Saying Goodbye to A Place You Love: Creating Ceremony as an International Person

In this tender moment from Episode 23, Mickelle revisits a rich, emotional conversation with Kris Herwig as she reflects on the deeply intentional process behind her family’s most recent move. What once felt like an automatic “yes” to opportunity evolved into a season of active reflection, weighing values, emotional needs, and the unique challenges of uprooting with older children. Through tears, lists, and long talks, Kris and her husband navigated uncertainty to redefine what home could mean—this time not just for them, but for their growing kids.

What stands out is the emotional labor of expat life—how choosing where and how to live isn’t a one-time decision, but an ongoing, layered process. Kris recognized that this move was different: she was now raising Third Culture Kids. She dove into the literature to better understand their emotional landscape and the long-term impact of mobility on growing children. And as always, Mickelle brings care and presence into the space, having walked the journey of goodbye alongside Kris, honoring the endings with ritual and heart.

Key Moments:

• Shifting from passive to intentional decision-making for big life decisions
  
  
  
• Creating space for emotion and uncertainty when moving to a new country
  
  
  
• Navigating a move with children and teenagers while keeping their mental health at the forefront
  
  
  
• The realities both good and hard of raising Third Culture Kids
  
  
  
• Redefining home for your family
  
  
  
• Honoring endings through ceremony and friendship

To connect with Mickelle or learn more about personalized rituals for transition, visit houseofperegrine.com or find her on Instagram @houseofperegrine. You can find the original episode and all the details at www.houseofperegrine.com/podcast/ep-023.

Send us a text, we'd love to hear from you and hear what you're enjoying and what you'd like to hear about.

House of Peregrine is for international life.

Join a global circle of thinkers, creators, and doers. We create software, host events, publish guides, produce podcasts, offer rewards and curated products — all within a vibrant ecosystem of experts and businesses all living their lives abroad.

Get started with a FREE account today to unlock exclusive connections, and opportunities:

houseofperegrine.com/auth/signup

Stay connected:

Subscribe: houseofperegrine.com/subscribe

Join our WhatsApp Group: HOP Community

Explore Memberships: houseofperegrine.com/memberships

Install the App: houseofperegrine.com/install

Follow us for daily inspiration and updates:

Instagram: @houseofperegrine

YouTube: @HouseofPeregrineofficial

LinkedIn:@company/house-of-...

Episode Transcript

(00:00):
Hi, I'm Michael Weber, founder and auteur of House of
Peregrine. Expat, immigrant, pioneer.
None of these were a fit, but Peregrine describes what we are
all about perfectly. Those that craft their life
story with intention. I've spent the last six years in
awe of the life changing connections and stories I have

(00:23):
experienced while living abroad and believe it is time for this
adventure to be recognized, celebrated, and elevated to the
life stage that it is. Through these interviews, I hope
to connect those living internationally more deeply to
both the place they are living and with themselves and those
around them. We cover everything from
international finances and meaning making to global

(00:46):
parenting and relationships to make your time abroad more
intentional, edifying and full of beauty.
Find us at houseofperegrine.com where you can find more ways to
connect with the ethos of Peregrine.
I hope you enjoy today's guest. Let's get started.
Hi, it's Miquel and welcome back.
I'm bringing you today a moment from my conversation with my

(01:08):
dear friend Chris Herwig. You might remember her from
episode 23, where we talked about the power of goodbye and
how meaningful it was to create a personal ceremony together
when she left Amsterdam. In this clip, we pick up with
Chris as she reflects on what itreally means to make the
decision to move, this time withmore complexity, more intention,
and two growing kids in the mix.What began as a passive

(01:31):
opportunity evolved into a deep and emotional process of
weighing values, navigating uncertainty, and defining home
as something her whole family could carry together.
It's a candid look at the emotional labor of expat life,
of choosing again and again, where and how to belong, and how
to celebrate it all with ceremony.
I hope you enjoy it and thanks for listening.

(01:53):
It felt like you didn't have an end date, but suddenly there was
an end date that you he introduced into your system.
And so that we all have those times that some people describe
it as like every year we sit down and decide to stay another
year when our visas come up, we make the decision.
You know, there's every family, every couple, every individual

(02:15):
has their own process of how they decide where to stay
because you do have to make a decision.
It's not a passive process, so. For you that was.
The moment where that that theremay be another move on the
horizon. And So what did that start
making you do feel? Considering.

(02:37):
All the fields. I mean, I think you said it very
well when you said it's not a passive process, but actually
all of our moves had been sort of passive, like as in, oh,
there's a job opportunity, let'sgo.
Like, oh, like, cool job opportunity, let's go.
And now we felt like we're at a point, like my husband stopped
working for the company he'd been at for a long time.
And so we're in the Netherlands.I think it might have still been

(03:01):
COVID. It was somewhere in that COVID
time, we were living in a 2 bedroom apartment with kids who
are not happy to be sharing roomanymore.
And you know, that was fair. So we knew that we needed to do
something. And so it was either are we
going to move, buy a house in the Netherlands?

(03:22):
Are we going to move somewhere else?
And what does that look like? So we, we thought like, OK,
we're going to be really, we're going to be grown-ups now and
really make this decision. We're very unhappy.
It felt like a lot of pressure because we didn't know, it
wasn't like we could sit down and have these.
We would do, we would like develop point systems, we would
like rank places on all these different things.

(03:44):
And everything always came out to average like the same.
So if something was more expensive or public
transportation or school systemsor whatever it, it all sort of
came out in the wash. So we were like how do we do
this? And ultimately really in a way
it did sort of semi passive again, just in the sense that my
husband looked for work and he looked both in the Netherlands

(04:06):
and in Sweden, only those two places.
And he got a really great job opportunity in Sweden.
So suddenly that was it. And he was like, I got a job
offer and it was like, OK, starting in a month, OK.
Starting in a month, but that process is I was kind of there
for it. It's it was a kind of like more
like a year process. Oh, yeah, I know, I know.

(04:28):
Yeah, you were there for it. And you know, I apologize
because I came over and had the same conversation like every
week. I was like, oh, what are we
gonna do? Don't apologize.
It is, you know, living intentionally is actually a lot
of. Work.
And making considered decisions and not just going with whatever
is presented with you, yeah, foryou is a lot of work.

(04:49):
And it does take a lot of consideration and conversations
and whatever you need. And I think that that what I was
is grateful because I've had other friends just not share it
and they just disappear. They sometimes move the next
week. They sometimes move overnight.
And so I think I've done it enough times that I wanted to be

(05:10):
part of your process because I was already part of your life.
And so this is part of your lifeand so I wanted to be part of
it. So I think that that's just part
of it, and it is part of this life of intentionally living in
a place for as long as it suits you.
And then you have to find a process.
Around that and it's a. Multi dimensional process,
especially when you have a, you know, a partner and children.

(05:32):
And as you know, you had to go through every layer of what that
is, what's best for the kids, what's best for me, what's best
for us, What is our long term goal?
Does this fit it? You know, yeah.
Is this our final resting place?Is it not?
And so this, this is a big decision that, you know, most
people, as we say, don't make. No, simply not I I think that

(05:56):
like, especially when you compare it to other times that
we moved, like the added dimension of our children being
older, like the last time we moved, I had a son who was three
and now I had two kids who were nine and well, when we moved 9
and 13 and that's really different.
And I will say that I, I went out and bought this book third

(06:18):
culture kids, which is really ironic because all along I had
these third culture kids, but this move felt different.
Like it felt like I was doing something so different because
it like, I don't know, they had been so young in the beginning.
I hadn't thought about it in thesame way.
So I was actually still learninga lot.
And I made the mistake of the I just looked in the index under

(06:39):
moving and under moving. It had different like sub
categories and the first one waslike adolescence.
So am I right? So I go to moving adolescence
and it was like, oh, like from the age of 13, like moving can
cause like all of these like negative effects and blah, blah,
blah, and increased of all thesethings.

(07:00):
And I was like, Oh dear God, what, what Like what I'm of
course it said like, you know, you can still do it, but it was
like all these things to think about, which was very daunting.
But also, I mean, honestly, goodto know, right.
So that you're considering all of these different things.
And so, yeah, I think moving considering the kids was really

(07:21):
hard. I had a moment where I told
Martin we couldn't move because I was too stressed about the
kids and in particular my daughter who's, yeah, I've been
anxious and doesn't deal with change that well.
But then actually we visited Sweden for a week last fall.
And then I just, I reversed it and said, look, you know what,

(07:41):
She'll be fine if we're with her.
She'll be fine. And I, I don't want, you know,
her, her like that is not how I should be making a decision.
Like we talked about it as a family and it was maybe not
their biggest wish to move, but but I I realized that if we were
together, we could always make it work.
So. Yeah, yeah.

(08:03):
And you're still, you know, I think in a way that is part of
the difference of, of living this way is your family really
is your home. So home is wherever you are.
And that is a new idea that we're all kind of having to
grapple with. I think that home there, they'll

(08:24):
have multiple homes, right? Amsterdam will always feel like
a home to them, even if they move back or they never come
back. And so, but it can't be their
only home. It can't be their only safe
place. And in a way, we're all raised
to think that that's really important.
And it is. So you you're in a way
compensating or doing this extralayer of support to make home

(08:50):
clear to them in other ways. I love this moment with Chris.
It's such a powerful reminder that moving, especially when
you're moving with a family, is about a whole bunch more than
just logistics. It's a layered, emotional,
sometimes even circularly painful and exciting moment.
And as we spoke about in her original episode, how we leave

(09:11):
matters just as much as where wego next.
And so if you haven't, go listento episode 23.
It's full of wisdom. I invite you to go back and
listen. Her episode is all about
friendship, ritual, and the power of honoring endings in a
world and a process that's oftentoo quick to rush on to the next
thing. I know I have been guilty of
this myself, because sometimes it's easier just to move on to

(09:32):
the next exciting thing then to feel and realize the pain and
the complexity of what leaving aplace brings.
So thank you to Chris for letting me be part of her
abstract life and letting me into her process of leaving and
also letting me create a ceremony for her that was very
meaningful for me as well because it was in fact an end of

(09:53):
a chapter for me as well as everyone who came.
If you are facing a new beginning or an ending, I would
love to create a ceremony for you.
That's something we offer. House of Peregrine, you can head
over to houseofperegrine.com andin the shop, you can sign up to
have me create a personalized ritual for you that will make
leaving, coming, or any other maybe life transition you have a

(10:16):
little more special and actuallytake a moment to acknowledge
what's going on. I love doing this and so I would
love to do it for you. Thank you so much for listening
to this episode and I'll see younext time.
OK, that's it for today. I hope you've enjoyed our show.
For the latest insights on living internationally, join us
at houseofperegrine.com to find out how you can connect with our

(10:39):
community. Let's craft our life story with
intention, together.