June 11, 2024 • 21 mins
June 11, 2024
139. The True Cost of Superficial House Flipping with Scott Wachter
Buying a newly renovated home can be a thrilling experience, but the shiny surfaces and modern fixtures might be hiding a multitude of problems. In our latest podcast episode, we dive into this issue with Scott Wachter, a Toronto homeowner who faced unexpected challenges after purchasing what seemed like a dream home. Scott's story is a cautionary tale for all potential homebuyers, emphasizing the critical need for thorough inspections and due diligence. This episode explores the reality behind quick renovation flips, the hidden flaws they can conceal, and offers invaluable advice on avoiding the pitfalls of superficially upgraded homes.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Have you ever bought a house only to discover that
the quick renovations theprevious owner made were more
trouble than they were worth?
Today we dive into ScottWachter's story, a homeowner who
thought he was getting a dreamdeal, only to find himself in a
nightmare of shoddy fixes.
Scott's home purchase seemedperfect on the surface New
floors, sparkling toilets,freshly caulked bathrooms and
(00:23):
modern LED fixtures.
Floors, sparkling toilets,freshly caulked bathrooms and
modern LED fixtures.
But as the dust settled, so didthe reality.
These hasty renovations werenot very good quality.
We'll discuss the red flags towatch for, the common pitfalls
of quick renovations and how youcan ensure that your investment
holds real value.
Join us as Scott shares hisjourney through the trials and
tribulations of correcting thiscorner cutting and learn how to
(00:45):
avoid these costly mistakes.
This episode is packed withinsights that could save you a
fortune and a whole lot ofheadaches.
I'm George Siegel, and this isHomeowners Be Aware, the podcast
that teaches you everything youneed to know about being a
homeowner.
Scott, thank you so much forjoining me today.
Well, thank you.
(01:06):
Yeah, glad to have you on Now.
I had put out a shout outlooking for people that had
interesting home buyingexperiences, and yours is kind
of different.
I mean, I figured it could be aproblem, but I never really
thought about how that carriesover, because you like to think
the person putting your housetogether and getting it ready
knows what they're doing and hasreal value in what they're
(01:27):
putting in there.
So tell us your story.
What happened?
Speaker 2 (01:30):
So I'm in Toronto, which, if you're not familiar
with, is a very hot real estatemarket.
It's very competitive, there's alot going on, and I went from
so I am a first-time home buyerin toronto and I did it at a
time, uh, I did it literally inmarch 2020, like the, the doors
(01:53):
closed on everything and I'mlike, yeah, no, best time to do
this, best time to do this isnow, uh, and so there was a lot
of just chaos and confusion andwe maybe spent considerably less
than we would have becauseeveryone was confused.
But part of that problem wasthat this home I'm in right now
was an investment property thatowned by a real estate agent who
(02:18):
was also keeping his mom in itlike it was.
His mom was there just to keepit clean and tidy, but it was an
investment property, whichmeans he did a lot of house
flipping, nonsense, and I I'veinvented the character for the
general contractor, because allthe work was done by one general
contractor.
You can tell not no specialists, no plumbers, no electricians,
(02:40):
one j, one gc, and he's just aderanged man.
Speaker 1 (02:43):
I call until uncle walter, because, uh, the, the
number of things I've had to gothrough fixing yeah now, first
of all, did you have a homeinspection?
Speaker 2 (02:54):
yes, we did do a home inspection, like it is part of
a row of townhouses so it'spretty easy to establish what's
going on.
And we did spot, you know, webasically spotted some loose
shingles.
The problem is not anythingdeeply structural, it's just oh,
this is the cheapest thing,like that.
Literally one of my toiletsbroke and I get the plumber and
(03:16):
it's like oh yeah, this is thecheapest one you can get from
Costco.
They break all the time thispart.
I've got a replacement valvefor it, we'll swap it.
But if it breaks again, I'mtelling you to buy a new toilet.
It's not worth replacing twice,fixing twice.
Speaker 1 (03:31):
Yeah, especially is it a one story or two story, two
story.
The toilets being bad on thesecond floor can be a major
disaster.
Oh yeah, exactly, Exactly Now.
Did you talk to other people inthe complex?
Did you talk to some of theneighbors and see how theirs was
, or were there?
Everyone is designed bysomebody different.
This guy just replaced theinterior of yours maintain the
(04:05):
outside.
Speaker 2 (04:06):
The interior is up to everyone.
I've been in a couple ofpeople's other people's homes
completely different looking.
Since then, three differentunits have sold and I've
definitely snooped them, likesnooped the pictures to be like,
no, what unit?
One is the only one that'sshaped differently.
What do they get?
And it's just their livingroom's slightly bigger.
Speaker 1 (04:23):
You know, the integrity of the person doing
the job is really so important,because when somebody's flipping
it, it's like if I'm selling myhouse and you come in as the
buyer and you point out two orthree things that you say need
to be fixed, I'm not going to goget top shelf repairs.
I'm going to try to save asmuch money as possible.
So if a flipper is doing thatand all they're really concerned
(04:45):
about is their profit margin,that's not necessarily in your
best interest.
Speaker 2 (04:51):
Well, and I mean both my in-laws died fairly close
together, so I had to overseepreparing that house for sale.
And, yeah, I bought 40 gallonsof white paint and did all of
every room in that myself,except one part where I needed a
big ladder and I just paid aguy.
But I had to redo, like I hadto redo the bathroom, had to
(05:15):
redo it.
It was an ugly old pink seafoam, seashell, pink tile thing and
I'm like, just just grab one ofthose one pieces.
You know, you know the ones,you know the ones, and we all do
it.
In so many cases my frustrationis just the install.
We had vinyl floors, theslatted vinyl floors, and they
(05:36):
were glued to the outside edge.
Speaker 1 (05:39):
So when it gets cold the entire room is pulling away
to the edge found, because itsounds like once you find one
thing, it kind of reveals that,okay, there's no way they were
just cheap here, and then youstart finding a lot of other
(06:00):
stuff.
Speaker 2 (06:01):
Oh yeah, no, we've, we've, we've had to deal with
some of the plumbing for thesink.
Just connections betweendifferent pipes were very weird.
It's like okay, this is, thisis a gasket that I don't know
what.
Why is this fit with a gasket?
I need and I don't want to justtear out plumbing and replace
it found something, figured itout.
(06:21):
Uh, there was some issues with,uh, you know, the kitchen sink
fosket being loose and beinginstalled so weird you can't
even get up there with theproper tools.
It's, it's, it just keeps goingand it's like, again, none of
these would have broken the deal, none of these.
But if I'd, even, but if I'dhad the moment to just shine a
(06:42):
flashlight at some of the, atanything, I'd be like all right,
you got to.
You got to knock another fiveoff for me to fix this.
Speaker 1 (06:49):
Yeah, no, it's always easy to to fall in love when
you're walking through a placeand you're drawn to the area
Maybe the fact that it'sdifferent, that it's new, that
you're actually going to own it.
So how would you go in withbetter eyes on something like
that?
Do you think you could havespent more time there?
Do you think you could havemaybe brought in?
It sounds like your inspectorshould have caught a lot of this
(07:11):
stuff.
Speaker 2 (07:12):
I mean, I think part of it, part of it was just the
stress of the pandemic.
Everyone was like oh, what dowe do?
How long do we stay More timeworking the hand sanitizer than
checking some of the otherthings?
Like my current bone ofcontention and it's a thing I
got to fix is just in thebathroom.
There's one of these.
You know one piece, ledfixtures.
(07:35):
You know the throwaway ones.
This is going to burn out inthree more years if I'm lucky.
And I got to, and I got to.
I got to chunk an entirefixture and I'm like well,
that's dumb.
I would have demanded areplacement before I moved in.
Speaker 1 (07:48):
Have you done anything to hold the seller
accountable?
Did you do any reviews on hiswebsite?
Did you contact him and saywhat did you just buy the
cheapest crap you could find tostick in here?
Is there any kind of engagementthere?
Speaker 2 (07:59):
So because the guy's a realtor, I've just been
because the original owner was arealtor.
I've just been telling my realestate guy.
It's like, dude, this guy'sthis everything I've had to do.
It's like, yeah, you know, justmake Leslie, let's make sure
everyone knows this guy is, youknow, a pain in the butt and
will try to hose you and glueyour floors in place.
Speaker 1 (08:22):
Yeah, you know, we should let people know that are
listening.
It's not just flippers.
A lot of times it's builders.
I think a lot of builders countthe nickels so when their basic
stuff might be garbage and thenyou ask for better quality and
then you upgrade things aroundthe house.
But you have to be careful whatpart of the process you do that
(08:43):
so you don't get change orders.
You kind of have to do thatearly in the process.
But when you're getting a housefrom a flipper you really have
to know their reputation andwhat they do.
And it might even pay to bringin somebody that's a designer or
somebody that has someexperience in those areas that
can look at the floor and go, no, no, they didn't do this right.
Or look at this, this doesn'tline up right, these windows
(09:05):
aren't square, this isn't right.
Speaker 2 (09:07):
Why did they fill their front garden with rocks?
This is another one.
This is this is one I fixed.
Is that, for whatever reason,the mother got sick of gardening
out front, so she didn't.
So, rather than just let thatsection go to grass, just just
let that go to grass.
Now, an entire flower bed, youknow six by eight flower bed out
front.
(09:27):
Just dumped gravel, just gravel.
Spent a whole day pickingstones.
I'm still picking stones.
Speaker 1 (09:35):
Yeah, that's tough to .
It's tough to get rid of those.
I mean, they can be a goodasset if they're used right, but
if they're just using it tofill valuable bedding space,
that's kind of frustrating.
No, it was, it was.
I had a just gravel garden.
Now did you purchase a homewarranty of any type, or are you
just pretty much in this onyour own?
Pretty much on this on my own?
(09:56):
Yeah, and then what's your longterm projection of how long
you'll stay in this place?
Speaker 2 (10:01):
I, it's Toronto.
I can't afford anything elseever.
Speaker 1 (10:06):
So you're there for life.
Speaker 2 (10:07):
Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1 (10:08):
Well, that's maybe won't be a problem, but yeah,
that's annoying though, andwe're talking about it.
So there are certain things youhave to disclose when you sell
your house.
I talk about some of the issuesI've had with my house, and the
main problem we had is thesuperintendent for the builder.
It was his last job with thecompany.
So he clearly had checked out.
Oh yeah, and that's frustrating, and so I always tell buyers
(10:33):
you can't rush into somethingunless you're a major builder,
good at contracting yourself andcan go in and fix things.
You really need to spend sometime there and get as much
information as possible, becauseyou shouldn't reward somebody
playing hot potato and throwingit to you and then running yeah,
yeah, exactly.
So what would you have donedifferently?
Speaker 2 (10:55):
I think part of it was there were.
I think I could have definitelybeen harder on the plumbing
issues, like part of it was wehad a we.
This unit came with a garbagedisposal.
These aren't legal in Toronto.
You can't have one in there,really.
Yeah, it's um I.
It's basically too much of astrain on the water treatment
(11:18):
system and you get it.
You get london style fatbergsotherwise.
So they just ban garbagedisposals.
You got to go through thecompost system is what it is so
municipal, municipal compostpickup is part of the deal.
Is the ups, is the upshot sowhat happens there, though?
Speaker 1 (11:36):
I mean, is that something that they it's, if
it's illegal when you go to sellthe house?
Is that something you're goingto have to get rid of?
Speaker 2 (11:43):
well, part of the negotiation was is you can't
sell me this house until youwere till you pull it out.
And he said, no, no, no, I will, we'll knock another.
Whatever we'll, we'll knockanother five thousand off the
thing, and I'm like to, and youcan pay a guy to fix it.
And I think as part of that, Ineeded to just be able to go
down the entire side of theplumbing for the kitchen sink
(12:04):
and say, actually, whole newkitchen sink, you're giving me a
whole new kitchen sink for this.
Not just, not just getting ridof this, uh, this contraband, uh
house home appliance.
Have you gotten rid of thiscontraband home appliance?
Have you gotten rid of it?
Oh yeah, no, I got rid of itright away.
I used it once just to hear thesound.
I used it to destroy some tealeaves.
I shouldn't say that Bylawofficer's going to chase me.
Speaker 1 (12:28):
They might, especially in Canada.
I had a guest on recently whowas telling me that if somebody
is a real contractor or doinglegitimate work at your house,
they're not going and buying theparts.
I think it was a plumber thattold me this.
They're not buying the parts atHome Depot or Lowe's, they're
going to a plumbing supply store.
They're going up a notchbecause that's really the I
(12:49):
guess we could say lower end forthe consumer, but a real
contractor is not buying theirstuff there.
Speaker 2 (12:55):
Yeah, that's right.
That's usually the case.
My day job is involved increating podcasts for a group of
lighting distributors.
We don't deal with Home Depot.
You deal with your local guy.
You buy your cans and tubesfrom a regional member of Nailed
right.
Speaker 1 (13:13):
So at least you should easily be able to get rid
of that light fixture in thebathroom.
Speaker 2 (13:17):
Oh yeah, no, I well, he also my, my, my, because the
whole this situation isdistributed across North America
.
My home base, where I go to dowork most, sometimes some days a
week, also takes in e-waste.
So sometimes I just walk inthere and I've dropped 50 AA
batteries in the bin.
For them, it's great.
Speaker 1 (13:38):
It's like hey, I killed two hard drives.
Speaker 2 (13:40):
Here you go.
Speaker 1 (13:41):
Nice, nice, do you have any idea if there's
anything going on behind thewalls?
Okay, you, the obvious stuffyou can see.
Right, they didn't do.
They didn't have the A team inthere doing this work.
So what about wiring?
What about pipes connectedbehind walls?
What about the stuff that couldreally cost you a lot of money?
Speaker 2 (13:57):
So part of it was again.
Part of the deal was this hadan old-fashioned fuse box,
actual fuse box for the mainelectrical panel, and I'm like,
all right, well, I'm going toget a guy in to switch that to
proper breakers.
And he did a full breakdown andtested everything while he was
in there.
Speaker 1 (14:15):
Okay, that's good because that's important.
You know, a lot of times ifthey're shortchanging you there,
you know that can lead to fires, that can lead to all kinds of
problems and I guess now youhave to just be a little
concerned.
You know one of the things thatwe learned if they don't put
the seal on the toilet rightupstairs, they leak.
They do, and yeah, so anybodywith an upstairs bathroom.
(14:38):
It's worth having a plumbercome and check that.
Speaker 2 (14:41):
If you're wondering, because the surprise of having
it happen is not good yeah,exactly, and you know I
unrelated, I had an issue withmy, uh, my washing machine, not
related to this flipper, but itwas like, yeah, no, a solenoid
in the valves blew and I wasleaking water into my garage.
(15:02):
I just had this during thewinter.
So I had just this sheet, thisstalactite of water just
constantly, just frozen water onone side of my garage and I
didn't you know, I don't, I parkoutside, I only go, I'm only in
there, I'm only in there todeal with garbage, really during
the winter, and I'm not.
And so one day, it's like oneday, it's fine, open the garage.
(15:26):
Two days later, that's a lot ofwater.
I don't think I can close mygarage because the ice is
pushing the railing, you couldhave turned it into a skating
rink possibly for some of theneighborhood kids.
Oh yeah, for sure, yeah, but youknow the risk.
Speaker 1 (15:41):
There, too, a lot of laundry rooms.
You know they really shouldhave some type of drain in the
floor, and that's another thingto look for.
Speaker 2 (15:49):
That's mandated in Canada actually Floor drainage.
Anywhere where you're doinglaundry has to have a floor
drain so the drain wasn'tworking no, so this is, this is
the dishwasher.
This is the dishwasher oh, thedishwasher they said the washing
machine, sorry, yeah sorry, Imight have said washing machine,
the dishwasher three and thevalve blew out, electrical.
(16:09):
You know the actual mag, theactual electrical and one valve
blew out.
So it's just constantly lettingwater in.
Speaker 1 (16:17):
Do you sit?
Speaker 2 (16:18):
there and wonder what's next.
Oh, I have my suspicions.
I have my suspicions.
I'm hoping it's somethingreally trivial, like I've got,
um, I've got an awning for mybackyard that is automatic, like
it's on motor, it's motorized.
Those were apparently installed, not part of the original build
, but like five years later,apparently, one of one of the
(16:38):
originals.
One of the people to first movein was like yeah, took us like
five years of arguing about whatcolor they should be, because
they all had to match.
Of course, because we're in atownhouse complex, I don't think
I can paint my garage door anycolor, but that specific shade
of brown, pretty sure, but likea five-year fight and everyone's
like and he, uh, denny the guy,he, he lived, he, he'd been
(17:02):
living here 50 years.
And he's like oh wait, yoursstill works, yours might be the
last one that does that and ifit breaks I will probably take
it down and I will not beallowed to add a new one,
because it would be a differentcolor, even though no one else
has one anymore.
Speaker 1 (17:22):
So there are HOA rules in the place.
Do you have to pay homeownersassociation dues every month?
I do have to pay dues.
Speaker 2 (17:29):
It's the rules aren't too bad, 're not I?
I know I.
It's not america bad.
I hear the horror stories fromamerica.
It's literally, uh, like therules are basically um, don't
paint your doors weird colors.
Uh, don't have seven dogs Ithink it's some number of pets
and I think, oh, I got introuble for having a sign out
(17:52):
during the election.
Nice, no political signs.
Speaker 1 (17:58):
Well, you know, a lot of the problem is not having
adequate reserves in casethere's a problem.
And when in my last documentaryfilm we interviewed a woman in
Panama City who lived in aduplex and both took a lot of
damage but the person who sharedthe other side, the other owner
, chose to sell out for pennieson the dollar and they weren't
going to rebuild it, so herinsurance company wouldn't let
(18:21):
her rebuild her side.
But there's a lot of rules in atownhouse complex or any kind
of HOA ruled society where ahomeowner really has to know
what's going on.
Speaker 2 (18:33):
Yeah, no, I do attend the meetings.
I am annoying about thembecause I'm a crazy person, I'm
a godless hippie and they're allold and hate me.
But it's very important for meto explain that, to show up and
say, ok, it's great that we havethis much in reserve and that
you're actually spending moneywhenever the shingles flap loose
.
But I'm like but have weconsidered rewilding all the
(18:59):
back grass?
You don't want people walkingback there anyway.
Let's just have ankle high, youknow, mid-calf high wildflowers
anyway discourages people fromwalking and we'll save half on
our, on our lawn care guys.
And they're like no, you'recrazy, you're a hippie, it's
wrong, it would look so untidy.
And I'm like no, we just have afield of blue flowers, you
dorks.
Speaker 1 (19:18):
You know that's tough when you live in it.
There's good and bad things inan HOA.
You know, in my neighborhoodthere is no HOA, so people can
leave their garbage out all week.
You know, when there's no rulesit can be just as bad as when
there are rules.
So it's really just a matter ofwhat you can live with.
Speaker 2 (19:34):
Oh yeah, I get that.
I get that and I'm relativelylucky that I'm not.
Again, I hear the horrorstories from America where it's
like, oh, you didn't have yourrecycling bins in within two
hours.
What are you talking about?
What do you mean?
You work as a surgeon.
Speaker 1 (19:50):
Yeah, the people that are on those boards are usually
.
Some of them can be wound alittle tight.
So what would be your finalpiece of advice?
Let's give some advice toanybody buying a house.
We'll use this as our, as ourtopic is a flipper did a house
and they're selling it to you.
What's your piece of advice foranybody that's going to
potentially buy that?
Speaker 2 (20:11):
Oh, don't be afraid to be mean, do not be afraid to
be really mean about all thethings that seem petty.
That seem petty Like when Isold the complaints I got from
the buyer felt petty and I'mlike, no, okay, now I get it.
Now I understand.
I mean my house wasn't muchbetter shape when I sold it than
this thing.
But be mean, don't be afraid tobe mean and bring your own
(20:36):
magnifying glass.
Speaker 1 (20:39):
Exactly, don't.
If they don't like yourquestions and they don't want to
answer, maybe that's not theright house for you.
Yeah, yeah, it's tough, it'stough.
Well, hey, I'm sorry for whatyou're going through, but you
know, good luck.
I hope it's almost done.
Speaker 2 (20:53):
It's almost done, my heart.
We did hardwood through thewhole house Real hardwood, not
engineered stuff.
A lot of buy it for life sortof improvements.
Speaker 1 (21:02):
Well, since you're going to be there for life,
that's probably wise.
Yeah, yeah, exactly All right,hey Scott, thanks so much for
coming on today.
Well, thank you.
All of Scott's contact info isin the show notes.
I know a lot of you listeninghave experienced all kinds of
things as either a homeowner ora renter.
There's a contact form in theshow notes.
Fill it out and send it my wayand you could be a guest to
(21:24):
share your story on an upcomingpodcast.
Thanks for taking the time tolisten today.
I'll see you next time.
Have you ever bought a house only to discover that
the quick renovations theprevious owner made were more
trouble than they were worth?
Today we dive into ScottWachter's story, a homeowner who
thought he was getting a dreamdeal, only to find himself in a
nightmare of shoddy fixes.
Scott's home purchase seemedperfect on the surface New
floors, sparkling toilets,freshly caulked bathrooms and
(00:23):
modern LED fixtures.
Floors, sparkling toilets,freshly caulked bathrooms and
modern LED fixtures.
But as the dust settled, so didthe reality.
These hasty renovations werenot very good quality.
We'll discuss the red flags towatch for, the common pitfalls
of quick renovations and how youcan ensure that your investment
holds real value.
Join us as Scott shares hisjourney through the trials and
tribulations of correcting thiscorner cutting and learn how to
(00:45):
avoid these costly mistakes.
This episode is packed withinsights that could save you a
fortune and a whole lot ofheadaches.
I'm George Siegel, and this isHomeowners Be Aware, the podcast
that teaches you everything youneed to know about being a
homeowner.
Scott, thank you so much forjoining me today.
Well, thank you.
(01:06):
Yeah, glad to have you on Now.
I had put out a shout outlooking for people that had
interesting home buyingexperiences, and yours is kind
of different.
I mean, I figured it could be aproblem, but I never really
thought about how that carriesover, because you like to think
the person putting your housetogether and getting it ready
knows what they're doing and hasreal value in what they're
(01:27):
putting in there.
So tell us your story.
What happened?
Speaker 2 (01:30):
So I'm in Toronto, which, if you're not familiar
with, is a very hot real estatemarket.
It's very competitive, there's alot going on, and I went from
so I am a first-time home buyerin toronto and I did it at a
time, uh, I did it literally inmarch 2020, like the, the doors
(01:53):
closed on everything and I'mlike, yeah, no, best time to do
this, best time to do this isnow, uh, and so there was a lot
of just chaos and confusion andwe maybe spent considerably less
than we would have becauseeveryone was confused.
But part of that problem wasthat this home I'm in right now
was an investment property thatowned by a real estate agent who
(02:18):
was also keeping his mom in itlike it was.
His mom was there just to keepit clean and tidy, but it was an
investment property, whichmeans he did a lot of house
flipping, nonsense, and I I'veinvented the character for the
general contractor, because allthe work was done by one general
contractor.
You can tell not no specialists, no plumbers, no electricians,
(02:40):
one j, one gc, and he's just aderanged man.
Speaker 1 (02:43):
I call until uncle walter, because, uh, the, the
number of things I've had to gothrough fixing yeah now, first
of all, did you have a homeinspection?
Speaker 2 (02:54):
yes, we did do a home inspection, like it is part of
a row of townhouses so it'spretty easy to establish what's
going on.
And we did spot, you know, webasically spotted some loose
shingles.
The problem is not anythingdeeply structural, it's just oh,
this is the cheapest thing,like that.
Literally one of my toiletsbroke and I get the plumber and
(03:16):
it's like oh yeah, this is thecheapest one you can get from
Costco.
They break all the time thispart.
I've got a replacement valvefor it, we'll swap it.
But if it breaks again, I'mtelling you to buy a new toilet.
It's not worth replacing twice,fixing twice.
Speaker 1 (03:31):
Yeah, especially is it a one story or two story, two
story.
The toilets being bad on thesecond floor can be a major
disaster.
Oh yeah, exactly, Exactly Now.
Did you talk to other people inthe complex?
Did you talk to some of theneighbors and see how theirs was
, or were there?
Everyone is designed bysomebody different.
This guy just replaced theinterior of yours maintain the
(04:05):
outside.
Speaker 2 (04:06):
The interior is up to everyone.
I've been in a couple ofpeople's other people's homes
completely different looking.
Since then, three differentunits have sold and I've
definitely snooped them, likesnooped the pictures to be like,
no, what unit?
One is the only one that'sshaped differently.
What do they get?
And it's just their livingroom's slightly bigger.
Speaker 1 (04:23):
You know, the integrity of the person doing
the job is really so important,because when somebody's flipping
it, it's like if I'm selling myhouse and you come in as the
buyer and you point out two orthree things that you say need
to be fixed, I'm not going to goget top shelf repairs.
I'm going to try to save asmuch money as possible.
So if a flipper is doing thatand all they're really concerned
(04:45):
about is their profit margin,that's not necessarily in your
best interest.
Speaker 2 (04:51):
Well, and I mean both my in-laws died fairly close
together, so I had to overseepreparing that house for sale.
And, yeah, I bought 40 gallonsof white paint and did all of
every room in that myself,except one part where I needed a
big ladder and I just paid aguy.
But I had to redo, like I hadto redo the bathroom, had to
(05:15):
redo it.
It was an ugly old pink seafoam, seashell, pink tile thing and
I'm like, just just grab one ofthose one pieces.
You know, you know the ones,you know the ones, and we all do
it.
In so many cases my frustrationis just the install.
We had vinyl floors, theslatted vinyl floors, and they
(05:36):
were glued to the outside edge.
Speaker 1 (05:39):
So when it gets cold the entire room is pulling away
to the edge found, because itsounds like once you find one
thing, it kind of reveals that,okay, there's no way they were
just cheap here, and then youstart finding a lot of other
(06:00):
stuff.
Speaker 2 (06:01):
Oh yeah, no, we've, we've, we've had to deal with
some of the plumbing for thesink.
Just connections betweendifferent pipes were very weird.
It's like okay, this is, thisis a gasket that I don't know
what.
Why is this fit with a gasket?
I need and I don't want to justtear out plumbing and replace
it found something, figured itout.
(06:21):
Uh, there was some issues with,uh, you know, the kitchen sink
fosket being loose and beinginstalled so weird you can't
even get up there with theproper tools.
It's, it's, it just keeps goingand it's like, again, none of
these would have broken the deal, none of these.
But if I'd, even, but if I'dhad the moment to just shine a
(06:42):
flashlight at some of the, atanything, I'd be like all right,
you got to.
You got to knock another fiveoff for me to fix this.
Speaker 1 (06:49):
Yeah, no, it's always easy to to fall in love when
you're walking through a placeand you're drawn to the area
Maybe the fact that it'sdifferent, that it's new, that
you're actually going to own it.
So how would you go in withbetter eyes on something like
that?
Do you think you could havespent more time there?
Do you think you could havemaybe brought in?
It sounds like your inspectorshould have caught a lot of this
(07:11):
stuff.
Speaker 2 (07:12):
I mean, I think part of it, part of it was just the
stress of the pandemic.
Everyone was like oh, what dowe do?
How long do we stay More timeworking the hand sanitizer than
checking some of the otherthings?
Like my current bone ofcontention and it's a thing I
got to fix is just in thebathroom.
There's one of these.
You know one piece, ledfixtures.
(07:35):
You know the throwaway ones.
This is going to burn out inthree more years if I'm lucky.
And I got to, and I got to.
I got to chunk an entirefixture and I'm like well,
that's dumb.
I would have demanded areplacement before I moved in.
Speaker 1 (07:48):
Have you done anything to hold the seller
accountable?
Did you do any reviews on hiswebsite?
Did you contact him and saywhat did you just buy the
cheapest crap you could find tostick in here?
Is there any kind of engagementthere?
Speaker 2 (07:59):
So because the guy's a realtor, I've just been
because the original owner was arealtor.
I've just been telling my realestate guy.
It's like, dude, this guy'sthis everything I've had to do.
It's like, yeah, you know, justmake Leslie, let's make sure
everyone knows this guy is, youknow, a pain in the butt and
will try to hose you and glueyour floors in place.
Speaker 1 (08:22):
Yeah, you know, we should let people know that are
listening.
It's not just flippers.
A lot of times it's builders.
I think a lot of builders countthe nickels so when their basic
stuff might be garbage and thenyou ask for better quality and
then you upgrade things aroundthe house.
But you have to be careful whatpart of the process you do that
(08:43):
so you don't get change orders.
You kind of have to do thatearly in the process.
But when you're getting a housefrom a flipper you really have
to know their reputation andwhat they do.
And it might even pay to bringin somebody that's a designer or
somebody that has someexperience in those areas that
can look at the floor and go, no, no, they didn't do this right.
Or look at this, this doesn'tline up right, these windows
(09:05):
aren't square, this isn't right.
Speaker 2 (09:07):
Why did they fill their front garden with rocks?
This is another one.
This is this is one I fixed.
Is that, for whatever reason,the mother got sick of gardening
out front, so she didn't.
So, rather than just let thatsection go to grass, just just
let that go to grass.
Now, an entire flower bed, youknow six by eight flower bed out
front.
(09:27):
Just dumped gravel, just gravel.
Spent a whole day pickingstones.
I'm still picking stones.
Speaker 1 (09:35):
Yeah, that's tough to .
It's tough to get rid of those.
I mean, they can be a goodasset if they're used right, but
if they're just using it tofill valuable bedding space,
that's kind of frustrating.
No, it was, it was.
I had a just gravel garden.
Now did you purchase a homewarranty of any type, or are you
just pretty much in this onyour own?
Pretty much on this on my own?
(09:56):
Yeah, and then what's your longterm projection of how long
you'll stay in this place?
Speaker 2 (10:01):
I, it's Toronto.
I can't afford anything elseever.
Speaker 1 (10:06):
So you're there for life.
Speaker 2 (10:07):
Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1 (10:08):
Well, that's maybe won't be a problem, but yeah,
that's annoying though, andwe're talking about it.
So there are certain things youhave to disclose when you sell
your house.
I talk about some of the issuesI've had with my house, and the
main problem we had is thesuperintendent for the builder.
It was his last job with thecompany.
So he clearly had checked out.
Oh yeah, and that's frustrating, and so I always tell buyers
(10:33):
you can't rush into somethingunless you're a major builder,
good at contracting yourself andcan go in and fix things.
You really need to spend sometime there and get as much
information as possible, becauseyou shouldn't reward somebody
playing hot potato and throwingit to you and then running yeah,
yeah, exactly.
So what would you have donedifferently?
Speaker 2 (10:55):
I think part of it was there were.
I think I could have definitelybeen harder on the plumbing
issues, like part of it was wehad a we.
This unit came with a garbagedisposal.
These aren't legal in Toronto.
You can't have one in there,really.
Yeah, it's um I.
It's basically too much of astrain on the water treatment
(11:18):
system and you get it.
You get london style fatbergsotherwise.
So they just ban garbagedisposals.
You got to go through thecompost system is what it is so
municipal, municipal compostpickup is part of the deal.
Is the ups, is the upshot sowhat happens there, though?
Speaker 1 (11:36):
I mean, is that something that they it's, if
it's illegal when you go to sellthe house?
Is that something you're goingto have to get rid of?
Speaker 2 (11:43):
well, part of the negotiation was is you can't
sell me this house until youwere till you pull it out.
And he said, no, no, no, I will, we'll knock another.
Whatever we'll, we'll knockanother five thousand off the
thing, and I'm like to, and youcan pay a guy to fix it.
And I think as part of that, Ineeded to just be able to go
down the entire side of theplumbing for the kitchen sink
(12:04):
and say, actually, whole newkitchen sink, you're giving me a
whole new kitchen sink for this.
Not just, not just getting ridof this, uh, this contraband, uh
house home appliance.
Have you gotten rid of thiscontraband home appliance?
Have you gotten rid of it?
Oh yeah, no, I got rid of itright away.
I used it once just to hear thesound.
I used it to destroy some tealeaves.
I shouldn't say that Bylawofficer's going to chase me.
Speaker 1 (12:28):
They might, especially in Canada.
I had a guest on recently whowas telling me that if somebody
is a real contractor or doinglegitimate work at your house,
they're not going and buying theparts.
I think it was a plumber thattold me this.
They're not buying the parts atHome Depot or Lowe's, they're
going to a plumbing supply store.
They're going up a notchbecause that's really the I
(12:49):
guess we could say lower end forthe consumer, but a real
contractor is not buying theirstuff there.
Speaker 2 (12:55):
Yeah, that's right.
That's usually the case.
My day job is involved increating podcasts for a group of
lighting distributors.
We don't deal with Home Depot.
You deal with your local guy.
You buy your cans and tubesfrom a regional member of Nailed
right.
Speaker 1 (13:13):
So at least you should easily be able to get rid
of that light fixture in thebathroom.
Speaker 2 (13:17):
Oh yeah, no, I well, he also my, my, my, because the
whole this situation isdistributed across North America
.
My home base, where I go to dowork most, sometimes some days a
week, also takes in e-waste.
So sometimes I just walk inthere and I've dropped 50 AA
batteries in the bin.
For them, it's great.
Speaker 1 (13:38):
It's like hey, I killed two hard drives.
Speaker 2 (13:40):
Here you go.
Speaker 1 (13:41):
Nice, nice, do you have any idea if there's
anything going on behind thewalls?
Okay, you, the obvious stuffyou can see.
Right, they didn't do.
They didn't have the A team inthere doing this work.
So what about wiring?
What about pipes connectedbehind walls?
What about the stuff that couldreally cost you a lot of money?
Speaker 2 (13:57):
So part of it was again.
Part of the deal was this hadan old-fashioned fuse box,
actual fuse box for the mainelectrical panel, and I'm like,
all right, well, I'm going toget a guy in to switch that to
proper breakers.
And he did a full breakdown andtested everything while he was
in there.
Speaker 1 (14:15):
Okay, that's good because that's important.
You know, a lot of times ifthey're shortchanging you there,
you know that can lead to fires, that can lead to all kinds of
problems and I guess now youhave to just be a little
concerned.
You know one of the things thatwe learned if they don't put
the seal on the toilet rightupstairs, they leak.
They do, and yeah, so anybodywith an upstairs bathroom.
(14:38):
It's worth having a plumbercome and check that.
Speaker 2 (14:41):
If you're wondering, because the surprise of having
it happen is not good yeah,exactly, and you know I
unrelated, I had an issue withmy, uh, my washing machine, not
related to this flipper, but itwas like, yeah, no, a solenoid
in the valves blew and I wasleaking water into my garage.
(15:02):
I just had this during thewinter.
So I had just this sheet, thisstalactite of water just
constantly, just frozen water onone side of my garage and I
didn't you know, I don't, I parkoutside, I only go, I'm only in
there, I'm only in there todeal with garbage, really during
the winter, and I'm not.
And so one day, it's like oneday, it's fine, open the garage.
(15:26):
Two days later, that's a lot ofwater.
I don't think I can close mygarage because the ice is
pushing the railing, you couldhave turned it into a skating
rink possibly for some of theneighborhood kids.
Oh yeah, for sure, yeah, but youknow the risk.
Speaker 1 (15:41):
There, too, a lot of laundry rooms.
You know they really shouldhave some type of drain in the
floor, and that's another thingto look for.
Speaker 2 (15:49):
That's mandated in Canada actually Floor drainage.
Anywhere where you're doinglaundry has to have a floor
drain so the drain wasn'tworking no, so this is, this is
the dishwasher.
This is the dishwasher oh, thedishwasher they said the washing
machine, sorry, yeah sorry, Imight have said washing machine,
the dishwasher three and thevalve blew out, electrical.
(16:09):
You know the actual mag, theactual electrical and one valve
blew out.
So it's just constantly lettingwater in.
Speaker 1 (16:17):
Do you sit?
Speaker 2 (16:18):
there and wonder what's next.
Oh, I have my suspicions.
I have my suspicions.
I'm hoping it's somethingreally trivial, like I've got,
um, I've got an awning for mybackyard that is automatic, like
it's on motor, it's motorized.
Those were apparently installed, not part of the original build
, but like five years later,apparently, one of one of the
(16:38):
originals.
One of the people to first movein was like yeah, took us like
five years of arguing about whatcolor they should be, because
they all had to match.
Of course, because we're in atownhouse complex, I don't think
I can paint my garage door anycolor, but that specific shade
of brown, pretty sure, but likea five-year fight and everyone's
like and he, uh, denny the guy,he, he lived, he, he'd been
(17:02):
living here 50 years.
And he's like oh wait, yoursstill works, yours might be the
last one that does that and ifit breaks I will probably take
it down and I will not beallowed to add a new one,
because it would be a differentcolor, even though no one else
has one anymore.
Speaker 1 (17:22):
So there are HOA rules in the place.
Do you have to pay homeownersassociation dues every month?
I do have to pay dues.
Speaker 2 (17:29):
It's the rules aren't too bad, 're not I?
I know I.
It's not america bad.
I hear the horror stories fromamerica.
It's literally, uh, like therules are basically um, don't
paint your doors weird colors.
Uh, don't have seven dogs Ithink it's some number of pets
and I think, oh, I got introuble for having a sign out
(17:52):
during the election.
Nice, no political signs.
Speaker 1 (17:58):
Well, you know, a lot of the problem is not having
adequate reserves in casethere's a problem.
And when in my last documentaryfilm we interviewed a woman in
Panama City who lived in aduplex and both took a lot of
damage but the person who sharedthe other side, the other owner
, chose to sell out for pennieson the dollar and they weren't
going to rebuild it, so herinsurance company wouldn't let
(18:21):
her rebuild her side.
But there's a lot of rules in atownhouse complex or any kind
of HOA ruled society where ahomeowner really has to know
what's going on.
Speaker 2 (18:33):
Yeah, no, I do attend the meetings.
I am annoying about thembecause I'm a crazy person, I'm
a godless hippie and they're allold and hate me.
But it's very important for meto explain that, to show up and
say, ok, it's great that we havethis much in reserve and that
you're actually spending moneywhenever the shingles flap loose
.
But I'm like but have weconsidered rewilding all the
(18:59):
back grass?
You don't want people walkingback there anyway.
Let's just have ankle high, youknow, mid-calf high wildflowers
anyway discourages people fromwalking and we'll save half on
our, on our lawn care guys.
And they're like no, you'recrazy, you're a hippie, it's
wrong, it would look so untidy.
And I'm like no, we just have afield of blue flowers, you
dorks.
Speaker 1 (19:18):
You know that's tough when you live in it.
There's good and bad things inan HOA.
You know, in my neighborhoodthere is no HOA, so people can
leave their garbage out all week.
You know, when there's no rulesit can be just as bad as when
there are rules.
So it's really just a matter ofwhat you can live with.
Speaker 2 (19:34):
Oh yeah, I get that.
I get that and I'm relativelylucky that I'm not.
Again, I hear the horrorstories from America where it's
like, oh, you didn't have yourrecycling bins in within two
hours.
What are you talking about?
What do you mean?
You work as a surgeon.
Speaker 1 (19:50):
Yeah, the people that are on those boards are usually
.
Some of them can be wound alittle tight.
So what would be your finalpiece of advice?
Let's give some advice toanybody buying a house.
We'll use this as our, as ourtopic is a flipper did a house
and they're selling it to you.
What's your piece of advice foranybody that's going to
potentially buy that?
Speaker 2 (20:11):
Oh, don't be afraid to be mean, do not be afraid to
be really mean about all thethings that seem petty.
That seem petty Like when Isold the complaints I got from
the buyer felt petty and I'mlike, no, okay, now I get it.
Now I understand.
I mean my house wasn't muchbetter shape when I sold it than
this thing.
But be mean, don't be afraid tobe mean and bring your own
(20:36):
magnifying glass.
Speaker 1 (20:39):
Exactly, don't.
If they don't like yourquestions and they don't want to
answer, maybe that's not theright house for you.
Yeah, yeah, it's tough, it'stough.
Well, hey, I'm sorry for whatyou're going through, but you
know, good luck.
I hope it's almost done.
Speaker 2 (20:53):
It's almost done, my heart.
We did hardwood through thewhole house Real hardwood, not
engineered stuff.
A lot of buy it for life sortof improvements.
Speaker 1 (21:02):
Well, since you're going to be there for life,
that's probably wise.
Yeah, yeah, exactly All right,hey Scott, thanks so much for
coming on today.
Well, thank you.
All of Scott's contact info isin the show notes.
I know a lot of you listeninghave experienced all kinds of
things as either a homeowner ora renter.
There's a contact form in theshow notes.
Fill it out and send it my wayand you could be a guest to
(21:24):
share your story on an upcomingpodcast.
Thanks for taking the time tolisten today.
I'll see you next time.
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