they retire and youknow they have good lives and
you know.
But you don't.
You just you're so used toseeing somebody all the time
being friendly with them in thisstate.

Speaker 1 (20:38):
And you can't just turn that off.
No, you're going to developrelationships Right.

Speaker 2 (20:40):
And so you still, and still, to this day, when you
run into somebody like Two yearsago at the stadium, the bullpen
coach for the for for Arizona,Mike.

Speaker 1 (20:51):
Oh, like fall fetters , my gosh Mike better since he
left his clubhouse over 20 yearsago.

Speaker 2 (20:55):
But I walked across the field, I saw him and give me
a big hug.
Oh my gosh, that's kind of meansomething.

Speaker 1 (20:59):
Yeah, yeah, I mean it's kind of like well, geez,
you know the impact that youmake on guys, that yeah.

Speaker 3 (21:06):
Well, speaking of that, I mean you get the image,
you get the MRI and you have togo in and deliver the news.
And you did that with me andI'll never forget it, how
empathetic you were and how youpresented it.
Obviously, I have five kneesurgeries under my belt, but
I'll never forget you gave meoptions, you gave me a way to
think about it and you kind ofwe both kind of said like you're

(21:26):
going into something, that'sgoing into arbitration, there's
a good chance.
I wasn't coming back, but youlaid it all out.
Obviously, this wasn't year two, three, four, three.
You'd been in it, but yourbaseball knowledge and the way
you presented it put me at ease.
I don't even think my wife wasthere at the moment.

Speaker 1 (21:41):
Well now, Ford, can you slow that down, because we
need to tell us exactly whathappened.
I'm in.

Speaker 3 (21:45):
Miami, I have my first four-hit game and I go to
break up a double play.
What year?
This is 2013.
Okay, I just get hot.
I struggled most of the year.
April had a good month, ThenMay and June.
I really didn't play well,probably put too much pressure
on myself.
Got hot In a week in July.
Russell Martin was kind ofbanged up so I was getting to

(22:10):
play more slide in that base andmy knee just sticks, ended up
finishing the game.
We won the game.
Um, I take a lot of pride intofinishing that game because
russell was hurt too and he wassitting on the sidelines with
his entire gear on.
I'll never forget I was likedude, you can take that off,
you're not coming in, it's likeyou can't.

Speaker 1 (22:20):
Despite your injury, you're gonna.

Speaker 3 (22:21):
I was like I'm finishing it walk so I knew
someone was seriously injuredyep, and then I hobbled to the
plane the next day, or I hobbledthrough and actually passed all
the tests because doc wasn'tthere.
So I passed all my tests withwith their doctors there they're
like, oh, we think he's good,stay on the roster.
And then the next day end uphaving image my knees this big
and my meniscus is torn in halfand it's stuck underneath my

(22:43):
patella okay, but you didn'tknow what was going on so you go
back back to that conversationwith Fat to Mayo, now and then
as soon as I get back straightto images and I'm waiting in the
room I think my wife's out oftown, she's flying in and it's
just me and him and he lays itout and I guess he has a
whiteboard.
But his brain has a whiteboardand he's laying out options for

(23:03):
me, like we can do this, we cando this, we can do this, we can
do this.
He's like I do think you canrepair it.
It's going to take time.

Speaker 2 (23:13):
He just gave me a list of options and gave me a
decision.

Speaker 3 (23:14):
I try to do that.
Not everybody does that.
It's a whole thing.

Speaker 2 (23:17):
I think one of the things that experience has
taught me is that I don'tnecessarily know what the
players think.
I don't have an idea.
Is he arbitration eligible?
Is he free agent?
You know what's the rostermakeup.
What has the manager said tohim about his future?
I mean, you don't know any ofthat, right, but he talked to me

(23:37):
like he did, but I want, so Itried to put myself in the
player's position and say, look,I'm not going to come here and
just tell you what to do.
I'm going to lay this out foryou.
There's different scenarioshere and then I can help you
make the best decision for you.
Right, because you understandexactly where you're at in this
whole major league odyssey.
Right, that you as a physiciandon't really understand, and I

(24:00):
think that's what really setsyou apart as a sports medicine
physician.
Right, you have to understandthe psych of the athlete.
What are they thinking?
How can you help them besuccessful without being
authoritarian?
And if you have that trust andthat rapport with your athletes,

(24:23):
I think that you'll have muchbetter outcomes.
Look, if you want to ask mewhat I and I don't know if I
really should even say this, butI'm going to know, at the end
of the day, you know thegenerational changes that have
occurred.
You know there's so muchinterference today by the agents
where they're dictating wherethey want the medical care to be

(24:48):
delivered, and yet they're notexperts, right?
Nor do they care about thePittsburgh Pirates, right?
Like I'm here, I care aboutthis team, right?
This is my team.

Speaker 3 (24:57):
But he also made you feel like he cared about you too
, right yeah?

Speaker 2 (25:00):
I care about the organization.

Speaker 3 (25:02):
But you also cared about the players.

Speaker 2 (25:03):
Yes, of course, and there is a separation at times
Ever, ever, ever.
I don't represent management.
I represent the player.

Speaker 3 (25:11):
And you could feel that Right, and I think that's
something that's People ask methat.

Speaker 2 (25:15):
Like do you ever feel pressure from management?
The answer is no, because I'venever let them, but I'm going to
do what's right for the player.
But having said that, I haveseen several times in my career
really good players go tooutside uh facilities and have

(25:36):
bad outcomes that have, quitehonestly, ended their careers
right, and you know I'm notgoing to say those names out
loud, but I mean it's.
It's disheartening because they, these athletes, were trusting
their agents who they thoughthad their best interests at
heart.
They send them to this placeand you're wondering what's this
guy thinking?
And I can't really stop them.
It's it's, it's what theirchoice is, right, I mean, I've
had, you know, I try to counselthem, but you know, and so they

(25:59):
put their blind faith insomebody that they don't know
and then it costs them a careerand it's, and it's sad to see
that happen, right, Really sad.

Speaker 1 (26:05):
Oh, that happened right.
Really, my gosh.
Yeah, that's got to be another.

Speaker 3 (26:08):
Another great thing he did for me is you got me into
I don't know if there's amedical study with you and dr
andrews with stem cells right,and I still believe, and I ended
up having a stem cell on myother knee and both these have
been great.
I haven't taught enough and youknow what?

Speaker 2 (26:23):
let me tell you something about that but he's
always on the cutting edge.

Speaker 3 (26:25):
Yes, he brought that I was very interested.

Speaker 1 (26:28):
You got to be up to speed on all this, yeah like
he's putting.

Speaker 3 (26:31):
You're putting your name with dr andrews, you guys
are collaborating, they get thatdone and he he just.
But I had I was so fortunate umto have dr andrews in my career
as an ally um, and not only,you know, an ally, but a mentor
he didn't have to tell me that,by the way, you know, you never
had to tell me that, but he wasalways transparent and that that
speaks volumes to this man'scharacter and so you know, dr

(26:52):
andrews, you know, look it will.

Speaker 2 (26:54):
It will never be, dr andrews, equal in the history of
masley baseball and what hiscontributions to this game have
been.
I mean, I think he should belike in the medical wing of the
baseball hall of fame yeah yeah,because his what he did was he
saved so many countless careersby not only performing cutting

(27:15):
edge surgery but studying theresults of those surgeries and
learning from those results andimproving those results.
Um, so it's not just saying,okay, I'm gonna do this, this,
this and that right, it'simproving that over time and
being able to measure that right.
And I think the other thingthat Dr Ingers has done really
big is prophylaxis.
Right, how do we cut down onthese injuries?

(27:37):
Why are we seeing so many ofthese injuries?
You know and it'smultifactorial I don't know that
I have the answers to that.
I certainly think we're puttingmore torque on arms today than
we did.
Okay, you know, guys arethrowing harder, they're bigger,
they're stronger, they'respinning harder.
I mean, you know it's going toaffect us, right.

(27:58):
But is there something that youknow we can do early?
I think, if you look back 15, 20years ago, dr Green used it a
lot of studies on youth baseballto help cut those numbers down.
So that you know and I can'ttell you how many kids I've seen
over the years and I said look,it's not really how, it's not,
it's not important how good youare at 16.

(28:19):
So good you are at 26.
Yeah, yeah.
And if there's one thing I didlearn from from the players,
from people like you, and ifthere's one thing I did learn
from the players from peoplelike you, is if you sat in the
locker room with most of themand you said, greg, hey, are you
the best player in LittleLeague?
Are you the best player in yourhigh school?
Most of them are going to tellyou no, and you're going to look
at them and say, well, you madeit to the major leagues.

Speaker 1 (28:40):
Yeah, right, right.

Speaker 2 (28:42):
How about the other guys?
Well, the difference is, everyyear I just got a little bit
better.
You know, every year I just gota little bit better.
So it's it's important to tellpeople you might not be.
Look, my son, pj, playedbaseball in high school with
david bednar that I think he wasgoing to be an all-star
pittsburgh pirate back then.
Of course not right, but godbless him.

Speaker 1 (28:59):
Every year he just got better, yeah, right that's
right tons of stories like thatnow you talk about the
relationship you have with.
You know, michael McHenrypoints out, here's one instance
where you're going through thesescenarios and telling each
player you know, these are youroptions and that's what you do.
You've got to have great tablemanners and you talk about, you
represent the player.
But you talked about thedifferent factions.
You've got a player, you've gotan organization.

(29:22):
You've got Allegheny HealthNetwork.
You've got it all.
Don't forget mama the wife oh mygosh, I did, I just, but it's
because most of the time, andthat's the last thing so how do
you juggle all that?

Speaker 2 (29:35):
well, you know it's.
It's kind of interesting.
You asked me that because I,you know, obviously I've tried
your big residency program,fellowship programs, so there's
a lot of teaching involved andwhen I tell the fellows every
year does everything.
When I call it, when I talk tothe fellows, everybody say
listen, I want you to have yourown high school team.
Okay, it's important to learnhow to have confidence to manage

(29:56):
a team right.
The first time you're out thereyou're scared Am I going to
make the wrong decision?
When they send this kid back in, should I hold them out?
I mean you know nervous.
There's no cookbook on what'sright.
I mean you have to have someexperience with it.
Right, and you have that.
You know you have to be, youhave to understand.
Your job is to preventcatastrophic injury Right To
harm to the athlete.
I said when you're in highschool you're going to talk to

(30:18):
the player, the parent and thecoach.
When you come to a professionalteam, you're talking to the
player, the player's family, theplayer's agent, your general
manager, your manager, theircoaches.
It just goes on down the list.
So it's the same discussion youjust amplify it.

Speaker 1 (30:38):
I can't imagine having to do all that.
You almost have to be apolitician to a degree, don't?

Speaker 2 (30:42):
you.
You have to make it simpleenough that they can understand
it.

Speaker 3 (30:46):
But you have to talk to each one different, because
you have to have more empathywith the family than you do with
the organization, because theywant it cut and dry.

Speaker 2 (30:53):
I mean the first thing.
The organization says, well,when can you play?
That's right.
I mean, that's the first thing.

Speaker 3 (30:58):
Because you have to make a move and that's not
insensitive.
Yeah, exactly, I tell peopleall the time.
The greatest gift I got waswhen I got hurt in college.
My college coach very hard nose, he's the snake.
God rest his soul.
But he said to me he goes, youdon't exist and I go what he
goes, you don't exist until Ican see you physically go back
on the field.
Every day he would walk by thetrainer Is he ready?

(31:20):
And that's it.
But he wouldn't say my name.
It really was like I didn'texist.
But that it really was like Ididn't exist.
But that put a differentmindset in my mind that if I'm
hurt I can't play.
But if I can play I'm going togo play.
Because he got me back on thefield faster than probably any
human, because he made me thinkI could do things I couldn't.
But also I didn't feel like Iexisted.
So I worked twice as hard.

Speaker 2 (31:40):
It brings up an interesting point, mike.
I mean, you're a professionalathlete.
You played at the highestlevels throughout your career.
I have been asked so many timesby people and I'm not a
baseball expert, I am not abaseball coach, I'm not a
baseball what's your baseballlife.
I'm a, I'm a doctor and I knowwhat I know and, more

(32:03):
importantly, what I don't know.
Okay, but I think people havealways asked you know if you, if
you have a son, he's a reallygood baseball player?
And People have always askedyou know, if you have a son,
he's a really good baseballplayer and he has a chance to
get drafted high, would you sendhim to college or would you
send him to the pro game?
And I think my answer todaywould be different than what it
was a decade ago, because Ithink that the pressure to win
in college is greater than it isin professional sports.

Speaker 3 (32:25):
One hundred percent.

Speaker 2 (32:26):
Really, because at the minor league level, it's all
about development, right, andeverything you do is being
monitored how you eat, how youwork out, how you train.
You have professional strengthand conditioning coaches,
professional athletic trainers,professional physical therapists
, professional nutrition Right,so you are getting a

(32:46):
professional environment interms of your development.
Colleges don't have that typeof resources to do those things.
Number one and number two thecollege coach.
If he doesn't win, he's fired,right?
Yeah, he's not there to develop.

Speaker 1 (33:02):
Yeah, that's true you're there to pay his mortgage
.
Yeah, yeah, that's true, rightso so, true, so so maybe at the
major league level it'sdifferent.

Speaker 2 (33:10):
yeah right, certainly the pressure here to win is
enormous, but the minor leaguesis about developing talent to
get to the major leagues.
College is not necessarily so.
So I think I think you'll getbetter training in a
professional environment thanyou would in a college
environment just because theuniversities don't have that
kind of research to put tobaseball because, it's a
non-revenue sport you sport.

Speaker 1 (33:39):
You know, pat, how about going through all these
situations when you know a guyuh might be hurt not sure that
kind of thing and the dance, uhto work with management, the
player, but now the media isinvolved too, and fans.

Speaker 2 (33:50):
Well, I always how hard, is that I?
You know, to me it's prettysimple if you live in the media,
you die in the media.

Speaker 1 (33:58):
And I kind of have a— , but you have to keep things
under wraps.

Speaker 2 (33:59):
Yes, Well, I think I have a professional relationship
with most of the writers and Itell them point blank look,
there's HIPAA rules.
I'm not going to violatesomebody.

Speaker 1 (34:11):
Yeah, that makes it easy, doesn't it?

Speaker 2 (34:12):
And look, there are times when players say things to
the media that may not becompletely true, uh-huh, okay,
and I have to just sit there andsay, well, it's not my place.

Speaker 3 (34:20):
You think that's because they don't know.

Speaker 2 (34:22):
You're talking about the—.

Speaker 3 (34:23):
I think they want to— or push the envelope.

Speaker 1 (34:25):
Yeah, push the envelope.
Explain that what?

Speaker 3 (34:28):
do you mean Right?

Speaker 2 (34:39):
So, divide, you know whether it's between the agent
and the organization or theplayer in the organization and
they say something could also beperformance-based.
It could be performance-based,okay, where they see it a
different way, right, and solook, and I just said my job,
that's why we have this great prteam, right, that's what they
do.
They stick to pr.
That's not part of my job,right, and what the pirates
release is what they release.
Um, sometimes it'll ask me tolook at it, right, and that's
fine, just to make sure there'snothing that's incorrect in that

(35:01):
statement.
But I'm never going to get upand talk about a player's health
publicly.
That's just not what.

Speaker 1 (35:11):
I should do.
How about the differencebetween a player that you know
is hurting but is notnecessarily hurt, Like you can
play through this?

Speaker 2 (35:22):
They all are Amen by 130 games.
They all are.

Speaker 1 (35:27):
But isn't there a difference, though?
I think the way I would phrasethat is performance-based.

Speaker 2 (35:33):
Okay, I look at a player and say the most
important I know you may behurting, but is this impacting
your performance?
Because if it is, then you'rehurting your career and I need
to help you.
Okay, if it's, if you can stillplay with this and not impact
your performance, well then okay.

Speaker 3 (35:48):
Well, that's, that's hard right, exactly very hard
right played all year 15 hurtand I wish I had to mail right,
mean, but you have to.

Speaker 2 (35:56):
You know you're helping the athlete because you
understand the situation he's in.
Right, I mean, look, you knowtoo, don't forget the other side
of this.
The people, like the public,sometimes gets awed by the size
of the contracts and the moneyand these.
You know we do not understandhow hard it is to leave your

(36:18):
family in the beginning ofFebruary and live out of a
suitcase in a locker to at leastmid-October.
You're never sleeping in yourown bed.
You very rarely.
Sometimes can't see your family, especially if your kids are at
school.
Ok, you're constantly traveling.
You're on the road, road.
You're going from place toplace to place.

(36:38):
The public puts so much demandson your time.
I mean I I once said tosomebody, you know, could you
imagine if somebody came up tome right before right when I'm
scrubbing my hands to go intothe or, and asked me for, like,
my autograph?
I'm like, wait a second.
That would be great.

Speaker 1 (36:52):
Yeah, I think we had a commercial there.
That's a good commercial.
I got my game face.
That would be great.
Yeah, I think we had acommercial there.
That's a good commercial.
I got my game face.
That would be hilarious.

Speaker 2 (37:00):
And I try to explain to people.
Do you understand?
Before a game, these guys arementally prepared, right,
because their livelihoods are atstake.
Yeah right, this isn't easy.
Yeah, right.
And if there's one thing I'velearned from most of the major
league players, and if it'sfunny, if you ask, like you know
, of course they're going to saywell, you know, making the

(37:20):
major leagues was easy, stayingin a major league.

Speaker 1 (37:23):
Yeah, yeah, okay yeah , right, right.

Speaker 2 (37:26):
Well, for a guy like me, it wouldn't have been easy
to make.

Speaker 3 (37:29):
Yeah, yeah, I mean so I'm not easy to get there.

Speaker 2 (37:30):
I'm very but but no, realistically, I mean and mean
it's so, people, I think thefans I wish sometimes had a
little more respect.
Just for what, you know, hedidn't sign my baseball.
He's getting ready for a game,right, you know, and I think for
an athlete that's really got tobe hard, because there's a fine

(37:53):
line.
Right, you want to beeverything to everybody all the
time, but yet you have to have alittle area where you have
sanity for yourself, right,someplace where you can go hide
and just say you know, I need todecompress.
And that's where the veteranscome in.
Right, the veterans help youwith that.
1,000%.

Speaker 1 (38:10):
It's funny because I watch you and how you interact
with people, even outside this,because I watch you and how you
interact with people evenoutside the or you know, outside
this, in in your ballpark, inyour offices, as you're
approaching surgery.
You are.
It's really fascinating towatch because it's like he's an
athlete a professional athlete,I agree and his focus and how

(38:32):
and how he demands respect andhe gets respect.
But he demands respect andpeople fall in line when you are
there at Pat DeMille's officeand he's walking around.
This is maybe a bad analogyBarry Bonds-like, but I mean
this in terms of people that arein his field know how great he

(38:55):
is at what he does and so theyknow that and it's just a
fascinating thing to watch.
But that's what you have to be.
You have to be able to separateand you talk about a fan asking
for your autograph, but you do.
There are times when, yeah, youhave time with people, also
times when, man, I'm heading tosurgery and this is it.

Speaker 3 (39:12):
I'm laser focused no-transcript different, that's
exactly right you get like this,yes, but then you take it off,
you walk into a room likethere's no doubt in my mind.
I think you were doing surgerythe day you came and saw me, but

(39:32):
then you're empathetic, I don'thave my wife there, you're able
to do that.

Speaker 1 (39:35):
You turn on the switch.
It's crazy.
Compartmentalize is fascinating, it is.

Speaker 2 (39:39):
Yeah, and again, I think having such a deep respect
and appreciation for what ittakes to do this at this level
helps you with that Right.

Speaker 3 (39:50):
I mean because and that didn't come at easy.
Like that took time to see.

Speaker 2 (39:54):
Yeah, but I mean well , I mean I remember the first
year I was here.
I'm standing out here on thefoul pole and Ken Griffey's 15
feet away.
I'm like, wow, that's KenGriffey.

Speaker 1 (40:05):
Oh, that's cool.

Speaker 2 (40:07):
One of the greatest players of my generation.
I'm like, wow, whoever thoughtI'd be 15 feet away from Ken
Griffey?
Yeah, okay.
Ever thought I'd be?
Yeah, yeah, okay, um, so yeah,I mean those are kind of moments
that are ever emblazoned in mybrain.
That were special things.
Uh, for me, because Iappreciate the game and I always
did um, and you know, look,there's 30 teams, there's 30

(40:28):
medical directors.
Right, did I ever think I'd gethere?
I, I never.
I didn't know i't.
I never thought about it thatway, right, but when the
opportunity came, I know I wantto do it.

Speaker 1 (40:38):
Do you have a greatest?
We ask players and people inthe business their greatest as
its broadcaster.
If it's a writer, your greatestarticle, your greatest call
players, your your first homerun, the greatest moment in your
career?
Do you have a great moment whenit comes to your time with the
pirates Like cause?

Speaker 3 (40:57):
I'm thinking about Kendall uh and his return, yeah,
but there's so many, I startedto point to one, I'm sure.
Watching the guys return, yeah,you must love that.

Speaker 2 (41:06):
Jason Bay was special , jason Kendall was special.
I mean there's just so much.
Oh, we just talked about jungho gung, freddie sanchez, he

(41:26):
came back on the field, right,aj was a riot.
Okay, right, I mean, you know,I'll tell you what?
Um, I've never seen you, maybebe able to answer this more than
me.
You know how important is keenchemistry, right?
Uh.
Some people say, well, it'sreally important, uh, but other
people say no, no, it's aboutteam power.
I think somewhere.
The answer is probablysomewhere in the middle, but
I've never seen a locker roomchange so fast the minute AJ
Burnett walked through that door.

Speaker 1 (41:46):
That's interesting, right, that is interesting.

Speaker 2 (41:49):
I cannot agree more, really, I mean just he had that
moxie that I'm not afraid topitch to anybody, I'm not afraid
to play against anybody.
I'm going to make you guysbelieve that too, wow.

Speaker 3 (42:02):
I use the word identity a lot and Brownie
doesn't necessarily love it.
I think I can explain it thebest.
Based around him, he brought inan identity for our team.

Speaker 2 (42:11):
Right.

Speaker 3 (42:12):
It goes to his shirt.
Sit that down.

Speaker 1 (42:15):
Now again, our debate has been this Pat that you have
, AJ did change the club when hehis presence.
But if AJ Burnett falls on hisface when he goes to that mound,
that doesn't work, you canthrow that out you got it, you
can go ahead and be as cocky asyou want to be.

Speaker 3 (42:30):
There, when you talk about chemistry, it takes a
village.
He was just a leader.
We needed a pirate and we got apirate.
It's funny that he had a patchon his eye the first week he was
a pirate because the man was apirate.
He came out, the city fell inlove with him because he was
hard-nosed from Arkansas, so hehad that grittiness about him.

Speaker 1 (42:49):
He drove a lot of fast cars too.
Yeah, yeah, I raced him onetime on the parkway in his
batmobile.

Speaker 3 (43:00):
I'm driving my car he's, we were.
I mean, it was unbelievable.
He was unapologetically him,and I think great teams have
guys like that, but then theyalso have guys like kutch was
probably the face and you had tolook at all the young talent
you had exactly you had you, youhad andrew, you had neil pedro
jordy, jay yeah I mean it wasand, but I think aj was able to
give them direction.
Yes, yeah, the leader you know,and and russell martin too, I

(43:22):
mean yeah, another he came inwith the pedigree, yeah, and I
think that was important too.
He was here for two years.
I don't think people talk aboutthat enough, that two-year deal
signing him here.
You knew that that guy wasn'tjust coming here to get a
contract immediately.

Speaker 1 (43:34):
It's going to be two years, but when you know, we
started winning immediatelyright, how about the day
somebody pat, somebody came intoaj the day he was pitching?
You know that story, of course,in the vote, oh yeah, oh yeah,
into the clubhouse and he's gothis stall and somebody, unaware
you know, walks up to us.
You're parked in the garage inthe wrong spot.
Aj ripped him, said I ampitching today, you, and it was

(43:59):
like what spot was it I?
don't care if it's yeah.
I don't care if it's theowner's spot.
I do remember that story yeah,and now to this day.
Now they've got a special spotfor the starting pitch.

Speaker 2 (44:07):
Oh, I love it, so I remember something about coffee
too, but we'll get that outthat's true, that is true but he
learned all that from DocHolliday right.

Speaker 1 (44:17):
Well, passing down that.
Yeah, it goes back to theveteran things.

Speaker 3 (44:21):
I think the only way you have the great talent at the
bottom is you have to haveveterans at the top to pour into
it.
I mean, we're very lucky rightnow with Paul Skeens.
I think he's already a veteranin the sense of the way he can
pour into guys.
But having that is so important.
That's how you build thatchemistry, because then you have
a coaching staff but you haveyou have an actual team that's
really staffing themselves.
The coaches are overseeing andthen they can really focus on

(44:43):
how can we find extra wins, putthem in the right spots, instead
of trying to maybe navigatepersonalities.

Speaker 2 (44:48):
Everything else the team's doing that in its own
right and I think to you know,to kind of answer your question
a little more than I think aboutit.
I mean how special it was to beable to sit with Bill Mazeroski
and Bill Martin and Steve Glassand John Candelaria, and before
the games those guys had thatlittle smoking area where the

(45:11):
public can't see them and youjust pull up a chair and you
just listen to them, right, andyou just like, oh, my God S god
suck it all in, right, like youknow what I mean.
And they played against all thegreat ones.
I mean you know they playedagainst the willies, the mickeys
, the henrys, you know they.
I mean that's, that's priceless.
Oh, I will tell you one funnystory.
I don't know if you ever heardthis before.

(45:32):
It was at the pirates 50th uh,celebration of the 60 team,
right, uh, and we were all up atthe stadium in one of those
world series boxes and, um, Ihad my wife with me and a lot of
the players were there, uh, I'dsay almost all of them that
were still alive were there.
Um, and uh, I'm sitting at oneof those little high top tables

(45:52):
and I'm sitting with bill and mylean in my way, okay, and I
paid my pay, my link.
Let me ask you a question AfterBill hit that home run, did you
guys have like a big partysomewhere?
Did you like rent out arestaurant or something?
She scoffed at me.
She said Patrick, you know Bill.
I said what did you do?

(46:13):
He said well, I picked them upin the car.
He pushed me over to thepassenger seat.
We drove to the top of ShenleyPark.
He turned the car off, turnedthe radio off and we sat there
for two hours in completesilence.
Incredible, I said what yeah?

Speaker 1 (46:26):
I would have been dancing on the street, matt,
well, matt has talked about thatEverybody in Pittsburgh was
partying except for and my wifeMylene.

Speaker 2 (46:31):
Wow, I did not know that, just sat silent for two
hours the hero of the 60 WorldSeries sat in the most famous
home run in the history ofbaseball In Oakland.

Speaker 1 (46:39):
Wow, and just sat there with his wife in the car
Unbelievable story To this dayYankees, still they moan about
that.

Speaker 2 (46:45):
Oh yeah, they still like it.
Heck, we'll go to springtraining games.

Speaker 1 (46:48):
You'll see people miserable in the other three.

Speaker 2 (46:59):
When else have you seen a ninth inning walk-off
home run in the bottom of theninth in game seven, that was it
, joe Carter did game six but hedidn't get seven.

Speaker 1 (47:05):
Game seven, the only game seven to walk off.
It's all the marvels.
Hey, Pat, tell us about ErnieWithers.
Oh wow, I get so embarrassed bythis.
I was with you, I was talking.

Speaker 2 (47:19):
You were on the golf cart.
You were next to me right.
Practice it, if you remember.
You almost ran me over, no,Bones was driving.
Bones was driving.

Speaker 1 (47:24):
That's.

Speaker 3 (47:25):
Scott Bonnet that makes more sense.

Speaker 1 (47:25):
And I'm leaning over.
We're chatting and all of asudden boom.

Speaker 2 (47:28):
So that practice didn't start to 11 30 that day
and I had taken my bike.
I were like 25 miles thatmorning, so my legs were dead,
tired and bones comes up in thisgolf cart.
I'm thinking, all right, I'mgonna sit down yeah, I'm sitting
down and then brownie'sstanding next to us and we're
just I don't know what we'retalking about.
We're just talking passing timeand all of a sudden I hear jeff

(47:50):
patonic scream in my name.
I didn't see exactly whathappened and then Bones pulled
out about 10 feet with the golfcart.
I saw somebody down in centerfield and you know, it took like
10 seconds to get there and thewhole time I'm thinking, oh, is
this somebody that went basilbagel, right it was a little hot
that day.

Speaker 1 (48:10):
Are you thinking of players Dale?

Speaker 2 (48:12):
No, I knew it was a player because I wasn't wearing
a uniform, okay, but I didn'tknow who it was.
And when I got there, well, hewas pulseless, he wasn't
breathing, his pupils were fixedand dilated and he said this
isn't basal vehicle.

Speaker 1 (48:29):
Again.
This is on the field at thePirate City Minor League Complex
one morning last springtraining.
So I started.

Speaker 2 (48:34):
CPR.
I said call 911, get thedefibrillator and go inside and
get Dr Franco, and I starteddoing CPR on him, probably
within 30 seconds of him hittingthe deck, and then one of our
trainers, matt, came over, heput the paddles on while I kept
up the compressions and then,you know, you just hit the

(48:54):
button and you know if you're inmy position.
You've done CPR in the hospitalmany, many times.
The vast majority of times, youknow, unfortunately people
don't survive.
We hit the button Next thing,you know, I felt the pulse in
his neck and his wrist God, it'sunbelievable.
And he wasn't breathing.
And so I said get the EMBU bag.
I was about to start bagging.

(49:16):
What's that?
What did that mean?
A mask okay to push, aaron okayand, uh, he took a big yawn,
opened his eyes and said wheream I?
No kid.
And then I took my balls wow,like, oh my god, 145.

Speaker 1 (49:34):
Can you explain that?
What's the feeling?
Like man, because you've beendoing as you said before the
first time.
Are you expecting this isn'tgonna work when you're doing it?

Speaker 2 (49:42):
look what's going through your mind.
They're surviving v-fib in thefield of like one and 200.
Yeah, uh, now withdefibrillators, they're probably
better now than they were.
Um, so I don't know what theexact statistics are today, but
I will say this um, you know,you don't.
It's like when you go into thebaddest box, you're not.
You know you're not thinkingabout.

Speaker 1 (50:00):
You know what you're eating is your adrenaline right
going like crazy you'reprofessional, you're doing what
you're trained to do.

Speaker 2 (50:05):
Yeah, I'm a surgeon, I'm trained to do this stuff,
right?
It's not, it's like it's reflexfor me, right?
So I just first thing I did wasokay, what's your name, how old
you are, what medicines you are, any allergies, any drugs?
You know all this pertinentstuff I needed to know, right.
And then I just kept them calmand I waited till the paramedics
got there.
So, um, and to this day I meanI would say this to you I mean I

(50:28):
tried, I try not to make a bigdeal of this, because I think I
just did what I was supposed todo, right, uh, but it happened
because it got a lot of this,because I think I just did what
I was supposed to do, right, butit happened because it got a
lot of attention, because it wasthe day of the first full squad
workout.
So media was there, tv wasthere, radio was there, print
was there, it was another day,nobody's.

Speaker 1 (50:45):
By the way, we should explain that this guy was
amongst a group from the chamberof commerce who were shagging.
They have guests shagging flyballs and that's he was happened
to be out there, so, I'm sorry,go ahead.

Speaker 2 (50:54):
Yeah, so he was president of the Chamber of
Commerce for Manatee County andso, yes, and he had all the
local politicians and stuff werethere.
So I mean, I think that it just.
If it happened in the middle ofPublix, nobody knows.
Yeah, right, it was just, and Iwould do the same thing if it
was in the middle of Publ.
It just was happening that theywere all there that day.
I will say this though you didtell me to go talk to the

(51:16):
meeting, I'm like there's no way.
And he said why not?
I said, well, he got to thehospital.
I'm not sure what happened tohim after he got to the hospital
.
Good point, I'm not going tostart saying hey, I saved his
life, unless I know it's reallya lie the handoff.
Let's.

Speaker 3 (51:33):
Yeah, let's make sure Important point.

Speaker 2 (51:35):
But no, he had surgery that night and then two
weeks later he wanted to meet meand I just said, look, let's
just do this in a real privateplace.
I don't want to do this infront of people, in front of the
media.
I mean it's a very emotionalthing.
And so I met with he and hiswife and I mean they had a good
cry.
I mean we hugged and cried foran hour.

Speaker 1 (51:52):
Unbelievable.

Speaker 2 (51:53):
And then we've become good friends and so you know,
when he comes to Pittsburgh,I've taken him out to dinner,
We've been out to dinner herewith our wives and it's nice.

Speaker 1 (52:00):
It's an unbelievable story.

Speaker 2 (52:02):
He's a really well-respected member of this
community.
Yeah, has a lot of friends.
I mean you saw him on the fieldtoday, a very nice man, and,
more importantly, mike.
What he's done is he's paid itforward.
That's awesome.
So he has spent.
He's become a CPR instructor.

(52:23):
He goes around and givesclasses and right now I think
he's up to 200.
He's had 200 automaticdefibrillators that he has a
foundation that people donate tothe foundation.
He buys these frivolities,giving them to schools, to cops,
the fire departments.
He gave 75 to the pirateorganization last year.
So he's very excited about hisphilanthropy and what he's doing

(52:48):
and paying it forward and Igive him a lot of credit.
I mean, you know he, he, hebacked up.
You know, you know he, he, hedid what he said he would do and
give him a lot of credit forthat, but how gratifying Pat for
you man.

Speaker 1 (52:57):
You know, what I mean .

Speaker 2 (52:59):
When all this no get out of here.

Speaker 1 (53:01):
But when all is said and done, we get to brag.
We're talking about his homerun, the walk-off home runs, all
this great stuff.
You've got to be sitting back,Of course.
All this stuff you've done overyour career as a surgeon, but
this moment you've got to besitting back with a glass of
wine at some point and say likedang dang well, let me tell you

(53:22):
what I told my wife.

Speaker 2 (53:23):
Honey, I pushed the button.

Speaker 1 (53:24):
It worked yeah, but man, somebody had to push the
button.
If it wasn't for god, hewouldn't be here because it was
a bad drink, right?
Is there a feeling you candescribe when you start to see
and feel a pulse Like holysmokes?

Speaker 2 (53:35):
Yeah, I was like oh my God, this really worked.
Man Like, oh yeah, yeah, I mean, I didn't expect.

Speaker 3 (53:40):
With a little bit higher blood pressure, of course
.

Speaker 2 (53:42):
Yeah, and usually when you shock somebody, you
usually do it more than once,right, yeah.
So I mean, I think the factthat we got to him so quick and
he was right, give our trainerscredit too, because they had.
They were all there on thescene, no doubt the equipment
right there, you know, and allthe players were kind of lined
up on one knee and and you know,so it was kind of um.
You know, I'm just glad itworked out well, I'm gonna

(54:05):
embarrass you too.

Speaker 1 (54:06):
By the time we have left the inaugural do it band,
man lupke, patrick de mayoendowed chair, what's that like?

Speaker 2 (54:14):
yeah, I look, you know I was can you say that
faster before?
No I can't I can't so it's alot of money, it's an amount
full yeah, you know, in theworld of academic medicine, um,
when somebody wants to give agift, they call it an endowment
and they name it a chair.
It's not act like my kids.

Speaker 1 (54:30):
Look like I was getting a little bit bigger than
that you're actually sitting init.

Speaker 2 (54:34):
Yeah, yes no, but it's so.
They call it a chair and it'sin recognition.
Uh, and so the what happenswith that chair is that money
that they donated millions ofdollars will continue to grow
over time, and the investmentsthat had spent off will be
dedicated to orthopedic research, and so long after I'm retired

(54:56):
and I'm gone.
The chair stays in perpetuity,and so talk about humbling path
after that.
It is one of those things thatI never expected yeah right and
honestly.
You know, like I told you before, usually it happens after
you're gone it was pretty coolyou're able to see it.

Speaker 3 (55:12):
Yeah, I love that thing it happened while you were
still here, so you can enjoy it.

Speaker 2 (55:17):
But no, I'm not going anywhere for a while.

Speaker 1 (55:19):
I'll tell you what an absolute treat man.
He is humble, but to see him inaction, he's a special guy man
and we're lucky to have him Well, thank you for having me here,
today.

Speaker 2 (55:29):
I appreciate you.
Hold Mike Hunter, I got to tellyou one thing.
I don't know if I ever told youthis, but when you were playing
, you know what the girls usedto call you Mike McCotty.
Did you know that?
Oh, yeah, man, wow, mike.

Speaker 1 (55:41):
McCotty, is that right?
How about that?
No, that's over In perpetuity.

Speaker 3 (55:47):
I was a believer of Homer right there, by the way.

Speaker 1 (55:50):
Thanks for sharing the mail on Hold my Cutter.
We're going to do it again upin Pittsburgh at Rocky, because
he's got some good cigars for ustoo.
So we'll do that on Hold myCutter, all right.
Well, thank you very much, guys.
Thank you, stay well.