August 28, 2023 • 64 mins
Prepare to be riveted as the brave Jennifer, a sexual assault survivor, unravels the story of her grim ordeal in far-off Turkey. Working abroad, Jennifer was in a dire situation with a man she initially considered a friend. He deceived and delivered her to a monster who attempted to rape her.
Her story is not only a testament to her resilience, but it also stands as a beacon of hope for survivors globally. Join us on this journey from the depths of despair to the heights of spiritual wisdom and healing.
Join us as we dive into Jennifer's world, where she discusses her podcast, Trauma Rewired, Neurology, and Somatic Healing. The Podcast teaches you about your nervous system, how trauma gets stored in the body, and what you can do to heal. She aims to empower other survivors like her, to heal and rewrite their narratives.
Check out Trauma Rewired: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/trauma-rewired/id1537602643.
Her story is not only a testament to her resilience, but it also stands as a beacon of hope for survivors globally. Join us on this journey from the depths of despair to the heights of spiritual wisdom and healing.
· Share the I Need Blue Podcast with at least one person to spread awareness and healing.
· Seek help if needed and prioritize your own well-being.
Connect with Jen:
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/ineedbluepodcast/
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/needbluepodcast
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCp1q8SfA_hEXRJ4EaizlW8Q
Website: https://ineedblue.net/
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
Remember you are stronger than you think.
Don't believe me, we're aboutto prove it.
Welcome back.
This is Jen Lee, creator andhost of I Need Blue podcast.
(00:22):
True Crime to True Life.
As a survivor of arm droperyand abduction, I understand the
trauma and triggers survivorsexperience Knowing this and
through my powerful podcast, Ioffer survivors a safe place to
share their lived experiences.
(00:42):
Survivors need blue to feelthey belong, they are loved,
understood and my favoriteempowered.
Please note I Need Blue doescontain sensitive topics which
could be triggering.
Please seek help if needed andremember you always come first.
I Need Blue episodes can befound on Apple Podcasts, spotify
(01:07):
and many listening platforms,including my website,
wwwineedbluenet.
There you will find all theepisodes, valuable resources,
safety tips, my newly releasedbook and e-book why I Survived
by Jennifer Lee, and if yourpassion is to learn to podcast,
(01:31):
you will find a learn to podcastPDF available as well.
I would like to thank Shar Good, the talented violinist who
composed and performed thisopening music.
You can find information aboutShar Good on my website.
As always, thank you forlistening.
Let's begin today's episode.
(01:53):
Strong, resilient, resourcefuland determined, saved my guest's
life literally.
Jennifer traveled to Turkey on awork assignment.
She was well-traveled,understood different countries'
(02:15):
cultural expectations and knewenough of their language to get
by.
She was excited about this newadventure.
It started with her living withher boss's female cousin.
All was fine until hell brokeloose one day and she needed to
find new accommodations.
(02:36):
As Jennifer shared details ofwhat followed, I found myself
holding my breath, trying toimagine the scene she was
describing, yet not wanting toimagine it.
Several times she escapedsexual assault, which could have
led to her being trafficked.
Jennifer will share her storywith us today.
(03:00):
It will have you on the edge ofyour seats.
We will discuss how she thrivesand helps others.
Now she has a podcast TraumaRewired Neurology and Somatic
Healing with Jennifer Wallaceand Elizabeth Kristoff.
The podcast teaches you aboutyour nervous system, how trauma
(03:25):
gets stored in the body and whatyou can do to heal.
Only can be found on manypodcast listening forums,
including Apple Podcast.
Jennifer, thank you for beingmy guest today and welcome to
the I Need Blue podcast.
Speaker 2 (03:45):
Thank you so much, Jennifer.
I'm so happy to be here withyou and to connect with you and
your listeners.
It's a really pleasure.
Speaker 1 (03:53):
Thank you.
I am so thrilled to have youhere as well.
We've had some awesomeconversations and getting to
know each other.
Like I had stated in myintroduction is, when you
started to tell me little piecesof your story, I was in awe.
I'm so glad that, number oneyou are here and you are safe.
(04:13):
You're in a spot where you canshare your story.
But not only that you've founda way to help others as well.
Speaker 2 (04:23):
I really feel like that second piece really feels
purposeful, to be able to sharethe story, and share it from a
place of groundedness andregulation, whereas telling it
isn't going to dysregulate meany further or send me into
something protective like abinge eating episode or
(04:43):
something to find the safetyback again in my nervous system
after sharing such a big story.
It's just so relevant.
Speaker 1 (04:51):
Absolutely.
It's situational awareness.
In today's world, especiallyfor women, whether you're
traveling abroad or even ifyou're just going for a walk in
your neighborhood, it's soimportant to be aware and to
know the signs and to protectyourself.
Speaker 2 (05:08):
Yes, absolutely.
Thank you so much for yourintroduction.
We share an experience that'skind of like same church,
different pew.
We're in a small population,what feels like a small
population, although hundreds ofthousands people worldwide are
affected by violent crimes, sextrafficking, violent sexual
(05:31):
assaults and all of it.
Like you said, women in thisday, you just can't be aware
enough of your surroundings.
Speaker 1 (05:40):
Absolutely.
While you bring that up beforewe start sharing your story,
this happens way more than wethink.
Doing your podcast has thatkind of opened your eyes up to
that reality.
Speaker 2 (05:52):
Yes, I think it has.
I think what it really does,too, is women knowing this story
and knowing that I'm prettyopen about really any of the
body boundary violations I'veexperienced in life, I think, as
someone who's a guide in thehealing arts, I want women to
feel really safe with me, andsharing these stories I feel
(06:15):
like is really foundational forthe work that we can do together
, because they know that I'vebeen through it I'm on the other
side of it too Well thank youfor all of that.
Speaker 1 (06:26):
And you said body boundaries.
I've never heard that before.
I made a little note of it.
Speaker 2 (06:32):
Yeah, we talk about body boundary violations a lot
From our perspective.
When we think about bodyboundary violations, we think of
that on a spectrum and on thelow end of the spectrum might be
someone just looking at my body, objectifying my body or maybe
even talking about my body.
We live in a culture, once again, women have been subjected to a
(06:54):
lot of people talking about ourbodies.
Even that can trigger anemotional flashback in my body
of a thread.
If that thread gets pulled of,that body boundary violation
where I feel like the man infront of me has that like a
predatory energy to him, he'sgoing to spin me out.
I mean, he's just going tototally spin me out inside
(07:15):
because that objectification ofme is going to trigger a body
boundary violation, maybe likethe story I'm about to tell in
Turkey, or maybe another timewhere I was sexually assaulted,
you know, even like in my earlychildhood experience, right?
So there's all these livedexperiences from my early
childhood to well, body boundaryviolation can happen basically
(07:40):
anytime you walk out of thehouse.
We always have that opportunity.
But it's about how can I managethat activation from a place of
higher consciousness now sothat that activation doesn't
then totally spin me out andspiral me.
Speaker 1 (07:57):
That is fascinating.
You are teaching me somethingand you have put into words
something that I have beentrying to figure out for a long
time.
I could have another wholeepisode and we could talk about
that.
I'm sure.
Awesome, I love it, thank you.
Thank you so much for that, forsaying those words.
Speaker 2 (08:18):
Yeah, yeah, you're welcome.
Speaker 1 (08:19):
All right, Now let's move on to your story and Turkey
.
Speaker 2 (08:26):
Okay, so I was 32 years old and I was living in
London for four years.
I had gone there for a finearts degree and I had graduated
and about two months later wentto Turkey.
I was going to Turkey by way ofan opportunity.
I thought I was about to livemy dream life.
(08:48):
I deeply believe in education,especially for young girls in
third world countries anddeveloping countries, and I also
believe in water.
So I thought I was joiningforces with a foundation that
was going to support these twothings and then I also would be
able to support my travelinghabit and my art, my art career
and all of it.
So I really thought I wasaccepting my dream job and I
(09:11):
went to Antalya, turkey.
It's a beautiful place right onthe Mediterranean.
It's gorgeous, the food isincredible and it's kind of a
hotspot tourist destination.
It was like 92 degrees everyday.
I loved it.
I loved it.
I loved the Mediterranean.
I mean, I just love the water.
My boss you mentioned I wasliving with his cousin and there
(09:32):
was a language barrier becauseI don't speak much Turkish.
She doesn't speak much Englishand she had introduced me to a
man who ran an IT shop man namedKarem.
He was about my age and soabout maybe four times, five
times something like that on mywalk back and forth to the beach
(09:53):
from my apartment, I would stopin sometimes and speak to him
because, quite honestly, it'sjust really nice to speak
English with somebody who's yourage, who seems to be interested
about like Hollywood or BritneySpears or I don't even know.
You know, it's just like sorandom stuff to talk about.
It felt pretty comfortable.
I thought.
I thought I was gaining afriend and an ally in this
(10:15):
person.
So one day I'm sitting in theapartment there's no windows and
not even in front of me,there's no visible entry into
the apartment and Fatash, myboss's cousin, comes in and she
sees me sitting in a bathingsuit, in a bikini.
I just come off the beach, Iwas putting on his mafter sun
(10:38):
and she flipped I mean she justcompletely flipped when she saw
me sitting there in a bikini.
Just, she just went off on meand she was treating me
incredibly poorly and speakingme I mean, like I said, very
broken language, but speaking tome very like calling me a slut.
She was going there, she wasgoing to places that were
(10:58):
completely disproportionate towhat was going on, like I'm
sitting on the couch applyingafter sun lotion.
So I didn't hold back any ofthe things back either.
I wasn't doing anything.
So I got defensive, it gotheated and I went to my room.
I packed a bag, I got onlineand I started looking at
different Airbnb's and differentplaces I could stay.
I was in a resort town, sothere's got to be nice places.
(11:21):
I left my bag, I took my listup to the IT shop and I said,
hey, this is what's gone down.
I need a break.
My boss is out of town.
I just I can't.
I need a nice space to be safeand relax.
And so he made a couple phonecalls.
I mean, he looked at my list.
He was like no, no, okay, okay,no, I call these couple places.
(11:44):
So he made a phone call, got mea reservation, so off we go.
As we leave his IT shop, the manwho was coming through.
This was interesting because myalarm bells did slightly go off
at the energy of this man.
He just had Bdis, he was alittle bit shorter, he just had
(12:06):
an energy to him that wasn'tvery kind, and so I didn't say
anything, I didn't do anything,I just kept walking.
We get in the car.
We go up and Krim says, oh, youknow what, I forgot something.
He circles back, he goes insideand, in retrospect, I think
this is the moment where thesetwo get in cahoots with each
(12:26):
other, because I don't know this, but Krim is about to Deliver
me to this man's house, like I'mgoing to the scary BDI guys
house.
So Krim gets back in the carand he says hey, you know what?
I have this girlfriend, thisRussian girl named Elani.
She's about your age, shespeaks great English and her
brother is out of town.
He's gonna be out of town forthe weekend.
It's perfect, because you canjust stay there for that time
(12:48):
and you can't stay beyond thattime because he's coming back.
Perfect.
He totally sold me, literallyon this experience, great.
So off we go to Elani's houseand, like he said, she was very
welcoming and the house lookedpretty normal Instruments,
artwork, you know.
It looked like a lived space.
We sit, we all talk, and thensome time passes by and the man
(13:13):
from the IT shop at the doorcomes through and a very
different energy this time.
He's happy, he's very kind.
I think in that moment I justneglected what I had met in the
shop and just put it off to.
You know what?
I'm in a culture.
I'm in a different experience.
I'm not the Equal.
(13:34):
I'm just gonna kind of like letthat go.
And at some point Karem Left togo close the shop and then was
gonna come back.
He comes back, he's got a caseof beer with him and I've never
been a beer drinker.
So as everybody starts to kindof party a little bit, that's
not really me.
I did take a few hits off of aspliff that was going around.
So I think, once again,retrospect, they're trying to
(13:57):
kind of get me a little bit outof my consciousness.
What is that?
It's cannabis mixed withtobacco, gotcha.
But they don't know that Ialready have a fine history with
cannabis and that that wasn'treally doing anything for me or
to me.
So, in their probably attempt toget me a little sideways, I was
(14:21):
, I was fine, totally so Karemleaves and as he's leaving, I'm
like, oh, you know what, it'sgetting late, I'd really like to
go to bed as well.
So I go, I brush my teeth,leave my toothbrush into the
little thing, and they're likeno, no, please stay up with us.
We really want to get to knowyou.
Please have one drink with usand I was like, alright, I'll
(14:43):
stay up just for a little bitlonger with y'all, so that time
comes and goes and I go to bedthere's two twin beds in my room
and as I'm sat there, the doorOpens and when I look over, it's
seen on and he's in his tidywhiteies.
That's it.
(15:03):
And I said to myself, literallysaid to yourself brace yourself
, because he's coming for you.
And he did, and so fight wasdefinitely it.
We carried on for Maybe fiveminutes, I guess, of just full
on.
He's going.
I mean he couldn't hold myhands, my arms, my legs open.
(15:27):
Stop me from screaming.
I mean, we were really all overthe place.
They remind me of like thedusty guy and Charlie Brown, you
know, it's like it just likescuffle everywhere and what were
you?
wearing.
I was wearing some black plazopants with a cotton waistband, a
really thick cotton waistbandlike five or six inches, and
(15:49):
they were just giant.
And I was wearing a cap sleevet-shirt with sleeves down to my
elbows, and so those plazo pantsaren't very hard to get down.
They're the easiest pants toget down.
He was, I mean, he was goingthere very easily.
I just continued to fight andscream and at some point I Don't
(16:09):
know why, he just stopped.
He just stopped and he left theroom and I was like, oh my god,
and now comes the flight.
How am I kidding out of here?
First of all, I changed clothes.
I put jeans on Because I feltlike that was just a more Secure
(16:29):
yeah, technically smart move.
I changed my jeans.
I put on another t-shirt on topof the one that I was already
wearing, just once again, Ithink just to have more barrier.
There's two windows In the room.
When you open the door, there'sone in front of you, and at the
bed that I was on there's onein front of that.
(16:50):
So I grabbed my passport, mytelephone, and I'm Looking out
the windows like how am I?
I'm only on the second floor, Ido know that, so that doesn't
seem too very far down, I don'tknow, but there's Nothing there
to catch me and I'm not twostories up, I'm more like five
stories up, because it justdrops down.
I Think, okay, well, you're notgetting out of one of these
(17:14):
windows, but when you get out ofthe house you'll have your
thing.
So I dropped my passport,dropped my telephone and to this
day of everything I know of theretrospect and the reflection I
can look at, this is the onepart that I cannot Figure out.
I dropped my things.
I've changed my clothes.
Now I'm just like, okay, allright, I'm like taking it all in
(17:34):
here.
He comes busting through thedoor with my passport and my
telephone and he's pissed.
He's screaming at me somethingin Turkish I can't understand
and he just basically starts topunch me.
We go back down onto the bedand this time the fighting was
way more intense.
I mean, the energy behind his,his aggression, was much
(17:59):
different.
And I'm also this time I'mscreaming for her.
I'm screaming her name, likeplease come here and help me.
And at some point she does openthe door.
She opens the door, she looksat us, we make eye contact and
she shuts the door and in thatmoment I know like You're alone,
she's in on this like this is.
This is now.
(18:20):
This is like continuing toescalate in the gravity of sort
of what I'm involved in in thismoment.
There was a moment during thesecond attack where he gets my
jeans a little bit down and Iremember listening to an Oprah
episode one time where there wasthis elderly black lady who had
(18:42):
had her home broken into in themiddle of the night and she
found herself Awakened by theattacker on top of her and she
grabbed him by the genitals sohard that he begged her to call
the police.
And I thought about that lady,thought about that.
I thought I'm gonna try thatbecause he's just wearing tidy
whiteies, I Think before Iapplied the correct amount of
(19:03):
pressure he was already sort ofonto what I was doing because he
was just oh man, he was mad andhe got me pretty hard at one
point and I remember thinking tomyself like he's much stronger
than you are.
How long can this Go on?
I mean he's a little bitshorter than me, a couple inches
, but he's bigger than me is sothat's sausage fingers.
(19:24):
I mean he's got big hands.
In that moment of feeling likethere's a little bit of defeat
starting to happen.
He slid my underwear over justenough for me to feel Either his
finger, his penis, something onme, and that was like all the
(19:45):
fire I needed and it was justlike no, I just continued.
I just really fought back thenand once again and I mean we're
probably talking about sevenminutes I would think of this
attack and once again he justStopped.
He just stopped.
He gets up, he leaves the room,start to compose myself again
(20:07):
what the fuck am I gonna do?
And I Send quorum the IT guy atext that said help me in all
caps flip phone.
So as soon as I send themessage, send it goes
doodly-doodly-doop, does alittle message, a little music,
to let me know that I've sentthe text.
Well, he hears that whereverhe's at in all way.
(20:30):
And here he comes.
And he just grabbed me by thewrist.
I was still holding my phonewhen he walked through the door.
So he's trying to pull me outof the room and I'm trying to
stay in the room and we are likereally fighting each other and
he's telling me he wants me togo into the master bedroom and
sleep with them.
(20:51):
She's in the bed in the middleof this king size bed, totally
passed out, or what I think haspassed out.
He finally gets me out of thehallway, shoves me into this
room, walks me to the far end ofthe bed and puts me down and
then he's just like goes off.
So I'm sitting there and I'mjust like I start to lay down on
(21:14):
my side and I'm trying to watchhim over my shoulder just to
keep an eye on him, because it'sso I don't know what's
happening.
It's pretty erratic andobviously not safe.
So I lay there and I just likecried on the bed skirt, leaving
some mucus, leaving some tears,leaving my DNA.
(21:35):
And he's in and out of the roomand he's carrying around this
key.
There's like set of round keysthat looks like something of a
junkyard, you know, like all thekeys, it's like a thousand keys
.
He's got that and he puts it onan ironing board, under a pile
of clothes on the ironing board.
So I'm just like, ok, well,that's not an option, but her
cell phone is right here on thebedstand next to me.
(21:57):
So I take it, I power it offand I put it in between the
mattress and the bed skirt and Ijust laid there waiting for him
to fall asleep, and laid therefor hours thinking about do I
try and go off this patio door?
Like, should I try and sneakout of this room?
Like we're talking about likefive hours of just like
(22:20):
contemplation.
And at some point I've beenmonitoring the pace of his
snores for a while and I'm like,ok, I'm going to try to get out
of here, I'm going to try toget out of this room first.
So I so slowly begin to get upand I'm looking for weapons
everywhere, because if I startto wake him up, I've got to find
something.
Just grab anything, right?
(22:41):
I start to slowly creep out ofthe room and the door was open
slightly.
I had to open it just a littlebit and I've got one eye on him.
I slink out of the door and I'mlike, oh my god.
Now I'm in the apartment.
First thing I do is go grab aglass, because I thought that's
(23:01):
a weapon.
I'm going to break this, I'mgoing to shove it into his
throat.
That's going to be what's goingto happen here.
So I grabbed my glass and nowI'm like walking around the
apartment.
There's a little camera fromthe night before where we'd all
taken a picture of the three ofus and I'm sure that was you
know.
Look at this girl that I've got.
Now I go out onto the balconyand I'm like, ok, I'm going to
(23:24):
have to jump down this balcony,I'm going to have to lower
myself, I've got to figure thisout and it's marble or something
down there.
So, once again, not a softlanding, and I've never jumped
off of a balcony.
Like all this stuff is goingthrough my mind.
And because, back to Oprah,oprah was my babysitter in the
80s and I know from John Walshwe don't go to the second
(23:45):
location.
I have to get out of here now,because if this goes any further
, I don't know what's happeningand the movie Taken had just
been released.
Like all this stuff is, youknow, it's just so much, so much
.
So I go out on the balcony, I'mdoing the survey.
I remember the camera and thepicture.
(24:05):
I got to get that cameraBecause then when I go to the
police I need photos of, like,who are these two people?
So I go in, I grab the camera.
It's bright, red, little pointand shoot thing.
So I can't throw ever a day inmy life and I don't know what
went in this moment I wasthinking.
But there's a giant agave plant, probably about 20 yards away,
(24:28):
10, 20 yards, something likethat.
Well, I pitch it and it landsnowhere near the agave plant,
but a few feet in front of it.
It's red, what am I going to dohere?
And I had the phone.
I turned the phone on.
It needed a passcode.
So then that goes out thewindow.
No telephone.
I'm standing there and then,boom, he's on the balcony and
I'm not even holding my glass atthis point.
(24:50):
So now I'm not feeling greatabout that.
And as I turn around, he'sshocked.
I'm shocked, he's very shocked.
I mean, he's just looking likea fit of, he looks like a madman
.
And he grabs me by the lefthand, he starts pulling me in
and he notices that this camerais not there and he's accusing
(25:10):
me of taking it.
And I'm like what?
Why would I do that?
I don't need your stupid camera.
What do you mean?
And then I had this moment ofplay nice.
Try the play nice.
Maybe this whole thing is justa misunderstanding and he's just
(25:31):
going to open the door andeverything is fine.
Let me just see how nice I canbe.
So I switch my tune a littlebit and I'm like, hey, so last
night we were talking aboutgoing to the beach, and what do
you think about that?
And he's just like er, alls hecan think about is this camera.
He goes and wakes her up.
And now the two of them arejust going through the house to
(25:54):
this camera.
And when I'm going through thehouse, I mean she's looking in
cabinets, they've looked intrash cans, and when she comes
out of the bedroom and she'strying to figure she's groggy
and hungover, like what's goingon?
He's telling her what I did thenight before with my things,
that I threw them out the window, my phone and my passport.
And so obviously I've takenthis camera and I'm doing
(26:16):
everything I can to keep him offthe balcony Because, hello,
you'd have to be in a totallyblind hot to see this camera.
It's literally right there onthe lawn.
So I'm trying to keep him outof there and at one point he
makes that.
He goes into the bedroom, hegrabs his 1,000 keys and now he
is unlocking the three or fourdeadbolts that are holding the
house and he's going to gooutside.
(26:38):
So I decide I'm going to.
He's like mm-mm, he's nothaving it.
So he grabbed me by the throat.
I was with his left hand andjust pushed me back until I
would hit the couch behind meand sit down.
And as soon as I popped down Iwas right back up.
So keeps getting a little bitmore aggressive.
But he goes out the door andthen on the other side, he's
(27:01):
luck luck, locking us back in.
Elani goes to the bathroom.
The bathroom I was brushing myteeth in and I'm like Elani, you
have to help me.
You have to help me get out ofhere.
Like I'm freaking out andtrying to be reasonable, I'm
trying to reason with her andshe's just like you're making it
worse.
Just calm down, everything'sfine, everything's not fine.
(27:24):
Just tell me where your keysare right now.
Help me get out of here.
Like, let's just, I got to go,elani, and now here comes the
keys.
He's back.
So I'm there.
I'm stood standing in thehallway.
He comes down and more arguing,more, everybody together.
It was like watching charadesin a language that I didn't
(27:47):
quite understand, but I knewthat they were talking about me.
At one point he goes back to thebedroom.
She's in the kitchen, she'sgoing through drawers.
It was crazy and I rememberedfrom the night before that she
had cut a loose string from hist-shirt with a small pair of
scissors, bigger than nose,trimming.
Not as big as standard, justprobably a 3-inch blade,
(28:12):
something like that and theywere under the sofa table.
So, while everyone wasdistracted, I went and grabbed
those scissors and I put thembeneath the back of my bra strap
where it clasped.
And when he comes back from thebedroom he's holding my passport
and I'm like, oh great, mypassport.
This is always so confusing,what's going on here?
(28:36):
So I put my passport in theside part of my bra and as he
goes to walk out the door, againI'm right on him.
He grabs me by the throat,pushed me down and I just
decided this is enough, it's youor him, and it's not gonna be
you.
So I grab the scissors, I'mholding them in my hand, but
(28:57):
I've got the blade going up myright forearm and I just had my
arm down by my side and as Ipopped back up and grabbed them
and he turns around.
Now he's grabbing me by thethroat.
I mean, he's like I said, it'sjust getting more, more
aggressive.
And so I took the scissors outand I stabbed him two times,
once in the throat and once inthe face, on the nose, and from
(29:19):
the nose I just dug as hard as Icould into his face and at that
time, the first time I hit him,he's like realizing what is
happening and as he's got me bythe throat, he releases just
enough to try and like hit me ina really short space.
But everything is happeningvery slow motion for me as I'm
(29:41):
watching this scene unfold whereI'm sure for him things were
much different, but luckily Iwas watching that fist.
I mean he just barely missed me.
I mean I think he really wouldhave like probably broken my jaw
, quite honestly, had I not hadthe thankfully the slow, the
slow motion.
He is just bleeding outeverywhere.
I don't know how to describethis, but like there's a soft
(30:01):
spots on your neck, right Ifyou're going around your throat.
They're just soft spots.
There's a reason why there's aparticular way you hurt someone
in the neck area.
I just did like a puncture, agiant puncture wound, basically.
So he is bleeding out.
I mean he is pissed.
I'm back down on the couch nowwatching this whole scene unfold
(30:24):
.
She, elani, is cleaning.
She's got rags, she's cleaningup blood.
She's bandaging him up.
He's looking at me, he's raging.
He goes to the kitchen, hegrabs a nine inch carving knife
and he stands.
He gets right up on me.
He, before he stands me up, heis like wielding it over me,
(30:44):
like psycho.
He's just pretending like he'scoming at me with this giant
knife.
At one point he stands me up andI said to myself I mean, I'm an
only child, my mom is the mostimportant person in my world,
and I felt very sad in thatmoment, thinking that I had done
(31:06):
everything I could do.
And I said to myself well, youdid everything that you could do
and now you're going to die.
And then, with it was likefinish that sentence.
And then this rush of it's theonly thing I can describe as
what people would describe asdivine intervention, something
(31:28):
came into that space.
There was a very felt sense ofsafety, of separation, and in
this moment of me, the nextsecond was no, you're not going
to die.
It's like something came in andtold me that.
And so he sits me back down andhe starts making some phone
(31:52):
calls.
He looks at me and he says thepolice are coming.
And I'm like, oh, anotherinteresting turn of events.
The police is coming.
I don't know what that means.
Here comes a man and a young manyou know roughly our age, in
his 30s, and he was in blueboard shorts and a pink Ralph
Lauren Polo.
(32:12):
And I'm like this doesn't lookgood.
They're probably going to killme somewhere in the middle of
Turkey, nowhere to be found.
I don't know what kind of copthis is.
Once again, the charadesthey're talking, the guys
looking at me and looking backand I'm just like, oh my God.
And then he tells me he's goingto call Karem the IT guy.
Great, okay.
(32:32):
So here comes Karem.
Same thing.
Karem comes down, he sits infront of me and he goes Jennifer
, what did you do?
And I said, listen, you need toget me out of here right now.
He was like this is very bad.
I was like it's very bad.
Very bad is an understatement.
Karem, I need to get the fuckout of here, like now, for real.
(32:53):
And he looks at me and, aswe're talking, sinon is still
walking around and he's stillholding the knife.
He's just walking around withit casually now, like at his
side.
So, as I'm talking to Karem,I'm like I'm the knife and back
to Karem I'm the knife and backto Karem I'm the knife and back
to Karem, I'm the knife, andback to Karem and finally he
gets that message.
He gets up, he takes the knifefrom Sinon, they go off.
(33:16):
He comes back and says, go getyour things.
So I go pack up, I'm in a quicksilver duffel and I'm walking
down and to get down thestaircase is a massive marble
spiral staircase.
I've got the duffel bag on myleft side as we're spiraling
down and he's behind me, karem'sin front of me and I'm thinking
(33:39):
like I'm still bracing, I'mworried that he's going to push
me down this flight of stairs.
And so I've got the duffel bagthere ready and we get into the
car and Karem looks at me and hewas like he's asking about a
camera.
I'm like I don't have a clueabout this camera and in the
meantime I think I'm coming backfor the camera.
So off, karem and I go and hedoesn't take me home at first.
(34:04):
He takes me down to the beach.
It's like 10 am.
I get a coffee, he gets a beer.
Everyone's looking at me.
So strangely I hear I think I'mjust in jeans and a t-shirt.
So we go, sit down and hestarts telling me basically how
bad I messed up, what a sceneI've caused and I'm like Karem,
this man tried to rape me.
Do you know what rape is?
(34:25):
And he's like yeah, I know itis.
I'm like no, you obviously donot know what rape is, so take
me home.
I will be on the first flightback to London.
I'm going home.
He's like you're not going tothe cops.
I'm like hell, no, I'm not.
I'm getting out of this country.
No, I'm not going to the cops,I'm getting on a plane, which,
of course, that wasn't trueeither.
(34:47):
When Karem dropped me off to myapartment, the way that it's set
up there, in this particularspace, was there was a little
bit of a lobby and then I was onthe eighth floor of like 10
floors and there's no way down.
There's one way in and one wayout and there's a buzzing system
, but you don't get to knowwho's down there.
You either buzz and then theperson in the apartment decides
(35:09):
I'm going to let in the strangeror not.
I waited in that hallway,waited for Karem to leave,
because there was no way I wasgoing back up into the place
where they know where I live andI have no way out but down.
So I knew neighbors in theexact floor in the opposite
apartment of me in the nextbuilding.
So I went over and I went totheir apartment and they buzzed
(35:30):
me up, thankfully, when theyopened the door I just wanted to
fall into them but they werelike whoa pushed me back and my
I was wearing a yellow notjersey material, but the color
of a Brazil jersey, so like thebright yellow and green and I
was covered in blood.
That's probably why everyonewas looking at me so strangely
(35:53):
at the beach getting coffee,because I was covered in blood.
Why Karem wasn't worried aboutthat is beyond me.
But I got myself together, Ichanged clothes, put my clothes
in a bag for the police.
I called my dad.
At this moment too, I don't knowwhat Fatash's role is in this
whole situation.
(36:13):
Who are my allies?
I don't really think I have anyin this moment and I only know
these neighbors.
And I know the mayor and hisdaughter, and she's 14.
She spoke English.
She was my next phone call,called my dad and I called her
and took a cab over to themayor's house and when he
arrived home me, him and hisbrother they took me to the
(36:36):
police.
What was that car ride like?
The cab ride from the apartmentto the mayor's was really sad.
It was washed in shame it was,it was hard, it was dark.
(36:57):
You know, I thought what have I?
I think a lot of people willtell you once they've been
through something like this.
It feels shameful because, like,what did I do?
How did I?
It's shameful to feel like Ihad this experience and I just
remember feeling like I leteverybody down.
I just I felt lonely and empty.
(37:21):
So I felt some void.
There was also the, theheightened activation of like I.
I mean I just stabbed somebody,so like I have, I have engaged
in something that's really kindof violent and also I won.
(37:42):
So there's that part of it too.
So it's just like it's solayered, it's so, it's so
overwhelming it is, it's so muchall at one time.
It's just.
I think that's why it feelslike a void, because it's just
too much all at one time andit's just so overwhelming in the
(38:02):
system to feel just one thingin the, in the moment, and then
it just all becomes too much.
It's like how can?
I can't feel anything actually,cause I just just too much.
Speaker 1 (38:14):
Like you said, and I have to imagine also you were
probably wondering about the cabdriver Like is he in?
Speaker 2 (38:21):
on it.
Oh, everyone is at this point,everyone's a suspect.
Like, just get me to the place,but at least I'm in contact
with the young lady, bless herheart, she was 14.
And when she answered the phoneI said, hey, it's Jennifer.
And she was, like you know, soexcited.
Hi, jennifer.
(38:41):
Oh, how are you?
I was like, well, something'shappened.
I need to talk to you.
It's very serious.
Is your mother with you?
I need you to tell her what I'mtelling you.
Do you know what rape is?
And oh, I can hear her littlegasp Now.
I can hear it right now to tellI don't want to tell a 14 year
(39:01):
old that you know.
But she was like, yes, and Isaid, okay, well, I, it was
attempted.
It hasn't been done, but that'swhat we're dealing with and I
need to, I need to come over.
They took me to the police, thepolice department.
I had my bag of clothes andeverything.
I felt like all the CSI, allthe John Walsh, all the Oprah
(39:25):
paid off.
All of it came together in thismoment.
The police chief was justamazing.
I mean, he was such a kind man,he really believed everything I
said and I thought I could getto the apartment that I was held
in because what was?
Only a few minutes from the ITshop.
So me, the police chief and thethe mayor left me with his
(39:50):
brother to watch over me and wewent to the IT shop.
We sat there for a minute, theyall talked, and the police
chief let me know they weregoing to be there in the morning
when Karem opened that shop.
So off we go to find theapartment and I just want to say
, like the chief of police, hewas like a Turkish Tommy Lee
Jones.
I mean he really had like theostrich boots on the belt, like
(40:14):
snap.
I mean he was just fantasticfrom, really from the inside out
.
He really had a good heart.
We drive around.
I'm just like so upset atmyself I can't remember where
this apartment is.
They're like don't worry aboutit, we're going to get Karem,
karem's going to take us to theapartment.
So next off, we got to go to thehospital because you've got to
do all the rape kit stuff.
Even though there was nopenetration of any kind, there
(40:38):
still have to do all of that.
And at this point even thebruises hadn't really only
started to develop, like my skinwas tender, but when they took
pictures.
Nothing was really kind ofhappening yet and there was no
swab to take.
Like I said, no penetration, nomouth stuff or anything.
So but that took, oh my God,took hours.
(40:59):
And now the mayor and hisbrother they own hotel in the
neighboring town and they'regoing to take me there to stay
put me up in a room.
Getting back to who do you trust?
So I get in this room and Istart moving all the furniture
Furniture in front of the.
There was a patio door.
I was on the ground level, so Istarted moving that furniture.
I moved furniture in front ofthe door and now I get to take a
(41:24):
shower, because I couldn't doany of that in all of these
hours waiting for this hospitalstuff.
A whole day has probably gone byat this point and the shower
was totally dry.
There was no soap in there,there was nothing.
I just took a water shower andI was scared to stay in there
for too long also.
So I got out and I wasclutching my phone I'm just like
(41:46):
in and out of sleep and I wokeup to a phone call.
My mom had gotten in touch withthe US Embassy and the US
Embassy was now involved in whatwas going on.
Today I contacted the BritishConsulate because I was in.
I was in Antalya.
There is no US Embassy.
The British Consulate's husbandlives in the town where you're
(42:07):
staying and he's coming to getyou right now.
Get your things.
We don't know who you'reinvolved with, we don't know who
knows that you're at that hotel, but you've got to get out of
there right now.
So okay, and I should say too,the night before, when I was
waiting for the mayor to arrive,I had my flight book back to
London next day 6pm.
So now it's this day.
I'm flying out in the eveningbecause I've done all the things
(42:28):
, and so the consulate's husbandcomes to pick me up.
Lovely man, I don't think I'dever.
What a dream to have a Scottishperson pick you up in the
middle of all of this.
So we're riding, we're in thevan, and then I get this phone
call from the chief of police.
He's like puts the man on thephone.
(42:50):
He knows Turkish, so they starttalking.
The man's like they found thehouse, they're there, and he
wants you to go there.
The people who took you aregone, but they're at the house
and now you need to go there.
So he intercepts me, the policechief.
We go there, I put the bootieson and we start walking around.
I really got a different viewof where I was because, like I
(43:13):
said, in my bedroom there weretwo twin beds.
They were both children'scomforters.
One looked like a little spaceguy for little boys, something
like Nickelodeon or something,and then mine was a really
flowery young girls.
Speaker 1 (43:29):
So obviously it was set up for children.
Speaker 2 (43:32):
Yeah, it looked totally different.
And then in one of the roomsthat I had not had access to,
there were bunk beds.
I start doing basically theinterpretive dance of what has
happened than I before.
There's my toothbrush, there'smy snot, there's my mucus,
there's my tears, there's hisblood, because there was like a
couple of little blood spots.
(43:52):
Thankfully that she didn'tclean up.
They each smoked a cigaretteand left it in the ashtray, so
they'd thankfully left their ownDNA there for us.
We go all through the house.
The police chief is there.
He just, he hugged me.
I mean, he was just sowonderful, honestly, his whole
team was fantastic.
And then they take me now to theconsulates.
(44:14):
We all go there, the chief, thehusband and me, and this lovely
lady that took such great careof me.
She gave me money, she bookedmy flight, she, she did so much
for me, and then in the end theywanted me to go back to the
hospital, so she went with me.
They wanted to draw my bloodfor some reason.
After, you know, still, like Isaid, there was, there was
(44:35):
nothing there.
But on the way to the airportthe chief took me to the airport
, him and his detective, andhe'd had a picture of scene on
at this point because he'd hadthe picture from where they
rented the apartment, hispassport ID and I said, yeah,
that's him.
Except for now he's going tohave a big ass scar all the way
across the space.
That ain't going anywhere, ever, ever.
(44:57):
And yeah, I got a so off I goabout almost nine months to the
day.
On May 5th 2010, I testifiedThey'd caught him at some point
and the chief told me let meknow that they were going to
lock down, like his.
The border people would knowthat he was not to leave the
(45:19):
country.
And now Alani, I have no ideawhat happened to her.
Hopefully she's safe.
Speaker 1 (45:25):
Was there talk between the police chief or
anybody else that these peoplewere involved in trafficking?
Speaker 2 (45:34):
There wasn't that known at the time.
There was only the suspicion ofthat, but it wasn't confirmed
at the time that I was in frontof the police and when I
testified the following Maythere was.
When I finished, the lady waslike you know, great job, we're
never going to know what comesof this.
And I was like really she waslike our relations with Turkey
(45:57):
aren't that close, like we'renot going to know in detail how
we can follow this.
So I really don't know.
I don't know what the outcomewas of this whole thing.
Speaker 1 (46:08):
Wow, I'm assuming you testified virtually.
Speaker 2 (46:11):
I'm from Virginia and Norfolk Virginia is a huge
naval air force, like all thegovernment we have so much
government in my town.
So I just went down to one ofthe federal departments in
Norfolk and live court reporterand me and the attorney.
I didn't see him in that moment, it was just us in a conference
(46:33):
room.
Basically, it was very I wish Iwould have been able to see him
again.
I don't know why.
Maybe the scar, maybe just tosee, I mean his image is really
burned in my mind.
Honestly, especially when Ithink, you know, when you replay
the scenes in your mind andit's like certain certain clips
(46:54):
of the movie, is the face yousee.
And for me, one of the faces Isee for him is that first time
that we crossed paths in the ITshop.
I guess that's part of the shametoo that comes with these kind
of things.
Why, why didn't I feel thedanger the second time?
You know, I saw it the firsttime, I felt it the first time,
(47:15):
but not the second time.
But I think that I don't know.
I think in saying that I alsohave, I think, this perspective
or maybe this just likeunderstanding now that being
there in this experience it wasjust part of my story.
It was just something that Iwas supposed to live through,
maybe to talk about, to bringawareness to like.
(47:37):
So I left Turkey.
With bruises, I experienced avine intervention that put me on
a whole new spiritual path, onethat I did not have before.
I mean, that was really a greatblessing to experience that.
So you know and you remember, Iwas saying too like I was going
to break this glass and shoveit into his throat, like I
probably would have killed him,and thankfully I didn't also
(48:01):
have to experience that, even inmy own defense.
Speaker 1 (48:06):
Had you ever thought about what you would say to him?
Speaker 2 (48:10):
I think I would have more questions than what I would
want to say.
I just would want to talk.
I think it'd just be morecuriosity.
Why are we even on this path,dude?
Like I don't know?
It's so layered, I think too,because it does bring in a
spiritual aspect.
Speaker 1 (48:32):
Absolutely.
And I also want to say, goingback to the first time you saw
him, you were like, ah,something's not right.
And then the second time youmet him, you were like, wow, he
was really nice.
We want to think the best ofpeople, yeah.
Speaker 2 (48:49):
I always want to believe that people are good.
And I mean my radars go off andsometimes I'll just look at
someone and I'm like that's nota good person and I'll walk away
.
But like sending that with loveto you, like I can feel
something's off here, you're nota safe body, but my alarm goes
off and I'm just going to walkaway.
(49:10):
It's not going to hopefully betoo big of a deal in my body,
you know.
Speaker 1 (49:15):
Getting back to those violations, Divine intervention
, your journey and faith and allof those things.
Let's delve into that a littlebit.
Speaker 2 (49:27):
Sure, yeah, I love this part of the experience.
I wasn't anyone who grew upwith religion or didn't really
understand Jesus or just any ofit any of it and so this is the
experience that really opened meup to wanting to understand
more about the something greaterthat really connects us.
(49:49):
And I have a.
One of my mom's friends alwaystells me always, even when I was
a little girl she's always tellme you have angels.
And in that moment it was itreally felt like I, maybe I do
have angels.
Like what is this?
How can I explore this?
And so I learned to meditate, Istarted to pray never prayed
(50:12):
before and I started to just getcurious about what else is
there.
And then I got diagnosed withbreast cancer five years later,
after I got back from Turkey.
And this is the time in thistreatment where my faith really
(50:33):
plays a major role, because Ididn't have much else to do but
sit around and pray Honestlywhen I was going through
treatment.
So it really was the time thatmy meditation practice really
got grounded in and really gotsolid.
Because the truth is, after Igot back from Turkey, those five
(50:53):
years to to breast cancer, theywere really stressful.
I was really scared in my bodyI still had.
I'm someone who if my fightflight gets activated it's
likely leaning towards a fightresponse.
I have a real pricklysensations.
That happened in my body and soI can recognize that now I
(51:14):
would be in public.
I remember being at Coles afterI'd returned and I wanted a gun.
I was like I was.
I was really dysregulated, veryscared.
In these years I had thatdivine intervention.
It was curious and I would gosee different healers but I
wasn't in a place to really likeabsorb it.
I was still kind ofself-medicating and not in that
(51:36):
grade of a place.
But when breast cancer comes Ireally leaned in on that divine
intervention and got to knowfaith like that belief, that
trust, and it's been a reallyjuicy experience.
Ever since then.
I've never that connection'snever broke for me.
Speaker 1 (51:54):
Interesting question for those who are going down
path of faith or have doubtsbecause their thought is I don't
think God hears me.
What would you say to them?
Speaker 2 (52:07):
You are God.
We're all made in the visionsof God or the cloth of God, and
we're all these iterations.
We have to find the divinitywithin ourselves, find it in
other people, and I waslistening to something too.
There was I'm not a Christianby definition.
(52:28):
I really love Jesus, but Iwouldn't consider myself like
the traditional type ofChristian.
But I was reading somethingrecently that said that so many
young people nowadays justaren't into Jesus and they don't
even care about Christianityand it's like Jesus is cool.
I mean, that's a really coolguy, what he did, what he does,
(52:49):
what he stands for, his stories,and that this is the teacher of
our times.
Right, it was the Buddha, andother times or maybe the.
You know, there's been manyspiritual teachers in our times
and I think people are reallymissing out because the religion
(53:11):
side is maybe too boxed in forpeople to get to an
understanding of what a greatteacher this person is.
Speaker 1 (53:24):
For you.
What is the greatest lesson youhave taken away from Jesus Love
?
Speaker 2 (53:33):
Love, because we're all made in the image of God.
That's what it is.
We're all made in the likenessand in the image of God and if
that is true, if we, I come froma belief that thinks we are all
iterations of the divineexpressing itself.
So I'm got you, you are divine,we're all divine, and I don't
(53:56):
think of God as this old man inthe sky that is waiting to judge
me on some day.
I really look at it as I'm partof something really big in this
experience and we're allconnected.
We are all connected in this.
(54:17):
It's like one great big nervoussystem that we're in here, the
galaxy, the stars, the cosmos,and as we walk paths of faith,
there's so many differentconsciousness that we can
connect to, that we can learnfrom.
There's been so many incredibleteachers, mother Mary, there's
been so many incredible teacherthat I don't think all the time
(54:37):
gets her right of what's reallydue for that incredible woman.
But you know, there's a lot ofteachers and there's a lot of
women that have been left out inspiritual spaces, back to
Mother Mary or Mary Magdalene,and I think whatever calls to
you, just try it out.
It doesn't have to be rigid, itcan be really loose.
(55:00):
There's so many spiritualmasters and teachers today for
us to learn from.
Speaker 1 (55:07):
And I think being called is really about being
open, because people get calledin different ways.
It isn't, you know God, justcome and knock it on your door
saying, hey, this is what youknow, here's your purpose, this
is what I want you to do.
It doesn't work that way.
So it's really about being opento the possibility and to
reference kind of what you saidabout religion, not boxing
(55:30):
yourself in.
Speaker 2 (55:31):
Yeah, and we're capable of so much like our
human bodies are just theseincredible intelligent designs
that are all divine wisdom andancient knowledge.
And look at your DNA, look atyour genealogy Like we're.
It's incredible what we are.
If you want to believe, well,if you just give it a chance,
(55:55):
find something.
I always tell people whenthey're going through a
diagnosis like whatever youbelieve in, just start believing
in it hard.
And getting back to what youasked me about Jesus and the,
what did I learn the most?
I?
One of the things, too, I thinkabout is that there is a Christ
consciousness that lives withinus.
I think, as a teacher, he wasshowing us what's possible in
(56:21):
all of our lives.
I don't think Jesus would haveput himself on a pedestal and
seen himself in all of the homesthe way that he is displayed
now.
I think it would be.
You know, I think he's a guide.
He's trying to teach us what weall can do.
If we are all made in the sameimage, right, we're all special.
(56:41):
We all have those powers likehealing ourselves and helping
other people heal, and that thatthat lives in us.
Speaker 1 (56:50):
Yeah, I kind of call that the super conscious and
it's almost like our moralcompass in a way of you kind of
understand the differencebetween what's right and what's
wrong.
You have respect for human life, because when you love others,
you respect their life.
You don't go out andintentionally hurt them or
commit crimes, things like that.
(57:11):
The fact that you know you'resharing this message and we're
having conversation about it isso important because I think
it's getting lost in therhetoric and we can, by talking
about it and creating thatawareness in your passion, like,
obviously, when you talk aboutJesus and you love Jesus, like
it comes through and it makes meI believe in Jesus, but if I
(57:35):
didn't, it would make me curious.
Like, well, who is this Jesusguy?
Like these Jennifer's there alltalking about Jesus?
Speaker 2 (57:44):
Yes, people are missing out.
He's a cool guy, I love it.
Speaker 1 (57:52):
He really is, you know.
The last thing I want to talkabout is choices.
We have choices.
You and I kind of talked aboutthis.
You had lots of choices to makeduring your whole incident of
am I going to choose to live orchoose to die?
Am I going to fight, am I notgoing to fight?
(58:13):
And then even later in life,with your breast cancer?
We make choices every day.
We don't give enough credit tohow important choices really are
.
So let's talk about that for aminute.
Speaker 2 (58:25):
Okay, yeah, I love it .
Choices there's this idea ofthe present moment, right, that
we, when we're present,everything is possible, anything
is possible in the presentmoment and I think that's made
possible by the choices that areavailable in the present moment
and that when we're here, whenwe're embodied, when we're
(58:49):
attuned to the people with us,to the experiences, to the life
that's happening, we can makechoices that, like you said, it
could go either way.
Does this choice reflect thehigher life of consciousness
that I'm going towards?
Or is this going to diminish mysystem in some way?
(59:12):
Like, what am I doing here?
And when we have those, I think,higher states of consciousness,
those frontal front brainactivations and you, it's almost
like, well, it's massiveself-abandonment to go the other
way.
Right, the choice of the lifethat we always want.
It is in front of us andsometimes it's hard to make
(59:34):
those choices.
But staying present, stayinggrounded, and it can be fun,
right, it can be fun, even afterwe've been through these big
experiences, like you and I havebeen through and like some of
our listeners have been through,like life can be really fun and
joyful and pleasurable, andthat's a choice, and sometimes
(59:55):
that is a daily recommitment,every day when I wake up.
Thank you, thank you for yourattitude and what's on the day.
Speaker 1 (01:00:05):
I love what you shared.
Thank you so much.
Speaker 2 (01:00:07):
There's a song I listened to by Tony Jones, and
she says something along thelines of my heart is beating for
me every second of the day, andthat's abundance.
My breath, I breathecountlessly throughout the day,
and that's abundance.
Speaker 1 (01:00:26):
That's amazing.
Those are things we take forgranted.
Speaker 2 (01:00:29):
I know this beautiful body that we have right.
Speaker 1 (01:00:32):
Absolutely.
We just assume they're going tobe there, right?
You have taken your experienceand used it to help others by
creating this podcast.
Can you tell us about that andhow the listeners can find your
podcast?
Speaker 2 (01:00:50):
Yes, trauma Rewired I co-host that with Elizabeth
Kristof.
She's the founder ofBrain-Based Wellness and the
Neurosematic IntelligenceCoaching, certification and
Trauma Rewired is really a lovestory.
It's a dedication to thenervous system and it's really
educational.
It's a podcast rooted inscience, but in that science we
also share our lived experiencesand we really, in season two,
(01:01:14):
we talk about the nervous systemsort of as an individual and
like what is trauma?
How does it live in the body?
What does it mean to have afight trauma response?
That, like I said, is my go-to.
Or what does flight feel like?
What can that look like?
What is freeze and fawn?
And what is perfectionism as atrauma response?
Or what is dissociation Right?
(01:01:36):
So we break down each thingindividually and now we've just
launched season three, wherewe're looking at the brain as a
social organ and how we aredeveloped within the
neurobiology of relationshipsand the neuroscience of
relationships, the way that weconnect, the way our attachments
are formed from an early age,and it still goes through the
lens of complex trauma, but it'smore of a, like I said, the
(01:02:00):
nervous system as a whole, associety, culture, our
relationships, to all of it.
Speaker 1 (01:02:07):
So if somebody is listening, they're like, how do
I know what my nervous system isdoing?
Like what is the first step youwould recommend them to do?
Speaker 2 (01:02:16):
I would recommend you listen to the podcast, honestly
available, where all podcastsplay Like.
It's a really easily laid outfor y'all to learn, like with
the foundation of your nervoussystem.
And then if you're interestedin the tools that we use and the
tools that we talk about, thengo to rewiretrialcom.
We offer two free weeks on siteof nervous system training,
where we're there live teachingfour times a week and we love to
(01:02:38):
be in community and answer yourquestions.
Speaker 1 (01:02:41):
That's great.
That's awesome.
That is a fabulous resource forlisteners to.
Number one, be able to listento your podcast, but number two,
to have that community.
I love communities, so much Ireally crave it, yes, and lots
of people know that they're notalone, and that's so important.
Speaker 2 (01:03:00):
Yeah, definitely it really is.
It really is.
And back to the shared storyit's important for us to share
our stories.
Speaker 1 (01:03:07):
Mm-hmm, there is healing and sharing.
Speaker 2 (01:03:10):
Yes, and there's healing in community, and I
don't think healing is donealone.
You know, sometimes peoplethink they might be stuck where
they are, and you and I weretalking a little bit before we
hit record about the change.
That's always possible.
Change is always possible andwherever you're experiencing
(01:03:33):
right now, it does not have tostay like this.
You have an operating systemthat's your nervous system, and
that operating system istrainable and it's changeable,
and so I just don't ever wantpeople to think like it's just
like this.
I'm just wired this way andthis is just how it is and how
it will always be.
But we always have choice,thank you and I were talking
(01:03:56):
about.
We always have a choice andthere's so much opportunity for
that change in your nervoussystem.
Speaker 1 (01:04:04):
Absolutely, Jennifer.
Thank you for being my guest onthe I Need Blue podcast.
Thank you so much, jennifer.
Speaker 2 (01:04:10):
I just loved it so much.
Thank you, you're welcome.
Speaker 1 (01:04:13):
We'll have to do this again.
I thoroughly enjoyed it as well, and I think you bring a lot
more information to my listenersthat I think we can delve into.
If you are interested in doingthat, I am totally open to being
back here again with you.
Speaker 2 (01:04:28):
This is Jen.
Speaker 1 (01:04:29):
Lee with the I Need Blue podcast.
Thank you for listening today.
You can find all of my episodesand everything you ever needed
to know about the I Need Bluepodcast on my website,
wwwinadbluenet.
And remember you are strongerthan you think.
Remember you are stronger than you think.
Don't believe me, we're aboutto prove it.
Welcome back.
This is Jen Lee, creator andhost of I Need Blue podcast.
(00:22):
True Crime to True Life.
As a survivor of arm droperyand abduction, I understand the
trauma and triggers survivorsexperience Knowing this and
through my powerful podcast, Ioffer survivors a safe place to
share their lived experiences.
(00:42):
Survivors need blue to feelthey belong, they are loved,
understood and my favoriteempowered.
Please note I Need Blue doescontain sensitive topics which
could be triggering.
Please seek help if needed andremember you always come first.
I Need Blue episodes can befound on Apple Podcasts, spotify
(01:07):
and many listening platforms,including my website,
wwwineedbluenet.
There you will find all theepisodes, valuable resources,
safety tips, my newly releasedbook and e-book why I Survived
by Jennifer Lee, and if yourpassion is to learn to podcast,
(01:31):
you will find a learn to podcastPDF available as well.
I would like to thank Shar Good, the talented violinist who
composed and performed thisopening music.
You can find information aboutShar Good on my website.
As always, thank you forlistening.
Let's begin today's episode.
(01:53):
Strong, resilient, resourcefuland determined, saved my guest's
life literally.
Jennifer traveled to Turkey on awork assignment.
She was well-traveled,understood different countries'
(02:15):
cultural expectations and knewenough of their language to get
by.
She was excited about this newadventure.
It started with her living withher boss's female cousin.
All was fine until hell brokeloose one day and she needed to
find new accommodations.
(02:36):
As Jennifer shared details ofwhat followed, I found myself
holding my breath, trying toimagine the scene she was
describing, yet not wanting toimagine it.
Several times she escapedsexual assault, which could have
led to her being trafficked.
Jennifer will share her storywith us today.
(03:00):
It will have you on the edge ofyour seats.
We will discuss how she thrivesand helps others.
Now she has a podcast TraumaRewired Neurology and Somatic
Healing with Jennifer Wallaceand Elizabeth Kristoff.
The podcast teaches you aboutyour nervous system, how trauma
(03:25):
gets stored in the body and whatyou can do to heal.
Only can be found on manypodcast listening forums,
including Apple Podcast.
Jennifer, thank you for beingmy guest today and welcome to
the I Need Blue podcast.
Speaker 2 (03:45):
Thank you so much, Jennifer.
I'm so happy to be here withyou and to connect with you and
your listeners.
It's a really pleasure.
Speaker 1 (03:53):
Thank you.
I am so thrilled to have youhere as well.
We've had some awesomeconversations and getting to
know each other.
Like I had stated in myintroduction is, when you
started to tell me little piecesof your story, I was in awe.
I'm so glad that, number oneyou are here and you are safe.
(04:13):
You're in a spot where you canshare your story.
But not only that you've founda way to help others as well.
Speaker 2 (04:23):
I really feel like that second piece really feels
purposeful, to be able to sharethe story, and share it from a
place of groundedness andregulation, whereas telling it
isn't going to dysregulate meany further or send me into
something protective like abinge eating episode or
(04:43):
something to find the safetyback again in my nervous system
after sharing such a big story.
It's just so relevant.
Speaker 1 (04:51):
Absolutely.
It's situational awareness.
In today's world, especiallyfor women, whether you're
traveling abroad or even ifyou're just going for a walk in
your neighborhood, it's soimportant to be aware and to
know the signs and to protectyourself.
Speaker 2 (05:08):
Yes, absolutely.
Thank you so much for yourintroduction.
We share an experience that'skind of like same church,
different pew.
We're in a small population,what feels like a small
population, although hundreds ofthousands people worldwide are
affected by violent crimes, sextrafficking, violent sexual
(05:31):
assaults and all of it.
Like you said, women in thisday, you just can't be aware
enough of your surroundings.
Speaker 1 (05:40):
Absolutely.
While you bring that up beforewe start sharing your story,
this happens way more than wethink.
Doing your podcast has thatkind of opened your eyes up to
that reality.
Speaker 2 (05:52):
Yes, I think it has.
I think what it really does,too, is women knowing this story
and knowing that I'm prettyopen about really any of the
body boundary violations I'veexperienced in life, I think, as
someone who's a guide in thehealing arts, I want women to
feel really safe with me, andsharing these stories I feel
(06:15):
like is really foundational forthe work that we can do together
, because they know that I'vebeen through it I'm on the other
side of it too Well thank youfor all of that.
Speaker 1 (06:26):
And you said body boundaries.
I've never heard that before.
I made a little note of it.
Speaker 2 (06:32):
Yeah, we talk about body boundary violations a lot
From our perspective.
When we think about bodyboundary violations, we think of
that on a spectrum and on thelow end of the spectrum might be
someone just looking at my body, objectifying my body or maybe
even talking about my body.
We live in a culture, once again, women have been subjected to a
(06:54):
lot of people talking about ourbodies.
Even that can trigger anemotional flashback in my body
of a thread.
If that thread gets pulled of,that body boundary violation
where I feel like the man infront of me has that like a
predatory energy to him, he'sgoing to spin me out.
I mean, he's just going tototally spin me out inside
(07:15):
because that objectification ofme is going to trigger a body
boundary violation, maybe likethe story I'm about to tell in
Turkey, or maybe another timewhere I was sexually assaulted,
you know, even like in my earlychildhood experience, right?
So there's all these livedexperiences from my early
childhood to well, body boundaryviolation can happen basically
(07:40):
anytime you walk out of thehouse.
We always have that opportunity.
But it's about how can I managethat activation from a place of
higher consciousness now sothat that activation doesn't
then totally spin me out andspiral me.
Speaker 1 (07:57):
That is fascinating.
You are teaching me somethingand you have put into words
something that I have beentrying to figure out for a long
time.
I could have another wholeepisode and we could talk about
that.
I'm sure.
Awesome, I love it, thank you.
Thank you so much for that, forsaying those words.
Speaker 2 (08:18):
Yeah, yeah, you're welcome.
Speaker 1 (08:19):
All right, Now let's move on to your story and Turkey
.
Speaker 2 (08:26):
Okay, so I was 32 years old and I was living in
London for four years.
I had gone there for a finearts degree and I had graduated
and about two months later wentto Turkey.
I was going to Turkey by way ofan opportunity.
I thought I was about to livemy dream life.
(08:48):
I deeply believe in education,especially for young girls in
third world countries anddeveloping countries, and I also
believe in water.
So I thought I was joiningforces with a foundation that
was going to support these twothings and then I also would be
able to support my travelinghabit and my art, my art career
and all of it.
So I really thought I wasaccepting my dream job and I
(09:11):
went to Antalya, turkey.
It's a beautiful place right onthe Mediterranean.
It's gorgeous, the food isincredible and it's kind of a
hotspot tourist destination.
It was like 92 degrees everyday.
I loved it.
I loved it.
I loved the Mediterranean.
I mean, I just love the water.
My boss you mentioned I wasliving with his cousin and there
(09:32):
was a language barrier becauseI don't speak much Turkish.
She doesn't speak much Englishand she had introduced me to a
man who ran an IT shop man namedKarem.
He was about my age and soabout maybe four times, five
times something like that on mywalk back and forth to the beach
(09:53):
from my apartment, I would stopin sometimes and speak to him
because, quite honestly, it'sjust really nice to speak
English with somebody who's yourage, who seems to be interested
about like Hollywood or BritneySpears or I don't even know.
You know, it's just like sorandom stuff to talk about.
It felt pretty comfortable.
I thought.
I thought I was gaining afriend and an ally in this
(10:15):
person.
So one day I'm sitting in theapartment there's no windows and
not even in front of me,there's no visible entry into
the apartment and Fatash, myboss's cousin, comes in and she
sees me sitting in a bathingsuit, in a bikini.
I just come off the beach, Iwas putting on his mafter sun
(10:38):
and she flipped I mean she justcompletely flipped when she saw
me sitting there in a bikini.
Just, she just went off on meand she was treating me
incredibly poorly and speakingme I mean, like I said, very
broken language, but speaking tome very like calling me a slut.
She was going there, she wasgoing to places that were
(10:58):
completely disproportionate towhat was going on, like I'm
sitting on the couch applyingafter sun lotion.
So I didn't hold back any ofthe things back either.
I wasn't doing anything.
So I got defensive, it gotheated and I went to my room.
I packed a bag, I got onlineand I started looking at
different Airbnb's and differentplaces I could stay.
I was in a resort town, sothere's got to be nice places.
(11:21):
I left my bag, I took my listup to the IT shop and I said,
hey, this is what's gone down.
I need a break.
My boss is out of town.
I just I can't.
I need a nice space to be safeand relax.
And so he made a couple phonecalls.
I mean, he looked at my list.
He was like no, no, okay, okay,no, I call these couple places.
(11:44):
So he made a phone call, got mea reservation, so off we go.
As we leave his IT shop, the manwho was coming through.
This was interesting because myalarm bells did slightly go off
at the energy of this man.
He just had Bdis, he was alittle bit shorter, he just had
(12:06):
an energy to him that wasn'tvery kind, and so I didn't say
anything, I didn't do anything,I just kept walking.
We get in the car.
We go up and Krim says, oh, youknow what, I forgot something.
He circles back, he goes insideand, in retrospect, I think
this is the moment where thesetwo get in cahoots with each
(12:26):
other, because I don't know this, but Krim is about to Deliver
me to this man's house, like I'mgoing to the scary BDI guys
house.
So Krim gets back in the carand he says hey, you know what?
I have this girlfriend, thisRussian girl named Elani.
She's about your age, shespeaks great English and her
brother is out of town.
He's gonna be out of town forthe weekend.
It's perfect, because you canjust stay there for that time
(12:48):
and you can't stay beyond thattime because he's coming back.
Perfect.
He totally sold me, literallyon this experience, great.
So off we go to Elani's houseand, like he said, she was very
welcoming and the house lookedpretty normal Instruments,
artwork, you know.
It looked like a lived space.
We sit, we all talk, and thensome time passes by and the man
(13:13):
from the IT shop at the doorcomes through and a very
different energy this time.
He's happy, he's very kind.
I think in that moment I justneglected what I had met in the
shop and just put it off to.
You know what?
I'm in a culture.
I'm in a different experience.
I'm not the Equal.
(13:34):
I'm just gonna kind of like letthat go.
And at some point Karem Left togo close the shop and then was
gonna come back.
He comes back, he's got a caseof beer with him and I've never
been a beer drinker.
So as everybody starts to kindof party a little bit, that's
not really me.
I did take a few hits off of aspliff that was going around.
So I think, once again,retrospect, they're trying to
(13:57):
kind of get me a little bit outof my consciousness.
What is that?
It's cannabis mixed withtobacco, gotcha.
But they don't know that Ialready have a fine history with
cannabis and that that wasn'treally doing anything for me or
to me.
So, in their probably attempt toget me a little sideways, I was
(14:21):
, I was fine, totally so Karemleaves and as he's leaving, I'm
like, oh, you know what, it'sgetting late, I'd really like to
go to bed as well.
So I go, I brush my teeth,leave my toothbrush into the
little thing, and they're likeno, no, please stay up with us.
We really want to get to knowyou.
Please have one drink with usand I was like, alright, I'll
(14:43):
stay up just for a little bitlonger with y'all, so that time
comes and goes and I go to bedthere's two twin beds in my room
and as I'm sat there, the doorOpens and when I look over, it's
seen on and he's in his tidywhiteies.
That's it.
(15:03):
And I said to myself, literallysaid to yourself brace yourself
, because he's coming for you.
And he did, and so fight wasdefinitely it.
We carried on for Maybe fiveminutes, I guess, of just full
on.
He's going.
I mean he couldn't hold myhands, my arms, my legs open.
(15:27):
Stop me from screaming.
I mean, we were really all overthe place.
They remind me of like thedusty guy and Charlie Brown, you
know, it's like it just likescuffle everywhere and what were
you?
wearing.
I was wearing some black plazopants with a cotton waistband, a
really thick cotton waistbandlike five or six inches, and
(15:49):
they were just giant.
And I was wearing a cap sleevet-shirt with sleeves down to my
elbows, and so those plazo pantsaren't very hard to get down.
They're the easiest pants toget down.
He was, I mean, he was goingthere very easily.
I just continued to fight andscream and at some point I Don't
(16:09):
know why, he just stopped.
He just stopped and he left theroom and I was like, oh my god,
and now comes the flight.
How am I kidding out of here?
First of all, I changed clothes.
I put jeans on Because I feltlike that was just a more Secure
(16:29):
yeah, technically smart move.
I changed my jeans.
I put on another t-shirt on topof the one that I was already
wearing, just once again, Ithink just to have more barrier.
There's two windows In the room.
When you open the door, there'sone in front of you, and at the
bed that I was on there's onein front of that.
(16:50):
So I grabbed my passport, mytelephone, and I'm Looking out
the windows like how am I?
I'm only on the second floor, Ido know that, so that doesn't
seem too very far down, I don'tknow, but there's Nothing there
to catch me and I'm not twostories up, I'm more like five
stories up, because it justdrops down.
I Think, okay, well, you're notgetting out of one of these
(17:14):
windows, but when you get out ofthe house you'll have your
thing.
So I dropped my passport,dropped my telephone and to this
day of everything I know of theretrospect and the reflection I
can look at, this is the onepart that I cannot Figure out.
I dropped my things.
I've changed my clothes.
Now I'm just like, okay, allright, I'm like taking it all in
(17:34):
here.
He comes busting through thedoor with my passport and my
telephone and he's pissed.
He's screaming at me somethingin Turkish I can't understand
and he just basically starts topunch me.
We go back down onto the bedand this time the fighting was
way more intense.
I mean, the energy behind his,his aggression, was much
(17:59):
different.
And I'm also this time I'mscreaming for her.
I'm screaming her name, likeplease come here and help me.
And at some point she does openthe door.
She opens the door, she looksat us, we make eye contact and
she shuts the door and in thatmoment I know like You're alone,
she's in on this like this is.
This is now.
(18:20):
This is like continuing toescalate in the gravity of sort
of what I'm involved in in thismoment.
There was a moment during thesecond attack where he gets my
jeans a little bit down and Iremember listening to an Oprah
episode one time where there wasthis elderly black lady who had
(18:42):
had her home broken into in themiddle of the night and she
found herself Awakened by theattacker on top of her and she
grabbed him by the genitals sohard that he begged her to call
the police.
And I thought about that lady,thought about that.
I thought I'm gonna try thatbecause he's just wearing tidy
whiteies, I Think before Iapplied the correct amount of
(19:03):
pressure he was already sort ofonto what I was doing because he
was just oh man, he was mad andhe got me pretty hard at one
point and I remember thinking tomyself like he's much stronger
than you are.
How long can this Go on?
I mean he's a little bitshorter than me, a couple inches
, but he's bigger than me is sothat's sausage fingers.
(19:24):
I mean he's got big hands.
In that moment of feeling likethere's a little bit of defeat
starting to happen.
He slid my underwear over justenough for me to feel Either his
finger, his penis, something onme, and that was like all the
(19:45):
fire I needed and it was justlike no, I just continued.
I just really fought back thenand once again and I mean we're
probably talking about sevenminutes I would think of this
attack and once again he justStopped.
He just stopped.
He gets up, he leaves the room,start to compose myself again
(20:07):
what the fuck am I gonna do?
And I Send quorum the IT guy atext that said help me in all
caps flip phone.
So as soon as I send themessage, send it goes
doodly-doodly-doop, does alittle message, a little music,
to let me know that I've sentthe text.
Well, he hears that whereverhe's at in all way.
(20:30):
And here he comes.
And he just grabbed me by thewrist.
I was still holding my phonewhen he walked through the door.
So he's trying to pull me outof the room and I'm trying to
stay in the room and we are likereally fighting each other and
he's telling me he wants me togo into the master bedroom and
sleep with them.
(20:51):
She's in the bed in the middleof this king size bed, totally
passed out, or what I think haspassed out.
He finally gets me out of thehallway, shoves me into this
room, walks me to the far end ofthe bed and puts me down and
then he's just like goes off.
So I'm sitting there and I'mjust like I start to lay down on
(21:14):
my side and I'm trying to watchhim over my shoulder just to
keep an eye on him, because it'sso I don't know what's
happening.
It's pretty erratic andobviously not safe.
So I lay there and I just likecried on the bed skirt, leaving
some mucus, leaving some tears,leaving my DNA.
(21:35):
And he's in and out of the roomand he's carrying around this
key.
There's like set of round keysthat looks like something of a
junkyard, you know, like all thekeys, it's like a thousand keys
.
He's got that and he puts it onan ironing board, under a pile
of clothes on the ironing board.
So I'm just like, ok, well,that's not an option, but her
cell phone is right here on thebedstand next to me.
(21:57):
So I take it, I power it offand I put it in between the
mattress and the bed skirt and Ijust laid there waiting for him
to fall asleep, and laid therefor hours thinking about do I
try and go off this patio door?
Like, should I try and sneakout of this room?
Like we're talking about likefive hours of just like
(22:20):
contemplation.
And at some point I've beenmonitoring the pace of his
snores for a while and I'm like,ok, I'm going to try to get out
of here, I'm going to try toget out of this room first.
So I so slowly begin to get upand I'm looking for weapons
everywhere, because if I startto wake him up, I've got to find
something.
Just grab anything, right?
(22:41):
I start to slowly creep out ofthe room and the door was open
slightly.
I had to open it just a littlebit and I've got one eye on him.
I slink out of the door and I'mlike, oh my god.
Now I'm in the apartment.
First thing I do is go grab aglass, because I thought that's
(23:01):
a weapon.
I'm going to break this, I'mgoing to shove it into his
throat.
That's going to be what's goingto happen here.
So I grabbed my glass and nowI'm like walking around the
apartment.
There's a little camera fromthe night before where we'd all
taken a picture of the three ofus and I'm sure that was you
know.
Look at this girl that I've got.
Now I go out onto the balconyand I'm like, ok, I'm going to
(23:24):
have to jump down this balcony,I'm going to have to lower
myself, I've got to figure thisout and it's marble or something
down there.
So, once again, not a softlanding, and I've never jumped
off of a balcony.
Like all this stuff is goingthrough my mind.
And because, back to Oprah,oprah was my babysitter in the
80s and I know from John Walshwe don't go to the second
(23:45):
location.
I have to get out of here now,because if this goes any further
, I don't know what's happeningand the movie Taken had just
been released.
Like all this stuff is, youknow, it's just so much, so much
.
So I go out on the balcony, I'mdoing the survey.
I remember the camera and thepicture.
(24:05):
I got to get that cameraBecause then when I go to the
police I need photos of, like,who are these two people?
So I go in, I grab the camera.
It's bright, red, little pointand shoot thing.
So I can't throw ever a day inmy life and I don't know what
went in this moment I wasthinking.
But there's a giant agave plant, probably about 20 yards away,
(24:28):
10, 20 yards, something likethat.
Well, I pitch it and it landsnowhere near the agave plant,
but a few feet in front of it.
It's red, what am I going to dohere?
And I had the phone.
I turned the phone on.
It needed a passcode.
So then that goes out thewindow.
No telephone.
I'm standing there and then,boom, he's on the balcony and
I'm not even holding my glass atthis point.
(24:50):
So now I'm not feeling greatabout that.
And as I turn around, he'sshocked.
I'm shocked, he's very shocked.
I mean, he's just looking likea fit of, he looks like a madman
.
And he grabs me by the lefthand, he starts pulling me in
and he notices that this camerais not there and he's accusing
(25:10):
me of taking it.
And I'm like what?
Why would I do that?
I don't need your stupid camera.
What do you mean?
And then I had this moment ofplay nice.
Try the play nice.
Maybe this whole thing is justa misunderstanding and he's just
(25:31):
going to open the door andeverything is fine.
Let me just see how nice I canbe.
So I switch my tune a littlebit and I'm like, hey, so last
night we were talking aboutgoing to the beach, and what do
you think about that?
And he's just like er, alls hecan think about is this camera.
He goes and wakes her up.
And now the two of them arejust going through the house to
(25:54):
this camera.
And when I'm going through thehouse, I mean she's looking in
cabinets, they've looked intrash cans, and when she comes
out of the bedroom and she'strying to figure she's groggy
and hungover, like what's goingon?
He's telling her what I did thenight before with my things,
that I threw them out the window, my phone and my passport.
And so obviously I've takenthis camera and I'm doing
(26:16):
everything I can to keep him offthe balcony Because, hello,
you'd have to be in a totallyblind hot to see this camera.
It's literally right there onthe lawn.
So I'm trying to keep him outof there and at one point he
makes that.
He goes into the bedroom, hegrabs his 1,000 keys and now he
is unlocking the three or fourdeadbolts that are holding the
house and he's going to gooutside.
(26:38):
So I decide I'm going to.
He's like mm-mm, he's nothaving it.
So he grabbed me by the throat.
I was with his left hand andjust pushed me back until I
would hit the couch behind meand sit down.
And as soon as I popped down Iwas right back up.
So keeps getting a little bitmore aggressive.
But he goes out the door andthen on the other side, he's
(27:01):
luck luck, locking us back in.
Elani goes to the bathroom.
The bathroom I was brushing myteeth in and I'm like Elani, you
have to help me.
You have to help me get out ofhere.
Like I'm freaking out andtrying to be reasonable, I'm
trying to reason with her andshe's just like you're making it
worse.
Just calm down, everything'sfine, everything's not fine.
(27:24):
Just tell me where your keysare right now.
Help me get out of here.
Like, let's just, I got to go,elani, and now here comes the
keys.
He's back.
So I'm there.
I'm stood standing in thehallway.
He comes down and more arguing,more, everybody together.
It was like watching charadesin a language that I didn't
(27:47):
quite understand, but I knewthat they were talking about me.
At one point he goes back to thebedroom.
She's in the kitchen, she'sgoing through drawers.
It was crazy and I rememberedfrom the night before that she
had cut a loose string from hist-shirt with a small pair of
scissors, bigger than nose,trimming.
Not as big as standard, justprobably a 3-inch blade,
(28:12):
something like that and theywere under the sofa table.
So, while everyone wasdistracted, I went and grabbed
those scissors and I put thembeneath the back of my bra strap
where it clasped.
And when he comes back from thebedroom he's holding my passport
and I'm like, oh great, mypassport.
This is always so confusing,what's going on here?
(28:36):
So I put my passport in theside part of my bra and as he
goes to walk out the door, againI'm right on him.
He grabs me by the throat,pushed me down and I just
decided this is enough, it's youor him, and it's not gonna be
you.
So I grab the scissors, I'mholding them in my hand, but
(28:57):
I've got the blade going up myright forearm and I just had my
arm down by my side and as Ipopped back up and grabbed them
and he turns around.
Now he's grabbing me by thethroat.
I mean, he's like I said, it'sjust getting more, more
aggressive.
And so I took the scissors outand I stabbed him two times,
once in the throat and once inthe face, on the nose, and from
(29:19):
the nose I just dug as hard as Icould into his face and at that
time, the first time I hit him,he's like realizing what is
happening and as he's got me bythe throat, he releases just
enough to try and like hit me ina really short space.
But everything is happeningvery slow motion for me as I'm
(29:41):
watching this scene unfold whereI'm sure for him things were
much different, but luckily Iwas watching that fist.
I mean he just barely missed me.
I mean I think he really wouldhave like probably broken my jaw
, quite honestly, had I not hadthe thankfully the slow, the
slow motion.
He is just bleeding outeverywhere.
I don't know how to describethis, but like there's a soft
(30:01):
spots on your neck, right Ifyou're going around your throat.
They're just soft spots.
There's a reason why there's aparticular way you hurt someone
in the neck area.
I just did like a puncture, agiant puncture wound, basically.
So he is bleeding out.
I mean he is pissed.
I'm back down on the couch nowwatching this whole scene unfold
(30:24):
.
She, elani, is cleaning.
She's got rags, she's cleaningup blood.
She's bandaging him up.
He's looking at me, he's raging.
He goes to the kitchen, hegrabs a nine inch carving knife
and he stands.
He gets right up on me.
He, before he stands me up, heis like wielding it over me,
(30:44):
like psycho.
He's just pretending like he'scoming at me with this giant
knife.
At one point he stands me up andI said to myself I mean, I'm an
only child, my mom is the mostimportant person in my world,
and I felt very sad in thatmoment, thinking that I had done
(31:06):
everything I could do.
And I said to myself well, youdid everything that you could do
and now you're going to die.
And then, with it was likefinish that sentence.
And then this rush of it's theonly thing I can describe as
what people would describe asdivine intervention, something
(31:28):
came into that space.
There was a very felt sense ofsafety, of separation, and in
this moment of me, the nextsecond was no, you're not going
to die.
It's like something came in andtold me that.
And so he sits me back down andhe starts making some phone
(31:52):
calls.
He looks at me and he says thepolice are coming.
And I'm like, oh, anotherinteresting turn of events.
The police is coming.
I don't know what that means.
Here comes a man and a young manyou know roughly our age, in
his 30s, and he was in blueboard shorts and a pink Ralph
Lauren Polo.
(32:12):
And I'm like this doesn't lookgood.
They're probably going to killme somewhere in the middle of
Turkey, nowhere to be found.
I don't know what kind of copthis is.
Once again, the charadesthey're talking, the guys
looking at me and looking backand I'm just like, oh my God.
And then he tells me he's goingto call Karem the IT guy.
Great, okay.
(32:32):
So here comes Karem.
Same thing.
Karem comes down, he sits infront of me and he goes Jennifer
, what did you do?
And I said, listen, you need toget me out of here right now.
He was like this is very bad.
I was like it's very bad.
Very bad is an understatement.
Karem, I need to get the fuckout of here, like now, for real.
(32:53):
And he looks at me and, aswe're talking, sinon is still
walking around and he's stillholding the knife.
He's just walking around withit casually now, like at his
side.
So, as I'm talking to Karem,I'm like I'm the knife and back
to Karem I'm the knife and backto Karem I'm the knife and back
to Karem, I'm the knife, andback to Karem and finally he
gets that message.
He gets up, he takes the knifefrom Sinon, they go off.
(33:16):
He comes back and says, go getyour things.
So I go pack up, I'm in a quicksilver duffel and I'm walking
down and to get down thestaircase is a massive marble
spiral staircase.
I've got the duffel bag on myleft side as we're spiraling
down and he's behind me, karem'sin front of me and I'm thinking
(33:39):
like I'm still bracing, I'mworried that he's going to push
me down this flight of stairs.
And so I've got the duffel bagthere ready and we get into the
car and Karem looks at me and hewas like he's asking about a
camera.
I'm like I don't have a clueabout this camera and in the
meantime I think I'm coming backfor the camera.
So off, karem and I go and hedoesn't take me home at first.
(34:04):
He takes me down to the beach.
It's like 10 am.
I get a coffee, he gets a beer.
Everyone's looking at me.
So strangely I hear I think I'mjust in jeans and a t-shirt.
So we go, sit down and hestarts telling me basically how
bad I messed up, what a sceneI've caused and I'm like Karem,
this man tried to rape me.
Do you know what rape is?
(34:25):
And he's like yeah, I know itis.
I'm like no, you obviously donot know what rape is, so take
me home.
I will be on the first flightback to London.
I'm going home.
He's like you're not going tothe cops.
I'm like hell, no, I'm not.
I'm getting out of this country.
No, I'm not going to the cops,I'm getting on a plane, which,
of course, that wasn't trueeither.
(34:47):
When Karem dropped me off to myapartment, the way that it's set
up there, in this particularspace, was there was a little
bit of a lobby and then I was onthe eighth floor of like 10
floors and there's no way down.
There's one way in and one wayout and there's a buzzing system
, but you don't get to knowwho's down there.
You either buzz and then theperson in the apartment decides
(35:09):
I'm going to let in the strangeror not.
I waited in that hallway,waited for Karem to leave,
because there was no way I wasgoing back up into the place
where they know where I live andI have no way out but down.
So I knew neighbors in theexact floor in the opposite
apartment of me in the nextbuilding.
So I went over and I went totheir apartment and they buzzed
(35:30):
me up, thankfully, when theyopened the door I just wanted to
fall into them but they werelike whoa pushed me back and my
I was wearing a yellow notjersey material, but the color
of a Brazil jersey, so like thebright yellow and green and I
was covered in blood.
That's probably why everyonewas looking at me so strangely
(35:53):
at the beach getting coffee,because I was covered in blood.
Why Karem wasn't worried aboutthat is beyond me.
But I got myself together, Ichanged clothes, put my clothes
in a bag for the police.
I called my dad.
At this moment too, I don't knowwhat Fatash's role is in this
whole situation.
(36:13):
Who are my allies?
I don't really think I have anyin this moment and I only know
these neighbors.
And I know the mayor and hisdaughter, and she's 14.
She spoke English.
She was my next phone call,called my dad and I called her
and took a cab over to themayor's house and when he
arrived home me, him and hisbrother they took me to the
(36:36):
police.
What was that car ride like?
The cab ride from the apartmentto the mayor's was really sad.
It was washed in shame it was,it was hard, it was dark.
(36:57):
You know, I thought what have I?
I think a lot of people willtell you once they've been
through something like this.
It feels shameful because, like,what did I do?
How did I?
It's shameful to feel like Ihad this experience and I just
remember feeling like I leteverybody down.
I just I felt lonely and empty.
(37:21):
So I felt some void.
There was also the, theheightened activation of like I.
I mean I just stabbed somebody,so like I have, I have engaged
in something that's really kindof violent and also I won.
(37:42):
So there's that part of it too.
So it's just like it's solayered, it's so, it's so
overwhelming it is, it's so muchall at one time.
It's just.
I think that's why it feelslike a void, because it's just
too much all at one time andit's just so overwhelming in the
(38:02):
system to feel just one thingin the, in the moment, and then
it just all becomes too much.
It's like how can?
I can't feel anything actually,cause I just just too much.
Speaker 1 (38:14):
Like you said, and I have to imagine also you were
probably wondering about the cabdriver Like is he in?
Speaker 2 (38:21):
on it.
Oh, everyone is at this point,everyone's a suspect.
Like, just get me to the place,but at least I'm in contact
with the young lady, bless herheart, she was 14.
And when she answered the phoneI said, hey, it's Jennifer.
And she was, like you know, soexcited.
Hi, jennifer.
(38:41):
Oh, how are you?
I was like, well, something'shappened.
I need to talk to you.
It's very serious.
Is your mother with you?
I need you to tell her what I'mtelling you.
Do you know what rape is?
And oh, I can hear her littlegasp Now.
I can hear it right now to tellI don't want to tell a 14 year
(39:01):
old that you know.
But she was like, yes, and Isaid, okay, well, I, it was
attempted.
It hasn't been done, but that'swhat we're dealing with and I
need to, I need to come over.
They took me to the police, thepolice department.
I had my bag of clothes andeverything.
I felt like all the CSI, allthe John Walsh, all the Oprah
(39:25):
paid off.
All of it came together in thismoment.
The police chief was justamazing.
I mean, he was such a kind man,he really believed everything I
said and I thought I could getto the apartment that I was held
in because what was?
Only a few minutes from the ITshop.
So me, the police chief and thethe mayor left me with his
(39:50):
brother to watch over me and wewent to the IT shop.
We sat there for a minute, theyall talked, and the police
chief let me know they weregoing to be there in the morning
when Karem opened that shop.
So off we go to find theapartment and I just want to say
, like the chief of police, hewas like a Turkish Tommy Lee
Jones.
I mean he really had like theostrich boots on the belt, like
(40:14):
snap.
I mean he was just fantasticfrom, really from the inside out
.
He really had a good heart.
We drive around.
I'm just like so upset atmyself I can't remember where
this apartment is.
They're like don't worry aboutit, we're going to get Karem,
karem's going to take us to theapartment.
So next off, we got to go to thehospital because you've got to
do all the rape kit stuff.
Even though there was nopenetration of any kind, there
(40:38):
still have to do all of that.
And at this point even thebruises hadn't really only
started to develop, like my skinwas tender, but when they took
pictures.
Nothing was really kind ofhappening yet and there was no
swab to take.
Like I said, no penetration, nomouth stuff or anything.
So but that took, oh my God,took hours.
(40:59):
And now the mayor and hisbrother they own hotel in the
neighboring town and they'regoing to take me there to stay
put me up in a room.
Getting back to who do you trust?
So I get in this room and Istart moving all the furniture
Furniture in front of the.
There was a patio door.
I was on the ground level, so Istarted moving that furniture.
I moved furniture in front ofthe door and now I get to take a
(41:24):
shower, because I couldn't doany of that in all of these
hours waiting for this hospitalstuff.
A whole day has probably gone byat this point and the shower
was totally dry.
There was no soap in there,there was nothing.
I just took a water shower andI was scared to stay in there
for too long also.
So I got out and I wasclutching my phone I'm just like
(41:46):
in and out of sleep and I wokeup to a phone call.
My mom had gotten in touch withthe US Embassy and the US
Embassy was now involved in whatwas going on.
Today I contacted the BritishConsulate because I was in.
I was in Antalya.
There is no US Embassy.
The British Consulate's husbandlives in the town where you're
(42:07):
staying and he's coming to getyou right now.
Get your things.
We don't know who you'reinvolved with, we don't know who
knows that you're at that hotel, but you've got to get out of
there right now.
So okay, and I should say too,the night before, when I was
waiting for the mayor to arrive,I had my flight book back to
London next day 6pm.
So now it's this day.
I'm flying out in the eveningbecause I've done all the things
(42:28):
, and so the consulate's husbandcomes to pick me up.
Lovely man, I don't think I'dever.
What a dream to have a Scottishperson pick you up in the
middle of all of this.
So we're riding, we're in thevan, and then I get this phone
call from the chief of police.
He's like puts the man on thephone.
(42:50):
He knows Turkish, so they starttalking.
The man's like they found thehouse, they're there, and he
wants you to go there.
The people who took you aregone, but they're at the house
and now you need to go there.
So he intercepts me, the policechief.
We go there, I put the bootieson and we start walking around.
I really got a different viewof where I was because, like I
(43:13):
said, in my bedroom there weretwo twin beds.
They were both children'scomforters.
One looked like a little spaceguy for little boys, something
like Nickelodeon or something,and then mine was a really
flowery young girls.
Speaker 1 (43:29):
So obviously it was set up for children.
Speaker 2 (43:32):
Yeah, it looked totally different.
And then in one of the roomsthat I had not had access to,
there were bunk beds.
I start doing basically theinterpretive dance of what has
happened than I before.
There's my toothbrush, there'smy snot, there's my mucus,
there's my tears, there's hisblood, because there was like a
couple of little blood spots.
(43:52):
Thankfully that she didn'tclean up.
They each smoked a cigaretteand left it in the ashtray, so
they'd thankfully left their ownDNA there for us.
We go all through the house.
The police chief is there.
He just, he hugged me.
I mean, he was just sowonderful, honestly, his whole
team was fantastic.
And then they take me now to theconsulates.
(44:14):
We all go there, the chief, thehusband and me, and this lovely
lady that took such great careof me.
She gave me money, she bookedmy flight, she, she did so much
for me, and then in the end theywanted me to go back to the
hospital, so she went with me.
They wanted to draw my bloodfor some reason.
After, you know, still, like Isaid, there was, there was
(44:35):
nothing there.
But on the way to the airportthe chief took me to the airport
, him and his detective, andhe'd had a picture of scene on
at this point because he'd hadthe picture from where they
rented the apartment, hispassport ID and I said, yeah,
that's him.
Except for now he's going tohave a big ass scar all the way
across the space.
That ain't going anywhere, ever, ever.
(44:57):
And yeah, I got a so off I goabout almost nine months to the
day.
On May 5th 2010, I testifiedThey'd caught him at some point
and the chief told me let meknow that they were going to
lock down, like his.
The border people would knowthat he was not to leave the
(45:19):
country.
And now Alani, I have no ideawhat happened to her.
Hopefully she's safe.
Speaker 1 (45:25):
Was there talk between the police chief or
anybody else that these peoplewere involved in trafficking?
Speaker 2 (45:34):
There wasn't that known at the time.
There was only the suspicion ofthat, but it wasn't confirmed
at the time that I was in frontof the police and when I
testified the following Maythere was.
When I finished, the lady waslike you know, great job, we're
never going to know what comesof this.
And I was like really she waslike our relations with Turkey
(45:57):
aren't that close, like we'renot going to know in detail how
we can follow this.
So I really don't know.
I don't know what the outcomewas of this whole thing.
Speaker 1 (46:08):
Wow, I'm assuming you testified virtually.
Speaker 2 (46:11):
I'm from Virginia and Norfolk Virginia is a huge
naval air force, like all thegovernment we have so much
government in my town.
So I just went down to one ofthe federal departments in
Norfolk and live court reporterand me and the attorney.
I didn't see him in that moment, it was just us in a conference
(46:33):
room.
Basically, it was very I wish Iwould have been able to see him
again.
I don't know why.
Maybe the scar, maybe just tosee, I mean his image is really
burned in my mind.
Honestly, especially when Ithink, you know, when you replay
the scenes in your mind andit's like certain certain clips
(46:54):
of the movie, is the face yousee.
And for me, one of the faces Isee for him is that first time
that we crossed paths in the ITshop.
I guess that's part of the shametoo that comes with these kind
of things.
Why, why didn't I feel thedanger the second time?
You know, I saw it the firsttime, I felt it the first time,
(47:15):
but not the second time.
But I think that I don't know.
I think in saying that I alsohave, I think, this perspective
or maybe this just likeunderstanding now that being
there in this experience it wasjust part of my story.
It was just something that Iwas supposed to live through,
maybe to talk about, to bringawareness to like.
(47:37):
So I left Turkey.
With bruises, I experienced avine intervention that put me on
a whole new spiritual path, onethat I did not have before.
I mean, that was really a greatblessing to experience that.
So you know and you remember, Iwas saying too like I was going
to break this glass and shoveit into his throat, like I
probably would have killed him,and thankfully I didn't also
(48:01):
have to experience that, even inmy own defense.
Speaker 1 (48:06):
Had you ever thought about what you would say to him?
Speaker 2 (48:10):
I think I would have more questions than what I would
want to say.
I just would want to talk.
I think it'd just be morecuriosity.
Why are we even on this path,dude?
Like I don't know?
It's so layered, I think too,because it does bring in a
spiritual aspect.
Speaker 1 (48:32):
Absolutely.
And I also want to say, goingback to the first time you saw
him, you were like, ah,something's not right.
And then the second time youmet him, you were like, wow, he
was really nice.
We want to think the best ofpeople, yeah.
Speaker 2 (48:49):
I always want to believe that people are good.
And I mean my radars go off andsometimes I'll just look at
someone and I'm like that's nota good person and I'll walk away
.
But like sending that with loveto you, like I can feel
something's off here, you're nota safe body, but my alarm goes
off and I'm just going to walkaway.
(49:10):
It's not going to hopefully betoo big of a deal in my body,
you know.
Speaker 1 (49:15):
Getting back to those violations, Divine intervention
, your journey and faith and allof those things.
Let's delve into that a littlebit.
Speaker 2 (49:27):
Sure, yeah, I love this part of the experience.
I wasn't anyone who grew upwith religion or didn't really
understand Jesus or just any ofit any of it and so this is the
experience that really opened meup to wanting to understand
more about the something greaterthat really connects us.
(49:49):
And I have a.
One of my mom's friends alwaystells me always, even when I was
a little girl she's always tellme you have angels.
And in that moment it was itreally felt like I, maybe I do
have angels.
Like what is this?
How can I explore this?
And so I learned to meditate, Istarted to pray never prayed
(50:12):
before and I started to just getcurious about what else is
there.
And then I got diagnosed withbreast cancer five years later,
after I got back from Turkey.
And this is the time in thistreatment where my faith really
(50:33):
plays a major role, because Ididn't have much else to do but
sit around and pray Honestlywhen I was going through
treatment.
So it really was the time thatmy meditation practice really
got grounded in and really gotsolid.
Because the truth is, after Igot back from Turkey, those five
(50:53):
years to to breast cancer, theywere really stressful.
I was really scared in my bodyI still had.
I'm someone who if my fightflight gets activated it's
likely leaning towards a fightresponse.
I have a real pricklysensations.
That happened in my body and soI can recognize that now I
(51:14):
would be in public.
I remember being at Coles afterI'd returned and I wanted a gun.
I was like I was.
I was really dysregulated, veryscared.
In these years I had thatdivine intervention.
It was curious and I would gosee different healers but I
wasn't in a place to really likeabsorb it.
I was still kind ofself-medicating and not in that
(51:36):
grade of a place.
But when breast cancer comes Ireally leaned in on that divine
intervention and got to knowfaith like that belief, that
trust, and it's been a reallyjuicy experience.
Ever since then.
I've never that connection'snever broke for me.
Speaker 1 (51:54):
Interesting question for those who are going down
path of faith or have doubtsbecause their thought is I don't
think God hears me.
What would you say to them?
Speaker 2 (52:07):
You are God.
We're all made in the visionsof God or the cloth of God, and
we're all these iterations.
We have to find the divinitywithin ourselves, find it in
other people, and I waslistening to something too.
There was I'm not a Christianby definition.
(52:28):
I really love Jesus, but Iwouldn't consider myself like
the traditional type ofChristian.
But I was reading somethingrecently that said that so many
young people nowadays justaren't into Jesus and they don't
even care about Christianityand it's like Jesus is cool.
I mean, that's a really coolguy, what he did, what he does,
(52:49):
what he stands for, his stories,and that this is the teacher of
our times.
Right, it was the Buddha, andother times or maybe the.
You know, there's been manyspiritual teachers in our times
and I think people are reallymissing out because the religion
(53:11):
side is maybe too boxed in forpeople to get to an
understanding of what a greatteacher this person is.
Speaker 1 (53:24):
For you.
What is the greatest lesson youhave taken away from Jesus Love
?
Speaker 2 (53:33):
Love, because we're all made in the image of God.
That's what it is.
We're all made in the likenessand in the image of God and if
that is true, if we, I come froma belief that thinks we are all
iterations of the divineexpressing itself.
So I'm got you, you are divine,we're all divine, and I don't
(53:56):
think of God as this old man inthe sky that is waiting to judge
me on some day.
I really look at it as I'm partof something really big in this
experience and we're allconnected.
We are all connected in this.
(54:17):
It's like one great big nervoussystem that we're in here, the
galaxy, the stars, the cosmos,and as we walk paths of faith,
there's so many differentconsciousness that we can
connect to, that we can learnfrom.
There's been so many incredibleteachers, mother Mary, there's
been so many incredible teacherthat I don't think all the time
(54:37):
gets her right of what's reallydue for that incredible woman.
But you know, there's a lot ofteachers and there's a lot of
women that have been left out inspiritual spaces, back to
Mother Mary or Mary Magdalene,and I think whatever calls to
you, just try it out.
It doesn't have to be rigid, itcan be really loose.
(55:00):
There's so many spiritualmasters and teachers today for
us to learn from.
Speaker 1 (55:07):
And I think being called is really about being
open, because people get calledin different ways.
It isn't, you know God, justcome and knock it on your door
saying, hey, this is what youknow, here's your purpose, this
is what I want you to do.
It doesn't work that way.
So it's really about being opento the possibility and to
reference kind of what you saidabout religion, not boxing
(55:30):
yourself in.
Speaker 2 (55:31):
Yeah, and we're capable of so much like our
human bodies are just theseincredible intelligent designs
that are all divine wisdom andancient knowledge.
And look at your DNA, look atyour genealogy Like we're.
It's incredible what we are.
If you want to believe, well,if you just give it a chance,
(55:55):
find something.
I always tell people whenthey're going through a
diagnosis like whatever youbelieve in, just start believing
in it hard.
And getting back to what youasked me about Jesus and the,
what did I learn the most?
I?
One of the things, too, I thinkabout is that there is a Christ
consciousness that lives withinus.
I think, as a teacher, he wasshowing us what's possible in
(56:21):
all of our lives.
I don't think Jesus would haveput himself on a pedestal and
seen himself in all of the homesthe way that he is displayed
now.
I think it would be.
You know, I think he's a guide.
He's trying to teach us what weall can do.
If we are all made in the sameimage, right, we're all special.
(56:41):
We all have those powers likehealing ourselves and helping
other people heal, and that thatthat lives in us.
Speaker 1 (56:50):
Yeah, I kind of call that the super conscious and
it's almost like our moralcompass in a way of you kind of
understand the differencebetween what's right and what's
wrong.
You have respect for human life, because when you love others,
you respect their life.
You don't go out andintentionally hurt them or
commit crimes, things like that.
(57:11):
The fact that you know you'resharing this message and we're
having conversation about it isso important because I think
it's getting lost in therhetoric and we can, by talking
about it and creating thatawareness in your passion, like,
obviously, when you talk aboutJesus and you love Jesus, like
it comes through and it makes meI believe in Jesus, but if I
(57:35):
didn't, it would make me curious.
Like, well, who is this Jesusguy?
Like these Jennifer's there alltalking about Jesus?
Speaker 2 (57:44):
Yes, people are missing out.
He's a cool guy, I love it.
Speaker 1 (57:52):
He really is, you know.
The last thing I want to talkabout is choices.
We have choices.
You and I kind of talked aboutthis.
You had lots of choices to makeduring your whole incident of
am I going to choose to live orchoose to die?
Am I going to fight, am I notgoing to fight?
(58:13):
And then even later in life,with your breast cancer?
We make choices every day.
We don't give enough credit tohow important choices really are
.
So let's talk about that for aminute.
Speaker 2 (58:25):
Okay, yeah, I love it .
Choices there's this idea ofthe present moment, right, that
we, when we're present,everything is possible, anything
is possible in the presentmoment and I think that's made
possible by the choices that areavailable in the present moment
and that when we're here, whenwe're embodied, when we're
(58:49):
attuned to the people with us,to the experiences, to the life
that's happening, we can makechoices that, like you said, it
could go either way.
Does this choice reflect thehigher life of consciousness
that I'm going towards?
Or is this going to diminish mysystem in some way?
(59:12):
Like, what am I doing here?
And when we have those, I think,higher states of consciousness,
those frontal front brainactivations and you, it's almost
like, well, it's massiveself-abandonment to go the other
way.
Right, the choice of the lifethat we always want.
It is in front of us andsometimes it's hard to make
(59:34):
those choices.
But staying present, stayinggrounded, and it can be fun,
right, it can be fun, even afterwe've been through these big
experiences, like you and I havebeen through and like some of
our listeners have been through,like life can be really fun and
joyful and pleasurable, andthat's a choice, and sometimes
(59:55):
that is a daily recommitment,every day when I wake up.
Thank you, thank you for yourattitude and what's on the day.
Speaker 1 (01:00:05):
I love what you shared.
Thank you so much.
Speaker 2 (01:00:07):
There's a song I listened to by Tony Jones, and
she says something along thelines of my heart is beating for
me every second of the day, andthat's abundance.
My breath, I breathecountlessly throughout the day,
and that's abundance.
Speaker 1 (01:00:26):
That's amazing.
Those are things we take forgranted.
Speaker 2 (01:00:29):
I know this beautiful body that we have right.
Speaker 1 (01:00:32):
Absolutely.
We just assume they're going tobe there, right?
You have taken your experienceand used it to help others by
creating this podcast.
Can you tell us about that andhow the listeners can find your
podcast?
Speaker 2 (01:00:50):
Yes, trauma Rewired I co-host that with Elizabeth
Kristof.
She's the founder ofBrain-Based Wellness and the
Neurosematic IntelligenceCoaching, certification and
Trauma Rewired is really a lovestory.
It's a dedication to thenervous system and it's really
educational.
It's a podcast rooted inscience, but in that science we
also share our lived experiencesand we really, in season two,
(01:01:14):
we talk about the nervous systemsort of as an individual and
like what is trauma?
How does it live in the body?
What does it mean to have afight trauma response?
That, like I said, is my go-to.
Or what does flight feel like?
What can that look like?
What is freeze and fawn?
And what is perfectionism as atrauma response?
Or what is dissociation Right?
(01:01:36):
So we break down each thingindividually and now we've just
launched season three, wherewe're looking at the brain as a
social organ and how we aredeveloped within the
neurobiology of relationshipsand the neuroscience of
relationships, the way that weconnect, the way our attachments
are formed from an early age,and it still goes through the
lens of complex trauma, but it'smore of a, like I said, the
(01:02:00):
nervous system as a whole, associety, culture, our
relationships, to all of it.
Speaker 1 (01:02:07):
So if somebody is listening, they're like, how do
I know what my nervous system isdoing?
Like what is the first step youwould recommend them to do?
Speaker 2 (01:02:16):
I would recommend you listen to the podcast, honestly
available, where all podcastsplay Like.
It's a really easily laid outfor y'all to learn, like with
the foundation of your nervoussystem.
And then if you're interestedin the tools that we use and the
tools that we talk about, thengo to rewiretrialcom.
We offer two free weeks on siteof nervous system training,
where we're there live teachingfour times a week and we love to
(01:02:38):
be in community and answer yourquestions.
Speaker 1 (01:02:41):
That's great.
That's awesome.
That is a fabulous resource forlisteners to.
Number one, be able to listento your podcast, but number two,
to have that community.
I love communities, so much Ireally crave it, yes, and lots
of people know that they're notalone, and that's so important.
Speaker 2 (01:03:00):
Yeah, definitely it really is.
It really is.
And back to the shared storyit's important for us to share
our stories.
Speaker 1 (01:03:07):
Mm-hmm, there is healing and sharing.
Speaker 2 (01:03:10):
Yes, and there's healing in community, and I
don't think healing is donealone.
You know, sometimes peoplethink they might be stuck where
they are, and you and I weretalking a little bit before we
hit record about the change.
That's always possible.
Change is always possible andwherever you're experiencing
(01:03:33):
right now, it does not have tostay like this.
You have an operating systemthat's your nervous system, and
that operating system istrainable and it's changeable,
and so I just don't ever wantpeople to think like it's just
like this.
I'm just wired this way andthis is just how it is and how
it will always be.
But we always have choice,thank you and I were talking
(01:03:56):
about.
We always have a choice andthere's so much opportunity for
that change in your nervoussystem.
Speaker 1 (01:04:04):
Absolutely, Jennifer.
Thank you for being my guest onthe I Need Blue podcast.
Thank you so much, jennifer.
Speaker 2 (01:04:10):
I just loved it so much.
Thank you, you're welcome.
Speaker 1 (01:04:13):
We'll have to do this again.
I thoroughly enjoyed it as well, and I think you bring a lot
more information to my listenersthat I think we can delve into.
If you are interested in doingthat, I am totally open to being
back here again with you.
Speaker 2 (01:04:28):
This is Jen.
Speaker 1 (01:04:29):
Lee with the I Need Blue podcast.
Thank you for listening today.
You can find all of my episodesand everything you ever needed
to know about the I Need Bluepodcast on my website,
wwwinadbluenet.
And remember you are strongerthan you think.
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