Watch Collecting as Legacy Treasures: Timepieces for Retirement Generations

Episode Transcript
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(00:50):
Aloha Inspired Money Maker. Let's I
want to thank you for tuning in. If this is your first time here, welcome.
If you're returning, welcome back. Let's all be inspired money
makers together. Imagine this. You're cleaning out
an old drawer and you find a small, familiar box
inside a watch, worn, a little

(01:12):
scratched but still ticking. It's the same watch you remember
seeing your grandfather wearing every Sunday at family
dinners. Instantly, a flood of memories rush in,
not just of him, but of moments, lessons, laughter,
and time itself, somehow preserved in that simple
object. In a world where so much is disposable,

(01:36):
a watch can mean far more than just keeping the time. It's
a legacy, a bridge between generations, a symbol of
what endures when trends fade in years past.
This is our fifth watch episode on Inspired Money
and I never expected that having these conversations with
watch experts would result in my grandfather's

(01:58):
watch finding its way to me. It's a
1940s rose gold Rolex bubble Back.
It was inherited by my cousin Fred when our
grandfather passed away. And my cousin has an
enviable watch collection. So when we had
lunch a few months ago, he said, you know what? I never

(02:20):
wear that bubble back. And I also don't have a
son. I think I'll pass it on to you. Just promise
that you'll pass it on to your son. So I made that
promise. The watch is now not on my wrist
today because I locked it up and I didn't have time to grab it. But
today we're exploring watch collecting, not as just a hobby

(02:42):
or an investment, but as a way to create and pass on timeless
treasures. How do timepieces become an heirloom?
What makes them worth preserving, wearing, and eventually handing
down? And how can today's collectors think about
building collections that honor the past and also look to the
future? We have an incredible guest panel

(03:04):
lined up, experts who live and breathe this world of
craftsmanship, storytelling and legacy. Whether you're a
seasoned collector, someone considering
a first purchase of a special watch, or just someone who loves
the idea of time captured in a small work of art, I
hope that you'll stay with us today. Before we jump in, I've

(03:26):
been spending a lot of time on LinkedIn. Shout out to the
LinkedIn fam if you're watching this LinkedIn Live. I recently hit
a milestone surpassing 18,000 followers there.
So I've been posting daily market wrap up videos
that surprisingly have garnered something crazy like
more than 18 million impressions over the last year.

(03:49):
So I'd love to connect with you. If you're on LinkedIn, find me
at Advisor Andy or just search Andy Wong
Wang Advisor and you can test out LinkedIn's
search capability. But I'd love to connect with you there.
Now let's welcome in our incredible panelists for today's
discussion. Joining us is Paul Boutros,

(04:11):
Deputy Chairman and Head of Watches, Americas at Philips. He's
a lifelong watch enthusiast with a background in
electrical engineering. And since joining Philips in
2014, he's helped build one of the most respected
watch departments in the world. You might know him best for
leading the record breaking sale of Paul Newman's Rolex Daytona

(04:33):
for $17.8 million. Paul, welcome to the
show. Thank you so much, Andy. A pleasure to
be here. And I hear May 2025
marks Philip's 10 year anniversary. Yes,
10 years since we held our first auction in Geneva in May
2015. And this year, yes, we

(04:55):
are celebrating our 10 year anniversary and we'll celebrate it in a
bigger fashion I think come the fall. Exciting.
Next up we have Stephen Pulvirent. He's a writer,
photographer and creative director whose career spans
Hodinkee, Bloomberg and surface media. Today he's the founder of
Rhyme and Reason, a creative agency based in Los

(05:17):
Angeles. He's also the founder of the Enthusiasts,
a podcast and newsletter about watch collecting culture.
Stephen, great to have you with us. Hey, great to be here.
Thanks so much for having me. With us today is Tariq
Malik, founder of Momentum, Dubai's premier destination
for vintage and collectible watches. From dealing swatch

(05:39):
watches at age 16 to becoming one of the world's leading
authorities on vintage day dates, Tariq has helped put
Dubai on the global horology map. Tariq, welcome and
thank you for joining us at this late hour where you are. Hi
Andy, thank you very much for inviting me. And he's still in
the shop, so he's working.

(06:01):
And joining our panel, I think for the fourth time is Dan
Spitz, a third generation master watchmaker, former
lead guitarist of legendary metal band
Anthrax, Dan holds both Swiss and American credentials
in watchmaking and micromechanical engineering.
His career includes roles as headmaster watchmaker for

(06:23):
Chopard and juror for the Grand Prix,
the Lingerie de Geneve. Dan, thrilled to have you back.
Thank you for having me and hello to everybody. Glad to be here. Once
again we're going to have a lot of fun talking
about watches passion and
I think trends in the industry. So let's jump right in and go

(06:45):
to segment one. Timepieces carry more than the time
they hold Memories and stories that bridge generations.
Watches passed down within families are more than functional
objects. They're heirlooms imbued with the experiences of those
who wore them before. Each scratch and mark can be a reminder of
shared milestones, from graduations to promotions, creating

(07:07):
a sense of connection across time. Collectors often share
stories of pieces worn by parents or grandparents. Like a
Rolex explorer worn daily after graduation or an
Omega constellation inherited from a grandfather. Such
watches become cherished family icons, symbolizing
resilience, achievement, and the bonds of legacy. As

(07:28):
gifts for special occasions, they become lasting tokens of
accomplishments and family pride. In watch collecting, the
value isn't solely in craftsmanship, but in the emotions and memories
woven into each timepiece, making them treasured links between the
past, present, and future.

(07:51):
So before we start, a shout out to Stephen. I want to thank
him for sharing some of the stills that are
featured in today's segments, and they are his. His. His
photographs. So thank you, Stephen, for that. Stephen, I'll start with
you. How has storytelling shaped your relationship with
watches? Yeah, I mean, I got

(08:13):
into watches and the watch industry as a. As a
journalist. I was, you know, before that, writing mostly about
menswear. And for me, stories were
a way to learn about this. You know, it was. It was the stories that
watches carry, to me have always been the most compelling part of
this. I love the products themselves. I love watchmaking

(08:34):
as a science and an artist. But to me, it's really the
stories that watches carry, the stories we tell ourselves
about the watches we own and the roles they play in our lives
that kind of elevates them beyond, you know, ordinary, everyday
things and makes them special objects. Yeah.
Kind of nice that it's the celebration of, like, human

(08:56):
ingenuity in this time of, like, digital everything,
right? Yeah, absolutely. And, you know, as
somebody who is, you know, completely addicted to my smartphone
and had my attention span completely ruined by
Instagram. Yeah, it's nice to have something
that's not that. Something that's mechanical, that encourages

(09:18):
you to slow down, to think long term.
It's a nice kind of antidote to what everything else in our lives
is trying to get us to do. It's nice that the two things can
coexist. Paul, tell us about the relationship that you
had with your dad and how watches bring forth some of
your happiest memories together.

(09:41):
It all started because of my father, who was a
collector of many different things.
I got the collecting bug from him. We started collecting coins
together, and I was collecting baseball cards. And then one day, after
a coin show in 1986. We're walking on Fifth Avenue in
Manhattan during the Christmas holiday season and

(10:03):
he stopped by a watch boutique. It was Wempe when it was on the other
side of fifth Avenue to where it is today. And inside the,
the vitrines, I saw these small objects with these big
price tags and they were watches. $10,000,
$25,000, $100,000. I couldn't believe
this world that I was, I was looking at. And

(10:25):
yeah, we had this amazing retail experience where
a wonderful sales lady invited us in and took an
interest in my interest and showed me an IWC pocket watch that had a
retail price of $23,000. And it was love at first sight
when she opened up the case back and showed me the movement. And, you
know, my dad and I had a sort of turbulent

(10:48):
relationship. He came from a different country, we had
a significant age gap. But when
it came to the subject of watches, it was always just
happy memories, peace and joy. And we
would hunt the world for watches together. After that first experience, discovering
watches together. You were the research guy

(11:10):
and he was bankrolling this joint project.
Yes, exactly. So I did everything I
could to learn as much as I could about watches back in the days before
the Internet. And I would call these brands, you
know, the advertisements in New York Times or Wall Street Journal where Audemars Piguet
or Patek Philippe had an advertisement. I'd call the numbers listed and

(11:32):
here's a 10 year old kid, or maybe I was 11, asking for a
catalog to be sent to us. And then, you know, going to the
library, getting books on, on watches and learning the hard way. And then we go
to flea markets, we would go to auctions together. And
yeah, he would say, hey, this is a good watch, you should
buy it. And sure enough, we made many mistakes because he

(11:53):
listened to me as a kid with little information.
But it was such a joy going out there
and hunting together. And you could just imagine when we found something
great, how much happiness. And we would be high fiving and talking
about it at dinner for years to come.
I love that it brought you and your dad closer together.

(12:17):
Dan, I think you can relate to Paul's experience
looking at that first movement. Right. Tell us about the family
stories that are embedded in your watchmaking journey. Well,
I think. And you started off with your story. You know what that
Olbat means to you. And this
is what makes watch collecting, mechanical watch

(12:39):
collecting now so prevalent because none of us need watch.
We have time all around us now with digital. So it's become
more of a twofold. One is what we've
been talking about already, which is to bring back the memories of vintage
watches or whatever, the stories they hold, and.
And also the more modern indies that brought

(13:01):
watchmaking more into watchmaking art, which is
like, there's no dial on the front of the watch. It kind of showed me
what you could do as a. As a master watchmaker. But what I do
here is a whole different perspective of what you gentlemen
are going to talk about. Because the reason I run this workshop here
in Delray beach, it's a very affluent area, is to

(13:23):
bring back those stories that you gentlemen are talking about
that have been long gone. Because in my country here,
there's not many people like me that have the skill
set to revive vintage watches where there is
no more parts to be had anywhere on planet Earth. So they have to be
manufactured, wheels, pinions, screws,

(13:45):
everything to bring back that memory. So I get people
who come in here first, and they tell me their story,
and they have their beater watch on. It's a Rolex, usually, and
nobody can fix it correctly. And then I fix it correctly for them,
and they're kind of blown away. And they say, hey, in my safe, I have
three or four paddocks for my dad and his dad. They've been

(14:07):
sitting there for 40, 50 years. I brought into three different watchmakers,
and they just. It never ran right. They're just horrible watchmakers. And we just
gave up. And. And then they trust me because
my credentials are a little bit weird in this country.
And I do their first paddock, and they. You could see the
first time I hand it to them, and it's. You know, the second

(14:29):
hand is moving or whatnot. I could see the flashback that you
gentlemen talk about. Those stories just, bam, it's hitting them. And some of
them cry. You know, they saw. They. You can see they want to reach out
and, like, hug me, and that's why I do what I do. That. That love.
It's like, it's. It's not a watch. It's a tangible
moment in time that somebody went, for

(14:51):
instance, Similar story. Here's a local collector that.
That he's got 30, I think 30 watches
that he collected with his dad. So this is one of them
here. This is one of them here. They've just been
sitting there. He's now a collector. He's passed away. They've been sitting in the
safe. So he entrusts me to bring back those memories.

(15:14):
And that's what mechanical watches do. From my
standpoint. And if I can bring back some of that love to those people
who've given up, you know, they have an old man on the moon, watch him
there, only 70s or 60s or whatever it was. And you
know, it's just trash. And then revive
it and bring back those memories, it's with us. And

(15:35):
then we can pass that on to the next generation. And I have the
same thing my grand. I grew up with my grandfather's store in the Catskill
Mountains, the largest vintage watch collection in the United
States. So I grew up around all those memories too, with my dad,
and I have those memories. But I'd like to bring a more
watchmaking perspective of what other people like me around the world

(15:57):
and my friends can do in the individual world who are
trained in Switzerland, at schools like wosa, where we can revive
watches that were given up on and bring back memories that were given
up on. I love that these watches can come out
of the safe and be worn again. So
great that you're doing that work. Tariq, your interest in watches began

(16:20):
with trading Swatch watches when you were, I think, a
teenager. Can you tell us how that grew into a love for
Rolex and other watches and you starting your own
shop? Well, I wouldn't say
it was. It was an interesting part of my life. I think it wasn't really
the love for the watch itself. I'll be honest and say

(16:42):
that my brother at the time, he said,
my eldest brother, he said, like, he was always a business minded, personally
said, guys, go and buy a Swatch watch. You know,
and this particular one, it was the Goldfinger, go and buy it and
put it away. And you had to
subscribe to win a raffle to have

(17:04):
to take part in a raffle so you can actually win the
authorization to buy that watch. So I was like, what is
that? Usually when I want to buy a Casio, I'll just go buy a Casio.
No. He said, no, this is different. You know, the market is very strong. A
lot of people are looking for these. This was during the
international Swatch collectors boom in the early

(17:24):
90s, 1991, I think it started. So I
was fortunate enough to win one of those raffles
together with my twin brother. He had another one. So we
had the authorization to go and buy this watch. It was out of
our mind. Like we didn't understand how you have to win a raffle to buy
a watch anyways. We did so. And that time where there was no Internet

(17:48):
and the world was like connected in
itself, like not you. How can I say? You were not connected to the world.
You're connected to your local community. And this was like more or less through a
newspaper. So we bought. Every Saturday, we bought the newspaper
and looked if there was people buying or selling
these Swatch watches. And believe it or not, and we found

(18:09):
this and we went and and spoke to those
people. We didn't sell the watch, we just spoke about it. What is so
special about these? We have these watches, but we don't know what these are. And
they said, you know, there's a collector's market and these are traded and they
go up in value. And we're like, oh, wow, 16. You know, we want to
make money. You know, you don't think, really, I'll be very honest, you don't think

(18:30):
about a passion for watches at the age of 16. So this was very
attractive. So what we. What did we do? We went. That time I was living
in Germany, so instead of the local newspaper, we bought the big newspapers
from Munich and Dusseldorp and Frankfurt, the bigger cities.
And boom. We found an advert for a
Swatch show, something like the IWGs now in the

(18:52):
US that was a Swatch show. And we're like, okay, let's do it. It's like
150km away. So my dad drove us
there and we proudly took our watches
there. And we open, we pay the 5 German marks admission
and we go in and there's hundreds of dealers on
tables and trading these watch watches and running around

(19:13):
with cash wrapped in rubber bands. We like, oh,
my God, you know? And
so we became interested. What are people trading? What are people
buying? What are they paying for that? What are paying for that? All these watches,
we've never seen them before, except for the two which me and my twin brother
had. So anyways, we came back with

(19:34):
me having doubled my money and my brother having him having him having
tripled his money. But we came out with a
big memory. We kind of photographed all the watches we saw and
their values in our minds because we didn't have the iPhone to snap the
photos and we didn't take a camera. And then we started looking for these
watches. And then we found out that some of those watches are still available at

(19:56):
the Swatch retailer. So we went, okay, dad, can you borrow us money? We
need some more money. He said, okay, take some. He was always very supportive
of these things. And we went to this watch, we said, okay, we'll
take five of these and five of these and seven of these, and
they're like, no, no, no. You can only buy one of these
watches. Each person, only one watch. We couldn't

(20:19):
understand, but kind of made sense. So, you know, as youngsters, okay,
friends all together. You, then you, then you, though. Here's
the cash. Go buy this. Go buy this. Go buy this. We collected all
those watches. I don't know. I don't know how many were. 15, 20 watches in
the first batch. All were still available watches. We're not speaking about discontinued
older models. That's what we got later in. And my

(20:41):
dad watched us there and then he said, like,
I bought you something. I bought you a Plexiglas
briefcase so you can look through it. That
means we'll go to the next show. But you're not going to spend money on
the table because you want to sell your watches so you could
take a table. You just going to take the briefcase. And because the watch watches

(21:02):
are wrapped in these plastic covers,
making the watch visible, you can walk through the show and make your
deals. And this is what we did. And we came back with a stack of
money. So this was at the age of 16.
And so fast forward, we kept going
to these shows, we kept meeting private people, kept buying, like all

(21:25):
the newspapers you could buy to find people who are looking for
these and sometimes also who are selling these. And
I'm just trading, trading, trading. Anyways,
there was a lag. I mean, there wasn't a show for these every
week, nor every month. Like every two months, three months, there was a show.
So we said, okay, we need to find a channel where we can sell these

(21:47):
watches. Also in the interim, where
there's no show. So in our town in Aachen in Germany, there
was a small shop in the town center where we actually saw
them displaying those collectible
watches. Not speaking about this watch dealer, this collectible watches in the window,
we're like, oh, they're selling those. So we went inside and we said, are they

(22:09):
for sale? Yes, they're for sale. And would you sell our watches?
We'll give you a commission. And they said, yeah, why not? So we left them
there. And every Saturday we would go and check on the watches and what
was being sold. Take the cash, bring some more watches and so on,
and fast forward
this whole collector's boom a

(22:32):
few years later, two, three years later, it. It burst.
Yeah, like everything that flies too high comes down, it burst. All the
watches were available at retail. Nobody needed us dealers anymore.
So the good thing is that at the young age, you don't also
think of that long term. So we sold all the watches. We didn't get
into losses and so on. What we wanted then is like to

(22:55):
learn more about watches. So we said, would you give us a job at
the shop where we were selling the watches for us? And they gave us a
job so you can learn trading watches. And that was like watches, Swiss watches.
I'm not speaking about Rolex, this Omega, like
some watch brands. So this is where we started
learning about watches. And that's where we also got a little bit passionate about the

(23:17):
watch itself rather than the trading. And fast
forward, the owners of the shop had like a dispute
and they said, guys, we're closing the shop
down. Sorry you're losing your job, but this
is how it is. And a month later, they tried to sell
the shop. Nobody bought the shop. They came to us and said, would you buy

(23:39):
the shop? Do you want to buy the shop? I mean, you know, everything inside
out. You know our clients, you know how we operate and all these things. And
we're like, we're 21. My twin brother, me, we're 21. We
cannot afford shop. And
I don't know how it happened, but with the support of my parents at that
time, we bought the shop and six months later we

(24:00):
relaunched the whole business. I love it. I love the
perspective through a sales lens and the sales
innovation with the see through briefcase.
Let's, let's go to segment 2. Horology
segment of watchmaking blends centuries of innovation with
precision engineering. From early mechanical movements powered

(24:22):
by gears and springs to the quartz revolution of the
1970s, advancements in watch technology
have continually redefined accuracy and
craftsmanship. Today, watches feature diverse
mechanisms. Manual wind for a classic touch,
automatic for convenience, and quartz for precise, low
maintenance timekeeping. Hybrid movements such as Seiko's

(24:46):
Spring Drive combine mechanical and quartz elements for
unique performance. Watch complications like chronographs,
perpetual calendars and tourbillons demonstrate skill and
creativity, transforming watches into multifunctional tools
and aesthetic marvels. Brands like Rolex Patek
Philippe and Audemars Piguet showcase mastery in each

(25:08):
piece with examples like the Rolex Submariner and Patek
Philippe Grand Complications offering exemplary durability
and intricate design. Recognizing these elements
enriches appreciation for timepieces as both technological
achievements and artistic legacies.

(25:30):
Dan, as the watchmaker, take us inside the watch for a
moment. Are there micro mechanical innovations
that still blow your mind?
There's a lot of innovation going on just the last 20 years
or so with silicon hairsprings. Anyone
that's shopping for a Modern watch knows that they keep way better time.

(25:55):
You have the coaxial escapement that's in Omegas, developed by a
British gentleman named George Daniels, which
he took around most of the big companies first. And they were
like, you're denied. Deny, deny, you're British. You can't have an
invention on a Swiss watch. It's. It is the best and we can't
top it, but we're not putting that in our watch. I think he went to

(26:16):
Patek first, was the story, and then he stuffed it into his
personal Rolex just to show them like it can be done.
See, so this innovation is always innovation,
but in the past, you know, we had Breguet, who has his name on just
about everything. So I
deal mainly with vintage, and

(26:38):
I love vintage, because when wristwatches began,
it was more like, how do we miniaturize a pocket watch and strap it to
our wrist? So the watches were built at a
time where we were also in a mindset of how
do we make things that will last for centuries and centuries?
Because every, even a little kid at 8 years old, he didn't leave the house

(27:00):
without a watch on. He needed to know what time it was to come back,
even if he was just playing at the end of his driveway and he had
to come back in for lunch or whatever it was. So the
things had to take a beating. And everything inside the watch, from a
mechanical standpoint, is made. So which means I can
manufacture wheels and pinions to

(27:20):
older watches, Patek Philippe and so forth
here in my workshop with all the stuff that I have here.
The more modern watches have been designed more inside a computer, into
CAD and cam and then CNC and edm, wire erosion
machines and spark erosion machines. So everything
has been made more precise, but the wheels, opinions and parts are

(27:43):
thinner and thinner and thinner to make a thinner watch. And a lot of these
parts are not going to be able to be remanufactured
60, 80 years from now. Meaning if you buy more modern
watch, if the company decides they would not like to sell you those parts 60
years from now, then it's landfill. And that's the
disturbing part that I think people should be aware of when they're shopping for

(28:04):
watches. And another reason why vintage watches have just
skyrocketed in price and just booming,
you know, because, I mean, we have watches like you just showed, like, like
Audemars Piguet, right? So you have the old time, you know,
the micro rotor that winds, you know, this one's
solid gold. When you wear your Watch, you don't have to wind it anymore.

(28:26):
You have, you know, Rolexes with
crazy, crazy dials, but they're sealed in the back
and they're waterproof and fashionable. Then you
have man on the moon, Omega type stuff. Sorry,
it's backwards, you know, also sealed back. But this one is, I
did a restoration on, this one is early 70s. So

(28:49):
you have your pick of what you want to go
for. So if you don't go for modern, how do you find. And you don't
want vintage, you're kind of stuck, right? I don't
want the hassles of vintage because then you have to deal with someone like me
to pay for restorations. But now the modern watches, they don't really appeal
to me. So what do you do? So there is something that people should be

(29:10):
aware of, like something which is very rare, like a man on the
moon, where Omega actually reproduces
the Lamania chronograph movement that's in here that was developed in the
late 30s. It's the same movement that's in Patrick and other,
other brands as well back then. So this is basically, you can
go buy a new version of this watch. So you're

(29:32):
buying a brand new vintage watch and it has now they put
the coaxial escapement and the silicon aspect and just hopped it up a little
bit. It's one of the few companies that is producing a brand new
vintage watch. So if you buy an Omega, a certain
model, because they have many models that has the Lamania in it, or they now
produce the 321, which is the watch that went to the moon

(29:54):
in exact specification these, it's like, it's like you're going back in time and
buying something from the late 30s, early 40s, and that will last centuries and
centuries. And the bonus here is what how I
try to guide my all my collectors
is that I can make any part to this watch
here in my facility, any and every part. If they decide they don't want to

(30:16):
sell parts anymore to anybody, this watch will, will keep
going and keep taking by any traditional training or
watchmakers. And that's the worrisome part that I
guide people with nowadays to be careful what you purchase to make sure
that that story of you can pass this on for generations and
generations is not a lot of bullshit, pardon my

(30:38):
language. In the more modern pieces,
there is a little, you know, there's some shady stuff going on and some
know how and knowledge that everyone should know, such as silicon haspins.
They're wonderful. I keep better time in position.
When I time watches in different positions, they're extremely
accurate. But in 80 years, if someone who

(31:01):
shouldn't be inside your watch that calls himself a watchmaker and he's just
learned his craft on YouTube, which you can't learn this on YouTube, and he's
poking around and poached that hairspring and now it's all out of whack and mangle,
which is a lot of work nowadays. You're not going to be able to
get that hairspring material ever and make a new hairspring
and get the watch going again like we do for the pocket watches,

(31:23):
museum pieces and so forth. That watch is going to just be
landfill again. So be careful what you choose. Consult your
watchmaker, especially if you're spending a lot of money investing in
vintage watches. Good cautionary tale and thank you for the watch
porn. Paul, how do you evaluate
craftsmanship when authenticating rare watches?

(31:47):
Oh yeah, that's a good question.
It really takes experience to understand what
is truly quality and what's not so
great. There are levels, of course, and there are
levels of quality at the price point at different price points. And so what
I'm looking for, especially if I'm considering newer watches for my own personal

(32:10):
collection or advising collection clients on what next to
purchase, you know, I'm looking for excellence at the
price. So, you know, there's mass produced watches mass
produced with excellence and there are handmade watches with
excellence. And so I look for brands that are
pushing the state of the art of watchmaking with their own original

(32:32):
designs and, you
know, truly focused on making a
precise timekeeper. So that's
as far as quality goes.
The second part of your question was authentication.
And so that is examining

(32:55):
details. So when you're
examining a watch, they speak to you and when everything
is correct, the watch sings to you. So you're looking
for, you're looking first at the serial number, of course, to see when
the watch was manufactured. And you expect the watch to have
certain features. So say it's a watch from the 1970s and it has

(33:17):
luminous material. The luminous material should be tritium and under
UV light it should react a certain way.
The designation at 6 o'clock, say Swiss made or T.
Swiss T or Swiss t less than
25. All of those things are details
that changed over time and you want to make sure

(33:40):
that it's correct for that era. The case serial
number should be, you know, matching the dial
era and pushers and crown, you
know, those are replaceable but you hope to find original
pushers and crown and crowns. We're
always looking for well preserved watches. It's similar to collecting

(34:01):
cars. You know, a car as close to brand new condition
is the ideal. So the less miles it has, the better quality car
it is. And it's similar with watches. The less it's been worn,
the closer it is to new, the more desirable it is and the less
problems you'll have with it.
Stephen, provide us with some context. There are

(34:24):
like the big premier brands, but there's also a rise
of affordable indies. What do we need to know?
Oh, I think you're muted. Sorry about that. Yeah, I mean, I think,
you know, there's the rise of indies at all price points. I think
we've seen an explosion of more affordable independent

(34:47):
brands over the last number of years. And, and by independent, we just
mean not owned by a huge global
conglomerate, you know, not owned by LVMH or
Richemont, who own, you know, kind of the vast majority of the
household names. But we've seen
a huge surge in high end independent watchmaking as

(35:08):
well over the last, let's say maybe two decades.
And I think it just speaks to the diverse
needs and wants of customers. You know, you still have
customers who, you know, for them a Rolex is all they'll,
they'll ever want or need. You have customers who,
all they want is Patek Philippe. You have customers who buy a variety of

(35:30):
watches, but they want to buy, you know, brands that will get
recognized on the street or maybe have longer
histories. But then you have customers who don't. You have customers who want something
different. You have customers who want something maybe more expressive.
You have customers who want to meet the person whose name is on the
dial. And I think it's really wonderful that over the

(35:52):
last decade or two, we've seen the market
diversify, we've seen the industry diversify. And now if
you're interested in watches, kind of no matter where your interests
lie, what your budget is, there's something really cool out there
for you. And I'll just speak personally. You know, when I
first got interested in this, you know, maybe 15 years

(36:14):
ago, a little less than 15 years ago, that, that wasn't the
case. And I'm, I'm often jealous now of what I see
out there. And I say, you know, if only this
had been around when, when I was looking for something like this or when I
was looking to get into this hobby. Yeah, I think we're
in kind of a better, more exciting place than, than ever.

(36:38):
Tariq, can you discuss a vintage piece in your collection that
really exemplifies exceptional horological craftsmanship.
What's a favorite? So I love maybe, you know,
I love day dates. Reason why I love day dates is
because there is such. The day date for me is a completely different
watch that is not comparable to the other let's say Rolex models,

(37:00):
Daytona gmt, Submariner. I would say very, very carefully,
Paul will maybe prove me wrong. We've seen most of the
things that exist in terms of sports models already.
But the day date is one of those models where I think that we
don't know what's out there. Watches
that were ordered by heads of states by Middle Eastern

(37:23):
personalities and all these what's sleeping in their safes.
There's watches we see here occasionally that we have never
seen that we don't have a reference to. So this is what
fascinates me in terms of the day dates and looking at
my favorite piece. I have a Rolex
1803 and Paul is

(37:44):
sitting there. I bought it from Philips actually.
It's a yellow gold with a blue dial with
Arabic Hindi numerals that is kind
of one of a kind. I'm not
sure. It's quite a few years back that I bought it. And me loving
day dates, living in the Middle east, being able to read these numbers and the

(38:07):
Arabic language as well, that just is
complete a pure romance for me. I
have a very strong bond with the watch and I reconnect. Every single time I
look at the watch I reconnect with it and I love it more and
more. It's, it's going to go in the box where the heirlooms
at some point will go. The passion is clearly for

(38:29):
the day date and mostly I would say because most of the day date
dials, sorry cases are very similar or same 36
millimeter. I think it's about the dial so.
And with these dials I have some other favorites but this one really stands
out. Love hearing about
your passion and where that landed. Let's move on to

(38:50):
the next segment. Ethical watch collecting
requires attention to both environmental impact and labor
standards. Some brands prioritize sustainable materials
such as Triwa, which uses recycled ocean plastics
and repurposed metals. And brands like Oris known for
supporting ocean conservation initiatives through eco friendly

(39:12):
production. Ensuring fair labor practices is equally
important. Swiss brands often follow rigorous labor
standards, providing safe working conditions and fair wages. While
smaller independent brands also focus on ethical sourcing and
craftsmanship, reducing the risk of exploitation in
manufacturing. Transparency helps collectors identify

(39:33):
responsible brands with certifications like Fairmind Gold
and ISO 14001 for environmental management
as key indicators. Informed purchasing supported by
ethical certifications and industry research encourages a
shift toward more sustainable practices in watchmaking, combining
personal values with positive environmental impact.

(40:01):
Paul, how does Philips navigate environmental or ethical
concerns in curation?
Well, you know, we, we are
heavily scrutinized, not only by governments,
auctions are heavily regulated, but also the
community. So we, we do our very best,

(40:23):
you know, to, to source correct
watches, you know, not so much focus on
the environmental side because we don't manufacture watches, we
take watches in on consignment. So these are already manufactured watches. We
do search the world for watches we believe will have enduring appeal and
enduring style and enduring value.

(40:45):
I should have said. And we of
course seek to deal with
reputable people, whether it's the consignors
that we work with or the buyers who
buy with us. Every person who deals
with Philips is vetted. We ensure

(41:07):
that, you know, that we're not dealing with criminals, we're not
dealing with fraudulent folks to protect
both our consignors and the reputation of the
company. So yeah, and ethics of course
are very, very, we
operate at a very high standard ethically. We have to,

(41:29):
this, this business. Philips is an over 200 year old
company and you know, we, we've endured through so
much and we will continue to endure
because, because of that focus on, on integrity and ethical,
ethical business standards. Stephen, you're in
LA known for being the place where pop culture is

(41:51):
made. What do you see?
Yeah, I mean from, from an ethical standpoint, I think, you know,
customers want to know where things come from. They want to know
what they're buying. And watch brands like all other
companies are, are falling into line there.
I think, you know, you hear about, you know, Fair Mine

(42:14):
Gold, ethically sourced gemstones, like all of this stuff
is good and it's a move in the right direction. But I think those
are issues more on the margins. I think
if you want to make a case for the kind of ethics and
sustainability of watches, it's that they last a long time, right? That
these things aren't ending up in landfills. That

(42:36):
unlike our fashion culture where, you know, people are
wearing, I think I saw a study the other day that, you know, the average
American wears each garment they buy fewer than 10 times
now, you know, before it goes in the
trash, which is horrifying.
Watches are the opposite. Right. And some of that's necessitated

(42:58):
by their cost. But I think that's the
real case for sustainability in watches is that these
things last a long time, they don't get churned in the same
way. You know, then you can get into the ethical questions
of the companies that own these watchmakers, where the money for
those companies came from. I'll just say it doesn't take

(43:20):
doing a lot of digging to start having ethical concerns.
But on the whole, I think, you know, I think watches are a
sustainable option and I think the industry is moving in a
positive direction because consumers demand it. And I think contemporary
consumers ask a lot and I think that's a,
that's a good thing. Yeah, it goes back to what Dan was talking

(43:42):
about, building the watch to last
hundreds of years and the engineering that goes into
that. Dan, what challenges do artisan watchmakers face
in sustainable production?
Well, first I want to agree with Stephen and
you because everything I do here

(44:03):
is for sustainable everything. I'm taking
what used to be considered, you know, an old
watch, you know, like, like, like the Omega I
keep showing here when I was younger, that was if it was old and
beat up, it was here. It was your beater watch. It was just an old
watch. Can you do an overhaul on it and get it going? And now they're

(44:25):
worth a lot of money, some of them. So there's a. Sustainability
is whatever it takes to get that going. That gentleman doesn't. He's not going to
go to the store to buy something new. He wants that memory. It's been with
him. A watch is not just a watch, it's not just a
memory of when you were there with your
significant other or your parents or your cousin or whatever. It was purchasing that

(44:47):
watch. When you wear something and it's that same watch every day, it becomes your
best friend. You travel the world. Some people, that's their business, that's their job,
they're traveling. The only thing they're taking with them is that watching a suitcase,
it's the best friend. So if you keep recycling that, I keep finding
guys like me around the world who are far few between
nowadays to restore these. That's the

(45:09):
best practice. And the flip side of that is what I was saying previously is
we need to make sure that the companies that are making the more
modern watches are adhering to the principles of over
building the movements so that people like me
can restore them. And that is why the, in the whole
birth of the indie, everything was birthed to

(45:31):
build again. Roger W. Smith type
watches that are overbuilt, miniature pocket watches that
every single part in Roger's watches,
I'm just picking his Name, there's others can be remade by someone like
me forever, Forever and ever and ever. It
doesn't get more sustainable than that. The flip side of

(45:53):
that is what Paul was saying earlier that I wanted to touch upon
things you do have to be work aware of if you are going
to go down this recyclable route. Find someone like me and then
just go watch something. Okay. It's not in your family. You're gonna go, I want
an old whatever is. It's not just a dial,
it's not just a case. Consult a knowledgeable

(46:14):
watchmaker. Because I have watches every day on my bench
that these were not priced
vintage watches. 30 years ago @ my
bench, we would rob parts from another watch and put
it in there. I just finished the Valjoux 72 Daytona
and this. Even the Wick Rag pinion, the

(46:37):
mountain minute recorder wheel was not original. The
chronograph would never work right because the gearing of the two gears meshing
into each other were too tight. It was robbed off another model of a
Valjoux 72. And then the guy was filing the
teeth of the wheels. Anything to get it going and get his money that
day. That's how watchmakers operated when these watches were

(46:58):
not worth the money. They were just get it running,
get your money, get them out the door and onto the next Rolex or whatever
would be. It was a job. So a lot of those older watches,
authentication is very, very big, especially the big brands obviously, like
Rolex. Right? Because everything's like nowadays, even internal
parts. You all should know it's not that.

(47:21):
Crack the black open to the bootleg Rolex now and there's a big Chinese
sticker and a battery inside. Anymore they're making exact
replicas of the movement. High tech as well is
very, very, very dangerous out there in those markets. So be
very careful and just have someone such as myself that can help you
or find someone local to you. There's your

(47:43):
sustainability. It's here. There should be more people like me.
But the problem is you're not going to have them. Because as you all
are very aware, if you're on Instagram or any social media,
all the young people coming out of watchmaking school are
not going into doing what I do. They're going right to making their own watches
while they're still in their last year of school and taking orders because

(48:06):
they want to produce masterpieces. And there's a
lot of money in that and trying to
come out of school and then try to get a parts account with big Brands
is an impossibility. They don't want to sell any watchmakers parts and that's how
Indy was birthed. Stephen, just so you know, you're a little younger here.
It's because people like us. But my friends were all

(48:29):
pissed off the carriage Delanens and me and everybody else when we
were doing the work for those small piece runs for the
bigger brands of their NDAs and we finally realized hey, we can sell
direct and you know, we can't buy parts to fix a Rolex
or a fix of this. I'm just throwing names out there fix this brand that.
Apparently because they decided that they wanted to bring all those repairs in house

(48:50):
and screw the collectors who purchased a watch where it would be a
monopoly and you can only get your watch fixed by the big brand.
So we went out and started building our own watches. That's how the
current wave of Indy was birthed. It's going to keep getting
bigger and bigger.

(49:14):
Thanks Dan. That makes sense. I think musical instruments are similar in
that luthiers want to build. It's really
hard to find top notch repair
people because people want to build instruments and that just makes
more money. So talking about business we go back to
Tariq. Tariq, how

(49:36):
do you at Momentum ensure that there's authenticity,
ethical sourcing? Like what do we need to know as consumers?
As consumers I think the most important word here is transparency,
full transparency. That transparency is not always
given to us when we buy the watch. So we have to be able, we
don't only have to have the intention to do all the checks we need to

(49:59):
do but we also have to be able to do all those
checks in order for clients to come in and fully trust
us. So we have a technical manager, a
watchmaker in house, we have A Service Center, 25 square meter
service center in the shop. The watchmaker is trained
by Rolex, iwc, Patek, Chopard and a few

(50:20):
others. Very, very experienced watchmaker who was with us for almost
10 years. So there's certain checks which are on the technical
side which are performed by him, the movement,
functionality, the glass, whatever and then there's us
as a, as a specialist for the watches
themselves. The reference serial number checks and then we have to check

(50:42):
the. What Paul correct mentioned that the
watch overall is period correct that it's a, it's a,
it harmonizes as a
whole and because this is what we want to promise to our
client. So the, the problem in
the world is with, with some people is that they

(51:04):
have, there's people with bad Intentions as well. Let's keep them
aside. There's people who have good intentions, but they're sadly not
able to do some verifying
checks with which the client at
some point is at risk. And he might not know or get to know when
he goes and, let's say, consigns the watch in 10 years to an auction or

(51:25):
wants to sell it to somebody else or send it to the manufacturer. So I
think it's very, very important that a buyer of
a vintage watch, I can speak right now, only that he
really, really selects the seller and he
has a connection with the seller and is fully satisfied. What's done
wrong in many cases is that people, I mean, we, as a

(51:47):
quality reseller, we have a. I would say we have
a healthy premium for quality. And I think
this is very important that you long for
quality rather than going for the price where
somebody's always cheaper than you. Whoever's selling a watch, there's always somebody
who's cheaper than you. But buying the watch and then walking

(52:09):
around and trying to authenticate it, because we don't need these watches,
I think Dan mentioned it earlier, we don't need these watches. We
love them. We are able to afford them. And this is why we want to
buy and admire them and enjoy them. So why
should anybody in this luxury be sweating

(52:30):
that he might have bought something
wrong? I think they have to do their checks beforehand.
So once they've paid, they should be happy with what they
have. And in order to maintain that, we have a very, very
strong
inspection sheet, I would say, which we

(52:51):
follow for all watches that we buy and then sell.
It pays to hang out with the experts like this
panel. We're going to bring it home and go to the last segment.
Building a valuable watch collection involves combining passion with
strategy. Key factors such as condition, authenticity and
rarity drive a watch's value and potential for

(53:13):
appreciation. Collectors prioritize watches in pristine
condition with original parts and documentation to verify their
authenticity. Limited editions and models with unique
histories like The Patek Philippe Nautilus
5711, often hold strong investment potential.
The watch market is also influenced by trends, brand

(53:34):
reputation and cultural factors, which can shift demand
significantly. Informed purchasing decisions begin with thorough
research. Following industry publications and consulting. Watch
experts can provide insight into the best options. Buying
from reputable sources is crucial to avoid counterfeits.
Regular maintenance and proper storage are also essential to retain

(53:56):
value. With consistent care, strategic planning and
awareness of market dynamics, collectors can build a watch
portfolio that combines financial potential with lasting
personal value.
Paul, how has the definition of investment grade

(54:17):
changed over the years.
Sorry, I unmuted. Yeah, we, we don't
like to talk about watches as investments per se,
but we always encourage people to buy watches that they
love. Watches are a wonderful

(54:37):
collectible to own, and the best watches
certainly retain their value. Many of them don't go
up in value. Some of them just keep their value
and, you know, a few of them actually go up in value.
That is a real bonus. Over time,
they have proven to be, you know, a good investment if we just

(55:00):
look at past history. But what's in
style today may not be in style tomorrow. So
it's really important you buy watches because you love them. And you
buy what you love because 10 years down the road, you, you
invest in a great watch. And if tastes
changed and the value of the watch has gone down, at

(55:22):
least you still have a watch that you love and it will retain most of
its value. Especially if you're buying the best quality watches at the price
level that you can afford. Well preserved, made
by great brands who have pushed the state of the art of
design and watchmaking. And watches that
fit wrist sizes of all types. You know, that's

(55:44):
something very important, is to consider the potential market for
a timepiece if it's overly large or super small, there are
fewer and fewer people who want those. But watches well sized
that fit wrist sizes of all types, men, women, small
people, larger folks. You can be
assured that when it's time to sell that watch, you will find a market

(56:07):
for it. Fair comment about
viewing it as an investment or something that you just
collect and that you love. Do you dare make any,
like, prognostications on
trends or where things are going in watches?
You know, what, past performance is kind of indicative of

(56:29):
future performance. I think in the world of watches,
you know, established brands that have a long,
uninterrupted history of making exceptional watches at the
price point that they've been operating at are a good bet for,
you know, future, future appreciation and future
desirability. Definitely there is an increase in

(56:52):
demand for independence, as Stephen, Dan and Tariq
have all mentioned. Just look for authenticity, look
for true watchmaking craft. Educate yourself as much as
you possibly can to understand what is quality and what
is, you know, true passion. Watches made with love
versus watches made to make money and marketing

(57:14):
brands that are in the business of making as much money as possible
versus, you know, watchmakers who create the best watches they could
possibly make. Thank you for sharing your
insights. I know that you have to drop off soon. Hopefully that
reflects the experiences and mistakes that you made with your dad,
but also a lot of collective experience with all the

(57:36):
watch, with all the watch auctions.
So very good advice. Tariq, do
trends in Dubai match the rest of the world or are there unique
happenings in Dubai? I think Dubai
is pretty much on the par with the rest of the world.
People here embrace these trends very quickly and they react also

(57:58):
very quickly. And I wanna, I wanna
touch up on, on, on the investment part you
mentioned. I think we don't want to
mess it up for the future generation. Also, if we start speaking about
investments on watches, then I don't know in 10
years where watches will stand for the next generation. They will not have a passion

(58:20):
for them, they will not enjoy them. It will be
merely a financial aspect. And as Paul correctly
mentioned, I believe that look for, for a brand
that's there, look for their iconic models, look for quality,
look for esthetics, look for size as well. As you
mentioned, I think with these watches, if you have

(58:42):
this very fine and short checklist, I think
with the watch that ticks all the boxes or most of these, I would
say in the future you are very safe. That doesn't mean that the
watch, the value will go up in next year or the next two years, maybe
in 10 years, or it will
retain its value, but it's something to be safe. I'm from the time when we

(59:03):
bought watches and we were happy that we only lost 30%,
you know, and today people come in and they want to buy a watch and
then three weeks later they come and says, can I get more for it?
And a good example, I want to touch also
the first thing on the opening you mentioned the bubble back. So speak to an
old school collector or dealer who was active in the 80s. It was not

(59:25):
me, but I've heard stories that the Vintage
Daytona was $1,800 and the exotic dial
Paul Newman was $2,300 and
the bubble back was $8,000.
This is the comparison. So where's the bubble back Today? The bubble back is still
8,000 and Paul Newman. We don't need to

(59:48):
mention the numbers, but it couldn't go
completely the wrong way. That's why we don't have that glass
ball to mention. And we don't want to actually mention
any future outlook to the
clients because we have no idea if we're going to
succeed or not. I mean, financial advisors live with it. I couldn't

(01:00:09):
really live with it saying, yeah, your watch is going to go up and then
it comes back and went down and he's unhappy about the watch. You're just going
to leave and lose the passion about the watch. And we lost a
person then in the world who doesn't love watches
anymore. Stephen,
which modern indie brands? Do you see

(01:00:30):
any that could be future icons?
Yeah, I do. I think, you know, if you look
at the market, I think Francois Paul Journe with his
brand FP Journe, has kind of established a
really great model. I think for a lot of independent watch
watchmakers. You know, he's thinking

(01:00:53):
both short term and long term. There's a lot of his
personality in the watches he makes, but he's
also established a company and there are watchmakers around him. And when
he is dead, at some point, I think consumers can be pretty
confident that those watches can still be serviced. There will still be new
things coming out like it's, it's built to be future proofed.

(01:01:15):
And I think, you know, Debuffe is another independent brand
that has done quite a great job there. And then
I think we have a new crop of young independent
watchmakers. Red Jet, Bridget Be
in Geneva is like my age
and one of the great living watchmakers. You have

(01:01:36):
others, you have folks who aren't watchmakers but have started
watchmakers brands. Simon Brett comes to
mind. And I think these folks are
thinking long term, they're focusing on building
infrastructure around them, not just watches.
You know, you can make a really beautiful watch, but if you're

(01:01:58):
going to survive long term, you also have to build kind of a company
around you. You have to build infrastructure around you.
And those, those are the folks doing a great job
trying to think of other names. Josh, Josh Shapiro here in L. A
is literally hand making watches in Los Angeles in a way
that, you know, nobody has done in the United states in probably

(01:02:21):
100 years. There's, there's quite a lot
of talented watchmakers who,
due to the trends in the industry, have been able to find
customers and now really kind of push the industry into its
next, next phase and next generation. And I think the future is
bright. I think, you know, we can talk, you know, short term, long

(01:02:43):
term. Is it a down year in the industry? Are the tariffs
affecting things like you can look short term if you want, but
if you look long term, I really think the future for watchmaking is bright
and it's, it's a better time to be interested in watches now
than it's ever been in the past. I don't think watch lovers have ever had
it so good. And I think we can lose sight of that sometimes it's

(01:03:05):
easy to get jaded. But I think as someone who loves
watches, not just because I work in watches, but because I, I just
personally love them, I see lots of reasons to be,
to be optimistic. It's a great time to be in
watches. Dan, what are your thoughts?
I think your Rolex Bubble back tells a

(01:03:28):
story because yeah, they were trending and one of the first
timepieces that were considered, wow, we've
entered the vintage world now. It's not just a used, old crappy watch that
needs to be fixed up. And they trended huge and they
skyrocketed. And even though they were really small
watches, which is what was in fashion in the beginning of

(01:03:50):
wristwatches, that was a normal size watch for everyone, even the
military. You know, 34 millimeters was
all we needed. I don't know what happened after that. And, and
you know, now those watches completely plummeted. So if
you had a safe full of those in the 80s and you bought them while
they were high, your investment was a bad investment. Right. But if

(01:04:12):
they're still in your safe and you don't care about that
investment now, you care about your son or
your daughter and her holding on to them and it turns around again.
It's just like any other commodity, but you're diving in and falling
into the name brands. I feel
most of the collecting would be in the modern indie world,

(01:04:35):
but it's a very confusing minefield. Like any other industry,
there's a lot of people who
call themselves indie, but it's a multi billion dollar company. Is that really
indie? It's not indeed. There's a, they have a board now. It's not two
guys in workshop making masterpieces
that, that can be repaired and repaired and repaired over and over

(01:04:57):
again in an extremely limited quantity. So
it's, I really wouldn't guide anyone again into that
investment world. It really should be something you passionately fall in love
with, becomes your best friend. If it happens to make
money, fine. But you know the other three you buy are going to happen. You're
going to lose money. It's just like any other

(01:05:19):
commodity. So really fall in love with the watchmaker, their
story, their personality. The indie world is a whole
other world because generations from now
you purchase a watch, you don't just purchase the watch, you go pick it up
at the glass desk with all the other watches. You can fly out
and have dinner with that master watchmaker. So that's a story

(01:05:41):
attached to that time and that timepiece
and that's going to carry on forever because there's pictures there. We all carry our
forms with us that take pictures. That's what I see the
future. But be careful of the mindfield where people say they're
indie. They never went to watchmaking school in Switzerland
and they have nine other people around them who are actually producing the parts

(01:06:03):
on other, on their NDAs and they're not really telling the truth. So
be careful when you first dive into the indie world because just like any other
business, you know it kind of it because there's so much
money in it now. Right. It's not the beginning of it like when I was
in it in the beginning. It is a wavy,
snakey kind of road there as any other business. So

(01:06:24):
invest wisely and purchase for what you really
love. Thank you. I think Tariq wanted to chime
in. I just had a thought like
when we, when we, as Dan correctly mentioned is
bubble backs were like more like the first collectible watches in the
80s that people started collecting just in the

(01:06:46):
past be in the 60s or 70s or
80s when people did not
collect watches but they, they bought watches
because they loved them and they could afford them.
I always feel that those people were hundred times
richer than any of us out here. Doesn't

(01:07:08):
matter what, what your bank balance is because they just bought this
watch because they love it, they like it and they wore it. And we know
that they threw away the box and papers because we don't find them here when
we buy watches that the links are lost and that. And
today, today I know that
people want to, want to retain their hard earned money but today it's

(01:07:30):
a lot about the value. Even if you have like a passion for watches.
I want to buy something which I can sell with the profit
or people say I want to buy something which I can, you know,
get my money out. Like in those years I don't think
people had these thoughts. They just bought them, they wore them.

(01:07:50):
We know how they wore them, they wore them. They're completely worn out. But
that says actually that people had a bond with those watches and that
they actually never thought about selling them. You know, there was no
investment perspective. There was no collecting. There was
just buying the watch and enjoying it. And today everything is around the
dollars, everything and for everyone and

(01:08:12):
legitimize. I mean we all want to retain what we
have in the best way.
Tariq is right. You're 100 right because,
because I get that revolving door here. The, the collectors who
are, who are bringing in their watch, they don't want to Buy a new watch.
You know, people, the guy who comes in with this, he tells me his story.

(01:08:35):
That's why I love doing what I do that I see here. I push him
out. These people stay here. I would say yesterday, for almost three hours,
telling me his story. When he got this watch. There's a story attached to
it. It was a. He was an attorney, and he.
It was his first time in the courtroom, you know, in front of a judge.
So he signified that he won the case, he got the money, he went out,

(01:08:57):
and he treated himself to something he's not never looking
to as an investment. It's that tangible story that's
attached to that watch forever. And then the next milestone, his life. He went out
and he treated himself because he loved watches. He loved the machines
that are inside them. To the next milestone. He had a. They
had a baby, got married, had a baby. He goes out and bought his wife

(01:09:18):
a watch, maybe a pathetic Philippe. Whatever it was. And there's that
milestone it was never, never about. Can I sell it for more money later?
It was, I'm gonna give these to my kids because the story's attached to
it. And that's really what mechanical watch makes.
I think we're going to leave it there. Beautifully said by
everybody. This is really an incredible conversation. One of

(01:09:42):
my favorite takeaways from today is a
watch isn't just something that you wear. It's something that you live with.
It's something that absorbs your story and carries it forward.
So whether it's a piece you want to buy to celebrate a milestone or
a vintage treasure passed down through generations, every
watch becomes a witness to your life. And I love this idea

(01:10:05):
of utility. Are you buying a watch to
wear it and enjoy it? I think all the guests
today said that you have to follow your heart and buy what you
love and be less concerned
about valuation and where prices are going.
If prices go up, that's a bonus. So I think

(01:10:28):
that's what makes collecting and passing down timepieces so
powerful. It's not just about owning something beautiful or
valuable. It's about building a legacy
that lasts far beyond your own time.
So a challenge for everybody this week. Just take one
watch, whether it's a daily wearer or

(01:10:49):
something that's tucked away, and write down the story that you want
it to tell. Maybe it's aspirational. If you don't own a
watch yet, write that story down, but write the
story of what it means to you. Is it an achievement that you're proud of?
Is it something that a dream that you're working toward.
Maybe it's the remainder of someone who or a reminder of

(01:11:11):
someone who inspired you. Whatever it is, capture it and
then think about who you might want to share that story
with someday. And maybe even you will pass a
watch on to that person, just like my cousin Fred
did giving me a watch.
So when we collect with intention, we don't just collect watches. We collect

(01:11:34):
memories, values and legacies. Thank you for spending time with us today.
If you enjoyed this conversation, be sure to subscribe, leave a review
and share this episode with someone who you think would love it too.
Let's thank our guests one more time. Paul Boutros had
to, had to go, but you can find him at philips.com
Stephen Pulvirent he is founder of Rhyme and

(01:11:58):
Reason and check out the enthusiast podcast and
newsletter which is about culture of watch collecting.
Stephen Stephen Pulvirent.com is that the best
place to find you? Yeah, you can find
me at stevenpolverint.com and you you can find the enthusiasts at the
enthusiasts.net. Perfect. Tariq Malik

(01:12:19):
is founder of Momentum in Dubai and you can find him at
Momentum-Dubai.com. Tariq,
thank you again for sticking with us so late
in the day. I'm sure you're eager to get home.
It was a pleasure. Thank you very much for having me. Very, very
grateful. And finally, Dan Spitz. Thanks

(01:12:42):
for joining us once again, Dan. Dan can be
found at danspitz.com or
delraybeachwatchmaker.com. He's got
prices on there for repair. All kinds of
information. Dan, anything you wanted to share before we go?
I just love all the people who love mechanical

(01:13:02):
timepieces, the stories that are attached to them.
And I, that's why I do it. I do, I love to hear their stories
when they, when they walk in my workshop and they tell me about their dad
and their grandpa. And somehow these kind of pieces are
intertwined in those stories. And that's the
beauty of what we, what we're all in

(01:13:25):
this, you know, this. It's, we don't need time on, on
our wrist anymore, but we want it because it's really a
memory or it's micromechanical art attached to that memory. And
I think that's a very beautiful thing. It is a beautiful thing. Thank you,
Dan. Thank you, Tariq. Thank you, Stephen. Thank you to
Paul. The next Inspired

(01:13:46):
Money episode will be next week. We're exploring the
world of philanthropy, making a meaningful impact through
giving. That will be Wednesday, May 7th at 1pm
Eastern. Thank you, everyone, for joining. Until next time,
do something that scares you because that's where the magic happens.
Thanks, everyone.

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}Watch Collecting as Legacy Treasures: Timepieces for Retirement Generations