From Diagnosis to Freedom: Debbie Thomas’ Radical Healing and Soul-Tending Journey

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:16):
Welcome to the Hope Unlocked podcast.
I'm your host, kristen Kurtz,and I'm also the founder of New
Wings Coaching.
I help and empower wildheartedand adventurous women of faith
feeling caged and stuck, unlocktheir true purpose and potential
, break free from limitationsand thrive with confidence,
courage and hope.
If you're curious to learn moreabout coaching with me, head to
newwingscoachingnet and be sureto explore the show notes for

(00:38):
ways to connect with me further.
Get ready to dive in as weuncover empowering keys and
insights in this episode.
So tune in and let's unlockhope together.
Welcome to the Hope Unlockedpodcast.
I'm Kristen Kurtz, your host.
I pray this episode is like aholy ivy of hope for your soul.
Please help me.
Welcome Debbie Thomas to theshow.

(00:58):
I am so excited to have herhere with us today.
We actually met through amutual friend and at a very
divine time.
We were just talking about thisbefore we got started.
Just these convergences thathappen with people, and I
definitely feel like that wasthe case last year.

(01:18):
Before we get into that, wouldyou be open to telling us a
little bit about yourself?

Speaker 2 (01:24):
Sure Well, thanks for the great introduction, kristen
.
I'm so blessed to have met youa year just about a little under
a year ago, through our mutualfriend, amy.
Yeah, I am just a regularperson who, 12 years ago, was
diagnosed with a stage threecarcinoma on the left side of my

(01:45):
head while going through arotten second marriage very
toxic marriage and was going toget the cancer taken out like
everybody else and ended upgoing down a path that I never
expected to journey down andhealed the cancer naturally, and
I have to say it's the bestthing that ever happened to me,
and so I have a story to tell onhow the body can heal itself

(02:08):
when given the correct tools todo so, and I'm just so grateful
to be here.

Speaker 1 (02:14):
Yes, thank you so much.
Debbie actually was one whocame alongside me as well when I
was given a diagnosis from adermatologist for something that
I had on my nose and I'll justshare.
Like when I heard the diagnosisprior to that, I heard in my

(02:34):
spirit all clear, like I wasseeing that it was not going to
be what they were saying that itwas going to be and that I was
not willing to go down that roadthat you had the option for as
well.
And yeah, it was a pretty wildjourney.
But I would love for you tokind of backtrack for us, like

(02:56):
what that journey looked likefor you when you were given, you
know, similar diagnosis.
You know we were both on ourface, right, and yeah, tell us a
little bit more about what thatlooked like for you.

Speaker 2 (03:12):
Well, I think just leading up to getting that call
that nobody ever wants, thatsays you have cancer and it
really doesn't matter what kindof cancer I mean all cancer can
be deadly right.
So it doesn't matter where itis on your body.
That's a really scary moment inyour life that you don't think
you're ever going to go through.
And so at the time that thecall came in, I was just at a

(03:37):
real crossroads in my life.
I was in my second marriage.
I was terribly unhappy, totallyin fight or flight, had married
a man that I knew many yearsago in college.
That basically was kind ofliving a double life and I won't
get into that, that's a wholenother podcast.
But I'll just say that to saythat I learned so much through

(03:58):
this journey that there areemotional roots to cancer and, I
believe, to many dis-eases inthe body.
That it's all connected mind,body, soul, spirit.
So I'm so grateful for thatpart and I'm actually really
grateful for the time in my lifewhen the cancer came out,
because it forced me to deal andlook at the situation that was
going on in my current marriageand then deal with some undoubt,

(04:23):
with trauma from my firstmarriage and then from my second
marriage.
So the story goes that I had Ijust I kept getting lots of
headaches and I had this funkysore on the left side of my head
.
I'm talking for, I want to say,well over a year.
And finally, I used to ownChristian boutiques, I had

(04:46):
stores, I used to designChristian clothing and that was
my field.
I thought that was going to bemy field for the rest of the
year, or the rest of my life,excuse me.
I was very successful, loved it.
It was really my ministry.
But it was getting hard to dothat ministry when my marriage
is a mess and not feeling greatand I talk with my hands a lot
and at the time I had prettylong fingernails and I talk with

(05:07):
my hands and I I swiped theleft side of my head with one of
my nails and it felt likesomebody put a dagger in the
left side of my head and I justthought innately.
It was like this is not good,like this is not, this is not
normal.
It felt like an ice pick wentin my head.
So I went to the head and neckcancer center of Arizona.

(05:27):
I lived in Arizona 31 years, soat this point I'm living in
Arizona it's where I raised mykids and just thought, well, I
don't know what they do, theyfreeze it off, they.
You know I'm not thinking Ihave cancer, I'm just like I
don't know.
I mean, I'm not worried at all,I'm just like get it off, like
just freeze it off or whateveryou do.
And so the doctor comes in theroom and was a female doctor,

(05:48):
she was the one that I was toldto go to and she immediately
just said that's doesn't lookgood, let's take a punch biopsy.
So they take a very painfulAgain.
I'm not prepared for any ofthis and I think I'm just, you
know, really living in the areaof this is not my life right,
like I'm just kind of zoned outin other parts of my life.

(06:10):
So they do the biopsy.
They said we'll call you inlike five or six days.
Well, the very next day I'msitting there having lunch with
my then husband and they calland they're like you need to get
in here immediately.
This is a.
Actually they were worried thatit was a cranial carcinoma
manifesting as squamous cellcarcinoma.
But they're like it's the waythat this is presenting itself

(06:33):
and that's why they called soquick.
Like this is a type of cancerthat spreads very quickly.
Next it will go into lymphnodes, possibility of thyroid,
and then down to breast and Iknow nothing about cancer at
this point.
I own stores and down to breastand I know nothing about cancer
at this point.
I own stores and make Christianclothing and I'm like what,
what, what, what.
So she's like you need toschedule.
Here's the number.
Call this number to schedulewith one of our four surgeons.

(06:56):
You need to get in immediately.
So obviously I should have gonein, probably a year or even
before that.
I think it had been over a yearsince I've been having
different weird symptoms.
So of course I you know, I'mjust totally shaken up and not
really feeling great supportfrom my partner at the time for
many other reasons.
I had just caught him in a lotof lies and this whole second

(07:19):
life that he was living.
So I run in the kitchen, callthe place and and the nurse had
said on the phone like this isthe doctor you're going to want
for your type of cancer, causeit's on the left side of my head
, it's very close to my eye.
So I asked for that doctor andthat doctor had basically an
eight week waiting list.
They're like you're, it's goingto be a four hour surgery,

(07:40):
we're going to wheel you acrossthe hall for plastic surgery and
so for that type of window theycouldn't get me in.
Basically, for eight weeks iswhat I'm being told, and again,
this is all kind of still just ablur at the time.
I can't believe this is my life.
I'm like what, what stage, likewhat?
And so I said, well, I wantthat doc just put me down for
okay.
So I've got eight weeks andit's just not registering, but

(08:02):
I'm thinking eight weeks, that'slike where's the cancer going
to go by then?
So I hang up the phone.
I've got my appointment set andI'll tell you what, kristen, we
wouldn't be talking right now.
If I could have gotten in thenext day or the next week.
I would have had it cut out andmoved along with my life.
Probably I don't know if I'dstill be in the same marriage,
probably would have had multiplecancers come out in different

(08:24):
areas because of the way I wouldhave treated it.
Because when we puncture acancer cell it innately knows to
spread fast and far in the body.
So I didn't know that at thetime.
So I have to say I mean withright now, with chills head to
toe.
This was one of the biggestblessings in my life was this
cancer diagnosis and the factthat that particular surgeon who
I felt confident with thatthat's who I was supposed to go

(08:47):
to, that they couldn't get me infor two months.
So I started researching cancer.
I was raised on a big ranch inIllinois, big horse farm, and I
was raised by very hardworkingparents.
My dad was an attorney but healso was a polo player and my
mom taught pony club and we hadthis big, big farm and all of us

(09:07):
.
I'm second youngest to sevenkids and I was taught to roll up
your sleeves and get in it.
You get to work.
We shoveled stalls, we baledhay.
We were hard workers as kidsand that's really who I am,
through and through.
So I'm like, okay, I'm going tostart educating myself on a
cancer cell.
What is a cancer cell?
How does a cancer cell live?
You know why?
Why would I have cancer?
I'm in the gym every day, I'msuper in shape, like I eat well,

(09:31):
like I'm like, why do I havecancer?
So that's the beginnings of thestory and the diagnosis and it
led down this crazy.
I mean, even as I retell it somany times since then it's been
12 years I still think, like,thank you, lord, that this is
the journey you had me on.
I had no idea what was coming.

(09:53):
I was still going to go havethe surgery.
Well, lo and behold, he took medown a path to this naturopath,
and then this person at church,and then this functional
medicine doctor, and then thisraw food chef, and then this
frequency medicine specialist,and I went down this path where
each of these doors opened andit was led to this person, this
person, this person, and then Icreated my own, basically like

(10:16):
nine steps of, and it was by nomeans easy, but I created my own
healing path because of,basically, you know, eight to 10
hours of research a day.
I was obsessed with what is acancer cell?
How can you get rid of it?
Is it possible, like I'mfinding online, all these people
have done it naturally and I'mlike I didn't even know you
could cure cancer naturally,like how you know, and again,

(10:39):
this is 12 years ago.
You can find a lot more onlineright now, and I connected with
different people from all aroundthe world, mostly Australia.
They use a lot of black salve,which is one of the tools that I
use to pull the cancer out.
But the Lord just led me downthe path to meet the correct
people, or the people that hehad in mind, to help my body be

(11:02):
equipped to heal itself.
And that's really what it is mybody healed itself when given
the tools to do so.

Speaker 1 (11:09):
Yeah, well, I'm.
I'm gathering that people arewondering like what?
What did you learn?
Like, what did you find outinitially when you were doing
your research?
That was, I don't know like,maybe like the most shocking for
you, especially in this realmof you know, skin cancer,
because you know, even in my ownfamily, for myself, like over

(11:30):
the years you know, I've beenone who's very freckly right.
I'm spotted.
Yeah, fair skin they want youlike going in every year they
want.
At one time I was going inevery six months to get biopsies
and different things andgetting things frozen off and
not knowing right.

(11:51):
Because that's I think that's akey here is.
Debbie went on a researchjourney.
She felt well, part of it toowas that that delay, quote,
unquote where you would have towait eight weeks.
So you had time in between, butyou had the wherewithal to say

(12:12):
I want to know what is the whybehind this?
What is the root cause?
Could you like take us there alittle bit, like in your first
findings?

Speaker 2 (12:22):
Sure, Well and I'm just going to be brutally honest
here, I have nothing to hide,but I think my motives at that
point, in the very beginning,were very vain.
I thought well, they're tellingme there's a large tumor,
multiple tumors, and I'm alittle bit vain, you know, at 45
years old, and I didn't wantthere to be a giant hole on the
left side of my head.
So in my you know finite mindat the time I'm thinking well,

(12:50):
maybe there's a way, if I eatsomething or, you know, change
my diet or take some supplements, I can shrink the tumor so
there won't be as big of a holeon the left side of my head.
So that's the raw truth.
That's really what started thejourney of yeah.
But I also did want to know like, why would I cancer?
Like I'm super healthy, I livehealthy, I you know da, da, da,
da.
Well, so, as I touched onearlier, the first thing I
learned about cancer is that ithas a very thick cellular wall.

(13:14):
And the last thing, type thatwhen you go in and poke through
that thick cellular wall, thosecancer cells get really pissed
off and they spread fast and far.
And that's why we see, you know, sally Sue, that has breast

(13:36):
cancer, has gone through Westernmedicine to not I'm not going
to say to heal it, but to get ittaken out has done some chemo,
radiation, yada, yada, and I'mnot knocking anybody for doing
that.
But I will tell you, you know,we all go do the cancer walk and
we get all excited that thisperson's cancer free.
And then five, six or sevenyears down the road it's come

(13:58):
back.
It's in the spine, it's in thebrain, it's in the lungs.
If you understand, you knowit's like looking under the hood
of your car to understand howthe engine works, like, how does
gas work in a car?
Well, how do our cells becomecancerous?
So I learned that a cancer cellis nothing more than and I and
I like to minimize it when Italk about it, because in our

(14:19):
world, here in the United Statesat least, we've made cancer so
taboo and so scary that the onlyhope you have is to go to your
doctor and whatever he says todo you're going to do because
that's threatening your life,and that's it.
You have a one-way street tothe end of to get out of that
door, of whatever they have tooffer for cancer.
And I'm here to tell you that isnot true, and that's one of the

(14:42):
biggest things that I speak topeople.
I'm not going to tell you howto heal this or that.
I can share my journey, butwhat I do tell all of my clients
now is to be your own healthadvocate.
Look at your body.
You only get one.
You know, by the grace of Godhe gave us these amazing
machines that when we actuallycan unburden the toxic, figure

(15:03):
out what the toxic load is,lessen it in the body and then
replace it with tools, allnatural tools, to help the body
heal itself the way it wasdesigned to do it, you can
overcome dis-ease.
So I'm learning through.
So what you asked is early on.
What am I learning?
I'm learning that cancerdoesn't like to be pissed off.
You don't ever want to do abiopsy and I'm learning that I

(15:26):
need to become alkaline.
Cancer only grows in an acidicenvironment.
So okay, let's some elementaryfacts here.
What causes you to be acidic?
One of the biggest things thatcauses you to be acidic?
Besides your diet sugar,starches, red meat, caffeine,
you know, and everybodyprocesses that a little bit
different, but also undealt withemotions, high stress, cortisol

(15:50):
off the charts.
You're in fight or flight.
Toxic relationship, undealtwith trauma, undealt with hurt,
anger, resentment, shame, grief,you name it.
Well now, as I'm researchingthis, I mean this is literally
day one my eyes.
I mean I cannot read it fastenough.
I'm going well, that's me, allthose things like I'm in fight
or flight.
I'm literally like fighting formy life here trying to figure

(16:12):
out.
I'm two years into my secondmarriage and I'm literally
miserable.
I married a man that literallydoesn't exist total, I won't
label him and won't get intothat, but it I, I was married to
an imposter and I had to figureout how to get out of it.
He at the time had gotten a jobswindled in and gotten a job at

(16:33):
my dad's law firm, and so nowhe's, you know, on the on the
pay cycle at one of my dad's lawfirms and I got to figure out
now how to go tell my dad thatthis guy's a total shyster.
So that's right.
When the cancer hit, and nowI'm reading first day, thank God
for the internet.
Right, that cancer.
Can you know there's anemotional route to, I believe,

(16:54):
all cancers and that I need toget alkaline.
So then I start researching well, how do I get alkaline?
I've got to deal with theemotional part.
I get that which I don't reallyknow at the time how to do that
.
But I'm reading through okay, Ihave to do this.
And then also through my diet.
So then I'm looking up analkaline food chart.
Well, what foods do I eat?
You know I'm pretty smart girl,so I'm just trying to like put

(17:17):
these pieces together.
It's like a big puzzle and I'mfinding one piece at a time and
trying to figure out where itfits.
So I got on the phone.
It took me about two days tofind a raw food chef.
I learned that there's a lot ofalkalinity in raw food and when
we don't cook our food andagain, this isn't for everybody.
This was what I chose to do forme to help heal my body.
But when you're not eatingcooked food, that's all depleted

(17:39):
of all your nutrients.
When you're eating raw food,the body can assimilate it so
quickly and use it for fuel anduse it to heal the body.
So I'm looking up foods thatheal cancer.
I'm doing my juices every day.
I bought a really great juicer.
I hired this raw food chef inArizona at the time.
She's amazing, haley still goodfriends with her.
She literally is such a bigpart of my healing journey.

(18:02):
She would come every Thursday.
She'd bring a whole bunch ofrecipes.
She'd give me my shopping list.
We cleaned out the very firstvisit.
We cleaned out all of thepantry, all the cabinets, redid
all my spices.
And again I'm a healthy girl,like I've been pretty healthy my
whole life.
Like I'm thinking, well, whatare you going to clean out of my
cabinets?
Well, let me tell you there wasa lot and at the time I had

(18:23):
three stepkids and my three kids.
So you got, you got.
Three kids were coming up onEaster and they're they know
they're not getting chocolate orcandy.
I'm making everything raw which, looking back, my kids are, all
you know, adults and in theirtwenties now.
But they they, you know jokeabout that time of when they
couldn't have candy.
They were posting on, you know,instagram and Facebook, like

(18:44):
our moms lost her mind, like,and so people like their friends
were leaving like hidden Easterbaskets and bags of candy at
the front door so I wouldn't see, so they could take it up to
the room.
It was that bad but yeah.
So those were kind of the justthe baseline of I knew that now
that I'd had this biopsy I'mlike, okay, that wasn't good.

(19:06):
The cancer can spread, so that'snot good.
I need to get alkaline.
I know there's an emotionalcomponent.
I know there's some you knowthings that I can juice and some
supplements I should starttaking.
And and then, you know, nowwe're going into week after week
of hours and hours of researchof my type of cancer and
figuring out.

(19:26):
I have to say Arizona is a greatplace.
It's a great state in thePhoenix, you know, scottsdale,
chandler, gilbert area.
There's a lot of naturalhealing modalities there and
different functional medicinepractitioners and naturopaths
and homeopaths, so I had quitean array of people to choose

(19:46):
from to start making anappointment with.
I'm like I'm going to go do ablood draw and I'm going to go
here and do some ozone therapyand I'm going to go here and do
a lymphatic massage because asI'm going down this journey, I'm
learning all these differentthings that have to do with you
know could be related to cancerand this will help flush out the
cancer cells and help thelymphatic system get moving.

(20:08):
And yeah, and then I you knowone of my good friends who
worked at Mayo Clinic for manyyears and turned into a
homeopath and frequency medicinespecialist.
She said you've got to go seethis doctor.
His name's Dr Ketover.
He was a radiologist turnednaturopath 30 years into
frequency medicine.
He's in Scottsdale.
He'sover, he was a radiologistturned naturopath 30 years into
frequency medicine.
He's in Scottsdale.
He's expensive, he's hard toget into, but I've been going to

(20:30):
him for 17 years and he'shealed tons of things.
He'll he'll tell you what theroots of your cancer are.
And I said, huh, like what inthe world?
There's no way, yeah.

Speaker 1 (20:47):
Well, how, like can I just ask really quick how, how
far into this, like, how closeto the diagnosis was this timing
of this friend saying go seethis guy?

Speaker 2 (20:51):
about a week because I she was somebody that I really
respected in the health world.
She had been in westernmedicine for so long.
She was a trauma nurse and thenturned into all holistic,
everything and just very, verywise.
She's about 10 years older thanme and she's very emphatic when
she speaks to you.
It's like you need to do thisand you don't say no to Marianne

(21:14):
.
And so she said you need to gosee Dr Ketover.
Dr Ketover is retired now, sadlyso, because he had a long list
of clients for many, many yearsthat he helped heal through
something called frequencymedicine and to me back then 12
years ago I thought, well,that's nuts.
Like frequency, what likefrequency of a radio?
She said, debbie, just go.

(21:35):
I said what's he gonna do?
I've got this thing on sitelike what's he gonna do?
She said he's gonna run youthrough a bunch of scans.
You're gonna hold on to thesetwo copper isotope bars that
connect to a box, that connectto his computer.
Don't ask questions.
She said don't bring your cellphone, don't put makeup on, no
hairspray, no lotion, no perfume, no, nothing.
It's the most sterileenvironment and he'll.
He'll reprimand you if youbring any of those things in

(21:56):
there and he's not going to wantto know anything about your
cancer, he's just going to runscans and he's going to tell you
exactly what you need to do toget rid of the toxic burden in
your body.
I said, well sounds, you know,it sounds very interesting.
I'm not sure I believe whatyou're saying, like, not that I
don't believe it, but this isvery foreign to me.
And so she made a call, got mein earlier.

(22:17):
He had about a month and a halfwaiting list and next thing you
know, so this is about a weekafter.
I mean I remember like it wasyesterday.
I got the call on a Thursdayand it was the following I think
it was the following Friday I'msitting in Dr Ketover's office
in Scottsdale, arizona, holdingonto two cold copper isotope
bars, sitting in a chair with a70 something year old man who

(22:40):
did not talk much and I'mwatching his screen.
It looks like Chinese, it's likeyou know.
I don't know what's what he'slooking at or what this even is,
but I'm trusting the processbecause of my friend and we get
done.
He's running, you know, maybean hour worth of these scans and
he's saying very little and helooks at me and he said young
lady, open your mouth.

(23:00):
And I was like, okay, is thispart of the deal?
I opened my mouth and at thetime I have nine silver amalgams
you know fillings fromchildhood, and four that had
turned into root canals thatwere on the left side of my head
, like left side of my mouth,and he said he grabs a card of a
biological dentist in MesaArizona.

(23:21):
He slides it across the desk.
He said you need to get all ofthat metal on those root canals
out.
You are the most mercury toxicclient I've seen in 26 years of
practice.
And I I'm just going huh, likeI don't even know mercury.
I'm thinking when we're kids,you know, break a thermometer.
Your mom says scram, get out ofthe room.
This is all foreign to me andagain I thought that I was this

(23:43):
healthy girl.
I'm like I don't.
I said okay, what?
What do you mean?
So he explains a little bitmore, very short, not a wordy
guy.
He was a little intimidating.
And then he said you have oneother route to your cancer and I
said okay.
He said it's emotional.
He said in your liver you areholding onto absolute, you know,
toxic amounts of anger.

(24:04):
Let's see anger, resentment,shame and grief.
And I started to sob and hesaid and it's from a either a
death or a death of arelationship.
Well, it was.
It was my first marriage, youknow, the love of my life, the
father of my kids, you know, andthere wasn't healing there and
it was a very broken marriageand that's for another podcast.

(24:25):
But I knew.
And then here I'm in, Iattracted a somewhat similar
person and I'm in my secondtoxic marriage and don't know
how to get out.
So I am just sobbing and hesays it's okay.
He says I suggest that you goto a counselor and do some EMDR
therapy, some trauma work.
And you know he wasn'tinterested in hearing anything

(24:46):
of what.
What it was about.
That wasn't his role.
And then he imprinted a couplebottles of drops, these two
ounce little bottles that looklike water, and he said I'm
putting all the frequencies ofthe different vitamins, minerals
, emotional layers, you know,yada, yada, yada, detox for
heavy metals in these drops.
I need you to take them, aslabeled, morning and night and

(25:06):
come back in six weeks.
And my head was spinning.
I'm just looking at this whitehaired man going okay, okay,
okay, and I'm wiping the tearsaway and I remember going to the
front desk and paying the ladytaking my little drops and
walking to the car and I calledMarianne and she says how was it

(25:26):
?
How was it?
Was it incredible?
And I said I don't know what tothink, marianne, I said he got
right to the root of it.
You know I'm I got to get allthis dental stuff taken out and
I got to go see a therapist andshe said, debbie, whatever he
said, he's right.
You know, he cured my son'sADHD, he got rid of parasites
for me.
He's done this for this person,this for this person.
I said no, I know in my gut,like I know in my heart of

(25:50):
hearts, he's spot on, like whathe said was very valuable.
But I said I don't know whatthat machine was.
And she's like oh yeah, yourbody's an electrical system.
It measures frequency and thoseare the frequencies that you're
missing, that your body needsto help heal itself.
So, I hung up with her, got inthe car, drove about 40 minutes
back to my home in Chandler andjust prayed the whole way and

(26:11):
just said, lord, is this for me,like, is this?
I don't want to ever dosomething that's outside of what
you would have me do.
But this whole frequency thing,it makes total sense and I'm in
.
But if I shouldn't be in orinvolved in this, if this is not
of you, please show me.
And you know.

(26:32):
From from then on, the doorsjust kept opening wider and what
he showed me was how relevantthis type of um therapy is.
I don't even know if you wouldcall it therapy, but frequency
medicine and frequency scanningare very, very um.
They're able to pull back kindof the smoke screen and see
what's really going on with thebody and what the body's trying

(26:54):
to heal.

Speaker 1 (26:55):
Yes, well, and I love for the viewers if you're
listening, if you caught thisDebbie prayed about this and she
was asking the Lord for youknow.
Basically a confirmation, right?
Is this the path you want me on?
And it was very clear for you,right, that this was your next
step and I would have been okay.

Speaker 2 (27:16):
Like I'm, like Lord, I do not want to go where you
don't want me to go.
So if it was a no, then I wouldhave thrown those drops in the
trash and I don't even know if Iwould have gone to the
biological dentist.
But it was clearly a yes,because then of course, I race
home and I start doing moreresearch about mercury and about
what is EMDR, and I actuallyhave two sisters that are family

(27:39):
therapists and at the time Icalled one of them and I said
you know, what do you know aboutemotional trauma, emdr?
And she said you need to go.
Emdr is so worth like, you needto go, you need to go.

Speaker 1 (27:52):
And so yeah, I just, and that was the same day, like
you called your sister.

Speaker 2 (27:56):
Absolutely yes, and I , you know, I spared her the
frequency part because I thoughtshe's going to think I'm nuts.
Everybody's going to I thinkI'm nuts.
But I want to talk about theemotional piece because that was
her forte and she reiteratedthat that was something that I
needed to do.
So, of course, in my littlenine step healing protocol that
I sort of self-designed as Iwent down this little path of

(28:20):
meeting these different people,one of the big steps is the
frequency medicine.
You've got the raw food andgetting alkaline and now you've
got the emotional piece.
I've got to I'm learning aboutthe liver and that's where we
store that anger and thatresentment, and I had so much of
it from my first marriage.
I was holding on to so much Imean daily and then it was

(28:40):
coming bubbling up in thesurface, to the surface in my
second marriage of these oldwounds that I hadn't dealt with
in the first marriage.
So it's like double whammy.
I'm like I got to deal withthis stuff.
I just didn't know how.
I wasn't equipped.

Speaker 1 (28:53):
Right, right.
So, as you were, like otherthan you know, just seeing this
thing basically kind of manifeston your temple, was there any
other like health things thatwere coming up for you around
this time as well?
Yes, yes.

Speaker 2 (29:11):
That all makes sense.
Now I was getting really badheadaches and they would be
centered on that left side, likenear the left temple.
But this is another piece thatnow it makes so much sense.
So I tell my clients, if youhave these types of symptoms,
please go to a biologicaldentist or go get a frequency
scan done.
So over the years, I would sayprobably leading up to that, the

(29:34):
diagnosis, like three yearsprior, maybe every couple months
, maybe it'd be six months,maybe it'd be six months, maybe
it'd be two months.
There was never a rhyme orreason.
But on that bottom jaw.
So I had two root canals on thebottom jaw on the left side and
two on the top jaw so you canput your fingers along that jaw
line of top and bottom.
I would get little.

(29:56):
I don't know.
I know what they are nowbecause I spent two years at my
biological dentist.
I went there about every twoweeks for different treatments
and surgeries but I had puspockets so I would get terrible
pain where I had infections atthe base of all four root canals
.
I ended up going to thebiological dentist.
They run something called acavitat scan.

(30:17):
There's very few in the countrythat still have one.
The American Dental Associationwas after this guy because he
had healed so many people fromLyme and lupus and lots of
cancers.
They would fly in from all overthe world to go to him.
His name's Dr Margolis.
Of course he's retired now too.
I used to send all my clientsto him until he retired.
But he ran a scan on all fourof those root canal sites and

(30:40):
you can be rated from a one tofour based on how infected they
are, and one at the least fourat the most all four were fours,
and I had pus pockets at thebase of all four of those root
canals, so two on my upper jaw,two on my lower and they would
get swollen, inflamed.
I could feel them underneath myjaw and so I would find myself

(31:02):
throughout the day taking likemy forefinger or thumb and
pressing deep into it, almostlike when you have a knot on
your neck and you just pressinto it to relieve it.
I, you know, I got so used toit.
I own stores, right, I'mtalking to customers all day, so
I'd find myself.
You can even see in picturesI've got like one.
You know my thumb is up againstmy jaw because it just became a

(31:26):
regular thing where I wouldpress that infected pus pocket
to relieve really what the itwas pooling a bunch of gunk
there, all these toxins and yuck.
And that's actually a reallyinteresting story because when I
got I had two cavitationsurgeries.
He made me do them six monthsapart, so we did the bottom two
and then we did six months ofhealing, then we did the top two

(31:48):
.
And I'm talking, kristen, likemore.
This was a surgery nobody wantsto have.
These were all in big molars.
So they crack the molar, theyextract the molar and the post,
which the post is full of allkinds of heavy metals, mercury
being one of them, cadmium, lead, beryllium I had them all.
I mean, I was off the charts.

(32:08):
And so many metals they take itout.
I did not want to do any typeof dental implant.
I was so afraid of putting anymore toxic substances into that
subcutaneous tissue in my mouththat had you know, was infected
already.
But what they do is after thesurgery they do red light
therapy, they do a vitamin C IV.
You're in the office foranother two hours.

(32:30):
They're treating that opensocket, they pack it with
probiotics and but they scoopout some tissue from each of the
sockets and then they send itto a lab and like four or five
weeks later you get this likesix-page report.
And so I got my first reportbefore the second surgery and it
was so interesting.
So first of all there was tonsof cancer cells.

(32:53):
There was some Lyme in there,which I grew up on a big horse
ranch in Illinois right near theWisconsin border.
We were bit by ticks all thetime.
As kids we had woods on ourproperty, we'd go climb the
trees, so I definitely had Lymelaying dormant in my system.
And then, but this is the mostinteresting one there's all

(33:14):
kinds of parasites like in youknow these long words.
Of course I'm Googling each oneand one of the main one that was
in both of those sockets andthen in the other two sockets
when I had the surgery sixmonths later and got that report
, this crazy parasite I'll haveto look at my reports to tell
you the name of it.
I don't recall offhand becauseit was a very long word, but it

(33:34):
came from a certain region inAfrica and my little sister I'm
the second youngest of seven andmy little sister's name is
Susie and she graduated fromGeorgetown University in African
Studies and was over in Africafor three years teaching at a
Catholic mission and I went overand saw her the summer before I

(33:54):
got married in my firstmarriage and spent quite a bit
of time in the bush in Namibiaand literally lived in the bush
Like it was I never.
It was one of the neatestexperiences of my life, but I
brought back some seriousparasites from there that lodged
themselves into my gum tissue.
So there's a fun fact.

Speaker 1 (34:14):
Yeah, so who knew that that was possible?

Speaker 2 (34:18):
I know I mean this again, and here you know the the
um, the dental journey.
The immediate thing that I didis I went and scheduled.
I went and saw Dr Margolis andthen we scheduled to have the
silver Morgans talk taken out.
So we did them in quadrants, soI was there like every two or
three weeks for one quadrant butthe surgeries were.

(34:38):
I had already pulled out thefour tumors.
I, you know, I had alreadydealt with so many things and
had gone way deep down therabbit hole of healing cancer
naturally and was convinced Icould do it by the time I had my
first cavitation surgery.
So when it came back with thatparasite, at that point my mind
frame was like, well, of coursethat makes sense, you know,

(34:59):
because all the research I'ddone and then learning from each
you know doctor or specialistthat I had gone to, and hearing
their stories and putting ittogether with my story, I'm like
I now know and I tell myclients that cancer has very
definite roots.
There's typically it can be allof these or one of these or two
of these, but there's typicallyalways a parasitic route.

(35:20):
There's typically always atleast cancers have one of these.
So parasites, heavy metals,emotional and then just the
toxic burden.
So like chemicals, chemical,you're chemically toxic.
Your exposure to chemicals yeah.
Oh my gosh yeah.

Speaker 1 (35:40):
I mean, I've done a lot of research myself and I I
don't like, I don't know at all,and I know you've definitely
done a lot more research than meand I've learned so much more
from you as well.
For those who are listening and, um, you know they're like oh
my gosh, I have metal in myteeth.
Like what do?
What do I do I?
You know, I'm just imaginingsomebody who has maybe never

(36:01):
taken a more holistic route andmaybe they are dependent on, you
know, insurance and cause.
That, typically, is where a lotof people go.
Well, I need to only go wheremy insurance covers we don't
have a lot of money.
What would you say to somebodywho's like what would you say to
somebody who's like what do Ido if we don't have a lot of

(36:21):
extra funds?

Speaker 2 (36:23):
Yeah, the sad part about that is that when you do
go to a biological dentist andall the treatments I had done,
you know of course insurancedidn't cover any of it, right,
because it's outside the dentalrealm.
Healing conference this weekendin Austin and I talked to a lot
of people at my booth abouttheir dental work and people
that were going through breastcancer, uterine cancer, ovarian

(36:44):
cancer, and they were openingtheir mouth saying, after
hearing my story, and saying,well, I've got all this metal.
I have three root canals, Ihave four, you know silver
amalgams, blah, blah, blah.
Should I go get it out?
And I said no, not, not so fast.
I said you know, the best thingyou can do is have your heavy
metals tested, whether it'sthrough blood work, or you're
going to a you know abioresonance scanning

(37:06):
practitioner like that's what Ido for a living now or you can
go to a bio dentist and maybejust figure out if you are what
we call off gassing, thatmercury and those metals in your
mouth, because my story is thatthose silver amalgams were put
in in childhood and so over theyears what had happened is,

(37:27):
every time I chew, well, onemercury does off gas when you
chew, but it just depends howmuch is releasing, like how old
the fillings are and how bigthey are.
But I would have pieces of themercury come out like I'd be
chewing and I'm like, oh, thishard rock thing, and then next
thing, you know, it turns into aroot canal.
So that's how my root canalshappened, is parts of the
fillings were falling out andthen they turn into a root canal

(37:50):
.
So my answer to that personbecause yeah, insurance will not
cover that is that I wouldn'tbe so quick to go run and take
out the metals in everybody'smouth, because you can, you know
, again, wake the beast and youcan cause a whole lot of
Furchheimer effects and detox,detoxing way too fast, and throw

(38:12):
your body into a healing crisis, like it can be really bad.
Um, so I would do some sort oftesting.
And then, as far as thefinancial piece, I will say this
if you do find that you aremercury toxic and you are it is
leaking out.
It wants to go up or down, soit typically drains to thyroid.
We any of my breast cancerclients I always ask to look in

(38:36):
their mouth or talk about theirdental work because that those
metals go down the jawline, tothe lymph nodes, to thyroid and
then to either or both breasts.
The other place it goes isright up into the brain.
So that's where we see a lot ofour dementia, alzheimer's,
parkinson's.
A lot of those have very heavymetal roots to them, lots of
mercury, lead, cadmium.

(38:57):
So you want to look at that andthink, well, how bad is it and
how much money would it cost?
Because this could be.
You know, this could change thequality of my life.
This could be life-threateningif left undealt with.
So my advice is don't mess withthem unless you know for sure
and you've done some sort ofmetal testing to show that you

(39:18):
are actually leaking the mercury.
You're going to off gas some ofit.
Again, mine were 30, some yearsold.
My fillings were and that wasthe root of all the issues the
root of the root canals.
But I would also say you know,if you need to figure out how to
save some money, if you know,save some money for a surgery or

(39:38):
for a procedure to get them out.
And I will make one comment onthat, because I've had several
people at my booth this weekendwho had healed their own cancer
or were going through cancersome wonderful people.
But some of them were throwninto cancer by going and getting
their uh, silver amalgams fillout and they just went to a

(39:59):
regular dentist.
They did not go to one thatdoes not have the exhaust fan.
The doctor should be completelysuited up.
It looks like a space helmet on.
They cover every ounce of yourskin.
You have a dental dam in yourmouth.
You have a hood over youliterally look like you have a
spacesuit on, because when yourelease that mercury and you
take it out, they're pulling itout of your molars.

(40:22):
It goes into the atmosphere andwill reabsorb subcutaneously
right back into your mouth, butinto your skin, into your eye
sockets, I mean everywhere.
And so I hear these stories ofpeople over the last 12 years or
10 years of seeing clientswhere all of a sudden they got
lupus, they got an autoimmune,they got Crohn's, they got

(40:43):
cancer and it started rightafter they had, you know, five,
six or ten silver amalgams takenout at a regular dentist.
They were exposed to massivemercury because they this dental
office didn't have a way toexhaust it out and didn't
carefully extract the mercury.

Speaker 1 (41:04):
Wow, debbie, you're actually like kind of putting
something together for me.
I think that might've been whathappened to me several years,
like probably 50 years ago.

Speaker 2 (41:10):
Really, I hear it all the time, Kristen, and I'm
bringing it up right now becausethis weekend I talked to
hundreds of people with cancerand many of them were related to
the mercury in their mouth, andthere was a couple of dentists
there on the panel that werespeaking that this is all that
they deal with is cancer relatedto root canals and silver
amalgams.
So, yeah, that is something, ifthat was the case, for you just

(41:34):
to know that, maybe there'ssome, you know, chelation
therapy or some heavy metaldetoxing that you want to do on
a continuous basis.
You know, foot detox bath,obviously lymphatic.
Keep that lymph system going,because that's our little trash
collector of the body.
That liver is where the metalsprocess through.

Speaker 1 (41:52):
So yeah, did you just ?

Speaker 2 (41:54):
go to a regular dentist.

Speaker 1 (41:56):
Yeah, yeah, because.
I remember him like I'mliterally having this in.
I, I, I guess kind of a visionof being in the chair, and I
remember him saying let's takethese out and put in the white
whatever that is.
I don't know what the white is,oh the white composite.
Composite.

Speaker 2 (42:13):
Yes, yes, oh, my gosh , yeah, okay, and that probably
was.

Speaker 1 (42:18):
shortly after that I started having like thyroid
problems and I mean there wasother factors that.
But, as you know, the spot thatmy cancer was on my nose, which
is very close to my mouth, Veryclose to your mouth.

Speaker 2 (42:41):
Yep, that is correct, and the fact that you know it
does.
Those metals drain down to thethyroid and when we have what I
call like a blanket of metalsover the thyroid, the thyroid
becomes like inactive.
It can't do what it needs to do.
It can't produce the hormonesto balance the body.
A lot of times when we seeunderactive thyroid it's, you
know, it's because of metalscoming right from the mouth.
Yeah well, much more.

Speaker 1 (43:03):
I want to be sure that we share your story, um, of
the black salve, because itactually is.
That's part of why I soconnected with you was because
I'll just back it up for onesecond, absolutely because I'm
so spotted and I have, you know,when I was little, people are
like no, it's angel kisses.
I'm like, okay, whatever.

(43:24):
I happened to sit next to alady on an airplane probably
seven, eight years ago and wewere just comparing skin stories
because that's what, you know,freckled people do, that's right
.
And she was like, if you ever,if you ever run into a problem
where it turns into skin canceror whatever, you need to use
this stuff.
So she told me what it was, andI am a resource collector.

(43:48):
My method of the madness is totake a website and email it to
myself with a label in thesubject line Did that?
And that was actually when Igot this diagnosis last know
diagnosis last year.
It was one of the first thingsthat came to mind, so I knew
that it was a key, but I held onto it for a little while.
Now, when my friends made thatconnection Amy, our mutual

(44:12):
friend she was like you got tohear she's like I don't know why
I didn't think to to connectyou with Debbie, but you got to
hear her story, so can you kindof tell us more about what that
looked like for you and yourjourney?
Sure, yeah, and decimate thiscrap, yeah.

Speaker 2 (44:33):
Right, go after it Absolutely Well again in all my
you know wonderful research.
About two weeks into mydiagnosis and waiting for my
surgery you know I've gottenalkaline took me about seven
days.
I'm testing my pH every day anddipping a strip in my urine.
So I'm feeling really goodabout that.
But also trying to think of howam I going to shrink this tumor

(44:56):
, if that's even possible.
And I ran across some differentthings online that talked about
black salve and about a guynamed Greg Canton, c-a-n-t-o-n,
who's got a great story.
I immediately resonated withhim.
He's like such a warrior forhealing disease.
Naturally he had to beextradited out of the US because
he was making I mean, if youcan even believe this, it's

(45:18):
something you can grow, grow inyour garden for probably 10
bucks and it's four herbs thatyou boil down and make into a
blacks, you know, a blackpoultice, kind of like a tar,
and he was, you know,distributing it for very
inexpensively to differentchiropractors and homeopaths and
naturopaths all across theUnited States and it was pulling

(45:41):
out cancer, all different typesof cancers lots of breast
cancer, pancreatic cancer, head,neck and chest cancers, any
type of tumor that's close tothe skin.
So it's not going to work forlike a blood or brain cancer.
But when you know you've got atumor that's close to that
outside dermal layer, you putthe salve on and basically the

(46:02):
blood root in it goes in andpulls, starts to pull the cancer
out.
So I saw his story online.
I had joined some private groupson Facebook about healing
cancer naturally and one of thembrought up black salve, which
led me to Greg Canton, which ledme to find that he is at that
time was in South America makingthe salve, basically in the

(46:24):
Amazon jungle, and that youcould get it from there.
They did.
It would be hit or miss.
They had a place where youcould order it from the United
States that would bring it infrom South America, but
sometimes you'd go to thewebsite and they were shut down.
So he spent some time in prisonin the United States for using
this and I mean that was justlike so up my alley.
I'm like are you kidding me?
Yeah, like how is this not okay?

(46:46):
And this was also like pullingthe wool back you know, from
over my eyes for all of my lifeabout the healthcare system and
Western medicine and the FDA andall the things in our crappy
food system.
I'm getting so angry and I'mlike, well, I've got, you know,
at this point I've got six moreweeks to wait.
So why don't I order the salve?
And I'm going to try it?

(47:07):
And by the time that I orderedit and it took, you know, three
or four days to get there,that's I was just immersed,
obsessed with just watching.
I found so many differentvideos and then I found this
woman her name is Susie which isnear and dear to my heart.
My mom is a Suzanne, my sisteris a Suzanne.
I love that name, but she issomebody in one of these groups
that's like if you want to usethe Black South for any type of

(47:28):
cancer, reach out to me.
I don't charge anything, butit's basically my ministry and
I'll help you through it.
So basically my ministry andI'll help you through it.
So she's in Australia.
So I reach out and we do a zoomcall.
Back then it was Skype and she'slike oh yeah, this is what you
do.
So when you get it, you'regoing to put it on, leave it on
24 hours.
It's going to burn and pull andyou know, some is worse than

(47:49):
others, depends how deep thecancer is.
You know, yada, yada, and Isaid okay.
And I said can, would it beokay if I?
You know, emailed, you, textedyou to ask.
She said morning, noon or night.
She said, debbie, this is whatI'm, I'm supposed to be doing.
And so I did.
She was like Kristen, for Imean, I can't take all the
credits.
I feel like she was so amazingfor me, but like when you came

(48:09):
to me, I'm like I was your Susie, susie was the one that you
know it's like everybody hassomebody before them.
She was my black salve mentor,um then, quite an amazing woman
herself, um, single mom and justa wonderful lady.
And in Australia, I mean, we'vealways joked about like at some
point we'll meet each other.
But so, sure enough, I got thesalve, I put it on where the

(48:31):
biopsy had been and holymacaroni, uh it.
It wasn't 24 hours for it tostart burning.
I would say within the firstthree minutes I was scared.
I thought what have I done?
It hurt so bad, it was pullingso deep and by the 24th hour,
when you get to actually wipe itoff, I mean I literally am

(48:52):
sitting there by my phonelooking at the time, can't wait
to wipe it off, thinking thatthe pain will go away and it
doesn't.
And I was, you know, somewhatprepared because I'd watched
videos, I'd heard other people'sstories.
You know I educated myself forprobably 100 hours at that point
on Black Sab and, sure enough,my first tumor.
I have it written down in myjournal.

(49:14):
But I pulled out four tumors infour months and each one was
roughly 30 days.
So I think the first one waslike 26 days, the second one was
28 days, the third one was like31 days, but it's those four
herbs but basically the bloodroute goes in, pulls that cancer
out, keeps it capsulated.
So it's not like a biopsy, it'snot spreading and it will pull

(49:36):
out those irregular cells andthen when you've got that, what
we call an Escher, which is atumor, when you've got that
coming out and it's fullyreleased and comes out, you will
have a hole in the side of yourhead and then you'll decide,
based on if there's little whitespots, what we call the
tentacles of cancer, whetheryou're going to apply the salve
again.
So I went through four roundsof it, pulled out four tumors

(50:00):
and the size of a dime, a nickel, about a quarter, and then
between a quarter and a halfdollar was the last one and and
then after the fourth one therewas no white dots.
So I created a cream in mykitchen to heal the hole where
the cancer was coming out andthat is my black sap story.
But I I highly, if you arewanting to heal your cancer with

(50:27):
a tumor that's closer to theskin, naturally, I highly
suggest it.
It hurts for a certain amount oftime.
It doesn't hurt the whole time.
You know this, kristen.
Yes, I know that some of yourtexts and pictures and you're.
I think you were thinking atone point what did I do?
Did you think?

Speaker 1 (50:43):
that I did Um, especially the second round.
Yes, it goes deeper each time.
It was um and, I'll be honest,it felt like somebody was
holding a cigarette on my noseyes, like.

Speaker 2 (50:57):
I always say it's like somebody poured acid on me
yeah.

Speaker 1 (51:00):
It was intense, but I knew.
I knew because of Debbie'stestimony, and I'm like you.
like we're warriors, let's justput it that way Like we've
absolutely we've been through alot and I've been through a lot
of pain emotional pain, physicalpain.
I was like you know what I'vebeen.
I've been through a lot of painemotional pain, physical pain.
I was like you know what I'vebeen.

(51:20):
I've been through that.
I can get through this, buthaving somebody to walk
alongside you who has actuallylike overcome, I think, is a
huge key, right, wouldn't you?

Speaker 2 (51:28):
say oh, it's everything I would.
I don't think I mean I wouldn'thave done this if I didn't have
somebody to walk me through itand know that it actually works.
I mean, it was very scaryTotally.

Speaker 1 (51:39):
And that's part of you know, when I think I said to
Amy, our friend Amy, you know,I knew, like again, like I said
I knew of the box valve becausesomebody had told me about it
those years ago and it actuallywas one of those things that
came to mind like well, hey, hey, here's that solution.
I remember thinking kind ofthat.

(52:01):
Maybe the vein thing too, likeyou know, maybe if it was on my
butt I would be fine.
Like it's out of sight, out ofmind, right?

Speaker 2 (52:09):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (52:09):
But going like right, like focal point nose, you know
face, like not knowing, becausefor me this spot had been there
for about 10 years.
So oh wow it was I was told itwas a, an ulcer, and then it
started kind of becoming like avolcano and it kind of started

(52:32):
erupting and that's where theywere like oh, no, kind of like
you, like this doesn't look good, we need to biopsy.
So I did have a spot that cameup on my leg during that time.
Do you remember that?

Speaker 2 (52:45):
Yes, I do.

Speaker 1 (52:46):
Kind of the experiment.
That was the first one and itit went really well, like it
wasn't as painful.
But man, and that's where, likeI'm always going to stress this
to you guys, like we needpeople.
Like look at all of if youthink back to Debbie's story all
of the connections, all thepeople who supported her and had

(53:06):
been on their own journey toget to step into whatever
they're doing to help bringthese healing modalities.
Look where she is now.
Look where she is now and Ilove how, like God literally led
you from having boutiques to Imean, he totally literally
flipped the script in all theword in your life.

(53:27):
So, because of your journey,then, like you started going on
your own journey to say, okay,like now it's my turn right,
like what did that look like foryou to step into this next leg
of your journey?

Speaker 2 (53:43):
Well, you know, as the Blackstaff was a big part of
that, because now I've got aphysical piece of the cancer,
I'm literally pulling it out.
So I sent the first one to Ifound a lab in Arizona where I
could send it there and have ittested, and it came back, as you
know, cancer cells.
So I was told to do that by thegal in Australia.
So again, she was my littlementor and so I knew I was onto

(54:08):
something.
And what's kind of a fun partof the story here is is my dad,
um, for his living he was anattorney and he was the head
legal counsel for the largestset of hospitals in the state of
Illinois, so 13 hospitals thatare run by a bunch of Catholic
nuns.
My dad was their legal counsel.
So can you imagine this?
That after I pull one out, I'm,you know, again, I'm just I do

(54:28):
have that warrior mindset, I'msomebody that takes risks and I
put myself in there and I justtell myself I can do it, and I
usually do it by the grace ofGod and with him leading the way
.
So after this first tumor cameout and my hundreds of hours of
research and all these otherthings that I'm doing.
You know ozone theory, ozonetherapy, I'm getting my blood

(54:49):
spun.
I got alkaline, I have the rawfood chef, I'm doing the
frequency, you know scanning.
I've got the dentist thinggoing and now I've pulled a
chunk of cancer out.
So I call my parents and I sayI'm going to cancel my surgery,
I'm going to heal this on my own.
They literally thought I lost.
Like did you fall and hit yourhead?
Like you're nuts?
And my dad at the time had me.

(55:11):
He wanted me to do a Skype callwith one of the oncologists at
the largest hospital that hedeals with in Illinois and I was
like dad, I got this and he'slike Debbie, I mean, he was
really upset with me Like youare great, this is can't like.
And I was like I know, dad, Iknow I know, but just trust me
and I know what I'm doing.
And cancer can be healed.

(55:32):
And so many people have done itand I wish I could have filmed
myself back then.
You know to like see thepassion that obviously I still
have.
But and my poor parents goingwhat?
And of course my kids wereworried.
You know they're just like whatis our mom doing?
And just to touch on the salveand you know this, kristen, when
you that tumor is coming closerto the surface, like the way

(55:56):
that the immune system works is,it brings redness to that area,
it's makes that area veryinflamed, it gets very warm.
So it's right by my left eye.
So I'm going to church.
I look like I they would callme the boxer.
It looks like I was in a boxingmatch At one point.
I woke up one morning my lefteye had swollen shut.
I had all this stuff, crusty,gunk over it and that whole area

(56:17):
about the size of like a soupcan, bottom of a soup can, if
you can imagine that circle.
It was all puffy and inflamedand I mean it looked like I'd
been in a bar fight.
You know I was making upstories like oh yeah, you should
see the other guy they're like.
And then I've got this bandage,like what are you doing?

(56:41):
So now I've got all my churchpeople, my Bible study group,
everybody's like what?
Which, by the way, as the yearshave gone on, several of them
have used the black salve for avariety of things.
I mean it just your story neverjust touches you.
But I now I've forgotten youroriginal question.

Speaker 1 (56:50):
I always go down on these.
You had mentioned that youcreated something to basically
fill in the dermal layers, right?
So how?
Like what like somethingcharged in you to be able to, to
get to that point because noteverybody is going to, you know,
go through that journey andthen be like, all right, I need
to create something that isgoing to even do something more

(57:12):
than beyond what I just wentthrough, right?

Speaker 2 (57:16):
So what happened?

Speaker 1 (57:17):
at that point.

Speaker 2 (57:18):
Well, and I and now I remember your question like how
I own stores, like how did Iget from owning stores to what
I'm doing now?
I was so angered by what I wasfinding out about our healthcare
system and how it was a bigboop and how the cancer industry
is a trillion dollar businessand how they scare people and
they don't ever really heal themRight, and so I was.

(57:38):
This passion in me was, andI've always been, interested in
health.
I've always been like that kindof crunchy girl and um, and
that that was definitely alwaysmy bent.
So, yes, I started creating a.
I just started throwingdifferent things in my Vitamix
that I had.
Research would help heal skin.
He healed this hole where thesalve was coming out.

(57:59):
I didn't think at the time I wasgoing to grow this into a
business, but on the flip side,after having seen that frequency
medicine doctor, I was like Iwant to do that.
That thing was so amazing.
If I didn't know what the tworoots of my cancer were, it was
going to come right back in mymind, right, like I need.
You need to get to the root ofwhether it's emotional, physical
, like the root cause.

(58:20):
Deal with the root so that theoutward symptom doesn't come
back.
So I started having an interestin this frequency therapy stuff
.
I thought, you know what, Ithink I could do that.
And then, meanwhile, you know,hand in hand, I'm making this
cream and I just, you know, Ijust called it face food, cause
I'm like I'm making this creamand I just, you know, I just

(58:42):
called it face food Cause I'mlike I'm making food for my face
, because everything on themarket was full of carcinogens.
It was full of fragrance,fragrances, phthalates, um, you
know, coloring, chemicals,solvents, endocrine disruptors,
and I'm like I can't put any ofthat on my skin.
I'm pulling all this stuff out.
So I started making a cream inmy Vitamix and then I started
giving it to friends at churchand giving it to people at my
store, and then that turned intoabout a year later.

(59:05):
I mean, I couldn't keep up withmaking it.
People instead of wanting onelittle, you know, I had these
little mini mason jars.
Instead of one, they wanted 12and or they wanted 10 or 4.
And so I then ended up findinga manufacturer that could do
more of an organic based, youknow, skincare line, and that
was my first product.

(59:25):
So I made my face food and itactually does have CBD in it,
because I learned this isanother piece of just educating
your listeners today but youknow CBD.
When you say that there's likea little bit of a tinge to that
industry, it's like, oh yeah,it's at every gas station coffee
shop.
Well, 12 years ago CBD wasn'ton every on every corner and I

(59:46):
had learned through all myresearch that the cannabinoids
in CBD are the fountain of youthfor the skin.
So it made sense to me to putCBD in my blender with some
different things like manuka oiland frankincense and moringa
oil, raspberry seed oil you knowdifferent things that are
healing calendula, and.
But I did put CBD in therebecause I knew that what the

(01:00:08):
effects it had on the skin.
And boy was I right.
So now I've created this skincream that heals over 25
different skin issues and helpedheal the hole in the side of my
face.

Speaker 1 (01:00:19):
I mean you guys, isn't this incredible Like?
Can you give us an example ofmaybe a few other skin
conditions that it would help?
Yeah?

Speaker 2 (01:00:31):
absolutely Well, some that I came upon and then some
that over the last 10 years ofnow manufacturing and selling
the cream, making and sellingthe cream different clients have
brought to me.
So the basic ones are thingslike eczema, psoriasis, any type
of burns.
I work with different cancerclients that have had radiation

(01:00:51):
or chemo and they get thatreally dry, flaky, red skin.
It works on a bug bite.
It works on a baby's bum, fordiaper's rash.
I have a client that used itfor hand, foot, mouth disease.
Antibiotics didn't touch it sothe cannabinoids in the cream
ate up the antibacterial,antifungal.
So I have one client this isthe strangest thing to use it

(01:01:13):
for, but I tell peopleapparently it works for this.
This is not an issue I have, butshe's had hemorrhoids for 25
years and she loves the facefood for her face.
And her husband said well, Iknow it's anti-inflammatory, why
don't you try it on thehemorrhoids?
And sure enough, it's her newhemorrhoid cream.
So I didn't, you know, didn'tset up to design a hemorrhoid
cream.
Um, but it's also a face cream.

(01:01:33):
It's for fine lines, wrinkles,sunspots, scarring, any type of
scarring, surgical scarring.
You can put it on an open woundand then finally, if you have
an early, early and I do stressthat that it has to be early,
we're not talking stage two,stage three, but early, early

(01:01:54):
skin cancer lesion.
So you know, this is your.
You've got a piece of a littlearea where it's getting a little
itchy or that shiny red andit's it's acting weird and it
just it doesn't feel the sametexture as everything else in
your skin.
Start putting the face food onit, at least morning and night,
ideally three times a day.
So maybe you know, morning,afternoon and night it will
literally eat up that pre-cancer.

(01:02:15):
I've had so many clients avoidgetting a Mohs surgery because
they caught the skin cancerearly enough and were able to
start putting the cream on it.
Now the flip side is, if you'vehad any type of, you know, any
type of cancer you've had breastcancer, skin cancer, whatever
and you've got, you've just hadyour surgery and you've got some
scarring or open wound, you canput the face food right on it

(01:02:39):
and those cannabinoids will goin.
They are like little Pac-Mansthat start eating up cancer
cells.
But we know in the cancerindustry that most cancers start
five to eight years out beforeyou get the diagnosis.
So, kristen, you said that spothad been there for what 10
years, right?
Had been there for what 10years, right?
And so by the time you're atthat, you know eight or 10 year

(01:03:04):
mark, or even five years, you'vegot millions of cancer cells.
So I can't claim that the facefood is going to eat up a
million cancer cells, but whatit can do is when it's early and
what's happening is that yourskin it's the largest detox
organ in the body it's pressingout, it's letting the body I
always say the body's lettingyou know.
You know there's somethingthere.
Please look at this.
When you see something outwardon your body that isn't normally

(01:03:25):
there, start putting the facefood on it.

Speaker 1 (01:03:29):
So has it helped, like with acne as well.

Speaker 2 (01:03:32):
Absolutely yes.
We have lots of teenagers thatuse it for acne.
I, my own kids, have used itfor acne.
Works really well for acne, wow.

Speaker 1 (01:03:40):
It's amazing.
I, I, I tell Debbie she's likethe George Washington carver you
know, like skin, and he like,truly like, there's so many
things that, um, I just thinkit's just so incredible how God
has given you these blueprints,truly honestly.
I mean, it came out of pain, itcame out of trauma, it came out

(01:04:02):
of, um, it came out of so much.
I do want to ask you, before weum close pretty soon, tell us
about the muscle mist, becauseyou guys, if you have any, if
you work out and you know youare getting older and maybe you
have some sore spots, I wouldlove for you to tell us a little
bit more about the muscle mist,because it is one of my

(01:04:25):
favorite products that you carryalong with the hydrate serum,
that's.

Speaker 2 (01:04:30):
Oh yes.

Speaker 1 (01:04:31):
I mean I love all of the things, but those are like
my three and the toothpaste.

Speaker 2 (01:04:40):
Okay, well, you're so nice.
Yeah, the, the mag mist.
Well, um, first of all, I haveto say we wanted to call it, you
know, miracle mist, but thatname was of course already
trademarked, so we didn't get touse that.
But, um, like I said, I wasjust at this integrative cancer
healing conference in Austin asa vendor and we had an open
bottle of magma sitting at ourtable and we, just the minute
people would come up to ourbooth, I would just ask them to

(01:05:02):
pull their hair back.
I'm like, can I spray the backof your neck?
And they're like, okay, what isthis?
And I said, well, it's organiccbd and it's magnesium.
And then it has some msm inthere eucalyptus, camphor,
camphor, menthol, clove oilsweet birch oil, arnica oil,
peppermint oil, all the things Isaid.
It's nature's answer tobiofreeze, but your body doesn't

(01:05:24):
become immune to it.
So they're listening as I'mspraying and I said don't rub it
.
Cool oil, dry mist, it'll just.
I said you'll feel it in about90 seconds.
And then I gave everybody asample.
I mean we had hundreds ofpeople coming through our booth
and some people brought it,bought it right away, because
they were like, oh my gosh, inthe midst of them, standing
there and talking to my son andI for four or five minutes,

(01:05:45):
they're like I feel it, oh mygosh, I feel it go in and my
neck feels better and thetension's gone.
So they were buying it.
But I told everybody, I saidtonight in your hotel room, do
one spray on the bottom of eachfoot that magnesium is going to
go up into in through yoursystem.
It's great to put it on thebottoms of your feet to get it
into the bloodstream quickly.
But also do one spray in yourbelly button, in your navel,

(01:06:08):
because there's thousands ofnerve endings there that connect
everywhere in the body and thatmagnesium will go right in as
well.
And because these people arelike well, I don't sleep at all.
And you know I said try themagnesium.
We had so many people that nextmorning coming to the booth I
mean one lady bought a dozenbottles.
They're like I slept like ababy.
I'm like I know and like.

(01:06:30):
My tagline is always like proofis in the product.
But so to back up a little bit,how I started it and made the
Magnus is that I kind of havelike a background, just have
been surrounded by athletes.
My first husband was aprofessional baseball player.
My kids have all been in allkinds of sports.
My son played football allthrough college for the Huskers.
My son-in-law plays in NFL.
My daughter is a strength andconditioning coach.

(01:06:52):
She works with guys that aregoing to the league.
So we are an athletic family.
And my son actually had sixdifferent surgeries from
football wrist, shoulder, youname it.
And so I've used things likearnica oil, I've used magnesium
oil, I've had him soak in amagnesium bath, I've used all

(01:07:13):
the natural things.
But when it came to starting toput the CBD, the organic
cannabinoids, into differentproducts, I'm like let's make a
topical anti-inflammatory thateverybody can use.
You know, little Johnny can useit after a soccer game.
Or you know, your grandma canuse it and make it really easy.

(01:07:35):
I know there's balms out thereand there's roll-ons, but I
prefer a spray and where liquidwise, it will go in deeper.
So we started kind of messingaround with some different
things and I went to myformulator and said, well, I
really like Arnicon, I reallylike camphor and, oh, I love
eucalyptus.
And again, another hundredhours of research of like what

(01:07:55):
are the best anti-inflammatoriesand then putting them all in
one mix we sell.
Now this is what 10 years laterwe sell over 10,000 bottles a
year.
I sell wholesale tochiropractors.
Physical therapists and massagetherapists carry this and can't
keep it on the shelf.

Speaker 1 (01:08:12):
It's amazing, I didn't know that Wow.

Speaker 2 (01:08:15):
Yeah, and kind of a fun fact, kristen, right before
COVID happened, I was flown outto Seattle and had a kind of an
introductory session with Costco, said no, because CBD, even
without THC, is not federallylegal in all 50 states yet and

(01:08:38):
we are no THC so that you cannever get high, we're not the
marijuana end of the plant.
But the one of the boardmembers had used it and loved it
and had brought in, wanted meto ship a bunch so that all the
board members could use it.
So I flew in so excited this isright before COVID, this is
2019.
And they that you know the headhoncho he shut it down.

(01:08:58):
He said we can't touch CBD.
So if President Trump decidesto do what he says he's going to
do and make CBD the non-THCkind, federally mandated, I'm
going to get back on that planeand go to Seattle.
So bring my Magnus, but itworks that well yeah.
One of the board members thoughtit was great and I love it.

(01:09:20):
I mean, it's something I travelwith it.
We have a little travel sizeand I can't live without it, but
just for the sleep part if I'mnot sore, the sleep part really
does, it does help.

Speaker 1 (01:09:30):
I'm going to try that .
I didn't do that.
Thank you, I know to do that.
Thank you, I know Everythingthat you've created has like
multi-purpose to it.
Yes, absolutely.

Speaker 2 (01:09:42):
My mom has neuropathy at 88 and she's very fit, very
active, but when she lays downat night she literally can't
sleep.
She wakes up through the night.
So I have her use the mag, mistand spray from the knee down
and the bottoms of her feet andit has helped so much because it
helps increase, gets rid ofinflammation, so therefore gets
rid of pain, but it also helpswith circulation.

(01:10:03):
So anybody that has diabetes orneuropathy it's really great
for to increase that circulation.

Speaker 1 (01:10:10):
Wow, debbie, this is so incredible.
We didn't share the name ofyour company, yet what is the
name of your company?

Speaker 2 (01:10:17):
Well, it's a great way to wrap it up, because when
I thought about what would Icall this, you know my face food
.
But what would I call thisbusiness where I get to scan
people and and and make products?
What I learned in my journey iswe need to heal from the inside
out.
So I call it soul tender,wellness.
And the tender of our soul isthe Lord.

(01:10:41):
Right, he's the great gardenerof our soul.
He's the tender he tends to ourgarden.
But we also have to look atmind, body, soul, spirit.
When we're trying to healsomething physical, don't fool
yourself and make yourselfbelieve that you doesn't, that
you don't have to deal withthose emotions or the hard
things that have happened to youin life.
Nobody gets out of this lifewithout some, you know, some

(01:11:04):
traumatic things.
That's just part of the deal.
But but you can.
You can have the tools toprocess through it and release
it and forgive and move on.
And that is tending to yoursoul.
And I try to remind everybody,when I'm talking about soul
tender, that that's really whatit's about for all of us.
But God is the tender of oursouls, but we need to tend to

(01:11:24):
our souls as well.
So it's soul tender, wellness.

Speaker 1 (01:11:27):
I love the name.
I love the meaning behind thename.
I just love you everything.
If somebody was going to well,first of all, what is your
website, and then I'll put it inthe show notes Okay, yeah, it's
soul tender wellnesscom andit's S O U?

Speaker 2 (01:11:43):
L.
We had somebody post us for aconference once and they put S O
L?
E like a shoe.
So it's not that it's soul likethe soul in your body.

Speaker 1 (01:11:53):
So okay, and I'll be sure to put that in the show
notes.
And then, um, you talked aboutsome of the ways that you can
come alongside others as well.
Like, what would that maybelook like for um somebody to um
maybe get a scan?
Um tell us more?
Um, I I'm sure somebody is likeokay, like, how do I contact
her?
What would this look like?

Speaker 2 (01:12:11):
Yeah, well, we actually just redid our website.
Um was quite a process andwe're still working on
fine-tuning it, but I do have acouple pages on there talking
about the bioresonance frequencyand kind of sharing a little
bit of my story.
And now my son has gotten intoit.
He's licensed to run the scans.
His specialty is elite athletes.
So whether it's junior high,high school, college pro, you

(01:12:35):
name it, he's the guy.
Junior high, high school,college pro, you name it, he's
the guy.
But if you go on there, thereare you can even buy a scan on
there, a scan package and getscanned, and there's a lot more
information.
But you can always contact methrough the website and I'm
always able to do a phone calland share more about it.
But I have been scanningclients now for almost 10 years

(01:12:56):
and I think I'm almost at 800clients and not had anybody not
have some sort of healing.
So I can't claim that you knowit's going to heal this or that,
but I will say that it willshow root causes and can help
your body be equipped to healitself.
It's really about balancing thebody.
The scans and the frequencydrops don't heal you.

(01:13:18):
They give your body the toolsto be balanced and able to heal
itself and unburdened by all thetoxic load.

Speaker 1 (01:13:27):
Yes, yeah, well, I would.
I'm definitely a testimony aswell, like I had a scan done
with Debbie and without eventelling her any of my health
history, it was popping upthings that are a hundred
percent true.
So I am a believer for sure.
Um, so, as we close today, um, I, like I said, I do this podcast

(01:13:50):
for the one and I would lovefor you to think of somebody
who's listening in today andwould you want to share anything
else, any words ofencouragement or wisdom, to
speak over them, and then wouldyou pray us out today?

Speaker 2 (01:14:03):
Yes, so I just would touch on, first of all, that the
Lord would lead your journeyLike he's the one that created
your body and he knows what itneeds to heal.
So just invite Him in to be apart of that process and it will
go the way that it's supposedto go.
And then also, I just would saythat I again I think I touched

(01:14:24):
on it at one point during thepodcast but we all have
emotional things.
Some of us have had traumaticchildhoods or abusive childhoods
or different toxicrelationships, and that does not
have to define you and it'sjust so much a part of my story.
And I work with a lot of women,especially that are just so

(01:14:44):
burdened and have carried theload for so long.
And I would just say that toreally work on the emotional
things in your life and dealwith them and get them out
whatever that looks like for youour life and deal with them and
get them out whatever thatlooks like for you.
There's a great book called theBody Keeps the Score and
different organs in the bodyhold on to different emotions.
So I would just look into that,because everybody's healing

(01:15:06):
journey, I believe, has someemotional component, so don't
forget that piece.

Speaker 1 (01:15:11):
Yes, yes, amen.
Thank you, debbie.
Would you be open to praying usout today?

Speaker 2 (01:15:17):
Absolutely.
Dear Heavenly Father, we justthank you so much, lord.
I thank you for this platform.
I thank you for Kristen and herheart to help others and to
create a space where people cancome and freely share their
stories of what you've done intheir lives, whether it's
physically, emotionally,spiritually or all of those.
Lord, we're just so gratefulfor you.

(01:15:37):
And, lord, I just give you thehonor today for what you've done
in my own life.
Like I take no credit for thisjourney, lord, you led me down
every single part of this pathand put all the right people in
my path, and one of them isKristen.
I you know she didn't touch onthis, but I've been so grateful
for the different talks thatI've had with her and things

(01:16:00):
that she's helped me unlock inmyself, lord, so we're just so
grateful for you.
You are the King of Kings, lord,you are the great Master,
healer.
You created us, lord, and wegive you all the glory and honor
today, lord, and I just ask fora special blessing for anybody
that's listening, that theywould be able to look deep

(01:16:20):
inside to their own healing andthat you would put the right
people in their path.
Lord, and I just pray.
A blessing over Kristen too,lord, that you would continue to
bring people to her where shecan give them a voice for the
world to hear and to grow big,big, white, fluffy wings and be
flying high with you at our side.
In Jesus' name, we pray, amen.

Speaker 1 (01:16:41):
Amen.
Well, debbie, I feel like I'llprobably have you back on
another time if you'd like tocome back and share more.
I just love everything you'redoing and thank you for being a
brave voice who is settingothers free.
So I'm going to close with theHope Unlocked anchoring verse.
It is may the God of hope fillyou with all joy and peace in

(01:17:01):
believing, so that by the powerof the Holy Spirit, you may
abound in hope, and that isRomans 15, 13.
So thank you again, debbie.
I cannot wait to see all hecontinues to unfold in your life
, and I'll be back with anotherepisode next week.

Speaker 2 (01:17:16):
Okay, thank you, kristen, it was awesome.

Speaker 1 (01:17:19):
Thank you, Debbie.

Speaker 2 (01:17:20):
Okay, god bless.

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