October 24, 2022 • 46 mins
Google Analytics 4 is not just an update of the popular, free web traffic tool. GA4 is an entirely new platform. Since Google has not made major changes in its analytics in 10 years, this is kind of a big deal. For many marketers, Google’s current version, known as Universal Analytics, is all they know. The Industrial Marketer Podcast breaks down what you need to know about this important transition.
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Episode Transcript
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Joey Strawn (00:00):
Welcome back everybody to another episode of
the industrial Marketer Podcastthe workplace for the tips, tech
trends and tactics forindustrials who care about
driving leads and money revenueto their businesses. It's
exciting to be back I missedevery one of you since our last
episode, I have one of yourhosts industrial Franken
(00:22):
marketer, Joey Strawn and asalways, I am here wishing you a
happy Nelsoween week withNelson. How are you now else?
Nels Jensen (00:33):
I promise not to scare anybody this will be a
very, very, very safe ground tothe to try to.
Joey Strawn (00:43):
You know what now I'm gonna stop you right there
because that's not a promisethat you can keep this week
because oh no, but superduperdoop doop de doop doop doop doop
doop, we're having a specialepisode a full on industrial
marketer special report becausewe are in we're recording this
around Halloween, if you hadn'tpicked up on the theme so far,
(01:04):
it should be released aroundHalloween. But here's the thing,
What's scarier to industrialmarketers than data and proving
ROI? Nothing. Nothing is scarierthan those numbers in those
spreadsheets and thosepercentages and trying to prove
ROI in the industrial marketingspace. So we decided to dedicate
(01:25):
an entire episode to analytics,but specifically Google
Analytics for GA for the rolloutthat is coming. If you haven't
heard about it, you've probablyheard about it. And if you
haven't, you need to hear aboutit because Google Analytics is
going away. And there's a newone coming. And Nelson That's
terrifying. Isn't it terrifying?
You're, you're I can tell you'reshaper to the core?
Nels Jensen (01:49):
Well, as long as I don't have to build any custom
dashboards or anything likethat, I'll be fine.
Joey Strawn (01:55):
Oh, no. See, it's like, it's like foreshadowing,
okay, I can't I can't handle it.
My my goose my goose bumps areup all over the place we're
diving in. Because this is ourspecial episode special report
on Google Analytics for and theupcoming changes in the data
sphere for all industrialmarketers. Now, this is a heavy
topic. And there's a lot that'sgoing into the GA for switch,
(02:18):
you know, it may everyone'sthinking, Oh, we got Google
Analytics and UniversalAnalytics that was all the same.
This is not the same. This is abig, big change. And so we are
bringing in the big guns. Sothis episode for our special
report, we have the new directorof analytics and industrial Nate
Griffin, here to talk to usspecifically about the
(02:41):
importance of data, theimportance of analytics, and
really making sure that everyonein this sphere is ready for this
because this is a big change.
It's a big stuff coming. Nate,thank you for being on the show
with us today.
Nate Griffin (02:56):
Oh, thank you for having me on your special War of
the Worlds Halloween episode. Ipromise? Well, I can't promise
the people will tune in. Andthen like go out in the field
looking for little green men whohave invaded Broadway expected
to be this scary.
Nels Jensen (03:15):
Okay, good.
Joey Strawn (03:17):
Now, listen, I are thrilled to have you here.
Because when we were talkinganalytics, we're like, Okay, we
gotta get the guy and talk tothe guy who was actually helping
us understand all this from ourend as a professional. And so I
mean, we're thrilled. Buthonestly, the real, the real
importance here is for ourlisteners, and these, you know,
(03:37):
the industrial marketer audienceare people who are on the ground
level, Nathan working in thefields of the industrial
marketing footsteps, all the wayup to managers, and C suite who
are trying to understand how allof this makes a difference for
their business. Like theyhaven't invested in marketing
infrastructure like this was,you know, their grandfather,
(03:58):
great, great grandfather startedthese businesses, you know, so
we're really talking thespectrum of industrial marketing
here. I mean, let's just startoff with an easy big question is
data and collecting it asimportant as we say and why why
is it important for marketers tocollect data?
Nate Griffin (04:17):
If you are using the internet to generate leads
or to generate revenue? Yourcustomers will leave a string of
data along. Now, whether or notyou choose to collect that data
or not, that is up to you. Butif you're not collecting that
(04:38):
data, if you're not analyzingthe data, you are flying blind
at where your biggestopportunities for sales and
leads are.
Joey Strawn (04:47):
It Okay, so that sounds pretty important to me.
So like if you're, you saidflying blind, it'd be like if
you didn't have sensors on anairplane, and you're just hoping
that you're pointing towardsBaltimore. would be lying,
Nate Griffin (05:01):
it would be going to a conference and having your
booth put up and absolutely nosignage. Oh wow. And then you
hand out your business card and,and then you hand out your
business card. And it's just anit's just a blank piece of
paper. And there's no, there'sno contact back. And you don't
know and you don't know who yougave it to. So there's no
(05:25):
there's nothing to there's nofollow up. There's nothing you
don't know where the person isgone. You don't know, if the
person has come back, you justhope you hope they're interested
because they added, they theyshowed up?
Joey Strawn (05:37):
Well, nails loves trade show analogies. And so you
just use one. And so I'll extendthat met Alex in that metaphor a
bit. So if you're spending awhole bunch of money to go to a
trade show to do that, the waythat you just described, that
money is not put to good use. Soif I'm hearing you correctly,
one of a will, a major benefitof having an analytics
(06:00):
infrastructure or understandingthe data around you is to make
sure that the money that peopleare putting towards sales,
marketing, and brandingactivities, is actually being
put to good use, that it's notjust being thrown asunder, or
tossed into a jacket lantern tokeep the that seasonal theme
(06:23):
alive. I mean, I mean, else isthat, is that what you're here.
Nels Jensen (06:27):
Well, right? Right.
And we haven't even brought upthe idea of actionable insights.
Right? It's like, it's not, it'sjust, it's just starting with
the foundational informationthat allows you to do something
next also tells you, right? Sohow many people found us? Who
are they? Where do they comefrom? Anyway? Yes.
Nate Griffin (06:52):
I, you know, and it's a lot of people are
hesitant to get into the dataand analytics game. I mean, you
you there's a big sportspushback about, you know,
baseball, and football teams areusing too much in analytics, and
I know what's best for my, formy business, or my team, or my
(07:14):
situational, pinch hitter, or myrelief pitcher, or when to go
for it on fourth and one, I knowwhat's best, I don't need, I
don't need numbers telling mewhat to do.
Joey Strawn (07:27):
Mind. My gut tells me how to do that I've been in
this business long enough toknow, et cetera, et cetera, et
Unknown (07:34):
I know what it is, I know who's buying what I know,
all of this stuff. Data is not apredictor of outcomes. It's not
going to tell you this is goingto work every time. It's a
roadmap of what did work. And soif you have a better opportunity
to go through that roadmap, andsay, All right, these people
(07:57):
came from here. And I know thata person coming from this area
of the country looking for thisparticular service or upgrade or
product that we have came fromhere, how often has that
happened, how easy it is torepeat that. Or easily, you
(08:20):
repeat that I'm sorry. And soit's yeah, it's not it's not a
predictor. It's the meaningfulinsights kind of come in from
the roadmap that it providesyou.
Joey Strawn (08:30):
I like I like the roadmap, picture that metaphor,
because as I'm thinking about,like, someone could give me a
map of the United States andsay, Hey, I need you to get from
New York City, to Los Angeles.
And if I just have the outlineof the country, I might can get
there without falling into theocean, but it's not going to be
quick, it's not going to beefficient, I'm going to get
(08:53):
lost, I might die. If you add inthe state lines a little bit
more detail, then I know alittle bit more about what I'm
doing with the states and theinterstates, then, well, that
makes my trip a whole loteasier, I can actually get there
without wasting a lot of time, Iknow which roads I should take
and what signs I should belooking for. But if you go even
(09:13):
deeper, and you start adding inlike which truck stops strong on
which roads and whererestaurants are and the more
detail I get on county lanes andstreets and oh no, there's
construction on this, you know,talking like ways level data
information, then my trip canbecome not only quick and
efficient, but optimized alongthe way as Oh, no, this bridges
(09:34):
out go a different way. It'llsave you a day's journey. And
that to me, as you're talkingabout this roadmap, you know,
having a lot of data isn'ttelling you where to go. It's
giving you the map, so you knowhow to get there the right way.
You know, it's almost that like,I've heard you talk to clients
about this. Nate specifically issaying, Well, I want to build
(09:57):
something that gives us a directSure no idea of what to do not
the answer, but which directionthe answer is in. And I've
always, I've always thoughtthat's a fun approach to saying
like, well, this doesn't give usthe answer it gives us how to
think about to get to the answerin which direction, we need to
be focusing our efforts. Andthat, to me, has always been a
(10:19):
fun, ongoing kind of kaizenesque thought process around
data analytics.
Nate Griffin (10:26):
Yeah, I always Oh, you know, a lot of a lot of web
analytics, a lot of expectationson web analytics kind of fall
into the soothsayer like, lookat the tea leaves and predict
the outcomes for us and tell us,tell us give us the answer.
Which doctor following and, andthat's not how I like to
(10:51):
approach it, I like to approachit as this is my goal, I know
that this is going to make memoney, this is going to save me
money, or this is going toimprove customer sentiment. So
now, what is that roadmap thatgets that gets a visitor to the
website? Or a potentialcustomer? From there, to this
(11:14):
point? And can we see that? Canwe replicate it? Can we make it
more efficient? And if we can doall those things can we do.
Nels Jensen (11:24):
So I also like to think about analytics really
allow you to play, you know,they show you what works
sometimes, or what has worked inthe past, but they also show you
what often doesn't work. So Ilike to think one of the
benefits for manufacturers withanalytics is it allows you to
play offense and defense at thesame time, it allows you to
(11:45):
adjust the dials so that youspend a little bit less than
this, because it's not producingas much results. And you spend a
little bit more on that, becauseit has been. So let's let's talk
now more about the changes inthe app in the landscape here
for analytics. You know, we'vecome up on this key juncture,
Google Analytics has. I've seenthe estimates around 86% of
(12:09):
market share for b2b marketing.
Obviously, it's free, but it'svery powerful. So get us up to
speed on where we are in the b2banalytics picture with this
Google Analytics for platform.
Nate Griffin (12:24):
Well, Google Analytics for is a brand new
codebase brand new library. It'sand it is going to be a complete
overhaul of an web analyticsimplementation. There should be
no
Joey Strawn (12:40):
stuff people have installed, you know, Google
Analytics. Now they're fine,right? They're totally
Nate Griffin (12:45):
No, no, no, no, this is, this is a completely
new update. They've had yourGoogle Analytics has been
working on using or they've beenusing what's called Universal
Analytics for the past 10 years.
But if you think about it,Google Analytics, as a property
as a product has only beenaround for about 15 years. And
(13:07):
in that first five years, therewas a lot of changes. They had
at least three major platformsbetween 2007 and 2012.
Joey Strawn (13:28):
So like Google Analytics, one, Google Analytics
two, and then Google Analyticsthree, which, if correct me if
I'm wrong on this, GoogleAnalytics three is essentially
what we know of as GoogleAnalytics, prime, Google and
Lidice, universal 360. Thecurrent what everyone uses is
essentially Google Analytics.
Three,
Unknown (13:48):
Yes. And in the first in the first five years, there
were, you know, they made threeupdates. And in 2012, it rested
on Universal Analytics. Andthat's what we've been using for
10 years. And so there's athere's a whole generation of
marketer of online marketersthat doesn't know anything but
Universal Analytics. Where haveyou been there since 2007?
(14:12):
You've already been throughthese these types of updates
before but if you haven't beenthere, if you haven't, you know,
you just started if you've onlybeen working in online since
even 2012, so 10 years. You'venever gone through this type of
drill before.
Joey Strawn (14:29):
I'll say that even even for me personally, Google
Analytics two was the one thatwas launching when I was first
getting into the professionalside of this Google Analytics.
One is what we used like inschool and and internships and
things of that nature. But likeGoogle, the current version is
ultimately the only one that Ifunctionally have used as a
(14:53):
professional for a decade. So ityou know it is a really big
change and Mel's, I laughed sohard because I know you did This
on purpose, but yourforeshadowing bit of, well,
thank goodness, I don't have towrite code or anything. That's
what one of and Nate, I want togo into some of the differences
between these tools and whywe're even talking about GA
(15:14):
four. But one of the maindifferences is Google Analytics,
three, the one we know and love,came prepackaged with a bunch of
reports and dashboards andelements, custom built, which is
normally what people think of.
So like the time on site, thevisitor, the the bar graphs, and
the charts, all that was prebaked in, that's not gonna be
the case with GA fours, theywill have to build dashboards
(15:38):
from scratch from using someelements of code implementation
knowledge, like, it's not just aplug and play wiziwig, like,
kind of used to be.
Nate Griffin (15:51):
Yeah, one of the things that, you know, I've,
I've even heard, you know,analytics practitioners, people
that I trust, and I've followed.
For years, I would considercolleagues, one of the big
problems, one of the big issuesthey have with GA four, is that
they can't find what they'reused to finding. And they have
to go in and build itthemselves. The other one is,
(16:13):
there's a lot of stuff thatthey're not, they're just gonna
drop, bounce rate. Inparticular, that's, you know, a
metric that everybody you know,if you're in the online space,
you know, what bounce rate is,and you might plan entire
campaigns around if your bouncerate is super high. You're not?
(16:35):
Well, we're going to stop thisone. And we're going to use this
page.
Nels Jensen (16:42):
Yeah. No, no, I was gonna say that. Let's talk about
the fundamental differences,because there are still ways to
evaluate what are effectivelanding pages. They're just
different. Right? Yeah.
Joey Strawn (16:56):
So theoretically, like, code in the equation to
come up with bounce rate, butit's not good. It's like these
pre baked dashboards, thesemetrics that Google has decided
are these ones to to visualize,won't be readily available. But
yeah, to your point, like it'sgoing to give marketers on our
(17:17):
end a lot more control over whatwe're seeing what we're looking
for, and what's unique to eachcustomer and client experience.
Because a lot of this is basedon user activity, as opposed to
website session activity, as Iunderstand it. Now, you were
about to say so yeah.
Nels Jensen (17:33):
That's, that's what it was. So Nate, yeah. Walk us
through a little bit about thefundamental differences with GA
four. And how that can benefitmarketers?
Unknown (17:43):
Well, the biggest thing is going to be it's going to be
focused on engaged users orengaged sessions sessions. What
that means is people that areactually taking action on the
website, how long they've beenaround, how long they come? How
often they come back. One of thethings, one of the things that
(18:07):
they've built in automaticallyis scroll tracking, scroll
tracking.
Joey Strawn (18:11):
Oh, nice.
Nate Griffin (18:12):
And like PDF download link clicking like,
this is stuff, they'veautomatically included in the
updates, because there was a lotof things. They were building
stuff that a lot of people builtinto GA, or to use
Joey Strawn (18:26):
Those types of things all the time. Yeah,
that's, that's actually I'mhappy to hear those will be
baked in the new round.
Nate Griffin (18:32):
Yeah. And they're, and they are. Yeah, they're
events, but everything's goingto be instead of hit based
tracking, everything is going tobe event based. So that's why
the scroll tracking isimportant. That's why those
outbound clicks, as events areautomatically being tracked. And
(18:54):
why bounce rate is kind of goingaway, because they want to focus
more on what people are doing,and less so much. What they you
know, trying to prove a negativeby right people didn't do
Joey Strawn (19:09):
well. And as I you know, and one of the things I've
been thinking about and youknow, you and I have chatted
about this off to the side, butyou know, the element of
tracking or is just seeingwhat's happening on a site, you
know, the world we live in,we've got, you know, voice
activated devices on our desksthat we can ask questions to
that will pop us audio answers,we have phones that are
(19:31):
connected to our profiles acrossseven devices and we can send
notes to ourself on Evernote andlinks to ourselves from a phone
to a laptop and you know, abounce may not be me bouncing
off of the site because I'm notinterested in the page. It could
be me bouncing from my phone tomy laptop because the video is
experience is better. And so youknow a lot of the things that I
(19:53):
see them implementing in GA fourseem to be around that realm
like for Like Inanna thinking ina manufacturing space, like, you
know, how often are peoplejumping from their phone to
their laptop to their tablet,when they're on the factory
floor, or, you know, they'reresearching something at work,
and then are researchingresearching something at home,
(20:14):
and then buying it at work on adifferent computer, because they
have their work paymentinformation and POS connected
there, I mean, some of thechanges, it feels like it's
really about connecting with thepeople and the individuals that
are searching and their habitsas opposed to just like what's
happening on an app or awebsite.
Nate Griffin (20:34):
No, and that's, that's a good point, the the big
thing they're trying to do ismake cross device attribution,
alive here. Universal Analyticsactually had, it was kind of the
first instance of this, thepoint of Universal Analytics is,
wherever the library was calledfraud. It was going to fire. So
(20:56):
you could put it anywhere youwant it, you could put it
behind, you could you could putit on, you could put it in a
CRM, if you wanted, it couldfire and send information back.
And it was also the first timeit allowed you to tie a user ID
together. So if somebody doessomething on one device, like
(21:17):
logs in, that you could tielogged in sessions together. But
for Universal Analytics, and forprivacy reasons, you had to have
those two separate profiles.
Yeah. Yep. Ga for is actuallytrying to stitch a lot of that
stuff together on your on theirown. And there's still a couple
of things you can do to make iteasier for them to do that, like
(21:37):
the universe, like the user ID,if you wanted to build in your
own user ID. But now it doesn'thave to be separate profiles are
separate properties, you cantrack that all in in one thing.
Joey Strawn (21:52):
See, that's helpful. And some people who
haven't set up Google Analyticsproperties or views or instances
before may not understand howhelpful that is. But it's very
nice that what you just said isvery nice.
Nate Griffin (22:04):
Yeah. Part of its going to be part of it's a
little black box. And so it'slike weird, like, what are they
what are they deciding is goingto stitch those users together?
My, I've heard some rumblingsthat it's actually based on,
like your logged in Googleaccount, right? I've heard that.
(22:24):
And there's some other stuffthat I'm not absolutely sure of
without like digging, digging,you know, doing some, like
heavy, heavy digging. But yeah,there are other things, there
are other things we can do tokind of help that along. And it
all it can be fairly property.
Nels Jensen (22:41):
So one of the things reading about on the
surface level that I do, I'mcertainly not in the weeds on
this. But, you know, I've read alot about first party cookies
and third party cookies, and thesort of change in sort of
structure or change inphilosophy, if you will talk
about cookies, and whatmanufacturing, marketers really
(23:03):
need to know, we don't need toget super in the weeds. But what
is what is really the keydifference here in terms of the
privacy and cookies aspect.
Nate Griffin (23:12):
So as our, as our online world evolves, you know,
browser, cookies, browsers, orjust kind of little bits of
data, that are metadata thatkind of like associate your
(23:32):
browser to something you'vedone. So like
Joey Strawn (23:37):
It's validating the fears that everyone's like,
every website I know isfollowing me around. It's like,
yes, every website you've beento kind of follows you under a
little bit. Because of thesecookies.
Nate Griffin (23:48):
Right? I mean, it started out as like just like a
bit of like you know, so whenyou click on a link and go back
to a page and that and or andleave but then go back to that
page and that link is purple,saying right like that. That's
the cookie working now from anonline marketing standpoint.
(24:10):
People have used cookies tostart you know, serving ads that
go hey, finished shopping. Youknow, you looked at this product
now it's gonna follow you aroundeven if you bought it you went
to you looked at a mattressreview. Are you interested in
this mattress forever?
Joey Strawn (24:32):
Casper? Yeah, Halloween Halloween
Unknown (24:35):
Yeah, there we go. And so so as this is going on,
there's been a ton of privacyprivacy concerns with cookies,
specifically coming out of theEU. That's where the GDPR Yeah,
yeah. originated and so tryingand I'm always of the mindset
(24:58):
that it's just a weird thingthat a lot of times Google goes
through these exercises, theselike privacy exercises to make
sure that EU type legislationdoesn't end up happening here.
The other part is they're justtrying to get in front of stuff.
Another thing that's kind of biggoing on right now is your
(25:19):
iPhone. And the iOS operatingsystem. They've recently allowed
you to disable tracking on apps.
You know, it'll ask you, Hey, doyou want this app to track you?
Nope. You know, I do that. The,the other thing is, more and
more people are using contentblockers, and ad blockers. And
(25:41):
if they're using an ad blocker,it's not going to fire any
JavaScript or Google Analytics,and therefore, nothing gets
stored. With that. So the, youknow, online marketing,
essentially has based itself onthose user cookies. And once
(26:04):
people start walking them anddisabling them, what's, you
know, how do we gain visibility?
So GTA four is Google's firstattempt at trying to move away
from cookies. And they're tryingto base it on user sessions. And
(26:28):
again, stitching that togetherany kind of any way they can.
But again, removing cookies fromthe equation of venture, it's
not one or 2% there yet. Butthis is their first attempt, I
don't know if there's gonna belike a fifth generation that
will do that. Or if like, thatwill be an update in
Joey Strawn (26:48):
Oh, you know, a fifth generations come? And gee,
well, it's gonna be a hardthing. It's both years.
Nels Jensen (26:55):
Yeah. But there'll be there'll be updates
throughout. I mean, you know,and we've talked a little bit
about the learning curve. Andwe've talked a little bit about
the change, but there's a, thereare some potential elements of
this, that sound pretty excitingto me, the sort of predictive
nature, you know, if you do abetter job of tracking these
custom, I'm tracking theseactions on a site, you can build
(27:19):
a more robust pattern ofbehavior from your users, you
know, even to the point Googleis promising sort of a
artificial intelligencepredictive basis for setting up
future campaigns and, and evenwithin, you know, helping you
determine which segments perhapsyou want to market to. I mean,
(27:42):
what is is the Are we at the ageof, of artificial intelligence
here with this? Is this just abridge to what's next? What do
you think about the ability todo a lot of these sort of non
futuristic but I mean, peoplecan apply data visualizations
(28:04):
and things now but they'recertainly they're promising a
bit a much better look into thefuture.
Nate Griffin (28:13):
It's a double edged sword. I so I think this
has given them a lot morecapabilities than then UAE had,
I will go to say that. SoFacebook, look alike audiences
on Facebook ads, is probably oneof the strongest marketing tools
(28:38):
I've ever used. Ever, like justI was I was printing money with
that. And I think this actually,this upgrade for Google
Analytics, gets it. You know, ifwe're talking about predictive
capabilities, and being able tolike figure out how to define
(28:59):
segments, actually gets itcloser to on par with Facebook's
look alike audiences. If youdon't know what Facebook look
alike audiences are, that'swhere you can upload an email
list into Facebook, Facebookwill find will try to find those
(29:21):
people, whether it's by name,email, phone number, zip code,
address, whatever, they will tryto find those people. And then
they will say, All right, whatdo all these people have in
common? Turn that into anaudience. Yeah. And those things
(29:41):
are powerful when you reallydial them in. I felt like
especially
Joey Strawn (29:44):
I mean, we give we give Facebook so much more
information about us than we doGoogle because you know, people
are liking pages and interactingwith content and sagging. They
like things where you have somuch information Yeah, so to
your point, like If Google cantake that mindset and start
connecting the universe of dotsbehind what they know as well,
(30:09):
that can be a really powerfultool that
Unknown (30:11):
It is a very powerful marketing tool it, it also, you
know, it. Facebook is cookiebased still. So and Facebook is
kind of running into that thingwhere, you know, iOS turned on
the thing that said, don't trackme while I'm from this app. So
unless Facebook can kind of makean update, they might be. They
(30:34):
might be in a jam. But GoogleAnalytics is kind of paving the
way to say things get around,get around. Yeah,
Nels Jensen (30:44):
I mean, my understanding is that with GA
four, you can define whichevents, which of these user
events are most important toyour particular business. So it
makes it a little easier tocustomize what you're looking
for in, in your analytics. Soyou know, if that's the case,
(31:05):
the predictive insights shouldcome more, more of them and
faster, because you're able todefine what's a great experience
from the start. Right?
Manufacturers are differentthan, you know, a lot of
consumer facing retail products,right? So the idea that down,
it's almost like built in andcorrect me if I'm wrong, because
(31:28):
I'm probably wrong. But it juststrikes me is it's almost like
you're building in lead scoringfrom the start.
Nate Griffin (31:37):
Yeah, yeah, it really is. It can, you know? It
really Yeah.
Nels Jensen (31:43):
Yeah. And that could be, you know, Joey,
doesn't that sound, you know,enticing to you. I mean, I get
it, there's going to be learningcurves and, you know, changes
heart and everything like that.
But, you know, it does strike methat for manufacturers with
these long buying cycles, andthese buying committees, and,
you know, it makes it easier toconnect the dots, if you got
multiple people from the samecompany, you know, almost like
(32:05):
the Account Based Marketingapproach makes it Yeah, to me,
it sounds like it could make iteasier to get into ABM.
Joey Strawn (32:14):
Here's, here's what I think ultimately, and I'll
pull back the curtain and theveneer of tell you my true
personal opinion on this. Ithink that GA four is going to
be so powerful for exactly thething that you said nails, but
it's going to require thatpeople be more engaged with it,
be more knowledgeable about itand use it. I think Universal
(32:35):
Analytics became a crutch for alot of people because it has,
oh, behavior and conversions andthe things that became easy and
repeatable. And they didn't haveto think too hard or be too
involved with their own data. Ithink GA four will be powerful
in all of those ways. But itwill require more of people. And
so it may not be as used. Butwe'll see I hope I hope time
(32:59):
will tell and I hope time willwill make me more of an
pessimists on this. But youknow, again, as they mentioned,
I've seen this happen a coupleof times. And that was the thing
about Google Analytics three oruniversal that that was so
appealing was Oh, my goodness,anyone can use this, and that
they're taking a little of thatof that back. And that's okay,
(33:22):
that's not you know, like theend of the world. We're all
marketers, we can all figure itout. And there are other tools
like a bunch of us have workedand things like Supermetrics and
other platforms that do a lot ofthe same machinations if you've
had to build a Facebook tag or aFacebook event to make their
advertising work. You've donesome work. So it's not like
you're learning a new saleentirely. But I do think it's
(33:43):
going to require more of itsusers. I mean, Nate thoughts,
Nate Griffin (33:47):
I think what's happening is because Google is
building in some of the stuffthat like, people would build in
Universal Analytics for custom,like custom, you know, custom
events for scrolling customevents for downloads. And also,
while also taking out likemaking making generic reports
(34:11):
that they used to have custom.
What I think is may be happeningis they may be moving towards
more of a business intelligencevibe than they are. Yeah.
Nels Jensen (34:26):
That's a really good way to put it. I like to
Unknown (34:29):
Because I think Google Analytics is realizing that the
power users are not necessarilyjust leaving the Google
Analytics data, you know, notjust using Google Analytics on
its own but using Google likepulling data out and and making
their own displays.
Joey Strawn (34:48):
Yeah, and then pointing people to those
analytics displays and usingthem as ongoing informational
pieces that they can use intheir daily marketing activity.
He's No, I agree. I think, youknow, we've talked a lot about
how it's going to look and howthat's going to transition, you
know, in, in the time we haveleft, what is it going to take
(35:12):
for people to change over? Imean, like, you know, we're
talking to people who may haveGoogle Analytics instances right
now. And they're thinking thatit's just going to update on on
its own. And they may belearning with listening to this
episode, that that's not thecase. Like, for people who just
have no analytics, or just haveGoogle Analytics set up on their
on their sites, what should theyprepare for when it comes to
(35:34):
changing over.
Nate Griffin (35:36):
So the first thing they will have to do is create a
separate GA for property. Okay,so all the properties every time
this happens, a new property hasto open up and the property is.
So you know, Google Analytics,the number you know, there's the
there's that number that's likeyou a hyphen, there's your
(35:58):
Number Number Number NumberNumber Number Number Number
hyphen, one. That's your GoogleAnalytics property. And that's
what tells Google Analytics togo, alright, I fired this code,
where am I going to put it, I'mgoing to put it in this property
over here, and it shows up. Andthat's what you log in and to
Google Analytics. And you see,every time they've done a
(36:20):
library update like this,they've had to create new
properties, because it's goingto someplace new, it's, it's,
it's a new program, callingsomething new. So create a GA
for property, they will nexthave to if they are using if
they have put the code. If theyhave hard coded the code on
(36:42):
their page, they will need toreplace the code the the GA and
analytics.js code for the G tag
Joey Strawn (36:52):
The snippet tag that applies,
Unknown (36:57):
They will need to apply the new Google Analytics
snippet. If they're using GoogleTag Manager, there will be a you
know you there will be a newcontainer. And it will, you'll
be able to click new tag, andthere'll be a new thing that
says Google Analytics GA fortracking, you will add a number
(37:19):
in there, that number beginswith a G. So it was G hyphen,
number,
Joey Strawn (37:24):
Okay, now you play anymore G hyphen, right?
Unknown (37:27):
If it doesn't begin with a G, you're adding the
wrong thing. And that's, that'skind of the first thing and but
the next part is, you know,adding goals, adding events,
adding reports that you're usedto seeing, you're gonna have to
(37:47):
redo all of that stuff. So ifyou see a, if you see a new
goal, or you know, you've gotsomething tagged as a goal,
you're gonna have to build allthat back in and into the GA for
property.
Joey Strawn (38:04):
So what I'm hearing is that it's basically as if,
imagine that your GoogleAnalytics tomorrow got erased,
what would you do to start andset up an entirely new one, so
you would go to GoogleAnalytics, you would set up a GA
for account, you would get theyou would put in your domain,
and they would give you alittle, you know, profile and
(38:25):
instance. And one of the firstthings will be giving you the
code or like if I know Googlegiving you the option to email
said code developer. And, andthen that's, and that's what you
would be adding to your GoogleTag Manager, you would add it in
the same way you would add anyother tag to your Google Tag
Manager. And then from thatpoint on, you would work inside
(38:48):
GA4 and that login instance, asopposed to the previous one,
Unknown (38:54):
right. Now, the other thing that's, you know, going
into predictive analytics thatwe're discussing, GA4 for can
go, ah, we see this is happeninga lot. Is this a conversion? You
know, it will it will kind ofput those little
Joey Strawn (39:12):
That's cool, then it'll kind of walk you through
how to get that conversiontracked in the system.
Nate Griffin (39:17):
Well, it may automatically track like,
especially if it's like a pageview,
Joey Strawn (39:21):
Like a thank you page or something.
Nate Griffin (39:23):
Yeah, if it's a thank you page, it'll go does is
would you consider this aconversion? And then you go,
yes, I would consider this aconversion. So that actually for
some listeners, yeah, itactually can find stuff for you
on that initial thing. Or now,you will want to, you know, you
(39:45):
don't want to rely 100% on
Joey Strawn (39:48):
Of course, anyone who's used Google Ads knows
this. It's like, recommendationsfor everything.
Nate Griffin (39:54):
Oh, I do want to bring up you will have to it's
easy. If you've got Google ads.
ads associated. If you've gotGoogle ads and universal,
connected, you can still connectGA for the same exact way. It'll
just, it'll email you have
Joey Strawn (40:12):
You have to connect it again, though.
Nels Jensen (40:14):
Yes. But it's pretty simple like, like, it's a
really simple thing is, youknow, you click the connect
button and then go. Alright,this is what you're logged into,
is this. Is this what you wantto connect? You don't have to
disconnect. Okay, universal, theUniversal Analytics tag?
Joey Strawn (40:31):
They do that for search console as well, I would
Nate Griffin (40:34):
Yes, yeah, you can do that for Search Console.
imagine.
Joey Strawn (40:34):
So none of that will be automatically connected
in the install, it willessentially like Google
universal, will have to beconnected on a one by one
instance.
Nate Griffin (40:42):
Yeah, but, and I may be wrong on this, it's been
10 years. So I think it used tobe, you could only have one
thing connected, like oneproperty. But now that they're
letting you now they're lettingyou do it simultaneously. So you
(41:04):
don't have to turn off. Youdon't have to turn off the
connection to UniversalAnalytics.
Nels Jensen (41:11):
You can what I've read, you can run them both in
parallel until they turn off UAon July 1, of 2023. Right? And
you know, so let's just talkabout incentives. This sounds
imposing, you might needresources, or you can ask for
people like us to help. Butthere is value in doing this
(41:31):
sooner than later and startingto build up your, you know, your
your historical data, if youwill, because yes, you'll be
able to save the data that youhad from Universal Analytics.
But it's not a year over yearcomparison, because it's a whole
new platform. So you know, don'tdelay, you know, this is
something you're you're betteroff doing sooner than than
(41:54):
later. Right. Easy for me to say
Joey Strawn (41:56):
You messed up the end of that now says don't delay
get GA4 for today. Yeah, firstkid on your block. Yeah. That's
what you meant to say. Yeah. Butno, no, I mean, Nate, would you
agree? Would you agree thatlike, even now, like, well, I
don't, I have until July 1, todo this, go ahead and get out
there and getting a property.
Unknown (42:16):
Now, if you don't have time, to get the one for one
instances, like or take somethat's gonna take some heavy
lifting. Or if you don't havetime to do that, at least get,
you know, data flowing into theGA for property now, because
then you will at least be ableto, you know, have enough of a
(42:38):
history, you know, even ifyou're not reporting on it, you
have enough of a history to go.
All right, I think I can seewhere some of the parallels are,
won't be, you know, you
Joey Strawn (42:50):
You only playing catch up as much as there's what
I hear.
Nate Griffin (42:53):
Yeah, or you won't be trapped in the house with a
giant stalker. I was trying toreally force the Halloween
metaphor, I'm sorry,
Joey Strawn (43:02):
It was really scary. And don't worry, it'll
keep coming back to haunt usyear after year after year. You
know that. And that's how youthat
Nels Jensen (43:12):
I know. I'm a lot older than you guys. But I
worked at a movie theater whenthe very first Halloween came
out. Jamie Lee Curtis was ababysitter. So that is
sunsetting, as well. So here weit is no, it's just sort of the
you know, we're closing a coupleof circles here.
Joey Strawn (43:29):
It's the circle of Halloween. And it's a circle of
data. And it's the circle ofGoogle and I donate thank you so
much for being here today andchatting through this. I know,
we like to get technical andnerdy off to the side. But you
know, really bringing this toour listeners attention is is
important. And I know that it'sout there, but whether or not
(43:52):
people have been payingattention to it, I hope they are
now so thank you for yourinsights and time today.
Nate Griffin (43:57):
They Thank you for having me. I was really trying
to rein myself in from goingcrazy deep dive because this is
this has been like my careersince you know, since since
Google Analytics started, youknow, I've been in it and like I
can you know, I love to nerd outon that stuff. So hopefully I
(44:21):
was you know, hopefully I was agood resource and wasn't too
dry.
Joey Strawn (44:26):
No, you're fantastic. Our listeners are
loving it.
Unknown (44:30):
Anytime you want to have like, if you think your
listeners would like a real deepdive and and this stuff, you
know and let me
Joey Strawn (44:38):
You know what you know what I'm gonna put this out
there for our listeners who wantto test Nate's mettle. Go ahead
and email us email us atpodcast@industrialmarketer.com.
I say this every episode thatyou send us your questions, send
us your topic ideas, things thatyou want us to talk about on the
show. But if you have a questionabout Google Analytics GOOG, GA4
(44:58):
for implementation had ahistory, whatever, email us and
we'll put Well, if we get enoughof them, we'll get Nate back and
put his test his metal.
Nels Jensen (45:06):
Yeah. And if and if the subject matter today is
Sunday just a little bit scary,you know, then you know if
you're not into Google TagManager and and you're not sure
that you're capable of doingthis then you know what, come by
ring our doorbell and we'll havea treat for you. Okay.
Joey Strawn (45:25):
Yes. And also email us and ask us to help because
this is something that we do andwe are helping people with these
transitions so we're happy totalk to you about it. But as
always, thank you so much forlistening to the industrial
Marketer Podcast you know,subscribe to the episodes if you
haven't already. Follow us onsocial media make all of your
(45:46):
trick or treaters listenactually put us on speaker as
the trick or treaters are comingaround, out. That'll work. It is
there'll be horrifying for them.
And I and we want to be part ofyour community as well. So like
I said, emails thatpodcast@industrialmarketer.com
If you have questions for us, ifyou want to be a part of the
show, and we are looking forwardto the next time that we get to
(46:07):
chat about all of this world ofindustrial marketing and how
much we love it and all of theopportunities that it has for
us. So thank you guys very much.
Happy Halloween, and until nexttime, have a good one.
Welcome back everybody to another episode of
the industrial Marketer Podcastthe workplace for the tips, tech
trends and tactics forindustrials who care about
driving leads and money revenueto their businesses. It's
exciting to be back I missedevery one of you since our last
episode, I have one of yourhosts industrial Franken
(00:22):
marketer, Joey Strawn and asalways, I am here wishing you a
happy Nelsoween week withNelson. How are you now else?
Nels Jensen (00:33):
I promise not to scare anybody this will be a
very, very, very safe ground tothe to try to.
Joey Strawn (00:43):
You know what now I'm gonna stop you right there
because that's not a promisethat you can keep this week
because oh no, but superduperdoop doop de doop doop doop doop
doop, we're having a specialepisode a full on industrial
marketer special report becausewe are in we're recording this
around Halloween, if you hadn'tpicked up on the theme so far,
(01:04):
it should be released aroundHalloween. But here's the thing,
What's scarier to industrialmarketers than data and proving
ROI? Nothing. Nothing is scarierthan those numbers in those
spreadsheets and thosepercentages and trying to prove
ROI in the industrial marketingspace. So we decided to dedicate
(01:25):
an entire episode to analytics,but specifically Google
Analytics for GA for the rolloutthat is coming. If you haven't
heard about it, you've probablyheard about it. And if you
haven't, you need to hear aboutit because Google Analytics is
going away. And there's a newone coming. And Nelson That's
terrifying. Isn't it terrifying?
You're, you're I can tell you'reshaper to the core?
Nels Jensen (01:49):
Well, as long as I don't have to build any custom
dashboards or anything likethat, I'll be fine.
Joey Strawn (01:55):
Oh, no. See, it's like, it's like foreshadowing,
okay, I can't I can't handle it.
My my goose my goose bumps areup all over the place we're
diving in. Because this is ourspecial episode special report
on Google Analytics for and theupcoming changes in the data
sphere for all industrialmarketers. Now, this is a heavy
topic. And there's a lot that'sgoing into the GA for switch,
(02:18):
you know, it may everyone'sthinking, Oh, we got Google
Analytics and UniversalAnalytics that was all the same.
This is not the same. This is abig, big change. And so we are
bringing in the big guns. Sothis episode for our special
report, we have the new directorof analytics and industrial Nate
Griffin, here to talk to usspecifically about the
(02:41):
importance of data, theimportance of analytics, and
really making sure that everyonein this sphere is ready for this
because this is a big change.
It's a big stuff coming. Nate,thank you for being on the show
with us today.
Nate Griffin (02:56):
Oh, thank you for having me on your special War of
the Worlds Halloween episode. Ipromise? Well, I can't promise
the people will tune in. Andthen like go out in the field
looking for little green men whohave invaded Broadway expected
to be this scary.
Nels Jensen (03:15):
Okay, good.
Joey Strawn (03:17):
Now, listen, I are thrilled to have you here.
Because when we were talkinganalytics, we're like, Okay, we
gotta get the guy and talk tothe guy who was actually helping
us understand all this from ourend as a professional. And so I
mean, we're thrilled. Buthonestly, the real, the real
importance here is for ourlisteners, and these, you know,
(03:37):
the industrial marketer audienceare people who are on the ground
level, Nathan working in thefields of the industrial
marketing footsteps, all the wayup to managers, and C suite who
are trying to understand how allof this makes a difference for
their business. Like theyhaven't invested in marketing
infrastructure like this was,you know, their grandfather,
(03:58):
great, great grandfather startedthese businesses, you know, so
we're really talking thespectrum of industrial marketing
here. I mean, let's just startoff with an easy big question is
data and collecting it asimportant as we say and why why
is it important for marketers tocollect data?
Nate Griffin (04:17):
If you are using the internet to generate leads
or to generate revenue? Yourcustomers will leave a string of
data along. Now, whether or notyou choose to collect that data
or not, that is up to you. Butif you're not collecting that
(04:38):
data, if you're not analyzingthe data, you are flying blind
at where your biggestopportunities for sales and
leads are.
Joey Strawn (04:47):
It Okay, so that sounds pretty important to me.
So like if you're, you saidflying blind, it'd be like if
you didn't have sensors on anairplane, and you're just hoping
that you're pointing towardsBaltimore. would be lying,
Nate Griffin (05:01):
it would be going to a conference and having your
booth put up and absolutely nosignage. Oh wow. And then you
hand out your business card and,and then you hand out your
business card. And it's just anit's just a blank piece of
paper. And there's no, there'sno contact back. And you don't
know and you don't know who yougave it to. So there's no
(05:25):
there's nothing to there's nofollow up. There's nothing you
don't know where the person isgone. You don't know, if the
person has come back, you justhope you hope they're interested
because they added, they theyshowed up?
Joey Strawn (05:37):
Well, nails loves trade show analogies. And so you
just use one. And so I'll extendthat met Alex in that metaphor a
bit. So if you're spending awhole bunch of money to go to a
trade show to do that, the waythat you just described, that
money is not put to good use. Soif I'm hearing you correctly,
one of a will, a major benefitof having an analytics
(06:00):
infrastructure or understandingthe data around you is to make
sure that the money that peopleare putting towards sales,
marketing, and brandingactivities, is actually being
put to good use, that it's notjust being thrown asunder, or
tossed into a jacket lantern tokeep the that seasonal theme
(06:23):
alive. I mean, I mean, else isthat, is that what you're here.
Nels Jensen (06:27):
Well, right? Right.
And we haven't even brought upthe idea of actionable insights.
Right? It's like, it's not, it'sjust, it's just starting with
the foundational informationthat allows you to do something
next also tells you, right? Sohow many people found us? Who
are they? Where do they comefrom? Anyway? Yes.
Nate Griffin (06:52):
I, you know, and it's a lot of people are
hesitant to get into the dataand analytics game. I mean, you
you there's a big sportspushback about, you know,
baseball, and football teams areusing too much in analytics, and
I know what's best for my, formy business, or my team, or my
(07:14):
situational, pinch hitter, or myrelief pitcher, or when to go
for it on fourth and one, I knowwhat's best, I don't need, I
don't need numbers telling mewhat to do.
Joey Strawn (07:27):
Mind. My gut tells me how to do that I've been in
this business long enough toknow, et cetera, et cetera, et
Unknown (07:34):
I know what it is, I know who's buying what I know,
all of this stuff. Data is not apredictor of outcomes. It's not
going to tell you this is goingto work every time. It's a
roadmap of what did work. And soif you have a better opportunity
to go through that roadmap, andsay, All right, these people
(07:57):
came from here. And I know thata person coming from this area
of the country looking for thisparticular service or upgrade or
product that we have came fromhere, how often has that
happened, how easy it is torepeat that. Or easily, you
(08:20):
repeat that I'm sorry. And soit's yeah, it's not it's not a
predictor. It's the meaningfulinsights kind of come in from
the roadmap that it providesyou.
Joey Strawn (08:30):
I like I like the roadmap, picture that metaphor,
because as I'm thinking about,like, someone could give me a
map of the United States andsay, Hey, I need you to get from
New York City, to Los Angeles.
And if I just have the outlineof the country, I might can get
there without falling into theocean, but it's not going to be
quick, it's not going to beefficient, I'm going to get
(08:53):
lost, I might die. If you add inthe state lines a little bit
more detail, then I know alittle bit more about what I'm
doing with the states and theinterstates, then, well, that
makes my trip a whole loteasier, I can actually get there
without wasting a lot of time, Iknow which roads I should take
and what signs I should belooking for. But if you go even
(09:13):
deeper, and you start adding inlike which truck stops strong on
which roads and whererestaurants are and the more
detail I get on county lanes andstreets and oh no, there's
construction on this, you know,talking like ways level data
information, then my trip canbecome not only quick and
efficient, but optimized alongthe way as Oh, no, this bridges
(09:34):
out go a different way. It'llsave you a day's journey. And
that to me, as you're talkingabout this roadmap, you know,
having a lot of data isn'ttelling you where to go. It's
giving you the map, so you knowhow to get there the right way.
You know, it's almost that like,I've heard you talk to clients
about this. Nate specifically issaying, Well, I want to build
(09:57):
something that gives us a directSure no idea of what to do not
the answer, but which directionthe answer is in. And I've
always, I've always thoughtthat's a fun approach to saying
like, well, this doesn't give usthe answer it gives us how to
think about to get to the answerin which direction, we need to
be focusing our efforts. Andthat, to me, has always been a
(10:19):
fun, ongoing kind of kaizenesque thought process around
data analytics.
Nate Griffin (10:26):
Yeah, I always Oh, you know, a lot of a lot of web
analytics, a lot of expectationson web analytics kind of fall
into the soothsayer like, lookat the tea leaves and predict
the outcomes for us and tell us,tell us give us the answer.
Which doctor following and, andthat's not how I like to
(10:51):
approach it, I like to approachit as this is my goal, I know
that this is going to make memoney, this is going to save me
money, or this is going toimprove customer sentiment. So
now, what is that roadmap thatgets that gets a visitor to the
website? Or a potentialcustomer? From there, to this
(11:14):
point? And can we see that? Canwe replicate it? Can we make it
more efficient? And if we can doall those things can we do.
Nels Jensen (11:24):
So I also like to think about analytics really
allow you to play, you know,they show you what works
sometimes, or what has worked inthe past, but they also show you
what often doesn't work. So Ilike to think one of the
benefits for manufacturers withanalytics is it allows you to
play offense and defense at thesame time, it allows you to
(11:45):
adjust the dials so that youspend a little bit less than
this, because it's not producingas much results. And you spend a
little bit more on that, becauseit has been. So let's let's talk
now more about the changes inthe app in the landscape here
for analytics. You know, we'vecome up on this key juncture,
Google Analytics has. I've seenthe estimates around 86% of
(12:09):
market share for b2b marketing.
Obviously, it's free, but it'svery powerful. So get us up to
speed on where we are in the b2banalytics picture with this
Google Analytics for platform.
Nate Griffin (12:24):
Well, Google Analytics for is a brand new
codebase brand new library. It'sand it is going to be a complete
overhaul of an web analyticsimplementation. There should be
no
Joey Strawn (12:40):
stuff people have installed, you know, Google
Analytics. Now they're fine,right? They're totally
Nate Griffin (12:45):
No, no, no, no, this is, this is a completely
new update. They've had yourGoogle Analytics has been
working on using or they've beenusing what's called Universal
Analytics for the past 10 years.
But if you think about it,Google Analytics, as a property
as a product has only beenaround for about 15 years. And
(13:07):
in that first five years, therewas a lot of changes. They had
at least three major platformsbetween 2007 and 2012.
Joey Strawn (13:28):
So like Google Analytics, one, Google Analytics
two, and then Google Analyticsthree, which, if correct me if
I'm wrong on this, GoogleAnalytics three is essentially
what we know of as GoogleAnalytics, prime, Google and
Lidice, universal 360. Thecurrent what everyone uses is
essentially Google Analytics.
Three,
Unknown (13:48):
Yes. And in the first in the first five years, there
were, you know, they made threeupdates. And in 2012, it rested
on Universal Analytics. Andthat's what we've been using for
10 years. And so there's athere's a whole generation of
marketer of online marketersthat doesn't know anything but
Universal Analytics. Where haveyou been there since 2007?
(14:12):
You've already been throughthese these types of updates
before but if you haven't beenthere, if you haven't, you know,
you just started if you've onlybeen working in online since
even 2012, so 10 years. You'venever gone through this type of
drill before.
Joey Strawn (14:29):
I'll say that even even for me personally, Google
Analytics two was the one thatwas launching when I was first
getting into the professionalside of this Google Analytics.
One is what we used like inschool and and internships and
things of that nature. But likeGoogle, the current version is
ultimately the only one that Ifunctionally have used as a
(14:53):
professional for a decade. So ityou know it is a really big
change and Mel's, I laughed sohard because I know you did This
on purpose, but yourforeshadowing bit of, well,
thank goodness, I don't have towrite code or anything. That's
what one of and Nate, I want togo into some of the differences
between these tools and whywe're even talking about GA
(15:14):
four. But one of the maindifferences is Google Analytics,
three, the one we know and love,came prepackaged with a bunch of
reports and dashboards andelements, custom built, which is
normally what people think of.
So like the time on site, thevisitor, the the bar graphs, and
the charts, all that was prebaked in, that's not gonna be
the case with GA fours, theywill have to build dashboards
(15:38):
from scratch from using someelements of code implementation
knowledge, like, it's not just aplug and play wiziwig, like,
kind of used to be.
Nate Griffin (15:51):
Yeah, one of the things that, you know, I've,
I've even heard, you know,analytics practitioners, people
that I trust, and I've followed.
For years, I would considercolleagues, one of the big
problems, one of the big issuesthey have with GA four, is that
they can't find what they'reused to finding. And they have
to go in and build itthemselves. The other one is,
(16:13):
there's a lot of stuff thatthey're not, they're just gonna
drop, bounce rate. Inparticular, that's, you know, a
metric that everybody you know,if you're in the online space,
you know, what bounce rate is,and you might plan entire
campaigns around if your bouncerate is super high. You're not?
(16:35):
Well, we're going to stop thisone. And we're going to use this
page.
Nels Jensen (16:42):
Yeah. No, no, I was gonna say that. Let's talk about
the fundamental differences,because there are still ways to
evaluate what are effectivelanding pages. They're just
different. Right? Yeah.
Joey Strawn (16:56):
So theoretically, like, code in the equation to
come up with bounce rate, butit's not good. It's like these
pre baked dashboards, thesemetrics that Google has decided
are these ones to to visualize,won't be readily available. But
yeah, to your point, like it'sgoing to give marketers on our
(17:17):
end a lot more control over whatwe're seeing what we're looking
for, and what's unique to eachcustomer and client experience.
Because a lot of this is basedon user activity, as opposed to
website session activity, as Iunderstand it. Now, you were
about to say so yeah.
Nels Jensen (17:33):
That's, that's what it was. So Nate, yeah. Walk us
through a little bit about thefundamental differences with GA
four. And how that can benefitmarketers?
Unknown (17:43):
Well, the biggest thing is going to be it's going to be
focused on engaged users orengaged sessions sessions. What
that means is people that areactually taking action on the
website, how long they've beenaround, how long they come? How
often they come back. One of thethings, one of the things that
(18:07):
they've built in automaticallyis scroll tracking, scroll
tracking.
Joey Strawn (18:11):
Oh, nice.
Nate Griffin (18:12):
And like PDF download link clicking like,
this is stuff, they'veautomatically included in the
updates, because there was a lotof things. They were building
stuff that a lot of people builtinto GA, or to use
Joey Strawn (18:26):
Those types of things all the time. Yeah,
that's, that's actually I'mhappy to hear those will be
baked in the new round.
Nate Griffin (18:32):
Yeah. And they're, and they are. Yeah, they're
events, but everything's goingto be instead of hit based
tracking, everything is going tobe event based. So that's why
the scroll tracking isimportant. That's why those
outbound clicks, as events areautomatically being tracked. And
(18:54):
why bounce rate is kind of goingaway, because they want to focus
more on what people are doing,and less so much. What they you
know, trying to prove a negativeby right people didn't do
Joey Strawn (19:09):
well. And as I you know, and one of the things I've
been thinking about and youknow, you and I have chatted
about this off to the side, butyou know, the element of
tracking or is just seeingwhat's happening on a site, you
know, the world we live in,we've got, you know, voice
activated devices on our desksthat we can ask questions to
that will pop us audio answers,we have phones that are
(19:31):
connected to our profiles acrossseven devices and we can send
notes to ourself on Evernote andlinks to ourselves from a phone
to a laptop and you know, abounce may not be me bouncing
off of the site because I'm notinterested in the page. It could
be me bouncing from my phone tomy laptop because the video is
experience is better. And so youknow a lot of the things that I
(19:53):
see them implementing in GA fourseem to be around that realm
like for Like Inanna thinking ina manufacturing space, like, you
know, how often are peoplejumping from their phone to
their laptop to their tablet,when they're on the factory
floor, or, you know, they'reresearching something at work,
and then are researchingresearching something at home,
(20:14):
and then buying it at work on adifferent computer, because they
have their work paymentinformation and POS connected
there, I mean, some of thechanges, it feels like it's
really about connecting with thepeople and the individuals that
are searching and their habitsas opposed to just like what's
happening on an app or awebsite.
Nate Griffin (20:34):
No, and that's, that's a good point, the the big
thing they're trying to do ismake cross device attribution,
alive here. Universal Analyticsactually had, it was kind of the
first instance of this, thepoint of Universal Analytics is,
wherever the library was calledfraud. It was going to fire. So
(20:56):
you could put it anywhere youwant it, you could put it
behind, you could you could putit on, you could put it in a
CRM, if you wanted, it couldfire and send information back.
And it was also the first timeit allowed you to tie a user ID
together. So if somebody doessomething on one device, like
(21:17):
logs in, that you could tielogged in sessions together. But
for Universal Analytics, and forprivacy reasons, you had to have
those two separate profiles.
Yeah. Yep. Ga for is actuallytrying to stitch a lot of that
stuff together on your on theirown. And there's still a couple
of things you can do to make iteasier for them to do that, like
(21:37):
the universe, like the user ID,if you wanted to build in your
own user ID. But now it doesn'thave to be separate profiles are
separate properties, you cantrack that all in in one thing.
Joey Strawn (21:52):
See, that's helpful. And some people who
haven't set up Google Analyticsproperties or views or instances
before may not understand howhelpful that is. But it's very
nice that what you just said isvery nice.
Nate Griffin (22:04):
Yeah. Part of its going to be part of it's a
little black box. And so it'slike weird, like, what are they
what are they deciding is goingto stitch those users together?
My, I've heard some rumblingsthat it's actually based on,
like your logged in Googleaccount, right? I've heard that.
(22:24):
And there's some other stuffthat I'm not absolutely sure of
without like digging, digging,you know, doing some, like
heavy, heavy digging. But yeah,there are other things, there
are other things we can do tokind of help that along. And it
all it can be fairly property.
Nels Jensen (22:41):
So one of the things reading about on the
surface level that I do, I'mcertainly not in the weeds on
this. But, you know, I've read alot about first party cookies
and third party cookies, and thesort of change in sort of
structure or change inphilosophy, if you will talk
about cookies, and whatmanufacturing, marketers really
(23:03):
need to know, we don't need toget super in the weeds. But what
is what is really the keydifference here in terms of the
privacy and cookies aspect.
Nate Griffin (23:12):
So as our, as our online world evolves, you know,
browser, cookies, browsers, orjust kind of little bits of
data, that are metadata thatkind of like associate your
(23:32):
browser to something you'vedone. So like
Joey Strawn (23:37):
It's validating the fears that everyone's like,
every website I know isfollowing me around. It's like,
yes, every website you've beento kind of follows you under a
little bit. Because of thesecookies.
Nate Griffin (23:48):
Right? I mean, it started out as like just like a
bit of like you know, so whenyou click on a link and go back
to a page and that and or andleave but then go back to that
page and that link is purple,saying right like that. That's
the cookie working now from anonline marketing standpoint.
(24:10):
People have used cookies tostart you know, serving ads that
go hey, finished shopping. Youknow, you looked at this product
now it's gonna follow you aroundeven if you bought it you went
to you looked at a mattressreview. Are you interested in
this mattress forever?
Joey Strawn (24:32):
Casper? Yeah, Halloween Halloween
Unknown (24:35):
Yeah, there we go. And so so as this is going on,
there's been a ton of privacyprivacy concerns with cookies,
specifically coming out of theEU. That's where the GDPR Yeah,
yeah. originated and so tryingand I'm always of the mindset
(24:58):
that it's just a weird thingthat a lot of times Google goes
through these exercises, theselike privacy exercises to make
sure that EU type legislationdoesn't end up happening here.
The other part is they're justtrying to get in front of stuff.
Another thing that's kind of biggoing on right now is your
(25:19):
iPhone. And the iOS operatingsystem. They've recently allowed
you to disable tracking on apps.
You know, it'll ask you, Hey, doyou want this app to track you?
Nope. You know, I do that. The,the other thing is, more and
more people are using contentblockers, and ad blockers. And
(25:41):
if they're using an ad blocker,it's not going to fire any
JavaScript or Google Analytics,and therefore, nothing gets
stored. With that. So the, youknow, online marketing,
essentially has based itself onthose user cookies. And once
(26:04):
people start walking them anddisabling them, what's, you
know, how do we gain visibility?
So GTA four is Google's firstattempt at trying to move away
from cookies. And they're tryingto base it on user sessions. And
(26:28):
again, stitching that togetherany kind of any way they can.
But again, removing cookies fromthe equation of venture, it's
not one or 2% there yet. Butthis is their first attempt, I
don't know if there's gonna belike a fifth generation that
will do that. Or if like, thatwill be an update in
Joey Strawn (26:48):
Oh, you know, a fifth generations come? And gee,
well, it's gonna be a hardthing. It's both years.
Nels Jensen (26:55):
Yeah. But there'll be there'll be updates
throughout. I mean, you know,and we've talked a little bit
about the learning curve. Andwe've talked a little bit about
the change, but there's a, thereare some potential elements of
this, that sound pretty excitingto me, the sort of predictive
nature, you know, if you do abetter job of tracking these
custom, I'm tracking theseactions on a site, you can build
(27:19):
a more robust pattern ofbehavior from your users, you
know, even to the point Googleis promising sort of a
artificial intelligencepredictive basis for setting up
future campaigns and, and evenwithin, you know, helping you
determine which segments perhapsyou want to market to. I mean,
(27:42):
what is is the Are we at the ageof, of artificial intelligence
here with this? Is this just abridge to what's next? What do
you think about the ability todo a lot of these sort of non
futuristic but I mean, peoplecan apply data visualizations
(28:04):
and things now but they'recertainly they're promising a
bit a much better look into thefuture.
Nate Griffin (28:13):
It's a double edged sword. I so I think this
has given them a lot morecapabilities than then UAE had,
I will go to say that. SoFacebook, look alike audiences
on Facebook ads, is probably oneof the strongest marketing tools
(28:38):
I've ever used. Ever, like justI was I was printing money with
that. And I think this actually,this upgrade for Google
Analytics, gets it. You know, ifwe're talking about predictive
capabilities, and being able tolike figure out how to define
(28:59):
segments, actually gets itcloser to on par with Facebook's
look alike audiences. If youdon't know what Facebook look
alike audiences are, that'swhere you can upload an email
list into Facebook, Facebookwill find will try to find those
(29:21):
people, whether it's by name,email, phone number, zip code,
address, whatever, they will tryto find those people. And then
they will say, All right, whatdo all these people have in
common? Turn that into anaudience. Yeah. And those things
(29:41):
are powerful when you reallydial them in. I felt like
especially
Joey Strawn (29:44):
I mean, we give we give Facebook so much more
information about us than we doGoogle because you know, people
are liking pages and interactingwith content and sagging. They
like things where you have somuch information Yeah, so to
your point, like If Google cantake that mindset and start
connecting the universe of dotsbehind what they know as well,
(30:09):
that can be a really powerfultool that
Unknown (30:11):
It is a very powerful marketing tool it, it also, you
know, it. Facebook is cookiebased still. So and Facebook is
kind of running into that thingwhere, you know, iOS turned on
the thing that said, don't trackme while I'm from this app. So
unless Facebook can kind of makean update, they might be. They
(30:34):
might be in a jam. But GoogleAnalytics is kind of paving the
way to say things get around,get around. Yeah,
Nels Jensen (30:44):
I mean, my understanding is that with GA
four, you can define whichevents, which of these user
events are most important toyour particular business. So it
makes it a little easier tocustomize what you're looking
for in, in your analytics. Soyou know, if that's the case,
(31:05):
the predictive insights shouldcome more, more of them and
faster, because you're able todefine what's a great experience
from the start. Right?
Manufacturers are differentthan, you know, a lot of
consumer facing retail products,right? So the idea that down,
it's almost like built in andcorrect me if I'm wrong, because
(31:28):
I'm probably wrong. But it juststrikes me is it's almost like
you're building in lead scoringfrom the start.
Nate Griffin (31:37):
Yeah, yeah, it really is. It can, you know? It
really Yeah.
Nels Jensen (31:43):
Yeah. And that could be, you know, Joey,
doesn't that sound, you know,enticing to you. I mean, I get
it, there's going to be learningcurves and, you know, changes
heart and everything like that.
But, you know, it does strike methat for manufacturers with
these long buying cycles, andthese buying committees, and,
you know, it makes it easier toconnect the dots, if you got
multiple people from the samecompany, you know, almost like
(32:05):
the Account Based Marketingapproach makes it Yeah, to me,
it sounds like it could make iteasier to get into ABM.
Joey Strawn (32:14):
Here's, here's what I think ultimately, and I'll
pull back the curtain and theveneer of tell you my true
personal opinion on this. Ithink that GA four is going to
be so powerful for exactly thething that you said nails, but
it's going to require thatpeople be more engaged with it,
be more knowledgeable about itand use it. I think Universal
(32:35):
Analytics became a crutch for alot of people because it has,
oh, behavior and conversions andthe things that became easy and
repeatable. And they didn't haveto think too hard or be too
involved with their own data. Ithink GA four will be powerful
in all of those ways. But itwill require more of people. And
so it may not be as used. Butwe'll see I hope I hope time
(32:59):
will tell and I hope time willwill make me more of an
pessimists on this. But youknow, again, as they mentioned,
I've seen this happen a coupleof times. And that was the thing
about Google Analytics three oruniversal that that was so
appealing was Oh, my goodness,anyone can use this, and that
they're taking a little of thatof that back. And that's okay,
(33:22):
that's not you know, like theend of the world. We're all
marketers, we can all figure itout. And there are other tools
like a bunch of us have workedand things like Supermetrics and
other platforms that do a lot ofthe same machinations if you've
had to build a Facebook tag or aFacebook event to make their
advertising work. You've donesome work. So it's not like
you're learning a new saleentirely. But I do think it's
(33:43):
going to require more of itsusers. I mean, Nate thoughts,
Nate Griffin (33:47):
I think what's happening is because Google is
building in some of the stuffthat like, people would build in
Universal Analytics for custom,like custom, you know, custom
events for scrolling customevents for downloads. And also,
while also taking out likemaking making generic reports
(34:11):
that they used to have custom.
What I think is may be happeningis they may be moving towards
more of a business intelligencevibe than they are. Yeah.
Nels Jensen (34:26):
That's a really good way to put it. I like to
Unknown (34:29):
Because I think Google Analytics is realizing that the
power users are not necessarilyjust leaving the Google
Analytics data, you know, notjust using Google Analytics on
its own but using Google likepulling data out and and making
their own displays.
Joey Strawn (34:48):
Yeah, and then pointing people to those
analytics displays and usingthem as ongoing informational
pieces that they can use intheir daily marketing activity.
He's No, I agree. I think, youknow, we've talked a lot about
how it's going to look and howthat's going to transition, you
know, in, in the time we haveleft, what is it going to take
(35:12):
for people to change over? Imean, like, you know, we're
talking to people who may haveGoogle Analytics instances right
now. And they're thinking thatit's just going to update on on
its own. And they may belearning with listening to this
episode, that that's not thecase. Like, for people who just
have no analytics, or just haveGoogle Analytics set up on their
on their sites, what should theyprepare for when it comes to
(35:34):
changing over.
Nate Griffin (35:36):
So the first thing they will have to do is create a
separate GA for property. Okay,so all the properties every time
this happens, a new property hasto open up and the property is.
So you know, Google Analytics,the number you know, there's the
there's that number that's likeyou a hyphen, there's your
(35:58):
Number Number Number NumberNumber Number Number Number
hyphen, one. That's your GoogleAnalytics property. And that's
what tells Google Analytics togo, alright, I fired this code,
where am I going to put it, I'mgoing to put it in this property
over here, and it shows up. Andthat's what you log in and to
Google Analytics. And you see,every time they've done a
(36:20):
library update like this,they've had to create new
properties, because it's goingto someplace new, it's, it's,
it's a new program, callingsomething new. So create a GA
for property, they will nexthave to if they are using if
they have put the code. If theyhave hard coded the code on
(36:42):
their page, they will need toreplace the code the the GA and
analytics.js code for the G tag
Joey Strawn (36:52):
The snippet tag that applies,
Unknown (36:57):
They will need to apply the new Google Analytics
snippet. If they're using GoogleTag Manager, there will be a you
know you there will be a newcontainer. And it will, you'll
be able to click new tag, andthere'll be a new thing that
says Google Analytics GA fortracking, you will add a number
(37:19):
in there, that number beginswith a G. So it was G hyphen,
number,
Joey Strawn (37:24):
Okay, now you play anymore G hyphen, right?
Unknown (37:27):
If it doesn't begin with a G, you're adding the
wrong thing. And that's, that'skind of the first thing and but
the next part is, you know,adding goals, adding events,
adding reports that you're usedto seeing, you're gonna have to
(37:47):
redo all of that stuff. So ifyou see a, if you see a new
goal, or you know, you've gotsomething tagged as a goal,
you're gonna have to build allthat back in and into the GA for
property.
Joey Strawn (38:04):
So what I'm hearing is that it's basically as if,
imagine that your GoogleAnalytics tomorrow got erased,
what would you do to start andset up an entirely new one, so
you would go to GoogleAnalytics, you would set up a GA
for account, you would get theyou would put in your domain,
and they would give you alittle, you know, profile and
(38:25):
instance. And one of the firstthings will be giving you the
code or like if I know Googlegiving you the option to email
said code developer. And, andthen that's, and that's what you
would be adding to your GoogleTag Manager, you would add it in
the same way you would add anyother tag to your Google Tag
Manager. And then from thatpoint on, you would work inside
(38:48):
GA4 and that login instance, asopposed to the previous one,
Unknown (38:54):
right. Now, the other thing that's, you know, going
into predictive analytics thatwe're discussing, GA4 for can
go, ah, we see this is happeninga lot. Is this a conversion? You
know, it will it will kind ofput those little
Joey Strawn (39:12):
That's cool, then it'll kind of walk you through
how to get that conversiontracked in the system.
Nate Griffin (39:17):
Well, it may automatically track like,
especially if it's like a pageview,
Joey Strawn (39:21):
Like a thank you page or something.
Nate Griffin (39:23):
Yeah, if it's a thank you page, it'll go does is
would you consider this aconversion? And then you go,
yes, I would consider this aconversion. So that actually for
some listeners, yeah, itactually can find stuff for you
on that initial thing. Or now,you will want to, you know, you
(39:45):
don't want to rely 100% on
Joey Strawn (39:48):
Of course, anyone who's used Google Ads knows
this. It's like, recommendationsfor everything.
Nate Griffin (39:54):
Oh, I do want to bring up you will have to it's
easy. If you've got Google ads.
ads associated. If you've gotGoogle ads and universal,
connected, you can still connectGA for the same exact way. It'll
just, it'll email you have
Joey Strawn (40:12):
You have to connect it again, though.
Nels Jensen (40:14):
Yes. But it's pretty simple like, like, it's a
really simple thing is, youknow, you click the connect
button and then go. Alright,this is what you're logged into,
is this. Is this what you wantto connect? You don't have to
disconnect. Okay, universal, theUniversal Analytics tag?
Joey Strawn (40:31):
They do that for search console as well, I would
Nate Griffin (40:34):
Yes, yeah, you can do that for Search Console.
imagine.
Joey Strawn (40:34):
So none of that will be automatically connected
in the install, it willessentially like Google
universal, will have to beconnected on a one by one
instance.
Nate Griffin (40:42):
Yeah, but, and I may be wrong on this, it's been
10 years. So I think it used tobe, you could only have one
thing connected, like oneproperty. But now that they're
letting you now they're lettingyou do it simultaneously. So you
(41:04):
don't have to turn off. Youdon't have to turn off the
connection to UniversalAnalytics.
Nels Jensen (41:11):
You can what I've read, you can run them both in
parallel until they turn off UAon July 1, of 2023. Right? And
you know, so let's just talkabout incentives. This sounds
imposing, you might needresources, or you can ask for
people like us to help. Butthere is value in doing this
(41:31):
sooner than later and startingto build up your, you know, your
your historical data, if youwill, because yes, you'll be
able to save the data that youhad from Universal Analytics.
But it's not a year over yearcomparison, because it's a whole
new platform. So you know, don'tdelay, you know, this is
something you're you're betteroff doing sooner than than
(41:54):
later. Right. Easy for me to say
Joey Strawn (41:56):
You messed up the end of that now says don't delay
get GA4 for today. Yeah, firstkid on your block. Yeah. That's
what you meant to say. Yeah. Butno, no, I mean, Nate, would you
agree? Would you agree thatlike, even now, like, well, I
don't, I have until July 1, todo this, go ahead and get out
there and getting a property.
Unknown (42:16):
Now, if you don't have time, to get the one for one
instances, like or take somethat's gonna take some heavy
lifting. Or if you don't havetime to do that, at least get,
you know, data flowing into theGA for property now, because
then you will at least be ableto, you know, have enough of a
(42:38):
history, you know, even ifyou're not reporting on it, you
have enough of a history to go.
All right, I think I can seewhere some of the parallels are,
won't be, you know, you
Joey Strawn (42:50):
You only playing catch up as much as there's what
I hear.
Nate Griffin (42:53):
Yeah, or you won't be trapped in the house with a
giant stalker. I was trying toreally force the Halloween
metaphor, I'm sorry,
Joey Strawn (43:02):
It was really scary. And don't worry, it'll
keep coming back to haunt usyear after year after year. You
know that. And that's how youthat
Nels Jensen (43:12):
I know. I'm a lot older than you guys. But I
worked at a movie theater whenthe very first Halloween came
out. Jamie Lee Curtis was ababysitter. So that is
sunsetting, as well. So here weit is no, it's just sort of the
you know, we're closing a coupleof circles here.
Joey Strawn (43:29):
It's the circle of Halloween. And it's a circle of
data. And it's the circle ofGoogle and I donate thank you so
much for being here today andchatting through this. I know,
we like to get technical andnerdy off to the side. But you
know, really bringing this toour listeners attention is is
important. And I know that it'sout there, but whether or not
(43:52):
people have been payingattention to it, I hope they are
now so thank you for yourinsights and time today.
Nate Griffin (43:57):
They Thank you for having me. I was really trying
to rein myself in from goingcrazy deep dive because this is
this has been like my careersince you know, since since
Google Analytics started, youknow, I've been in it and like I
can you know, I love to nerd outon that stuff. So hopefully I
(44:21):
was you know, hopefully I was agood resource and wasn't too
dry.
Joey Strawn (44:26):
No, you're fantastic. Our listeners are
loving it.
Unknown (44:30):
Anytime you want to have like, if you think your
listeners would like a real deepdive and and this stuff, you
know and let me
Joey Strawn (44:38):
You know what you know what I'm gonna put this out
there for our listeners who wantto test Nate's mettle. Go ahead
and email us email us atpodcast@industrialmarketer.com.
I say this every episode thatyou send us your questions, send
us your topic ideas, things thatyou want us to talk about on the
show. But if you have a questionabout Google Analytics GOOG, GA4
(44:58):
for implementation had ahistory, whatever, email us and
we'll put Well, if we get enoughof them, we'll get Nate back and
put his test his metal.
Nels Jensen (45:06):
Yeah. And if and if the subject matter today is
Sunday just a little bit scary,you know, then you know if
you're not into Google TagManager and and you're not sure
that you're capable of doingthis then you know what, come by
ring our doorbell and we'll havea treat for you. Okay.
Joey Strawn (45:25):
Yes. And also email us and ask us to help because
this is something that we do andwe are helping people with these
transitions so we're happy totalk to you about it. But as
always, thank you so much forlistening to the industrial
Marketer Podcast you know,subscribe to the episodes if you
haven't already. Follow us onsocial media make all of your
(45:46):
trick or treaters listenactually put us on speaker as
the trick or treaters are comingaround, out. That'll work. It is
there'll be horrifying for them.
And I and we want to be part ofyour community as well. So like
I said, emails thatpodcast@industrialmarketer.com
If you have questions for us, ifyou want to be a part of the
show, and we are looking forwardto the next time that we get to
(46:07):
chat about all of this world ofindustrial marketing and how
much we love it and all of theopportunities that it has for
us. So thank you guys very much.
Happy Halloween, and until nexttime, have a good one.
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