July 31, 2023 • 28 mins
In this episode, I'll share 7 things that shifted my sexual fetish to become less intense, less frequent, less disruptive, and less arousing. NOTE: I believe trying to alter sexual attraction is both unethical and unhelpful. My fetish has not been removed or replaced, and that is not my goal. Rather, my fetish lost its power through a series of shifts that took place as I pursued healing and freedom from porn.
Here are the 7 things that helped me:
- Talking about the fetish
- Understanding the fetish
- Appreciating the fetish
- Acknowledging the fetish
- Completing the action
- Receiving the real thing
- Stopping the behavior
Related episodes:
- Sexual Arousal vs. Sexual Desire
- The Secret Behind Sexual Fetishes
- How To Interpret Sexual Fantasies
- Unwanted Sexual Attraction
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
Welcome to the Husband Material podcast, where
we help Christian men outgrowporn.
Why?
So you can change your brain,heal your heart and save your
relationship.
My name is Drew Boa and I'mhere to show you how let's go.
Hey, my name is Drew.
I'm the founder of HusbandMaterial, where I help men
(00:23):
outgrow porn.
Today we are talking aboutfetishes.
Have you ever had a sexualfetish?
A sexual fetish is somethingvery specific in particular that
you find sexually irresistible.
It's part of a person ratherthan a whole person.
It could be an object, it couldbe a body part.
(00:43):
In my case, I have had a sexualfetish for braces and
orthodontics.
This is the type of porn andsexual fantasy that always
appealed to me.
Sometimes men ask me can myarousal template change?
Can we switch out what I'msexually attracted to for
something else?
And when I hear that, my heartbreaks because every sexual
(01:06):
fetish or sexual attraction orpoint of arousal is a part of
you that is not bad, but good.
Now, what it is doing can bevery damaging, but that part of
you, just like an emotion, isnot bad, it's good.
We need to learn how to embraceour emotions and express them
(01:30):
in healthy ways.
In the same way.
I really believe we need to beable to accept our sexual
arousal, listen to what it'strying to tell us and ultimately
use it for healing.
That's what this episode is allabout, and as you heal, as a
byproduct, you may experience ashift in those sexual feelings
(01:51):
which can make it so much easierto get lasting freedom.
So in this episode even thoughI hesitate to share it because
it does feel extremelyvulnerable I want to tell my
story.
I want to be honest about whatI've experienced and, at the
same time, acknowledge that yourexperience might be different,
and that's okay.
From a young age, I was alwaysattracted to girls and women
(02:14):
with braces, and when I gotbraces, I was sexually attracted
to myself, which felt reallyweird.
And yet, over the last fewyears, this fetish has lost so
much of its power, and that hasmade freedom from porn and
unwanted sexual behavior so mucheasier.
Now let me be clear.
I would say that my sexualfetish has become less intense,
(02:36):
less frequent, less disruptiveand even less arousing, but it
did not get removed, it did notget replaced.
In fact, just recently, oneweek ago, I had a very strong
experience of sexual temptationabout this specific fetish, and
so, although it has lost so muchof its power.
Sometimes I get hit by atrigger tornado or a shame storm
(03:00):
or an extremely powerfulattraction that seems to come
out of nowhere, but for the mostpart it's not as difficult to
deal with as it was before.
Now, I didn't try to make thishappen.
I didn't intend to shift mysexual arousal template.
(03:20):
I know many of you guys haveasked can my arousal template
shift?
Can my sexual attractionschange?
Well, I believe that trying toalter sexual attraction is
actually unethical and unhelpful.
It's like trying to get rid ofone of your emotions and if you
want to heal and you want moreintegration, you need to get to
(03:43):
know that part of you.
You need to get to know yourfeelings and discover what's
underneath them and, as a result, you may experience some
amazing shifts.
With that said, let me tell youthe story of how my sexual
fetish shifted over time.
I believe there are seven thingsthat really helped me, and I
didn't do these seven thingsnecessarily trying to shift my
(04:08):
sexual fetish or my fantasies ormy arousal.
My goal was healing and freedomfrom porn and along that
journey, some of these actionsthat I took seemed to have a
really wonderful effect.
The seven things that reallyhelped me are talking about the
fetish, understanding the fetish, appreciating the fetish,
(04:31):
acknowledging the fetish,completing the action, receiving
the real thing and stopping thebehavior.
Let's start with talking aboutthe fetish.
I remember the first time Iever told someone about my
sexual fetish for braces.
I was terrified.
I was terrified of beingcondemned, and when I told him
(04:58):
that I was really turned on byraces, he didn't think that was
weird at all.
He didn't feel toward me how Ifelt toward myself, and in that
moment, and so many moments overand over again since then, I
have realized that my deepest,darkest secrets do not
(05:19):
disqualify me from being loved.
This has created so much spaceWithout the burden of shame and
secrecy and self-condemnation.
The sexual fetish didn't haveas much power, which was
wonderful, and I find that themore I can talk about these
(05:40):
things, they lose their power,and maybe you're thinking to
yourself oh, I've already donethat.
However, he told people about myspecific fetish or my specific
unwanted attractions but howspecific did you get?
Because I find that each time Ishare, each time I talk about
this stuff, I go a little deeper.
I take a redemptive risk toshare a little bit more than I
(06:03):
did before, and each time I ammet with love and acceptance,
the healing sinks in and thesexual attraction gets a little
bit less charged.
Now it's not like I'm trying toshift my sexual attraction, but
it just happens Because it'snormalized.
Instead of being this forbidden, magicalized secret, it's a
(06:28):
normal part of life that we canjust talk about and man that
feels so good.
That was the first thing thatbegan to shift how I felt about
my fetish.
The second thing wasunderstanding the fetish.
This all started for me in 2015when I watched a video by
Patrick Carnes who talked abouthow your sexual development can
(06:51):
get stunted, and when he saidthat I realized that's what
happened to me at 13 years old.
That was the time of life whenall the other girls who I was
interested in had braces.
That was a huge contributor towhy that fetish was so strong.
(07:12):
Now.
I still had those attractionseven before that, but even just
that understanding turned on alight bulb in my head and that
really helped the fetish go frombeing this unknown, scary
monster to something a lot moremanageable.
And that was just the start ofmy journey.
As I continued into 2018, I readthe book Unwanted by Jay
(07:36):
Stringer, and that also helpedto put some pieces together and
connect the dots between mysexuality and my story.
Seeing where my sexual fetishcame from was like turning on
the lights inside my soul Beforeit was dark.
I was scared.
I didn't know what this thingwas, where it came from, why it
has so much power over me.
It was like this big, scarymonster.
(07:58):
But when we flip on the lights,what I saw was a little boy who
didn't get what he needed at acritical time of development,
especially in puberty, and sothis big, scary monster was
actually more like a littlemouse.
If you've ever seen the Wizardof Oz, you know that when
(08:18):
Dorothy and the Scarecrow andthe Tin man and the Cowardly
Lion finally find the Wizard, heseems like aw, it's the great
and terrible.
But then they pull back thecurtain and they see a little
man inside, and that's how Ifelt about my fetish.
It was this big, great andterrible powerful force keeping
(08:40):
me trapped in porn.
But when I pulled back thecurtain and I saw that little
boy, little Drew, oh my goodness, myself, awareness, myself,
compassion grew, and it hasnever stopped growing.
Ever since 2015, I've beencontinuing to learn about myself
, especially by reading the bookUnwanted by Jay Stringer.
Going through his leadershiptraining and now in husband
(09:03):
material, even more layers arebeing uncovered.
The more we can understand theconnections between our
sexuality and our story, youmight find that things begin to
shift.
They feel less magical and moremanageable, and I wish that
understanding was enough, butunfortunately it's not.
Many of you guys have begun tounderstand your brokenness,
(09:27):
understand how your sexualdevelopment got hijacked by porn
, by abandonment, abuse andmeasurement all the different
layers of your story.
And yet the pull of porn andthe fascination of a fetish
still feels really powerful.
And that is often a hint thatyou need to take the next step,
(09:50):
something that probably hashelped me more than anything
else Appreciating the fetish yes, appreciating it.
And when I say appreciate thefetish, I'm specifically talking
about appreciating the divinedesire underneath the surface
level arousal.
So at the surface level I havethis fetish for braces and
(10:15):
orthodontics, but at the soullevel there is a desire
underneath that arousal foracceptance, for innocence, for
connection, and that is what Ihave learned to bless.
When you can bless yoursexuality, you don't have to
(10:38):
battle it anymore.
When you can befriend thelittle boy who developed those
feelings in the first place.
It creates an amazing internalshift within yourself.
You are no longer in fight,flight or freeze mode.
You are no longer living in acycle of fear, shame, arousal
(10:59):
and self condemnation.
Rather, you are living in love.
You are living in appreciation,whether it's grief or joy, or
both.
My friend, when you can'tappreciate what this attraction
is trying to do, then you canactually work with it and lead
(11:23):
it in a different direction.
That's not destructive, that'snot damaging.
So I actually think if you findyourself having trouble letting
go of a particular type of pornor a particular sexual fetish,
maybe that part of you actuallyneeds to be appreciated more,
(11:45):
because there is somethingreally good within it and it
might take some digging to findwhat that good divine desire is.
It has material.
We can help you do that.
And when you find that divinedesire maybe multiple divine
desires then you have somethingto embrace.
Oh man, that just feels so good.
(12:07):
You have something to say yesto.
If you've been trying to say no, no, no, no to your fetish,
what if you can find a way tosay yes to the deeper desires
underneath it?
It becomes a lot easier to letgo of some of the old patterns
and when those fetishes andfantasies come up again.
(12:29):
Here is another action that hasreally helped me Simply noticing
the fetish.
This is also called mindfulness.
Then a really strong, seeminglyirresistible sexual thought
comes up.
Instead of fueling it anddwelling on it, instead of
(12:49):
fighting it or trying to ignoreit or avoid it, just being with
it has such a powerful effect onyour brain, on your body, on
your whole system.
So, in other words, if I seesomeone with braces, rather than
just being aroused by that, Ican be with the arousal.
(13:13):
Here's what noticing the fetishsounds like Hmm, I'm feeling
very aroused right now.
Hmm, that person is reallyattractive, isn't that
fascinating?
Wow, I'm feeling a reallystrong pull toward that.
That's interesting.
Non-judgmental observation has away of defusing and draining
(13:38):
the power out of some of ourstrongest sexual feelings, and
this is a skill that you can useto manage any emotion.
Instead of being angry, be withthe anger.
Instead of being anxious, bewith your anxiety.
This is a skill that you candevelop and it works wonders.
(13:59):
At this point, I've shared fourout of the seven things that I
believe shifted my sexual fetishover time.
Again, my goal has been healing, not removing or replacing the
fetish, but talking about it,understanding it, appreciating
it and noticing it has given mea lot more love, joy, peace,
(14:20):
health.
Wholeness Like this is goodstuff.
Now there are three more thingsthat I want to share that have
created some very importantshifts that are a little bit
more difficult to talk about.
The first one is completing theaction.
What do I mean by completingthe action?
Completing the action meansreleasing intense emotions and
(14:43):
trauma that is stored in yourbody when extremely important
events are interrupted,developmental milestones never
get met.
Remember when I said PatrickCarnes taught me that your
sexual development can getstunted.
Well, on the flip side, yoursexual development can resume
(15:06):
when you complete theinterrupted action.
For example, when I was ateenager, I had a series of
almost girlfriends and it seemedlike every time I got kind of
close to getting into arelationship, I moved away, or
they moved away, or somethingwould happen and it would get
(15:30):
cut off.
Over the years, I've discoveredthat my sexual fetish for
braces was actually calling meto complete the action.
These relationships with thesemiddle school girls were so good
at the beginning but they gotinterrupted and that fetish was
a way of saying, hey, there'sthis thing that you really need
(15:50):
to do.
And at the husband materialleaders retreat in March, I
finally did it.
The very first girl who I everhad a crush on and really liked
and she liked me back was a hugepart of my origin story and why
(16:13):
I had a thing for girls withbraces.
She had braces.
And in March, at the husbandmaterial leaders retreat, I got
to complete the action through apsychodrama process where I sat
across from a man who wasrole-playing her.
Her name was Katie and I got totell her all of the things that
I felt toward her that I nevergot to tell her.
(16:35):
And I got to hold her hands andI looked into her eyes just
through role-playing, but itfelt so real and I said goodbye
and I broke up with her and Ijust wept and sobbed and I got
to say thank you.
I got to say thank you for whatyou gave to me and the beauty
(17:00):
and the connection that I feltwith you.
Oh, my goodness, I got tocomplete the action.
I got to say what I never gotto say.
I got to do what I never got todo.
How about you?
Where did your development getstunted?
Where did trauma leave youstuck, needing to complete a
certain action, like connectingwith your dad or standing up to
(17:21):
the bullies or separating fromyour mom or escaping from an
abuser that you never took, thatyou never had the opportunity
to take.
When you can pinpoint the partsof your story where you got
stuck or where something veryimportant was incomplete, that
gives you a clue about whatactions you can take to bring
(17:44):
completion.
And, man, that has reallyaffected my sexual fetish.
It doesn't feel the same way asit did before.
I think part of that is becausea fetish is inherently
incomplete.
It's partial, it's just a pieceof a real person or a piece of
a real relationship, not thefull thing.
(18:04):
And in full, beautiful,God-designed sexuality we are
designed to be aroused by acomplete experience, not just
part of it, and a fetish isoften times just a symbol or a
representation of the real thingthat we truly desire, that we
truly need.
So the next thing that has hada really big influence on the
(18:28):
strength and power of my sexualfetish is receiving the real
thing.
I see this happening every yearat the husband material retreat,
especially for guys whoexperience same-sex attraction.
They come to this retreat andthey experience the connection
and the brotherhood with menthat they have desired.
(18:49):
It's their divine desire andthey're actually getting it in
real life.
It's amazing.
It's like, wow, I sexualizedthis, but now I'm getting the
non-sexual version of it andit's even better.
Sometimes it's reallytriggering.
It's like there's somebody whoyou are attracted to, yet
through a real, authentic humanconnection that is safe and
(19:13):
appropriate, you get the realthing, not just the symbolic
sexual fetish version of it.
This actually happened for merecently.
I did not try to make thishappen, it just happened and it
was very healing.
I was on an airplane coming backfrom that husband material
leaders retreat where I finallybroke up with that eighth grade
(19:37):
girl I had loved all those yearsago, feeling a tremendous
release, feeling so much morecomplete On this airplane.
I go to my seat, I sit downit's a middle seat and I'm very
tall, so it's cramped and I geta tap on the shoulder.
It turns out that somebodynoticed me in my discomfort and
(20:01):
offered for me to switch seatswith somebody else in an exit
row so I could have more spacefor my six foot seven inch body.
Do you know who it was?
Can you guess what type ofperson noticed me in my
uncomfortable state and invitedme to sit next to her in the
exit row where there was morespace.
It was a 15 year old girl whowas riding on the airplane with
(20:22):
her mother coming back from avolleyball tournament and, of
course, she had braces.
So here I am, sandwichedbetween this 15 year old girl
and her mother on this airplane.
I was speechless, I didn't knowwhat to do.
I was like this is sotriggering and yet also somehow
(20:46):
healing.
And on this airplane ride I hada real time, real life
conversation with a 15 year oldgirl with braces that was
vulnerable.
We both opened up in a verysafe, appropriate way.
Her mom was right there.
I don't feel the need to includeall the details of what
(21:07):
happened here, but actuallyhaving a real conversation with
the type of person who I hadformerly objectified seemed to
shift something.
It was very strange to feellike I was living out something
I had fantasized about.
Yet there wasn't a sexualcharge to it, it was normal, it
(21:30):
was real life.
And receiving the real thing interms of having a safe,
appropriate, healthy interactionwith the type of person who I
had formerly objectifiedaffected me in a way that I
still don't understand.
Yet this is what I see oftenhappening with husband, material
(21:52):
men.
Sometimes they find themselvesinteracting with somebody who
historically, would have beenthe kind of person they would
have pursued, and porn, and yet,through a redemptive risk and a
healing experience and a safeenvironment, they get the real
(22:12):
version, not the fake version.
It's important to note thattrying to force these
experiences to happen is a badidea.
We can't do that.
I don't think we should.
What we can do is create space.
For me, actually talking tothis person on the airplane was
(22:32):
an incredibly healing experience.
I think God gave it to me.
If I had tried to orchestratethat experience, it probably
would have been part of somekind of addictive cycle.
I actually don't think it wouldhave been healthy for me to try
to make that happen, but in theGod-Orchestrated series of
(22:58):
events it was perfectly safe, itwas perfectly appropriate and
it brought my healing that muchdeeper.
It allowed me to encounter notjust the part of a person that I
had sexualized, it washumanizing and that's so
(23:18):
beautiful.
That has also created a shiftin my sexual fetish.
The last point I need to mentionis deceptively simple stopping
the behavior.
What you feed grows and whatyou starve dies, the more fuel
(23:39):
you give to a sexual fetish,either by indulging it or
resisting it, the more it willgrow.
On the other hand, the more youtalk about it, understand it,
appreciate it, notice it andmove on from it and let it go,
then the less space it will takeup, the less pain in your body,
(24:04):
your heart, your mind.
As simple as it may sound, theless time I've spent either
indulging the fetish or tryingreally hard to avoid the fetish,
the less space it has taken upin my life.
Let me be clear it's not gone.
It could return.
Yet for the most part, mysexual fetish is less intense,
(24:26):
less frequent, less disruptiveand even less arousing.
It has not been removed, it hasnot been replaced.
It's not gone and sometimes itcomes back very strongly.
Let's pretend for a moment thatmy sexual fetish is a dog.
I'm not saying the dog died.
I'm not saying the dog became acat.
(24:48):
Rather, I'm saying that thefetish used to be like this big,
scary guard dog and now it'slike a small, friendly dog.
Or you could say it used to belike a dog that was wounded and
now it's been getting healthier.
Or this is my favoritecomparison you could say the
(25:12):
fetish was like a little puppythat is finally now growing up
into a mature adult dog.
That's my favorite comparison.
So the fetish did not getremoved, it did not get replaced
.
It is not gone and sometimes itreturns forcefully.
(25:32):
And it has shifted.
It's not like it used to be,and that's a beautiful thing.
Again, here's what made thedifference for me Talking about
it, understanding it,appreciating it, noticing it and
being mindful of it, completingthe interrupted actions,
(25:52):
receiving the real thing insteadof the fake sexual symbol and
finally stopping the behavior.
So if you want greater healingand freedom from porn, here's my
best advice Be radically honestand vulnerable.
Learn more about your sexualstory, differentiate your sexual
(26:13):
desire from your sexual arousal, practice mindfulness,
non-judgmental observation,release intense emotions and
trauma that you may be carrying.
Receive the real thing of whatyou desire rather than the
partial version of itrepresented or symbolized by a
(26:35):
sexual fetish, and finally stopthe unwanted behavior.
Outgrow porn.
Husband material is here tohelp.
As a result, along this journey, you may experience a shift in
what arouses you.
Along the way, you may findthat your sexual fetishes become
less magical and moremanageable, but that's not the
(26:58):
goal.
These things have really helpedme and I believe they can help
you too.
Thank you for listening andalways remember you are God's
beloved Son, and in you he iswell pleased.
Welcome to the Husband Material podcast, where
we help Christian men outgrowporn.
Why?
So you can change your brain,heal your heart and save your
relationship.
My name is Drew Boa and I'mhere to show you how let's go.
Hey, my name is Drew.
I'm the founder of HusbandMaterial, where I help men
(00:23):
outgrow porn.
Today we are talking aboutfetishes.
Have you ever had a sexualfetish?
A sexual fetish is somethingvery specific in particular that
you find sexually irresistible.
It's part of a person ratherthan a whole person.
It could be an object, it couldbe a body part.
(00:43):
In my case, I have had a sexualfetish for braces and
orthodontics.
This is the type of porn andsexual fantasy that always
appealed to me.
Sometimes men ask me can myarousal template change?
Can we switch out what I'msexually attracted to for
something else?
And when I hear that, my heartbreaks because every sexual
(01:06):
fetish or sexual attraction orpoint of arousal is a part of
you that is not bad, but good.
Now, what it is doing can bevery damaging, but that part of
you, just like an emotion, isnot bad, it's good.
We need to learn how to embraceour emotions and express them
(01:30):
in healthy ways.
In the same way.
I really believe we need to beable to accept our sexual
arousal, listen to what it'strying to tell us and ultimately
use it for healing.
That's what this episode is allabout, and as you heal, as a
byproduct, you may experience ashift in those sexual feelings
(01:51):
which can make it so much easierto get lasting freedom.
So in this episode even thoughI hesitate to share it because
it does feel extremelyvulnerable I want to tell my
story.
I want to be honest about whatI've experienced and, at the
same time, acknowledge that yourexperience might be different,
and that's okay.
From a young age, I was alwaysattracted to girls and women
(02:14):
with braces, and when I gotbraces, I was sexually attracted
to myself, which felt reallyweird.
And yet, over the last fewyears, this fetish has lost so
much of its power, and that hasmade freedom from porn and
unwanted sexual behavior so mucheasier.
Now let me be clear.
I would say that my sexualfetish has become less intense,
(02:36):
less frequent, less disruptiveand even less arousing, but it
did not get removed, it did notget replaced.
In fact, just recently, oneweek ago, I had a very strong
experience of sexual temptationabout this specific fetish, and
so, although it has lost so muchof its power.
Sometimes I get hit by atrigger tornado or a shame storm
(03:00):
or an extremely powerfulattraction that seems to come
out of nowhere, but for the mostpart it's not as difficult to
deal with as it was before.
Now, I didn't try to make thishappen.
I didn't intend to shift mysexual arousal template.
(03:20):
I know many of you guys haveasked can my arousal template
shift?
Can my sexual attractionschange?
Well, I believe that trying toalter sexual attraction is
actually unethical and unhelpful.
It's like trying to get rid ofone of your emotions and if you
want to heal and you want moreintegration, you need to get to
(03:43):
know that part of you.
You need to get to know yourfeelings and discover what's
underneath them and, as a result, you may experience some
amazing shifts.
With that said, let me tell youthe story of how my sexual
fetish shifted over time.
I believe there are seven thingsthat really helped me, and I
didn't do these seven thingsnecessarily trying to shift my
(04:08):
sexual fetish or my fantasies ormy arousal.
My goal was healing and freedomfrom porn and along that
journey, some of these actionsthat I took seemed to have a
really wonderful effect.
The seven things that reallyhelped me are talking about the
fetish, understanding the fetish, appreciating the fetish,
(04:31):
acknowledging the fetish,completing the action, receiving
the real thing and stopping thebehavior.
Let's start with talking aboutthe fetish.
I remember the first time Iever told someone about my
sexual fetish for braces.
I was terrified.
I was terrified of beingcondemned, and when I told him
(04:58):
that I was really turned on byraces, he didn't think that was
weird at all.
He didn't feel toward me how Ifelt toward myself, and in that
moment, and so many moments overand over again since then, I
have realized that my deepest,darkest secrets do not
(05:19):
disqualify me from being loved.
This has created so much spaceWithout the burden of shame and
secrecy and self-condemnation.
The sexual fetish didn't haveas much power, which was
wonderful, and I find that themore I can talk about these
(05:40):
things, they lose their power,and maybe you're thinking to
yourself oh, I've already donethat.
However, he told people about myspecific fetish or my specific
unwanted attractions but howspecific did you get?
Because I find that each time Ishare, each time I talk about
this stuff, I go a little deeper.
I take a redemptive risk toshare a little bit more than I
(06:03):
did before, and each time I ammet with love and acceptance,
the healing sinks in and thesexual attraction gets a little
bit less charged.
Now it's not like I'm trying toshift my sexual attraction, but
it just happens Because it'snormalized.
Instead of being this forbidden, magicalized secret, it's a
(06:28):
normal part of life that we canjust talk about and man that
feels so good.
That was the first thing thatbegan to shift how I felt about
my fetish.
The second thing wasunderstanding the fetish.
This all started for me in 2015when I watched a video by
Patrick Carnes who talked abouthow your sexual development can
(06:51):
get stunted, and when he saidthat I realized that's what
happened to me at 13 years old.
That was the time of life whenall the other girls who I was
interested in had braces.
That was a huge contributor towhy that fetish was so strong.
(07:12):
Now.
I still had those attractionseven before that, but even just
that understanding turned on alight bulb in my head and that
really helped the fetish go frombeing this unknown, scary
monster to something a lot moremanageable.
And that was just the start ofmy journey.
As I continued into 2018, I readthe book Unwanted by Jay
(07:36):
Stringer, and that also helpedto put some pieces together and
connect the dots between mysexuality and my story.
Seeing where my sexual fetishcame from was like turning on
the lights inside my soul Beforeit was dark.
I was scared.
I didn't know what this thingwas, where it came from, why it
has so much power over me.
It was like this big, scarymonster.
(07:58):
But when we flip on the lights,what I saw was a little boy who
didn't get what he needed at acritical time of development,
especially in puberty, and sothis big, scary monster was
actually more like a littlemouse.
If you've ever seen the Wizardof Oz, you know that when
(08:18):
Dorothy and the Scarecrow andthe Tin man and the Cowardly
Lion finally find the Wizard, heseems like aw, it's the great
and terrible.
But then they pull back thecurtain and they see a little
man inside, and that's how Ifelt about my fetish.
It was this big, great andterrible powerful force keeping
(08:40):
me trapped in porn.
But when I pulled back thecurtain and I saw that little
boy, little Drew, oh my goodness, myself, awareness, myself,
compassion grew, and it hasnever stopped growing.
Ever since 2015, I've beencontinuing to learn about myself
, especially by reading the bookUnwanted by Jay Stringer.
Going through his leadershiptraining and now in husband
(09:03):
material, even more layers arebeing uncovered.
The more we can understand theconnections between our
sexuality and our story, youmight find that things begin to
shift.
They feel less magical and moremanageable, and I wish that
understanding was enough, butunfortunately it's not.
Many of you guys have begun tounderstand your brokenness,
(09:27):
understand how your sexualdevelopment got hijacked by porn
, by abandonment, abuse andmeasurement all the different
layers of your story.
And yet the pull of porn andthe fascination of a fetish
still feels really powerful.
And that is often a hint thatyou need to take the next step,
(09:50):
something that probably hashelped me more than anything
else Appreciating the fetish yes, appreciating it.
And when I say appreciate thefetish, I'm specifically talking
about appreciating the divinedesire underneath the surface
level arousal.
So at the surface level I havethis fetish for braces and
(10:15):
orthodontics, but at the soullevel there is a desire
underneath that arousal foracceptance, for innocence, for
connection, and that is what Ihave learned to bless.
When you can bless yoursexuality, you don't have to
(10:38):
battle it anymore.
When you can befriend thelittle boy who developed those
feelings in the first place.
It creates an amazing internalshift within yourself.
You are no longer in fight,flight or freeze mode.
You are no longer living in acycle of fear, shame, arousal
(10:59):
and self condemnation.
Rather, you are living in love.
You are living in appreciation,whether it's grief or joy, or
both.
My friend, when you can'tappreciate what this attraction
is trying to do, then you canactually work with it and lead
(11:23):
it in a different direction.
That's not destructive, that'snot damaging.
So I actually think if you findyourself having trouble letting
go of a particular type of pornor a particular sexual fetish,
maybe that part of you actuallyneeds to be appreciated more,
(11:45):
because there is somethingreally good within it and it
might take some digging to findwhat that good divine desire is.
It has material.
We can help you do that.
And when you find that divinedesire maybe multiple divine
desires then you have somethingto embrace.
Oh man, that just feels so good.
(12:07):
You have something to say yesto.
If you've been trying to say no, no, no, no to your fetish,
what if you can find a way tosay yes to the deeper desires
underneath it?
It becomes a lot easier to letgo of some of the old patterns
and when those fetishes andfantasies come up again.
(12:29):
Here is another action that hasreally helped me Simply noticing
the fetish.
This is also called mindfulness.
Then a really strong, seeminglyirresistible sexual thought
comes up.
Instead of fueling it anddwelling on it, instead of
(12:49):
fighting it or trying to ignoreit or avoid it, just being with
it has such a powerful effect onyour brain, on your body, on
your whole system.
So, in other words, if I seesomeone with braces, rather than
just being aroused by that, Ican be with the arousal.
(13:13):
Here's what noticing the fetishsounds like Hmm, I'm feeling
very aroused right now.
Hmm, that person is reallyattractive, isn't that
fascinating?
Wow, I'm feeling a reallystrong pull toward that.
That's interesting.
Non-judgmental observation has away of defusing and draining
(13:38):
the power out of some of ourstrongest sexual feelings, and
this is a skill that you can useto manage any emotion.
Instead of being angry, be withthe anger.
Instead of being anxious, bewith your anxiety.
This is a skill that you candevelop and it works wonders.
(13:59):
At this point, I've shared fourout of the seven things that I
believe shifted my sexual fetishover time.
Again, my goal has been healing, not removing or replacing the
fetish, but talking about it,understanding it, appreciating
it and noticing it has given mea lot more love, joy, peace,
(14:20):
health.
Wholeness Like this is goodstuff.
Now there are three more thingsthat I want to share that have
created some very importantshifts that are a little bit
more difficult to talk about.
The first one is completing theaction.
What do I mean by completingthe action?
Completing the action meansreleasing intense emotions and
(14:43):
trauma that is stored in yourbody when extremely important
events are interrupted,developmental milestones never
get met.
Remember when I said PatrickCarnes taught me that your
sexual development can getstunted.
Well, on the flip side, yoursexual development can resume
(15:06):
when you complete theinterrupted action.
For example, when I was ateenager, I had a series of
almost girlfriends and it seemedlike every time I got kind of
close to getting into arelationship, I moved away, or
they moved away, or somethingwould happen and it would get
(15:30):
cut off.
Over the years, I've discoveredthat my sexual fetish for
braces was actually calling meto complete the action.
These relationships with thesemiddle school girls were so good
at the beginning but they gotinterrupted and that fetish was
a way of saying, hey, there'sthis thing that you really need
(15:50):
to do.
And at the husband materialleaders retreat in March, I
finally did it.
The very first girl who I everhad a crush on and really liked
and she liked me back was a hugepart of my origin story and why
(16:13):
I had a thing for girls withbraces.
She had braces.
And in March, at the husbandmaterial leaders retreat, I got
to complete the action through apsychodrama process where I sat
across from a man who wasrole-playing her.
Her name was Katie and I got totell her all of the things that
I felt toward her that I nevergot to tell her.
(16:35):
And I got to hold her hands andI looked into her eyes just
through role-playing, but itfelt so real and I said goodbye
and I broke up with her and Ijust wept and sobbed and I got
to say thank you.
I got to say thank you for whatyou gave to me and the beauty
(17:00):
and the connection that I feltwith you.
Oh, my goodness, I got tocomplete the action.
I got to say what I never gotto say.
I got to do what I never got todo.
How about you?
Where did your development getstunted?
Where did trauma leave youstuck, needing to complete a
certain action, like connectingwith your dad or standing up to
(17:21):
the bullies or separating fromyour mom or escaping from an
abuser that you never took, thatyou never had the opportunity
to take.
When you can pinpoint the partsof your story where you got
stuck or where something veryimportant was incomplete, that
gives you a clue about whatactions you can take to bring
(17:44):
completion.
And, man, that has reallyaffected my sexual fetish.
It doesn't feel the same way asit did before.
I think part of that is becausea fetish is inherently
incomplete.
It's partial, it's just a pieceof a real person or a piece of
a real relationship, not thefull thing.
(18:04):
And in full, beautiful,God-designed sexuality we are
designed to be aroused by acomplete experience, not just
part of it, and a fetish isoften times just a symbol or a
representation of the real thingthat we truly desire, that we
truly need.
So the next thing that has hada really big influence on the
(18:28):
strength and power of my sexualfetish is receiving the real
thing.
I see this happening every yearat the husband material retreat,
especially for guys whoexperience same-sex attraction.
They come to this retreat andthey experience the connection
and the brotherhood with menthat they have desired.
(18:49):
It's their divine desire andthey're actually getting it in
real life.
It's amazing.
It's like, wow, I sexualizedthis, but now I'm getting the
non-sexual version of it andit's even better.
Sometimes it's reallytriggering.
It's like there's somebody whoyou are attracted to, yet
through a real, authentic humanconnection that is safe and
(19:13):
appropriate, you get the realthing, not just the symbolic
sexual fetish version of it.
This actually happened for merecently.
I did not try to make thishappen, it just happened and it
was very healing.
I was on an airplane coming backfrom that husband material
leaders retreat where I finallybroke up with that eighth grade
(19:37):
girl I had loved all those yearsago, feeling a tremendous
release, feeling so much morecomplete On this airplane.
I go to my seat, I sit downit's a middle seat and I'm very
tall, so it's cramped and I geta tap on the shoulder.
It turns out that somebodynoticed me in my discomfort and
(20:01):
offered for me to switch seatswith somebody else in an exit
row so I could have more spacefor my six foot seven inch body.
Do you know who it was?
Can you guess what type ofperson noticed me in my
uncomfortable state and invitedme to sit next to her in the
exit row where there was morespace.
It was a 15 year old girl whowas riding on the airplane with
(20:22):
her mother coming back from avolleyball tournament and, of
course, she had braces.
So here I am, sandwichedbetween this 15 year old girl
and her mother on this airplane.
I was speechless, I didn't knowwhat to do.
I was like this is sotriggering and yet also somehow
(20:46):
healing.
And on this airplane ride I hada real time, real life
conversation with a 15 year oldgirl with braces that was
vulnerable.
We both opened up in a verysafe, appropriate way.
Her mom was right there.
I don't feel the need to includeall the details of what
(21:07):
happened here, but actuallyhaving a real conversation with
the type of person who I hadformerly objectified seemed to
shift something.
It was very strange to feellike I was living out something
I had fantasized about.
Yet there wasn't a sexualcharge to it, it was normal, it
(21:30):
was real life.
And receiving the real thing interms of having a safe,
appropriate, healthy interactionwith the type of person who I
had formerly objectifiedaffected me in a way that I
still don't understand.
Yet this is what I see oftenhappening with husband, material
(21:52):
men.
Sometimes they find themselvesinteracting with somebody who
historically, would have beenthe kind of person they would
have pursued, and porn, and yet,through a redemptive risk and a
healing experience and a safeenvironment, they get the real
(22:12):
version, not the fake version.
It's important to note thattrying to force these
experiences to happen is a badidea.
We can't do that.
I don't think we should.
What we can do is create space.
For me, actually talking tothis person on the airplane was
(22:32):
an incredibly healing experience.
I think God gave it to me.
If I had tried to orchestratethat experience, it probably
would have been part of somekind of addictive cycle.
I actually don't think it wouldhave been healthy for me to try
to make that happen, but in theGod-Orchestrated series of
(22:58):
events it was perfectly safe, itwas perfectly appropriate and
it brought my healing that muchdeeper.
It allowed me to encounter notjust the part of a person that I
had sexualized, it washumanizing and that's so
(23:18):
beautiful.
That has also created a shiftin my sexual fetish.
The last point I need to mentionis deceptively simple stopping
the behavior.
What you feed grows and whatyou starve dies, the more fuel
(23:39):
you give to a sexual fetish,either by indulging it or
resisting it, the more it willgrow.
On the other hand, the more youtalk about it, understand it,
appreciate it, notice it andmove on from it and let it go,
then the less space it will takeup, the less pain in your body,
(24:04):
your heart, your mind.
As simple as it may sound, theless time I've spent either
indulging the fetish or tryingreally hard to avoid the fetish,
the less space it has taken upin my life.
Let me be clear it's not gone.
It could return.
Yet for the most part, mysexual fetish is less intense,
(24:26):
less frequent, less disruptiveand even less arousing.
It has not been removed, it hasnot been replaced.
It's not gone and sometimes itcomes back very strongly.
Let's pretend for a moment thatmy sexual fetish is a dog.
I'm not saying the dog died.
I'm not saying the dog became acat.
(24:48):
Rather, I'm saying that thefetish used to be like this big,
scary guard dog and now it'slike a small, friendly dog.
Or you could say it used to belike a dog that was wounded and
now it's been getting healthier.
Or this is my favoritecomparison you could say the
(25:12):
fetish was like a little puppythat is finally now growing up
into a mature adult dog.
That's my favorite comparison.
So the fetish did not getremoved, it did not get replaced
.
It is not gone and sometimes itreturns forcefully.
(25:32):
And it has shifted.
It's not like it used to be,and that's a beautiful thing.
Again, here's what made thedifference for me Talking about
it, understanding it,appreciating it, noticing it and
being mindful of it, completingthe interrupted actions,
(25:52):
receiving the real thing insteadof the fake sexual symbol and
finally stopping the behavior.
So if you want greater healingand freedom from porn, here's my
best advice Be radically honestand vulnerable.
Learn more about your sexualstory, differentiate your sexual
(26:13):
desire from your sexual arousal, practice mindfulness,
non-judgmental observation,release intense emotions and
trauma that you may be carrying.
Receive the real thing of whatyou desire rather than the
partial version of itrepresented or symbolized by a
(26:35):
sexual fetish, and finally stopthe unwanted behavior.
Outgrow porn.
Husband material is here tohelp.
As a result, along this journey, you may experience a shift in
what arouses you.
Along the way, you may findthat your sexual fetishes become
less magical and moremanageable, but that's not the
(26:58):
goal.
These things have really helpedme and I believe they can help
you too.
Thank you for listening andalways remember you are God's
beloved Son, and in you he iswell pleased.
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