November 21, 2023 • 60 mins
Ever wondered what it's like to transition from a high-flying corporate career to a fulfilling role in public service? Well, you're about to find out. Join us as we sit down with Shelly Brindle, the mayor of Westfield, New Jersey, and former executive at HBO. Our conversation is an illuminating look at her journey from a single-parent home to the C-suite at HBO, and eventually to her mission of making a difference in her community as mayor. Shelly opens up about her experiences, challenges, and the important lessons she's learned along the way.
As we navigate through our conversation, we also delve into the heart of transformational leadership and the essence of a strong company culture. Shelly shares her insights from leading HBO through a time of significant industry transition, with the rise of streaming services. She highlights the importance of preparing for change, embracing transparency, and empowering others. Our chat also explores HBO's journey through the shift from traditional cable distribution to embracing the new trend of streaming services.
Finally, we discuss Shelly's decision to leave her corporate role and run for mayor. We touch on her motivations, the challenges she faced as a professional woman in politics, and the legacy she aims to leave. Our conversation goes beyond her political career as we talk about the importance of empathy, the value of empowering employees, and her experiences of prioritizing family and happiness over corporate America. Join us for this inspiring and insightful conversation, and be prepared to see leadership in a whole new light. The journey from boardroom to local government might be less straight and narrow than you think.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 2 (00:06):
Hey hikers, the turkeys have taken over the
trail so, in honor of theirThanksgiving hustle, we're
bringing back one enjoyableepisode from Season 1 for your
holiday pleasure.
We'll be back next Tuesday,november 28th, with an exciting
conversation featuring DaisyJoplin, the fantastic classical
rock violinist.
Happy Thanksgiving to everyoneand a special thank you to those
(00:28):
delectable turkeys.
Unless you're a vegan orvegetarian.
In that case, a big thank youto all of the delicious tofu
furkeys out there.
Okay, first I will start offwith my obligatory.
Are you okay with beingrecorded on a podcast?
Speaker 1 (00:43):
Yes, I am.
Speaker 2 (00:44):
Well, there goes that liability.
This is.
I Took a Hike.
I'm your host, darren Mass,founder of business therapy
group in Parktime, wildernessPhilosopher.
Here we step out of theboardrooms and home offices and
into the great outdoors wherethe hustle of entrepreneurship
meets the rustle of nature.
In this episode I chat with themayor of Westfield, new Jersey,
and former C-suite executive atHBO, shelly Brindle.
(01:07):
Our topics include growing upin a single-parent home,
challenging the All BoysExecutive Club, rising to the
political occasion and so muchmore.
There was so much inspirationwhen I took a hike with Shelly
Brindle.
You are the Westfield mayor.
(01:29):
Yes, mayor, shelly Brindle, ifI may, what is your salary?
A dollar, a?
Speaker 1 (01:35):
year.
A dollar a year and I'm notallowed to cash the check, so
just saying.
Speaker 2 (01:42):
You're not allowed to cash the check.
But what does that mean?
The town has an open balance ofcurrently what five?
Speaker 1 (01:48):
Six dollars.
Six dollars, exactly All right.
Speaker 2 (01:50):
So there's a six dollar open balance.
You're not allowed to soessentially, the accountants are
not allowed to balance thebooks.
Speaker 1 (01:56):
You're absolutely right, I haven't really thought
about that.
Yeah, this could be a liability, you know.
Speaker 2 (02:01):
So clearly.
In order to have thisaltruistic nature to be the
mayor of a town, volunteer yourtime.
Yes, you have had to have someextensive business success in
your life.
Speaker 1 (02:14):
Yes.
Speaker 2 (02:15):
So why don't we take a look back at what you did
prior to being a mayor and we'llfinally wind up on what it's
like to be a mayor and thechallenges I can imagine in
dealing with people, especiallyopposing opinions?
Speaker 1 (02:33):
Yes, and really in the insights between private and
public sector, which have beenreally interesting.
But if we want to go way, wayback prior to my, even my career
, before being mayor because I'malways intrigued by what life
decisions people have made orwhere they grew up, that kind of
(02:53):
informed, ultimately, the paththat they chose, and I think it
wasn't until actually I becamemayor that I started reflecting
back and figured, oh, that'sprobably where I ended up here.
So my dad was an Air Forcepilot and he was killed in
Vietnam when I was six years old.
Oh, wow, so my mom and I hadtwo older sisters.
My mom picked us up from wherewe were living in Nevada at the
(03:17):
time, this small town inVirginia, and I realized I only
grew up with women in the house.
So we were like a pack of fourwomen and I tell this to the
Girl Scouts actually.
So there were never any boychores or girl chores in our
house, they were just chores.
And so, you know, did it all,cut in the grass, clean out the
garbage a whole bit, and then, Ithink only later that was
(03:40):
definitely informative, becausethere was never any sense of
where women belong versus menbelong.
And then, you know, in collegeI became a football manager and
I was on a full scholarship forworking with the football team
at the University of Virginia.
Speaker 2 (03:55):
Oh, wow.
Speaker 1 (03:56):
Yeah, where, once again, I was one of the few
women in the arena, if you will,and I'll be honest with you.
I was a good student at school,but I wasn't an exceptional
student and I like to tellpeople I didn't even get into
the business school at UVAbecause I realized my brain
thinks much more creatively andI'm not the finance person or
the accounting person, because Ido better when there aren't
(04:18):
constraints with what you can do, and that's what I realized
when I got into the businessworld.
I get hyper focused on resultsand I was always the one that
good morning, able to reallyidentify, like what was the
primary priorities of what wewere trying to accomplish and
then zero in on what needs tohappen to drive that ball
(04:42):
forward.
Eventually that led just Idon't know, I just ended up
delivering results.
I moved to New York and Istarted in a marketing job at
HBO and I ended up pretty muchdoing almost every job you could
do from, you know, marketing,overseeing research to product
development, to ultimatelygetting to the C-suite where I
(05:02):
was running the EVP of domesticdistribution and marketing,
where I was overseeing prettymuch the domestic revenue for
the company.
Speaker 2 (05:11):
Hey listener, thanks for hiking along with us.
Discover more episodes athightokahikecom, or to recommend
an adventurous guest, apply tobe a sponsor, discover books
along the trail, or to simplydrop us a line.
Let's take a step back.
So you grew up in a house withfour girls.
I have three daughters and mywife.
(05:33):
I can only imagine what thathouse is, especially as a single
parent house.
Yes, lots of strife, lots ofscreaming and not enough
hairbrushes.
Speaker 1 (05:44):
Yes, you know it well , I can tell you in my life
every morning wears thehairbrush.
Speaker 2 (05:52):
I have relegated a hairbrush on a chain so I can
imagine what that house was like.
More power to your mom, becauseto be a single parent first of
all is extremely challenging,daunting.
You have to earn, you have towork and feed and take care of
all your children.
So that's an amazingaccomplishment right there, and
(06:12):
I hope you thank your motherthroughout all of this.
Speaker 1 (06:15):
Oh she knows, and you know, and we didn't have a lot
of money because back then Well,how could you?
Yeah, and the military didn'toffer the same benefits that
they might offer families today,but it's never enough.
But yes, we had these majordrag out screaming fights, but
we were also like in it togetherand we'd sit around the dinner
(06:35):
table and figure out how we'regoing to get money for my
sister's prom dress, I mean.
So it became this very we'reall in this together, like you
know, how are we going to figurethis out?
So, but yeah, I think inhindsight, when I became the
first female and only femaleexecutive in the C-suite at HBO
and then later to become thefirst female mayor of my town, I
(06:59):
can't help but think that thoseearly experiences in my family
somewhat informed that path.
Speaker 2 (07:06):
Oh well, of course, all of the experiences,
especially in early childhoodand to adolescence, shape who we
are today.
Right, Sometimes we like toescape who we are.
Speaker 1 (07:16):
Yes, exactly.
Speaker 2 (07:17):
But that's never going to happen, right?
There are times where the wordsout of my mouth and the voice
that I hear in my brain is myfather the one you probably
swear you'd never be Swore sworeI would not be like him.
I respected him, but I swore Iwould be different.
I'd be more present for my kids, which I have been.
But sometimes I say those dadjokes and say guess what I said
(07:42):
Use your head for more than justa hat rack.
Speaker 1 (07:45):
What do you make sense All right.
Speaker 2 (07:47):
So you have a strong background in essentially
surviving right.
Fending for yourself and afamily that big with one single
parent that gets you to college.
You were an okay student andguess what?
Most successful people werejust okay students.
Speaker 1 (08:03):
That's right.
Speaker 2 (08:04):
Myself included.
I was just an okay student atbest.
And then you get hired at HBO.
Being a female is a challengein a very stuffy corporate world
.
You are an executive in the Csuite.
What were some of your biggestaccomplishments at HBO?
Speaker 1 (08:24):
Well, that's a good question and it's funny just to
back up a little bit about whatyou said about being a woman,
because what was interesting isthat at HBO at the time you know
I'm dating myself now in thelate 18, late 80s it was a very
young company and fairlyprogressive, so it was actually
a good place to be a woman in amedia environment that was
(08:47):
rapidly changing.
So there's a lot of opportunityfor women.
It's funny, I didn't reallyrealize the impact Good morning,
good morning.
And the challenge is, honestly,until I got into the C suite
and I remember thinking, gosh,you know, we don't have there's
no challenges with women gettingadvancing, because I kept
(09:09):
moving forward.
And then I got in the C suiteand I was laughing, I'm like, oh
, this is what's happening uphere.
So that was very interesting,but really my probably my
accomplishment.
I was always a bit of atransformational person, so I
was always given things thatwere somewhat broken and trying
(09:29):
to fix it, and so really it waswhen I moved into that C suite
role where I was given theresponsibility for the revenue
of the company and, quitefrankly, it was at a time when
Netflix was, you know, stilldelivering red envelopes to
people's houses.
But it was pretty obvious wherethat future was going, and so
(09:50):
when I took over that job,historically our distribution
partners were the traditionalcable companies, you know
Comcast and Cox and all of those.
Speaker 2 (09:59):
I know them all too well, coming from telecom, and
the challenges in working withmonster companies.
Speaker 1 (10:05):
Exactly.
And so when I took over I waslike, okay, but, and we had a,
you know, a company a lot of oursales and marketing folks had
been there a really long timeand I said we have to prepare
ourselves for a future where ourdistribution partners are Apple
and Google and Facebook andeverything else and we need to
(10:27):
make sure that we're reallyequipped, both organizationally
and strategically, to reallycapture that.
And I remember looking aroundat all the things that are all
great and I'd been there a longtime too.
And that's when you know, yourealize you can't fire everybody
, but you can inspire everyone.
Speaker 2 (10:46):
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Speaker 1 (11:18):
And it really is about getting people vested in
that outcome.
And I'll never forget the bigmeeting we did with the layoff
people.
We reorganized, integrated kindof sales and marketing into
these different teams, provideda different level of
accountability for results.
And I really believe in myleadership mantra has always
been around three principles,and it really is.
(11:42):
I always say it's transparency,empowerment and accountability,
and what I mean by that.
It's very important to be very,very transparent with the
entire team.
Like I think a lot of leaderswill sometimes communicate in
silos so like, oh, this teamonly works on this, so I'm going
to give them all theinformation they need for this
(12:03):
and then this team works on this, so they'll only know about
this.
But I wanted people to be ableto be able to respond and make
decisions opportunistically whenthey have them, and the only
way you can do that is if youhave full information about what
is driving the business.
So I wanted the leaders thatwere running let's just hit the
(12:23):
Comcast team if they were in aComcast meeting and there was an
opportunity, a growthopportunity for HBO within that
account, it might sound like agreat idea for Comcast, but
whatever that decision was couldhave impact on the other pieces
of the business.
If they didn't understand that,they would be going in there
(12:44):
saying yes, yes, yes, butactually the larger benefit
would be a no.
So the reason it was importantto be transparent and so we
would have these team meetingsand we would share everything,
for every single piece ofbusiness, with everyone, so that
then they could go into thoseplaces and feel vested in that
larger outcome and makedecisions based upon the results
.
But the third leg of that stool, which I think is the hardest
(13:09):
and most often ignored, isaccountability.
And if you don't hold peopleaccountable for delivering very
clear on objectives, bothsubjectively and quantifiably,
the other two things don'tmatter and everything breaks
down.
Because you know it's a cliche,but it's true You're only as
good as your weakest link.
Right, right.
Speaker 2 (13:28):
This is true.
So you said a quote that Iloved you can't fire everybody,
but you can inspire them.
Yes, based on that quote, youand I are very aligned.
Believe in people.
Speaker 1 (13:38):
Yes.
Speaker 2 (13:38):
Right.
You wouldn't be where you're attoday without the help of
others supporting you, and theonly way you can gain support of
others is to be likable,charismatic and be in the
service of supporting those verysame people.
That's right.
So would it be fair to say thatyou are a cultural leader?
Speaker 1 (13:57):
Yeah, I'm very passionate about culture because
to me, culture is everything.
People is everything.
You know.
People married with the rightculture is what delivers
exceptional outcomes.
And my job honestly and it'snot people don't believe it, but
my role whenever I took on anew position is to make myself
feel relevant and it's funny.
Speaker 2 (14:19):
Hold on, I'm going to pause you right there.
So the purpose of everythingthat I've done since the sale of
my company has been the pursuitof relevance.
It's a very important word andyou got there without me asking
you.
So let's talk about relevanceand what relevance means.
Speaker 1 (14:36):
I think it's in two, and actually there's a part
where you want to be relevant,but as a leader, I think a goal
should be to make yourselfirrelevant, because in so doing,
what that means you're doing isthat you're surrounding
yourself with people who aresuper smart mostly smarter than
me who have core competenciesthat are compliment whatever I
(14:59):
do, and if you empower them in away to take ownership of the
decisions, at the end of the day, the role of the leader should
be like you know what my work isdone here and they can kind of
go from there, and the ironicpart is a lot of leaders are
afraid of that because they feellike they then will become
themselves personally irrelevant.
But by doing that you everysingle experience of mine is,
(15:23):
when you create a culture likethat of empowering these people
and giving them ownership of theoutcomes, you deliver
exceptional outcomes, and thenguess what happens.
As a leader, then you getpicked to choose to go and do
something else.
Speaker 2 (15:36):
So I love that.
So, as a coach, I mentor my CEOclients that if you cannot take
a vacation and leave yourcompany for at least two weeks,
preferably a month, then it'snot a healthy company.
So, in line with what you'resaying about irrelevance, you
(15:56):
have to be able to step away,trust your people to do the job
and the task and be able tosupport your customer and
themselves without yourinvolvement to have a healthy
company or, in this case, youwant to make yourself irrelevant
.
To be relevant, that's exactlyright.
Speaker 1 (16:15):
I think a lot of leaders are afraid and there's
another kind of similar equationin that which I said.
I was always the consider the.
I was always the one neverafraid to ask the dumbest
question in the room.
Speaker 2 (16:30):
It was the same.
In fact, having ADHD, I wasalso the class clown and I
wasn't afraid to embarrassmyself, which you met one of my
daughters yesterday.
But it's that type of thinking,especially as a child, that
develops strong leaders, theability to not be.
You're asking any question,regardless of if it's quote,
(16:52):
unquote, dumb or not.
That's courage.
Speaker 1 (16:55):
Well, you realize, when you're not afraid to ask
the dumb question, you know what.
Everybody else has the samequestion, they're just afraid to
ask it.
And so I was always the onethat would say you know people,
they'd come in and share thisgreat strategy.
And I'm like, okay, that soundsgreat, people would be
enthralled with it.
And I'm like, okay, how doesthat make sense?
And how are we making money?
And suddenly everybody's like,huh, and it's funny.
(17:17):
People would say how do youhave the courage to take so many
risks?
And I always felt like nottaking risks was more fearful
for me than taking them, because, going back to your point about
relevance, it's like for me itwas always about pushing things
(17:38):
forward.
But the irony is I keptthinking like you know what fire
me for doing the right thing?
I take that any day of the weekand I used to tell that to my
team moral fortitude.
Yeah, moral fortitude.
And guess what I kept gettingpromoted and that's what I tell
people is like sometimes, ourown fears they're keep us, keep
us back from achieving what itis we really aspire to do.
(18:01):
And I think that was the othergoing back with make yourself
irrelevant.
To become relevant, try tobecome a bit more fearless to
actually get to the place whereyou want to go.
And a lot of people don't makethat connection.
Speaker 2 (18:14):
So fear, uncertainty and doubt is you know, the fud
or the fud factor is cripplingfor most Not many, but most
people being afraid to ask yourmanager a question or disagree
with a directive.
But in the right, way In theright way, one of the books that
I have all my clients read is abook by Patrick Lincioni called
(18:35):
Getting Naked.
Speaker 1 (18:35):
It's a great book.
Speaker 2 (18:37):
I recommend that you read it or anyone reads it, for
that matter and no, they are notsponsoring this show, but I
believe in this so heavily.
I've listened to it hundreds,if not a thousand times already,
and it talks about removing thethree biggest fears that hold
us back from being successfulthe fear of vulnerability, the
fear of embarrassment and thefear of failure.
(19:00):
And it's a business fable thatdemonstrates the always be
selling mentality and jumping in.
As you know, always startconsulting and assuming the
client.
But if you can get past thosethree biggest fears, you can
find much greater success,because your client will
appreciate the fact that yousaid you don't really agree with
their marketing, Right?
(19:21):
So it's a very important themeand it obviously worked for you
throughout your career.
Now I will ask you a pointedquestion.
Do you believe that you as afemale in the corporate world in
the 80s, in the 90s, was lookedat a little more heavily as a
(19:43):
checkbox in the time?
I?
Speaker 1 (19:45):
would actually say gosh.
I have to say, ironically, Iwould think I was less than a
checkbox earlier in my careerthan I was later in my career.
I'll never forget, actually,them telling me when I was being
considered for this role and itwas running and typically there
had been a separate salesorganization, a separate
(20:07):
marketing organization they werecombining all of it and putting
it under me and that role thatcertainly ran the distribution
arm of the organization had onlyever been led by men and it was
always on our executive floor,on the C-suite.
So not only did I get that job,I got a bigger job than any of
them had ever had before andthey actually asked our HR are
you actually going to put her onthe executive floor?
Speaker 2 (20:29):
Ah, so that was a real conversation.
Yeah, you were made aware ofthat conversation at the time.
Speaker 1 (20:33):
Yes, Luckily the HR person told me that in like
incredulous like can you believe?
People are asking me are youactually going to put her on
their floor?
No, other women were there.
This was in 2010.
Speaker 2 (20:46):
It wasn't like it was way past when that would be
allowed.
To be honest, the fact that theHR individual brought that up
is technically a no-no in the HRworld.
But, you had a greatrelationship with him.
Speaker 1 (21:00):
We did and I think he was doing me a bit of a favor,
Like okay, just so you know,this is kind of what you're
walking into.
And it was just a reallyinteresting dynamic because I
definitely felt like when I gotup there, I'm like, oh, who
doesn't belong?
No, you can tell.
I felt like I was in intrusionon a club.
Speaker 2 (21:20):
So I love that.
I love that because you weretold you can't do something and
you use that as drive.
Absolutely, oh yeah you don'twant me here.
I'm going to prove to you notonly can I do your job, I'll do
it better, more efficient andstronger than you.
Speaker 1 (21:36):
That's right and you know what, and we had some of
the best performance we had in30 years.
And then it led, obviouslygoing back to that conversation
I had earlier about who ourclients of the future were going
to be.
Well, then it came all aboutstreaming, and so really it was
about leading an organization toreally kind of the streaming
(21:56):
future.
And when he asked me earlier,some of the biggest
accomplishments I had was onewas changing the culture that we
talked about so importantly toone that was more innovative, I
like to think, which, ultimately, is what led to the ability for
streaming.
But and so anyway.
So, and once HBO Go launched,and then HBO Now launched, and
(22:17):
now HBO brand is Max.
Don't even get me started onthat.
Speaker 2 (22:21):
Wait, you just glossed over this so what was
your contribution in HBO Go andstreaming services?
Speaker 1 (22:27):
Well, think about it.
We saw, you know, netflixcoming, we saw where things were
going and all of our revenue,95% of the company's revenue,
was tied to traditional cabledistributors who did not want us
going around that traditionaldistribution mechanism.
Because most people, a lot ofpeople, don't realize.
(22:47):
You know, hbo was not aretailer, we are a wholesaler.
We sold our content to ourproduct, to Comcast or those of
the world who then sent it tocharge the customer.
That does make sense yes and sopeople used to always ask me if
I got HBO for free.
I'm like I don't know, becausethat means Comcast would have to
give it to me for free.
Speaker 2 (23:06):
One of your perks, you could save $9.99 a month.
Speaker 1 (23:08):
Yeah, exactly no.
So but that's really importantto remember because we are in
classic innovators dilemma,because all of our revenue was
coming from this traditionaldistribution which we could see
was becoming less relevant inthe future.
So how do you migrate?
And a public company, a part ofTime Warner, how do you migrate
(23:28):
those revenues in your businessmodel where you're not really?
They call you a trading analogdollars for digital dimes.
Speaker 2 (23:36):
Yes.
Speaker 1 (23:37):
And that was.
Speaker 2 (23:38):
Analog dollars for digital dimes.
Did you say that Time Warnerowned HBO?
Speaker 1 (23:41):
Yeah, which is now, of course, a home by discovery.
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (23:45):
So I want to take a step back because this is really
fascinating to me.
What was the boardroomconversation like when you're
looking as HBO at a threat likeNetflix, which I can imagine in
Blockbuster was very differentthere was probably a bunch of
nah.
Speaker 1 (24:02):
This will never do, this will never work.
Speaker 2 (24:05):
Yeah, but HBO, no way you saw that this was a threat
actor.
Speaker 1 (24:10):
Yeah, and it was interesting.
I think it was initiallydismissed and some of it was
posturing, some of it was legit,I think even Jeff Fuchus.
There's a book that just cameout it's not TV, it's HBO, which
I was quoted in many cases, forbetter or for worse, jeff
Fuchus was a chairman, evencalled them the Albanian army,
(24:32):
like Netflix, like it was alittle bit dismissive.
Speaker 2 (24:35):
Oh, wow.
So similar posturing asBlockbuster.
We're the big company, there'sno way it'll take us down.
Speaker 1 (24:40):
That's exactly right, but I mean really, Netflix
wasn't an entertainment company.
They were a tech company andthey had data and the big
difference was they knew whotheir customers were and could
serve up programs and showsbased upon those needs.
We didn't know who ourcustomers were.
Speaker 2 (25:00):
Because you were a wholesale.
You were a wholesale.
You're a customer with,technically, the cable.
Speaker 1 (25:04):
Comcast dude.
Who are you?
Speaker 2 (25:05):
know stuffy suits.
Speaker 1 (25:07):
Exactly.
That in and of itself was ascary proposition, right?
So I think the aha moment waswhen Netflix bought the show.
Oh my God, what's the WhiteHouse show?
House of Cards House of Cardswhen Netflix bought, because HBO
was in the running for that.
And when Netflix came in andthey bought that show and not
(25:29):
only, you know, typically wewould pilot shows and then you
know, you determine whetheryou're going to spend the money
on the continued investment,whatever, netflix went in and
bought House of Cards, fullseason, no pilot required, like
it was just, and everyone's like, oh my gosh, they're crazy, you
know.
But what that did, mostimportantly, it sent a message
(25:49):
to the creative community thatNetflix was a place where they
could do business independentlyand freely, and that's something
that HBO would always prideitself on.
So I think that was the reallybeginning of really the
relevance of Netflix in terms ofthe Hollywood creative
community seeing them as alegitimate distribution play for
(26:10):
their shows.
Speaker 2 (26:11):
What I imagine happened was HBO and the entire
digital world looked at Netflixas that disruptive kid in class
asking that stupid questionwithout fear.
And then the stuffy businesspeople said oh wait, we need to
pay attention.
Speaker 1 (26:27):
When you're part of a public company and you're
responsible for quarterlyshareholder returns and you know
the technical investment.
And so the little backstoryabout our Our investment is so
we had our own team in Seattleworking on our own you know
platform, if you will, of thestreaming platform.
(26:49):
We thought we could do it onour own but I mean, it wasn't
our DNA, we were each but wasnot a tech company and
ultimately, as great as theywere, they weren't able to
deliver what we needed by whenwe needed at a time, certainly
before.
I remember ForgetPork, theshareholder meeting.
So the big moment I'll neverforget that I laugh about.
I was going to a Google company, but Google used to.
(27:09):
I don't know if they still do.
They had these conferencescalled Zeitgeist and I went to
the Google Zeitgeist conferencewhere they brought in all these
you know interesting speakersand whatever.
And I meet this guy who worksfor Major League Baseball, but
he worked for this companycalled.
It was a Major League BaseballAdvanced Media.
They called him Bantech and hisname was Kenny.
It's in the book actually.
Speaker 2 (27:29):
Kenny from Bantech.
Kenny from Bantech, that is theperfect name for a baseball guy
.
Yeah, kenny from Bantech.
Speaker 1 (27:35):
And Kenny.
I was telling him we're talkingabout a dilemma with, like, we
needed to launch a streamingservice but we didn't have a
technical platform and we neededto launch it by this date.
And he goes we know Bantech hasbeen doing this with WWE and he
told us exactly how they weredoing it and how you were
enabling current distributors,the whole bit.
He said we'll meet with you.
So I went back and told our CEO, richard Plepler.
(27:57):
I said I might have found asolution for us, and so he gave
us permission.
Me and my partner in crime wentdown to the Google the Bantech
offices, which were in Chelsea,and had this kind of covert
meeting with their CTO and myfriend, with Kenny from Bantech
and others Literally I don'tknow.
(28:18):
Within five days, hbo announceda relationship with Bantech and
they created a platform to go.
So all because I had gone tothat conference, met Kenny from
Bantech and it really it wasliterally announced the
shareholder meeting was, I think, the following week, so they
announced the launch of theservice at a shareholder meeting
(28:39):
Before it was even developed.
I don't think before you.
Speaker 2 (28:42):
The contract was signed with Bantech, so you are
essentially the personresponsible for HBO Go.
Hey listener, thanks for hikingalong with us.
Discover more episodes athightokahikecom, or to recommend
an adventurous guest, apply tobe a sponsor, discover books
along the trail, or to simplydrop us a line.
Well, I mean it's you and yourpartner in crime.
Speaker 1 (29:04):
It takes a village.
I think I was instrumental infinding that platform that
enabled it, but clearly it's.
You know it takes a village,but that was a pretty key moment
for us.
Speaker 2 (29:15):
So it was there at the meeting at 118th Avenue the
building.
I know all too fondly 116thAvenue, 6th Avenue oh, so that's
the one in Chelsea.
Speaker 1 (29:26):
Oh, yeah, yeah, you're thinking the one in
Chelsea.
Exactly, I'm thinking the HBOoffices.
Yes, okay.
Speaker 2 (29:31):
So the one in Chelsea , the Google building, 118th
Avenue.
I spent two years of my careerin that building on the eighth
floor.
I was at a company that didtelecom services and it was a
big switching facility wheremillions of call minutes went
through that switch forcommercial businesses every
second.
Wow, and Google bought thebuilding and I remember being in
(29:54):
a meeting with very highranking executives at Google.
The CEO of the company I workedfor, which is a multi-billion
dollar company at the time, saidwe really want to renew our
lease.
Will you let us do that?
And Stone faced the executive.
The leading executive fromGoogle looked at the CEO of my
(30:15):
company, who I very muchrespected, and said no, we need
a break room on your floor.
Speaker 1 (30:23):
Stop it yeah.
Speaker 2 (30:24):
And then I watched the CEO of my company literally
cry because back then it was, Ibelieve, 2004 or 2005,.
Moving a telecom switchingfacility that processed that
many minutes is an impossibletask.
As luck would have it, digitalinternet-based calling came out
and we were able to do it fastforward with new gear, much
(30:48):
smaller footprint, but, yeah,that was the first time I saw an
adult man cry.
That's crazy it was rough, butI remember him saying no, we
need a break room.
Speaker 1 (30:57):
That is hilarious.
Speaker 2 (30:58):
Yeah, so it turned into a room with a kitchen and
slides and all the Google-esqueand ugly cultural it did.
Speaker 1 (31:05):
Yeah, so, funny.
Speaker 2 (31:07):
So with a lot of history in that building.
Speaker 1 (31:09):
Yeah, so, anyway.
So that was you know.
And then, once we launched HBILthat's why I said my work, I
think my work is done here.
Speaker 2 (31:17):
So that's why you left.
You were ready, checked out.
Speaker 1 (31:20):
A couple of things.
I mean, I turned 50.
I'd been there for 27 years.
I felt like I had accomplishedeverything I wanted to
accomplish and I definitelywanted to have the opportunity
for a second chapter that I justfelt like had some social
impact and, honestly, my kids atthe time were like fourth,
eighth and tenth grade.
(31:40):
I thought and I said, you know,what they needed.
Speaker 2 (31:42):
You.
Speaker 1 (31:43):
Well, I didn't need me as much as I needed them and
I just felt like you know,they'd only known me as the mom
that was commuting every day inthe New York City and traveling
and so forth.
So but they were also reallyproud of everything I had done
and I felt it was really to me.
It's also I love my job, I lovemy culture, I love the people
(32:06):
and I always say it's reallyimportant for your kids If
you're going to work, they needto see that you're enjoying what
you do, because if not, theyperceive it as you're making a
choice to do something that youknow you're making a choice to
do something that you hateversus spending time with them.
So for me, it was alwaysimportant that my kids saw how
(32:29):
much I love my job, the value Igot out of it, and I brought
them into the city with me asmuch as I could.
So that was really important.
Speaker 2 (32:35):
So they saw a strong, hardworking female in the
corporate world who cared aboutthem.
But your realization that lifehas to come first came after 50.
You accomplished a lot of greattasks, you made a great name
for yourself, and then whathappened?
Speaker 1 (32:54):
So then I used to imagine my it sounds terrible,
but my funeral and eulogy.
Speaker 2 (33:01):
I do that too, by the way you do.
So I was.
I do that too, right, I'd likea lot of people to show up.
Speaker 1 (33:06):
Right, but then it's not just a lot of people who
show up.
Speaker 2 (33:09):
Yes, there's an A list.
Speaker 1 (33:11):
And that was imagining at the time.
Okay, my CEO would bedelivering the eulogy and it
would be filled with all HBOpeople and I said I don't
necessarily know if I want my.
You know, shelley got Game ofThrones from your TV to your
iPhone as to be you know whatwas on my tombstone.
I just felt like there shouldbe something that was Something
more, something more, somethingthat was truly meaningful.
(33:35):
Yeah, so I decided to leave,and just which was?
You know, people don't do that,just leave their C-suite job
and just figure out what thatlooked like.
And so I was able to spend moretime at home, more time in our
town of Westfield, where I'dlived at the time for 23 years.
Honestly, my world had reallyevolved down in New York City.
(33:56):
Westfield, for me, was a placewhere I took my kids to their
sports activities on weekends.
I felt I was able to kind ofsee it with fresh eyes and I
realized we had a beautiful,historic downtown that had a lot
of vacancies, that was feelingthe impact of so many Main
Street.
America downtowns are, from,you know, digital shopping, and
(34:17):
they never really figured outthat pivot from brick and mortar
to what a future of downtownlooks like.
And so I just started askingquestions.
You know like oh well, what'sthe plan?
Basically, what's the plan?
Because it's not a quick fix.
It's something about changingthe ecosystem of your community
to support these businesses forthe long term.
Speaker 2 (34:38):
You did what you do best.
You asked the stupid questionthat everyone was thinking, but
too afraid to ask.
Speaker 1 (34:43):
I don't even know if they were thinking that.
I'll be honest with you, I justthink no one really.
You know, it takes a lot ofpolitical will to make
significant changes and it'shard, anyway.
So I start asking a lot ofquestions and then someone said
you know what?
And there was an electioncoming up and they said why
don't you consider running formayor?
I'm like no, no, no, deal withthe people, no, but can someone
(35:08):
else come and fix all?
these things you know and thenI don't know it.
Just you know, when you tellyour kids you know you can't
rely on others to do the workyou don't want to do, like I
didn't want to be the mayor andI told them I'm very open, I
don't want to be the mayor, Ijust want from a big CZE job.
And now I'm going to enterlocal politics for a free job
(35:29):
that you know comes with a lotof, you know, headache.
I mean honestly because of justthe it's politics right.
Speaker 2 (35:36):
Yeah, it's politics.
Speaker 1 (35:37):
On all aspects and putting yourself out there
running for office in yourcommunity, all that stuff.
So that was you know, and onething led to another, and that
was my daughter was really theimpotet.
She was the senior in highschool.
Then at the time, you know youcan't rely on others to do the
work.
And then you know, I watched.
I think I'm the only one thattook Barack Obama seriously when
(35:59):
he said you know, if you wantto make a difference, get a
clipboard, get some signaturesand run for office.
And then I honestly I was like,well, why not me Seriously,
like oh, the bug was planted.
Speaker 2 (36:11):
The model was there, the goal the working
professional woman there, an HRperson came and said you know,
you're a female, that's whatthey're talking about.
You can't do this.
Speaker 1 (36:21):
Yeah, that drove you further, you know, yeah, you're
probably right, and I was again.
Speaker 2 (36:28):
We are the same person we grew up as we were
kids.
That mentality, that strive,that and I'm a fighter.
Speaker 1 (36:33):
I am, and I just it was.
It was like why not me?
And like, honestly, it feltvery selfish that I, I don't
want to do that and so, and so,luckily, we had a great team and
we all won and and it's beenwell, you won you won twice.
Speaker 2 (36:50):
You are the first female mayor in the over 300
year existence of this town thefounding of this town.
I will say, all politicalaspects aside, you are a great
leader in this town you inspiremany.
As a father of daughters, I'mvery happy to see you as our
mayor.
Speaker 1 (37:05):
I'll be, I'll be.
I'd be lying if I didn't tellyou, though, running for local
office has been the hardestthing I've ever done in my
entire career.
Speaker 2 (37:14):
The hardest thing you've ever done in your career.
What do you hate most about it?
Speaker 1 (37:17):
The politics, the politics.
I told someone I like the job,I don't like the industry.
You know if that's a fair thingto say.
Unfortunately it's.
Sometimes when you makedecisions it's hard to decipher
our are the.
Are the objections legitimateobjections or are there some
(37:39):
that are just politically drivenbecause?
Speaker 2 (37:40):
Or emotionally or yeah, and trying we have.
We have a lot.
I've been to some of those townmeetings.
You have a lot of people thatare fundamentally unhinged with
any change and you canunderstand it, because they grew
up in this town, this is theirchildhood town, and to see the
town change yeah.
Right.
How would you like it ifsomeone moved next door tore?
(38:02):
Down the entire block and thenput up a new house.
Speaker 1 (38:03):
Yeah, you can understand it Right.
Speaker 2 (38:06):
But then there are some times, I imagine, you just
want to take someone by theshoulders and shake them.
Speaker 1 (38:10):
Well, yeah, you know I will say the job being mayor
has required a lot more empathy,which I think has been really
good for me in terms of, youknow, growth.
The other thing going back tolike why I ran, there was all of
that, but there was also aninsatiable little bit of a
curiosity to understand do thesame leadership principles that
were successful in the privatesector apply in the public
(38:33):
sector?
And you know, and I realizedthey do.
And because, at the end of theday, it's all about people.
So the focus has really been onthe town employees Because, at
the end of the day, if you havethat same notion where your town
employees whether it's police,fire, public works, court,
(38:56):
anybody who touches the public,right, if they're feeling valued
, if they're feelingacknowledged, if they feel like
they're part of something larger, you know what then they are
going to take a lot of pride inwhat they do and that's going to
show outwardly to the community, and so that and it's
interesting because you knowthere's a lot of union employees
(39:18):
, so you don't have the samelevers of incentivization in the
public sector that you do inthe private- Well, you have the
people.
But you have the people.
Speaker 2 (39:27):
People tend to want to do the best job that they can
, otherwise they're just schlubs.
Speaker 1 (39:31):
That's why I said no one.
I don't think anybody anywheregoes up and says you know what?
I don't, I don't.
I feel like I'm being verymediocre today.
Speaker 2 (39:38):
There's one guy.
Speaker 1 (39:39):
There's a few.
Speaker 2 (39:40):
Exactly, yeah, there's somebody out there who
says I just want to be yeahright.
Speaker 1 (39:44):
But I think most people do want to feel rewarded
and valued and acknowledgedright.
Speaker 2 (39:49):
Well, it's the herd mentality, right.
We want to be part of a group,we want to be part of something
bigger than us.
Yes, and really the bestincentive you can give an
employee or, in this case, aworker for the town, is a pat on
the back publicly praising inpublic criticizing in private,
because that lasts far longer.
Feeling like you're the hero,like you scored that home run
(40:11):
for the day yeah.
That's intrinsic in us fromearly childhood.
Speaker 1 (40:16):
They also want to feel honestly that someone has
their back.
And I'll never forget the mostperceptive conversation I had
when I first started, becauseyou know I come in thinking I'm
going to bring all this privatesector stuff to town hall and
you realize A even though I ran,you know a four and a half
billion dollar P&L like that,the P&L and municipal government
(40:38):
and finance there's nothingrelatable.
Speaker 2 (40:40):
No.
Speaker 1 (40:41):
And you're like.
So it's funny, the things Ithought I would bring in are
different from what I thought.
But one guy said to me I didn'tunderstand, like when residents
would come up with problems orchallenges and the answer to
them was, hey, sorry, we can'tdo that, as opposed to saying
you know we can't do that, butthis is what you might be able
to do and try to.
You know, try to get to yes,offer a solution.
(41:02):
Offer a solution and I just getto yes, culture, that I talk
about it.
And he said to me I asked thatquestion and he says you know
why, mayor?
Because you never know what anelected official is going to
sell you down the river, which Iwas so glad he said that to me
that's a very politicalstatement.
But what he was saying and it'strue a lot of times these
public employees and I hopepeople that listen to this think
(41:24):
about this next time is that ifthey go out on a limb, they
never know if, like who they'rehelping or rewarding somehow
might get back to the mayor oranother elected official and
claim I don't know, they didn'tdo this or they did this or you
did, you know.
So it's just easier for them tostay in their box, to stay in
(41:44):
their lane, to stay in theirlane.
But what I discovered over thelast few years when they've seen
, when they've seen me have thecourage and fortitude to stand
up to public objections oralways have their back, they're
putting themselves out there.
They are now becoming verysolution oriented.
Speaker 2 (42:07):
You're empowering them to step a little bit more
outside of their comfort zone.
Speaker 1 (42:12):
Because they know I'm always going to have their back
.
And so, therefore, and I tellthem, I got you back every time,
and you've seen it in thepolice, in the fire, and so what
gives me such pleasure?
It's a lot of stuff.
The public sees it, but theydon't know what it is a result
of.
But, and we've done that, we'veinvested in equipment, we
(42:34):
provide them automation, weprovide them tools, and when you
do that, people say they'reinvesting in me, right?
So therefore, I'm going to goforward.
So a lot of the progress youmight see in town isn't anything
that I've done specifically.
It's the things that we put inplace to let our employees do
their best jobs.
Speaker 2 (42:54):
So one thing that I would do and I realize that
you're running the town as if itis a company, right, culturally
.
Yes, you're treating peoplewith the respect you're giving
them the power, empowering themwith what they need.
And it does show, I will say,from police the fire to the new
equipment, to the way that thepolice respond to you.
(43:15):
The police don't harass you,they're happy to see you If you
have an issue.
They're welcoming, they want tospeak to you.
I've actually become friendswith several of the police
officers, so you treat peoplewell.
It bleeds out right.
Happy employees breed happycustomers.
You can see a smile over thephone.
I absolutely believe that.
But sometimes you have toremind people.
(43:36):
So one trick I would do in mycorporate business was at the
end of the year, before bonustime, we would show and
demonstrate that we covered 100%of your health care.
Just a little reminder.
We put you through training andyou could look at that as
almost like a corporatementality, but no, the purpose
of that was to remind everybodyof what they have and to
(44:00):
appreciate it, because all toooften in personal and business
we stop appreciating things.
Speaker 1 (44:05):
Yes.
Speaker 2 (44:06):
We stop realizing what others do for us to empower
us, and I think that's verybeneficial.
Is you do that with the town?
There is, at some point I get atown letter of all the
accomplishments and it's verybeautifully made, it's well done
, it's well marketed, and I sitthere and I read it and I say,
oh wow, I didn't know that, butthat's great.
(44:27):
That's awesome we bought a newfire truck that will benefit me.
I hope I never have to use it.
Yeah, but that'll benefit me.
Speaker 1 (44:34):
I'm glad to hear you acknowledge that whole purpose
of that was to make theresidents feel better about
their tax pay.
They're what they pay for.
Speaker 2 (44:42):
Oh, we do pay a lot of taxes.
Speaker 1 (44:44):
We pay a lot of taxes .
Speaker 2 (44:45):
We pay a lot of taxes .
Speaker 1 (44:46):
Exactly, but that's exactly right.
It's to make them like okay,I'm getting my money, well, my
money's worth, to the degree wecan do that in our state.
Speaker 2 (44:55):
Well, everyone's got to speak of taxes.
Everyone has a way to check offif they value or if they're
getting value out of their taxes.
For me three kids in publicschools I value my taxes Right
Now.
I've had this conversation withChristie, my wife.
When do we move?
Yes, Right, Are we lifelonghere?
Yeah, Are we going to pay thatincreasing tax bill?
Speaker 1 (45:16):
Right.
Speaker 2 (45:17):
Or do we move after the kids graduate from college?
Right, it's a very touchysubject right now.
Yes, christie, and I love thistown.
We'll see.
We'll see.
Hopefully I do well enough inlife to want to stay here.
Speaker 1 (45:31):
Well, I hope so, and now we've got all this amazing
investment coming into town.
Speaker 2 (45:36):
So in this small community there are so many
successful, business-mindedpeople.
It's amazing.
It is amazing.
It is amazing the wealth ofknowledge and success and again
in my pursuit of finding, isthere such thing as success
that's not tied to wealth?
Right and the relevance factor.
Speaker 1 (45:57):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (45:58):
So what is your definition of success?
Speaker 1 (46:00):
You know, I think it's about impact.
I think it's about what impacthave you made in your community,
as you define it, and thatcould be your community, whether
it's you know your family,where you live.
But I just think beyondmaterial things, and that's I
(46:24):
just want to be able to say myhusband thinks I'm crazy because
I've, no matter what I do, Idon't think I've ever done
enough.
Speaker 2 (46:30):
And I think that's a record all husbands think their
wives are crazy and all wivesthink their husbands are crazy.
If you were to ask Chrissy ifI'm crazy, she'll say yes.
Speaker 1 (46:38):
Yeah, so, yeah.
So I just think it's aboutimpact, and have you done
everything you can do to make adifference in the world?
Speaker 2 (46:48):
So the story?
Yeah.
So do you associate wealth ormoney with success?
No, not at all, and actuallyIsn't it sad how many people do.
Speaker 1 (46:57):
Yeah, and it's funny.
I just met with all the thirdgraders yesterday.
As you well know, they're sointrigued by like when I tell
them I make a dollar and theywant to know how, oh, my
daughters came home and they'relike dad, you make more money
than the mayor.
Speaker 2 (47:12):
I said, well, not really.
Speaker 1 (47:15):
But I think like and I tell this to women in
particular, because I thinkwomen tend to be the most
vulnerable to it I've never beencaught up in the I don't know
the privileges or the stature ofposition, and so, even as I
grew in my career at HBO and wasearning pretty good money, I
(47:37):
never changed how I live.
Maybe I went on some greatvacations and ate well, but it
didn't really change anything.
Part of it was I always wantedto be working on my terms and I
wanted to be able to walk outthe door any day on my terms,
and not because I'm beholden tothe paycheck.
And that's when I said you know, fire me for doing the right
(48:00):
thing, I'll take it.
I wanted to be able to do that,and so I've just never valued
that level of wealth and it'sjust more about you know, the
teachers you meet and thosereally I see those are the real,
those are the people I reallyrespect.
Speaker 2 (48:18):
Are you impressed with people who are wealthy
Monetarily, that is?
Speaker 1 (48:23):
No, the money doesn't impress me.
Like, if someone, like, is aninnovator and has done really
and they took a lot of risk,they happen to make a lot of
money because it great, but I'mmore impressed with what got
them there than I am about themoney itself.
So, but you know, there'speople who are innovators in
professions that don't aren't aslucrative.
So, no, I'm not, if anything.
I'm honest.
(48:43):
Honestly, I'm kind of like ahate to say it.
I'm almost an anti elitist.
Speaker 2 (48:50):
There's nothing wrong with that, because I agree with
you.
I have met billionaires thatare miserable and I have met
people that barely make it by,that are so happy, and that's
when it clicks and you startrealizing I can't take it with.
You is true.
Speaker 1 (49:09):
Well, there's this book.
So I was talking about theinnovators dilemma.
I don't know if you've everread that book by Clayton
Christensen, nope.
So he was coming to an eventthat we were having and I said,
oh, let me make sure I read hisbooks before I go.
So I did not read.
Oh, I had read the innovatorsdilemma, but there's another
book he had written called howWill you Measure your Life, and
that's the book I read, and itwas the first book I read.
(49:30):
That actually explained my ownsuccess to me.
But what he said in that bookhe was now a established author,
a very successful professor atHarvard, and he said he went to
his 30th year reunion at Harvardand he couldn't figure out why
there are so many successfulpeople who are so miserable
(49:52):
Alcoholics, divorces, kids whoare estranged or whatever it was
.
So we actually did someresearch to understand what
happened and what he discoveredand I think this is true is that
a lot of these people,especially those that come out
of elite colleges or whatever,they might want to go to the
Peace Corps, teach for America,go be a teacher, do whatever
(50:15):
they want to do.
He said they get the offersfrom Bain and McKinsey or
whoever else.
And so they go and they're like, okay, I'm gonna go do that for
a couple years and make all themoney, and then I'm gonna go
pursue what I really want to do,or go start that incubator or
whatever it was, and then guesswhat happens.
They get on that hamster wheeland they can't stop.
(50:35):
The drug is in their system 30years later they've, like now in
a part where they maybe arereflecting back a little bit and
realize they missed theopportunity to do whatever they
ever did.
So I gave that book to everyintern I ever had and I just
think it's really important tokind of be clear on that North
(50:56):
Star early and not try it'seasier said than done,
especially if you've got studentloans and all that kind of
stuff, but I don't know just tryto remember what it is that
drives you and what makes youhappy and try to stay on that
path.
Speaker 2 (51:11):
As Americans cuz I can only speak from the American
standpoint we're programmed atan early age that money is
everything.
You see all of this marketingflashed in front of your eyes,
your brain absorbed it.
It's a constant stream of want,want, want, need, need and
unfortunately, we've tied moneyto that feeling.
Money and materials Right.
(51:32):
I look at money as simply aresource.
Do you have enough for yougoing to run out?
Now again, there are plenty ofpeople that live by their means
and there are plenty of peoplethat overspend.
I think we are anovermaterialized, overspending
society, overreaching constantly.
And social media, it's all themarketing.
(51:53):
And it's unfortunate becausethe pursuit of true happiness is
impossible if you're constantlychasing.
Yeah, and that's what we are.
We're a society as a wholethat's constantly chasing.
I'll be happy when this willmake me happy if, but we don't
live in the moment when themoment is truly up, and it's
(52:14):
usually not on your choice.
Speaker 1 (52:15):
Right, exactly.
Speaker 2 (52:17):
And I'm now 43.
I turned 43 recently.
You're such a youngster I guessmy brain thinks I'm 28.
My herniated back occasionallydoes not Right, but I'm learning
how to deal with that,especially as a hank.
But yeah, so I did a completepivot.
I went from corporate Americato just say you know what, screw
(52:40):
it.
I'm going to be happy, mysuccess being in my kid's life
every day.
Because that old man on hisdeathbed the last few moments,
when asked do you have anyregrets?
That story's been heard.
You never hear him say I wish Ibought that yacht.
Speaker 1 (52:56):
Right.
Speaker 2 (52:57):
Right, it's always.
I wish I was in my children'slives.
Speaker 1 (53:00):
It's very true.
It's very true.
Speaker 2 (53:03):
So it sounds like and looks like and is similar in
your world because you have donethat.
Speaker 1 (53:10):
Yeah, but it's funny my kids laugh because you know,
going from corporate, I'm nolonger commuting but the mayor
obligation has there's a lot ofnights and weekends and so forth
.
Speaker 2 (53:22):
They're like what I always see you around town.
So what's interesting is ittruly is a volunteer position
and it only pays a dollar.
You have to have some sense ofsavings to be able to do the job
, and I wasn't really in thetown when the last mayor was
here, but I'm fairly certain hehad a full-time job and was a
(53:43):
mayor.
Speaker 1 (53:43):
Correct and most of them do and because, honestly,
most people that can't sustainthemselves on a volunteer job.
And I committed when I ran todo it full-time.
Now, keep in mind, when I leftHBO the plan wasn't oh, let me
go take a full-time job thatdoesn't pay.
That wasn't the conversation Ihad with my financial advisor,
(54:05):
so he's like okay.
But going back to thatconversation earlier about, for
me I just never really valuedthe big material things and able
to save a bunch of money sothat we could make the decisions
for our family.
But you're right, and thechallenge, it wasn't a hard
thing for me to commit to doingthis full-time because I had a
(54:25):
really big vision for the townand there was no way you could
push that forward with whatneeded to happen.
Doing it on nights and weekends, it just wasn't going to be
possible.
When you're only able to do itpart-time, you're just
sustaining, right, and it's likeyou're more of a If you can
sustain.
Speaker 2 (54:41):
Right and probably not even sustaining exactly Well
, yeah, with the amount ofexplosive growth this town saw,
especially after the pandemic.
I mean every single house thatwas listed, much like other
places in America.
It was listed, it was upbid, itwas swarmed and sold, even
still right now, which with suchincredibly high rates, I'm
shocked.
Speaker 1 (55:02):
I mean nobody's moving, and I was very clear
also when I ran.
It goes back to that pointbeing fearless, Since I didn't
really ever want to be the mayor.
Speaker 2 (55:11):
I'm not really You're not afraid of being the mayor.
Speaker 1 (55:13):
I'm not afraid of being the mayor and I'm not
afraid about losing the job.
So, as a result, I used to.
I would tell people listen, Iam not going to be the mayor of
the status quo.
If that's what you're lookingfor, he's your guy, it's not me.
Speaker 2 (55:28):
That's a great quote.
I will not be the mayor of thestatus quo.
Speaker 1 (55:31):
Because I wanted it to be very clear.
If I won, I wanted people toknow what they were getting.
And so when I do these bigthings, I don't want you to
think, oh, I didn't know that.
And so, and luckily, we werereelected, and so we keep moving
forward.
Speaker 2 (55:47):
So are you going to run again in the next cycle?
Where's it too soon?
Speaker 1 (55:50):
It's too soon.
I think I'm very committed toseeing through this big $450
million project that we have inthe works.
Speaker 2 (55:59):
And what's the timeline for that?
Speaker 1 (56:01):
Well, it should break ground late next year.
But you know there's a lot of.
Speaker 2 (56:05):
Big investment in the town.
Speaker 1 (56:06):
Big and huge investment, Big tax infusion,
Revenue infusion for the towntax, major public benefits.
It reminded me, honestly, doingthat negotiation with the
Hudson's Bay Company, which is alarge North American
conglomerate.
I felt like I was back in theComcast boardroom.
I really did.
You know, at the end of the day, you have to know what is
(56:29):
important to each side and cometo a place and Do you feel like
you won?
I feel like the town won and Ireally do, and that was really
what I was, all I really caredabout.
The big difference is, as Itold my old HBO folks, I said in
the private sector you kind ofsay, okay, we're going here and
you know, you know you're goingto have people who will post up.
(56:51):
At the end of the day they getsome line because you know it's
their job, it's their paycheck.
In the public sector, thosepeople go right to social media.
Speaker 2 (57:00):
They go right to social media.
You're technically not theirboss.
They're elected to, so you musthave the patience of a saint.
Actually it's so funny, Ireally do not Well you had to
learn something, just like youhave to have empathy.
Speaker 1 (57:15):
Yeah, the empathy you learn, you really do try to
understand, try to give peoplethe benefit of the doubt.
You have a lot of moralfortitude and I think, if
anything, I get very committedto things.
When I believe they're theright thing to do, I'll tell
them, I'll jump on my back, I'mgoing to take you through this,
but you know what, the peoplethat are around you looking at
(57:38):
you as a leader to see if you,like you know, waver and your
strength gives them strength.
And I think that was even thisand that's true, that's just
true in leadership, whether it'syou know, you're in politics or
whether you're in the boardroom.
And you have to be, as a leader, I think, fully committed to
(58:01):
where you're going and theoutcome, and never let your team
see you sweat.
Speaker 2 (58:06):
Never let your team see you sweat.
That's interesting to mebecause there have been a couple
of times where I've let my teamlet's take a seat.
Yeah, I've been there a coupleof times where I've let my team
see me sweat because I wanted toappear human.
Speaker 1 (58:20):
Yeah, yeah, I think it's different.
Like tell them, like, listen,this is where the
vulnerabilities are.
This is the part I'm afraid of.
But you know what, we're goingfor it and I think you're right
being very real, even going backto that notion about
transparency, when I would shareall the information about the
company, it would be like, yeah,you know what, we're in a
(58:41):
really bad place and we gotthree months to turn this around
and you end up creating thissense of spree to core.
You know we're all in thistogether and we're going to make
it happen, and I think that'svery different than it's knowing
that you're going to going backto it.
You're going to have their back, go to bed, and I think that's
what's really important for themto see.
Speaker 2 (59:02):
I agree, for everyone's got a different
leadership style.
So for me, I was never the mostcharismatic right and I had to
earn that respect from people byhelping them and showing them
how much value they had.
And if I made a mistake I'd bethe first person to fall on the
sword and say, whoops, I screwedup.
And I think that helped me inmy career and that helped keep
my people in the company.
(59:24):
In 10 years of running mytelecom business, we never had
anyone quit and that, to me, wasthe most rewarding statistic I
had, because that meant I wasliked.
People show value and they'recareers with with.
You know my success and theirsuccess.
So that was, that was arewarding feeling.
So, shelly, I want to thank you.
Thank you, this was amazing.
(59:46):
You are an amazing person.
Speaker 1 (59:47):
Oh, you're so nice.
Speaker 2 (59:48):
I truly mean that as I look you in the eyes.
You're an amazing person youare.
You are an inspiration to many,especially my daughters.
Thank you so much.
Speaker 1 (59:56):
It's been a privilege , thank you.
Speaker 2 (59:58):
Next time on, I Took a Hike.
We take a spirited journey withDaisy Joplin, a classical and
rock violinist and founder ofthe Daisy Joplin Music
Mentorship Foundation.
Till next time, I'm Darren Mass.
Thanks for listening.
Hey hikers, the turkeys have taken over the
trail so, in honor of theirThanksgiving hustle, we're
bringing back one enjoyableepisode from Season 1 for your
holiday pleasure.
We'll be back next Tuesday,november 28th, with an exciting
conversation featuring DaisyJoplin, the fantastic classical
rock violinist.
Happy Thanksgiving to everyoneand a special thank you to those
(00:28):
delectable turkeys.
Unless you're a vegan orvegetarian.
In that case, a big thank youto all of the delicious tofu
furkeys out there.
Okay, first I will start offwith my obligatory.
Are you okay with beingrecorded on a podcast?
Speaker 1 (00:43):
Yes, I am.
Speaker 2 (00:44):
Well, there goes that liability.
This is.
I Took a Hike.
I'm your host, darren Mass,founder of business therapy
group in Parktime, wildernessPhilosopher.
Here we step out of theboardrooms and home offices and
into the great outdoors wherethe hustle of entrepreneurship
meets the rustle of nature.
In this episode I chat with themayor of Westfield, new Jersey,
and former C-suite executive atHBO, shelly Brindle.
(01:07):
Our topics include growing upin a single-parent home,
challenging the All BoysExecutive Club, rising to the
political occasion and so muchmore.
There was so much inspirationwhen I took a hike with Shelly
Brindle.
You are the Westfield mayor.
(01:29):
Yes, mayor, shelly Brindle, ifI may, what is your salary?
A dollar, a?
Speaker 1 (01:35):
year.
A dollar a year and I'm notallowed to cash the check, so
just saying.
Speaker 2 (01:42):
You're not allowed to cash the check.
But what does that mean?
The town has an open balance ofcurrently what five?
Speaker 1 (01:48):
Six dollars.
Six dollars, exactly All right.
Speaker 2 (01:50):
So there's a six dollar open balance.
You're not allowed to soessentially, the accountants are
not allowed to balance thebooks.
Speaker 1 (01:56):
You're absolutely right, I haven't really thought
about that.
Yeah, this could be a liability, you know.
Speaker 2 (02:01):
So clearly.
In order to have thisaltruistic nature to be the
mayor of a town, volunteer yourtime.
Yes, you have had to have someextensive business success in
your life.
Speaker 1 (02:14):
Yes.
Speaker 2 (02:15):
So why don't we take a look back at what you did
prior to being a mayor and we'llfinally wind up on what it's
like to be a mayor and thechallenges I can imagine in
dealing with people, especiallyopposing opinions?
Speaker 1 (02:33):
Yes, and really in the insights between private and
public sector, which have beenreally interesting.
But if we want to go way, wayback prior to my, even my career
, before being mayor because I'malways intrigued by what life
decisions people have made orwhere they grew up, that kind of
(02:53):
informed, ultimately, the paththat they chose, and I think it
wasn't until actually I becamemayor that I started reflecting
back and figured, oh, that'sprobably where I ended up here.
So my dad was an Air Forcepilot and he was killed in
Vietnam when I was six years old.
Oh, wow, so my mom and I hadtwo older sisters.
My mom picked us up from wherewe were living in Nevada at the
(03:17):
time, this small town inVirginia, and I realized I only
grew up with women in the house.
So we were like a pack of fourwomen and I tell this to the
Girl Scouts actually.
So there were never any boychores or girl chores in our
house, they were just chores.
And so, you know, did it all,cut in the grass, clean out the
garbage a whole bit, and then, Ithink only later that was
(03:40):
definitely informative, becausethere was never any sense of
where women belong versus menbelong.
And then, you know, in collegeI became a football manager and
I was on a full scholarship forworking with the football team
at the University of Virginia.
Speaker 2 (03:55):
Oh, wow.
Speaker 1 (03:56):
Yeah, where, once again, I was one of the few
women in the arena, if you will,and I'll be honest with you.
I was a good student at school,but I wasn't an exceptional
student and I like to tellpeople I didn't even get into
the business school at UVAbecause I realized my brain
thinks much more creatively andI'm not the finance person or
the accounting person, because Ido better when there aren't
(04:18):
constraints with what you can do, and that's what I realized
when I got into the businessworld.
I get hyper focused on resultsand I was always the one that
good morning, able to reallyidentify, like what was the
primary priorities of what wewere trying to accomplish and
then zero in on what needs tohappen to drive that ball
(04:42):
forward.
Eventually that led just Idon't know, I just ended up
delivering results.
I moved to New York and Istarted in a marketing job at
HBO and I ended up pretty muchdoing almost every job you could
do from, you know, marketing,overseeing research to product
development, to ultimatelygetting to the C-suite where I
(05:02):
was running the EVP of domesticdistribution and marketing,
where I was overseeing prettymuch the domestic revenue for
the company.
Speaker 2 (05:11):
Hey listener, thanks for hiking along with us.
Discover more episodes athightokahikecom, or to recommend
an adventurous guest, apply tobe a sponsor, discover books
along the trail, or to simplydrop us a line.
Let's take a step back.
So you grew up in a house withfour girls.
I have three daughters and mywife.
(05:33):
I can only imagine what thathouse is, especially as a single
parent house.
Yes, lots of strife, lots ofscreaming and not enough
hairbrushes.
Speaker 1 (05:44):
Yes, you know it well , I can tell you in my life
every morning wears thehairbrush.
Speaker 2 (05:52):
I have relegated a hairbrush on a chain so I can
imagine what that house was like.
More power to your mom, becauseto be a single parent first of
all is extremely challenging,daunting.
You have to earn, you have towork and feed and take care of
all your children.
So that's an amazingaccomplishment right there, and
(06:12):
I hope you thank your motherthroughout all of this.
Speaker 1 (06:15):
Oh she knows, and you know, and we didn't have a lot
of money because back then Well,how could you?
Yeah, and the military didn'toffer the same benefits that
they might offer families today,but it's never enough.
But yes, we had these majordrag out screaming fights, but
we were also like in it togetherand we'd sit around the dinner
(06:35):
table and figure out how we'regoing to get money for my
sister's prom dress, I mean.
So it became this very we'reall in this together, like you
know, how are we going to figurethis out?
So, but yeah, I think inhindsight, when I became the
first female and only femaleexecutive in the C-suite at HBO
and then later to become thefirst female mayor of my town, I
(06:59):
can't help but think that thoseearly experiences in my family
somewhat informed that path.
Speaker 2 (07:06):
Oh well, of course, all of the experiences,
especially in early childhoodand to adolescence, shape who we
are today.
Right, Sometimes we like toescape who we are.
Speaker 1 (07:16):
Yes, exactly.
Speaker 2 (07:17):
But that's never going to happen, right?
There are times where the wordsout of my mouth and the voice
that I hear in my brain is myfather the one you probably
swear you'd never be Swore sworeI would not be like him.
I respected him, but I swore Iwould be different.
I'd be more present for my kids, which I have been.
But sometimes I say those dadjokes and say guess what I said
(07:42):
Use your head for more than justa hat rack.
Speaker 1 (07:45):
What do you make sense All right.
Speaker 2 (07:47):
So you have a strong background in essentially
surviving right.
Fending for yourself and afamily that big with one single
parent that gets you to college.
You were an okay student andguess what?
Most successful people werejust okay students.
Speaker 1 (08:03):
That's right.
Speaker 2 (08:04):
Myself included.
I was just an okay student atbest.
And then you get hired at HBO.
Being a female is a challengein a very stuffy corporate world
.
You are an executive in the Csuite.
What were some of your biggestaccomplishments at HBO?
Speaker 1 (08:24):
Well, that's a good question and it's funny just to
back up a little bit about whatyou said about being a woman,
because what was interesting isthat at HBO at the time you know
I'm dating myself now in thelate 18, late 80s it was a very
young company and fairlyprogressive, so it was actually
a good place to be a woman in amedia environment that was
(08:47):
rapidly changing.
So there's a lot of opportunityfor women.
It's funny, I didn't reallyrealize the impact Good morning,
good morning.
And the challenge is, honestly,until I got into the C suite
and I remember thinking, gosh,you know, we don't have there's
no challenges with women gettingadvancing, because I kept
(09:09):
moving forward.
And then I got in the C suiteand I was laughing, I'm like, oh
, this is what's happening uphere.
So that was very interesting,but really my probably my
accomplishment.
I was always a bit of atransformational person, so I
was always given things thatwere somewhat broken and trying
(09:29):
to fix it, and so really it waswhen I moved into that C suite
role where I was given theresponsibility for the revenue
of the company and, quitefrankly, it was at a time when
Netflix was, you know, stilldelivering red envelopes to
people's houses.
But it was pretty obvious wherethat future was going, and so
(09:50):
when I took over that job,historically our distribution
partners were the traditionalcable companies, you know
Comcast and Cox and all of those.
Speaker 2 (09:59):
I know them all too well, coming from telecom, and
the challenges in working withmonster companies.
Speaker 1 (10:05):
Exactly.
And so when I took over I waslike, okay, but, and we had a,
you know, a company a lot of oursales and marketing folks had
been there a really long timeand I said we have to prepare
ourselves for a future where ourdistribution partners are Apple
and Google and Facebook andeverything else and we need to
(10:27):
make sure that we're reallyequipped, both organizationally
and strategically, to reallycapture that.
And I remember looking aroundat all the things that are all
great and I'd been there a longtime too.
And that's when you know, yourealize you can't fire everybody
, but you can inspire everyone.
Speaker 2 (10:46):
This episode is sponsored by Business Therapy
Group.
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Book your session with me atbusinesstherapygroupcom.
(11:08):
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Speaker 1 (11:18):
And it really is about getting people vested in
that outcome.
And I'll never forget the bigmeeting we did with the layoff
people.
We reorganized, integrated kindof sales and marketing into
these different teams, provideda different level of
accountability for results.
And I really believe in myleadership mantra has always
been around three principles,and it really is.
(11:42):
I always say it's transparency,empowerment and accountability,
and what I mean by that.
It's very important to be very,very transparent with the
entire team.
Like I think a lot of leaderswill sometimes communicate in
silos so like, oh, this teamonly works on this, so I'm going
to give them all theinformation they need for this
(12:03):
and then this team works on this, so they'll only know about
this.
But I wanted people to be ableto be able to respond and make
decisions opportunistically whenthey have them, and the only
way you can do that is if youhave full information about what
is driving the business.
So I wanted the leaders thatwere running let's just hit the
(12:23):
Comcast team if they were in aComcast meeting and there was an
opportunity, a growthopportunity for HBO within that
account, it might sound like agreat idea for Comcast, but
whatever that decision was couldhave impact on the other pieces
of the business.
If they didn't understand that,they would be going in there
(12:44):
saying yes, yes, yes, butactually the larger benefit
would be a no.
So the reason it was importantto be transparent and so we
would have these team meetingsand we would share everything,
for every single piece ofbusiness, with everyone, so that
then they could go into thoseplaces and feel vested in that
larger outcome and makedecisions based upon the results
.
But the third leg of that stool, which I think is the hardest
(13:09):
and most often ignored, isaccountability.
And if you don't hold peopleaccountable for delivering very
clear on objectives, bothsubjectively and quantifiably,
the other two things don'tmatter and everything breaks
down.
Because you know it's a cliche,but it's true You're only as
good as your weakest link.
Right, right.
Speaker 2 (13:28):
This is true.
So you said a quote that Iloved you can't fire everybody,
but you can inspire them.
Yes, based on that quote, youand I are very aligned.
Believe in people.
Speaker 1 (13:38):
Yes.
Speaker 2 (13:38):
Right.
You wouldn't be where you're attoday without the help of
others supporting you, and theonly way you can gain support of
others is to be likable,charismatic and be in the
service of supporting those verysame people.
That's right.
So would it be fair to say thatyou are a cultural leader?
Speaker 1 (13:57):
Yeah, I'm very passionate about culture because
to me, culture is everything.
People is everything.
You know.
People married with the rightculture is what delivers
exceptional outcomes.
And my job honestly and it'snot people don't believe it, but
my role whenever I took on anew position is to make myself
feel relevant and it's funny.
Speaker 2 (14:19):
Hold on, I'm going to pause you right there.
So the purpose of everythingthat I've done since the sale of
my company has been the pursuitof relevance.
It's a very important word andyou got there without me asking
you.
So let's talk about relevanceand what relevance means.
Speaker 1 (14:36):
I think it's in two, and actually there's a part
where you want to be relevant,but as a leader, I think a goal
should be to make yourselfirrelevant, because in so doing,
what that means you're doing isthat you're surrounding
yourself with people who aresuper smart mostly smarter than
me who have core competenciesthat are compliment whatever I
(14:59):
do, and if you empower them in away to take ownership of the
decisions, at the end of the day, the role of the leader should
be like you know what my work isdone here and they can kind of
go from there, and the ironicpart is a lot of leaders are
afraid of that because they feellike they then will become
themselves personally irrelevant.
But by doing that you everysingle experience of mine is,
(15:23):
when you create a culture likethat of empowering these people
and giving them ownership of theoutcomes, you deliver
exceptional outcomes, and thenguess what happens.
As a leader, then you getpicked to choose to go and do
something else.
Speaker 2 (15:36):
So I love that.
So, as a coach, I mentor my CEOclients that if you cannot take
a vacation and leave yourcompany for at least two weeks,
preferably a month, then it'snot a healthy company.
So, in line with what you'resaying about irrelevance, you
(15:56):
have to be able to step away,trust your people to do the job
and the task and be able tosupport your customer and
themselves without yourinvolvement to have a healthy
company or, in this case, youwant to make yourself irrelevant
.
To be relevant, that's exactlyright.
Speaker 1 (16:15):
I think a lot of leaders are afraid and there's
another kind of similar equationin that which I said.
I was always the consider the.
I was always the one neverafraid to ask the dumbest
question in the room.
Speaker 2 (16:30):
It was the same.
In fact, having ADHD, I wasalso the class clown and I
wasn't afraid to embarrassmyself, which you met one of my
daughters yesterday.
But it's that type of thinking,especially as a child, that
develops strong leaders, theability to not be.
You're asking any question,regardless of if it's quote,
(16:52):
unquote, dumb or not.
That's courage.
Speaker 1 (16:55):
Well, you realize, when you're not afraid to ask
the dumb question, you know what.
Everybody else has the samequestion, they're just afraid to
ask it.
And so I was always the onethat would say you know people,
they'd come in and share thisgreat strategy.
And I'm like, okay, that soundsgreat, people would be
enthralled with it.
And I'm like, okay, how doesthat make sense?
And how are we making money?
And suddenly everybody's like,huh, and it's funny.
(17:17):
People would say how do youhave the courage to take so many
risks?
And I always felt like nottaking risks was more fearful
for me than taking them, because, going back to your point about
relevance, it's like for me itwas always about pushing things
(17:38):
forward.
But the irony is I keptthinking like you know what fire
me for doing the right thing?
I take that any day of the weekand I used to tell that to my
team moral fortitude.
Yeah, moral fortitude.
And guess what I kept gettingpromoted and that's what I tell
people is like sometimes, ourown fears they're keep us, keep
us back from achieving what itis we really aspire to do.
(18:01):
And I think that was the othergoing back with make yourself
irrelevant.
To become relevant, try tobecome a bit more fearless to
actually get to the place whereyou want to go.
And a lot of people don't makethat connection.
Speaker 2 (18:14):
So fear, uncertainty and doubt is you know, the fud
or the fud factor is cripplingfor most Not many, but most
people being afraid to ask yourmanager a question or disagree
with a directive.
But in the right, way In theright way, one of the books that
I have all my clients read is abook by Patrick Lincioni called
(18:35):
Getting Naked.
Speaker 1 (18:35):
It's a great book.
Speaker 2 (18:37):
I recommend that you read it or anyone reads it, for
that matter and no, they are notsponsoring this show, but I
believe in this so heavily.
I've listened to it hundreds,if not a thousand times already,
and it talks about removing thethree biggest fears that hold
us back from being successfulthe fear of vulnerability, the
fear of embarrassment and thefear of failure.
(19:00):
And it's a business fable thatdemonstrates the always be
selling mentality and jumping in.
As you know, always startconsulting and assuming the
client.
But if you can get past thosethree biggest fears, you can
find much greater success,because your client will
appreciate the fact that yousaid you don't really agree with
their marketing, Right?
(19:21):
So it's a very important themeand it obviously worked for you
throughout your career.
Now I will ask you a pointedquestion.
Do you believe that you as afemale in the corporate world in
the 80s, in the 90s, was lookedat a little more heavily as a
(19:43):
checkbox in the time?
I?
Speaker 1 (19:45):
would actually say gosh.
I have to say, ironically, Iwould think I was less than a
checkbox earlier in my careerthan I was later in my career.
I'll never forget, actually,them telling me when I was being
considered for this role and itwas running and typically there
had been a separate salesorganization, a separate
(20:07):
marketing organization they werecombining all of it and putting
it under me and that role thatcertainly ran the distribution
arm of the organization had onlyever been led by men and it was
always on our executive floor,on the C-suite.
So not only did I get that job,I got a bigger job than any of
them had ever had before andthey actually asked our HR are
you actually going to put her onthe executive floor?
Speaker 2 (20:29):
Ah, so that was a real conversation.
Yeah, you were made aware ofthat conversation at the time.
Speaker 1 (20:33):
Yes, Luckily the HR person told me that in like
incredulous like can you believe?
People are asking me are youactually going to put her on
their floor?
No, other women were there.
This was in 2010.
Speaker 2 (20:46):
It wasn't like it was way past when that would be
allowed.
To be honest, the fact that theHR individual brought that up
is technically a no-no in the HRworld.
But, you had a greatrelationship with him.
Speaker 1 (21:00):
We did and I think he was doing me a bit of a favor,
Like okay, just so you know,this is kind of what you're
walking into.
And it was just a reallyinteresting dynamic because I
definitely felt like when I gotup there, I'm like, oh, who
doesn't belong?
No, you can tell.
I felt like I was in intrusionon a club.
Speaker 2 (21:20):
So I love that.
I love that because you weretold you can't do something and
you use that as drive.
Absolutely, oh yeah you don'twant me here.
I'm going to prove to you notonly can I do your job, I'll do
it better, more efficient andstronger than you.
Speaker 1 (21:36):
That's right and you know what, and we had some of
the best performance we had in30 years.
And then it led, obviouslygoing back to that conversation
I had earlier about who ourclients of the future were going
to be.
Well, then it came all aboutstreaming, and so really it was
about leading an organization toreally kind of the streaming
(21:56):
future.
And when he asked me earlier,some of the biggest
accomplishments I had was onewas changing the culture that we
talked about so importantly toone that was more innovative, I
like to think, which, ultimately, is what led to the ability for
streaming.
But and so anyway.
So, and once HBO Go launched,and then HBO Now launched, and
(22:17):
now HBO brand is Max.
Don't even get me started onthat.
Speaker 2 (22:21):
Wait, you just glossed over this so what was
your contribution in HBO Go andstreaming services?
Speaker 1 (22:27):
Well, think about it.
We saw, you know, netflixcoming, we saw where things were
going and all of our revenue,95% of the company's revenue,
was tied to traditional cabledistributors who did not want us
going around that traditionaldistribution mechanism.
Because most people, a lot ofpeople, don't realize.
(22:47):
You know, hbo was not aretailer, we are a wholesaler.
We sold our content to ourproduct, to Comcast or those of
the world who then sent it tocharge the customer.
That does make sense yes and sopeople used to always ask me if
I got HBO for free.
I'm like I don't know, becausethat means Comcast would have to
give it to me for free.
Speaker 2 (23:06):
One of your perks, you could save $9.99 a month.
Speaker 1 (23:08):
Yeah, exactly no.
So but that's really importantto remember because we are in
classic innovators dilemma,because all of our revenue was
coming from this traditionaldistribution which we could see
was becoming less relevant inthe future.
So how do you migrate?
And a public company, a part ofTime Warner, how do you migrate
(23:28):
those revenues in your businessmodel where you're not really?
They call you a trading analogdollars for digital dimes.
Speaker 2 (23:36):
Yes.
Speaker 1 (23:37):
And that was.
Speaker 2 (23:38):
Analog dollars for digital dimes.
Did you say that Time Warnerowned HBO?
Speaker 1 (23:41):
Yeah, which is now, of course, a home by discovery.
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (23:45):
So I want to take a step back because this is really
fascinating to me.
What was the boardroomconversation like when you're
looking as HBO at a threat likeNetflix, which I can imagine in
Blockbuster was very differentthere was probably a bunch of
nah.
Speaker 1 (24:02):
This will never do, this will never work.
Speaker 2 (24:05):
Yeah, but HBO, no way you saw that this was a threat
actor.
Speaker 1 (24:10):
Yeah, and it was interesting.
I think it was initiallydismissed and some of it was
posturing, some of it was legit,I think even Jeff Fuchus.
There's a book that just cameout it's not TV, it's HBO, which
I was quoted in many cases, forbetter or for worse, jeff
Fuchus was a chairman, evencalled them the Albanian army,
(24:32):
like Netflix, like it was alittle bit dismissive.
Speaker 2 (24:35):
Oh, wow.
So similar posturing asBlockbuster.
We're the big company, there'sno way it'll take us down.
Speaker 1 (24:40):
That's exactly right, but I mean really, Netflix
wasn't an entertainment company.
They were a tech company andthey had data and the big
difference was they knew whotheir customers were and could
serve up programs and showsbased upon those needs.
We didn't know who ourcustomers were.
Speaker 2 (25:00):
Because you were a wholesale.
You were a wholesale.
You're a customer with,technically, the cable.
Speaker 1 (25:04):
Comcast dude.
Who are you?
Speaker 2 (25:05):
know stuffy suits.
Speaker 1 (25:07):
Exactly.
That in and of itself was ascary proposition, right?
So I think the aha moment waswhen Netflix bought the show.
Oh my God, what's the WhiteHouse show?
House of Cards House of Cardswhen Netflix bought, because HBO
was in the running for that.
And when Netflix came in andthey bought that show and not
(25:29):
only, you know, typically wewould pilot shows and then you
know, you determine whetheryou're going to spend the money
on the continued investment,whatever, netflix went in and
bought House of Cards, fullseason, no pilot required, like
it was just, and everyone's like, oh my gosh, they're crazy, you
know.
But what that did, mostimportantly, it sent a message
(25:49):
to the creative community thatNetflix was a place where they
could do business independentlyand freely, and that's something
that HBO would always prideitself on.
So I think that was the reallybeginning of really the
relevance of Netflix in terms ofthe Hollywood creative
community seeing them as alegitimate distribution play for
(26:10):
their shows.
Speaker 2 (26:11):
What I imagine happened was HBO and the entire
digital world looked at Netflixas that disruptive kid in class
asking that stupid questionwithout fear.
And then the stuffy businesspeople said oh wait, we need to
pay attention.
Speaker 1 (26:27):
When you're part of a public company and you're
responsible for quarterlyshareholder returns and you know
the technical investment.
And so the little backstoryabout our Our investment is so
we had our own team in Seattleworking on our own you know
platform, if you will, of thestreaming platform.
(26:49):
We thought we could do it onour own but I mean, it wasn't
our DNA, we were each but wasnot a tech company and
ultimately, as great as theywere, they weren't able to
deliver what we needed by whenwe needed at a time, certainly
before.
I remember ForgetPork, theshareholder meeting.
So the big moment I'll neverforget that I laugh about.
I was going to a Google company, but Google used to.
(27:09):
I don't know if they still do.
They had these conferencescalled Zeitgeist and I went to
the Google Zeitgeist conferencewhere they brought in all these
you know interesting speakersand whatever.
And I meet this guy who worksfor Major League Baseball, but
he worked for this companycalled.
It was a Major League BaseballAdvanced Media.
They called him Bantech and hisname was Kenny.
It's in the book actually.
Speaker 2 (27:29):
Kenny from Bantech.
Kenny from Bantech, that is theperfect name for a baseball guy
.
Yeah, kenny from Bantech.
Speaker 1 (27:35):
And Kenny.
I was telling him we're talkingabout a dilemma with, like, we
needed to launch a streamingservice but we didn't have a
technical platform and we neededto launch it by this date.
And he goes we know Bantech hasbeen doing this with WWE and he
told us exactly how they weredoing it and how you were
enabling current distributors,the whole bit.
He said we'll meet with you.
So I went back and told our CEO, richard Plepler.
(27:57):
I said I might have found asolution for us, and so he gave
us permission.
Me and my partner in crime wentdown to the Google the Bantech
offices, which were in Chelsea,and had this kind of covert
meeting with their CTO and myfriend, with Kenny from Bantech
and others Literally I don'tknow.
(28:18):
Within five days, hbo announceda relationship with Bantech and
they created a platform to go.
So all because I had gone tothat conference, met Kenny from
Bantech and it really it wasliterally announced the
shareholder meeting was, I think, the following week, so they
announced the launch of theservice at a shareholder meeting
(28:39):
Before it was even developed.
I don't think before you.
Speaker 2 (28:42):
The contract was signed with Bantech, so you are
essentially the personresponsible for HBO Go.
Hey listener, thanks for hikingalong with us.
Discover more episodes athightokahikecom, or to recommend
an adventurous guest, apply tobe a sponsor, discover books
along the trail, or to simplydrop us a line.
Well, I mean it's you and yourpartner in crime.
Speaker 1 (29:04):
It takes a village.
I think I was instrumental infinding that platform that
enabled it, but clearly it's.
You know it takes a village,but that was a pretty key moment
for us.
Speaker 2 (29:15):
So it was there at the meeting at 118th Avenue the
building.
I know all too fondly 116thAvenue, 6th Avenue oh, so that's
the one in Chelsea.
Speaker 1 (29:26):
Oh, yeah, yeah, you're thinking the one in
Chelsea.
Exactly, I'm thinking the HBOoffices.
Yes, okay.
Speaker 2 (29:31):
So the one in Chelsea , the Google building, 118th
Avenue.
I spent two years of my careerin that building on the eighth
floor.
I was at a company that didtelecom services and it was a
big switching facility wheremillions of call minutes went
through that switch forcommercial businesses every
second.
Wow, and Google bought thebuilding and I remember being in
(29:54):
a meeting with very highranking executives at Google.
The CEO of the company I workedfor, which is a multi-billion
dollar company at the time, saidwe really want to renew our
lease.
Will you let us do that?
And Stone faced the executive.
The leading executive fromGoogle looked at the CEO of my
(30:15):
company, who I very muchrespected, and said no, we need
a break room on your floor.
Speaker 1 (30:23):
Stop it yeah.
Speaker 2 (30:24):
And then I watched the CEO of my company literally
cry because back then it was, Ibelieve, 2004 or 2005,.
Moving a telecom switchingfacility that processed that
many minutes is an impossibletask.
As luck would have it, digitalinternet-based calling came out
and we were able to do it fastforward with new gear, much
(30:48):
smaller footprint, but, yeah,that was the first time I saw an
adult man cry.
That's crazy it was rough, butI remember him saying no, we
need a break room.
Speaker 1 (30:57):
That is hilarious.
Speaker 2 (30:58):
Yeah, so it turned into a room with a kitchen and
slides and all the Google-esqueand ugly cultural it did.
Speaker 1 (31:05):
Yeah, so, funny.
Speaker 2 (31:07):
So with a lot of history in that building.
Speaker 1 (31:09):
Yeah, so, anyway.
So that was you know.
And then, once we launched HBILthat's why I said my work, I
think my work is done here.
Speaker 2 (31:17):
So that's why you left.
You were ready, checked out.
Speaker 1 (31:20):
A couple of things.
I mean, I turned 50.
I'd been there for 27 years.
I felt like I had accomplishedeverything I wanted to
accomplish and I definitelywanted to have the opportunity
for a second chapter that I justfelt like had some social
impact and, honestly, my kids atthe time were like fourth,
eighth and tenth grade.
(31:40):
I thought and I said, you know,what they needed.
Speaker 2 (31:42):
You.
Speaker 1 (31:43):
Well, I didn't need me as much as I needed them and
I just felt like you know,they'd only known me as the mom
that was commuting every day inthe New York City and traveling
and so forth.
So but they were also reallyproud of everything I had done
and I felt it was really to me.
It's also I love my job, I lovemy culture, I love the people
(32:06):
and I always say it's reallyimportant for your kids If
you're going to work, they needto see that you're enjoying what
you do, because if not, theyperceive it as you're making a
choice to do something that youknow you're making a choice to
do something that you hateversus spending time with them.
So for me, it was alwaysimportant that my kids saw how
(32:29):
much I love my job, the value Igot out of it, and I brought
them into the city with me asmuch as I could.
So that was really important.
Speaker 2 (32:35):
So they saw a strong, hardworking female in the
corporate world who cared aboutthem.
But your realization that lifehas to come first came after 50.
You accomplished a lot of greattasks, you made a great name
for yourself, and then whathappened?
Speaker 1 (32:54):
So then I used to imagine my it sounds terrible,
but my funeral and eulogy.
Speaker 2 (33:01):
I do that too, by the way you do.
So I was.
I do that too, right, I'd likea lot of people to show up.
Speaker 1 (33:06):
Right, but then it's not just a lot of people who
show up.
Speaker 2 (33:09):
Yes, there's an A list.
Speaker 1 (33:11):
And that was imagining at the time.
Okay, my CEO would bedelivering the eulogy and it
would be filled with all HBOpeople and I said I don't
necessarily know if I want my.
You know, shelley got Game ofThrones from your TV to your
iPhone as to be you know whatwas on my tombstone.
I just felt like there shouldbe something that was Something
more, something more, somethingthat was truly meaningful.
(33:35):
Yeah, so I decided to leave,and just which was?
You know, people don't do that,just leave their C-suite job
and just figure out what thatlooked like.
And so I was able to spend moretime at home, more time in our
town of Westfield, where I'dlived at the time for 23 years.
Honestly, my world had reallyevolved down in New York City.
(33:56):
Westfield, for me, was a placewhere I took my kids to their
sports activities on weekends.
I felt I was able to kind ofsee it with fresh eyes and I
realized we had a beautiful,historic downtown that had a lot
of vacancies, that was feelingthe impact of so many Main
Street.
America downtowns are, from,you know, digital shopping, and
(34:17):
they never really figured outthat pivot from brick and mortar
to what a future of downtownlooks like.
And so I just started askingquestions.
You know like oh well, what'sthe plan?
Basically, what's the plan?
Because it's not a quick fix.
It's something about changingthe ecosystem of your community
to support these businesses forthe long term.
Speaker 2 (34:38):
You did what you do best.
You asked the stupid questionthat everyone was thinking, but
too afraid to ask.
Speaker 1 (34:43):
I don't even know if they were thinking that.
I'll be honest with you, I justthink no one really.
You know, it takes a lot ofpolitical will to make
significant changes and it'shard, anyway.
So I start asking a lot ofquestions and then someone said
you know what?
And there was an electioncoming up and they said why
don't you consider running formayor?
I'm like no, no, no, deal withthe people, no, but can someone
(35:08):
else come and fix all?
these things you know and thenI don't know it.
Just you know, when you tellyour kids you know you can't
rely on others to do the workyou don't want to do, like I
didn't want to be the mayor andI told them I'm very open, I
don't want to be the mayor, Ijust want from a big CZE job.
And now I'm going to enterlocal politics for a free job
(35:29):
that you know comes with a lotof, you know, headache.
I mean honestly because of justthe it's politics right.
Speaker 2 (35:36):
Yeah, it's politics.
Speaker 1 (35:37):
On all aspects and putting yourself out there
running for office in yourcommunity, all that stuff.
So that was you know, and onething led to another, and that
was my daughter was really theimpotet.
She was the senior in highschool.
Then at the time, you know youcan't rely on others to do the
work.
And then you know, I watched.
I think I'm the only one thattook Barack Obama seriously when
(35:59):
he said you know, if you wantto make a difference, get a
clipboard, get some signaturesand run for office.
And then I honestly I was like,well, why not me Seriously,
like oh, the bug was planted.
Speaker 2 (36:11):
The model was there, the goal the working
professional woman there, an HRperson came and said you know,
you're a female, that's whatthey're talking about.
You can't do this.
Speaker 1 (36:21):
Yeah, that drove you further, you know, yeah, you're
probably right, and I was again.
Speaker 2 (36:28):
We are the same person we grew up as we were
kids.
That mentality, that strive,that and I'm a fighter.
Speaker 1 (36:33):
I am, and I just it was.
It was like why not me?
And like, honestly, it feltvery selfish that I, I don't
want to do that and so, and so,luckily, we had a great team and
we all won and and it's beenwell, you won you won twice.
Speaker 2 (36:50):
You are the first female mayor in the over 300
year existence of this town thefounding of this town.
I will say, all politicalaspects aside, you are a great
leader in this town you inspiremany.
As a father of daughters, I'mvery happy to see you as our
mayor.
Speaker 1 (37:05):
I'll be, I'll be.
I'd be lying if I didn't tellyou, though, running for local
office has been the hardestthing I've ever done in my
entire career.
Speaker 2 (37:14):
The hardest thing you've ever done in your career.
What do you hate most about it?
Speaker 1 (37:17):
The politics, the politics.
I told someone I like the job,I don't like the industry.
You know if that's a fair thingto say.
Unfortunately it's.
Sometimes when you makedecisions it's hard to decipher
our are the.
Are the objections legitimateobjections or are there some
(37:39):
that are just politically drivenbecause?
Speaker 2 (37:40):
Or emotionally or yeah, and trying we have.
We have a lot.
I've been to some of those townmeetings.
You have a lot of people thatare fundamentally unhinged with
any change and you canunderstand it, because they grew
up in this town, this is theirchildhood town, and to see the
town change yeah.
Right.
How would you like it ifsomeone moved next door tore?
(38:02):
Down the entire block and thenput up a new house.
Speaker 1 (38:03):
Yeah, you can understand it Right.
Speaker 2 (38:06):
But then there are some times, I imagine, you just
want to take someone by theshoulders and shake them.
Speaker 1 (38:10):
Well, yeah, you know I will say the job being mayor
has required a lot more empathy,which I think has been really
good for me in terms of, youknow, growth.
The other thing going back tolike why I ran, there was all of
that, but there was also aninsatiable little bit of a
curiosity to understand do thesame leadership principles that
were successful in the privatesector apply in the public
(38:33):
sector?
And you know, and I realizedthey do.
And because, at the end of theday, it's all about people.
So the focus has really been onthe town employees Because, at
the end of the day, if you havethat same notion where your town
employees whether it's police,fire, public works, court,
(38:56):
anybody who touches the public,right, if they're feeling valued
, if they're feelingacknowledged, if they feel like
they're part of something larger, you know what then they are
going to take a lot of pride inwhat they do and that's going to
show outwardly to the community, and so that and it's
interesting because you knowthere's a lot of union employees
(39:18):
, so you don't have the samelevers of incentivization in the
public sector that you do inthe private- Well, you have the
people.
But you have the people.
Speaker 2 (39:27):
People tend to want to do the best job that they can
, otherwise they're just schlubs.
Speaker 1 (39:31):
That's why I said no one.
I don't think anybody anywheregoes up and says you know what?
I don't, I don't.
I feel like I'm being verymediocre today.
Speaker 2 (39:38):
There's one guy.
Speaker 1 (39:39):
There's a few.
Speaker 2 (39:40):
Exactly, yeah, there's somebody out there who
says I just want to be yeahright.
Speaker 1 (39:44):
But I think most people do want to feel rewarded
and valued and acknowledgedright.
Speaker 2 (39:49):
Well, it's the herd mentality, right.
We want to be part of a group,we want to be part of something
bigger than us.
Yes, and really the bestincentive you can give an
employee or, in this case, aworker for the town, is a pat on
the back publicly praising inpublic criticizing in private,
because that lasts far longer.
Feeling like you're the hero,like you scored that home run
(40:11):
for the day yeah.
That's intrinsic in us fromearly childhood.
Speaker 1 (40:16):
They also want to feel honestly that someone has
their back.
And I'll never forget the mostperceptive conversation I had
when I first started, becauseyou know I come in thinking I'm
going to bring all this privatesector stuff to town hall and
you realize A even though I ran,you know a four and a half
billion dollar P&L like that,the P&L and municipal government
(40:38):
and finance there's nothingrelatable.
Speaker 2 (40:40):
No.
Speaker 1 (40:41):
And you're like.
So it's funny, the things Ithought I would bring in are
different from what I thought.
But one guy said to me I didn'tunderstand, like when residents
would come up with problems orchallenges and the answer to
them was, hey, sorry, we can'tdo that, as opposed to saying
you know we can't do that, butthis is what you might be able
to do and try to.
You know, try to get to yes,offer a solution.
(41:02):
Offer a solution and I just getto yes, culture, that I talk
about it.
And he said to me I asked thatquestion and he says you know
why, mayor?
Because you never know what anelected official is going to
sell you down the river, which Iwas so glad he said that to me
that's a very politicalstatement.
But what he was saying and it'strue a lot of times these
public employees and I hopepeople that listen to this think
(41:24):
about this next time is that ifthey go out on a limb, they
never know if, like who they'rehelping or rewarding somehow
might get back to the mayor oranother elected official and
claim I don't know, they didn'tdo this or they did this or you
did, you know.
So it's just easier for them tostay in their box, to stay in
(41:44):
their lane, to stay in theirlane.
But what I discovered over thelast few years when they've seen
, when they've seen me have thecourage and fortitude to stand
up to public objections oralways have their back, they're
putting themselves out there.
They are now becoming verysolution oriented.
Speaker 2 (42:07):
You're empowering them to step a little bit more
outside of their comfort zone.
Speaker 1 (42:12):
Because they know I'm always going to have their back
.
And so, therefore, and I tellthem, I got you back every time,
and you've seen it in thepolice, in the fire, and so what
gives me such pleasure?
It's a lot of stuff.
The public sees it, but theydon't know what it is a result
of.
But, and we've done that, we'veinvested in equipment, we
(42:34):
provide them automation, weprovide them tools, and when you
do that, people say they'reinvesting in me, right?
So therefore, I'm going to goforward.
So a lot of the progress youmight see in town isn't anything
that I've done specifically.
It's the things that we put inplace to let our employees do
their best jobs.
Speaker 2 (42:54):
So one thing that I would do and I realize that
you're running the town as if itis a company, right, culturally
.
Yes, you're treating peoplewith the respect you're giving
them the power, empowering themwith what they need.
And it does show, I will say,from police the fire to the new
equipment, to the way that thepolice respond to you.
(43:15):
The police don't harass you,they're happy to see you If you
have an issue.
They're welcoming, they want tospeak to you.
I've actually become friendswith several of the police
officers, so you treat peoplewell.
It bleeds out right.
Happy employees breed happycustomers.
You can see a smile over thephone.
I absolutely believe that.
But sometimes you have toremind people.
(43:36):
So one trick I would do in mycorporate business was at the
end of the year, before bonustime, we would show and
demonstrate that we covered 100%of your health care.
Just a little reminder.
We put you through training andyou could look at that as
almost like a corporatementality, but no, the purpose
of that was to remind everybodyof what they have and to
(44:00):
appreciate it, because all toooften in personal and business
we stop appreciating things.
Speaker 1 (44:05):
Yes.
Speaker 2 (44:06):
We stop realizing what others do for us to empower
us, and I think that's verybeneficial.
Is you do that with the town?
There is, at some point I get atown letter of all the
accomplishments and it's verybeautifully made, it's well done
, it's well marketed, and I sitthere and I read it and I say,
oh wow, I didn't know that, butthat's great.
(44:27):
That's awesome we bought a newfire truck that will benefit me.
I hope I never have to use it.
Yeah, but that'll benefit me.
Speaker 1 (44:34):
I'm glad to hear you acknowledge that whole purpose
of that was to make theresidents feel better about
their tax pay.
They're what they pay for.
Speaker 2 (44:42):
Oh, we do pay a lot of taxes.
Speaker 1 (44:44):
We pay a lot of taxes .
Speaker 2 (44:45):
We pay a lot of taxes .
Speaker 1 (44:46):
Exactly, but that's exactly right.
It's to make them like okay,I'm getting my money, well, my
money's worth, to the degree wecan do that in our state.
Speaker 2 (44:55):
Well, everyone's got to speak of taxes.
Everyone has a way to check offif they value or if they're
getting value out of their taxes.
For me three kids in publicschools I value my taxes Right
Now.
I've had this conversation withChristie, my wife.
When do we move?
Yes, Right, Are we lifelonghere?
Yeah, Are we going to pay thatincreasing tax bill?
Speaker 1 (45:16):
Right.
Speaker 2 (45:17):
Or do we move after the kids graduate from college?
Right, it's a very touchysubject right now.
Yes, christie, and I love thistown.
We'll see.
We'll see.
Hopefully I do well enough inlife to want to stay here.
Speaker 1 (45:31):
Well, I hope so, and now we've got all this amazing
investment coming into town.
Speaker 2 (45:36):
So in this small community there are so many
successful, business-mindedpeople.
It's amazing.
It is amazing.
It is amazing the wealth ofknowledge and success and again
in my pursuit of finding, isthere such thing as success
that's not tied to wealth?
Right and the relevance factor.
Speaker 1 (45:57):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (45:58):
So what is your definition of success?
Speaker 1 (46:00):
You know, I think it's about impact.
I think it's about what impacthave you made in your community,
as you define it, and thatcould be your community, whether
it's you know your family,where you live.
But I just think beyondmaterial things, and that's I
(46:24):
just want to be able to say myhusband thinks I'm crazy because
I've, no matter what I do, Idon't think I've ever done
enough.
Speaker 2 (46:30):
And I think that's a record all husbands think their
wives are crazy and all wivesthink their husbands are crazy.
If you were to ask Chrissy ifI'm crazy, she'll say yes.
Speaker 1 (46:38):
Yeah, so, yeah.
So I just think it's aboutimpact, and have you done
everything you can do to make adifference in the world?
Speaker 2 (46:48):
So the story?
Yeah.
So do you associate wealth ormoney with success?
No, not at all, and actuallyIsn't it sad how many people do.
Speaker 1 (46:57):
Yeah, and it's funny.
I just met with all the thirdgraders yesterday.
As you well know, they're sointrigued by like when I tell
them I make a dollar and theywant to know how, oh, my
daughters came home and they'relike dad, you make more money
than the mayor.
Speaker 2 (47:12):
I said, well, not really.
Speaker 1 (47:15):
But I think like and I tell this to women in
particular, because I thinkwomen tend to be the most
vulnerable to it I've never beencaught up in the I don't know
the privileges or the stature ofposition, and so, even as I
grew in my career at HBO and wasearning pretty good money, I
(47:37):
never changed how I live.
Maybe I went on some greatvacations and ate well, but it
didn't really change anything.
Part of it was I always wantedto be working on my terms and I
wanted to be able to walk outthe door any day on my terms,
and not because I'm beholden tothe paycheck.
And that's when I said you know, fire me for doing the right
(48:00):
thing, I'll take it.
I wanted to be able to do that,and so I've just never valued
that level of wealth and it'sjust more about you know, the
teachers you meet and thosereally I see those are the real,
those are the people I reallyrespect.
Speaker 2 (48:18):
Are you impressed with people who are wealthy
Monetarily, that is?
Speaker 1 (48:23):
No, the money doesn't impress me.
Like, if someone, like, is aninnovator and has done really
and they took a lot of risk,they happen to make a lot of
money because it great, but I'mmore impressed with what got
them there than I am about themoney itself.
So, but you know, there'speople who are innovators in
professions that don't aren't aslucrative.
So, no, I'm not, if anything.
I'm honest.
(48:43):
Honestly, I'm kind of like ahate to say it.
I'm almost an anti elitist.
Speaker 2 (48:50):
There's nothing wrong with that, because I agree with
you.
I have met billionaires thatare miserable and I have met
people that barely make it by,that are so happy, and that's
when it clicks and you startrealizing I can't take it with.
You is true.
Speaker 1 (49:09):
Well, there's this book.
So I was talking about theinnovators dilemma.
I don't know if you've everread that book by Clayton
Christensen, nope.
So he was coming to an eventthat we were having and I said,
oh, let me make sure I read hisbooks before I go.
So I did not read.
Oh, I had read the innovatorsdilemma, but there's another
book he had written called howWill you Measure your Life, and
that's the book I read, and itwas the first book I read.
(49:30):
That actually explained my ownsuccess to me.
But what he said in that bookhe was now a established author,
a very successful professor atHarvard, and he said he went to
his 30th year reunion at Harvardand he couldn't figure out why
there are so many successfulpeople who are so miserable
(49:52):
Alcoholics, divorces, kids whoare estranged or whatever it was
.
So we actually did someresearch to understand what
happened and what he discoveredand I think this is true is that
a lot of these people,especially those that come out
of elite colleges or whatever,they might want to go to the
Peace Corps, teach for America,go be a teacher, do whatever
(50:15):
they want to do.
He said they get the offersfrom Bain and McKinsey or
whoever else.
And so they go and they're like, okay, I'm gonna go do that for
a couple years and make all themoney, and then I'm gonna go
pursue what I really want to do,or go start that incubator or
whatever it was, and then guesswhat happens.
They get on that hamster wheeland they can't stop.
(50:35):
The drug is in their system 30years later they've, like now in
a part where they maybe arereflecting back a little bit and
realize they missed theopportunity to do whatever they
ever did.
So I gave that book to everyintern I ever had and I just
think it's really important tokind of be clear on that North
(50:56):
Star early and not try it'seasier said than done,
especially if you've got studentloans and all that kind of
stuff, but I don't know just tryto remember what it is that
drives you and what makes youhappy and try to stay on that
path.
Speaker 2 (51:11):
As Americans cuz I can only speak from the American
standpoint we're programmed atan early age that money is
everything.
You see all of this marketingflashed in front of your eyes,
your brain absorbed it.
It's a constant stream of want,want, want, need, need and
unfortunately, we've tied moneyto that feeling.
Money and materials Right.
(51:32):
I look at money as simply aresource.
Do you have enough for yougoing to run out?
Now again, there are plenty ofpeople that live by their means
and there are plenty of peoplethat overspend.
I think we are anovermaterialized, overspending
society, overreaching constantly.
And social media, it's all themarketing.
(51:53):
And it's unfortunate becausethe pursuit of true happiness is
impossible if you're constantlychasing.
Yeah, and that's what we are.
We're a society as a wholethat's constantly chasing.
I'll be happy when this willmake me happy if, but we don't
live in the moment when themoment is truly up, and it's
(52:14):
usually not on your choice.
Speaker 1 (52:15):
Right, exactly.
Speaker 2 (52:17):
And I'm now 43.
I turned 43 recently.
You're such a youngster I guessmy brain thinks I'm 28.
My herniated back occasionallydoes not Right, but I'm learning
how to deal with that,especially as a hank.
But yeah, so I did a completepivot.
I went from corporate Americato just say you know what, screw
(52:40):
it.
I'm going to be happy, mysuccess being in my kid's life
every day.
Because that old man on hisdeathbed the last few moments,
when asked do you have anyregrets?
That story's been heard.
You never hear him say I wish Ibought that yacht.
Speaker 1 (52:56):
Right.
Speaker 2 (52:57):
Right, it's always.
I wish I was in my children'slives.
Speaker 1 (53:00):
It's very true.
It's very true.
Speaker 2 (53:03):
So it sounds like and looks like and is similar in
your world because you have donethat.
Speaker 1 (53:10):
Yeah, but it's funny my kids laugh because you know,
going from corporate, I'm nolonger commuting but the mayor
obligation has there's a lot ofnights and weekends and so forth
.
Speaker 2 (53:22):
They're like what I always see you around town.
So what's interesting is ittruly is a volunteer position
and it only pays a dollar.
You have to have some sense ofsavings to be able to do the job
, and I wasn't really in thetown when the last mayor was
here, but I'm fairly certain hehad a full-time job and was a
(53:43):
mayor.
Speaker 1 (53:43):
Correct and most of them do and because, honestly,
most people that can't sustainthemselves on a volunteer job.
And I committed when I ran todo it full-time.
Now, keep in mind, when I leftHBO the plan wasn't oh, let me
go take a full-time job thatdoesn't pay.
That wasn't the conversation Ihad with my financial advisor,
(54:05):
so he's like okay.
But going back to thatconversation earlier about, for
me I just never really valuedthe big material things and able
to save a bunch of money sothat we could make the decisions
for our family.
But you're right, and thechallenge, it wasn't a hard
thing for me to commit to doingthis full-time because I had a
(54:25):
really big vision for the townand there was no way you could
push that forward with whatneeded to happen.
Doing it on nights and weekends, it just wasn't going to be
possible.
When you're only able to do itpart-time, you're just
sustaining, right, and it's likeyou're more of a If you can
sustain.
Speaker 2 (54:41):
Right and probably not even sustaining exactly Well
, yeah, with the amount ofexplosive growth this town saw,
especially after the pandemic.
I mean every single house thatwas listed, much like other
places in America.
It was listed, it was upbid, itwas swarmed and sold, even
still right now, which with suchincredibly high rates, I'm
shocked.
Speaker 1 (55:02):
I mean nobody's moving, and I was very clear
also when I ran.
It goes back to that pointbeing fearless, Since I didn't
really ever want to be the mayor.
Speaker 2 (55:11):
I'm not really You're not afraid of being the mayor.
Speaker 1 (55:13):
I'm not afraid of being the mayor and I'm not
afraid about losing the job.
So, as a result, I used to.
I would tell people listen, Iam not going to be the mayor of
the status quo.
If that's what you're lookingfor, he's your guy, it's not me.
Speaker 2 (55:28):
That's a great quote.
I will not be the mayor of thestatus quo.
Speaker 1 (55:31):
Because I wanted it to be very clear.
If I won, I wanted people toknow what they were getting.
And so when I do these bigthings, I don't want you to
think, oh, I didn't know that.
And so, and luckily, we werereelected, and so we keep moving
forward.
Speaker 2 (55:47):
So are you going to run again in the next cycle?
Where's it too soon?
Speaker 1 (55:50):
It's too soon.
I think I'm very committed toseeing through this big $450
million project that we have inthe works.
Speaker 2 (55:59):
And what's the timeline for that?
Speaker 1 (56:01):
Well, it should break ground late next year.
But you know there's a lot of.
Speaker 2 (56:05):
Big investment in the town.
Speaker 1 (56:06):
Big and huge investment, Big tax infusion,
Revenue infusion for the towntax, major public benefits.
It reminded me, honestly, doingthat negotiation with the
Hudson's Bay Company, which is alarge North American
conglomerate.
I felt like I was back in theComcast boardroom.
I really did.
You know, at the end of the day, you have to know what is
(56:29):
important to each side and cometo a place and Do you feel like
you won?
I feel like the town won and Ireally do, and that was really
what I was, all I really caredabout.
The big difference is, as Itold my old HBO folks, I said in
the private sector you kind ofsay, okay, we're going here and
you know, you know you're goingto have people who will post up.
(56:51):
At the end of the day they getsome line because you know it's
their job, it's their paycheck.
In the public sector, thosepeople go right to social media.
Speaker 2 (57:00):
They go right to social media.
You're technically not theirboss.
They're elected to, so you musthave the patience of a saint.
Actually it's so funny, Ireally do not Well you had to
learn something, just like youhave to have empathy.
Speaker 1 (57:15):
Yeah, the empathy you learn, you really do try to
understand, try to give peoplethe benefit of the doubt.
You have a lot of moralfortitude and I think, if
anything, I get very committedto things.
When I believe they're theright thing to do, I'll tell
them, I'll jump on my back, I'mgoing to take you through this,
but you know what, the peoplethat are around you looking at
(57:38):
you as a leader to see if you,like you know, waver and your
strength gives them strength.
And I think that was even thisand that's true, that's just
true in leadership, whether it'syou know, you're in politics or
whether you're in the boardroom.
And you have to be, as a leader, I think, fully committed to
(58:01):
where you're going and theoutcome, and never let your team
see you sweat.
Speaker 2 (58:06):
Never let your team see you sweat.
That's interesting to mebecause there have been a couple
of times where I've let my teamlet's take a seat.
Yeah, I've been there a coupleof times where I've let my team
see me sweat because I wanted toappear human.
Speaker 1 (58:20):
Yeah, yeah, I think it's different.
Like tell them, like, listen,this is where the
vulnerabilities are.
This is the part I'm afraid of.
But you know what, we're goingfor it and I think you're right
being very real, even going backto that notion about
transparency, when I would shareall the information about the
company, it would be like, yeah,you know what, we're in a
(58:41):
really bad place and we gotthree months to turn this around
and you end up creating thissense of spree to core.
You know we're all in thistogether and we're going to make
it happen, and I think that'svery different than it's knowing
that you're going to going backto it.
You're going to have their back, go to bed, and I think that's
what's really important for themto see.
Speaker 2 (59:02):
I agree, for everyone's got a different
leadership style.
So for me, I was never the mostcharismatic right and I had to
earn that respect from people byhelping them and showing them
how much value they had.
And if I made a mistake I'd bethe first person to fall on the
sword and say, whoops, I screwedup.
And I think that helped me inmy career and that helped keep
my people in the company.
(59:24):
In 10 years of running mytelecom business, we never had
anyone quit and that, to me, wasthe most rewarding statistic I
had, because that meant I wasliked.
People show value and they'recareers with with.
You know my success and theirsuccess.
So that was, that was arewarding feeling.
So, shelly, I want to thank you.
Thank you, this was amazing.
(59:46):
You are an amazing person.
Speaker 1 (59:47):
Oh, you're so nice.
Speaker 2 (59:48):
I truly mean that as I look you in the eyes.
You're an amazing person youare.
You are an inspiration to many,especially my daughters.
Thank you so much.
Speaker 1 (59:56):
It's been a privilege , thank you.
Speaker 2 (59:58):
Next time on, I Took a Hike.
We take a spirited journey withDaisy Joplin, a classical and
rock violinist and founder ofthe Daisy Joplin Music
Mentorship Foundation.
Till next time, I'm Darren Mass.
Thanks for listening.
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