Underlying Worldviews: DEI & Climate Alarmism | Darrell Harrison - Ideas Have Consequences

Episode Transcript
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Darrell Harrison (00:03):
This is why ideologies like DEI, critical
race theory, cultural Marxism,transgenderism are making such
inroads in the culture.
Because the church is I hate tosay this.
I have to be honest with youguys.
The church is quite cowardly ina lot of ways today.

(00:23):
I think it fears beingpersecuted, when Christ himself
said that the church would bepersecuted for standing for the
truth.
So there's an irony there thatwe should fear persecution when
Christ said that that's what weshould expect.

Luke Allen (00:45):
Hi friends, welcome to Ideas have Consequences.
The podcast of the DiscipleNations Alliance.
Here on this show we examinehow our mission as Christians is
to not only spread the gospelaround the world, to all the
nations, but our mission alsoincludes to be the hands and
feet of God, to transform thenations to increasingly reflect
the truth, goodness and beautyof God's kingdom.

(01:05):
Tragically, the church haslargely neglected this second
part of her mission and todaymost Christians have little
influence on their surroundingcultures.
Join us on this podcast as werediscover what it means for
each of us to disciple thenations and to create
Christ-honoring cultures thatreflect the character of the
living God.

Scott Allen (01:24):
Well, welcome again everyone to another episode of
Ideas have Consequences.
This is the podcast of theDisciple Nations Alliance.
I'm Scott Allen, I'm thepresident of the DNA and we're
thrilled today to have with us,back again with us after quite a
gap, a person that I havetremendous respect for Pastor
Daryl Harrison.

Pastor Harrison thank you so much for
joining us on the podcast again,scott Dwight, the pleasure is
all mine.
I am overjoyed to be with you,gentlemen, you brothers, once
again, scott, after what yousaid has been a pretty
significant gap since we lastspoke, so the honor is mine to
be with you both.

Oh well, thank you.
Let me introduce you a littlebit, darrell.
May I call you Darrell, pastor,darrell Sure absolutely no, I'm
just Darrell.

Even when I'm at church and in the midst of my
official pastoral duties, Iprefer people to just call me
Darrell.

Okay, well, that's what we'll do then.
Yeah, just a littleintroduction.
Daryl, as of about a year ago,is on the pastoral team at a
church that I have tremendousrespect for Redeemer Bible
Church in Gilbert, arizona,working alongside our good
friend Pastor John Benzinger, sothat's exciting to see that

(02:45):
move, daryl.
Before joining the staff there,daryl served at Grace to you,
which is the well-known andrespected ministry of John
MacArthur.
He was the director of digitalplatforms there.
But perhaps Daryl is mostwell-known by me and most people
as the co-host of the JustThinking podcast, along with his

(03:08):
friend, virgil Walker.
It's one of the leadingChristian podcasts in the world.
And, daryl, let me just sayagain that your podcast for me
as I was researching my book my2020 book why Social Justice Is
Not Biblical Justice was abreath of fresh air, just an
incredible encouragement, sourceof joy, laughter, insight, huge

(03:31):
help to me.
So I just want to pause rightnow in this introduction and
thank you for your podcast, foryour ministry with Virgil and
just the incredible courage andleadership I would say that you
provided to those of us in theevangelical church as we kind of
were getting our heads aroundthis woke worldview that we've
had to deal with, so thank youfor that.

Thank you very much, brother.
That means a lot to me comingfrom you.
Well it's been.

I just remember when John Bottomore, one of our
team members, he pointed outyour podcast to me, I guess many
years ago, and I just I couldnot get enough of it and I loved
the humor too.
So I always wish I had aHammond Oregon.
You know, when you join us youknow, I just love that.

(04:21):
I just thought that was sowonderful.
I'm a native of Oregon, livedall my life on the West Coast,
but I've traveled broadly aroundthe world and have spent many
months in the South.
When I was a college student, Ispent time in your native
Atlanta and many other cities.
It was a real eye-openingexperience for me.
I went to many all-blackchurches for the first time.

(04:43):
Oregon is a very white placeand, man, that was just a joy,
eye-opening joy, and so youbrought back great memories for
me of those days.
Anyways, being in church.

Yeah, yes, so you know you talk about the
Hammond B3, oregon, Scott.
And for your listeners who maynot be familiar with the Just
Thinking podcast, there's asignificant sort of element to
why Virgil and I, sort ofintermittently, will sort of add
that sound effect asappropriate in our episodes,

(05:19):
because it's actually a.
It harkens us back to ourexperience growing up in the
black church, in the quoteunquote black church.
So with Virginal I share thatexperience from an
ecclesiastical background, sothe organ is very prominent in
the worship ambience of urbaninner city black churches.

(05:48):
Ambiance of urban inner cityblack churches.
So, uh, uh, so.
So there's a, there's a, thoughit may, it comes across
somewhat humorous uh, to tofolks who listen to us, uh,
because there is some humor.
Uh, that's the case thatoccasionally accompanies that
sound effect when you hear it inour episodes.
But there's a very uhsignificant reason why we employ
the Hammond B3.
It's sort of a subtle homage tomy and Virgil's upbringing in

(06:11):
some of those black churchesthat you just alluded to, when
you would visit Atlanta.
So it's sort of an homage toour experience when we were
growing up and not astheologically mature as we are
right now, by God's grace.
But yeah, just to give you alittle backstory on that.

Oh, I appreciate that you know.
Another thing insights that Igained as I was researching for
the book was just the legacy ofthe black church in America and
how deep and rich and powerfulthat legacy is.
Now I know it's split anddivided like evangelical
churches today, but boy, I justgained such an incredible

(06:54):
appreciation for the churchcoming out of slavery and what
it meant for the black communityin the United States so
powerful, so.

I see you guys .
Yeah, that's a.

You're continuing a really unique I mean unique in
the world and very powerfullegacy there.

Well, thank you very much, Tyler.
It's sort of a bittersweetreality when you look at the
history of the black church inAmerica.
And let me just say this as acaveat to your listeners when I
mentioned the term black church,go ahead and assume air quotes
with that, okay.
So you know, I use the term forthe sake of conversation.
It's not that I subscribe toand sort of an anthropological

(07:36):
identifier such as black church,white church, asian church,
asian church.
You know folks who listen toVirgil and me, they ought to
know that by now that we don'tsubscribe to these sort of
identifiers, those kind ofcategories.
So I used the term black churchin context.
So the history of the blackchurch in America I mean we're
talking was born out of slavery,pre-slavery, post-slavery

(07:58):
discrimination, where leaderslike Richard Allen, who founded
the AME denomination, saw itnecessary to build houses of

(08:18):
worship for former slaves,understanding that history from
the standpoint of suffrage.
A doctrine of slavery, adoctrine of still waiting for a

(08:47):
Moses-type figure to lead themto the promised land.
And you know, that's anotherepisode, that's a whole other
episode right there.

I would really enjoy that.
And you know, I know where yourheart is on issues of.
You know these identifiers,cultural identifiers.
You know these identifiers,cultural identifiers, but I
really am speaking of culture,and kind of the richest sense of
the word, in that, over thatmany decades and centuries, you

(09:15):
know there's richness to thisculture that's unique in the
world and you know, going backto the Hammond Organ and there's
my own brief experience,there's just a powerful richness
to it and it's something that Ithink is really precious.
So, anyways, well, let mecontinue, if I might, with just
again a few more notes on theintroduction, but I'd love for

(09:36):
you to finish whatever I don'tget here, which I'm sure will be
a lot, a lot more to you.
Daryl Daryl's a fellow of theBlack Theology and Leadership
Institute at PrincetonTheological Seminary.
Daryl has a passion forexpository teaching, for
cultural apologetics, whichwe're going to be talking about
today, and biblical counseling,which I didn't know until today.

(09:58):
In his spare time, daryl enjoyscollege sports.
Great time for college sports,daryl.

Yeah.

I already posted my Final.

Four on X.
Yesterday I think I surprised alot of people with my
selections.

Who's going to win it all?

I've got Michigan State winning the whole
thing.
I've got three Big Ten teams inmy Final Four.
That has nothing to do with thefact that my wife is from
Michigan, by the way.
It's like the old saying youknow, defense wins championships
.
And these Big Ten schools theyhave big guys who play defense.
They play really tough.
So I don't think these aregoing to be high-scoring games.

(10:36):
I just think in the end defenseis going to win.
You just can't count MichiganState out.
So I've got them winning thewhole thing.

Okay, well, thank you guys.
I get to choose that now on myDNA.

March Madness bracket.

So, anyways, that's great.
Well, yeah, so sports.
Classical music is another areaof enjoyment.
I share that with you, andreading of the Puritans that's
also something that is wonderfuland rich.
He and his wife Melissa havethree adult children Colin,
naomi and Yasmin, and each ofthose, I guess, are they still

(11:16):
in Atlanta, is that right?

Yeah, so all of our family is in Georgia.
When we left Atlanta to go toLA for a grace to you and you,
and then from LA to here Arizona, we have no family out west.
All of our family is back east.

Gotcha.
Okay, well, you must betraveling a bit then, you know,
in addition to what you'retraveling with work-wise, with
family.
So well, daryl, I would love to, or we would love to, talk to
you today about just what we'reseeing right now in the culture
around it.
You know, the way I am seeingit is kind of this rather sudden

(11:51):
collapse, and for me a bitunexpected collapse of the woke
revolution, the social justice,the cultural, marxist,
ideological social justicerevolution that it seemed to me
kind of peaked perhaps in 2020,2021, 19, 2020, 21,.

(12:11):
Around that time I always kindof put George Floyd there, you
know, at the peak of that BlackLives Matter, when it was at its
peak.
But boy, how things havechanged in just such a short
time.
You know, I think you couldlook at any number of indicators
.
Well, I just mentioned BlackLives Matter.
You know the three founders ofthat are no longer in the news

(12:36):
and you know the wholeorganization, I guess, has been
kind of exposed as a fraud.
You know there was just so muchgraft, you know, involved.
They just skimmed a lot of them.
These founders skimmed so muchmoney off of that and bought
these giant houses and you know,wow, that's just one.
You think about people like someof the key spokespeople of the

(12:57):
movement, like Ibram X Kendi orTa-Nehisi Coates they're also,
you know, ta-nehisi Coates.
They're also, you know, nolonger looked upon favorably by.
You know the vast swaths ofpeople you've got Of late.

(13:18):
You know the big talk is allabout canceling and ending
policies of DEI diversity,equity and inclusion.
Of course, this is kind of onthe policy level, a lot of this
with the new Trumpadministration.
Anyway, it's just so muchchange and I'd love to hear your
thoughts as somebody who youknow you saw this movement,

(13:38):
understood it before most peoplein the Church did.
You know you were a propheticvoice on this.
I guess just some of the—I'dlove your thoughts on what's
happening right now.
You know why is this collapsehappening?
Did it take you by surprise?
Maybe we'll just start withthat.

Yeah, great questions there, scott, and I
don't think any astute biblicalChristian is taken by surprise
by any of this.
You mentioned the wordindicators.
I made a note that that wordstood out to me.
What were some of theindicators?
And I think a primary indicatorand no offense to any of your

(14:24):
listeners who may disagree withme on this, they're obviously
free to do so but I think theprimary indicator was the two

(14:46):
administrations, in with BarackObama's president, and then we
have Joe Biden, the Joe Bidenadministration that we just came
out of.
I think those two gentlemen andtheir worldview together
created the perfect recipe forwhat we're seeing happen right
now.
And I think again, for anybiblically astute Christian,

(15:10):
this is no surprise whatsoever,because we understand and I love
the fact that Ideas haveConsequences is a worldview
podcast, because I think I woulddescribe myself as a believer
in Christ who understands thatworldviews matter.

(15:32):
Ideas have consequences, whichis why you guys named your
podcast that because they dohave consequences, and I think
it behooves every trulyregenerate believer to look at
the world through the lens ofwhat scripture says.
You look at what's going onwith Black Lives Matter, george

(15:56):
Floyd.
You know, virgil and I I'm notpatting ourselves on the back
here.
But the fact is that when BlackLives Matter sort of percolated
onto the social scene, evenwithin the church, virgil and I
were probably some of the mostforensic voices out there trying
to educate Christians on whothese people really were.

(16:22):
I've been following Barack Obamasince 2004.
Now he didn't run for presidentuntil 2008.
But I remember watching himgive the keynote address at the
Democrat National Convention in2004.
And he turned.
That arena was so animated, soemotional You'd have sworn he

(16:49):
was the second coming of MartinLuther King Jr.
And I said to myself right thenthat night I said Barack Obama
began running for president.
That night is, as we look at,the more tangible evidence of
where the culture is right now.

(17:10):
With respect to BLM, the wholeGeorge Floyd thing now we have
critical race theory.
Now we've sort of here'scritical race theories, ugly
stepchild DEI that we're dealingwith now.
You can't divorce thoseworldview fruits from the
worldview that produced thosefruits.

(17:30):
So I would say, barack Obamaand Joe Biden, their worldview,
their ideology, their philosophyof the world had immense impact
in affording the culture tofeel free enough to express

(17:53):
itself in ways that we're seeingright now.
Under Barack Obama, the LGBTQagenda was vivified was vivified
.
Barack Obama made that clearwhen he was running for office
that he was fully supportive ofhaving what they would call
same-sex marriage legalized.

(18:14):
You fast forward to Joe Bidenand I've said from day one of
the Biden administration, whenyou look at a lot of his
especially domestic policies andsome of his cabinet appointees
people who really was close tohis inner circle Joe Biden ran
his entire administration on thetenets of critical race theory

(18:35):
and DEI.
So it percolates down from thetop is my overarching point here
.
So none of what we're seeingright now are big bang events.
Okay, they just didn't happenex nihilo.
Dei just didn't pop out fromnowhere.
Transgenderism didn't just popout from nowhere.

(18:56):
I think we have asociopolitical culture in
America right now and in theworld at large, but in America,
where we live, we have asociocultural environment and
atmosphere right now that hasbeen facilitated by the
political leaders that we and Isay we many Christians have

(19:17):
elected to office.
So I think those two gotogether.

Yeah Well, political and just generally
cultural, I think a lot ofacademic.
You know.
It seems to me in hindsighthere a little bit that this
really was an elite or atop-down movement that didn't
have, as it turns out, a lot ofkind of bottom-up or, you know,
normie or whatever you want tocall it grassroots support.

(19:43):
And I kind of felt that.
You saw that even in theevangelical church, where
evangelicals that picked up thewoke worldview often were
pastors, leaders, but the peoplein the pews didn't buy it.
You know a lot of them.
There was a lot of switching ofchurches.

(20:06):
So it seems to me that thispart of what we're seeing is
just how fragile it is.
If you have, you know, a kindof a social revolution that's
pushed and, by the way, thetactics that were used to push
it were really aggressive.
They were, you know, they werekind of cancel culture,
censorship, you know all sortsof really aggressive, and I

(20:29):
think the tactics turned peopleoff.
What are your thoughts aboutall that, daryl?

Yeah, again, I think your point, scott, about
it being a top down versus abottom up movement is spot on.
Matter of fact, mostrevolutions happen that way.
You have the top down elitistswho have the positions of power,
they have the money, they havethe mechanisms, the machine.

(20:54):
The machinery is in place forthem to sort of execute on these
revolutions.
And again, revolutions occurbecause there's someone, or
maybe several someones, who wantto impart their worldview on
the rest of us.
This is why I say,revolutionaries are

(21:14):
eschatological, revolutionariesare eschatological.
When we think of eschaton andeschatology, we normally have
sort of a propensity to seeeschatology in the context of
the end of something.
But what we have to do asbelievers we have to understand
that eschatology is not just theend of something, but the end

(21:34):
of something and then thebeginning of something else.
So this is what revolutions tryto accomplish.
They're eschatological andthey're trying to replace one
type of world with another typeof world.
So usually the bottom ups,they're the pawns, they're the

(21:54):
people who have no clue.
Pawns, they're the people whohave no clue.
They have no.
They're so far separated fromthe top-down elitists, that.
But as Marx would say, usefulidiots, they're the useful
idiots of the elites, while theelites keep their hands clean.

(22:14):
The top-down people on thecollege campuses with the
megaphones and they're wearingthe keffiyehs, and they're the
ones getting their hands clean.
The top-down people on thecollege campuses with the
megaphones and they're wearingthe keffiyehs, and they're the
ones getting their hands dirty,they're the ones getting
arrested.

Luke Allen (22:25):
So here you have.

You know, this is people like the World
Economic Forum, the World HealthOrganization, people like
George Soros, the United Nationsand people like that.
So those are the top-down folks.
They've got the money, they'vegot the money, they've got the
structure, they've got theorganization.
And then the bottom-up folkswho are convinced that the
top-down folks care about them.
That's where the naivety isChinese people during his

(22:55):
cultural revolution in the 60sand 70s to end up killing dozens
of millions of people in Chinabecause he was able to convince
these young people that theywere just ideological world
changers.
It's every generation we havethis new crop of young, college
educated idealists who thinktheir job is to change the world

(23:16):
.
And this is what revolutionsare about.
Revolutions are about changingthe world.
Wokeness is a revolution.
Wokeness is just another termthat we've given to a historical
, repetitive presentation ofhuman nature.
Presentation of human nature,our human nature.

(23:38):
As sinners, we rebel we organizerevolutions because that's the
way we've convinced ourselvesthat well, I can get what my sin
nature wants.
I can get what I want byrevolution.
So this is all a top downorchestrated exercise that we're

(24:02):
seeing and these things arecyclical.
They're cyclical because, likeI say, all the time we repeat
history because human naturedoesn't change.
Human nature does not change.
That's why we repeat history.

(24:25):
So now we have anothergeneration of revolutionaries
who think well, I'm going to,I'm going to, you know, I'm
going to buy into this communismand cultural Marxism, because
my grandparents, they justdidn't do it right, you know,
and there's just sort of anaivete here.
And as Christians we need to besmarter than that.
You know, I think about a textScott, like Colossians 2.8, if I
can get there real quick.
The apostle Paul says inColossians 2.8, he says see to
it that no one thinks youcaptive through philosophy and

(24:48):
empty deception according to thetradition of men, according to
the elementary principles of theworld, rather than according to
Christ.
This is a one verse apologeticas to why Christians need to pay
attention to what's going onaround them, because the church
has been used across history topush social justice, to push DEI

(25:08):
and even to push wokenesscoming out of the whole George
Floyd situation.
Again, your point is wellthought out, scott, as it
relates to top-down versusbottom-up.

Luke Allen (25:25):
Hi friends, I wanted to take a quick minute to tell
you about our newest Bible studyhere at the Disciple Nations
Alliance, titled the Ten Wordsto Heal Our Broken World Bible
Study by Scott Allen Guys.
This 10-week Bible study is aperfect resource for any of us
who want to deeply ground ourunderstandings of each of these
10 culture-forming words in theBible.
Open your Bibles to see thetrue meanings of the words truth

(25:48):
, human, sex, marriage, freedom,authority, justice, faith,
beauty and love.
If you're wondering whydefining words is so important,
just keep listening to today'sepisode and think about how the
words that God originallydefined for us in his word, for
example, words like truth, sex,human and justice, have been so

(26:11):
drastically redefined by thosewho are behind some of the major
false ideologies that are inopposition to biblical
Christianity today.
If Christians don't know how todefine these words according to
God's word, then who's going todefend them against being
redefined?
So again, the Bible study isthe 10 words to heal our broken
world Bible study.
It's a 10 week course and it'snow available on Amazon, so you

(26:34):
can grab your copy today by justtapping the link in the show
notes.
This is a great study for youif you want to take it on your
own, at your own pace, with yourchurch Bible study, with your
small group or with any suchgroup that you're a part of.
We really hope this is ahelpful resource for you and we
also hope that you enjoy therest of the episode.

Dwight Vogt (26:55):
Okay, yeah, you guys are talking about cyclical
revolutions In this case.
Yeah, we've seen the DEI.
You referred to it as woke theworldview of CRT.
What's caused the switch in therevolution?
We've just come up againstreality.
Did the evangelical, biblicalworldview finally pervade in US

(27:18):
society?
It's finally getting the upperhand.
What happened?
What do you credit that to?

Well, here's what I'm seeing, Dwight.
Okay, let me just speak plainlyand bluntly.
Here's what I'm seeing.
I'm seeing the church not bethe students of the Bible that
we're supposed to be.
I've always argued that there'sa difference between reading
your Bible and studying yourBible, and what I'm seeing here

(27:49):
is, especially as it relates tothe degree that the church is
being captured by a lot of whatwe're seeing, and you see this
especially in mainlinedenominations, mainline
denominations where theirdoctrinal positions are sort of
malleable.
All right, they're mutable,they're flexible, they're

(28:10):
changeable, you know.
So you'll see these in mainlinedenominations where right above
the pulpit, they have the prideflag hanging.
They'll have the Black LivesMatters flag hanging.
They're capitulating on some ofthe clear teachings of scripture
against homosexuality, forexample, sexual immorality 1
Thessalonians 4.3.

(28:30):
They're capitulating to theculture, really out of fear,
really out of fear.
There's a fear that they willnot be liked, there's a fear
that they won't be accepted bythe culture.
There's a fear that they won'tbe seen as loving, as kind, as

(28:52):
gracious.
So what I'm seeing here, dwight, is not a church that is
standing on truth and I hate theterm culture war, so I'm not
going to use that term butthey're not standing on truth
against the evil error that iscoming against the church from
the world.
So, and I think this is whyideologies like DEI, critical

(29:16):
race theory, cultural Marxism,transgenderism are making such
inroads in the culture, becausethe church is I hate to say this
.
I have to be honest with youguys the church is quite
cowardly in a lot of ways.
Today day, I think it fearsbeing persecuted.

(29:37):
That's an irony.
The church fears beingpersecuted when Christ himself
said that the church would bepersecuted for standing for the
truth.
So there's an irony there thatwe should fear persecution when
Christ said that.
That's what we should expectwhen we come against an ungodly
world with the truth ofscripture.
So I again, I think there's alot of work to do within the

(30:04):
church and that work has got tostart within the pulpit.
We need courageous men who arewilling to stand for the truth
in the pulpit, regardless ofwhat it's gonna cost us to do
that, and it will cost ussomething.
So again, I wish I had morepositive news on that, dwight,
but from what I'm seeing andfrom you guys, you all know from

(30:27):
listening to Virgil and me onour Just Thinking podcast, that
we have tackled all of theseissues, but I'm still seeing
people out here demandingreparations.
They're demandingdiscriminatory treatment under

(30:48):
the guise of equality andjustice, in the form of DEI
policies.
We're seeing our children beravaged, sexually abused by men
who are pretending to be womenby virtue of the fact that they
just put on a dress and somelipstick.

(31:08):
This is a spiritual battle thatwe're in, gentlemen, and I just
don't think the church reallyrealizes that.

Yeah, I just want to comment a little bit on what
you're saying there, daryl.
My concern, you know, one ofthe things that we teach at
Disciple Nations Alliance comingfrom Daryl, one of our
co-founders, daryl Miller isthis concept of worldview at the
foundation, these kind of core,usually religious beliefs, deep

(31:34):
beliefs then leading to orcontributing to principles, kind
of foundational principles,those contribute you can think
of arrows, contributing topolicies and practices and those
, of course, having consequences.
And it seems to me that myconcern is that the Church and

(31:56):
the culture generally is nowkind of awakened or aware of the
dangers.
At a level of policy, like DEI,you know, we lose this whole
concept of merit-based and, wow,so many things fall apart if
you don't have some of the bestand brightest flying airplanes,
running universities or whateverit is.
We're all kind of realizingjust how damaging that is or all

(32:20):
sorts of things, I think.
Another thing that people areresponding to it's been
interesting for me to kind ofwatch the broader culture Like
where did you start gettingpushback?
One of the first places I sawit was school mothers, you know,
rejecting this idea that youcan categorize my son or my
daughter in public school basedon skin color, and put them into

(32:41):
a category of good or evil Likethat just—that was really—you
know non-Christians pushed backagainst that and said how dare
you, you know, make those kindof almost well racist judgments
against my son or my daughter?
You know, and not just whites,but blacks too.
You know we're saying the samething.
You know, how dare you paint myson or my daughter, you know,
and not just whites, but blackstoo.
You know we're saying the samething.
You know, how dare you paint myson as a victim, you know,

(33:04):
without any agency or whateverit is.
So you saw that, that wholemovement in school.
Then there was the movementagainst the rabid sexuality of
the children, especially at thetransgender with transgenderism.
You know the curriculum inpublic schools.
There was a big push againstthat.
And then you know there was amajor push too, continuing

(33:29):
against transgenderism in sports, transgenderism in terms of
surgery, especially for theyoung, and just kind of the
eye-opening shock that we allfelt about how big that industry
was and who was behind it.
Just kind of revulsion againstthat.
And then now everyone's talkingDEI.

(33:50):
I remember at the beginning wedidn't even know what to call
this.
The best name was culturalMarxism, but you couldn't say
that because you got all sortsof pushback and flack against
people that were.
You know, you're just callingme names or whatever it is, even
though it was an accurate name.
Then it was kind of criticalrace theory and now it's DEI,
you know.

(34:12):
But all that to say, I feel likeit's been at the level of
policy but not yet pushing downto the deep principle and
paradigm, and I think that'swhat we have to see clearly is
that you know we're dealing withan atheistic ideology.
There is no God, all that thereis is power, you know.

(34:32):
And these are dangerous anddeadly ideas and you know, not
just now, they've been that waythrough the 20th century
wherever they've been put intopractice.
But we can't just think, oh hey, we'll change a policy, you
know, change a law.
You know we've got to combatthis as Christians at the level
of worldview, kind of firstprinciples level.

(34:54):
You know what is this and howis it different from what the
Bible teaches on basic things?
And you know I'm speaking tosomebody who knows this so well.
I get that, Daryl, but that'smy concern.

Well, what you're talking about is
apologetics.
Is what you're talking about?
Bottom line is that, asChristians, we must be
apologists.
See, you bring up a great point.
We just can't address theseissues on the level of policy.
So, for instance, as Christianapologists, we can't just come
out and say, well, you know,transgenderism is wrong, without
being able to articulate andintelligently establish a

(35:29):
biblical apologetic for whytransgenderism is wrong.
We need to be able to pointpeople to Genesis 127, where the
creator, yes, the God whocreated us all in his image,
created us male and female.
Now, there's no, uh, there's nocomma after that verse.
That's period.
You're created male and female.
There's no, there's no ellipsesafter that verse.
Dot, dot dot that's right,that's, this is, it's finished,

(35:51):
it's final, it's definitive.
You, you are either male or youare female.
This is why Virgil and I, onour podcast, are just thinking
we spend so much time definingterms.
You would probably, I wouldguess if I had to put a number
on it.
You could click play on any ofour episodes, and we probably
spend the first third of everyepisode defining terms.

(36:13):
We did an episode last year,2024 on gender identity, where
we gave the history of the termgender as the culture uses it
and we introduced people to oneof the most demented individuals
ever to walk the face of thisearth, dr John Money, who opened
the first transgender clinic atJohns Hopkins University.

(36:34):
And this man was a Frankenstein, he absolutely was, he actually
he.
Matter of fact, john money isknown as the father of gender,
he's known as the inventor ofgender, uh.
So we have to as apologists.
As apologists, we need to beable to say and make the
distinction between what isbiological sex against the

(36:55):
culture's uh uh terminology ofbiological gender.
And when you understand thehistory, the origins, the
genesis of this idea ofquote-unquote gender, you'll
understand that it has nothingto do with biological sex but
has everything to do withabsolutely destroying God's

(37:17):
creative order.
That's what this whole idea,this whole philosophy of gender
is about destroying God'screative order, in which there
is definitively only two sexesthere is male and female.
There is no such thing astransgender.
But people like John Money.
But people like John Money,people like I'm thinking of the

(37:41):
woman who wrote a book.
The book was titled GenderTrouble.
I can't think of her name rightnow.
But people like that who are?
You mentioned the wordatheistic.
That's exactly right, scott.
These are unbelievers, theseare haters of God who want to
destroy I mean absolutelydestroy God's created order for

(38:02):
the family, for sex, formarriage, for how our children
ought to be raised.
And then again, eschatological.
They want to replace it withthis demonic evil licentiousness
, this world of licentiousnesswhere they can do what they want
, be who they want.

(38:24):
So that we're seeing everythingnow, from adult human beings
dressing up as furries, asanimals they're.
They're carrying out some ofthe most diabolical sexual
imaginations that you can thinkof, all under the guise of

(38:44):
gender and when peopleunderstand that, as the gender
theorists themselves declare,that gender is all about how you
feel.
So if you feel like a tree,you're a tree and I have to
acknowledge your tree pronouns,I guess, well, I'm an oak or I'm
a pine tree or I'm a, whateverthe case may be, and this is why

(39:08):
their pronouns run the gamut.
So we have to be apologists asit relates to, you know, these
worldviews.
See, when I say worldview, whatI mean, and this is what I want
to make clear to your listeners, scott.
This is how people think.

Yeah, this is how they see the world.

This is how they see the world.
This is how they see the world,and that includes how they see
you.
So when you look at all theseworldviews and how they're
coming against the church, thechurch is the enemy of these
worldviews and how they'recoming against the church, the
church is the enemy of theseworldviews.
The church is the only enemy ofthese worldviews.
These worldviews do not goafter Islam, they don't go after
Hinduism, they don't go afterBuddhism.

(39:48):
They go after Christianity, theBible and the God of the Bible.
Because the Bible dares to say,because the Bible dares to say
no, you are not that, you arenot a furry panda.
You are a male adult, you are afemale adult, you are created
in God's image and that's theend of that.

(40:10):
But because we dare to respondto the world with that truth, we
are their mortal enemy, andthere is no other animosity out
there right now that you couldpoint to that even gets close to
the level of the animosity thatthe world has for the church.

Yeah, yeah, I mean, except for perhaps the Jewish
community, and I think that it'sfor the same reason.

you know, it's God the God of the Bible
ultimately that people arerebelling against in this fallen
world.

You know it goes back to the Garden of Eden and
you can be like God yourself.
That old temptation hasn't goneaway.

Yeah, away, I just have a couple of thoughts on
what you just said, darrell.
First of all, I want to thankyou for that insight on
eschatology.
I've never thought of it thatway, but it makes sense to me
that it's not just the end, it'sthe beginning of some movement.
I'm going to look at my Bibledifferently from when I look at
eschatology here.

(41:16):
And the other one is using theword apologetics.
I saw an article recently andyou're using it broadly.
I grew up in the 60s andapologetics was about the
inerrancy of the Bible and, youknow, is creation true?
And you're using it broadly inthe sense of apologizing in a
good way for God's given order,which is a worldview comment.

(41:40):
And I think that's also a reallygood thing that's happening as
we think about apologetics inour church.
We're broadening it to go whatis God's given?
What is God given order?
What is his design at theparadigm level, as you put it,
scott?
So that's what I heard you sayand I appreciate that.

Darrell, you criticized the church of not
being engaged and allowing theseworldviews to get the upper
hand in the culture.
And you know, as JohnStonestreet often says, you know
, ideas have consequences andbad ideas have victims.
I mean, it's true, these aredeeply, deeply damaging ideas.

(42:18):
They destroy people, theydestroy—you can't have a
functioning culture if thesecore presuppositions of this
woke, cultural, marxistworldview take hold in a culture
.
You just can't, becauseeverything becomes power.
You know, and it's just gettingthe upper hand and putting

(42:39):
forth my power in any way that Ican, shutting you down,
censoring you, persecuting you,throwing you in prison, whatever
you know we'll do.
Whatever you know, it's justpower.
You can't have a functioningsociety when people are, you
know, operating in that way,without any love, without any
grace or forgiveness or all ofthese things that come from the

(43:00):
Bible.
But I do want to—it seems to methat—I just heard a sermon,
recently in fact, on this, wherethe pastor, great guy, but he
was saying the mission of theChurch, when it boils down to it
, is to just preach the goodnews of salvation, and I thought
well, certainly it's not lessthan that.
You know, the gospel is centralto the biblical worldview.

(43:23):
But I found myself being a bitfrustrated with that too,
because I thought to use NancyPeercy's you know the title of
her great book.
We have total truth.
You know, we have to be outthere representing not just
truth about sin and salvationbut truth about what does it
mean to be a human being, aboutmarriage, sexualities.
We have to be representing allof that.
That's all included in mission.

(43:46):
And I know that someevangelicals get nervous when
you broaden it in that waybecause they have a fear and I
think there's right reason tofear that if you get it too
broad, if it becomes too big,then we're going to lose this
emphasis on evangelism andgospel presentation.
Do you agree with me on myconcern there?

(44:08):
Because I do think that's partof the reason that the Church
hasn't been as engaged on someof these things.
And I think when you don'tengage in that way, if you think
that way, it's very easy tokind of go along with whatever
the culture is putting forwardon those issues, right, because
you assume that it's notimportant or the Bible doesn't
speak to it or whatever it is.

Yeah, I completely agree with you, scott
.
I couldn't say it any betterthan you articulated it there.
And I think having that sort ofparadigm of how the church is
supposed to be involved inworldview issues, to the extent
that a Christian might think thechurch should be involved,

(44:51):
whatever extent that might be, Ithink a lot of that mindset is
attributable to just tradition,ecclesiastical tradition.
It could be attributable toecclesiastical denominationalism
and what that denomination hastaught or subscribed to over the
generations.
But you know again, you know,you look at you, look at what

(45:13):
God, even God, says in his word.
God says come, let us reasontogether.
Look at what God, even God,says in his word.
God says come, let us reasontogether.
You see, christianity and beinga Christian, being a follower
of Jesus Christ, does not detachyou from the mind.
It does not detach you fromthinking.
So, yes, still, salvation is byfaith alone.
You know, recall now that Jesusin John 17, in his high

(45:37):
priestly prayer, he explicitlyasked his heavenly father not to
take us out of the world.
He says I'm not asking you totake them out of the world, I'm
asking you to protect them fromthe evil one, keep them from the
evil one.
Well, and I don't mean to soundfacetious here, but why do you

(46:00):
think Jesus asked God, thefather, to not take us out of
the world, to leave us here?
Why do you think one of theseverses I'm about to cite that we
use as a bumper sticker phrasewhy do you think Jesus left us
here to be salt and light, to bea city on a hill?
You can't do that by justsitting in your pew and counting
the increase in the membershiprole.
You have to be a consciousthinking believer.

(46:24):
If you're being salt and light,it's like Jesus himself said if
you take away the salt, it'snot salty anymore.
So you can't be a static,uninvolved Christian in this
world, because I don't thinkthat's why Jesus left us here.
He didn't leave us here tocollect dust, okay.

(46:46):
Now in saying that, I thinkanother, another disheartening
reality of the church andbelievers having sort of a
narrow, traditional view of howwe are to be involved in the
world is that we think thatchanging policy is the answer.

(47:09):
So you know, you look at whatwe call the Great Commission.
You know Jesus sent us out tomake disciples.
Ultimately, the goal isn't tochange policy.
Now, in saying that, I am 100%behind, and I'll just go ahead
and admit that right now, whereAmerica is right now, as we

(47:31):
record this episode, on March 17, 2025, is light years from
where we were three months ago.
Okay, so I'm going toacknowledge that in the open and
be transparent about that.
However, ultimately, what wewant our hearts to be changed,
that's what, ultimately, what wewant.

(47:51):
We want believe.
We want unredeemed,unregenerate believers to come
to faith in Jesus Christ and bycoming to faith in him, the Holy
Spirit now indwells them, sotheir entire view of the world
changes to one that mirrors whatscripture says about ourselves,
about the world.
So, yes, I would love to seepolicies reflect God's

(48:18):
principles and precepts, butultimately, policies don't
change the heart.
Policies do not change theheart.

I'd love to just piggyback on what you're saying,
because I couldn't agree morefervently with what you're
saying, although like you, Imean I do.
I really appreciate and honorChristians who are involved in
the policy arena on issues oflife or education or you name it
.
You know they're involved inpolitics and policy.
Those are important fights, butto put our hope in that, apart

(48:54):
from people's hearts, and mindsbeing changed.
I don't think is right.
We've got to go more upstreamand you know we have to.
I was thinking as you weretalking about the issue of
slavery and how.
You know, in the New Testament,you know, there wasn't some big

(49:15):
policy push to outlaw slaveryin the Roman Empire.
You know, coming out of theChurch, but what you had was
something actually more powerful, in a real way.
You had a complete paradigmshift, you know, in terms of how
we think about master and slave, and you know Paul made this

(49:37):
explicit in several of hisletters.
Right, you know including oh,what's the small book Onesimus?

you know yeah, Philemon.

Philemon.
I mean you know you have tothink completely differently now
about if you're a master, aboutyour slave and if you're a
slave, about your master,because you're all brothers and
sisters in Christ and you allhave equal.
That is a worldview level shiftat the level of what does it
mean to be a human being, whatdoes it mean to be a believer in
Jesus Christ?

(50:06):
And that has to come beforeyou're going to get a policy
change, which did come underpeople like William Wilberforce,
of course, much later you knowwhere you've got the eradication
of slave trade in England andlater in the United States.
You know the Bible put itsemphasis on that worldview shift
coming out of the heart shift.
Now you're a new person inJesus Christ.

(50:27):
Now you've got to thinkdifferently.
And once those pieces were putin place, slavery is just going
to come to an end.
It can't continue.
Right, right, right.

That's the that was the.
When you look at the abolitionmovement, you mentioned
Wilberforce and the influenceand the impact that he had on
slavery over in England.
But you look at theabolitionist movement here in
America, you know, leading up tothe Emancipation Proclamation
and whatnot, that the abolitionmovement was essentially an

(51:00):
Imago Dei movement.
This was a movement that wasbuilt upon the foundational
truth, the universal truth ofGenesis 127.
Slavery ended because, overtime, people began to understand
that every single human beingon the face of this planet is
created in the image of God.

(51:20):
It doesn't matter what yourethnicity is, it doesn't matter
what your cultural background is.
Every single human being thatinhabits this planet was created
in the image of God.
That is ultimately what broughtslavery to an end in England
and America.
That's what convictedWilberforce, a former slave

(51:41):
trader okay, a former slaveowner, william Wilberforce.
So when you look at how thesubject of slavery is so
casually bantered about in theculture today, you know as it's
being used as a bargaining toolto get reparations, people are

(52:02):
what I call monetizing suffrage.
They're monetizing historicalsuffrage in order to get a
paycheck from the government.
But yeah, again, scott, youbring up a great example of what
it means to be a Christianapologist.
Are you equipped, as aChristian, to answer a
reparationist, to use scriptureto answer a reparationist and

(52:27):
say, no, slavery is an Imago Deiissue?
Reparations is stealing.
Reparations totally goesagainst the biblical model of uh
uh, reconciliation andremuneration remuneration where
a sin was actually committed,yeah, okay.

(52:48):
So, for example, scott, Icannot argue that you owe me
reparations because you haven'tsinned against me.
What do you?

yeah to me that's the biggest argument against
reparations is that— Ridiculousyeah.
I mean, there's a place forpeople to—for wrongs that you've
done.
What's the word I'm looking forhere?
To—it's not reparations, butit's to pay, to make a payment
for the wrong that you've done.
But it's got to be kind of youpersonally.

(53:19):
And the Bible makes a big pointout of the fact that even
children, you know, aren't goingto be held responsible for the
sins of their fathers, much lessseveral generations later.
You know that's a biblicalunderstanding of justice.
You know, and we're not, youknow.
So the reparations thing iswe're going to lump everyone
into these broad, clumsycategories of skin color, and
some people are going to pay andsome people are going to pay

(53:46):
and some people are going toreceive.

It's just, it's just it.
You know, it's just when I, youguys are triggering a thought
for me.
I was thinking of robertscirocco of the acton institute
and he talked about um, if youget, if you get what it means to
be human right, you'll geteverything else right.
He was talking about economics,he was talking about education,
he was talking about justiceand, daryl, you said it was an
Imago Dei movement in Americaand I thought, wow, that is so

(54:09):
powerful, because if I think ofeducation and if we could make
that an Imago Dei movement, itwould be a great argument and I
don't know if you're followingthe revolution too at the end of
it, isn't well every everyone,but but but even education.
I was thinking why, anyway, Iwas thinking about the other day
that that if you recognize theuniqueness of a human being as a

(54:32):
child, each one has his ownlearning capacity, each has his
own, but each has a calling,each has a, a future.
And how would you educate thatchild?
And anyway, people don't thinkthat way, they just go.
Well, let's, let's create theeducation factory and we'll
produce, right, this kind ofperson but anyway, it's just

(54:54):
mago day it's ma Mago Day.
That's the answer.
I think so here you go.

Genesis 127 levels the playing field for
everybody.
You can apply Genesis 127 andthe universal principle and
truth that God created everyindividual in his image, male
and female.
You can apply that principle toeverything in the world.
Education DEI goes away.
Dei goes away.

(55:19):
The world education dei goesaway.
Dei goes away.
Reparations goes away um socialjustice goes away.

He made us unique.
Psalms 139.
He made us unique, absolutelyunique.
So we're precious for ouruniqueness as well as our value
in his image, you know anyway,yeah so, so.

So again, as an apologist, you know, we need
to be able to, dwight, as youjust did.
We need to be able to look atthese worldview issues and
articulate them, engage indiscourse about them through the
lens of what Scripture says.
And I keep going back toScripture, because what does
Jesus say in John 17?
He asked the Father to sanctifyus in his truth, that his word

(55:57):
is truth.
You've heard it said before.
All truth is God's truth.
So, whether we're talking aboutscripture or what God has
revealed of himself in creationthrough general revelation, you
know, if we would just apply theunbiased, equitable principles
and precepts that we find inscripture, all this stuff would
go away.

(56:17):
The problem is is that in oursin nature, we don't want, we
really don't want what God, whathis word, defines as equity.
We don't want that.
Now, a great example fromscripture would be the situation
in which King Solomon had toadjudicate that situation
between the two femaleprostitutes who were arguing

(56:39):
over who was the mother of thelive baby.
There were two babies One haddied, there was one remained
alive.
And you recall that when Godappointed Solomon to succeed his
father, david, that God asked,solomon said hey, ask me
whatever you want and I'll grantit to you.

(57:00):
And Solomon, in an incredibledemonstration of wisdom, said
give me wisdom to judge thispeople.
Just give me wisdom to judgethis people.
And we see that wisdom ondisplay in that situation.
This is a great example of thedistinction between equality and
equity Equality- comes inwherein.

(57:21):
Solomon applied God's lawequally to both the women.
He applied God's law equally toboth of them.
Equity came in.
Equity is God's principle offairness.
This is his principle of doingwhat is righteous, based on the
truth.
So equity meant that only oneof those women was going to
leave with that baby.
Equity meant one of those womenwas going to leave without a

(57:44):
baby.
You see, but we need tounderstand distinctions like
that through scripture so thatwe can understand well, dei is
not only wrong, it's sinfulbecause it's ethnic partiality
against one ethnic group,probably more than one ethnic
group in favor of another ethnicgroup.

(58:04):
So I argue against DEI on thebasis of a text like James 2.9.
You know you should show thereis no impartiality with God.
So DEI is sinful.
Partiality.
Social justice again, I argueagainst social justice from a
text like Leviticus 19, 15.

(58:25):
You shall do no injustice injudgment, you shall not be
partial to the poor nor defer tothe great, but you are to judge
your neighbor.
Failing Social justice, bydefinition, is sinful.
Because is sinful because itshows deference to the poor and
it makes the rich or the greatthe enemy.
So again, if we're going to bebiblical apologists, we have to

(58:48):
be so familiar with God's Wordthat we can argue articulately
against these worldviews fromthe standpoint of what Scripture
says and not just say well, youknow that's wrong, or I'm
against that, or I support that.
We need to be able to establishwhy.

Yeah, and Daryl, just to add to what you're
saying there, you know, in termsof arguing against these things
, to me the deepest level of itis that you know, the worldview
of social justice, or theideology of social justice,
justice or the ideology ofsocial justice or wokeness, it's
atheistic and it basically says, you know, there is no God, all

(59:28):
there is is power.
And then it divides humanity upinto groups based on things
like skin color, sex, gender,and it says every one of these
groups is either in a positionof leveraging their power to you
know, exploit selfishly peoplethat don't have power.
That is the worldview, that'sthe world that they see, that's
all there is.
And so good and evil is afunction of what group are you

(59:49):
in.
The evil is caused by thisgroup or that group.
Well, that's completelydifferent from what the Bible
says.
I mean, yeah, the Bible goesdeeper and it says, no, the evil
is because we're all sinners,right?
That?

Darrell Harrison (01:00:02):
line between good and evil.

Scott Allen (01:00:04):
All you know.
It comes right out of our heart.
Right?
You can't point to that groupover there and say the problem
with the world is you.
You've got to point that fingerback inside of yourself and so
you've got to change.
If you want to change the world, you've got to change, you know
, through faith in Jesus, it'syou know, something you've got
to do.
That's why I think it's youknow.
Some have labeled it a falsegospel because it gives a sense

(01:00:26):
of justification to a particulargroup of people where none is
deserved.
They need to be saved, but theyfeel like they're justified
because of whatever thoseexternal characteristics are so.

Yeah, what you just did there, scott, maybe
unbeknownst to you.
You just gave a pretty, uhpretty succinct definition of
what marxism is yeah you knowmarxism.
Marxism is rooted in, uh,division, uh, classes, uh.
This is why critical racetheory, which is an out out
offshoot of marx, a tenet ofMarxism, does exactly that

(01:01:01):
Critical race theory.
And what I want your listenersto understand when they hear the
word critical critical pedagogy, critical theory, critical
health justice, things like thatwhen they hear the word
critical, that word criticaldoesn't mean analytical.

So normally you and I.
That's correct.
No, that's important tounderstand.
That's right yeah.

Yeah, when we say, well, we're going to take a
critical look at something,that means we're going to take
an objective, analytical look atsomething, dice it up, put it
back together and see what thatleads to.
But in critical race theory theword critical means to
criticize.
It means to criticize.

Yeah, it means there's some kind of nefarious
thing behind things that looklike freedom or justice.
Oh, you use that word freedom,but what you really are doing is
leveraging it for your ownpower.
They're always kind of tryingto get at that.

There's some ulterior motive here for you
Exactly right, because that'sall there is Well.

power in this worldview, too, is always
negative, right, it's only usedfor one purpose only to oppress.
The Bible says no power rightlyused is used.
I mean Jesus, the most powerfulbeing in the universe, laid
down his life for the good ofothers.
I mean that is revolutionary,you know, but that worldview
doesn't exist.

(01:02:20):
In this worldview, power isn'tcompletely negative and only
used to oppress.

Well, you know , power is only negative until
you can get it.
Until you can get it Right, youcan have it.
You know.
Then, all of a sudden, it's notnegative.
That's right, this is what.

Well, and that's why this is not a workable
worldview.
It just pits people againsteach other, destroys any hope of
any kind of relationship thatyou could have with one another
if we're always just trying tofight to get on top of the
pyramid, right.

Right, that's so perfectly said, scott.
This is exactly what criticalrace theory does.
Critical race theory dividespeople into categories and then,
by definition, it createsantagonistic relationships
between those people.
So they begin to hate oneanother, dislike one another,
distrust one another.

That's right.

All the behavioral characteristics that
grow out of critical race theoryand ethnic prejudice are
antithetical to what the gospelteaches, are antithetical to
what the gospel teaches In termsof you.
Take Ephesians 2, where God hastorn down that wall of division
.
Critical race theory is anideology that builds that wall

(01:03:26):
back up, and that's exactly whatwe're seeing with CRT DEI,
social justice.
I've argued for years.
You don't need to put amodifier like the word social
and add it to the word justice,because, scripturally speaking,
there's either justice orthere's injustice.
There's one or the other.

(01:03:46):
So when we latch on, when we asthe church, we latch on to
worldly terminology and worldlyvernacular, we're setting
ourselves up for defeat, becauseunless we can recapture those
words, the last thing a believerin Christ should do is use the
world's terms, because when youuse the world's terms, you end
up fighting on the world's turfand then you're going to end up

(01:04:07):
losing every time you, you're,you're preaching from the book I
just finished writing, which ison words and the power of words
, and there's nothing morepowerful than the biblical
definitions of these key words,and the way that the enemies of
the gospel want to change isthey want to redefine those
words.

So you're right on spot on.
Hey, listen, we're running outof time, daryl, and I would be
remiss if I didn't.
I know we're going to changethe subject dramatically here a
bit, but I do want to talk aboutyour most recent book and would
love to have you back on andcontinue this part of the
discussion, but what I'm talkingabout here is a book that you

(01:04:47):
just recently published withVirgil Walker your friend Virgil
titled A Biblical Theology ofClimate Change.
That was published by G3 Press.
I would encourage all of ourlisteners to go over to the G3
website and you can look at thisbook, you can purchase it, and
I encourage you to do that Justbefore, again, before we leave.

(01:05:10):
I just wouldn't mind hearing alittle bit of your thought on
that.
What caused you to be focusingon that as a subject?
And you know what caused you tobe focusing on that as a
subject and and you know whatwhat drove you to write this
book, if you don't mind, daryl.

Yes, scott, yeah, be glad to, and speaking
of being glad, so I will be gladto come back on with you guys
to discuss this topic evenfurther because it's a very
complex topic to navigate.

Yes, I know we're not going to begin to do it
justice, but I just wanted to atleast put it on the table here.

Yeah so.
Virgil Walker again, who's myco-host on the Just Thinking
podcast.
We've we don't shy away fromtough topics.
I mean, we've done criticalrace theory, we've done gender
identity, we've done slavery,we've done all that stuff.
Critical race theory, we'vedone the enneagram, all that
kind of stuff.
The critical race theory stoodout to us because, like the like

(01:06:03):
, like those other topics that Ijust mentioned, we saw evidence
that the church was starting tobuy into this thing.
They were starting to buy intothis thing and they were
starting to buy into it notknowing what it really is, but
critical, I'm sorry, critical.
There is critical climate change, but we'll talk about that
later.
But climate change, climatechange is one of the most

(01:06:23):
demonic, surreptitiousideologies to come against the
church in a long, long time, andwhat it does is all.
First of all, it's about thevernacular.
So climate change is a nearly70 year old worldview that, when
you dig deep into it, scott,has nothing to do with saving

(01:06:45):
the environment, improving theenvironment, but has everything
to do with population control.
You can go all the way back tothe 60s.
One of the one of the books Iread in preparation for writing
the book we also have a podcastepisode on.
This was a book by Dr PaulEhrlich called the Population
Bomb.
That was written in 1968.
To promote abortion and topromote population control and

(01:07:07):
reduction for the sake ofappeasing a pantheistic pagan
goddess by the name of GaiaG-A-I-A.

(01:07:31):
So in the book we talk aboutGaianism and where that came
from.
So climate change is really areligion.
It is a religion grounded inMiddle Eastern paganism, whereby
elitists again, global elitistsare pushing these policies like
EVs, electric vehicles, andthey're saying you can't use air

(01:07:52):
conditioning, you can't userefrigeration, you have to kill
all the cows, you can't eat meat.
All these kind of things arereligious in mother earth.
Earth and climate change is anentity, is a living entity with
rights, and it has more rightsthan human beings, which is why

(01:08:26):
climate change cannot beseparated from population
reduction.
So the fear mongers who arepromoting climate change will
say well, we need people to stopgetting married, you're having
too many children, you'redriving too many cars.
This is all about populationcontrol so as to appease the God

(01:08:47):
that they worship.

Wow, well, yeah, boy, this is a topic I care
deeply about and I've spoken outmany years ago against the
crisis du jour of the day, whichwasn't climate, but it was
overpopulation, and you had guyslike Paul Ehrlich speaking into
that.
And you know the populationbomb.

(01:09:10):
You know, if we don't curbhuman population, we're going to
destroy this world.
That's the connection toenvironment and climate and
things like that.
And, as you said too, you know,once you dismiss God, these are
ultimately atheistic worldviews, at least atheistic in the
sense they don't believe in theGod of the Bible, they don't
believe in creation.
So what are you left to worship?
You know not the Creator, butcreation itself.

(01:09:32):
You know that's what you areworshiping, and so you're
correct to call it a religion.
That's what you are worshiping,and so you're correct to call
it a religion.
Boy, would I love to talk moreabout that.
It's so relevant here in thestate of Oregon because it's
deeply believed and it's drivingso much policy in really
harmful ways.

Yeah, and when you look at it, scott,
especially you there being inOregon, you're front and center
of this stuff.
You know you got really havetrees, nature, what they would
call nature has more rights thanhuman beings.

You know and see, by the way, that's not.
You know, you're not speakingwith hyperbole.
There there actually is a legalmovement to give right, legal
rights to right in annabelle,objects like trees and lakes and
things like that.
Yeah, it's a movement.

And the climate change movement is
what's called Earth Law.
It's called Earth Law, so yourlisteners need to study up on
everything that they can find onEarth Law.
Go out and read the UnitedNations Charter for Paris 2030.
Whenever you hear the word 2030, 2035, this is what they're
talking about.
Zero emissions.
This is what they're talkingabout.

(01:10:41):
Zero, zero emissions.
This is what they're talkingabout.
They want to get people.
They want to take away yourliberties.
They want to take away yourliberties.
This is what this is all about.
They want.
Gaia is angry.
Okay, gaia is angry.
With humanity, we need toreduce the population, and the
irony of them pontificatingabout reducing the population is
that it's always everybody elsewho has to die, not them.

(01:11:01):
It's everybody else who has todie.
You know, not them, so you getyou get the credit.

Well, I always thought that you know I mean, I
was just listening to, oh, whatwas, um uh, jane goodall, you
know, she spoke a couple yearsago at the world economic forum
and she was basically making thecase in a passionate way that
we needed to reduce worldpopulation down to something
like a billion.
I mean dramatic, you know, ifif we were going to survive as a

(01:11:29):
, as a race, a species, and Ithought okay well, like who you
know, you first you know, yeah,what am I?
It's really nothing, you know,yeah, but I'm like it's really
nothing to laugh at, though,because I do think that we are
seeing them make attempts tokill off huge numbers of people,
not through, you know, puttingguns in people's faces, but

(01:11:50):
through other means that aremuch more nefarious, and, you
know, I'd love to hear One ofthose nefarious means is
euthanasia.

You're seeing euthanasia being more widely
used around the world.
That's all driven by climatechange, guys, and you know it's
interesting how the woman whoyou just mentioned was speaking
at the world economic forum.
They talk about saving theplanet, but I'm like, for who?
You don't want to have children?
Who are we saving the planetfor?
You're up here, uh, trying totell us it's dangerous to the
planet to have children.

(01:12:19):
So who are you going to besaving the planet for?
If you follow the climatechange religion to its logical
conclusion, no one.
Ultimately, there will be noone here.
There will be no one becauseyou can't reproduce, because
reproducing is harmful to theplanet.
So even if they got thepopulation down to a billion,
when those billion dies offthat's the logical ultimate

(01:12:42):
conclusion to climate changeNobody lives because you can't
reproduce.

Yeah, and that shows the truly demonic roots of
this, because that is Satan'sagenda to steal, to kill and to
destroy, and especially todestroy God's image bearers and
it runs directly counter toGod's love for His image bearers
.
You know, going back to Genesis1-1, be fruitful, multiply, fill
the earth.
That's what he wants.
And this idea that human beingsare just a drain on the

(01:13:10):
environment, that is such afalse idea.
Yes, we can be destroyers ofthe environment.
We often are in our fallencondition.
But as image bearers of God, wehave the capacity to have godly
dominion and actually protectthe environment and do all sorts
of positive things, create newresources.
That never gets, of course,looked at or appreciated.

(01:13:31):
That would go against the grainof this movement, of course.
So human beings have to just bemerely a blight upon this kind
of perfect creation.
There's a lot of biblicalapologetics that I'm sure you've
done in this book and that wecan talk about, maybe next time
you come on, daryl.
I would love that because I dothink I would be more than happy
to absolutely yeah, that wouldbe great Thanks for writing the

(01:13:53):
book too, and just for all thatyou're doing to to further the
cause of truth, biblical truth,true truth, uh, in a world
that's uh full of lies that arevery destructive, and uh, I'm
just so grateful for your voiceand for your courage out there,
uh, dwight.
Any final thoughts or comments?

Dwight Vogt (01:14:12):
Oh, I, I've just appreciated Daryl hearing you
and and it goes back to justyour your podcast with Virgil,
appreciate it very much.
So thanks for joining us.

Thank you.
Thank you, gentlemen, forhaving me again.
It's really been a pleasure.
This has been the fastest 90minutes that I can recently
remember, but that's usually agood thing that the dialogue was
hopefully the dialogue.
It was enjoyable for us buthelpful to your listeners.

Yeah, I totally agree, daryl.
Thank you so much for coming onand just again for your voice
in the Church and in the culturemore broadly, and just for
honoring us today with yourpresence, and I really agree.
I hope that this was helpfulfor all of our listeners.
Thank you who are listeningtoday to this podcast.
We deeply appreciate you tuningin and hope that you'll share

(01:15:01):
links with your friends and giveus positive reviews as well.
This is Ideas have Consequences.
The podcast of the DiscipleNations Alliance.

Luke Allen (01:15:14):
Thank you so much for listening to this episode
with our amazing guest, darylHarrison.
If you'd like to learn moreabout him, his writings and his
podcast, the Just ThinkingPodcast, make sure to head over
to this episode's page, which islinked in the show notes.
By the way, we actually alreadygot him back on the calendar to
join us again for anotherepisode in a couple months to

(01:15:35):
tell us more about what he'slearned during his writing
process of his newest book,biblical Theology of Climate
Change.
If you head over to the episodepage, you can also learn more
about our newest Bible studyhere at the Disciple Nations
Alliance that I mentioned duringthe break, which is called the
10 Words to Heal Our BrokenWorld Bible Study by Scott Allen
.
If you'd like to grab your copytoday again, that is on Amazon,

(01:15:57):
or you can also just head overto the episode page or
10wordsbookorg, which is wherewe house everything 10 Words
Book.
That's it for today, guys.
Thanks again for joining us forthis discussion.
We truly appreciate your timeand attention and we hope that
you'll be able to join us againnext week here on.
Ideas have consequences.

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Underlying Worldviews: DEI & Climate Alarmism | Darrell Harrison

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}Underlying Worldviews: DEI & Climate Alarmism | Darrell Harrison