Beyond Ego Forgiveness | Wisdom Dialogues, Sedona | September 15, 2025 - Hope Johnson's Wisdom Dialogues

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
live Yay Aloha and welcome to Wisdom Dialogues with
Hope Johnson, coming to youfrom Sedona.
Arizona Woo.

(00:23):
Yay, it's so fun to be here ohmy gosh, it's always so fun to
be with you guys.
I've been having definitelyhaving some realizations,
insights.
It seems like the realization,like the, the, like, the
resonance of the of therealization, like I, I can sense

(00:46):
it.
I can sense what it is anddon't know really how to
articulate it, even to myself.
So I'll have moments where I'mlike, okay, I'm not really sure,

(01:06):
do I really even know that thisis a valid insight or am I just
cruising around?
But you know, what I've learnedis I can tell when there's some
kind of dissonance, and I maynot know exactly how to put my

(01:29):
finger on it at the time, likehow to, how to explain it, how
to articulate what it is, um,but I could sense it and I'll
just stay with it.
I'll stay on it, I'll stay withit, I'll keep looking at it,
okay.
So, for instance, when I firstgot here, I started to notice

(01:49):
something that was going on inthe energy field, like of people
who want to wake up reallybadly right, so much that
they're going I'm almost there,I'm almost there, we're almost
there, almost there, I'm almostthere, we're almost there.

(02:10):
The Galactic Council is sayingthat we're almost there.
Pretty soon, some shit's goingto go down and we're going to be
there.
Right, so yeah, so I ended uphaving a a conversation with
Thomas and it got really deepfor me.
I sent it.

(02:31):
It got really deep for him.
We've been really close so wecan sense each other really well
, so, anyways.
So I noticed that people aresaying like they forgive

(02:57):
themselves for making illusions.
True, Like, for instance, I'lljust give you, for instance, I
forgive myself for trying toplay small, or I forgive myself
for thinking I was a bad person,thinking I was apart from God,

(03:26):
let's say.
So.
There's this repeating and, ohmy gosh, it just shot me back to
where I was doing an ACIMmeeting on I believe it was July
25th, and Jesus was talkingabout circular miracles and
miracles that collapse time.

(03:46):
Right, so there's a circular.
Of course, you're always Jesusis always happy about every
miracle that you do.
So when you say something likeit's not so much the words, it's
not really the words at all.
There's a sense, there's acoherence underneath it that

(04:07):
decides whether it's a miraclethat collapses time or a
circular miracle in the wayJesus was talking about it.
This was in chapter 2, sectionX, 10 in Roman numeral.
In Roman numeral and paragraphsnine to 11, when we did that
deep dive July 25th.

(04:34):
If you want to look up thevideo, it was super impactful
about how some miracles collapsetime and mostly the miracles
that they were doing.
He was talking to Helen and Billat the time and he was saying
you guys do not guard your mindas much as I would like you to
Right.
That's why you're alwaysmiscreating, Because you're not

(04:54):
guarding your mind.
So a true miracle coming fromtrue forgiveness would actually
say that you don't have thepower to miscreate.
You actually can't miscreateand that's what he's saying.
As long as you believe that youhave that kind of power and

(05:16):
it's real, you're in circularmiracles.
As long as you believe that youcan miscreate, you make
illusions of miscreation.
See why I'm kind of like this.

(05:36):
It's like yeah.

Speaker 3 (05:47):
Are you drunk in the circle?

Speaker 1 (05:52):
it's just, it's amazing to me because it's like
I forgot about that whole acimdeep dive.
I forgot the wording, I forgoteverything like that.
Then an example of this came upand I didn't really recognize
that that's what it was relatingto until today, and so I was

(06:12):
kind of like whoa, wait a second, cause I forgot about that
lesson.
But then I see how it justcomes back and goes oh, this is
here's an example of what'sgoing on here.
You know, and when you get aload of people and and you know,
it's like, like for me, I'veseen for myself, uh, that, what,

(06:32):
what forgiveness really is.
And you know Jesus talks aboutin A Course in Miracles, uh,
about how you have to learnforgiveness from the one who
knows how to forgive right.
See, we initially think we're aseparate self that needs
forgiveness, right, and ofcourse in miracles even start

(06:56):
speaking to that self.
In some of the earlier chapters,I think, or in some of the
earlier lessons, I think it, orin some of the earlier lessons,
I think, it starts, it stopsaround lesson 200, you know.
So that's a circular miraclewhere you can get this.
Uh, I forgive myself formiscreating.
Basically, is what's happeningthere?

(07:19):
I forgive myself formiscreating.
Now, that's a circular miracle.
It's not a bad miracle, it'snot a good and bad thing.
It's Jesus is saying he wantsyou to have that relief while
you need that relief.
It's just that starting andthis is in chapter two of the
text, so he's starting early onthis to get this message across

(07:41):
that ultimately, what you wantis miracles that collapse time,
and the miracle that collapses,collapses time, sees that you
are not capable of miscreationin the first place.
Right, so you go from, uh, fromforgiveness, uh, kind of like

(08:02):
as a forgiveness to destroy way,even when you first start out.
Not that even this is right orwrong, not that this is even
right or wrong.
Forgiveness to destroy, that'sthe ego's way of forgiveness and
that's how you know forgiveness, until you learn forgiveness
from the one who knows how toforgive and you can say that's

(08:25):
the Holy Spirit.
How does the Holy Spirit lookon everything?
Look at how the Holy Spiritforgives.
The Holy Spirit accepts thatit's an illusion and accepts
what the truth is.
The Holy Spirit just accepts,wipes everything away, see.
Wipes everything away, see.

(08:50):
So there's a point in thelearning and I get the sense
that a lot of people you know,maybe you guys online, maybe
people around here in Sedona whoare in ACIM groups and stuff
like that, are ready, certainlyhave studied enough, certainly
have practiced enough of thekind of forgiveness that's
circular, that keeps the littleeye intact, who's capable of

(09:10):
miscreation?
It just makes me laugh, you know, and that's the whole thing.
The whole thing is we forgot tolaugh.
So it's like you can laugh atit.
It's like, wow, this is just sofunny.
It's like repetitively,repeatedly forgiving that one

(09:34):
that thinks it's capable ofmiscreation, and it's great
because you actually get somerelief out of it.
Every miracle is awesome, somerelief out of it.
Every miracle is awesome.
But certain miracles collapsetime and that's what you want.
Once you're what you reallywant, what you really want to do
.
And here's what I see about themiracles that collapse time.

(09:56):
Once you get into the knack ofmaking that kind of miracle that
collapses time because this issaying I'm not capable of doing
this, like, for instance, youget the perception that you
offended someone and you fuckingrecognize you're not capable of
offending anyone.
That's the kind of miracle thatcollapses time Because you're

(10:17):
actually recognizing that you'redreaming.
Look at what a miracle does.
It establishes that you'redreaming a dream and none of its
content is true.
That's actually what it's does.
It establishes that you'redreaming a dream and none of its
content is true.
That's actually what it's doing.
It's establishing that in yourmind, right?
So if you need to forgiveyourself because you're not
ready to accept what's actuallythe truth, recognize that.

(10:40):
That'll help you, because noone's pushing you to, hey, do
this really fast.
That That'll help you, becauseno one's pushing you to, hey, do
this really fast.
You know, it's like.
It's like I'm just bringing tothe forefront what you want to
know to do what you want to do,to actually do what you want to
do, and do what A Course inMiracles is actually saying to
do.
Right, because, because this islargely misunderstood and here's

(11:01):
the thing about groups too.
This is what I noticed aboutgroups.
And you know, when I learned ACourse in Miracles, when I
learned, when I took A Course inMiracles and everything, I did
not join a fucking group until Iwas on it for like nine years.
So I was getting theinterpretation that was coming
from spirit.

(11:22):
That's what I wanted, that'swhat was available actually to
me.
There were no A Course inMiracles groups on the island of
Hawaii.
I wasn't looking for them toohard either because someone
might be listening to me rightnow and go what are you fucking
crazy?
There was like 10 groups.
Okay, well, to me there weren'tNot that I knew of.

(11:42):
And I wasn't looking that hardBecause I got the word from
spirit you're going to get thisfrom spirit, you're going to get
this teaching from spirit.
So I was sharing with my friendThomas.
You know, I was like I neverdid it that way.
I never forgave myself.

(12:03):
I never fucking did that.
I never did it that way.
I never forgave myself.
I never fucking did that.
And I was like I'm sure itdoesn't say anywhere in A Course
in Miracles to forgive yourself.
And he's like, oh really.
And I was like I seem prettyconfident, don't I?
And the thing is I don't evenknow the words to me don't

(12:28):
matter.
I just really did not takeanything to mean that I should
forgive myself for anything,because by the time I started
taking A Course in Miracles inthe first place, I already knew
there was no self so who couldbe forgiven.
So I went back and I looked inA Course in Miracles and yeah,
it does say in a couple ofdifferent places about forgiving

(12:48):
yourself, and then it even saysforgive yourself for something.
I'm like what the fuck?
And I look at it and I go man,I did not take it that way and
you know the thing is, it's notreally meant that way.
What Jesus is saying is you gotto learn how to forgive from the
one who knows how to forgive.
That's saying that the waywe're conditioned in believing

(13:14):
that we're a separate self, wedon't know how to forgive.
We're thinking there's someoneactually there to forgive.
There is no one.
Look at in other places and, ofcourse, in miracles.
It says you're not capable ofthinking apart from God.
So if you're forgiving yourselffor thinking apart from God,

(13:37):
and meanwhile the lesson isyou're not capable of thinking
apart from God, what do youthink is happening?
That's circular, that'scircular, see.
So what we want to do iscollapse time.
And here's what I noticed aboutcollapsing time Once you get
the knack for it, you do itright, you do it right, you do
it right.
Yeah, that's how I experiencedit.

(13:58):
Hey, you finally fucking didforgiveness right.
Jeez, how long did that takeyou?
Yes, I believe that that is areally good way to say it,
because see the reason why it'scoming to the word forgiveness

(14:20):
and not acceptance, because theego would hijack the word
acceptance too.
What does the word acceptancemean to the ego?
It's like look at how the egolooks at it.
It's all an energy.
The ego is looking at it as ohI guess I know plenty of people
like this.
I guess I should just accept itbecause it's my.
You know what I mean.
So that's why we have thesedifferent ways of pointing to it

(14:43):
, because you can see how eachword, the ego I know you don't
mean it like that- well, youknow, it's acceptance that
shadow and light is all part ofthe god's experience and there's
no separation right, yes, yes,and and let's give it okay.
So what?
So, what?
What diana's saying, which isreally awesome, the way's saying
accept it as if it's shadow andlight and it's all part of the

(15:07):
plan and it's you know, yeah,that's true enough too.
That's true enough.
And at the same time, I wouldtake the acceptance to another
level too and go.
It's acceptance because it'syour fucking role, it's giving
you a role, that's the rolethrough which you extend love.

(15:29):
Okay, extending love is actuallythe evolution of forgiveness,
because you recognize there'snothing at all to forgive.
Let's say so.
Then it's just extending love.
So you need forgiveness, whilethere are illusions being taken
as true To make that the kind offorgiveness that induces a

(15:53):
miracle that collapses time.
You want to forgive like this.
I'm not capable of doing what Ithought I did.
I'm not capable of thinkingwhat I thought I did.
I'm not capable of thinkinglike I thought I thought.
I'm not capable of thinkinglike that.
I'm not capable of thinkingagainst God.

(16:13):
I'm only capable of thinkingwith God.
So the thought that's true isthat I wasn't capable of that
other thought.

Speaker 3 (16:25):
I wasn't capable of that other thought yeah, yeah,
so, so.

Speaker 1 (16:30):
So look at what you're, what you're saying.
What you're saying light, light, that you know it's, it's
shadow and light.
They can't really fight.
They're not in a fight, right?
Because shadow and light, theshadow is a shadow of the light.
Yeah, well, here.
So here's where I would come inwith that.
So now Diana is sharing thatthey need each other.

(16:50):
Okay, in an illusion, yes, yes,but the truth is, light doesn't
need a shadow to be light,shadow needs light to be a
shadow.
You see what I'm saying, so, so, so look at.

(17:15):
So this kind of acceptance isaccepting that in the illusion,
in the manifestation, which isnot a reality, you also have a
unique role, which is also not areality.
But it's your unique role,where your function of
forgiveness, which evolves toextending love, is applied to it

(17:35):
.
This is extended in time in theillusion through your unique
role, and everyone's role iscompletely unique.
Everyone's role and everyone'srole is completely unique.
Everyone's role, and basically,this is what you're imagining,
that's your role, your role iswhat you're imagining, it's

(18:02):
perfect as it is.
I like to say it's perfectlyhelpful to you and for everyone
involved, because when you'reaware of its helpfulness to
allowing you to serve yourfunction.
That's where you actually seethe benefits of it and it
becomes, I've been saying, likean offering, like a prayer.
Right, this is my offering,whatever it is, whether it's

(18:23):
some kind of a delusionalthought or anything.
Oh, substack, peeps, aloha, Ilove you.
Thank you for joining.
Hooray, yay, I see you.
Oh, you listened more thanthree times to that one.
Okay, she's talking about ACIMdeep dive from July 25th, where

(18:46):
we talked about circular andcircular miracles and miracles
at collapse time.
She's asking if I'm okay andsafe where I am in New Mexico.
I'm actually in Sedona, arizona, and yes, I'm okay and safe,

(19:09):
I'm always safe.
It's funny, you know.
It's like I'm always safebecause I trust my brothers, who
are one with me.
Right, that's just how it isRight.
So so I'm over here.
I was going to share this storytoo.
This is really fun.
So I'm over here, apparently ina one-bedroom apartment, with
another person who happens to bea male.

(19:30):
One bedroom, one bath.
Okay, it's so funny becauseit's like I'm not used to this
kind of living situation at all.
It gives me opportunities forbringing things to the truth.
I'm not used to this kind ofliving situation at all.
It gives me opportunities forbringing things to the truth.
I'm not even going to sayforgiveness, because I don't

(19:50):
have a forgiveness thing.
It's like not a thing like that, right.
It's like something will justcome up, like like the ego will
say something to me, like it'lljust pop up and say I got to get
the fuck out of here and I'lljust go, that is not me, right.

(20:11):
And and see, it's funny,because the ego is totally
afraid of this.
It's like what, Wait a second,this is a really important
thought.
This is a really.
The ego will be like this is areally important thought.
And you know the spirit's justlike, just in accepting whatever
it is, the thought it arises,it's like, oh, interesting, okay

(20:34):
, well, that is not me.
And then you're watching it andI'm like, okay, I'm just
watching how this goes, withoutlooking at and like kind of like
taking score or analyzing, likean ego does.
What I'm experiencing is twopeople that are totally willing.
It's like the perfect partnersfor seeing through illusions,

(20:59):
just totally willing.
It's so smooth.
Our relating is so smoothbecause the underlining,
underlying I got to say, myrelating is smooth with anyone,
though.
It's just how it is, butsometimes their relating isn't
that smooth with me if they gettriggered, but then I I always
see them come back so fast.

(21:20):
It's just so, it's just sosimple.
I never have a sense like, ohmy God, how's it going to be
when I'm living with that person.
Will I be able to handle theiremotions?
Will I be able to handle theiroverwhelm?
Will I be able to handle allthis shit?
It's like no, I know it'scoming from me.
It's going to be fuckingawesome.
So, anyways, we meet each otherat this place where where uh,

(21:48):
what is what is that term?
Thomas, we were, we werelooking at it.
It's called, uh, like willingpartners or something like that
Partner who is willing to see.
Uh, yeah, so we're both sowilling to see the innocence and
be happy.
Right, it's like everything weseem to do together is just

(22:10):
fucking awesome.
You know, it's like everyeverything.
We had one, we had.
We had one experience that wasjust like so much fun for me.
I was having a blast, I justthought it was so good, so good.
So Thomas's cousin, or somethinglike that, gets a timeshare and

(22:30):
she pays for the timeshare andeverything, and she's not going
to use it.
So Thomas is like, hey, youwant to go hang out this
timeshare for a week.
It'll probably be awesome.
You could look at it on thewebsite.
So I look it up on the websiteand I look at the photos and I
was like shit, that looks biggerthan the place we're in right
now.
Let's check it out.
We're like, okay, so we get allpacked up on a Friday, pack all

(22:51):
our stuff up, go over there,find out that the reservation is
until Saturday Right, we'repacked up, we're all packed up,
we're there to check in, right,and we find out the reservation
is until Saturday.
Well, first, even before that,we somehow don't see the front
desk at all and we just end upin the tour section where they

(23:12):
want to sell you shit, like theywant to sell you some
timeshares.
So so it's like, you know, toan ego this would look like man.
What the fuck kind of mess isit?
What a waste of time we spenttoday.
We spent today packing and thenwe end up over there and then
they're telling us and then,gosh, you know, first we're in
line and Thomas shows me thephone and he's like here's the

(23:35):
reservation, and I go, shit.
It says such and such date.
Isn't that today?
No, that's not the date today.
Oh, that's not the day today,right, so so so I'm just like.
I'm just like, oh, oh, this isawesome, you know.
I'm like, of course, I knowwhat it's for, I don't really
care what happens, it doesn'tmatter to me what happens, I

(23:57):
don't care about that, itdoesn't matter really.
You know, it's not like.
It's not like decisions can'tpop up.
I allow decisions to pop up.
You know it's like shit.
Just play with those two, havefun with those two.
So so we go back home next day,we pack again.
We kind of have to unpackbecause we like bring all of our

(24:17):
shit.
You know, like that we want touse.

Speaker 3 (24:26):
It's really good it gets better.

Speaker 1 (24:28):
So so we pack everything up again.
This place is only 15 minutesaway too.
So we pack all of our shit upagain, go back over there, right
and uh, and we go check in andand you know the place I'm
hearing things like I hearsomething.

(24:49):
I overhear someone say okay,$175 for two nights, and I'm
like thinking that sounds kindof cheap.
You know, it's kind of low for,like a timeshare, you know.
So then we get routed over toanother desk, supposedly to get
our parking pass, and we end upin basically a sales funnel,

(25:12):
like a person's looking to sellus some stuff.
So we go ahead and we, you know,we sign up to take the
timeshare thing because we'relike I'm thinking I don't know
if we'll go or not, but you know, if we seem to be not having
anything to do at 1030 in themorning on a Sunday, and it
sounds good to go eat somesnacks and listen to something

(25:32):
and they'll give us a freedinner.
Cool, so sign up for that, getto the room and as soon as we
open the door, I'm like what inthe world?
It's a tiny house.
Now, I'm not trying to talkshit on tiny houses.
I know lots of people love tinyhouses.
They're like, oh, tiny house.
Okay, for one thing, I'm with adude it's not like my boyfriend

(25:56):
or my husband or something likethat and this thing is really
really small.
So, plus, we both block and Icould see block therapy.
We're laying on the floor withthese blocks and there's no room
for that.
So as soon as I opened the door, I'm like nope, nope.
We're like looking at stuff.

(26:19):
No, nope, nope, that's not it,we're not staying there.

Speaker 3 (26:23):
They're all the same.

Speaker 1 (26:24):
Yeah, yeah, we're not saying no, we're not saying
that.
So then we go back again, we goback, we go back over here
again and you know, the wholetime I'm like this is fucking
awesome.
It doesn't matter which way itgoes.
It doesn't mean see one examplethat I'm sharing with you guys
here does not mean we have to gouse the tiny house now to be

(26:47):
spiritual or anything like that.
It's just right there in themoment there's no rules.
There's no rules about this.
Kalama, to answer your question,that was chapter 2, section 10,
paragraphs 9 through 11 or 12.

(27:08):
Yeah, so you know, these arethe kinds of things that Jesus
is saying.
This is your role.
This is part of your role.
Whatever it is that's arising,that's part of your role.

(27:29):
For me, when it comes to anythought, you know some of you
guys might hear me and go, wow,you know, you got a thought in
your.
You got a thought in your mindsaying you better get the fuck
out of there.
And you don't.
I'm going to.
You know the thought, thethought, for specifically, it
popped up once for twice.
I don't know, I got to get thefuck out of here.
You know it sounds like yourown voice right, it's like

(27:50):
urgent, it's like I got to getthe fuck out of here and it's
like what I notice, I know so.
So you know, living like this,living like this, it's like what
you learn to trust thatwhatever it is is fucking
awesome.
And it was funny because one ofmy friends, just out of the blue

(28:11):
today I didn't I didn't sayanything to anyone, but just out
of the blue today said do youneed a place to stay, are you?
No, it was something like areyou looking for a place to stay?
And I go not particularly aplace to stay, and I go not
particularly.
I'd be open to a bedroom and abathroom that was private, but
I'm not really feeling like Ineed to particularly look for

(28:32):
that, because what I'mexperiencing here with Thomas
and every day, every morning,every night, all throughout the
day, is these deep, deeprealizations and that kind of
like supersedes anything thatspeaks to how I like to be
comfortable in a livingsituation Still didn't mean I

(28:58):
had to go into the tiny house.

Speaker 3 (29:00):
Well, and what you're saying, too, is just needs
arise and you speak.

Speaker 1 (29:04):
Right, that's right.

Speaker 3 (29:06):
Like energetic space, because I believe in the
energetic space, yeah.

Speaker 1 (29:10):
Well, what I noticed too.
Okay, so that's a really goodpoint.
Thank you for bringing that up.
Diana said she notices the needfor energetic space and just
speaking the needs when theyarise, speaking the need for
energetic space, right.
So for me, I can't think of aninstance where I needed to do

(29:34):
that with Thomas, because wecompletely like get each other
like energetically.
And you know, I like to playwith this.
I was playing with this inMexico too.
There was this.
There was this guy who took meto Guadalajara and he took me on
a bus and he kept on touchingme.
He was, he just kept on.
He's like touching my thighs,he's like up my thighs, and then

(29:57):
he's like wrapping his handaround and like touching my boob
from the side and everything.
And he, he asked me he's like,he's like, he's like, are you
okay with me touching you?
And I'm like you know what, I'mnot really sure, like I'm
observing this right now I don'twant to say no to you, I'm just
kind of like watching it.
He's like oh, that's veryinteresting of you, you know,

(30:25):
cause, like I'm energetic,energetically, I'm communicating
, I know that.
So, and then it always occursto me I trust my brothers, who
are one with me, Like Thomasasked me the other night.
He said what are your boundaries?
And I was like I don't have anyboundaries of my own.
The Holy Spirit has boundariesfor me.
I don't know what they are, soit's like.

(30:45):
It's kind of like I just watchand see like where are the
boundaries, and watch like wheredo they arise?
And what I noticed in myexperience of this is I haven't
really had to speak anyboundaries.
They just kind of like showthemselves, they just reveal

(31:06):
themselves.
People change a little bit.
They'll go, they'll, they'llback off a little bit, they'll
do whatever they do and thingswill just change.
I like to watch things changelike that more than just go to
using my words.
So I'm super stoked that theHoly Spirit shows me how I can
do that, because it's soenergetic.

(31:31):
The first time that I couldthink of that I really
experienced that energetic wason the dance floor, when someone
was cornering me on the dancefloor.
When someone was cornering meon the dance floor, apparently I
can only be cornering myself,so it seemed like someone was

(31:53):
cornering me like I couldn't getout of this person's space.
Right, I couldn't get out.
There was like no way out ofthis person's space.
So I came back to energeticallybeing aware that this person is
my projection and it seems likethey're in my space right now,

(32:14):
right, and it's like.
And I kept eye contact with theperson too and what I notice is
their energy completely changed,right there, and it just wasn't
the same anymore, right, andit's like when we learn and
truly recognize that we areenergetic, we are not made of

(32:39):
energy.
Okay, that's one thing.
We are not made of energy.
When we think we're made ofenergy, then we're afraid of
other people's energy.
That is thing.
When we think we're made ofenergy, then we're afraid of
other people's energy.
That is bullshit.
Our thoughts are projecting anenergy and that's making an
image and that image isenergetically relating with
other energies.
But really it's our thoughtsthat are making the image and

(33:06):
the relating and everything,waiting for a miracle.
Yeah waiting, yeah, see.
So when you're identifying asthat person or as that energy,
when you're identifying as that,you're basically needing to

(33:26):
protect yourself.
So you're needing to come upwith boundaries, and that's not
anything bad about that.
There's just a step that takesyou beyond that.
It takes you beyond theboundaries.
So it's like it's like yourecognize that you don't have
boundaries of your own.
They're Holy Spirit'sboundaries.

(33:47):
That doesn't mean I can't speakboundaries.
I mean, when you look at thatexample of when I was in India
and that guy grabbed my ass, allof a sudden it just popped
right out of my mouth hey, donot grab my ass.
But I'm laughing at the sametime because I know I'm grabbing
my own ass.

Speaker 3 (34:04):
But I'm laughing at the same time because I know I'm
grabbing my own ass and I'mthinking more of like
perceptions of needing to engagewhen you don't need to engage
and being able to go.
I'm going to go lay down.

Speaker 1 (34:17):
Oh, yeah, totally.

Speaker 3 (34:19):
That be just organic.
Oh yeah, not a need forboundaries, or you know.
Yeah, yeah, that's exactly ourown energy and being whatever,
right.

Speaker 1 (34:31):
That's exactly what.
That's exactly what I'm talkingabout too.
It's all the same, right.
It's all the same whethersomeone is like grabbing you
physically or you just need to,uh, have some energy boundaries.
Where you say I'm going to bed,that's not even a thing for me,
like, if I feel like I'm goingto bed, I'm just going to bed.

(34:51):
That's like people pleasingstuff.
I feel like you know, it's likeif you're thinking that you
need to be a certain way,sacrifice something because
someone else is in the field, orsomething like that, or not say
what it is that you want to do,or anything, then that's

(35:16):
different.
Yeah, that's like peoplepleasing Sure.

Speaker 3 (35:21):
Yeah, that's kind of.
You know what I'm pointing toin my own being.

Speaker 1 (35:25):
Uh-huh.

Speaker 3 (35:26):
Understanding and knowing.

Speaker 1 (35:28):
Understanding and knowing, yes, that that exists
within my thought.
It exists within your thoughtthat you need energetic
boundaries.
Is that what you're saying, orthat?

Speaker 3 (35:40):
That people pleasing.

Speaker 1 (35:42):
People pleasing Easily, oh, or that people

(36:06):
pleasing people pleasing easily,oh.
So know boundaries about yourbody and stuff like that being
touched, but boundaries aboutwhen you're going to take care
of your energy, when you'regoing to eat, when you're going
to sleep, when you're going torest, when you're going to have
time away.
And you know it's fun because,like Thomas Thomas tells me, you
know, just let me know if youneed some space, like if you

(36:29):
need some space, and I'll justleave and I'm like, ok, yeah, I
will, and I don't have that comeup.
It seems like yeah, yeah,Because it seems like you know,
anytime there seems to be like Ineed something that I don't
have.
It's like, oh my goodness, Ihave everything I need, it's

(36:53):
just perfect.
That's what it shows me.
It's like being aware of thatspace, that gentle space of
perfection and joy, and alsoaware that everything's
temporary.
It's like man, my friend isasking are you looking for a
place to stay?
And I could be out of here atsome point soon.

(37:17):
Huh, Well, yeah, and and andalso I could.
I could just be redirected too.
That's the other thing.
I could be redirected at anytime.
Right, accepting the blessingsand you could see.

(37:48):
It doesn't matter what kind ofsituation or circumstances or
circumstance that I find myselfin.
There's never a need for anyhurry.
There's never any need for anyrush Like, oh my God, I got to
get out of here.
There's never any need for that, because recognizing that
wherever you find yourself iswhere the role is, where your

(38:10):
role is and, anyways, it's notgoing to make anything go faster
.
It actually slows it downbecause it's a distraction,
Right, it's like it slowseverything down.
Right, it's like it slowseverything down.

(38:32):
So resting in it, resting inwherever we are in the role lets
you find the joy, and not onlythe joy, the gratitude in it,
Like what I'm sharing with youguys, the parts where something
comes up.
It's like very small amount ofthe time, the 95, 99, I don't
know how much percent of thetime it's like gratitude.
Oh, my goodness, goodness,thank you for all of this that

(38:56):
I've been given.
All of this connection, all ofthis awareness, all of this kind
of like an explosion ofconsciousness, it's just amazing
, right, and with that there'speace in any circumstances.

(39:18):
I mean, you guys, people haveasked me before like, oh, what
if you go to jail for that?
Like when I was playing in arole of activist, right, I'm
like, if I'm in jail, I'm havinga kick-ass time over there.
It's the same.
That's the thing about notminding what's going on in the
field, because everything in thefield is giving you exactly

(39:42):
what you need.
And see, the ego is alwaysgoing toward ingratitude.
That's what it's doing, Likeany situation it finds itself in
, it's finding reasons to not begrateful.
That's what it does and that'swhat the illusion is always
showing.
So look and I've heard peopletalk about this before it's like

(40:03):
wherever I go, everywhere I go,I'm running into it sucks the
people around me.
They suck.
Well, that's because you go toingratitude and you keep on one.
Then you find more and morereasons to be grateful, right?
So it's in every situation,it's in every job.

(40:36):
It's like an erroneous thoughtthat'll pop up and if there's
the following of that thought,that's what expands.
Like whatever you put yourattention on, that expands.
So I don't like to ignore thesethings either.
See what's going on here, how Ibring them to the surface.

(40:59):
I bring them to the surface sothey could be seen in the light.
The thing that we've beenstudying recently is the
unwatched mind.
The mind needs to be watched.
What it's saying is not true.
It's not that you know whatit's saying is true and you give
it value, but it needs to bewatched because otherwise it

(41:22):
will ruin all of yourexperiences and relationships.
That's what it does.
It makes everything out to benot good enough, right?
This is what happens inmarriages too.
Oh my gosh, I should go.

Speaker 3 (41:42):
I'm trapped here.

Speaker 1 (41:44):
A job, a place, you start seeing these things.
Look for something that you canbe grateful for.
For me, I'm always grateful forwhat unfolds.
Everywhere I go, I could hearthe ego's voice talking about
how it's shitty.

(42:04):
Like, okay, go to NamasteVillage, oh my gosh, no hot
water.
First, three weeks, no hotwater.
I got to get the fuck out ofhere.
Next step right, I'm over at aplace.
Now they have hot water and thelandlords are completely up my

(42:27):
ass.
Right, the place is kind of likeI'm in a, I'm in like a, a
situation where you got like a,you're like a kid and these are
your parents.
That's what it seemed like.
These are my parents andthey're watching me.
They're watching who's comingover.
I have a friend spend the nighta couple of times.

(42:48):
Next thing, you know, they'reasking for her last name, right?
So so what I?
What I see over and over againis these things where there's
some kind of complaint orthere's some kind of issue or
some kind of this isn't theperfect situation.
These last for a very shortportion of it, unless you blow

(43:11):
them up big, and then it gets tobe more and more like oh my
gosh.
But yeah, it's a matter ofseeing the benefits, seeing the
uh, the blessings in everything,because in everything you'll
find a mix and then you looktoward the benefits.

(43:34):
That's how it is, um, so one ofthe benefits is a whole big
acim community here, people whoare really committed.
They're meeting all the time.
They're reading about it,they're talking about it.

(43:57):
They're really sweet, they'rereally loving.
You can tell they've beenpracticing for a long time
because they're super loving,and Thomas is one of those guys.
He does some of the lessons tooReading of Anna the grandmother
.
If you guys want any links onthat, just email me.

(44:19):
I'll send them to you or textme or something.
I'll send you links so you canjoin.
I go to those.
I like to participate.
It's really fun, it's reallyinteresting.
People get deep.
I love it.
So I'm finding a really sweetcommunity here, and also there's
a chocolate shop right up theroad that reminds me of Puna.

(44:40):
A couple people even recognizeme from wisdom talks.
They're like, hey, what are youdoing here?
Super sweet, loving vibes, lotsof hugs and loving each other
up.
It's really cool.
I love it.
I love it.
I'm having a blast here.
So the main thing, though,that's been so opening for me is

(45:14):
being with living with whatpeople would call a willing or
what, what the course of lovewas calling a willing partner in
awakening, and this doesn'thave to be like a uh, romantic
partner, it doesn't need to belike that.

(45:35):
It's just a willing partner inrelating.
That's where we're just so openwith each other, we're so
willing to see the innocence.
I've never had this kind ofconnection before and this kind
of connection is exactly whatpropels each of us along our

(45:55):
path and everyone else andeveryone else we come into
contact with.
We were in a bar, irish bar onenight after going, dancing under
the full moon and we were justhanging out and there was a vibe
with us.
You know, there's like acertain vibe between us and
we're just loving each other upand we're just hanging out and

(46:16):
we're looking in each other'seyes and one or two or three I
don't know people were just kindof like making comments and
looking at us and one personeven says you guys must be so in
love and we're like, yeah, weare, that is for sure.
It's like we have this kind ofvibe together.

(46:39):
We have this kind of connectiontogether where, anywhere we go,
we're just like having such agood time.
We go to the grocery storetogether.
We go to the grocery storetogether, we're just totally,
you can say, in love, right, butthere's no possession, there's
no possessiveness to it.

(47:00):
Thomas has really close friends,one who's really close with him
, who has been his girlfriendtwice and he's still really
close with her and you know hehugs her and sits and kisses her
and sits next to her and holdsher hand and everything like
that, dances with her, and thenhe does the same kind of
affection with me.

(47:20):
You know we have the same kindof affection and kind of close
connection.
And you know, thomas, he'sreally super affectionate like
hands on.
You know, thomas, he's really,uh, super affectionate like
hands-on, you know.
And body on too.
I mean I don't know if dianagot it, got any kind of taste of
that, but fuck, he just comesup and he just like puts his

(47:40):
whole body on you, like youcould feel the shape of the
penis on you and everything youknow you didn't get that
greeting.
All right, thomas, I don't knowwhat's happening here, but it's
supposed to be equal, equal, uh,whatever, equal, equal, full

(48:07):
body hugging.
So you know, when people talkabout boundaries, that's what I
noticed, I noticed.
Ok, I know that this is a thing, I know that this is a thing, I
know that women because youknow, I seem to get like whoa,

(48:27):
it's kind of like whoa, what thefuck.
You know, it's like oh, whatthe fuck.
And it's funny because Thomaswas telling me, you know, he's
talking with his friends andhe's like hope is unflinching.
Thomas doesn't notice I'm goingwhoa, what the fuck.
But you know why he doesn'tnotice it?
Because I notice it and Inotice that's not me.

(48:52):
See, I notice that is not meand I want to play with it.
So I'm not saying that peopleshould do this, I'm not saying
people have to do this.
I want to play with it.
I want to see what's going on.
This is the first Thomas ishearing about this.
What's going on?

(49:15):
This is the first Thomas ishearing about this.
I want to know and I want tosee this energetic play.
I know that at any moment Thomasis just such a sweetie he's
like he'll ask me.
He actually asked me what areyour boundaries, right?
And I said I don't have any Outof my own.
The spirit has boundaries.
When those need to come out,you'll know, right?
So this part that's actuallydoing the flinching is not

(49:37):
showing on the surface becauseit's not me and I know it's not
me, and so it's just kind oflike hmm, let's see how this
energy plays out.
It's an energy playing outanyways.
Again, this isn't somethingthat I'm saying people should do
to be spiritual or provespirituality or anything like
that.
If you get the sense that youneed to say, hey, no, I want to

(50:01):
set some clear boundaries here,for one, when we hug your
fucking penis, doesn't go on me,okay.
Or you don't come around tryingto kiss me with your tongue, or
something like that, you mightjust say stuff like that and I
have certainly.
I have said stuff like that alot because I could be super
straightforward when I need tobe straightforward.

(50:21):
No problem at all.
And then there's this partthat's like let's just see how
the energy plays, and what Inotice is that Thomas is really
good at feeling my energy.
He's good at it and see, thething is, I may be recognizing

(50:43):
this thing that's flinching, andrecognizing that it's not me,
but I'm not even having anenergetic boundary there.
It's not there.
I'm like, okay, it's not there,I actually do not mind, it's
not a big deal that when he hugsme he's that close to me.
That's not a big deal, right?
So I'm like, okay, you noticewhat's flinching and go.

(51:03):
Okay, that's actually not a bigdeal, okay.
Sometimes he comes around anduses his tongue to kiss me.
I just don't get into that,right.
So I could always say at anytime I could say, hey, don't do

(51:24):
that.
But there's certain instanceswhere I'm just interested in the
energetic plate.
Let's see where this goes.
I want to see if this can bemanaged energetically and it's a
safe space, because he is sucha sweet, sweet dude Any second
that I would say no to that.

(51:45):
He would completely back offtoo.
He would just completely backoff too.
But at the same time, I don'tfeel like they need to be a
sweet dude for me to feel thisway too.
I think that me feeling thisway is automatically making them
sweet dudes.
I've had a lot of practice withthis, especially in Mexico,
because almost every Uber driverthought they wanted to date me

(52:09):
so, and some of them were morestraightforward than other ones.
Right, some of the Uber driverswere much more straightforward
and you know, sometimes I justgo, I just go.
You know what, I'm not intothat.
And then other times I just go,oh okay, and play along with it

(52:29):
.
One guy said he wants to spankme.
I told him he'd have to wait acouple weeks.
Well, I just had laser on mybutt and my butt was burned at
the time.
So I told him he needed to waita couple weeks on the app,
right, and then he goes are youafraid of me?

(52:52):
You know, like on the app, andI'm like no, I'm not afraid of
you, I know you're the holy sonof God on the app because we
don't speak the same language,like we're doing a translator
thing and just noticing, man,I'm safe anywhere I go.
I was walking around Mexico atlike one in the morning and I

(53:14):
was telling some people that andthey're like aren't you afraid
of someone grabbing you?
And I go, you know what I thinkif someone grabbed me, I would
grab them back.
I think I would actually justlike wrap my arms and legs
around them.
Oh, you want to grab?
Let's be like really close, youknow will be, we'll just be

(53:38):
really really close, right, oh,thanks, right, it's all the way
you, it's all the way you bewith it.
It really is, it's all the wayyou're gonna be with it.
Are you gonna be with it?
In a way, that's making yourillusions true.
One illusion is that you can'ttrust your brothers.
You can trust all your brothers.
They're one with you.

(53:58):
You can trust all of them, see.
And then it's an idea too, andwhen there's an idea that you
can't trust your brothers, it'san idea that you can't trust
yourself.
So it's like can I trust myself?
Can I trust that, if this goestoo far for me, that I will just
go?
Oh, you know what, nevermind, Idon't want to do that anymore.

(54:22):
Right, that's what I was, that'swhat I would do when I,
whenever I was with my husband,tony, because he would go play
along with my games, and then,when it went too far and it was,
you know, it was like like I'dgo.
Okay, now I want to, now I wantto do it like this.
I want to.
Basically, we're role-playingall the time.

(54:43):
I want to role-play like this.
Basically, we're alwaysrole-playing and then I go.
You know what.
Actually, I don't want to do itlike that anymore.
I don't want to, let's say, Idon't want to push each other in
that way.
Right, there's like these kindsof games that we start to play.
I don't want to push each otherin that way.
I don't want to make thatillusion true anymore.

(55:05):
I know we were doing it likethat before, but I'm not doing
it like that anymore.
Those kind of energeticboundaries come up too, yeah,
but I just noticed, man, I'vebeen really liking playing with
that one that's a sexual one and, who knows, maybe it's because
I've been with my husband 30years before this.

(55:26):
You know, I've been with myhusband 30 years before this,
you know, and it would always belike the boundary would come up
fast because, because I had acommitment with him, it's like
if I have a commitment,commitment with someone, and
then I'm not playing this out atall, you know, it's like, hey,

(55:47):
you need to know.
And Thomas notices thedifference too, too, from when I
came over.
I came over and hung out at hishouse.
Before, when I was married, theboundaries were clear, right,
because I had a commitment withsomeone.
So those are just coming outright away.
But now it's like oh, this isinteresting, this is different,

(56:10):
because now I don't have thatreason and now I could just kind
of like, watch and go.
Hmm, where is this going, right?
Hmm, what is this?
In Mexico, it went all the wayto sex with one dude.
It went all the way to sex withone dude.
I was not expecting that tohappen.

(56:32):
You know, like I said, I'm justwatching, I don't know.
I mean, it's just the same thatdude and Thomas.
It's just different thatapparently, at least so far,
energetic boundaries are at acertain place.
Who knows, maybe it's that welive together.
I don't know, I don't evenquestion the spirit's boundaries
because they're not mine, Idon't have rules about those,

(56:54):
right.
But with my friend over there inMexico, who I met one week
before I ended up leaving, I wasjust watching, watching,
watching.
I was like, oh shit, this isgoing to sex.
That happens too.

(57:20):
It's just like.
It's just like freedom playingin the field.
There's no rules about it.
And and you know, the funnything is, I was talking on
wisdom dialogues and we weredoing ACIM deep dives and I was
getting released from this senseof needing to use bodies for
sex at all.
And I was like gosh, am I evenever going to have sex again?

(57:43):
If that's not the case, if I'mnot using bodies for sex, am I
ever even going to have sexagain?
And then it was like prettyvast.
Yes, you are.
The answer came very quicklythere and you know so much, yeah

(58:04):
, and so it's just a play ofenergy.
And what Jesus was talking aboutis that you've misunderstood
what sex is for.
And it's like man, I see that,I see how I misunderstood what
it was for.
It was like using it to joinbodies, using it for joining
bodies together.
That's not really.

(58:25):
Bodies cannot join, they cannotreally join, cannot join, they
cannot really join.
But when the mind is joined,you know, it's like it's like
really innocent and free.
It's not like what will thismean if we have sex or anything
like that?
It's just, it's just reallyfree.

(58:45):
Will it happen again?
I don't know, it's just in themoment.
It's like okay, you're watching, are there boundaries?
Where are they?
Show me where they are.
And then the lessons that comeup from that, basically just
revealing that it doesn't meananything more.

(59:07):
And I've done a video aboutthis before, called Sex and
Sandwiches, likening sexbasically as the same kind of
event, impactful event as eatinga sandwich.
Like you know, it doesn't haveto be such a major thing.
It doesn't have to be, it's soloaded.

(59:28):
Yeah, it's loaded.

Speaker 3 (59:29):
Well, it's because of the, the only thing about where
we came from was that it wasmore about procreation and there
wasn't like freedom sexual.

Speaker 1 (59:40):
Right openness.
She's saying it was aboutprocreation.

Speaker 3 (59:46):
Yeah, you know there's.
Whatever I'm playing in rightnow is like thinking about the
liberation in the 60s and 70s.
That was a part of like, hey,you know, this is a God-given
right, Right, you know, toexperience this type of energy
exchange, this ecstasy that thebody has the capacity for.

(01:00:08):
That the body has the capacityfor, yeah, and then you're free
to experience that in the waythat you want to experience it.

Speaker 1 (01:00:16):
Well, yeah, I mean really, when you look at the
experiences, you're sayingyou're free to experience
sexuality in the way you want toexperience it.
And it's like when you look atevery experience as being for
what it's for awakening the mind.
If you look at every experienceas being for what it's for
awakening the mind, if you lookat every experience as being for
that, then it's the same thingas anything else.

(01:00:40):
But if you look at it as it'sfor something else I mean at one
point and of course in miraclesJesus talked about how sex is
for making babies.
He said that's what it's for,you know, and what it looks like
, because Jesus is never like incondemnation and going you

(01:01:00):
shouldn't do it.
He's not saying you shouldn'tdo it, but it's like it has like
a purpose in the world.
It's for making babies.
It's not going to get youanything.
It's not going to get youanything any different from
anything else.
But certain lessons come up.
You get to see things, and youknow what I mean by lessons is

(01:01:23):
you just get to.
You get to have more clarityright about things, about how
this works, about how to relateand everything like that.
So what I saw was, you know, asense like major.
What came up like in the middleof the night after that going
on, was this major, oh my God,like that in my mind.

(01:01:48):
But I noticed it's the ego,it's just the ego, and it
switches really fast to whereI'm just like released from it
in an instant and noticing too.
That's what I want.
I want those thoughts to cometo me.
Who better?
I mean it's like yeah, yeah,yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:02:06):
Yeah, and it's just that.
You know, maybe the experienceof freedom with sex brings up
all the shame that we'verepressed or suppressed about
the body and its experience.

Speaker 1 (01:02:21):
Yeah, and you know, I got a sense that after the fact
, like, oh, that was not right,that wasn't you know something
like that.
And man, it just didn't last.
That wasn't you know somethinglike that.
And it, man, it just didn'tlast, it couldn't last.
Because the thoughts whenthey're uh, when when they come
up to the truth it's like thetruth of the matter is

(01:02:41):
everything is for awakening.
Anyways, uh, the guy was supersweet, super sweet, loving all
that kind of stuff.
There's definitely no regretsabout it.
What I share with you guys isthese thoughts that come up that
I'm giving no meaning.

(01:03:02):
The reason why I'm sharing themwith you here on Wisdom
Dialogues is so you could seehow this works.
On wisdom dialogues is so youcould see how this works.
The reason I share so openly isso that you can see how this
works, how you don't get caughtup in stupid thoughts.
There's absolutely no.
There's no reason why anyoneshouldn't have done what they've

(01:03:28):
done.
Even if you find out, wow, Ijust had sex with a complete
asshole, I would be the same waywith it.
Be the same way about it.
I just want to say, in casehe's listening and he knows who
he is, he is such a sweetheart,right, and that thought that

(01:03:50):
popped up, that thought thatsaid that shouldn't, and and
also also a thought that poppedup is a, is a thought of missing
and comparing to a previouspartner and it's like no way,
that's not.
You know that it's not.
Basically it's not him, right?

Speaker 3 (01:04:10):
So it would be after 30 years of practice.

Speaker 1 (01:04:19):
He says that would be , that would be after the yeah,
that would be after 30 years ofpractice playing with it,
playing in the field like thatwith another body, you know.
But yeah, actually it wasn'teven about him either.
So it's playing with the bodies, just playing with bodies, just

(01:04:39):
playing with bodies, apparently, you know.
And the thing about the thingabout playing with bodies that
makes it any kind of quoteunquote dangerous is our mind
about it, that's all.
It is the mind's popping up andsaying things, you know, and
it's, and it's not true.
And I see that I see this tooin like in the male female

(01:05:00):
dynamic is guys trying harderand harder to be more
understanding and being sweeter,and I think that is really
sweet, you know.
And I'm going to say this itdoesn't matter how much guys
you're doing that, the chicksare still going to perceive you
as something.
That's just how it goes,because it's not the doing that

(01:05:24):
that makes a difference.
It's in your recognizing thatyou're not capable of going too
far.
Let's say, let me just say thatto you, to all you men who
think I know some people aregoing to go what the fuck are
you saying?
You're giving them all thepermission.
But here's the thing, and thisis why forgiveness actually

(01:05:49):
works.
This is why forgiveness works,because when you recognize, when
you guys recognize, that youactually are not capable of
overstepping anyone's boundaries, you won't perceive yourself
doing it anymore I'm serious andno one's going to perceive that

(01:06:09):
you're doing it to them.
The only reason anyoneperceives that you can overstep
their boundaries Thomas, are youhearing this?
The only way anyone everperceives that you can overstep
their boundaries is because youthought you were capable of
doing that.

(01:06:29):
So once you do that kind offorgiveness that I'm talking
about earlier, that collapsestime.
No one's gonna be able toperceive you as overstepping
their boundaries at any time.
That's what you wanna do.
So whenever you get that sensethat someone's acting like, oh,
that's too far or something likethat, or let's say, you're too

(01:06:52):
affectionate, you can't be tooaffectionate either.
You're not capable of being tooaffectionate, anything like
that, that's your opportunity torecognize you made that up and
you're not capable of it.
You're not capable of being tooaffectionate.
You're not capable of goingbeyond anyone's boundaries.

(01:07:13):
It's really not a matter ofcontrolling each other.
It really isn't.
But see, the ego is so scared.
The ego is saying yes, okay,and there is a time when people
need to learn this.
So, if you're listening to meright now and you're going, oh
fuck, I'm just going to gooverstep everyone's boundaries
right now, you're probably notlistening to wisdom dialogues if

(01:07:35):
that's your mindset, but justin case you are, you know, and
even in case you're not, becauseyou're probably like listening
to what I'm saying and going, ohmy God, this is so dangerous.
But actually it's the safestthing, because in my
defenselessness, my safety lies.
This is not taken literally bypeople and that's why they're

(01:07:59):
still doing A Course in Miracles50 years later.
Right, because it's not takingliterally that in my
defenselessness, my safety liesOkay, defenselessness, my safety
lies Okay.
So that's why I will tell everyguy uh, you are not capable of
going further than my boundariesallow, you're not.
You're not capable of thatbecause they're not I know

(01:08:21):
they're not my boundaries, theirspirits boundaries.
So there's no uh, and you know,and this is speaking, this is
speaking from someone.
I have had experiences, as a lotof people who are in my age
range have, of being molested asa child.
But I can see with crystalclear vision that I let it occur

(01:08:46):
, even as a child, that it wasan energetic play.
It was a total energetic play.
So, look, this is what is trulyhelpful, is for everyone to see
.
Eventually.
It doesn't mean that you knowthis is for everyone right now,

(01:09:09):
but eventually, and if you'relistening to wisdom dialogues
right now and you spend timelistening to wisdom dialogues,
this is something that you canapply to yourself.
Don't worry about anyone else.
Don't worry about if this isdangerous for anyone else.
Can you trust yourself enoughto know that you can't be too
much?
You can't do too much tosomeone?

(01:09:33):
You cannot harm a brother.
You cannot harm and you cannotbe harmed.
See.
I've seen this go on so muchwhere it's like you did this to
me and then it just keeps onrolling.
So that's the differencebetween, you know, keeping these

(01:09:53):
illusions alive which you know,at a time you need to exercise
boundaries like that.
At a time you need to exercisediscipline like that, because
you don't know yet that you canbe trusted, you can totally be
trusted, and that's what I see.

(01:10:16):
Like when I'm interacting withsomeone, like when I'm
interacting with anyone who youknow interacts in a way where
it's more physical and stufflike that, I notice I'm only
letting them go as far as I wantthem to go.
They're not going any furtherthan that.
The guy in the hotel room whograbbed my ass did I want him to

(01:10:39):
grab my ass?
Yes, I did.
And then I could still say, hey, don't grab my ass, recognizing
that I wanted that.
This is like the practicalapplication of in my

(01:10:59):
defenselessness my safety liesand I can trust all my brothers
who are one with me.
See, so when I'm demonstratingit, I'm demonstrating it to my
own mind and I'm demonstratingit to the whole mind, which is
not separate.
It's demonstrating safety.
It's demonstrating completesafety in the arms of love with

(01:11:21):
each other and it's showing theego that there's no need for it
here.
There's no need for that.
I just love the play.

(01:11:44):
I love my role in it.
I love that I get to expose itlike I do.
It's like showing what trueforgiveness is.

(01:12:09):
What I think is isn't and youknow it's like I've been asked
before but isn't that spiritualbypass?
If you go, last night I got thesense that I was this and then

(01:12:30):
you just go, that didn't happen.
Isn't that spiritual bypass?
And I go well, it's spiritualbypass to believe that you are
capable of doing that.
Actually, when you're awarethat you're not really capable,
but you're doing it in a dream,you actually change it within

(01:12:51):
the minds of everyone else too.
It changes it when you'regiving in to guilt and thinking
that you need to change orapologize to someone, or
something like that, you'restill circulating.
It's circular.
It's like we forgive each otherin an ego way of forgiving each

(01:13:13):
other.
It's like, hey, I just need toget okay, I need to pretend like
I really did do something wronglast night.
I acted a certain way Ishouldn't have acted, for
instance and I need to make thisright with the other person and
I need to apologize to thatother person.
And then the other person mightapologize to me too and say, oh

(01:13:36):
, I was doing it wrong too, andthen it feels really good
because both people they feellike they made a connection and
they did, in a way.
It's just that what you reallywant to see together.
And here's how I would look atit.
Here's how I would play with it, like if someone told me hey, I

(01:13:58):
noticed that I didn't, let'ssay I didn't listen to you last
night, I didn't hear you, Ioverstepped my bounds or I
offended you or something likethat.
You know what my response tothem would be oh, no, you were
100% helpful.
Every single time, no, no, no,you were 100% helpful.

(01:14:24):
I don't want you to act anyother way.
I don't want you to have anyfeeling that says you acted
wrong or you thought wrong oryou did anything wrong.
Whatever you seem to do like,even if I'm pushing you, even if
I'm like, kind of like pushingon you to recognize something,
I'm pushing you to recognizeyour own innocence.

(01:14:46):
I'm not pushing you torecognize that you did or
thought anything wrong.
Own innocence, I'm not pushingyou to recognize that you did or
thought anything wrong.
All I ever want for my brotherbecause all I ever want for

(01:15:07):
myself is them to see their owninnocence I take responsibility
for every thought that seems tobe arising about them.
Taking responsibility for memeans I just hand it over to the
Holy Spirit.
It's not true.
It's never true.
So the ego will be, can't belike can you, can you?

(01:15:40):
Can you really live in asituation like this?
Can you really?
Can you really live in asituation like this?
Right, and it's like, let's see, right because he, because
here's the thing too.

(01:16:00):
There's no situation.
That's the thing about beingone, that's the thing about
totally being one.
There isn't a situation.
You know, I was playing with theosho card, the osho zen tarot,
and I, you know, sometimes I wasplaying with the Osho card, the
Osho Zen Tarot, and I, you know, sometimes like to play with
those cards.
And I was looking at they havethese different spreads.
So I'm looking at thesedifferent spreads and this
different spread, say there's anissue, and I'm like I can't

(01:16:23):
think of a single issue that Ineed to bring to this thing.
I don't see an issue right.
It's like everything that evenseems to be an issue.
It's like the forgiveness hasalready occurred before.
I've heard this term tooforgiveness before that.
What seems to be an issuebecomes like food for awakening.

(01:16:48):
It's like the perfect food.
It becomes the perfect food.
Whatever seems to be an issuebecomes a perfect food for
awakening right, and then it'slike and then it's like there's
no need to, I guess.
I guess you could say there'sno need to be fussy.

(01:17:09):
There's no need to be fussyabout things like oh, I need a,
I need a boundary over here, Ineed this, I need this space, I
need this over here.

Speaker 3 (01:17:19):
You see what I mean it's a persona that's picky
about food sometimes yeah, well,I get that too.

Speaker 1 (01:17:27):
She's saying she has a persona that's picky about
food.
I get that.
That too.
I've been playing with this.
Me and Thomas have been playingwith this all the time, because
, like, I come over here andlike he's got this food where
I'm like, oh no, I'm not eatingthat fucking food, right, but
it's not like you have to changeor anything like that.

(01:17:50):
It's super gentle, right.
I'm also not afraid of eatingany kind of food.
I'm not afraid of it.
There are the preferences.
I recognize the preferences.
I'm like okay, so I come overhere and I forgot what we were
first eating.
It didn't, I don't, I don'teven know what it was, but I
found the very first day I washere, I found a little local

(01:18:13):
store where I could buy somethings, and so I got some things
, I stuck them in the fridge andI start doing that stuff.
But I'm, you know, I have a.
I have a way of like knowingwhat I like.
Like as far as like eating,eating high fat foods.
I love high fat foods.
Ghee, right, I like.
I like sourdough bread.

(01:18:33):
I like eggs that haven't beenrefrigerated.
That's my favorite kind of eggs.
So talk about this in frameHoney the body, because Good yes
.

Speaker 3 (01:18:43):
I'm glad Going to that.
Right, the body has preferences, or is it the mind that has
preferences, right?
Yeah, you know, there's somesatiation of desire.

Speaker 1 (01:18:53):
Well, okay, good, I'm glad you're asking that.
Okay, so the body is aprojection of the mind.
It doesn't have any preferences, it has no intelligence, it has
no, nothing at all.
So these preferences that comeup, you could say they are part
of the role.
Remember, we were talking aboutthe role earlier, the character

(01:19:14):
, right.
So there's a role being playedout, and that was something
Thomas and I were just goingover recently too.
There's this role of a humanthat's being played, and you're
the only one who's going to havethis particular role to play In
this particular role, to play.
This persona that I've madelet's put it in terms like that

(01:19:38):
has preferences.
Okay, for certain foods, okay.
So this may be where you mightsee a little bit more of what
you might call fussiness, too,although I don't let it rule me,
because I could be in arestaurant or I could be in a
situation where the Holy SpiritI just check in with the Holy

(01:20:00):
Spirit about what I eat, abouteverything, about every single
thing, and sometimes I findmyself eating things that
wouldn't normally be on my menu,but I just automatically give
it no value, like that.
Like, as far as you know,there's a certain knowledge that
I seem to have and this is alsomy role to have this knowledge,

(01:20:24):
because it's that's what'scoming up, and and it's it's
this knowledge, and it's worldlyknowledge.
So it doesn't really meananything that seed oils are bad
for you, and even when I saythat I recognize, okay, nothing
can really inherently be good orbad for you.
That's not possible, becauseit's all projected by your mind,

(01:20:46):
right?
So I still find myself, though,apparently having a preference
for oils and fats that are notseed oils.
It's a matter of like.
Last night I was in a restaurantand I asked what oil do you
guys?
Oh, I saw polenta on the menuand I go oh, what oil do you

(01:21:07):
guys cook those in?
He goes and he finds out andthey say vegetable oil, and I'm
like no, I'm not really into it.
But it's not like.
I'm like against it, like if itwas feeling like I'm really
into it, I'll have it.
I know, I know I'm totallyprotected, I know there's that
none of this shit can actuallydo anything to me.
So it's not.

(01:21:28):
It's not a matter of like that.
And let's say I'm at someone'shouse, like someone, I'll be at
someone's house and they'remaking food that I wouldn't
normally eat.
I don't.
I don't make it a guilty thingby projecting that that food is
bad for me.
So last night, when I was atthat restaurant too, I was

(01:21:49):
asking what the oils were and hesaid seed oils.
I'm like, oh, nevermind.
And I go hey, you know, if itwas something like some good oil
, like palm oil or somethinglike that that's not made of
corn specifically, that's whatit is.
When it's vegetable oil, Idoubt it's broccoli oil or
something like that, likevegetable oil, like what.

(01:22:13):
They just get a bunch ofvegetables and, right, some corn
, yeah, some corn.
Here's some corn oil which isbasically, it seems to be like
in everything.
So if I'm at someone's houseand they're making something in
corn oil, I'll just eat it Ifit's fried.
A lot of the times I'll findmyself asking what kind of oil

(01:22:35):
it is, and I'll likely eat lessof it if it's corn oil, if it's
what they call vegetable oils.
But see, in exercising thesepreferences and knowing that I
only exercise them when inspiredto do so, it's still asking the
Holy Spirit, it's alwayschecking in with the Holy Spirit

(01:22:55):
.
Even the asking what kind ofoil they use is also checking in
with the Holy Spirit.
Even to ask that question.
It may not be a thing.
So the person who answers methe question is like I don't
know anything about.

(01:23:16):
He says something like I don'tknow anything about these
specialty oils and I go, oh well, bless that up because it
doesn't have any effect on you.
You see what I mean.

(01:23:43):
It's like, it's like that.
It's like OK everybody's goingto have you know, it's like's
like, if I can exercise mypreference, I will.
If I can't exercise mypreference, it has no meaning.
Right, and it's still, evenwhen I'm exercising it.
It has no meaning.
Same thing goes with vaccines.

(01:24:05):
Like, let's say, I wouldn'ttake a vaccine, couldn't take a
vaccine.
Apparently, vaccine is full ofpoisons, apparently.
Now, if I needed to take avaccine because the Holy Spirit
inspired me to take a vaccinelike, let's say, I needed a

(01:24:31):
vaccine to go to a certain placewhere the Holy Spirit would
have me be, I'll just take avaccine and deny any fucking
meaning to it, deny any power toit.
See, so it's not a matter ofnow.
You have to prove it by doingall the things you don't like to
do.
It's like if there is anopportunity to exercise a
preference that just arisesanyways and you know it's so

(01:25:01):
energetic too.
It's like you can feel likewhat it is in the moment.
You know, in one moment itmight be like some ghee and some
bread.
That's one of my favoritethings, by the way Ghee and
bread.
I like to toast the bread withghee, and another time it might

(01:25:21):
be, I don't know, a hot dog froma fast food truck or something
like that, but the energetics ofit is the same.
This is the energetics ofinspiration in the spirit.
See, when it's in the spirit,it's always good for you Because

(01:25:42):
it's nourishing.
The spirit is nourishing, itmakes it always good for you.
And when it's coming from mind,when it's coming from a mindset

(01:26:04):
that says the self is separateand this food is separate from
the self, it's always an attackon the body because it's making
the self separate, doesn'tmatter how good your nutrition
is either.

(01:26:28):
So thomas and I have beenplaying around with sensuality,
especially around food.
There's one thing that Inoticed when I first got here,
just observing Thomas eating,I'm going, hmm, he could have
some more sensuality with hisfood.
And so I started to play withthat.

(01:26:52):
I started to make certainthings hey, you want to try this
?
And he's like, wow, this is sogood, this is so decadent, it's
so good.
I'm like I know.
So I started telling him aboutfat.
And that's the fun thing aboutyou know, decadent fats.
It's like they feel so decadentand we've been taught that this

(01:27:15):
stuff, this kind of stuff,isn't bad for, is bad for us.
It'll make us fat, right.
So people have developed thismindset where there's eating out
of conditioning that says I'mgoing to prevent myself from
getting fat, I'm going to dogood.
Conditioning that says I'mgoing to prevent myself from
getting fat, I'm going to dogood, right, I'm going to, I'm
going to use low fat things.

(01:27:36):
And so then what happens is theeating.
You never believe that.
So then the eating loses itssensuality, right, the eating
itself loses its sensualitybecause, kind of like that, uh,
that mouth, even that mouth feel, you know, it's like there's a
sense of juiciness and goodness.

(01:27:57):
So you know, even somethingreally simple like switching
from low-fat yogurt to full-fatyogurt makes a big difference in
the way it feels, right.
And so then you go from justconsuming food to just keep on
consuming, consuming, consuming,and a lot of it's so mindless.

(01:28:17):
It's like this mindlessconsuming takes over to where
you're having a joyous,luxurious, uh kind of like an
erotic, even sexual, time withyour food, right?
Another thing that we've touchedupon, too, is that the whole
life you could say is sexual,like the whole thing is the way

(01:28:43):
the spirit is penetrating ourminds.
You can say it's so like that.
So then the experience becomeslike that.
And why wouldn't we want tohave our experiences like that?
That's why I like to just berolling around in the field,
like I have been, you know, justkind of like rolling around in

(01:29:04):
the field, going, hmm, how canthis just be like really juicy
and sensual, without bringingthe mind into it right, how does
?
How could this just be reallysweet and juicy and sensual?

Speaker 3 (01:29:19):
well, it is that everything is creation and
creator, so it's all sexeverything is diana saying.

Speaker 1 (01:29:26):
Everything is creation and creator, so it's
all sex.
It's fun how my wisdomdialogues go back and forth too.
I'm noticing this because someguys you know, part of it is
that I'm just a fucking idiot.
Okay, I've said this before.
I don't say this in a mean waytoward myself.

(01:29:46):
I'm not saying that in a meanway toward myself at all.
Don't get me wrong.
Okay, right, it's like dude,several months ago I was talking
about how the truth is erotic.
That was like one of the mainthings I was talking about.
The truth is erotic.
Oh my gosh, I feel so sexualand everything like that.
You know, and and so and sothen we're going through a

(01:30:11):
Course in Miracles and we'regetting to these deep dives and
Jesus is talking about, hey, sexis for procreation, not
recreation.
I was trying to say recreation,what I'm going to purify this

(01:30:34):
whole sexual thing toward bodies.
But see, here's the thing Ineeded to purify the sexual
thing toward bodies, becausethat was hooking me into
something.
It was hooking my mind intosomething where I was like, okay
, I just want to get unhookedfrom this.
You know, it's basically hookedinto this sense like I need a
body, and that helped me so much.
You see how it could just goback and forth like that it's

(01:30:54):
fine, you still use it forawakening.
So it's like, at that point intime it seemed like I needed
another body and a particularbody to be okay.
So I'm like, okay, what needsto be purified here?
Okay, it it's the sexualattraction to bodies, it's

(01:31:17):
making that body an object.
Let's say so then.
What I'm experiencing is I'mexperiencing it deeper now,
where it's not singling out sex,because sex isn't arising like
that.
It's arising as somethingthat's really neutral.
It's arising as somethingthat's across all things that I

(01:31:41):
seem to do, everything I seem todo.
I like to walk across the roomsexually right, sexually or
sensually right, actually,you're sensual.
Sensually.
Yeah, it's the same to me, Imean really, I mean it's just
this sense of making love in thefield.

Speaker 3 (01:32:03):
We do distinguish, I feel like I do distinguish that
you know there's a differencebetween the sexual and sensual
energy.

Speaker 1 (01:32:12):
Sexual and sensual energy.

Speaker 3 (01:32:14):
Yeah, many times sexual, is going for something.

Speaker 1 (01:32:17):
It is going for something.
I see what you're saying, yeah,and you know, certainly these
words can be interpreted however.
We need to see what we need tosee.
I know they really can.
They really can.

(01:32:39):
It's like when I say sexual,it's kind of like there's this
interaction where there's it'slike it's got a sense, like an
erotic sense with it.
It's like the whole body'senergy field Is for a
pass-through of all the otherenergies, like there's an

(01:33:00):
individual body's energy fieldand then there's all these other
energies that they're just notdoing any harm, let's say
they're not caustic to it, butthey just pass right through it
and it feels like a penetration.
It feels like a kind of apenetration.
It's like all these energies,even the thoughts, everything,

(01:33:22):
nothing gets stuck in the body'senergy field.
It just passes through it andit's a very sensual or erotic or
sexual thing.
And this is not like somethingthat has to do specifically with
the act of sex in a physicalsense.

(01:33:44):
It doesn't physically have todo, but it can include that.
It can certainly include that.
So it's not like it.

Speaker 3 (01:33:56):
Belief can be penetrated in creation.

Speaker 1 (01:34:01):
Yeah, yeah, it's a kind of it's.
It's kind of like a, asexuality that doesn't require
bodies, because it it includeseverything.
Like before anything is even aform, like before anything even
becomes a body or any kind ofform, is it allowed to be

(01:34:22):
penetrating you?
Is every thought allowed?
So it includes the thought andeven a thought that and I'm
gonna say especially especiallya delusional thought, right?

Speaker 3 (01:34:37):
we want to penetrate those well.

Speaker 1 (01:34:39):
Well, yeah, it's like .
It's like especially adelusional thought, because it's
like if we just allow it topenetrate the body's energy
field, it moves through, itpasses through, rather than
being stuck, instead of likestopping at the energetic let's
say energetic boundaries, likeno, I don't want that thought.

(01:35:01):
My boundaries are strong, Idon't want that thought.
And to me it's like any thought.
Earlier today the thoughtoccurred to me.
I hadn't heard this thought ina long time.
It's one of the funniestthoughts that occurred to me
ever occurred to me.
It's I hate my life, I want todie.
Those particular words occurredto me this morning, and you know

(01:35:22):
what the thing is.
They're not true.
They're just popping up likepop, pop, pop.
They don't really mean anything.
The very first time I ever sawthis thought, I was aware that
it wasn't me.
I was like what?
That is not me, that's not me.

(01:35:45):
And how long has that thoughtbeen playing unwatched?
I didn't even see it until Iwas apparently around 40 years
old.
I'm pretty sure that thoughtwas playing unwatched since I've
been a kid.
It sounds like a kid thought tome.

(01:36:07):
It sounds like a thought thatcame up when I was a kid.
Sounds like a thought that cameup when I was a kid.
But see, this is what Jesus ispointing.
It's a same oh yeah, she'ssaying it's the same, get me out
of here.
But see, here's the thing theydidn't even originate in time.

(01:36:27):
These thoughts didn't originatein time.
They originate with the thoughtof separation.
It's really the thought ofseparation.
So it's not like it goes backto some childhood thing or
something like that.
It's just that in the illusionof time.
This is how much it's beenplaying out repetitively, with
being unwatched because of thefear of watching them.

(01:36:49):
So now that I don't have anyfear of watching my mind which
it's been quite a few years now,and I've been watching it more
and more and more where I couldjust bring it out, I could just
say it to you guys.
Right, it's like this is whatoccurs.
These are errant thoughts.
They can bring on feelings ifthey're followed.

(01:37:11):
If they're not followed, thenyou don't get any bad moods or
anything.
I was talking with Thomas aboutthat too.
He's like yeah, I know, I wastalking with Thomas about that
too and I go.
Here's the thing about me Idon't get bad moods because I
watch my mind.
I see these thoughts and I seethat they're not true.

(01:37:32):
If I find myself in a bad mood,you know what happened.
I believed I probably didn'tsee the thought.
I didn't see it, I wasn'twatching it and I just believed
it.
But because my mind is sotransparent to me okay, my mind
is so transparent to me I'musing these thoughts to

(01:37:54):
demonstrate to myself that theillusion isn't true.
I just keep on having a goodtime.
Oh, that's going to make mehave an even better time.
Oh, it gets even more sexualnow, right, and it's like truly.
And it's like truly, I don'thave my own boundaries.

(01:38:24):
Kalama said I love the way youare unpacking this today.
You know what the funny thingis, kalama?
I do not know what the fuck I'mdoing.
I came up here and I sat downand, first of all, everything
was blurry and I felt reallyweird.
I felt like I was on apsychedelic of some sort.

(01:38:44):
I don't know, did someoneroofing my drink around here?
No, no, I'm just kidding.
No one was even here.
I was here by myself.
Apparently I was only drinkingwater, except for coffee in the
morning earlier.
Yeah, the thing is, when I sithere, I know it's going to be

(01:39:13):
fun, I know it's going to beedgy, but I don't know exactly
how it's going to go.
I don't know what's going to goon and how this is, and even
how anyone's going to perceiveit, and you know when it comes
to that it and you know when itcomes to that.
Of course I've had peopleperceiving.

(01:39:33):
You know I don't like it whenyou talk about me on wisdom
dialogues.
I don't want that and it's likeokay, well, here's the thing.

Speaker 3 (01:39:55):
If you don't want me to talk about you on wisdom
dialogues, don't hang out withme.

Speaker 1 (01:40:04):
That's all.
That's my advice.
Don't hang out with me, becausethat is what goes on.
This is, this is my thing.
You know, when I first movedinto um my friends, uh, my
friend's place when I moved inat Seaview, the first moved out
of um, that my first thing movedout of my house in HPP.

(01:40:26):
Oh, my gosh, first wisdomdialogues, first wisdom
dialogues.
You know what goes on.
I share my experience.
I don't even know what I'mgoing to share ahead of time.
I have no idea.
I have no idea.
I have no clue what's going tocome out.
I don't have no plan.

(01:40:46):
I don't know.
Some people didn't like it.
So, oh, yeah, to the tune ofstarting a group with about 100
and some odd people from aroundthe area to control me, get me
to stop doing stuff like that.
Yeah, it was awesome, I lovedit.
Yeah, it was awesome.

(01:41:09):
So I just replied on the group.
It was a Facebook messengergroup.
Aloha, everyone.
Just to let everyone know thisis a condition for me living
anywhere.
I talk about my life, I talkabout everything.
That's just what I do.
And I told her I'm willing tomove out.

(01:41:33):
She's like, never mind, we'reokay.
And you know, if everything islooked at as helpful, which for

(01:41:58):
me, from my, from my point ofview, it is.
It's always helpful ifeveryone's, if everything's
looked at in as helpful.
What I notice is it helpseveryone else see it as helpful
too, because we are not thesepersonalities.
There is nothing to protecthere, there is nothing, and also
I'm not sharing in a way that'scondemning anyone.

(01:42:19):
No one's ever doing anythingwrong.
It's beautiful, it's absolutelybeautiful for me.
Conversation about going to theedge to test the edges of sex
and food, all the subjects yeahRight, it's like, hey, woo, I'm

(01:42:45):
not married anymore.
Now I can test all the edges ofsex, but I was always testing
the edges of food.
In fact, that's one thing thathelped with Thomas, you know,
because I was like, hey, youknow, fat is something that's
like really awesome to be eating, it's sensuous and stuff like

(01:43:07):
that.
And, like you know, apparentlyI'm in like really good shape,
especially if you say forsomeone over 50, apparently I'm
in really good shape, okay, notnot like overweight or anything
like that.
And and you know, like pretty,uh, pretty toned too, and I'm

(01:43:29):
like I've been doing this for 20years, this much fat.
So it's like that is definitelyhelpful for someone to go.
Oh well, you didn't just startthis like, no, I've been doing.
I, and you know I was on to itearly on too, because early on,
when everyone was doing wasworking out, I was like a battle

(01:43:50):
of the bulge person from thetime I was like 14.
It seemed like anyone.
Anything I ate made me fat, nomatter how hard I tried, I'd
always have some pudge on me,you know.
So it started to evolve when Iwas in my 20s and I go, you know
what I'm getting the sense thatit's all energy, and I was

(01:44:12):
already getting the sense ofthat.
It's the way energy passesthrough this energy field.
I couldn't articulate that, butI was already getting that
sense.
It's the way energy passesthrough this energy field.
So I started to look at thatand then I started to experiment

(01:44:33):
.
I worked in an office, I workedin a law firm and I went to
lunch every day when I worked ina law firm.
So what I would do is try toeat low-fat.
For years I'd try to do likeI'd go out and I'd get broccoli.
How old was I?
About 26.
I'd get broccoli and I'd getrice, you know, and some low-fat

(01:44:55):
chicken breast, some dry-asschicken breast.
This is my meal that I thoughtwas healthy.
Some dry chicken breast, riceand broccoli.
Anyone relate with that?
Some 80s healthy food right.
Some people are still on that.
I'm like man, you're from the80s the 80s food right Some
people are still on that.

Speaker 3 (01:45:15):
I'm like man, you're in.

Speaker 1 (01:45:16):
You're from the eighties, the eighties, lean
cuisine.
There we go, yeah, yeah.
So I was just start toexperiment and I would eat, like
that.
I come back to my desk and Ifeel tired and bloated and so,
uh, and so I'm just watching.
Um, you know that this is athing to just be observing
things, right, just beingobservance.
So I went out to lunch with afriend another time and we went

(01:45:39):
to Mediterranean food and Iwasn't.
I just was like, okay, I'm justgoing to eat what I want to eat
today.
I'm not going to try to be on adiet, I'm going to eat whatever
I want to eat, what I wanted toeat.
This was my first experimentwith like okay, can I go against
the grain of what society issaying is healthy and going to

(01:46:01):
make me thin, right?
So I experimented withsomething.
I don't remember what it was.
I remember it being a fattymeat, because I prefer that to
chicken breast.
Chicken breast sounds likepunishment.
It may have been lamb.
There was definitely lots offat in the meal.

(01:46:23):
And then I went back and Inoticed I wasn't bloated and I
felt fine.
I didn't feel tired, bloatedand I felt fine.
I didn't feel tired.
So I go oh, I just perked rightup.
Maybe it's true what I thoughtwhen I was 17.
A thought occurred to me when Iwas 17.
What if everything that youenjoyed eating was actually good

(01:46:45):
and healthy for you?
And then, so here I am likealmost 10 years later, and I'm
going wait a second, I'm goingto try this.
So I started doing that.
I started just eating thethings.
I started going out to thisFrench cafe where they had like
a shot of espresso and just asmuch cream, heavy cream on top

(01:47:09):
of it, and you'd actually drinkthe espresso through the heavy
cream on top of it and you'dactually drink the espresso
through the heavy cream.
And I was just enjoying mymeals so much and I was noticing
that I was feeling way betterand actually some of that pudge
was going away.
So it's like it's like testingthese different things, testing

(01:47:32):
these different edges and seeinglike how can I experience more
sensuality without having to?
When we think of sensuality, wethink of needing another body
or something in particular bodyor something in particular.

(01:48:00):
It's really just with theability that you're always given
and the right to make apreference for something that
feels good.
In the same way, it's the rightto decline anything that
doesn't feel in alignment withyour energy.
You always have that right todecline anything that doesn't
feel in alignment with yourenergy, right?
You always have that right todecline it.
And for me, here's one thingthat I noticed too with this
experimentation with sexualenergy is I'm way more likely to

(01:48:25):
feel like oh, okay, I want tosee like how this goes.
You know, maybe I'm not feelinga yes or a no.
It's not always cut and driedlike that.
It's kind of like a let's see,I'm not sure Right.
And it's like, really, ifsomeone comes up and they're
like kissing you with theirtongue or something like that,

(01:48:47):
it's not like the actual kissingwith the tongue.
That's the part it's like areyou going to engage that?
Are you really going to engagethat?
You know, and basically youstart kissing back or not.
It's simple like that.
You don't even have to tellanyone anything.

(01:49:07):
It's just kind of like oh, it'senergy, it's all energy thing.
It's just kind of like oh, it'senergy, it's all energy.
I did tell the cute littlecartel guy over in Ajijic.
I had my own cartel guy rightoutside the door.
He's a cartel drug dealer.
He's always right out there.

(01:49:28):
He's like a young dude, he'sprobably like in his 20s or
something, and he's alwaystelling me he loves me.
And so I started hugging himand I started kissing him and
then he went to stick his tonguein my mouth and I just go oh,
no, no, that's not what I meantby it.
He's like OK, OK, ok, and hejust stopped doing that

(01:49:51):
altogether.
And he doesn't speak anyEnglish either.
He could just tell by theenergy.
I was like oh, I think he gotthe wrong impression.
But you know, I'm more likelyto decline like, like in a cut

(01:50:13):
and dried way.
I'm more likely to decline whenanyone wants to play with me in
a manipulative way.
When I'm recognizing thatsomething's manipulative, I'm
like oh no, thank you right then, uh, you know, I'm more more

(01:50:33):
likely to decline.
It's just like, oh, no, thankyou, and just like and just like
no, I exit that wholeconversation.
It's just not even um,interesting to me.
That's like really fast.
Durga is writing me, says Ifeel supported by your
remarkable transparency.
You laugh at murderous thoughts, thoughts I share deeply.

(01:50:57):
I have never experienced ateacher so real, inspiring and
transformational.
Thank you.
You are talking about it in away that's rare and great.
That's from Kalama.
Thank you, my love.
Yeah, like I said, I don't knowwhat I'm doing.

(01:51:18):
I am really just devoted to thetruth and as I'm talking to you
guys, I'm hearing what it isthat's coming out.
There's that too.
Okay.
What's Glenn saying?
Nobody has a choice in whatthey perceive their elf doing?

(01:51:45):
Hooray, oh, thank you, glenn, Ilove that.
That's so good.
Yeah, nobody.
It's like whatever you perceiveyourself doing, that's perfect,
that's the rule.
If you perceive yourself havinga, that's perfect, that's the
role.
If you perceive yourself havinga preference, playing out a
preference, having a boundary,not having a boundary, that's
all the role.
That's all the role you'replaying, then he says I love you

(01:52:15):
, freaking idiot.
I love you too.
He loves me, he loves me big.
Thank you, glenn.
I appreciate you.
Thank you, yeah, I'm sure youknow, if I was identified as an

(01:52:40):
ego which I'm not, that's why Ican let it flow there would be.
This would be hard, this wouldbe difficult.
That's why people watch thisand go oh my gosh, that's a lot
of transparency.
Yeah, yeah, it would bedifficult if I'm identified as
an ego, and you know, I've heardfrom my friends too.
You know I'm like is thatdifficult for you?

(01:53:01):
And my friends will go yes, butI'm devoted to awakening, so I
love it, right, and you knowit's like the more you recognize
that you're not an ego.
Anything that arises, anythingthat is said, any experience

(01:53:28):
that is had to, becomes perfect.
Any experience that is hadbecomes perfect.
I noticed that for myself.
I got to play it out really goodwhen I was in Puna back in 2018

(01:53:50):
or so.
My daughter was going aroundPuna basically telling people
what a fucking terrible person Iam, while I'm having wisdom
dialogues too I'm having wisdomdialogues every week and my
daughter's over and saying stuffabout me being a terrible

(01:54:10):
person, and she even tells meshe goes.
Mom, I'm sorry.
Even tells me she goes.
Mom, I'm sorry.
I have been talking about youin a really bad way to a lot of
people and I'm sorry about thatbecause I know it's ruining
wisdom dialogues and I go.
No, it's not, I go.
It's the best for wisdomdialogues.
You're the best.
Keep on doing what you're doing.

(01:54:31):
This is perfect for it.
And you know it's like everyweek I would show up and
sometimes people would havequestions about it.
They'd be like hey, yourdaughter, though, she's talking
like that and like that, and I'mlike, I'm glad she's expressing
herself.
It's perfect for me.
This is exactly what I'mtalking about.
Whatever it is, it's perfectfor me.

(01:54:51):
Exactly what I'm talking about.
Whatever it is, it's perfectfor me.
I'm not trying to change theillusion.
This is what's coming up latelytoo.
It's like, whatever it is thatseems to be coming up in the

(01:55:17):
perception, it's perfect.
It's perfect for me.
Whatever I seem to do, I'm notwalking on eggshells, trying to
be the perfect person that noone gets mad at.
If anyone needs to be mad at me, that's perfect for me.
That is perfect for me.
That's perfect for me.
That is perfect for me.
You know people ask me they'relike well, if you're like that,
how are your relationships?

(01:55:38):
My relationships are great.
I don't make anyone a victim,not even making them a victim of
myself.
That's ridiculous.
I'm not capable of doing orsaying anything wrong.
I don't buy into that stuff.
Thank you, kalama.
Kalama says we are powerfulbeings and you saying it like

(01:55:59):
this gives us power to beourselves and free.
Yeah, of course that's what Iwant.
Because you are me, because youare me, I know I can handle
whatever kind of perception Iget from being this transparent.

(01:56:21):
I can handle any perception.
You know I can handle anyperception of any person,
anywhere.
Anyhow, you know, early on, myhusband got the perception that
I was saying things that hewould not like on wisdom
dialogue.
So he just never came and neverlistened Right.
And then, once I separated fromhim, he started coming and I

(01:56:43):
talk about him too, right there,and he'd go.
I get it.
This is awesome.
We're seeing through theillusion.
We're seeing through theillusion.
We're seeing past the illusion.
This is what we're doingtogether.
It's not a matter of thebehavior or anything like that

(01:57:06):
being the thing.
It's the thought.
It's the thought.
It's the thought, the egothought that actually is
meaningless.
So recently, when we were doingsome ACIM deep dives, jesus was
very adamant about your mind isunwatched.

(01:57:29):
Your mind is unwatched.
Watch your mind.
When you watch it, you're goingto find stuff in there that you
don't want to look at.
Look at it and you'll see stuff.
When you start looking at it,like for me, I want to look at
it, I get a kick out of it.
I'm like, oh really, that's theway it's presenting it.

(01:57:51):
That's the way it's presentingit.
That's the way it's presentingit now.
Okay, I'm going to go soon.
It's after five.
I love you guys.
Kalama, you have one lastcomment for me here.
Guided by Course in Miracles,the wisdom dialogues is a
perfect match, no matter if youknow what you're doing, thank

(01:58:12):
you.
Thank you for that comment.
I love you.
Okay, so I'll be back onWednesday.
That's two days from now.
Same time, 3 pm.
This is when we're doing it.
3 to 5 pm and same channel, andI love you so much.
Go to hopejohnsonorg.
You can donate there.

(01:58:33):
If you like my work, go overthere and donate.
This is 100% funded bydonations and sweet peeps like
Thomas being so generous with mehere.
Let's see what else One-to-onesI offer one-to-ones there and
you can.
If you're listening to thislater, you can go there to find
the Zoom link.

(01:58:54):
To come on with me on Zoom.
So until next time, yay.
So, juicy, yes, mahalo Alohaand a hui hou, yay, bye, thank
you.

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Beyond Ego Forgiveness | Wisdom Dialogues, Sedona | September 15, 2025

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}Beyond Ego Forgiveness | Wisdom Dialogues, Sedona | September 15, 2025