Tracing Threads Through Time: From China to Pittsburgh

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When Ted Anthony put pen to paper as a 10-year-old defending Pirates broadcaster Milo Hamilton in the Post-Gazette, little did he know it would launch a lifetime journey through words, baseball, and the stories that connect us all. 

In this captivating conversation, the Pulitzer Prize-nominated Associated Press journalist traces an extraordinary path from listening to Game 7 of the 1979 World Series on shortwave radio in China to reporting from conflict zones in Afghanistan. Ted shares the deeply human moments that defined his career – photographing an Afghan waiter who had never seen his own image, hearing Pirates broadcaster Greg Brown's voice mysteriously appearing on his phone in North Korea, and witnessing the electric atmosphere of the 2013 Wild Card "blackout" game at PNC Park.

Baseball emerges as the constant thread throughout Ted's life, connecting generations and preserving memory. He recounts bringing his elderly mother, a devoted Bill Robinson fan, back to PNC Park after decades away; his grandfather's correspondence with Mark Twain about cigar bands; and his grandmother's devotion to keeping baseball scorecards for his grandfather. Each story reveals how personal experiences weave into the larger tapestry of community and shared history.

The conversation takes fascinating detours through Ted's book "Chasing the Rising Sun," which traces an iconic American song's journey across continents, and the surprising connections between his son and former Pirate Travis Snider. Throughout it all, Ted's brilliant storytelling reminds us that whether we're listening to a game on the radio, scanning box scores, or passing down Pirates memories, these shared experiences form the beating heart of what makes a place like Pittsburgh special.

Take a journey with Ted Anthony and discover how baseball, journalism, and the power of story can transport us through time and across the world while keeping us firmly rooted in what matters most.

THANK YOU FOR LISTENING!!!!

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:04):
welcome, welcome to hold my cutter.
We're coming your way here,burned by rocky patel and our
guest ted anthony oh, you'redoing it.
Oh, that's if you're watchingthis, you know what we're doing.
Got the flame up, started thestogie, the edge.
Uh, great the edge.

Speaker 2 (00:24):
What a great sound.

Speaker 1 (00:25):
That's a great sound.
That's a great sound.
This is, this is.

Speaker 2 (00:28):
You've been perfecting that for a while, huh
.

Speaker 1 (00:30):
I have not.
Our guest Ted Anthony has.
However.

Speaker 3 (00:33):
I'm telling you, it's your intro.

Speaker 1 (00:34):
It's the new intro.
You want to try it Fort.
Let me see.
Oh, is that?

Speaker 2 (00:40):
good.
This that's what I wish.
I felt like when I was hittingSizzling hot Fire.

Speaker 1 (00:45):
Michael McHenry comes to the plate Sizzling hot and,
yeah, our guest is Ted Anthony.
He has suggested and boy, whata good call the Edge.
We've had the Edge previouslyhere at Burned by Rocky Patel,
which is just a few blocks downthe road.
You can see PNC Park justacross the way.
We see where Michael McHenryaworks most nights Aworks At

(01:09):
Sportsnet Pittsburgh aworks.

Speaker 2 (01:12):
Is that right?
You're aworking.
You're the writer, you'reaworking.

Speaker 1 (01:15):
I'm aworking Two-time Pulitzer Prize nominee by the
Associated Press.
He started with the AP, reallystarted in, I think, 1992, if
I'm not mistaken, when thePirates were winning the third
straight National League Easttitle.
So it's been a while, but hereally got his start.
And Ted Anthony writes Americanculture.

(01:35):
International affairs hasreported for more than 30
countries, but he really got hisstart as a 10-year-old.

Speaker 2 (01:43):
Right, wait, wait, wait, boy genius.
He is a boy genius, yes, Cranka 10-year-old right.

Speaker 1 (01:46):
Wait, wait, wait, Boy genius.
He's a boy genius, yes.

Speaker 3 (01:48):
Cranky 10-year-old.
So my first published piece ofwriting was in the Post-Gazette
in 1978, and I was 10, and I wasa big fan of the lumber company
.
I guess by that point it wasLumber and Lightening and Milo
Hamilton and Lanny Fr terry werein in your seat and people were
not liking milo hamilton.
They were hating on milohamilton a lot, then, and why?

(02:10):
Is that I think they felt likehe was not well first of all.

Speaker 1 (02:12):
I mean, it was the obvious bob prince he was
replacing a legend, bob prince,and people were not so he had.

Speaker 3 (02:17):
He could not fill those shoes someone I forget who
it was in one of your episodessaid you got to be here five
years and then it tips over,right.

Speaker 1 (02:23):
Yeah, we talked about that.

Speaker 3 (02:24):
And it hadn't happened yet and it never would
have happened for Milo Hamilton.
But I adored Milo Hamilton.
I thought he was great.
That makes two of us.
He's how I sort of came into mybaseball consciousness.

Speaker 1 (02:36):
Same here, right.

Speaker 3 (02:37):
And I still remember him and I heard this recently
and it was exactly as I rememberhim calling Candelaria's
no-hitter in 76, you know,against the Dodgers.
And so people were writing inthis stuff and I was pissed.
I was pissed, I was not happyabout it.

Speaker 1 (02:56):
We were a newspaper family.
We took both papers.

Speaker 3 (02:57):
You know, back then you used the word took to get a
paper.
You don't get the paper, youtake the paper.
So we took both papers, yeah,and so I decided I'm going to
write in.
I had been calling inoccasionally to KDKA to things
like I don't know if you'llprobably remember like Roy Fox
and Perry Marshall, all of them.

Speaker 1 (03:12):
Trish Beatty, yeah, trish Beatty.
Absolutely Art Palin.

Speaker 3 (03:15):
Art Palin and my mother actually won a contest to
write a poem about the Pirates,and Art Palin went to the ball
game with her.

Speaker 1 (03:21):
Oh my gosh.
By the way, ted, is thisfamiliar?
I have seen so many lettersputting Milo, hamilton and
Leonard for Terry down, oh boy.
One I refer to in particular isa letter sent by John P Engel
which appeared in the July 18thPost-Gazette.
Let me quote him.
If he, hamilton, would shut uplong enough to let people who

(03:42):
know baseball think it would bea pleasure.
End quote.
Now, between pitches, hamiltongives listeners tidbits of
information about the playersbecause he thinks that they
would like to know thesestatistics.
Now, if Mr Eagle I guess it was, I'm sorry, with Mr Angle
thinks that this is notworthwhile, then maybe he should

(04:03):
turn off the radio betweenpitches.

Speaker 2 (04:05):
He thought he was an eagle.
That's for sure Bad printing.
I can't believe you excavatedthat.

Speaker 1 (04:11):
Allison Park Ted Anthony as a 10-year-old.
The date was Wednesday, july25th.
Letters to the sports editor inthe Post Gazette defending Milo
Hamilton.

Speaker 3 (04:25):
I gotta give you props for excavating such a deep
cut man.

Speaker 1 (04:28):
Well, actually, that's incredible.
Well, no, what's incredible ishe gave us so much nice
information.
Normally we have to do prep,which we still did.
I felt guilty, I didn't have todo enough prep, but I wanted to
make sure I did that.
So there you are as a10-year-old defending Lyle
Hamilton.

Speaker 3 (04:42):
I never thought it would be published.
I was just tilting at windmills, you were 10.

Speaker 2 (04:47):
I was 10.
I was playing with the turtlesNinja Turtles.
Well, in fairness, my parentswere— and GI Joe's, You're
writing for a paper.

Speaker 3 (04:55):
They were linguists at Pitt, so I mean, I had a
little bit of the word stuff inme.
You made a choice, but that wasthe first of a lot of verbiage
that's been expelled.
Let's put it that way.
But it was, and I think in away that was like and I, my
friends saw people who read thatit was like the sports op ed.

Speaker 1 (05:14):
Yes, yes.

Speaker 3 (05:15):
And I had friends in school who read it and I was
like, ok, so this is this ispretty cool, this is this could
be powerful.
You know, this is a you canreach people, and that was the
beginning of it, I guess one ofthe seeds.

Speaker 2 (05:25):
When did the love start?
Because I mean you're 10.
So you got published at 10.
So you had to start at what.
Four?

Speaker 3 (05:33):
I don't know if it was that far.

Speaker 2 (05:34):
Look, I, I was on Hooked on Phonics.
Yes, that's right.
It didn't work for me either,that's incredible to me Ten
years old.
So when did it start?

Speaker 3 (05:43):
I think.
I mean I was always a wordperson.
We played word games at thedinner table.
My father was told horriblepuns which you know that gets
you to start jokes.

Speaker 2 (05:53):
Do you remember a good dad joke?

Speaker 3 (05:55):
Okay, a good dad joke .
When we were living in China in79, we had a tiny little
Christmas tree, Because you know, they didn't have Christmas
trees in China back then.
They didn't have Christmas.
And so we get this tiny littletree and it starts slouching and
my father says I believe weneed a chiropractor.
That tree clearly has curvatureof the pine.

(06:16):
It's also awful, it's great,but it's so good.

Speaker 1 (06:22):
It's awfully good.
Please stop, please stop,please stop.
You're in China, a Pirates fanin China.
How did it all start?
Wow All right.

Speaker 3 (06:33):
So my parents, like I said, were linguistics
professors at Pitt and my fatherwas running the Asian Studies
Department, and we got aninvitation.
What happened was China hadjust opened up to Americans on
January 1st 79.
Carter and Deng Xiaopingnormalized relations, and
there's this whole rush ofpeople to go teach in China, but

(06:54):
they were all in their early20s and they didn't know how to
teach.
Their only experience was thatthey spoke English, and so
around about April of that year,they started looking at
mid-career linguists, like myparents at Pitt, and Pitt had a
good relationship with someeducational institutions in
China.
So we got set to go over and wewere going to go over in July.
And let me just ask both of youwhat was starting to happen in

(07:16):
July of 1979 over at Three RiverStadium.

Speaker 1 (07:19):
A lot of good things.
A lot of good things, july of1979.

Speaker 3 (07:21):
Pirates were the pennant race.
I was not happy.
Things, a lot of good things,and pirates were the pennant
race I was not happy.

Speaker 2 (07:29):
I was not happy they.
We had a um, we had a answer.
What's that?
I was six years pre-spur.

Speaker 1 (07:33):
Yeah, so that's one way, I was born 85, interesting
way to put it okay.

Speaker 3 (07:36):
So anyway, here we go that threw me off my gut, me
too um.

Speaker 2 (07:41):
I was just thinking like man 79 I can't, can't
imagine, yeah.

Speaker 3 (07:44):
So we had a guy in our neighborhood, dr Connelly,
who co-owned a car wash withPhil Garner, so we'd have
baseball parties in ourneighborhood and you know people
like Phil Garner and Candelaria, and later Donnie Robinson,
would come and pitch us tennisballs.
How cool, and I'm going.
Meanwhile I'm at Falk School upat the University of Pittsburgh
School, up on the hill by wherePitt Stadium used to be, and

(08:07):
went to school with WillieStargell's kids and Willie
Stargell would show up in hisleisure suit of 79 with these
pointed collars that madeSaturday Night Fever look
conservative and he'd give outStargell stars that year.
So I still have actual, realStargell stars and my sister
gave me back one of them acouple of years ago and I just

(08:30):
absolutely treasure it.
But so I'm entrenched with thepirates that year and suddenly
we're going off to China and Iwas like you've ruined my life.
Yeah, you don't, it was not cooland I dealt with it.
So I get there and you knowwe're learning Chinese really
fast because I get there was nointernational school really back
then.
So I went to the one schoolthat had international students
and I was going to school withNorth Koreans and Burmese and
Bangladeshis and I went to thelike the party when Rhodesia

(08:54):
became Zimbabwe at the embassy,stuff like that.
But I'm all about baseball atthat point and I have my my 20,
my 28 inch Louisville SluggerRod Carew model with me and I'm
trying to teach these guysbaseball because they've never
from all these countries theydidn't really know, and there
are only a couple otherAmericans and I'm out there on
the playground, you know, with abat.

Speaker 2 (09:14):
I'm like you on the postgame, show you know holding
the bat and swinging it aroundAlways.

Speaker 3 (09:18):
And trying to teach people bong chow, which is what
baseball is called in China.
Bong chow, which is whatbaseball is called in China.
And so the Pirates are gettingbetter and better.
No internet, no nothing.
So my grandmother is sending meclips from the St Petersburg
Times we hit the playoffs, we dowell in the playoffs at the
World Series, and I'm like, ifthey make it to game seven, I
have to find a way to listen tothis right.

(09:39):
So I had a friend, and he washalf American, half Chinese.
He lived in our compound.
His father had been one ofChairman Mao's like confidants
during the early part of China.
What?
And then?
No, this is true.

Speaker 2 (09:53):
How old are you at this time?

Speaker 3 (09:55):
At this time I'm 11.

Speaker 2 (09:57):
Right, but I was published.
Crazy, I know I know, yes,you're already an adult.
Yeah, yeah, that's right, he'ssmoking a cigar, right yeah?

Speaker 3 (10:06):
Yeah, at 11.
Yeah, but it was a black andmild.
So he but he was one ofChairman's confidants and then
he got like purged andimprisoned and he had just
gotten out of prison.
He'd come back to the house andhe had this shortwave radio and
it was.
It looked like this thing fromI don't know, from like some
1940s army movie, and it wasjust giant console on his coffee

(10:29):
table and I thought, hmm, Icould you know voa armed forces
radio, maybe I could listen tohim.
So I asked my friend, my friendasked his father come on, I get
invited over, I get invitedover to listen to the seventh
game of the world series at likeseven in the morning.
Skip school, my parents, let meskip school.

Speaker 2 (10:48):
That's probably a 12 hour time difference.

Speaker 3 (10:50):
Yeah, it's, it's.
It's 12 or 13, depending on thedaylight savings, so I forget
what it was then.
But uh, holy, so we'relistening to it.
And all my friends, of course,took the opportunity to skip
school Cause this was a a littleevent.
So we're all gathered aroundthis big console and we're
listening to it.
Memory it wasn't Milo and Lanny, unfortunately, but it w.
It was armed forces radio.
But, like when Stargell hitsthe home runoff of Scotty

(11:10):
McGregor, I'm like in heaven.
And uh, uh, here are thepirates.
When the world series, and youknow, for years I was like, okay
, this is a better story thanhaving been there.
So, and I'm still years later Itold Willie's daughter, kelly,
who I went to school with she'sa wonderful person and she loved

(11:33):
that story that I was listeningto it at seven in the morning
skipping school in China, that'sincredible.

Speaker 2 (11:39):
Do you speak Chinese?
Do you remember it?

Speaker 3 (11:41):
I do, I also was.
I worked there for the AP forseveral years.
But when you learn a languagemy and again this goes back to
my parents being linguists whenyou learn a language, there's up
until about nine.
You can learn it really easily,but then you forget it when you
leave.
Anytime after age 12, it'sreally hard to learn and you can
keep it when you learn it, butit's it's hard to learn.
But between 9 and 12, there'sthis window, and so I was going

(12:03):
to a Chinese school and stuffwas being taught in Chinese, so
I had to catch up and that was.

Speaker 2 (12:08):
You're a stone in the fire.
What's that?
You're a stone in the fire.
Right, right, exactly, and itwas learn or else, and it was.

Speaker 3 (12:13):
And if you wanted to communicate with all these kids
from all these other countrieswho didn, I love the language.
The language is it's musicalit's.
The characters are fascinating.
I miss speaking it every day.
You know you can't read thecharacters.
I can't.

Speaker 1 (12:32):
You can read Chinese Was that by?

Speaker 3 (12:35):
11 too.
I mean, it's not a question ofby 11.

Speaker 1 (12:38):
We were learning like 11-year-old Chinese kids.
You know so.

Speaker 3 (12:41):
I read, and when I went back to China for the AP I
found that after a while thecharacter knowledge came back.
But the problem was I only hadthe knowledge of a 12 year old.
So, like economics, politics,sex, I had to learn all of that
stuff because that wasn't partof a 12 year old's vocabulary,
right?

Speaker 1 (12:58):
When did you go back to China?
So when, first?
When did you leave?
How old were you when you left?
We were just there a year, Justone year.

Speaker 3 (13:04):
But you know when you're 11, a year is like
one-tenth of your life.

Speaker 2 (13:07):
Yeah, you're like a dog.

Speaker 1 (13:08):
Oh my gosh, this is so long.
So when did you go back, ted?

Speaker 3 (13:14):
I went back in 01 and stayed until 04.
And we moved there like sevenweeks before 9-11.

Speaker 1 (13:20):
Now this is you and your family.
Now this is you and your family.

Speaker 3 (13:21):
Yeah Well, it wasn't a family.
I had just gotten married andwe moved there about seven weeks
before 9-11.
And so the three years in Chinawas like we thought China was
going to be this really coolplace that we could just sort of
travel around in and writeabout and stuff.
And it turned out I got sentall over the place after 9-11 to
cover the aftermath and it wasnot.

(13:45):
I mean, it was fascinating.
Fascinating and it was in someways I realized years later,
kind of traumatizing to be inthose conflict zones.
But it wasn't the Chinaexperience remotely that we
expected, because we had thiswhole group of this journalism
community in Beijing and who hadall come there to cover China,
but we were all getting rotatedin and out of Pakistan and
Afghanistan and then later Iraq,and so it was.

(14:06):
It was this.
It was really interesting.
It was like almost like a, agraduating class that keeps in
touch, because there was thisgroup of people who they were
there when the big thinghappened and they had to.
They and their spouses had tomake their lives around this,
right, that's how you reallycome together.

Speaker 2 (14:21):
Yeah, that's incredible.
You still talk to a lot of them, oh yeah, yeah, and some of
them.

Speaker 3 (14:24):
I was in Afghanistan and Iraq with some of them, and
so it was what was that?

Speaker 2 (14:28):
like which one Either one Start with Afghanistan.

Speaker 3 (14:34):
Well, so Afghanistan will always be endlessly
fascinating to me.
My father had spent time thereteaching in 51, like long before
I was born and he would tell meabout it.
And there were these things Igrew up with in the house, like
there was this one fan for thefire that looked like a 16th
century executioner's hatchetand there was a tobacco canister

(14:55):
and stuff.
And I these are part of thelandscape of my childhood and I
didn't think much of them.
And then I went back toAfghanistan to cover stuff.
And you see this stuff, youknow.
I mean you look, you, you walkaround Pittsburgh and there are
things that you would see andpick up on that you wouldn't if
you weren't from here, andthat's the same thing.
I was seeing these things frommy house.
But in the world and but interms of of covering it, I mean

(15:17):
it was scary.
There was, um, a lot ofpotential for things to go south
.
There was.
It's not the talk about theglamour of being a foreign
correspondent, I mean there's.
It's hugely rewarding.
You get to know the culture,you get to understand things,
you get a front row seat tohistory.
But it's not like I mean it'sscary, and I don't recall a day

(15:38):
where I didn't have situationalawareness.
That was way too much, becauseI couldn't get rid of it for a
lot of years afterwards that wasway too much because I couldn't
get rid of it for a lot ofyears.

Speaker 2 (15:45):
Afterwards.
Can you share the greatestmoment, like one that just gives
you chills thinking about it,and then the scariest moment in
Afghanistan?

Speaker 3 (15:56):
So I think that's a good question.
Okay, the greatest moment is Iwent to this restaurant in the
Sharana neighborhood of Kabuland was talking to this
restaurant in the Sharananeighborhood of Kabul and I was
talking to this waiter and withmy translator and the waiter was
really nice and sweet and I hada digital camera around my neck
and he said he'd never had apicture taken of him.

(16:18):
Ever, so I took a picture of himand showed it to him on the
back of the early digital cameraand he said can I have one?
I said I don't have a printer,I can't really give you one.
And he was disappointed and I.
We parted very friendly, but hewas disappointed.
Six months later I come backfor another assignment there and
I, before I came, made sure Igot a printout of his, the

(16:40):
picture of him, and we went backto the restaurant and found him
and I handed him an eight byten of himself.
He'd never seen a picture ofhimself.

Speaker 2 (16:47):
Wow and wow, I bet he lit up he was.

Speaker 3 (16:50):
He was like which is thank you, and he, he was so
moved and I to me that like that, that made the whole thing.
It's like you, you make alittle different by you.
That's so cool you make a littledifference in someone's life
and you know you're thinkingabout, okay, afghanistan has
been.
You know, a lot of people feellike they've been occupied for
years and years and years, thatthey're not sure what to think

(17:11):
of the united states, and maybeyou can build a little bridge in
that tiny little way and I lovethat you know, I think that's
amazing and that that was that.
I think of that to this day andI still have the picture that
is super cool.
So scariest.
I mean, I don't talk about thatstuff a lot, but there was.
That's why.

Speaker 2 (17:30):
I said if you don't want to.
No, no, I've heard a lot ofmilitary side and it's very
fascinating to me herejournalist side.

Speaker 3 (17:37):
And I want to make a really important point this is
very, very different from themilitary.
I can leave at any time.
Right, right, this is very,very different from the military
.
I can leave at any time Right,military people can't.

Speaker 2 (17:46):
I love the perspective that you could have,
because you do have a10,000-foot view, yeah, and you
go in and out.

Speaker 3 (17:51):
And that is hugely rewarding, but I just want to
make sure that we don't no doubtno doubt.
So we're going through thissort of mountain pass to this
place called the Panjshir Valley, which is where a lot of the
battles had taken place over theyears, and it was on the way to
this to Bagram Air Base, whichis where the US was based at

(18:11):
that time, and we're stopped ata checkpoint and a guy comes
running toward our car,screaming at the top of his
lungs and pointing an AK-47 atme.
And I'm just petrified, andanybody who, who tells you that
you, you know, oh, you just,you're not scared, you just suck
it up.
I mean, maybe they can, but no,every human being.

Speaker 2 (18:33):
You see down a barrel of a gun, you're, you're
terrified.

Speaker 3 (18:36):
It turns out that this guy was worried because
there had been an accident upahead and he didn't want us to
go and get into a problem.
He was.
He was helping, oh, but he wasa guy who was guarding the
checkpoint and had an ak-47, sothere was no threat.
But I didn't know that until Igot the translation.
So that was one of the moreterrifying incidents you have no

(18:57):
clue and he's going noballistic yeah, and and, but
he's going ballistic and, in away, that is on our behalf and
uh, that's, and it's also a goodlesson, which is that you know
you don't know people'sintentions, right.

Speaker 2 (19:09):
Truth Well said.

Speaker 1 (19:10):
Ted you talked about OK, you know 79,.
You're in China listening tothe pirates and then, long
stretch of not winning, you bet92.
I think you started the AP.

Speaker 3 (19:20):
Right.

Speaker 1 (19:26):
And before the AP, I was at the Harrisburg Patriot
News, which is, I think, yourhometown paper, isn't it?
Yes, yes, Originally, that'sright.
We talked about that previously.
I forgot about that, that'sright.
Yeah, I grew up in central PAand Harrisburg Patriot News was
our hometown newspaper.
And then later, Pirates getback into the playoffs, 20-some
years later and you're on theroad again, aren't you Well?

Speaker 3 (19:44):
I did make 2013.
Okay, were you at the wild cardgame?
Oh yeah, absolutely Well,that's how we met.
I mean, I had done thePittsburgh Magazine cover story
on the Pittsburghers of the yearafter that season.
The Pirates were the.

Speaker 1 (19:55):
Pittsburghers of the year and Ted wrote an
unbelievable essay great story.
So he's a brilliant, giftedwriter.

Speaker 3 (20:02):
As you can tell as you hear him talk, he's
incredible, great story.
He's on the Blackout, whichobviously you know well.

Speaker 2 (20:08):
Oh yeah, he's incredible.
Is there anything to match that?
Everybody that's come on, Ibelieve.

Speaker 1 (20:14):
That's a great question for Ted.

Speaker 2 (20:16):
Yeah, because you've been all over.

Speaker 3 (20:18):
Everybody says it's their favorite.
I have never been to anythinglike that.

Speaker 1 (20:25):
Explain it, ted it, from your perspective.
Where were you where, where wasyour seat?
So?

Speaker 3 (20:26):
are you with our seat ?
I was with my wife and our twosons, who were very young then,
um the one who was already a bigtravis snyder fan that year and
the other one who was a hugerussell nights.
I used the other one who's ahuge russell martin guy and
we're up in I.
I don't know exactly what thethe section was.
It must have been like 323.
It's that little one that'slike the wedge shape in the

(20:49):
middle of two in the upper deckon the left field.

Speaker 1 (20:52):
Oh, left field.

Speaker 3 (20:52):
Yeah, it's a little wedge shape and people were
offering my kids beards.

Speaker 1 (21:01):
What a memory for those kids.

Speaker 3 (21:03):
Well, they took it up later.

Speaker 2 (21:06):
As they were smoking their black and mild.

Speaker 3 (21:09):
But it was I mean, and when it got so loud, Cueto
dropped the ball and RussellMartin, of course, homered, and
it was probably.
And I went to Penn State and soI mean I've been to games with
110,000 people.
I almost got trampled at oneNotre Dame game in 87.
But this was I mean, you werethere, you were there.

Speaker 1 (21:31):
But not the stands.

Speaker 3 (21:32):
No, but it's a different perspective.

Speaker 2 (21:34):
No, I know, and someone that's covered so much.
Your perspective is likepriceless.

Speaker 3 (21:40):
You know what I remember the most?
My father used to tell me thatwhen he was growing up in
Cleveland he would go to LeaguePark and try to look in through
the slats and the fences.
And I remember looking on theClemente Bridge and there were
people gathered on the ClementeBridge and they were watching
the game.
They could only see like maybea third of it or a half, but

(22:01):
they were there and they wantedto.
I don't even think they theywanted necessarily to see and
process the game as much as theyjust wanted to be a part of
this moment in Pittsburgh.
And that was, you know, I, we,we had moved back to Pittsburgh
to take care of my parents in 07.
And that was the moment I reallysort of viscerally felt like a
Pittsburgher again.
Was was when that happened andwhen everybody was in it for one

(22:25):
thing, and you felt like.
You know, to be honest, and I'msure you picked up on this,
that kind of crowd can beintimidating and even a little
bit menacing.
My older son was a littlefreaked out by it, but he didn't
leave.
He didn't want to miss anythingbut the fact that all of that
energy was channeled intosomething that we all had in
common.
You know that was incredible.

Speaker 1 (22:47):
That tells you about Pittsburgh and sports and the
Pirates and the history.
And was it not that year youalso wrote a great essay about
your mom and you brought herback.
She was a big Bill Robinson fan.
Yeah, she was.

Speaker 3 (23:03):
Yeah, we used to go down.
There was a bank.
It's now been absorbed 10 timesover by PNC.
It was called Franklin Federaland they had a thing on the
south side and my mother lovedBill Robinson Because when my
mother was the most intobaseball, it was 76, 77, really,
and that was his heyday withthe Pirates, right.

(23:23):
And so we go down and it'sgoing to be Bill Robinson and
Dave Parker and they both signautographs.
They're both perfectly nice andthere's huge crowds around
Parker, you know, they want tosee the Cobra and Robinson had
some, but he was, he was.
It was less intense.
And so after everybody leftRobinson's hanging around and he
and my mother get into thisconversation and they talk and

(23:46):
she's like, you know, she's likethis is baseball to me.
And so when she was about toturn 90 and she was having
trouble walking, she said shewished she could see a pirate
game again and it was 2013.
And you were like this ishappening it was September and
we got some help from so we wentin the entrance you go into

(24:07):
with the elevators and we gotsome help to get her up to her
seats.
We were in a Pittsburghbaseball club seats so that she
could go inside if she needed to, to to the indoor part.
And I mean I took a picture ofher and she has this big grin on
her face and it's just.
It was incredible.

Speaker 2 (24:30):
And when?
When we saw mccutcheon, she'slike he is, so down to earth
he's.
So you know he's the billrobinson of today and I like
that.

Speaker 1 (24:33):
I like hearing that.
I'm gonna tell him that, yeah,that's really cool, because bill
robinson was for older piratefans he was.
He was the, not the superstar.
He was.
You think about parker andstargell and even omar moreno
and those guys.
But Robinson was so clutch andI remember Ted listening to
games in the Harrisburg area andhe was one of my favorites too
because he was so clutch and hehit, I think, two home runs one

(24:56):
night to win.
And afterward they had him onthe post-game show and they said
what is it about you that youcan come up big in these clutch
situations?
And he quoted the former DodgerWillie Davis, said it's not my
wife, it's not my life, so whyworry?
And he said I think about thatevery time when I come to the
plate in a tough situation.

Speaker 2 (25:14):
Will you say that one more time.
I love that.

Speaker 1 (25:16):
It's not my life, it's not my wife, so why worry
Wow?

Speaker 3 (25:20):
That's great, it's a game and that's great, it's a
game and that's on brand withwhat he was right.

Speaker 1 (25:24):
Yes, and he was just so clutch.
But you bring your mom to thatgame and what a moment that must
have been that you were able toshare that moment with her at
PNC Park, and she had not beento a game in a long, long time.

Speaker 3 (25:39):
No, both my parents were against the bond issue that
created PNC Park.
Will you explain that parents?
were against the bond issue thatcreated PNC Park and then the
book was like that Well,basically, as I understand I
mean, I you could probablyexplain it better than me but
essentially that they wanted toborrow money to build PNC Park
and, as I recall and I'm not,I'm not wire sure, as we say for
this uh, but, um, it wasrejected.

(26:00):
But then they did it anyway,yeah, and my father was like I'm
not going to go to a game.
My father was this baseballlover since the 20s and he's
like this is ridiculous, I'm notgoing to go to a game.
And so, finally, I took him toa game and we walk in and, as we
all know, you see the citysprawled out before you and it's
magical.
And he was won over.
And same thing with my mother.

(26:21):
I was, um, she had not been topnc park before that game in
2013 and I was worried about theverticality of it because she
wasn't walking well and stuff,and I mean, she couldn't, like I
said, she couldn't wipe thegrin off her face and and just
to see that and to see that shewas letting in baseball again,
you know, baseball I love, and Isaid this in that that essay,
you, which is another deep cutyou did your homework Always.

(26:43):
I feel like there's so much inkabout fathers and sons in
baseball and there's less inkabout mothers and sons or
mothers and daughters.
Which is wild, and I thinkthat's different in Pittsburgh a

(27:04):
little bit.
I mean, I know so many morewomen, both in in my generation
and any generation, who are intosports, but I wish there was
more literature.
I wish there was more, you know, exploration of that, because
my mother, I mean she, she, shehad this.
I'm going to, I'm going to gooff script for a second,
although I guess there's noscript.
So that Art Palin thing I wastalking about in KDK.

(27:25):
Yes, she won pirate ticketsbecause you had to come up with
a cheer, and so she came up withthis cheer that went hang in
there, each and every buck.
You're in the race to stay,with just a little bit of luck.
Where there's a willy, there'sa way, wow.

Speaker 1 (27:43):
I love it.
That gives me goosebumps.

Speaker 3 (27:45):
Yeah, that is so cool and so she won tickets and they
went with trish baity.
Oh my gosh and art palin to toa ball game and I still.
I am so glad that my father wasan obsessive taper of things
because I still have the, thesound of it and no way, yeah,
wow that so cool.

Speaker 2 (28:03):
That's like the pirate star Spangled Banner
Right.

Speaker 1 (28:08):
That's exactly right, because he's got the stars,
that's right.
It's about Willie, that's right.
That's beautiful Wow.

Speaker 3 (28:14):
She was.
Two days ago was the sixthanniversary of her death, and so
I've been thinking about her alot.
Oh, my gosh, and I just lovethat, me too, and I hope that
there's more literature andcontent and stuff like that
about mothers and sons ormothers and daughters.

Speaker 2 (28:30):
My mom was like I call her, dorothy Mantooth.
If you've ever seen that movie,she's incredible.
She had a really bad life.
By every stretch of theimagination, she shouldn't be
the woman she is.
By every stretch of theimagination she shouldn't be the
woman she is.
And the fact that she gave methe life I have and now having
another son that I didn't knowshe had, she was forced to give

(28:51):
up I mean I would not be the manI am today without my mom.

Speaker 1 (28:54):
So yeah, I think moms are incredible.
Well, how big into baseball isyour mom Now, of course, how big
she was into me.
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (29:02):
Yeah, yeah, but she'll.
She'll watch the pirates nowyou brought her into baseball
yeah, her love for me and herwant to be, you know, the person
that could elevate me or pushme into you know better than
what she had, I mean have youwritten about that?
No, you really should.
I'm not a very good writer, somaybe we, maybe you can help me

(29:23):
out.

Speaker 3 (29:23):
I can absolutely help you out.
You're a good talker and that'swhat makes very good writer, so
maybe you can help me out.
I can absolutely help you out.
You're a good talker and that'swhat makes a good writer.
I appreciate that Good talker.
Good thinker equals good writer.

Speaker 1 (29:29):
Well, you got to do that.
That's humbling.
Yeah, that's humbling comingfrom you.
That's Michael McHenry rightthere.

Speaker 3 (29:35):
But that's a story that needs to be told and I can
guarantee you from stuff I'vemake a difference it will cut
the best of grooves.

Speaker 2 (29:43):
All right, I'm in.
You sold me that wasn't veryhard, but you sold me, but it is
something.

Speaker 1 (29:50):
There are so many stories and you and I have
talked about this before, ted somany stories to be told.
I mean people that are watchingor listening to this right now
will be thinking about theirmothers and whether it's again,
whether they turned you on tobaseball or vice versa, is the
case with Michael, or the tiesto Pittsburgh and Western

(30:12):
Pennsylvania.
What makes it so different andso unique?
There is that story, thosestories to be told.

Speaker 3 (30:20):
I want to tell you a story about what my sister did
when my father got Alzheimer's.
It's directly related to that.
So, as I said, he was aCleveland Indians fan.
Earl Averill from SnohomishWashington was his favorite
player, and when he started tolose, I mean, he was an educator
and all of his knowledge sortof drained out the back of his
head, it's just horrible towatch.

(30:41):
So she found an autographedCleveland Indians baseball from
the early 30s on eBay.
She got that and she compiledthis incredible notebook of
clips and photos and things thatwere essentially yeah, it was
about baseball, but it wasmnemonic devices.
It was basically designed todraw out his memories that were
in there, as my father put it.
Before he lost too much memory,he said you know, it's all in

(31:04):
in the hard drive, but there'sno icon to click on.
Um.
And so she did this and for thelast few years of his life he
had the cleveland indians withhim again, which I, I absolutely
love, and that's incredible.
And he uh, we were talking aboutthis earlier, he also he also
left behind this my um, my uhthat's my grandfather had

(31:26):
tickets to the 1920 World Series, cleveland and Brooklyn.
So, ted, if you're not watching, you're listening?

Speaker 1 (31:31):
Ted's showing a framed two tickets to the 1920
World Series between Clevelandand Brooklyn, unused.

Speaker 3 (31:42):
And the question is, why didn't he use them?
And you know, I mean, you talkabout storytelling.
That's a better story thanhaving two ripped tickets that
he used.
Maybe he didn't get to see thegame.
But here we are, 104 yearslater, and we're still talking
about these tickets.
And when you say people are outthere thinking about their
mothers and stuff, right, peopledon't realize that their

(32:03):
stories matter.
They think that, okay, it mightmatter to the next person at
the dinner table, it mightmatter to the cousin, but that's
the patchwork, right?
That's the patchwork ofPittsburgh or of any community.

Speaker 1 (32:13):
That story that matters to you matters to others
because it matters to them.
It's that tie.

Speaker 3 (32:18):
And then when you bring them together and you have
a whole cluster of them, all ofa sudden you start seeing the
texture of a community.

Speaker 1 (32:25):
You mentioned Cleveland, so your dad was from
Cleveland.

Speaker 3 (32:28):
My dad Anthony's go back in Cleveland to clear the
forest in 1832 west of Cleveland, and so we've done a lot in our
family history and Clevelandwas very important to them.
But then my grandfather, who Ijust mentioned, was a clerk for
the New York Central Railroad,so they moved from Cleveland to
Detroit in 37, and so he becamea Tigers fan.
So the one through line is Iwas raised to not like the

(32:50):
Yankees.

Speaker 2 (32:55):
That's universal in Pittsburgh.
Yes, that is universal.

Speaker 1 (32:57):
That is no doubt Opening day, baby.
Well so, ted, what's your first?
Do you have one?
First memory that stands out ofthe Pittsburgh Pirates?
What's your first?
Do you have one?

Speaker 3 (33:06):
first memory that stands out of the Pittsburgh
Pirates.
So there was a thing that theyused to do at Three Rivers
called Jacket Day, and it hadthese.
They gave out these jacketsthat were supposed to be pirate
jackets, but effectively theywere like black and gold hefty
bags.
Right, yeah, like rain stickers.

Speaker 1 (33:23):
Yes, the things that if it rained in the summer you'd
be like drenched.

Speaker 3 (33:26):
And so we went to Jacket Day, and this is actually
.
This is a pirate story, but nota pirate story.
We went to Jacket Day.
We're seeing, you know, RichieHebner, Richie Zisk, Frank
Tavares, those years you know,and this was before Tanner was
made this was the year thatMurtaugh was last year, and
afterward I go under gate A,which, as you'll recall, is
where the players went in andout to get autographs.

(33:48):
There were always this phalanxof kids there waiting for
autographs.
So we're getting autographs,and I had been a baseball fan
for all of that summer and formuch of the previous year, but I
had not really been to a game.
And so this guy comes out in asuit.
It's Vin Scully.
Oh right, and somehow I knowit's Vin Scully.

(34:11):
So I go up to him and I ask himfor an autograph on my
scorecard and he smiles at meand he says, son, I don't mean
to disappoint you, but I'm not aplayer.
And I said no, I know who youare, mr Scully.
Can you sign my?
You should ask him if he knewwho you were.
And I said no, I know who youare, mr Scully.

Speaker 2 (34:24):
Can you sign?

Speaker 3 (34:24):
my.
You should ask him if he knewwho you were.

Speaker 2 (34:26):
Yeah, that's right.
I was published at 11.
He gave me an autograph.
He gave me an autograph.

Speaker 3 (34:30):
And I loved the fact that, you know, while all these
kids were and rightly so goingafter the players, I loved that
this guy, who was one of myearliest memories of baseball,
was that day.
Isn't that incredible?

Speaker 1 (34:47):
It's funny you say that because I remember, like it
was yesterday, when I first metLanny Frateri as a young kid
outside Gate A and similar story.
He was just so kind and I wasso nervous my knees were shaking
because for me that was almostmy Willie Stargell and Omar
Moreno.
It was meeting Lanny Frateri.

Speaker 3 (35:07):
Well, I'll bet and you know it's interesting
because I've learned this injournalism, because you know I'm
primarily a writer, but we'reall multi-format journalists.
Now I mean, as you prove,setting up this whole shebang,
head help.
But there's something, and Imean you know this well, there's
something incredibly intimateabout the voice.

(35:29):
We talked about this when I didthat story on umpires' voices.

Speaker 1 (35:31):
That's right, that's right.

Speaker 3 (35:33):
And the person you listen to on NPR or whatever.
You're waking up in the morningwith them.
You might be showering withthem.
I won't go any further downthat road, but I have friends at
NPR and it's like I actuallyknow them, so they're personal
to me.
But the people you hear on theradio, I remember being under my
covers at night with this radioand I would pull in because AM

(35:57):
radio could pull in from a longway away.
I heard Chicago Cubs broadcastwhen they did night games, I
heard KYW in Philadelphia andpeople like you.
This is a good example of it.
I got the good fortune of goingto North Korea a few times in my
role as Asian news director andI wasn't there as a journalist.

(36:18):
I was there as kind of a suitto push for access for us and at
one point they decided to takeus out to this national park
because we weren't allowed to gooutside Pyongyang without
escorts and we stopped at somekind of rest stop on the side of
the road and I realized that,against all odds because North
Korea is very, very locked downI have an international cell

(36:41):
phone signal at that moment.
So what do you think is thefirst thing I did?
You?

Speaker 2 (36:45):
made a call.

Speaker 3 (36:46):
Nope Took a picture I powered up the MLB app because
it was like 9 in the morning.

Speaker 2 (36:53):
Oh, I should have known that.

Speaker 3 (36:55):
It was like 9 in the morning.
I thought can I get the Piratesfrom here?
So I have like two bars right,it's middle of North Korea.
Suddenly it clicks, it takesand this is an early version of
MLB TV and suddenly in the ruralfields of North Korea comes the
voice of one, greg Brown.
No, in North Korea.
And so that was.

Speaker 2 (37:16):
Rocket man probably wanted to listen too right.

Speaker 3 (37:19):
But so I'm thinking, of course, what I'm thinking is
okay, the tech guys at MLB, youknow they're probably tracking
the IP addresses.
Oh, yeah.
One IP address?

Speaker 2 (37:28):
Oh yeah, you know it popped up what.
But I mean untapped market.

Speaker 3 (37:32):
Yes, that's right you have called a game that is
available in north korea.
How does that make you that?

Speaker 2 (37:39):
it's humbling, humbling your voice carries my
friend.

Speaker 1 (37:42):
Yeah that's why that's crazy.
Uh, well, now so, but but youruh father and grandfather were
both Cleveland fans, right?

Speaker 3 (37:53):
And, I think, my great-grandfather, because when
my uncle, john Bradley Anthony,told me before he died that
something very vague about howhis father, who was my
great-grandfather, likedbaseball and this was when it
was like the Cleveland Spidersor the Cleveland.

Speaker 1 (38:09):
Naps or what have you .

Speaker 3 (38:11):
And after Nap LeJoy.
And so it may go back evenfurther than my grandfather, I
don't know, but yeah Did you sayNaps.

Speaker 1 (38:19):
The Naps, that's a terrible baseball name.
It was after Nap LeJoy.
Yeah, the player Like Naps,yeah.

Speaker 2 (38:25):
They put you to sleep .
Yes, that's what they did Easyright there.
Man, that's terrible.
Yeah, I can't do better thanthat.
I like spiders, especially ifyou've got a good pitching staff
or a good bullpen.

Speaker 1 (38:35):
Yeah, come out and bite you.

Speaker 2 (38:37):
Just arms coming everywhere.

Speaker 1 (38:41):
Well, so what about the story about your grandfather
?
And he passed along?
Was it a box score?
No, no Is told us about it.

Speaker 3 (38:50):
No, there's a cigar band story.

Speaker 1 (38:52):
Oh, okay, that's what you might be referring to.

Speaker 3 (38:54):
So my grandfather.
When I was growing up I neverknew my grandfather.
He died in 54.
And when I was growing up myfather had this in his study
this overstuffed couplenotebooks of cigar bands from
like the early 1900s that mygrandfather collected and he
ended up selling them.
It's like the only thing myfather ever got rid of of family

(39:16):
history.
But he ended up selling them tosome guy who collected them in
the North Hills, and that's whatI remember of it.
Right, so that 30 years passed,35 years passed.
I get this email out of theblue from a guy who is a Mark
Twain biographer and, as youprobably know, mark Twain loved
cigars and he says are yourelated to an Edward Mason

(39:41):
Anthony from Cleveland, ohio,who was alive, who would have
been about 12 years old in 1906?
I'm like, as it happens, I am.
So it turns out he's compilinga book of letters that were
written to Mark Twain from thepublic and answers to them and
my grandfather at age 12 hadsent, of course.

Speaker 2 (40:03):
Just know you beat him.
Just know you beat him.

Speaker 3 (40:07):
So he wrote to Mark Twain and asked for cigar bands
because there was, like this,feature in the Chicago Tribune
about Mark Twain's cigars.
And so my grandfather wrote tohim and said I collect them, I
live in Cleveland, Can you sendme some of the ones that you
have if you're not throwing themaway?
And he got a nice note back,not from Mark Twain but from
Mark Twain's personal secretary,saying Mr Twain thanks you for

(40:28):
Mr Clemens.
They referred to him as MrClemens.
Mr Clemens thanks you for yourletter and wishes you the best
of luck.
He has a young person to whomhe supplies, and they call them
life belts for cigars.

Speaker 2 (40:38):
Oh my gosh, why did they refer to him as Clemens?

Speaker 3 (40:41):
That was his real name that was his birth name,
Mark Twain is like.
It means like two fathoms.
It was his pen name oh wow youknow, and so so he sent me a
copy of the letter in my 12 yearold grandfather's handwriting,
which is like the samehandwriting he had at 860, and I
have a copy of that and I Ijust I loved that because it was
like here's this, this kid outof nowhere who thrusts this

(41:05):
thing into the sort of matterstream of history, and then it
goes.
It comes back at his grandsonmore than a hundred years later
and the cigar bands.

Speaker 2 (41:14):
He's 12.
I know it's a different time,but like that's a crazy thing.
I don't know.
I don't know any 12 year oldscollecting cigar bands now right
, I don't know any now.

Speaker 3 (41:25):
And he didn't smoke cigars.

Speaker 2 (41:26):
according to my father, he smoked cigarettes,
but he was but do you think itwas just because of Mark Twain?

Speaker 3 (41:32):
No, because he has all these others in those
notebooks.
So I mean I think he, I'm suresomeone in the family did,
because there were like hundredsof them.

Speaker 2 (41:39):
So he probably looked up somebody and then that's
kind of how.

Speaker 3 (41:42):
So that's really cool , yeah, but I love that because
it's like, yeah, it's so cool,that's one of those stories,
these little brushes withhistory, that you sort of pass
in the night right.

Speaker 1 (41:49):
Well, now speaking of your grandfather, he wasn't
able to listen to the games whenhe worked right, so your
grandmother helped.
How?

Speaker 3 (41:57):
So my, as I said, my grandfather was a clerk for the
railroad and he had had when hewas about 16 or 15, I think he
had had polio, which was a hugething back in the during World
War I and he couldn't fightbecause of it and um.
So he had this boot and hewalked with a limp and um.

(42:21):
When they started broadcastinggames in the late twenties um,
the, the, my grandmother wouldbe at home during the day with
my father, who was not yet inschool, and she'd listened to
the games on the um, on the, thehuge radio in their living room
that sat on the floor and jackgrainy, who was a very famous
broadcaster, was calling thegames and she would keep score,
she would um on on like pulppaper, she would draw grids and
she would keep score for mygrandfather and then they would

(42:43):
go out to the um, to the frontstoop and the streetcar at the
end of the day would let mygrandfather off of the streetcar
when he's coming home from workwith a bunch of other guys and
my father, who was like six orseven, would see which one was
his father down the blockbecause of his polio shoe and
how he was walking and he'd rundown the street holding the
score sheet and hand it to mygrandfather, so my grandfather

(43:04):
could immediately see what theIndians had done.

Speaker 2 (43:06):
Wow, that's like a Hallmark movie.
It is, isn't it?
Yeah it really is.

Speaker 3 (43:09):
It's veering into Mitch's album territory a little
bit.

Speaker 1 (43:11):
Yeah, it really is Wild and that takes us kind of
into the early days of the boxscores, which your grandmother
was basically making her own boxscore for your grandfather.
Yeah, what a great lady by theway, oh, isn't that tremendous.

Speaker 3 (43:25):
Right, yeah, so great .
Well, she was a fan too, I mean, it wasn't.

Speaker 1 (43:28):
Yeah, it was a labor of love.

Speaker 3 (43:30):
Yeah, but we talked about that.
What I love about we're so muchnow.
The media industry has beenupended.
People are consuming media inso many different ways and we're
looking for alternative storyforms, right Things that will
resonate with audiences.
And when I teach writing, oneof the things I always show I

(43:52):
show a box score from like 1885,because the box score in the
newspaper is like one of theearliest alternative story forms
in journalism.
It's got characters, it's gottime that you move through, it's
got conflict, it's got a veryspecific and exciting outcome
all there in those columns andthose numbers and those names.
And to me, you know you look ata box score and the whole game

(44:13):
opens up to you.
I used to be obsessed with boxscores when I was a kid.

Speaker 1 (44:16):
Likewise.
And you wonder, are those daysdwindling?
I wonder how many pay attentionto that box score.
Now the story is told to you onthe app.
Play-by-play is literally givento you.

Speaker 3 (44:30):
I love the game day part of MLB where you can look
at the different things butthere is something to
deciphering that.
I have a good friend injournalism.
You actually may have met him.
His name, dave Jones, used tocover Penn State for years for
the Patriot News and he has thisidea for a next generation box
score and I really want, I'mlooking forward to seeing what
he does.
He just retired and I meanthose things.

(44:52):
You know, you can, I know weall have.
You know we're connected 24seven.
We have our devices but sittingthere visualizing a baseball
game through its box score, youknow it's, it's so cool and
that's what I.
The reason I teach with that isbecause people are accustomed
to telling stories in certainways, but there are all kinds of
other ways to tell stories thatwill punch through the static

(45:14):
and for people in the 1880s,1890s, 1900s, box score was
punching through the static andpeople went through those.

Speaker 1 (45:22):
And you used your imagination, you would look at
the box score and you would tryto figure out and imagine that
home run that was hit in thefifth inning with two men on
base.
What it was, where it was, youknow, you can see who hit it,
when and off of home, and youcan do it.

Speaker 3 (45:38):
You can do it the next day in the paper, or you
can do it a hundred years later.

Speaker 1 (45:42):
That's exactly right.

Speaker 3 (45:42):
I mean, I look at these these pirate box scores
from the first decade, decade ofthe 20th century.
You know, fred clark, deacon,philippe uh, hannes wagner,
obviously all of that you know.
And they, they come alive inone line and you, you see the
little you see the little uhbecause the type isn't perfect
in early newspapers and youthink someone saw this the day
that happened and that's so coolted.

Speaker 1 (46:05):
Uh, you know you're.
You're talking about your earlydays and your first memories as
a fan.
Does one moment aside from thatwild card game stand out?
One pirate moment, a win, ahome run, something in
particular aside from that wildcard game?

Speaker 3 (46:25):
I think one moment, god, it's so hard to narrow it
down, it's so hard I know it'snot really a fair question
because so many memories runthrough you, I think in 82….
Oh, that's great.
He starts memories.

Speaker 2 (46:42):
I see that Rolodex going, yeah, I know, 24,

Speaker 3 (46:45):
82.
There we go, I'm.

Speaker 1 (46:49):
ADHD and so everything in there is.
You two get along great.

Speaker 2 (46:51):
Yeah yeah, we were doing jumping jacks before we
got on.

Speaker 3 (46:56):
It was Stargell Appreciation Day.
It was in September of 82.
It was his last day.
You got a little brochure whenyou went in that I still have,
with a painting of Stargell onthe front and I remember because
it seemed like all of thesethings came together my
Pittsburgh stuff, my China stuff, falk School and knowing Kelly
and Willie Jr, who they calledSun Sun, that's right,

(47:33):
no-transcript introduced him andstuff, and so that I know it's
not a an in-game moment, butthat's, that was a pretty cool.

Speaker 2 (47:44):
But that was your moment.
That's cool, I think so didstargell actually visit?

Speaker 3 (47:48):
school yeah he came and he was in that leisure suit
and he was that's what he said,I remember one time when he came
to see I gotta find it ifthere's a picture of that oh
there are plenty of those.
I want to see if I can matchthat leisure shoot.
There's a lot of chest shown oh, yeah, yeah and jones jared
jones jared jones.
Yeah, call that manhood yeah anduh, and we, we had done a

(48:10):
school play and I think one ofthe kids had been in it and I
was in it and I remember beingthere like I don't think I was
saying anything at the moment,but I was on the stage and you
know, I mean he had an aura, hehad charisma.
And so he walks in and he'slike trying to make himself
smaller, which with WillieStargell was generally not
possible and he sat down and hewatched the play and when people

(48:32):
went up to him and asked himfor his autograph afterward he
said I'm just a dad today and Ithought that was so cool.
Albeit he gave out Stargellstars, but he just wanted to be
a dad at folk school.

Speaker 2 (48:47):
So the Stargell stars for people that may be
listening that aren't fromPittsburgh, don't remember.
Explain that because you'vementioned it twice.
And obviously the the actual,like BP hats this year had the,
the stars on it and I loved it.
So explain that a little bit.

Speaker 3 (49:03):
So, um, in roundabout 77 or so, they started wearing
these pillbox hats with stripeson them.
They would now still buy it1976.

Speaker 1 (49:11):
Or so they started wearing these pillbox hats with
stripes on them.
1976, it was the bicentennialand all National League teams
wore the pillbox caps, but thePirates kept them.
The Pirates kept them.
Everybody else did it for ayear.
They didn't like it, thePirates liked it and kept it.

Speaker 3 (49:19):
And not only that, but after 76, when they were
still wearing the earlieruniforms, they switched to the
mix and match gold, black andpinstripes, and you never knew
what they were going to bewearing it would change during
double headers, stuff like that,I love it.
And so the pillbox hats, theblack ones he would put.
First he started putting.

(49:39):
They were just little goldstars made of embroidered with a
black S on them, and they stuckto the hat and he would give
them out.

Speaker 1 (49:48):
I forget why he gave them out, maybe when someone
home ordered, it was almost likethe star of the game in his
mind, and so slowly, gradually,we noticed that all the Pirates
players in the dugout and on thefield they had various
permutations of these stars.

Speaker 3 (49:59):
And by 79, it was the thing, and everybody loved them
.
But you know you couldn't getthem then.
This was before they sold allthe gear to the public.
And so for us, in 79, gettingthese stargill stars from
stargill.

Speaker 1 (50:13):
It was really that's.
The only way to get them waswillie.
Stargill had to give you thisstar, so the players would have
an occasionally how are we notbringing that back?
Well, jeff banister did that afew years ago when banny was the
bench coach.
He tried to bring those back.
That's a hard thing to do, it'sa hard thing to recreate, that
I mean.
But they did with the ones thatget sold in the store.

Speaker 3 (50:31):
They still, when they have the pillbox hats.

Speaker 1 (50:33):
They have the stars, but they're embroidered right,
and they don't have an s on thembut it looks like it a little
bit right.

Speaker 3 (50:37):
Yeah, but um, it was I.
I was lucky enough to get twoof them.
I gave one to my sister, who'salso a huge pirate fan, and she
kept it for like 35 years andthen gave it back to me long
after mine was gone.
So I have one original one,right now, but it was such a.
That's another.
You know, we talk aboutcommunity and what makes you a
Pittsburgher?
That's one of those things.
That was the Pirates' terribletowel.

Speaker 1 (50:56):
That's right, that's exactly right.

Speaker 2 (50:58):
So it needs to come back.

Speaker 1 (51:01):
Well, it helps.
It helps when you're winningtoo.
We've talked about that before.
You can't wait for it.
We've talked about that.
You've got to be prepared towin.
You mentioned meeting WillieStargell, your son.
Eventually did he meet TravisSnyder.
He became his favorite player.

Speaker 3 (51:16):
Oh yeah, so this is a great story.
So, summer of 2013,.
Travis Snyder's up to the plateand my son was then what six?
And you're calling the game andwe're sitting in our living
room in the dark and he saysbass is alert.
He says Travis Snyder is goingto hit a grand slam and we're

(51:36):
like Wyatt, you always say thatand he's like no, this time I
mean it Before, I want he's.

Speaker 2 (51:45):
Bob Walk, he's Bob Walk.
Yeah, bob Walk is alwayscalling a homer and he's like
I'm never wrong.
Because when I write, that'sall I remember.

Speaker 3 (51:53):
And he's this little guy, and he's under the blanket
and he's like no, this time Imean it.
I know I've said it before, butthis time is different.
Boom Next pitch.

Speaker 2 (52:00):
He had a feel Next pitch.

Speaker 3 (52:01):
Boom, come on, and we hear you saying Grand Sal, wow.
And so he was so happy and hebecame obsessed with Travis
Snyder and for a while it was alittle sort of Rain Man-like.
For a while everything was 23.
He would draw 23.
It was a little bit like Redrum.

Speaker 1 (52:16):
Yes, he was such a stuffer Redrum, Redrum.

Speaker 3 (52:18):
Redrum, everything was 23.
I would go and we moved toThailand and I would go to
hotels and go to the 23rd floorand photograph 23 for him, oh,
for him, oh and cool, sointentional.
I love this, so great.
So he drew this picture.
I don't know if you remember,but, travis you, I'm sure you do
, travis snyder had the pinkcheeks.
Yeah, and so still does my son.
My son did um lunch meatlunchbox lunchbox best steak

(52:41):
I've ever had.
Yeah, well, he, and he does iton instagram all the time oh so
good.
So we moved to bangkok and andhe draws a picture of Travis
Snyder and I tweeted out andtweeted at Travis Snyder who
tweets back at him and my son'sso excited and I ended up
writing a piece about how TravisSnyder was for us, for a
six-year-old moving to Bangkok,like I got dragged away in 79.

(53:04):
This Travis Snyder focus washis way of holding on to home
and to Pittsburgh, and so Iwrote this.
I put it on.
It wasn't for the AP, I justwrote it personally on Medium
and, because I know a lot ofsports writers, it got
circulated around.
And the PR person for theOrioles because it was written,
because he had been traded andwhy it was so upset that he had

(53:26):
been traded to the Orioles.
So the PR person for theOrioles picks up on this and her
name I don't know if youremember her name is Kristen
Hudak.
Yes, and she's a Johnstownperson, right.
And so she arranges for A acare package to get sent to
Thailand with Travis Snyderstuff.
B Travis Snyder to record avideo for Wyatt.
And C the pièce de résistance,she invites us to camden yards

(53:52):
and we're home for the summer in2015.
So we go both.
My kids get to take battingpractice under the inside, under
the, the stands with uh travisand manny machado, who was with
the orioles at the time.

Speaker 2 (54:00):
That wasn't cool at all.

Speaker 3 (54:01):
No, no and um what?
Because we knew how much youlove food, wyatt brought him a
street food book from bangkok oh, it's and travis gave him a bat
and a glove and stuff, andthey're still in touch, I mean,
and Wyatt turns 18 today andthey still go back and forth
sometimes.
And Wyatt follows his Instagramand in fact, my wonderful

(54:23):
soon-to-be ex-wife who is theeditor of Kidsburg, the website
for parents in Pittsburgh, justhad him on their new podcast and
he he's doing some wonderfulwork now around emotional health
and teenagers and things likethat, and he's just.

Speaker 1 (54:37):
He is a solid individual my goodness,
incredible so much in his lifetoo.

Speaker 2 (54:41):
That's the thing yeah , you know, and he's giving back
ebbs and flows.

Speaker 3 (54:44):
I mean he gets the big leagues super young, but he,
he made an impression on ourfamily and you know, I think
what I love about it is that youknow, with uh no disrespect to
people like mccutcheon, they'rethe stars people love.
Travis snyder was a great ballplayer, but he was not the
center of attention always and Ilove that.
That wyatt focused on this guywho works his butt off, who is

(55:05):
is uh making good and who is iswilling to interact, and that's
you know.
That to me, is a throwback towhen people lived here during
the offseason.
I used to work at Shop and Saveand I think Bill Mazeroski was
working for some grocerywholesaler for a while and he
would stop by when players inthe offseason would sort of
really interact.

Speaker 2 (55:25):
We talk about that all the time the roots aren't
deep enough.
I believe that matters so much.
Like if you go over right nowinto the clubhouse I've talked
about this on the podcast beforebut there's no locker that has
anything in it.
When I was in Colorado, I wouldwalk into their locker room and
they would have ropes for ToddHelton, for Matt Holiday, for

(55:46):
even when Hop was there.
But it was cool because I walkin, I'm like whoa.

Speaker 3 (55:51):
Yeah, holiday, for even when hop was there, but it
was cool, because I walk in I'mlike, oh yeah, I know that's too
long, yeah, absolutely, but youput, you chose to put down
roots here.
I did.
I mean so you're, you're now apart of the community right.

Speaker 2 (55:58):
Yeah, I'm a yalzer is what I say.
My wife's every time I say thatshe's like we got a trademark,
that I'm like that is so good.

Speaker 1 (56:04):
Yeah, but yeah, really good two new things today
.

Speaker 3 (56:06):
you got the y, the yalzer, you've got the sound of
the lighter at the beginning.

Speaker 1 (56:09):
Well, that leads me to.
And now Gustine at the plate.
Frankie Gustine, and line driveright for it.
And that's going to bug on therug.
That's going to score a couple,frankie Gustine.
He's got that restaurant downthere in Oakland.

Speaker 3 (56:24):
So Frankie Gustine's restaurant by Forbes Field.
He just burnt the mic.
Folks.
My father took me there all thetime to get the turkey
Devonshire.
I don't know if you've everheard of turkey Devonshire.
I'm sure you have ClassicPittsburgh dish.
It's basically toast turkeybacon cheese sauce.
Where are you going to go wrong?
You can't go wrong.

Speaker 2 (56:43):
Anything with bacon on it.
As long as you put mayonnaisenear it, it's perfect.

Speaker 3 (56:47):
My older son now cooks bacon in clarified bacon
grease that he bought.

Speaker 2 (56:51):
So why aren't we friends?
Yes, that's great.

Speaker 3 (56:55):
So we would go there.
And somehow in these pre-Ebay,pre-internet days, my father got
me a Frankie Gustine card from49, a Bowman card before tops.
And we go in and he says, whydon't you ask the bartender if
we can get him to sign it?
And so I take it up to thebartender.
He says, come back next Tuesday.
And come back next Tuesday.

(57:16):
He hands it back and I have aFrankie Gardena 1949 autographed
card that my father got for me.
Little card, it's fraying, it'sall oh my gosh, but it's that he
autographed that and he madeanother one.
That made a friend for life,you know.
And so years later, because ofthis, because of the tie with my

(57:36):
father, I had a jersey made atpnc park that was gustine 16,
and one day I'm walking aroundby, uh, I guess by the, the
rotunda, and these people comeup to me and they're like we are
frankie gustine's grandkids andwe've never seen this before
and it made them so happy and Iget um, I get the people notice

(57:59):
that there's what?
what's the guy's name?
Forgive me, the, the gentleman,uh, baseball uh, joe baseball,
joe, yeah and baseball joe umaccosted me at a, at a, uh, oh
yeah.

Speaker 1 (58:10):
And Baseball Joe accosted me at a food stand.
He will Did he toss you the?

Speaker 3 (58:13):
ball.
No, but he had his keyboardbecause of his stroke, he still
writes me emails.
And so he's typing out on thekeyboard about how excited he is
to see a Frankie Gustine jersey.
So these things there are thesethrough?
Lines.
There are these through, linesthat keep going, you know.

Speaker 1 (58:31):
And you know it frustrates us, know it
frustrates me, away at the card.

Speaker 3 (58:32):
Yeah, it's just so great.
And uh, this has been up.
Uh, this has been up with mefor 45 years now.

Speaker 1 (58:37):
I guess 40 years oh my gosh, frankie gustine was
such a gentleman.
His kids, oh, you knew him,yeah, but toward the end of of
his, toward the end of his life.
Yeah, I got a chance to just toclass act as kids, just as
classy, and we talked about howimportant history is and that's
in society and life.

Speaker 3 (58:58):
And how it's passed on through family.

Speaker 1 (59:05):
Yes, but it seems to me, ted, and I think Michael
agrees, that too many of us inthe game of baseball have kind
of lost that, that we forget theimportance of history.

Speaker 3 (59:12):
So how do you bring it back?
Because I mean this is a gamethat I would argue and again I'm
going to out myself.
I am not a huge sports fan.
I'm a baseball fan and I mean Iwatch the Steelers, I watch the
Pens, but it's baseball thathas stuck with me.
But baseball is such a sport ofhistory I mean you do it all

(59:32):
the time You're pulling out likeKai Kyler references.

Speaker 1 (59:36):
Well, you got to be careful because some people
don't care for that too much.
I understand that you don'twant to go too far into the
history books.

Speaker 3 (59:42):
Maybe they should turn off the radio between
pitches.
Well, that's an idea, that's agood call.

Speaker 1 (59:45):
Well, hello, Go back to the box scores, Ted.
We talked about you as a writer, as a 10-year-old, but you've
got to tell us the story, awayfrom sports, about the book you
were kind enough to autographfor me and I read, and it's
fascinating in that you chasedthe.
I think in fact, the book'stitle was Chasing the Rising Sun

(01:00:06):
, the Journey of an AmericanSong.
Several years ago you wrotethis book about an iconic song.
That's been well.
It's brought back to life inmany movies.
I think the one that comes tomind for me was Casino.
Yes, but your journey intochasing the rising sun, I love

(01:00:27):
that you remember Casino.

Speaker 3 (01:00:28):
That was an intense scene, oh man.

Speaker 1 (01:00:31):
So it's 19.
There was a man from NewOrleans.

Speaker 3 (01:00:36):
I'm not singing, oh you could, but the lyrics.
There is a house in New Orleansthey call the rising sun.
They call the rising sun, ohyeah great it's been the ruin of
many.
That's in a ton of great movies.

Speaker 1 (01:00:48):
Okay, so the animals by the way.

Speaker 3 (01:00:51):
I guess the animals popularized it.
But so I'm sitting in a Thairestaurant in New Hampshire with
my then-girlfriend, who wouldbecome my wife yeah, you
probably get really confusedwith food, don't you?

Speaker 2 (01:01:00):
Yeah, really, you've been everywhere.

Speaker 3 (01:01:02):
And so we're listening and there's this
background music, elevator musicplaying, and we're like this
sounds familiar, elevator musicplaying, and we're like this
sounds familiar, what is this?
And we realize it's House ofthe Rising Sun.
And you know, I don't I saythis in the book I don't usually
believe in epiphanies.
I believe that knowledge isaccumulated gradually.
But I had this epiphany foronce and it's it said that the
story of how this song becamebackground music in a Thai

(01:01:25):
restaurant in New England is thestory of American music in the
20th century and how it went.
You know, something thatstarted local.
At that time I thought itstarted in New Orleans.
I would later find it was fromAppalachia.
But I wanted to know where thissong came from and I became
obsessed with it.
And you can't write a bookunless you're obsessed.
You really can't.
You know, and it goes back toADHD, as you know, if you have

(01:01:48):
ADHD, you can't focus onanything until you can, and when
you can, you focus on nothingelse.
It's that hyper-focus and so Iwrote a piece for the AP.
I found the 15-year-old girl.
Well, the family of the15-year-old girl who had sung it
for this musicologist namedAlan Lomax, who was collecting
songs in Appalachia in 1937 andbasically had this giant

(01:02:09):
recording machine in the back ofhis, traced it for the AP story
.
And then it wasn't enough andso I said I want to write a book
and I really I spent yearstracking and what I realized
early on was I tracked this songback as far as I could.
It has roots in oldScotch-Irish balladry, but also

(01:02:32):
some mix with someAfrican-American music from
Appalachia and a lot ofAppalachian hill ballads, and I
realized I wasn't going to findits origins.
But the book became about whereit traveled and that was a lot
more of an interesting book.
And I found like 90 year oldmusicians who had been
completely forgotten, who hadsung early recordings of it in
the thirties and stuff like that.

(01:02:53):
And on the flip side of it, Isang it in a karaoke bar in
Bangkok and I talked about thediaspora and how it spread
around and it was this.
It was such a wonderfulexperience because it was I
always.
My father said to me when I wasgrowing up, you either you can't
leave the house until youeither learn how to play the
piano or learn how to type.
And I learned how to type andthat set my, that set my

(01:03:14):
direction.
But that moment was when themusic was in me and I really
loved finding out all of thesepeople in these places and how
music evolved and how things goviral long before we were
talking about going viral, howthings go from tiny towns and
mining communities and farmingcommunities to you know this guy

(01:03:36):
, alan Lomax, who was friendswith Woody Guthrie and Lead
Belly and Pete Seeger, and fromthem it went to Bob Dylan and
Dave Van Ronk and then theAnimals and from there it went
everywhere, because it's apublic domain song.
So any musician playing in a baror cutting their first album,
they want to do it because it'sthis compelling song that it

(01:03:57):
could be about.
It's specific and universal.
It could be about, you know, ahouse of ill repute.
It can be about a gamblingaddiction, it can be about
drinking, but it has specifics,like new orleans, like one foot
on the platform, the other oneon the train, and so it's this
song that is so compelling to somany people and it's been
remixed and redone in hundredsof ways I had to I had to detox

(01:04:17):
after the book.

Speaker 1 (01:04:18):
I couldn't listen to it.
How long did it take you toresearch it, and you traveled
all over the world to track downthe history of this song.

Speaker 3 (01:04:26):
Yeah, and in fact it took up our honeymoon.
We drove around the Southlistening to old music and
talking to people, but I mean,how long it took me is kind of a
bit illusory because it took meseven years, but that's because
9-11 and having a kid and uhand moving back to life like it

(01:04:46):
exactly but, um, but I would saythat totally it probably took
me.
If you compressed all the, allthe obsession on the research,
it probably took me about threeyears and uh, took me all these
places.
I never thought I'd be likerural missouri, where I found a
version, low-ststaffed Englandwhere the song might have come
from, that kind of thing, and itwas fun.
It was fun.
It was like it was an excuse.

(01:05:07):
Somebody once said that thebest kind of journalism is being
a social anthropologist with apress pass.
That's good I got to haveglimpses into people's lives and
they trusted me to tell theirstories, not not people, not the
people who have an obligationto tell their story, like
leaders and politicians andpeople like that, but people who

(01:05:27):
didn't have that obligation,who could have sent me packing,
but instead they invited me intotheir homes.
They told me about theirfathers or their grandfathers or
their grandmothers, and it wasan emotional experience and the
end of it I gathered the familyof the woman who sang the
version that is responsible forus knowing it and they she had
died of like emphysema at age 49in like the sixties.

(01:05:48):
And they had.
They she got, they were gettingminimal royalty checks, like
you know, 75 cents here andthere, and I found the recording
in the library of congress andI played it for her kids and
they hadn't heard her voice ohmy gosh because I mean, they
were poor and they, they.
This wasn't like you know.

Speaker 2 (01:06:06):
You don't have your, your your good for you, that's
your, you know.

Speaker 3 (01:06:10):
Voice recorder on your phone and so they got to
hear her singing and that was.
That was like an unparalleledmoment in my life.
I to to you know, I've gottento do all kinds of cool things,
and that is the nub of it.
That's what makes it worthwhile.

Speaker 1 (01:06:26):
Might be the top of the list right there.
I think so.
Did you meet Eric Burton by theway I did in new Orleans.

Speaker 3 (01:06:31):
He um he answered the door he answered the door with
a Hawaiian shirt wide open, youknow.
So I got to see a lot of EricBurden and we sat in the big
Lebowski.
But best story he told me was hewas once traveling by himself
and he went into some bar tohave a drink and they were doing
karaoke and he went up and hesang House of the Rising Sun.

(01:06:55):
Nobody knew who he was.
And he comes back to the barand someone says to him son,
Nobody knew who he was.
And he comes back to the barand someone says to him no,
you're pretty good, that wasn'ttoo bad.

Speaker 1 (01:07:02):
Oh my gosh, that really sounds like it.
Oh, that's so cool, Ted man.
That's amazing, Unbelievablestories and we cannot thank you
enough, for we would plead withyou to come back and join us on
another.

Speaker 2 (01:07:16):
Hold my Cutter.
We've only been through abouthalf the world?

Speaker 3 (01:07:20):
Yeah, barely touched the surface here, I have been
more fortunate than I everdreamed and it's important for
me to always keep that in mindBecause, I mean, the Associated
Press is an incredibleorganization.
It's got people everywhere.
We always joke, you know, whenyou work for the AP, no matter
what country you lose yourwallet in, you can get help.

(01:07:41):
That's incredible, that is.
I mean, there are people whorisk their lives every day.
There are people we have peoplein Gaza, we have people in
Ukraine, and I don't do thatkind of stuff anymore, but we
have people who do every day andthey are I mean, they're, they
continue to be my heroes, and I,every day.
My mother, when I, when Istarted with the Patriot News

(01:08:03):
and finished at Penn State, mymother said every day, for you
is going to be an education thatyou get paid for, and that
hasn't changed.
And I mean I'm, I am stillgratified every time I get to
write something, every time Iget to talk to someone who, by
all rights, has no reason totalk to me but is willing to and
you know we live in a polarizedtime so to be able to meet

(01:08:25):
people and make these littleconnections, that's what it's
all about.

Speaker 1 (01:08:29):
It really is Now.
You settled in Pittsburgh.

Speaker 3 (01:08:30):
Now, right, I mean I split the time between
Pittsburgh and New York, but Ilive in the house that I grew up
in.
We bought it and there are goodthings and bad things about
living in a multigenerationalhouse.
There's a lot of ballast ofhistory, both good and grief.
I mean, my parents left a lotbehind.
I'm still sorting through itafter 16 years.

(01:08:51):
But, yeah, pittsburgh is in myveins.
The only two towns I've everfelt truly at home in are
Pittsburgh and Beijing, and Ilove this place and I feel like
for years I was focused on NewYork and I didn't.
Now I'm on the board ofdirectors of Public Source,
which you may have heard of.
It's the local digital newsorganization, and I'm trying to

(01:09:14):
not just skate on the surfacebut dig in, so I really
appreciate your willingness tohave me here and to let me be a
little bit part of it.

Speaker 1 (01:09:22):
Our next project.
By the way, we talked aboutthis a couple years ago the
great minor league nicknamesright and the origins.

Speaker 3 (01:09:27):
Oh yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:09:28):
Remember that we talked about that.
That's a cool thought.
I would love to do that.

Speaker 3 (01:09:32):
I wrote about minor league baseball teams and how
they brand and stuff a few yearsback and we got to talking
about you know, because that'sanother thing.
It is so community specific andit is so you know you.
I love that you can tell thestory of a community, in many
cases through its minor leaguebaseball team and what you know.
What they do have their logo,their, their, their name.
It's.
It's like this, this communityhistory and postage stamp size

(01:09:54):
right yeah, what some of thebest stories are the minor
leagues johnstown I mean, yeah,I was.

Speaker 2 (01:10:00):
I dug in with johnstown this past year.
It was remarkable, like whatall that city's been through and
how baseball is literally atthe core of everything there.
It gave them hope and you knowit's just on a podcast the other
day it talked about 79 worldseries during that time.
Sports in general really pulledeverybody out of a deep
depression.
Could have been a greatdepression, but that's where

(01:10:21):
they went to have solitude, tohave, you know, a getaway of
some sort, because the the citywas losing everything.
The steel mills are closing andeverything else and I heard
that over and over in johnstown.
It was remarkable, but thepeople are really what?

Speaker 3 (01:10:34):
make it.
You're going to get sick of mesaying this, but you should
write about that folks, I'll bewriting.
Yeah, you will.
I'm not letting you off thehook on this Fair enough.

Speaker 1 (01:10:44):
I love that In the meantime we'll be listening and
watching.
Hold my Cutter.
Can't thank Ted Anthony enough.

Speaker 3 (01:10:50):
Thank you for the cigar.

Speaker 1 (01:10:52):
And I hope you enjoyed the coffee, good coffee,
here at Burn by Rocky SattelCoffee, coffee, coffee here at
Burien by Rocks Hotel.
Enjoy your coffee and yourstogie next time.
On Hold my Cutter.