November 12, 2025 • 31 mins
For many veterans, the toughest battles begin after coming home. Isolation, moral injury, post-traumatic stress, and the loss of structure can make reintegration feel like an entirely new mission — one without a map.
In this powerful Veterans Day episode of the Human Resilience Podcast, hosts Bob Gold and Shelley Schoenfeld sit down with retired Brigadier General and military psychiatrist Dr. Stephen Xenakis and Army veteran Ben Parker to explore what life after service truly looks like — the quiet struggles, the search for purpose, and the small steps that rebuild strength and connection.
Together, they share honest reflections on how trauma shapes identity, what recovery really takes, and why connection — not perfection — is the foundation of healing.
Listen and Learn:
- The emotional and psychological realities of reintegration after service
- Why connection and peer support are critical to recovery and resilience
- How behavioral science and small daily actions can restore structure and hope
- Practical ways families and communities can support veterans in transition
If you or someone you know is a veteran in crisis, dial 988 and press 1 to reach the Veterans Crisis Line. For further information on GoMo Health's Veteran Resiliency program, click here.
Guests:
- Dr. Stephen Xenakis, Retired Brigadier General & Military Psychiatrist
- Ben Parker, U.S. Army Veteran
Hosts:
- Bob Gold, Chief Behavioral Technologist, GoMo Health
- Shelley Schoenfeld, Chief Marketing & Client Services Officer, GoMo Health
Thanks for tuning in. Subscribe today to receive new episode drops, comment with questions for our hosts/guests and follow @GoMoHealth on social for the latest in healthcare engagement.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
SPEAKER_03 (00:05):
I spent 10 years in the army.
I was enlisted.
I was in the OD tech.
Did three tours overseas.
And I always thought I was I wasreally lucky in a sense that I
really didn't have a lot ofPTSD.
I mean, saw a lot of awfulstuff.
Um, did a lot of you knowinteresting um events part of
over there.
But um, yeah, I you I didn'treally have issues until I got
(00:29):
home, until I got married, untilI got my first kind of real
world job.
And and then it it it allstarted kind of crumbling down a
little bit.
SPEAKER_00 (00:40):
Sometimes something new intercepts our lives and
changes the way we're able tolive, work, or care for
ourselves and others.
Hi, I'm Shelly Schoenfeld, ChiefMarketing and Client Services
Officer at Gomo Health.
SPEAKER_01 (00:53):
Hi, I'm Bob Gold, Chief Behavioral Technologist.
Nice to have you all aboard.
SPEAKER_00 (00:58):
Thanks, Bob.
And together today, we're divinginto the real stories and
science behind whole personhealth, what it means, why it
matters, and how it can make adifference for people who need
it most.
Welcome to season two of humanresilience, changing the way
healthcare is delivered.
For many veterans, the mostdifficult battles aren't always
(01:19):
fought on the front lines.
They begin at home andinternally.
Today's timely episode beingthat it's Veterans Day, so
thanks everybody for joining us.
But today we're focusing on atopic that's really close to all
of our hearts, which are theinvisible rules and challenges
that veterans often face as theytransition to civilian life.
(01:42):
Sometimes they includeisolation, depression,
post-traumatic stress, and a lotof structure and mission that
wants to find really everyminute of their daily living.
Joining us today to share theirinsights is retired Brigadier
General Dr.
Stevensanel, a psychiatrist andlongtime advocate for mental
(02:03):
health and ethical leadership inthe military, and Ben Parker, a
veteran who's lived thechallenges of reintegration
firsthand.
Together, we'll talk about whatrecovery looks like, how to
restore purpose and connection,and what support systems make
the difference.
So thank you, Dr.
Zanakis and Ben, for joining ustoday.
SPEAKER_01 (02:26):
Yeah, thank you guys.
Uh Ben, tell us a little bitabout you, you know, just as a
person and family, and then themilitary and what things maybe
you experienced a little bit.
SPEAKER_03 (02:39):
Sure.
Um, so I'm mine is Ben Parker.
I'm I live in Cincinnati, Ohio.
I was born in Indianapolis, butpretty much grew up here in
Cincinnati.
So always kind of the one to getback home.
Cincinnati is a great, greatcity.
Um, it it's got you know, ourfamily's here, so it's it's good
to be here.
Uh yeah, I'm married, I havethree kids.
I have a 17-year-old, aneight-year-old, and a
six-year-old, two girls and aboy.
Um, so so good, strong familylife.
(03:01):
Very, very lucky in that.
Uh, I work at Newcore Steel as aas an engineer.
So um life is life is good uhwhen it comes to the the home
front.
SPEAKER_01 (03:12):
Yeah, and just um thank you, and we'll get into
the military background and someof the things you experienced or
have dealt with in a second, andthen to introduce uh Dr.
Steve Zanakis, let him do ithimself.
Steve, tell us a little bitabout you.
SPEAKER_02 (03:32):
Uh well, thanks.
Uh it's good to be here, and I'mglad we're uh able to have this
conversation on Veterans Day.
Uh as Shelly said, I'm aphysician, I'm a psychiatrist,
uh career army.
Uh my father was also a careerAir Force officer uh who fought
in World War II, Korea, Vietnam.
(03:53):
I grew up in a military family,and so I'm it's been it's my
life.
And uh went on to have a careerhere, and I feel like uh we it's
part of what I think is animportant thing for us to do,
recognize that on Veterans Day.
I do a lot of work.
I see a number of uh servicemembers and veterans and uh help
(04:16):
out in programs uh uh like Gomoand uh to make sure that uh we
as a country continue to helpand support our military and
their families and all ourveterans.
SPEAKER_01 (04:31):
So, Ben, thank you, Steve.
So to Steve's point, Ben, tellus a little bit about maybe
during active duty when you gotback to integrate back, or
things that may have impactedyou, you know, from a sort of a
mental brain health perspective.
SPEAKER_03 (04:50):
Sure.
Um, I spent 10 years in thearmy.
Uh, I was enlisted, I was an EODtech, um, did three tours
overseas.
Um, and I always thought I was Iwas really lucky in a sense that
I really didn't have a lot ofPTSD.
I mean, saw a lot of awfulstuff, um, did a lot of you know
interesting um events part ofover there.
(05:10):
But um, you know, I you I didn'treally have issues until I got
home, until I got married, untilI got my first kind of real
world job.
And and then it it it allstarted kind of crumbling down a
little bit.
And I felt really bad for mywife because when we were
dating, I was good.
We were we were fine, you know.
But life had for me had alwaysbeen a series of chapters, and
(05:33):
you know, the military and thencollege and then moving home,
getting that first job, gettingmarried, kind of each one of
those was a chapter.
And once all that was kind ofsaid and done and settled,
that's it.
There's no more chapters.
Now it's just it's just life,it's just growing up, raising
kids, and that becomes your nextchapter.
(05:54):
And really, kind of at thatpoint is when I started to have
you know my first series ofstruggles.
Um and it took a lot of time, ittook um you know going to the
VA, talking to people, talkingto their vets, getting involved
in the community, um, before Ireally got a handle on it.
And uh it's always there, it'salways uh beneath the surface,
(06:15):
but I think I have the tools andthe support to manage through
it.
SPEAKER_01 (06:20):
And I want to ask Steve about that because he's
experienced a lot of quotereintegration back or transition
issues uh with veterans.
But what about your spouse oryour uh loved ones?
Did they see it out ofcuriosity?
Did they uh create more stigmafor you?
Did they understand what youwere going through?
(06:42):
They couldn't possiblyunderstand, you know, like how
did people react to you?
And were you visible with someof your issues, or you kind of
kept it to yourself?
SPEAKER_03 (06:53):
I I mean it was we had struggles.
The wife and I, we had a lot ofstruggles.
Um, you know, me not reallyknowing how to how to explain
it, or even when you're in themoment of going through
something, maybe, you know,maybe I'm losing my mind on the
weed whacker because I can't getit to start, but it's not really
the weed whacker that's theproblem, you know.
And then she's seeing me throughthe window losing my mind on the
(07:14):
weed whacker, like, what are youdoing?
You know, and then coming at youwith for that, like, why are you
flipping out on the weedwhacker?
And it that's how the conflictgoes.
So it's not it's not the weedwhacker, obviously, but it's
there's other things there.
Um, so it just took time.
Uh we we we never really watcheda lot of movies or anything or
talked about it, but then um,there's a couple movies out
(07:36):
there.
Collecting Sergeant Dan uh is areally powerful documentary um
that we watched together.
I think that put a lot intoperspective for her to kind of
see you know the the EOD worldand the struggles that families
go through, and and I and thatthat helped us a lot.
Gotcha.
SPEAKER_01 (07:53):
Steve, you know, just comment on some of the
things.
Ben, I mean, you've worked witha lot of folks, and I think that
transition back to quote outsociety back out of the
military, what have you seen asissues with that?
SPEAKER_02 (08:11):
Well, look, I mean, I kind of want to ask Ben a
little bit, uh, and to get himinto this conversation because I
appreciate what he's done.
Uh I uh I I think about it.
Um, you know, remember in theHurt Locker, which was about an
EOD technician?
(08:32):
There's a scene in that, and youstop me, Ben, if I'm if I'm not,
you know, if I'm treading onsomething that I shouldn't be in
a minefield.
Uh there's a scene in that wherehe's in the grocery store,
right?
And he's holding his baby, andhe's looking at these, I guess,
(08:52):
these cereals.
And and the baby's got the smileon his face and kind of looks
like, oh, he's happy.
And and the the character, and Iforget who the protagonist was,
is saying, Oh, you think it'shappy, you think this is great.
What you get is the feelinglike, hey man, this is
(09:15):
different.
He feels so different, and hedoesn't feel right in that world
that he's in.
Uh, and because he felt right,he had what he needed when he
was in the theater.
He had teams, he had purpose, hehad connections.
(09:38):
Now, my experience over theyears, as particularly as
growing up and seeing myfather's military service and
living on bases, we we lived onbases in Japan in the early 60s,
where I went to high school andhe was flying to Vietnam.
And then later on in my ownmilitary service and my own
(10:01):
deployments, I understand thatfeeling of, hey, I mean, I've
got something that's reallychanged me here.
It's now in my DNA.
Sometimes it's a good thing, bythe way.
I mean, it gives you purpose, itgives you focus, but it's a
memory that stays with you.
And you have to make someadjustments, and it's really
(10:24):
tough to make those adjustments.
That's what I hear and see whenI both when I think about my own
experience and I think aboutthese service members that I see
in these veterans, that they'vehad something really special.
And it and it came at a specialtime, by the way, when they
(10:46):
were, you know, olderadolescents, right?
We bring people into themilitary when they're 18, 19
years old or 20.
And those are big years, right?
Those when you get, you know,the you get a sense of who you
are.
So I I think that this is theexperience that these folks
(11:07):
have.
And then they they they leavethe military, come back to their
communities like you did, andyou go, Oh, wait a minute,
what's this all about?
Where am I going?
What am I doing?
What's my what am I waking up todo today?
What's my purpose?
Uh why don't I feel right?
(11:27):
Or what am I feel like I'mmissing?
I really think that's what's sotough uh for lots of folks, and
they've got to work it through.
They've got to think throughthat and go forward.
SPEAKER_01 (11:39):
And so, Ben, how did like you seem to be you're
appearing very comfortable, youknow, with who you are now.
Um like you what what andmentally like you said, okay,
well, I didn't know really whatmy purpose was.
Let's say I had a purpose, Ididn't know what that was.
Like what was that maturationprocess, and what do you
(12:03):
believe, let's say your purposeis now, like that has helped
you.
SPEAKER_03 (12:09):
Well, and I'll go back to to Steven's point real
quick about the Hurt Locker.
There's a lot of interestingparts about the Hurt Locker.
It's a it's a Hollywood movie,but certainly that last 20
minutes of the movie, it'sthat's that's pretty that's
pretty close.
Uh, you know, so I I don'tdisagree with that.
And and it's an interesting wayto put it of all that movie that
that gets right and what allgets wrong, that's that that
last 20 minutes is pretty good.
Um, you know, I for me,obviously, you know, family is
(12:35):
is a good purpose.
Um, but you know, just trying tostay goal goal-oriented is is
critical.
Um, you know, not everyveteran's gonna have a family,
not every veteran's gonna havethe same life as me.
But as long as you know you havesomething that you're working
towards is what's important.
So for me, it's it's family,it's it's you know getting the
next good job and and keeping usgoing.
(12:57):
Uh, you know, got one going tocollege next year, making sure
she's taken care of and squaredaway, and uh keeping the wife
happy and keeping thatrelationship strong.
Um, you know, those are thepurpose, those are those are the
goals, but also you know, my ownpersonal desires and goals.
Yeah, I used to have a lot ofhobbies.
Yeah, all the kids come alongand now it kind of goes away.
I used to have a motorcycle, butuh which is fine.
I'll have all of that again, youknow, one day when when they're
(13:19):
all grown up and out of thehouse.
So we have a boat, that's boats,that's a good hobby.
So just focus on the family andand uh you know what what our
next fun trip is as a group.
SPEAKER_01 (13:30):
Giving them you know that's awesome.
You know, there are definitelyparallels and other aspects of
transition.
Like, you know, a number ofpeople when they retire become
clinically depressed, like likeso because again, they what's
their purpose?
What do I do now?
Oh, I couldn't wait to retire.
(13:51):
Oh, thank God.
And they don't know what to do,and there's no purpose.
So I think you know, focusing onthat, focusing on what is your
outlook and how do you createthat?
And your case, you're lucky youhave a family, right?
And you you know, you have thosethings, but when when people
(14:14):
don't and they don't really havethat support system, right,
that's when they may turn tooutlets, whether it be substance
use, suicide, give up, right?
Those types of things.
And Steve, on your end, you youknow, from working with a number
(14:37):
of folks, one story I'd like youto tell is your guy who you
defended in prison, who now hasa purpose.
Like I think that's a goodstory, you know, as an example
of someone who maybe lost apurpose and found it, but what
do you you know, describe someof that?
SPEAKER_02 (14:57):
Or well, I mean, I'm glad you brought that up, Bob,
because it is a great story.
It's important.
Um uh and not only for this uhsergeant who ended up in prison
and he's serving a long uhprison sentence, but uh you
(15:18):
know, we have anoverrepresentation of veterans
in the prison and on death row.
We have proportionally um moreveterans on death row than
really have served in thecountry.
And we've got a number that arenow serving long sentences for
other offenses.
(15:39):
Uh that's we we need tounderstand that uh these people
have had experiences that haveunlocked all sorts of feelings
and emotions, and they've donethings that they otherwise would
not have done, and that's reallyset them up for many of the
kinds of uh uh actions ofoffenses that they've committed.
(16:02):
And I think we have a realresponsibility as a as a nation
to do what we can to supportthem.
What this young man discoveredafter he went spiral downhill,
he got out honorable service, hehad uh been, in fact, he it
wasn't uh he'd served in uh inuh units where he got exposed to
(16:25):
a lot of blasts, had a lot oftrauma, a lot of TBI, PTSD, uh,
that really wasn't helped theway it needed to be helped.
And he got out and he got intowork and he got into substances
and alcohol and he reallyspiraled.
And unfortunately, he committedthese offenses that he ended up
pleading guilty to.
(16:47):
And finally it dawned on himwhen he got into prison and he
saw that there were a number ofother veterans in the prison.
He asked, What can I do to nowuh really recover from what's
happened to me?
And he realized that if he couldrecreate what was so good about
(17:11):
coming into the military thatgave him a sense of teamwork and
relationships and discipline androutine and some sense of faith
that maybe he could recover andhelp his fellow veterans, and
he's done that.
He's built a program in thisprison in Louisiana, and it's
(17:32):
just really exceptional.
He's got a number of veterans inthat program, and they've like
they've had no disciplineproblems.
Uh, they all feel, you know,they've adjusted to what they're
doing, they understand whattheir lives are like.
And then he did something reallyspecial.
I've had a chance to reallysupport him and spend time.
(17:53):
He they have young offendersthat these are young people 18,
19, 20 years old, who've neverhad those experiences, by the
way.
They didn't serve in themilitary, but they never had
what they what we get asmilitary folks in basic
training.
And he said, maybe if I givethese young kids that kind of
(18:14):
experience, they'll have thatsame sense of purpose and
they'll feel better about whatthey did.
And he set up a program forthem, same kind of uh benefit to
them.
So this is really important.
I mean, there are the goodthings that you get that you
want to sustain.
Ben is lucky because he's gotfamily and he's got connections.
(18:38):
A lot of these veterans don't.
They come out with theirrelationships fall apart.
SPEAKER_01 (18:46):
No, 100%.
Ben, so speaking of that, Ithink you said you're an
engineer, you you know, right atwork.
Like what to see's point, whatare some of the positive aspects
of things you learned or did inthe military that helps you now
uh deal or do with work oraspects of working with people
(19:12):
or teamwork or things like that?
Like, what what are some of thethings that have helped you in
your life?
SPEAKER_03 (19:18):
Um, certainly, you know, being in EOD tech teaches
you how to solve unique problemswhen there's no manual, right?
How to do things.
So really more of a sense ofhey, this is a problem, we're
gonna figure out how to fix itsomehow.
There's a solution, we justhaven't figured it out yet.
Um, and that really applies notjust to to work, but also to to
life, you know, and and surethere's a lot of veterans that
(19:40):
don't have family, but there arethere's lots of other um
opportunities out there to togrow and meet other men and
other veterans.
Um, I look at a lot of the uhmost counties have a veteran
service commission of some kind.
Here in Warren County in Ohio,the their veterans commission is
fantastic.
Um, they helped me with some VAdisability stuff that I hadn't
(20:02):
you know really done since I'dgotten out.
Um, but also had just lots of Iyou know, I used to still email
the guy who helped me there fora while, just chatting back and
forth.
Um, I'd say one of the biggestlife changes for me was I got
involved in a in a free men'sgroup called F3.
Um, and it's a it's a globalmen's group.
Uh it's completely free, it's afitness group.
(20:22):
Um, but it's also we we we jokethat it's a it's a men's group
that likes to do with a fitnessproblem, right?
Um, so we meet in the mornings.
Uh we travel, there's there'slocations like I travel for
work.
Uh I have plants all over the USthat I travel to, and and people
ask me, why is your hotel youknow 20 minutes further away?
It's like, well, there's aworkout in the morning that I'm
gonna go to and uh and gettogether with a group of guys
(20:43):
and and and and work out andalso have an opportunity to talk
and and work through some stuff.
Um, so so so whether you have afamily or not, you you as men,
we need uh that communityleadership, that community
guidance, whether we're a partof it or whether we're doing it.
Um, and you have to seek thatout.
You have to, you know, we werepart of something big in the
(21:04):
military, and that's a lot ofpeople's miss is being a part of
something bigger.
Um and yeah, New Corps is agreat company.
You know, I'm I'm a part of NewCorps and all that, but it's not
my identity.
Uh, and being a veteran is notmy identity, you know.
It's parts and pieces of allthis put together that now
creates what I am.
And I have good days and I havebad days.
Um, but really what's what'simpactful for me is just finding
(21:26):
those groups that I can I can bea part of and really you know
excel in that.
And I love working out, I lovethose groups worked out this
morning.
Um, so F3 is is really one ofthose things that have helped me
immensely, as well as theveteran commissions and just
getting hooked up with otherveterans and talking.
I I'm on the veterans committeehere in our local municipality.
Um, so we did those banners thatyou see a lot of cities have,
(21:48):
which is fantastic.
So you just you got to get outthere and apply yourself.
SPEAKER_01 (21:53):
You know what's interesting?
So Gomo, Ben, has kind ofdigital therapeutics that help
people, but one thing I couldtell you this is consistent,
military, no military.
The increase in social media andjust digital has while someone
may have 3,000 likes orfollowers, loneliness and
(22:15):
isolation has increased becauseit's surface.
So one of the things we do inour micro learning, micro-doing
messaging and activities is tryto get folks like yourself to
get out there and go to thatfitness class.
In other words, meet people, youknow, feel a sense of
connectedness, you know, notjust online with surface, but
(22:41):
actually getting out there.
So I think, you know,intuitively, I think you're just
amazing in that you're doing thetypes of things that I think
help keep you mentallyhealthier, besides that
particular one is physicallyhealthier, but you know, uh, but
I definitely seen the increasein loneliness and isolation, not
(23:02):
only in the military, amongstteenagers and amongst other
folks too.
And you know, it's it'sfascinating.
I know in Steve's world, youknow, sometimes getting folks to
raise their hand to say needhelp individual, and then
sometimes people won't go togroup therapy, let's say, and
what you have to do in thatmindset, you know.
(23:26):
But I think it's very catharticin doing that.
Steve, what is your thought onthat?
Or Ben, what were you gonna say?
SPEAKER_03 (23:33):
I'm gonna say you need an outlet.
There has to be an outlet, youknow, for any man, just you need
you need an outlet.
Right.
SPEAKER_00 (23:42):
And for so many things in life, we need that
circle of support, and thatcomprises of a lot of different
people, influences, characters,like Ben, you talked about you
watch the movie with your wife,and it helped you start talking
about things, help you realizethings, maybe think, see a
little bit of a light, and maybeidentify some solutions.
Um what, and I'd be curious fromboth of you, from your
(24:06):
experience, what helped anindividual to reach that point
to break through and say, I'mready?
I'm is it is it a sense of uhdespair?
Is it a sense of hope on theopposite end?
Is it sitting with your wife andwatching the movie?
Is there like a tipping point orsomething that somebody usually
experiences that gets them toview things and see hope and be
(24:32):
um positive and have changetheir outlook?
Because with we know with somany things in life how
important that outlook is andhow that influences our next
chapter, like what you weresaying, Ben.
What's what's the impetus?
What can we do to help peoplereach that point of realization?
Ben and Dr.
Zanakis, I'd be curious to hearfrom you both.
SPEAKER_03 (24:55):
I would say for me, uh, we knew something was
missing.
We knew that we weren'tconnecting on it.
We weren't it wasn't jiving, andwe couldn't figure out how to
how to kind of get over the uhthe edge on that.
And then I I was it was aroundMemorial Day and I and I just
saw the uh the trailer for thatmovie collecting Sergeant Dan.
If you haven't seen it, check itout.
Um and I saw I watched thetrailer and I was like, holy
(25:19):
cow, this might be this might besomething that we can sit down.
And I just asked her, I waslike, hey, can we watch a movie
tonight?
It's gonna be tough.
And she said, Yeah, we satthrough it, we cried, and uh I
and that was that was big forus.
I didn't know that we neededthat, but it just kind of kind
of clicked.
So we were open, I was open tofinding something.
I think that's that's the case.
SPEAKER_01 (25:38):
What have you seen or done or whatever on your end?
SPEAKER_02 (25:43):
Well, I mean, I think it's uh it's been
different, you know, differentfolks.
Sometimes uh though we've gotyou know, men and women who get
to a point in their life, likeBen was saying, they'll say,
look, there's something notright here, it's really missing.
Uh, I've been trying to do thisand that, the usual kind of of
(26:05):
um, you know, ideas that theyhave, and they realize, look,
that's really not working.
I need to do somethingdifferent.
And uh let me reach out and talkto somebody.
And if they're lucky, and here'swhere it does get uh very
touchy.
I mean, you they really went,they need the each of us needs
to be able to connect tosomebody that we feel some trust
(26:29):
and comfort with.
And that really is just goodluck because that doesn't always
happen.
Sometimes it's a family member,sometimes it's a professional,
sometimes it's a colleague thatyou have at work who says, Hey,
hey, look, you know, let me justtalk to you, and let's just talk
with each other.
Then there are those people thatunfortunately get into a black
(26:54):
hole really deep and they see nodaylight, and a lot of them
think about you know, suicide,and um, it just shocks them,
completely shakes them up, anduh enough that they'll say, I
really do need to go talk tosomebody, I need to do something
(27:16):
else, and with some luck, theywill find somebody that they
trust.
And I I really think that theway we can most help people is
the relationship.
We've got a lot of tools, andyou know, the field mental
health talks a lot about thetools and programs and
(27:38):
protocols.
It's really the relationshipbecause that's actually what was
important about being in themilitary, being in the team.
You were with your team, youwere with people that
understood.
So we can help, and I find itmost important, in figuring out
if I can connect or not connect,and how I connect.
(28:03):
And with that connection, what'sthe message and how I can how
that person's life can betouched, and how they can go on
and do what's important forthem.
SPEAKER_01 (28:16):
Yeah, I think just a comment on that, like it's who
am I, I am who.
Like, so some of the things wetry to do when we engage folks
on the is say, hey, let's writedown who do you believe you are
now, and what are yourrelations, and that okay, who
out there do you have that youknow that could they be helpful
(28:40):
to seize point?
So it's a matter of gettingsomeone maybe to take a minute
to think through.
Somebody may have someone whocan help them, they don't think
that way right now, right?
So it's first getting them tothink like and change their
outlook, right?
A little bit on that.
So I think there's various youknow, techniques.
(29:00):
Because to Ben's point, thereare a lot of things out there
per se.
It may not be personal thatsomeone needs, but there are
potential outlets for someonewho doesn't have what Ben had,
how do they reach out?
How do they think that can helpthem?
That's what we have to helppeople do, right?
Because you you gotta get themto figure out how to go forward
(29:25):
and talk to people, right?
You know, that type of thing,you know.
Shall I and Ben, any othercomments on that?
SPEAKER_03 (29:34):
Or no, yeah, that's that's that's a good a good
summary.
SPEAKER_00 (29:39):
And those connections are hugely
important, you know.
Dr.
Zanakis, you talked about therelationships, the connections,
how they impact your outlook,Bob mentioned.
And then, you know, kudos to youfor seeking out and finding all
of those outlets, groups,resources, people to talk to,
uh, support systems to buildyour resources.
(30:00):
Resilience, because like yousaid, it's day by day.
Some days good, some days not sogood, but you have built the
tools within yourself and withinyour personal relationships and
within those circles of supportand groups that you've
established that you have peopleto turn to and to walk through
with all of that.
So appreciate both of yousharing your outlook and your
(30:22):
honesty.
And of course, for both of yourservice.
Conversations like this remindus that healing really happens
when people are connected.
And that gives us courage andcompassion and empathy to walk
these paths with others.
So if you listeners or someoneyou know is a veteran struggling
with transition or mental healthchallenges, you can access
(30:45):
support through the VeteransCrisis line by dialing 988 and
then pressing one.
To learn more about GOMOHealth's Veterans Resiliency
program that we spoke a littlebit about, visit gomohealth.com.
And if you enjoyed what youheard today, please subscribe,
submit your questions, and besure to like and comment on this
(31:05):
episode.
And for more expert insightsinto the world of healthcare,
visit us at Gomohealth.com andbe sure to tune in on Thursdays
to catch our freshest content.
Thanks for joining us and thanksfor listening.
SPEAKER_02 (31:20):
Thank you guys.
Thank you.
Appreciate it.
Thanks you all.
I spent 10 years in the army.
I was enlisted.
I was in the OD tech.
Did three tours overseas.
And I always thought I was I wasreally lucky in a sense that I
really didn't have a lot ofPTSD.
I mean, saw a lot of awfulstuff.
Um, did a lot of you knowinteresting um events part of
over there.
But um, yeah, I you I didn'treally have issues until I got
(00:29):
home, until I got married, untilI got my first kind of real
world job.
And and then it it it allstarted kind of crumbling down a
little bit.
SPEAKER_00 (00:40):
Sometimes something new intercepts our lives and
changes the way we're able tolive, work, or care for
ourselves and others.
Hi, I'm Shelly Schoenfeld, ChiefMarketing and Client Services
Officer at Gomo Health.
SPEAKER_01 (00:53):
Hi, I'm Bob Gold, Chief Behavioral Technologist.
Nice to have you all aboard.
SPEAKER_00 (00:58):
Thanks, Bob.
And together today, we're divinginto the real stories and
science behind whole personhealth, what it means, why it
matters, and how it can make adifference for people who need
it most.
Welcome to season two of humanresilience, changing the way
healthcare is delivered.
For many veterans, the mostdifficult battles aren't always
(01:19):
fought on the front lines.
They begin at home andinternally.
Today's timely episode beingthat it's Veterans Day, so
thanks everybody for joining us.
But today we're focusing on atopic that's really close to all
of our hearts, which are theinvisible rules and challenges
that veterans often face as theytransition to civilian life.
(01:42):
Sometimes they includeisolation, depression,
post-traumatic stress, and a lotof structure and mission that
wants to find really everyminute of their daily living.
Joining us today to share theirinsights is retired Brigadier
General Dr.
Stevensanel, a psychiatrist andlongtime advocate for mental
(02:03):
health and ethical leadership inthe military, and Ben Parker, a
veteran who's lived thechallenges of reintegration
firsthand.
Together, we'll talk about whatrecovery looks like, how to
restore purpose and connection,and what support systems make
the difference.
So thank you, Dr.
Zanakis and Ben, for joining ustoday.
SPEAKER_01 (02:26):
Yeah, thank you guys.
Uh Ben, tell us a little bitabout you, you know, just as a
person and family, and then themilitary and what things maybe
you experienced a little bit.
SPEAKER_03 (02:39):
Sure.
Um, so I'm mine is Ben Parker.
I'm I live in Cincinnati, Ohio.
I was born in Indianapolis, butpretty much grew up here in
Cincinnati.
So always kind of the one to getback home.
Cincinnati is a great, greatcity.
Um, it it's got you know, ourfamily's here, so it's it's good
to be here.
Uh yeah, I'm married, I havethree kids.
I have a 17-year-old, aneight-year-old, and a
six-year-old, two girls and aboy.
Um, so so good, strong familylife.
(03:01):
Very, very lucky in that.
Uh, I work at Newcore Steel as aas an engineer.
So um life is life is good uhwhen it comes to the the home
front.
SPEAKER_01 (03:12):
Yeah, and just um thank you, and we'll get into
the military background and someof the things you experienced or
have dealt with in a second, andthen to introduce uh Dr.
Steve Zanakis, let him do ithimself.
Steve, tell us a little bitabout you.
SPEAKER_02 (03:32):
Uh well, thanks.
Uh it's good to be here, and I'mglad we're uh able to have this
conversation on Veterans Day.
Uh as Shelly said, I'm aphysician, I'm a psychiatrist,
uh career army.
Uh my father was also a careerAir Force officer uh who fought
in World War II, Korea, Vietnam.
(03:53):
I grew up in a military family,and so I'm it's been it's my
life.
And uh went on to have a careerhere, and I feel like uh we it's
part of what I think is animportant thing for us to do,
recognize that on Veterans Day.
I do a lot of work.
I see a number of uh servicemembers and veterans and uh help
(04:16):
out in programs uh uh like Gomoand uh to make sure that uh we
as a country continue to helpand support our military and
their families and all ourveterans.
SPEAKER_01 (04:31):
So, Ben, thank you, Steve.
So to Steve's point, Ben, tellus a little bit about maybe
during active duty when you gotback to integrate back, or
things that may have impactedyou, you know, from a sort of a
mental brain health perspective.
SPEAKER_03 (04:50):
Sure.
Um, I spent 10 years in thearmy.
Uh, I was enlisted, I was an EODtech, um, did three tours
overseas.
Um, and I always thought I was Iwas really lucky in a sense that
I really didn't have a lot ofPTSD.
I mean, saw a lot of awfulstuff, um, did a lot of you know
interesting um events part ofover there.
(05:10):
But um, you know, I you I didn'treally have issues until I got
home, until I got married, untilI got my first kind of real
world job.
And and then it it it allstarted kind of crumbling down a
little bit.
And I felt really bad for mywife because when we were
dating, I was good.
We were we were fine, you know.
But life had for me had alwaysbeen a series of chapters, and
(05:33):
you know, the military and thencollege and then moving home,
getting that first job, gettingmarried, kind of each one of
those was a chapter.
And once all that was kind ofsaid and done and settled,
that's it.
There's no more chapters.
Now it's just it's just life,it's just growing up, raising
kids, and that becomes your nextchapter.
(05:54):
And really, kind of at thatpoint is when I started to have
you know my first series ofstruggles.
Um and it took a lot of time, ittook um you know going to the
VA, talking to people, talkingto their vets, getting involved
in the community, um, before Ireally got a handle on it.
And uh it's always there, it'salways uh beneath the surface,
(06:15):
but I think I have the tools andthe support to manage through
it.
SPEAKER_01 (06:20):
And I want to ask Steve about that because he's
experienced a lot of quotereintegration back or transition
issues uh with veterans.
But what about your spouse oryour uh loved ones?
Did they see it out ofcuriosity?
Did they uh create more stigmafor you?
Did they understand what youwere going through?
(06:42):
They couldn't possiblyunderstand, you know, like how
did people react to you?
And were you visible with someof your issues, or you kind of
kept it to yourself?
SPEAKER_03 (06:53):
I I mean it was we had struggles.
The wife and I, we had a lot ofstruggles.
Um, you know, me not reallyknowing how to how to explain
it, or even when you're in themoment of going through
something, maybe, you know,maybe I'm losing my mind on the
weed whacker because I can't getit to start, but it's not really
the weed whacker that's theproblem, you know.
And then she's seeing me throughthe window losing my mind on the
(07:14):
weed whacker, like, what are youdoing?
You know, and then coming at youwith for that, like, why are you
flipping out on the weedwhacker?
And it that's how the conflictgoes.
So it's not it's not the weedwhacker, obviously, but it's
there's other things there.
Um, so it just took time.
Uh we we we never really watcheda lot of movies or anything or
talked about it, but then um,there's a couple movies out
(07:36):
there.
Collecting Sergeant Dan uh is areally powerful documentary um
that we watched together.
I think that put a lot intoperspective for her to kind of
see you know the the EOD worldand the struggles that families
go through, and and I and thatthat helped us a lot.
Gotcha.
SPEAKER_01 (07:53):
Steve, you know, just comment on some of the
things.
Ben, I mean, you've worked witha lot of folks, and I think that
transition back to quote outsociety back out of the
military, what have you seen asissues with that?
SPEAKER_02 (08:11):
Well, look, I mean, I kind of want to ask Ben a
little bit, uh, and to get himinto this conversation because I
appreciate what he's done.
Uh I uh I I think about it.
Um, you know, remember in theHurt Locker, which was about an
EOD technician?
(08:32):
There's a scene in that, and youstop me, Ben, if I'm if I'm not,
you know, if I'm treading onsomething that I shouldn't be in
a minefield.
Uh there's a scene in that wherehe's in the grocery store,
right?
And he's holding his baby, andhe's looking at these, I guess,
(08:52):
these cereals.
And and the baby's got the smileon his face and kind of looks
like, oh, he's happy.
And and the the character, and Iforget who the protagonist was,
is saying, Oh, you think it'shappy, you think this is great.
What you get is the feelinglike, hey man, this is
(09:15):
different.
He feels so different, and hedoesn't feel right in that world
that he's in.
Uh, and because he felt right,he had what he needed when he
was in the theater.
He had teams, he had purpose, hehad connections.
(09:38):
Now, my experience over theyears, as particularly as
growing up and seeing myfather's military service and
living on bases, we we lived onbases in Japan in the early 60s,
where I went to high school andhe was flying to Vietnam.
And then later on in my ownmilitary service and my own
(10:01):
deployments, I understand thatfeeling of, hey, I mean, I've
got something that's reallychanged me here.
It's now in my DNA.
Sometimes it's a good thing, bythe way.
I mean, it gives you purpose, itgives you focus, but it's a
memory that stays with you.
And you have to make someadjustments, and it's really
(10:24):
tough to make those adjustments.
That's what I hear and see whenI both when I think about my own
experience and I think aboutthese service members that I see
in these veterans, that they'vehad something really special.
And it and it came at a specialtime, by the way, when they
(10:46):
were, you know, olderadolescents, right?
We bring people into themilitary when they're 18, 19
years old or 20.
And those are big years, right?
Those when you get, you know,the you get a sense of who you
are.
So I I think that this is theexperience that these folks
(11:07):
have.
And then they they they leavethe military, come back to their
communities like you did, andyou go, Oh, wait a minute,
what's this all about?
Where am I going?
What am I doing?
What's my what am I waking up todo today?
What's my purpose?
Uh why don't I feel right?
(11:27):
Or what am I feel like I'mmissing?
I really think that's what's sotough uh for lots of folks, and
they've got to work it through.
They've got to think throughthat and go forward.
SPEAKER_01 (11:39):
And so, Ben, how did like you seem to be you're
appearing very comfortable, youknow, with who you are now.
Um like you what what andmentally like you said, okay,
well, I didn't know really whatmy purpose was.
Let's say I had a purpose, Ididn't know what that was.
Like what was that maturationprocess, and what do you
(12:03):
believe, let's say your purposeis now, like that has helped
you.
SPEAKER_03 (12:09):
Well, and I'll go back to to Steven's point real
quick about the Hurt Locker.
There's a lot of interestingparts about the Hurt Locker.
It's a it's a Hollywood movie,but certainly that last 20
minutes of the movie, it'sthat's that's pretty that's
pretty close.
Uh, you know, so I I don'tdisagree with that.
And and it's an interesting wayto put it of all that movie that
that gets right and what allgets wrong, that's that that
last 20 minutes is pretty good.
Um, you know, I for me,obviously, you know, family is
(12:35):
is a good purpose.
Um, but you know, just trying tostay goal goal-oriented is is
critical.
Um, you know, not everyveteran's gonna have a family,
not every veteran's gonna havethe same life as me.
But as long as you know you havesomething that you're working
towards is what's important.
So for me, it's it's family,it's it's you know getting the
next good job and and keeping usgoing.
(12:57):
Uh, you know, got one going tocollege next year, making sure
she's taken care of and squaredaway, and uh keeping the wife
happy and keeping thatrelationship strong.
Um, you know, those are thepurpose, those are those are the
goals, but also you know, my ownpersonal desires and goals.
Yeah, I used to have a lot ofhobbies.
Yeah, all the kids come alongand now it kind of goes away.
I used to have a motorcycle, butuh which is fine.
I'll have all of that again, youknow, one day when when they're
(13:19):
all grown up and out of thehouse.
So we have a boat, that's boats,that's a good hobby.
So just focus on the family andand uh you know what what our
next fun trip is as a group.
SPEAKER_01 (13:30):
Giving them you know that's awesome.
You know, there are definitelyparallels and other aspects of
transition.
Like, you know, a number ofpeople when they retire become
clinically depressed, like likeso because again, they what's
their purpose?
What do I do now?
Oh, I couldn't wait to retire.
(13:51):
Oh, thank God.
And they don't know what to do,and there's no purpose.
So I think you know, focusing onthat, focusing on what is your
outlook and how do you createthat?
And your case, you're lucky youhave a family, right?
And you you know, you have thosethings, but when when people
(14:14):
don't and they don't really havethat support system, right,
that's when they may turn tooutlets, whether it be substance
use, suicide, give up, right?
Those types of things.
And Steve, on your end, you youknow, from working with a number
(14:37):
of folks, one story I'd like youto tell is your guy who you
defended in prison, who now hasa purpose.
Like I think that's a goodstory, you know, as an example
of someone who maybe lost apurpose and found it, but what
do you you know, describe someof that?
SPEAKER_02 (14:57):
Or well, I mean, I'm glad you brought that up, Bob,
because it is a great story.
It's important.
Um uh and not only for this uhsergeant who ended up in prison
and he's serving a long uhprison sentence, but uh you
(15:18):
know, we have anoverrepresentation of veterans
in the prison and on death row.
We have proportionally um moreveterans on death row than
really have served in thecountry.
And we've got a number that arenow serving long sentences for
other offenses.
(15:39):
Uh that's we we need tounderstand that uh these people
have had experiences that haveunlocked all sorts of feelings
and emotions, and they've donethings that they otherwise would
not have done, and that's reallyset them up for many of the
kinds of uh uh actions ofoffenses that they've committed.
(16:02):
And I think we have a realresponsibility as a as a nation
to do what we can to supportthem.
What this young man discoveredafter he went spiral downhill,
he got out honorable service, hehad uh been, in fact, he it
wasn't uh he'd served in uh inuh units where he got exposed to
(16:25):
a lot of blasts, had a lot oftrauma, a lot of TBI, PTSD, uh,
that really wasn't helped theway it needed to be helped.
And he got out and he got intowork and he got into substances
and alcohol and he reallyspiraled.
And unfortunately, he committedthese offenses that he ended up
pleading guilty to.
(16:47):
And finally it dawned on himwhen he got into prison and he
saw that there were a number ofother veterans in the prison.
He asked, What can I do to nowuh really recover from what's
happened to me?
And he realized that if he couldrecreate what was so good about
(17:11):
coming into the military thatgave him a sense of teamwork and
relationships and discipline androutine and some sense of faith
that maybe he could recover andhelp his fellow veterans, and
he's done that.
He's built a program in thisprison in Louisiana, and it's
(17:32):
just really exceptional.
He's got a number of veterans inthat program, and they've like
they've had no disciplineproblems.
Uh, they all feel, you know,they've adjusted to what they're
doing, they understand whattheir lives are like.
And then he did something reallyspecial.
I've had a chance to reallysupport him and spend time.
(17:53):
He they have young offendersthat these are young people 18,
19, 20 years old, who've neverhad those experiences, by the
way.
They didn't serve in themilitary, but they never had
what they what we get asmilitary folks in basic
training.
And he said, maybe if I givethese young kids that kind of
(18:14):
experience, they'll have thatsame sense of purpose and
they'll feel better about whatthey did.
And he set up a program forthem, same kind of uh benefit to
them.
So this is really important.
I mean, there are the goodthings that you get that you
want to sustain.
Ben is lucky because he's gotfamily and he's got connections.
(18:38):
A lot of these veterans don't.
They come out with theirrelationships fall apart.
SPEAKER_01 (18:46):
No, 100%.
Ben, so speaking of that, Ithink you said you're an
engineer, you you know, right atwork.
Like what to see's point, whatare some of the positive aspects
of things you learned or did inthe military that helps you now
uh deal or do with work oraspects of working with people
(19:12):
or teamwork or things like that?
Like, what what are some of thethings that have helped you in
your life?
SPEAKER_03 (19:18):
Um, certainly, you know, being in EOD tech teaches
you how to solve unique problemswhen there's no manual, right?
How to do things.
So really more of a sense ofhey, this is a problem, we're
gonna figure out how to fix itsomehow.
There's a solution, we justhaven't figured it out yet.
Um, and that really applies notjust to to work, but also to to
life, you know, and and surethere's a lot of veterans that
(19:40):
don't have family, but there arethere's lots of other um
opportunities out there to togrow and meet other men and
other veterans.
Um, I look at a lot of the uhmost counties have a veteran
service commission of some kind.
Here in Warren County in Ohio,the their veterans commission is
fantastic.
Um, they helped me with some VAdisability stuff that I hadn't
(20:02):
you know really done since I'dgotten out.
Um, but also had just lots of Iyou know, I used to still email
the guy who helped me there fora while, just chatting back and
forth.
Um, I'd say one of the biggestlife changes for me was I got
involved in a in a free men'sgroup called F3.
Um, and it's a it's a globalmen's group.
Uh it's completely free, it's afitness group.
(20:22):
Um, but it's also we we we jokethat it's a it's a men's group
that likes to do with a fitnessproblem, right?
Um, so we meet in the mornings.
Uh we travel, there's there'slocations like I travel for
work.
Uh I have plants all over the USthat I travel to, and and people
ask me, why is your hotel youknow 20 minutes further away?
It's like, well, there's aworkout in the morning that I'm
gonna go to and uh and gettogether with a group of guys
(20:43):
and and and and work out andalso have an opportunity to talk
and and work through some stuff.
Um, so so so whether you have afamily or not, you you as men,
we need uh that communityleadership, that community
guidance, whether we're a partof it or whether we're doing it.
Um, and you have to seek thatout.
You have to, you know, we werepart of something big in the
(21:04):
military, and that's a lot ofpeople's miss is being a part of
something bigger.
Um and yeah, New Corps is agreat company.
You know, I'm I'm a part of NewCorps and all that, but it's not
my identity.
Uh, and being a veteran is notmy identity, you know.
It's parts and pieces of allthis put together that now
creates what I am.
And I have good days and I havebad days.
Um, but really what's what'simpactful for me is just finding
(21:26):
those groups that I can I can bea part of and really you know
excel in that.
And I love working out, I lovethose groups worked out this
morning.
Um, so F3 is is really one ofthose things that have helped me
immensely, as well as theveteran commissions and just
getting hooked up with otherveterans and talking.
I I'm on the veterans committeehere in our local municipality.
Um, so we did those banners thatyou see a lot of cities have,
(21:48):
which is fantastic.
So you just you got to get outthere and apply yourself.
SPEAKER_01 (21:53):
You know what's interesting?
So Gomo, Ben, has kind ofdigital therapeutics that help
people, but one thing I couldtell you this is consistent,
military, no military.
The increase in social media andjust digital has while someone
may have 3,000 likes orfollowers, loneliness and
(22:15):
isolation has increased becauseit's surface.
So one of the things we do inour micro learning, micro-doing
messaging and activities is tryto get folks like yourself to
get out there and go to thatfitness class.
In other words, meet people, youknow, feel a sense of
connectedness, you know, notjust online with surface, but
(22:41):
actually getting out there.
So I think, you know,intuitively, I think you're just
amazing in that you're doing thetypes of things that I think
help keep you mentallyhealthier, besides that
particular one is physicallyhealthier, but you know, uh, but
I definitely seen the increasein loneliness and isolation, not
(23:02):
only in the military, amongstteenagers and amongst other
folks too.
And you know, it's it'sfascinating.
I know in Steve's world, youknow, sometimes getting folks to
raise their hand to say needhelp individual, and then
sometimes people won't go togroup therapy, let's say, and
what you have to do in thatmindset, you know.
(23:26):
But I think it's very catharticin doing that.
Steve, what is your thought onthat?
Or Ben, what were you gonna say?
SPEAKER_03 (23:33):
I'm gonna say you need an outlet.
There has to be an outlet, youknow, for any man, just you need
you need an outlet.
Right.
SPEAKER_00 (23:42):
And for so many things in life, we need that
circle of support, and thatcomprises of a lot of different
people, influences, characters,like Ben, you talked about you
watch the movie with your wife,and it helped you start talking
about things, help you realizethings, maybe think, see a
little bit of a light, and maybeidentify some solutions.
Um what, and I'd be curious fromboth of you, from your
(24:06):
experience, what helped anindividual to reach that point
to break through and say, I'mready?
I'm is it is it a sense of uhdespair?
Is it a sense of hope on theopposite end?
Is it sitting with your wife andwatching the movie?
Is there like a tipping point orsomething that somebody usually
experiences that gets them toview things and see hope and be
(24:32):
um positive and have changetheir outlook?
Because with we know with somany things in life how
important that outlook is andhow that influences our next
chapter, like what you weresaying, Ben.
What's what's the impetus?
What can we do to help peoplereach that point of realization?
Ben and Dr.
Zanakis, I'd be curious to hearfrom you both.
SPEAKER_03 (24:55):
I would say for me, uh, we knew something was
missing.
We knew that we weren'tconnecting on it.
We weren't it wasn't jiving, andwe couldn't figure out how to
how to kind of get over the uhthe edge on that.
And then I I was it was aroundMemorial Day and I and I just
saw the uh the trailer for thatmovie collecting Sergeant Dan.
If you haven't seen it, check itout.
Um and I saw I watched thetrailer and I was like, holy
(25:19):
cow, this might be this might besomething that we can sit down.
And I just asked her, I waslike, hey, can we watch a movie
tonight?
It's gonna be tough.
And she said, Yeah, we satthrough it, we cried, and uh I
and that was that was big forus.
I didn't know that we neededthat, but it just kind of kind
of clicked.
So we were open, I was open tofinding something.
I think that's that's the case.
SPEAKER_01 (25:38):
What have you seen or done or whatever on your end?
SPEAKER_02 (25:43):
Well, I mean, I think it's uh it's been
different, you know, differentfolks.
Sometimes uh though we've gotyou know, men and women who get
to a point in their life, likeBen was saying, they'll say,
look, there's something notright here, it's really missing.
Uh, I've been trying to do thisand that, the usual kind of of
(26:05):
um, you know, ideas that theyhave, and they realize, look,
that's really not working.
I need to do somethingdifferent.
And uh let me reach out and talkto somebody.
And if they're lucky, and here'swhere it does get uh very
touchy.
I mean, you they really went,they need the each of us needs
to be able to connect tosomebody that we feel some trust
(26:29):
and comfort with.
And that really is just goodluck because that doesn't always
happen.
Sometimes it's a family member,sometimes it's a professional,
sometimes it's a colleague thatyou have at work who says, Hey,
hey, look, you know, let me justtalk to you, and let's just talk
with each other.
Then there are those people thatunfortunately get into a black
(26:54):
hole really deep and they see nodaylight, and a lot of them
think about you know, suicide,and um, it just shocks them,
completely shakes them up, anduh enough that they'll say, I
really do need to go talk tosomebody, I need to do something
(27:16):
else, and with some luck, theywill find somebody that they
trust.
And I I really think that theway we can most help people is
the relationship.
We've got a lot of tools, andyou know, the field mental
health talks a lot about thetools and programs and
(27:38):
protocols.
It's really the relationshipbecause that's actually what was
important about being in themilitary, being in the team.
You were with your team, youwere with people that
understood.
So we can help, and I find itmost important, in figuring out
if I can connect or not connect,and how I connect.
(28:03):
And with that connection, what'sthe message and how I can how
that person's life can betouched, and how they can go on
and do what's important forthem.
SPEAKER_01 (28:16):
Yeah, I think just a comment on that, like it's who
am I, I am who.
Like, so some of the things wetry to do when we engage folks
on the is say, hey, let's writedown who do you believe you are
now, and what are yourrelations, and that okay, who
out there do you have that youknow that could they be helpful
(28:40):
to seize point?
So it's a matter of gettingsomeone maybe to take a minute
to think through.
Somebody may have someone whocan help them, they don't think
that way right now, right?
So it's first getting them tothink like and change their
outlook, right?
A little bit on that.
So I think there's various youknow, techniques.
(29:00):
Because to Ben's point, thereare a lot of things out there
per se.
It may not be personal thatsomeone needs, but there are
potential outlets for someonewho doesn't have what Ben had,
how do they reach out?
How do they think that can helpthem?
That's what we have to helppeople do, right?
Because you you gotta get themto figure out how to go forward
(29:25):
and talk to people, right?
You know, that type of thing,you know.
Shall I and Ben, any othercomments on that?
SPEAKER_03 (29:34):
Or no, yeah, that's that's that's a good a good
summary.
SPEAKER_00 (29:39):
And those connections are hugely
important, you know.
Dr.
Zanakis, you talked about therelationships, the connections,
how they impact your outlook,Bob mentioned.
And then, you know, kudos to youfor seeking out and finding all
of those outlets, groups,resources, people to talk to,
uh, support systems to buildyour resources.
(30:00):
Resilience, because like yousaid, it's day by day.
Some days good, some days not sogood, but you have built the
tools within yourself and withinyour personal relationships and
within those circles of supportand groups that you've
established that you have peopleto turn to and to walk through
with all of that.
So appreciate both of yousharing your outlook and your
(30:22):
honesty.
And of course, for both of yourservice.
Conversations like this remindus that healing really happens
when people are connected.
And that gives us courage andcompassion and empathy to walk
these paths with others.
So if you listeners or someoneyou know is a veteran struggling
with transition or mental healthchallenges, you can access
(30:45):
support through the VeteransCrisis line by dialing 988 and
then pressing one.
To learn more about GOMOHealth's Veterans Resiliency
program that we spoke a littlebit about, visit gomohealth.com.
And if you enjoyed what youheard today, please subscribe,
submit your questions, and besure to like and comment on this
(31:05):
episode.
And for more expert insightsinto the world of healthcare,
visit us at Gomohealth.com andbe sure to tune in on Thursdays
to catch our freshest content.
Thanks for joining us and thanksfor listening.
SPEAKER_02 (31:20):
Thank you guys.
Thank you.
Appreciate it.
Thanks you all.
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