December 1, 2025 • 26 mins
In this episode of Inside IALR, we sit down with two of our most experienced research associates, Amy Turner and Rob Chretien.
Each has more than a decade of hands-on experience in IALR's research labs. They've witnessed significant changes in agricultural research, from theoretical plant genetics to cutting-edge applied science, during that time.
Learn about their work with beneficial plant bacteria (endophytes), precision agriculture and controlled environment systems that promise to revolutionize food production. Hear stories of unusual experiments, like rearing black soldier fly larvae, and discover how partnerships with industry are turning research into real-world solutions.
The Institute for Advanced Learning and Research serves as a regional catalyst for economic transformation in Southern Virginia. Our services, programs and offerings are diverse, impactful and far reaching.
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Episode Transcript
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Caleb Ayers (00:17):
Alright, welcome to another episode of Inside IALR.
Thanks for being here forjoining us today.
We have a research divisionthat does a lot of very cool
work centered primarily aroundagriculture, and that's a mix of
research services that weprovide to companies as well as
our own research publicationsand things that we're
publishing.
So today we have two of ourlongtime research associates,
(00:40):
Rob Creeshan and Amy Turner.
Thank you guys for being here.
You guys have both been herefor more than a decade.
But to start, if you just kindof want to give us a rundown of
kind of how you ended up atIALR, whatever previous
experience you want to talkabout, and then kind of how you
ended up here.
Amy Turner (00:55):
Okay, so um I've been here almost 15 years, uh,
started in 2011.
Um and I first heard aboutIELR, I was actually at a soccer
practice amongst other soccermoms, and we had just moved back
to the area and I was lookingfor places to work, and one of
the other moms mentioned theinstitute, and she mentioned ag
(01:18):
research, and that was what mybackground was in.
So um, so yeah, it was just aconversation, and I was so
grateful to find a place that umthat I could apply my skills
and um was real happy to findthe institute.
Um I live in North Carolina, soI'll drive over the line into
Virginia to work.
(01:38):
So uh I felt very fortunate.
So 15 years.
Robert Chretien (01:41):
That's awesome.
What about for you, Rob?
So I came in October 2012 for astartup company.
One of the labs, well, it wasuh it used to be office space
and it was converted into labspace for a startup company.
And so that lasted for a yearand a half, the startup company,
and then there was an openingat the institute, so I just
(02:02):
transitioned from the startupcompany to working for the
institute.
So that was in June of 2014, iswhen I became an official
institute institute employee.
Caleb Ayers (02:11):
Yeah, there are um so for those who don't know, you
know, we've been around, Iguess, 23-ish years as far as
the Institute for AdvancedLearning and Research.
That's when we were founded.
We've been in this building,um, or our our main building for
21 years.
There are not there are a lotof people who have been here
less than you all have.
We'll we'll put it that way.
(02:32):
You guys are are some of theveterans on the block.
So what's kind of been, Iguess, in that time that you've
been here?
I know this a lot of thespecifics of our research have
changed during that time, butkind of big picture, talk about
kind of some of the stuff thatyou've worked on, the projects
that you've worked on uh duringthat time.
Amy Turner (02:51):
Well, when I first got here, we were mainly doing
theoretical research.
We were doing a lot of plant uhgenetic transformation uh and a
lot of tissue culture.
And I was originally hired as atissue plant tissue culture
technician, so mainly lab work.
Um over the years, we haveevolved uh evolved into
(03:12):
precision agriculture, and um weconsider our program an applied
research program, meaning um wewould like for the things we're
working on to be directlyapplicable to what our growers
need and want.
And um that's done through ourprecision ag program and um our
(03:34):
plant endophyte research, andum, which is really exciting,
and uh and we also now of coursecontrolled environmental ag.
So we've we're we've moved inthat space also.
Robert Chretien (03:48):
So when I started, I was working with
another um scientist, and hesince left.
So I was doing some molecularstuff for him and um doing some
pro running some protein gels,and then he left, and then I
started to work with Dr.
May.
And so then we started um ourfocus was whittled down to just
(04:10):
working with plant endophytes,and so um I started working off
with Dr.
May um another scientist wasisolating the endophytes, and
then me and Dr.
May would characterize them umto see if they had growth
promotion properties and thentest them and the greenhouse,
and so now we've kind of stoppedcollecting the endophytes, now
(04:31):
we're just focusing on workingwith them, and now we have the
CEA center, and so we're usingthe endophytes predominantly to
test growth promotion um inhydroponics in the CEA center.
Caleb Ayers (04:42):
On the endophytes, either one of you, can you kind
of give the the 30-secondelevator explanation of what
what a plant endophyte is andkind of what you guys are
working on to do with those?
Robert Chretien (04:54):
Beneficial bacteria that live in plants,
like our gut bacteria.
Initially people thoughtbacteria and plants were all
pathogens, but there's actuallybeneficial bacteria that help
them grow, acquire nutrients.
So um we focused on those asopposed to there's other
bacteria that are in the soil.
Our focus is on those bacteriathat are live inside the plants.
Caleb Ayers (05:16):
I know now, yeah, as you said, you know, we're not
collecting them, we're usingthis library we have.
What was that process like ofkind of going through?
We have 2,000 of these things.
Like, what was that processlike of characterizing and going
through and test doing all thatkind of testing?
Robert Chretien (05:28):
Well, the Amy's property was used to gather
plants, so they would you cantalk about that.
Amy Turner (05:33):
Yeah, so we um actually went out into the field
and collected plants.
We tried to select for plantsthat might be growing under
extreme environments.
You know, you sometimes you'llsee a weed growing in the middle
of a parking lot.
How you know, how is thatpossible?
Why why is that plant able tosurvive that environment?
(05:54):
Sometimes there may be abacteria within that plant that
can help it uh survive thatenvironment.
So we um actually collectedplants from the field, weeds,
uh, field crops.
Um we also collected someplants from Dr.
Lohmann's property, and thenthe plants are brought into the
(06:15):
lab, and then it's separatedinto roots, stems, and leaves.
Through a process in the labprocess, you can actually
extract that bacteria.
And then um, so Robert's got alot more knowledge as far as uh
the microbial work, um, and hecan talk about what they do once
that bacteria is extracted,what what kind of process it's
(06:37):
yeah.
Robert Chretien (06:38):
So the I didn't do most of it, but there was
another person here.
She would crush up the um grindup the roots and the leaves and
stems, and then you umcentrifuge the the large
material that don't centrifugedown the bacteria.
Then you take the supernatin,and then you have to dilute it
(06:58):
down so that when you plate it,you'll get individual colonies.
And then she would just lookfor physical differences, so
like different colors ordifferent shapes to try and
distinguish different ones soyou don't keep you know
culturing the same bacterium.
And so then you just look forphenotypic differences and then
isolate those and put them, andthen we put them in the minus 80
(07:20):
and store them and thencharacterize them to see um what
they could do to help theplants.
So we have like five differentassays.
It's like phosphatesolidization, uh hormone
synthesis um called IAA, um uhsiderophore activity of binds
iron, uh nitrogen fixation.
Amy Turner (07:42):
And what am I forgetting?
Well, we have we can also do wehave a plant pathologist on
staff, and he also utilizes thebacteria to see which ones are
effective against diseasedevelopment.
Robert Chretien (07:53):
Yeah.
And ACC DMase was the fifth onethat I forgot.
Caleb Ayers (07:57):
I've heard Scott Lohman talk about the the
phosphate one, some of some ofthose other things you said.
Amy Turner (08:04):
I have no clue what they mean, and we're gonna
they're all they're allbeneficial for plant growth.
Got it.
Yes, that I I just think.
And that's the important part.
And it and it's interestingbecause it, you know, you find
different bacteria in the rootsthat that may not be growing in
the the upper portion of theplant.
So that's why we divide the theplant up to see, you know,
(08:24):
what's living in the roots,what's living in the the shoots,
and what's in, and then alsodifferent times of the year.
So you may collect a plant inthe spring, and you've it's got
a certain reservoir of bacteriain the spring, you go back in
the fall and try and collectsome of the similar plant
material in the same locationand see if you've got a
different um a differentmicrobial community within the
(08:47):
plant.
It can it can change that much.
Caleb Ayers (08:50):
That's interesting.
(09:21):
What does a typical day looklike for our two best laboratory
research associates?
Robert Chretien (09:28):
And the only the only ones.
Caleb Ayers (09:30):
I was gonna leave that part out for my guys.
Robert Chretien (09:33):
So lately it's mostly germinate seeds, wait
till they grow, inoculate themwith endophytes, grow them in
hydroponics, the CEA, and thenharvest them, weigh them,
collect data to see if there'sgrowth promotion, whatever.
So that's kind of like repeatover and over again.
(09:53):
Yeah.
Amy Turner (09:54):
And when you've got plants growing in the greenhouse
or in the growth chambers, yourfirst priority every every day
is go check your plants.
And you might go out there andcheck them two or three times a
day just to see make sureeverything's growing well, doing
well.
And then we do a lot ofcleaning.
Our day uh involves a lot ofcleaning because uh greenhouse
sanitation is important, and ofcourse, lab laboratory
(10:17):
cleanliness is especially doingmicrobial work.
Um, we do you do a lot ofcleaning, but that's that's just
part of the job.
Caleb Ayers (10:24):
What's something you do that most people would be
surprised that someone in yourposition would do?
What's one one task or one typeof project or Amy covered that?
Robert Chretien (10:34):
I was thinking about that and um cleaning.
We use the dishwasher to cleanour glassware and stuff, so we
do a lot of wait, is there adishwasher up in the labs?
Yes.
I have not noticed.
Amy Turner (10:47):
It's a lab great uh dishwasher that uses resins to
to get the glasswork clean.
Robert Chretien (10:53):
We do lab work, but a good percentage of our
time is cleaning things.
Caleb Ayers (10:57):
I know during the summer we have a lot of interns
come in for our research teamand you all obviously work
closely with them.
When you're talking to thesestudents who are, you know,
obviously interested in in somelevel of research career.
What's kind of the whatmessages do you share with them?
What are kind of the thingsthat you share with them as far
as what this career is like, whythey should should or shouldn't
(11:19):
pursue a research career?
Amy Turner (11:21):
Really enjoy the opportunity to work with with
students.
And we um we'll have highschool students through college
students come in and working inum in the labs, and I think it's
a really good opportunity forkids in the region.
And I love to see that spark ofinterest, especially if if they
hadn't considered uh a careerin ag research.
(11:42):
So it's it's a lot of fun to tosee somebody think, hey, yeah,
this this might be something, orthe or maybe they're interested
in environmental sciences.
That that's a lot of fun.
Mainly, I think, is just youknow, look for those
opportunities throughinternships.
Anything you can do to get somejob skills is always my my main
(12:03):
piece of advice for students.
Robert Chretien (12:05):
Yeah, we get we get students that aren't
necessarily interested in plantstuff.
So they might be medicalstudents or something, so they
settle for doing an internshipwith us.
So they're not quite aspassionate about plants as some
of us are, but so they're justthey want just want lab skills.
Caleb Ayers (12:23):
Right.
What is y'all's favorite partabout your job?
Obviously, Rob, you justmentioned I could hear the
passion when you said we'repassionate about plants.
So I would imagine that thatthat factors in.
But what are some of the thefavorite some what are some of
y'all's favorite parts of yourjob?
Robert Chretien (12:36):
We produce edible crops, so like we get to
after if we don't have to drythem down, whatever, we get to
eat some of the stuff that wegrow.
So I like growing stuff andwatching it start off small and
get bigger and then harvest it.
Amy Turner (12:50):
We have a lot of variety in our day-to-day.
I enjoy that.
Um with each new project, youcan you may be learning
something new.
I enjoy learning something new,um, especially in CEA.
We're looking at a lot of uhnew and novel crops.
Um, we've had a greenhouse fullof edible flowers.
(13:10):
It was beautiful, it smelledgreat.
It was a great place to walkinto every day to see those
beautiful flowers.
Um, so I enjoy the variety.
I I like being in a bright,sunny greenhouse on a cold
winter day.
It it can be 40, 50 degreesoutside, but if it's bright and
sunny, it's 70, 80 in thegreenhouse.
It was a great place to be.
So those are some of myfavorites.
Robert Chretien (13:32):
Yeah, in the wintertime.
Right.
In the summertime, you don'tlike being in the greenhouse
very well.
Caleb Ayers (13:38):
Amy, you mentioned at the beginning that you know a
lot of what you guys did in thebeginning was more theoretical
research.
And now, I mean, uh the wholedivision is called applied
research.
Like that's that's very muchthe focus is how can we use
these things now?
I think that's cool to see.
And clearly, as you guys havetalked about, like you've worked
on a ton of different thingsover your career here as the
focus has shifted as the, as yousaid, bringing in endophytes,
(14:01):
bringing in precisionagriculture, bringing in CEA.
What has been the process likeof learning?
I would imagine a lot of newskills and new techniques.
What has that process been likeof having to essentially work
on different projects duringduring your time here?
Amy Turner (14:15):
That's true.
And and somewhat of mygeneration, sometimes I struggle
with the technology, but butand and that's really exciting
thing is a technology.
Precision ag technology, um,looking forward to you know how
are we gonna incorporate AI.
Um, we've talked a little bitabout that with uh I've had a
(14:35):
discussion with Dr.
Lohman about how to to utilizethat and what we're currently
doing.
So there's there's a lot ofexciting stuff.
Um, hopefully, all thistechnology is gonna make ag more
competitive.
You know, we've got to growmore more food for more people
on less available land.
So uh, you know, how are wegonna do it better in the field
(14:57):
uh to help us cover that is uhour is CEA is you know using
these indoor vertical farms tohelp feed people.
Um yeah, that's that's anexciting part of what we're
doing is is trying to utilizetechnology to accomplish the
things we need to do in ag.
Robert Chretien (15:14):
Yeah, when I first started, we would do stuff
in the lab characterizing thebacteria, and then we would move
to the greenhouse to see theenhanced growth, but we were
growing in um you know soillessmix.
And now we're mostly justgrowing in hydroponic systems.
So that was interesting tolearn because I had never worked
with hydroponics, so I got tolearn um and utilize that.
Caleb Ayers (15:36):
Right.
And for for anyone listeningwho doesn't know hydroponics,
that means the plant isessentially the roots are put
directly in the water.
What's your what's your eitheryour favorite or your most uh
most used tool?
And explain it because Iprobably won't know what it is.
Amy Turner (15:53):
Well, currently it's an ECPH meter.
So when you're working withhydroponics, it's very important
to check your um your nutrientsolution and your the pH and the
concentration of your nutrientsolutions.
Caleb Ayers (16:09):
So out there versus basic, is that correct?
I remembered something frombiological.
Amy Turner (16:14):
Plants grow healthiest at a certain you
know, certain pH.
We have multiple units outthere in the greenhouse and in
the vertical farm with multiplereservoirs and uh each one of
those reservoirs have to bechecked for ECPH.
So if we spend a lot of timedoing that, so uh that's an
important piece of equipmentthat we're utilizing daily.
Robert Chretien (16:36):
I would say that was gonna be my answer.
But I also but I also haveanother one as a pipette.
Every day I'm gonna do it.
Caleb Ayers (16:45):
Keep it simple, yeah.
Yeah, so like, and even usingthe pipette to change the pH.
Give me one good story, onegood funny thing.
It could be funny, it could besad, it could be um I don't
know, whatever you want it tobe, but one one kind of
memorable good story during yourtime here.
Amy Turner (17:03):
Yeah, I think originally you were saying it
was a funny lab story.
There's nothing funny in thelab.
No funny business lab.
One thing I was saying, but themost humorous thing I could
think of was, you know, when thebig talk was the next great
cash crop for growers is goingto be industrial hemp.
And Virginia legalizedindustrial hemp.
People were so excited aboutit.
And um, the institute felt likewe needed to be looking at and
(17:27):
studying industrial hemp.
And so we started doing that.
And then out of our researchand interests, uh, we had what
we call industrial hemp summit.
And it the first one was it wascrazy.
People went, it went sold out.
It was quite an event.
People were crashing the gate.
There were people sneaking intrying to get in.
(17:48):
And and so we were likestanding at the doors, you know,
do you have do you have a past?
Can you and it was um it wasfunny just to to see how uh
enthusiastic people were abouthim.
Robert Chretien (18:01):
And they had to have a security guide first
year.
Amy Turner (18:04):
Right.
And after that first year, wewe had to have a person, uh, a
security guard here to help uskeep people out that hadn't paid
uh registration.
But um that's why that was oneof the most humorous things I
could think about because wejust were astounded that people
were that enthusiastic about itthat they would actually sneak
(18:25):
into an event.
Caleb Ayers (18:27):
But so there's really no funny business allowed
in the lab.
That's what you're saying.
Nothing funny ever happens inthe lab.
Robert Chretien (18:33):
Well, we also a lot of times we work by
ourselves, so we're notinteracting with anybody.
So there's not like a lot oflike you know, if I'm in a in
the greenhouse by myself, I'mnot joking around with anybody
because there's no one else Ineed to joke around with.
Caleb Ayers (18:47):
So you're not you're not in there talking to
yourself, cracking jokes, no,talking to the plants.
Aren't you supposed to talk toplants?
Isn't that a thing?
Amy Turner (18:55):
It is the theory out there, but really I've also
heard that it's because you'rebreathing CO2 onto the plant as
you're talking to it.
It's not that the plant'sactually benefiting from the
words we're saying.
Caleb Ayers (19:06):
Interesting.
Amy Turner (19:07):
So yeah.
Huh.
That's or it could be the factthat you're actually paying them
attention.
Right.
Caleb Ayers (19:14):
Um, what is the most unusual experiment you have
ever had to work on?
Amy Turner (19:20):
Black soldier fly larvae.
Oh, yeah.
Did you see those?
Caleb Ayers (19:24):
I don't think so.
Amy Turner (19:25):
Um recently, um, it's been in the last four or
five years.
Originally, Virginia Tech.
Dr.
Mike Evans wanted to look atblack soldierfly larvae, um
utilizing the larvae to get ridof greenhouse waste.
And then another company thatwe frequently do um contract
research with, they found out wewere working with black soldier
(19:47):
fly larvae, and they wanted tolook at using the larvae to
consume food waste.
So you've got the the larvae,which are maggots, and they're
in these large incubators, andyou're introducing either your
greenhouse waste or your foodhouse race, and they consume it.
And then those larvae areextremely nutrient-rich.
And then you can either sellthe product, if you're a grower
(20:09):
and and you're interested inthis, you can either either sell
the larvae to other growers,and it's a very high, high
protein creature, and that canbe fed to livestock.
A lot of some people will havethis nice circular system where
you know you've got a greenhousethat's producing excess
material that you can feed tothe larvae, and then the larvae
can be fed to your chickens.
(20:31):
So it's a it's it's a nicesystem, but they stink to high
heaven, and they were maggots,and they were big, fat, juicy
maggots.
But but it was interesting.
It was just one of those, likeyou said, a new project.
I had to completely start fromscratch.
Um, eventually I got to where Icould rear my own, you know,
the the larvae would eventuallyhatch into the black soldier
(20:51):
fly, and um, and then I was ableto get those flies to lay more
eggs and produce more larvae.
So I kind of got to look at thewhole cycle, which was which
was interesting, but they weresmelly.
Caleb Ayers (21:04):
Where was this happening?
Amy Turner (21:05):
In the greenhouse.
So I had the incubators in thegreenhouse.
Caleb Ayers (21:09):
Man, I'm sad I missed that.
Amy Turner (21:10):
That's yeah, I've got pictures.
I have pictures.
Caleb Ayers (21:13):
I was not expecting to hear the term big fat juicy
maggots on this on thisinterview.
So I that's a change up.
Amy Turner (21:20):
That was one of my most interesting.
Robert Chretien (21:23):
Um mine, I'd say Scott wanted to see if we
could use the endophytes forvarious purposes, and one of
them we wanted to see if wecould use them to as an
herbicide.
And so I I'd worked with somethe endophytes in tissue
culture, and some of them justlike killed the seedlings.
So then I tried growing thatbacteria up and spraying um
(21:44):
germinated seedlings with thebacteria.
It didn't work, but um itkilled them in tissue culture,
but when I tried it in thegreenhouse, just spraying
spraying them with the bacteria,it didn't work either.
Caleb Ayers (21:54):
Didn't work no.
Because pretty much theresearch we're doing now is
we're inoculating.
You're we're you what you'retalking about earlier, you're
inoculating the seeds.
We're not doing anything.
There's no other ways to applythose at this point, right?
Robert Chretien (22:06):
Yeah, we're inoculating, well, we let them
germinate.
We typically um she does it alittle bit differently
sometimes.
Typically we let themgerminate, but then we add a
mill of the inoculum to the umit's like a growth, like a foam.
So they grow in this it's likealmost like a sponge and it
(22:26):
absorbs the nutrients.
That's where the roots grow in.
So we add a mill of theinoculum into that sponge.
Okay.
But also Amy does it where shejust puts the inoculum on a
seed.
She do makes a little divot forthe seed and then puts the
bacteria.
Caleb Ayers (22:40):
But it's always early in the process.
Like it's it's what you guysare describing as well.
Either right away or a weekafter what they've germinated.
Yeah, that's all the questionsthat I think we'll we'll get to
today.
I think you guys clearly havesome some good.
I mean, you've been here awhile, have great institutional
knowledge.
And I think, you know, the thework that this research team
does as far as obviously we're,you know, you all are um working
(23:04):
on these experiments or onthese um on this work that you
know, we've we've had plenty ofpapers published in scientific
journals and things like that umthat you guys have have worked
on, but also, you know, workingdirectly with companies on on
specific projects and jointresearch.
There's a lot of, I guess, alot of partnership opportunities
for companies who are workingin agriculture in um in this
(23:26):
area.
So is there anything else thatyou all would want to add?
Anything that you think that'sespecially interesting about
working here or or your job?
Robert Chretien (23:36):
Uh there was one on something people probably
don't know that we do, or orsomething unusual that we do.
Um we probably don't know thatwe sift uh dirt.
So Amy gets dirt from uhlocally.
And then we sieve it to get outthe um large chunks of clay or
(24:00):
stones uh before it can be used.
So that's this is non-umhydroponic growth.
Sounds very fun.
Amy Turner (24:09):
Um well one thing I think it's is interesting is out
of our endophyte researchproject, um we actually have
companies that have licensedsome of our bacteria to develop
uh biopesticides.
I think one of the questionsyou had that we were gonna talk
about was, you know, what aresome of the things that that
(24:29):
we've accomplished that we mightbe most uh proud of?
And um I think there's andthere's a large interest in
biopesticides for these large agchemical companies.
And um, a few of thosecompanies have approached us um
because they've seen what wehave.
And so they're working onproducts, and that's really
exciting.
And hopefully they'll developsome great the next great
(24:52):
product and it'll be somethinggood for the environment and
hopefully be good good for theinstitute also.
Caleb Ayers (24:57):
Yeah, no, absolutely, and yeah, uh that's
a great way to tie that togetherthat you know the the work the
work that you all are doing ishaving an impact, you know.
That's to again to bring itback to that applied research.
These are things that are goingto be relevant either very in
the next very soon or arealready you know relevant right
now.
These you guys aren't aren'tdoing research for things that
(25:17):
might theoretically be beapplicable to industry in ten
years.
We're we're looking at thingsthat can be used right now.
So thank you guys for sharingyour stories.
I appreciate it.
Amy Turner (25:26):
Thank you.
You're welcome.
Alright, welcome to another episode of Inside IALR.
Thanks for being here forjoining us today.
We have a research divisionthat does a lot of very cool
work centered primarily aroundagriculture, and that's a mix of
research services that weprovide to companies as well as
our own research publicationsand things that we're
publishing.
So today we have two of ourlongtime research associates,
(00:40):
Rob Creeshan and Amy Turner.
Thank you guys for being here.
You guys have both been herefor more than a decade.
But to start, if you just kindof want to give us a rundown of
kind of how you ended up atIALR, whatever previous
experience you want to talkabout, and then kind of how you
ended up here.
Amy Turner (00:55):
Okay, so um I've been here almost 15 years, uh,
started in 2011.
Um and I first heard aboutIELR, I was actually at a soccer
practice amongst other soccermoms, and we had just moved back
to the area and I was lookingfor places to work, and one of
the other moms mentioned theinstitute, and she mentioned ag
(01:18):
research, and that was what mybackground was in.
So um, so yeah, it was just aconversation, and I was so
grateful to find a place that umthat I could apply my skills
and um was real happy to findthe institute.
Um I live in North Carolina, soI'll drive over the line into
Virginia to work.
(01:38):
So uh I felt very fortunate.
So 15 years.
Robert Chretien (01:41):
That's awesome.
What about for you, Rob?
So I came in October 2012 for astartup company.
One of the labs, well, it wasuh it used to be office space
and it was converted into labspace for a startup company.
And so that lasted for a yearand a half, the startup company,
and then there was an openingat the institute, so I just
(02:02):
transitioned from the startupcompany to working for the
institute.
So that was in June of 2014, iswhen I became an official
institute institute employee.
Caleb Ayers (02:11):
Yeah, there are um so for those who don't know, you
know, we've been around, Iguess, 23-ish years as far as
the Institute for AdvancedLearning and Research.
That's when we were founded.
We've been in this building,um, or our our main building for
21 years.
There are not there are a lotof people who have been here
less than you all have.
We'll we'll put it that way.
(02:32):
You guys are are some of theveterans on the block.
So what's kind of been, Iguess, in that time that you've
been here?
I know this a lot of thespecifics of our research have
changed during that time, butkind of big picture, talk about
kind of some of the stuff thatyou've worked on, the projects
that you've worked on uh duringthat time.
Amy Turner (02:51):
Well, when I first got here, we were mainly doing
theoretical research.
We were doing a lot of plant uhgenetic transformation uh and a
lot of tissue culture.
And I was originally hired as atissue plant tissue culture
technician, so mainly lab work.
Um over the years, we haveevolved uh evolved into
(03:12):
precision agriculture, and um weconsider our program an applied
research program, meaning um wewould like for the things we're
working on to be directlyapplicable to what our growers
need and want.
And um that's done through ourprecision ag program and um our
(03:34):
plant endophyte research, andum, which is really exciting,
and uh and we also now of coursecontrolled environmental ag.
So we've we're we've moved inthat space also.
Robert Chretien (03:48):
So when I started, I was working with
another um scientist, and hesince left.
So I was doing some molecularstuff for him and um doing some
pro running some protein gels,and then he left, and then I
started to work with Dr.
May.
And so then we started um ourfocus was whittled down to just
(04:10):
working with plant endophytes,and so um I started working off
with Dr.
May um another scientist wasisolating the endophytes, and
then me and Dr.
May would characterize them umto see if they had growth
promotion properties and thentest them and the greenhouse,
and so now we've kind of stoppedcollecting the endophytes, now
(04:31):
we're just focusing on workingwith them, and now we have the
CEA center, and so we're usingthe endophytes predominantly to
test growth promotion um inhydroponics in the CEA center.
Caleb Ayers (04:42):
On the endophytes, either one of you, can you kind
of give the the 30-secondelevator explanation of what
what a plant endophyte is andkind of what you guys are
working on to do with those?
Robert Chretien (04:54):
Beneficial bacteria that live in plants,
like our gut bacteria.
Initially people thoughtbacteria and plants were all
pathogens, but there's actuallybeneficial bacteria that help
them grow, acquire nutrients.
So um we focused on those asopposed to there's other
bacteria that are in the soil.
Our focus is on those bacteriathat are live inside the plants.
Caleb Ayers (05:16):
I know now, yeah, as you said, you know, we're not
collecting them, we're usingthis library we have.
What was that process like ofkind of going through?
We have 2,000 of these things.
Like, what was that processlike of characterizing and going
through and test doing all thatkind of testing?
Robert Chretien (05:28):
Well, the Amy's property was used to gather
plants, so they would you cantalk about that.
Amy Turner (05:33):
Yeah, so we um actually went out into the field
and collected plants.
We tried to select for plantsthat might be growing under
extreme environments.
You know, you sometimes you'llsee a weed growing in the middle
of a parking lot.
How you know, how is thatpossible?
Why why is that plant able tosurvive that environment?
(05:54):
Sometimes there may be abacteria within that plant that
can help it uh survive thatenvironment.
So we um actually collectedplants from the field, weeds,
uh, field crops.
Um we also collected someplants from Dr.
Lohmann's property, and thenthe plants are brought into the
(06:15):
lab, and then it's separatedinto roots, stems, and leaves.
Through a process in the labprocess, you can actually
extract that bacteria.
And then um, so Robert's got alot more knowledge as far as uh
the microbial work, um, and hecan talk about what they do once
that bacteria is extracted,what what kind of process it's
(06:37):
yeah.
Robert Chretien (06:38):
So the I didn't do most of it, but there was
another person here.
She would crush up the um grindup the roots and the leaves and
stems, and then you umcentrifuge the the large
material that don't centrifugedown the bacteria.
Then you take the supernatin,and then you have to dilute it
(06:58):
down so that when you plate it,you'll get individual colonies.
And then she would just lookfor physical differences, so
like different colors ordifferent shapes to try and
distinguish different ones soyou don't keep you know
culturing the same bacterium.
And so then you just look forphenotypic differences and then
isolate those and put them, andthen we put them in the minus 80
(07:20):
and store them and thencharacterize them to see um what
they could do to help theplants.
So we have like five differentassays.
It's like phosphatesolidization, uh hormone
synthesis um called IAA, um uhsiderophore activity of binds
iron, uh nitrogen fixation.
Amy Turner (07:42):
And what am I forgetting?
Well, we have we can also do wehave a plant pathologist on
staff, and he also utilizes thebacteria to see which ones are
effective against diseasedevelopment.
Robert Chretien (07:53):
Yeah.
And ACC DMase was the fifth onethat I forgot.
Caleb Ayers (07:57):
I've heard Scott Lohman talk about the the
phosphate one, some of some ofthose other things you said.
Amy Turner (08:04):
I have no clue what they mean, and we're gonna
they're all they're allbeneficial for plant growth.
Got it.
Yes, that I I just think.
And that's the important part.
And it and it's interestingbecause it, you know, you find
different bacteria in the rootsthat that may not be growing in
the the upper portion of theplant.
So that's why we divide the theplant up to see, you know,
(08:24):
what's living in the roots,what's living in the the shoots,
and what's in, and then alsodifferent times of the year.
So you may collect a plant inthe spring, and you've it's got
a certain reservoir of bacteriain the spring, you go back in
the fall and try and collectsome of the similar plant
material in the same locationand see if you've got a
different um a differentmicrobial community within the
(08:47):
plant.
It can it can change that much.
Caleb Ayers (08:50):
That's interesting.
(09:21):
What does a typical day looklike for our two best laboratory
research associates?
Robert Chretien (09:28):
And the only the only ones.
Caleb Ayers (09:30):
I was gonna leave that part out for my guys.
Robert Chretien (09:33):
So lately it's mostly germinate seeds, wait
till they grow, inoculate themwith endophytes, grow them in
hydroponics, the CEA, and thenharvest them, weigh them,
collect data to see if there'sgrowth promotion, whatever.
So that's kind of like repeatover and over again.
(09:53):
Yeah.
Amy Turner (09:54):
And when you've got plants growing in the greenhouse
or in the growth chambers, yourfirst priority every every day
is go check your plants.
And you might go out there andcheck them two or three times a
day just to see make sureeverything's growing well, doing
well.
And then we do a lot ofcleaning.
Our day uh involves a lot ofcleaning because uh greenhouse
sanitation is important, and ofcourse, lab laboratory
(10:17):
cleanliness is especially doingmicrobial work.
Um, we do you do a lot ofcleaning, but that's that's just
part of the job.
Caleb Ayers (10:24):
What's something you do that most people would be
surprised that someone in yourposition would do?
What's one one task or one typeof project or Amy covered that?
Robert Chretien (10:34):
I was thinking about that and um cleaning.
We use the dishwasher to cleanour glassware and stuff, so we
do a lot of wait, is there adishwasher up in the labs?
Yes.
I have not noticed.
Amy Turner (10:47):
It's a lab great uh dishwasher that uses resins to
to get the glasswork clean.
Robert Chretien (10:53):
We do lab work, but a good percentage of our
time is cleaning things.
Caleb Ayers (10:57):
I know during the summer we have a lot of interns
come in for our research teamand you all obviously work
closely with them.
When you're talking to thesestudents who are, you know,
obviously interested in in somelevel of research career.
What's kind of the whatmessages do you share with them?
What are kind of the thingsthat you share with them as far
as what this career is like, whythey should should or shouldn't
(11:19):
pursue a research career?
Amy Turner (11:21):
Really enjoy the opportunity to work with with
students.
And we um we'll have highschool students through college
students come in and working inum in the labs, and I think it's
a really good opportunity forkids in the region.
And I love to see that spark ofinterest, especially if if they
hadn't considered uh a careerin ag research.
(11:42):
So it's it's a lot of fun to tosee somebody think, hey, yeah,
this this might be something, orthe or maybe they're interested
in environmental sciences.
That that's a lot of fun.
Mainly, I think, is just youknow, look for those
opportunities throughinternships.
Anything you can do to get somejob skills is always my my main
(12:03):
piece of advice for students.
Robert Chretien (12:05):
Yeah, we get we get students that aren't
necessarily interested in plantstuff.
So they might be medicalstudents or something, so they
settle for doing an internshipwith us.
So they're not quite aspassionate about plants as some
of us are, but so they're justthey want just want lab skills.
Caleb Ayers (12:23):
Right.
What is y'all's favorite partabout your job?
Obviously, Rob, you justmentioned I could hear the
passion when you said we'repassionate about plants.
So I would imagine that thatthat factors in.
But what are some of the thefavorite some what are some of
y'all's favorite parts of yourjob?
Robert Chretien (12:36):
We produce edible crops, so like we get to
after if we don't have to drythem down, whatever, we get to
eat some of the stuff that wegrow.
So I like growing stuff andwatching it start off small and
get bigger and then harvest it.
Amy Turner (12:50):
We have a lot of variety in our day-to-day.
I enjoy that.
Um with each new project, youcan you may be learning
something new.
I enjoy learning something new,um, especially in CEA.
We're looking at a lot of uhnew and novel crops.
Um, we've had a greenhouse fullof edible flowers.
(13:10):
It was beautiful, it smelledgreat.
It was a great place to walkinto every day to see those
beautiful flowers.
Um, so I enjoy the variety.
I I like being in a bright,sunny greenhouse on a cold
winter day.
It it can be 40, 50 degreesoutside, but if it's bright and
sunny, it's 70, 80 in thegreenhouse.
It was a great place to be.
So those are some of myfavorites.
Robert Chretien (13:32):
Yeah, in the wintertime.
Right.
In the summertime, you don'tlike being in the greenhouse
very well.
Caleb Ayers (13:38):
Amy, you mentioned at the beginning that you know a
lot of what you guys did in thebeginning was more theoretical
research.
And now, I mean, uh the wholedivision is called applied
research.
Like that's that's very muchthe focus is how can we use
these things now?
I think that's cool to see.
And clearly, as you guys havetalked about, like you've worked
on a ton of different thingsover your career here as the
focus has shifted as the, as yousaid, bringing in endophytes,
(14:01):
bringing in precisionagriculture, bringing in CEA.
What has been the process likeof learning?
I would imagine a lot of newskills and new techniques.
What has that process been likeof having to essentially work
on different projects duringduring your time here?
Amy Turner (14:15):
That's true.
And and somewhat of mygeneration, sometimes I struggle
with the technology, but butand and that's really exciting
thing is a technology.
Precision ag technology, um,looking forward to you know how
are we gonna incorporate AI.
Um, we've talked a little bitabout that with uh I've had a
(14:35):
discussion with Dr.
Lohman about how to to utilizethat and what we're currently
doing.
So there's there's a lot ofexciting stuff.
Um, hopefully, all thistechnology is gonna make ag more
competitive.
You know, we've got to growmore more food for more people
on less available land.
So uh, you know, how are wegonna do it better in the field
(14:57):
uh to help us cover that is uhour is CEA is you know using
these indoor vertical farms tohelp feed people.
Um yeah, that's that's anexciting part of what we're
doing is is trying to utilizetechnology to accomplish the
things we need to do in ag.
Robert Chretien (15:14):
Yeah, when I first started, we would do stuff
in the lab characterizing thebacteria, and then we would move
to the greenhouse to see theenhanced growth, but we were
growing in um you know soillessmix.
And now we're mostly justgrowing in hydroponic systems.
So that was interesting tolearn because I had never worked
with hydroponics, so I got tolearn um and utilize that.
Caleb Ayers (15:36):
Right.
And for for anyone listeningwho doesn't know hydroponics,
that means the plant isessentially the roots are put
directly in the water.
What's your what's your eitheryour favorite or your most uh
most used tool?
And explain it because Iprobably won't know what it is.
Amy Turner (15:53):
Well, currently it's an ECPH meter.
So when you're working withhydroponics, it's very important
to check your um your nutrientsolution and your the pH and the
concentration of your nutrientsolutions.
Caleb Ayers (16:09):
So out there versus basic, is that correct?
I remembered something frombiological.
Amy Turner (16:14):
Plants grow healthiest at a certain you
know, certain pH.
We have multiple units outthere in the greenhouse and in
the vertical farm with multiplereservoirs and uh each one of
those reservoirs have to bechecked for ECPH.
So if we spend a lot of timedoing that, so uh that's an
important piece of equipmentthat we're utilizing daily.
Robert Chretien (16:36):
I would say that was gonna be my answer.
But I also but I also haveanother one as a pipette.
Every day I'm gonna do it.
Caleb Ayers (16:45):
Keep it simple, yeah.
Yeah, so like, and even usingthe pipette to change the pH.
Give me one good story, onegood funny thing.
It could be funny, it could besad, it could be um I don't
know, whatever you want it tobe, but one one kind of
memorable good story during yourtime here.
Amy Turner (17:03):
Yeah, I think originally you were saying it
was a funny lab story.
There's nothing funny in thelab.
No funny business lab.
One thing I was saying, but themost humorous thing I could
think of was, you know, when thebig talk was the next great
cash crop for growers is goingto be industrial hemp.
And Virginia legalizedindustrial hemp.
People were so excited aboutit.
And um, the institute felt likewe needed to be looking at and
(17:27):
studying industrial hemp.
And so we started doing that.
And then out of our researchand interests, uh, we had what
we call industrial hemp summit.
And it the first one was it wascrazy.
People went, it went sold out.
It was quite an event.
People were crashing the gate.
There were people sneaking intrying to get in.
(17:48):
And and so we were likestanding at the doors, you know,
do you have do you have a past?
Can you and it was um it wasfunny just to to see how uh
enthusiastic people were abouthim.
Robert Chretien (18:01):
And they had to have a security guide first
year.
Amy Turner (18:04):
Right.
And after that first year, wewe had to have a person, uh, a
security guard here to help uskeep people out that hadn't paid
uh registration.
But um that's why that was oneof the most humorous things I
could think about because wejust were astounded that people
were that enthusiastic about itthat they would actually sneak
(18:25):
into an event.
Caleb Ayers (18:27):
But so there's really no funny business allowed
in the lab.
That's what you're saying.
Nothing funny ever happens inthe lab.
Robert Chretien (18:33):
Well, we also a lot of times we work by
ourselves, so we're notinteracting with anybody.
So there's not like a lot oflike you know, if I'm in a in
the greenhouse by myself, I'mnot joking around with anybody
because there's no one else Ineed to joke around with.
Caleb Ayers (18:47):
So you're not you're not in there talking to
yourself, cracking jokes, no,talking to the plants.
Aren't you supposed to talk toplants?
Isn't that a thing?
Amy Turner (18:55):
It is the theory out there, but really I've also
heard that it's because you'rebreathing CO2 onto the plant as
you're talking to it.
It's not that the plant'sactually benefiting from the
words we're saying.
Caleb Ayers (19:06):
Interesting.
Amy Turner (19:07):
So yeah.
Huh.
That's or it could be the factthat you're actually paying them
attention.
Right.
Caleb Ayers (19:14):
Um, what is the most unusual experiment you have
ever had to work on?
Amy Turner (19:20):
Black soldier fly larvae.
Oh, yeah.
Did you see those?
Caleb Ayers (19:24):
I don't think so.
Amy Turner (19:25):
Um recently, um, it's been in the last four or
five years.
Originally, Virginia Tech.
Dr.
Mike Evans wanted to look atblack soldierfly larvae, um
utilizing the larvae to get ridof greenhouse waste.
And then another company thatwe frequently do um contract
research with, they found out wewere working with black soldier
(19:47):
fly larvae, and they wanted tolook at using the larvae to
consume food waste.
So you've got the the larvae,which are maggots, and they're
in these large incubators, andyou're introducing either your
greenhouse waste or your foodhouse race, and they consume it.
And then those larvae areextremely nutrient-rich.
And then you can either sellthe product, if you're a grower
(20:09):
and and you're interested inthis, you can either either sell
the larvae to other growers,and it's a very high, high
protein creature, and that canbe fed to livestock.
A lot of some people will havethis nice circular system where
you know you've got a greenhousethat's producing excess
material that you can feed tothe larvae, and then the larvae
can be fed to your chickens.
(20:31):
So it's a it's it's a nicesystem, but they stink to high
heaven, and they were maggots,and they were big, fat, juicy
maggots.
But but it was interesting.
It was just one of those, likeyou said, a new project.
I had to completely start fromscratch.
Um, eventually I got to where Icould rear my own, you know,
the the larvae would eventuallyhatch into the black soldier
(20:51):
fly, and um, and then I was ableto get those flies to lay more
eggs and produce more larvae.
So I kind of got to look at thewhole cycle, which was which
was interesting, but they weresmelly.
Caleb Ayers (21:04):
Where was this happening?
Amy Turner (21:05):
In the greenhouse.
So I had the incubators in thegreenhouse.
Caleb Ayers (21:09):
Man, I'm sad I missed that.
Amy Turner (21:10):
That's yeah, I've got pictures.
I have pictures.
Caleb Ayers (21:13):
I was not expecting to hear the term big fat juicy
maggots on this on thisinterview.
So I that's a change up.
Amy Turner (21:20):
That was one of my most interesting.
Robert Chretien (21:23):
Um mine, I'd say Scott wanted to see if we
could use the endophytes forvarious purposes, and one of
them we wanted to see if wecould use them to as an
herbicide.
And so I I'd worked with somethe endophytes in tissue
culture, and some of them justlike killed the seedlings.
So then I tried growing thatbacteria up and spraying um
(21:44):
germinated seedlings with thebacteria.
It didn't work, but um itkilled them in tissue culture,
but when I tried it in thegreenhouse, just spraying
spraying them with the bacteria,it didn't work either.
Caleb Ayers (21:54):
Didn't work no.
Because pretty much theresearch we're doing now is
we're inoculating.
You're we're you what you'retalking about earlier, you're
inoculating the seeds.
We're not doing anything.
There's no other ways to applythose at this point, right?
Robert Chretien (22:06):
Yeah, we're inoculating, well, we let them
germinate.
We typically um she does it alittle bit differently
sometimes.
Typically we let themgerminate, but then we add a
mill of the inoculum to the umit's like a growth, like a foam.
So they grow in this it's likealmost like a sponge and it
(22:26):
absorbs the nutrients.
That's where the roots grow in.
So we add a mill of theinoculum into that sponge.
Okay.
But also Amy does it where shejust puts the inoculum on a
seed.
She do makes a little divot forthe seed and then puts the
bacteria.
Caleb Ayers (22:40):
But it's always early in the process.
Like it's it's what you guysare describing as well.
Either right away or a weekafter what they've germinated.
Yeah, that's all the questionsthat I think we'll we'll get to
today.
I think you guys clearly havesome some good.
I mean, you've been here awhile, have great institutional
knowledge.
And I think, you know, the thework that this research team
does as far as obviously we're,you know, you all are um working
(23:04):
on these experiments or onthese um on this work that you
know, we've we've had plenty ofpapers published in scientific
journals and things like that umthat you guys have have worked
on, but also, you know, workingdirectly with companies on on
specific projects and jointresearch.
There's a lot of, I guess, alot of partnership opportunities
for companies who are workingin agriculture in um in this
(23:26):
area.
So is there anything else thatyou all would want to add?
Anything that you think that'sespecially interesting about
working here or or your job?
Robert Chretien (23:36):
Uh there was one on something people probably
don't know that we do, or orsomething unusual that we do.
Um we probably don't know thatwe sift uh dirt.
So Amy gets dirt from uhlocally.
And then we sieve it to get outthe um large chunks of clay or
(24:00):
stones uh before it can be used.
So that's this is non-umhydroponic growth.
Sounds very fun.
Amy Turner (24:09):
Um well one thing I think it's is interesting is out
of our endophyte researchproject, um we actually have
companies that have licensedsome of our bacteria to develop
uh biopesticides.
I think one of the questionsyou had that we were gonna talk
about was, you know, what aresome of the things that that
(24:29):
we've accomplished that we mightbe most uh proud of?
And um I think there's andthere's a large interest in
biopesticides for these large agchemical companies.
And um, a few of thosecompanies have approached us um
because they've seen what wehave.
And so they're working onproducts, and that's really
exciting.
And hopefully they'll developsome great the next great
(24:52):
product and it'll be somethinggood for the environment and
hopefully be good good for theinstitute also.
Caleb Ayers (24:57):
Yeah, no, absolutely, and yeah, uh that's
a great way to tie that togetherthat you know the the work the
work that you all are doing ishaving an impact, you know.
That's to again to bring itback to that applied research.
These are things that are goingto be relevant either very in
the next very soon or arealready you know relevant right
now.
These you guys aren't aren'tdoing research for things that
(25:17):
might theoretically be beapplicable to industry in ten
years.
We're we're looking at thingsthat can be used right now.
So thank you guys for sharingyour stories.
I appreciate it.
Amy Turner (25:26):
Thank you.
You're welcome.
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