IGP Album Review: Michael Jackson - Bad

Michael Jackson has produced some of the greatest music in the past 100 years. Over the years, the Infectious Groove Podcast has reviewed many Michael Jackson albums including Thriller, HIStory and Invincible. This week, we focus on the 1987 follow up to Thriller, Bad. Our friend Garrett from The EverTrending Story Podcast sits in with us as we talk through our review. We talk about the songs, the vocals, the short films and more. It's Season 8, Episode 12 of the Infectious Groove Podcast!

Episode Transcript

(00:01):
It's the Infectious Groove Podcast, partof the Odd Pods Media network. Recorded
from Detroit, Michigan and Jacksonville,Florida, The Infectious Groove Podcast is your
source for Jammie Jams album reviews andthe best in depth music discussion. Thanks
for joining us. Now here areyour hosts. Hello, Welcome to the

(00:24):
Infectious Group Podcast. My name isRuss. I will be your host for
this week. Michelle has the weekoff because, as everyone knows, she
can only put thought and effort intothe podcast every other week, so which
we understand, we get it,we understand, we feel blessed and honored
for the time that she she doesgive us, So I will be taking
you through this episode this week.This episode will be an album review.

(00:46):
It is my pick and I realizedthat there were two Michael Jackson albums that
we hadn't reviewed in the time thatthis show has been out, and one
of them happens to be my secondfavorite Michael Jackson album. So the second
half of the episode, after weget our normal segments, will be a
review of the Michael Jackson album Badand helping me out with that. So
I'm not just sitting here talking tomyself about how great I think this album

(01:08):
is. Is a friend of oursfrom a podcast that we love that also
happens to be part of the OddPods media network. We've got our friend
Garrett from the Ever Training Story podcast. How are you doing? Brother?
Doing well? How are you dude? Not too bad? Not too bad
at all. I've got a hecticweek going between and between the time we're
recording this and the time the episodecomes out, all of the hectic things

(01:29):
that I've been preparing for will havehappened, you know. But like,
yeah, but I'm you know,in the prep stages while this is being
recorded. So, but Garrett's podcastyou have heard us talk about on the
show several times, not only becausehe leaves a lot of feedback for us
regarding our show, but we've alwaystalked about his show. And in short,

(01:49):
they have what I personally think isgot to be the most original idea
of going on in all the podcasting. So if you would, Garrett,
tell everybody, if they tune intothe Ever Training Story podcast, what are
they going to hear? You aregoing to hear myself and my co host
Frankie. What we do is weperuse the news and trending topics of the
store, and we find certain onesthat sound fun and catchy, and what

(02:13):
we do is we will spin thoseinto a fictional story that we write using
a randomized genre. And it takes, like, you know, fifteen twenty
minutes to get through a story whenwe're reading it, but yeah, we
just we fit those those trends intothe stories as we see fit. And
I like it a lot because,first of all, like I said,
I think it's an incredibly original idea. And second of all, if you've

(02:38):
clicked on any news story lately,you're probably under the impression that the world
is ending and everything is awful,and Garrett and Frankie have found a way
to put a little bit of apositive spin, in a fun spin,
on some of the things that aregoing on in the news. So as
you listen to this episode, ifyou hear Garrett talking and you like what
he's got to say, then justknow that when you tune into his podcast,

(02:59):
you're going to hear a whole differentball of wax. But it is
quite original and quite fun, Somake sure to check out the Ever Trending
Story podcast on our show. Here. The last couple of things that we've
covered. We've got feedback from thelast couple of things that have gone out
on our air waves, one ofwhich was the episode we did of the
epic cover battle between ever Clear andVan Morrison for the song Brown Eyed Girl.

(03:21):
Then we had recently a YouTube videocome out about a lot of different
hit songs that sound alike. Sowe've got some feedback to share from both
of those things. Leave that joke, worry about that right. Our friend
Sean and Chris from the Dad andRock podcast said that they had never heard
the Ever Clear version of Brown EyedGirl before and couldn't make it through it,

(03:44):
so they preferred the Van Morrison versionin spades. But it could just
be for nostalgia reasons. So andI get that. I get it.
I mean, I like multi versionsthat went on about that and in great
detail last week, But you know, it's not It's certainly not for everybody.
And I could also see a somebodylistened to it now it having a
totally different impact than when it cameout. On the other side of the
coin we have, our friend Sethwrote in and said another great podcast Michelle

(04:06):
Gun and Michelle I hadn't heard theEver Clear version and holy crap, it
had me hooked from the opening acappellaevery clear ever. Claire managed to make
the song so much better and madeit their own style. So you know,
you have two different people there whohad never heard the song before,
once that they couldn't stomach it,and the other said they had it had
hooked from the beginning, so youknow it happens. We did a YouTube

(04:27):
video about hit songs that sound thesame, and without spoiling the whole video,
the type of thing I'm talking aboutis Stay with Me by Sam Smith.
How it pretty much sounds exactly likeI Won't Back Down by Tom Petty
and that you know, that's thetype of thing we're talking about. So
we had our friend Jamie Porter Leftto comment on the video and said,
my favorite is twenty five or sixto four by Chicago Babe, I'm Gonna

(04:48):
Leave You by Zeppelin, brain stewby Green Day. All have the same
chord progression as while my guitar gentlyweeps by the Beatles. So it's a
lot of songs that are all thesame. This is something a viewer Matt
Left to comment, This says nicesubject. Is it just me or does
anyone here part of the Munsters themein Billie Ilish Bad Guy, which I

(05:08):
had never thought about before until heleft that comment, and I was like,
oh, I can totally hear thatnow, so that's interesting. Viewer
named Melvin wrote in and said,one interesting aspect about the Tom Petty red
out Chili Pepper sound like that Idon't hear talked a lot about both songs
were produced by Rick Rubin. Ialways wonder if he was involved in writing
both tracks uncredited, and if thathad something to do with the lack of

(05:30):
public comment from both the artists,which is very that's possible. I mean,
yeah, it's something I've never thoughtabout before, but you know why
not, right, Yeah, yeah, it's very very possible. A viewer
Time wrote in and said, anothergreat video I just played while why Don't
You Get a Job, and almoststarted laughing out loud at how similar it
is by to Obladeblo Dot. Anotherone that's bothered me for years now that

(05:54):
I haven't seen management mentioned anywhere elseis four nine Blinds, What's Up?
And Bonnie mcphair Don't Worry Be Happy? Way too similar to be a coincidence,
and I haven't seen anyone on anythingonline where anybody has addressed their similarity,
and that's one that I didn't That'sanother one I didn't think about.
I've known both of those songs foryears, and then when they left that
comment, I was like, oh, yep, yep, they'll certainly self

(06:16):
Yeah, yeah they do. Sowe do have for a little while longer.
We have a brand new podcast episodecoming out every Monday. But then
over on Infectious Group of Music onYouTube, we have three YouTube videos coming
out every single week Tuesday, Thursday, and Saturday. And those videos are
all five to ten minute little shortsnippet videos featuring myself in some videos,
and myself and Lauren from the beardAl podcasting others. So make sure that

(06:41):
you're subscribed to that if you arenot, so that has been some of
the feedback that we have had.If you leave a comment on for the
podcast or on YouTube, we willmore than likely read it on the show
for you. Moving right along ourJimmy Oh Jamie James as a segment where
we talk about what we've been listeningto and why and what we think you
should listen to. And for me, I've got three straight rock tracks this

(07:04):
week. Two of them are brandnew but one of them is pretty old
now, coming up, I thinkon twenty five years or so old.
But it's a great cut that Igot reminded of this week, And actually
I'll start with that one first.So when Guns and Roses like broke up
pretty much in the mid nineties,like around three ninety four, pretty much

(07:27):
the whole world always goes on abouthow we never got any more Guns and
Roses until the Chinese Democracy album cameout in two thousand and eight, but
a lot of people forget that theydid put out one single song on the
end of Day's soundtrack, and thesong is called Oh My God, and
it is killer. Like I hatedit the song when I first heard it,
but I hated when I first heardit. I mean for like the

(07:50):
first two years that it was out. I was like, no, absolutely
not. And for some reason,it grew on me along the way.
And my son and I were actuallyhaving a text conversation the other day where
he mentioned it offhand and I waslike, oh man, what a jam.
I haven't listened to that in awhile. And as soon as it
started, I was hooked on it. So that went into my rotation for
this week, and then The othertwo songs that I've been listening to are
by the same band. And I'vetalked about this a few times over the

(08:13):
past month or so, but theband Extreme, to the average listener,
the band who has known for justmore than Words, does a lot of
music that is a lot different thanthe song More than Words. They have
a brand new album coming out inJune, and they've released three songs from
the album now and the two latestthat just came out. One's called Rebel
and one's called Banshee, and theyare just great, hard rocking songs.

(08:35):
There are songs in the style thatI love by Extreme, which is everything
else they did besides More Than Words, and I can't wait for the rest
of that record to come out.So I'm super pumped for the album.
And I usually don't listen to morethan one or two singles from an artist
when their album is coming out,but it's been since two thousand and eight

(08:56):
since Extreme put an album out,so I'm kind of starved, you know.
Yeah. Yeah, and all threeof the songs that they put out
kick ass, so yeah, soit's like, well again, yeah,
I'm not gonna hold back. I'mjust gonna listen you know. So that's
the three that I've been listening to. Oh My God, My Guns N'
Roses, Banshee and Rebeled by ExtremeGarrett. What have you r, Jamie

(09:18):
jamspen Well, I have not hadtoo much time for music lately, just
because most of my days caught upwith with podcasting at work and stuff.
But a couple of the ones thatI've been just really digging lately. I
don't know where this one like camefrom, but it randomly just popped in
my head and I'm like, Iwonder if I if I still like that
song. It's called still Fly.I don't remember exactly what the name of
the group is. I'll make sureI get that to you, an old

(09:41):
school rap song. I think Birdman'spart of it. It's just a fun
driving one. And where I livein North Dakota there is no more snow
on the ground for the most part, and it's like sunny out, so
it's like good driving music to kindof cruising ye, which we've been missing
for you know, nine months now. And then another one that I recently

(10:01):
discovered is one of my co workerstold me that day Las Soul just recently
let all of their music onto streaming. Yes, sir, Yeah, I
didn't know too much of their stuff, but I dove in head first and
I've just been enjoying it. Andone of them that's really just got my
attention is a song called Rock CocaineFlow with m F Doom. Holy shit,

(10:22):
that song is a killer, man. I can't get over how good
that one is. Yeah. Therecord most people know off the top of
their head by day La Soul isthe breakthrough three ft high and rising,
but they put out a record.Jeez, I don't know. I want
to say I'm probably gonna be wrongon this, but I feel like within
the past five years, and Ithink that that is off the record that
you're talking about. The grind dateis what the album's called. Yeah,

(10:48):
Yeah, Yeah, I don't know. It's just a I love the beat
that's in it. It kind ofgoes up and down between each artist and
MF Doom and there's always always atreat when you get to hear and then
the last one has just got mehooked. And unfortunately it's one of those
things that came from TikTok. ButI this song is one of the most

(11:09):
positive, just awesome songs I thinkI've ever heard it's called If I Were
a Fish, and it is sucha fun song, and the reason that
it was written and just how bigthe song has gotten over the last like
two weeks is inspirational, and it'salso just a hell of a fun song
to listen to and sing along with. Is there? This is a Grandpa

(11:31):
moment for me where I the onlyI should In the interest of full disclosure,
I'm not at all against TikTok,nor am I against any way that
artists can get noticed or blow up, you know what I mean, like
any way that artists can. However, the only time I ever used TikTok
is when Michelle sends me TikTok's.In ninety percent of the time, it's
some of these baby falling down orsomething. That's what Michelle sends me,

(11:54):
you know. So I generally don'tpick up new music on there, but
I don't even know how it works. Do they have the artist listed for
who it is or is it justsomeone who happened to get a ton of
views or it's I think this personactually is kind of an indie artist that
started on there and just kept puttingtheir music out and eventually just you know,
it gets picked up. Um,I know, they just like recorded

(12:16):
an official version to put that outon Friday. There's a couple other musicians
I've found too, where one guywas trying to write this song and he
was putting his like progression through it, and all of a sudden he's like,
Hey, I'm heading to LA torecord this song, and it's just
like, I don't know, It'sit's crazy how all that stuff just blows
up because of the attention it getsthrough through TikTok yep. And I don't,
like I say, I don't youknow. I know We've had plenty

(12:37):
of moments on the show over thepast three years where I very much sound
like get off my lawn, youknow, as far as like music,
and but I don't have any problemwith that. Man. To me,
it's like it's just it's an expedientversion of what used to happen back in
the day. Like you know,like when the artist that me and you
grew up on, it was ayou know, two three four year process
for like the right person to hearthem, and then the right amount of

(12:58):
people hear and then them to buildup. Like now that stuff can be
instantaneous. So it's not I don'thate the game or the player in this
instance. It's just times have changedand it's great. And my thing is,
I think a lot of people puttoo much stock into like the people
who are mad about this stuff puttoo much stock into like this doesn't take
away from what you are, likelike Okay, I'm a huge Floyd fan,

(13:20):
right, or like say let's saysomeone's a huge Zuplin fan. This
be becoming popular right here, rightnow does not mean that there's not space
for you to still love those classicartists that you did, you know what
I mean? Right, yep.So I just think that the people that
get upset over this type of stuffblowing up, I really don't think you
have a leg stand it. It'slike, it's not like they came in
your house and took your Zeppelin recordsand they're like, this is all you

(13:41):
get now, you know what Imean? Yeah? Yeah, like you
said, it's just a different wayto go about it, and you know,
if it works, it works,and if it doesn't, then you
know, just move on to thenext one. Yeah, just literally you
can just slide onto the next thing, and you do. You don't you're
not forced to listen to it,so, but that segment is always popular
on the show exactly the reason thatyou just heard. We have. Usually

(14:03):
I have a little bit more diversityin what I'm listening to, but this
week it's just like, Nope,this is just straight rock stuff. But
Garrett definitely brought the diversity. Andwe always have the Infectual Screw Podcast playlist
on Spotify that we will have theJamie Jams and Garrett and I were listening
to, as well as the entiretyof the album that we are about to
review, speaking of which we're goingto take a quick break from when we

(14:24):
come back. Garrett is going tosit in with me while we walk through
a review of Michael Jackson Bad,one of easily one of the most popular
records in the history of the music, and we'll go through everything about it
when we come back. You arelistening to the Infectual Screw podcast on the
Odd Pods Media Network. Hey youthere, We've got a question for you.

(14:54):
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(16:00):
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We interview politicians, journalists, activists, and others who share their experiences in
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from the Infectious Group podcast and I'mNot Alone. I've got with me this

(16:48):
week Garrett from the over Trending Storypodcast, who you've probably heard his ad
playtime and again on the show herein between when we take breaks, and
they are part of the Odd Podsmedia network, so you should see retweets
and interaction going back and forth betweenus and them on Twitter all the time,
so if you're looking to follow themon socials, it will be real
easy to do. Garrett is sittingin with me to go through another one

(17:11):
of our album reviews, and overthe past three years on the show,
in one form or another, wehave talked about some of my favorite Michael
Jackson albums and it came back aroundtime for me to pick the album for
review, and I realized that wehadn't picked one of my favorite Michael Jackson
albums yet we hadn't discussed it infull, so I figured why not do
that now? So having said that, we are going to discuss Michael Jackson

(17:32):
Bad. This album was released onAugust thirty first, nineteen eighty seven.
It is they follow up to theinsanely successful Thriller album from nineteen eighty two.
To give you an idea of thekind of success we're talking about with
Bad, this album sold two pointtwo five million copies in its first week
of sales in the US alone,and in case you are wondering where that's

(17:52):
at now, it is up toover thirty five million copies of this record
has been sold. And to putthat into perspective, there are artists who
go their entire career with their entirecatalog not selling thirty five million copies.
Yeah. Yeah, this is thefirst album in history to have five straight
number one singles. There were sixtop ten singles from the record, and
actually there was a seventh single releasedcalled Another Part of Me, and that

(18:17):
one reached number eleven. So youknow, with the asterisk of all asterisks.
It was six top ten singles insteadof seven, and the Yeah the
seventh came in at number eleven.Globally, this remains Michael Jackson's second best
selling album, with Michael Jackson's Thrillerof course, being the best selling album
of all time by anyone ever,not just Michael Jackson, but by anyone

(18:42):
ever. The only album that's evenever in the discussion with Thriller as far
as album sold is Sometimes there's companiesout there that try and do creative math
and say that the Eagles' greatest hitshas sold more copies, but every time
the actual math is done, they'relike, no, really, it's Thriller
that's sold more copies. So wealways ask the person who chose the record

(19:03):
for us, why did they choosethis record for us? And of course
I have reasons for that. Firstof all, there's only two Michael Jackson
albums between Thriller and the last albumthat he released when we before he passed
that we have not reviewed on theshow, one of which is this one
bad and the other is Dangerous,And I don't have anything against Dangerous.

(19:26):
As a matter of fact, Dangeroushas my personal favorite Michael Jackson song on
the album. But with History beingmy favorite Michael Jackson album, the second
half of History from Scream to Smile, with that being my favorite Michael Jackson
album, Bad is easily my secondfavorite Michael Jackson album. So I don't
know how we didn't get around tocovering it by now, is you know,

(19:48):
kind of I'm just surprised. Andthen as a side note, this
is the only tour that I evergot to see Michael Jackson in concert on
was the Bad Tour, So that'skind of an another thing that anchors this
is a big favorite for me too. That's awesome. He was absolutely incredible,
Like if you if you can go, you can go on YouTube and
see there's some really good pro shotfootage from that tour, and it's just

(20:11):
astounding. The dude was The dudewas on fire. Yeah, absolutely at
the peak of his abilities. Sowhat we do when we do our album
reviews, we go through each myselfand Garrett will go through and tell you
what we think the best tracks onthe record are more or less our favorite
tracks on the record. We willthen go through We have a category called
Stinkers and basically just songs that weyou know, don't like. It doesn't

(20:33):
have to be the worst song ever, but its songs we don't like,
and believe it or not, Ido have at least one on this record.
And we'll go through some open discussionpoints, some things that I want
to talk about with the record,some things Garrett might want to bring up.
Then we round out a review bysaying if we personally would buy this
record, if we recommend that youbuy it, and then we give it
a rating of one to ten,with ten being the best. So as

(20:55):
far as best tracks go, Ihave talked a ton about this record already,
So Garrett, I'm gonna throw itover to you first. You know,
for me, it's like with thisrecord, it's like, well,
you know, you can almost readoff the track list and say, okay,
well those are the best best tacks, right, but you know,
do what you can, man,take it. I was initially just going
to say yes when you asked meto name off the favorite tracks, because

(21:18):
I'll be honest, I never reallygot into Michael Jackson too much as a
as a youth, but as I'vegotten older, I've learned to, you
know, appreciate more of his music. This was honestly my first time going
through this entire album. Yeah yeah, I get that night on the show
My Wife the full disclosure. Mywife's just heard this album and it's entirely
like a week ago for the firsttime ever, and I'm really disappointed I

(21:41):
waited this long. I guess theother side of that too, is you
know, I went through and startall the ones that i'd heard before,
and it was half the album.Yeah. Yeah, so it's like I
missed it. I just didn't hearthe full potential of it. But I
mean there's there's so many just goodones. I mean, the Way You
Make Me Feel, I truly thinkthat's probably the best one on the album.

(22:03):
It is such a jam ship.I mean, you can't go wrong
with Smooth Criminal. Actually a funfact about that, the first time I
ever heard that song was from alienAnt Farm, and then when I heard
that Michael Jackson was the original person, I was like. I told my
friends at school because I'm like,hey, did you know he did this?
And they're like, yep, weknew that I was in the Yeah.

(22:26):
They're like, well, we wereliving on Earth when it came out,
so yeah, yeah, I mean, man in the Mirror is such
a great song. I mean,I mean that's pretty good too. I
wish it wasn't the title track,but we can get more into that later.
Yeah, I mean just the wholething was just just great, just
great. Yeah. I I pairedup with you on a few that you
mentioned. The way you made mefeel. I think it's ridiculous. It's
it's it's so good. It's justholy cow. What a jam. Liberian

(22:52):
Girl, I think is a beautifulsong. And actually those two songs we're
going to touch when we get toopen discussion. I want to talk a
little bit about the short films fromthis album, which I generally like to
focus on just the album when we'redoing an album review, but those two
short films in particular have a coupleof things I want to point out.
Another part of me I think isbrilliant. Man in the Mirror. I

(23:15):
mean, this guy MJ had somany anthems earth song, we Are the
World, Heal the World. Andthen you know, if you're gonna be
known for just one, I'll takeMan in the Mirror all day, every
day. Yeah. Dirty Diana Ithink is insanely good. Yeah, what
a jam. Side note, theguitarist on that is Steve Stevens, who

(23:37):
is mostly known for playing with BillyIdol. So if you've heard White Wedding
Rebel yell Idols version of Money Money, that's the same cat playing guitar album.
And then now, the one songthat's weird on this record is because
when it was originally released, thealbum ended with Smooth Criminal, but then
they very soon after they added thesong leave Me Alone for obvious and unfortunate

(24:00):
reasons, because the tabloids and themedia had pretty much already started beating MJ
down, which to this day hasn'tstopped even though he left the earth.
They can't stop help themselves with beatinghim up all the time. Yea,
but I love that song too.It's a fantastic, fantastic jam. When
we get to open discussion, there'sa thing I want to mention about the

(24:21):
song that could have been there insteadof that one. But it's a it's
a great song. So as faras sneakers go, like I say,
I do have one, and Ihave tried so hard to love this song.
I have, I really have.I've tried so hard, and then
you know, at one point youhave to realize that you can't, in

(24:42):
my opinion, you can't force yourselfto like something like you, you know
what I mean, Like it eitherreaches out and it touches you or it
doesn't. Right, Yeah, Andokay, you know, obviously you have
Michael Jackson on the song, andthen on top of that, Stevie Wonder
is on this track, and it'slike Stevie Wondering Michael Jackson are on the
same track, and I don't likeit, then this must be user error,

(25:03):
you know what I mean, Likeit's it's got to be me right,
But the song just good friends,man, I cannot get I tried
again the other night when Lauren andI were listening to it straight through,
and I even did the thing whereI didn't say anything to her before the
song, you know, like Iwas like, okay, if she starts
bopping right like, then it's youknow what I mean, then like it's
me. And it was the onlysong during the whole thing too, where

(25:27):
she was kind of like, ah, I could take her leave that,
and I was like I know,right, you know, so wait,
wait where do you stand on it? Did you have any notes on that
song? Like? Is it trulyuser error? Do you like that song
or is that one that didn't stickout to you? So I took notes
on on every every song, andthe only notes I wrote for that one

(25:47):
is I like it, but I'mconfused. On the title. I didn't
put any like love hat. Itwas just kind of very mid for me.
Yeah, And when I was like, because the music program I was
using didn't tell me it was StevieWonder. I don't know if that if
he was left off intentionally or not, but I was like, who's this
other guy singing with them? AndI mean I liked it, but there
I don't know it just lyrically itwas. It was weird to me as

(26:11):
well, but I wouldn't skip it. And that's the thing is a lot
of the record has even like likeBurying Girl and I just can't stop loving
you are the lightest of the fairon the record, right, And what
you said those lyrics are very definitive, you know, like he's like,
you know, like like Burying Girl, you came and you change my world,
just like in the movies, likethis is a you know, a

(26:33):
very deep, big love they've gotbetween them, right, and I just
can't stop loving you. That's likethe top of the mountain as far as
like passionate lyrics, and then JustGood Friends is like, ah, you're
here and I'm here, right,you know, So maybe that that might
be a very observational point that youmade, where maybe that's it. The
rest of the record is so passionateand has something to say that this is

(26:55):
the one song where I'm like,well, if you don't know how you
feel about this, then I thenwhy should I? Yeah, And I
mean as far as like stinkers go, I did write one, and I
just wrote stinker potential because I kindof like you with with Just Good Friends.
I tried to give this one acouple of different chances, and every
time I listened to it, Iwas just like, not this one ain
for me? And I feel ashamedto say this now, but it's actually

(27:17):
Liberian Girl. Really yeah, Icould well, I will tell you that
that was one of the last songson the record that I came to love.
It took me a while love it. Now. I genuinely love the
song, but for years I wasvery much like I could do without that,
you know, Yeah, I justwrote what a weird love song?

(27:38):
Name her? At least instead ofjust continuously referring to a Liberian girl.
Yeah, that's true. And thenI said her audio feels out of place,
but the music is good, andthat that was kind of just something.
I mean, this whole album,if it was just like instrumentals,
I mean, you could listen tothis whole thing and just enjoy every second
of it. I think every songhas just a great sound owned to it.

(28:00):
Yeah, oh no, I totallyagree. Yeah. And what's funny
is if you you know, Iwould expect anybody to do this kind of
deep research, but this is somethingyou can do when you have time.
Is if you go on YouTube,there's tons of videos about the isolated vocals
and master tracks and stuff for thisrecord. And a lot of the percussion
that you're hearing on all these songsis MJ. So like he's like,

(28:25):
yeah, he's like using his bodyto add to the percussion of the songs
before you even worry about his mainvocal. So if you listen, if
you go to YouTube and you justkind of look for it doesn't even matter
what tracks Smooth Criminal. If youjust put in like Smooth Criminal isolated tracks
or Liberian Girl isolated tracks or whatever, you will be astounded by how much

(28:45):
of the percussion that MJ did forthese tracks. And then of course it's
obvious on first listen when you hearthe songs, like he's doing all of
his own backups and all of hisown harmonies and everything. It's insane,
just such a talented dude to justbe doing all that and just killing it
with every every facet of it.And he's just killing it. Yeah.
Yeah, there's a so the younglady that sings the duet I just can't

(29:10):
stop loving you. Her name isSayeda Garrett and she wrote A Man in
the Mirror as well, So she'syou know, she's she's pretty darn talented.
Yeah, And there is there isa video of her available on the
internet that I absolutely love, andit it's her talking about when people say
that Michael Jackson wasn't a musician quoteunquote wasn't a musician because he didn't play

(29:33):
a traditional instrument, right, Andthere's a quote from her, and you
got you gotta go watch this clipbecause it's hilarious just to see her.
But she's like, she's like,he didn't play the instrument, but he
knew what he wanted to hear.And he knew the melody, and if
he didn't play it like he toldyou to play it, he keeps singing
it until you did. God damnit. It's very very, very cool.

(29:59):
And it's like this is coming fromthe young lady that's saying on I
just can't stop loving you, andwrote man in the mirror, so she
knows what she's talking about. Yea, yeah. So anyways, yeah,
it's it's really just a fantastic recordacross the board. So let's get into
some open discussion on the matter.I've got a couple of things I want
to mention on it, and I'msure you have at least a couple of
things that you'd like to bring up. I know you said you had other

(30:21):
notes for other songs too, soI don't want to just discount, you
know, what you have in yournotes. One general observation I want to
say is, and I touched onthis in the intro to the record,
some these sales numbers are insane.Absolutely absolutely. The fact that you even
said, like, you know,some artists will go their whole, you
know, musical career and just noteven like come close to what he did

(30:42):
with just the one is insane.Yeah, it's absolutely insane. Now here's
one thing that I think a lotof people will take issue with. And
you know, when you're coming offof any huge success, if you're Pink
Floyd trying to follow up The DarkSide of the Moon, if your Deaf
Leppard trying to follow up Hysteria.Like you, whatever your huge success is,

(31:03):
you always are gonna have this gargantuanweight on your shoulders. Well,
imagine that you're following up Thriller.For Christ's sake, it's like the largest
selling record of all time, youknow. And and yeah, like every
man, woman, and child onthe Earth is dressed as you you know,
like this is a big thing tofollow up this album. To me,

(31:26):
doesn't sound like he's trying to outdoThriller, like it just this is
just sounds like, oh and Ialso make all of this music as well.
M Do you get that? Okay? I'm not alone in that right,
No, No, definitely not.It just it just feels like he's
like, you know, if peoplelike this, I've got all of this
to share with you. So let'sjust like he's, like you said,

(31:48):
he's not trying to one up himselfevery time he's just just continuously just sharing
what but he's capable of, right, which just happens to be more and
better than what most others capable of. You know. Now, one thing
I want to dial back and touchyou. You said you had some thoughts
on the title cut, and Iwant to say this. What's funny is
the very first single off of thisrecord was the song that I've already been

(32:12):
complimentary about, the ballad I JustCan't Stop Loving You. When you know,
waiting what seemed like in the eighties, five years an eternity as a
kid waiting for the follow up toThriller, The first thing I ever heard
off of this record was the songI Just Can't Stop Loving You, and
I did not like it. WhenI first heard it, I was like,
oh, this is no I've waitedforever, you know, And it

(32:34):
was probably just because it was aballad and yeah, you know, I
don't know. And there was noshort film to go with it either,
which you had been used to bythat time, like oh, with Michael
Jackson's songs, comes at a shortfilm, you know. But then Bad
I remember clearly seeing like the twentyminute short film that went with Bad and
everything and I my first impression waswhen they do that slow camera angle around

(32:57):
him when he first shows up,when it turns from black and white,
I was like, oh man,what an haplete titled album, and so
holy shit, he looks bad ashell, right, But yeah, I
remember being like, ah, butI just this song is just okay though,
like, and it's growing over theyears. I like the song a
lot more now, but I rememberbeing like, oh no, the first
two songs to come from this record, I just think are okay. Yeah,

(33:22):
you know yeah. When I firstbooted this album up, I was
I was, honestly, this isthis is funny. I was kind of
disappointed that the song wasn't fat byWeird album, right, Yeah, yeah,
because I knew that one, youknow, way more than bad.
And I mean, it's a greatway to start the album, Like the
way that the song starts, It'sa great way to introduce the album.

(33:45):
And then my my main complaint withit is is it the ending. It
just overstated this welcome just a bit. Yeah. Yeah, I'm not a
huge fan of when when they justdo that repetitious thing at the end just
just either fade out quickly or justhit a note just be done, right.
I get what you mean. Yeah, I mean honestly, you know,
looking at all the tracks that areon this, if it would have

(34:06):
been you know, either Man inthe Mirror or The Way You Make Me
Feel, as like the title track, I think that would have fit better.
Just with how much I liked thesongs on here, right, either
of those songs would have been abetter choice for me. I see what
you're saying. One thing I willsay is that I regarding weird Al,
there's two things that I love aboutthe weird Al parody and everything that comes

(34:28):
with it. One the outro ofbad where Michael does all of the the
ad libs and whatnot and the wholeworld has to answer right now. I
love that weird Al turns those intothe fat jokes where he's like, when
I say it around the house,I at least say it around the house,
you know. Oh, that's alwayskilled me from the first time that
I heard it. And also it'sworth noting. And I don't know if

(34:49):
you know this, A lot ofpeople don't know this. If you ever
watched the video for Fat, ifyou notice a incredibly striking resemblance between the
sets for the videos that's because notonly he did Michael Jackson give weird Al
permission to do fat, he gavehim the set from the bad video.
I love that. I love thatyou've mentioned that. I think you're on

(35:09):
your show or on Lauren Show before, but it's still such a such a
fantastic thing. You just I lovethat he just embraced weird Al just doing
his stuff. He's like, yeah, of course you can just you know,
do this and make it just lookextra cool. Yeah. I can't
even imagine how much money. Youknow, it costs something to make sure
that set was left up. Youknow, for weird Al, you use

(35:30):
it, and for an artist,you know, you take. Weird Al
doesn't have to ask permission to dohis parodies, but he does, right.
And I wouldn't doubt if that hitplayed into it too, with MJ's
decision of being like, you knowwhat, this is a good guy,
you know what I mean like andthen and Michael Jackson was historic for his
sense of humor and the fact thathe loved to be teased, so I'm

(35:51):
sure he was like, well,this is the only guy that's got the
balls to poke fun at what I'mdoing. Then have at it, you
know. Yeah, yep, anotherthing and this is off top pick from
the record, and it's probably morefor you, Garrett than anybody else.
Is when I mentioned the song leaveMe Alone was added to the record,
there is as it's on streaming ifyou listen to the Bad twenty five version.

(36:13):
There is a song that was almoston this record, and it's a
song called street Walker that I almosttotally cheated and told you to listen to
that too, because that's how muchI love this song. Okay, oh
man, it is a jam andlike I me personally, I would put
it up there with the Way YouMake Me Feel Dirty Diana, like I
think it's of that caliber. Yeah, it bums me out that it got

(36:37):
left off the record. So Iwould just recommend you and anybody listening to
this album to this podcast that hasn'tmaybe hasn't heard the song Streetwalker by Michael
Jackson cool for years. It wouldhave had to have been one of those
things where I'm like, well,I'll burn it on a CD or put
it in a drop box and giveit to you or whatever. But now
it's it's on streaming. Now it'son it's part of the Bad twenty five

(36:57):
sets. You can just go toSpotify check it out and see what you
think. I think it's it's sucha jam and I wish it was on
this record. The only other thingI wanted to point out, and it
was I wanted to talk about twospecifically, or else we're going to be
here all night. The short filmsfrom this album are insanely good. I
think they're on par with or betterthan the short films from Thriller. And
that's saying a lot. Okay,I think I've only honestly seen bad.

(37:21):
You need to check more out.You've for sure seen smooth criminal Man,
the Lean, the White Suit,the Gangster. Oh yep, yep,
Yeah, no, I've seen thattoo. That's for sure got to be
the only two I've seen. Though, Now, I'll be honest with you,
there are some like Man in theMirror is there's I don't think there's
any footage of MJ and it.It's all um the troubles of the world,

(37:43):
like things we need to take alook at, starving children, bombing
and whatnot. It's all news footage, okay. Another part of Me is
a concert film. It's all justfootage from I believe the European leg of
the tour, which I mean isgreat, but it's not there's no like,
you know, it's not a messagein a short film type thing.
It's really it's the closest to justa music video that MJ does. Dirty

(38:07):
Diana is a also a concert,but it's not. It wasn't shot at
actual MJ concerts. It's just kindof like a staged um. This woman,
the character from the song is prowlingaround backstage and this MJ concert is
happening. But the tune that Iwanted to talk about specifically is one the
way you make me feel. Man. If you like that song, you

(38:28):
are gonna love the short film forit. You talk about the peak of
cool man. He's standing he's standingout in the street, and before the
song even starts, this, uh, this young lady that he's gonna be
singing too in the in the videokind of passes him on the street like
he's nothing okay, and he justkind of looks like, are you kidding
me? You know, like,who the fuck? You know what I

(38:50):
mean, and he goes this isbefore the song even starts. He goes,
hey, and everything, every everyoneand everything on the street stops including
her. He walks, he circlesaround here a couple of times, and
acapella, he goes, you knockme off from my feed now baby,
and then the beats of the songkicks in. It is so cool,
oh man, Yeah, it isso cool. Like it. Trust me,

(39:12):
when you watch the video for thatsong, you'll love it. Do
that as soon as we're done recordingnow. And then here's the other thing.
And this is why I think helpedLiberian Girl grow on me. It's
because of the short film that goeswith it. So the short film for
a Liberian Girl. I want tomake sure I don't overstate this. It
has um everyone who's ever been famousin it. Literally every person who's ever

(39:37):
been famous is in this video.And it's a time capsule, right because
the video came out in eighty sevenor eighty eight. So you have Brigitte
Nielsen and Sylvester Salone, you haveCarl Weathers, you have Jasmine Guy,
John Travolta a living in and JohnSteven Spielberg is in this short film.
I mean literally everybody weird weird Oulis in Michael Jackson's short film for this.

(40:01):
Literally everybody who's was famous at thetime is in this video. And
there's no storyline or anything to thevideo, like the girl from the song,
it's just the songs just playing inthe background. But the whole video
is all of these super famous peopleall arguing with each other about who's the
most famous and who's the one who'sgonna quote star in the m video.

(40:23):
Right. And then at the endof the video, the camera swoops around
and it's been MJ has been sittingthere filming all of these celebrities arguing with
each other the whole time, right, So yeah, and then and the
only reason Weird is in the videois because a bunch of celebrities run over
and they see him from behind becausehe's in his he's got his hair done

(40:43):
like the cover of the album,and everybody's like, oh, there's Michael,
and the weird al turns around.He's like, who'd you think I
was? You know, like it'sreally funny. Yeah, but I just
love that that this guy got.He had enough power to have everybody who
was famous in the world to havehim in this just to make fun of
how vain all are I love.Yeah, that's a that's a very just

(41:04):
clever thing. To do for avideo like that, And what I say
is, besides Michael's astounding main vocalon Live Berrian Girl, I think the
repeated watches of that video to seelike what I missed or who I missed
is what the repetition that led tome being like, damn it, that's
a great song, you know so, But my number one thing for you,
I would tell you for sure tocheck out the video for and watch

(41:28):
whatever. I'm sure the long versionof the Way You Make It feels like
six or seven minutes long because theintro, the intro alone where she walks
around him and he gives it theold damn it, you don't walk by
Michael Jackson. Yeah, yeah,it's you. Oh yeah. It's a
definition of how dare you? So? Anyways, that's really what I had
to say as far as like thefull scope of the record goes. Did
you have any other thoughts or anythingyou want to point out about maybe any

(41:51):
individual songs or the album as all. Yeah, just just to kind of
touch on a couple of them.So like on the Way You Make Me
Feel, I just wrote it's anabsolute fire of a groove and impossible to
hate anything about this song. Yep, I really I don't see how you
can. The only thing I wouldadd to that is wait to see the
video. Yeah. Um, ISpeed Demon was just kind of a myth

(42:13):
song for me. I feel likethe music didn't match like what the song
was was saying, but it stillwas good music. I mean, that
was just kind of the theme throughoutthe whole album. Like I said earlier,
That's another one too where I feelthe short film lends itself. Well,
let me let me put I swearwhat I'm about to say is true.
The short film for that involves MichaelJackson in a dance off with acclaimation
Rabbit, So I swear all right. Yeah. So again, that's another

(42:39):
one where I've watched it enough towhere I think, finally one day I
was like, oh, I lovethe song because I love I will love
the video so much. Sure,Um, I wasn't also a fan of
the Michael Jackson noise he makes athat one compared to everything else he does.
Yeah, yeah, I hear that. That was a little weird.
Yeah. Um. And just anotherthing, I mean, I feel like
this goes without saying, but Manin the Mirror has one of the best

(43:04):
key changes I think I've ever heardin music when when that kicks in and
then he's got the like the choirbehind him too. Holy shit, that
thing just hits you. Yeah.And uh I mentioned earlier on that I
did get to see him on thattour. And let me tell you something,
brother, when he does that songlive and he does that the spin
before that key change and the keychange happens and he drops and hits that

(43:27):
key change, it changed your wholelife. I've seen that person. I
just got goosebumps just from you describingthat. I think the only other like
key change that that rivals that isthe one on Circle of Life. But
yeah, as far as like yeah, I really feel like that one is
just it Just like when I whenI heard it, I just had my
you know, my earbuds in andI was just in the moment. And
when it kicks in, it reallyjust like like elevates you. It's it's

(43:51):
incredible. Yeah. And then youknow, just for the regular album itself,
I mean, Smooth Criminal was justa hell of a closer to that
album, Like it starts off goodwith bad and you know it. You
always talk about album sequencing. Ifeel like this album was sequenced really well.
You know, even though I wasn'ta big fan of Liberian Girl,
the whole the ups and downs ofthe album felt really well, and just

(44:14):
to end it on Smooth Criminal wasjust chef's kiss. Yep, yeah,
I agree. It's like, letme put it this way, if you
waited five years for the record,I don't believe anybody who bought it in
that first week when they got tothe end, we're like, oh damn
it, you know, yeah,I think, and it was Smooth Criminal
on the way the original album endswith it ending with Smooth Criminal, I
think is one of those things toothat would make you be like, oh,

(44:37):
we gotta listen to this again now, like you would want to go
right back to bad you know.Yeah, absolutely, yeah. So we
always ask if you would buy thisalbum, and I think it would go
without saying that I have bought thisalbum several times in life, from the
first week that it was released backin August of nineteen eighty seven and actually

(44:57):
a year ago, I sold offmy entire vinyl collection except for a very
few records, and we just herein Florida got are set up for like
a much smaller vinyl collection that weintend to have here at the house.
And literally one of the first tenrecords that I bought was Michael Jackson bat
So yes, not only would Ibuy it, but I recommend everyone else
does as well. Is this arecord you would go out and buy,

(45:20):
Garrett? Oh? Absolutely, Idon't know how you can say no to
this thing. I mean just likethe singles that came out of it were
just absolute hits, and I wouldlisten to this thing, no problems.
Yeah, absolutely go out and buyit. Right, would you recommend?
I would always recommend this record toanybody. Especially My thing is with looking

(45:43):
at this in twenty twenty vision,right, because now we have the luxury
looking back at MJ's entire catalog sinceunfortunately, you know, it's it's over,
we're not going to get anymore yeah, new works that the producers from
him, so now we can lookback at the whole catalog. Me personally,
I would tell people to start withthe second half of History for many

(46:04):
many reasons. Scream Drew smile.I think that's the best complete work that
he's ever It's my favorite complete workthat he's ever done. But before most
people would say, okay, well, if you're gonna listen to that first,
fine, but then go right toThriller, And I totally disagree.
I think this record, I thinkyou should absolutely listen to Bad before Thriller.
I think it's just a stunningly goodalbum that is different from Thriller in

(46:27):
many ways. But I like that. I would tell people to listen to
this before Thriller. Yeah, Imean, I mean, but since this
is my first actual foray into afull Michael Jackson album, aside from I
think the one that you're talking about, I also listened to because you had
reviewed it on your show like aseason or two ago. Yeah, I
listened to that one, and Imean I enjoyed that as well. But
as as a first time like listenerto this, I would definitely go out

(46:49):
and be like, Hey, ifyou haven't somehow listened to Bad, you
need to go listen to Bad.Yeah. It's it's such a good fellow
up. It stands on its own, but it's an amazing fellow up under
incredible pressure. So we always writethe album with ten being the best,
one being the absolute worst. Garrett, I will let you go first on
this. I feel like your numberis going to come in a little bit

(47:10):
lower than me. But I getwhy yours would be a little bit lower
than me, because I think youhad some songs that you didn't favor as
much as like have maybe had timeto grow on me. But having said
that, I don't want to putwords in your mouth. I will let
you go ahead and give us youryou're writing five out of ten. I'm
just kidding. I was filling infor Michelle over here. Yeah. No,

(47:32):
I really thought long and hard aboutthis today just to make sure I
give this the right number, andI honestly gave this a nine out of
ten. All right, Yeah,that's okay, cool, And now see
I was I also gave it anine out of ten. Mine is because
there's it must be user error.But I cannot bring myself to like the

(47:52):
song just good Friends. I justI don't know why, but I can't.
I just can't, like myself bringmyself to like that. And yeah,
it's got the one stinker for me, so that detracts the one point
overall for me. So what wasyour thinking on giving it such a high
mark? Yeah, I mean itwas basically the same thing. Like I
enjoyed every song. I really wouldn'tskip any of them aside from Liberian Girl.

(48:15):
But I mean it's not that Iwas skipping every time. I think
I just have to be in theright mood for that one. It just
I mean, maybe that'll grow onme too. But overall, I mean
it's it's a damn near perfect album. The music is flawless throughout. It's
just an easy listening just through andthrough. I am really sad and upset
with myself that I did not givethis a chance years ago. I mean,

(48:37):
it came up before I was Iwas born, and I definitely didn't
get into Michael Jackson like early enough. But yeah, well you know,
hey, you got the future now, you know you know about it now,
you know. Plus, dude,if I if I if I could
be you and see all those shortfilms for the first time, like I
mean, like I've seen him allof those like fifty or one hundred times

(49:00):
each, If I could go backand watch everything you're about to watch for
the first time, I trade placeswith the n RB. You're in an
enviable position, my friend. Ishould almost just video myself watching needs to
put it up on YouTubers. Yeah, dude, dude, I'll tell you
what reaction videos get a huge thingon YouTube, huge numbers for reaction videos.
Yeah, absolutely, you know.Plus it would be genuine because everybody

(49:22):
could hear you learning about it onthis show. Like if anybody was like,
oh, there's no way he's everseen a video for that, you
can be like, no, youcan hear there's a podcast where you can
hear me hearing about it for thefirst time. Yeah, you can be
there when I learned about it.Yeah. But yeah, so I yeah,
I think it's an absolute banger ofa record. And yeah, I

(49:42):
also get it a nine out oftown. I think it's as close to
perfection as a pop album can getin my opinion, is what you're getting
here with this record. So,Garrett, we greatly appreciate you stepping in
to help us out. If youwere listening to the program last week,
we said our friends Dad and Rockwe're going to be here to help us
out this week, and we hada grave scheduling issue between the two of
us, and they've contributed to ourshow plenty. We always have great interactions

(50:07):
with them. So if you wouldlike to look into what Dad and Rot
does, make sure to look forthem on YouTube and subscribe to their channel.
However, because they couldn't make it, Garrett was more than happy to
step in and did a fantastic jobhelping us out with taking a look at
an MJA record that he wasn't familiarwith at all. And I think that
longtime fans and people who maybe haven'theard this record could benefit from what Garrett

(50:29):
brought to the table with this,because longtime fans get to hear you being
like, holy crap, this isgreat, and people who maybe like you,
who hadn't listened to the record yetmight now be like, damn,
apparently I need to stop missing out. So Garrett, we appreciate you stepping
in and helping us out. Wealways say at the top of the show,
Hey, this is who we haveand you should go check out their
show. But tell everybody again,why, as this episode is ending,

(50:52):
why should they go over search foryour podcast now and subscribe to that.
Oh, that's because Frankie and Imight wonderful co host. We peruse the
news and we come up with somecrazy trendy articles and some keywords, and
we turn those into fun fictional storiesutilizing a randomized genre, and we just

(51:13):
have a good time hanging out overthere. We make the news less shitty.
So there you go. I swearI know you guys just recently changed
your logo to like a much nicerlike handwritten almost like calligraphy type. Fine,
you should put that out there too, unquotes. We make the news
less shitty. There you go.That's a good tech line. I'll tell
you what. That is a goodtagline, man, because there if you

(51:37):
turn on the news, you're gonnasee a lot of bad stuff. And
you know, they call it doomscrolling for a reason, and you know,
if you would like some help withthat and a new twist on things.
Like me personally, I hate thenews. I can't stand every looking
around seeing everything awful in the worldall the time. And when I went
on the Overtraining Story podcast, Ihad a riot discussing things that things id

(52:00):
I'd heard about and things I didn'teven want to hear about that we twisted
into a story and had a greattime with. So yeah, we always
have a reindorsement for it on theshow. Next week on the podcast,
I'm going to be joined by mywife Lauren, who runs her own podcast,
the beardl Podcast, and Michelle willbe back on the program with us
next week, and we are goingto be discussing our three favorite music biopics

(52:22):
of all times. So if youlistened recently to our episode about our favorite
soundtracks of all time, where webasically just said like, hey, these
are you know, my favorites,and then Lauren will go through her favorites
and she'll go through her favorites andwe'll just kind of share with you guys
what we think of some music biopicsand why there are our favorites and so

(52:43):
on, because the why it alwaysmatters to me as much as what we're
actually talking about. So everybody,I'll have that to look forward to next
week. But like we always sayabout this time, without music, life
would be a mistakes Group podcast ishosted by Russ Robinson, Kyle Whimple,
and Michelle Cappellani, Produced and editedby Russ Robinson. Internal and outcome music

(53:06):
composed by Chris Kimmo, recorded withthe Road podcast or pro and Road pod mice