February 6, 2024 • 51 mins
Imagine being uprooted from your homeland as a child, thrust into an entirely new culture without the ability to communicate. This was the reality for Tomoko, whose heartfelt journey from Japan to the United States unfolds before us. Joining us as she shares her narrative of culture shock, adjustment, and the power of resilience. Her experiences are a beacon for anyone grappling with change, illustrating that with self-compassion and mindfulness, we can find a path to inner peace and growth.
As our conversation with Tomoko deepens, we explore the thorny pathways of healing from trauma. She bravely recounts her own steps toward recovery, emphasizing the pivotal role of shifting perspectives through mindfulness and the additional complexities introduced by parenthood. Tomoko's insights are a testament to the human spirit's remarkable ability to heal and transform, offering hope to those touched by similar challenges. Her personal evolution is not just inspiring; it's a guidepost for others on the journey of healing, highlighting the importance of calming the nervous system and finding fulfillment in helping others.
Wrapping up this profound episode, Tomoko's dedication to community service and her entrepreneurial spirit come to light. Her work with Spill the Tea Cafe supports the LGBTQ and gender-diverse community, illuminating how her own resilience now fuels her passion for aiding others. Listeners are encouraged to engage with Tomoko's story and share their own tales of overcoming adversity. As we anticipate the release of her upcoming book, her journey stands as a reminder that every challenge we face is an opportunity to build a stronger, more resilient self.
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Disclaimer: The views reflected by any of the guests may not reflect the views of the podcast host. Some topics may be difficult for some viewers, so proceed at your own risk. This podcast does not replace psychotherapy or advice and is for entertainment purposes only.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Christina McKelvy (00:00):
Today we're going to be speaking with Tomoko
.
She shares her story aboutbeing sent to the USA from Japan
, which was only 12 and notknowing anyone.
We discuss how she experiencedher life, her work and her
perspective.
Tomoko is an MFT intern,marriage family therapist,
working at Spill and Tea Cafeand exploring Honolulu.
Spill and Tea Cafe specializesin mental health care for youth,
(00:23):
with a special emphasis onsupporting gender diverse and
LGBTQ plus teens.
If you are in Honolulu, pleasecheck them out.
We'll be right back after thisshort break.
Welcome to Hopology Stories ofHope, healing and Resilience.
(00:55):
I'm your host, christinaMcKelvie.
Today we have Tomoko here todayand I repeated myself and I
said today twice.
Sorry, listeners, but you knowwhat it has been a day.
It is 4-eleven and Tomoko whattime is it?
Where you're at?
Tomoko (01:10):
It is 1-eleven.
Christina McKelvy (01:13):
Oh, and you're in the middle of the
Pacific.
Yes, in Hawaii, oh, hawaii, Ilove it.
That's where I'm from too.
We're from different islands,but I am no longer in Hawaii.
I am in Arizona, and it's hot.
It's not supposed to be hotwhere I'm at.
(01:34):
So how are you doing, tomoko?
I'm doing well.
Thank you for having me.
Of course, I'm really excitedto talk to you.
So I met you when we werevolunteering for the Hawaii
Crisis Responders for the Lineof Fires, and we were on a team
for an hour, you myself and aprofessor from the Midwest
(01:58):
somewhere.
Yes, he actually sent me someof his website and he did a lot
of studies on resilience.
It was amazing studies.
So, yes, that's where I met you, and we didn't really have
anyone show up for us for ourcrisis group, and so we got to
know each other and I heard alittle bit about your story,
(02:20):
what you shared, and I found itvery fascinating.
Speaker 2 (02:24):
And.
Christina McKelvy (02:25):
I wanted to.
You know I invited you on, sothank you so much for telling
the world, or the handful oflisteners I have, your story,
and so let's start, you know,with tell us a little bit about
you and a little bit about yourbackground, and we can go from
there.
Tomoko (02:37):
Sure.
So I was born and raised inJapan.
Tokyo is where I grew up.
I am a middle child of threechildren.
I have an older brother or hadone he was two years older than
me, and a younger sister who'sfive years younger.
Most of my family or immediatefamilies my immediate families,
(03:02):
you know they all still live inJapan.
I grew up there until I was 12.
And at 12, I was sent toCalifornia alone to initially
live with that relative, livewith relatives for several years
to learn English.
(03:23):
But I ended up in a boardingschool by the age of 13.
Christina McKelvy (03:31):
Dave, you know that you were going to go
into a boarding school when youfirst moved to California to
live with your family.
Tomoko (03:40):
So an interesting side note.
I'm sorry, I don't mean to likerear off on this.
I don't know, have you heard ofthe comedian or up and coming
like she's getting a lot oftrash in now they say his her
name is Asako Katsuka.
Christina McKelvy (03:57):
Yes, she's, hilarious.
Tomoko (03:59):
She is amazing.
She recently came to Hawaii andI had to go see her and she
shared her story of beingkidnapped.
She said and made it into acomedy skit, she was taken from
Tokyo, japan, to California whenshe was eight, I believe.
So the similarity in ourstories are just incredible and,
(04:24):
you know, the timing that Iheard about her story was
incredible.
I thought I would just kind ofthrow that in there.
Yeah, no, so very similar, yeah, and it's just.
I mean, obviously I've nevermet anyone who's you know, left
Japan to the United States inthe in the way that I did.
(04:45):
So I thought that was reallyinteresting.
I would love to talk to her oneday, but anyway, yeah, so I
know, actually I did it, and theinteresting thing is that I
think I was probably like maybe11, close to 12.
My, my mom just basically saidhey, you're going to go to
school in the United States,you're going to live in
(05:08):
California, you can live with,you know, with your relatives,
and that was it.
So it was almost like presentedas if, like, hey, we're going
to the store.
You know, there were nopreparations, they didn't ask me
questions, they didn't ask meto ask them questions.
No English lessons.
(05:29):
I didn't know how to speakEnglish, write, read nothing,
not not a bit, and I was 11, 12years old.
I had no idea what to expect orhow to even prepare mentally
for this.
You know, I just all I knew wasthat I visited there before I
visited my relatives.
(05:51):
It was fun when I visited.
So I went with that mentalityof like, oh, okay, it's gonna be
fun.
Christina McKelvy (05:57):
Yeah, so what was the boarding school that
you went to?
Was it only in English, or didthey teach it in Japanese?
So you didn't know English.
You know how to write Englishin English, you didn't know how
to speak in English, and thenyou're thrown into a school in
California.
Tomoko (06:16):
Yeah, so I initially lived with my family or relative
and then attended an elementaryschool.
So I graduated from elementaryschool in Japan and then was
sent away.
I attended an elementary schoolin California while living with
my relatives.
(06:36):
I remember like just holding anEnglish Japanese dictionary and
just walking around pointing tothings.
That's how I could.
That was the only way I couldcommunicate.
Yeah, yeah, it was.
It was very obviously verydifficult adjustment because I
had to adjust to the environment, people saying goodbye to
(07:01):
everything I knew, lifestyle,culture, even the way we, you
know, the way I eat, the thingsI ate were different.
You know, I went from likeeating rice every day to, you
know, meat and potatoes andthings like that.
So just that alone was a hugeadjustment.
(07:23):
But I had to go through everyother kind of adjustment.
You could imagine, wow, at 12years old, at 12 years old, yes,
yeah, yeah, it's big shot.
Christina McKelvy (07:40):
It is.
And you mentioned, you know,the comedian.
You mentioned her, yeah, andyou know she had a similar story
.
I know, yes, you know she.
I think she went to live withher grandma, yeah, and she
didn't know if she thought itwas a vacation and her mother
believed, had or hasschizophrenia.
Yes, and I'm curious, you know,it sounds like her story is one
(08:06):
of the only stories you'veheard that similar to yours.
Tomoko (08:09):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Yeah.
It was just interesting to hearbecause it's my.
My story is still very rare, soto hear her on the stage tell
her story, that's very similar.
And of all the places in theUnited States, she also moved to
(08:34):
California I think it wasSouthern California also, and
for me so it was sort ofcathartic moment for me to hear
that story.
Christina McKelvy (08:44):
You knew you were alone, yeah, yeah.
Yeah, I'm wondering how thatfelt.
You know that at 12 years oldhow that can feel the confusion.
It sounded like you didn't knowwhy you didn't.
You weren't expecting anything.
You were thrown into this.
Speaker 2 (09:00):
You know what that does for you then, and also what
it does for you now, youwouldn't even think about that.
Tomoko (09:07):
Yeah, I've had.
I've had a lot of differentmoments to process everything on
different levels, at differenteach it was.
I feel like I'm finally in aspace where I am very
comfortable talking about it.
(09:28):
I'm okay to talk about it.
Yeah, I'm actually writing abook about it, about my life,
nice and I'm hoping yeah, hopingthat I can help others in
overcoming trauma, childhoodtrauma, and so in a sense, I
feel like I'm in a really goodplace.
But I've had to process them indifferent stages, even as
(09:54):
recent as this past year, andsometimes I will have memories
thinking about what happenedback then and I cry for who I
was.
Christina McKelvy (10:24):
What did that look like?
Like how did you mention this?
Getting into the space, likeyou're now in the space where
you can talk about it, where youcan process it, and you said it
kind of happened in stages.
Tell me a little bit more aboutthat, like what those stages
looked like for you.
Tomoko (10:38):
Okay so, I'll also build it.
So, like leaving, being sentaway at 12, that is just a small
part of this traumaticchildhood that I had, on top of
not being properly prepared ortalked about how my life would
(11:00):
change and being thrown into thesituation, literally.
But I was also.
I went from an abusive housesituation to another abusive
situation, living with myrelatives, and then I eventually
(11:20):
escaped and I think I livedthere for seven months, whereas
I was supposed to, or I was toldI would live there until I
finished middle school and then,from high school, I would
attend boarding school because Iwould mature by then, I would
know English by then, and so theplans were abruptly changed, in
(11:47):
a sense, and so I, you know,instead of three years, seven
months later, I left myrelatives house and I was
supposed to go back home briefly, but I couldn't due to my
student visa situation.
So I was placed in a fostersystem and lived with the foster
(12:11):
family, who was again not verykind, and still my English was,
you know, seven months.
My English was very broken.
Now I'm living with strangers,not very nice, and my first, you
know, I spent my firstChristmas away from my family
(12:31):
and home with strangers who wereabusive.
So it's like there were layersof abuse that took place by the
time I was 13.
And so, you know, I startedattending boarding school maybe
(12:51):
six months after, in January,after I turned 13.
And then, of course, thisschool was very difficult
because it was middle school andhigh school.
That can be difficult, oh mygosh.
And I was the youngest at theschool.
(13:12):
Still, my English was verybroken, gosh.
I was bullied.
There was a lot of racism thatI experienced, so it's just you
know layers and layers of a lotof difficult times, traumatic
events, and I had to deal withall of them and come to terms
(13:33):
with them at that moment in away that I could with my very
underdeveloped brain you know,at 14, 15, you know.
So in that sense it had to takedifferent stages in over many
decades for me to process them.
(13:55):
Because I mean, gosh, I had CPT.
You know I had developed CPTSDwhich I wasn't diagnosed for
decades after.
I didn't even know.
Christina McKelvy (14:08):
Yeah, I think it's even a new, a relatively
new term.
Tomoko (14:12):
Yeah.
Christina McKelvy (14:13):
CPTSD Right right.
Tomoko (14:16):
Yeah, I didn't know about it until really recently,
several years ago.
Christina McKelvy (14:23):
Complex PTSD.
Tomoko (14:24):
Complex PTSD.
Right, I realized I had PTSD,you know, many years later
because I would have flashbacks.
I would have.
I had very, very bad anxiety,depression.
(14:44):
You know all of everything.
All of the above on the list ofPTSD symptoms.
Yeah, if it was listed you hadit.
Christina McKelvy (14:53):
I'm sorry If it was listed.
You had it.
Yes, exactly.
Tomoko (14:56):
Anyone yeah, right.
And so, yeah, I feel like itneeded to take.
It had to take over, you know,it had to happen over the years
the processing and healing of it.
And really I feel like I wantto say it took me when I had to
(15:16):
make a really strongdetermination that I'm going to
focus on healing and focus onworking on myself and my pain
and all the unhealthyattachments and personalities
that I've developed over theyears because of my childhood
(15:37):
trauma.
So it really took I would say Iwould say at least 15 years,
maybe more, to a constant,constantly working on healing.
And I've tried everything, readall of the books, wrote
(15:57):
everything meditation,acupuncture, chiropractic
therapy, I mean just all kindsof different methods of healing
and they all did part in gettingme to heal and to get me to
where I am today.
Christina McKelvy (16:16):
They all had a part.
Yeah, I would say so.
Tomoko (16:20):
It has to be very holistic.
I think so.
Christina McKelvy (16:23):
Yeah, I'm glad you pointed that out, that
it has to be holistic, becauseyou mentioned again that you had
to heal.
You healed in parts and it took15 years.
You start off like when you're12, just kind of figuring out
what was going on.
And then over the years, reading, writing, understanding,
(16:46):
getting that diagnosis ofcomplex PTSD, understanding that
and it seems like for a lot ofus I feel like trauma, we're
never fully healed from trauma.
Yeah, we're learning tonavigate with our trauma,
navigate life with trauma.
And you mentioned it has to beholistic, there's not just one
(17:07):
thing that works.
So what did the holisticapproach look like for you?
Because you said chiropractic,acupuncture, writing therapy,
chinese herbal, I mean reallykinesiology.
Tomoko (17:23):
I mean you, you, you, you know, if you've mentioned
any type of healing methods,I've tried it.
I've tried the Western way,using medication, and then I
used more holistic way, likehomeopathic remedy, essential
oil and flower essence.
(17:43):
I mean like I tried everythingbecause I really really just
wanted to get out of this dark,dark place that I felt like was
really slowly killing me and Ididn't want, but at the same
time I didn't want, to give upon life.
I mean, there's so many timeswhere I thought why you know
(18:05):
like what, what's, what's thewhat's the best way to get out
of this dark place?
You know like what's, what'sthe point, but I really just
firmly believed in deserving tolive a good life and I slowly
started to shift my mindset,really slowly and at my pace,
(18:29):
and that's why it takes 15 plusyears to heal from trauma like
this.
And I realized that I had totake your time and the biggest
thing I realized I had to do inwhat ultimately saved my life is
that I have to do this myselfand I have to own things, I have
(18:53):
to believe in myself.
I had to like basically rewirethe way I thought, you know,
just the way I saw the world.
No-transcript.
So you had to shift yourthinking, your beliefs, oh yeah,
in so many ways, and meditationand affirmation and things like
(19:19):
that.
Really really, I mean, it takestime.
It's a practice, you know, justlike going to the gym, just
like practicing sports or yogaor whatever.
You slowly build it and slowlyshift your mindset.
Because what trauma does in oneof the worst things traumatic
(19:43):
events or like abuse can do,especially when you experience
them as a child is that itcreates the world and the views
and perspectives for you.
So if you were traumatized, ifyou were neglected, if you were
abused, then that's the set oflens you're going to see the
(20:05):
entire world for the rest ofyour life.
Then, unless you heal from themor, you know, really heal and
change the perspectives yourselfand the belief system yourself.
And I feel like that's where alot of people struggle, because
we want somebody else to fix itright, like we want the
(20:29):
therapist to fix it, the doctorto fix it, the medicine to fix
it.
But ultimately it's really upto you.
It's hard work.
I can tell you that it's hardwork.
You have to be patient, youhave to be most patient with
yourself.
But once you get there, it'sreally incredible.
(20:53):
Life really changes yeah.
Christina McKelvy (21:10):
The part of healing from trauma is finding
ways to shift your perspectiveor change the way you see the
world, like you mentioned.
I know earlier I mentioned Idon't feel that we can fully
heal from our trauma.
What I meant to say is the termget over it or things like that
(21:30):
.
When I think of healing and Ialso think of scars, you know
like the scars heal but youmight still have remnants of it
Definitely yeah, yeah.
Tomoko (21:42):
And so I think, and I totally agree with you, the way
I see it is more like whenyou're traumatizing, you can't
get over it and you strugglebecause you have these terrible
aftermath mindsets and the wayyou react to things and the way
(22:03):
you hurt, the way you takethings.
It's almost like your wound isjust not healing and you're
walking around with all thesecuts.
Yeah, but once you heal or onceyou are in a better place, yeah
, there are scars, but theydon't hurt anymore.
You know and so, yes, definitelyyou still have scars.
Some days you still you know,some days I still cry and
(22:28):
remember and even react tothings.
But now that I've done the workfor so many years, there's more
subtle like calmness to myreaction, because I'm not
reacting from this fearfulanxiety-injustice place and
(22:50):
that's.
I didn't mention this earlier,but I'm trying to get licensed
in MFT and that's how I try tohelp my clients to help them to
lessen their calm their nervoussystem, because without calming
(23:12):
your nervous system it's reallydifficult to come out of trauma
or trauma mindset.
Christina McKelvy (23:19):
You're always hyper vigilant.
You're reacting.
Yes, yeah, yeah, I will sayyou're very calm.
Speaker 2 (23:27):
Thank you.
Yeah, yeah, yeah yeah.
Tomoko (23:33):
I it wasn't.
It didn't happen overnight.
My kids can tell you.
Christina McKelvy (23:42):
Not having kids, I'm sure is.
Oh, god has its own stories.
Tomoko (23:48):
Oh yeah, oh yes, oh yes yeah.
Christina McKelvy (23:52):
I'm wondering how being a mom has played into
your perspective, you know,since you're sitting away as a
child and you mentioned you hadtrauma even before.
Yeah, and the people that youwere supposed to care for you
and you were supposed to trust.
You could not.
Speaker 2 (24:08):
So I'm curious how that yeah how being a mom has
just been a perspective or whatthat was like for you.
Tomoko (24:13):
Yeah, I appreciate you asking me that, because that is
a huge part and I didn't knowuntil I experienced it and my
therapist mentioned it that youknow, people often relive their
trauma through their kids, andthat's exactly what happened,
and it freaked me out becauseI'm like what is happening?
(24:34):
What's going on?
Why am I reacting this way?
I really had adverse reactions,like when my oldest son turned
12 or, you know, was about toturn 12, I was having major
anxiety, just worrying andoverthinking, and I had no idea
what was going on until mytherapist said I think this is
(24:56):
connected to you know yourexperience and you're reliving
it through him, and so youranxiety is heightened and I'm
like that makes total senseBecause you were 12.
Christina McKelvy (25:06):
Yes, Right yeah, wow yeah.
Tomoko (25:11):
And so there were a lot of reliving moments.
I also lost my brother when Iwas 16 and he was 18 in a carts
event.
So I relived that through myoldest son and then I a lot more
subtle because of where I amnow but in a sense I'm reliving
it again through my second sonbecause he's getting close to
(25:34):
the age that my brother died andhe everybody I mean including
myself he reminds us the most ofmy brother.
He looks like my brother, heacts like my brother, and so
it's.
It can be very heavy sometimesjust looking at him, both, you
know, in a negative and positiveway.
(25:54):
Negative way, it's like beingreminded of the loss, but then
also positive is that we sort ofget to see his life through my
son in a in an interestingspiritual way, I guess, and so
there's a lot of mixed emotionsand, of course, as an abused,
(26:17):
you know, I was pretty severelyabused as a child, physically,
mentally, and so I knew thatwhen I had three children, or
before I had children, I waslike, okay, I got it, I got to
make sure I don't become, youknow this an abusive parent.
(26:42):
And then when I burst threechildren, I was like, oh my gosh
.
I got to really make sure.
That was another, another bigreason why I decided to focus on
my healing because I knew thatI needed.
I did not want to repeatbecause you know I, when I
(27:03):
studied psychology, thestatistics of of abused person
becoming an abuser was thepercentage was so high and I
also made many mistakes as as aparent and I wanted to correct
them.
I wanted to be better, I wantedto to raise healthy children.
(27:26):
So it's a lot of discipline, alot of determination to to focus
on that as a mother.
Christina McKelvy (27:38):
You wanted to break that generational cycle,
exactly.
Speaker 2 (27:43):
Yeah.
Tomoko (27:43):
Yeah, really needed to.
Speaker 2 (27:46):
Yeah.
Tomoko (27:50):
And the I feel like the beautiful thing about it, now
that I am where I am, is that Isomehow knew that I like I
knowing that and, you know,doing something about it is is
huge, right, like I can even saythat for myself, it's huge.
(28:10):
It is not an easy path to youknow, and it is a path that you
have to choose because it has tobe determined, it has to be
something.
You say I am going to do thisand I'm going to consciously
work on this, and and knowingthat, somewhere inside I believe
(28:30):
that I could.
Yeah, I feel like that's hugetoo.
And then I mean, yes, I mademany, many mistakes and it's
it's.
You know, guaranteeing is stillvery, very challenging, but I
feel like, for the most part,I've done a lot better than had
I not made that determination tobreak the cycle, and so, yeah,
(28:56):
I feel very proud of that.
Christina McKelvy (28:59):
You made that choice.
Tomoko (29:02):
Yeah, that's super hard.
Christina McKelvy (29:05):
It can be.
You know, there's sometimesthere's a lot of barriers
sometimes for individuals likemaybe they want to make that
choice, but there's somethingthat gets in the way.
Tomoko (29:16):
And also, you know, societal expectations and people
not knowing what I've beenthrough and I me feeling like I
need to live up to everybody'sexpectations.
You know I mean just all kindsof mess.
It's a lot, it's a lot ofcomplicated stuff that that
(29:37):
takes place.
I think any mother could relateto it.
Christina McKelvy (29:43):
Those expectations.
You need to live up to them.
I mean because being sent awayat 12, I know, when I was 12, I
was always people pleasing,still am and to an extent you
know, and at that age you'rethat's, you know, you're so
impressionable.
So being sent away, like whatmessages?
You know just that 12 year oldself-receive and how does that
(30:05):
carry on?
Like you said, through yourbelief system, how you see the
world, parenting, you knoweverything like that.
Tomoko (30:14):
Definitely, yeah, it affects everything in your mind,
and not just your childhood,but years and decades later.
So it's it's very complicatedand you have to like essentially
undo all of that, you know,basically in order to heal and
(30:35):
in order and you, there's a lotof growth in that too, of course
, as hard as it is.
So, yeah, it was very, verydifficult and very long path,
but I'm really glad I chose that, yeah, and now you're here,
yeah, and I'm here.
Christina McKelvy (30:57):
This is wonderful and getting and
working on your MFT, which ismarriage and family therapy.
Tomoko (31:06):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, it's.
You know, when I was in college, during my senior year,
studying psychology atUniversity of Hawaii at Manoa, I
dropped out because of my CPTSDand I was not diagnosed at that
(31:26):
time, and so there was a lot ofinternalizing happening.
Oh my gosh you know, my anxietywas way up there, my depression
, my, you know I was reacting toeverything I used to tell
people.
It's almost like walking aroundand not having any skin,
anything that brushes against mehurt.
Christina McKelvy (31:49):
Your nerves are raw Exposed.
Tomoko (31:51):
Yeah, exposed and raw, and that's that was the only way
to help others understand whatit's like to be me, and I feel
like I would still use that.
That's how difficult life wasat that moment.
I was 22, 23, dropped outSenior year.
I didn't even know.
I didn't even know until many,many years later, when I decided
(32:15):
to go back to school and like Ishould finish getting my, my
bachelor's.
I only had one class, so I didthat back in 2017.
I got my you know, bachelor'sdegree in psychology.
Finally, after all the years,and I'm actually really glad I
(32:36):
did it the way I did, becausehad I become a therapist back,
you know, in my twenties, Iwould have probably been a mess
because you know it, just youyou really have to heal from,
from your trauma If you want tohelp others.
You can't help others until youhelp yourself.
Yeah, so I'm really glad.
(32:57):
And then I just continued withit.
I'm like you know, I never,ever, thought I would get my
master's.
I never thought I was capableor smart enough, all the things
on the list but like, oh, maybeI can.
And I did it.
I graduated and, yeah, I'mreally, really glad I did it the
(33:17):
way it did.
I mean, sitting with a bunch of20-something year olds was very
intimidating.
I'm like oh, I'm anti here, hiyou know like anti yeah.
Brilliant young people.
And I'm going to school and I'mlike, okay, I'm a little bit
(33:38):
late in the game, but I'm trying.
But again, I'm really glad theway that I'm doing it, the way I
am, because it just it's yeah,it's such a, it's such an
incredible work and I feel a lotmore comfortable doing it.
Christina McKelvy (34:00):
Yeah, because you like, so you healed or
you're healing.
Tomoko (34:05):
Yeah, yeah, and I feel like I'm in a good place to tell
people or I shouldn't say tellpeople, because that's not what
my job is is as a therapist, butlike guide them through their
challenges I feel like I'm in amuch better place to to provide
the guidance I always tell myclients.
Just think of me as a GPS andyou know.
(34:27):
I like that I'm just a GPShelping you from.
You know get from A to B.
You know, if there's anaccident I'll find you a better
path.
You know, but I'm not here totell you what to do, or you know
.
So I'm.
I'm a much better GPS than Iwould have been in my 20s.
Christina McKelvy (34:53):
In your 20s you would have been the beta GPS
.
Yeah, the.
Speaker 2 (34:58):
AOL version.
Christina McKelvy (34:59):
Oh my goodness, Did you ever find out,
or did you, why you were sentto the United States?
Tomoko (35:13):
Yeah, I did.
That's an interesting thing too.
I, in my 30s, I did have amoment where I was able to kind
of confront my parents andbasically what happened was when
I was living in Japan, I wassent to a very prestigious
(35:37):
school all girls Japan Women'sUniversity, but it's like it's
almost, like, you know, likePunahou here.
Yeah, it's from preschool allthe way to well.
This one is all the way touniversity.
Punahou is high school, but it'sa very like if you get in your
(35:58):
set.
And my mom went there and shewanted me and my sister to go
there.
We got in, but it was reallydifficult.
It's one of the top schools inJapan.
If you mention, oh, yeah, youknow, I went to the school.
Everybody in Japan knows whatthat is.
It's very, very, very difficultschool.
(36:25):
When I attended there, you know,because of the situation at
home, nobody helped me.
I was on my own, whereas all myclassmates this is a type of
school where all the parents arehands-on with every homework,
every prep for tests, exams andall that I didn't have any of
that, so I failed a lot, whichis not acceptable.
(36:49):
It's a very, very typicalJapanese system type of school,
but like on the steroid kind ofthing.
It's a very cookie cutter.
If you are not getting straightA's, then you know you're not
meeting their expectations.
I definitely wasn't.
Nobody helped me not onceanybody helped me with homework
(37:14):
from first grade to sixth grade.
So basically at sixth grade youtransition into middle school
and it's another campus and yourparents meet with the principal
and they'll tell you, okay,you're transitioning or, I'm
sorry, you're not good enough.
And basically the school waslike, yeah, it's not good enough
(37:37):
.
And I didn't know that.
My mom didn't tell me Untilyour 30s.
Yeah, when I asked her, Wow.
So the way I'm interpreted well,the way I've interpreted it is
that she was too ashamed to tellpeople that I got kicked out.
But if she said, oh my gosh,she's going to school in the
(38:00):
United States, it soundsfabulous.
And instead of because, in youknow, I feel like my perception
or it about it is correct,because If it was with more
positive intentions, you know, Iwould think she would have
(38:22):
explained why I was going to theUnited States, she would have
prepared me better.
I would have at least hadEnglish lessons or, you know,
been able to ask questions.
I really basically had to prythat out of her and she finally
got very upset and said, well,you got kicked out.
And I was like, oh gosh, Ididn't see that coming, yeah.
(38:46):
And so, instead of sending meto a public school from middle
school, she chose to send meaway.
Christina McKelvy (38:56):
You said it, you feel that it was more of a
pride for her on herself.
Tomoko (39:03):
Yeah, definitely, and I was able at that point to tell
her.
Well, because of this decisionand because I didn't know
anything about it, I struggledand then I also went through a
lot of abuse, bullying.
I was also molested when I was14.
(39:23):
So, like all these thingshappened you know, by the time I
was 16, I've had so much traumahappen in my life that it was
so difficult that I it took along time for me to confront my
(39:43):
family.
Yeah, and of course, when Iwould try to, it was very not a
Japanese girl thing to do toconfront my parents, you know,
seeing as very disrespectful,none of my statements were taken
well, taken well or takenproperly, I guess you know.
(40:12):
So that was hard, but Inavigated through those things
over the years and overcame them.
Christina McKelvy (40:25):
Having that discussion with your mom sounds
like it was one of those piecesfor your healing.
One of the parts for yourhealing.
Tomoko (40:32):
Yes, definitely, and I didn't know this then because it
did take I think I was about 33, 35 maybe, but it took another
10 plus years to be where I amnow Real and realize that that
was, that was still a very toxicmoment.
(40:54):
Yeah because she initiallydenied, like kind of played,
like I don't know, I don't knowwhy I sent you, and I would say
well, you threw me away.
That's how I see it.
You threw me away and she'slike oh my gosh, no, no, I
didn't throw you away.
I'm like so why did you send meaway?
And I pushed it.
I can be like that.
(41:16):
You were determined, you weredetermined to find out why that
happened to you because itshaped your perspective.
Christina McKelvy (41:26):
It shaped your life Exactly.
Tomoko (41:28):
Yeah, yeah, and I pushed her enough that she got very
upset and kind of blurred it out.
I don't think she hadintentions to tell me.
And when she blurred it out itwas obviously a very shock for
me to hear, because I had noidea I hadn't been kicked out
(41:53):
and I was like I don't know.
I guess it's in a sense thatthat moment they confirmed I
don't think like this anymore.
But back then, you know, likegosh, I must not be good enough
or I must be disposable becausemy parents don't love me.
You know that mindset I livedthat in that mindset for a very,
(42:13):
very long time.
So that sort of confirmed thatLike, oh, I got kicked out.
Even the school didn't want me,you know, and then it forced my
parents to throw me away, andso it was very traumatic again
in a sense, like it just thingswere confirming that I'm
(42:35):
worthless.
Yeah, that was very painful.
Christina McKelvy (42:39):
How did he navigate?
Tomoko (42:40):
that In that conversation it blew up into a
huge argument, only because mymother lost her temper and I
just had to walk away.
But it was a lot of tensionafter that and a lot of anxiety
that came up, so like triggeringmy PTSD.
(43:02):
I think that was.
You know, in hindsight that'swhat was happening A lot of
nightmares, a lot of anxiety, alot of crying and then just
going through the depression.
I mean, gosh, I've had so manydepression, I don't have it
anymore.
(43:23):
But back then it would easilycome up.
Just any kind of those types ofmoments would trigger my
depression, and it would beanywhere from like two weeks to
weeks where I before I snap backout of it.
But interestingly, I was reallygood at putting the happy face,
(43:48):
so I could do that.
And I assure you I'm not doingthat right now.
I'm not putting a happy face,I'm really happy, yeah.
And so, yeah, that's a hugedifference.
Speaker 2 (44:01):
It's a huge huge difference.
Tomoko (44:02):
Back then I got very good at putting the facade.
People believed I was a veryhappy person.
They knew I was struggling hereand there, but not to the
extent of I was.
I don't think people had anyidea.
But yeah, again, the 15, 20years of healing really closed
(44:28):
them out of that.
Speaker 2 (44:29):
Yeah.
Christina McKelvy (44:35):
Yeah, amoko, it's interesting to hear your
story, you know, because what Ihear is that it took time.
Healing takes time and it takestrying many different things and
(45:01):
being okay with, oh, thisdidn't work, so I'm going to try
this.
I'm going to confront one of thepeople that instigated that
drama.
Okay, that might have notworked for that moment, but in
the future maybe it did help.
And you know, so I I lovehearing that journey and it's so
real because I think many of usthat have gone through a trauma
(45:22):
that is our experience is ittakes time and you have to
figure out the different thingsthat work for you.
We're getting speaking up time,we're getting close to time and
one thing that helps a lot ofpeople, you know, with their
journey with trauma or healing,even moving forward as hope.
And that's why my podcast iscalled Hopology, because I love
(45:45):
hearing stories of hope, healingand resilience, which you have
spoken about a lot is thatresilience that you have?
And so I want to ask and Iasked the same question to all
my guests and I I got this ideafrom a friend who did a podcast
and he would ask and a questionat the end of his episodes too,
(46:06):
and so I like to ask what givesyou hope?
Tomoko (46:09):
What gives me hope?
I would say I mean there aremany things, but one thing that
really gave me hope for mygaming journey was that I'm
capable of changing that.
I can rewire my, my mind system, my thought process, If I I
(46:33):
just have to really believe inmyself and give myself credit,
and there there's a lot of hopein that that I can change.
Things can change.
Christina McKelvy (46:48):
You're capable of changing.
Yeah yeah, that's the hope foryou.
Yeah Well, I really appreciatedthis conversation and I know
you also have a nonprofit.
What's that name of yournonprofit?
Tomoko (47:08):
Oh no, I don't have a nonprofit.
I it's not registered as 501 C3.
I just do these projects everyyear.
That's it.
Yeah, yeah, one is called stuff, a purse project.
I collected gently used pursesand collect sanitary items for
(47:28):
donations.
I do it for my birthday everyyear.
Invite all my girlfriends, Icook for them.
I love to cook, so I cook forthem.
We talk, story and then stuffall the bags with sanitary items
and toiletries and we've beengiving them, donating them to
(47:48):
incredible nonprofits like mymovement and other houseless
projects that help house listteams girls.
Because there's another storybehind that, maybe I can share
next time.
Christina McKelvy (48:07):
Yes, I want you back, for sure, yeah.
Tomoko (48:09):
Oh, thank you, yeah.
So yeah, I do, I love doing, Ilove volunteering.
I try to volunteer as much as Ican.
Christina McKelvy (48:18):
And that instills hope in the people that
you're serving, but also Ibuilders, you know it helps us
to know when we volunteer, sothank you.
Well, thank you for being onhere and let me know when your
book is out.
Yes, have you back on.
Tomoko (48:36):
Thank you so much.
Thank you for having me andlistening to my story.
Thank you, of course.
Christina McKelvy (48:45):
I hope you enjoyed listening to Tomoko's
story and it's just incredibleto hear the resilience she had
as a young girl and latercircling back, you know, with
her family to ask questions andtry and get that closure.
You can find more informationabout Tomoko through the show in
the show notes.
(49:05):
Excuse me, and also, as Imentioned, she really wants to
promote the tea cafe, whichagain serves LGBTQ and gender
diverse.
If you enjoy today's episode,leave a review, share it.
Also, consider supporting theshow.
This is a passion project.
(49:27):
It's just me, and if you wouldlike to be on the podcast and
you have a story to share, feelfree to email me at
homologypodcasts at gmailcom.
Thank you.
Speaker 2 (49:49):
And tonight yeah.
Today we're going to be speaking with Tomoko
.
She shares her story aboutbeing sent to the USA from Japan
, which was only 12 and notknowing anyone.
We discuss how she experiencedher life, her work and her
perspective.
Tomoko is an MFT intern,marriage family therapist,
working at Spill and Tea Cafeand exploring Honolulu.
Spill and Tea Cafe specializesin mental health care for youth,
(00:23):
with a special emphasis onsupporting gender diverse and
LGBTQ plus teens.
If you are in Honolulu, pleasecheck them out.
We'll be right back after thisshort break.
Welcome to Hopology Stories ofHope, healing and Resilience.
(00:55):
I'm your host, christinaMcKelvie.
Today we have Tomoko here todayand I repeated myself and I
said today twice.
Sorry, listeners, but you knowwhat it has been a day.
It is 4-eleven and Tomoko whattime is it?
Where you're at?
Tomoko (01:10):
It is 1-eleven.
Christina McKelvy (01:13):
Oh, and you're in the middle of the
Pacific.
Yes, in Hawaii, oh, hawaii, Ilove it.
That's where I'm from too.
We're from different islands,but I am no longer in Hawaii.
I am in Arizona, and it's hot.
It's not supposed to be hotwhere I'm at.
(01:34):
So how are you doing, tomoko?
I'm doing well.
Thank you for having me.
Of course, I'm really excitedto talk to you.
So I met you when we werevolunteering for the Hawaii
Crisis Responders for the Lineof Fires, and we were on a team
for an hour, you myself and aprofessor from the Midwest
(01:58):
somewhere.
Yes, he actually sent me someof his website and he did a lot
of studies on resilience.
It was amazing studies.
So, yes, that's where I met you, and we didn't really have
anyone show up for us for ourcrisis group, and so we got to
know each other and I heard alittle bit about your story,
(02:20):
what you shared, and I found itvery fascinating.
Speaker 2 (02:24):
And.
Christina McKelvy (02:25):
I wanted to.
You know I invited you on, sothank you so much for telling
the world, or the handful oflisteners I have, your story,
and so let's start, you know,with tell us a little bit about
you and a little bit about yourbackground, and we can go from
there.
Tomoko (02:37):
Sure.
So I was born and raised inJapan.
Tokyo is where I grew up.
I am a middle child of threechildren.
I have an older brother or hadone he was two years older than
me, and a younger sister who'sfive years younger.
Most of my family or immediatefamilies my immediate families,
(03:02):
you know they all still live inJapan.
I grew up there until I was 12.
And at 12, I was sent toCalifornia alone to initially
live with that relative, livewith relatives for several years
to learn English.
(03:23):
But I ended up in a boardingschool by the age of 13.
Christina McKelvy (03:31):
Dave, you know that you were going to go
into a boarding school when youfirst moved to California to
live with your family.
Tomoko (03:40):
So an interesting side note.
I'm sorry, I don't mean to likerear off on this.
I don't know, have you heard ofthe comedian or up and coming
like she's getting a lot oftrash in now they say his her
name is Asako Katsuka.
Christina McKelvy (03:57):
Yes, she's, hilarious.
Tomoko (03:59):
She is amazing.
She recently came to Hawaii andI had to go see her and she
shared her story of beingkidnapped.
She said and made it into acomedy skit, she was taken from
Tokyo, japan, to California whenshe was eight, I believe.
So the similarity in ourstories are just incredible and,
(04:24):
you know, the timing that Iheard about her story was
incredible.
I thought I would just kind ofthrow that in there.
Yeah, no, so very similar, yeah, and it's just.
I mean, obviously I've nevermet anyone who's you know, left
Japan to the United States inthe in the way that I did.
(04:45):
So I thought that was reallyinteresting.
I would love to talk to her oneday, but anyway, yeah, so I
know, actually I did it, and theinteresting thing is that I
think I was probably like maybe11, close to 12.
My, my mom just basically saidhey, you're going to go to
school in the United States,you're going to live in
(05:08):
California, you can live with,you know, with your relatives,
and that was it.
So it was almost like presentedas if, like, hey, we're going
to the store.
You know, there were nopreparations, they didn't ask me
questions, they didn't ask meto ask them questions.
No English lessons.
(05:29):
I didn't know how to speakEnglish, write, read nothing,
not not a bit, and I was 11, 12years old.
I had no idea what to expect orhow to even prepare mentally
for this.
You know, I just all I knew wasthat I visited there before I
visited my relatives.
(05:51):
It was fun when I visited.
So I went with that mentalityof like, oh, okay, it's gonna be
fun.
Christina McKelvy (05:57):
Yeah, so what was the boarding school that
you went to?
Was it only in English, or didthey teach it in Japanese?
So you didn't know English.
You know how to write Englishin English, you didn't know how
to speak in English, and thenyou're thrown into a school in
California.
Tomoko (06:16):
Yeah, so I initially lived with my family or relative
and then attended an elementaryschool.
So I graduated from elementaryschool in Japan and then was
sent away.
I attended an elementary schoolin California while living with
my relatives.
(06:36):
I remember like just holding anEnglish Japanese dictionary and
just walking around pointing tothings.
That's how I could.
That was the only way I couldcommunicate.
Yeah, yeah, it was.
It was very obviously verydifficult adjustment because I
had to adjust to the environment, people saying goodbye to
(07:01):
everything I knew, lifestyle,culture, even the way we, you
know, the way I eat, the thingsI ate were different.
You know, I went from likeeating rice every day to, you
know, meat and potatoes andthings like that.
So just that alone was a hugeadjustment.
(07:23):
But I had to go through everyother kind of adjustment.
You could imagine, wow, at 12years old, at 12 years old, yes,
yeah, yeah, it's big shot.
Christina McKelvy (07:40):
It is.
And you mentioned, you know,the comedian.
You mentioned her, yeah, andyou know she had a similar story
.
I know, yes, you know she.
I think she went to live withher grandma, yeah, and she
didn't know if she thought itwas a vacation and her mother
believed, had or hasschizophrenia.
Yes, and I'm curious, you know,it sounds like her story is one
(08:06):
of the only stories you'veheard that similar to yours.
Tomoko (08:09):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Yeah.
It was just interesting to hearbecause it's my.
My story is still very rare, soto hear her on the stage tell
her story, that's very similar.
And of all the places in theUnited States, she also moved to
(08:34):
California I think it wasSouthern California also, and
for me so it was sort ofcathartic moment for me to hear
that story.
Christina McKelvy (08:44):
You knew you were alone, yeah, yeah.
Yeah, I'm wondering how thatfelt.
You know that at 12 years oldhow that can feel the confusion.
It sounded like you didn't knowwhy you didn't.
You weren't expecting anything.
You were thrown into this.
Speaker 2 (09:00):
You know what that does for you then, and also what
it does for you now, youwouldn't even think about that.
Tomoko (09:07):
Yeah, I've had.
I've had a lot of differentmoments to process everything on
different levels, at differenteach it was.
I feel like I'm finally in aspace where I am very
comfortable talking about it.
(09:28):
I'm okay to talk about it.
Yeah, I'm actually writing abook about it, about my life,
nice and I'm hoping yeah, hopingthat I can help others in
overcoming trauma, childhoodtrauma, and so in a sense, I
feel like I'm in a really goodplace.
But I've had to process them indifferent stages, even as
(09:54):
recent as this past year, andsometimes I will have memories
thinking about what happenedback then and I cry for who I
was.
Christina McKelvy (10:24):
What did that look like?
Like how did you mention this?
Getting into the space, likeyou're now in the space where
you can talk about it, where youcan process it, and you said it
kind of happened in stages.
Tell me a little bit more aboutthat, like what those stages
looked like for you.
Tomoko (10:38):
Okay so, I'll also build it.
So, like leaving, being sentaway at 12, that is just a small
part of this traumaticchildhood that I had, on top of
not being properly prepared ortalked about how my life would
(11:00):
change and being thrown into thesituation, literally.
But I was also.
I went from an abusive housesituation to another abusive
situation, living with myrelatives, and then I eventually
(11:20):
escaped and I think I livedthere for seven months, whereas
I was supposed to, or I was toldI would live there until I
finished middle school and then,from high school, I would
attend boarding school because Iwould mature by then, I would
know English by then, and so theplans were abruptly changed, in
(11:47):
a sense, and so I, you know,instead of three years, seven
months later, I left myrelatives house and I was
supposed to go back home briefly, but I couldn't due to my
student visa situation.
So I was placed in a fostersystem and lived with the foster
(12:11):
family, who was again not verykind, and still my English was,
you know, seven months.
My English was very broken.
Now I'm living with strangers,not very nice, and my first, you
know, I spent my firstChristmas away from my family
(12:31):
and home with strangers who wereabusive.
So it's like there were layersof abuse that took place by the
time I was 13.
And so, you know, I startedattending boarding school maybe
(12:51):
six months after, in January,after I turned 13.
And then, of course, thisschool was very difficult
because it was middle school andhigh school.
That can be difficult, oh mygosh.
And I was the youngest at theschool.
(13:12):
Still, my English was verybroken, gosh.
I was bullied.
There was a lot of racism thatI experienced, so it's just you
know layers and layers of a lotof difficult times, traumatic
events, and I had to deal withall of them and come to terms
(13:33):
with them at that moment in away that I could with my very
underdeveloped brain you know,at 14, 15, you know.
So in that sense it had to takedifferent stages in over many
decades for me to process them.
(13:55):
Because I mean, gosh, I had CPT.
You know I had developed CPTSDwhich I wasn't diagnosed for
decades after.
I didn't even know.
Christina McKelvy (14:08):
Yeah, I think it's even a new, a relatively
new term.
Tomoko (14:12):
Yeah.
Christina McKelvy (14:13):
CPTSD Right right.
Tomoko (14:16):
Yeah, I didn't know about it until really recently,
several years ago.
Christina McKelvy (14:23):
Complex PTSD.
Tomoko (14:24):
Complex PTSD.
Right, I realized I had PTSD,you know, many years later
because I would have flashbacks.
I would have.
I had very, very bad anxiety,depression.
(14:44):
You know all of everything.
All of the above on the list ofPTSD symptoms.
Yeah, if it was listed you hadit.
Christina McKelvy (14:53):
I'm sorry If it was listed.
You had it.
Yes, exactly.
Tomoko (14:56):
Anyone yeah, right.
And so, yeah, I feel like itneeded to take.
It had to take over, you know,it had to happen over the years
the processing and healing of it.
And really I feel like I wantto say it took me when I had to
(15:16):
make a really strongdetermination that I'm going to
focus on healing and focus onworking on myself and my pain
and all the unhealthyattachments and personalities
that I've developed over theyears because of my childhood
(15:37):
trauma.
So it really took I would say Iwould say at least 15 years,
maybe more, to a constant,constantly working on healing.
And I've tried everything, readall of the books, wrote
(15:57):
everything meditation,acupuncture, chiropractic
therapy, I mean just all kindsof different methods of healing
and they all did part in gettingme to heal and to get me to
where I am today.
Christina McKelvy (16:16):
They all had a part.
Yeah, I would say so.
Tomoko (16:20):
It has to be very holistic.
I think so.
Christina McKelvy (16:23):
Yeah, I'm glad you pointed that out, that
it has to be holistic, becauseyou mentioned again that you had
to heal.
You healed in parts and it took15 years.
You start off like when you're12, just kind of figuring out
what was going on.
And then over the years, reading, writing, understanding,
(16:46):
getting that diagnosis ofcomplex PTSD, understanding that
and it seems like for a lot ofus I feel like trauma, we're
never fully healed from trauma.
Yeah, we're learning tonavigate with our trauma,
navigate life with trauma.
And you mentioned it has to beholistic, there's not just one
(17:07):
thing that works.
So what did the holisticapproach look like for you?
Because you said chiropractic,acupuncture, writing therapy,
chinese herbal, I mean reallykinesiology.
Tomoko (17:23):
I mean you, you, you, you know, if you've mentioned
any type of healing methods,I've tried it.
I've tried the Western way,using medication, and then I
used more holistic way, likehomeopathic remedy, essential
oil and flower essence.
(17:43):
I mean like I tried everythingbecause I really really just
wanted to get out of this dark,dark place that I felt like was
really slowly killing me and Ididn't want, but at the same
time I didn't want, to give upon life.
I mean, there's so many timeswhere I thought why you know
(18:05):
like what, what's, what's thewhat's the best way to get out
of this dark place?
You know like what's, what'sthe point, but I really just
firmly believed in deserving tolive a good life and I slowly
started to shift my mindset,really slowly and at my pace,
(18:29):
and that's why it takes 15 plusyears to heal from trauma like
this.
And I realized that I had totake your time and the biggest
thing I realized I had to do inwhat ultimately saved my life is
that I have to do this myselfand I have to own things, I have
(18:53):
to believe in myself.
I had to like basically rewirethe way I thought, you know,
just the way I saw the world.
No-transcript.
So you had to shift yourthinking, your beliefs, oh yeah,
in so many ways, and meditationand affirmation and things like
(19:19):
that.
Really really, I mean, it takestime.
It's a practice, you know, justlike going to the gym, just
like practicing sports or yogaor whatever.
You slowly build it and slowlyshift your mindset.
Because what trauma does in oneof the worst things traumatic
(19:43):
events or like abuse can do,especially when you experience
them as a child is that itcreates the world and the views
and perspectives for you.
So if you were traumatized, ifyou were neglected, if you were
abused, then that's the set oflens you're going to see the
(20:05):
entire world for the rest ofyour life.
Then, unless you heal from themor, you know, really heal and
change the perspectives yourselfand the belief system yourself.
And I feel like that's where alot of people struggle, because
we want somebody else to fix itright, like we want the
(20:29):
therapist to fix it, the doctorto fix it, the medicine to fix
it.
But ultimately it's really upto you.
It's hard work.
I can tell you that it's hardwork.
You have to be patient, youhave to be most patient with
yourself.
But once you get there, it'sreally incredible.
(20:53):
Life really changes yeah.
Christina McKelvy (21:10):
The part of healing from trauma is finding
ways to shift your perspectiveor change the way you see the
world, like you mentioned.
I know earlier I mentioned Idon't feel that we can fully
heal from our trauma.
What I meant to say is the termget over it or things like that
(21:30):
.
When I think of healing and Ialso think of scars, you know
like the scars heal but youmight still have remnants of it
Definitely yeah, yeah.
Tomoko (21:42):
And so I think, and I totally agree with you, the way
I see it is more like whenyou're traumatizing, you can't
get over it and you strugglebecause you have these terrible
aftermath mindsets and the wayyou react to things and the way
(22:03):
you hurt, the way you takethings.
It's almost like your wound isjust not healing and you're
walking around with all thesecuts.
Yeah, but once you heal or onceyou are in a better place, yeah
, there are scars, but theydon't hurt anymore.
You know and so, yes, definitelyyou still have scars.
Some days you still you know,some days I still cry and
(22:28):
remember and even react tothings.
But now that I've done the workfor so many years, there's more
subtle like calmness to myreaction, because I'm not
reacting from this fearfulanxiety-injustice place and
(22:50):
that's.
I didn't mention this earlier,but I'm trying to get licensed
in MFT and that's how I try tohelp my clients to help them to
lessen their calm their nervoussystem, because without calming
(23:12):
your nervous system it's reallydifficult to come out of trauma
or trauma mindset.
Christina McKelvy (23:19):
You're always hyper vigilant.
You're reacting.
Yes, yeah, yeah, I will sayyou're very calm.
Speaker 2 (23:27):
Thank you.
Yeah, yeah, yeah yeah.
Tomoko (23:33):
I it wasn't.
It didn't happen overnight.
My kids can tell you.
Christina McKelvy (23:42):
Not having kids, I'm sure is.
Oh, god has its own stories.
Tomoko (23:48):
Oh yeah, oh yes, oh yes yeah.
Christina McKelvy (23:52):
I'm wondering how being a mom has played into
your perspective, you know,since you're sitting away as a
child and you mentioned you hadtrauma even before.
Yeah, and the people that youwere supposed to care for you
and you were supposed to trust.
You could not.
Speaker 2 (24:08):
So I'm curious how that yeah how being a mom has
just been a perspective or whatthat was like for you.
Tomoko (24:13):
Yeah, I appreciate you asking me that, because that is
a huge part and I didn't knowuntil I experienced it and my
therapist mentioned it that youknow, people often relive their
trauma through their kids, andthat's exactly what happened,
and it freaked me out becauseI'm like what is happening?
(24:34):
What's going on?
Why am I reacting this way?
I really had adverse reactions,like when my oldest son turned
12 or, you know, was about toturn 12, I was having major
anxiety, just worrying andoverthinking, and I had no idea
what was going on until mytherapist said I think this is
(24:56):
connected to you know yourexperience and you're reliving
it through him, and so youranxiety is heightened and I'm
like that makes total senseBecause you were 12.
Christina McKelvy (25:06):
Yes, Right yeah, wow yeah.
Tomoko (25:11):
And so there were a lot of reliving moments.
I also lost my brother when Iwas 16 and he was 18 in a carts
event.
So I relived that through myoldest son and then I a lot more
subtle because of where I amnow but in a sense I'm reliving
it again through my second sonbecause he's getting close to
(25:34):
the age that my brother died andhe everybody I mean including
myself he reminds us the most ofmy brother.
He looks like my brother, heacts like my brother, and so
it's.
It can be very heavy sometimesjust looking at him, both, you
know, in a negative and positiveway.
(25:54):
Negative way, it's like beingreminded of the loss, but then
also positive is that we sort ofget to see his life through my
son in a in an interestingspiritual way, I guess, and so
there's a lot of mixed emotionsand, of course, as an abused,
(26:17):
you know, I was pretty severelyabused as a child, physically,
mentally, and so I knew thatwhen I had three children, or
before I had children, I waslike, okay, I got it, I got to
make sure I don't become, youknow this an abusive parent.
(26:42):
And then when I burst threechildren, I was like, oh my gosh
.
I got to really make sure.
That was another, another bigreason why I decided to focus on
my healing because I knew thatI needed.
I did not want to repeatbecause you know I, when I
(27:03):
studied psychology, thestatistics of of abused person
becoming an abuser was thepercentage was so high and I
also made many mistakes as as aparent and I wanted to correct
them.
I wanted to be better, I wantedto to raise healthy children.
(27:26):
So it's a lot of discipline, alot of determination to to focus
on that as a mother.
Christina McKelvy (27:38):
You wanted to break that generational cycle,
exactly.
Speaker 2 (27:43):
Yeah.
Tomoko (27:43):
Yeah, really needed to.
Speaker 2 (27:46):
Yeah.
Tomoko (27:50):
And the I feel like the beautiful thing about it, now
that I am where I am, is that Isomehow knew that I like I
knowing that and, you know,doing something about it is is
huge, right, like I can even saythat for myself, it's huge.
(28:10):
It is not an easy path to youknow, and it is a path that you
have to choose because it has tobe determined, it has to be
something.
You say I am going to do thisand I'm going to consciously
work on this, and and knowingthat, somewhere inside I believe
(28:30):
that I could.
Yeah, I feel like that's hugetoo.
And then I mean, yes, I mademany, many mistakes and it's
it's.
You know, guaranteeing is stillvery, very challenging, but I
feel like, for the most part,I've done a lot better than had
I not made that determination tobreak the cycle, and so, yeah,
(28:56):
I feel very proud of that.
Christina McKelvy (28:59):
You made that choice.
Tomoko (29:02):
Yeah, that's super hard.
Christina McKelvy (29:05):
It can be.
You know, there's sometimesthere's a lot of barriers
sometimes for individuals likemaybe they want to make that
choice, but there's somethingthat gets in the way.
Tomoko (29:16):
And also, you know, societal expectations and people
not knowing what I've beenthrough and I me feeling like I
need to live up to everybody'sexpectations.
You know I mean just all kindsof mess.
It's a lot, it's a lot ofcomplicated stuff that that
(29:37):
takes place.
I think any mother could relateto it.
Christina McKelvy (29:43):
Those expectations.
You need to live up to them.
I mean because being sent awayat 12, I know, when I was 12, I
was always people pleasing,still am and to an extent you
know, and at that age you'rethat's, you know, you're so
impressionable.
So being sent away, like whatmessages?
You know just that 12 year oldself-receive and how does that
(30:05):
carry on?
Like you said, through yourbelief system, how you see the
world, parenting, you knoweverything like that.
Tomoko (30:14):
Definitely, yeah, it affects everything in your mind,
and not just your childhood,but years and decades later.
So it's it's very complicatedand you have to like essentially
undo all of that, you know,basically in order to heal and
(30:35):
in order and you, there's a lotof growth in that too, of course
, as hard as it is.
So, yeah, it was very, verydifficult and very long path,
but I'm really glad I chose that, yeah, and now you're here,
yeah, and I'm here.
Christina McKelvy (30:57):
This is wonderful and getting and
working on your MFT, which ismarriage and family therapy.
Tomoko (31:06):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, it's.
You know, when I was in college, during my senior year,
studying psychology atUniversity of Hawaii at Manoa, I
dropped out because of my CPTSDand I was not diagnosed at that
(31:26):
time, and so there was a lot ofinternalizing happening.
Oh my gosh you know, my anxietywas way up there, my depression
, my, you know I was reacting toeverything I used to tell
people.
It's almost like walking aroundand not having any skin,
anything that brushes against mehurt.
Christina McKelvy (31:49):
Your nerves are raw Exposed.
Tomoko (31:51):
Yeah, exposed and raw, and that's that was the only way
to help others understand whatit's like to be me, and I feel
like I would still use that.
That's how difficult life wasat that moment.
I was 22, 23, dropped outSenior year.
I didn't even know.
I didn't even know until many,many years later, when I decided
(32:15):
to go back to school and like Ishould finish getting my, my
bachelor's.
I only had one class, so I didthat back in 2017.
I got my you know, bachelor'sdegree in psychology.
Finally, after all the years,and I'm actually really glad I
(32:36):
did it the way I did, becausehad I become a therapist back,
you know, in my twenties, Iwould have probably been a mess
because you know it, just youyou really have to heal from,
from your trauma If you want tohelp others.
You can't help others until youhelp yourself.
Yeah, so I'm really glad.
(32:57):
And then I just continued withit.
I'm like you know, I never,ever, thought I would get my
master's.
I never thought I was capableor smart enough, all the things
on the list but like, oh, maybeI can.
And I did it.
I graduated and, yeah, I'mreally, really glad I did it the
(33:17):
way it did.
I mean, sitting with a bunch of20-something year olds was very
intimidating.
I'm like oh, I'm anti here, hiyou know like anti yeah.
Brilliant young people.
And I'm going to school and I'mlike, okay, I'm a little bit
(33:38):
late in the game, but I'm trying.
But again, I'm really glad theway that I'm doing it, the way I
am, because it just it's yeah,it's such a, it's such an
incredible work and I feel a lotmore comfortable doing it.
Christina McKelvy (34:00):
Yeah, because you like, so you healed or
you're healing.
Tomoko (34:05):
Yeah, yeah, and I feel like I'm in a good place to tell
people or I shouldn't say tellpeople, because that's not what
my job is is as a therapist, butlike guide them through their
challenges I feel like I'm in amuch better place to to provide
the guidance I always tell myclients.
Just think of me as a GPS andyou know.
(34:27):
I like that I'm just a GPShelping you from.
You know get from A to B.
You know, if there's anaccident I'll find you a better
path.
You know, but I'm not here totell you what to do, or you know
.
So I'm.
I'm a much better GPS than Iwould have been in my 20s.
Christina McKelvy (34:53):
In your 20s you would have been the beta GPS
.
Yeah, the.
Speaker 2 (34:58):
AOL version.
Christina McKelvy (34:59):
Oh my goodness, Did you ever find out,
or did you, why you were sentto the United States?
Tomoko (35:13):
Yeah, I did.
That's an interesting thing too.
I, in my 30s, I did have amoment where I was able to kind
of confront my parents andbasically what happened was when
I was living in Japan, I wassent to a very prestigious
(35:37):
school all girls Japan Women'sUniversity, but it's like it's
almost, like, you know, likePunahou here.
Yeah, it's from preschool allthe way to well.
This one is all the way touniversity.
Punahou is high school, but it'sa very like if you get in your
(35:58):
set.
And my mom went there and shewanted me and my sister to go
there.
We got in, but it was reallydifficult.
It's one of the top schools inJapan.
If you mention, oh, yeah, youknow, I went to the school.
Everybody in Japan knows whatthat is.
It's very, very, very difficultschool.
(36:25):
When I attended there, you know,because of the situation at
home, nobody helped me.
I was on my own, whereas all myclassmates this is a type of
school where all the parents arehands-on with every homework,
every prep for tests, exams andall that I didn't have any of
that, so I failed a lot, whichis not acceptable.
(36:49):
It's a very, very typicalJapanese system type of school,
but like on the steroid kind ofthing.
It's a very cookie cutter.
If you are not getting straightA's, then you know you're not
meeting their expectations.
I definitely wasn't.
Nobody helped me not onceanybody helped me with homework
(37:14):
from first grade to sixth grade.
So basically at sixth grade youtransition into middle school
and it's another campus and yourparents meet with the principal
and they'll tell you, okay,you're transitioning or, I'm
sorry, you're not good enough.
And basically the school waslike, yeah, it's not good enough
(37:37):
.
And I didn't know that.
My mom didn't tell me Untilyour 30s.
Yeah, when I asked her, Wow.
So the way I'm interpreted well,the way I've interpreted it is
that she was too ashamed to tellpeople that I got kicked out.
But if she said, oh my gosh,she's going to school in the
(38:00):
United States, it soundsfabulous.
And instead of because, in youknow, I feel like my perception
or it about it is correct,because If it was with more
positive intentions, you know, Iwould think she would have
(38:22):
explained why I was going to theUnited States, she would have
prepared me better.
I would have at least hadEnglish lessons or, you know,
been able to ask questions.
I really basically had to prythat out of her and she finally
got very upset and said, well,you got kicked out.
And I was like, oh gosh, Ididn't see that coming, yeah.
(38:46):
And so, instead of sending meto a public school from middle
school, she chose to send meaway.
Christina McKelvy (38:56):
You said it, you feel that it was more of a
pride for her on herself.
Tomoko (39:03):
Yeah, definitely, and I was able at that point to tell
her.
Well, because of this decisionand because I didn't know
anything about it, I struggledand then I also went through a
lot of abuse, bullying.
I was also molested when I was14.
(39:23):
So, like all these thingshappened you know, by the time I
was 16, I've had so much traumahappen in my life that it was
so difficult that I it took along time for me to confront my
(39:43):
family.
Yeah, and of course, when Iwould try to, it was very not a
Japanese girl thing to do toconfront my parents, you know,
seeing as very disrespectful,none of my statements were taken
well, taken well or takenproperly, I guess you know.
(40:12):
So that was hard, but Inavigated through those things
over the years and overcame them.
Christina McKelvy (40:25):
Having that discussion with your mom sounds
like it was one of those piecesfor your healing.
One of the parts for yourhealing.
Tomoko (40:32):
Yes, definitely, and I didn't know this then because it
did take I think I was about 33, 35 maybe, but it took another
10 plus years to be where I amnow Real and realize that that
was, that was still a very toxicmoment.
(40:54):
Yeah because she initiallydenied, like kind of played,
like I don't know, I don't knowwhy I sent you, and I would say
well, you threw me away.
That's how I see it.
You threw me away and she'slike oh my gosh, no, no, I
didn't throw you away.
I'm like so why did you send meaway?
And I pushed it.
I can be like that.
(41:16):
You were determined, you weredetermined to find out why that
happened to you because itshaped your perspective.
Christina McKelvy (41:26):
It shaped your life Exactly.
Tomoko (41:28):
Yeah, yeah, and I pushed her enough that she got very
upset and kind of blurred it out.
I don't think she hadintentions to tell me.
And when she blurred it out itwas obviously a very shock for
me to hear, because I had noidea I hadn't been kicked out
(41:53):
and I was like I don't know.
I guess it's in a sense thatthat moment they confirmed I
don't think like this anymore.
But back then, you know, likegosh, I must not be good enough
or I must be disposable becausemy parents don't love me.
You know that mindset I livedthat in that mindset for a very,
(42:13):
very long time.
So that sort of confirmed thatLike, oh, I got kicked out.
Even the school didn't want me,you know, and then it forced my
parents to throw me away, andso it was very traumatic again
in a sense, like it just thingswere confirming that I'm
(42:35):
worthless.
Yeah, that was very painful.
Christina McKelvy (42:39):
How did he navigate?
Tomoko (42:40):
that In that conversation it blew up into a
huge argument, only because mymother lost her temper and I
just had to walk away.
But it was a lot of tensionafter that and a lot of anxiety
that came up, so like triggeringmy PTSD.
(43:02):
I think that was.
You know, in hindsight that'swhat was happening A lot of
nightmares, a lot of anxiety, alot of crying and then just
going through the depression.
I mean, gosh, I've had so manydepression, I don't have it
anymore.
(43:23):
But back then it would easilycome up.
Just any kind of those types ofmoments would trigger my
depression, and it would beanywhere from like two weeks to
weeks where I before I snap backout of it.
But interestingly, I was reallygood at putting the happy face,
(43:48):
so I could do that.
And I assure you I'm not doingthat right now.
I'm not putting a happy face,I'm really happy, yeah.
And so, yeah, that's a hugedifference.
Speaker 2 (44:01):
It's a huge huge difference.
Tomoko (44:02):
Back then I got very good at putting the facade.
People believed I was a veryhappy person.
They knew I was struggling hereand there, but not to the
extent of I was.
I don't think people had anyidea.
But yeah, again, the 15, 20years of healing really closed
(44:28):
them out of that.
Speaker 2 (44:29):
Yeah.
Christina McKelvy (44:35):
Yeah, amoko, it's interesting to hear your
story, you know, because what Ihear is that it took time.
Healing takes time and it takestrying many different things and
(45:01):
being okay with, oh, thisdidn't work, so I'm going to try
this.
I'm going to confront one of thepeople that instigated that
drama.
Okay, that might have notworked for that moment, but in
the future maybe it did help.
And you know, so I I lovehearing that journey and it's so
real because I think many of usthat have gone through a trauma
(45:22):
that is our experience is ittakes time and you have to
figure out the different thingsthat work for you.
We're getting speaking up time,we're getting close to time and
one thing that helps a lot ofpeople, you know, with their
journey with trauma or healing,even moving forward as hope.
And that's why my podcast iscalled Hopology, because I love
(45:45):
hearing stories of hope, healingand resilience, which you have
spoken about a lot is thatresilience that you have?
And so I want to ask and Iasked the same question to all
my guests and I I got this ideafrom a friend who did a podcast
and he would ask and a questionat the end of his episodes too,
(46:06):
and so I like to ask what givesyou hope?
Tomoko (46:09):
What gives me hope?
I would say I mean there aremany things, but one thing that
really gave me hope for mygaming journey was that I'm
capable of changing that.
I can rewire my, my mind system, my thought process, If I I
(46:33):
just have to really believe inmyself and give myself credit,
and there there's a lot of hopein that that I can change.
Things can change.
Christina McKelvy (46:48):
You're capable of changing.
Yeah yeah, that's the hope foryou.
Yeah Well, I really appreciatedthis conversation and I know
you also have a nonprofit.
What's that name of yournonprofit?
Tomoko (47:08):
Oh no, I don't have a nonprofit.
I it's not registered as 501 C3.
I just do these projects everyyear.
That's it.
Yeah, yeah, one is called stuff, a purse project.
I collected gently used pursesand collect sanitary items for
(47:28):
donations.
I do it for my birthday everyyear.
Invite all my girlfriends, Icook for them.
I love to cook, so I cook forthem.
We talk, story and then stuffall the bags with sanitary items
and toiletries and we've beengiving them, donating them to
(47:48):
incredible nonprofits like mymovement and other houseless
projects that help house listteams girls.
Because there's another storybehind that, maybe I can share
next time.
Christina McKelvy (48:07):
Yes, I want you back, for sure, yeah.
Tomoko (48:09):
Oh, thank you, yeah.
So yeah, I do, I love doing, Ilove volunteering.
I try to volunteer as much as Ican.
Christina McKelvy (48:18):
And that instills hope in the people that
you're serving, but also Ibuilders, you know it helps us
to know when we volunteer, sothank you.
Well, thank you for being onhere and let me know when your
book is out.
Yes, have you back on.
Tomoko (48:36):
Thank you so much.
Thank you for having me andlistening to my story.
Thank you, of course.
Christina McKelvy (48:45):
I hope you enjoyed listening to Tomoko's
story and it's just incredibleto hear the resilience she had
as a young girl and latercircling back, you know, with
her family to ask questions andtry and get that closure.
You can find more informationabout Tomoko through the show in
the show notes.
(49:05):
Excuse me, and also, as Imentioned, she really wants to
promote the tea cafe, whichagain serves LGBTQ and gender
diverse.
If you enjoy today's episode,leave a review, share it.
Also, consider supporting theshow.
This is a passion project.
(49:27):
It's just me, and if you wouldlike to be on the podcast and
you have a story to share, feelfree to email me at
homologypodcasts at gmailcom.
Thank you.
Speaker 2 (49:49):
And tonight yeah.
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