Podcasting Power Hour: Creating good Podcasting intros and creative content strategies.

This content is repurposed from episodes of Podcasting Power Hour. Podcasting Power Hour is recorded live on Twitter Spaces. On this episode: we talk about creating good Podcasting intros and creative content strategies. Of course, we answer your podcasting questions as well.

Episode Transcript

(00:01):
What you're gonna do, brother,when Jeff Townsend Media runs wild on you.
Have you been searching for a podcast? Do you want to learn from
some great content creators? Well you'vecome to the right place Indie Podcaster with
your host Jeff Townsend, the Indiepodcast Father. All right, all right,

(00:29):
all right, this is Jeff Townsend. Thank you for checking out another
episode of Indie Podcaster. This podcastis made for podcasters and other content creators.
Certainly don't consider myself a guru,or either do any of my friends
that will be featured in these episodes. But what we do like to do
is talk content creation, pick eachother's brains, and have a good time.
I'm proud to mention that this podcastis sponsored by Indie drop In.

(00:52):
Now, let me tell you somethingabout Indie Dropping. This is an awesome
network that my friend Greg has created. What he does is drop episodes from
independent content creator into his established podcastaudience on his feed, and he shares
your episodes to an audience that alreadyexists. Yes, it's like free advertisement
promotion for your podcast. He spenta lot of time, money, and
effort building it, and he alreadyhas an audience interested in the content,

(01:15):
and he can certainly help you bysharing your content is great promotion. Go
to indie drop in dot com slashcreators and check it out. If you're
a comedy, true crime, paranormal, for various other different kinds of podcasts,
you can benefit from this. SoI really encourage you once again go
to indie drop in dot com slashcreators and see if you can get your
stuff featured on indie drop in.We'll go back to the podcast here Indie

(01:38):
Podcasters. So what we've currently beendoing is sharing content from three different projects
that I'm involved in. The firstis Good Morning Podcasters with my good friend
Fuzz Martin. We also do somecontent on podcasting Sucks, and then in
these episodes you will also hear somecontent from podcasting Power Hour. Podcasting Power
Hour is a live thing we doon Twitter spaces. We get a whole
bunch of great podcast minds together wetalk podcasting. So if you're a content

(02:01):
creator a podcaster, I think you'lltake something away from every episode of the
content I'm going to share with you. With that being said, make sure
you check out Eddie drop in andmake sure you enjoy this episode. I
think it's important that we all continueto learn and grow every day, and
that will help us become even bettercontent creators. That's certainly what I try
to do, learn something new everyday. I'm excited to share this content

(02:22):
with you. I think it'll bea learning experience for you. Let's get
to this episode, and I hopeyou have a great time listening to it.
Welcome to Podcasting Power Hour with yourhost Jeff Townsend, aka the Indie
podcast Father. I'm your co hostGreg from Indie Dropping Network. Podcasting Power

(02:53):
Hour is recorded live every Monday atnine pm Eastern Time on Twitter spaces.
Every week, an experienced panel ofpodcasters and other experts over tackle your podcast
and questions. We will, ofcourse put links to all of our guests
and any relevant information in the shownotes. All right, let's get this

(03:15):
party started. Fair enough, allright, we'll get it going. We
don't have it necessarily like a settopic or like a guest we're bringing in
tonight, so definitely deeding you guysto request the mic, come up and
talk some podcasting, of course.I am Jeff Townsend and welcome to the
most stupid pandas Twitter space in theworld, Podcasting Power Hour Greg joins me.

(03:39):
His milkshake brings all the boys tothe yard. Damn Bright, it's
better than yours, Oh Greg,Yeah, cookies and cream always does it.
I don't know what it is,but it's a crowd favorite. Hello
everyone, I'm Greg. Yeah,Greg here from Indie Dropping Network and thanks.

(03:59):
Fuzz. I can't cut it,cut it, cut it, cut
it, cut it. No,I'm just kidding. I can't. I
can't speak today. You can find, you can find. I've done some
interviews, but uh, but nobodycan say it or remember it, so
I just don't talk, don't don'tbring it up. But yeah, thanks
for coming. Uh. It lookslike we have a huge crowd today,

(04:23):
so hopefully we don't get too routy. Yeah. I must just be the
jizzling ships these days. What happenedto like the two hundred plus people?
I must have scared them off.Those are all Tanner's bots. He does
have a lot of bots. He'sgot to pay to fight off the bots.
It's epic anyways, Fuzz, hecan go ahead and introduce yourself as

(04:44):
the You're kind of like the Uh, there's a captain, then there's a
first officer, and what's the third, he's like the flight engineer, Yeah,
you're my flight engineer, Fuzz Navigator, the bos, Yes, I'm
the Bosh. Hey everybody, I'mFuzz Martin. I I am a former
broadcaster. I am the owner andpartner at a relatively large advertising agency,

(05:06):
and I love podcasting. So Jeff, thanks for putting this on no problem,
of course, some of the usuals. Jim Edward, I would miss
it for his life, and Jenis also here, and I see Michelle
down there listening, and then someother people that are always here. So
we appreciate your continued support and attendance. Greg. Do you have something you

(05:27):
want to kick us off with tonightor do I need to do that?
No, I mean I can kindof talk about some podcasting work that I'm
doing and kind of some interesting observations. So I had my niece come over
today and she's doing some summer workand she's helping me curate shows for Scary
Time and comedy and true crime andall that stuff. And she yells down

(05:50):
the stairs to me earlier today andshe's like, I found a show,
but his intro music has seriously beengoing on for a minute and like fifteen
seconds. Should I I mean,is this a crappy show or should I
cut it? Like? But Iskipped to the middle and it seems okay.

(06:14):
And it just is funny because she'sfourteen, doesn't know anything about podcasting,
and she hated it immediately. Sojust goes to show that I think
some of the best practices are stilluniversally appreciated, even by like new listeners.
And so that's why I put thattweet out there today that said,

(06:38):
hey, keep your intro music toless than fifteen seconds unless you're going to
talk over it. And then Googleducking what if your intro music? And
I'm saying this that I'm probably noteven right, but my wife's intro music
is really good and it has anice break at twenty seconds where you can

(07:01):
talk over it. And there's ifwe we would have to change up the
entire flow of the intro if weif we switched it. So what are
you what are your thoughts on that? You're gonna say, you're gonna tell
me to cut it? I knowyou are. I mean, you're pushing
it, man, Like I whatI would do is I would go over
to you know, Apple Analytics andsee if anybody's dropping off. If they're

(07:26):
not, I would say, you'refine, But but you know, on
the twentieth show, twenty seconds isgoing to drive me crazy. The first
one they might be okay, I'llargue on the other side of that,
though, the technology you have nowwhen you're doing a podcast, you can
push skip forward thirty seconds. It'snot a big deal once you get to

(07:49):
the fifteenth show and you know theintro's there. Yeah, but I don't
think what you're fighting against is notlike you got to You got a couple
of things happening here, right,So one is is these little annoyances add
up, so like there's a rulein customer satisfaction that's like death by a
thousand cuts. And then you knowthe like one hundred people will be dissatisfied,

(08:13):
but I think only like three orfour will complain. So there's like
these two kind of conspiring notions andI'm messing up the math, I'm sure,
but the sentiment is correct. Sowhat you have to do. You
have to do two things in podcasting. One is the friction has to be
very low for continued listeners, likethey have to It has to be fun,

(08:37):
right, like if you even noticein the show sein film, they
started cutting out the opening monologues,like because I think I don't know why,
but I suspect it was just wearingpeople out, and then they would
only put them in some episodes thenso then the other thing you want to
do in podcasting is you don't wantto optimize your first sixty seconds, because

(09:01):
that's about how long it takes somebodyto fumble around and find something else to
listen to. So you might befine, fuzz your very niche. That
show is super niche. It's it'sdialed in to the right audience. It's
got some legs on it, Like, you're probably fine. But fortunately,

(09:26):
so we did the thing that youyou were talking about a few of these
episodes ago, and we took abreak. So we're planning to come back
the week after Labor Day. Soif I'm going to change it, I
need to change it now. Well, we're going out of season five,
and that's like it's kind of thethe branding of the show. It's part

(09:50):
of the branding. So that's whatabout what about if you started with voice
and then and then went to itstarted then started the music. Yeah,
yeah, so like did a coldopen play exactly and going, uh,
you know, that's that's an interestingquestion, and I might have to play
with that. We're going to recordthe first couple episodes this weekend, so

(10:11):
I've got a couple of weeks toplay around with that. Somebody, Yeah,
I think you're I think you're inthe zone where experimentation is. You
know, you're you're probably like plusone or minus, you know, a
few percentage points, right. Ithink the the kind of the moral of
the story is is, if you'replaying your favorite song at the beginning of

(10:31):
the podcasting problem, you're doing itwrong. Is you know, you're you're
probably like plus one or minus youknow, a few percentage points, right.
I think the the kind of themoral of the story is is if
you're playing your favorite song at thebeginning of the podcasting problem, you're doing
it wrong. A twenty second,perfectly chosen song with a great break and

(10:56):
you know, part of the branding. I think that's the least of problems.
You know. Yeah, it's probablyfine, Yeah, all right,
Well, we'll play around with it. But I I do agree with you,
like I would say that I wouldrather listen to and I might be
the minority, but I'd rather listento a music bed than a pre roll

(11:18):
any day. Oh my god,I think that's everybody. But we're not
going to get away from pre rolesanytime soon. No, I understand,
but it's uh, it's tough.I mean, either the shows that I
I mean knowing, like you know, the shows that I listened to that
aren't people even on here that Iyou know, I want to support.
I pay for Patreon, do allthat stuff, but I will skip the

(11:41):
two minutes of pre role you know, Magic Spoon garbage every time because it's
just you know, like I wantto support them, but it's also like
I can't, like this is justdropped off. It was always you only
have your audience's attention for a certainamount of time, and you could tell

(12:05):
them, hey, support the show, go buy Magic Spoon. You know
it's got these great flavors. They'reyou know, peanut butter, X,
Y and Z and get out ofit. And I'm more likely to go,
you know, use your promo codeand go buy that. Then if
you went on and talked for twominutes about the thing. I don't think
longer is better. I think authenticand tying it into the show is better

(12:28):
than trying to make I don't knowwhy, if it's the advertisers or if
it's the podcasters that think that theyneed to have a longer spot in order
to sell more stuff. So justcame here to say that there is an
article that Brian Barletta wrote for SoundsProfitable. I want to say ten months

(12:50):
ago about this that I think advertisersare starting to understand that more does not
mean better value when it to thead, A perfect ad could be fifteen
seconds long. So I would justencourage folks to go to sounds profitable dot
com and search I'll, I'll findit, and I will share it.

(13:11):
But I am just I wanted topop in really to say that I don't
mind a pre roll ad, butI think it's because I work in the
podcast space and I also work inthe ad tech space, and so I'm
always interested to see how my favoritepodcasters are getting compensated and who is paying
the bills for them, and alsohow they creatively choose to talk about those

(13:35):
podcasts. Like I was just listeningright before I tuned into American History Tellers
with Lindsey Graham, and he doessuch a good job doing podcast ads for
companies that you've heard a million timesbefore. But he just does such a
great job bringing himself into it.And I'm sure David agrees with me because
I know he loves Lindsey Graham too. And let me say not Lindsay Graham

(13:58):
in so I get quoted the historianand the podcaster, not the politiction.
No, be your on record.That sound bite is going to get some
play. And I'm just kidding,just kidding, I'm already taking note to
write to you know, manipulate thatone. So did I did I talk
about my experiment, my pre roleexperiment here on this in this group.

(14:20):
I don't know if I did,but I on on my True Crime show,
which is my biggest show. WhatI did was I for three months,
I swapped out, I turned offpre roles. I recorded a cold
open. I kind of did afew things at once. I kind of
I wanted to describe more about theshow and about the creators, and and

(14:46):
then I played what I would normallyplay the pre role at like a minute
and half in or two minutes in, right, I would say, all
right, we're going to get rightto the show after, you know,
to uh, two ads or somethingsomething like that, And what I was
trying to see is is would myretention suffer? And there was absolutely zero

(15:11):
change in my retention. So Ialmost think that people prefer to skip or
they have their podcast apps set toskip pre rolls like two minutes in or
something, because there was zero change. And what happened though, is because
my my ads are dynamic for themost part, unless I sell a host

(15:33):
red is my revenue went way downbecause now it looks like I have five
mid rolls or some craziness in myin my podcast because it's you know,
two minutes in qualifies as a midroll for some reason, and uh,
spreaker couldn't fill three slots or fiveslots or however many slots that was in

(15:54):
my show. So it reduced myrevenue by like twenty five percent, which
is significant. So for three months, you know, I sucked a little
win and tested it out and itdidn't make any difference at all, which
I thought was interesting. Did youit's almost expected to really? Yeah,
I think that. Well, mygut was telling me that people, well,

(16:19):
I should say a comment set medown a rat hole, which is
something you should never let happen toyou. But because I am showcasing other
people's shows. I take it verypersonally, and I want to try to
understand is it their show? Isit the way I'm saying them is it?

(16:40):
Did I not describe them perfectly?Did I not sell it the way
it should have been sold? Like, I'm very cautious that people give me
their hard work. I want tomake sure I do a good job.
So so this this comment or said, oh great, you know, I'm
skipping through these podcasts and I've heardseventeen dairy queen ads or something like that.

(17:03):
And I thought to myself, ohmy god, like this is my
life. Like if this person's complaining, that means there's one hundred people that
hate this. And uh so Ithought, okay, let's let's turn off.
See what happens. And I justassumed people might be scrolling and going,
Nope, sucky ad next, next, next, next, Okay,

(17:26):
Indie droping sucks, I'm going towhatever. But that is not the case.
Maybe it is the case and theystill hang up. I don't know,
but it didn't show any difference.Matt, go ahead, I know
that you requested to speak Matt.That's his name, right, Oh yeah,
yeah, Okay, that's what tosay. I didn't forget your name.
How are y all good? Howyou doing? Man good? Just

(17:48):
putting together my episode. I'm releasingthe warm and you know the intro,
and I missed the past couple ofminutes. I'm sorry of discussion, but
uh, intro is a fascinating topicbecause that's something I've always struggled with and
with the two artists that I producethe I usually start off when you all

(18:12):
say twenty seconds of music. Definelike what's that defined? Ass? Just
like twenty seconds of just music andthen you're going into the introduction yeah or
yeah. So think about it whenyou press play on a podcast and it's
just music for twenty seconds yep,and then and then the host cuts in.

(18:34):
So that's what we're talking about.So I go, and I may
I probably I might be doing it. I'm learning something here. I start
off, I try to get inand out as quick as I can,
and I'll intro, Like for Jackshow, I'll intro you know the show,
the host, who the guest is, and that's about forty seconds,

(18:56):
host, the guest, some ofthe little house keeping notes for about twenty
seconds. Then at about the fortysecond mark, I'll go into a one
minute preview of the of the hourlong episode of the interview, and then
I'll go into a twenty second preroll of our of our sponsor, and

(19:18):
then the episode starts. The keyis I always say in the very beginning.
Coming up in two minutes is episodenumber twenty seven with Jim Lauderdale.
So if people don't want to listento all the bs in between, they
know approximately the two minute mark,they could just fast forward through it.
That's the way I do it.I don't know, that's probably not the

(19:40):
right way, but that's the way, the best way I've come up with.
Yeah, it's kind of like goahead, Ariel, Sorry, go
ahead. I just want to saythere's no right way and wrong way,
and I want to cut all ofthat out from podcasting because it's not radio,
you know, So you could decidethat this week that is the right
way and next week that is notthe right way. But I think in

(20:02):
general a barrier is that a lotof people come in and they think there's
a right way. There's a wrongway, not just for intros but for
everything, And I just want toget it in everyone's head that there's none
there's no right way, there's nowrong way. Yeah, that's exactly That's
exactly what I was going to say. And I think your retention data will
tell you if your audience is respondingto your show early or not. And

(20:25):
that's the I love the by theway, I love the the clips in
the front of the show. Iknow some people hate it. It's you
know, but like if I canget a laugh or a build interest within
the first couple of seconds, Imean, I prefer them to be completely
upfront, like before anything. Likeyou know, I think Conan does it

(20:45):
that way, where there'll be likea clip, a funny clip, and
then music and then they'll talk overthe music. It's been a while since
I listened to that show, butI always thought that that was hilarious because
I was in simply waiting for thatsection of the show. And I used
to interesting that you say that becauseI used to do that. I used

(21:07):
to kick it off right with theone minute preview coming up in one minute,
bam right into it, and thenI'll intro the guest. Last but
not least, the biggest debate thatI've had with Jack and with this new
host, new show and producing withBrad, it'd be interesting to hear y'all's
feedback. And I've debated this withJack for a year and a half,

(21:29):
and that is when you're introing,you get so like Jim Lauderdale's coming tomorrow,
he's had nine songs cut by GeorgeStrait, two time Grammy Award winner.
I mean, little Harris produced arecord with her blah blah blah.
And then I go and then Jackand Jim start talking, right, try
to get the natural flow of thefirst twenty thirty seconds them walking into the

(21:51):
room and talking. So I liketo introduce the guest because it's kind of
like my analogy is, it's kindof like you don't want the headline band
introducing the headline band. So Jacksometimes has well, I want to introduce
the guest. So I said,well, Jack, you don't. So
these listeners need to know how manyGrammys they've won, or how many hits

(22:14):
they've written and all that stuff.And if you're not going to do it,
somebody asks to and if that thatwill be me. If you can
do it, great, If not, then I'm going to have to do
it. Yeah, But to stopyou there, I would just say if
I mean, if you have astar introducing somebody the I think I would

(22:37):
rather hear as the listener here interthem then. And this is no knock
on you at all, but likeyou're in my opinion, your job is
to make that show awesome and tostep back into the shadow and allow your
host that you're producing to be inthe spotlight. And what I would recommend,

(23:03):
in my opinion, would be foryou to give him all of the
like you maybe even like just bullit up, like here's all the stuff
about this this guest that we havecoming up and put it in a way
that it's gonna make Jack look likethe star. And the more you the
the better you make him sound,man, the better that show is gonna

(23:26):
be. I'm gonna have to shoveand thanks for this feedback. Man,
it's priceless, because I'm gonna bynext time we take Sunday and I'm going
to Nashville tomorrow to do a show, and I'm gonna put six bullet points
and then shove it in their faceand go when they all sit down start
talking, You've got to introduce viathese bullet points because if you don't do
it, I'm gonna have to doit, and I don't want to do

(23:48):
it a star. I'm not.So I appreciate the feedback. It really
is priceless. Yeah, like it'sit's always hard to like even when you're
when you're interviewing big, big namesand all that, you want them to
the brighter they are, the better. Everybody else shines in that. So

(24:08):
and from your your place, theyou don't need to be the star of
that. You're you're going to getall the residuals of putting that together,
being the being the guy that makesthat happen. You're gonna be in the
background. That's just that's just thedeal. Because you're working with celebrities,
but that's where you need to bethe uh, the guy that keeps them

(24:33):
all on track because they are.It's like herding cats, right. So
yeah, exactly, So I appreciateit. Yeah, yeah, you're welcome,
of course. Yeah. I haveno opinion here. I've heard shows
where the producers are very active,you know, like the man behind the
glass, and they chime in andthey add to the conversation and you know,

(24:56):
so the I would say, youknow, I think Fuzz has a
point, but I don't think whatyou're necessarily doing is wrong. I mean,
your show has got a feel foryou know, you got to give
it your own fingerprint, so youknow, if if it feels right,
I would say do it. Ifyour listeners respond to it, I say

(25:18):
do it, you know, butyou might want to try to switch it
up and just give it a feel. How much that retention rate is correct
on charm because zero? Okay,got it? That's what I thought.
Because I looked at that, I'mlike, come on, there's no lay
these people are listening to that muchof that content. I mean, it
just depends on if you're SYNCD withApple of Spotify. The Apple and Spotify

(25:41):
data is absolutely accurate the retention.The episode to episode retention is based on
ips and things like that, whichchange a lot on mobile phones. So
it's that, you know, it'skind of garbage data in, garbage data
out. I mean, it's accurateaccording to them. You know, it's
technically accurate, but I just thinkthat those types of measures are tough to

(26:06):
quantify. Yeah, and who's allgoing to podcast movement on the here in
a couple of weeks in Dallas,I didn't make the cut. I did
not make the cut. Yeah,I'm I'm debating about paying, about going
until tomorrow to make the decision.According to my wonderful wife, do you

(26:27):
want me to give you an endorsementor how would you like? How would
you like to proceed jacking around goingto podcast movement? Yeah, I have
you know, I can steer youin either direction, but I can tell
you about my positive experiences there.I went to the Nashville one last year
and it was it was fantastic.I really I've got to go. I'm

(26:52):
gonna go. I just have tofight the internal personal wonderful bride battle.
But this time is some I worantfor me to go because of this new
show that I'm watching in November.So how would you experience been like?
Positive? Oh? Extremely? SoI can pretty much point all of my
podcast career successes back to podcast MovementAnaheim in twenty seventeen because I used my

(27:22):
moxie and I got to go forfree, which was amazing, and I
made connections that I still am intouch with to this day. I've can
trace like three jobs back to podcastMovement. So I am really really just
grateful for podcast movement, for theconnections, for the schmoozing and that goes
for all podcast conferences, Like Isee Anna's here in the in the chat

(27:44):
and she has a podcast conference inAtlanta. That's also amazing. But yeah,
I am a big fan of whenpodcasts people get together. How important
if in the hypothetical and I'll shutup after this one, I promise with
the questions, if Jack and thisother artist I'm working with, Brad,
if they had the opportunity and thehypothetical to play for the conference at least

(28:10):
at five o'clock, would that bea pretty big optity for them to in
front of the XM radio folks andwhatnot? Or is that would that be
a waste of their time at anypodcast conference? Maybe podcast movement? What
do you mean to do it?Yeah? Yeah, do a live show.
I mean there might be an opportunitythat there's been an opportunity where if

(28:34):
I lean on them hard enough,I think they would do it. I
just don't want them to show upand then look at me and go,
oh my god, I'm don't Idon't you know, it's I don't know
what they're in for. Yeah,I'll say it's hard to predict if people
would attend because they have a lotof sessions going on at once. You

(28:56):
have to submit the sessions in advance, so it depends. If you wanted
to have it as an official PodcastMovement event, they would have had to
submit it, I think back inMarch. But if you wanted to do
something like outside of town or outsideof the event, sorry, it'd been
it's the last minute idea. I'vebeen talking to the conference about and got

(29:18):
it. I just don't know ifit would be the best opportunity for Jack
or Brad to do that, becauseI don't want them to look at me
like I'm crazy when they show upand play and nobody's paying attention. It's
hard. It's hard to tell.I don't know. You went to some
in Nashville, I imagine, andif you hit or miss when it comes
to it's even if it's like anamazing speaker, if they're up against somebody

(29:40):
who's also an amazing speaker, therecould be five people in the session,
even though there are three thousand peoplethere. It's really hard to say,
got it great. I appreciate allthe feedback everybody really do. Jim Mallard,
do you have anything to throw?And you've been strangely quiet on the
topic of the intros. No,I think it's a wild Red depens By
show and it's I don't know.I've battled it for years too, So

(30:04):
thank you, Jim. I thinkall right, So we're about halfway through
here, we'll go ahead and resetand David are you ready? Yes?
I am so. Hey everyone,I'm David. I'm here to pitch my
show, which is called Conscious BusinessLeaders. Wait. Is this the guy
that we've been waiting for for sevenyears? Yeah? Yeah, this is

(30:27):
him? All right? So ConsciousBusiness Leaders is a podcast that shares the
stories of seasoned entrepreneurs who have theprofitable companies while maintaining a mission of helping
others. Boom, I feel likeyou've been coached on that. It was

(30:48):
pretty clean. I don't get tosay this enough, but say it while
smiling. All right, let mereach men say that so I get to
say it to you, all right. Conscious Business Leaders is a podcast that
shares the stories of seasoned entrepreneurs whohave built profitable companies while maintaining a mission

(31:10):
of helping others. Boom, don'tsay it while grumpy, just kidding,
ed, you've been asking for thisfor weeks. What do you think Eduardo
Haven's the eighth. What do youthink He's probably got a grilled cheese in

(31:33):
his mouth. He's probably making littlecheese sandwiches alvacado and octagenarian. Oh right,
even as grilled cheeses are too highclass for us. Well, we
have a substitute. Ed that justjumped up to speak. Thanks Jeff,
we'll go to the next day.Thanks Jeff. What's my podcast called again?

(31:53):
The greatest song ever sung? Shitty? No, I just want to
go sign what Ariel said. I'vebeen in sales and sales training for twenty
plus years, and that is literallyone of the first things we tell people
if they have anything to do withphone calls and their job is you can
hear a smile through a phone.So I'm happy Ariel said that. I

(32:14):
like hearing those those points validated.And David, your pitch does sound much
better than the last time you putit out there, so good job man.
Thanks. Yeah, that's a reallygood point too, Like even when
recording to I've noticed that like whenyou try to like smile and have good
posture, it definitely sounds better.You got to hype yourself up to do
anything audio. To me, youreally do like bad days. That's your

(32:37):
elevator pitch, And then what wouldyou say is your most pressing need?
Are you trying to get more listeners, trying to get more interviews, trying
to get more downloads? Where areyou right now? At this point,
I would say more listeners. Lastweek I was struggling a little bit with
getting guests, but then after gettingsome feedback from the community and stuff,

(33:00):
I actually did get a few moreinterviews books. So I'm actually booked out
for like a month now. Soat this point, probably just focusing on
getting listeners. I know I needto start reaching out to like newsletters at
some point soon, so I thinkthat's probably like my next step. I
think, try to get more morenewsletters. Was you just play kidding?

(33:22):
Ariel? Here? Uh? Ariel? By the way, is it Ariel
or Aril? Because I never knowand I feel bad when I say your
name. Your name is puzz howeverit comes out of your mouth is lovely
for me, okay, perfect,Tanner says Ariel. I I don't mind

(33:45):
ari Aril, Ariel, Ariel,It's really fine. My best friend calls
me Aril, and my parents callme Ariel, so I don't know I
don't know what my name is.Tanner just sent out a tweet. I'm
at dinner but Jeff sucks, Sothank you Tanner. Here you're missed.

(34:07):
You can see it in the commentssection down below to your right, which
is a new feature. So ifyou are listening and you don't want to
come up and speak, but youhave something you want to say or ask,
you can do that down there,look in the bottom right hand corner.
So I've got a question for Dan, what what type of guests and
who who are you looking for?I guess is the first question, Uh,

(34:29):
for guests? You said, yeah, for guests, I mean,
obviously we don't like Merk Cuban,But I mean what specifically, what type
of people are you looking forward to? The guests? I'm looking for founders
of companies that basically like do goodfor others, like their employees or like
customers. I mean, well,it's funny you said Mike Cuban, because
I feel like he actually would bea good example, like his new uh

(34:52):
prescription drugs company. I don't knowif you've heard of it, but it's
been like glowering prices for consumers.But yeah, basically entrepreneurs that are like
actually helping people in addition to makingmoney. Hey, Dave, send me
send me a direct message after this. Okay, I might have somebody for
you. Okay, sounds good.Oh sorry, go ahead, No,

(35:13):
you you're first. Just wanted tosay, of course you got to interview
the squad cast boys. Yeah,I had to redo the interview, but
it's coming out soon. Okay.Good to know. David. Where are
you currently? How are you currentlylooking for guests for your show? So
a lot of them I've been findingon Twitter and LinkedIn now that I'm thinking

(35:37):
about it, Like, I'm noteven sure how I come across some of
these people, but like sometimes i'lljust like see business owners kind of explore
the business. If I see thatthere's something interesting there, I dive into
it a little bit more. Butit seems like a lot of cold outreach.
To be honest, Are you askingfor a referral at the end of

(35:59):
your interview you? I actually havebeen, Yeah, And that's how I
did get a couple of them,because Zach and Rock gave me a couple
of people that I have looked.So I've gotten a couple of referrals.
I've heard that that's a really goodpractice. I've been trying to do that.
Yeah, because you can name dropthe person who referred to you.
Yeah, that makes sense. Everytry going big like Bill Gates, Warren

(36:24):
Buffett kind of stuff. I haven'tyet. I mean, I would honestly
like to have Mark Cuban. Ithink he actually would be a really good
good fit for it, but Igotta think about how I can get an
introduction to him. I mean,like Mackenzie Scott what's his name's ex wife?
Oh? Yeah, bezosm Like didshe a conscious business leader? Yeah?

(36:49):
I mean she gave way a giantchunk of her her earnings to nonprofits,
like that's her thing. Oh,I didn't even know that. That's
interesting. She's given eight point sixbillion dollars in two years to seven hundred
and eighty plus organizations. It's alot of money. And I'll double down

(37:12):
on that. Just start finding thesepeople that you're interested in and start sending
them emails, because the worst that'sgonna happen is they don't reply. A
few of them will send you backin now, and then one of these
days she'll get it, open upyour email and there'll be Yeah, we
can do that and you'll just probablyshit your pants. Honestly, Yeah,
do it all right? We havea couple people that have requested here on

(37:36):
a europe first, then I knowChris will follow. Hi. I'm new
to this Twitter world, so Ihope I'm doing this right. I don't
even know what the process is,but when I came up here to ask
about is I'm in the process oflaunching a new show for myself, and
this is mainly it's gonna be calledThe Content Trapper. It's mainly because I

(38:00):
wait, since my connection was lost, is my connection back? Are you're
good? Okay, you're good.But now it's called the Content Trapper.
And a lot of it is becausemy community has been asking to hear more
from me, specifically, which Istruggle with. We've talked about this.
The premise of the show is mixed. Part of it is me talking to

(38:21):
content entrepreneurs about how they're utilizing contentin their business, especially because really it's
a new wave of things, butalso focusing in on equipment. So I
also own a fifteen hundred square footstudio in the heart of Atlanta, and
so it's also talking through like theups and downs of having a team of

(38:42):
thirteen people, and you know,managing over twenty shows and the studio and
the equipment and the winds and thefails and all of those things that go
into it. And I think I'mjust trying to figure out how to properly
structure it, because part of itwill have a YouTube component where reviewing like
equipment and some of the things thathave worked and not worked. And then
the other part will be more sojust the podcast element that's more so focused

(39:07):
on content entrepreneurs. And I hopeall of that made sense. I'm gonna
stop talking now. Yes, definitelymade sense. You're a really cool spot,
which is that you have you haven'tyet formatted it, which means that
you can build marketing into every singleaspect of your show, which is going

(39:30):
to be really really important in orderfor it to reach a wider audience.
If it were me, I waslistening to a show today that I really
liked the way things were segmented.Let me try to remember that, because
I really like shows that you thatyour audience knows what to tune in for.
They have special names of the segment. The segments don't always have to

(39:54):
care episode. I think one ofthem is called hysteria. It's from Crooked
Media. I really like the showbecause they have their regular chat up top.
It's a two person co host show, but then they always have two
or war one guest at the bottomhalf of the show or the yeah,
the bottom half of the show,and then at the end of that conversation

(40:15):
they do a round table with thoseguests about and then they do like a
I think they call it like asanity corner or something like that. And
it's just something that me as alistener, I am learning to anticipate and
get excited for and then if Itweet at them, say love this section
of the show something like that.So I would encourage you, for all

(40:36):
of the segments that you mentioned tocome up with a way to make that
enticing for listeners and so that theycan possibly and so that they can possibly
call into that show. Maybe notnow, maybe that's too much for your
launch, but sometime in the futureyou can start gaining you can start garnering
voice clips that you eventually play.But yeah, okay, end of rant.

(40:58):
I just think build marketing into everything. Think marketing at every stage.
Perfect, Greg, what do youget, well, Jeff, I know
why you you came to me next, because so I love the idea.
I think it's amazing, but itsounds to me like one is a podcast

(41:20):
and one is a YouTube channel.And I think the gear review life of
a of a studio owner, youknow, mix some vloggi content sounds a
lot like Peter McKinnon and awesome,like super awesome, and then the content
podcast sounds equally cool for a deeperdive, more intellectual type of content.

(41:52):
And I mean, I don't knowif I would break the niche and put
them together, but that's just mycraziness with niche. Like I think that
niche is the most important thing thatyou can do and starting any content creation
enterprise. I don't disagree about nicheniche, I say niche, but it

(42:19):
doesn't matter. I don't disagree.What I do think though, an a
because I know your community has askedfor this show, and I imagine that
you have done some either surveying orjust anecdotal chatting with them to find out
what they want from you, andthat's why you're going in this direction.
What I would recommend actually is fourepisodes per month twice a month are your

(42:42):
flagship episodes. It's the segment ofthe show that you're having the conversations,
and then the other two times throughoutthe month, that's when you're quote unquote
breaking format breaking niche The example thatI will point to here is a podcast
called how to Do the Pot.It's a podcast geared towards women who are
interested in cannabis. Two episodes permonth, she talks about something having to

(43:04):
do with the cannabis industry, orwhat to do if you get too high,
or here are the strains that youshould try out if you want to
go to sleep better. But thenthe other two times per month are short
episodes two to five minutes long,and speaking of building marketing into every step,
they are user generated. People callin and leave two to five minute
voice clips about the first time theybought legal weed. So those stories are

(43:29):
always we know what to expect.She can call on her community to share
their own stories so that the communityfeels a part of it. And if
people don't want to listen to aforty five minute episode, if they're new
listeners just checking out the feed forthe first time, they can get a
taste of the host and a tasteof the show and the vibe of the

(43:50):
show with a two to five minuteepisode. So I'm not saying you do
a two to five minute episode.What I am saying is it might be
interesting to incorporate these that people getyou to the cadence of the show being
twice a month, this, twicea month, this, they can tune
in for both, they can tunein for either, and that's what I
would recommend. I like, I'll, oh, go ahead, buzz no.

(44:12):
I was just gonna say, Ithink that sounds brilliant, and I
wholly endorse that. I think thatsounds like something that would be fun to,
that would be fun to listen to, it would be great for the
audience. And that's some wonderful adviceas usual. So I don't know a
lot of people in here. Ithink the only person I do know is
Ariel. So just to give alittle bit more background into me, which

(44:37):
hopefully will be helpful, I havea podcast community called Black Pod Collective and
then a podcast conference called Black PodFestival, and so I've traditionally stayed pretty
behind the scene. I don't reallyshare a lot about myself. It's more
so focused on my community. Mycommunity consist of about five hundred members across
the globe and they're paid members,and then we have those who are not

(45:00):
in the community that just kind ofcomes to the conference. The biggest feedback
from the conference, and just thebiggest feedback in general, has been people
want to learn more about my journeyand me as the individual, which I
struggle with. So I think I'mtrying to incorporate more of me. So
part of that is like the contentportion of it, the entrepreneurship person and

(45:23):
all of those pieces, and soI've kind of gone back and forth between
like certain things will just be forthe YouTube channel. I e I don't
want to review an app on apodcast because of the fact that you can't
see it. So I feel likeI want to do some video that is
just for the YouTube channel, whereaslike I'm reviewing some of the apps that
I use for clients, some ofthe things that I enjoy, or just

(45:45):
reviewing new things that I'm like,I didn't know how to use this,
And then other elements would be likeme talking about how I jumped into entrepreneurship
from a ten year career in healthcare, and that would just be on the
podcast itself. But we do likevideo, it would still be recorded fully,
But to do video clips for socialmedia but not for the premise of

(46:05):
it being released to YouTube. Doesthat make more sense or does it make
better sense for this to be aI don't know. It feels like a
HOTCHPODG the more I keep talking.But yeah, you have a team bind
you right, you have video producers, audio producers. Yeah, I have
a team. In that case,I would go crazy and have separate feeds.
I mean, the reason I usuallysuggest that people combine feeds or or

(46:34):
you know, just consolidate is becausethey don't have the resources. But you
have the resources, and you havethe community asking for it, in which
case I would make it as easyto understand as possible. And what can
unite those two entities is branding andlogos and things like that. But yeah,
I mean, there are gonna bepeople tuning in for different reasons.
So I actually go back on whatI said before based on the extra knowledge

(47:00):
that you gave us, and Iwould separate those entities. So I think,
I think you have an amazing reachalready. I think you know,
when you have people asking to knowyour journey, I mean, that's as
good as it gets for starting somethinglike this. I think so you also

(47:22):
have this opportunity where video content Ithink is going to amplify your message to
an extent that I think that mightbe superior to audio, especially if you're
doing like conventions and you know,you have all these other things going on,

(47:47):
like people would love to see yourjourney in setting up the conferences and
how do you get speakers, andyou know that is kind of vloggy,
but it's also your life and it'swhat they're asking to be exposed to,
not just the journey, but thebut the current. It sounds like you
know more about you And to me, I think that's the I mean,

(48:13):
that's the star. I mean,you're doing things that people only dream about
doing. That's that's a life Ithink would be very positive impact to share.
It's super awesome meeting you, bythe way, and I think Ariel's
right. If you have a team, that's a great opportunity to just go
crazy. Yeah, Michelle, goahead. Well, I one thought,

(48:34):
as you were talking about all thesedifferent components that you want to build out,
I would really spend a lot oftime thinking about how this is a
funnel into your business and how youcan optimize that, like it's great to
share your story and all of thatkind of thing, but you're sharing your

(48:57):
story not only for people who alreadyknow you know you, but for people
to get to know you. Liketo bring them into the community community that
you're building. By the way,I've been looking to go to your conference
for two years now, but ofcourse with the COVID, so I'm very
excited to see the new dates upon the website. So like, there
are people who've been quietly watching whatyou've been doing for a while now.

(49:21):
Obviously COVID's impacted like in person connections, but we're out there kind of watching.
And so I would say very strongly, how can you get people on
your email list with the content thatyou're sharing. It's not enough to have
a YouTube channel and review a product. Like if you're bringing a product in

(49:42):
front of people because you love it, understand that you can also be an
affiliate for that product and optimize thatauthentically and ethically because you love that product.
So just I would think about yourfunnel. I would think about the
monetization opportunities within that funnel that arethat are ethical for you. And because

(50:04):
you're building it out and you havea team like game on and congratulations.
I'm excited to see it. I'mexcited to subscribe and to finally go to
New York in the sweltering, swelteringheat of summer. So congratulations, Thank
you so much. That always warmsmy heart right when I meet anybody who

(50:24):
you know wants to join us onthis journey. So hopefully I get to
meet you in person next year,I will probably be shooting you an episode
so you can listen to it beforeour release, because I'm very big on
doing focus groups for clients, soI'm gonna I'm gonna treat myself like a
client for once. Yeah. Again, super awesome meeting you. I gave

(50:45):
you a full sounds like you're doingamazing podcasting. Power Hour is part of
indeed drop In network. If youare a podcaster looking to grow your listeners,
check out Indie drop In. Indiedrop In is always free and we
have opportunities right now for comedy,true crime, scary and paranormal podcasts.

(51:09):
Just go to indie drop in dotcom to learn more. You had two
people waiting patiently Sticky Paul's I seeyou have your hand up, Chris?
Are you? Is it okay?If Sticky Pauls goes first. Yeah,
that's perfect, what's fun. Okay, it's very kind of you, Sticky
Paul. It's nice to meet you. What you got going on? Hi?

(51:30):
There? Can you guys hear me? You sound beautiful, loud and
clearly. Thank you guys so much. My name is Travis. I am
the founder of Sticky Past Studios inLas Vegas, Nevada. I was looking
at the article that was attached tothis podcasting Power Hour, and I've been
listening for a bit and it's likereally awesome to hear all the different perspectives

(51:52):
of marketing and advertising and getting sponsorsand getting affiliate codes and making some money
for podcasting we have. We specializein audio and video podcasting. We kind
of treat our business closer to abroadcast studio in the way that we do
everything live, even if it's notlive. We have a five camera setup

(52:15):
with you know, as many micsas you need. We have close ups
and a wide shot, and wehave a rig that can run intros,
outros, audio clips, et cetera. We can attach discord, a call
in feature, et cetera. WhatI really wanted to talk about is just
the idea of monetizing a podcast,and how many people tend not to like

(52:37):
reach out to their network for podcasting. They think that podcasting is just about
creating content and then hoping somebody willsee it. And I want to open
up the forum and kind of discussthis kind of like this way of podcasting
that not many people consider, andit's podcasting and advertising through their guests and
monetizing day one with no listeners,simple through basically social media influencer marketing as

(53:04):
a podcast instead of podcast marketing tosponsors. And I'll explain a little bit
further. We have our studio isbasically just a home for a network called
podcast Junkies Network. The son offamous singer Tony Orlando of the seventies,
his name is John Orlando, hoststhe show called Action Junkies, and there's
a bunch of other shows like FitnessJunkies, Political Junkies, We Junkies for

(53:30):
twenty Junkies, et cetera. Andwe hope to build out the brand and
keep expanding. But the one thingwe do that most others don't consider is
we focus on getting guests of influenceranging from you know, one hundred thousand
followers on Instagram, or a millionfollowers on TikTok or however the many,
however, like the cookie crumbles andreaching out to sponsors based off of the

(53:54):
not the viewership of the podcast orthe listenership of the podcast, but the
clips and the content we make fromthe pillar is what we call the podcast.
So we've structured our podcast studio tobe kind of like a content farm
for our clients and our internal podcasts. So, for example, we create

(54:19):
six pieces of content from a singlepodcast so we can have consistent content coming
out every single day. We focusmostly on reels, TikTok YouTube shorts because
that is getting most of the engagementthese days. So for our Action Junkie
show, we have a guest,Lacey k. Summer. He has eleven
million followers on Instagram. What wewould normally do is we would reach out

(54:42):
to sponsors that have her demographic andsay we're gonna have Lacey k Summer.
She has eleven million followers. Ifwe're close enough with her, which specifically
we are, we would ask herfor her general engagement and her demographic and
we go out to a sponsor.For example, I believe a few years
ago, probably more than a Felixsix. We reached out to whoever the
studio is for Fast and Furious andwe were able to work out a deal

(55:07):
under the guys that the engagement willbe between one and three million engagements a
five thousand dollars one time podcast sponsorship, simply by getting Lacey to agree to
the fact that she likes going tothe movies and she of course she would

(55:28):
see Fast and Furious six or whateverthe movie is was coming out at the
time. But we take that ideaand we keep on expanding it where we
get somebody with only five thousand subscrifollowers on Instagram and we use their name
and their audience to make content forourselves and give them clips to post on
their personal page. So when wego back to the advertisers, not only

(55:50):
include the listenership of the actual audioon Spotify and all the other platforms and
video, but we include how manypeople saw the clips and what was including
the clips. We you know,show their logo. We have product placement
in the background. We have organicadvertising, which is like I love Jersey
Mikes. You know, I'd eatevery single day. It's funny. We
have a story about Jersey Mikes xyzand then that becomes kind of like an

(56:13):
engaging aspect to advertising. So Iwas wondering if you guys have explored that
kind of basically traditional I guess it'sfunny I'm saying traditional influencer marketing through podcasting
rather than approaching it from I'm buildinga brand first and then looking for advertising
after thirty forty fifty episodes in communitybuilding, What do you guys think,

(56:36):
Well, not all of us havewith Khalifa coming to our studio, that's
fun So the ability to do someof the things that you're talking about are
limited by I think I would saythat there's a number of us here who
are who do things that aren't justpodcasting and therefore aren't spending as much time

(57:06):
focused on that as we probably Iwould like to be. So I'm not
speaking for everybody. There are someof you here who do that day and
day. That's that's the thing thatyou do. But the ability to go
out and do that outreach and youknow, find those sponsors and find those

(57:29):
opportunities when you're when that's going tomake or break you're you know, you
know, getting the bills paid,that's one thing versus those of us who
are doing this in addition to runin another business so or working or whatever
that might be. So it's ait's a very good question. I'm not

(57:52):
sure, and I don't I can'tspeak for everybody, but I would say
that it's a uh. I feellike what you're doing is is a different
level than or a different style thana lot of us are doing here currently.
Yeah, I agree, Jon gotanything of that, Yeah, I

(58:15):
mean, I don't have too muchthe What I would say is I am
very supportive of anyone who can puttogether a story and go pitch a sponsor
before they've gotten any sort of trackrecord. Now you seem to have a

(58:37):
track record, and I think it'sprobably easier today than it was what you
said six years ago. Oh,fantastically easier. It's right, big repertoire,
Yeah, exactly. So I think, you know, there's one kind
of constant thing with sponsors, justfrom my experience, is that when you
don't sell the twenty five mattress,to get pissed. So, you know,

(59:02):
I think if you can, ifyou can team up with somebody who
has a larger reach and a higherengagement in order to put together a package
that uh, is good for youand good for everybody. I think that's
smart. I know people who dothat with series. I know people that

(59:24):
go out and get funding for likeaudio dramas. So it's definitely done in
podcasting. But uh, you know, finding sponsors is a full time job.
I would bet you have someone thatspecializes in this and probably does this
for you. Yeah, we havea kind of like a collective of people
who depending on the ranking of thesponsor, we have people fishing for that.

(59:47):
Yeah, but they're yeah, andyou've probably built pitch decks, and
you probably have stats, and youprobably have you know, your you've got
data people looking at these analytics,and you've got a process that you've cultivated
over time, and all that stuffis IP. That's very very valuable that
you've learned through blood, sweat andtears. And you're right, other people

(01:00:10):
can do it. But it's it'syou know, it's like you know,
you see it's somebody playing the piano. It looks damn easy, but when
you sit behind the piano, it'shard. One. The one thing I
like, the analogy I like tomake is like we're not in like the
advertising business, where the billboard business, we're essentially like how to billboard people

(01:00:34):
sell billboards. It's about just likeviewerships and people who pass on the street.
One of our biggest kind of pitchesto in Vegas like law firms are
really big, for example, Sowe have a lot of meetings with those
people and they will spend ten twentythirty thousand dollars on a billboard for no

(01:00:55):
like direct return and non monetizable return. Really, I mean, you can't
prove that this billboard is what sentthem to you. Was it the seven
billboards? Was it the commercial etcetera. So we leveraged the ambiguity of
kind of that kind of marketing tothese people who are used to that traditional

(01:01:15):
marketing and sell them on the ideathat as long as people are seeing your
brand that the demographic they want ina way that's engaging, because we make
the argument as well like not eventhe drivers are paying attention to the road,
let alones and billboards, They're ontheir phone. The passengers of course
on their phone. You're in ataxi, they're on your phone, Like
where are you seeing these billboards now? In a non obtrusive way. And

(01:01:38):
it's the answer to that is basicallythrough social media content, which I guess
our pillar of that is podcasting,but I guess it could be anything.
Right, If you do a Twitchstream that's just you know, eight hours
long, you can cut that upand then you know, splice that and
sell that a sponsorship as well.And sorry, real, good ahead,

(01:02:00):
Greg, finish your thought. No, I was gonna say, I do
think it's brilliant that you can getlike, you know, some eleven million
dollars Instagram followers say I love JerseyMikes and then a clip of it,
so you know, Bravo. Yeah, I'm not gonna lie. She's kind
of in the cahoots with us.She's like a kind of a partner,
but it's just what's it to her? Go Areel. Do you know about

(01:02:22):
podcorn? Podcorn? No, I'mnot familiar. Podcorn is great if you
are looking to potentially connect with withadvertisers who are already familiar with sponsoring on
podcasts. It's a marketplace that connectspodcasters with advertisers. The advertisers lay out

(01:02:42):
the demographics that they're looking to hit, the minimum downloads, the campaign length,
how much they're willing to spend,things like that, and then you
pitch you pitch to them. Yousay, you know our podcast has this,
we do weekly. We can offera mid roll at this, we
can offer a pre role at this, post role at this, and also
we can we can do creative integration, or we can do this type of

(01:03:07):
ad like really totally an interesting,flexible platform that I've had a lot of
success on with the right pitches andthe right partners. It's also a great
way to just see who's doing what. And something that I have done is
seen who is advertising there, goneto their competitors who are not advertising there,
and pitch them on my own.So that is another way to potentially

(01:03:30):
find sponsors. That's that's a fantasticplatform. And does this platform like take
like a cut of like as likea broker fee between it and it does?
Yeah, I believe it's ten percent. Oh okay, that's not too
bad. We tend to stay awayfrom obviously, because our idea is not
like the cost per million kind ofthing where they take thirty percent of the

(01:03:51):
pre rul ads. We actually advertiseor advise against that to our clients simply
because it's like advertising before people actuallycare about you tends the people off.
We found out like the community ofpeople. But I love that. I
love that kind of networking tool andthe fact that you kind of go to
the competitors of the people who arealready kind of doing that. Yeah,

(01:04:11):
that's that's outside of podcorn, ofcourse, that would be your own course.
I mean, that's just a brillianttactic. I really appreciate the knowledge
on it. We focus mostly onboost on the ground kind of cold calling
or through relationships with other people,but we want to kind of get the
five hundred, the two hundred dollarsa month kind of sponsors as well for
lower level podcasts that can Yeah,I also think a big opportunity lot is

(01:04:35):
available for people who are not yetadvertising on podcasts but need to be advertised,
sorry, need to be sold onwhy that would be helpful for them.
So even just building out a deckthat says, you know, podcast
advertising one on one and why youshould do it with sticky paws, that
is that what you're called. Yes, that would be that would be something

(01:04:55):
that I would just have handy,that's that's fantastic advice, and I would
have a kind of like a followup kind of like thing not to cut
any off they've been waiting but islike video on Spotify. What is your
guys' opinion on this new kind ofpseudo audio video podcasting world where videos coming
back around and touching the audio listeners? Have you guys explored that as like

(01:05:19):
as like the place where your videocontent lives to kind of direct the top
of the funnel there? What isyour guys' opinion? Tbd? No one
knows. I mean, I didyou know one of the shows that I
do infrequently is a video show,and I put it, you know,
I signed up with anchor just soI could do video on Spotify just so

(01:05:43):
I could understand it. And youknow, I put the same video on
YouTube and it I'll performs one hundredto one. So I don't know who
knows. I think my opinion onit is if your audience is big enough
to start with, I think it'sgreat. I think if you're starting off,
I would put your efforts elsewhere untilyou make it big, because I

(01:06:09):
don't think on Spotify's platform the discoverabilityis going to be high enough that is
going to make it worth your effortsput it there versus something like YouTube or
just podcasting in general, it's moreof a yes and kind of thing like
put it both for the convenience ofthese That's exactly what I did exactly,
and you know, YouTube's algorithm isso good, and Spotify is is basically

(01:06:34):
like nineteen ninety search. However,on the contrary, Spotify now has a
form or you can submit to befeatured. And my guess, just like
how Apple is very much prioritizing theirInApp real estate for podcasts that have paid
programs, Spotify will start prioritizing someof their inap real estate for podcasts that

(01:06:56):
have video podcasts hosted on Spotify orAnchor or Megaphone or whatever it is.
So that is just something to keepin mind. That's what I'm hoping for,
That's what I'm That's exactly where Idid it. That's fantastic. I
also like the fact that it's it'sagain speaking to our tactics to getting sponsors.
Is the ambiguity of like who's actuallywatching Some people, you can look

(01:07:16):
bigger than you are if there's noviewer count at the bottom of your video.
You send someone to your YouTube videoor their podcasts, they see that
four people watched it, they mightlook lower on your podcast simply because of
the kind of like the entourage effectof Oh, other people aren't listening.
Send them to your audio video podcaston anchor you could. They might not
make that same assumption off the bat. Yeah, I appreciate you coming up

(01:07:41):
and talking. I do know.Thank you. I'm a man in my
word, and we have two peoplewaiting, so I will stay on and
over. I appreciate it. Oh, no problem at all, Chris,
I know, even waiting patiently.Man, I appreciate it. Hey man,
No, it's been a pleasure tosit and wait because it's given me
a chance to smoke another joint andactually enjoy myself for once. Because it
has been a word wind of oneof the weirdest experiences I can possibly explain.

(01:08:03):
So I'm going to give the elevatorthe elevator pitch of what's going on.
I was contacted by someone because ofmy notoriety in the cannabis industry.
For those who don't know me,I'm a political lobbyist. I'm actually the
only US citizen that I know ofin the South, especially that's not a
lawyer or former elected official or someonethat studied political science in college that decided

(01:08:25):
to open up their first public lobbyistfirm in North Carolina solely for the legalization
of cannabis and psychedelics nationwide, andthat has gotten me a lot of notoriety
with you know, a very smallgroup of people, but a very important
and powerful group of people that havebeen helping me along this way and kind
of helping me navigate the waters ofthis journey. So one of those people
reached out to me and said,Hey, there's this tattoo convention that's got

(01:08:46):
a national following. It's got afreak show that goes with it, it's
got a live suspension show. There'slike guys and stars from ink Master.
I've bought a four and a halfyear contract that it gives us excivity to
be the only cbdbd's to eight andTXC vendor for the whole like twenty two
shows that they do nationwide. Ineed somebody to run Raleigh because I'm stuck
in Florida this month and I'm like, Okay, I've heard pitches like this

(01:09:09):
before. This guy's probably gonna burnme like everybody else. I've learned my
lesson too many times now. Hell, I'm still trying to recoup the twenty
six thousand I lost in that smallbusiness loan scandal that some of you know
about that now has my case elevatedto the level of the FBI because of
how many people he stole from thatday. So you know, I've been
down this road before, so obviouslyI'm hesitant, and I've still got the
podcast that I'm trying to focus onwith weed to people at the same time.

(01:09:31):
But this was just too good ofan offer to pass up. I'm
like, wait, you want meto go in my hometown when I'm the
face of legalized weed and sell productfor three days at a tattoo convention that's
filled with the freak show when I'ma former circus performer myself. Yes,
when do you need me there?You know? So he offered to pay
me three hundred and fifty dollars.Wasn't expecting much performance out of me.
I knocked out ten thousand dollars insales on Saturday loan. He was so

(01:09:54):
impressed by the performance that they've offeredme a contract now. And this is
all happened within like you know,the last two week weeks. I fly
out to Jersey on Thursday. Iget back from Jersey on Monday, and
then I have to turn around andfly to Dallas the next Thursday, then
Cincinnati, then New Orleans, andso on and so on through like major
cities up until like June of nextyear, and then I just washeder into
and repeat for the next four anda half years. All the licensing's been

(01:10:15):
taken care of, all the complianceissues has been taken care of. But
the beauty of this is that thereare some states we're going to go to
where we've partnered with people that alreadyhave the licenses to sell cannabis openly because
it's legal in that state for recreationalmeans. That means that you know someone
who has been a cannabis grower sincehe was sixteen years old, that is
known as an outlaw in his ownstate, that has stood up in front

(01:10:38):
of the states that has said Iam a criminal for choosing medicinal cannabis to
cure my brain tumor five years ago. I'm gonna have the opportunity finally to
stand in a legal state and actuallysell weed openly without fear of arrest sarch
receidure for the first time in mylife. And I feel like that needs
to be recorded and not for myown notoriety. I never do anything for
my own notoriety. This is alwaysabout bringing light to the greater cause of

(01:11:02):
you know, legalization that needs tohappen across the board, and decriminalization and
all of the social justice reforms programsthat I work on. The problem is,
I'm about to go mobile. I'vegot maybe one week I could think
of before December that I'm going tohave off to myself, and I've only
got my phone. My laptop diedlast week. We're probably not going to
turn the profit that I want toturn until about two shows because I found

(01:11:25):
out that the geniuses behind this havebeen doing this old school hustle deal where
they've been paying for each show asit happens. So like all the profit
that we make from Jersey, agood portion of that has to pay for
the next show, and some moneythat's still left over from Raleigh that I
was unaware of. Fortunately, Igot the power of attorney today, so
I'm taking over all the financial accountsfor it. I already talked to the
attorneys. There's no back taxes Ihave to worry about. After Dallas,

(01:11:47):
I should be like finally in thegreen for once with this company. So
I'm really saving their ass on thatpart, and they're very grateful for it.
But I don't know what to dowith all this. I feel like
I'm being forced into a spotlight becausebasically all all I do is I go
to this convention with villain arts tattoos, and I stand in front of like
fifteen thousand people a day that's acaptive audience, while I've got a little

(01:12:08):
bluetooth speaker and I'm dancing around whileI'm dressed from head to toe in a
black and red leather circus outfit,looking at people going, you know,
you want to be as high asme right now? Twenty bucks and I'll
change your life. Come on inhere and see you get. And the
next thing I know, they're walkingout three hundred and sixty dollars a product
in their hand. And I'm doingthat all day long, and everybody's just
kind of like how that they can'tfigure out how I'm doing it. And

(01:12:29):
it's because I feel like this isreally what I was born to do,
Like I've always been passionate about this, and I finally get to bring medicine
to people on a national scale.But I don't want to say that I
don't know how to monetize it.But my biggest problem is how do I
do this mobile wise? Like Idon't really have a team that can follow
me. I have an amazing producerthat I can email things too, that
does all the episodes my podcast,the intro music, the outro music.

(01:12:53):
If you've ever listened to an episodefor somebody that's as small in this game
as I am. He puts somesoul into that, and some of the
episodes he's produced have even made mesit on the floor just go that's not
mine, Like, there's no waythat's mine. But I just don't know
what to do with the mobility ofthis. And I was wondering if anyone
has had any experience of just kindof starting out where you've got all of
these possibilities in front of you,but really no capital to work with and

(01:13:15):
nothing more than an iPhone. Man, if that's the elevator pitch, i'd
hate to hear the whole story seehow long it took. But to be
honest, I think you've kind ofalready have an idea. You're just looking
for validation of what you're thinking ofdoing. And my advice to you is

(01:13:36):
just do what you feel you haveto do to get your message out there.
So if this going to conventions withthese people and talking to fifteen thousand
people at a time is more effectivethan recording a podcast and hoping that you
get one thousand or two thousand,or five thousand or ten thousand listeners over

(01:14:00):
the course of a month or youknow, six months or whatever. I
think you already have an idea ofwhat you want to do. You're just
looking for someone else to say it'sokay to do it. Well, I
agree with that. I would alsolet me let me jump in here quick
too. I think if you're atthese shows and you're getting you know,

(01:14:20):
fifty, you have an audience offifteen thousand people. Could you be converting
them into listeners and also not justlisteners, but also to you know,
repeat customers in that instance, andso having them you know, become you

(01:14:43):
know, a part of your brand, having them appreciate your brand and be
a part of that. Could you, while you have that audience, get
them to subscribe to buy from youknow, buy from you, or buy
from your company. I don't knowthe logistics of all that. Apologize for
being kind of ignorant to that becauseI'm in a state that doesn't allow that

(01:15:06):
stuff. And oh, you knowwhat, we have to drive to Illinois
or Michigan if we want to belike, you know, good stuff.
So what's the the ability for youto take that reach and amplify your sales
and also your your listenership through there. And you know, from a technological

(01:15:31):
standpoint, there's so many different thingsthat you can do on your iPhone to
to make that happens. I canoffer you like four things without even pulling
up Google here, So that part'spretty easy. I appreciate that. I
love the passion. It's very sincere. I think you got to you got

(01:15:53):
to keep that up and figure outhow to use it to your advantage.
I mean, I think, Greg, before we go to Matthew, go
ahead, Grace, oh, Isaid. And it's an honest honestly,
it's an easy thing to keep up, because I'm not kidding. Five years
ago, I was diagnosed with aninoperable frontal low brain tumor that they gave
me a year to live, andcannabis is what cured me. And I
decided when I got my second andmart done and we were showing that the

(01:16:15):
swelling went down and the tumor itactually shrunk in size. I decided at
that moment that if cannabis saved mylife, it did so so no one
would ever have to plan their funeralon their fortieth birthday ever again. And
that's been the one thing that's fueledme through all of this. So like,
losing that passion and that drive isnever going to be an issue.
I just have to figure out away to like pay the bills while I'm
doing that. Yeah, I don'tthink I have anything to add. I

(01:16:36):
mean from a technology standpoint, Ithink I think for under one hundred bucks,
you could probably get a nice microphone, and if you have a producer
you can ship the files off toor pop them in a dropbox or something.
You probably could put together a decentlittle show on the road. And

(01:16:56):
it sounds like you're going to geta lot of exposure. And I would
say, just congrats. I appreciatethat. I really do appreciate the passion.
Matthew, You've been waiting patiently withyour hand up. Good. We'll
finish off the evening with you.What you got. Hey, thanks thanks
for letting me talk. I'll bequick since you're you know that was pretty
long. I have a cannabis historypodcast. I'm not here to plug it,

(01:17:19):
but my thing is, because it'scannabis history, we keep falling into
black holes when it comes to advertising. I mean a lot of a lot
of monetization's been lost. I justwanted to know if anybody had any good
advice on how to monetize something thatis I mean it's cannabis related in the
sense that it's just strain and genetichistory because we're old breeders. But that's

(01:17:41):
it. Like that, we've we'verun into every problem like we're selling weed.
I've been on this road before.I can help you. Thank you.
So we have a couple of specializesin your marketing issue, so make
sure to send me a message andI'll give you this contact. There are
a number of clients or brands thatwe work with who sell nutrients to help

(01:18:09):
the growth of cannabis products, butthey're run by organizations who don't yet want
to say that they're for cannabis.So if you think of some of the
big names in fertilizers that you maysee in your local big box store,

(01:18:30):
and I'm not going to name names, but they do grow. They do
sell products for hydroponicts, for inground folier applications, all different sorts of
types of things. They're looking forplaces with again promote their product to growers

(01:18:53):
in particular, but can't for regulatorypurposes, especially if they're publicly traded or
some of those kind of things,go out and say specifically, this product
works great for marijuana. And soyour best bet is to look for the

(01:19:13):
places who might sell different types ofnutrients and other types of you know,
those types of I guess I'm tryingtrying to say things without saying that I
know literally exactly what you're talking abouthere, So I really appreciate that's really
smart. Yeah, so if yougo to there you find them. You

(01:19:36):
know, you could go to LinkedIn, find them marketing director or CMO or
those kind of people and try tohave a conversation with them. And then
you know, that's where you gotto make your pitch on why they should
advertise on the show, how muchit costs, what your listenership looks like,
those kind of things, because they'rethey're still going to want to make

(01:19:57):
sure that they're getting their their money'sworth. But there are if you,
if you DM me, I couldprobably give you some names, or not
names, but brands that you canreach out to and or start doing some
research on. But that would beyou know, it goes back to Greg's

(01:20:20):
niche talk that he gives every timewe have this conversation, is there are
people who are looking for people likeyou and looking for shows like yours to
advertise on, but they don't knowyou're there and they don't know where to
find you. So you need tohelp them. You need to grease the
skids. That's all great advice,you know, Like I as a black

(01:20:44):
market dude, I've never looked atLinkedIn ever in my life. But that's
pretty brilliant and it seems obvious tosome people but not to be so I
really appreciate that you got it.Thanks for coming on the show. In
the short term, you ought tolook at some affiliate opportunities because I'm sure
they exist, like even for youknow, like the more legal CBD type

(01:21:08):
stuff that's you know, big andcan sell a lot of places. I
know, there's like, I mean, I don't know how deep you get
into this, but there's like homegrow kits. There's like all sorts of
these. There's all sorts of thesethings out there, depending on how deep
you want to go or whatever.I mean, I seen an affiliate.

(01:21:29):
There's affiliates for everything. And thereason I this came to mind is because
I was thinking about buying a vineyardand I wanted to understand, like how
you know if the soil is anygood? And I was listening to a
podcast about vineyards and it was anaffiliate for a soil sample kit I don't

(01:21:51):
know, like and that's when Irealized I was way over my head.
So nothing happened there, but itjust made me. It just always reminds
me that there is an affiliate forliterally everything, like just just anything you
can think of, there's affiliate relationships. I appreciate that. Like I said,

(01:22:15):
I was as a black market dude, and like I had people running
our podcast and they they made themselveswith the owners. So now I'm competing
with our old podcast. But Ido have, like the last fourteen days
that seemed to be good despite competingagainst my other version of our podcast.
So I really appreciate all the help. It's all brand new. The business
side of this to me. Yeah, look, if you look at I

(01:22:36):
did an interview at Jordan Harbinger wheresomething similar happened to him, where he
had to compete against his old show. So if you want to hear a
show about like a Kindred Spirit there, just search for podcast creators. You
can watch it video on Spotify foranybody who's interested in seeing how that works.
Not to plug that, but hedominated and and crushed that other show,

(01:23:01):
so it might give you some inspiration. Oh I'd love it. I
need it right now. Thank you. It's also an episode that I feel
dropped on mind. So if youwant to listen to my podcast instead of
Greggs, that'd be awesome. Ohyeah, yeah, you can listen to
listen to Jeff's. It doesn't doesn'tmatter to me. I'd rather he's got
more episodes than he's got more episodesthan me. I'm gonna be taking a

(01:23:24):
both that, so I appreciate it. All right, Greg, take us
home. It's your turn this week. Thanks everybody for coming to podcasting Power
Hour. Believe it or not,it's supposed to be an hour and it
starts at nine Eastern time. Wewould love if you shared it with somebody.
We want to keep this community growing. Uh. There's also a podcast

(01:23:46):
version of this that's you know,it's a few weeks time. That's my
job to do. So if youmiss a week, it's no problem at
all. All just go to PodcastingpowerHour dot and you can see U.
I edit it slightly, mostly justJeff and and and D so I cut

(01:24:09):
ed out of almost everything. Souh but but other than that, it's
pretty much this exact same thing.And uh yeah, we'd appreciate it if
you gave it a follow, alistener, whatever the people say these days,
Go ahead, fuzz I saw youcome off the mute. I was
just gonna say, smash that plusbutton on Apple podcasts. Yeah, what

(01:24:30):
is that like? The check mark? Give me the check mark. Smash
that tiny little button that's easy tomiss. No. I again, I
appreciate everybody listening, and this isa lot of fun. Every week that
I can make it. I apologizein the weeks that I can't because I'm
busy running this huge metropolis of twothousand, seven hundred and four people.

(01:24:53):
And uh no, thanks, thanksfor coming on the Podcasting Power Hour.
Last thing I'll say, make sureyou give me a super follow before you
buy Tanner Campbell. Any coffee begreatly appreciated. That's hilarious. And on
that note, keep being you,keep being great and don't litter. We'll

(01:25:17):
see you next week. Agree beforeGreg has a chance. Oh the closing
thoughts by Ed. See you later. Everybody click and that's the end.
Thank you for listening to the podcastingPower Hour. Everyone is free to participate
on Twitter spaces every Monday at ninepm Eastern time. To join, just

(01:25:40):
follow Jeff at podcast underscore Father orGreg at Indie Droppin'. If you found
this podcast helpful, go into yourpodcast app and write a quick review.
Other podcasters will see it and knowthis show is worth listening to. Also,
I'll put a few links in theshow notes for ways you can support

(01:26:00):
the show. I think by nowyou know we love our coffee. Have
a great week. What do youthink? ED? You already missed the
pitch that you've been asking for.Oh, I'm sorry. You know that
I have to walk my dogs aroundthat time and I just sometimes get in
the dead zone. How was thepitch? Yeah, the pitch was fantastic.
Good to hear. I'm glad itwent well, but not noticed.

(01:26:24):
It was better when he smiled though, although I could not keep I had
to stay on mute because it wasthe funniest thing Ariel's ever said. That
was pretty good. I will haveto get care of that fall. Yeah,
she reached out and said she hadto jump off, but she was
glad she could get back in.We hadn't talked to her much in the

(01:26:45):
last couple of weeks. Early.No, No, I see Leo's on
too. No no chatting from him. Maybe his microphone's all acting crazy.
Thought we would get some some goodinputs there. So are we going to
do a podcasting power our post showwith the ask at anything? So?
Oh on the on the podcast version, by the way, if you get

(01:27:09):
past the credits, I put thepost show in so I listened to it
to make sure we don't see anythingweird. But this part is in the
podcast. So and ed, Ido not cut you out. Don't worry,
buddy, got worried. I wouldcut myself out if I could.

(01:27:31):
So we told Tanner that. Wetold Tanner that the show starts it at
ten his time today, So justkeep that. Make sure you don't break
our secret. Paddington can stay inthe dark for all I care. No,
Greg, I'm not having mic issuestonight. I what No, I

(01:28:00):
told you it was something stupid inme. Later, I was trying to
stop it. How about I interruptyou like that one? Oh gosh,
I believe you for Oh no,you know no, I was. I
was pro weed until that kept gettinginterrupted. I'm totally anti are we?
Are we going to start the showmany time soon? Guys? I'm hanging

(01:28:24):
up. This is this is enoughfor me. No, but I mean
Tanner finally showed up. It's timeto start the show. Oh damn it.
See he's early. No, buttonight I just wondered he missed Ariel.
He would be very sad. Yeah. She specifically said she liked to

(01:28:44):
be called ari which is what Tannercalls her, which I thought was hilarious.
Hey Tanner, how are the tacostaco Tanner he's having? He's having?
By the way, I did Idid confirm with some friends in Texas
that breakfast tacos must contain egg.So I don't know how it's going on
in Denver, but those are notbreakfast tacos. All breakfast tacos must contain

(01:29:09):
egg. That is just a generalrule of thumb, regardless of where you
are. That's how Laco Bell didit. That's how Taco Bell did it.
Yeah, Leo, I mean TacoBell. I mean that's the authority.
You were so right. Absolutely neverlived that down. I was like,

(01:29:30):
is this what your podcast sounds like? Oh my gosh, I wish
I had real philosophical things to saylike that. One guy was too well,
isn't we legal one in Colorado?Oh it's not an Indiana that's right,
Jeff? Were you not going toapprove Tanner? I approved him.
I've improved him like six times.I don't know what he's doing. He

(01:29:51):
pumped himself back down. I think. So. That guy said he's coming
to Cincinnati. I almost to ed, I cannot take it anymore. And
I was in your corner last nightand I was I was with you,
man, you're gonna you're just gonnacall me out like that. Oh,

(01:30:12):
I'm gonna static you out like that. But that guy said he's coming to
Cincinnati. I almost said, hey, let's hook up. But he talked
too fast for me. I can't. I can't deal with people who talk
really, really super fast like that. I don't know why. It just
gives me the Yeah, I'm ona three thirty three mega Hurtz brain I
can't do it. Yeah, itmakes me uneasy. Hey, guys,

(01:30:36):
I came here a little late.This is the first time I'm joining the
group. Is it okay? IfI asked a question, I'm not gonna
always wait till next week. ButI never knew this group existed. It
was the first time. Just Traderrecommended it to me and I just hopped
on. Jeff, is it pastyour bedtime? Can you stay up late?

(01:30:57):
I'm fine, although I will tellyou Tanner, it keeps giving me
an error message. I'm not surewhat's going on. It says I add
you as a speaker, and thenit says an error message. But I'm
good. That's up to Greg andFuzz. I'm still on COVID brain.
Yeah, I'm good. Because Nosa, I if it's pronounced Nosa, I
have an affinity for trucking logistics.So I want to hear your question,

(01:31:19):
and I have wanted to hear yourquestions since you requested me a speaker.
So hit us. I'm gonna drop, guys, so have a great night,
and Nosa. I hope you getyour question answered without me, but
it's unlikely. See you all right. Thank you, Thank you, Greg,

(01:31:40):
and fuzz. So a couple offriends approached me, like two friends
of mine approached me about an ideaof starting a podcast network centered around a
music genre. Right, So theidea is to talk about things pertaining to
that music genre, like maybe interviewartists, uh, break down, you

(01:32:02):
know, albums, talk about historicalthings that happen within that genre. Everything
sounded good to me, but myonly issue was music licensing and podcasting.
I mean it's been an age longbattle between those two where you know,
record labels don't necessarily want to permitpodcasts to use music without fair use or

(01:32:29):
not. And I was like,how are you going to have a music
podcast or music genre network without playingmusic not consistently but you know every now
and again. And if you knowthe record labels are pulling down episodes because
of that, then is it somethingthat's sustainable? So I don't know,
like, does anyone have any kindof recommendation or resources to kind of like

(01:32:55):
help with that. Yeah. SoI spent fifteen years in broadcasting and I
worked with not only record labels butalso bi ascap licensing. And I will
say that the reason they don't likepodcasts is because anybody can go to your
RSS feed and download their protected songswithout you paying for them. So the

(01:33:19):
it in whether you know they downloada full episode of a show and they
take out the the minutes within thatthat are that you know their song or
songs plural. That's why they don'tlike that. So you're not going to
have a good time if you tryto put music into your podcast, and

(01:33:42):
you're not going to have a goodtime if you are trying to make a
show based around music, I wouldrecommend doing something like AMP or what's the
other live broadcast thing from station Headas the other I don't know I'm thinking
of. I would recommend doing somethinglike that if you're gonna do but those

(01:34:06):
are live broadcast type things. Otherwise, I believe you can put music in
the anchor if you only if youplay the whole song and don't uh,
if you don't, you can't talkover the music or anything like that.

(01:34:28):
I think you have to play thewhole song and like go to a break,
go ahead is struggling to answer thequestion. So the way the way
it works on anchor is, Yeah, you have to play the whole song.
You can't interrupt it, you can'ttalk on it. Over it.
However, the only way people whoare listening to your show can hear those

(01:34:49):
songs is on Anchor or Spotify,So if you have your podcast anywhere else,
they won't hear them. Yeah,so you're a knows that becomes really
small. Go ahead, I gottashare an embarrassing story. You guys are
gonna laugh at me. And Iknow that everybody loves a good chance to
laugh at Tanner because he's a bigold shit talker. Got this, I've

(01:35:10):
got that podcast. It's called PracticalStoicism. It's about ten thousand dollars a
day. Okay, it's got aboutthirty forty thousand regular listeners. I get
forty thousand dollars in the seven daysof a release. So I'm thinking,
you know what it's time for.It's time based on Greg's advice. Fucking

(01:35:30):
Greg, this is the reason neverto listen to him. If he's in
the room, I can't see him. But if he's ever in this room,
never listened to him. He goes, you should try to monetize this,
and I go, you know what, Greg, You motherfucker, You're
right. I should. So I'mgoing to start up a supercast. So
I start up a supercast two daysago. You guys, does anyone does
anybody want to guess how many peoplesigned up for my supertest out of forty

(01:35:50):
thousand regular listeners? Go ahead,I will wait for your guests. Zero
problem. I already said seven,zero fucking not a single one. Yeah,
and I'm gonna. And the reasonthat I thought to bring it up
was because you guys were talking aboutSpotify and the largest portion tens of thousands

(01:36:14):
of those forty thousand, are onSpotify, and I thought, well,
I can do one of two thingshere. I can launch a supercast,
or I can launch I can movemy podcast over to Anchor, which I'm
not necessarily against. Anchor has matureda lot since its early days. It's
still got shitty analytics. But ifmost of my audience is there, I
would be willing to do it.But you know what, if there's nothing

(01:36:36):
within the Spotify app that allows somebodyto subscribe to a payment plan, they
have to escape the they have toescape the app and they have to go
to Anchor. And the reason forthat is that Spotify doesn't want to give
any money to Apple or to Googlefor processing the payment within the app on
their devices. And so I thought, Okay, well it's probably not going

(01:36:58):
to have as good results, butit will have some results. And to
this, to right now, thisvery minute, not a single fucking person
has subscribed. So I just wantto give you all a chance to laugh
at me for that. There done. Back to the original question, music
and a podcast, it's just it'sit's just has not muck you, Jim,

(01:37:20):
Sorry, Tanner. Yeah, theproblem is all the licensee. So
yeah, that's why on Anchor andSpotify, if you play music, there's
a there's a show called super Novasuper Nova Earth and he only hosts it
on Spotify because it's a music show, and he'll only host it there because

(01:37:43):
that's the only place people can hearthe music he plays. So he can't
even try to venture out of it. And that's because it's a closed it's
a closed platform that people can't actuallydownload to their device. I mean you
can with any platform, you canfind a way to record an audio or
whatever that might be, but youcan't physically download it through an RSS right

(01:38:04):
through your computer. So that's why. And I know there's something about music
licensing where you can play it.I think it's fifteen seconds before you start
running intoda any issues. I don'tknow if that's one correct, but it's
it's not my wife an lawyer.My wife is a lawyer. And now
fairy use is a myth in mostregards when we post to music, right,

(01:38:29):
So that's why it gets so complicatedwith running a music podcast. So
I've got a question for you,Fuss. Do you think that these two
things we just mentioned about Spotify mypathetic situation in this music situation, do
you think it's a reason to focuson Spotify or do you think it's a
reason to avoid Spotify. If youhave if you can find enough audience to

(01:38:50):
be on Spotify to find that,then I think it's a reason you sure
focus on Spotify. I will tellyou this, and since there are a
good thirteen of us here, Ihave a podcast that I it's like an
archivedcast podcast. I haven't done anepisode and I don't know two years,

(01:39:12):
and we used to do titles orlyrics of songs as the title of our
show. And on Spotify, Istill get downloads like forty downloads a month
on a stupid episode that I've nevertouched because people type that in the Spotify
and you get found that way.But from a you know, should should

(01:39:35):
you focus on Spotify itself? Idon't know if it's music focused, maybe
I could see for Nosa's application thatmight be. That might be cool,
but I don't know. I meanthe well, you know what I've got
it run out five episodes because anchorstreeand see where it goes. What do

(01:40:00):
I mean? You'll just be outthe time at that point. If it
works, it works. If itdoesn't, you put it back on the
shelf and you forget it. Beforeyou go starting a network and all this
other stuff, just try five showsand hack you with the music and focus
on Spotify And well, can youeven really start a music podcast network if
you're only going to be on oneor two systems because of the song limitations?

(01:40:24):
Exactly? Well no way, wait, wait, wait a minute,
I think you could. There's thisJeff and Greg have heard me talk about
this. But there's this myth inpodcasting that being everywhere matters. But the
side effect of being everywhere is thatyou must promote everywhere whereas if you phot
platform, be at Spotify or Appleor overcast or player FM, whatever it

(01:40:47):
is, if you put all ofyour efforts to growing an audience in a
single place. That must be easierif you are more likely to be successful
than splitting your marketing attentions across Imean, god, how many are there
fifty potential listing platforms. I wouldjust say, if you're going to do
that to you're gonna have to letyour audience obviously know U front this is

(01:41:13):
where we're going to go. Butgo on a platform. You have to
go on Spotify because that's I thinkthat's the only podcasting platform that has the
license ability for you to play asong without getting sued. So don't try
to do that on your own platform, and you know, not put it
on on Apple or whatever. Justlike, no, that's not true.

(01:41:35):
You can play up to six minutesof any song without any legal ramifications.
Just go ahead and do it.You'll see, well, Tanner Campbell a
lawyer. Better call Tanner Tanner whencomes did drag come back in the room
all of a sudden and start givingbad advice again? So I will for

(01:42:00):
over this week. Oh I'm sorry, I'm just saying you're very over.
I got in the car and drovehome from my dinner with Seth, and
I didn't expect that this would stillbe going on. Yeah, it ended
a little while ago. You camein on the back end of the banter.
It went till ten twenty five.I think though we had people waiting
in line to get we were allmaking fun of you, you know,

(01:42:21):
perfect perfect. Did you guys talkabout the charting thing? Because I'm sorry
I missed that. We wait,what what charting thing are you talking about?
I left it figure we could talkabout it next week. Okay,
cool, I'll have more data buythen too, so maybe that's better.
We had pretty good I mean really, we just piggybacked off questions and Greg
kind of kicked it off. Butwe had some pretty good questions tonight.

(01:42:44):
There was one guy that had aten minute elevator pitch. How did it
go? Would you have sold me? Was that pitch? No? I
actually I actually texted Jeff Well andI said, I feel like we're being
filibustered. Yeah. I was lostpretty early. I couldnt even comment on
it because I was I was gone. Yeah. I texted I DM Jeff

(01:43:06):
about ninety seconds in and said,this guy already lost me after ninety seconds.
And then he just kept going andgoing and going. The thing he
has he has a cool studio.But he was trying to sell us,
is what was happening? And tosay it sounds like he's got a great
studio in Vegas. I just saw. I just told you that ten minutes
and what seven words? What washe trying to What was he trying to

(01:43:26):
sell engineering services model? He wastrying to sell his advertising model, is
what I gleaned from it. Yep, Well, listen, I mean you
got to respect a guy for hustling. Here we all are, well most
of you guys tonight showing up hostingconversations, and I bet you're not a
single son of a gun in theaudience tipped you or went to your profile

(01:43:47):
and bought your coffee. So youknow, you got to appreciate the hustle.
Sometimes we don't get paid three gamelike seven followers, So that's like
seven thousand dollars a month, sevenfollowers that will never subscribe to a fucking
thing you put out. That that'sthe value. That's the value I bring
to you, guys. I getyou the cheapest people. Hey, so

(01:44:11):
is that a value? Add?No value? Value? Time zero and
zero. Buddy, I single handedlyruined Tanner's podcast and all his ambitions with
it, thousands of I make everyyear are now no longer there. All
right, I'll buy. Oh wait, do you not know the Satoshi story?

(01:44:36):
Well, I just know what yousaid on your show. Here's evidence
of no one listening to anything anyonesays outside of these rooms. So I
listen to your show. I knowabout the stosis, like five thousand is
worth a penny, or fiftys areworth a penny. Listen, fifty is
worth a penny. And if youdownload the Fountain app you can get you

(01:44:58):
can get tipped three toshi for everyepisode you push you put out and podcasting
two point zero and all this bitcoinshit are like, let's get rich getting
money from our supporters, and allthese supporters are like tipping one hundred satoshi
per episode with is two cents,and everybody's like, this is the answer.
This is how we finally turn aprofit as podcasters. And we're like,

(01:45:20):
dude, at what point do Iget to tell a listener to fuck
off for seriously insulting me, forgiving me two pennies for listening to my
shit? Like, at what pointdo we just say listen not asshole?
You wouldn't give anybody who did anythingincluding begging on the corner two cents,
How fucking dare you? Okay,I'm downloading I'm downloading the Fountain app just

(01:45:43):
to give Tanner fifty please I needit. So my I would say it
was back in January this past yearor this year, we switched from Spreaker
to Captivate, and when we switched, we lost our programmatic ads that ran

(01:46:04):
on my wife's show and my show, but my wife's show mostly, and
we were you know, she's gotone hundred and seventy five weekly followers and
you know, residual episodes and thingslike that. We're probably making I don't

(01:46:25):
know, twenty bucks a month onher show. And she's like beside herself
that Captivated hasn't rolled out these programmaticads because they said they were going to,
and they haven't when they switched toGlobal, and it's kind of like
Sutocia, I'm like, it doesn'tmatter so much. We should probably just
put together a sell sheet and getyou an actual sponsor instead of trying to

(01:46:51):
get these programmatic ads on your showthat are going to pay shit anyway.
So but yeah, it's kind ofwhole Satoshi thing. It's like you've got
a super niche audience, you couldprobably find actual people to buy that,
and spending the time to implement thisor wait for this or switch back to

(01:47:13):
spreaker isn't worth the funds. It'sthe route that I went. I mean,
I've been able to maintain three sponsorsjoy the whole time throughout the podcast
now, So no regrets with thatdecision. The problem with her show is
that she focuses on free tools forteachers, since teachers are completely yes,

(01:47:34):
broken, underfunded, et cetera.So finding somebody to pay for us to
say, hey, you know,this episode's brought to you by you know
X platform. They also have afree version, and you know, uh,
one hundred and sixty nine of thoseone hundred and seventy followers each month

(01:47:56):
are going to get the free version, and maybe one will describe as yeah,
but is there some I mean there'spotential for coffee or pens or something
else that is kind of aligned,but not necessarily. She makes her money
on her show by speaking at conferences. So each year she'll get a she'll

(01:48:17):
get a handful of speaker events,and you know, it ends up being
five thousand or so a year ishand so it's not so bad when it
comes down to it. But itdoesn't. It's not episode related, you
know, Like there's that whole tiein that you want that gratification of,
like, hey, we've got thismany followers and this many people listening,

(01:48:39):
and we should get paid for theepisode versus the My expertise is good enough
that I've been asked to come andspeak at this because of what I talk
about paying me money. Wait aminute, how are you going to say
five thousand dollars a year is prettyokay? I mean we're doing It's not
our I mean, this is ourListen to me. God damn it.

(01:49:01):
We have people rioting in the streetswith signs because they want to make eighteen
dollars for working at McDonald's, andyou think making five thousand dollars a year
for the podcast is fucking worth it? What the fuck is wrong with people?
Do? Where is this inconsistent moralityand outrage when it comes backcasting?
Fuck especially, he says, podcasting, it's just you talking. That's all

(01:49:25):
you do. And I'm gonna I'mgoing to close this room out and open
up a new one. So actuallyI got to take off. Guys.
Thanks for hanging out. Thanks again, Jeff. Yeah, I open up
another one for a little bit.Is is Greg? Is Greg gonna be
there? So I know what tothink. Greg's already asleep. He's old,

(01:49:46):
so yeah, he's all right.Everybody that wants to chat for a
while, look for that space herein thirty seconds. All right, see
you guys. Thank you for checkingout this episod o AI podcaster. I
really do appreciate it. If you'reinterested in learning more about this podcast,
you can go to podcastfather dot com. If you're interested in all the different

(01:50:09):
kind of work that I'm doing,you can go to Jeff Townsend dot Media
contact form on there various other differentpodcasts and projects that I'm involved in that
I think you will enjoy. Butagain, thank you for supporting me,
and make sure you support any droppingnetwork like we cover to the beginning.
Get your podcast featured on there.Until I see you next time, Take
care of yourself and keep being youand keep being great. Jeff Townsend Media

(01:50:44):
saves you. Good night. Andthe question is do I stay here?
Will you be back? Ahre yougonna come back? Will you be back?
Are you coming back?