February 19, 2024 • 36 mins
Welcome to an enriching episode of the Inscape Quest podcast, where we deep dive into the fascinating artistic life of two-time Grammy-winning composer, Peter Kater. Our host, Trudi Howley, engages with Peter in an introspective dialogue that unfolds his riveting career journey, effective music-making process, and his unwavering connection with listeners worldwide.
This episode unfolds some monumental milestones of Peter's career in music and his unique, soul-stirring piano readings. Peter shares his groundbreaking method of connecting with audience members by improvising melodies that mirror their individual life stories while they recline under the piano. This empathetic approach conceived his first Grammy-winning compilation.
Peter narrates his profound love for the creative process, his technique of introspection, and his alternative path to creativity that prioritizes inspiration over forced productivity. Peter’s love for nature and his conscious endeavors to maintain a harmonic relationship with the cosmic world also find a place in the talk, adding a captivating dimension to this audio exploration.
This episode also introduces listeners to Peter's early days, marked by the traumatic loss of his mother, life as a hitchhiker, and accidental encounters with famous artist Allen Ginsberg. Emphasizing Peter's creative journey from a classically trained musician to a Grammy-winning artist, this episode is a must-listen for every music enthusiast, artist, and anyone hunting for inspiration to lead an accomplished life.
In this enlightening episode, we navigate the realms of Grammy-winning pianist, Peter Kater. Together with his mate Brian, they dared to dream and transform a dull restaurant into an animated arts café. Stumbling upon an unsuspecting Allen Ginsberg, they found themselves creating a distinctive atmosphere at their café.
Delve deeper into Peter's varied life as an artist, his creative process, his takeaways from his time in Hawaii and Colorado, and how these distinct environments molded his music. Get an exclusive sneak-peek into how Grammy-winning music comes into existence as Peter deconstructs his prominent tracks, 'Dancing on Water' and 'Wings of Love.'
The episode will also give you insights into Peter's music retreats in Maui and Montana, where he shapes a nurturing setting for self-expression, relation building, and vulnerability, thus encapsulating the transformative potential of excellent music. Gear up for an episode that immerses you into the extraordinary life of Peter Kater!
Check out Peter's music retreat offerings in Maui & Montana.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
Hello podcast listeners. Thank you for tuning in today to the Inscape Quest podcast show.
I am your host, Trudi Howley.
Here I am talking with people about how they engage with their relationships, work, and passions.
Please subscribe and share this show with a friend and thanks to you,
(00:25):
we can grow meaningful conversations together, one episode at a time.
Music.
Peter Kater is a two-time Grammy-winning composer.
Along with his solo piano improvisations, throughout his career,
(00:46):
he's enjoyed collaborating with many other artists. Peter has recorded over
60 albums and created film and television soundtracks.
In this conversation, I get a glimpse into Peter's great love for the creative
process, how he engages with self-exploration, his audience,
(01:07):
and we learn about his passion for the natural environment.
Peter I'm really excited to get
to have this conversation with you today so thank
you yeah thank you for having me I first
met you came across your music when
(01:28):
I came to one of your concerts and
I lay under your piano while you were
playing and that was such an extraordinarily profoundly
profound experience for me curious where did you get the idea for having audience
members lie underneath your piano as you played it just kind of happened organically
(01:50):
actually i was holding some retreats in hawaii and as part of the retreat.
We would go over to my house and, you know, it'd be like, I don't know how many
people, I think we had 10 or 12 people, you know, people would sit around on
the floor around the piano as I played.
And then gradually, you know, people just got closer and closer.
(02:11):
And then one person was just like, I'm just getting under the damn thing.
And so it became a thing, you know, where, you know, people were like,
oh, I want to get under there next, you know?
And then people started talking about, you know, how cool the experience was.
And then I started to have a sense that I felt like, am I playing differently
(02:31):
depending on who's under the piano?
You know, I was like, wow, this feels really interesting.
What would it feel like if I just had one person under the piano at a time?
So I started exploring it more consciously. It's interesting.
So I know one of your Grammy winning albums was born out of having people lie under your piano.
(02:51):
Yeah, so I started doing these one-on-one, I call them piano readings,
where I'll have a person come over,
we talk for a little bit about what's going on in their lives,
and we just keep talking until I get a very strong starting point impression
as to what I would play for this person.
(03:12):
And I just need to know what's the melody, what's the feeling,
what's the initial key signature, enough to start.
Once I have a very clear impression of how to start, then I'll have them lie
under the piano and then I'll improvise just for them for 10-15 minutes.
And I started doing a bunch of these. And at one point, I realized that I had
over 100, maybe even close to 200 of these recorded readings that some of them
(03:38):
were actually really, really good musically.
I mean, not to say that they all aren't good. They all are what they're supposed to be.
But some of them were more enjoyable to listen to than others, for me, as an artist.
And so I started going through them.
And I picked out, I think, 10 pieces. And then I picked up my favorite sections
of those pieces and I made them into an album because I thought the music is good.
(04:03):
People should be able to listen to this and download it or buy it if they want.
I released a record and that was the record where I won my first Grammy and
it was just solo piano improvisations.
It was very rewarding to get a Grammy for that because it wasn't like a record
that I produced with other musicians and had a big production budget for and
(04:27):
was trying to make a great record.
It was just something that kind of happened naturally and organically and there
was no production involved.
It was just me improvising off the top of my head. And so it was a nice way
to win a Grammy after, I think, at that time, 13, 12 nominations and no wins.
So with two wins, bookending those nominations, how do you envisage working
(04:52):
forward in terms of continuing to find your purest expression as a composer?
Yeah, so I just finished a project that I produced for a friend of mine who's
a vocalist. And that record turned out really well. And I just,
I literally just finished.
And so now I'm in the part of my process where recharging, kind of entering what I would call.
(05:17):
Void of unknowing you know it's like i i have this belief through experience that,
everything all creativity comes out of out of darkness out of the void out of
nothing out of the womb you know the empty womb i already have some ideas of what i want to do next.
Nothing that i want to talk about or even act on
(05:39):
yet you know i'm just kind of waiting until i feel like
i have that sense of like i have to start now you know
i enjoy the downtime tell you the truth i
i really do i i enjoy just kind
of being in nature and having days with no agenda you know where i can just
kind of re-explore myself my inner world you know which might sound kind of
(06:03):
trendy but i actually spend hours every day doing that what you know who am
i today well how you You know, like,
because I don't assume that I'm the same person that I was yesterday or a week ago or a year ago.
In some ways, at my core, possibly, I am. But everything floating around that is always shifting.
(06:24):
I think it's important to be curious about who we are today.
Yeah, I love that you say that. and wondering when
you talk about composing is it
always about evoking emotion or
exploration that what drives your composition
(06:45):
i think what drives my compositions or my
improvisations is again that
that question of like you know what
do i feel right now like what best expresses is
where I'm at right now or and or what do I need to hear or want to hear that
(07:06):
will bring more fullness or wholeness to my experience I hardly ever go to the
piano just because I enjoy playing.
I almost always go to the piano because I need to, you know,
because I have to, because I want to, I have to work through something or I
(07:27):
want to explore something or I'm curious about something.
So honestly, you know, sometimes I won't play the piano for weeks at a time,
depending on like this period right now, where I'm in right now.
I don't anticipate playing the piano very much at all. I'll do my Facebook Live
concerts and my little intimate home concerts and piano readings as a way of staying connected.
(07:51):
For my own self and my own private time, I will probably just try to be out
in nature. That sounds a great way to recharge and wait for this creative expression
to come through the void.
And I know that you have great respect for the environment.
If one feels that music is a way of praising and calling, do you feel like you're
(08:14):
calling for something bigger than yourself?
Yeah, that's definitely part of the process of trying to figure out who I am
today and where is my connection.
I have to say that probably feeling connected to something, either to myself
or to the universe or God, whatever you want to call it, or even to someone
(08:36):
else is probably the highest priority.
Is there anything in the external environment, like culture or politics,
does that ever come into your music or is it always an internal experience for you?
It's always an internal experience for me. And I have to say that culture and
(08:57):
politics and the world is probably in direct conflict to what it is that I'm trying to do.
Especially these days. it's like you know
oh my god have you ever had
a period of what's traditionally called
writer's block i do have those periods all the time but i don't interpret them
(09:20):
as writer's block or even as there being something wrong i just simply don't
feel creative and i don't argue with it i don't make it a problem i'm like fine
i'll go out for lunch fine i'll like i said i'll go into nature fine i'll,
I'll do something else. I don't have an agenda. And maybe it's because I'm already prolific.
I mean, I can honestly say without.
(09:42):
An ego that I am prolific because I've written over a thousand songs.
I've recorded over 70 records and 100 TV and film scores. And it feels like nothing to me.
It's effortless. And so I don't really worry about it anymore.
I mean, maybe earlier in my career when I was in my 20s, I'd be like,
oh, I finished an album. And now I don't feel creative.
(10:05):
And I don't know if I'm ever going to be able to do another album again.
I was there, but through experience, I realized that that's just a natural process.
That's just what happens. I like comparing it to.
But I do like the comparison of the womb and the darkness and the waiting and
the growth and the birth and all that kind of stuff. I think it's a really beautiful comparison.
(10:29):
As we think about the idea of creativity Creativity from almost nothingness,
but spaciousness, and then bringing it to life.
And that process is somewhat torturous.
What happens if somebody asks you for a composition? Is that a piece you've already done?
(10:55):
Or would you have to create something?
Well, that's just it. it i have such faith in
my creative process that if someone
asks me for a composition or someone says can
you write the music for this thing or whatever i have no doubt that i'll have
what i need to do it it's almost like i just put in a request you know to myself
(11:17):
it's like i need to have a song by friday and i'll wait until friday if i have
to i'm not like sitting down at the the piano on Monday,
you know, trying to create a song.
I wait until I have the song. I wait until I know I have it.
You know, it's like it's a recognition that happens inside myself.
We're like, oh, that's what it is.
(11:38):
And then I'll go and work on it. But I won't sit down at the piano and screw
around with melodies and see if this feels good or this or that.
It's a very intuitive process for me, which, again, I love. I just love approaching
creativity from that perspective.
I'm enjoying hearing you talk about the creative process because,
to me, it just sounds so present. It's like just the present moment that then moves through you.
(12:06):
And that sounds so beautiful as a way of living.
When did you first start composing?
When I was a teenager, I was classically trained from the age of six.
I hated playing classical music. I loved listening to it on occasion,
but I didn't like playing it because it's just so structured and so specific.
(12:27):
It left no room for me to be myself.
So when I was a teenager and I finally started learning how to improvise and
play music that I actually enjoyed, like all the popular music of the time,
I also started exploring writing my own stuff because it seemed like a natural next step.
Then my mother passed of cancer when I turned 18, and that kind of set me free.
(12:51):
I mean, obviously, it was a traumatic experience, but she had it for two years.
And so when she finally passed, it was like a relief, you know,
because she suffered quite a bit.
And that set me free because I had no ties to try to be anyone for anyone else. I was an only child.
My father left when I was very young.
(13:13):
No other immediate family. My grandparents were in Germany, you know, and I was in New Jersey.
So I just kind of like, I just kind of shot off into the world and I hitchhiked
around the country for a year and a half.
I put in like 30,000 miles on the road.
In a year and a half, I was I was reacting to sort of a tumultuous childhood
and also kind of searching for who I am, you know, away from that experience.
(13:37):
And in that process, I discovered some musicians like Keith Jarrett and the
group Oregon and the Paul Winter Consort.
And their style of improvising and just playing together off the top of their
heads was just amazing to me. And so it prompted like a six-year period of just improvising.
(13:58):
I didn't want to play any structured songs at all, even if it was pop music and music that I loved.
I just was improvising, improvising like five nights a week,
four hours a night in different clubs and restaurants and bars.
So I believe in your earlier career that you had a couple of encounters with Allen Ginsberg.
(14:18):
Yeah, it was kind of a coincidence, you know, Because back in early Boulder,
and this was the late 70s, Boulder was very grassroots.
The Naropa Institute was like a two-room office above what is now Hapa Sushi
on Pearl Street, which was the New York deli.
And the Rolfe Institute wasn't even here yet.
(14:40):
There was a lot of grassroots organizations like Hakomi, Ridwan School.
Everything was very... I see Trimpa Rinpoche, you know, wandering around the
streets of Boulder, you know, drunk on sake.
Old Boulder was ridiculously cool. There was a kind of energy where if you were
innovative and motivated, you could make things happen. It wasn't that hard.
(15:04):
There was a lot of potential, you know.
So this friend of mine and I, there was this restaurant that was not doing very well.
And it was sort of like it was off the mall, but it was a downstairs basement location.
And we thought, well, we should bring some music and we should like,
you know, we should turn this little boring restaurant into like a happening
(15:25):
kind of scene, you know, call it Arts Cafe.
We would, you know, we would play there. I would play.
I'll give my friend credit. His name is Brian Golden. We had a piano down there,
an upright piano. We had guitarists come in. We would do jam sessions.
People would sit around and drink coffee and have sandwiches and,
you know, that kind of thing.
Word got around. And so Allen Ginsberg comes in.
(15:50):
You know it's kind of like to tell you the truth i didn't i didn't really know
what an important figure he was you know at the time or or even you know or
would become even he was like yeah i mean let's i'm gonna read my poetry you
can you want to play with me you know and so we'd be like,
sure you know and because that was exactly the kind of thing we were looking
for you know something really innovative and so he'd be reading his poetry and
(16:14):
you know i'd be improvising playing playing the piano.
Those kinds of things happened quite a bit. Again, a very ripe,
interesting time, you know.
Certainly sounds like an interesting time. And I just want to add to that what
I just said, because I want to be clear about it. It wasn't like we were entrepreneurs.
It wasn't like we had money and we wanted to make things happen and we invested.
(16:36):
It wasn't like that. We had nothing. We were living in attic,
unfinished attics and sleeping in.
You know in the foothills at times i mean we're the group of
artists where we really we were like we had nothing you know i i had you know
maybe two two pairs of jeans at the most and half the time had no place to live
you know but we wanted to do these things because it was creative and fun and
(16:59):
something to do it wasn't like these days molded where it's like well let's
put a business plan together.
And let's think this through and do some research wasn't like
that it was very much like by the
seat of our pants if that's the correct expression progression
when was the first time that you got paid for
a piece of music that you created
yourself i know exactly when it was i had been playing all around you know like
(17:26):
i said boulder and denver i was making fifty dollars a night to play for four
hours you know it's it's really not a whole lot better these days you know the
average musician gigging musician around town makes you you know,
150 or maybe $200 a night playing for four hours. It's nothing, you know.
And then I recorded my first album, which an investor paid for.
(17:46):
And I'm not including that as being paid to write music. That was like just
sort of a next step in my career.
First time I got a phone call, it was from this guy named Marty Stauffer,
who had a TV show, PBS TV show called Wild America.
And somehow he had heard my album and he
wanted me to write some music for his tv shows which i wound up doing dozens
(18:10):
of them but the first one he was kind of sheepish he was kind of like well you
know if you could do the music and we don't have much of a budget because it's
you know it's pbs and blah blah blah but we could pay you you know five hundred dollars a minute.
What? $500 for a minute of music? I was like, you know, of course,
I was cool. I was like, yeah, that'll be okay.
(18:32):
But inside, I'm like, oh, my God, like, what just happened?
You know, and he wanted eight to 11 minutes of music per 30 minute program.
So I know you have a teenager in the house.
And I'm wondering if your teenager invites
you to to listen to any of his music and if
there's anything that you enjoy right now
(18:54):
that might be out of your normal range of
listening yes he does that all the
time and i encourage him to do that and i love that i could drive in my car
and just drive around for an hour or two while he plays me all his current and
of course his turn he's turned me on to music but normally i would never have
listened to if i wasn't trying to understand it and see it from his perspective
(19:19):
come to really enjoy since then.
Groups like the Boyds, the Strokes, Queens of the Stone Age.
Interpol, which is not a new group.
I mean, they've been around for 20 years, but they wouldn't have been on my radar normally.
And yeah, I took them to see Interpol at Red Rocks in the frigging snow.
I was like, are you sure you want to go do this? It was like March or April or something, you know?
(19:43):
Like, are you sure you want to go? Because I'm not a cold weather fan. I don't like snow.
Yeah, we went up. You just said you don't like the cold, and I know you spend
a significant amount of your time in Maui. Do you feel you're more creative
in one place or the other?
No, but it's a different kind of creativity in one place or the other.
And that's very apparent in my music. If you listen to the albums that I wrote
(20:05):
and produced in Colorado, they're very different than the albums that I created in Hawaii.
Hawaii is a much softer fluid energy. It's very feminine.
Hawaii for me is all about improvisation and I don't know, it's just very spacious
and flowing and all the music I've done there has been that way.
I don't think I've hardly written any compositions there.
(20:29):
Whereas here in Boulder, it has become really largely about compositions and
songwriting, and I play things very specifically.
If you care to look at two albums of mine that won Grammys, Dancing on Water,
which is all about Hawaii, is very fluid.
And you can hear it in the opening, the first 30 seconds of the album.
(20:49):
It's like, wow, this is just fluid, you know.
And then you listen to my album Wings, which I didn't even really...
This is the first time I realized that Dancing on Water is about water and Wings is about air.
Wings is very structured. Every single song on there is a composition and I
can play every single song on there.
And it's very structured and i
think they're equally beautiful if i can say
(21:11):
that but in very different ways you know colorado is
very masculine you know the energy here is very
structured about climbing peaks
and challenging yourself and pushing yourself there's a sense of wanting to
accomplish and succeed here whereas in hawaii it's more like you just want to
(21:32):
melt and just be present and not think about any of those things that I would
think about in Colorado.
I love that you've made the connection between the air and water.
I'm fascinated. I love the elements.
I mean, I'm definitely a pagan at heart. I've done several albums.
I did a whole series on the elements for a record label called Real Music,
(21:55):
and the album titles are Earth, Air, Fire, and Water.
And then I did another album in Hawaii that was on the elements,
but I called it Wind, Rock, Sea, and Flame.
So if we were to hear some music right now, which would be something you would
like to share with the listeners?
Oh, okay. Well, I think it would be interesting to do what I just said,
(22:18):
you know, like play the title track to my Dancing on Water CD and just listen to how fluid that is.
And then in comparison, play a song from my Wings album, like Wings of Love. Music.
Music.
(31:16):
And we hoped you enjoyed the depth in Peter's compositions and his piano artistry
there and his two Grammy award-winning compositions, Dancing on Water,
followed by Wings of Love.
So as you think about your music being a multi-sensory way of expressing yourself,
(31:36):
are you creative in other ways in your life?
Yeah, so, you know, I've been doing this for a long time. So I've definitely,
you know, been able to notice my patterns.
And I do notice that when I'm not working on a project, I really enjoy cooking more.
And I like to, you know, spend time doing it.
(31:56):
You know, I'll spend an hour or two, maybe even three, you know.
But I find that when I'm working on an album or a project, I just eat to just fulfill my hunger.
Try painting, but it's not my thing. and i
enjoy food is high priority for me as far as like
quality of life when you have your retreats
in maui or in montana is
(32:20):
food a big part of the retreat as
well as the music it is to varying
degrees depending on what's available like if i do a
retreat on maui food's a huge part of it because there
is great access to not only great restaurants but also
great chefs and so i will hire a full-time
chef to cook for the week and you know come up with a
(32:42):
menu and it's very good in montana
it's a little harder because you know there's not
as much access to extraordinary restaurants
or chefs and the food is really good
but it's not as much focus what does a retreat look like for your guests the
idea is that they come in and they leave their their world behind mind and they
(33:07):
step into this new world that I couldn't say is my world, but it's also just
like a world that I create,
you know, and all their needs are taken care of.
I provide all the structure, all the nutrients, we could say,
you know, and the schedule and the music.
And I just think of like, what would be really fun? Like, what would be really cool?
(33:30):
Like, how could I create a space where people feel safe enough to just really
drop into deeper levels of their their transparency their authenticity their
expression their vulnerability you know.
And I don't push very hard for that. I just set up a little structure of like
breaking into small groups and we have to answer these questions.
(33:51):
And based on authentic relating and intimacy building, trust building,
where we just, you know, questions are anything from, you know,
what's the first childhood memory you have and how did you feel about it?
To what did you firmly believe that you now see was misguided?
Light questions to deeper questions. And it's important to have a nice balance
(34:13):
of easy questions and harder questions.
And it just brings people into talking about things that they didn't even know
that they wanted to talk about.
And then what happens is that we begin to see we aren't so different from each other.
Behind all the different careers and different body types and presentation and
(34:35):
belief systems even, And there is a very authentic human being that we're moved by seeing,
and we're also moved by being seen.
And then we mix that with beautiful nature and my music and guest musicians
and, you know, three meals a day provided for us lovingly. It's very, very interesting.
(34:56):
Doing a concert is one thing and playing for people for a half hour or two hours
is one thing, but building a relationship over a week is beautiful.
It sounds incredibly nourishing and very organically therapeutic.
I'm struck by how that's very parallel to your own organic process of letting
(35:18):
this creativity of composing arise in you.
I really love this whole transformative view for others and yourself as you
immerse yourself in your work.
A very special process to be a part of, to include your audience so much. Quite a gift.
(35:39):
Thank you so much. It was an absolute delight. Yeah, thank you too.
I actually found it very enjoyable because I don't know if I would have answered
those questions that way yesterday.
Or a week ago. It's like, it's an interesting practice, you know,
to just be like, really just be present with where you are.
(35:59):
If we approach our day, we walk out into the world. And if we don't approach
it as if we're exploring it afresh every day, how boring is that?
Thank you for listening to the InScape Quest podcast with Trudy Howley.
If you like this show and want to send questions or submit topics you'd like
(36:23):
to hear about on your podcast, you can find me on Instagram at inscapequest.
Thank you for listening and for your shares, subscriptions and downloads. Cheerio.
Hello podcast listeners. Thank you for tuning in today to the Inscape Quest podcast show.
I am your host, Trudi Howley.
Here I am talking with people about how they engage with their relationships, work, and passions.
Please subscribe and share this show with a friend and thanks to you,
(00:25):
we can grow meaningful conversations together, one episode at a time.
Music.
Peter Kater is a two-time Grammy-winning composer.
Along with his solo piano improvisations, throughout his career,
(00:46):
he's enjoyed collaborating with many other artists. Peter has recorded over
60 albums and created film and television soundtracks.
In this conversation, I get a glimpse into Peter's great love for the creative
process, how he engages with self-exploration, his audience,
(01:07):
and we learn about his passion for the natural environment.
Peter I'm really excited to get
to have this conversation with you today so thank
you yeah thank you for having me I first
met you came across your music when
(01:28):
I came to one of your concerts and
I lay under your piano while you were
playing and that was such an extraordinarily profoundly
profound experience for me curious where did you get the idea for having audience
members lie underneath your piano as you played it just kind of happened organically
(01:50):
actually i was holding some retreats in hawaii and as part of the retreat.
We would go over to my house and, you know, it'd be like, I don't know how many
people, I think we had 10 or 12 people, you know, people would sit around on
the floor around the piano as I played.
And then gradually, you know, people just got closer and closer.
(02:11):
And then one person was just like, I'm just getting under the damn thing.
And so it became a thing, you know, where, you know, people were like,
oh, I want to get under there next, you know?
And then people started talking about, you know, how cool the experience was.
And then I started to have a sense that I felt like, am I playing differently
(02:31):
depending on who's under the piano?
You know, I was like, wow, this feels really interesting.
What would it feel like if I just had one person under the piano at a time?
So I started exploring it more consciously. It's interesting.
So I know one of your Grammy winning albums was born out of having people lie under your piano.
(02:51):
Yeah, so I started doing these one-on-one, I call them piano readings,
where I'll have a person come over,
we talk for a little bit about what's going on in their lives,
and we just keep talking until I get a very strong starting point impression
as to what I would play for this person.
(03:12):
And I just need to know what's the melody, what's the feeling,
what's the initial key signature, enough to start.
Once I have a very clear impression of how to start, then I'll have them lie
under the piano and then I'll improvise just for them for 10-15 minutes.
And I started doing a bunch of these. And at one point, I realized that I had
over 100, maybe even close to 200 of these recorded readings that some of them
(03:38):
were actually really, really good musically.
I mean, not to say that they all aren't good. They all are what they're supposed to be.
But some of them were more enjoyable to listen to than others, for me, as an artist.
And so I started going through them.
And I picked out, I think, 10 pieces. And then I picked up my favorite sections
of those pieces and I made them into an album because I thought the music is good.
(04:03):
People should be able to listen to this and download it or buy it if they want.
I released a record and that was the record where I won my first Grammy and
it was just solo piano improvisations.
It was very rewarding to get a Grammy for that because it wasn't like a record
that I produced with other musicians and had a big production budget for and
(04:27):
was trying to make a great record.
It was just something that kind of happened naturally and organically and there
was no production involved.
It was just me improvising off the top of my head. And so it was a nice way
to win a Grammy after, I think, at that time, 13, 12 nominations and no wins.
So with two wins, bookending those nominations, how do you envisage working
(04:52):
forward in terms of continuing to find your purest expression as a composer?
Yeah, so I just finished a project that I produced for a friend of mine who's
a vocalist. And that record turned out really well. And I just,
I literally just finished.
And so now I'm in the part of my process where recharging, kind of entering what I would call.
(05:17):
Void of unknowing you know it's like i i have this belief through experience that,
everything all creativity comes out of out of darkness out of the void out of
nothing out of the womb you know the empty womb i already have some ideas of what i want to do next.
Nothing that i want to talk about or even act on
(05:39):
yet you know i'm just kind of waiting until i feel like
i have that sense of like i have to start now you know
i enjoy the downtime tell you the truth i
i really do i i enjoy just kind
of being in nature and having days with no agenda you know where i can just
kind of re-explore myself my inner world you know which might sound kind of
(06:03):
trendy but i actually spend hours every day doing that what you know who am
i today well how you You know, like,
because I don't assume that I'm the same person that I was yesterday or a week ago or a year ago.
In some ways, at my core, possibly, I am. But everything floating around that is always shifting.
(06:24):
I think it's important to be curious about who we are today.
Yeah, I love that you say that. and wondering when
you talk about composing is it
always about evoking emotion or
exploration that what drives your composition
(06:45):
i think what drives my compositions or my
improvisations is again that
that question of like you know what
do i feel right now like what best expresses is
where I'm at right now or and or what do I need to hear or want to hear that
(07:06):
will bring more fullness or wholeness to my experience I hardly ever go to the
piano just because I enjoy playing.
I almost always go to the piano because I need to, you know,
because I have to, because I want to, I have to work through something or I
(07:27):
want to explore something or I'm curious about something.
So honestly, you know, sometimes I won't play the piano for weeks at a time,
depending on like this period right now, where I'm in right now.
I don't anticipate playing the piano very much at all. I'll do my Facebook Live
concerts and my little intimate home concerts and piano readings as a way of staying connected.
(07:51):
For my own self and my own private time, I will probably just try to be out
in nature. That sounds a great way to recharge and wait for this creative expression
to come through the void.
And I know that you have great respect for the environment.
If one feels that music is a way of praising and calling, do you feel like you're
(08:14):
calling for something bigger than yourself?
Yeah, that's definitely part of the process of trying to figure out who I am
today and where is my connection.
I have to say that probably feeling connected to something, either to myself
or to the universe or God, whatever you want to call it, or even to someone
(08:36):
else is probably the highest priority.
Is there anything in the external environment, like culture or politics,
does that ever come into your music or is it always an internal experience for you?
It's always an internal experience for me. And I have to say that culture and
(08:57):
politics and the world is probably in direct conflict to what it is that I'm trying to do.
Especially these days. it's like you know
oh my god have you ever had
a period of what's traditionally called
writer's block i do have those periods all the time but i don't interpret them
(09:20):
as writer's block or even as there being something wrong i just simply don't
feel creative and i don't argue with it i don't make it a problem i'm like fine
i'll go out for lunch fine i'll like i said i'll go into nature fine i'll,
I'll do something else. I don't have an agenda. And maybe it's because I'm already prolific.
I mean, I can honestly say without.
(09:42):
An ego that I am prolific because I've written over a thousand songs.
I've recorded over 70 records and 100 TV and film scores. And it feels like nothing to me.
It's effortless. And so I don't really worry about it anymore.
I mean, maybe earlier in my career when I was in my 20s, I'd be like,
oh, I finished an album. And now I don't feel creative.
(10:05):
And I don't know if I'm ever going to be able to do another album again.
I was there, but through experience, I realized that that's just a natural process.
That's just what happens. I like comparing it to.
But I do like the comparison of the womb and the darkness and the waiting and
the growth and the birth and all that kind of stuff. I think it's a really beautiful comparison.
(10:29):
As we think about the idea of creativity Creativity from almost nothingness,
but spaciousness, and then bringing it to life.
And that process is somewhat torturous.
What happens if somebody asks you for a composition? Is that a piece you've already done?
(10:55):
Or would you have to create something?
Well, that's just it. it i have such faith in
my creative process that if someone
asks me for a composition or someone says can
you write the music for this thing or whatever i have no doubt that i'll have
what i need to do it it's almost like i just put in a request you know to myself
(11:17):
it's like i need to have a song by friday and i'll wait until friday if i have
to i'm not like sitting down at the the piano on Monday,
you know, trying to create a song.
I wait until I have the song. I wait until I know I have it.
You know, it's like it's a recognition that happens inside myself.
We're like, oh, that's what it is.
(11:38):
And then I'll go and work on it. But I won't sit down at the piano and screw
around with melodies and see if this feels good or this or that.
It's a very intuitive process for me, which, again, I love. I just love approaching
creativity from that perspective.
I'm enjoying hearing you talk about the creative process because,
to me, it just sounds so present. It's like just the present moment that then moves through you.
(12:06):
And that sounds so beautiful as a way of living.
When did you first start composing?
When I was a teenager, I was classically trained from the age of six.
I hated playing classical music. I loved listening to it on occasion,
but I didn't like playing it because it's just so structured and so specific.
(12:27):
It left no room for me to be myself.
So when I was a teenager and I finally started learning how to improvise and
play music that I actually enjoyed, like all the popular music of the time,
I also started exploring writing my own stuff because it seemed like a natural next step.
Then my mother passed of cancer when I turned 18, and that kind of set me free.
(12:51):
I mean, obviously, it was a traumatic experience, but she had it for two years.
And so when she finally passed, it was like a relief, you know,
because she suffered quite a bit.
And that set me free because I had no ties to try to be anyone for anyone else. I was an only child.
My father left when I was very young.
(13:13):
No other immediate family. My grandparents were in Germany, you know, and I was in New Jersey.
So I just kind of like, I just kind of shot off into the world and I hitchhiked
around the country for a year and a half.
I put in like 30,000 miles on the road.
In a year and a half, I was I was reacting to sort of a tumultuous childhood
and also kind of searching for who I am, you know, away from that experience.
(13:37):
And in that process, I discovered some musicians like Keith Jarrett and the
group Oregon and the Paul Winter Consort.
And their style of improvising and just playing together off the top of their
heads was just amazing to me. And so it prompted like a six-year period of just improvising.
(13:58):
I didn't want to play any structured songs at all, even if it was pop music and music that I loved.
I just was improvising, improvising like five nights a week,
four hours a night in different clubs and restaurants and bars.
So I believe in your earlier career that you had a couple of encounters with Allen Ginsberg.
(14:18):
Yeah, it was kind of a coincidence, you know, Because back in early Boulder,
and this was the late 70s, Boulder was very grassroots.
The Naropa Institute was like a two-room office above what is now Hapa Sushi
on Pearl Street, which was the New York deli.
And the Rolfe Institute wasn't even here yet.
(14:40):
There was a lot of grassroots organizations like Hakomi, Ridwan School.
Everything was very... I see Trimpa Rinpoche, you know, wandering around the
streets of Boulder, you know, drunk on sake.
Old Boulder was ridiculously cool. There was a kind of energy where if you were
innovative and motivated, you could make things happen. It wasn't that hard.
(15:04):
There was a lot of potential, you know.
So this friend of mine and I, there was this restaurant that was not doing very well.
And it was sort of like it was off the mall, but it was a downstairs basement location.
And we thought, well, we should bring some music and we should like,
you know, we should turn this little boring restaurant into like a happening
(15:25):
kind of scene, you know, call it Arts Cafe.
We would, you know, we would play there. I would play.
I'll give my friend credit. His name is Brian Golden. We had a piano down there,
an upright piano. We had guitarists come in. We would do jam sessions.
People would sit around and drink coffee and have sandwiches and,
you know, that kind of thing.
Word got around. And so Allen Ginsberg comes in.
(15:50):
You know it's kind of like to tell you the truth i didn't i didn't really know
what an important figure he was you know at the time or or even you know or
would become even he was like yeah i mean let's i'm gonna read my poetry you
can you want to play with me you know and so we'd be like,
sure you know and because that was exactly the kind of thing we were looking
for you know something really innovative and so he'd be reading his poetry and
(16:14):
you know i'd be improvising playing playing the piano.
Those kinds of things happened quite a bit. Again, a very ripe,
interesting time, you know.
Certainly sounds like an interesting time. And I just want to add to that what
I just said, because I want to be clear about it. It wasn't like we were entrepreneurs.
It wasn't like we had money and we wanted to make things happen and we invested.
(16:36):
It wasn't like that. We had nothing. We were living in attic,
unfinished attics and sleeping in.
You know in the foothills at times i mean we're the group of
artists where we really we were like we had nothing you know i i had you know
maybe two two pairs of jeans at the most and half the time had no place to live
you know but we wanted to do these things because it was creative and fun and
(16:59):
something to do it wasn't like these days molded where it's like well let's
put a business plan together.
And let's think this through and do some research wasn't like
that it was very much like by the
seat of our pants if that's the correct expression progression
when was the first time that you got paid for
a piece of music that you created
yourself i know exactly when it was i had been playing all around you know like
(17:26):
i said boulder and denver i was making fifty dollars a night to play for four
hours you know it's it's really not a whole lot better these days you know the
average musician gigging musician around town makes you you know,
150 or maybe $200 a night playing for four hours. It's nothing, you know.
And then I recorded my first album, which an investor paid for.
(17:46):
And I'm not including that as being paid to write music. That was like just
sort of a next step in my career.
First time I got a phone call, it was from this guy named Marty Stauffer,
who had a TV show, PBS TV show called Wild America.
And somehow he had heard my album and he
wanted me to write some music for his tv shows which i wound up doing dozens
(18:10):
of them but the first one he was kind of sheepish he was kind of like well you
know if you could do the music and we don't have much of a budget because it's
you know it's pbs and blah blah blah but we could pay you you know five hundred dollars a minute.
What? $500 for a minute of music? I was like, you know, of course,
I was cool. I was like, yeah, that'll be okay.
(18:32):
But inside, I'm like, oh, my God, like, what just happened?
You know, and he wanted eight to 11 minutes of music per 30 minute program.
So I know you have a teenager in the house.
And I'm wondering if your teenager invites
you to to listen to any of his music and if
there's anything that you enjoy right now
(18:54):
that might be out of your normal range of
listening yes he does that all the
time and i encourage him to do that and i love that i could drive in my car
and just drive around for an hour or two while he plays me all his current and
of course his turn he's turned me on to music but normally i would never have
listened to if i wasn't trying to understand it and see it from his perspective
(19:19):
come to really enjoy since then.
Groups like the Boyds, the Strokes, Queens of the Stone Age.
Interpol, which is not a new group.
I mean, they've been around for 20 years, but they wouldn't have been on my radar normally.
And yeah, I took them to see Interpol at Red Rocks in the frigging snow.
I was like, are you sure you want to go do this? It was like March or April or something, you know?
(19:43):
Like, are you sure you want to go? Because I'm not a cold weather fan. I don't like snow.
Yeah, we went up. You just said you don't like the cold, and I know you spend
a significant amount of your time in Maui. Do you feel you're more creative
in one place or the other?
No, but it's a different kind of creativity in one place or the other.
And that's very apparent in my music. If you listen to the albums that I wrote
(20:05):
and produced in Colorado, they're very different than the albums that I created in Hawaii.
Hawaii is a much softer fluid energy. It's very feminine.
Hawaii for me is all about improvisation and I don't know, it's just very spacious
and flowing and all the music I've done there has been that way.
I don't think I've hardly written any compositions there.
(20:29):
Whereas here in Boulder, it has become really largely about compositions and
songwriting, and I play things very specifically.
If you care to look at two albums of mine that won Grammys, Dancing on Water,
which is all about Hawaii, is very fluid.
And you can hear it in the opening, the first 30 seconds of the album.
(20:49):
It's like, wow, this is just fluid, you know.
And then you listen to my album Wings, which I didn't even really...
This is the first time I realized that Dancing on Water is about water and Wings is about air.
Wings is very structured. Every single song on there is a composition and I
can play every single song on there.
And it's very structured and i
think they're equally beautiful if i can say
(21:11):
that but in very different ways you know colorado is
very masculine you know the energy here is very
structured about climbing peaks
and challenging yourself and pushing yourself there's a sense of wanting to
accomplish and succeed here whereas in hawaii it's more like you just want to
(21:32):
melt and just be present and not think about any of those things that I would
think about in Colorado.
I love that you've made the connection between the air and water.
I'm fascinated. I love the elements.
I mean, I'm definitely a pagan at heart. I've done several albums.
I did a whole series on the elements for a record label called Real Music,
(21:55):
and the album titles are Earth, Air, Fire, and Water.
And then I did another album in Hawaii that was on the elements,
but I called it Wind, Rock, Sea, and Flame.
So if we were to hear some music right now, which would be something you would
like to share with the listeners?
Oh, okay. Well, I think it would be interesting to do what I just said,
(22:18):
you know, like play the title track to my Dancing on Water CD and just listen to how fluid that is.
And then in comparison, play a song from my Wings album, like Wings of Love. Music.
Music.
(31:16):
And we hoped you enjoyed the depth in Peter's compositions and his piano artistry
there and his two Grammy award-winning compositions, Dancing on Water,
followed by Wings of Love.
So as you think about your music being a multi-sensory way of expressing yourself,
(31:36):
are you creative in other ways in your life?
Yeah, so, you know, I've been doing this for a long time. So I've definitely,
you know, been able to notice my patterns.
And I do notice that when I'm not working on a project, I really enjoy cooking more.
And I like to, you know, spend time doing it.
(31:56):
You know, I'll spend an hour or two, maybe even three, you know.
But I find that when I'm working on an album or a project, I just eat to just fulfill my hunger.
Try painting, but it's not my thing. and i
enjoy food is high priority for me as far as like
quality of life when you have your retreats
in maui or in montana is
(32:20):
food a big part of the retreat as
well as the music it is to varying
degrees depending on what's available like if i do a
retreat on maui food's a huge part of it because there
is great access to not only great restaurants but also
great chefs and so i will hire a full-time
chef to cook for the week and you know come up with a
(32:42):
menu and it's very good in montana
it's a little harder because you know there's not
as much access to extraordinary restaurants
or chefs and the food is really good
but it's not as much focus what does a retreat look like for your guests the
idea is that they come in and they leave their their world behind mind and they
(33:07):
step into this new world that I couldn't say is my world, but it's also just
like a world that I create,
you know, and all their needs are taken care of.
I provide all the structure, all the nutrients, we could say,
you know, and the schedule and the music.
And I just think of like, what would be really fun? Like, what would be really cool?
(33:30):
Like, how could I create a space where people feel safe enough to just really
drop into deeper levels of their their transparency their authenticity their
expression their vulnerability you know.
And I don't push very hard for that. I just set up a little structure of like
breaking into small groups and we have to answer these questions.
(33:51):
And based on authentic relating and intimacy building, trust building,
where we just, you know, questions are anything from, you know,
what's the first childhood memory you have and how did you feel about it?
To what did you firmly believe that you now see was misguided?
Light questions to deeper questions. And it's important to have a nice balance
(34:13):
of easy questions and harder questions.
And it just brings people into talking about things that they didn't even know
that they wanted to talk about.
And then what happens is that we begin to see we aren't so different from each other.
Behind all the different careers and different body types and presentation and
(34:35):
belief systems even, And there is a very authentic human being that we're moved by seeing,
and we're also moved by being seen.
And then we mix that with beautiful nature and my music and guest musicians
and, you know, three meals a day provided for us lovingly. It's very, very interesting.
(34:56):
Doing a concert is one thing and playing for people for a half hour or two hours
is one thing, but building a relationship over a week is beautiful.
It sounds incredibly nourishing and very organically therapeutic.
I'm struck by how that's very parallel to your own organic process of letting
(35:18):
this creativity of composing arise in you.
I really love this whole transformative view for others and yourself as you
immerse yourself in your work.
A very special process to be a part of, to include your audience so much. Quite a gift.
(35:39):
Thank you so much. It was an absolute delight. Yeah, thank you too.
I actually found it very enjoyable because I don't know if I would have answered
those questions that way yesterday.
Or a week ago. It's like, it's an interesting practice, you know,
to just be like, really just be present with where you are.
(35:59):
If we approach our day, we walk out into the world. And if we don't approach
it as if we're exploring it afresh every day, how boring is that?
Thank you for listening to the InScape Quest podcast with Trudy Howley.
If you like this show and want to send questions or submit topics you'd like
(36:23):
to hear about on your podcast, you can find me on Instagram at inscapequest.
Thank you for listening and for your shares, subscriptions and downloads. Cheerio.
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