September 21, 2025 • 41 mins
What happens when you step away from a successful career to rediscover your authentic self? Michelle Seymour-Smith's story offers a masterclass in intentional career transformation.
Growing up in Spanish Point, Bermuda as a shy middle child, Michelle found her professional calling early – at just 13, she was helping with general ledger entries at an insurance company. This early exposure to accounting set her on a path that would lead to a 16-year career culminating as CFO. But when burnout hit, Michelle made the brave decision to walk away.
"I literally just turned to my husband and said 'I'm done,'" Michelle recalls. His simple acceptance opened the door to what she calls her "year of yes" – exploring everything from Reiki certification to daily yoga practice. Most significantly, she challenged herself to have 200 meaningful conversations, a practice that organically led to board opportunities and a whole new career chapter.
Michelle's perspective on leadership resonates deeply: "Leadership is respect for people." Drawing from mentors who valued her contributions from a young age, she emphasizes the importance of helping employees understand their role in the company's mission while giving them agency in how they accomplish their work. For women specifically, she advocates authenticity about the challenges of balancing career and family responsibilities.
What makes Michelle's journey particularly compelling is her recognition that "those things that make you different are your superpower." Whether feeling like an outsider culturally (with a Bermudian father and Portuguese mother), being the only woman in executive meetings, or transitioning careers when others might have stayed the course, Michelle found strength in her unique perspective.
At the heart of Michelle's story are two principles she hopes to be remembered for: knowing your own value and recognizing your agency to make choices. "When you hit that stage of empowerment, when you really truly realize what you're capable of, nothing can stop you," she shares. "It's this feeling of being unleashed."
Ready to discover your own value and unleash your potential? Michelle's journey might be exactly the inspiration you need.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:19):
I'm a hustler baby woman, determined to succeed and
looking for a bit of motivation, a bit of tough love and some
actionable takeaways to be thebest.
You, girl.
You are in the right place.
Hey guys, and welcome back toHustle Hard Podcast.
As always, thank you forspending some time with me today
(00:39):
.
I'm super grateful that youdecided to join us.
Make sure you head over to thewebsite deshaykeenscom to check
out all the content that we haveall of our previous episodes as
well as this current episode.
Make sure you like andsubscribe on YouTube.
Big shout out to our seasonsponsors, 59 Front, as well as
Brown Company and our newestsponsors, scudamark.
So my guest for today issomeone that I just recently met
(01:00):
, but I was awe-inspired by herconversation at the conference
that we were at.
She was so thoughtful in theway that she entered the
conversation, as well as veryinspiring with the words that
she was saying to us.
She gave us a very holisticapproach to the topic and I
thought to myself she's got tobe on the podcast.
So please join me in welcomingthe amazing Michelle
(01:20):
Seymour-Smith.
Speaker 2 (01:21):
Thanks, tashae, thanks for having me, no problem
.
Speaker 1 (01:24):
How are you doing today?
I'm good, thanks, excited to behere.
I'm excited, all right.
So we'll jump in with somequick questions and then we'll
go from there.
All right, yeah, ready, allright.
What's always on yournightstand?
Speaker 2 (01:36):
Books, lots and lots of books that I can't always get
to.
I know that Exactly Too many Todigital.
Speaker 1 (01:42):
I know, I like the feel of a book, though.
Speaker 2 (01:44):
Yeah, I agree.
Speaker 1 (01:45):
Yeah, I'm big on that .
All right, tea or coffee tostart the day.
Always, coffee, always coffee.
I know I'm trying the matchathing, but I still need my
coffee, coffee, all right.
What was your favorite book asa child?
Speaker 2 (02:05):
Oh, I loved the Little House on the Prairie.
I read all of them and all ofthem, and then, when my daughter
was around the age, I boughtthe set for her and she's like
these are the worst books I'veever read.
Why would you give these?
Speaker 1 (02:11):
to me, were you heartbroken I was.
Speaker 2 (02:13):
I love them.
Speaker 1 (02:14):
I love them.
Okay, what's your go-to way torelax after a long day?
Speaker 2 (02:20):
Meditate.
I probably don't do it as muchas I should, but I'm I.
During pandemic I got back intoit.
And I would say, when I'mreally stressed, um, at the end
of the day, that's probably thebest thing If it's first thing
in the morning.
Actually, a walk outside isalways kind of my preferred way
to kind of calm down.
Speaker 1 (02:37):
Okay, and what?
I guess, who inspires you rightnow?
Speaker 2 (02:43):
Who inspires you right now?
I would actually say my kids.
Right now.
My kids are right at that age.
My daughter's about to graduate, my son is 11, going on 17.
And there's an element of therelationship is shifting and I'm
really amazed with these peoplethey're growing into.
So I would say they're reallyinspiring me.
(03:05):
I did a talk at BHS and whilemy daughter's not a student
there, her friends are and shewas like don't embarrass me.
So it's really living up tolike their standards.
Speaker 1 (03:15):
That's impressive.
Yeah, it sure is.
I'm sure you'd agree.
All right, what's a phrase youcurrently live by.
I'm drawing a blank it's okay,yeah, all right.
Well, if you think about it,well, let me know, we'll go from
there.
What's one word your friendswould use to describe you?
Speaker 2 (03:37):
um generous.
I think, generous with time,generous, generous with advice,
generous.
Speaker 1 (03:44):
Good, okay, what's a hidden talent or surprising fact
that no one knows I'm a Reikipractitioner.
Reiki, yeah, really.
Speaker 2 (03:51):
Yeah, okay, I have questions, I have questions, but
we'll get back to that.
Speaker 1 (03:55):
Okay, what's one place you've always wanted to
visit, but you haven't yet?
New Zealand, okay, on the list,for sure.
Speaker 2 (04:07):
Hmm, okay, on the list for sure.
And what's one thing you wishmore people knew about you?
I think there's a really softand creative side to me.
I think oftentimes peopleoutside my personal life people
know me corporate wise and Ihave this very technical
background as a CFO CTO you know, in the insurance world and I
(04:28):
think I'm in my heart, I'mactually an artist and I'm very
creative and just it's kind ofthe antithesis of the accountant
, which is hard facts, like Ireally like to paint, I like to
meditate, I do energy healing,so there's this very soft
spiritual side to me that Ithink, unless you're in my inner
circle, you probably don't know.
Speaker 1 (04:47):
Okay, that's good.
All right, I'm definitelyintrigued.
And finally, because we're soclose to cut match, what's your
cut match?
Team St George's?
All right, interview over,we're done.
We're done, it's okay.
I'll give you a bye right now,and we know Somerset will keep
the cups, so that's okay, theyprobably will.
I'll still cheer for StGeorge's now.
(05:08):
It's hard being a St George'sfan these days.
Speaker 2 (05:10):
It is All right.
Speaker 1 (05:12):
So take me back to young Michelle growing up in
Spanish Point with your family.
Speaker 2 (05:17):
So I was the middle child.
Speaker 1 (05:19):
And.
Speaker 2 (05:19):
I have classic middle child syndrome.
I'm the negotiator, thepeacemaker.
My sister older sister was theboss, my younger- sister was our
younger brother sorry was therebel, and I was home brand fit
right into those classic yeah,and I was painfully shy.
There's, you know, we had a big,noisy house and just I was the
(05:43):
kid who would always take a bookand kind of crawl into like
this little nook where no onecould find me in and stay away.
But what was lovely growing upin Spanish Point was all the
kids we went to school with.
All our friends our age alllived in Spanish Point, just
happened to be that way, andfrom our house was like the road
furthest from the point.
Our house was like the roadfurthest from the point, so it
(06:03):
was kind of this invisible linethat from our road towards the
end of Spanish Point weliterally had free reign of the
neighborhood.
And you know, you could justleave your house, you'd just go
running, you'd be like tell yourparents I'll be back in time
for dinner and you just went offand the beach was down at the
end.
So it was pretty magical.
(06:26):
I think about how my kids areraised now and everything is a
play date or you have toschedule it's so structured.
We had the complete opposite.
It was just like come home, doyour homework and just go run
barefoot until it got dark.
Speaker 1 (06:36):
When streetlights came on, you knew you had to go
home.
That was like a real thing.
I didn't have the streetlightsconversation, but we definitely
played outside when I was little, but yeah being able to just
roam freely.
You just don't see kids doingthat anymore.
Speaker 2 (06:50):
Yeah, and we knew all the people down the point.
So it was like telephone tags.
So if my mom couldn't find oneof us she'd call the next
neighbor along they'd call thenext one.
Eventually he'd come home.
Speaker 1 (06:56):
So yeah, it was great , yeah, so, speaking of your mom
, you mentioned to me that oneof the greatest privileges
you've had in life was havingthe parents that you've had.
Like, what values or lessons doyou carry with you from your
parents?
Speaker 2 (07:09):
so my parents, um, my dad was Bermuda, my mom is
Portuguese from the Azores andthey neither of them.
They grew up fairly poor andthey didn't really have
opportunity.
Um, my dad started work at 12.
In those days in Bermuda, youcould finish school right after,
I guess right before middleschool whatever what we call
middle school now, yeah, and mymom in the Azores.
(07:30):
You only started school at seven, so she only went to school
from seven to 12.
And so they were reallyhardworking and they really
valued education and they weredetermined that we were going to
have the best education and allthe opportunity that they
didn't.
So that's why I always say it'smy greatest privilege I had my
parents, because they theypushed us and they sacrificed so
(07:51):
that we could have a goodeducation.
Speaker 1 (07:53):
And.
Speaker 2 (07:54):
I always say everything I have is because my
parents gave that to me yeah, Ilove it.
Speaker 1 (07:58):
My grandmother was is Jamaican Sorry she is here with
us present and so it's a verysimilar dynamic, I think, for my
, my father and his siblings aswell.
But you said your mom moved to,uh, bermuda from the Azores.
Like what was that?
Like that dynamic like it inyour household culturally?
Um, being having a mom from theAzores and growing up in
Bermuda, I think?
Speaker 2 (08:18):
you don't really know anything else um, but I will
say I always felt like I wasn'tPortuguese enough and I wasn't
Bermudian enough, I didn't speakPortuguese.
My mom didn't speak it to us atthe time when she came.
Her brothers were ridiculed forspeaking Portuguese, so she
didn't speak it to us and my daddidn't speak it, but we had all
(08:40):
the food, so like I, can makeall the Portuguese goodies.
Speaker 1 (08:43):
So I'm coming over Between me, my sister, my
brother and I, so like I canmake all the Portuguese goodies.
It's not.
Speaker 2 (08:44):
I can't make over between me my sister, my brother
and I like I think we could allcall and my niece is like
making this amazing Portuguesegoodies now so but I grew up
with the food.
Um, so culturally, you know, itwas very strict.
We were Catholic and you knowguilt is a real, real thing the
Portuguese Catholic community.
So I grew up with that.
(09:05):
But at the same time and my momwas super strict Actually my
son asked me recently like, ohyou know, can I tell granny this
?
I'm like I don't think granny'sgonna like that.
I'm like granny was reallystrict with me.
He goes well, did you justrebel?
And I'm like, oh no, I didn't.
(09:26):
So I was really that diligentdaughter, I did what was
expected to me, even to in mycareer.
You know, in those days it wastourism and accounting, and she
wanted me to have good education, good jobs.
I'm like I'll be an accountantand go do those things.
Speaker 1 (09:33):
Yeah, and what do you think?
Do you think it's different nowin terms of, like, the
acceptance of the Portugueseculture in Bermuda?
And speaking Portuguese likemore than when your mom or you
were little with your mom,definitely.
And.
Speaker 2 (09:46):
I would like to think that generally, society has
become more accepting all around.
There's always work to be done,but I would say I'll give you a
story my mom so we all have ourPortuguese passports and my mom
said I can't believe there camea day where this would be of
value, Because in my dayeverybody was trying to hide the
fact that they were Portuguese.
(10:07):
So I think, collectively, Ihope that people are more
accepting of Portuguese, ofinterracial relationships and
people of all kind ofbackgrounds and sexual
preference and everything.
So it's definitely more openthan when I was growing up and
hopefully it'll keep going thatway.
Yeah, absolutely, preference ineverything.
So it's definitely more openthan when I was growing up and
hopefully it'll keep going thatway.
Speaker 1 (10:26):
Yeah, absolutely so.
You mentioned your mom sayingbeing an accountant or different
things like that, and when wewere chatting you told me that
you knew you wanted to be anaccountant at 13.
So tell me a bit of what thatexperience was like figuring out
that you wanted to be anaccountant at 13.
Speaker 2 (10:43):
So these things only happen in Bermuda.
So we were working from a youngage and my mom worked at
Trimmingham, so I was the Easterbunny.
I folded the accounts and I gotan opportunity through a family
friend to go to what was thenJohnson Higgins and is now Marsh
, to go into the office and helpher with filing, and that
sounded like a lot more fun thanbeing the Easter bunny or
(11:04):
spraying perfume on people,which were all the things I had
to do, and so, at like 13 or 14,I was in this big corporate
office.
I was taking checks up to theCEO Can you imagine Like not
just the CEO but taking checks.
And I remember very distinctly Iwas working during one of my
school breaks and the departmentthat had me working was next to
(11:27):
the accounts payable department.
And they were like, well, canyou help us do general ledger
entries?
And of course I didn't knowwhat that was.
And this was at 13, at 13, yeah, 13 or 14.
And so they gave me the entriesto put in the general ledger.
And then you know that was oneof my first exposures to a
computer where doing data inputin a computer.
How big were those computers?
No-transcript so.
(12:16):
But I had a full circle momentbecause when I was hired to be
the controller at Arch, thislovely lady was sitting at
reception.
I was like, oh hi, I'm, youknow, I'm here, I'm starting my
first day, and this lady's likeI know you, you are that little
girl who used to come aroundwith the checks, and she was the
somebody who used to run the ITShout out to.
(12:38):
Carmelita Lambert.
Speaker 1 (12:39):
God bless her I love her so much.
Speaker 2 (12:41):
But you know, here I was in my first big job, you
know, kind of feeling proud ofyourself, and she reminded me oh
, you're just that little girlwho don't forget where you're
from.
Speaker 1 (12:49):
Yeah, so, but she was always lovely.
So, yeah, that's amazing, butthat's a cool part about Bermuda
.
That is such a Bermuda story,such a Bermuda story like you're
not going to hear that in manyother places.
Like you know, I remember youused to pass around the time
like you know what I mean, but Ithink that's the part of us too
, like that's really a culturalBermuda thing, like I know who
your people are.
Yeah absolutely that smallisland vibes, but I love that
(13:10):
about it.
Speaker 2 (13:11):
No matter where you are, I always say you're one
degree of separation away fromsomeone and it keeps you humble
because your feet are firmlygrounded on the earth, so you
can't get into that ego space,because we all know who you are
and where you came from andyou're no different than anyone
else, absolutely.
Speaker 1 (13:24):
No, I totally get it.
So you say you were shy, but Ifeel like you don't seem very
shy to me now, like what changed, what happened?
Speaker 2 (13:33):
I don't know, but my best friend from childhood
always says Michelle didn'tspeak forever and then when she
started, she never shut up.
And, funny enough, I've beendoing a lot more public speaking
these days and I really enjoyit, so I think part of it is
this is where age is always agood thing.
I think it's growing into yourown and knowing your message.
Um, I would say when I probablygot started in my career, that
(13:57):
was probably the shift for mewhen I started working at Arthur
Anderson.
And there was a real confidenceum circuit where I I just I knew
I was smart and I was workinghard and I liked the work I was
doing, I liked the people I wasworking with and you kind of get
that feedback loop that you'redoing well and it propels you
and kind of the switch went atsome point probably my early 20s
where I suddenly became verycareer focused and very kind of
(14:21):
ambitious and confident inmyself and in that level.
So and it's just fed it.
And now I think at this stageof my life, there's an element
of there's so much rhetoric inthe world that I think we
actually owe it to use ourvoices for good.
So, like your podcast, and Ithink you have to, you have to
counter it, you have to use yourvoice to counter it.
Speaker 1 (14:42):
Yeah, a thousand percent, I think.
Sometimes I had someone on thepodcast before Zanika,
ironically, is also anaccountant and she naturally is
she self-proclaimed a shyerperson and a bit of an introvert
and she said on the podcast shewas talking about you know, you
have to figure out what'sbetter staying quiet or actually
speaking up in the moment andit's almost pretty much
(15:03):
identical to what you're sayingthere, and so it's interesting
how those personalities aresimilar with the different
careers that people take.
Speaker 2 (15:12):
Well, the energy person in me would say like you
have to counter energy with whatyou have, and whether that's
your voice, whether it's yourenergy, whether it's in the
immediate community in front ofyou, or whatever your reach is,
I think you have to use that forthe influence you want to see
in the world.
Yeah, absolutely.
Speaker 1 (15:25):
So you were a CFO for 13 years at your previous
company and what would you say?
That was that that experiencewas like and how it pretty much
shaped you to kind of whatyou're doing now.
Speaker 2 (15:36):
So it's the CFO.
I kind of grew into that roleand the great thing was I had
the opportunity to come into thecompany at startup, so we
really built it together and, ifanything, it really proved to
me that I think, you know, whenI look back at the company, what
really made it so successful inthose early days was just the
group of people.
I think that's where the sum ofthe parts is.
(15:57):
The whole is greater than thesum of any parts.
We had the synergy and we justhad this really dynamic
environment and I think, ifanything, it showed me.
You know, through my journeythere, I think I learned my own
value.
I think I.
You know there's, as you gothrough life, like 13, I was
there ultimately for 16 yearsand you know, like anything,
(16:19):
there's this initial rush whereyou're like, okay, I'm doing
well, I'm doing well.
Then you kind of hit a pointwhere life is you know for me.
I had my family, so you're notas focused on your career, more
at home.
And then you do also hit apoint of where you have doubts
and you know I hit a place whereI felt like you know, I was the
only woman in the room, theonly accountant in the room, the
only keep going and I had anexperience that kind of showed
(16:43):
me those things that make youdifferent are your superpower,
and so that's really shaped kindof the next chapter for me,
which is really owning yourvalue.
And I think one of the mostimportant things, I think one of
my special talents is I seevalue where others don't.
So it's how can I use that tohelp propel growth?
(17:07):
If you're a company, if you'rean individual, how to see your
own value and your own agency tomake a change or the strategic
shift in whatever you're tryingto do.
So I think that experiencereally has defined like okay,
this is a different chapter thatI want and how do I want it to
look and how do I be intentionalabout it.
Speaker 1 (17:25):
Absolutely so.
Would you say that that is kindof what propelled you into this
new kind of space you're in asan executive Sorry, as a
non-executive director as wellas like a strategic advisor?
Like was that planned or wereyou pretty strategic about that?
Like, walk me through thosethat step.
Speaker 2 (17:42):
Yeah, for strategic advisor.
I was very unstrategic about it.
So I had hit a point.
In my last two years I was inthe chief transformation role,
which was all about respect forpeople, leadership, operational
efficiency, but I was travelingevery week and I had a young
family still and we kind of hitan inflection point where I
(18:04):
needed to make a decision Did Iwant to go the operations route
or the finance route?
And I literally just had thismoment where I was like neither,
like.
I remember very clearly thiskind of moment of I'm done, I
need a break.
And I think it was acombination of burnout.
I think I just felt frayed,like I was looking at the
(18:25):
options at the company and Ididn't find either of them
appealing, find either of themappealing.
And when I looked in my homelife I could see I really had
been neglecting it andhealth-wise I wasn't in a good
place.
And I literally just turned tomy husband and just said I'm
done.
And he was like okay, and so Ileft at the end of 2019 thinking
(18:46):
okay, I'll take a break andprobably go back somehow.
And then COVID happened andduring COVID my sister went
through breast cancerchemotherapy.
During COVID and I had tohomeschool my young son, who had
ADHD, which was really not fun.
My daughter struggled withanxiety and it really shifted my
priorities and I just realizedI didn't want to go back into
(19:09):
that environment because Iwanted a life where I was more
involved with my kids.
So I did not know what I wantedto do, so I did what I called a
year of yes, work, stuff thatcame my way and there were
(19:32):
opportunities to go back intoindustry and I said yes to
everything else.
That's how the Reiki came up.
I went on a painting retreat itwas virtual because it was
COVID.
Yeah, I took up archery.
I took up a challenge to yoga.
Yeah, I did a challenge to yogaevery day, which I did for two
years so I just kind of explored.
I think I was so burned out andso focused on work before I'd
forgotten what made me happy.
And in that year of yes,someone challenged me to have
(20:01):
200 meaningful conversations.
And this is the advice I giveanyone who's looking on how to
change careers, how to breakinto directorships Go meet 200
people.
And so it's like networking ata completely different level and
because you have a clearpurpose in what you're trying to
understand.
And for me that was.
I'm in a period of transition.
I don't know what to do.
Tell me about a transition inyour life.
It was just how do I learn fromthese people?
(20:22):
I think you know, at some pointmy name just kind of got out
there and that's actually howthe boards found me, got it, so
I think I was really lucky inthat I kind of I almost fell
into it.
But then, once I started to getthe calls you know the way with
boards it's a very strangeinterviewing process.
They have lots of meetings andthen you never hear from them
(20:44):
again.
So it took a few before I foundone that was like the right fit
.
And one of the things I learnedas well is, in the beginning
you're almost like, yes, okay,I'll do it.
And they didn't work out, andthat was a great thing.
And I realized I'm like, okay,I have to show up the way I want
to be with what's important tome and when I feel like I truly
(21:04):
was confident in that space, inthe kind of interview process,
that was the first board andthen, literally the day that
board was announced, I got acall for another board, so I was
able to start building aportfolio.
And then, you know, in all ofthat there's this element of,
well, if you could do anythingfor free, what would you do?
And for me, that's always beenmentoring people, and I met a
(21:28):
lot of people who are at acrossroads in their career and
they're stuck.
And I'm a big believer in youhave agency of choice.
If you feel stuck in that job,you can choose to stay in the
job or you can choose to look atother options.
So I do a lot of work around.
How do I help someone look atall of the options that they
have available and choosesomething different if they're
(21:50):
not where they were, or if wherethey are is like, ok, I have to
, I want to choose this forthese reasons, okay, well, how
do we make it more, more of afull life for you?
Speaker 1 (21:59):
yeah, so no, I I've.
That's pretty much, as wediscussed before, what I do
pretty often, but in-house at mycompany, and it actually is
really powerful to see someonego from being in that stuck
place to in the place after that, like whatever that kind of
looks like for them.
I think that's actuallyprobably the most rewarding part
of that process.
Speaker 2 (22:18):
I absolutely agree.
When someone realizes whatthey're capable of or what their
own value is, like I think thatthat was something I struggled
with.
So when I see someone likeclick, like wait a minute, this
is what I bring to the table,and oh, I can do all these
things, suddenly they'reunleashed.
I think that's the best feelingin the world, absolutely.
Speaker 1 (22:35):
So I mean quick pivot , tell me a bit about these 200
conversations Like who did youdecide who to choose to meet?
Or like were you just randomlylike hey, that person looks
interesting, I want to meet them.
Speaker 2 (22:46):
Well, it started.
The person who challenged mesaid I'm going to introduce you
to the first two and then whenyou have Two out of 200?
Speaker 1 (22:53):
Tell them there's any better ratio than that.
Start with the first two.
Speaker 2 (22:56):
And then she said, when you meet with those two,
ask them to introduce someoneelse.
So that's how it started.
And then, because it was COVID,everybody was happy to have a
30-minute Zoom call.
And because it's Zoom, you knowit's going to be 30 minutes.
That was just a break betweenthe constant meetings that
everybody was having at the time.
And I met people like around theworld, and then I started
(23:18):
applying as Bermuda began toopen up.
I think I just I think that'sreally all it is.
It's being open to meeting newpeople, much like how we met
right, Like I think there's.
You were open to approaching meand I was opening to the
conversation and often that'sreally the shift it takes.
I would have said when I was inmy corporate life, you know, I
really was going through lifewith blinders on in terms of
(23:39):
like this work is so important.
This is what you know.
It's very insular to thecompany, Whereas now I'm very
much more open and my daughtertells me like I'm the world's
greatest networker, but I don'tconsider it networking, as much
as I love making new connectionswith people.
Speaker 1 (23:55):
But I think that's that's really what it is.
That's networking, like I mean,and a lot of people and I hate
the phrase that you either haveit or you don't but being good
at networking is a true gift,like some people really just are
not good at it.
You know what I mean.
Being able to work a room andmeet people and be pretty
unapologetic about going up tosomeone and introducing yourself
is that is something you canteach someone to do.
(24:17):
But someone who's naturallygood at it far excels in that
scenario than anything.
That's one thing.
Speaker 2 (24:23):
I always am like wow, I wish everyone could do that,
because they not everyone can Iactually think everyone can get
to a place that they can, and Ithink it's keep it simple have
one question, have one questionfor somebody, because at the end
of the day, what I've learnedis nobody wants to be like have
one question and have it be athoughtful question, like don't
(24:55):
lead with what do you do?
You know, if you're at an event, then use something from the
event to anchor that question,or in the 200 questions for me.
I was in a period of transition, so that was my anchor point.
So, yeah, you don't need tocarry on a conversation for two
hours, so 15 to 20 minutes likeone question can carry a
conversation.
Yeah, um, yeah, you don't needto carry on a conversation for
two hours, so 15 to 20 minutes,like one question can carry a
conversation.
Speaker 1 (25:15):
Yeah, definitely, and you're absolutely correct.
People as much people like oh,I don't like to talk about
myself, it's actually theeasiest subject to talk about
when you really think about it,cause nobody knows you better
than you, right?
So I mean you're, you're anobviously reading your bio and
looking, looking you up, likeyou're often, very often
regarded to as someone who is apioneer in the industry, right,
in terms of insurance, just foreveryone else's knowledge, like
(25:37):
what would be your definition ofleadership, and then how has
that evolved over time?
Leadership?
Speaker 2 (25:43):
is respect for people .
So I would say so.
I think, having started mycareer so young, I got to see a
lot of leaders.
I saw a lot of examples and whenI look back at the people who I
grew the most under, I learnedunder the best they really and
(26:05):
someone who comes to mindspecifically Scott Hunter, who
ran Arthur Anderson.
And so here was someone who wasa partner in a world, one of
the top audit firms in the world, but most of his staff were
under 25.
And as a 25-year-old I startedthere when I was 17.
(26:30):
But I always felt respected andseen and that there was
opportunity for me, and Scottnever made us feel like we were
young or immature or any ofthose things which probably were
, because we worked hard and weplayed hard too, yeah, but
that's important, good yeah.
Especially at that age.
But yeah, so I and how itchanged over time was when I was
in the chief transformationofficer role, I had the chance
to mentor with somebody who hadgone to Japan and studied under
(26:52):
Toyota and some of the foundersof lean thinking in Toyota, the
Toyota production system Just intime, it kind of goes under
different names and it reallyhoned that to some very simple
tenets and the first is respectfor people, and then the other
one is always trust the expert,and the first is respect for
people and then the other one isalways trust the expert, and
the expert is the person doingthe job.
(27:12):
Yeah, so what I always used tosay is I think for anybody
working in any position, youneed to know where the company
is going, you need to know yourrole in where the company is
going and you have to have somesay over how you get to do that
role.
I think if, as a leader, you canput that in your culture, I and
you have to have some say overhow you get to do that role.
I think if, as a leader, youcan put that in your culture, I
think you're going to havereally happy employees and
(27:33):
people who are fulfilled in whatthey do Absolutely.
Speaker 1 (27:35):
No, I mean, you're spot on.
I stand on my soapbox all thetime about culture and leaders
and how they really are thechange and what you see they
direct really are the change andwhat you see they direct, what
that looks like, and I wish mostleaders thought about
leadership from that viewpoint,as opposed to the traditional
way of how people thinkleadership should be.
I think that that's absolutelykey in everything that we do all
(27:56):
the time.
Speaker 2 (27:57):
And I think that was the differentiator for me when I
was interviewing for the boards.
You know, in the first coupleof boards you feel like you have
to be that technical expert.
You need to know what's goingon in the insurance market.
You know that very technicaland when I realized I'm like I
don't really want to talk aboutthose things, I can talk about
those things.
I can talk about the financialstatements, but what I'm really
interested in is how are youbuilding a foundation for growth
(28:18):
?
What kind of company do youwant?
What do you want beyond thebottom line?
Lots of companies, you know.
There were lots of interviewsthat kind of went sideways when
I started asking those questionsbecause they were like we're
just in, take advantage of themarket and get out with an ROE,
whereas the companies I'vealways gravitated to is there is
a mission greater than just thebottom line.
Speaker 1 (28:36):
Yeah, but those are also the companies that really
invest in their people.
Yeah, absolutely, businessimperatives.
We have things, numbers, thatneed to be hit.
I think that's all important,but people who understand that
their people are the mostimportant and that's how you're
going to get the best.
Them producing their best.
That's paramount with anyorganization, I agree, and those
(28:57):
are the people I want to be inthe room with.
A thousand percent.
I totally agree.
I say that all the time.
But where I initially wasintroduced to you was at a
conference that we were both atand you were speaking on this
panel and I think it was aboutleadership, and one of the
gentlemen just everyone'sknowledge which I was the only
woman on the panel and therewere other men on the panel and
(29:17):
one of the gentlemen essentiallysaid she was saying, making a
point around, men in leadershipneed supportive wives at home.
But he was making a veryblanket statement about
leadership and the assumptionwas that it was all men, one
with you sitting next to him.
But then you very eloquentlywere like and husbands too, and
like, every woman in the roomwas like yeah, you know what I
(29:39):
mean, because the narrative hasdefinitely shifted around what
leadership looks like, but canwe talk a moment about what that
representation looks like forwomen today in terms of
leadership?
Speaker 2 (29:51):
You have to ask me that question more specifically,
sorry.
Speaker 1 (29:54):
No, it's fine.
So what does it mean in termsof representation for women in
leadership?
Today we have some women inleadership.
Sometimes we don't, but thatnarrative, that traditional
narrative of men in leadership,supportive wives at home and
everyone having like thatthought process of that's what
that traditional leader lookslike.
How do we kind of shape that abit different?
(30:16):
Because there are husbands athome too, two wives who have
huge jobs Many of them have beenon the podcast how do we shift?
Speaker 2 (30:22):
that Well, I love Christy Hunter.
Our Scott always says you can'tbe what you can't see, and so I
think the reality is you justneed to see it.
And the one thing I want to sayin the moment I said husbands,
but you know, partners come inall shapes and sizes, and
sometimes those partners are.
You know like can be agrandparent or whatever.
So I think seeing all thecombinations, first of all,
(30:46):
seeing other people inleadership other than just white
men.
There's lots of really capablepeople and giving people
opportunity, having differentways of showing up and leader.
And one of the things isthere's always so much focus on
corporate leadership and that'salways been my focus but leaders
(31:06):
come in all different areas oflife.
So what I've learned from mykids is, like the sports coach
is just as important a leader as, say, my boss, like they have a
lot of influence, but I thinkwomen need to make it okay.
It's just if we focus on womenspecifically, because that's the
area I know best.
(31:27):
I think when you see women inleadership, women with children
in leadership, women who aredivorced or single or with a
spouse, you know you have to seeall iterations.
And I think what I've alwaysconnected with people over is
I'm very real about it Iremember when I first started
(31:47):
traveling to New York, I wasworking with a group of New York
women lawyers and this was likethe most hardcore group of
intimidating women you canimagine and we bonded over our
children and the guilt we hadbetween really loving our
careers but losing the time withour families and trying that
balance.
And one of them made thecomment of I was the first
(32:09):
leader she'd seen in thatposition and then I was the
first woman leader she'd met.
That was real about thechallenges of being a woman in
business and I don't really knowhow to show up any other way,
but how I am.
So I think when women make itokay to say like, oh, I've got
my kid's got a recital and I'mgoing to leave for it, or
(32:30):
there's an assembly, or my kid'ssick, I'm going to be the one
to go home.
I'm not going to call thepartner and tell them to do it.
If you can.
I think it makes it okay foreveryone else to say okay, I can
exist in that position with thelife I have.
Speaker 1 (32:45):
Absolutely, and whatever your support looks like
, that's up to you, like youknow what I mean, and whatever
you need to do to makeeverything work for you.
I think that that's totallyfine and it works for everyone,
whatever you choose to do thatis.
Speaker 2 (32:56):
But the key is, you need the support, you know it
truly does take a village, and Ithink that's the difference is
you need the partner behind youbecause it's really hard.
Especially the higher up you goin at least in corporate
corporate, you know living thehigher you go, just the
environment can be so political,can be toxic.
(33:20):
You feel very alone because youdon't have peers, especially as
a woman at a very high level incorporate Bermuda or corporate
America, whatever.
But I felt very alone.
My peers were all men.
They all had the wives with thenannies and the housekeepers
and God bless my husband.
I had him and I had my parents,but I didn't have the army that
(33:43):
they did yeah.
So I think the more that youhave that support behind you and
you know who's got your back,you know who your trusted people
are, even outside of the office, that you can kind of be
yourself with and take yourproblems to, I think that's
really important.
Speaker 1 (34:00):
Yeah, absolutely.
What's one thing about yourhusband that people might not
know, but it makes a hugedifference in, or had made a
huge difference in, your abilityto lead and, you know, rise in
your own career.
Speaker 2 (34:14):
So I think people who know my husband my husband is
what you see is what you get,and he's an iron man so he's
very disciplined and veryfocused.
So I think people who know himknow those things about him that
really sums it up, and I thinkyou know he's not ego driven and
he was always really supportive.
(34:35):
So maybe what people don't knowis he's a really good cook.
So he used to do all thecooking before we shifted and
now I primarily do the cooking,unfortunately for him.
But we shifted and now Iprimarily do the cooking,
unfortunately for him butfortunate for me.
But yeah, he just he'ssteadfast and he's you know
whether it's doing 50 miles onthe bike or Michelle's off to
(34:57):
New York again.
He was always very steadfastbut I'm pretty sure anyone who
knows my husband knows thatabout him, without a doubt.
Speaker 1 (35:03):
Yeah, and I also I mean from obviously knowing you
this short period of time healso seems incredibly supportive
.
Like not very many people willbe like you're done and be like
okay, cool, let's figure it out.
Like, how has that support beenfor you?
Speaker 2 (35:17):
Um, the fact that I could step out and there wasn't
a discussion on finances, therewasn't a discussion on what will
we do, there wasn't adiscussion of what next.
He just was accepting.
There's a level of acceptancethat is pretty special actually,
(35:42):
but the fact that I'm like thisis how I feel about something
as important as my career, andhe was just like yep, that's
okay.
It shows that he knows, I knowwhat's best for me and he
respects me.
So I think when you have thatsupport, it opens up possibility
, because clearly, if I didn'thave it, I wouldn't have been
able to just step out and Iwouldn't be where I am today,
absolutely.
Speaker 1 (36:03):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (36:04):
Yeah, it's pretty.
Speaker 1 (36:05):
He probably knew you needed the break too.
Speaker 2 (36:06):
Well, sometimes I joke.
I'm like I think it was atestament to how frayed life was
that he was like, oh, thank God, I'm done with this.
Exactly so, but that alsowasn't what he led with, which
is also nice.
Speaker 1 (36:18):
Yeah, he's a pretty smart guy.
Speaker 2 (36:20):
I guess I'll keep him around some longer.
No, it's funny so.
Speaker 1 (36:22):
No, it's funny.
So how are you being reallyintentional about this new phase
in life?
Speaker 2 (36:35):
Yeah.
So I think it started with theboards kind of being intentional
of.
This is what I want to talk tothe CEOs and the equity backing
these ventures about, and it wasmore than just what kind of
underwriting do you want to do,what type of shop do you want to
do?
And every board I joined, Ifeel like there's a purpose to
it somewhere and I think it's areally amazing group of people
(36:56):
that I have worked with.
So that was the first thing.
So, to the extent that the workI was doing, I feel like it's
aligned with what I do.
And then, even in this nextchapter, I'm doing a lot more
speaking and at some point I'llsit down and do a bit more
writing because, I quite like todo that and working more with
individuals.
I think it's intentional fromthe point of view again of where
(37:17):
I feel like there's an energyin the world that's very counter
to what we've all known, andfor every action there's an
equal and opposite reaction soif I want to be that opposite
reaction, I have to putsomething into it, and so I do
accept that I'm taking morespeaking engagements.
I'm putting myself out there onthe stage in a way I never did
(37:37):
before.
She described herself in threeconcentric circles and she said
this is me and these are myvalues and what I believe in,
and these are the people Isurround myself with, whether
they're family by choice orfamily by blood.
And then this is the work thatI do, and it was the first time
(37:58):
I'd seen this work-lifeintegration, like everything she
did and the people shesurrounded herself with are so
aligned with who she was, and sothose are leading principles
for me is when I get a call oran opportunity, or when I'm
choosing not to do something,it's like okay, is this in
alignment with who I am, what Ibelieve in, what my priorities
(38:19):
are and how I want to show up.
So I'm much more consciousabout that and thinking about it
in what I do.
And even the times you're likeI don't feel like doing it, it's
like is that really inalignment?
You know, get your butt outthere.
Speaker 1 (38:32):
Yeah, exactly, michelle, I have like want to
keep talking to you, but we'rerunning out of time and that's
okay too.
We can always do a part two ifwe need to.
But how I wrap up here witheveryone on the podcast is when
you know with everyone on thepodcast is when you know when
someone says your name yearsfrom now and they're like, hey,
you know, michelle Seymour Smith, what do you want to be
(38:52):
remembered for in those momentswhen you're no longer around and
obviously, touch wood, it'll bea very long time from now and
you're enjoying all this newphase of life that you're in.
But what do you want to beremembered for?
Speaker 2 (39:03):
I think there's two principles that are really
important to me, and one isknowing your own value, and then
the other is having your ownagency and having control and
choice over what it is you'redoing.
And so I tell my kids all thetime that anything is possible,
which is the Iron man slogan.
But I'm like, anything'spossible if you want it and you
(39:23):
go for it.
If you want it and you go forit, and I hope that, whether
it's my kids, or whether it'ssomeone I worked with or my
closest friends, I hope theyalways feel like I felt like I
could do anything with.
Speaker 1 (39:35):
Michelle.
Speaker 2 (39:35):
Michelle believed in me and Michelle saw what I, the
value I bring, and they seetheir own value bring and they
really feel empowered.
Because I think when you hitthat stage of empowerment, when
you really truly realize whatyou're capable of, like nothing
can stop you and it's thisfeeling of being unleashed and I
hope that's the feeling I leavepeople with.
(39:56):
I love that.
It's amazing, thank you so muchfor being with us today.
Speaker 1 (40:01):
I really do appreciate it.
I think we got some amazinggems here today.
Like I'm like, my brain isprocessing on what we're gonna
put out okay, that's good I Ilove it.
Speaker 2 (40:11):
I'm super intrigued there are a couple like oh, I
bubble that one, but that's okay, none of it.
We would never know which oneit was.
You're amazing so much.
Oh, you really are.
No, like I'm glad you're doingthis.
So people's like, people'sstories need to be told.
So thank you for having me.
Absolutely, I appreciate it all.
Speaker 1 (40:26):
So thank you for having me.
Absolutely.
I appreciate it.
All right, guys, thank you forjoining us today.
Had the amazing MichelleSeymour-Smith on the podcast
with us today.
If you guys want to learn anymore about her, make sure you
check out her LinkedIn page andyou can ping her on there.
Speaker 2 (40:36):
You can be her 200th and 10th person she may be, or
whatever number.
Speaker 1 (40:41):
She's on now and I hope you got something valuable
and meaningful from thisconversation.
As always, thank you to oursponsors, 59 Front Brown Company
and Scudamar, and, you know, asalways, thank you for spending
time with me today on HustleHeart Podcast you.
I'm a hustler baby woman, determined to succeed and
looking for a bit of motivation, a bit of tough love and some
actionable takeaways to be thebest.
You, girl.
You are in the right place.
Hey guys, and welcome back toHustle Hard Podcast.
As always, thank you forspending some time with me today
(00:39):
.
I'm super grateful that youdecided to join us.
Make sure you head over to thewebsite deshaykeenscom to check
out all the content that we haveall of our previous episodes as
well as this current episode.
Make sure you like andsubscribe on YouTube.
Big shout out to our seasonsponsors, 59 Front, as well as
Brown Company and our newestsponsors, scudamark.
So my guest for today issomeone that I just recently met
(01:00):
, but I was awe-inspired by herconversation at the conference
that we were at.
She was so thoughtful in theway that she entered the
conversation, as well as veryinspiring with the words that
she was saying to us.
She gave us a very holisticapproach to the topic and I
thought to myself she's got tobe on the podcast.
So please join me in welcomingthe amazing Michelle
(01:20):
Seymour-Smith.
Speaker 2 (01:21):
Thanks, tashae, thanks for having me, no problem
.
Speaker 1 (01:24):
How are you doing today?
I'm good, thanks, excited to behere.
I'm excited, all right.
So we'll jump in with somequick questions and then we'll
go from there.
All right, yeah, ready, allright.
What's always on yournightstand?
Speaker 2 (01:36):
Books, lots and lots of books that I can't always get
to.
I know that Exactly Too many Todigital.
Speaker 1 (01:42):
I know, I like the feel of a book, though.
Speaker 2 (01:44):
Yeah, I agree.
Speaker 1 (01:45):
Yeah, I'm big on that .
All right, tea or coffee tostart the day.
Always, coffee, always coffee.
I know I'm trying the matchathing, but I still need my
coffee, coffee, all right.
What was your favorite book asa child?
Speaker 2 (02:05):
Oh, I loved the Little House on the Prairie.
I read all of them and all ofthem, and then, when my daughter
was around the age, I boughtthe set for her and she's like
these are the worst books I'veever read.
Why would you give these?
Speaker 1 (02:11):
to me, were you heartbroken I was.
Speaker 2 (02:13):
I love them.
Speaker 1 (02:14):
I love them.
Okay, what's your go-to way torelax after a long day?
Speaker 2 (02:20):
Meditate.
I probably don't do it as muchas I should, but I'm I.
During pandemic I got back intoit.
And I would say, when I'mreally stressed, um, at the end
of the day, that's probably thebest thing If it's first thing
in the morning.
Actually, a walk outside isalways kind of my preferred way
to kind of calm down.
Speaker 1 (02:37):
Okay, and what?
I guess, who inspires you rightnow?
Speaker 2 (02:43):
Who inspires you right now?
I would actually say my kids.
Right now.
My kids are right at that age.
My daughter's about to graduate, my son is 11, going on 17.
And there's an element of therelationship is shifting and I'm
really amazed with these peoplethey're growing into.
So I would say they're reallyinspiring me.
(03:05):
I did a talk at BHS and whilemy daughter's not a student
there, her friends are and shewas like don't embarrass me.
So it's really living up tolike their standards.
Speaker 1 (03:15):
That's impressive.
Yeah, it sure is.
I'm sure you'd agree.
All right, what's a phrase youcurrently live by.
I'm drawing a blank it's okay,yeah, all right.
Well, if you think about it,well, let me know, we'll go from
there.
What's one word your friendswould use to describe you?
Speaker 2 (03:37):
um generous.
I think, generous with time,generous, generous with advice,
generous.
Speaker 1 (03:44):
Good, okay, what's a hidden talent or surprising fact
that no one knows I'm a Reikipractitioner.
Reiki, yeah, really.
Speaker 2 (03:51):
Yeah, okay, I have questions, I have questions, but
we'll get back to that.
Speaker 1 (03:55):
Okay, what's one place you've always wanted to
visit, but you haven't yet?
New Zealand, okay, on the list,for sure.
Speaker 2 (04:07):
Hmm, okay, on the list for sure.
And what's one thing you wishmore people knew about you?
I think there's a really softand creative side to me.
I think oftentimes peopleoutside my personal life people
know me corporate wise and Ihave this very technical
background as a CFO CTO you know, in the insurance world and I
(04:28):
think I'm in my heart, I'mactually an artist and I'm very
creative and just it's kind ofthe antithesis of the accountant
, which is hard facts, like Ireally like to paint, I like to
meditate, I do energy healing,so there's this very soft
spiritual side to me that Ithink, unless you're in my inner
circle, you probably don't know.
Speaker 1 (04:47):
Okay, that's good.
All right, I'm definitelyintrigued.
And finally, because we're soclose to cut match, what's your
cut match?
Team St George's?
All right, interview over,we're done.
We're done, it's okay.
I'll give you a bye right now,and we know Somerset will keep
the cups, so that's okay, theyprobably will.
I'll still cheer for StGeorge's now.
(05:08):
It's hard being a St George'sfan these days.
Speaker 2 (05:10):
It is All right.
Speaker 1 (05:12):
So take me back to young Michelle growing up in
Spanish Point with your family.
Speaker 2 (05:17):
So I was the middle child.
Speaker 1 (05:19):
And.
Speaker 2 (05:19):
I have classic middle child syndrome.
I'm the negotiator, thepeacemaker.
My sister older sister was theboss, my younger- sister was our
younger brother sorry was therebel, and I was home brand fit
right into those classic yeah,and I was painfully shy.
There's, you know, we had a big,noisy house and just I was the
(05:43):
kid who would always take a bookand kind of crawl into like
this little nook where no onecould find me in and stay away.
But what was lovely growing upin Spanish Point was all the
kids we went to school with.
All our friends our age alllived in Spanish Point, just
happened to be that way, andfrom our house was like the road
furthest from the point.
Our house was like the roadfurthest from the point, so it
(06:03):
was kind of this invisible linethat from our road towards the
end of Spanish Point weliterally had free reign of the
neighborhood.
And you know, you could justleave your house, you'd just go
running, you'd be like tell yourparents I'll be back in time
for dinner and you just went offand the beach was down at the
end.
So it was pretty magical.
(06:26):
I think about how my kids areraised now and everything is a
play date or you have toschedule it's so structured.
We had the complete opposite.
It was just like come home, doyour homework and just go run
barefoot until it got dark.
Speaker 1 (06:36):
When streetlights came on, you knew you had to go
home.
That was like a real thing.
I didn't have the streetlightsconversation, but we definitely
played outside when I was little, but yeah being able to just
roam freely.
You just don't see kids doingthat anymore.
Speaker 2 (06:50):
Yeah, and we knew all the people down the point.
So it was like telephone tags.
So if my mom couldn't find oneof us she'd call the next
neighbor along they'd call thenext one.
Eventually he'd come home.
Speaker 1 (06:56):
So yeah, it was great , yeah, so, speaking of your mom
, you mentioned to me that oneof the greatest privileges
you've had in life was havingthe parents that you've had.
Like, what values or lessons doyou carry with you from your
parents?
Speaker 2 (07:09):
so my parents, um, my dad was Bermuda, my mom is
Portuguese from the Azores andthey neither of them.
They grew up fairly poor andthey didn't really have
opportunity.
Um, my dad started work at 12.
In those days in Bermuda, youcould finish school right after,
I guess right before middleschool whatever what we call
middle school now, yeah, and mymom in the Azores.
(07:30):
You only started school at seven, so she only went to school
from seven to 12.
And so they were reallyhardworking and they really
valued education and they weredetermined that we were going to
have the best education and allthe opportunity that they
didn't.
So that's why I always say it'smy greatest privilege I had my
parents, because they theypushed us and they sacrificed so
(07:51):
that we could have a goodeducation.
Speaker 1 (07:53):
And.
Speaker 2 (07:54):
I always say everything I have is because my
parents gave that to me yeah, Ilove it.
Speaker 1 (07:58):
My grandmother was is Jamaican Sorry she is here with
us present and so it's a verysimilar dynamic, I think, for my
, my father and his siblings aswell.
But you said your mom moved to,uh, bermuda from the Azores.
Like what was that?
Like that dynamic like it inyour household culturally?
Um, being having a mom from theAzores and growing up in
Bermuda, I think?
Speaker 2 (08:18):
you don't really know anything else um, but I will
say I always felt like I wasn'tPortuguese enough and I wasn't
Bermudian enough, I didn't speakPortuguese.
My mom didn't speak it to us atthe time when she came.
Her brothers were ridiculed forspeaking Portuguese, so she
didn't speak it to us and my daddidn't speak it, but we had all
(08:40):
the food, so like I, can makeall the Portuguese goodies.
Speaker 1 (08:43):
So I'm coming over Between me, my sister, my
brother and I, so like I canmake all the Portuguese goodies.
It's not.
Speaker 2 (08:44):
I can't make over between me my sister, my brother
and I like I think we could allcall and my niece is like
making this amazing Portuguesegoodies now so but I grew up
with the food.
Um, so culturally, you know, itwas very strict.
We were Catholic and you knowguilt is a real, real thing the
Portuguese Catholic community.
So I grew up with that.
(09:05):
But at the same time and my momwas super strict Actually my
son asked me recently like, ohyou know, can I tell granny this
?
I'm like I don't think granny'sgonna like that.
I'm like granny was reallystrict with me.
He goes well, did you justrebel?
And I'm like, oh no, I didn't.
(09:26):
So I was really that diligentdaughter, I did what was
expected to me, even to in mycareer.
You know, in those days it wastourism and accounting, and she
wanted me to have good education, good jobs.
I'm like I'll be an accountantand go do those things.
Speaker 1 (09:33):
Yeah, and what do you think?
Do you think it's different nowin terms of, like, the
acceptance of the Portugueseculture in Bermuda?
And speaking Portuguese likemore than when your mom or you
were little with your mom,definitely.
And.
Speaker 2 (09:46):
I would like to think that generally, society has
become more accepting all around.
There's always work to be done,but I would say I'll give you a
story my mom so we all have ourPortuguese passports and my mom
said I can't believe there camea day where this would be of
value, Because in my dayeverybody was trying to hide the
fact that they were Portuguese.
(10:07):
So I think, collectively, Ihope that people are more
accepting of Portuguese, ofinterracial relationships and
people of all kind ofbackgrounds and sexual
preference and everything.
So it's definitely more openthan when I was growing up and
hopefully it'll keep going thatway.
Yeah, absolutely, preference ineverything.
So it's definitely more openthan when I was growing up and
hopefully it'll keep going thatway.
Speaker 1 (10:26):
Yeah, absolutely so.
You mentioned your mom sayingbeing an accountant or different
things like that, and when wewere chatting you told me that
you knew you wanted to be anaccountant at 13.
So tell me a bit of what thatexperience was like figuring out
that you wanted to be anaccountant at 13.
Speaker 2 (10:43):
So these things only happen in Bermuda.
So we were working from a youngage and my mom worked at
Trimmingham, so I was the Easterbunny.
I folded the accounts and I gotan opportunity through a family
friend to go to what was thenJohnson Higgins and is now Marsh
, to go into the office and helpher with filing, and that
sounded like a lot more fun thanbeing the Easter bunny or
(11:04):
spraying perfume on people,which were all the things I had
to do, and so, at like 13 or 14,I was in this big corporate
office.
I was taking checks up to theCEO Can you imagine Like not
just the CEO but taking checks.
And I remember very distinctly Iwas working during one of my
school breaks and the departmentthat had me working was next to
(11:27):
the accounts payable department.
And they were like, well, canyou help us do general ledger
entries?
And of course I didn't knowwhat that was.
And this was at 13, at 13, yeah, 13 or 14.
And so they gave me the entriesto put in the general ledger.
And then you know that was oneof my first exposures to a
computer where doing data inputin a computer.
How big were those computers?
No-transcript so.
(12:16):
But I had a full circle momentbecause when I was hired to be
the controller at Arch, thislovely lady was sitting at
reception.
I was like, oh hi, I'm, youknow, I'm here, I'm starting my
first day, and this lady's likeI know you, you are that little
girl who used to come aroundwith the checks, and she was the
somebody who used to run the ITShout out to.
(12:38):
Carmelita Lambert.
Speaker 1 (12:39):
God bless her I love her so much.
Speaker 2 (12:41):
But you know, here I was in my first big job, you
know, kind of feeling proud ofyourself, and she reminded me oh
, you're just that little girlwho don't forget where you're
from.
Speaker 1 (12:49):
Yeah, so, but she was always lovely.
So, yeah, that's amazing, butthat's a cool part about Bermuda
.
That is such a Bermuda story,such a Bermuda story like you're
not going to hear that in manyother places.
Like you know, I remember youused to pass around the time
like you know what I mean, but Ithink that's the part of us too
, like that's really a culturalBermuda thing, like I know who
your people are.
Yeah absolutely that smallisland vibes, but I love that
(13:10):
about it.
Speaker 2 (13:11):
No matter where you are, I always say you're one
degree of separation away fromsomeone and it keeps you humble
because your feet are firmlygrounded on the earth, so you
can't get into that ego space,because we all know who you are
and where you came from andyou're no different than anyone
else, absolutely.
Speaker 1 (13:24):
No, I totally get it.
So you say you were shy, but Ifeel like you don't seem very
shy to me now, like what changed, what happened?
Speaker 2 (13:33):
I don't know, but my best friend from childhood
always says Michelle didn'tspeak forever and then when she
started, she never shut up.
And, funny enough, I've beendoing a lot more public speaking
these days and I really enjoyit, so I think part of it is
this is where age is always agood thing.
I think it's growing into yourown and knowing your message.
Um, I would say when I probablygot started in my career, that
(13:57):
was probably the shift for mewhen I started working at Arthur
Anderson.
And there was a real confidenceum circuit where I I just I knew
I was smart and I was workinghard and I liked the work I was
doing, I liked the people I wasworking with and you kind of get
that feedback loop that you'redoing well and it propels you
and kind of the switch went atsome point probably my early 20s
where I suddenly became verycareer focused and very kind of
(14:21):
ambitious and confident inmyself and in that level.
So and it's just fed it.
And now I think at this stageof my life, there's an element
of there's so much rhetoric inthe world that I think we
actually owe it to use ourvoices for good.
So, like your podcast, and Ithink you have to, you have to
counter it, you have to use yourvoice to counter it.
Speaker 1 (14:42):
Yeah, a thousand percent, I think.
Sometimes I had someone on thepodcast before Zanika,
ironically, is also anaccountant and she naturally is
she self-proclaimed a shyerperson and a bit of an introvert
and she said on the podcast shewas talking about you know, you
have to figure out what'sbetter staying quiet or actually
speaking up in the moment andit's almost pretty much
(15:03):
identical to what you're sayingthere, and so it's interesting
how those personalities aresimilar with the different
careers that people take.
Speaker 2 (15:12):
Well, the energy person in me would say like you
have to counter energy with whatyou have, and whether that's
your voice, whether it's yourenergy, whether it's in the
immediate community in front ofyou, or whatever your reach is,
I think you have to use that forthe influence you want to see
in the world.
Yeah, absolutely.
Speaker 1 (15:25):
So you were a CFO for 13 years at your previous
company and what would you say?
That was that that experiencewas like and how it pretty much
shaped you to kind of whatyou're doing now.
Speaker 2 (15:36):
So it's the CFO.
I kind of grew into that roleand the great thing was I had
the opportunity to come into thecompany at startup, so we
really built it together and, ifanything, it really proved to
me that I think, you know, whenI look back at the company, what
really made it so successful inthose early days was just the
group of people.
I think that's where the sum ofthe parts is.
(15:57):
The whole is greater than thesum of any parts.
We had the synergy and we justhad this really dynamic
environment and I think, ifanything, it showed me.
You know, through my journeythere, I think I learned my own
value.
I think I.
You know there's, as you gothrough life, like 13, I was
there ultimately for 16 yearsand you know, like anything,
(16:19):
there's this initial rush whereyou're like, okay, I'm doing
well, I'm doing well.
Then you kind of hit a pointwhere life is you know for me.
I had my family, so you're notas focused on your career, more
at home.
And then you do also hit apoint of where you have doubts
and you know I hit a place whereI felt like you know, I was the
only woman in the room, theonly accountant in the room, the
only keep going and I had anexperience that kind of showed
(16:43):
me those things that make youdifferent are your superpower,
and so that's really shaped kindof the next chapter for me,
which is really owning yourvalue.
And I think one of the mostimportant things, I think one of
my special talents is I seevalue where others don't.
So it's how can I use that tohelp propel growth?
(17:07):
If you're a company, if you'rean individual, how to see your
own value and your own agency tomake a change or the strategic
shift in whatever you're tryingto do.
So I think that experiencereally has defined like okay,
this is a different chapter thatI want and how do I want it to
look and how do I be intentionalabout it.
Speaker 1 (17:25):
Absolutely so.
Would you say that that is kindof what propelled you into this
new kind of space you're in asan executive Sorry, as a
non-executive director as wellas like a strategic advisor?
Like was that planned or wereyou pretty strategic about that?
Like, walk me through thosethat step.
Speaker 2 (17:42):
Yeah, for strategic advisor.
I was very unstrategic about it.
So I had hit a point.
In my last two years I was inthe chief transformation role,
which was all about respect forpeople, leadership, operational
efficiency, but I was travelingevery week and I had a young
family still and we kind of hitan inflection point where I
(18:04):
needed to make a decision Did Iwant to go the operations route
or the finance route?
And I literally just had thismoment where I was like neither,
like.
I remember very clearly thiskind of moment of I'm done, I
need a break.
And I think it was acombination of burnout.
I think I just felt frayed,like I was looking at the
(18:25):
options at the company and Ididn't find either of them
appealing, find either of themappealing.
And when I looked in my homelife I could see I really had
been neglecting it andhealth-wise I wasn't in a good
place.
And I literally just turned tomy husband and just said I'm
done.
And he was like okay, and so Ileft at the end of 2019 thinking
(18:46):
okay, I'll take a break andprobably go back somehow.
And then COVID happened andduring COVID my sister went
through breast cancerchemotherapy.
During COVID and I had tohomeschool my young son, who had
ADHD, which was really not fun.
My daughter struggled withanxiety and it really shifted my
priorities and I just realizedI didn't want to go back into
(19:09):
that environment because Iwanted a life where I was more
involved with my kids.
So I did not know what I wantedto do, so I did what I called a
year of yes, work, stuff thatcame my way and there were
(19:32):
opportunities to go back intoindustry and I said yes to
everything else.
That's how the Reiki came up.
I went on a painting retreat itwas virtual because it was
COVID.
Yeah, I took up archery.
I took up a challenge to yoga.
Yeah, I did a challenge to yogaevery day, which I did for two
years so I just kind of explored.
I think I was so burned out andso focused on work before I'd
forgotten what made me happy.
And in that year of yes,someone challenged me to have
(20:01):
200 meaningful conversations.
And this is the advice I giveanyone who's looking on how to
change careers, how to breakinto directorships Go meet 200
people.
And so it's like networking ata completely different level and
because you have a clearpurpose in what you're trying to
understand.
And for me that was.
I'm in a period of transition.
I don't know what to do.
Tell me about a transition inyour life.
It was just how do I learn fromthese people?
(20:22):
I think you know, at some pointmy name just kind of got out
there and that's actually howthe boards found me, got it, so
I think I was really lucky inthat I kind of I almost fell
into it.
But then, once I started to getthe calls you know the way with
boards it's a very strangeinterviewing process.
They have lots of meetings andthen you never hear from them
(20:44):
again.
So it took a few before I foundone that was like the right fit
.
And one of the things I learnedas well is, in the beginning
you're almost like, yes, okay,I'll do it.
And they didn't work out, andthat was a great thing.
And I realized I'm like, okay,I have to show up the way I want
to be with what's important tome and when I feel like I truly
(21:04):
was confident in that space, inthe kind of interview process,
that was the first board andthen, literally the day that
board was announced, I got acall for another board, so I was
able to start building aportfolio.
And then, you know, in all ofthat there's this element of,
well, if you could do anythingfor free, what would you do?
And for me, that's always beenmentoring people, and I met a
(21:28):
lot of people who are at acrossroads in their career and
they're stuck.
And I'm a big believer in youhave agency of choice.
If you feel stuck in that job,you can choose to stay in the
job or you can choose to look atother options.
So I do a lot of work around.
How do I help someone look atall of the options that they
have available and choosesomething different if they're
(21:50):
not where they were, or if wherethey are is like, ok, I have to
, I want to choose this forthese reasons, okay, well, how
do we make it more, more of afull life for you?
Speaker 1 (21:59):
yeah, so no, I I've.
That's pretty much, as wediscussed before, what I do
pretty often, but in-house at mycompany, and it actually is
really powerful to see someonego from being in that stuck
place to in the place after that, like whatever that kind of
looks like for them.
I think that's actuallyprobably the most rewarding part
of that process.
Speaker 2 (22:18):
I absolutely agree.
When someone realizes whatthey're capable of or what their
own value is, like I think thatthat was something I struggled
with.
So when I see someone likeclick, like wait a minute, this
is what I bring to the table,and oh, I can do all these
things, suddenly they'reunleashed.
I think that's the best feelingin the world, absolutely.
Speaker 1 (22:35):
So I mean quick pivot , tell me a bit about these 200
conversations Like who did youdecide who to choose to meet?
Or like were you just randomlylike hey, that person looks
interesting, I want to meet them.
Speaker 2 (22:46):
Well, it started.
The person who challenged mesaid I'm going to introduce you
to the first two and then whenyou have Two out of 200?
Speaker 1 (22:53):
Tell them there's any better ratio than that.
Start with the first two.
Speaker 2 (22:56):
And then she said, when you meet with those two,
ask them to introduce someoneelse.
So that's how it started.
And then, because it was COVID,everybody was happy to have a
30-minute Zoom call.
And because it's Zoom, you knowit's going to be 30 minutes.
That was just a break betweenthe constant meetings that
everybody was having at the time.
And I met people like around theworld, and then I started
(23:18):
applying as Bermuda began toopen up.
I think I just I think that'sreally all it is.
It's being open to meeting newpeople, much like how we met
right, Like I think there's.
You were open to approaching meand I was opening to the
conversation and often that'sreally the shift it takes.
I would have said when I was inmy corporate life, you know, I
really was going through lifewith blinders on in terms of
(23:39):
like this work is so important.
This is what you know.
It's very insular to thecompany, Whereas now I'm very
much more open and my daughtertells me like I'm the world's
greatest networker, but I don'tconsider it networking, as much
as I love making new connectionswith people.
Speaker 1 (23:55):
But I think that's that's really what it is.
That's networking, like I mean,and a lot of people and I hate
the phrase that you either haveit or you don't but being good
at networking is a true gift,like some people really just are
not good at it.
You know what I mean.
Being able to work a room andmeet people and be pretty
unapologetic about going up tosomeone and introducing yourself
is that is something you canteach someone to do.
(24:17):
But someone who's naturallygood at it far excels in that
scenario than anything.
That's one thing.
Speaker 2 (24:23):
I always am like wow, I wish everyone could do that,
because they not everyone can Iactually think everyone can get
to a place that they can, and Ithink it's keep it simple have
one question, have one questionfor somebody, because at the end
of the day, what I've learnedis nobody wants to be like have
one question and have it be athoughtful question, like don't
(24:55):
lead with what do you do?
You know, if you're at an event, then use something from the
event to anchor that question,or in the 200 questions for me.
I was in a period of transition, so that was my anchor point.
So, yeah, you don't need tocarry on a conversation for two
hours, so 15 to 20 minutes likeone question can carry a
conversation.
Yeah, um, yeah, you don't needto carry on a conversation for
two hours, so 15 to 20 minutes,like one question can carry a
conversation.
Speaker 1 (25:15):
Yeah, definitely, and you're absolutely correct.
People as much people like oh,I don't like to talk about
myself, it's actually theeasiest subject to talk about
when you really think about it,cause nobody knows you better
than you, right?
So I mean you're, you're anobviously reading your bio and
looking, looking you up, likeyou're often, very often
regarded to as someone who is apioneer in the industry, right,
in terms of insurance, just foreveryone else's knowledge, like
(25:37):
what would be your definition ofleadership, and then how has
that evolved over time?
Leadership?
Speaker 2 (25:43):
is respect for people .
So I would say so.
I think, having started mycareer so young, I got to see a
lot of leaders.
I saw a lot of examples and whenI look back at the people who I
grew the most under, I learnedunder the best they really and
(26:05):
someone who comes to mindspecifically Scott Hunter, who
ran Arthur Anderson.
And so here was someone who wasa partner in a world, one of
the top audit firms in the world, but most of his staff were
under 25.
And as a 25-year-old I startedthere when I was 17.
(26:30):
But I always felt respected andseen and that there was
opportunity for me, and Scottnever made us feel like we were
young or immature or any ofthose things which probably were
, because we worked hard and weplayed hard too, yeah, but
that's important, good yeah.
Especially at that age.
But yeah, so I and how itchanged over time was when I was
in the chief transformationofficer role, I had the chance
to mentor with somebody who hadgone to Japan and studied under
(26:52):
Toyota and some of the foundersof lean thinking in Toyota, the
Toyota production system Just intime, it kind of goes under
different names and it reallyhoned that to some very simple
tenets and the first is respectfor people, and then the other
one is always trust the expert,and the first is respect for
people and then the other one isalways trust the expert, and
the expert is the person doingthe job.
(27:12):
Yeah, so what I always used tosay is I think for anybody
working in any position, youneed to know where the company
is going, you need to know yourrole in where the company is
going and you have to have somesay over how you get to do that
role.
I think if, as a leader, you canput that in your culture, I and
you have to have some say overhow you get to do that role.
I think if, as a leader, youcan put that in your culture, I
think you're going to havereally happy employees and
(27:33):
people who are fulfilled in whatthey do Absolutely.
Speaker 1 (27:35):
No, I mean, you're spot on.
I stand on my soapbox all thetime about culture and leaders
and how they really are thechange and what you see they
direct really are the change andwhat you see they direct, what
that looks like, and I wish mostleaders thought about
leadership from that viewpoint,as opposed to the traditional
way of how people thinkleadership should be.
I think that that's absolutelykey in everything that we do all
(27:56):
the time.
Speaker 2 (27:57):
And I think that was the differentiator for me when I
was interviewing for the boards.
You know, in the first coupleof boards you feel like you have
to be that technical expert.
You need to know what's goingon in the insurance market.
You know that very technicaland when I realized I'm like I
don't really want to talk aboutthose things, I can talk about
those things.
I can talk about the financialstatements, but what I'm really
interested in is how are youbuilding a foundation for growth
(28:18):
?
What kind of company do youwant?
What do you want beyond thebottom line?
Lots of companies, you know.
There were lots of interviewsthat kind of went sideways when
I started asking those questionsbecause they were like we're
just in, take advantage of themarket and get out with an ROE,
whereas the companies I'vealways gravitated to is there is
a mission greater than just thebottom line.
Speaker 1 (28:36):
Yeah, but those are also the companies that really
invest in their people.
Yeah, absolutely, businessimperatives.
We have things, numbers, thatneed to be hit.
I think that's all important,but people who understand that
their people are the mostimportant and that's how you're
going to get the best.
Them producing their best.
That's paramount with anyorganization, I agree, and those
(28:57):
are the people I want to be inthe room with.
A thousand percent.
I totally agree.
I say that all the time.
But where I initially wasintroduced to you was at a
conference that we were both atand you were speaking on this
panel and I think it was aboutleadership, and one of the
gentlemen just everyone'sknowledge which I was the only
woman on the panel and therewere other men on the panel and
(29:17):
one of the gentlemen essentiallysaid she was saying, making a
point around, men in leadershipneed supportive wives at home.
But he was making a veryblanket statement about
leadership and the assumptionwas that it was all men, one
with you sitting next to him.
But then you very eloquentlywere like and husbands too, and
like, every woman in the roomwas like yeah, you know what I
(29:39):
mean, because the narrative hasdefinitely shifted around what
leadership looks like, but canwe talk a moment about what that
representation looks like forwomen today in terms of
leadership?
Speaker 2 (29:51):
You have to ask me that question more specifically,
sorry.
Speaker 1 (29:54):
No, it's fine.
So what does it mean in termsof representation for women in
leadership?
Today we have some women inleadership.
Sometimes we don't, but thatnarrative, that traditional
narrative of men in leadership,supportive wives at home and
everyone having like thatthought process of that's what
that traditional leader lookslike.
How do we kind of shape that abit different?
(30:16):
Because there are husbands athome too, two wives who have
huge jobs Many of them have beenon the podcast how do we shift?
Speaker 2 (30:22):
that Well, I love Christy Hunter.
Our Scott always says you can'tbe what you can't see, and so I
think the reality is you justneed to see it.
And the one thing I want to sayin the moment I said husbands,
but you know, partners come inall shapes and sizes, and
sometimes those partners are.
You know like can be agrandparent or whatever.
So I think seeing all thecombinations, first of all,
(30:46):
seeing other people inleadership other than just white
men.
There's lots of really capablepeople and giving people
opportunity, having differentways of showing up and leader.
And one of the things isthere's always so much focus on
corporate leadership and that'salways been my focus but leaders
(31:06):
come in all different areas oflife.
So what I've learned from mykids is, like the sports coach
is just as important a leader as, say, my boss, like they have a
lot of influence, but I thinkwomen need to make it okay.
It's just if we focus on womenspecifically, because that's the
area I know best.
(31:27):
I think when you see women inleadership, women with children
in leadership, women who aredivorced or single or with a
spouse, you know you have to seeall iterations.
And I think what I've alwaysconnected with people over is
I'm very real about it Iremember when I first started
(31:47):
traveling to New York, I wasworking with a group of New York
women lawyers and this was likethe most hardcore group of
intimidating women you canimagine and we bonded over our
children and the guilt we hadbetween really loving our
careers but losing the time withour families and trying that
balance.
And one of them made thecomment of I was the first
(32:09):
leader she'd seen in thatposition and then I was the
first woman leader she'd met.
That was real about thechallenges of being a woman in
business and I don't really knowhow to show up any other way,
but how I am.
So I think when women make itokay to say like, oh, I've got
my kid's got a recital and I'mgoing to leave for it, or
(32:30):
there's an assembly, or my kid'ssick, I'm going to be the one
to go home.
I'm not going to call thepartner and tell them to do it.
If you can.
I think it makes it okay foreveryone else to say okay, I can
exist in that position with thelife I have.
Speaker 1 (32:45):
Absolutely, and whatever your support looks like
, that's up to you, like youknow what I mean, and whatever
you need to do to makeeverything work for you.
I think that that's totallyfine and it works for everyone,
whatever you choose to do thatis.
Speaker 2 (32:56):
But the key is, you need the support, you know it
truly does take a village, and Ithink that's the difference is
you need the partner behind youbecause it's really hard.
Especially the higher up you goin at least in corporate
corporate, you know living thehigher you go, just the
environment can be so political,can be toxic.
(33:20):
You feel very alone because youdon't have peers, especially as
a woman at a very high level incorporate Bermuda or corporate
America, whatever.
But I felt very alone.
My peers were all men.
They all had the wives with thenannies and the housekeepers
and God bless my husband.
I had him and I had my parents,but I didn't have the army that
(33:43):
they did yeah.
So I think the more that youhave that support behind you and
you know who's got your back,you know who your trusted people
are, even outside of the office, that you can kind of be
yourself with and take yourproblems to, I think that's
really important.
Speaker 1 (34:00):
Yeah, absolutely.
What's one thing about yourhusband that people might not
know, but it makes a hugedifference in, or had made a
huge difference in, your abilityto lead and, you know, rise in
your own career.
Speaker 2 (34:14):
So I think people who know my husband my husband is
what you see is what you get,and he's an iron man so he's
very disciplined and veryfocused.
So I think people who know himknow those things about him that
really sums it up, and I thinkyou know he's not ego driven and
he was always really supportive.
(34:35):
So maybe what people don't knowis he's a really good cook.
So he used to do all thecooking before we shifted and
now I primarily do the cooking,unfortunately for him.
But we shifted and now Iprimarily do the cooking,
unfortunately for him butfortunate for me.
But yeah, he just he'ssteadfast and he's you know
whether it's doing 50 miles onthe bike or Michelle's off to
(34:57):
New York again.
He was always very steadfastbut I'm pretty sure anyone who
knows my husband knows thatabout him, without a doubt.
Speaker 1 (35:03):
Yeah, and I also I mean from obviously knowing you
this short period of time healso seems incredibly supportive
.
Like not very many people willbe like you're done and be like
okay, cool, let's figure it out.
Like, how has that support beenfor you?
Speaker 2 (35:17):
Um, the fact that I could step out and there wasn't
a discussion on finances, therewasn't a discussion on what will
we do, there wasn't adiscussion of what next.
He just was accepting.
There's a level of acceptancethat is pretty special actually,
(35:42):
but the fact that I'm like thisis how I feel about something
as important as my career, andhe was just like yep, that's
okay.
It shows that he knows, I knowwhat's best for me and he
respects me.
So I think when you have thatsupport, it opens up possibility
, because clearly, if I didn'thave it, I wouldn't have been
able to just step out and Iwouldn't be where I am today,
absolutely.
Speaker 1 (36:03):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (36:04):
Yeah, it's pretty.
Speaker 1 (36:05):
He probably knew you needed the break too.
Speaker 2 (36:06):
Well, sometimes I joke.
I'm like I think it was atestament to how frayed life was
that he was like, oh, thank God, I'm done with this.
Exactly so, but that alsowasn't what he led with, which
is also nice.
Speaker 1 (36:18):
Yeah, he's a pretty smart guy.
Speaker 2 (36:20):
I guess I'll keep him around some longer.
No, it's funny so.
Speaker 1 (36:22):
No, it's funny.
So how are you being reallyintentional about this new phase
in life?
Speaker 2 (36:35):
Yeah.
So I think it started with theboards kind of being intentional
of.
This is what I want to talk tothe CEOs and the equity backing
these ventures about, and it wasmore than just what kind of
underwriting do you want to do,what type of shop do you want to
do?
And every board I joined, Ifeel like there's a purpose to
it somewhere and I think it's areally amazing group of people
(36:56):
that I have worked with.
So that was the first thing.
So, to the extent that the workI was doing, I feel like it's
aligned with what I do.
And then, even in this nextchapter, I'm doing a lot more
speaking and at some point I'llsit down and do a bit more
writing because, I quite like todo that and working more with
individuals.
I think it's intentional fromthe point of view again of where
(37:17):
I feel like there's an energyin the world that's very counter
to what we've all known, andfor every action there's an
equal and opposite reaction soif I want to be that opposite
reaction, I have to putsomething into it, and so I do
accept that I'm taking morespeaking engagements.
I'm putting myself out there onthe stage in a way I never did
(37:37):
before.
She described herself in threeconcentric circles and she said
this is me and these are myvalues and what I believe in,
and these are the people Isurround myself with, whether
they're family by choice orfamily by blood.
And then this is the work thatI do, and it was the first time
(37:58):
I'd seen this work-lifeintegration, like everything she
did and the people shesurrounded herself with are so
aligned with who she was, and sothose are leading principles
for me is when I get a call oran opportunity, or when I'm
choosing not to do something,it's like okay, is this in
alignment with who I am, what Ibelieve in, what my priorities
(38:19):
are and how I want to show up.
So I'm much more consciousabout that and thinking about it
in what I do.
And even the times you're likeI don't feel like doing it, it's
like is that really inalignment?
You know, get your butt outthere.
Speaker 1 (38:32):
Yeah, exactly, michelle, I have like want to
keep talking to you, but we'rerunning out of time and that's
okay too.
We can always do a part two ifwe need to.
But how I wrap up here witheveryone on the podcast is when
you know with everyone on thepodcast is when you know when
someone says your name yearsfrom now and they're like, hey,
you know, michelle Seymour Smith, what do you want to be
(38:52):
remembered for in those momentswhen you're no longer around and
obviously, touch wood, it'll bea very long time from now and
you're enjoying all this newphase of life that you're in.
But what do you want to beremembered for?
Speaker 2 (39:03):
I think there's two principles that are really
important to me, and one isknowing your own value, and then
the other is having your ownagency and having control and
choice over what it is you'redoing.
And so I tell my kids all thetime that anything is possible,
which is the Iron man slogan.
But I'm like, anything'spossible if you want it and you
(39:23):
go for it.
If you want it and you go forit, and I hope that, whether
it's my kids, or whether it'ssomeone I worked with or my
closest friends, I hope theyalways feel like I felt like I
could do anything with.
Speaker 1 (39:35):
Michelle.
Speaker 2 (39:35):
Michelle believed in me and Michelle saw what I, the
value I bring, and they seetheir own value bring and they
really feel empowered.
Because I think when you hitthat stage of empowerment, when
you really truly realize whatyou're capable of, like nothing
can stop you and it's thisfeeling of being unleashed and I
hope that's the feeling I leavepeople with.
(39:56):
I love that.
It's amazing, thank you so muchfor being with us today.
Speaker 1 (40:01):
I really do appreciate it.
I think we got some amazinggems here today.
Like I'm like, my brain isprocessing on what we're gonna
put out okay, that's good I Ilove it.
Speaker 2 (40:11):
I'm super intrigued there are a couple like oh, I
bubble that one, but that's okay, none of it.
We would never know which oneit was.
You're amazing so much.
Oh, you really are.
No, like I'm glad you're doingthis.
So people's like, people'sstories need to be told.
So thank you for having me.
Absolutely, I appreciate it all.
Speaker 1 (40:26):
So thank you for having me.
Absolutely.
I appreciate it.
All right, guys, thank you forjoining us today.
Had the amazing MichelleSeymour-Smith on the podcast
with us today.
If you guys want to learn anymore about her, make sure you
check out her LinkedIn page andyou can ping her on there.
Speaker 2 (40:36):
You can be her 200th and 10th person she may be, or
whatever number.
Speaker 1 (40:41):
She's on now and I hope you got something valuable
and meaningful from thisconversation.
As always, thank you to oursponsors, 59 Front Brown Company
and Scudamar, and, you know, asalways, thank you for spending
time with me today on HustleHeart Podcast you.
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